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Speaker 1: You're listening to a Mother Mea podcast.

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Speaker 2: Momma Mea acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters

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Speaker 2: that this podcast is recorded on Hi.

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Speaker 1: I'm Grace Ruefrey. This is MoMA Mes twice daily news podcast,

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Speaker 1: The Quickie, dropping into your ears with a very special

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Speaker 1: listening recommendation for you. We want to share with you

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Speaker 1: an episode from our sister podcast, But Are You Happy?

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Speaker 1: Claire Stephens sits down with people who seem to have

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Speaker 1: it all, but in reality face the same problems we

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Speaker 1: all have, and better yet, they've got tons of advice

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Speaker 1: on how to deal with it. Check out this episode

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Speaker 1: with Zoe foster Blake, the owner of massively popular Go

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Speaker 1: to Skin, is a self described perfectionist, and while she

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Speaker 1: doesn't always see that as a positive trait, Zoe shares

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Speaker 1: with Claire the things she's learned about embracing failure, recognizing

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Speaker 1: when she needs space to recharge, and all the offers

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Speaker 1: she turns down for the sake of her mental health.

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Speaker 1: So is Zoe foster Blake happy find out.

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Speaker 2: I am a perfectionist. I don't think that's a positive thing.

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Speaker 2: I think it's actually really fear masquerading as perfectionism. I

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Speaker 2: think sometimes the times when everything's meant to be perfect

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Speaker 2: and you feel like it built it up so much

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Speaker 2: in your mind and it fails. It's not a failure.

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Speaker 2: It's a lesson that's always meant to be.

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Speaker 3: Hello and welcome to but are you happy? The podcast

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Speaker 3: that asks the questions you've always wanted to know from

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Speaker 3: the people who appear to have it all. I'm Claire Stevens,

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Speaker 3: and today's guest is one who has been at the

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Speaker 3: very top of my wish list since I first had

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Speaker 3: the idea for this show. In terms of people with

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Speaker 3: aspirational lives, Zooey Foster Blake is in a league of

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Speaker 3: her own. She's an author of fiction and nonfiction and

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Speaker 3: children's books, a skincare founder, and an entrepreneur, and as

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Speaker 3: a fixture of Australian media, she's known for her warm,

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Speaker 3: handid funny tone, one that is profoundly distinct to her.

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Speaker 3: I read Zoe's novels in my twenties. She's written a

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Speaker 3: lot of them and they're the kinds of stories that

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Speaker 3: feel like a cozy, comfortable hug from a friend. She

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Speaker 3: then launched Go to Skincare, an iconic now international skincare company,

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Speaker 3: and while I don't know a lot about business and

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Speaker 3: stakes and shares, it's worth many, many, many ends of

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Speaker 3: million dollars. So obviously I have a million questions for her,

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Speaker 3: because she really does have the secret source. Un Lucky

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Speaker 3: for us, Zoe is not into gatekeeping. She's one of

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Speaker 3: those people who really does believe that there's enough success

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Speaker 3: for everyone, and she likes to teach. Over the years,

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Speaker 3: Zoe Foster Blake has taught me about vitamin C and

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Speaker 3: face oils and hyaluronic acid, and I distinctly remember a

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Speaker 3: mind blowing makeup tutorial where she put blush on her

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Speaker 3: nose and it really does brighten up your whole faith.

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Speaker 3: But in this interview, she taught me a lot more

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Speaker 3: about boundaries, about success, about drive, about creativity, and of

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Speaker 3: course about happiness. He is Zoey Foster Black. You in

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Speaker 3: your early career, like me, you worked for Mayor Friedman.

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Speaker 3: Tell me when you were in your early twenties working

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Speaker 3: at Cosmo and then Harpers Bizarre. Who were you at

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Speaker 3: that stage in your life?

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Speaker 2: Oh, it was such a great time. I came in

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Speaker 2: at twenty three knowing nothing about beauty editing at all,

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Speaker 2: but I'd worked in kids' mags and music mags before then,

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Speaker 2: so I'd grow on my teeth a little bit, but

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Speaker 2: i'd just come out of a big breakup, and I

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Speaker 2: really felt like it was my Carry Bradshaw moment because

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Speaker 2: I was suddenly in this glamorous job, at this glamorous building.

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Speaker 2: All of these glamorous women who I'd looked up to

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Speaker 2: for so long, you know, just pinched me a moment,

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Speaker 2: and so I embraced it. I started dressing up for work,

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Speaker 2: which you had to anyway, and my confidence really bloomed,

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Speaker 2: and I was the first time I really felt like

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Speaker 2: part of a team and part of something bigger. And

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Speaker 2: I had not had a great relationship with other women

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Speaker 2: before that. I had a really good best female friend

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Speaker 2: at school, but I had a lot of male friends.

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Speaker 2: I just thought they were easier, less bullshit, and we

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Speaker 2: just would be idiots together, and there was more emphasis

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Speaker 2: on comedy with the boys. So it was the first

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Speaker 2: time I fell in love with women really and saw

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Speaker 2: them not as competitors or as boring and whatever I

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Speaker 2: thought of them during school, and just fell in love

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Speaker 2: with women and being part of something really fun.

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Speaker 3: When you were a beauty editor, did you feel like

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Speaker 3: it was enough, like when you were You're at that

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Speaker 3: stage in your career and you are getting all these

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Speaker 3: opportunities and you're writing about beauty and really making a

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Speaker 3: name for yourself. Were you more ambitious than that?

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Speaker 2: Yes? And the proof came quickly because Mia quickly put

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Speaker 2: me in church lifestyle as well, and I started writing

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Speaker 2: dating columns. I had all of the time in the

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Speaker 2: world and all of the energy, and I just wanted

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Speaker 2: to do everything. Started a beauty blog, so I'd write

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Speaker 2: that in the mornings before work, jump on the bus,

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Speaker 2: drive in to go into work, then go to events afterwards.

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Speaker 2: And then I remember sort of feeling like I needed

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Speaker 2: to move on, like I've been at Cosmo for a

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Speaker 2: few years, and it was actually me who said, just

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Speaker 2: can you write a book or something like? Just stay here,

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Speaker 2: but do something else to keep you busy. And I'd

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Speaker 2: always thought I might write fiction. My father's an author,

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Speaker 2: and I thought beauty editing was just this mad world,

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Speaker 2: like I can believe it existed. I could get sent

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Speaker 2: stuff to play with and that's your job. That's actually

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Speaker 2: your job, and you get to take it home. So yeah,

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Speaker 2: So I was blogging, working full time, writing a column

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Speaker 2: and writing a book and that was just enough.

