Speaker 1: So you're listening to a Muma Mia podcast.
Speaker 2: Mamma Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waders
Speaker 2: that this podcast is recorded on from Mamma Mia. Welcome
Speaker 2: to the Spill your daily pop culture fix. I'm Laura
Speaker 2: Brodnick and I'm Cacenula Kid, and we have a big
Speaker 2: build up of stories over the weekend. That's the fun
Speaker 2: thing about a Monday show is that on Fridays we
Speaker 2: do like our fun little TV movie Deep Dive, and
Speaker 2: then over the weekend, I'm just in my notes up
Speaker 2: the whole time, all the little solicious updates that we
Speaker 2: have to talk about.
Speaker 1: I am going to just also address my voice. I
Speaker 1: have had a flu and I sound I've got my
Speaker 1: sexy flam going on.
Speaker 2: So yeah, it's like that episode of Friends, you know,
Speaker 2: where Phoebe gets sick and then she has this really
Speaker 2: sexy singing voice and then she tries to get sick again.
Speaker 2: So no, you do sound very sultry.
Speaker 1: Thank you very much, And it's for all of the
Speaker 1: sultry news that we've got today.
Speaker 2: Yes, So coming up on the show today, there's been
Speaker 2: a whole big divorce Converse station around Hayley Bieber and
Speaker 2: Justin Bieber. It only took one photo to cement that story.
Speaker 2: But we have an update that happened as we were
Speaker 2: walking into the studio. Actually breaking news here, Investigative journalism
Speaker 2: at play. Also, Timmy Hambrow has announced her divorce with
Speaker 2: a very emotional video. The response from the public, which
Speaker 2: is what we're going to be talking about, along with
Speaker 2: how the separation was bradcrumbed, has been very intense. So
Speaker 2: we're going to get into that. But first we have
Speaker 2: an update in the Justin Baldoni and Blake Lively legal
Speaker 2: case involving Taylor Swift. So a few weeks ago we
Speaker 2: gave the update that Taylor Swift had been subpoenaed by
Speaker 2: Justin Baldonie's legal team basically to potentially appear in Core,
Speaker 2: but also to have her phone in computer and computer
Speaker 2: gone through to get evidence from the case. And they
Speaker 2: put forward a motion to dismiss it, and we thought
Speaker 2: that had gone ahead, but we had an update to
Speaker 2: say the judge in the case has actually stepped in.
Speaker 2: So a judge ruled on Wednesday that Justin Baldoni can
Speaker 2: obtain any messages between Blake Lively and Taylor Swift that
Speaker 2: are about the making of it ends with us and
Speaker 2: specifically to do with the sexual assault allegations that she's
Speaker 2: put forward. So in his order, the judge said that
Speaker 2: he found the messages can be very relevant to the
Speaker 2: case and that a protective order in place was to
Speaker 2: prevent them from leaking to the press. So that's been
Speaker 2: the big thing is that Justin Baldoni is saying and
Speaker 2: his legal team is saying, that these messages could hold
Speaker 2: the key to kind of proving his story right in
Speaker 2: terms of how much Taylor Swift was involved in the
Speaker 2: making of the movie, but more so about his behavior
Speaker 2: on set. And then Taylor Swift's team and Blake Lively's
Speaker 2: team separately because apparently something is going on behind the
Speaker 2: scenes there, both came out and said that Justin's team
Speaker 2: was doing this just to kind of pull her into
Speaker 2: the story, yeah, and get her and use her public
Speaker 2: profile and her fandom to bring more attention to his
Speaker 2: side of the case. So the judge has come out
Speaker 2: and said that he's like overall the previous thing about
Speaker 2: her not being able to be subpoened, so that the
Speaker 2: messages can be used, but there's a privacy bare them
Speaker 2: so they can't be leaked to the press.
Speaker 1: It'll be interesting to see if they don't get leaked,
Speaker 1: because it's one thing to say that, but as we
Speaker 1: all know, these things often get let out. So I'm
Speaker 1: sure they'll be heavily redacted. But I mean, this is
Speaker 1: a pretty big ruling considering the fact that we're actually
Speaker 1: now looking at private text messages between Taylor Swift and
Speaker 1: Blake Lively, Like this is it's not a light thing.
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know if I want anyone just
Speaker 1: like grabbing my text messages.
Speaker 2: Yeah exactly.
Speaker 1: The proviso that it has to be either about the
Speaker 1: movie or the sexual assault allegations, I think is really key.
Speaker 1: So he's not going to get access his team and
Speaker 1: not going to get access to every single text message.
Speaker 1: But I'm interested to see how they police that, Like
Speaker 1: how do they know that she's given over everything unless
Speaker 1: they go through everything?
Speaker 2: Yeah exactly that I guess potentially they have a third
Speaker 2: party go through her phone just played or do a
Speaker 2: keyword search. Well that was the thing in the markl
Speaker 2: and Prince Harry trial when they were in that when
Speaker 2: in that back and forth big legal case with the
Speaker 2: British press is that what they can do is not
Speaker 2: say like we want to see all your text messages,
Speaker 2: but we want every message and email with these key words.
