WEBVTT - The Block Dramala 0:00:12.767 --> 0:00:15.247 Hello, and welcome to Mama Mia out loud. It's what 0:00:15.287 --> 0:00:18.367 women are actually talking about on Monday, the fourth of November. 0:00:18.407 --> 0:00:21.847 I'm Holly Wainwright, I'm Mea Friedman, and I'm Jesse Stevens. 0:00:22.167 --> 0:00:25.847 On the show Today, A woman's real time meltdown is 0:00:25.927 --> 0:00:29.887 top of the Australian TV ratings again. So why has 0:00:29.927 --> 0:00:32.807 even our home renno inspo now got a side of 0:00:32.927 --> 0:00:38.247 cheating scandal? Also, something has happened to Sunday while spending 0:00:38.247 --> 0:00:40.607 the day meal prepping is now they must have badge 0:00:40.607 --> 0:00:44.607 of honor And a famous woman has donated millions of 0:00:44.607 --> 0:00:47.767 dollars to an anti violence charity. Why does it feel 0:00:47.807 --> 0:00:53.567 a bit wrong? But first, take my Pamela. 0:00:53.927 --> 0:00:57.807 The American people want to start the chaos and end 0:00:57.887 --> 0:01:03.727 the DRAMAA with a cool new step Mamala pick backing 0:01:03.767 --> 0:01:07.567 our pajamaa's and watch a rum Pamela. 0:01:08.167 --> 0:01:12.407 That audios Kamala Harris making a surprise appearance on Saturday 0:01:12.487 --> 0:01:16.847 Night Live with Maya Rudolph, who's been impersonating her on 0:01:17.207 --> 0:01:22.367 the show through this election cycle and actually since twenty nineteen. Now, 0:01:22.527 --> 0:01:25.567 in case you missed it, it's the US election this week. 0:01:25.607 --> 0:01:29.367 Of course, can you hear my faintly hysterical life. 0:01:29.167 --> 0:01:33.767 Yes, you say up, yeah, yeah. 0:01:33.087 --> 0:01:36.207 Interesting mood. I don't think that many of us are 0:01:36.207 --> 0:01:37.687 feeling very nearly. 0:01:37.647 --> 0:01:38.887 Hanging on by a thread. 0:01:39.167 --> 0:01:44.047 I wouldn't say, I'd say mannik, yeah, yes, hysterical. The 0:01:44.087 --> 0:01:46.327 polls open on Wednesday, our time. 0:01:46.647 --> 0:01:46.847 Now. 0:01:46.887 --> 0:01:51.127 Either you're full of existential fear and nausea about the 0:01:51.167 --> 0:01:54.327 results and you're refreshing the New York Times homepage until 0:01:54.327 --> 0:01:57.007 your thumb falls off, like me, or you have your 0:01:57.007 --> 0:02:00.167 fingers in your ears and you're singing, perhaps falla lulalla 0:02:00.327 --> 0:02:01.807 in a bid to drown out the. 0:02:01.727 --> 0:02:04.567 Noise, or or maybe a voting The third option. 0:02:04.407 --> 0:02:06.767 Is that you're mildly interested but don't really care what no. 0:02:06.807 --> 0:02:09.367 The fourth option is that you're a Trump supporter and 0:02:09.407 --> 0:02:10.567 you're also feeling really good. 0:02:10.687 --> 0:02:16.967 Well, no, everybody's nervous. It doesn't matter who. 0:02:15.087 --> 0:02:18.567 Are so tight. No one's feeling like a victory lap 0:02:18.607 --> 0:02:19.007 is imminent. 0:02:19.247 --> 0:02:22.287 Everyone's feeling tense. I think about the results, except for 0:02:22.327 --> 0:02:25.367 the people who are singing or don't really care. But 0:02:25.407 --> 0:02:27.967 no matter which of those categories you fall into, I 0:02:28.047 --> 0:02:31.847 just want to get you across some quick basics. The polls. Basically, 0:02:32.367 --> 0:02:33.367 nobody knows. 0:02:33.087 --> 0:02:34.207 Nobody has any idea. 0:02:34.287 --> 0:02:37.007 Every new pole is closer than the last pot, and 0:02:37.047 --> 0:02:38.287 it's close the poles I've ever made. 0:02:38.367 --> 0:02:40.007 Yeah, or they go there are two for her, two 0:02:40.007 --> 0:02:42.487 for him. One don't know. That's kind of it. 0:02:42.847 --> 0:02:45.287 And I'm clicking on a lot of stories that say 0:02:45.327 --> 0:02:49.607 this polster has predicted correctly every election result, and here's 0:02:49.607 --> 0:02:51.487 who he say he says is going to win. Or 0:02:51.487 --> 0:02:54.127 it's like a snail who has crawled in a particular direction. 0:02:54.767 --> 0:02:57.047 I've stopped looking at the poles. Those of us who 0:02:57.047 --> 0:02:59.247 lived through twenty sixteen were scarred by them. 0:02:59.247 --> 0:03:01.287 I've started asking my dog and seeing if the way 0:03:01.287 --> 0:03:04.127 that her ears twitched, there are any hints, any possible 0:03:04.207 --> 0:03:04.847 gives that. 0:03:05.327 --> 0:03:08.407 Meanwhile, Donald Trump was seen in a garbage truck looking 0:03:08.767 --> 0:03:12.367 a very unnatural shade of orange in a stunt that 0:03:12.487 --> 0:03:14.927 was designed to draw attention to the fact Joe Biden 0:03:15.087 --> 0:03:19.687 accidentally called Trump supporter's garbage. After one of the speakers 0:03:20.007 --> 0:03:22.967 at the Big Trump rally in Madison Square Garden in 0:03:23.007 --> 0:03:25.807 New York, Lass Week called the entire nation of Puerto 0:03:25.927 --> 0:03:28.047 Rico a floating pile of garbage. 0:03:28.287 --> 0:03:32.567 Cal did you guys see the Milwaukee rally where his 0:03:32.607 --> 0:03:33.367 mic wasn't working. 0:03:33.447 --> 0:03:34.367 Yes, Trump's mike. 0:03:34.527 --> 0:03:39.127 Trump's mike wasn't working, and he simulated Falatio on the 0:03:39.127 --> 0:03:41.927 microphone and then he threatened, He said, do you want 0:03:41.927 --> 0:03:44.047 to go see me basically knock out the people out 0:03:44.087 --> 0:03:46.287 the back. That was an interesting moment. I was way 0:03:46.327 --> 0:03:48.927 on the weekend and all anyone was doing was watching videos. 0:03:48.967 --> 0:03:51.607 They wanted to see the full video of him simulating 0:03:51.647 --> 0:03:52.207 the Falacio. 0:03:52.367 --> 0:03:55.407 I think he also in fact he did also suggest 0:03:55.607 --> 0:03:58.727 that people might want to go and shoot Liz Cheney, 0:03:58.767 --> 0:04:00.887 who is one of his critics, a former Republican in 0:04:00.927 --> 0:04:04.687 the face. And my favorite little morsel of the weekend 0:04:05.127 --> 0:04:08.807 is that Donald Trump has promised to put RFK Junior 0:04:09.487 --> 0:04:13.607 in charge of i think the Health Department if he wins, 0:04:14.327 --> 0:04:17.927 and RFK is excitedly announced on Twitter. He's i think 0:04:17.967 --> 0:04:20.567 a chair or a big part of the transition committee, 0:04:20.967 --> 0:04:23.327 so it's legit. He said that some of the things 0:04:23.367 --> 0:04:26.927 that Trump will do if he's elected is removed the 0:04:27.007 --> 0:04:31.727 fluoride in drinking water and ban vaccinations. So if Trump wins, 0:04:32.127 --> 0:04:34.927 maybe pop the surprise return of polio and measles on 0:04:34.967 --> 0:04:36.607 you bingo card for twenty twenty six. 0:04:36.807 --> 0:04:38.487 When are we going to know the result? 0:04:38.727 --> 0:04:41.247 However, our audience is feeling and as you say, we 0:04:41.327 --> 0:04:43.127 know some people are really into it and some people 0:04:43.167 --> 0:04:45.407 are like, stop talking about it. What are our plans? 0:04:45.647 --> 0:04:48.207 Yes, So, as I said, voting opens Wednesday our time, 0:04:48.807 --> 0:04:51.527 and experts say where I'm likely to know the result 0:04:51.567 --> 0:04:54.047 for four to ten days. But what I predict, because 0:04:54.047 --> 0:04:55.847 it's going to come down to a handful of votes 0:04:56.247 --> 0:04:59.087 in about three or four states, what I predict is 0:04:59.127 --> 0:05:02.767 that on the night of the election, which will be 0:05:02.847 --> 0:05:06.407 Wednesday our time Tuesday American time, Trump will hold a 0:05:06.447 --> 0:05:09.847 press conference into claar victory even though no will know, 0:05:10.327 --> 0:05:14.127 He'll just say I wont and then whatever happens, it 0:05:14.167 --> 0:05:16.247 will seem like either he did win and he just 0:05:16.247 --> 0:05:19.327 called victory or he has set up this whole narrative 0:05:19.367 --> 0:05:20.207 about stealing the O. 0:05:20.367 --> 0:05:22.727 It is so possible, though, like some people are saying, 0:05:22.727 --> 0:05:24.567 we probably won't know till the weekend, but it is 0:05:24.607 --> 0:05:26.127 possible that we'll know on Wednesday. 0:05:26.367 --> 0:05:27.287 If it's a landslide. 0:05:27.367 --> 0:05:29.767 Yeah, yeah, So either way, out louders, here's what's going 0:05:29.847 --> 0:05:32.447 to happen. We are not going to talk only about 0:05:32.447 --> 0:05:34.007 the American election at you, because I know that some 0:05:34.047 --> 0:05:35.727 of you will go Okay, we'll tune out about loud 0:05:35.767 --> 0:05:37.767 this week. We're going to be bringing you loads of distraction, 0:05:37.967 --> 0:05:41.487 loads of other content. But of course, the wonderful Amelia Lester, 0:05:41.727 --> 0:05:44.487 our expert, who is actually on Q and A tonight 0:05:44.567 --> 0:05:47.207 talking about this, is going to be in and out 0:05:47.247 --> 0:05:49.887 all week, and we all will do some bonus content 0:05:50.007 --> 0:05:52.487 either with Amelia and all of us, Amelia and Miya. 0:05:52.567 --> 0:05:54.527 We're going to be on it for you, So if 0:05:54.567 --> 0:05:56.687 you care, you can hear. And if you don't care, 0:05:56.927 --> 0:06:00.447 we've got loads of other gossips for you. All right, 0:06:00.607 --> 0:06:01.687 So I'm saying goodbye. 0:06:02.727 --> 0:06:06.287 I can't be on national television with having my marriage 0:06:06.327 --> 0:06:11.567 breaking down. I'm going home. I can't say I'll be returning. 0:06:12.647 --> 0:06:14.247 You can talk to Brad about the. 0:06:14.287 --> 0:06:18.647 Details, but unfortunately I can't do it anymore. I don't 0:06:18.647 --> 0:06:19.807 need to always be made. 0:06:19.607 --> 0:06:21.647 Out to be krabby and the bad guy anymore. 0:06:22.567 --> 0:06:24.967 Thank you for the opportunity, and I'm sorry couldn't start 0:06:25.047 --> 0:06:26.927 talking and I'm just so strung anymore. 