Speaker 1: Welcome to the Sees the Yay Podcast. Busy and happy,
Speaker 1: but tired and worn, just some of the feelings when
Speaker 1: baby is born. There's magic, elation, there's chaos and tears,
Speaker 1: but everyone goes through the same hopes and fears. So
Speaker 1: this is a segment we hope helps you feel supported
Speaker 1: and valid. The mum juggles real, the good, bad, the ugly,
Speaker 1: the best and worst day. It's part of the journey
Speaker 1: to seize the Babe. I'm Sarah Davidson, a lawyer turned
Speaker 1: entrepreneur who hung up the suits and heels to co
Speaker 1: found Macha Maiden, a Macha Milk Bar, become a TV
Speaker 1: and radio presenter, and of course host The Sees the
Speaker 1: Ya Podcast. This year, I added motherhood to that list,
Speaker 1: which is the best job I've ever had with our
Speaker 1: beautiful baby Teddy, and this segment was designed to house
Speaker 1: all the conversations we've been having about parenthood. We'll still
Speaker 1: do our regular episodes, and just like real life, it's
Speaker 1: a constant balance between our parent identity and everything else.
Speaker 1: I hope you guys enjoy this segment as much as
Speaker 1: I have enjoyed creating it. Welcome to a very hotly
Speaker 1: awaited episode of Seize the Baby, and by hotly awaited,
Speaker 1: I mean we had so many submitted questions from you guys,
Speaker 1: but possibly even more came up in my own brain,
Speaker 1: so this is a bit of a selfish episode as well.
Speaker 1: Pretty Much every area of parenting is overwhelming, sometimes confusing,
Speaker 1: energy intensive, but I think starting solids is right up
Speaker 1: there at the top of that list in the early days,
Speaker 1: so it's one of the first topics I wanted to cover,
Speaker 1: and after a few false starts in recording, we finally
Speaker 1: got there. Most of you also follow along on socials,
Speaker 1: so you'll probably already have heard about Nourishing Bubs and
Speaker 1: how game changing has been for Teddy's introduction to solids.
Speaker 1: But if you don't know, it's a beautiful Australian business
Speaker 1: using one hundred percent Aussie fruits and veggies to create
Speaker 1: individually portioned frozen baby food pures and foods, plus a
Speaker 1: ground breaking allergen intro pack. They're delivered to your door
Speaker 1: and make it so easy to start the process of
Speaker 1: introducing foods, taking away so much stress and really freeing
Speaker 1: up your time. But possibly even more stressful is also
Speaker 1: waiting through the timing of introducing solids, the volume, the methods,
Speaker 1: and so much other information. Even now, I still have
Speaker 1: so many questions on a daily basis. So I am
Speaker 1: thrilled that the incredible Nourishing Bubs founder, pediatric dietitian and
Speaker 1: nutritionist Olivia Bates joins us for this episode to share
Speaker 1: her wealth of knowledge. And it was such an incredible chat,
Speaker 1: covering so much detail that I've actually split it into
Speaker 1: a two parter, so we will be talking about when
Speaker 1: to start solids and how you do it in the
Speaker 1: first part, which you're getting today, and then the separate
Speaker 1: section because it is so detailed on allergens, will drop
Speaker 1: next week to follow. As always, every baby is different
Speaker 1: and every family has different preferences, priorities, and needs, so
Speaker 1: we will be talking general information and referring to the
Speaker 1: studies that the information is pulled from, but of course
Speaker 1: it will vary for each individual and family. I'll also
Speaker 1: include links to everything we mentioned in the show notes,
Speaker 1: but in the meantime, I hope you find this one
Speaker 1: as useful as I did. Olivia, Welcome to the show.
Speaker 2: I'm so excited to be here, Sarah. Thank you so
Speaker 2: much for having me.
Speaker 1: Oh, thank you so much for joining I mean we've
Speaker 1: had multiple attempts, multiple this morning, but multiple before this also.
Speaker 2: I know it seems like a journey, but it's meant to.
Speaker 1: Be, absolutely meant to be. We actually tried before Christmas
Speaker 1: and there were tech issues and then there was mum
Speaker 1: life issues. But I said to you before we started
Speaker 1: recording that Teddy's actually had you know, more questions have
Speaker 1: come up this week that I wanted to ask you.
Speaker 1: So I feel like timing always works itself out in
Speaker 1: a crazy way.
Speaker 2: Yes, no, that's awesome. Yeah know, so it is funny.
Speaker 2: I'm sure things like as you're approaching that one year
Speaker 2: mark like it just it's such a constant process as well.
Speaker 2: So yes, I'm glad it's all worked out, and I'm
Speaker 2: so excited to be.
Speaker 1: Here constant learning journey, and I'm especially grateful to have
Speaker 1: you because you have been such a pivotal part of
Speaker 1: Teddy's journey. And I think I, you know, as I
Speaker 1: do approach that one you mark, which oh my god,
Speaker 1: I can't even believe it, look back at the businesses
Speaker 1: and the people and sort of the experiences that have
Speaker 1: formed what your motherhood journey has looked like and what
Speaker 1: that first year has looked like, and you've been really
Speaker 1: a big part of making our life easier and our
Speaker 1: experience better, like measurably better than it would have been
Speaker 1: without you. So I'm very, very grateful for you.
Speaker 2: That honestly means a lot. And you've been so supportive
Speaker 2: of the business. And I've just yeah, loved just watching
Speaker 2: the journey and watching you guys really flourish as parents
Speaker 2: because I was following your journey before you felt pregnant.
Speaker 2: I've been following since mattibated, so as I told you before,
Speaker 2: so big time follower, and it's just been amazing to watch,
Speaker 2: really such a joy for me to be part of it.
Speaker 2: So thank you.
Speaker 1: Oh well, that's really special, and it's I think one
Speaker 1: of the great privileges of social media is that you
Speaker 1: can follow people through different chapters of their lives. And
Speaker 1: I love that you know, you have been around since
Speaker 1: then when motherhood was so far from my mind, and
Speaker 1: yet now you know we've reconnected in this new chapter.
Speaker 1: So we have so many questions, like it is just
Speaker 1: starting solids is one of the most overwhelming, information dense
Speaker 1: chapters of parenting and of life for a little one.
Speaker 1: But you know, I love the story as well. So
Speaker 1: before we get into the many, many questions that have
Speaker 1: been submitted that I have, can you tell us a
Speaker 1: little bit about your background in eddiatric dietetics and what
Speaker 1: that means, and then you know how Narish and Bubbs
Speaker 1: came about.
Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely so. I when I came out of Unich. Look,
Speaker 2: I always wanted to do something in the baby space.
Speaker 2: I actually used to want to be a pediatrician, but
Speaker 2: to be blatantly honest, I was like, I don't think
Speaker 2: I can do that many years at Uni, so I
Speaker 2: sort of was like, I need to do something else.
Speaker 2: Decided to be a dietitian because I also loved food
Speaker 2: and wanted to be a chef at one point, and
Speaker 2: was like, I found dietetics. And then when I came
Speaker 2: out of Union, I worked for an almond milk company,
Speaker 2: so I went straight into the food space, and I
Speaker 2: guess I just got really exposed to that potential to
Speaker 2: influence the food supply, which sort of sounds a bit ridiculous,
Speaker 2: but like, you know, instead of just doing one on
Speaker 2: one consult so you can ultimately like influence the food
Speaker 2: people have. And then inevitably I was like, you know,
Speaker 2: walking down the baby food asal and at the time
Speaker 2: it was very much like shelf stable squeezes and jars
Speaker 2: of food, and I was like, this is actually gross,
Speaker 2: like beef that's sat in a pouch for like two
Speaker 2: years and like so heat treated, and I'm like yuck.
Speaker 2: Like I'm like, this is worse than what we'd feed
Speaker 2: like pets, So why are we not doing better for kids?
Speaker 2: So I guess I really just wanted to take it
Speaker 2: back to basics. And this was back in twenty seventeen.
Speaker 2: I sort of well, I think twenty sixteen I came
Speaker 2: up with the concept and then we launched in twenty seventeen.
Speaker 2: So actually it's been quite a few years now. It's
Speaker 2: definitely been, you know, as you would know, such a
Speaker 2: rollercoaster journey. We've been in Woolworks during COVID years, which
Speaker 2: really was an interesting, interesting journey to say the least.
Speaker 2: It's definitely tested me. But it's yeah, like we're the
Speaker 2: last twelve months, I would say, we've seen a lot
Speaker 2: of growth and it's really like turned a corner. The
Speaker 2: Allergen Pack's been really amazing for us, and we've been
Speaker 2: really trying to pump out more products and yeah, it's
Speaker 2: just really coming to But I'm just like, I've always
Speaker 2: just loved babies, loved the baby space. I don't have
Speaker 2: any yet of my own, although it's a work in progress.
Speaker 2: But yeah, I'm just obsessed with kids, anything I can
Speaker 2: do to help them, and I just think I really
Speaker 2: wanted to make it easier for parents, Like I just
Speaker 2: found there is so, as you said, so much overwhelming information,
Speaker 2: some really conflicting information. I think when you're sleep deprived
Speaker 2: and you're like, I have no idea what I'm doing,
Speaker 2: and then you look something up and one person saying this,
Speaker 2: one person saying that, including your GP and your obstetrician
Speaker 2: and your midwife and your mom and your mother in law,
Speaker 2: and everyone has something to say, and it's like, oh
Speaker 2: my god, Like what do I do? Just give me
Speaker 2: a straight answer. So yeah, I just wanted to really
Speaker 2: alleviate that pressure. And a lot of what we do
Speaker 2: is also education as well around it. So yeah, that's
Speaker 2: important to me.