Speaker 2: And that's what Megan Michael was saying at the time.
Speaker 2: She's like, the other side asked for words like Kate
Speaker 2: William Archie Love all these kind of like weird words
Speaker 2: because they were obviously trying to dig around and find
Speaker 2: really salacious stuff. I think in this case too, because
Speaker 2: this side of it has been so public and there's
Speaker 2: been this real public speculation that Blake Lively and Taylor
Speaker 2: Swift's like very long term, very close friendship, like she's
Speaker 2: godmother to her children, has come to an end. There
Speaker 2: was the whole Travis Kelcey unfollowing Ryan Reynolds thing. Taylorsof's
Speaker 2: team put out a statement after the subpoena was initially
Speaker 2: pulled back, saying that she had wanted to have nothing
Speaker 2: to do with this case. And I think what's really
Speaker 2: telling if that, if you go through some of the
Speaker 2: legal documents Blake Lively's team attempted to this is like
Speaker 2: coming from the reports from that have been put forward
Speaker 2: from their legal teams, is that Blake Lively's team attempted
Speaker 2: to bargain with Justin Baldonie's team saying that they would
Speaker 2: hand over a lot of different things or video footage
Speaker 2: related to the film, unreducted versions of communication, or they
Speaker 2: would hand over all these other things listed in Justin
Speaker 2: Baldoni's complaint if Taylor Swift's text messages weren't subpoened as
Speaker 2: like kind of a bargaining chip. And then Justin Baldoni's
Speaker 2: team said no.
Speaker 1: I mean, look, I think Taylor would be absolutely furious
Speaker 1: that she's been dragged into this because you know, she's
Speaker 1: had such a great reputation for the last quite a
Speaker 1: few years. Now. You know, she's taken back her power
Speaker 1: doing all of her re recordings, and she's fought really
Speaker 1: hard to have this reputation and to get sort of
Speaker 1: dragged in by Blake Lively and it almost feels like unwillingly,
Speaker 1: unwillingly dragged into it feels kind of not very fair.
Speaker 1: So I can imagine that that would be a relationship
Speaker 1: ender for a friendship. Yeah, and it seems like she
Speaker 1: really is. She's going, I don't want to have anything
Speaker 1: to do with this. I'm stepping away.
Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, Well, this court case is still taking place
Speaker 2: in March of next year, which felt so far away,
Speaker 2: but it's creeping closer. But I think we'll have as
Speaker 2: I go through this discovery period and as all these
Speaker 2: emails and different bits of evidence get lead, there'll be
Speaker 2: more updates. But yeah, at the moment, those text messages
Speaker 2: are one hundred percent part of the case, Nana. So
Speaker 2: onto another story that's been bubbling away over the weekend,
Speaker 2: and that is this photo that has really cemented this
Speaker 2: idea that Hailey Bieber and Justin Bieber are headed for divorce.
Speaker 2: So what happened is that Haley is out and about
Speaker 2: New York and she's, you know, doing what a lot
Speaker 2: of starlet's do when they're in New York. She's going
Speaker 2: to all the popular restaurants, so she's walking along those
Speaker 2: streets and she's looking gorgeous in her beautiful fits and
Speaker 2: getting photographed. And that is half the point of going
Speaker 2: to New York is to kind of get that if
Speaker 2: you're famous, to get that publicity. The only thing is
Speaker 2: is that on Thursday she was photographed out and about
Speaker 2: going for breakfast and going for dinner that night, both
Speaker 2: times without her huge inc aangement ring that she always
Speaker 2: has on her finger was not pictured. She later again
Speaker 2: went out that night with Camilla Maroon and Suki Waterhouse,
Speaker 2: two other women who have both really been through the
Speaker 2: ringer in the past, with famous men Leonardo DiCaprio and
Speaker 2: Bradley Cooper, respectively. So I feel like that dinner, I
Speaker 2: would have even anything to still on at dinner and
Speaker 2: just hear about them talking about these famous childish men
Speaker 2: that two of them escaped and one of them is
Speaker 2: still married to. So these photos seemingly harmless except for
Speaker 2: the fact that her ring wasn't pictured. Were just spread everywhere,
Speaker 2: all over the Internet, all over TikTok, all over every
Speaker 2: social feed. All the tabloids picked it up, and it
Speaker 2: really cemented the idea that they're headed for divorce after
Speaker 2: all the negative speculation. Why are you laughing?
Speaker 1: The reason I'm laughing is because the amount of times
Speaker 1: I forget to put my engagement ring.
Speaker 2: On, Well, that's what I was thinking, Like.
Speaker 1: I put it on today because I knew we were
Speaker 1: talking about it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you don't want me to say to you, are
Speaker 2: you getting divorced?
Speaker 1: I often forget to put it on because I take
Speaker 1: it off. I don't sleep in my ring. Is it
Speaker 1: possible that she just forgot to put her ring on.
