Speaker 1: You're listening to a Mother and Mia podcast.
Speaker 2: Mama Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters
Speaker 2: that this podcast is recorded on.
Speaker 3: People can judge Anthony Alberanezi or they can judge me.
Speaker 3: I can only talk from my perspective. I believe that
Speaker 3: I'm the same person I was when I came into politics.
Speaker 3: I mean, hopefully I'll mature in a number of ways
Speaker 3: and different perspectives, etc. But my base being got the
Speaker 3: same friends from school. I've always been conscious of keeping
Speaker 3: your feet on the ground.
Speaker 2: For Mama Mia.
Speaker 4: You're listening to a special episode of No Filter. I'm
Speaker 4: your host, kateline Brook. Australian women have a very big
Speaker 4: choice to make in the coming weeks. The women of
Speaker 4: Australia will be voting for the next Prime Minister at
Speaker 4: a time when the world feels unpredictable, where so many
Speaker 4: people are worried about their futures and the futures of
Speaker 4: their children. Because our mission here at Mamma Maya is
Speaker 4: to make the world a better place for women and girls,
Speaker 4: We've invited both Prime Minister Anthony Albanesi and the Opposition
Speaker 4: leader Peter Dutton onto No Filter to.
Speaker 2: Speak directly to you.
Speaker 4: And because this is No Filter, the conversation you're about
Speaker 4: to hear isn't only about politics and policy positions, but
Speaker 4: it's also about the man behind the politics, the person
Speaker 4: who's asking for us to put our trust in them.
Speaker 4: Here's my conversation with the leader of the Opposition, Peter Dutton.
Speaker 2: Peter Dutton, Peter Craig Dutton, welcome.
Speaker 1: To No Filter. It's great to be here. Thank you.
Speaker 2: I am so.
Speaker 4: Intrigued by you because you are a contender for the
Speaker 4: highest job in the land.
Speaker 2: Is it aside from governor general?
Speaker 1: Is that side from governor general?
Speaker 4: Aside from governor general? And yet you travel amongst us
Speaker 4: as almost like a mythical beast because you are a
Speaker 4: man with no nickname.
Speaker 3: I get to DUTs. That's that's sort of the main
Speaker 3: thing PC. From my schoolmates from high school.
Speaker 2: Uh, what do you get Peter Craig?
Speaker 4: All right, okay, because then you were a police constable,
Speaker 4: you were yeah, right, Because you're very intriguing in the
Speaker 4: sense that if you look at the political landscape, which
Speaker 4: most of us don't get to do with kind of
Speaker 4: any you know, microscopic detail. I know the shape of
Speaker 4: Albanesi who's the Prime Minister. But I do not know
Speaker 4: the shape of you. And when I speak to are
Speaker 4: the friends. It's a very common kind of relationship that
Speaker 4: people have with you. Why do you think that is?
Speaker 3: I think it's true of most contenders for this office
Speaker 3: because the public just don't have a day to day
Speaker 3: interest in politics. It's just it's part of our culture.
Speaker 3: And when people see it on TV, they flip the channel,
Speaker 3: or they're annoyed by the discussion, or ones as bad
Speaker 3: as the other, or it's a boring conversation, not relevant
Speaker 3: to me. And it's not until people start to sharpen
Speaker 3: their focus and think about in some cases not until
Speaker 3: the dying hours of a campaign about who they're going.
Speaker 1: To vote for.
Speaker 3: So and if you're a reality TV star, as is
Speaker 3: the case in the US, then I guess you're a
Speaker 3: household name.
Speaker 1: But here I don't think that's generally the case.
Speaker 4: I ask because you know, there's the perception of you
Speaker 4: as being like a formidable kind of like a darkish
Speaker 4: sort of figure.
Speaker 1: Yes.
Speaker 4: And this amazing thing happened to me last week when
Speaker 4: I was at the Kylie concert right in Melbourne, and
Speaker 4: this guy came up to me and he said, I
Speaker 4: won't say his name, but you'll be able to work
Speaker 4: out who it is or anyway. And he ended up
Speaker 4: saying to me he was there with his partner and
Speaker 4: he said, I'm a politician and I said, oh, that's interesting.
Speaker 4: My brother's a politician. He goes, I know your brother.
Speaker 4: My brother's in the Liberal Party in Queensland. And I
Speaker 4: told him that I was interviewing you, and he said, well,
Speaker 4: I don't sit on that side of the aisle, but
Speaker 4: you're going to love Peter Darton.
Speaker 1: And I was like, that was going very bad.
Speaker 4: Second, how bizarre, because I'm like, mate, you are high
Speaker 4: on Kylie.
Speaker 2: What's going to happen?
Speaker 4: And then his partner said to me, you said, I'm
Speaker 4: so left, I'm nearly not even on the same page.
Speaker 4: But if I was lost, Peter Dutton is the man
Speaker 4: that I would want looking for me.
Speaker 1: That's very kind.
Speaker 4: Now. That was extraordinary to me only because it was
Speaker 4: so at odds with what the.
Speaker 2: I'm going to say, the public perception of no I.
Speaker 3: Think it's a fair point, and I think you get
Speaker 3: painted in a particular way, and sometimes you can be
Speaker 3: your own worst enemy.
Speaker 1: And I've had roles which are pretty tough roles.