Speaker 1: I mean, you absolutely have done that, and perhaps to
Speaker 1: a fault, I think in that sleep deprived chapter. For
Speaker 1: me personally, anyway, it's almost like once you sort of
Speaker 1: start with all the overwhelming information and then you kind
Speaker 1: of choose your trusted sources in each area. And I
Speaker 1: almost kind of once I decided, like Olivia is my
Speaker 1: trusted source in food, I kind of but like maybe
Speaker 1: other parents might listen and go, you could have like
Speaker 1: maybe research a little bit more, But I kind of like,
Speaker 1: once I decide a person is my authority in that area,
Speaker 1: because you're just so you have to block out everything
Speaker 1: else because once you make a decision, you got to
Speaker 1: kind of roll with it. It became like you became
Speaker 1: my trusted source, and then I've just done literally everything
Speaker 1: that you've told me to do, like like.
Speaker 2: Look, look he's looking great.
Speaker 1: So yeah, yeah. I also think what's really beautiful is
Speaker 1: that we just had an episode like on our sort
Speaker 1: of guest interview for Bluth. It was the founder of
Speaker 1: Blue Thumb Art and he's like a multimillion dollar art
Speaker 1: tech founder, but he knew nothing about art. And I
Speaker 1: think what's really interesting about your stories. You would assume
Speaker 1: he came out of your own personal frustration as a mum,
Speaker 1: but it was your passion for your skill and your
Speaker 1: your passion for the food industry that you could walk
Speaker 1: down the baby food aisle without buying any of that
Speaker 1: and still be passionate enough to start a business. Like
Speaker 1: I think people don't believe that if they're not personally
Speaker 1: connected at the time, they can't make a good idea.
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, that like and people are always like, surely
Speaker 2: you have children, you have children, right, And I'm like, no, way,
Speaker 2: I actually don't. Like I obviously love kids, and I
Speaker 2: can't wait I have babiesat forel like half of Sydney's children,
Speaker 2: and like, I know, I know kids well, Like I
Speaker 2: do know kids well, and I have had experience like
Speaker 2: feeding children understand like some of the you know, the
Speaker 2: battles and whatever. But I yeah, it's it's very much
Speaker 2: you know from I come at it from the Dietitian perspective, like,
Speaker 2: you know, knowing what I would want to feed my
Speaker 2: child when I'm a parent, So yes, I am. I'm
Speaker 2: aiming for the ideal, but I'm also very I have
Speaker 2: that experience enough experience with kids to also know, like, yes,
Speaker 2: you might feed them the perfect meal and they might
Speaker 2: throw it on the floor and choose to have a
Speaker 2: hot ship or something, you know, Like I one hundred
Speaker 2: percent understand, but I wanted to like simplify it, Like
Speaker 2: I just wanted to make it as simple as possible
Speaker 2: and go here you go. So I yeah, so I
Speaker 2: I think I like really resonated with that. I mean
Speaker 2: I do say to my husband like, I think I
Speaker 2: need my child for marketing purposes, so it's really good
Speaker 2: for advertising. But but you know, my my I will come.
Speaker 2: But it's yeah, no, it's always an unusual and to
Speaker 2: be honest, sometimes I'm a bit nervous about people I'm
Speaker 2: not a parent and I do as a business owner
Speaker 2: as something that I battle with and I have been
Speaker 2: told by like you know when I've looked at investor
Speaker 2: things as well, They're like, yeah, I wouldn't lead with
Speaker 2: the fact that you're not a mum, Like that's just
Speaker 2: not a good leader. I was like, okay, wow, yeah,
Speaker 2: I have been told, and I'm like okay, So sometimes
Speaker 2: I shy away from being like, oh, yeah, I'm not
Speaker 2: a mum yet.
Speaker 1: So yeah, that's really interesting. But I just think that
Speaker 1: it's a it's from a business perspective, like before we
Speaker 1: even get to the actual practical stuff. For anyone listening
Speaker 1: who does have an idea, but they do think that
Speaker 1: that excludes them from an industry. I absolutely think you're
Speaker 1: an amazing example that it doesn't.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I hope so, and I hope that, Like
Speaker 2: I mean, I will be the one that will sit
Speaker 2: there and talk babies with your telecows come home, like
Speaker 2: I'm very happy to do that, like but I love
Speaker 2: them so like I'm just like I was the little
Speaker 2: girl that was like I just want to go back
Speaker 2: and I want my baby born, Like I was obsessed
Speaker 2: with my baby born. If you're from the nineties, you
Speaker 2: know what I'm talking about. But like, yeah, I loved it.
Speaker 2: Where's the nappies? Like, yeah, that's all that's so sweet?
Speaker 1: Well, yeah, I mean talking about education and alleviating the
Speaker 1: overwhelm and stress and also lack of options. Really, at
Speaker 1: the time that you started, you have absolutely done that.
Speaker 1: Above and beyond. From a personal anecdotal perspective. You can
Speaker 1: borrow Teddy and make him a little mascot for now
Speaker 1: because it has truly been like since I was looking back,
Speaker 1: he's my post. His first box was around early September
Speaker 1: last year, so I worked out that's just a bit
Speaker 1: before six months. So one of the main areas of
Speaker 1: questions that I had and that a lot of people have,
Speaker 1: I've divided everyone submitted questions into like when, what, how,
Speaker 1: and and allergens and then sort of other So maybe
Speaker 1: we could start with when I assume for you that's
Speaker 1: sort of also when you know you have to think
Speaker 1: about when you start marketing to people and when your
Speaker 1: product is going to become relevant. So what are your
Speaker 1: thoughts on I thought that the most literature sort of
Speaker 1: spoke about six months, but then there's thoughts on starting before.
Speaker 1: Then a question was submitted about feeling forced by the
Speaker 1: GP and nurses to start it for and a half.
Speaker 1: What is your take on timing?
Speaker 2: Yeah, so this is such a great question. I think
Speaker 2: it's definitely one that creates a lot of confusion online.
Speaker 2: I will go straight in and say part of the
Speaker 2: confusion is the way that it is written in the guidelines,
Speaker 2: like specifically written. So in Australia we like to follow
Speaker 2: the Australian Society of Clinical Immunology Analogy guidelines there for
Speaker 2: our population. Their wording is to introduce solids around six months,
Speaker 2: not before four months. When baby is showing signs of readiness,
Speaker 2: continue breastfeeding if you aren't doing so while introducing solids.
Speaker 2: This is in line with the UK and the US
Speaker 2: and it's use of the word about and around, which
Speaker 2: are in all three of those guidelines. That's like, so,
Speaker 2: what's that like. That's very open to interpretation. It's quite
Speaker 2: an ambiguous word because it says not before four months.
Speaker 2: Like I've always been like, oh, okay, well that's sort
Speaker 2: of a window between four and six months. And the
Speaker 2: old guidelines did actually used to say between four and
Speaker 2: six months. So they have changed them and they've changed
Speaker 2: the wording, but it is still quite ambiguous. I think
Speaker 2: one thing you've got to remember is every baby develops
Speaker 2: at a slightly different rate. You can't be like, okay,
Speaker 2: like six months on the dot, every baby is going
Speaker 2: to be ready to start solids. It's just not like that.
Speaker 2: So you know, that is part of the issue around
Speaker 2: it is the wording. People that are strong advocates for
Speaker 2: not before six months months are the ones that look
Speaker 2: at the World Health Organization because World Health Organization says
Speaker 2: at six months, they don't mention four months. They don't
Speaker 2: use the word around or about. But it is also
Speaker 2: important to remember that the World Health Organization caters to
Speaker 2: the whole world, so we are also talking about third
Speaker 2: world countries. The thing with solids is as soon as
Speaker 2: you start to introduce solid you are also potentially introducing
Speaker 2: food borne illness. So there is a higher risk because
Speaker 2: obviously when you breastfeed or you prepare formula, it's quite
Speaker 2: a sterile process. Whereas you know you are potentially you know,
Speaker 2: there's they can be bugs and listeria, et cetera in
Speaker 2: the food that you're offering. You know, water supply, et cetera.
Speaker 2: That all can play a part in it. And so
Speaker 2: what they're trying to say in you know, particularly in
Speaker 2: third world countries, are like, we'd prefer to, you know,
Speaker 2: push it out a little bit longer because their immune
Speaker 2: system is going to be further along. A six month
Speaker 2: old immune system is going to be more developed than
Speaker 2: a four month old immune system, so in prefer to weight.