Speaker 2: Well, that was my I thought too, because I have
Speaker 2: seen her out because so much of Hailey Baber's brand,
Speaker 2: along with owning her business, is that she does these
Speaker 2: pap walks a lot of the time. And she's even
Speaker 2: said she works with a stylist who is specifically just
Speaker 2: for street style, so she pays the same amount to
Speaker 2: her and Kendall Janna both do. They pay the same
Speaker 2: amount to their street stylist as other celebrities do for
Speaker 2: a red carpet stylist. And so this woman will buy
Speaker 2: these clothes, put these outfits together, and she'll literally just
Speaker 2: wear them to walk down the street and get back
Speaker 2: in the car. But that like really ups their their
Speaker 2: like online cachet. It's like built their fandom. So it's
Speaker 2: a really smart way to do it. So my only
Speaker 2: thought was, if half of your brand is off these
Speaker 2: paparazzi style shoots and you're paying thousands and thousands of
Speaker 2: dollars to this really well known stylist to style you
Speaker 2: for these street style moments, that's and you don't wear
Speaker 2: your wedding ring. To me, that's a little bit more
Speaker 2: telling than just like the average lady out and about
Speaker 2: who hasn't popped her ring on.
Speaker 1: Yeah, understand what you're saying, but I mean the thing
Speaker 1: is Saturday night, so two nights later, so there was
Speaker 1: two images of her not wearing a ring, and then
Speaker 1: at the girls' night. So when she steps back out
Speaker 1: on the town, she's got the ring back on her finger.
Speaker 2: Yes, And actually as we were coming into the studio,
Speaker 2: she was papped again walking up and down the street.
Speaker 2: I can't even tell where she's going because it seemingly
Speaker 2: is that she's just walking up and down the road
Speaker 2: in front of like these New York hotels where I'm
Speaker 2: not even sure if she's staying there, and the ring
Speaker 2: is very visible on her finger. So yeah, it could
Speaker 2: It could be just that she didn't put the ring on,
Speaker 2: or she maybe just didn't go with this carefully curated
Speaker 2: outfit that she had paid thousands of dollars for someone
Speaker 2: to pick out for her.
Speaker 1: I think she just forgot.
Speaker 2: I have seen her out and about without her ring before.
Speaker 2: It's not something that I'm ever clocking. But but my
Speaker 2: only thing is if you're being watched so intently, it
Speaker 2: just feels like a bit of a choice potentially not
Speaker 2: to put it on, even to say like, I'm not
Speaker 2: gonna wear it and I don't care because it doesn't
Speaker 2: go with my outfit, or I'm not gonna wear it
Speaker 2: out tonight and I don't care what people think. I
Speaker 2: just think it's come off the back of her bit
Speaker 2: of everything.
Speaker 1: Just quietly.
Speaker 2: I do think like a huge diamond with her ring.
Speaker 1: Is pretty bloody gorgeous. I do really like her ring.
Speaker 2: Can you imagine it doesn't go this huge diamond doesn't
Speaker 2: go with my outfit?
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, it's I think that I don't think it's
Speaker 1: that it didn't go with her outfit. Might look I'm
Speaker 1: going to give Hailey the benefit of the doubt because
Speaker 1: they really I feel like she's been through the ring up.
Speaker 1: There has been so much speculation about her relationship with Justin.
Speaker 1: We talked about it here on the Spill a number
Speaker 1: of times. They keep saying we're fine. Then that people
Speaker 1: keep coming up with ways to say we're not fine.
Speaker 1: You know, but you know it's like where they smoke
Speaker 1: this fire. Maybe there is some validity behind this, but
Speaker 1: until we hear otherwise, I'm giving her the benefit of
Speaker 1: the doubt and just saying that she forgot to put
Speaker 1: her ring on, Yes exactly, I mean you forgot to
Speaker 1: put jewelry on today.
Speaker 2: I know I've got no not none of them are
Speaker 2: engaged in ring. But I forgot all of my jewelry
Speaker 2: today and I nearly didn't come to work. I feel
Speaker 2: like if you forget your jewelry, you shouldered to take
Speaker 2: a personal day. Both Haley Beaber and I were in
Speaker 2: the same boat. But I also think with this like
Speaker 2: it's just a little I think just because the build
Speaker 2: up from the last week, especially so Justin Bieber put
Speaker 2: up this Instagram story saying he was being given the
Speaker 2: silent treatment, people just assumed that was something to do
Speaker 2: with Haley. There was also that thing a while ago
Speaker 2: where they'd unfollow each other on Instagram, which they do
Speaker 2: a lot. They said it was a glitch, which I
Speaker 2: don't know. Glitch is on Instagram get a bad rap
Speaker 2: because every time a celebrity unfollows someone accidentally posts something
Speaker 2: like something they say it's a glitch. We don't know.