Speaker 3: And that shapes how people perceive you. And in a
Speaker 3: six second grab on the TV of a nighttime where
Speaker 3: you're trying to deliver a blow to your political opponent,
Speaker 3: that's different than if you're doing a long form interview
Speaker 3: or you're doing a breakfast TV segment and you're able
Speaker 3: to joke and show the true side. And I've also
Speaker 3: been a very private person. I sort of sound strange,
Speaker 3: but I don't enjoy talking about my childhood and my
Speaker 3: family and the rest of it. It's a given, it's
Speaker 3: a must because of this job. You're in the public eye,
Speaker 3: so you have no choice. But maybe because of that,
Speaker 3: I haven't sort of opened up enough over the years
Speaker 3: about you know, my background, who I am, what has
Speaker 3: influenced me. And more of that story has come out
Speaker 3: over the last couple of years, and it's amazing how
Speaker 3: many people have that exact conversation. They stop you at
Speaker 3: an airport or a shopping center and say, you know,
Speaker 3: I saw you on this or heard you on that,
Speaker 3: and just completely different than I.
Speaker 1: Thought you were.
Speaker 3: And so's it's funny how people can tell it. So
Speaker 3: I remember in twenty eighteen when we had a leadership
Speaker 3: change and Malcolm left the Prime ministership. I remember thinking
Speaker 3: at that stage, if I leave politics now, I'm sort
Speaker 3: of disappointed because people won't ever truly know who I am.
Speaker 1: And that's sort.
Speaker 2: Of ad You had the sense of that then.
Speaker 3: Yes, yeah, yeah, and I thought, you know, people, I'll
Speaker 3: be recorded in history sort of this dark figure, as
Speaker 3: you say, and that's actually not who I am. And
Speaker 3: fortunately since that time, people have been able to see,
Speaker 3: you know, more of me, more of my views, my
Speaker 3: background and all of that. So yeah, it's been an
Speaker 3: interesting transition.
Speaker 4: Well, the background that you don't like talking about eldest
Speaker 4: of five kids, eldest.
Speaker 1: Of five, least favorite, the youngest.
Speaker 4: Right, I have four children, and in our family, the
Speaker 4: kids will believe the youngest is my favorite, but the
Speaker 4: eldest often has responsibility heaped upon them. What was your family?
Speaker 3: Curely has this great theory about your wi my wife
Speaker 3: about birth order and where you are sort of you know,
Speaker 3: determines who you are.
Speaker 1: Et cetera. So but anyway, that aside, so what does
Speaker 1: hang on?
Speaker 2: What does she say in part.
Speaker 3: That the firstborn.
Speaker 1: Believe that they can rule the world or something like.
Speaker 3: That, and the real and this and this. I should
Speaker 3: listen more intently actually to what she's telling me. But
Speaker 3: but it's it's it basically talks about the you know,
Speaker 3: the role of the youngest and uh and and and
Speaker 3: that was I suppose in terms of my experience that
Speaker 3: it was ten years between me and my youngest sister.
Speaker 3: So and I, you know, I grew up in a
Speaker 3: family of five and with dad working with mum.
Speaker 2: But what did your dad? Was your dad a building.
Speaker 3: Bricklayer and then was a bright and yeah, work worked
Speaker 3: really hard, set a good example. And mum was originally
Speaker 3: a secretary and then took in kids, so did daycare,
Speaker 3: family daycare morning and afternoon, before and after school before
Speaker 3: you know, that was a thing. And then she went
Speaker 3: into child care. And so that that meant, you know,
Speaker 3: that home, we were all expected to, you know, by
Speaker 3: the clean up the dishes, clear the plates or so
Speaker 3: it was a discipline to do the folding or whatever
Speaker 3: it was or in my case, you know, and I
Speaker 3: finally remember it. I probably griped about it at the time,
Speaker 3: but you're changing nappies and feeding you know, the baby
Speaker 3: who's ten years younger, they're you, et cetera. And you know,
Speaker 3: lugging her around on your hip. So that was that
Speaker 3: was my experience. And I've got an amazing siblings, so very
Speaker 3: proud of.
Speaker 4: Them, you know. It's and then you became a copper, yes,
Speaker 4: and you became a copper when you were quite young.
Speaker 1: When I was about nineteen.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And how did that idea occur to you?
Speaker 3: Well, there's a great photo I think when I was
Speaker 3: at kindy and fully dressed in the police uniform with a.
Speaker 1: Gun on the side.
Speaker 3: And so I think I'd always had an interest or
Speaker 3: a fascination at a young age. But Mum convinced me
Speaker 3: rightly that I should go to UNI. No one had
Speaker 3: been to UNI in the family. And I did that
Speaker 3: for about for two years, and then I deferred and
Speaker 3: I came back and finished at part time as a
Speaker 3: Bachelor of Business degree.
Speaker 1: But I'd always wanted to go into the police.
Speaker 3: I never sort of thought of myself as sitting in
Speaker 3: an office nine to five, and I liked the idea
Speaker 3: of policing and that it was fast moving. You didn't
Speaker 3: know what the next radio corp would be, didn't know
Speaker 3: what was on the other side of that door, and
Speaker 3: so I felt that that was for me.
Speaker 4: There's more to my conversation with Peter Dutton coming up.
Speaker 4: He tells me about what he saw as a police
Speaker 4: officer that has shaped his politics and what he can
Speaker 4: do about.
Speaker 2: The housing market. Do I go anywhere?
Speaker 4: I read this thing once that if you look at
Speaker 4: the sort of socioeconomic background of cops, it often resembles criminals.
Speaker 4: So it's really that they come from very similar backgrounds
Speaker 4: on the segment, they've just chosen diametric opposed paths.