0:06:27.767 --> 0:06:31.007 Thanks guys, love me. A quarter of a million women 0:06:31.207 --> 0:06:33.247 have read a story on Mama here over the past 0:06:33.327 --> 0:06:38.287 week about a very particular drama unfolding on Australian reality TV. 0:06:39.567 --> 0:06:42.207 Now the block used to be used to be about 0:06:42.247 --> 0:06:43.087 home renovations. 0:06:43.207 --> 0:06:43.847 Was allo fun. 0:06:43.967 --> 0:06:44.407 Remember that. 0:06:44.567 --> 0:06:47.927 I remember Amity Dry who then released a song. I 0:06:48.087 --> 0:06:51.487 remember Gari and Was, who were the probably one of 0:06:51.527 --> 0:06:55.647 the first mainstream gay couples on a huge TV show. 0:06:55.807 --> 0:06:57.607 And I'm going to frighten you because that was twenty 0:06:57.687 --> 0:06:58.847 one years ago. I went and. 0:06:58.927 --> 0:07:02.167 Visited that block in Bondy. I was so into that show. 0:07:02.367 --> 0:07:03.927 Actually went and visited the set. 0:07:04.327 --> 0:07:07.647 I liked it before and after particlarly bathrooms and kitchens. 0:07:07.687 --> 0:07:10.487 Everybody really likes all that. Anyway, I was about to 0:07:10.567 --> 0:07:12.287 explain to you all what the block is, and then 0:07:12.327 --> 0:07:13.967 I looked up that it was twenty one years old, 0:07:14.007 --> 0:07:15.887 and I was like, I think we're across it. I 0:07:15.967 --> 0:07:18.247 think we're broadly across it, right. But what you might 0:07:18.287 --> 0:07:20.927 be interested to know is that even though almost everything 0:07:20.927 --> 0:07:22.927 about TV has changed in the last twenty one years, 0:07:22.967 --> 0:07:24.967 the block is still a big deal. It still pulls 0:07:25.047 --> 0:07:27.687 in more than two million viewers on a Sunday night. 0:07:28.127 --> 0:07:31.167 It's the highest ratings show that nine has on bvod. 0:07:31.247 --> 0:07:33.927 You know, like watch it on demand, and because as 0:07:34.007 --> 0:07:36.447 you'd know if you watch it, almost the entire thing 0:07:36.567 --> 0:07:39.967 is sold for sponsorship and integration. It makes a lot 0:07:40.087 --> 0:07:43.287 of money, so it's still a big behemoth that you know, 0:07:43.407 --> 0:07:47.207 the network's very invested in making sure survives, thrives, keeps 0:07:47.247 --> 0:07:50.407 bringing in the dollars. But this past week the chat 0:07:50.487 --> 0:07:54.487 hasn't been about bathroom grout, which is disappointing. It's about 0:07:54.567 --> 0:07:57.167 a classic reality show villain who also happens to be 0:07:57.207 --> 0:08:00.567 a woman, who is almost always the case. And if 0:08:00.607 --> 0:08:02.847 you've been paying any attention to this, you probably know 0:08:03.447 --> 0:08:06.287 that a woman called Kylie's personal life is being milked 0:08:06.287 --> 0:08:08.327 for ratings. And depending on where you sit on this, 0:08:09.007 --> 0:08:11.487 she's either only got herself to blame or she's being 0:08:11.567 --> 0:08:15.527 roundly exploited. What happened is Kylie. She's thirty seven years old. 0:08:15.567 --> 0:08:18.087 She's a hairdresser from Cans. She and her husband Brad, 0:08:18.247 --> 0:08:21.007 have four little kids, and they are competing on this 0:08:21.127 --> 0:08:23.447 season of the Block, along obviously with other people, which 0:08:23.527 --> 0:08:26.127 is being filmed in Philip Island and in Victoria right. 0:08:26.967 --> 0:08:29.127 She said that she and Brad came on the show 0:08:29.247 --> 0:08:31.167 for a break from the grind of parenting and to 0:08:31.247 --> 0:08:33.687 make some money, because one of the big appeals about 0:08:33.727 --> 0:08:36.367 the block is often the contestants do make big money, 0:08:36.487 --> 0:08:38.287 not always because it all depends on what the house 0:08:38.327 --> 0:08:40.887 goes for, but it is one of those shows right 0:08:40.927 --> 0:08:45.127 where they can walk away with life changing money. Unfortunately, 0:08:45.207 --> 0:08:48.167 what's been life changing for Kylie, rather than the money, 0:08:48.247 --> 0:08:51.727 has been her husband openly flirting with another contestant on 0:08:51.887 --> 0:08:54.887 the show, telling Mimi, one of the other contestants on 0:08:55.007 --> 0:08:57.167 camera that he would love to follow her on OnlyFans 0:08:57.167 --> 0:08:58.887 if she has an account, and that he'd like to 0:08:58.967 --> 0:09:00.887 take her for a drink when all this is over. 0:09:01.487 --> 0:09:03.527 Did he know it was being filmed? I mean, I 0:09:03.567 --> 0:09:05.447 guess they all know they're being filmed all the time. 0:09:05.647 --> 0:09:09.447 So his wife, Kylie was napping near him, but he 0:09:09.727 --> 0:09:12.207 assumed that she was really napping. I think Kylie may 0:09:12.287 --> 0:09:14.927 have overheard. Yeah, and that was all surprised was recorded, 0:09:14.967 --> 0:09:18.047 but also it's on TV exactly. There was no getting 0:09:18.087 --> 0:09:20.367 away from it, and Kylie was pissed off and she 0:09:20.527 --> 0:09:23.807 left and then she came back and as well as 0:09:23.847 --> 0:09:28.207 apparently dumping Brad on TV, she also gave Scotti Kam 0:09:28.287 --> 0:09:31.367 a big serve. She said under her breath, on the 0:09:31.407 --> 0:09:34.287 show when he was judging her garden, her back garden, 0:09:34.847 --> 0:09:37.847 that she fucking hates that guy and may have called 0:09:37.927 --> 0:09:41.647 him a fat sea word about about Scott cam on 0:09:41.847 --> 0:09:42.247 the show. 0:09:42.687 --> 0:09:46.167 So that never goes down. Well, now, we've all seen 0:09:46.247 --> 0:09:48.087 this play out before in one form or another, and 0:09:48.207 --> 0:09:50.447 the audience in the comments in out Louder's show this 0:09:50.647 --> 0:09:53.727 are very divided. They either think that she's an ungrateful 0:09:53.807 --> 0:09:56.407 and titled so and so, or they think that she's 0:09:56.407 --> 0:09:58.247 a woman married to a bit of a dickhead having 0:09:58.327 --> 0:10:02.127 her personal life exploited for ratings. Either way, it's symptomatic 0:10:02.247 --> 0:10:04.927 of how so many TV shows, even if they're meant 0:10:04.927 --> 0:10:08.727 to be about paving and palm trees, have been gamified. Jesse, 0:10:08.887 --> 0:10:09.727 you she's sorry? 0:10:09.887 --> 0:10:12.567 Why is she ungrateful for not being happy? 0:10:12.927 --> 0:10:16.647 Because because if you're watching the show, which a lot 0:10:16.687 --> 0:10:19.247 about Louders are, they're like, before all the cheating stuff, 0:10:19.287 --> 0:10:21.887 she she wasn't there that and rude about this and that, 0:10:22.127 --> 0:10:24.367 and like so there's more drama underneath it, do you 0:10:24.367 --> 0:10:26.887 know what I mean? And then this has happened, and 0:10:27.047 --> 0:10:30.007 so they're like saying, well, you know, what did she expect? 0:10:30.087 --> 0:10:31.847 And she's ungreat blah blah. But then a lot of 0:10:31.887 --> 0:10:34.407 other people are absolutely defending her and saying she clearly 0:10:34.487 --> 0:10:37.607 isn't okay. We shouldn't be watching this on TV. While 0:10:37.687 --> 0:10:41.007 watching it on TV, Jesse used to write about the 0:10:41.087 --> 0:10:44.767 drama of reality TV shows that were more specifically created 0:10:44.847 --> 0:10:47.407 for drama, like Married at First Sight and The Bachelor 0:10:47.487 --> 0:10:49.607 and all those things. But now we can't have our 0:10:49.687 --> 0:10:52.247 cooking or our home renovating or anything without it. What 0:10:52.647 --> 0:10:53.367 is that about? 0:10:53.927 --> 0:10:57.607 I reckon it is because the words and it would 0:10:57.647 --> 0:11:02.687 happen every season like clockwork, probably about oh well, actually, 0:11:02.927 --> 0:11:05.207 by the end of Claire and I recapping Married at 0:11:05.207 --> 0:11:07.327 First Sight, it happened multiple times a season because it 0:11:07.567 --> 0:11:11.207 caused such a spike. But the two words cheating scandal 0:11:11.607 --> 0:11:15.767 were ratings gold, and it was like, it was incredible 0:11:15.807 --> 0:11:18.527 what it did to ratings, how it got everyone interested, 0:11:18.607 --> 0:11:20.407 how people wanted to talk about it, they wanted to 0:11:20.487 --> 0:11:22.967 know the ins and outs. The other thing that happened 0:11:23.007 --> 0:11:25.527 in maybe the final season that Claire and I recapped 0:11:26.207 --> 0:11:30.007 was the advent of OnlyFans, which became very fun because 0:11:30.047 --> 0:11:32.847 suddenly and the block is different because it's marketed to 0:11:32.887 --> 0:11:36.447 a different audience. The block is more complicated because people 0:11:36.487 --> 0:11:37.167 watch it with their kids. 0:11:37.207 --> 0:11:38.127 Yeah, it's a family show. 0:11:38.247 --> 0:11:41.047 Yeah, Married at first sight wasn't so when OnlyFans came 0:11:41.167 --> 0:11:45.527 up and then it started this broader conversation about shame 0:11:45.727 --> 0:11:48.727 and nudity and sexualization and all that kind of stuff. 0:11:48.807 --> 0:11:52.287 So do you mean that the contestants went on these 0:11:52.367 --> 0:11:55.367 shows and then started only fans accounts, or they had 0:11:55.447 --> 0:11:58.727 only fans accounts where they could sell monetize. 0:11:58.887 --> 0:12:01.487 It was like the discovery the season that I'm thinking 0:12:01.567 --> 0:12:04.567 of the discovery of one contestant having an only fans 0:12:04.687 --> 0:12:07.647 put on the table like an ethical discussion about whether 0:12:07.807 --> 0:12:10.407 or not that was a good or a bad thing. 