Speaker 2: There was. Obviously Justin Bieber's been a bit on the
Speaker 2: record with some people who previously work with him that
Speaker 2: he's had some mental health issues. There is something there,
Speaker 2: he's had some breakdowns with paparazzi. To be fair, the
Speaker 2: paparazzi were literally like chasing him through the street and
Speaker 2: half knocking him over, like I would have yelled at
Speaker 2: them as well.
Speaker 1: I do think Justin Bieber has something deeper going on.
Speaker 1: I do think that he's probably in a little bit
Speaker 1: of a crisis at the moment. I don't know. Did
Speaker 1: you say their performance with Sissa, Yeah yeah, and all
Speaker 1: these people were talking about how he was doing the fentifold.
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, and they were playing it was super inappropriate.
Speaker 1: And we're saying it was the reason that he was
Speaker 1: like nodding off is because he was on some really
Speaker 1: hard drugs. Yeah, yeah, that's that's that was the speculation.
Speaker 1: I don't obviously, we don't know what's going on with him,
Speaker 1: but it's pretty clear from the from looking in he
Speaker 1: doesn't look very well. Yes, whether that's just exhaustion or
Speaker 1: you know, maybe having a mental health crisis. Like, who
Speaker 1: knows what's going on. But as we've seen so many
Speaker 1: times with celebrities, if you keep pushing them, it's not
Speaker 1: gonna make anything any better, you know what I mean. Now,
Speaker 1: he's obviously going through something, whether their relationship is on
Speaker 1: the rocks or not. They have the right to be
Speaker 1: able to tell us when they're ready to, but they're
Speaker 1: really doubling down on the fact that they're okay.
Speaker 2: Yes, well that's that's the thing. They're doing so much
Speaker 2: press in one corner, and then these like a photo
Speaker 2: without her without her ring, or that audit that was
Speaker 2: done the other day that show that he was like
Speaker 2: allegedly bankrupt, that's why he sold his masters, and then
Speaker 2: that kind of flipped the story again. And then she'll
Speaker 2: post like a beautiful photo of them with their baby
Speaker 2: jack Blues, but then like a negative story. It's like this,
Speaker 2: it's like they're keep trying to like build up this
Speaker 2: wall of like we're fine, we're fine, and they're like
Speaker 2: another wave of bad publicity just keeps coming in and
Speaker 2: just like knocking that wall over.
Speaker 1: You think the sale of Road would give her a
Speaker 1: couple more weeks, she only got like one good week
Speaker 1: of press out. Well.
Speaker 2: Well, to be fair, that was a little bit of
Speaker 2: justin Bieber's fault, because like that whole thing happened around
Speaker 2: the time she did that Vogue article and he put
Speaker 2: up and she was on the cover of Vogue, which
Speaker 2: is like huge, and then he put up saying I'd
Speaker 2: never thought she'd be on the cover of Vogue, and
Speaker 2: it's like, like she's trying to do good publicity for you.
Speaker 2: The interesting thing in that Vogue article is that she
Speaker 2: did like she referenced exactly the conversation we're having now.
Speaker 2: She was like, I just have to accept that people
Speaker 2: will never believe that we're happily married. She's like, I
Speaker 2: kept thinking, like, once we got engaged, now people will
Speaker 2: believe it. Once we got married, now people will believe it.
Speaker 2: And then she was like, and now we have a baby, like,
Speaker 2: now surely people will leave us alone. But I just
Speaker 2: you kind of kind of like feel her defeat in
Speaker 2: that Vogue article, and I think that that is probably
Speaker 2: how she's seeing, like feeling at the moment seeing all
Speaker 2: these photos everywhere people thinking that they're getting divorced because
Speaker 2: of that photo, and you're just like, like, now that
Speaker 2: that story is out there, like you can't put the
Speaker 2: genie back in the bottle.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think, you know what, We're gonna be talking
Speaker 1: a lot about them this year. I feel I think
Speaker 1: this is at the end of the Hailey justin drama.
Speaker 1: I do think she just left it on the on
Speaker 1: the counter. She forgot to put her ring on. Yeah,
Speaker 1: she was putting cream on her hands or something. She
Speaker 1: forgot to put her ring back on. That's my speculation.
Speaker 1: It happens. We've got some more relationship news as well.
Speaker 1: Tammy Hembrou and Matt Zukowski have split, confirming their divorce
Speaker 1: after less than a year of marriage. Now. She released
Speaker 1: a seven minute TikTok video on her account the other
Speaker 1: day app basically confirming what a lot of people have
Speaker 1: been speculating for the last few weeks. So Tammy and Matt.
Speaker 1: Matt used to be on Love Island. They met, had
Speaker 1: this beautiful wedding in Byron Bay. She wore the most
Speaker 1: beautiful pale pink.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was gorgeous.
Speaker 1: That was a really beautiful dress, like stunning wedding. She
Speaker 1: walked down the side of the pool. It was a
Speaker 1: really glamorous, gorgeous wedding, but had like a seventiered cake.
Speaker 1: It was very extravagant. Less than a year after getting married,
Speaker 1: they're divorced now. In this TikTok video, she is basically
Speaker 1: talking about how nasty everyone is. So I'm gonna just
Speaker 1: have a quick listen to this.