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Speaker 3: And Maya approached you at one stage for the deputy editor.

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Speaker 2: Job, or was sometime at a promotion.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and you said no because it would involve people

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Speaker 3: management and leaning more into the business side. And you

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Speaker 3: probably don't know this, but Maya uses you as an

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Speaker 3: example a lot of like mentoring conversations where she's like,

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Speaker 3: which path do you want to go down? She calls

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Speaker 3: it like the ladder or the lattice. Yeah, and she's like,

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Speaker 3: she offers you as one option, and it's like, well,

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Speaker 3: no one's gonna want to go down the other line.

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Speaker 3: Everyone just wants to be zooie. So she says, how

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Speaker 3: you said no to that because you didn't want to

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Speaker 3: do that.

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Speaker 2: There was hard role.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and you would have been sacrificing your creativity.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: How were you so self assured at that point to

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Speaker 3: say no?

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Speaker 2: Ubris? I really think it was hubris, because there is

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Speaker 2: a lot of creativity in being an editor or a

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Speaker 2: director of something because you ultimately, now as a founder ancident,

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Speaker 2: you're setting the visionary tone, you can shape a magazine.

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Speaker 2: You're pulling a team together to create something incredible together.

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Speaker 2: But at that time I saw them, it just as

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Speaker 2: a management role and a business role and a meetings

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Speaker 2: and only writing you did was the ads letter. I

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Speaker 2: was like, oh god, no, I'm a writer, and I

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Speaker 2: am a writer. Writing informs everything I do if you

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Speaker 2: really drill down on it. So I saw that pretty clear,

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Speaker 2: and it probably was pretty offensive back then at like

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Speaker 2: twenty six to say oh thanks. I just knew that, Yeah,

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Speaker 2: wouldn't be enough writing for me.

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Speaker 3: Are you good at saying no?

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Speaker 2: And also being an editor seemed really stressful? Yeah, a

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Speaker 2: lot of public facing stuff. Yeah, that scared the shit

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Speaker 2: out of me. Even as a bidiad you would have

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Speaker 2: to present to brand and it just ough heart.

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Speaker 3: Attacks, which is ironic now given what you.

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Speaker 2: Do, I still get heart attacks.

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Speaker 3: But yeah, when you said no to that? Is that

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Speaker 3: something you're good at saying no when things come up?

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Speaker 2: That just not yes?

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Speaker 3: Something that serves you. I love no And how do

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Speaker 3: you say no?

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Speaker 2: It took me a while to learn it, but it

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Speaker 2: is a real skill. And there are a few key

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Speaker 2: thinkers that I always looked to, like Kevin Kelly and

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Speaker 2: Seth God, who I just firm believers in. You know

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Speaker 2: that old adage when you say no to then you're

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Speaker 2: saying yes to you. But it's really about the more

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Speaker 2: busy you get, having children, having a business, trying to

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Speaker 2: feed all these different rounds, you just have to be

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Speaker 2: a lot more careful about what you say yes to.

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Speaker 2: And saying yes to a gig or a job or something.

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Speaker 2: It's never just that two hours on stage, as you know,

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Speaker 2: there's a lot of admin and emailing and sorting out

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Speaker 2: and contracts and travel and all of those things. And

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Speaker 2: it's a real privilege to be able to say no

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Speaker 2: to a lot of stuff now. But I have reached

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Speaker 2: that point because I've done the twenty years earlier of

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Speaker 2: building up that confidence but also that comfortable position to

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Speaker 2: be able to have my own business and writing books

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Speaker 2: in my family and that's all I do.

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Speaker 3: How do you say no? Because I I'm such a

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Speaker 3: people plaser and it's probably one of my big issues

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Speaker 3: is that please yourself. Please yourself at this time, I know,

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Speaker 3: But like if somebody comes to you and you say no,

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Speaker 3: and then they do that thing of like coming back

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Speaker 3: to you with more reasons why.

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Speaker 2: You can't give You can't give an explanation, So what's

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Speaker 2: the one sentence? Though we fostered Blake way to say

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Speaker 2: not you just say thank you so much. Sounds great.

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Speaker 2: I can't be there, but I hope it goes really

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Speaker 2: well because if you say, oh, I can't do it

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Speaker 2: that week, they were like, oh, what dates are you free?

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Speaker 2: Then never explain. Just say it's a no, and with kindness,

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Speaker 2: because you're like, thank you so much for thinking for me,

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Speaker 2: this is going to be a great event, but it's

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Speaker 2: not for me. And I think it's that really firm boundary.

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Speaker 2: It's not rude, it's just it's a no.

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Speaker 3: And I guess that's the only way that you're able

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Speaker 3: to focus on the stuff yeap, that really matters to

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Speaker 3: you and to do the really really big projects like

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Speaker 3: building a huge business.

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Speaker 2: And that is it. And I think also you get

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Speaker 2: to a point where, like you either remember if you're

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Speaker 2: saying yes to someone that's beneficial to them, that's helping

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Speaker 2: their brand and their moment. I would rather help my

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Speaker 2: brand and my team. Yeah, and what I'm doing over here.

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Speaker 2: So that's the choice you make too. You're like, oh,

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Speaker 2: I'm back myself.

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Speaker 3: I have a theory that the world lies to us

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Speaker 3: a bit about happiness and that often the moments that

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Speaker 3: we expect to be the happiest actually aren't. And that's

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Speaker 3: sort of what this podcast is about, that there are

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Speaker 3: these times where we have all these ideas about how

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Speaker 3: something should feel, and things might look really, really, really

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Speaker 3: shiny from the outside, and that's not the reality. Do

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Speaker 3: you have an example of a time where externally things

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Speaker 3: looked great, but under the surface they.