0:12:10.527 --> 0:12:12.807 So she was shamed by another contestant who came on 0:12:12.927 --> 0:12:13.647 and said but. 0:12:13.727 --> 0:12:18.287 Ever since, probably the most the only organic season of 0:12:18.447 --> 0:12:21.727 reality TV was that first season of Big Brother with 0:12:21.887 --> 0:12:25.407 Sarah Marie where nobody knew about sponsorship deals. I mean, 0:12:25.447 --> 0:12:29.047 this is even pre social media, right every season afterwards, 0:12:29.647 --> 0:12:31.887 you know, I was there in the audience when Sarah 0:12:31.887 --> 0:12:34.767 Marii came out and everybody was wearing bunny ears. She 0:12:34.847 --> 0:12:36.887 didn't make a cent out of the sale of bunny ears. 0:12:37.287 --> 0:12:39.287 And then what they found in subsequent seasons is that 0:12:39.367 --> 0:12:41.727 everybody would go in what's going to be my bunny? 0:12:41.847 --> 0:12:41.887 Is? 0:12:41.927 --> 0:12:43.287 How am I going to make money out of this? 0:12:43.367 --> 0:12:46.047 Which is fine, I understand that. So you're saying that 0:12:46.207 --> 0:12:48.927 only fans wrapped it up again and it has. 0:12:48.887 --> 0:12:49.847 Become part of the thing. 0:12:49.967 --> 0:12:50.127 Right. 0:12:50.167 --> 0:12:52.567 So people used to say they go on for Instagram followers, 0:12:52.607 --> 0:12:54.447 and you know you do, but also you can go 0:12:54.567 --> 0:12:56.287 on to build an audience who you think can then 0:12:56.407 --> 0:12:58.207 sell you only fans too if you're a hot sex 0:12:58.287 --> 0:12:59.967 So you don't get paid much to go on these shows, 0:13:00.007 --> 0:13:00.207 do you. 0:13:00.367 --> 0:13:03.207 Know, And it just offered another element of titillation. It 0:13:03.287 --> 0:13:05.167 probably in terms of the rating and in terms of 0:13:05.247 --> 0:13:07.407 the audience skewed it a little bit more because they 0:13:07.447 --> 0:13:11.647 were having different compass. But I think, you know, to 0:13:11.767 --> 0:13:14.607 go granular for a moment into the dynamics of a 0:13:14.687 --> 0:13:17.287 cheating scandal, like people do want to come to work 0:13:17.287 --> 0:13:20.527 on a Monday and talk about whether their husband saying 0:13:20.567 --> 0:13:22.487 to another woman I'd follow you on only fans if 0:13:22.487 --> 0:13:24.127 you had an account it's cheating or not, Like that's 0:13:24.127 --> 0:13:29.247 a genuinely interesting conversation. So look, I think it's coming 0:13:29.447 --> 0:13:33.647 for all forms of entertainment, which we've seen. But I'm 0:13:33.687 --> 0:13:35.327 going to go on a tangent because I was watching 0:13:35.407 --> 0:13:37.687 something over the weekend that just crystallized a whole lot 0:13:37.727 --> 0:13:40.887 of disparate things that I'm seeing. So I mentioned on 0:13:40.967 --> 0:13:43.527 the show the other week that I was watching Mister McMahon, 0:13:43.687 --> 0:13:47.447 which is about Vince McMahon, who is the co founder 0:13:47.607 --> 0:13:50.727 of WWA Wrestling. And as a kid, did you guys 0:13:50.727 --> 0:13:51.167 ever watch it? 0:13:51.647 --> 0:13:54.687 Yeah? I loved it, Hulk Hogan, Ye, Andre the Giant, Yes, 0:13:55.127 --> 0:13:55.487 loved it. 0:13:55.687 --> 0:13:57.927 So as a kid, I was vaguely aware of it, 0:13:58.087 --> 0:14:00.327 but I never was super into it. But it's like 0:14:00.407 --> 0:14:03.007 my whole childhood and adolescence now makes sense because everything 0:14:03.087 --> 0:14:05.807 from what the boys did in my primary school to 0:14:05.927 --> 0:14:08.247 terms they used is like, oh, that was a wrestling thing. 0:14:09.247 --> 0:14:11.487 So I'm going to put a pro wrestling framework on 0:14:11.567 --> 0:14:13.767 top of the evolution of reality television and then bring 0:14:13.847 --> 0:14:14.927 that into American polity. 0:14:15.287 --> 0:14:16.287 Okay, go Jesse. 0:14:16.567 --> 0:14:17.767 This is what my essay is about. 0:14:18.327 --> 0:14:20.327 From what next PhD is going to be. 0:14:20.807 --> 0:14:24.367 This is a thesis early eighties. You're talking whole Hogan, 0:14:24.527 --> 0:14:27.727 Andre the Giant. There's a heel. A heel is known 0:14:27.767 --> 0:14:29.487 as like the villain, and then there's a face who's 0:14:29.487 --> 0:14:31.487 the hero, and it's all confected, but no one cares 0:14:31.567 --> 0:14:34.007 right good and baddies, goodies and baddies, And there's an arena. 0:14:34.487 --> 0:14:37.687 There were arenas I think now still eighty thousand people 0:14:37.767 --> 0:14:40.367 in an arena just screaming like they're so they want 0:14:40.367 --> 0:14:42.487 to root for someone, they want to boo for someone else. 0:14:42.807 --> 0:14:47.047 There's something almost gladiatorial about the energy in it and 0:14:47.167 --> 0:14:50.047 the aim of the game. For McMahon, who I imagine 0:14:50.127 --> 0:14:53.567 now as a modern day TV producer, was what he 0:14:53.727 --> 0:14:56.607 refers to as heat. So it doesn't matter if they're 0:14:57.007 --> 0:15:00.207 booing or they're cheering, or they hate you or they 0:15:00.287 --> 0:15:03.847 have names for you, there is heat. They can they care. 0:15:03.967 --> 0:15:06.607 Engagement, there is an engagement. 0:15:06.367 --> 0:15:08.927 And so it doesn't matter if everyone's saying iffing, hate 0:15:08.927 --> 0:15:11.807 the blow. It's really degenerated. Whatever you're watching it, you're 0:15:11.807 --> 0:15:16.367 talking about it, Yeah, like good publicity exactly, which she 0:15:16.487 --> 0:15:19.647 is Trump. Yes. So this is the thing that's what 0:15:19.847 --> 0:15:23.687 keeps you coming back. It's rivalry, it's storylines. It's about 0:15:23.807 --> 0:15:27.007 seeing the worst parts of ourselves as well. It's like, 0:15:27.887 --> 0:15:30.767 if the lives we're living is order, we need to 0:15:30.847 --> 0:15:31.967 see the chaos so. 0:15:32.087 --> 0:15:35.407 It's like a soap opera but grafted onto something that 0:15:35.567 --> 0:15:38.807 is supposedly real, like a reality show, because they've always 0:15:38.807 --> 0:15:41.447 been soap opera is yeah for a long time. Wrestling 0:15:41.647 --> 0:15:43.967 is supposedly real. 0:15:44.207 --> 0:15:46.407 It's a sport, but people don't really care whether it 0:15:46.527 --> 0:15:48.967 is real do which is almost similar to reality TV. 0:15:49.167 --> 0:15:52.687 Nobody really cares if it's real or not, except every 0:15:52.807 --> 0:15:54.807 now and again. And this is what's happening right now 0:15:54.847 --> 0:15:58.087 today with Kylie. We all get reminded that there is 0:15:58.167 --> 0:16:00.487 a human at the bottom of this because one of 0:16:00.527 --> 0:16:02.447 the things she said, we're all sitting around going is 0:16:02.527 --> 0:16:05.847 it cheating that he wants? But she said, the thing 0:16:05.927 --> 0:16:08.367 that really upset me is that he never flirts with 0:16:08.487 --> 0:16:12.567 me like that. Now, that is a very human, vulnerable 0:16:12.727 --> 0:16:16.047 thing that so many of us could relate to. It 0:16:16.207 --> 0:16:17.887 reminds you that there's a woman at the bottom of 0:16:17.927 --> 0:16:19.887 all this who is real, no matter how much of 0:16:19.927 --> 0:16:23.127 a caricature she is on the TV. And she might 0:16:23.167 --> 0:16:26.207 as well be Hulk Cogan or whoever it's like, she's not. 0:16:26.527 --> 0:16:28.847 She is a real pers I reckon that. That's part 0:16:28.927 --> 0:16:31.127 of what makes it so interesting is trying to work 0:16:31.167 --> 0:16:34.567 out where the line is where the reality is, where 0:16:34.727 --> 0:16:41.047 the confected drama is that is incredibly engaging, and the 0:16:41.127 --> 0:16:44.447 reality is that this stuff works. And so then when 0:16:44.487 --> 0:16:47.767 we go to the Trump who's been accused of making 0:16:47.847 --> 0:16:50.527 politics into reality TV, I think he's made it into rest. 0:16:50.727 --> 0:16:53.167 He has, and he's a creature of the eighties exactly. 0:16:53.247 --> 0:16:56.647 So in the documentary the show actually features Donald Trump. 0:16:56.687 --> 0:16:59.847 He's really good mates with Vince McMahon. He's just obsessed 0:16:59.887 --> 0:17:03.807 with wrestling, and I think it has informed his character 0:17:04.087 --> 0:17:07.007 more than anything else. Like the idea of the mocking 0:17:07.247 --> 0:17:11.287 the trash talking like crazy Kamala, Comrade Kamala, like he 0:17:11.287 --> 0:17:13.807 always has a name. They repeating things when the audience 0:17:14.007 --> 0:17:18.127 likes it, generating heat. He's made it into this circle. 0:17:18.807 --> 0:17:22.247 This is why he was He found president being almost 0:17:22.327 --> 0:17:25.327 weird because you've always got to be not the victim. 0:17:25.487 --> 0:17:27.927 But if you're the good guy, which he always is, 0:17:28.487 --> 0:17:31.927 you've got to have bad guys. So when you're the president, 0:17:32.327 --> 0:17:35.887 he's always victimizing himself because he has to create a 0:17:36.007 --> 0:17:38.647 narrative where he's fighting against somebody. 0:17:38.847 --> 0:17:39.047 Yeah. 0:17:39.127 --> 0:17:41.247 Yeah, And the reality is I even thought about him 0:17:41.247 --> 0:17:42.847 in that rally saying I'm going to go out and 0:17:43.007 --> 0:17:46.367 you know, hit the guy backstage or whatever. I can't 0:17:46.447 --> 0:17:48.447 lose my shit at work this week, right, Like, I've 0:17:48.447 --> 0:17:49.927 got to keep it all together, and I've got to 0:17:49.967 --> 0:17:52.047 be polite, and I have to act in a certain way, 0:17:52.207 --> 0:17:54.727 and I have to wear this mask in the wrestling 0:17:54.847 --> 0:17:58.687 ring on reality TV. In American politics, they get to 0:17:58.807 --> 0:18:00.647 just rip the mask off. That's what it feels like. 0:18:00.727 --> 0:18:03.647 I think that's why it's cathartic for us to see that. 0:18:03.767 --> 0:18:06.007 It's like it is chaos to our order. 0:18:06.207 --> 0:18:09.767 The thing is yes, and that's why we as we've 0:18:09.767 --> 0:18:11.487 talked about a lot when we've been talking about the election, 0:18:11.647 --> 0:18:15.127 Trump's great strength is that he is very exciting. At 0:18:15.207 --> 0:18:17.087 some point, though, this shit has to get old because 0:18:17.087 --> 0:18:19.487 we've now been living in Trump's world for ten years, right. 