Speaker 2: Claire.
Speaker 3: Obviously, I've like, I get a lot of nasty comments
Speaker 3: being like, oh another marriage, like this is my first marriage,
Speaker 3: just FYI, But no comment that anyone could say, like,
Speaker 3: these comments haven't even been really getting to me, because
Speaker 3: nothing anyone could say could make me.
Speaker 4: Feel like more like shit than I already do, like
Speaker 4: more humiliated or more like I already like think that
Speaker 4: about myself right now.
Speaker 3: So I don't think those comments are getting to me
Speaker 3: because I'm already there.
Speaker 1: Okay, So she's so here, we can see Tammy. She's
Speaker 1: obviously really upset. She's talking about how you know, the
Speaker 1: fact that the backlashes being a lot of people are
Speaker 1: like a calm on lady, which I kind of have
Speaker 1: to admit, I kind of feel.
Speaker 2: No, I understand because that has been the sentiment from
Speaker 2: a lot of different people. It's interesting because I feel
Speaker 2: like there's been such a build up to this. I mean,
Speaker 2: there was so much sort of back and forth before
Speaker 2: their wedding in December over whether or not they would
Speaker 2: go through with it. Because they are one of those couples.
Speaker 2: They are a little bit like Haley and Justin where
Speaker 2: sometimes they'll do these little public things like unfollow each
Speaker 2: other where you feel like they are just having a
Speaker 2: tiff behind the scenes, but because they're so public, it
Speaker 2: blows up into a big thing. And all those photos
Speaker 2: came out leading up to their wedding where it looked
Speaker 2: like Tammy was like breaking down at her hens party
Speaker 2: and crying. People speculated it was because she was unhappy
Speaker 2: she was getting married, or that Matt had done something,
Speaker 2: And then every time something like a story like that
Speaker 2: bubbled up. I guess because they're both such huge influences,
Speaker 2: They've got these huge public profiles. She also owns a business,
Speaker 2: he does a podcast, like so much of their life
Speaker 2: is very very public, and it's almost like they had
Speaker 2: to keep stepping in and doing damage control leading up
Speaker 2: to the wedding, and then even after the wedding, there's
Speaker 2: been such a huge build up to this divorce announcement.
Speaker 2: So like again, they were following and following each other
Speaker 2: on Instagram, which.
Speaker 1: Is there was a lot of like lip syncing breakup
Speaker 1: video like breakup songs like this has been people have
Speaker 1: been speculating this for a long time. Yes, they had
Speaker 1: kind of been the writing's been on the wall.
Speaker 2: Well exactly like, they haven't been pictured together in months.
Speaker 2: They were sort of avoiding talking about each other in
Speaker 2: interviews and all that sort of stuff. And then just
Speaker 2: before this came out, she had missus Zikowski like in
Speaker 2: her Instagram and then she deleted that first kind of
Speaker 2: let people see that information, let them bubble away with
Speaker 2: all their thoughts, and then put this video out.
Speaker 1: My feeling is this, She's clearly someone who loves deeply
Speaker 1: and loves passionately, and there are people who who love
Speaker 1: like that and fall hard and fast. She hasn't been
Speaker 1: married before, she has been engaged before to her. I
Speaker 1: think it's her third child's baby daddy. I think she
Speaker 1: was engaged to him. She's got three kids. You know,
Speaker 1: she's like, she's been through it. I don't feel sorry
Speaker 1: for her really because and the reason I don't feel
Speaker 1: it makes it sound really harsh. It makes me sound
Speaker 1: like I'm being mean. But you're dating this person, you
Speaker 1: have this massive weddings, this big display of love eight
Speaker 1: months that is nothing in the scheme of a relationship
Speaker 1: that is nothing.
Speaker 2: And also eight months they've announced it like it obviously
Speaker 2: happened a few months ago.
Speaker 1: How can you give up that quickly if you're really
Speaker 1: like eight months is like that.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: And the reason I say that, like, and I'm not hered.
Speaker 1: I'm not trying to sound like a like holier than
Speaker 1: their relationship person, but I've been in a relationship with
Speaker 1: my partner since, like for sixteen years. Eight months is nothing.
Speaker 1: And I can tell you right now we've had periods
Speaker 1: of eight months where I haven't wanted to talk to him.
Speaker 1: But it doesn't mean that I've just like given up,
Speaker 1: do you know what I mean? I feel like, you know,
Speaker 1: she had this whole idea of this fairytale romance and
Speaker 1: then it didn't work out, and I'm like, Okay, well
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna get like.
Speaker 2: But I don't think it's And again, I've gotta I
Speaker 2: don't know these people, Like obviously, I know I know
Speaker 2: their public profiles, but I have like no and I
Speaker 2: don't only know like the surface level of their public profiles.