Speaker 2: When you're a cop, what did you learn from it
Speaker 2: that you've brought with you? Now?
Speaker 3: I led a very happy childhood growing up, so I'd
Speaker 3: never experienced drug use or I'd never seen domestic violence.
Speaker 3: That that wasn't you know, our environment. So I grew
Speaker 3: up I think naively, and you know, my eyes were
Speaker 3: like sources and first shift and seeing you know, some
Speaker 3: of the horrific things that you see, delivering death messages,
Speaker 3: the domestic violence, the motor.
Speaker 1: Vehicle accents, the kids, all of that.
Speaker 3: I think, I think you just grow up overnight and
Speaker 3: as a nineteen twenty year old being exposed to all
Speaker 3: of that, and I'd also, yeah, I'd wanted to stay
Speaker 3: in Brisbane, had a friend in Brisbane, but when I
Speaker 3: graduated from the academy, I got posted to towns Or,
Speaker 3: which is sort of traumatic at the time but fantastic
Speaker 3: because it made me.
Speaker 1: Grow up being away from home and yeah, it's confronting.
Speaker 3: So I think you still you carry that experience, those
Speaker 3: images with you and it's part of the reason that
Speaker 3: I really concentrated, particularly in the Immigration and Home Affairs portfolios,
Speaker 3: on protecting women and children, and that was important to me.
Speaker 3: When I first came into Parliament, I was really passionate
Speaker 3: about a case where a young baby had been abducted
Speaker 3: in Queensland and it's sort of quite a famous case,
Speaker 3: Didrew Kennedy abduction, And I'd worked with Fay, her mother,
Speaker 3: and there was a great, great injustice in that family,
Speaker 3: and I'd worked on that job just very briefly as
Speaker 3: a surveillance officer, and I was very passionate about that
Speaker 3: and changing that law and ended up getting the law
Speaker 3: modernized in relation to DNA technology. And I think it's
Speaker 3: probably in part what caught John Howard's eye early on,
Speaker 3: because I was fortunate enough to be promoted into the
Speaker 3: ministry after just one term and still quite young and
Speaker 3: still yeah, I was thirty three, I guess something like that.
Speaker 3: And so yeah, I mean I've always felt passionate about that.
Speaker 3: I just I believe with kids, and young girls in particular,
Speaker 3: that robbing that innocence of their childhood and not allowing
Speaker 3: them to, you know, to enjoy their childhood their development.
Speaker 3: I just I always found that very horrific really, and
Speaker 3: similarly for women going into it. I remember going into
Speaker 3: countless domestic violence scenes and you know, blood everywhere, kids
Speaker 3: clinging onto mom's legs or even dad's legs. All of
Speaker 3: that is you know, I mean, you can't help but
Speaker 3: be affected by that. And that's not something that I
Speaker 3: grew up with.
Speaker 1: And I just thought for.
Speaker 3: A woman in particular, not feeling safe in that home
Speaker 3: environment that had been the refuge for me and my
Speaker 3: safe space growing up. If you don't feel safe there
Speaker 3: where could you feel safe? And And so yeah, I
Speaker 3: mean that's that's been a lifetime passion of mine and
Speaker 3: it's one of the areas if I am fortunate enough
Speaker 3: to become Prime Minister that I really want to concentrate
Speaker 3: on it.
Speaker 1: I just don't think we do well enough in our country.
Speaker 4: Do you. So a lot of these issues that lead
Speaker 4: to domestic violence, for instance, become systemic, so you know, poverty,
Speaker 4: or a whole lot of you know, drug abuse, et cetera.
Speaker 4: How there's a there's a reliance on the government to
Speaker 4: correct faults that lie at a at a for merely level,
Speaker 4: or at a relationship level. And yet the Liberal Party
Speaker 4: is not generally the party that people think of that
Speaker 4: are compassionate in that area.
Speaker 1: Well, it's funny. I think that's probably a fair conclusion.
Speaker 3: But when you look at what we did when we
Speaker 3: were in government, the programs that we funded, particularly over COVID,
Speaker 3: where we were really concerned about people being stuck at
Speaker 3: home together in relationships that probably work because both parties
Speaker 3: are working for long hours and not spending every working
Speaker 3: hour together. And so we put a lot into that,
Speaker 3: into programs that into NGOs and provided support around housing,
Speaker 3: around support for women in those situations. So, yeah, I
Speaker 3: made a particular focus on canceling visas when I had
Speaker 3: that responsibility of people who are perpetrated domestic violence, pedophiles,
Speaker 3: people who had sexually assaulted women and children, you know,
Speaker 3: drug dealers and others, and I remember each of those
Speaker 3: cases as you're looking at it, there are six or
Speaker 3: eight victims before you're dealing with the case, and you think,
Speaker 3: if this decision had been made earlier, you know, those
Speaker 3: Australian citizens wouldn't have fallen prey to that pedophile or
Speaker 3: that individual. And there's a sense of satisfaction in doing that,
Speaker 3: even though it's a tough decision to make to deport
Speaker 3: someone from the country, but particularly when they've got their
Speaker 3: own family. But you also do it with the knowledge
Speaker 3: that they're not going on to offend against the next
Speaker 3: girl and against the next woman, et cetera, et cetera.
Speaker 1: So when you look at that, and.
Speaker 3: I think it's hard then to reconcile that we're not
Speaker 3: compassionate or that we don't have a focus as members
Speaker 3: of the Liberal Party on protecting women or putting in
Speaker 3: place better arrangements.