0:18:19.967 --> 0:18:22.047 And it's interesting when you go back to that comparison 0:18:22.127 --> 0:18:25.447 with reality TV, is we sort of swing between you know, 0:18:25.607 --> 0:18:28.687 remember when My Kitchen Rules was really popular because everybody 0:18:28.807 --> 0:18:30.647 liked watching the couples be horrible to each other. But 0:18:30.727 --> 0:18:32.327 then that kind of tanked and everyone went back to 0:18:32.407 --> 0:18:34.367 Master Chef because that was about being nice to each 0:18:34.407 --> 0:18:36.727 other and people's sob stories. And then you're kind of like, oh, 0:18:36.767 --> 0:18:38.207 we're a bit sick of that now and we want 0:18:38.247 --> 0:18:41.087 to It's like back to the tri We all oscillate 0:18:41.167 --> 0:18:43.167 between them because we know deep down that it's not 0:18:43.287 --> 0:18:46.607 good for us to marinate constantly in drama and negativity, 0:18:46.727 --> 0:18:48.887 but positivity is so boring. 0:18:49.287 --> 0:18:52.207 Having not looked at the Block for twenty years, probably 0:18:52.327 --> 0:18:54.727 after since that first season, and I was watching some 0:18:54.807 --> 0:18:59.687 clips before the show today, I was shocked by how 0:19:00.047 --> 0:19:02.527 the married at first sight of it all has been 0:19:02.607 --> 0:19:06.967 transposed onto this home renovation program, or I guess on 0:19:07.127 --> 0:19:09.727 my kitchen rules, onto this cooking program. 0:19:10.407 --> 0:19:12.127 It's like they want their cake and eating it. Though 0:19:12.687 --> 0:19:14.847 it obviously works to a point, because you know, if 0:19:14.887 --> 0:19:16.487 you look at what the outlauders said about the Block, 0:19:16.527 --> 0:19:18.047 they some of them are saying, I used to watch 0:19:18.047 --> 0:19:20.167 it with my kids. Then I saw this bullying going 0:19:20.247 --> 0:19:23.287 down this season, and I've stopped. And other people like 0:19:23.447 --> 0:19:26.287 the drama. But I guess what the producers are hoping 0:19:26.487 --> 0:19:28.847 is come for the bathroom, stay for the drama, or 0:19:28.887 --> 0:19:30.847 the other way around. Come for the drama, stay for 0:19:30.887 --> 0:19:31.567 the bathrooms. 0:19:31.687 --> 0:19:33.127 Like it's the you know what. 0:19:33.327 --> 0:19:35.767 The only thing it either escalates, which is what we've 0:19:35.807 --> 0:19:37.647 seen on Married at First side is it has to 0:19:37.807 --> 0:19:40.887 escalate every season to kind of retain its viewership or 0:19:41.327 --> 0:19:44.727 sponsors pool. Because if I'm a sponsor, there's a line, 0:19:44.887 --> 0:19:46.847 there's a line, right, But if I'm a family show, 0:19:47.247 --> 0:19:49.327 and there's different from Married at First site, because that 0:19:49.407 --> 0:19:50.847 makes a lot of money in a different way. But 0:19:51.007 --> 0:19:53.367 here you've got some of the most big conservative brands 0:19:53.407 --> 0:19:56.887 in Australia putting themselves inside this show exactly, and that's 0:19:56.887 --> 0:19:57.727 when it might change. 0:19:57.847 --> 0:19:58.047 Yeah. 0:19:58.247 --> 0:20:00.407 But I also think the other thing that's so predictable 0:20:00.607 --> 0:20:03.287 is that today everybody's loving all the headlines about Kylie 0:20:03.367 --> 0:20:05.607 and all the things, and in about a week everybody 0:20:05.647 --> 0:20:08.287 will be very sad about Kylie. And it's like we've 0:20:08.327 --> 0:20:09.847 been through this before, guys. 0:20:10.047 --> 0:20:12.887 In a moment, from label containers to life hacks, what 0:20:13.087 --> 0:20:28.487 has happened to our Sundays? Have you noticed something has 0:20:28.567 --> 0:20:31.487 happened to Sundays? What is meant to be a day 0:20:31.527 --> 0:20:35.727 of rest or maybe seeing family socializing. I would argue 0:20:35.767 --> 0:20:39.527 for sleep ins has been co opted and I, for one, 0:20:39.767 --> 0:20:41.887 shall not stand for it. You might have seen an 0:20:41.967 --> 0:20:44.327 article over the weekend in the Sydney Morning Herald by 0:20:44.407 --> 0:20:47.847 Giselle Onion newan that asked, how do you say I'm 0:20:47.887 --> 0:20:50.647 in my mid thirties without saying I'm in my mid thirties. 0:20:51.087 --> 0:20:53.367 The answer she posited is meal prep. 0:20:53.487 --> 0:20:54.207 Oh, I'm so young. 0:20:55.007 --> 0:20:56.847 I have only just started meal prep and I'm about 0:20:56.847 --> 0:20:57.567 to turn thirty four. 0:20:57.647 --> 0:21:00.207 There you go, right on time, So spot on, I 0:21:00.247 --> 0:21:00.647 don't do it. 0:21:00.727 --> 0:21:03.487 Actually, she writes that she loves planning out a week 0:21:03.567 --> 0:21:06.687 of meals, shopping for the ingredients, spending a Sunday cooking 0:21:06.727 --> 0:21:09.207 it all, and then dividing it into neat little container. 0:21:09.687 --> 0:21:12.127 It's what all the TikTokers do in the day in 0:21:12.207 --> 0:21:14.927 the Life videos, and now there are whole books written 0:21:14.967 --> 0:21:18.887 about it. Sunday meal prep has infiltrated at homes around 0:21:18.927 --> 0:21:21.567 the world, But I reckon, there's more. Why do I 0:21:21.647 --> 0:21:23.807 suddenly feel like I need to have an everything shower 0:21:23.887 --> 0:21:26.247 on a Sunday? I need to dee clean my house. 0:21:26.487 --> 0:21:28.207 I need to get ahead for the week, get all 0:21:28.247 --> 0:21:30.567 the laundry done, and lay my clothes out, dust my 0:21:30.687 --> 0:21:35.447 skirting boards, journal, meditate Sunday feels like work in order 0:21:35.527 --> 0:21:38.567 to make the actual work go more smoothly. Do you 0:21:38.687 --> 0:21:41.727 guys get the sense that you're meant to have totally 0:21:41.807 --> 0:21:43.287 optimized your Sunday. 0:21:43.487 --> 0:21:47.567 Holy yes, I do, and it makes me very anxious. 0:21:48.167 --> 0:21:50.767 It's supposed to make you less anxious, right, because it's 0:21:50.767 --> 0:21:53.607 supposed to be if you sort everything out on Sunday, 0:21:53.687 --> 0:21:56.527 then the week will run really smoothly. But I often 0:21:56.647 --> 0:21:59.687 find I get very stressed on Sunday afternoons. And it's 0:21:59.727 --> 0:22:01.727 not the Sunday sads, you know, the Sunday sads has 0:22:01.727 --> 0:22:03.727 always been around that on Sunday night, as you start 0:22:03.767 --> 0:22:05.927 getting the dread about the week ahead, because you know, 0:22:06.007 --> 0:22:07.207 I like my job, I get to come in and 0:22:07.287 --> 0:22:10.647 hang out with you too. It's more that rising panic 0:22:10.727 --> 0:22:13.447 about all the things are meant to have sorted out 0:22:13.527 --> 0:22:16.647 for the week, and the problem I have with it, 0:22:16.727 --> 0:22:19.887 well two things. One is supposed to be a trade off, right, 0:22:19.967 --> 0:22:21.927 So the people who love to get everything prepped on 0:22:21.967 --> 0:22:25.007 a Sunday say, I'm trading a couple of hours on 0:22:25.047 --> 0:22:28.567 a Sunday for like a smoother week. But I would 0:22:28.687 --> 0:22:32.087 argue that Sunday afternoons and Tuesday evenings are not worth 0:22:32.127 --> 0:22:33.247 the same amount, you know. 0:22:33.207 --> 0:22:33.567 What I mean? 0:22:33.647 --> 0:22:37.207 Like, what's more valuable, what's more fun, what's more enjoyable, 0:22:37.527 --> 0:22:40.447 what's better a Sunday afternoon or a Tuesday evening. 0:22:40.727 --> 0:22:43.327 Okay, Sunday afternoon. But I want to ask it not equal. 0:22:43.527 --> 0:22:46.607 I keep hearing the term cooking burnout. Do you relate 0:22:46.687 --> 0:22:47.127 with that term? 0:22:47.207 --> 0:22:49.887 Well, yes, because every person who has a family has 0:22:49.927 --> 0:22:51.927 to cook all the time, so like every night it's 0:22:52.007 --> 0:22:53.607 like what's for dinner, what's for dinner, what's for dinner? 0:22:54.047 --> 0:22:56.727 And I understand that this helps with that, but you've 0:22:56.767 --> 0:22:59.287 still got the burnout of having to plan the whole week. 0:22:59.727 --> 0:23:03.007 But there's been a shift in cooking right because we 0:23:03.127 --> 0:23:05.007 all know, we were talking about it last week that 0:23:05.487 --> 0:23:10.327 the absolute juggernaut that is Recipe to Eats now, who 0:23:10.487 --> 0:23:12.567 had a new book out last week called Tonight. She 0:23:12.767 --> 0:23:16.727 is a very famous in Australia. She was a food blogger, 0:23:16.807 --> 0:23:20.567 I guess you would say, who has become a publishing sensation. 0:23:20.727 --> 0:23:26.887 And that's because her food is simple, hearty, works and 0:23:27.087 --> 0:23:28.847 does not take you four hours. It used to be 0:23:28.967 --> 0:23:31.567 that all the cool aspirational cooking books were like fancy 0:23:31.647 --> 0:23:34.807 things for dinner parties and like let's stuff a mushroom 0:23:34.887 --> 0:23:37.287 and let's like butterfly and whatever. I don't even know 0:23:37.327 --> 0:23:39.927 what your butterfly, but something you know, whereas that is 0:23:40.047 --> 0:23:43.807 not what this is about. This is about simple, grounded, 0:23:44.087 --> 0:23:47.007 real food that works. And I think the meal prep 0:23:47.087 --> 0:23:49.607 thing is adjacent because it's like this idea that we 0:23:49.687 --> 0:23:53.927 could solve all that chaos and aspiration by just doing 0:23:53.967 --> 0:23:54.647 it on Sundays. 0:23:54.807 --> 0:23:57.807 I wonder if Nigie's next book will be called Tomorrow 0:23:58.407 --> 0:24:00.247 subtitled and the rest of the week. 0:24:00.687 --> 0:24:01.967 She does have meal prep sections. 0:24:03.127 --> 0:24:06.087 Every cookbook has meal prep sections. Now, I didn't realize 0:24:06.127 --> 0:24:07.647 that does. I don't own that many cookbooks. 