Speaker 2: Like I'm not a huge follower of both of the
Speaker 2: men anyway. But so when you say you don't feel sorry,
Speaker 2: you're talking about that like that TikTok where she that
Speaker 2: she put up where it like it's it's also set
Speaker 2: up I think to be very and I'm not sort
Speaker 2: of calling her like a mastermind or anything, but I
Speaker 2: think someone who has built their entire public profile off
Speaker 2: sharing videos of her life, if you're gonna post your
Speaker 2: marriage ending video, you put a lot of thought and
Speaker 2: time into how you do it. So I do think
Speaker 2: it was quite curated in the way that she's just
Speaker 2: sort of sitting in her closet, and it's not a
Speaker 2: fancy looking closet, like I do think it is a
Speaker 2: huge closet, but she's kind of sitting in one little
Speaker 2: corner of it. There's all like the just the white
Speaker 2: plastic hangers hanging behind her. She kind of looks like
Speaker 2: she's just sort of just very casually sitting, Like her
Speaker 2: makeup looks gorgeous, but like very natural. She's got like
Speaker 2: a really soft yellow top on. All these things to
Speaker 2: kind of just be like, this is relatable, this is vulnerable,
Speaker 2: and it's not set like an opulent part of the
Speaker 2: huge house we know she lives in. So I do
Speaker 2: think that that was kind of set up in terms
Speaker 2: of just knowing that also a lot of people who
Speaker 2: don't follow her normally would come and watch the breakup video,
Speaker 2: and knowing I think all these eyes would be on it.
Speaker 2: But I also think, like the video itself, like I
Speaker 2: did feel bad for her. I thought this was a
Speaker 2: hugely vulnerable thing to share and like a really emotional
Speaker 2: thing to look at. I don't know, maybe I'm just
Speaker 2: a sad but I felt really bad, but.
Speaker 1: I didn't Like I think she's being genuine when she
Speaker 1: says she's humiliated. Absolutely, I do think she is. I
Speaker 1: don't blame her for falling hard, like I don't blame
Speaker 1: her for falling hard and fast for someone I don't.
Speaker 1: I don't blame her, but I don't really feel sorry
Speaker 1: for her, because like you're thirty one years old, lady,
Speaker 1: Like you're you're a grown ass woman, you've got three kids,
Speaker 1: Like yeah, I know, But I just think him as well,
Speaker 1: Like I'm not just putting this on her, like I'm
Speaker 1: also putting this on you, like both they both are
Speaker 1: responsible for the press.
Speaker 2: But also we don't like the thing in the video
Speaker 2: is like she talked a lot about like she's like
Speaker 2: I need to take responsibility. I've made bad relationship choices.
Speaker 2: I need to like be you know, thinking of my kids.
Speaker 2: So she said all that, but she didn't actually say
Speaker 2: why they broke up, like for all we know, and
Speaker 2: again this is just allegedly, but for all we know,
Speaker 2: like he cheated on her or she cheated on him,
Speaker 2: like we just don't know. There were all those photos
Speaker 2: that came out, like just before she put the announcement
Speaker 2: out of him with a journalist. I don't want to
Speaker 2: say her name because I don't know if she's getting
Speaker 2: a lot of hate and that sort of stuff, But
Speaker 2: there were photos that came out. They're being photos previously,
Speaker 2: so it's one of those things we just don't know
Speaker 2: what happened. But I just think also, and again I
Speaker 2: feel like I'm really projecting on this woman who I
Speaker 2: don't know, but I feel like there still is this
Speaker 2: huge thing, especially if you live a very public life,
Speaker 2: to have that big fairy tail wedding and just to
Speaker 2: lock it down. So it kind of does feel like
Speaker 2: they were in that situation where it just went too
Speaker 2: hard and too fast and the big wedding was locked
Speaker 2: in and they engage like they're engagement was this huge
Speaker 2: thing on a beautiful overseas tropic or island on the beach, and.
Speaker 1: Just like just pump the brakes for a second.
Speaker 2: I know, But I also just think that some people
Speaker 2: just live very like accelerated live.
Speaker 1: I know, but this is the thing, the thing that
Speaker 1: really can you imagine being a guest at that wedding?
Speaker 2: Oh no? Can I just and I have been to
Speaker 2: weddings like that, Like haven't you been to weddings like that?
Speaker 2: Where you're sitting there and it's so opulent, so over
Speaker 2: the top, and you're looking at these people and sometimes
Speaker 2: I just feel like I'm like a crazy person in
Speaker 2: a horror movie where like everyone's been taken around by clones.
Speaker 2: Because I look around and I'm like, we all know
Speaker 2: this is a terrible idea.
Speaker 1: Do you need to do like a return policy if
Speaker 1: it's within twelve months, like you know, can I get
Speaker 1: my gift back?
Speaker 2: I mean, look, if their marriage ends terrible after a
Speaker 2: few months, I'm happy for them to keep the gift.
Speaker 2: But I'm just saying, we've all gone to weddings where
Speaker 2: you're like, I just feel like this like the train
Speaker 2: had just left the station and they had to stay
Speaker 2: on it, and we're all sitting here agreen that these
Speaker 2: people shouldn't be getting married, and they're saying all these
Speaker 2: things to each other in front of.