Speaker 4: Because you have a very beautiful family. You have a
Speaker 4: modern family in the sense that it's well documented that
Speaker 4: your daughter has it yet that Rebecca has a different mum,
Speaker 4: but Kiralyi has been a mum to her. You've got
Speaker 4: two sons. Also, you've done extremely well in business. Your
Speaker 4: wife has also done well in business. When you come
Speaker 4: from a position of being extremely comfortable how do you
Speaker 4: still read the rest of the country. Because politicians love
Speaker 4: to say Australians are doing it tough without an acknowledgment
Speaker 4: that the reason that we may be doing it tough
Speaker 4: is because of things that you have done.
Speaker 1: That's a fair point.
Speaker 3: Look, people can judge, you know, Anthony Alberanezi, or they
Speaker 3: can judge me. I can only talk from my perspective.
Speaker 3: I believe that I'm the same person I was when
Speaker 3: I came into politics. I mean, hopefully I'll mature it
Speaker 3: in a number of ways and different perspectives, et cetera.
Speaker 3: But my base, you know, being my I've got the
Speaker 3: same friends from school. I've always been conscious of keeping
Speaker 3: your feet on the ground and and you know, I've
Speaker 3: never forgotten growing up in a bigger family or in
Speaker 3: an environment where you know, there were arguments about money
Speaker 3: and there wasn't enough money to pay the bills. And
Speaker 3: Dad was a builder, as I say, worked his guts out,
Speaker 3: but he could price ten jobs.
Speaker 1: And get none.
Speaker 3: And you know, when the economy turned, he could price
Speaker 3: ten and get ten. And you know, I mean I
Speaker 3: went to work part time after school every day because
Speaker 3: I had always, from a young age, wanted to you know,
Speaker 3: be financially successful and and so I've never forgotten those
Speaker 3: routes that I never will and I think that's demonstrated
Speaker 3: in a number of the decisions that I've made and
Speaker 3: different portfolios. And I would want to bring that to
Speaker 3: the office of Prime Minister as well.
Speaker 4: Okay, my slight issue with that is that the times
Speaker 4: are so different now, and the times are different now
Speaker 4: because of policies that governments have implemented over the years.
Speaker 4: For instance, you could buy a house when you were nineteen, correct,
Speaker 4: whereas many Australians now will never be able to buy
Speaker 4: a house. So the times are different. You can't work
Speaker 4: your way, you know. And I have much respect for
Speaker 4: your work ethic, by the way, and I don't think
Speaker 4: work probably gets the respect that it deserves and the
Speaker 4: role that it plays in people's lives.
Speaker 2: But what so.
Speaker 4: My question is really on a policy level. It seems
Speaker 4: to me, and you alluded to this earlier, that people
Speaker 4: don't see a difference between the parties, and in fact
Speaker 4: UNI party seems to be a prevalent sort of thing.
Speaker 4: Government loves big Australia, but most Australians don't love big Australia.
Speaker 4: But Governments love big Australia because it means, you know,
Speaker 4: more taxes and more growth, and banks love big Australia
Speaker 4: and building companies love big Australia.
Speaker 2: How do you reconcile.
Speaker 4: That inclination towards satisfying the business end of town versus
Speaker 4: what Australians want.
Speaker 1: Well, it's a huge issue because a couple of points. One.
Speaker 3: I don't think we plan well enough in this country
Speaker 3: for migration movements, and we've got a natural instinct to
Speaker 3: want to live closer to the coast, and the government's
Speaker 3: bringing in in their migration program about a population in
Speaker 3: the same size as Adelaide over the course of a
Speaker 3: five year period, which is a lot of people. When
Speaker 3: you stop and think about that, we're not building the
Speaker 3: extra hospitals and the extra capacity at.
Speaker 1: Schools and in GP clinics, et cetera.
Speaker 3: So I think we do plan really poorly in this
Speaker 3: country and it's part of the reason why this perfect
Speaker 3: storm has percolated. Because we've got Australians who are lining
Speaker 3: up to rent a property, paying tweeks or for rent.
Speaker 3: They can't get a front of their own head. Young
Speaker 3: people are lining up at auctions and expected to pay
Speaker 3: five hundred thousand dollars over the reserve price to get
Speaker 3: a basic house. And so you know, I get that.
Speaker 3: And the reason that I'm passionate about making sure that
Speaker 3: we allow people to realize that dream of home ownership
Speaker 3: again is that I just think with a house, you've
Speaker 3: got or you're a unit, but with accommodation, you've got stability.
Speaker 3: I think it's good for a relationship. I think it's
Speaker 3: good stability when you have when kids come along, you
Speaker 3: get if you can get to the point where you've
Speaker 3: paid the houself by retirement, you can enjoy the hard
Speaker 3: work that you've spoken about, enjoy your life because of
Speaker 3: the hard work you've spoken about.
Speaker 1: I think you've then.
Speaker 3: Got an asset that's grown in value to give to
Speaker 3: your kids or your grandkids and set them up right.
Speaker 3: So so housing that's why it's such a.
Speaker 4: Love lulture that you think you need to tell me
Speaker 4: how great did you do?
Speaker 3: But I think I think it's important because I think
Speaker 3: a lot of people when you look at and the
Speaker 3: sort of a long way of answering your question about
Speaker 3: there's different views. We've got an amazing migrant population in
Speaker 3: our country. When you speak to many people from different
Speaker 3: migrant communities. They say, please, could we bring our parents
Speaker 3: or you know, the remaining three sisters or brothers from
Speaker 3: our from our family. And so they want a bigger
Speaker 3: migration program, and business, as you say, wants to bring
Speaker 3: more people in because they think they can't get the
Speaker 3: workforce without that migrant workforce. So we've got to make
Speaker 3: sure there's supply of housing. We've got to take care
Speaker 3: of Australians first, including people who have just become Australian citizens,
Speaker 3: and make sure they don't lose the dream of home ownership.