Speaker 2: So it is important to remember that, you know, That's
Speaker 2: why I do say you should really follow the guidelines
Speaker 2: for your country, because it's based on your food supply,
Speaker 2: et cetera. In saying that, though, I definitely like, you know,
Speaker 2: I hear you know, parents are telling me, and I
Speaker 2: do think often there is like pediatricians et cetera that
Speaker 2: are a bit more you know, pushy towards four months
Speaker 2: they sometimes are only seen, you know, the baby for
Speaker 2: a fifteen minute, you know stint, and we'll be like, oh, yep,
Speaker 2: I think that you know they you know they net
Speaker 2: control looks good. That's fine, Like you should get started
Speaker 2: on solids at the end of the day. You know
Speaker 2: your baby best. So we always talk about, you know,
Speaker 2: the signs of readiness, and the number one sign is
Speaker 2: always going to be that strong head and neck control,
Speaker 2: because if they've still got a floppy neck, there's the
Speaker 2: potential for choking, which is obviously one of the number
Speaker 2: one things we want to avoid. So you know, making
Speaker 2: sure they have that strong neck control. You can improve
Speaker 2: that by just practicing tummy time. In saying that, I
Speaker 2: don't expect, for example, you to put Bob in the
Speaker 2: middle of the floor with no support whatsoever, and they
Speaker 2: can completely hold themselves up right. But if you were
Speaker 2: to put them, say in a high chair, where there's
Speaker 2: obviously a little bit of support, they can hold themselves
Speaker 2: up right because they have that you know, head and
Speaker 2: neck control. Some babies obviously are a bit smaller, so
Speaker 2: they'll slide around the chair. I always just say, you know,
Speaker 2: get like a towel, roll it into a snake wrap
Speaker 2: it around their trunk. It'll just help give them a
Speaker 2: bit more support in there. And then things like you know,
Speaker 2: reaching for food, showing an interest in food. I'm sure
Speaker 2: you probably noticed this, like when you were eating Teddy
Speaker 2: would suddenly become interested and like want to grab what
Speaker 2: you were eating to Definitely you know that increased interest
Speaker 2: and awareness is starting to come along, but they're going
Speaker 2: to be more secondary to that head and net control.
Speaker 2: So I always say, look between that four and six
Speaker 2: month mark, when you're seeing those signs, you wouldn't start.
Speaker 2: Even if your baby was a week before four months
Speaker 2: and you're like, oh, they're showing the signs, do not start.
Speaker 2: They're definitely not ready. But from four months it's then
Speaker 2: really also up to you. You need to say. Some
Speaker 2: people are really excited and like I can't wait to
Speaker 2: start solids, and some people are like, ah, I want
Speaker 2: to push this out as long as possible. So it
Speaker 2: also is what works, what works best for you. The
Speaker 2: one thing to remember that we can't see from the
Speaker 2: outset is their digestive system, and so that one of
Speaker 2: the arguments for starting like more towards six months is
Speaker 2: people saying, well, their digestive systems are not ready, so
Speaker 2: you know, and again they're all going to develop at
Speaker 2: a slightly different rate. But say your baby's you know,
Speaker 2: five months old, they're showing all the signs of readiness,
Speaker 2: and you give them a little bit of food because
Speaker 2: you think they're ready. If their stomach became like really
Speaker 2: you know, tight and just stand and they became like
Speaker 2: gassy and uncomfortable and you know it seemed quite unsettled,
Speaker 2: that would suggest to me that they're digestive systems not
Speaker 2: quite ready, and I would leave it for a week
Speaker 2: or two and then come back and try again. But unfortunately,
Speaker 2: that's one sign that you can't see from the outset,
Speaker 2: and that's just going to be a bit of trial
Speaker 2: and error. But on the same token, some babies at
Speaker 2: four and a half months, the digestive system will be
Speaker 2: ready and so it's all fine to you know, push ahead.
Speaker 2: So I definitely think lately i've felt there's more of
Speaker 2: a move towards closer to six months. But I definitely
Speaker 2: hear of people being like, yeah, they see the doctor
Speaker 2: at four months and or they do the four month
Speaker 2: injections and the doctor's like, yep, cool, you can go
Speaker 2: get started now, And they're like, oh, I don't know
Speaker 2: if I feel like we're ready yet. You know your
Speaker 2: baby best, trust your own intuition. I think, don't yeah,
Speaker 2: don't feel pressured, but I you know, it's definitely a
Speaker 2: changing school of thought. And you've got to remember, like
Speaker 2: especially GPS, like they probably see adults and whatever, they're
Speaker 2: not constantly seeing babies. So you've got to you know
Speaker 2: your baby best. No one knows your baby better than you.
Speaker 1: I love how like my approach is always kind of
Speaker 1: look at what the overarching information is, which is like
Speaker 1: the window, the four to six month window, Then look
Speaker 1: at what your baby's doing, and then look at overlay
Speaker 1: your preferences over the top of that. So I kind
Speaker 1: of do those three things. It's like Teddy wasn't showing
Speaker 1: any interest. He had neck control from four months, but
Speaker 1: no interest whatsoever. So I was like, well, he's not
Speaker 1: ready yet. Then about five months there was interest, but
Speaker 1: we kind of weren't ready because we were overseas, and
Speaker 1: I was like, that's not the right time then. So
Speaker 1: then I thought, well, once we've got all three of
Speaker 1: those things lighting up, that's when we start. And it
Speaker 1: ended up just being a little bit before it was
Speaker 1: like five and a half. And I think the other
Speaker 1: thing is when people say when are you starting solids?
Speaker 1: You're not giving him like a beef sausage roll on
Speaker 1: day one. You know, you're just sort of like putting
Speaker 1: a tiny bit of stuff on his tongue. Like it
Speaker 1: takes a really long time before they swallow properly, so
Speaker 1: you know, you kind of that first little bit is
Speaker 1: it's all trial and errort, the biding, So I think,
Speaker 1: you know it's okay to let them start just working
Speaker 1: out what stuff in their mouth is. Like the first
Speaker 1: day there was a spoon in his mouth.
Speaker 2: Teddy was like, what is it?
Speaker 1: Get this out of my face?
Speaker 2: And yeah, you're so right. Like I also say to
Speaker 2: people like, I mean I didn't a couple of years
Speaker 2: obviously with COVID, but I was like, if you're traveling overseas,
Speaker 2: probably not the right time, just like because you know,
Speaker 2: also if you're introducing and when you start to inchuse
Speaker 2: allergens and stuff like, you want to be able to
Speaker 2: get to the hospital and things like that, so like
Speaker 2: they're really important things to consider if you're in the
Speaker 2: middle of Italy, which is I think where you went
Speaker 2: quite around that time. Yeah, you're not going to be like,
Speaker 2: oh so now I need to find the hospital because
Speaker 2: my chil's had a reaction like yeah, you want to
Speaker 2: be in you know, your comfort zone. So there's all
Speaker 2: those factors to consider in saying that. If your baby
Speaker 2: is approaching seven months, I'd be like, okay, like let's
Speaker 2: check in make sure there's not something else going on.
Speaker 2: If they're not interested, it could be like an undiagnosed
Speaker 2: tongue tie, So let's just like get that sorted. But yeah,
Speaker 2: aside from that, like your approach is like one hundred
Speaker 2: percent the way that I would go.
Speaker 1: And what about I found it kind of confusing to
Speaker 1: work out what is the first meal to add? So
Speaker 1: is it brecky then lunch than dinner or it doesn't
Speaker 1: matter what the order is or I mean, firstly, you
Speaker 1: don't really start with a full meal anyway, but like
Speaker 1: what time of day and then do you build up
Speaker 1: to full meals? How do you? Or is that also
Speaker 1: a personal preference thing?
Speaker 2: No, that's a really great question. So because you know,
Speaker 2: all new foods are something that they haven't had before.
Speaker 2: Although we have the allergens, they're the foods that are
Speaker 2: responsible for ninety percent of allergies worldwide. But any food
Speaker 2: could cause an allergy or an intolerance or some kind
Speaker 2: of reaction. So we always generally recommend a new food
Speaker 2: in the first half of the day, ideally, you know,
Speaker 2: after that first nap of the day. The reason being
Speaker 2: that you want them to be awake, ideally for two hours,
Speaker 2: so you can just so like you want them to
Speaker 2: be at the beginning of their awake windows so you
Speaker 2: can watch and observe them for any adverse reaction. So
Speaker 2: I usually find breakfast. However, you don't even need to
Speaker 2: think about it as breakfast as such, because you could
Speaker 2: offer veggies and beef or whatever. It doesn't need to
Speaker 2: be like cereal like it. Don't think about it like
Speaker 2: it has to be like our you know, breakfast is
Speaker 2: generally sweet and whatever it is, it doesn't matter what
Speaker 2: it is. So I usually do start with breakfast or
Speaker 2: as the first meal of the day. Usually just do
Speaker 2: one meal or one offering a food for a month,
Speaker 2: and then after a month you would add a second meal.
Speaker 2: Doesn't really matter where you add that second meal. Sometimes
Speaker 2: it's what's practical, Like if you're going to be out
Speaker 2: in the middle of the day. Maybe that doesn't work,
Speaker 2: or you know, you might be like I want to
Speaker 2: do a din like do like morning and then dinner time,
Speaker 2: and then I'll add the lunch in, So it doesn't
Speaker 2: matter what old I'd just always start with the first
Speaker 2: first half of the day, like just so you can
Speaker 2: watch for any adverse reactions. Then once they've had you know,
Speaker 2: for example, that food, it's fine for that then to
Speaker 2: become like a dinner time food, and then you can
Speaker 2: you know, move your new things to the first half
Speaker 2: of the day.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and then what about I found this really difficult
Speaker 1: and I still sometimes do. Actually, is how do you
Speaker 1: know how much perserve? And then how do you know
Speaker 1: when they're full? Because some babies will just keep eating
Speaker 1: past full. Some babies even if they're not full. You
Speaker 1: have to kind of like encourage them. And I still
Speaker 1: find it even on an evolving basis, like how is
Speaker 1: his appetite grown? I don't know how much to add
Speaker 1: to each serving? Like how do you kind of work
Speaker 1: all that out?