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Speaker 2: Worked probably, although a hand on heart. I try never

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Speaker 2: to be disingenious, and I'd rather omit than pretend. I

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Speaker 2: don't think it's helpful to portray that perfection. I know

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Speaker 2: that's obviously a lot of what social media is about,

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Speaker 2: and I know there are a lot of people now

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Speaker 2: how are being very open about their vulnerabilities and their

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Speaker 2: mental health, and I think it's very helpful for a

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Speaker 2: lot of people to see that. I can honestly say

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Speaker 2: that that doesn't happen for me very often. There's certainly

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Speaker 2: been big pockets of my life where things were meant

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Speaker 2: to be fantastic and amazing, but that's always not really

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Speaker 2: about the outside observer going, hey, this looks perfect, but

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Speaker 2: me placing those expectations on it and going, you should

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Speaker 2: be having the time of your life. Because I've worked

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Speaker 2: so hard to make it perfect. In my mind, I

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Speaker 2: am a perfectionist. I don't think that's a positive thing.

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Speaker 2: I think it's actually really fear masquerading as perfectionism. A

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Speaker 2: big one was the arrogance of taking a gap year

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Speaker 2: after year twelve and sort of telling ever rue in

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Speaker 2: my small town I'm going in the big city. You know,

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Speaker 2: I need a break from study. Oh my god, and

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Speaker 2: taking a year off before going to UNI and moving

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Speaker 2: to Sydney in a gust of like speed. I was seventeen.

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Speaker 2: I had no money, nothing, nothing saved. I wasn't going

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Speaker 2: to Africa to help orphanages. I wasn't going to work

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Speaker 2: overseas or travel. I didn't have a job. I just

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Speaker 2: moved to Sydney in a sharehouse and I only had

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Speaker 2: my grandma and my sister in Sydney, and I had

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Speaker 2: the most miserable, broke, sad, pathetic year of my life.

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Speaker 2: And I would go home for birthdays or twenty first

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Speaker 2: or whatever and had to pretend that everything was going great.

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Speaker 2: For example, I was working in the dungeon of the

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Speaker 2: Intercontinental selling their loyalty card as a telemarketer for zero dollars,

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Speaker 2: and so I'd tell everyone. I was working at the Intercontinental.

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Speaker 2: I was also a nightpacker at Coles like I was.

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Speaker 2: I did a lot of terrible jobs. But I now

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Speaker 2: am so grateful for that year, because without the depths

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Speaker 2: of being super duper broke and having not a friend

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Speaker 2: and no clue and just being aimless, I would never

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Speaker 2: allow myself to feel like that again. I just really

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Speaker 2: realized that I need to be busy, I need to

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Speaker 2: have some purpose, I need to have friends, and I

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Speaker 2: need to have some money.

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Speaker 3: M M.

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Speaker 2: So I think that year even that was silly, yeah,

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Speaker 2: and some could say a waste of a year, but

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Speaker 2: because I was also so young, it didn't really matter.

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Speaker 2: I still started union everybody else. But yeah, I think

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Speaker 2: sometimes the times when everything's meant to be perfect and

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Speaker 2: you feel like you built it up so much in

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Speaker 2: your mind and it fails, it's not a failure. It's

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Speaker 2: a lesson that's always meant.

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Speaker 3: To be in your new novel. Things will calm down soon.

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Speaker 3: Something I really took away from it was the kind

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Speaker 3: of unrelenting pressure of being a founder and how you

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Speaker 3: have these achievements that I just cannot even imagine in

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Speaker 3: terms of what you've built yet at the same time,

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Speaker 3: you kind of can't sit there to take it in

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Speaker 3: never because there's always a million other things you need

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Speaker 3: to be doing. Have you had that experience with business

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Speaker 3: sometimes that you look around and think this is incredible,

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Speaker 3: but I'm not able to feel it.

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Speaker 2: And I think anyone who works in like media where

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Speaker 2: you're always thinking about the next show or the next

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Speaker 2: magazine or the next whatever, where always working, you haven't

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Speaker 2: many months ahead. Yeah, it's it's a real trap because

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Speaker 2: you never take a moment to stop and think. It's

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Speaker 2: only having a few times over the years, and it's

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Speaker 2: like it was seeing our products and Saphora in the States,

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Speaker 2: and it's always the Christmas party where I stop and

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Speaker 2: look around and go, oh my god, these people, I

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Speaker 2: love them, Look what they've done, Look what we've created together.

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Speaker 2: Or feedback from customers where you know, whether it's at

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Speaker 2: an airport or an email, and it's just that pure

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Speaker 2: thank you. This has changed my skin, And I think

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Speaker 2: those little reminders. People might not give founders feedback because

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Speaker 2: they expect that they'll get it all the time, but

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Speaker 2: we really need it because it's a really kind of

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Speaker 2: busy and lonely position. A lot of the time. You're

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Speaker 2: the director and you're meant to have all the ideas

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Speaker 2: and you have this eternal type of creativity and excitement

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Speaker 2: and you're public facing. But well, you do get the

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Speaker 2: good jobs thumbs ups, but you you yourself will never

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Speaker 2: actually take a moment to stop. Yeah, and you've got

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Speaker 2: to force yourself to do it. And I think the

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Speaker 2: Christmas party is always a good one for me.

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Speaker 3: Does your business like at that go to Christmas party?

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Speaker 3: When you see your products in Sephora that.

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Speaker 2: Was in the States, Yeah, we're in Meca.

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Speaker 3: And yeah, when you have those moments, is it happiness

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Speaker 3: that you feel or is it something else? Like? What

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Speaker 3: does business give you?

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Speaker 2: I think it might be a sin. But pride, I

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Speaker 2: feel proud. I feel proud that I didn't know anything

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Speaker 2: about business, and I didn't know anything about creating a

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Speaker 2: team and a world place and a culture and satisfying

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Speaker 2: a customer. I had done it a little bit through

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Speaker 2: my writing, I guess, creating a project that people can

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Speaker 2: hold in their hands and enjoy. But it's pride, and

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Speaker 2: it's always a bit of how did you get here?

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Speaker 2: I wouldn't say it's imposter syndrome. I don't I'm past

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Speaker 2: that for that, But it's pride and a little bit

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Speaker 2: of fascination. It's go cow, but smile.

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Speaker 3: Do you get the sense of like I'm leaving a

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Speaker 3: legacy and I've created something bigger than myself as some

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Speaker 3: like almost immortality there.

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Speaker 2: I wouldn't have said yes to that because it feels

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Speaker 2: silly for a skincare brand to have a legacy. But

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Speaker 2: when I was buying my company back last year, this

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Speaker 2: huge maternal instinct came in and I just felt so

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Speaker 2: protective of what fills my cupboard. I would be bereft

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Speaker 2: if I had no more go to let alone the

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Speaker 2: millions of customers who love it and use it every

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Speaker 2: day and our team, and I just thought, this is

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Speaker 2: something that enhances people's lives, that they really enjoy a

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Speaker 2: little moment without getting to this is saving the earth.