Speaker 3: And we've got an aging population like what most Western democracies,
Speaker 3: so or communities and economies, and so we've got to
Speaker 3: get that balance right, and we haven't got it right.
Speaker 3: The supply side of housing have sort of dried up,
Speaker 3: and you've got this big demand with the migration program.
Speaker 3: And we've said that we should chill out a bit
Speaker 3: on that for a couple of years until we can
Speaker 3: recalibrate the two because otherwise that dream of home ownership
Speaker 3: is just going to get further and further away.
Speaker 1: But you look at.
Speaker 3: Every time you jump into an uber or go to
Speaker 3: a service station of seven eleven or tradees. Now there's
Speaker 3: a big migrant element to all of that. And they're
Speaker 3: not people have come from riches. These are people who
Speaker 3: see the golden ticket of Australian citizenship as an opportunity
Speaker 3: to create wealth and stability for their kids and grandkids
Speaker 3: in a way that their grandparents, who were living in
Speaker 3: a village somewhere could never have contemplated.
Speaker 1: And I think that's part of the.
Speaker 3: Great Australian tapestry and dream and I don't think we
Speaker 3: should ever lose sight of that.
Speaker 4: See.
Speaker 3: One of the things I don't think we do in
Speaker 3: our country well enough is talk about the great migrant story,
Speaker 3: particularly since the Second World War. People came here with
Speaker 3: literally nothing out of war torn Europe. My parents and
Speaker 3: came here as tilers, as bricklayers, as teachers, as you know,
Speaker 3: agricultural workers, whatever. And now their grandkids are doctors and
Speaker 3: millionaires and you know, radio superstars, you know whatever. I mean,
Speaker 3: there's we should be holding those examples up as as
Speaker 3: examples of aspiration. We've got to be proud again of
Speaker 3: who we are as a people in a country. And
Speaker 3: people look at Australia and think you are the best
Speaker 3: country in the world, and sometimes I think we lose
Speaker 3: sight of that, and we should be embracing it and
Speaker 3: running with it and helping as many people along the
Speaker 3: way as we can.
Speaker 4: I have more to ask PC, PC donn't After this shortbreak,
Speaker 4: I will go into the personal life of the opposition leader,
Speaker 4: his marriage, his self care routine, and just what he
Speaker 4: has to say to the women and girls of Australia.
Speaker 2: We'll be right back. What do you love about Australia.
Speaker 3: I love the fact that we've got choice, We've got
Speaker 3: freedom of our expression of thought, and that if you
Speaker 3: start with nothing, you can get ahead and you can
Speaker 3: create an opportunity. And that might seem hard for some
Speaker 3: people at different points in their life, but we have
Speaker 3: an incredible society where we take care of people who
Speaker 3: are in need can't take care of themselves. But we
Speaker 3: also have a system where people can work hard, sacrifice
Speaker 3: and realize and I think we should protect and defend
Speaker 3: that at every opportunity.
Speaker 4: Your family obviously very supportive of your dreams and your career.
Speaker 4: But yet, and I know I alluded to the fact
Speaker 4: that my brother's a politician. When someone in the family
Speaker 4: decides to become a politician, everyone else.
Speaker 1: Is set branded.
Speaker 4: Yeah, everyone else is swept up with that, whether they
Speaker 4: want to or not. It's a form of selfishness that
Speaker 4: we have to hope in our politicians is underwritten by
Speaker 4: a desire for the greater good.
Speaker 3: I think that's right. I think it's also true that
Speaker 3: I mean, you know, in your family, you've got two
Speaker 3: famous people with pretty identifiable surnames. So any if your
Speaker 3: cousins or kids or whatever, you know, would automatically get
Speaker 3: the question are you related.
Speaker 1: To you know? Do you know?
Speaker 3: And And I talked to my cousins about it, and
Speaker 3: most of they say, mate, we're really proud of what
Speaker 3: you do, and we're very very happy to be asked
Speaker 3: the question and to answer it. And maybe that's just
Speaker 3: a you know, a brave sort of face that they're
Speaker 3: putting on it for me, but I'm I'm really conscious
Speaker 3: of it because, particularly with your own kids, they're not
Speaker 3: you know. I think it was once anmously said that
Speaker 3: they're they're conscripts. Right, they're not. Yeah, but they haven't
Speaker 3: sought a public life. And I suppose for many kids,
Speaker 3: the family you know, you're born into comes with upside
Speaker 3: and downside and and but they're yeah, look, they're they're
Speaker 3: they're balanced and they're good about it.
Speaker 1: But yeah, that that is a definite downside.
Speaker 4: What percentage of your family extended, because I gather you're
Speaker 4: quite close to your extended family shares your politics.
Speaker 1: I think there would be I think it'd be a maturity.
Speaker 4: Yeah, right are you Sometimes they're at a family barbecue
Speaker 4: going I'm not sure about sure.
Speaker 3: Is going to say generally not and generally like in
Speaker 3: most conversations with your friends as well. I've got a
Speaker 3: lot of mates who who wouldn't vote, who wouldn't hopefully
Speaker 3: they will at this election, but it wouldn't vote liberal normally,
Speaker 3: And you know, we get on like a house on fire.