0:24:07.687 --> 0:24:09.687 What else is Sunday for? Confused? 0:24:09.687 --> 0:24:11.567 Oh my god, it's for enjoying yourself. 0:24:12.527 --> 0:24:15.767 I love pottering. My favorite thing to do on a 0:24:15.887 --> 0:24:18.687 Sunday is to have the whole day free and I 0:24:18.847 --> 0:24:24.047 potter and doing all of that organization, playing with my clothes, 0:24:24.567 --> 0:24:29.487 doing all my washing, doing my kids washing, sorting things 0:24:29.527 --> 0:24:34.247 into piles, reorganizing my bathroom, dyeing my eyebrows. I do 0:24:34.367 --> 0:24:37.127 my smoothie preps. Not every Sunday, but when I do 0:24:37.287 --> 0:24:39.407 my smoothie preps, which is my green smoothie, It's what 0:24:39.447 --> 0:24:42.367 I have for breakfast every day. It requires a lot 0:24:42.407 --> 0:24:43.687 of chopping of different things. 0:24:44.327 --> 0:24:45.007 Every two or. 0:24:45.047 --> 0:24:48.327 Three weeks, I'll go and buy all my greens, listen 0:24:48.367 --> 0:24:50.527 to a podcast, chop all my things up, put them 0:24:50.567 --> 0:24:52.727 all in little sandwich bags, pop them in the freezer. 0:24:53.607 --> 0:24:54.447 I feel so good? 0:24:54.647 --> 0:24:58.527 You are you about? It's only in the last few 0:24:58.567 --> 0:25:00.767 months I've heard about this concept of an everything shower. 0:25:01.327 --> 0:25:03.247 Do you have everything showers? And do you even know 0:25:03.247 --> 0:25:03.607 what they are? 0:25:04.127 --> 0:25:06.007 Of course I know what they are. It's so funny 0:25:06.047 --> 0:25:09.007 because last night my daughter came looking to pilfer some 0:25:09.087 --> 0:25:10.727 of my products and saying, I want to have in 0:25:10.767 --> 0:25:13.007 everything shower. Can I take your cleanser? Can I take 0:25:13.047 --> 0:25:14.967 you all these? Can I take you that I want to, like, 0:25:15.367 --> 0:25:18.647 exfoliate and do all of those things. I don't do 0:25:18.767 --> 0:25:21.087 it all in the shower for me, and everything shower 0:25:21.247 --> 0:25:24.447 just means do I shave my legs or because I 0:25:24.527 --> 0:25:26.407 do everything in the shower every time I have a shower. 0:25:26.447 --> 0:25:28.767 I wash my hair every time I have a shower. Sorry, 0:25:29.087 --> 0:25:31.767 every time I have a shower in the morning during 0:25:31.807 --> 0:25:34.967 the week, I wash my hair and I cleanse, you know, 0:25:35.167 --> 0:25:37.247 once or twice every day. And I don't use like 0:25:37.647 --> 0:25:39.287 body scrubs or anything like that. 0:25:39.567 --> 0:25:42.007 So I like an everything shower too, And my daughter 0:25:42.247 --> 0:25:44.767 definitely hasn't everything about every Sunday night. Sunday night is 0:25:44.847 --> 0:25:45.207 about that. 0:25:45.447 --> 0:25:48.407 It's about like, oh, I need it all done by Sunday. 0:25:48.567 --> 0:25:51.567 But Sunday is supposed to be fun. And the problem 0:25:51.647 --> 0:25:53.847 with the stress of the having everything sorted is now 0:25:53.887 --> 0:25:55.967 if I do what is supposed to be fun on Sunday, 0:25:56.047 --> 0:25:57.687 like go around for lunch at a friend's place, which 0:25:57.727 --> 0:25:58.607 is what I did yesterday. 0:25:58.647 --> 0:25:59.687 See, that's not fun for me. 0:26:00.447 --> 0:26:02.407 It doesn't have to be. But if it is, like 0:26:02.807 --> 0:26:05.167 if it's a day that you normally catch up with family, 0:26:05.407 --> 0:26:08.607 see friends, Like, aren't we allowed to have two days 0:26:08.647 --> 0:26:10.687 where we're all to do what we want rather than 0:26:10.767 --> 0:26:12.647 one and another one that's just more work? 0:26:12.807 --> 0:26:15.807 But again, hold, it's subjective. So what you want to 0:26:15.847 --> 0:26:18.327 do on Sunday is go and see your friends and 0:26:19.487 --> 0:26:22.927 lie around. What I want to do on a Sunday 0:26:23.967 --> 0:26:26.767 is potter and organize my life. So all of this 0:26:26.967 --> 0:26:29.807 stuff that is just what one does on a Sunday 0:26:30.047 --> 0:26:31.727 is just my happy place. 0:26:31.807 --> 0:26:33.807 However, but that's fine for us to be different. But 0:26:33.887 --> 0:26:36.127 the thing is is what this is about saying everybody 0:26:36.207 --> 0:26:38.047 should be doing that, that Sundays. 0:26:37.727 --> 0:26:41.727 Should predate yeah, and that it's about optimization and life 0:26:41.807 --> 0:26:43.767 hacks and productivity and all that kind. 0:26:43.807 --> 0:26:45.567 And we all know there's different kinds of rest, right 0:26:45.687 --> 0:26:48.087 So to you though, right, so it's up to you. 0:26:48.207 --> 0:26:51.487 There's no one policing you saying that it feels like, 0:26:51.647 --> 0:26:53.007 don't go to luck. That's on you. 0:26:53.247 --> 0:26:55.527 But I feel pressure. It's the guts on you. 0:26:55.727 --> 0:26:59.847 I think it's interesting though that meal prepping, Like, to me, 0:26:59.967 --> 0:27:02.127 that's quite new, right. I remember ten years ago, meal 0:27:02.167 --> 0:27:05.367 prepping was for the gym bros. If I knew someone, 0:27:05.447 --> 0:27:07.687 and the dieters and the dieties. So the ones that 0:27:07.807 --> 0:27:10.487 I knew were like, they would do meat and veggies 0:27:10.607 --> 0:27:14.087 because they were really into fitness and they became obsessed 0:27:14.127 --> 0:27:17.047 with what they were going to eat. But now everyone 0:27:17.167 --> 0:27:17.447 does it. 0:27:17.647 --> 0:27:20.607 So the reason is the American Surgeon General, a guy 0:27:20.647 --> 0:27:23.847 I've been interviewed on No Filter, actually lovely guy, VIVC. Murphy. 0:27:24.487 --> 0:27:27.567 He released a couple of weeks ago a warning that 0:27:28.127 --> 0:27:32.167 parenting in the way that society is expecting us to 0:27:32.287 --> 0:27:34.407 parenting now and the pressure that parents are putting on 0:27:34.447 --> 0:27:37.767 themselves forget about being bad for the children. This form 0:27:37.807 --> 0:27:40.167 of intensive parenting is actually bad for the parents. 0:27:40.407 --> 0:27:41.887 We're talking about this on the show recently. 0:27:42.087 --> 0:27:46.007 Yeah, so to me, this spills into that. So it's like, 0:27:46.407 --> 0:27:49.287 if you want to be this organized and have everything 0:27:49.447 --> 0:27:52.327 done and make sure you're spending quality time with your 0:27:52.407 --> 0:27:55.727 children all day on Sunday, and then of course you're 0:27:55.727 --> 0:27:57.207 going to feel like you've got less time. 0:27:57.567 --> 0:27:59.807 See I disagree because I reckon that meal prepping is 0:27:59.927 --> 0:28:01.207 also a lot of people who don't. 0:28:01.047 --> 0:28:03.087 Have to oh very much a millennial thing. 0:28:03.207 --> 0:28:05.487 Oh no, I'm just saying everything in our lives right, 0:28:05.527 --> 0:28:08.127 everything that we're doing, I'm saying for parents, it's worse. 0:28:08.167 --> 0:28:09.607 I remember I used to have to do this when 0:28:09.647 --> 0:28:12.007 my kids are smaller, because it's also frigging school lunches, 0:28:12.527 --> 0:28:16.767 making sure you them, and uniforms to wash. So there's 0:28:16.767 --> 0:28:19.047 a whole thing if you've got kids. I mean, also, 0:28:19.127 --> 0:28:21.887 everybody's got less time because they're on tiktop more and 0:28:21.967 --> 0:28:23.247 they're on scholar. 0:28:23.607 --> 0:28:24.567 Meal prep content. 0:28:24.687 --> 0:28:28.247 This is my theory. My theory is that I read 0:28:28.527 --> 0:28:31.407 this really interesting article in the Cydney Morning Herald over 0:28:31.447 --> 0:28:34.527 the weekend about how Lifeline has had a record number 0:28:34.567 --> 0:28:37.167 of calls. Three hundred people are calling Lifeline a day 0:28:37.207 --> 0:28:40.207 on average about financial stress. Like we've talked about the 0:28:40.247 --> 0:28:44.247 cost of living crisis and how much Australian families are suffering. 0:28:44.287 --> 0:28:47.407 But this is so real, and I think that if 0:28:47.487 --> 0:28:50.087 you are on a really tight budget, if you cannot 0:28:50.087 --> 0:28:53.127 afford waste, if you need to think about every single ingredient, 0:28:53.687 --> 0:28:55.367 and we know that if you go and buy certain 0:28:55.487 --> 0:28:57.447 ingredients in bulk then it's cheaper. Like I think that 0:28:57.647 --> 0:29:00.727 families have had to get more organised definitely. 0:29:00.367 --> 0:29:02.687 Because of how much it's It saves you money, it 0:29:02.767 --> 0:29:05.647 reduces food waste, and usually it means your food will 0:29:05.647 --> 0:29:07.607 be healthier if your meal prep. There's no argument that 0:29:07.647 --> 0:29:08.807 it's generally a good thing. 0:29:09.327 --> 0:29:10.727 It's just two types of people. 0:29:10.927 --> 0:29:12.887 It's the two types of people thing, because the thing 0:29:12.967 --> 0:29:15.447 is it's generally a very good thing for lots of reasons, 0:29:15.487 --> 0:29:18.047 but it always seems to fall on the women generally speaking, 0:29:18.127 --> 0:29:21.407 except for the gym bros. And it has taken out 0:29:21.487 --> 0:29:24.367 another chunk of leisure time which you could be spending 0:29:24.407 --> 0:29:24.887 on TikTok. 