Speaker 1: Ass ingenuous well, yes, exactly, you know, I mean, like
Speaker 1: professing your love for each other and then eight months,
Speaker 1: eight months, and that's what we know. So let's just
Speaker 1: say they split up four months ago or whatever. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so you're saying to me, you're professing your love to
Speaker 1: each other with this multi you know, hundreds and thousands
Speaker 1: of dollars on this wedding, talking about how much you
Speaker 1: adore each other, and then four months, six months, like
Speaker 1: it's done.
Speaker 2: I know, but again I don't performative. Well, I think
Speaker 2: performative is why a lot of people get stuck in
Speaker 2: these situations because once you set up this huge wedding
Speaker 2: and people book travel and you and you do all
Speaker 2: this stuff, it would be so hard to pull the plug.
Speaker 2: And I feel like that's what so many people who
Speaker 2: have had marriages that have ended really shortly like. And
Speaker 2: it's always the women who have to come out and
Speaker 2: explain it and say everything. But like, and I think,
Speaker 2: like it happens more than we kind of realize, just
Speaker 2: like when it happens on a huge scale to a celebrity,
Speaker 2: it seems bigger, Like the same thing happened with Kim
Speaker 2: Kardashi and when she married Chris Humphreys, like she was
Speaker 2: at the end, was like sobbing and saying, I'm so humiliated.
Speaker 2: I think it must be like it must feel like
Speaker 2: a deep humiliation. But she was just saying it was
Speaker 2: too much like the wedding was all set up like
Speaker 2: people what everyone was later it was this huge, opulent thing.
Speaker 2: And I also think about like Olivia Molly Rodgers, who
Speaker 2: was talked about in her podcast and she's written about
Speaker 2: it for Mamma Mia, where she also said that to
Speaker 2: her when she was getting married, that she was also
Speaker 2: feeling those doubts leading up into the wedding day, but
Speaker 2: she also just like it was she just felt like
Speaker 2: it was a bit too late to pull out. And
Speaker 2: I think also a lot of these women just think,
Speaker 2: like leading up to these weddings, like it's very heightened,
Speaker 2: there's a lot of stress. And I think what something
Speaker 2: they all seem to tell themselves is once we get
Speaker 2: through this and we get back to normal life, things
Speaker 2: will be better. So we just have to get through,
Speaker 2: you know, like you just cut compartment, right.
Speaker 1: I do feel a little bit sorry for her, but
Speaker 1: also but I just I just I just look at
Speaker 1: it and I'm Forgod's sake.
Speaker 2: And again, I think that's what a lot of people.
Speaker 2: I was like deep in the comments for all of
Speaker 2: this because I wanted to see how people are reacting
Speaker 2: and apart from some people being like, I think you're
Speaker 2: the problem, and I'm like, oh, it's a bit harsh,
Speaker 2: Like it's a bit harsh having like three partners and
Speaker 2: your thirty is like not that, it's just that she's
Speaker 2: a public figure, so it seems.
Speaker 1: More than three kids. I think. Yeah, I think it's
Speaker 1: the kids thing that I think a lot of people
Speaker 1: sort of slut shame her for a little bit. And
Speaker 1: I'm not here to slut shame her, but I do
Speaker 1: think once you have children, it's your responsibility to protect them,
Speaker 1: particularly from relationships. And these kids are old enough to
Speaker 1: know what's going on. Oh yeah, well I mean they
Speaker 1: were all yeah, so she's clearly embarrassed by that. I'm
Speaker 1: not saying she's a bad mother at all. Yeah, of course,
Speaker 1: I'm sure she wants what's best for her children. You
Speaker 1: can tell she loves her children. I'm not saying that
Speaker 1: at all, But like, you know, you've gone through all
Speaker 1: of this is huge to do, and now what it's over.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well I Also I wonder if the kids thing
Speaker 2: is a factor too, And again it's so so storry
Speaker 2: to be having this conversation about someone we don't know.
Speaker 2: But again, so much of her life is public and
Speaker 2: people project things on because if you even when she
Speaker 2: was single before she met Matt, there were people being like, oh,
Speaker 2: those kids need like a stable influence, they need like
Speaker 2: a father figure, even though that obviously have their fathers
Speaker 2: who are involved in their lives. And so you have
Speaker 2: this it's almost like a no win situation, Like you
Speaker 2: have this pressure to be married and to be in
Speaker 2: this very happy relationship, and you have this pressure to
Speaker 2: get this fairy tale ending, which like still to this
Speaker 2: day getting married, as much as like everyone says like
Speaker 2: it's not, it is like getting married is still the
Speaker 2: biggest achievement in a woman's life publicly, Like it's the
Speaker 2: only time you get that sort of level of adoration
Speaker 2: and fame and love and success. It's the only time
Speaker 2: you really get celebrated once you become an adult. So
Speaker 2: I think it's hard to sort of have that and
Speaker 2: be like, this is the main thing we're going to
Speaker 2: celebrate you for. But then if you rush into it
Speaker 2: because you're trying to get this thing that people are
Speaker 2: telling you should have, then you get punished for it.