Speaker 3: And generally it's a discussion about cricket or goal for family,
Speaker 3: or Olympics or whatever's in the news, and there's not
Speaker 3: a heavy conversation around politics, which actually is refreshing because
Speaker 3: you need to be able to switch off and.
Speaker 1: Just you know.
Speaker 4: I think also there is an appetite for people for
Speaker 4: people with for things not to be so binary. Yes,
Speaker 4: when people have divergent politics. And I always think someone
Speaker 4: said this, the bird needs the right wing and the
Speaker 4: left wing to fly, but that doesn't seem to be
Speaker 4: the case in the current climate.
Speaker 3: Well, I mean, if you go back to you know,
Speaker 3: ancient times, I mean the politicians.
Speaker 1: Were I do go back to back before you.
Speaker 3: But it's always been an adversarial It's like a courtroom
Speaker 3: environment where you've got each side of the argument, the
Speaker 3: prosecution and the defense, arguing vehemently for their belief I
Speaker 3: just think as long as it's done in a respectful way,
Speaker 3: you can have strong views. And as the Prime ministers
Speaker 3: pointed out, and as I've said publicly, I mean he
Speaker 3: and I get on well personally. We can have a conversation.
Speaker 3: If there's an issue around a national security issue that
Speaker 3: we need to deal with, what we do and we
Speaker 3: do it respectfully. Neither of us leak the conversation, So
Speaker 3: you know, I think we act in an honorable way,
Speaker 3: but we've just got a different pathway of getting to
Speaker 3: probably the same objective of what's best for our country.
Speaker 4: I think, touching on what you just said, a lot
Speaker 4: of people suspect that the seemingly too opposing sides of
Speaker 4: politics are more aligned with each other than you are
Speaker 4: with the interests of us.
Speaker 3: Think well, I think we're more aligned with each other
Speaker 3: than people realize. But generally that's because there's an obvious
Speaker 3: answer and you support it. It's a chicken in EG
Speaker 3: scenario as well, because the media aren't reporting the boring
Speaker 3: sort of consensus. You know, we found common ground today
Speaker 3: in Parliament and people were really pleased with the outcome.
Speaker 3: That rarely makes it onto the news. It's the it's
Speaker 3: the color and movement and that's what tunes people in.
Speaker 3: That's what you know, informs the clickbaits, that's what people
Speaker 3: want to read, the titillating bits and pieces about your
Speaker 3: property ownership or what you did or what you said,
Speaker 3: and the mundane stuff where there is agreement, which is
Speaker 3: probably eighty percent of the time and in the public's
Speaker 3: best interests. So I do think our stars align with
Speaker 3: where where the public is.
Speaker 1: That just sort of goes through to the keeper.
Speaker 4: People want to draw parallels between Australia and what's happened
Speaker 4: in America. So you're painted as some kind of down
Speaker 4: under Trump.
Speaker 3: Well, I'm accused of being not Trump enough to Trump,
Speaker 3: not Trump like Trump like. I mean, it's just your
Speaker 3: detractors will say, ah, you look like Trump while you're
Speaker 3: acting like Trump because they think that that is a
Speaker 3: way of landing a blow on you. I mean, that's
Speaker 3: what they're trying to do. I'm a very different person
Speaker 3: to President Trump. And you know, my biggest influence is
Speaker 3: in political life have been John Howard and Peter Costello,
Speaker 3: and I worked as assistant treasurer at Peter Costello. I still,
Speaker 3: you know, have a conversation with and see John Howard
Speaker 3: as a mentor. And you know, not that I agree
Speaker 3: with everything that he said or did or his different approaches,
Speaker 3: but there was a stability and there was a certainty
Speaker 3: and a strength in his leadership and character, and I
Speaker 3: admired that all and still do so. Yeah, Look, I
Speaker 3: think there will be things that we can agree with
Speaker 3: the US on and things that will have disagreements. I
Speaker 3: don't agree with President Trump at all in relation to
Speaker 3: Ukraine and what's happening there at the moment. I think
Speaker 3: that I think the incursion, that the invasion, the killing
Speaker 3: of people by Putin is an abomination, and so I
Speaker 3: don't like the characterization of that, but that's.
Speaker 1: How I see it.
Speaker 3: And I will always act in our country's best interest,
Speaker 3: and I think in a dynamic relationship like that, particularly
Speaker 3: with President Trump, you've got to have a Prime minister
Speaker 3: here in Australia who's prepared to stand up for our
Speaker 3: national interests, what we believe in, and.
Speaker 1: That I think is an essential.
Speaker 4: I mentioned this is conversation like has the potential to
Speaker 4: reach a vast sway of Australian women, and I want
Speaker 4: to give you a chance to speak directly to them.
Speaker 3: I want to be a prime minister who can govern
Speaker 3: for our country and for all Australians.
Speaker 1: But I strongly believe in.
Speaker 3: Making sure that people have dignity in their lives, women
Speaker 3: in particular, and that means first and foremost, running an
Speaker 3: economy where if you're sitting at home pulling your hair
Speaker 3: out in a garage or the back bedroom with your
Speaker 3: online business. I want to be a prime minister that
Speaker 3: creates an environment where you can make sales and that
Speaker 3: financial independence and success gives you options and opportunities. And
Speaker 3: I want to be a prime minister that can provide
Speaker 3: an environment where.
Speaker 1: You can afford to put a roof over your head and.
Speaker 3: To recover from a marriage breakdown or a violent relationship.