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Speaker 2: It's just a nice moment for people that they like

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Speaker 2: and it filled a gap and I'm proud of that.

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Speaker 2: Don't fuck it up, don't ruin it. It's really really

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Speaker 2: hard to get a brand that people resonate with. It's

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Speaker 2: really hard to get that stickiness and that loyalty in

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Speaker 2: their community. How dare you ruin that? Like you're so lucky.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, I really just went into full speed mode

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Speaker 2: and sixth year and just went at all costs. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: this must keep going. We want to be a household

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Speaker 2: name in Australia. That's our goal. Our big goal is

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Speaker 2: to be your household name in Australia. And we can

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Speaker 2: do it. We've been in BIS for ten years and

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Speaker 2: I think we'll get there.

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Speaker 3: After the break, Zoe and I talk about her strengths

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Speaker 3: and weaknesses as a business founder, and more about her

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Speaker 3: book and why she'd be happy to just sit and

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Speaker 3: write for the rest of her life. What do you

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Speaker 3: think is your biggest strength as a founder?

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Speaker 2: I think creativity, but also coupled with risk. I'm not

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Speaker 2: averse to risk. I think you have to lean into

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Speaker 2: risk and be really okay with both outcomes. And they're

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Speaker 2: not always going to be great. You won't hear about

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Speaker 2: the bad outcomes, you'll only see the good ones. But

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Speaker 2: take the chance. And that's what I love about us being,

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Speaker 2: you know, privately owned again and small and nimble, is

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Speaker 2: there is no bureaucracy. We can do whatever we want,

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Speaker 2: and I think sometimes we forget that. And I think

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Speaker 2: when you're trying too hard to think about what the

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Speaker 2: customer is thinking. You're overthinking it and you need to

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Speaker 2: go back to what we're thinking. Because when I started

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Speaker 2: the brand, I had blinkers on. I didn't care about

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Speaker 2: what every other brand was doing. That was twelve years ago.

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Speaker 2: Now it's a really saturated landscape, and when you're in

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Speaker 2: retail like Mecca and you're up against these beautiful international brands,

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Speaker 2: you have to be a bit o mindful about what

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Speaker 2: you're up against and how you can stand out. So

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Speaker 2: I like that. I think within discipline there's freedom, and

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Speaker 2: I like those boundaries because it allows me to be

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Speaker 2: more creative and push against things a bit more.

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Speaker 3: So.

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Speaker 2: I'm always reminding the team to be cheekier, be a

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Speaker 2: bit naughtier, where the rogue tra like, we take beauty

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Speaker 2: not too seriously. It's allowed to be fun, and we

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Speaker 2: like to make things fun that have no right to be.

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Speaker 2: It's like on the back of the packaging and little

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Speaker 2: moments on the website, we're like, that's allowed. No one

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Speaker 2: said you can't have fun. So I think being cheeky

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Speaker 2: and taking risks is probably what I bring.

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Speaker 3: Is that similar to how you approach creativity in general,

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Speaker 3: like in terms of writing, in terms of every creative

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Speaker 3: project you've embarked on, do you kind of have that

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Speaker 3: cheekiness risk taking, a bit of like a no fear Yeah.

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Speaker 2: And it's funny because I don't think of myself as fearless.

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Speaker 2: I'm a quite anxious person, but I think with creative projects,

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Speaker 2: I do feel pretty reckless, and I think that's a

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Speaker 2: good place to be in. And maybe I wouldn't have

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Speaker 2: at the start with my earlier novels because I really

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Speaker 2: needed them to work so that would validate me and

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Speaker 2: get me to do another one. That would like, oh,

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Speaker 2: if that works and I get to do another one.

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Speaker 2: I still feel that if this works, I get to

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Speaker 2: do another one. Is kind of my barometer of success

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Speaker 2: as well as how it resonates with the reader. So

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Speaker 2: it's a funny thing because you sort of there's a

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Speaker 2: selfishness to writing a piece of work that you're really

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Speaker 2: happy with and you love because I guess human to

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Speaker 2: be writing for the reader. But I can't write for

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Speaker 2: the reader because I don't know what they want and

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Speaker 2: what they're thinking, So I have to try and assume

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Speaker 2: that what I like is good taste. Yeah, and that's arrogant,

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Speaker 2: I guess but I feel confident enough at forty four

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Speaker 2: in my taste and in my work to be able

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Speaker 2: to work on it to a point where I feel

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Speaker 2: like it's good enough to go out there and I

395
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Speaker 2: could edit for ten years. I really could, and I

396
00:19:49,614 --> 00:19:52,494
Speaker 2: could hone and hone and hone. But yeah, so I

397
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Speaker 2: feel fearless and I loved Things Will Come Down Soon

398
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Speaker 2: because to me it felt genuinely innovative in terms of

399
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Speaker 2: it's not a business book, but you can learn so

400
00:20:00,334 --> 00:20:02,894
Speaker 2: much about business in it. And I just thought that

401
00:20:02,974 --> 00:20:06,014
Speaker 2: ven diagram a crossover of a founder who's an active founder,

402
00:20:06,814 --> 00:20:10,534
Speaker 2: a proven entrepreneur, and a fiction writer coming together to

403
00:20:10,574 --> 00:20:15,534
Speaker 2: offer something unique, something for everyone hopefully. So yeah, I

404
00:20:15,534 --> 00:20:16,374
Speaker 2: think you got to back.

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Speaker 3: Yourself as somebody who knows absolutely nothing about business, reading

406
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Speaker 3: Things Will Come Down Soon was so fascinating and you

407
00:20:27,134 --> 00:20:30,494
Speaker 3: could really feel the stakes. I don't think I've ever

408
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Speaker 3: felt stakes like that because you don't really read books

409
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Speaker 3: about business and especially women in business.

410
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Speaker 2: Yes, you so.

411
00:20:39,094 --> 00:20:43,734
Speaker 3: Rarely read those stories. Yet it feels very of the

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Speaker 3: moment because there are so many female entrepreneurs, there are

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Speaker 3: so many women building their own things. How did you

414
00:20:53,414 --> 00:20:57,334
Speaker 3: decide because as a reader, part of my fascination is

415
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Speaker 3: trying to work out parallels and who's who and looking

416
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Speaker 3: at all the characters, how did you creatively break your

417
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Speaker 3: own experience and writing some thing that was going to

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Speaker 3: be very very distinct and not kind of make people

419
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Speaker 3: look at your life and one of.