0:29:25.127 --> 0:29:27.887 But I just think everybody's always like not everybody. People 0:29:27.967 --> 0:29:30.407 have always been doing this, just like being sick of 0:29:30.487 --> 0:29:33.567 cooking because you've had to make school lunches or family 0:29:33.647 --> 0:29:36.367 meals or I'm sick of cooking for myself and I 0:29:36.407 --> 0:29:40.447 don't even cook now it's called cooking burnout. And it's 0:29:40.567 --> 0:29:46.087 almost like we are creating names and sicknesses and conditions 0:29:46.247 --> 0:29:49.567 and phenomenons. And I know it's interesting sometimes to put 0:29:49.607 --> 0:29:52.927 a name around something, but part of it is just 0:29:53.047 --> 0:29:55.407 how you choose to use your time. I mean, supermarkets 0:29:55.447 --> 0:29:58.927 have discovered that it used to be that basket size 0:29:59.327 --> 0:30:01.127 used to be one big basket and people would do 0:30:01.167 --> 0:30:04.527 a weekly shop. Now people are more likely to have two, three, four, six, 0:30:04.687 --> 0:30:07.887 ten baskets a week, plus delivery for a milk run 0:30:08.047 --> 0:30:10.927 or you know, casal or whatever. We're living in a 0:30:10.967 --> 0:30:13.767 non demand society, so we're not thinking ahead, we're not 0:30:13.927 --> 0:30:16.207 planning ahead. And I think the reason that this is 0:30:16.247 --> 0:30:19.487 a big thing for millennials is that it's like, ah, 0:30:19.847 --> 0:30:21.847 for all the reasons you say, Jesse, like people have 0:30:21.927 --> 0:30:24.607 always done this to save money, to save time, and 0:30:24.727 --> 0:30:27.527 millennials suddenly feeling like they've got less time, maybe because 0:30:27.527 --> 0:30:30.207 they've had kids, maybe because of cost of living or 0:30:30.247 --> 0:30:33.847 a combination, are going, oh, now I have to spend 0:30:33.927 --> 0:30:36.887 my sundays doing all these things. It's like, dude, we've 0:30:36.927 --> 0:30:37.567 always done it. 0:30:37.887 --> 0:30:41.127 Yeah, but there's definitely a cultural shift just in the 0:30:41.247 --> 0:30:43.127 water about the fact that it used to be seen 0:30:43.167 --> 0:30:44.727 as a bit of a sad thing, you know what 0:30:44.767 --> 0:30:46.567 I mean, Like, oh, you're going to eat leftovers through 0:30:46.607 --> 0:30:48.687 the week. Oh you have to plan your week as 0:30:48.767 --> 0:30:50.847 if you're worried about money, as if you're worried about health. 0:30:51.127 --> 0:30:51.367 Like that. 0:30:51.487 --> 0:30:53.327 That was a bit of a sad thing, but now 0:30:53.967 --> 0:30:56.407 now it's very But also now it's aspirational. It's like 0:30:56.767 --> 0:30:58.447 all the cool girls meal prep. 0:30:58.567 --> 0:31:00.807 But that's because it's content. 0:31:00.927 --> 0:31:03.687 It is content. But also I think that it's about control, 0:31:03.807 --> 0:31:05.487 you know what, you would just saying about this idea 0:31:05.567 --> 0:31:07.767 that so much of our lives is out of control. 0:31:07.847 --> 0:31:10.167 Now it feels that way. So it's like, if I 0:31:10.247 --> 0:31:13.047 can get everything in order on a Sunday, I'm wrestling 0:31:13.087 --> 0:31:14.727 back a bit of control, which I totally get. But 0:31:14.807 --> 0:31:17.927 I just think there's an interesting mood shift there about 0:31:18.007 --> 0:31:19.527 like it used to be a bit of a saddo 0:31:19.647 --> 0:31:22.287 thing and now it's a cool thing. Yeah, And you're right, Maa. 0:31:22.367 --> 0:31:24.487 It actually makes no difference whether you just need to 0:31:24.527 --> 0:31:26.727 do it or not. But it's like, is it worth 0:31:26.767 --> 0:31:29.607 taking a picture off in case. 0:31:29.527 --> 0:31:32.487 You missed it? Helen Miron's Roman Empire is Kurt Cobain. 0:31:32.967 --> 0:31:35.207 And if you think that there are too many nouns 0:31:35.247 --> 0:31:38.447 in that sentence that don't seem to belong together, you're right. 0:31:39.367 --> 0:31:43.567 During interview last week, the famous actress shared that she 0:31:43.727 --> 0:31:47.207 feels sad that Kurt Cobain, who was the lead singer 0:31:47.247 --> 0:31:50.767 of Nirvana in the nineties, She's sad that he's no 0:31:50.887 --> 0:31:54.007 longer alive because he never got the chance to experience GPS. 0:31:54.527 --> 0:31:58.647 And I always say it's so sad that Kurt Cobain 0:31:58.847 --> 0:32:03.607 died when he did because he never saw GPS. GPS 0:32:03.767 --> 0:32:07.167 is the most wonderful thing to what's my little blue 0:32:07.247 --> 0:32:10.527 spot walking down the street. I just find it completely 0:32:10.687 --> 0:32:12.127 magical and unbelievable. 0:32:12.487 --> 0:32:14.567 That's the reason that we're sad Kirk Cobain, Isn't it. 0:32:14.687 --> 0:32:18.087 Feel sad for so many reasons? And GPS doesn't make. 0:32:18.687 --> 0:32:23.247 What's interesting about this is that she uses him often 0:32:23.887 --> 0:32:27.687 as a way to talk about aging and about the 0:32:27.727 --> 0:32:33.007 progression of time. For example, in twenty fourteen, she told 0:32:33.087 --> 0:32:36.287 Oprah Winfrey, look at Kirk Cobain. He hardly even saw 0:32:36.367 --> 0:32:39.047 a computer. The digital stuff that's going on is so 0:32:39.207 --> 0:32:41.847 exciting I'm just so curious about what happens next. 0:32:42.247 --> 0:32:44.527 Is it that she feels like Kurt Cobain didn't die 0:32:44.647 --> 0:32:48.327 that long ago? Is it that that it's like he 0:32:48.447 --> 0:32:50.207 didn't die that long ago? And yet look at all 0:32:50.247 --> 0:32:51.807 the things she obviously. 0:32:51.487 --> 0:32:54.327 Thinks about him all the time, and she's like, what 0:32:54.487 --> 0:32:58.727 would Kurt Cobain say about this? In twenty fifteen, she 0:32:58.807 --> 0:33:02.127 said to Cosmopolitan magazine, I was thinking about Kurt Cobain 0:33:02.167 --> 0:33:04.767 the other day and he died without knowing the Internet. 0:33:04.887 --> 0:33:07.167 And I'm totally blown away by that. And then the 0:33:07.287 --> 0:33:09.847 year after, she said to The Daily Mail, if I 0:33:10.047 --> 0:33:12.607 died at twenty seven, the age that Kurt Cobain died 0:33:12.847 --> 0:33:15.647 in nineteen ninety four, I'd never even have known that 0:33:15.727 --> 0:33:18.527 there was an Internet. Incredible things are happening all the time, 0:33:18.567 --> 0:33:19.967 and I can't wait to see what comes next. 0:33:20.247 --> 0:33:23.887 I love her. After the Break, we unpack Anna Kendrick's 0:33:23.967 --> 0:33:27.287 Lattice movie and what's been called the Blake Lively Effect. 0:33:29.607 --> 0:33:31.207 Out loud as If you want to listen to us 0:33:31.327 --> 0:33:33.447 every day of the week, you can get access to 0:33:33.567 --> 0:33:37.367 exclusive segments on Tuesdays and Thursdays by becoming a mum 0:33:37.447 --> 0:33:40.127 and mea subscriber. Follow the link in the show notes 0:33:40.167 --> 0:33:42.687 to subscribe and support us, and a big thank you 0:33:42.927 --> 0:33:51.807 to all our current subscribers. Plot Twist, There's a story 0:33:51.887 --> 0:33:55.087 that made me furious on the weekend, and it's about 0:33:55.247 --> 0:33:58.247 someone donating a large amount of money to a charity 0:33:58.527 --> 0:34:02.247 for women. Let me unpack it for you and explain 0:34:02.527 --> 0:34:05.447 why I'm so grumpy. Anna Kendrick has said that she 0:34:05.607 --> 0:34:09.127 donated the fee she got from starring in and directed 0:34:09.887 --> 0:34:12.327 the hit Netflix true crime film Woman of the Hour. 0:34:12.367 --> 0:34:14.287 A lot of people are talking about that. It came 0:34:14.327 --> 0:34:17.127 out recently. It's about a woman who appeared on a 0:34:17.207 --> 0:34:21.607 nineteen seventies TV dating show and was matched with a 0:34:21.687 --> 0:34:25.247 serial killer in the midst of his crimes. Here she is, 0:34:25.287 --> 0:34:28.567 in her own words, telling an interviewer why she decided. 0:34:28.167 --> 0:34:28.567 To do this. 0:34:29.047 --> 0:34:30.447 And then I was just making the movie, making a movie, 0:34:30.487 --> 0:34:32.487 and we just barely made the deadline to get into 0:34:32.527 --> 0:34:36.407 TEFF and then it was like, oh, oh, there's like 0:34:36.927 --> 0:34:40.567 money going to be exchanging hands, and yeah, Like I 0:34:41.087 --> 0:34:44.407 sort of asked myself the question of like, do you 0:34:44.447 --> 0:34:45.287 feel gross about this? 0:34:45.367 --> 0:34:48.167 And I did, And so I'm not. 0:34:48.447 --> 0:34:49.967 Making money off of the movie. 0:34:50.167 --> 0:34:52.687 The money is going to or has gone to RAIN 0:34:52.927 --> 0:34:55.647 and to the National Center for Victims of Violent Crime, 0:34:55.847 --> 0:34:58.647 which was a charity that Matt Murphy recommended to me. 0:34:59.007 --> 0:35:01.887 So RAIN is a huge charity in the US that 0:35:02.087 --> 0:35:06.567 supports victims of domestic violence and sexual abuse. And look, 0:35:06.807 --> 0:35:10.167 why am I angry about it rich Hollywood celebrity donating 0:35:10.247 --> 0:35:12.767 money to charity. This is the reason. And now, of 0:35:12.807 --> 0:35:14.807 course it's not about the charity and the donation, because 0:35:14.847 --> 0:35:16.727 the charities have said how grateful they are. Of course 0:35:16.767 --> 0:35:20.287 they are. Netflix has made a huge amount of money 0:35:20.487 --> 0:35:23.407 from this. They paid eleven million dollars for the rights 0:35:23.447 --> 0:35:25.807 to make it and a Kendrick not to start in it, 0:35:25.927 --> 0:35:29.167 but she also directed it. It was watched twenty three 0:35:29.247 --> 0:35:31.527 million times in the two weeks after its release, so 0:35:31.607 --> 0:35:35.327 it's clearly a big, big success for the platform. But 0:35:35.487 --> 0:35:37.647 what worries me about this is that it is an 0:35:37.647 --> 0:35:40.327 example of something that I've come to think of as 0:35:40.367 --> 0:35:44.767 the Blake Lively effect, which is, if you remember, recently, 0:35:45.087 --> 0:35:47.447 Blake Lively made a movie called It Ends with Us 0:35:47.607 --> 0:35:51.567 where she got criticized hugely for centering herself in the 0:35:51.607 --> 0:35:54.287 publicity and the marketing of the film, even though she 0:35:54.487 --> 0:35:56.967 was the literal star of it, and she got attacked 0:35:57.007 --> 0:35:59.447 for wearing clothes on the red carpet that were too 0:35:59.567 --> 0:36:03.767 nice and apparently distracted from the experience of domestic violence victims, 0:36:04.887 --> 0:36:08.527 and that really impacted on how the movie was received 0:36:08.687 --> 0:36:13.527 and Blake Clively's reputation, and so clearly, fearing those same attacks, 0:36:13.527 --> 0:36:17.287 Anna Kendrick decided to preempt a Pylon. I'm not saying 0:36:17.327 --> 0:36:20.047 she didn't also have these good intentions, and who might 0:36:20.247 --> 0:36:23.527 doubt them, But my question is, are the actors who 0:36:23.567 --> 0:36:26.487 play men who abuse and murder women donating their salaries? 