Speaker 2: I don't know, it's a very strange thing. I did
Speaker 2: see a lot of people being like, she doesn't have
Speaker 2: to explain. But I feel also like you if you've
Speaker 2: monetized it to make it, and you've like picked all
Speaker 2: these people to know why, yeah, oh, I mean I
Speaker 2: would love to know more details later. I'm not above
Speaker 2: that gossip, but I know I'm from the general from
Speaker 2: the video where she's explaining, I saw a lot of
Speaker 2: people in the comments being like, you don't know us anything,
Speaker 2: And I do think it's that fine line where like
Speaker 2: she's such a public figure and that wedding like they
Speaker 2: created a huge amount of content from it. I still
Speaker 2: also think no one gets married just for content. I
Speaker 2: feel like people do a lot of other things for content,
Speaker 2: but I think actually getting married is such a step
Speaker 2: too far, because yes, you get the photos, but then
Speaker 2: you have to the initial payoff you get with sharing
Speaker 2: the photos would not be worth the months of like
Speaker 2: backlash and speculation you get and having to make that video,
Speaker 2: like they they really cancel each other out. So I
Speaker 2: don't think anyone does it for I think that kind
Speaker 2: of it kind of like makes.
Speaker 1: I think it got like she got caught up in it,
Speaker 1: probably because of all of that, yeah, and the attention
Speaker 1: and being in love and the ring and a big party.
Speaker 1: Like I'm sure that that's part of it. You know,
Speaker 1: who knows why this ended, But to be honest, it
Speaker 1: was almost as soon as they got married, the speculation
Speaker 1: that they would no longer together stop absolutely because they
Speaker 1: see like and that's I think what kind of irritates
Speaker 1: me a little bit. I'm like, I know, people get
Speaker 1: married and then they get divorced, but like marriage is.
Speaker 2: Hard, like yeah, but I think why some of these
Speaker 2: marriages that end after a few months, I think why
Speaker 2: they break up and why people who have been together
Speaker 2: for years break up. Would be such a difference, Yeah,
Speaker 2: such a different situation. And if you, like, if you've
Speaker 2: been with someone for a few months and you get
Speaker 2: swept up in the idea of a wedding and the party,
Speaker 2: and then the party is over and you're you're looking
Speaker 2: at that person, I can one hundred percent understand why
Speaker 2: you would say, like, I'm not going to try with
Speaker 2: you because I don't even like you. Yeah, Because I
Speaker 2: think when you're talking, you're ow your husband having bad spots.
Speaker 2: That's because you've been in love for years and you
Speaker 2: have that foundation. But that was a stranger that you
Speaker 2: don't even know on for a few months, and you'd
Speaker 2: only know on them. But I wouldn't have gotten marriage
Speaker 2: to different like situations. But if you've only known this
Speaker 2: person in these beautiful romantic resorts or at events or
Speaker 2: planning or I think that's very different to breaking up
Speaker 2: with someone who you've been like in the trenches.
Speaker 1: That's why I like, take your freaking time, girl.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, I'm sure she's wishing that now, Like that
Speaker 2: was my thought watching that video, and maybe I'm just
Speaker 2: such a sap. I felt, really I felt so emotional
Speaker 2: watching that for her because I was just like when
Speaker 2: she kept saying, I'm so humiliated, and I was like,
Speaker 2: this would be a lot. And also I also just
Speaker 2: wonder what was going through her mind on the wedding day,
Speaker 2: like because again so many women now who have gone
Speaker 2: through that and who have publicly talked about it say like,
Speaker 2: on the day, I felt sick on the day, I
Speaker 2: didn't want to do it, and I wonder, like she
Speaker 2: might never say it, but I wonder when you see
Speaker 2: those photos of her and that beautiful pink Vera Wang
Speaker 2: gown and like looking so happy shit and like with yeah,
Speaker 2: with that beautiful estate in the flowers and her kids
Speaker 2: like running up to her and being like mommy or
Speaker 2: a princess. All that I want her from a head,
Speaker 2: she's just like feeling sick, Like I just think that
Speaker 2: would just be the worst feeling for it to be
Speaker 2: so public and just feeling like so trapped.
Speaker 1: Look, maybe she's gonna learn a lesson from this, and hopefully,
Speaker 1: I'm sure she'll be okay, she'll be just fine. I'll
Speaker 1: be interested to see if they did do a prenup
Speaker 1: because she's got a lot.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, she's quite a smart businesswoman, so I'm assuming,
Speaker 2: I'm assuming. Surely, yeah, surely. Well, thank you so much
Speaker 2: for listening to the Spill today, and don't forget to
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Speaker 2: Spill is produced by Minitia Isswarren with sound production by
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Speaker 2: and we'll see you back here in your podcast feed
Speaker 2: at three pm tomorrow.
Speaker 1: Bye Lan.