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Speaker 2: Oh and they will, that's okay. The reason I love

421
00:21:20,374 --> 00:21:24,934
Speaker 2: fiction is very freeing and it's very liberating. And God,

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Speaker 2: I remember even back in their Kiss's days talking to

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Speaker 2: me about it, going, oh, I might write like it's

424
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Speaker 2: a bit of a autobiographic. Are you insane? You're twenty five,

425
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Speaker 2: You're going to burn all your bridges way too early.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: And my father as well, He's like, fiction is so

428
00:21:41,254 --> 00:21:44,494
Speaker 2: fun because you can mutate ten people into one to

429
00:21:44,534 --> 00:21:48,054
Speaker 2: get the perfect person with the perfect idiosyncrasies. And so

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Speaker 2: for me, each character works hard in this book to

431
00:21:52,854 --> 00:21:55,534
Speaker 2: pull the narrative through. There's no fat in there. They're

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00:21:55,534 --> 00:21:58,974
Speaker 2: all there to support kids trajectory and to show the

433
00:21:59,014 --> 00:22:03,454
Speaker 2: different facets of her life and her personality. So I

434
00:22:03,494 --> 00:22:05,134
Speaker 2: can hand on heart say this is not my life

435
00:22:05,174 --> 00:22:08,614
Speaker 2: and these are not my people, but certainly there's aspects

436
00:22:08,774 --> 00:22:12,094
Speaker 2: of these people that I've known. And also I meant

437
00:22:12,094 --> 00:22:13,694
Speaker 2: to a lot of young founders, and I've heard their

438
00:22:13,694 --> 00:22:16,294
Speaker 2: horror stories and so a lot of that have come in.

439
00:22:16,374 --> 00:22:18,214
Speaker 2: I didn't want to write my deal. My deal is

440
00:22:18,294 --> 00:22:22,174
Speaker 2: unique and circumstantial, and it's been written about, and I

441
00:22:22,214 --> 00:22:25,414
Speaker 2: wanted to create something new. And also, every deal and

442
00:22:25,494 --> 00:22:29,174
Speaker 2: every business is so specifically impersonal, and it's a moment

443
00:22:29,214 --> 00:22:33,374
Speaker 2: in time, and you know, there's so many factors that

444
00:22:33,414 --> 00:22:36,334
Speaker 2: come into the success of a business. So I didn't

445
00:22:36,334 --> 00:22:38,774
Speaker 2: want to necessarily replicate my own story.

446
00:22:39,294 --> 00:22:43,214
Speaker 3: I think what makes the book so vivid, and you

447
00:22:43,294 --> 00:22:48,334
Speaker 3: become so in Kit's world because your creativity and marketing

448
00:22:48,414 --> 00:22:50,614
Speaker 3: brain is all over it. Because even the business that

449
00:22:50,734 --> 00:22:54,054
Speaker 3: Kit has, which is second day Hair, you can't help

450
00:22:54,054 --> 00:22:56,374
Speaker 3: but be like, can somebody invent that?

451
00:22:56,494 --> 00:22:58,854
Speaker 2: I know, I'm thinking about it genuinely.

452
00:22:58,974 --> 00:23:00,814
Speaker 3: I was like, did you get halfway through the book

453
00:23:00,814 --> 00:23:03,734
Speaker 3: and think, oh wait, maybe I should also invent the product?

454
00:23:03,934 --> 00:23:05,054
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's trademarked.

455
00:23:06,054 --> 00:23:10,374
Speaker 3: Is it actually your site? It was like, maybe I

456
00:23:10,374 --> 00:23:11,014
Speaker 3: should steal that.

457
00:23:11,094 --> 00:23:14,294
Speaker 2: I did not the first I mean, there are products

458
00:23:14,294 --> 00:23:17,814
Speaker 2: out there that exist like this, but it couldn't be skin. Yeah,

459
00:23:17,814 --> 00:23:19,854
Speaker 2: And I didn't want to do makeup hair. I'm obsessed

460
00:23:19,894 --> 00:23:23,174
Speaker 2: with hair and hair products styling, and I know honestly

461
00:23:23,214 --> 00:23:25,174
Speaker 2: about six or seven styles who become good friends, who

462
00:23:25,174 --> 00:23:27,094
Speaker 2: all want to have their own brand or have started,

463
00:23:27,294 --> 00:23:30,414
Speaker 2: and so it made perfect sense. But the product itself

464
00:23:30,414 --> 00:23:34,974
Speaker 2: had to be something that doesn't exist really and could

465
00:23:35,014 --> 00:23:37,174
Speaker 2: be very sort to a lot of people. So of course,

466
00:23:37,214 --> 00:23:39,014
Speaker 2: you know, lived experience. I'm going to put a bit

467
00:23:39,054 --> 00:23:40,854
Speaker 2: of myself in there and what I would do if

468
00:23:40,894 --> 00:23:43,894
Speaker 2: I was a founder, But yeah, kidn exists as my

469
00:23:43,974 --> 00:23:47,374
Speaker 2: parable to show everything I've learned. And after my deal,

470
00:23:47,414 --> 00:23:50,534
Speaker 2: I honestly sat down and went, I feel the duty

471
00:23:50,734 --> 00:23:53,934
Speaker 2: of taking everything I've learned from these very expensive lawyers

472
00:23:53,934 --> 00:23:58,294
Speaker 2: and advisors to share that knowledge with people who like

473
00:23:58,374 --> 00:24:01,014
Speaker 2: meat perhaps and are creative and have no clue about

474
00:24:01,014 --> 00:24:03,494
Speaker 2: this stuff. And I ran my gamut for a year

475
00:24:03,534 --> 00:24:05,454
Speaker 2: and I'm like, Okay, here's what I learned, guys quick.

476
00:24:05,454 --> 00:24:06,574
Speaker 2: I needed to get it all down.