Speaker 3: And I want an opportunity where where people can, at
Speaker 3: different points in their life, feel comfortable about making choices
Speaker 3: that are right for them and facilitating those choices, and
Speaker 3: so that I think is important. When I go up
Speaker 3: to Alice Springs and speak to women in town camps
Speaker 3: or indigenous elders up there, their view is no different
Speaker 3: to women in the cities or frankly, a lot of
Speaker 3: parents are male or female, their instinct is to when
Speaker 3: you speak to them, what can I do for you?
Speaker 3: What are the priorities. I want a roof over my head.
Speaker 3: I want a safe environment. I want to be able
Speaker 3: to educate my kids. I want to be able to
Speaker 3: pay the bills. I want a good health system, and
Speaker 3: I want an environment where my kids, when they graduate
Speaker 3: from school or from a trade or from a university,
Speaker 3: can find a job. And they're pretty basic human instincts.
Speaker 2: And women also want physical autonomy.
Speaker 3: Yes, yeah, and again I mean it's people will want
Speaker 3: to concentrate in the health space. But I'm proud of
Speaker 3: the fact that I set up the Medical Research Future Fund,
Speaker 3: which has now got twenty two billion dollars in it
Speaker 3: provides a lot of research into breast cancer, into ovarian cancer,
Speaker 3: into brain cancers, cancers for children.
Speaker 4: What was your motivation for that? By the way, what
Speaker 4: was the impetus for that.
Speaker 3: Well, again, it's I think there is there's a human
Speaker 3: dignity element to being able to live in a country
Speaker 3: like ours and receive the medical attention. We've got some
Speaker 3: of the best researchers in the world, and I didn't
Speaker 3: think they had the stability in the money for their
Speaker 3: research that was required.
Speaker 2: And we've had a big brain drain as a result.
Speaker 3: Yes, And look, Australia is a market of twenty seven
Speaker 3: million people, so many of those researchers will automatically, at
Speaker 3: some stage in their career be attracted to London or
Speaker 3: to parts of Asia or Europe or the United States wherever.
Speaker 3: And in many cases that's a great thing because they
Speaker 3: expand their knowledge and they come back here when they
Speaker 3: want to raise their kids or when they want to retire,
Speaker 3: and they contribute to the you know, the health space
Speaker 3: here or the medical research space.
Speaker 1: So yeah, I think that's part of that thinking.
Speaker 3: And you know, and many other things that you can
Speaker 3: do if you manage the economy well and you've got
Speaker 3: good economic settings, you've got good revenues coming in, you
Speaker 3: can start to pay for different programs, and particularly mental
Speaker 3: health I think is a huge issue where we just
Speaker 3: haven't got it right in this country yet, and the
Speaker 3: number of young women presenting with mental health issues and
Speaker 3: online safety.
Speaker 2: Have you ever had issues like post policing or whatever.
Speaker 3: I think, not diagnosed, but I think if knowing what
Speaker 3: I know now about the impact that it has, even
Speaker 3: in the way in which you raise your own children,
Speaker 3: the way that we've been protective of them in a
Speaker 3: public place, you know, particularly of Rebecca, but the boys
Speaker 3: as well. Yes, I think, how can that not have
Speaker 3: an influence on you? And it's how you manage with
Speaker 3: that and the support you provide. And you know, for me,
Speaker 3: meditation is a big part of my life as well,
Speaker 3: which I find.
Speaker 2: That was surprising to me.
Speaker 3: I don't know why, but I find it a good
Speaker 3: reset and I find it a good clearing of your mind.
Speaker 3: And particularly you know, if you're starting at four point
Speaker 3: thirty five in the morning and you're not finishing until
Speaker 3: ten or eleven at night, you're going all day and
Speaker 3: you do need to take ten or twenty minutes just
Speaker 3: to reset, I think, and focus on yourself.
Speaker 1: And I think unless you're physically and mentally.
Speaker 3: Well, it's hard to do jobs like the one i'm
Speaker 3: in or like the one I'm aspiring to be.
Speaker 4: What do you do physically, by the way, I try
Speaker 4: and I always stay at a hotel with a good gym,
Speaker 4: so I try to go to the gym early or
Speaker 4: go for.
Speaker 2: A walk, very disciplined.
Speaker 3: But yeah, honestly, I don't know why, but I'm sure
Speaker 3: you know, the scientists can explain it better than I can.
Speaker 3: But I have a really flat start to the day
Speaker 3: if I don't do exercise, but I feel invigorated if
Speaker 3: I do. And you know, it means you're tired at
Speaker 3: the end of the day because you've got up earlier
Speaker 3: to do it. And sometimes in the guard I just
Speaker 3: hit the snooze button, sleep in.
Speaker 1: I'll do it in the afternoon, which of course never
Speaker 1: never happens.
Speaker 2: Nothing, nothing physical.
Speaker 4: Happens in the afternoon, not even afternoon to light exactly right.
Speaker 3: So yeah, so look, it's for me that that's an
Speaker 3: important part of the routine. And it also I just
Speaker 3: think out walking you can listen to a bit of music.
Speaker 2: Or not with Kira when you get the chance.
Speaker 3: Yes, yeah, we do, actually, yeah, which is it's not
Speaker 3: it's not a substitute for date night, but it is
Speaker 3: a good time to spend some time together and and
Speaker 3: you know, just have a chat in a relaxed environment.
Speaker 4: What is the secret of having a happy marriage for
Speaker 4: as long as you two have?