0:36:26.687 --> 0:36:28.967 Or is it just the women? Is it just the 0:36:29.047 --> 0:36:31.727 women who play their victims, because the last time I 0:36:31.887 --> 0:36:36.447 checked actors like zac Efron and David Tennant in Rivals 0:36:36.567 --> 0:36:40.127 and Channing Tatum, who was in Blink twice recently, all 0:36:40.567 --> 0:36:44.927 of whom are great actors, but have played men who've 0:36:45.327 --> 0:36:49.287 murdered and raped women. Did they donate their pay? And 0:36:49.447 --> 0:36:51.607 is this now the expectation of every woman who tells 0:36:51.647 --> 0:36:54.647 a story, either in film or in TV shows or 0:36:54.727 --> 0:36:57.687 in even books that depicts the abuse of women, Because 0:36:57.727 --> 0:37:00.247 to me, this does not seem like progress. Jesse, tell 0:37:00.287 --> 0:37:00.887 me why I'm wrong. 0:37:01.367 --> 0:37:04.127 Your instinct was my initial instinct, and now I've changed 0:37:04.127 --> 0:37:07.087 my mind. Not tell you I Justin Baldoni, who did 0:37:07.207 --> 0:37:11.127 it ends with us. He coins a production company, Wayfair Studios. 0:37:11.207 --> 0:37:13.047 He was the director, and he was the director and 0:37:13.167 --> 0:37:17.447 he played, yeah course, alongside Blake Lively. I reckon that 0:37:17.527 --> 0:37:20.767 what Anna Kendrick is doing is actually the Justin Baldoni effect, 0:37:20.927 --> 0:37:23.047 not the Blake Lively effect. And I say that because 0:37:23.127 --> 0:37:27.367 he partnered with the No More Foundation to provide resources 0:37:27.407 --> 0:37:28.927 and information related to the abuse. 0:37:28.967 --> 0:37:32.287 To picked it only afterwards, only after people came for Blake. 0:37:32.567 --> 0:37:35.047 I thought that, but then I checked, and it's even 0:37:35.087 --> 0:37:37.527 in the credits. They from the beginning, and he actually 0:37:37.607 --> 0:37:40.407 had partnered with them and worked with them prior. So 0:37:40.607 --> 0:37:43.687 he is very much a purpose based every project that 0:37:43.807 --> 0:37:46.567 he does, he is very much about how do I 0:37:46.647 --> 0:37:48.887 make the world better. That's how he presents and part 0:37:48.927 --> 0:37:52.887 of the ethos of his company. And so I think 0:37:53.127 --> 0:37:56.367 in that way, there is this trend towards if you're 0:37:56.407 --> 0:37:59.447 dealing with a really big issue like this, rather than 0:38:00.447 --> 0:38:02.767 be seen to be profiting off at how can you 0:38:02.927 --> 0:38:06.167 give back? And I think that Justin Baldoni, I agree 0:38:06.207 --> 0:38:06.407 with you. 0:38:06.887 --> 0:38:09.967 That infuriates me because do you know what's going to happen. 0:38:10.287 --> 0:38:12.727 People won't make these movies anymore. They won't make these 0:38:12.767 --> 0:38:15.847 TV shows, they won't tell these stories. Instead, they'll be 0:38:15.887 --> 0:38:18.167 a movie where they can keep all the tens of mine. 0:38:18.447 --> 0:38:20.887 But Anna Kendrick is worth an estimated and this is 0:38:20.927 --> 0:38:24.167 always highly contested, an estimated twenty million dollars. So Anna 0:38:24.247 --> 0:38:27.087 Kendrick does need the money, just like Justin Baldoni. And 0:38:27.247 --> 0:38:29.647 you know what, he didn't donate his salary from. 0:38:29.767 --> 0:38:32.047 But are we going to say that every celebrity who's 0:38:32.047 --> 0:38:34.327 got more money than us doesn't need it? No, no, no, 0:38:34.527 --> 0:38:36.807 But if that's and shouldn't be paid for their work, if. 0:38:36.767 --> 0:38:40.087 That's Anna Kendrick's choice, that she looked at it and went, 0:38:40.127 --> 0:38:42.367 I've actually got enough money. I'm doing this as a 0:38:42.487 --> 0:38:46.407 passion project and I want to donate. I agree with 0:38:46.527 --> 0:38:49.527 you that the expectation on women is a lot higher 0:38:49.647 --> 0:38:52.247 and that we demand women show us their wounds. In 0:38:52.327 --> 0:38:54.647 that Call her Daddy interview, I think in order to 0:38:54.847 --> 0:38:57.407 justify why she would make this film, she had to 0:38:57.447 --> 0:39:00.327 tell us about an abusive relationship. How long did that 0:39:00.487 --> 0:39:02.767 abusive relationship that you endured last? 0:39:02.967 --> 0:39:07.087 It didn't follow the traditional pattern, which is kind of 0:39:07.207 --> 0:39:10.847 yet another reason why I was finding it really difficult 0:39:10.927 --> 0:39:14.327 to identify it and name it as abusive, okay, because 0:39:14.327 --> 0:39:16.167 I was like reading all the articles and going like, 0:39:16.407 --> 0:39:18.967 this doesn't look like some of it looks like how 0:39:19.007 --> 0:39:22.407 they're describing it, but not completely. So the relationship was 0:39:22.447 --> 0:39:26.127 seven years. It was like an overnight switch. 0:39:26.087 --> 0:39:27.887 And you know what, that could also be really helpful 0:39:27.887 --> 0:39:29.447 to women. But we saw it this week too with 0:39:29.567 --> 0:39:32.327 Jackie O. Jackie O has released her memoir, which we 0:39:32.527 --> 0:39:34.607 talked about on the show, and there was a lot 0:39:34.607 --> 0:39:37.487 of criticism. I saw it everywhere about how she was 0:39:37.647 --> 0:39:41.047 profiting off like talking about her drug abut and she's 0:39:41.087 --> 0:39:42.647 only telling us this so that she can make money 0:39:42.687 --> 0:39:44.607 off it. And she's come out and said all proceeds 0:39:44.607 --> 0:39:45.567 are now being donated. 0:39:45.687 --> 0:39:47.407 It's her story in her life. 0:39:48.167 --> 0:39:48.927 Holy what do you think? 0:39:49.007 --> 0:39:52.247 Well, I think it's complicated because my instinct is me 0:39:52.407 --> 0:39:54.607 is too, is that I do think that women like 0:39:54.847 --> 0:39:57.327 I can't even think of how many TV shows I've seen, 0:39:57.367 --> 0:39:59.207 the movies I've seen where a man is an abusive 0:39:59.287 --> 0:40:00.727 killer and nobody it's a whole show. 0:40:01.087 --> 0:40:03.647 The director, it's the directed element. It was the fact 0:40:03.687 --> 0:40:05.167 that she directed it. It's not the character. 0:40:05.247 --> 0:40:08.167 No, no, I get all that, but I also kind 0:40:08.207 --> 0:40:10.407 of wonder if that is the case. I also kind 0:40:10.447 --> 0:40:12.367 of wonder if she was the star of this. But 0:40:12.527 --> 0:40:14.807 there are some nuances that are worth mentioning because this 0:40:15.007 --> 0:40:17.207 isn't actually a movie about domestic violence. This is a 0:40:17.247 --> 0:40:19.727 straight up serial killer movie, right. It's not about an 0:40:19.727 --> 0:40:22.487 abusive relationship. The woman involved in it in real life 0:40:22.527 --> 0:40:24.127 she never went on a date with this guy. In 0:40:24.207 --> 0:40:26.407 the movie, she does go on one date with this guy, 0:40:26.687 --> 0:40:28.807 but that's not actually what it's about. This is much 0:40:28.887 --> 0:40:33.127 more squarely in the very classic serial killer genre of 0:40:33.287 --> 0:40:33.687 a movie. 0:40:33.887 --> 0:40:34.007 Right. 0:40:34.567 --> 0:40:36.767 The thing about that, the positive thing about that, you 0:40:36.847 --> 0:40:40.247 could argue, is that maybe we finally learn a lesson 0:40:40.287 --> 0:40:42.687 about the fact that we have been watching culture that 0:40:42.807 --> 0:40:46.087 hangs off dead women and murdered women and women you know, 0:40:46.207 --> 0:40:48.167 who are raped and abused and have to start with 0:40:48.247 --> 0:40:50.527 a body. We all know those tropes, right, We've been 0:40:50.607 --> 0:40:54.887 watching unthinkingly and handing over our money to the storytellers 0:40:54.927 --> 0:40:57.007 of those things for a very long time, and finally 0:40:57.087 --> 0:40:59.087 we're kind of going hold on, isn't it a bit 0:40:59.167 --> 0:41:02.727 weird that we're all so happy to just consume this 0:41:02.927 --> 0:41:06.127 kind of content unquestionably, and often the serial killers end 0:41:06.207 --> 0:41:08.247 up almost being pin ups. If you think about Jamie 0:41:08.287 --> 0:41:10.727 Dornan in The Fall, or like our obsession with a 0:41:10.847 --> 0:41:14.167 character like Hannibal Lecter or whatever, that we erase the victim, 0:41:14.687 --> 0:41:17.727 and now culturally we are focused on the victims, and 0:41:17.767 --> 0:41:19.767 I think that's a good thing. I think the thing 0:41:19.887 --> 0:41:23.007 that's a bit depressing about this is if it is 0:41:23.087 --> 0:41:26.247 a defensive crouch, which it may well be, like as in, 0:41:26.367 --> 0:41:29.127 if the people who made this movie, including Anna Kendrick, 0:41:29.567 --> 0:41:31.367 saw what happened to It Ends with Us, which went 0:41:31.407 --> 0:41:32.807 on to be a massive smash by the way, and 0:41:32.887 --> 0:41:35.407 make everybody involved a lot of money and presumably also 0:41:35.487 --> 0:41:37.367 the charities involved a lot of money. So that's a 0:41:37.407 --> 0:41:39.967 good thing. But if they watched what happened to Blake 0:41:40.007 --> 0:41:42.887 Lively and Anna Kendrick was like, I do not want 0:41:42.927 --> 0:41:44.687 that to happen to me. I do also do not 0:41:44.807 --> 0:41:48.527 want that to overshadow this entire campaign and me talking 0:41:48.567 --> 0:41:50.967 about this movie that I really believe in and so 0:41:51.127 --> 0:41:54.567 we're going to do this. That's a bit sad because 0:41:54.607 --> 0:41:57.047 we can all feel so helpless about violence against women. 