477
00:24:07,454 --> 00:24:11,974
Speaker 3: Obviously, it's an amazing book and its page turner, and

478
00:24:12,054 --> 00:24:14,814
Speaker 3: I read it so bloody quickly. But I also think

479
00:24:14,854 --> 00:24:20,174
Speaker 3: that there's something quite altruistic about it, because as a

480
00:24:21,454 --> 00:24:26,054
Speaker 3: woman who I can be kind of creative, the idea

481
00:24:26,174 --> 00:24:31,774
Speaker 3: of owning anything doesn't come naturally, and the idea of

482
00:24:32,054 --> 00:24:37,134
Speaker 3: trying to build something for yourself doesn't come naturally, and

483
00:24:37,174 --> 00:24:41,854
Speaker 3: so reading somebody's story where she does that, and then

484
00:24:42,134 --> 00:24:45,214
Speaker 3: all the nuances of how you set up the company

485
00:24:45,254 --> 00:24:48,534
Speaker 3: and what that then means down the line, and having

486
00:24:48,614 --> 00:24:53,374
Speaker 3: to have really difficult conversations. Even the role modeling of

487
00:24:53,454 --> 00:24:59,894
Speaker 3: the difficult conversations that King had was actually incredibly insightful.

488
00:25:01,374 --> 00:25:04,534
Speaker 3: Is there anyone who's going to read your book and

489
00:25:06,014 --> 00:25:07,494
Speaker 3: see themselves or be pissed off?

490
00:25:08,294 --> 00:25:12,334
Speaker 2: No? You know, it shouldn't feel like that sort of

491
00:25:12,334 --> 00:25:16,214
Speaker 2: book where like I'm scorched earth about anything, all of

492
00:25:16,214 --> 00:25:18,534
Speaker 2: the stressing kickets last she brought on herself. Yeah, yea,

493
00:25:19,334 --> 00:25:21,414
Speaker 2: she shouldn't do that. The lessons that I put in

494
00:25:21,454 --> 00:25:24,854
Speaker 2: there were kind of really dramatized in terms of like equity,

495
00:25:24,894 --> 00:25:27,854
Speaker 2: giving away too much equity to start, or selling to

496
00:25:27,934 --> 00:25:30,614
Speaker 2: people who didn't really have your best interests at heart.

497
00:25:30,734 --> 00:25:34,454
Speaker 2: And I think I got to these positions or pivotal

498
00:25:34,454 --> 00:25:36,894
Speaker 2: moments in my business career where I could have made

499
00:25:36,894 --> 00:25:39,014
Speaker 2: those mistakes, and so I put them in the story

500
00:25:39,054 --> 00:25:42,174
Speaker 2: to factors protection and go did maybe not do that?

501
00:25:42,934 --> 00:25:45,614
Speaker 2: So that was the real head fuck when we with

502
00:25:45,694 --> 00:25:47,534
Speaker 2: Kit was like, do I want to show her making

503
00:25:47,574 --> 00:25:50,134
Speaker 2: all the wrong decisions or do I want to show

504
00:25:50,134 --> 00:25:51,694
Speaker 2: her making the right decisions? But how do we learn

505
00:25:51,774 --> 00:25:54,294
Speaker 2: from that? So I had to find that sweet spot

506
00:25:54,334 --> 00:25:58,094
Speaker 2: where she falters. But you know, anyway, I went to spilet.

507
00:25:58,254 --> 00:26:00,894
Speaker 2: But certainly she's learning as she goes, which I did too.

508
00:26:01,774 --> 00:26:04,414
Speaker 3: How do you go with being a perfectionist and being

509
00:26:04,454 --> 00:26:04,814
Speaker 3: a writer.

510
00:26:05,974 --> 00:26:08,174
Speaker 2: I think it's a skill. I don't see it as

511
00:26:08,174 --> 00:26:11,814
Speaker 2: a negative until submission time, and that's when a good

512
00:26:11,894 --> 00:26:14,374
Speaker 2: editor and a good copy of art are really vital.

513
00:26:14,454 --> 00:26:18,374
Speaker 2: Because I over wrote by thirty thousand words, which is

514
00:26:18,414 --> 00:26:23,454
Speaker 2: classic me the problem problem, well sort of, but then

515
00:26:23,614 --> 00:26:25,334
Speaker 2: you know, and then I remember shaving off like a

516
00:26:25,454 --> 00:26:28,054
Speaker 2: thousand and getting it back and going, guys, it's don't worry,

517
00:26:28,174 --> 00:26:32,694
Speaker 2: it's ready tend to print. Then they're like, you're cute,

518
00:26:33,294 --> 00:26:34,374
Speaker 2: and then I think we had to get rid of

519
00:26:34,374 --> 00:26:37,854
Speaker 2: at least another twenty thousand. So at that point, though,

520
00:26:37,894 --> 00:26:40,094
Speaker 2: I just realized I'm in the hands of professionals, and

521
00:26:40,814 --> 00:26:42,934
Speaker 2: I don't fight them on it. There's a few lines. No,

522
00:26:43,014 --> 00:26:44,854
Speaker 2: that's a really good line, Please come we keep that?

523
00:26:45,294 --> 00:26:47,094
Speaker 2: So yeah, I think you're going to hand it over

524
00:26:47,094 --> 00:26:49,494
Speaker 2: at one point. Otherwise you'll just you'll be paralyzed forever.

525
00:26:50,134 --> 00:26:53,774
Speaker 3: Is the perfectionism paralyzing in the first instance, Like when

526
00:26:53,814 --> 00:26:57,014
Speaker 3: you sit down to write. You wrote a blog post

527
00:26:57,094 --> 00:27:00,774
Speaker 3: in twenty twenty two called the Writer who Doesn't or

528
00:27:00,774 --> 00:27:04,174
Speaker 3: the Writer who isnt something like that, and you wrote

529
00:27:04,214 --> 00:27:06,774
Speaker 3: about how you wanted to establish a writing habit.

530
00:27:06,614 --> 00:27:07,654
Speaker 2: And you'll notice I haven't.

531
00:27:08,574 --> 00:27:11,174
Speaker 3: That was like the last Well, you wrote that blog

532
00:27:11,214 --> 00:27:14,174
Speaker 3: and now you've got an you did I did something else.

533
00:27:14,574 --> 00:27:18,654
Speaker 3: But I can imagine you've got your business, you've got family,

534
00:27:18,734 --> 00:27:20,774
Speaker 3: you've got all this stuff going on. Sit down in

535
00:27:20,774 --> 00:27:24,214
Speaker 3: front of your computer. Does the perfectionism emerge?