Speaker 2: Such a great question. So look, when you start, like
Speaker 2: I would just be you know, they might only take
Speaker 2: a tea spoon and that is absolutely fine. As you said,
Speaker 2: it's like just trying it out. Like you will always
Speaker 2: start with giving the milk feed first initially, so you're
Speaker 2: going to do your breastfeed or your formula feed. Wait
Speaker 2: about half an hour, give you solid feed. So they're
Speaker 2: just getting used to it. It's definitely not dominant. So
Speaker 2: what you'd start to do is you start to like
Speaker 2: learn their cues so like so it can take six
Speaker 2: weeks do they get to the point that they have
Speaker 2: like half a cup. So I'd definitely be starting with
Speaker 2: small amounts, and that's why we do like the really
Speaker 2: small cubes, so who can build up how much you offer.
Speaker 2: But similarly, if you're making the food yourself, I'd recommend
Speaker 2: doing like an ice cube trace so you can build
Speaker 2: the amounts that you offer, because they will start probably
Speaker 2: start with half a tea spoon, and then it'll move
Speaker 2: up and you'll get to half a cup. But you'll
Speaker 2: just start to work out their cues. So for example,
Speaker 2: if you're feeding, you know you're feeding Teddy and you've
Speaker 2: got through what you had, say defrosted or made for him,
Speaker 2: and he's like you're done with it, and you're like
Speaker 2: he's looking around for more, or he cries when you
Speaker 2: take away the ball, or he's reaching for more more
Speaker 2: like reaching out as if he wants more, Like that
Speaker 2: would suggest to me he wants more food, Whereas on
Speaker 2: the flip side, if he's like, you know, you're midway
Speaker 2: through what you've like put out, and he is like,
Speaker 2: you know, getting distracted, he's trying to pull off his bib,
Speaker 2: he's trying to climb out of the high chair, he's crying.
Speaker 2: He's like he's just lost interest. Just leave it. And
Speaker 2: it's hard, especially if you've like slaved or data make
Speaker 2: a beautiful meal. And we do have this habit of
Speaker 2: being like come on, and I like, as a babysitter,
Speaker 2: I've been like, come on, one more mouthful, But like, babies
Speaker 2: have this amazing ability to regulate their own appetite. You
Speaker 2: if you're breastfeeding, you know, like they cry when they're hungry,
Speaker 2: and they stop feeding when they've had enough, and if
Speaker 2: you're not feeding them from a bottle, you have no
Speaker 2: idea how that much they've had. You're just like, Okay,
Speaker 2: they've had enough, and like like they know, so like
Speaker 2: trust them to regulate it. And it can be frustrating
Speaker 2: because it's definitely goes in waves. You'll be like, I
Speaker 2: feel like this kid will like never stop eating, Like
Speaker 2: I could just like keep feeding him. And people say,
Speaker 2: like to me, they're like, do I like stop any time?
Speaker 2: I always say, the only time you would do? Like,
Speaker 2: sometimes babies eat so fast that their brain like can't
Speaker 2: get in touch with like when they're.
Speaker 1: Full, like us adults do that too. I'm like, that's amazing.
Speaker 2: Yes, So if you do, fine, you think they're doing that,
Speaker 2: and particularly if they get to the point where they
Speaker 2: like throw up, that suggests they've eaten too much. So
Speaker 2: what you might need to do is just slow down
Speaker 2: the feeding, like you know, just allow a lot of
Speaker 2: a pause, like slow them down, maybe try and give
Speaker 2: them some kind of destruction or give them the spoon
Speaker 2: to like be chewing on or something, just so that
Speaker 2: you can slow down the rate at which they're eating
Speaker 2: so that they have time for their brain to like realize, oh,
Speaker 2: actually I'm full. But that would only be if they
Speaker 2: getting to the point where they're basically overeating to the
Speaker 2: point where they throw up. Otherwise there will be days
Speaker 2: where they're just really hungry, you know, Like I know
Speaker 2: some people have like those wonder Week's apps, et cetera,
Speaker 2: where it says like they're going through a gross bert
Speaker 2: now and they might be eating more, and then they'll
Speaker 2: go through stages where like particularly if they're teething, like
Speaker 2: that can really put them off their appetite and they
Speaker 2: might just want to have like breastfeed or you know,
Speaker 2: formula feed. And that's fine as well, Like it's going
Speaker 2: to be like that, but inevitably you're like, oh, you know,
Speaker 2: yesterday we ate so much, like why are they not eating?
Speaker 2: They must be hungry, And we develop this expectation, but
Speaker 2: it will it will vary from day to day. Like
Speaker 2: I always just encourage people to try and keep up
Speaker 2: like a monthly way in ideally on the same scales
Speaker 2: and just you know, I know, I forgot what the
Speaker 2: color of the book is in Melbourne but green in
Speaker 2: South Wales. Yeah, so there's a blue book and you
Speaker 2: have the plot in chart and just to plot, make
Speaker 2: sure you're keeping like a regular rate on the growth
Speaker 2: chart so that you can see if they move up
Speaker 2: or down a line. The only time we start to
Speaker 2: get worried is if they drop down two lines. Other
Speaker 2: than that, you know they're going to sort of go up.
Speaker 2: They might move a little bit and that's absolutely fine.
Speaker 1: Yeah, amazing, And I think that's one of the things
Speaker 1: that's been really hard but also good to remember with Teddy,
Speaker 1: is it all that matters. It doesn't matter what he
Speaker 1: is compared to anyone else's age. It matters what he
Speaker 1: is compared to his percentiles, his whole life. Like you
Speaker 1: just need to stay in the window that your baby is.
Speaker 1: You're not trying to like it's you know, you're constantly
Speaker 1: looking around at what other mums are doing and other
Speaker 1: babies are eating, and they're all just figuring out at
Speaker 1: different rates. Like some kids that I know at the
Speaker 1: same age, we're eating lamptops when Teddy was still on
Speaker 1: pures and then some kids were still on breastmet or
Speaker 1: formula and they hadn't even started. And you get, really
Speaker 1: it's really hard to just focus down on what your
Speaker 1: green book or blue book trends are doing. Like that's
Speaker 1: where you really need to focus.
Speaker 2: It's so true, and I always really like to remind people,
Speaker 2: like you're running your own race. It's really hard. Like
Speaker 2: I think, you know, comparison can be the source of
Speaker 2: evil because you can be like, you know, little Freddy
Speaker 2: Freddy next door was born on exactly the same day
Speaker 2: as Teddy and he's doing this or you know, and
Speaker 2: you're like, but there's always going to be, you know,
Speaker 2: a couple of months buffer. Even with those milestones that
Speaker 2: babies need to meet, there's always going to be you know,
Speaker 2: a couple of months buffer in them hitting those milestones.
Speaker 2: So like, just try not to compare, because it can
Speaker 2: send you a little bit crazy and you're like, oh, no,
Speaker 2: like there's something wrong. But as I said, like at
Speaker 2: seven months, if there was not a not a bite
Speaker 2: being taken, yes, I'd be like, please just check in
Speaker 2: that something else is not going on. But aside from that,
Speaker 2: you know, there there's always going to be a buffer time.
Speaker 2: So you know, be gentle, be kind to yourself. And
Speaker 2: even like when you have subsequent children, people will be like, oh, well,
Speaker 2: my firstborn didn't do that, Like you know what I mean,
Speaker 2: And you compare to your own they're running their own race.
Speaker 2: Be guided by them, might trust them and it'll make
Speaker 2: you a lot calmer. But it's look as easier said
Speaker 2: than time.
Speaker 1: Are there any other broad guidelines And this is a
Speaker 1: very selfish question for this particular chapter of my solids journey,
Speaker 1: but are there any other guidelines on volumes by particular months,
Speaker 1: Like you know, if you haven't started at all by
Speaker 1: seven months, then that's kind of a clear guideline. But
Speaker 1: is it like you should be at three meals by
Speaker 1: this time, or you should be at x amount of
Speaker 1: like big morsels, like you should have gone from pures
Speaker 1: to like chunks, Like where does that all kind of sit?
Speaker 1: Is it anywhere we can look for those guidelines?
Speaker 2: Sure, Look there's a bit like look, there's some rough
Speaker 2: guidelines around that. So what we usually would say, so
Speaker 2: you know, if you're going to do pures, you start
Speaker 2: off with always start off with like a really smooth,
Speaker 2: consistency pure and you would do that for about a month.
Speaker 2: So usually you know, if you start obviously five months,
Speaker 2: by six months you might be moving to slightly chunkier
Speaker 2: But usually we'd say, you know, so by eight to
Speaker 2: nine months, you'd expect that they would have got to
Speaker 2: the point of having three meals per day, and they
Speaker 2: really should be getting to the point where they're able
Speaker 2: if they've done puis, they're able to handle quite a textured,
Speaker 2: you know, very chunky pure slash finger food. So ultimately,
Speaker 2: if you've done baby lead weaning, which we'll go into
Speaker 2: I'm sure in a second, but or pureise ultimately, by
Speaker 2: the time that they're nine months, they really converge like
Speaker 2: they would both be able to handle finger foods. So yeah,
Speaker 2: like nine months is what I say. By nine months,
Speaker 2: i'd really expect Bubby's having three meals per day and
Speaker 2: you know, is able to handle finger foods. There's no
Speaker 2: reason why you can't still be giving them, you know, pures,
Speaker 2: et cetera. But they're definitely able to handle like little
Speaker 2: sandwiches and little pieces of soft, soft finger food by
Speaker 2: that point. The way that you get there, I usually
Speaker 2: find it's easier just to do one meal. Say you
Speaker 2: started let's say six months, two meals at seven months,
Speaker 2: three meals at eight months, so you're actually there at
Speaker 2: eight months. Otherwise, if you start a bit early, you
Speaker 2: might do you know, one meal at five months, two
Speaker 2: meals at six months, three meals at seven months, so
Speaker 2: just one month, one month, one month, so it's a
Speaker 2: gradual step up. Some people that start at four months,
Speaker 2: I just they don't add your second meal until they're
Speaker 2: six months. And the reason that that's important is that
Speaker 2: obviously as they start to take more and more solid
Speaker 2: food in it will start to impact the amount of
Speaker 2: milk that they have, and we just don't want to
Speaker 2: like decrease the amount of milk that they're having too quickly. Obviously,
Speaker 2: it's a very specific makeup for their development. You know,
Speaker 2: it's got all of the nutrients and minerals as well
Speaker 2: as you know, energy breakdown that's perfect for their growth,
Speaker 2: and we just don't want to cut into that too quickly.