0:41:57.127 --> 0:42:00.167 So in another way, is the ultimate outcome a positive 0:42:00.207 --> 0:42:02.007 one for the wrong reasons almost you know. 0:42:02.247 --> 0:42:04.287 Yeah, exactly, And I feel that way about it too, 0:42:04.687 --> 0:42:07.647 But it's more that this will now be the expectation, 0:42:07.767 --> 0:42:09.807 but only for the women before we go. 0:42:10.127 --> 0:42:12.327 I came across this story on the BBC over the 0:42:12.367 --> 0:42:16.407 weekend about how weird it is that Australians don't wear shoes. 0:42:16.767 --> 0:42:19.767 It's been called one of the weirdest, perplexing, odd and 0:42:20.047 --> 0:42:22.287 unexplainable Australian cultural habits. 0:42:22.847 --> 0:42:25.367 But this, what do you mean, like where it's an 0:42:25.567 --> 0:42:28.407 entirely true. This is one of the things that absolutely 0:42:28.487 --> 0:42:30.727 boggled my mind when I first came to Australia, and 0:42:30.727 --> 0:42:33.807 I've actually got an American friend who moved home because 0:42:33.847 --> 0:42:36.727 of all the barefootness. Is like, shall I face Trump's America? 0:42:36.847 --> 0:42:38.927 Or am I dealing with bare toes in the supermarket queue? 0:42:38.967 --> 0:42:39.967 I think I'm going back to Trumps. 0:42:40.167 --> 0:42:42.727 See, apparently it can be explained right because in the 0:42:42.767 --> 0:42:46.567 fifties and sixties, Australia was marketed to migrants as somewhere 0:42:46.607 --> 0:42:48.687 you could take your shoes off because it was warm 0:42:49.287 --> 0:42:51.887 and the lifestyle was laid back. It was everyone's just 0:42:51.927 --> 0:42:55.167 walking around badfoot. But for a lot of overseas visitors, 0:42:55.247 --> 0:42:57.567 this is what it said. It's this odd thing that 0:42:57.607 --> 0:43:00.127 they've noticed and they really really don't like it. 0:43:00.287 --> 0:43:02.367 What don't they like about it because it's smelly? 0:43:02.647 --> 0:43:04.847 No, no, no, they just think have some decorrent. 0:43:04.927 --> 0:43:06.687 Well they're clearly not on wiki feed no. 0:43:07.007 --> 0:43:08.727 Exactly, but like last night, Oh. 0:43:08.687 --> 0:43:13.127 My god, Paradise for Food. In fact, Tourre's Australia is 0:43:13.167 --> 0:43:15.167 missing a trick. This is how we should be marketing 0:43:15.327 --> 0:43:18.327 Australian feet, the most beautiful feet in the world, and 0:43:18.407 --> 0:43:19.367 you can see them everywhere. 0:43:19.407 --> 0:43:21.687 Maybe I could be the foot of Australian. 0:43:21.207 --> 0:43:24.247 Tours because everyone knows it's actually very good for your feet. Holleen, Well, 0:43:24.327 --> 0:43:24.927 here's the thing that. 0:43:25.047 --> 0:43:26.887 Is So when I was young and I came to 0:43:26.967 --> 0:43:29.007 Australia and I noticed this, I used to love it. 0:43:29.487 --> 0:43:31.727 I remember going on holiday from work in my first 0:43:31.847 --> 0:43:33.687 job in Australia and being like, I'm not going to 0:43:33.767 --> 0:43:35.407 wear shoes for two weeks, Like that's the mark of 0:43:35.447 --> 0:43:36.927 a holiday, you know what I mean. I'm just going 0:43:37.007 --> 0:43:39.327 to walk around Barron Bay or wherever I was, like 0:43:39.447 --> 0:43:41.647 some backpackery town with no shoes on and I'm going 0:43:41.727 --> 0:43:44.167 to feel so free and now I'm old. I look 0:43:44.207 --> 0:43:46.727 at people and I'm like, put some shoes on. I'm like, 0:43:47.167 --> 0:43:48.167 no shoes, no shoes. 0:43:48.607 --> 0:43:48.887 I was. 0:43:49.127 --> 0:43:52.127 I had to do some shopping, like supermarket shopping yesterday, 0:43:52.127 --> 0:43:53.927 and Luke came and met me and he had no 0:43:54.007 --> 0:43:56.167 shoes on, and I went. The journey of my life 0:43:56.287 --> 0:43:58.367 is discovering where the line is. Because I found myself 0:43:58.367 --> 0:43:59.847 in a westfield with no shoes on, and I've gone 0:43:59.847 --> 0:44:00.527 across the line. 0:44:00.847 --> 0:44:02.847 How did you get into a west fo So I 0:44:02.927 --> 0:44:03.527 kind of needed to. 0:44:03.647 --> 0:44:05.527 Just go in and like duck in and get something. 0:44:05.567 --> 0:44:07.127 And maybe I was on my way home from the beach. 0:44:07.127 --> 0:44:09.167 Because the rule is within two caves of a beach, 0:44:09.287 --> 0:44:11.887 no shoes within two k's of my house. I feel like, 0:44:12.007 --> 0:44:14.927 no shoes within five within two k's. 0:44:14.727 --> 0:44:16.407 Of your house. Like if I would you walk to 0:44:16.447 --> 0:44:19.487 the corner shop with no shoes on? Yes? Really on 0:44:19.607 --> 0:44:20.847 a pavement in the city. 0:44:21.447 --> 0:44:24.247 But firstly, what are you stepping on? Second? Have you 0:44:24.327 --> 0:44:26.647 seen what people do on the footpath? Have you seen 0:44:26.727 --> 0:44:30.367 that it's a suburban Have you not seen people hoyke 0:44:30.447 --> 0:44:31.607 one onto the footpath? 0:44:31.687 --> 0:44:31.807 Oh? 0:44:31.927 --> 0:44:33.607 You know what it'd be good for the immune system. 0:44:34.047 --> 0:44:36.007 It's good for the foot. It's good for the foot 0:44:36.047 --> 0:44:37.687 because we shouldn't be in shoes all the time. 0:44:37.807 --> 0:44:40.007 Do you know what my kids freak out if I'm 0:44:40.047 --> 0:44:41.207 wearing shoes in my house. 0:44:41.687 --> 0:44:42.807 That freaks out in the house. 0:44:43.047 --> 0:44:45.887 Yeah, no, See, it's funny always looking at where the 0:44:45.967 --> 0:44:47.647 line is. So every night I take the dogs out 0:44:47.687 --> 0:44:49.487 for a walk just to go to the toilet, I 0:44:49.607 --> 0:44:52.647 just take them across the road. And I don't like 0:44:52.847 --> 0:44:56.087 not wearing shoes because then those same feet get into 0:44:56.127 --> 0:44:56.447 my bed. 0:44:57.367 --> 0:44:59.047 But yeah, you got to watch them. 0:44:59.767 --> 0:45:02.127 Do you know who's wearing shoes? People who live in 0:45:02.167 --> 0:45:05.727 the country, snakes. You would not see anyone walking around 0:45:05.767 --> 0:45:08.167 a proper country as town with no shoes. Thanks. 0:45:08.287 --> 0:45:10.687 You also get very rough skin on your feet if 0:45:10.767 --> 0:45:12.647 you wear bare feet, so then you have to add 0:45:12.647 --> 0:45:14.727 an extra step to your everything, Sharon a Sunday night, 0:45:14.847 --> 0:45:16.767 which is exfoliating your feet. 0:45:16.567 --> 0:45:18.567 With one of those foot files Thomas Stones. 0:45:19.247 --> 0:45:21.527 We ask people in the Mummere office if they're guilty 0:45:21.807 --> 0:45:23.567 of not wearing shoes, and here's what they told us. 0:45:24.527 --> 0:45:25.647 Yeah, I'm guilty. 0:45:25.727 --> 0:45:27.687 I'm very much known for being barefoot in the supermarket 0:45:27.687 --> 0:45:29.207 all the time because I never have enough time to 0:45:29.207 --> 0:45:30.887 pop up for a shop, so I never put shoes on. 0:45:31.007 --> 0:45:32.447 There's a time and a place, for sure. 0:45:32.527 --> 0:45:35.807 I wouldn't go barefoot in the office, but I'm a 0:45:35.967 --> 0:45:38.367 fan of getting my dogs out, which basically means I 0:45:38.527 --> 0:45:41.207 love wearing sandals or thongs everywhere. 0:45:41.367 --> 0:45:43.807 Oh my gosh, absolutely not. I have a bit of tact, 0:45:43.927 --> 0:45:46.487 thank you. It depends on where, Like, if it's a 0:45:46.567 --> 0:45:50.207 beach town, then yes. If you're more than three hundred 0:45:50.647 --> 0:45:52.007 away from a beach, no. 0:45:52.527 --> 0:45:57.047 No, that's absolutely vile, absolutely fucking not. People deserve jail 0:45:57.127 --> 0:45:59.447 time who do that in public. It's a visual assault 0:45:59.487 --> 0:45:59.967 on my eyes. 0:46:00.247 --> 0:46:03.007 Listen, I'm a bit of a shoe person, so the 0:46:03.127 --> 0:46:06.087 barefoot thing worries me. It's less about what other people 0:46:06.207 --> 0:46:09.567 think and more about me tripping, hurting my toe or 0:46:09.887 --> 0:46:11.287 falling over and embarrassing myself. 0:46:12.167 --> 0:46:14.207 One thing you made noticed if you follow us in 0:46:14.367 --> 0:46:16.447 your pod feed, I don't know what you call it anymore. 0:46:16.447 --> 0:46:18.287 It used to be called subscribing to a podcast. Now 0:46:18.327 --> 0:46:21.807 it's called following a podcast. Anyway, we have been dropping 0:46:21.847 --> 0:46:23.607 some little treats, and we're going to continue to drop 0:46:23.687 --> 0:46:26.967 some extra little treats, particularly on the weekend, just other 0:46:27.047 --> 0:46:29.727 little shows that Jesse, Holly or I might have made, 0:46:30.047 --> 0:46:32.567 or things that we think you might be interested in 0:46:32.687 --> 0:46:33.087 listening to. 0:46:33.607 --> 0:46:35.967 But if you're worried that you can't find your Friday episode, 0:46:36.087 --> 0:46:37.687 scroll back. Promise you it's there. 0:46:37.847 --> 0:46:41.647 It's there. That's everything from us today out louders as ever, 0:46:41.927 --> 0:46:43.607 huge thank you to all of you for being with 0:46:43.727 --> 0:46:45.927 the three of us on this Monday. As I say, 0:46:46.007 --> 0:46:48.247 we will be here all week with your American US 0:46:48.327 --> 0:46:50.887 gossip and otherwise and we couldn't do it without you. 0:46:50.967 --> 0:46:54.327 We'll be back in your ears tomorrow. Bye bye. Shout 0:46:54.367 --> 0:46:57.207 out to any Mamma Mia subscribers listening. If you love 0:46:57.327 --> 0:46:59.967 the show and you want to support us, subscribing to 0:47:00.047 --> 0:47:02.247 Mamma Mia is the very best way to do it. 0:47:02.527 --> 0:47:04.367 There's a link in the episode description.