536
00:27:24,254 --> 00:27:28,254
Speaker 2: Then? No, not till the end. And I'm so down

537
00:27:28,294 --> 00:27:32,014
Speaker 2: with the rewrite if it's not working. There are a

538
00:27:32,094 --> 00:27:34,614
Speaker 2: couple of camps of writers. There are the writers who

539
00:27:34,654 --> 00:27:36,854
Speaker 2: say it's very hard, and I sit down, I really

540
00:27:36,974 --> 00:27:40,694
Speaker 2: and I get typewriter dior here. I just once the

541
00:27:40,774 --> 00:27:43,294
Speaker 2: idea has marinated for long enough, it's all there and

542
00:27:43,334 --> 00:27:45,614
Speaker 2: it's just a case of getting it out. Hence the

543
00:27:45,774 --> 00:27:49,414
Speaker 2: thirty thousand overright. So for me, my problem is more like,

544
00:27:49,974 --> 00:27:53,134
Speaker 2: don't overrite. You're just wasting your time. This is not good,

545
00:27:53,174 --> 00:27:56,334
Speaker 2: but I like to explore every character and every subplot

546
00:27:56,454 --> 00:27:59,694
Speaker 2: to give more reflection back to my protagonist. And then

547
00:27:59,734 --> 00:28:01,494
Speaker 2: in the end, if we realize we don't need that,

548
00:28:01,494 --> 00:28:04,454
Speaker 2: that and that can go. And I also really love dialogue,

549
00:28:04,454 --> 00:28:06,734
Speaker 2: and dialogue is hard to keep brief because real life

550
00:28:06,774 --> 00:28:10,454
Speaker 2: conversations are super wordy, and I think you learn a

551
00:28:10,494 --> 00:28:13,574
Speaker 2: lot about characters and conversations with others. So I love diaralog,

552
00:28:13,654 --> 00:28:16,654
Speaker 2: but no, my perfectionism comes in the end. I love

553
00:28:16,694 --> 00:28:19,134
Speaker 2: the edit. Some people hate it. It is quite mathematical,

554
00:28:19,414 --> 00:28:23,094
Speaker 2: which is not my normal brain superpower. Because you've got

555
00:28:23,174 --> 00:28:25,174
Speaker 2: the hard copy, this soft copy of the line edit

556
00:28:25,294 --> 00:28:28,254
Speaker 2: that comments underline like it's a lot from my brain,

557
00:28:28,854 --> 00:28:30,654
Speaker 2: but I know we're shaving it off to get to

558
00:28:30,654 --> 00:28:31,854
Speaker 2: the good stuff underneath.

559
00:28:32,934 --> 00:28:35,934
Speaker 3: When you look at all these different things you do,

560
00:28:36,934 --> 00:28:40,134
Speaker 3: where does your kind of a liveness come from? Is

561
00:28:40,134 --> 00:28:41,414
Speaker 3: it business or is it writing?

562
00:28:42,254 --> 00:28:46,134
Speaker 2: Writing is business for me, so really go to for

563
00:28:46,174 --> 00:28:47,854
Speaker 2: a few reasons exist, but one of them was like

564
00:28:47,854 --> 00:28:50,374
Speaker 2: I wanted to be a copywriter and I wasn't, so

565
00:28:50,414 --> 00:28:51,814
Speaker 2: I thought, oh, make a brand. Then I get to

566
00:28:51,814 --> 00:28:53,574
Speaker 2: do my own ads. I get to do my own

567
00:28:53,614 --> 00:28:56,214
Speaker 2: marketing and copy as well. As the fact that that

568
00:28:56,494 --> 00:28:59,774
Speaker 2: sort of range for cutting out the beauty editor was

569
00:28:59,854 --> 00:29:01,374
Speaker 2: what I wanted to do by making a range that

570
00:29:01,374 --> 00:29:03,414
Speaker 2: anyone could pick up and understand instantly, and it was

571
00:29:03,534 --> 00:29:07,734
Speaker 2: just genuinely very useful and effective. But I love recommendations

572
00:29:07,734 --> 00:29:09,854
Speaker 2: and I love saving people time and money. I use

573
00:29:09,934 --> 00:29:11,294
Speaker 2: this one. And that's what I've done is a beauty

574
00:29:11,374 --> 00:29:14,334
Speaker 2: edit for ten years. But the writing, so I still

575
00:29:14,334 --> 00:29:17,414
Speaker 2: write all the copy on primary and secondary vessels for

576
00:29:17,494 --> 00:29:20,414
Speaker 2: the brand. Whatever you've hold in your hands, I've written.

577
00:29:21,014 --> 00:29:23,254
Speaker 2: I have an amazingly talented team who do all the

578
00:29:23,454 --> 00:29:25,614
Speaker 2: emails and social and everything. They're great at that. But

579
00:29:26,174 --> 00:29:28,094
Speaker 2: if you're holding it, I've written it because I love

580
00:29:28,174 --> 00:29:29,854
Speaker 2: that stuff, that little moment in the shower where you

581
00:29:29,894 --> 00:29:32,734
Speaker 2: get a little giggle. So I am a writer no

582
00:29:32,774 --> 00:29:35,494
Speaker 2: matter what I'm doing. Really, that's the essence of it all.

583
00:29:35,894 --> 00:29:38,574
Speaker 2: Whether it's Instagram, I'm a writer, the picture it's secondary,

584
00:29:39,134 --> 00:29:42,374
Speaker 2: it's anything. Children's books, you know, even though they are

585
00:29:42,374 --> 00:29:46,494
Speaker 2: literally called picture books, I still want the writing to

586
00:29:46,534 --> 00:29:50,774
Speaker 2: really sing. And of course novels, so the perfectionism it

587
00:29:50,894 --> 00:29:51,654
Speaker 2: runs through everything.

588
00:29:52,974 --> 00:29:56,174
Speaker 3: How do you go about because obviously, when may I

589
00:29:56,254 --> 00:30:01,614
Speaker 3: offered you the deputy editor job. You weren't into people managing?

590
00:30:02,574 --> 00:30:03,974
Speaker 3: Have you had to people manage?