Speaker 2: It's as well as having immunological benefits. So I just say, look,
Speaker 2: don't get to like I know people that are like, oh,
Speaker 2: I'm at three meals at six months and they're like
Speaker 2: so happy, and I'm like, you know what, just pull
Speaker 2: it back a bit, like just not because otherwise, you know,
Speaker 2: some babies will be like I'm done, Like I'm over
Speaker 2: the milk. And like when people sometimes do reach out
Speaker 2: to me and be like, oh, they're not really taking
Speaker 2: their milk, I'm like, you know what, they're probably just
Speaker 2: having so much solids that they don't need it. It's
Speaker 2: usually also at that point, like you know that eight
Speaker 2: to nine month mark where you're at, and it might
Speaker 2: be seven months that you get to three meals per day,
Speaker 2: but usually I say it eight months, we start to
Speaker 2: swap it over and start to give solid food before
Speaker 2: the milk. So initially you'll be starting off with always
Speaker 2: giving milk waiting about half an hour. But then at
Speaker 2: eight months, which is usually lines up with when they're
Speaker 2: having three meals per day, that's when we swap and
Speaker 2: we give the solid food first and wait about half
Speaker 2: an hour and then give the milk. And then you know,
Speaker 2: because then you're basically what happens is, you know, as
Speaker 2: you gradually increase the solids, you gradually reduce the milk.
Speaker 2: It's just like this crossover. And so then obviously solids
Speaker 2: will start to become more and more dominant. So in
Speaker 2: terms of yeah, that's sort of the guidelines. And then yeah,
Speaker 2: nine months, you'd really expect that whether or not you've
Speaker 2: done baby led winning on pures, they're able to handle
Speaker 2: some finger foods. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Oh that's so useful. And I also was going to
Speaker 1: ask that milk first versus second question as well, So
Speaker 1: thank you so much for answering that in terms of
Speaker 1: their preference. So I had a question from someone who
Speaker 1: has a ten month old who's still not overly interested
Speaker 1: and still sometimes gags, and I find Teddy has quite
Speaker 1: a sensitive gag reflex when he doesn't like something. So
Speaker 1: rather than just like push you get a way straight away,
Speaker 1: he will try it, and he'll try it quite a
Speaker 1: few times, even if he recognizes the food. But then
Speaker 1: he'll he'll gag. So, firstly, how do you know when
Speaker 1: they're really rejecting food because they don't like it or
Speaker 1: just because it's foreign. And how many times would you
Speaker 1: like keep trying that food. Would you wait a month
Speaker 1: or would you wait a week, or would you just
Speaker 1: conclude like they don't like this thing.
Speaker 2: Yeah, this is a good one. Look at the end
Speaker 2: of the day, like it is a learning process and
Speaker 2: they're going from having like they're born with the preference
Speaker 2: for sweet food. Then they have milk for you know,
Speaker 2: how ever many months and it's sweet and delicious, and
Speaker 2: then suddenly you're like, here's broccoli, like and they do
Speaker 2: have a very you know, their gag reflex is one
Speaker 2: much closer to the you know, the surface. But yeah,
Speaker 2: they can actually just gag on foods they don't like
Speaker 2: some of them. It's just about like a learning process.
Speaker 2: So we say, like, you know, it can take twenty
Speaker 2: times for them to like it. Insaying that you're not
Speaker 2: going to go and give like, yeah, twenty consecutive tryes.
Speaker 1: Wow, I've given up way earlier.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And people do because they're like I just want
Speaker 2: them to eat something like, but you're not going to
Speaker 2: do twenty days, Like that's just torture for the child,
Speaker 2: Like you do, Like say you do two days of gout,
Speaker 2: You're like, okay, I'd just be like, let's leave it,
Speaker 2: come back to it in two weeks and circle background
Speaker 2: to it and just try again. It's just like a
Speaker 2: try again, try again. Giving something with like something you
Speaker 2: know that they like also can help, like increase familiarity.
Speaker 2: So like if say they love pumpkin but they're not
Speaker 2: loving broccoli, like offering the pumpkin with the broccoli, whether
Speaker 2: that's mixed together as pure or like, you know, giving
Speaker 2: the two things.
Speaker 1: I love that you use those two because that's how
Speaker 1: I got him to eat broccoli is with pumpkins, because
Speaker 1: that was the first booth that he loved. I was like, Oh,
Speaker 1: this is the same pumpkin you have every day. What
Speaker 1: do you mean?
Speaker 2: Yeah, look, pumpkin sweet, delicious love or usually pretty well tolerated.
Speaker 2: Broccoli obviously bitter and like not nearly as you know,
Speaker 2: yummy as your pumpkins. So it is that it's just
Speaker 2: getting them used to those slightly bitter foods. And like
Speaker 2: I mean, I always use the example, but like when
Speaker 2: I was younger, I didn't like wine. Well now I
Speaker 2: like wine, like you know, like it's those flavors. But
Speaker 2: it's like those you know, they need to develop taste
Speaker 2: for things that they're not used to, and so like
Speaker 2: bitter and you know, sour and all of these things.
Speaker 2: It's just a new experience and some will take longer.
Speaker 2: But unfortunately it is a persistence and doing courages, doing
Speaker 2: little small amounts. We don't go and cook a whole
Speaker 2: head of broccoli and be like, okay, well we can
Speaker 2: I like broccoli, because you could be throwing out a
Speaker 2: lot of food.
Speaker 1: Well, that's also another question that came up about, you know,
Speaker 1: the bitters and then the like tart foods and the
Speaker 1: kind of categories of things. Is there a specific order
Speaker 1: of the type of food that you recommend introducing or
Speaker 1: specific foods by a certain age. And I think that
Speaker 1: you recommended to me, like pumpkin and sweet potato were
Speaker 1: the very first things that we tried at all like
Speaker 1: I wouldn't have gone in with broccoli because I feel
Speaker 1: like it just wouldn't have gone Well, do you have
Speaker 1: an order that you suggest.
Speaker 2: I usually go more flavor neutral first, so avocado or
Speaker 2: zecchini as one like that, I often will go for it.
Speaker 2: There's no heart and fast, but I definitely I would
Speaker 2: not give fruit first, Like I'm a hard veggies first gal.
Speaker 2: Like there is increasing research coming out to show the
Speaker 2: benefits of giving veggies first, just because of that the
Speaker 2: baby sweet preference, and in the UK their guidelines actually
Speaker 2: even say like dark leafy greens first, So I'd usually
Speaker 2: go like zucchini, which is also a good texture for
Speaker 2: a pure point of view, it's quite watery, so it's
Speaker 2: usually quite good for that. Avocado very flavor neutral, also
Speaker 2: usually really well tolerated, so they're usually my first two.
Speaker 2: I then actually got a bit more savory, and then
Speaker 2: I would go sweeter veggies. But there's no heart and fast,
Speaker 2: but I just do veggies first, to as many veggies
Speaker 2: as you can first before you start to introduce fruits,
Speaker 2: So like sometimes I say like avocado, zucchini, then you
Speaker 2: might go to like your broccoli and then move to
Speaker 2: your pumpkin and stuff. Sometimes people like often people do
Speaker 2: pumpkin first. It's a very common first food, and like
Speaker 2: it's not as sweet as like sweet potato, and then
Speaker 2: doing things like yeah, you're sweet. You carry all of
Speaker 2: those and then I would do, you know, you start
Speaker 2: to add the fruits in there some way. You also
Speaker 2: want to start to add the meat, but I wouldn't
Speaker 2: give you meat probably not the first thing I would give.
Speaker 2: Meat doesn't if you're not adding flavoring, doesn't have a
Speaker 2: whole lot of flavor, like, it's just like meaty like,
Speaker 2: So I usually would say, you know, incorporate the meat
Speaker 2: with like the veggies. So do a few veggies and
Speaker 2: then you can start adding the meat to it. One
Speaker 2: thing I just always say is I really encourage people
Speaker 2: not to mix the fruit into the savory because it's
Speaker 2: easy to do and the likelihood is they will, you know,
Speaker 2: eat it so quickly and they'll love it. But it's
Speaker 2: a false sense of you know, what flavors should taste like.
Speaker 2: And that's like obviously one of the really big criticisms
Speaker 2: of the pouches and stuff. You know, you you look,
Speaker 2: if you read the back of the pouch, it's like
Speaker 2: it says, it's like a you know, a chicken whatever
Speaker 2: pouch and then you know, chicken's like seven percent and
Speaker 2: apples like the first ingredient. Yeah yeah, you're like yeah,
Speaker 2: so yeah. Then you're like, why won't they eat my
Speaker 2: chicken and you know whatever that I've made them. It's
Speaker 2: because they're they're used to this sweetned you know, sense
Speaker 2: of safety, so you want them to learn to like
Speaker 2: savory foods. But it is a learning process. It's because
Speaker 2: they have that sweet preference. They've had all this sweet
Speaker 2: food In terms of things like you're tard and you're sour,
Speaker 2: You'll just gradually start to incorporate those, you know, like
Speaker 2: you might offer some yogan and just do like a
Speaker 2: full fat Greek yogurt. I wouldn't recommend like a sweeten one.