Speaker 3: I don't know, because I had plenty of unhappy relationships
Speaker 3: before that. Well, it just didn't work right despite your
Speaker 3: best efforts. So I think it depends on where you
Speaker 3: are in life. I think your own maturity obviously feeds
Speaker 3: into it. And you know, I get married way too
Speaker 3: young and the first time, yeah, and to an amazing person,
Speaker 3: but but we were just too young and headed in
Speaker 3: different directions, et cetera. And so so I think it's
Speaker 3: it's about your perspective on life. And I think not
Speaker 3: trying to change the other party is important. You can
Speaker 3: try and sort of smooth a few rough edges. What
Speaker 3: if they're wrong, Well then that's the that's their prerogative,
Speaker 3: and they can be wrong. And I think you've got
Speaker 3: to accept people for for the good and the bad,
Speaker 3: and you don't if you if you're chasing perfection every
Speaker 3: time and you want your own way every time, it
Speaker 3: just doesn't work. And you also need from my experience,
Speaker 3: and each their own and everyone's got their own formula.
Speaker 1: But for us, it's not letting things. I never want
Speaker 1: my head to hit the pillow.
Speaker 3: If you know we've had a disagreement about something, and
Speaker 3: I just think you should. You should finish each day
Speaker 3: in a good space, even if you've got to suck
Speaker 3: it up a bit and swallow a bit of pride,
Speaker 3: and you know, you might still have the discussion the
Speaker 3: next day. But I think goat bed at night knowing
Speaker 3: that the relationship means enough to you to try and
Speaker 3: resolve those problems.
Speaker 1: I also think you've got to spend a lot of
Speaker 1: time on that, that together time. Like it's sort of.
Speaker 3: A sort of a you know, geeky thing to sort
Speaker 3: of say, or maybe a.
Speaker 1: You know, a sloppy thing to say.
Speaker 3: But I just think if you're not able to speak
Speaker 3: with each other freely and have that discussion, then you've
Speaker 3: got to work out how you can do that. And
Speaker 3: it's I don't know, like I've married somebody who is.
Speaker 4: It.
Speaker 3: We're sort of ing and yang in terms of organized
Speaker 3: so curly. Always when the kids were young, things were packed,
Speaker 3: lunches were made. She was ready to get out of
Speaker 3: the door while I was still getting out of the shit.
Speaker 3: And she's always been well organized like that, and I
Speaker 3: think that where you can find that in and yang
Speaker 3: in different parts of your relationship. You compliment each other ultimately,
Speaker 3: so but you can still have big points of difference.
Speaker 4: Okay, I would like to ask you one thing. Should
Speaker 4: you win the election, do you think you're going to.
Speaker 1: I think we can win the election.
Speaker 3: It hasn't happened since nineteen thirty one for a first
Speaker 3: term government to lose, so it's a huge task and
Speaker 3: we've got to win about twenty seats, which is a
Speaker 3: big undertaking. But there's no doubt in my mind that
Speaker 3: we can win if we work hard, we're disciplined, and
Speaker 3: we put the policies out that can capture people's imaginations.
Speaker 4: Well, if you do win, I would like to invite
Speaker 4: you to come back thank you exactly a year from today. Deal,
Speaker 4: and I would like to know given the ethos, the
Speaker 4: mission statement of Mama Maya, which is to improve the
Speaker 4: world for women and girls.
Speaker 1: Yes, I would like.
Speaker 4: To discuss with you in that intervening period what you
Speaker 4: have done to that end.
Speaker 3: Well, firstly, an absolute commitment and it should be a
Speaker 3: conversation that continues on for the year about what we
Speaker 3: can do to make lives for women and young girls better,
Speaker 3: and particularly, as I said, a real focus with online
Speaker 3: and safety online and being able to deal with the
Speaker 3: transmission of images, and how women and girls can feel
Speaker 3: safe living a bigger part of their lives online than
Speaker 3: they ever have. But there are many other issues, housing etc.
Speaker 1: That I spoke about before. K So I think there's a.
Speaker 3: Lot of work for us to do, and it'd be
Speaker 3: great to work with you and great to be back
Speaker 3: here in twelve month's time.
Speaker 4: I'll shake on that. And then I want to ask
Speaker 4: you one more thing. Yeah, do you know the saying
Speaker 4: hard men make good times. Good times make weak mens
Speaker 4: in weak men make hard times.
Speaker 1: I have heard that.
Speaker 2: Yes, you were strong man.
Speaker 1: I'll let you either the judge of that.
Speaker 3: I believe that I have a strength of character and
Speaker 3: and ability to make tough decisions, to exercise compassion when
Speaker 3: it's needed and regularly, but to make the tough decisions
Speaker 3: for our country to keep people safe, to create a
Speaker 3: strong economy. I do believe that I've got that strength
Speaker 3: and I believe I can demonstrate that as Prime Minister.
Speaker 2: Peter Dutton, thank you for sharing yourself with no filter.
Speaker 1: Thank you very much. Kate, thank you.
Speaker 4: Okay, I feel like I know a little bit more
Speaker 4: of the enigma that is Peter Craig Dutton Pace if
Speaker 4: you're wanting more politics in your day. We also have
Speaker 4: an episode with Prime Minister Anthony albanizi how he feels
Speaker 4: he's gone over the past three years and just how
Speaker 4: those wedding plans are coming along. There is a link
Speaker 4: to that conversation in the show notes from MoMA Maya.
Speaker 4: You're listening to No Filter. I'm your host, kateline Brook.
Speaker 4: I'll be back in your ears next week.