Speaker 2: So that's obviously going to be quite tight, but there's
Speaker 2: no hard rules about that. I'd just usually say savory
Speaker 2: before sweet, so savory before sweet, and then just starting
Speaker 2: to incorporate meat. I mean, giving a baby like a
Speaker 2: slice of lemon is one of the funniest, fewdest things
Speaker 2: you'll ever watch. I don't know if you've done it, yea,
Speaker 2: we did.
Speaker 1: It was really.
Speaker 2: Like that because it takes them a second that.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, it's so cute. And I mean, if
Speaker 1: anyone is listening who hasn't started their Solar's journey yet
Speaker 1: and is doing this is kind of their introduction. By
Speaker 1: this point, it will already be sounding quite overwhelming how
Speaker 1: many different things there are to make. And this is
Speaker 1: why nourishing Bubs has been so revolutionary for us, because
Speaker 1: if you're doing it on your own, you're having to
Speaker 1: prepare a lot of different foods in random volumes, in
Speaker 1: an all different like you're trying to mix lots of
Speaker 1: different things. There's so much food wastage. So having the
Speaker 1: baby's first food pack that has all of these pre
Speaker 1: prepared snap frozen, like in one big pack, little cubes
Speaker 1: of all of these veggies, and then separate packs for
Speaker 1: the fruits so that you can just kind of mix
Speaker 1: and match and play and not waste and it's already
Speaker 1: done for you. Like, I can't even explain at this
Speaker 1: point how much the whole process was simplified by you
Speaker 1: giving us all this information but then saying and here
Speaker 1: here is the tools to do that introduction.
Speaker 2: I couldn't have said it better for myself. Yeah, I
Speaker 2: wanted to be like, here's the tools, here's what you need.
Speaker 2: You're still in control, you're still the chef, you can
Speaker 2: put together what you want. But like here it is.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that ability to know that there was not anything
Speaker 1: in those cubes other than what I would have prepared
Speaker 1: for myself, except that I didn't have to prepare it.
Speaker 1: But then I don't have to feel guilty for it
Speaker 1: because there isn't anything ad it. It's just that revolutionary.
Speaker 1: But I also wanted to ask, so we did have
Speaker 1: another question about the types of foods. Is it true?
Speaker 1: And I think I know the answer to this one.
Speaker 1: Is it true that there's a window to try those
Speaker 1: new foods between six and seven months? Like every kind
Speaker 1: of made your new food needs to be introduced at
Speaker 1: a particular time. Is there an optical time or are
Speaker 1: you just constantly reintroducing, not reintroducing, but sorry, constantly adding No,
Speaker 1: it's not that tight, Like.
Speaker 2: I wouldn't say it's that tight, it's step. Look, they
Speaker 2: say that the window is really the first two years
Speaker 2: of life, so you do have time, like because some
Speaker 2: people will be like, oh, I started with you know,
Speaker 2: they will start with food and then I'll they'll come
Speaker 2: to a talk and they'll be like, oh, eek, I
Speaker 2: already started with fruit, have I like stuffed it up already.
Speaker 2: But the reality is that they talk about like the
Speaker 2: window from having baby ingestation to at the end of
Speaker 2: the two years, so they call it the first thousand days,
Speaker 2: and that really is your window of opportunity to expose
Speaker 2: them to as many flavors as possible. Like the reality
Speaker 2: is you can't I usually say, one new food a day,
Speaker 2: especially for the first two to four weeks, so you
Speaker 2: know you're gonna get thirty foods maybe, like so you
Speaker 2: can't expose them to everything in a month period, So
Speaker 2: you definitely have some time. But you know those years
Speaker 2: of life are when they're like without sounding manipulative, but
Speaker 2: their brain's most like malleable, most influential. So if you
Speaker 2: can like really plant those seeds, lay those foundations for
Speaker 2: healthy eating, the reality is, you know, at three they
Speaker 2: might be really difficult eaters, but if they have, like
Speaker 2: you've laid those foundations, the likelihood is they will come
Speaker 2: back around to being good eaters. Like the amount of
Speaker 2: people that are like my baby was such a great eater,
Speaker 2: like from you know, six to twelve months and then
Speaker 2: suddenly we've like fallen off a cliff. But you know,
Speaker 2: they do come back around. If you've like really put
Speaker 2: the effort into to expose them to as many new
Speaker 2: foods and as many new flavors as possible. You know
Speaker 2: that is really important for them. So you know, it
Speaker 2: is important also to make a really conscious effort to
Speaker 2: expose them to different foods, like don't be giving them
Speaker 2: carrot every day, don't be giving them pumpkin every day. Also,
Speaker 2: you know, if you don't like a food, you still
Speaker 2: want to try and introduce them like we obviously.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's really hard, Like.
Speaker 2: I'm like, oh, I don't eat capsicums, so we don't
Speaker 2: have caps com in well you know what I mean. Like,
Speaker 2: and they're not going to expose to these great foods
Speaker 2: and so they're naturally their flavors are shaped by what
Speaker 2: the foods that you choose to eat. But you know,
Speaker 2: we really want to try and make sure we can
Speaker 2: get as many as many foods in as possible.
Speaker 1: I found that one of the hardest things is to
Speaker 1: expose him because we're very exploratory. We love exploring, adventurous
Speaker 1: when we eat, but like at home, where such creatures
Speaker 1: of habit, and I found it really hard to keep
Speaker 1: Teddy's palette exposed to things beyond our habitual routine at home.
Speaker 1: And I think I am like definitely now even listening
Speaker 1: to you, I'm like, oh my god, I really need
Speaker 1: to stop just beating him the same thing that I
Speaker 1: know he loves every day at the same meals because
Speaker 1: it's easy and because I know he likes it, and
Speaker 1: because it gets the calories in. But yeah, that was
Speaker 1: a really good reminder for me.
Speaker 2: People do it, Yeah, because so if you know they're
Speaker 2: going to eat it, you're like or you're like, oh,
Speaker 2: I want to give them something they eat. The best
Speaker 2: way is just to keep, you know, have something as
Speaker 2: a guarantee they'll eat, and then just something new and
Speaker 2: something you know that's a bit more like, oh, I
Speaker 2: don't know if they're going to like be into this,
Speaker 2: but something safe and something new can be the way
Speaker 2: to just help combat that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I love that. So moving on to the next section,
Speaker 1: like broad section, which is another thing that I think
Speaker 1: is really divisive at the beginning less so, as you mentioned,
Speaker 1: when it kind of ends up converging, but there's we've
Speaker 1: done this sort of when but then there's a decision
Speaker 1: of how you're going to start solids, and there's kind
Speaker 1: of a lot of options and obviously there's a lot
Speaker 1: of experimentation within each area. Or you can just kind
Speaker 1: of like you don't have to put labels on everything necessarily,
Speaker 1: you can just kind of start. But in terms of
Speaker 1: what you'll read when you first go out to read
Speaker 1: up on starting solids, there's kind of a few methods
Speaker 1: that come out, and you know, people who are more
Speaker 1: familiar will start using acronyms like BLW and I think
Speaker 1: new mums are just like, what the hell is that
Speaker 1: and what does that all mean? So can you take
Speaker 1: us through the how what the landscape looks like when
Speaker 1: nourishing bubs fits into that? What mixed feeding is, you know,
Speaker 1: like what kind of the options are for someone who's
Speaker 1: at the very beginning and it's just like lay this
Speaker 1: out in a diagram.
Speaker 2: Yes, So, as you said that, we really sort of
Speaker 2: talk about there's now like two main Initially back in
Speaker 2: the day, it used to just be pure. We call
Speaker 2: it i'd call pure like more traditional feeding approach. You
Speaker 2: move on to pure. As you start with a smooth pure,
Speaker 2: you start to graduate the texture as time goes on
Speaker 2: and ultimately, by about nine months, you'd get to the
Speaker 2: point where baby's having finger food. So you'll move from
Speaker 2: a smooth pure after a month, he'd make it a
Speaker 2: bit more textured. After another month he'd make it more
Speaker 2: like a minced texture, and then you get to more
Speaker 2: like a risotto and a finger food. So it's a
Speaker 2: gradual process. That's why you know, if you're buying patches
Speaker 2: or something, they also have you know, stage textures, et cetera.
Speaker 2: So you've probably seen that before. The more newer method
Speaker 2: is called Baby Led Winning BLW, and what it is
Speaker 2: it was developed by a woman called a Dual WRAPI
Speaker 2: and she basically it's a whole concept where you really
Speaker 2: skip the pure stage altogether and you go straight into
Speaker 2: giving baby finger foods. The reason that it has gained
Speaker 2: popularity is one because it really leans into this whole
Speaker 2: concept that you know, as I said before, babies have
Speaker 2: a really amazing appetite control, and so it allows them
Speaker 2: to really lead by you know, their feeding themselves. So
Speaker 2: you put the food on their plate and then they
Speaker 2: pick up and feed themselves. So as I said before,
Speaker 2: we do have a bit of a habit of if
Speaker 2: we've made this beautiful meal. We're like, come on, one
Speaker 2: more mouthful. Whereas you know with baby lead Winning, they're
Speaker 2: like picking it up themselves. So when they've lost interest
Speaker 2: and they're over it, you just you move on with
Speaker 2: the finger foods. Obviously people like, oh, but like how
Speaker 2: you know how often they won't have teeth when you
Speaker 2: start solids, you need to make sure that you're cooking
Speaker 2: them till they're really really soft. So you know, we
Speaker 2: talk about the squish test, so being able to squash
Speaker 2: it easily between your finger and your thumb so that
Speaker 2: they can squash it between the palette and tongue of
Speaker 2: their mouth, particularly if they've got no teeth. It is
Speaker 2: quite amazing what a baby can gum when they like
Speaker 2: how they get through that, Like I'm just like shocked,
Speaker 2: Like their gums are really quite strong. So you know,
Speaker 2: it's making sure it's cooked until it's really soft. And
Speaker 2: then again, if you're doing baby lead winning, you as
Speaker 2: time goes on, you start to reduce the amount you
Speaker 2: know you're cooking food so that it does become a
Speaker 2: little bit firm, and you're building up the resistance because
Speaker 2: ultimately having to chew on foods is what starts to
Speaker 2: develop the jaws, the the muscles in their jaw and
Speaker 2: will be ultimately involved in speech. So it is important
Speaker 2: whether you're doing baby lead winning or purease, that you
Speaker 2: are graduating the texture. Obviously with something like a lamb chop,
Speaker 2: like and I feel like the lamb chop is the
Speaker 2: most cliche into baby lead winning. You have like a
Speaker 2: six month old holding the lamb chop and you're like,
Speaker 2: but how do they manage that? They've got no teeth?
Speaker 2: But they'll like suck the goodness out of it, and
Speaker 2: you can let there are pictures where you see and
Speaker 2: like the lamb CHOP's basically gone gray because they actually
Speaker 2: like supple the new tunes. You're like, that's gross and weird,
Speaker 2: and like did they get anything out of it? But
Speaker 2: surprisingly they do. It is all about, you know, with
Speaker 2: baby lead winning, like bigger is better, particularly when you're starting.
Speaker 2: Otherwise they do have a habit of just like trying
Speaker 2: to swallow the whole thing, particularly if it's a small piece.
Speaker 2: So you know, a lamb chop is good or something
Speaker 2: that they can hold easily. We talk about you know,
Speaker 2: cutting it so that it's about the size of two fingers.
Speaker 2: So if you're cutting you know, made some steak, cut
Speaker 2: it into a slice, it's about the size of two fingers,
Speaker 2: you know, steamsticks of carrot, florets of broccoli, coulieflowered things
Speaker 2: that they can pick up easily because they pincy group
Speaker 2: is not developed, so it's harder for them to pick
Speaker 2: it up, so they need to like pick it up
Speaker 2: with their playing a grip. So yeah, just always thinking
Speaker 2: about the shape you're offering them. As time goes on
Speaker 2: and they get more towards like nine months old, you
Speaker 2: can start cutting it smaller because they've sort of learned
Speaker 2: how to handle it. But yeah, initially they'll just want
Speaker 2: to put the whole thing in their mouth. So you
Speaker 2: want to give them something big so that they're forced
Speaker 2: to like bite it like a chicken. Drumstick is also
Speaker 2: a good example, because they have to hold it and like,
Speaker 2: you know, sort of chew at it so that they're
Speaker 2: you know, don't choke. But you know, I think understandably, people,
Speaker 2: particularly first time parents, terrified at baby lad winning, so
Speaker 2: I definitely see it more common in second time parents
Speaker 2: because of that fear of choking, understandably, and then your
Speaker 2: little one always wants to copy what their oldest sibling
Speaker 2: is doing, so that's why it does become more popular.
Speaker 2: But I'm a really big advocate of a combination approach
Speaker 2: because every baby is different. Some babies like really like
Speaker 2: the independence quite early on have been able to feed themselves,
Speaker 2: and obviously, you know, baby lad winning is a more
Speaker 2: independent they're feeding themselves, they're really taking control in saying
Speaker 2: that you can do pures with baby lead winning. So
Speaker 2: if you like loaded the spoon and then give them
Speaker 2: the spoon, that's a method of baby lead weening. It's
Speaker 2: just yeah, it's basically just giving them the control and
Speaker 2: whether or not you're doing you know, purese or baby
Speaker 2: lead winning, and do encourage you to learn baby's Q
Speaker 2: and try not to as hard as it is, be like,
Speaker 2: come on, one more mouthful, because then you're pushing past
Speaker 2: their appetite cues. Obviously, we do a lot of pures,
Speaker 2: so you know, I would say we do more fit
Speaker 2: into the pure side. But you know, the pureise can
Speaker 2: also be used to make things like you know, use
Speaker 2: the veggie pures to make little fritters and things like that,
Speaker 2: So the pures can definitely be used in baby lead weaning,
Speaker 2: but I would say it does cater more towards that
Speaker 2: more traditional approach. If you are starting solids a little
Speaker 2: bit earlier than six months, I usually say don't start
Speaker 2: baby lead winning until six months just because their like
Speaker 2: hand eye coordination is usually not quite there until six months.
Speaker 2: So usually if you did want to start a bit early,
Speaker 2: it's easier just to do pureis maybe for a couple
Speaker 2: of weeks and then try baby lead win in from
Speaker 2: six months. But otherwise you can also do things like
Speaker 2: offer you know, a pure and like a finger. You
Speaker 2: could offer like broccoli pure and a piece of broccoli
Speaker 2: at the same meal, or some people will do like
Speaker 2: one meal, they'll do as pures, and then they might
Speaker 2: do like they might be out and about so they
Speaker 2: want to do little finger foods and that's easier for them.
Speaker 2: So it is again what really works for you, because
Speaker 2: you'll find, you know, and some babies just prefer to
Speaker 2: be spoon fed, and some babies do like that independence.
Speaker 2: So it's yeah, and also it's up to what you're comfortable.
Speaker 1: Teddy loves being spoon fed still.
Speaker 2: Now, yeah, so it's it's and it's also one dred
Speaker 2: percent what you're comfortable with some people Like I'm just
Speaker 2: not I'm not ready for it. I'm not ready for that.
Speaker 1: Like, I mean, it's a lot messier. Baby lead winning
Speaker 1: is definitely because they're just dropping stuff and it's going
Speaker 1: on the like they're using their hands, so it's everywhere.
Speaker 2: I mean, it's all messy. But yeah, it definitely is
Speaker 2: a lot messier. The only thing is just be careful
Speaker 2: of there's like Facebook groups I know where they're like
Speaker 2: hard advocates of baby lad weening and if you even
Speaker 2: mentioned pure's apparently you get like blocked and wall it's
Speaker 2: a bit like politic Like it's like very political. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I know, like many other you know, feeding specialists that
Speaker 2: are like yeah, no, Like I like a combination approach,
Speaker 2: work out what works best, and it's again, it's what
Speaker 2: works best for you and your family and your baby
Speaker 2: and your comfort level. As long as you're graduating the texture,
Speaker 2: it's just the most important thing. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I found it really interesting that there was such a
Speaker 1: division between the methods when I felt like we just
Speaker 1: kind of did something that was a bit of a
Speaker 1: mix of all. But I'm like, aren't they all just
Speaker 1: the same thing? Like, aren't they all just feeding your
Speaker 1: baby like I didn't. I can't believe that's the division,
Speaker 1: but it is quite separate.
Speaker 2: It is crazy. I mean, hopefully I think it is
Speaker 2: leveling out a little bit now. But initially, when it
Speaker 2: was a bit more like early and new and like trendy,
Speaker 2: it was like this, yeah, like I do think baby
Speaker 2: led whining people think some more trendy like yeah.
Speaker 1: It's quite enlightened that they're you know, feeding that the
Speaker 1: baby has control. Do they have utensils? Like you are
Speaker 1: you aiming to get them to use their spoon or
Speaker 1: is it just hands or is it kind of whatever?
Speaker 2: Not Necessarily, it's absolutely fine for them just to just
Speaker 2: to use. Initially you'd just be using the hands. I
Speaker 2: think from you know, twelve months, you would start to
Speaker 2: offer them more of the utensils, but you know, initially
Speaker 2: you would just be starting with the you know, if
Speaker 2: you're doing pures, you could, as I said, give them
Speaker 2: the preloaded spoon. I wouldn't be like, oh, let them
Speaker 2: just like scoop into the pureid, you know, I would
Speaker 2: it just hands. Initially it's the spoon and the fork.
Speaker 2: Like even that is like it's like how do I
Speaker 2: get that into my mouth? Yeah, so just getting the
Speaker 2: because even and one of the benefits they say, baby
Speaker 2: led winning, is it like promotes this, like you know,
Speaker 2: self confidence, because we do have a habit. If they're
Speaker 2: like they get it into the mouth, we're like, well done.
Speaker 2: Yeah you like cheer like, so there is that aspect
Speaker 2: of it. But yeah, the cutlery not Yeah, you don't
Speaker 2: need to start adding the cutlery really until like you know,
Speaker 2: ten twelve months, So laid it down the track. Just
Speaker 2: get get the food.
Speaker 1: Someone asked about recommendations on starting spoons and utensils. You
Speaker 1: actually have them at nourishing bubbs, don't you, And they're
Speaker 1: like beautiful and rubbery and.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so silicon, you definitely want to go for a
Speaker 2: silicon over a like a metal for a couple of reasons.
Speaker 2: So the metal obviously feels a bit different in their mouth.
Speaker 2: It also picks up on the temperature of the food,
Speaker 2: like if it's hot food, you know, the metal will
Speaker 2: become quite hot, whereas silicon also doubles as a bit
Speaker 2: of a teather for them. So like one habit that
Speaker 2: I also often like mention to people is like if
Speaker 2: you're finding they want to become a bit independent but
Speaker 2: it's like not really going anywhere. Like you give them
Speaker 2: a spoon, and you have a spoon and then they
Speaker 2: can like put it in their mouth, and often if
Speaker 2: they're like, you know, getting some teeth, they'll like want
Speaker 2: to that. This why Sophia the draft so popular because
Speaker 2: it gets to the back and like that just so
Speaker 2: they'll just chew on it, Like the utensils is just
Speaker 2: as much about like teething as it is about getting
Speaker 2: the food in so but otherwise, look, honestly, just like
Speaker 2: a little a small like shallow bowl. Silicon is the
Speaker 2: perfect option. Plenty of options available at you know, you
Speaker 2: chemes do your supermarket.
Speaker 1: And when would you say, I mean, you mentioned it before,
Speaker 1: but I've forgotten already. When would you say that the
Speaker 1: methods kind of converge and all babies would be doing
Speaker 1: a similar thing, Like you wouldn't be dividing the two methods.
Speaker 2: So nine months is really when I would say, you know,
Speaker 2: even if you've done pures, they should be able to
Speaker 2: start to end or finger foods at that point. So
Speaker 2: you know, some people like, yes, I've done baby led
Speaker 2: winning my baby is so ahead of the pack. But
Speaker 2: like ultimately at nine months, you wouldn't know who's done
Speaker 2: what it just you might still be giving like some
Speaker 2: well textured you know, things like risotto type texture, you know,
Speaker 2: thick textured pures as well, but they are still also
Speaker 2: having finger foods, and it would just be you know,
Speaker 2: meal dependent maybe like they get a little smallers bought
Speaker 2: at breakfast, but you're still you know, they're having a
Speaker 2: bit more of like a pasta or something with a sauce.
Speaker 1: So just outing myself, guys, Teddy definitely still gets spoon
Speaker 1: fed quite a lot of his meal, but he also
Speaker 1: gets in the same meal things that he can eat
Speaker 1: by himself. Like I'll cut up a roast chicken and
Speaker 1: like you'll have lots of little bits of chicken to
Speaker 1: put in his mouth. But then I'll also give him
Speaker 1: a mash of sweet potato and boccado and something else,
Speaker 1: and like often he'll have some in his mouth and
Speaker 1: then I will give him a pre loaded spoon, but
Speaker 1: I will also be spoon feeding him as well. So
Speaker 1: when should you not be spoon feeding or does that?
Speaker 1: Is that not there's no timeline when.
Speaker 2: Yeah, look, there's no like hard and fast rule as
Speaker 2: long as he has the skill and it sounds like
Speaker 2: he has the skill, the skill, he just.
Speaker 1: Doesn't love it. It's like, but you do it better, Mum.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think, you know, as time goes on, and
Speaker 2: definitely as he look, it's more it'll more be like
Speaker 2: when he starts to if he's going to daycare or something,
Speaker 2: they'll probably not be spoon feeding him, so I'll be like, yeah, buddy, like, no,
Speaker 2: we don't spoon feed you here. So yeah, I mean,
Speaker 2: you know, as he gets into those toddler years, he
Speaker 2: will definitely I think you'll find that you can sort
Speaker 2: of step away from the spoon feeding but just often
Speaker 2: more less foods that require probably spoon feeding. But you know,
Speaker 2: I think also as you do get into more of
Speaker 2: those toddler and like two three, you know, it is
Speaker 2: also easier just to give them more like finger food
Speaker 2: type options that really don't require like spoon feeding as such.
Speaker 2: That's definitely the area. Also, like we know that parents
Speaker 2: want product and we're trying to sort of move into
Speaker 2: as well, because I think finger foods. Finger foods are
Speaker 2: such a big area and people like and they also
Speaker 2: like the independence then though, so they want things that
Speaker 2: are like pick up little meatball and pick up you know,
Speaker 2: little things like that, And I think that's when the
Speaker 2: smorgas board type option, like, I mean, they get fed
Speaker 2: so well, like a bit of fruit and a bit
Speaker 2: of veggie and a bit of you know, a bit
Speaker 2: of protein, and they get all these little things beautifully
Speaker 2: like presented to them like little kings.
Speaker 1: Little kings, absolutely a little king. Oh my gosh. Well,
Speaker 1: the last question on this section was with baby like winning. Initially,
Speaker 1: it's really hard to know if anything's going in like
Speaker 1: similar with the breast milk thing. You can't actually measure
Speaker 1: how much they're eating because I for a lot it's
Speaker 1: being spilt out, Like how do you make sure they're
Speaker 1: getting enough or how do you know how much they
Speaker 1: should be eating of what is left after they kind
Speaker 1: of splatch it around everywhere?
Speaker 2: Really good question, really high answer. It's for this reason
Speaker 2: because it is quite hard to monitor. So this is
Speaker 2: why I'm a really big advocate of just keeping up
Speaker 2: that monthly weight just to make sure that they are
Speaker 2: getting enough food because the reality is it is a
Speaker 2: bit hard to tell how much they're having. So that's
Speaker 2: why I like to keep up the weight, just to
Speaker 2: make sure that either way they're you know, between the
Speaker 2: milk and between the solids that they are able to
Speaker 2: get enough food. So just making sure that they are
Speaker 2: tracking on their line or only moving up or down
Speaker 2: one line. So that's probably the easiest way. I know,
Speaker 2: it's a bit like overarching, and it also might you know,
Speaker 2: vary from day to day. And also look, we haven't
Speaker 2: really touched on all We haven't touched on iron, but
Speaker 2: iron is really important. So just making sure you are
Speaker 2: offering you know, iron rich foods. I mean, it's not
Speaker 2: standard practice. We don't have like sat amounts of food
Speaker 2: for that first two years of life. Like it's not
Speaker 2: like they have to have this amount of food because
Speaker 2: there's so much variation. That's why just you know, watch
Speaker 2: how they're tracking. Then if they're tracking on the right
Speaker 2: growth chart, we sort of provided we've been offering a
Speaker 2: variety of food, we do assume that they're also getting
Speaker 2: the variety of nutrients require. It's not standard practice to
Speaker 2: go and for example, do like an iron test on
Speaker 2: a baby because obviously, you know, require a blood test,
Speaker 2: which we don't necessarily want to do. But there are
Speaker 2: a few signs that you would be looking for, like
Speaker 2: if baby was you know, sleeping more than they should
Speaker 2: be or looking quite like tired, lethargic, pale like they
Speaker 2: would be signs an iron deficiency, and then there might
Speaker 2: be some intervention. There might be some you know, some
Speaker 2: supplements put on or more of a focus put on
Speaker 2: you know, iron rich foods. But it's not like we're
Speaker 2: not like, okay, they have to be having this amount
Speaker 2: of food. And this I guess occurs for baby lead
Speaker 2: winning and purese. It's for this reason also that the
Speaker 2: only time I wouldn't recommend baby lead weaning would be
Speaker 2: for a child that was born like low birth weight
Speaker 2: or was having any issues gaining weight, because it is
Speaker 2: very hard to monitor how much they had taken in.
Speaker 2: And so you know, if your baby was having issues
Speaker 2: gaining weight and they were falling off the growth chart,
Speaker 2: I'd be like, you know what, I'd probably be better
Speaker 2: just to stick to purage, just so you can be like, Okay,
Speaker 2: today we offered you know, half a cup of sweet
Speaker 2: potato and babe eight half of the heart cup. So
Speaker 2: we know they had a quarter of a cup of
Speaker 2: sweet potato. We can calculate the calories. We can also
Speaker 2: look at do we need to add something to it?
Speaker 2: Do we need to fortify it. Do we need to
Speaker 2: add any supplements to it? So because baby led winning,
Speaker 2: it's like, yeah, it's not a great answer because it's
Speaker 2: hard to tell, but it's just a general like you know,
Speaker 2: watching that growth chart and making sure that they're gaining
Speaker 2: enough weight. That's why you know, weight is so important
Speaker 2: and I think can become quite unfortunately a bit of
Speaker 2: a moment of stress, you know, especially in those early
Speaker 2: days when you know, obviously baby comes out of hospital,
Speaker 2: they lose a bit of weight, and then parents you know,
Speaker 2: might be having issues with supply and stuff. Like the
Speaker 2: weight is a really great marker just to you know,
Speaker 2: go okay, well they're tracking, so they should be getting enough.
Speaker 2: And then as long as there's no other signs that
Speaker 2: would suggest deficiency like you know, lethargy and you know,
Speaker 2: sleeping way more than they should be, we usually go okay,
Speaker 2: you know, they're not going to intervene without really having to,
Speaker 2: and premier babies will be put on like you know,
Speaker 2: iron supplements and stuff for that reason. But yeah, so sorry,
Speaker 2: a bit of a roundabout answer on that one, but it's.
Speaker 1: A hard Oh no, that's so valuable, Okay, guys, As
Speaker 1: I mentioned, I will stop us there for this first
Speaker 1: part one. As we covered so much information in so
Speaker 1: much detail, it can be quite overwhelming, but I do
Speaker 1: hope that you found it helpful and useful so far.
Speaker 1: We will have the allergens section and a couple of
Speaker 1: other questions in Part two, coming to you next week.
Speaker 1: In the meantime, I'll pop all the links so far
Speaker 1: in the show notes, and we'll be back with Part two.