591
00:30:04,614 --> 00:30:06,334
Speaker 2: Not really? And this is one of the things I

592
00:30:06,414 --> 00:30:08,134
Speaker 2: put in things will come down soon, is that it's

593
00:30:08,614 --> 00:30:13,894
Speaker 2: often feels Curdie. Founders often hire junior to start off

594
00:30:13,934 --> 00:30:17,014
Speaker 2: with to help them with admin or menial tasks. But

595
00:30:17,494 --> 00:30:19,934
Speaker 2: as Kit does, she hires very seen you, very early on.

596
00:30:20,054 --> 00:30:23,094
Speaker 2: And I think that's a good move because I know

597
00:30:23,174 --> 00:30:25,374
Speaker 2: what I'm good at and it's not people management, and

598
00:30:25,414 --> 00:30:28,654
Speaker 2: it's not running in a team and logistics and that

599
00:30:28,734 --> 00:30:31,214
Speaker 2: sort of thing. So I have a CEO and a

600
00:30:31,254 --> 00:30:33,094
Speaker 2: CIMO and I have grown ups in there doing that.

601
00:30:33,494 --> 00:30:35,614
Speaker 2: And that was a big important step in our growth

602
00:30:35,694 --> 00:30:39,294
Speaker 2: about five years in where I'm like, there was ten

603
00:30:39,334 --> 00:30:42,054
Speaker 2: of us, say, doing everything and not all of it great,

604
00:30:42,134 --> 00:30:44,054
Speaker 2: and so we brought into grown ups we always say,

605
00:30:44,334 --> 00:30:47,094
Speaker 2: and they're fantastic. So no, no, I think you can

606
00:30:47,214 --> 00:30:49,414
Speaker 2: know what you're good at and invest in what you're

607
00:30:49,414 --> 00:30:49,934
Speaker 2: not good at.

608
00:30:50,414 --> 00:30:56,374
Speaker 3: How do you go being Zoe Foster Blake the founder

609
00:30:56,414 --> 00:31:01,134
Speaker 3: and person working in this business and Zoe Foster Blake

610
00:31:01,214 --> 00:31:04,014
Speaker 3: the brand, Like, are you conscious when you come into

611
00:31:04,054 --> 00:31:08,254
Speaker 3: work that maybe you've got less of a margin of

612
00:31:08,414 --> 00:31:11,374
Speaker 3: error in terms of you how you behave that day totally.

613
00:31:11,854 --> 00:31:14,494
Speaker 2: I think that's when you become a public figure. That's

614
00:31:14,574 --> 00:31:17,294
Speaker 2: always in your mind anywhere you go and whatever you do,

615
00:31:17,934 --> 00:31:21,494
Speaker 2: particularly when your husband's a beacon for that stuffs, so

616
00:31:22,294 --> 00:31:23,414
Speaker 2: you get used to being.

617
00:31:24,814 --> 00:31:25,254
Speaker 3: Watched.

618
00:31:26,214 --> 00:31:28,814
Speaker 2: I don't think my team do that. You know, we're

619
00:31:28,854 --> 00:31:31,534
Speaker 2: good people, we're all in it together. But I think

620
00:31:31,574 --> 00:31:34,454
Speaker 2: the public facing aspect of being a brand founder is

621
00:31:34,934 --> 00:31:37,534
Speaker 2: pretty highly scrutinized, particularly in beauty. It never used to be,

622
00:31:37,614 --> 00:31:40,494
Speaker 2: but it's become very studied.

623
00:31:42,054 --> 00:31:45,454
Speaker 3: And does that scare you? Does it give you anxiety?

624
00:31:45,654 --> 00:31:49,494
Speaker 2: Yeah, totally, and it's an ongoing learning curve for me.

625
00:31:50,694 --> 00:31:52,134
Speaker 2: I think a lot of it comes back to my

626
00:31:52,214 --> 00:31:54,334
Speaker 2: mental health at that point and how capable I am

627
00:31:54,454 --> 00:31:58,054
Speaker 2: of dealing this shit. So if I'm getting into trouble

628
00:31:58,054 --> 00:32:01,454
Speaker 2: online about something that we've done as a brand, if

629
00:32:01,494 --> 00:32:04,494
Speaker 2: I've not been sleeping, if I'm super stressed and already pushed,

630
00:32:05,254 --> 00:32:09,254
Speaker 2: that affects me really a lot more, of course, But

631
00:32:09,374 --> 00:32:11,534
Speaker 2: I'm in a good, clean state of mind and I've

632
00:32:11,534 --> 00:32:14,374
Speaker 2: been looking after myself. It's amazing the difference you can do.

633
00:32:14,574 --> 00:32:16,734
Speaker 2: So that will always happen. It's just how I can

634
00:32:16,774 --> 00:32:19,974
Speaker 2: react to it. And that's my goal in terms of

635
00:32:19,974 --> 00:32:24,214
Speaker 2: personal improvement as to not being so reactive and recognizing

636
00:32:24,214 --> 00:32:27,654
Speaker 2: at a moment in time my people pleasing anxious side

637
00:32:27,694 --> 00:32:30,294
Speaker 2: wants to fix it immediately, and I'm always I want

638
00:32:30,294 --> 00:32:32,614
Speaker 2: to write back and defend ourselves. That's my first thing

639
00:32:32,614 --> 00:32:34,014
Speaker 2: I'm going to do, and that's the first thing you

640
00:32:34,014 --> 00:32:37,934
Speaker 2: shouldn't do. It's never defend yourself. You know, people will

641
00:32:37,934 --> 00:32:41,254
Speaker 2: be upset about things, and you have to be respectful

642
00:32:41,294 --> 00:32:44,814
Speaker 2: and also know what you know to be right. So

643
00:32:44,894 --> 00:32:49,414
Speaker 2: it's always going to be complicated that parasocial sort of relationship,

644
00:32:49,654 --> 00:32:51,614
Speaker 2: particularly if you feel like you're in trouble, because I

645
00:32:51,614 --> 00:32:53,774
Speaker 2: don't like feeling like I'm in trouble like most people,

646
00:32:53,854 --> 00:32:55,814
Speaker 2: particularly if you don't feel like you've done the wrong thing.

647
00:32:56,214 --> 00:32:59,174
Speaker 3: There are examples in the book where there will be

648
00:32:59,374 --> 00:33:03,774
Speaker 3: certain things going on online or even there's like, you know,

649
00:33:03,934 --> 00:33:08,654
Speaker 3: tiny doses of cancel culture sprinkled throughout, which is so

650
00:33:08,814 --> 00:33:11,214
Speaker 3: clever because that is part of what it is to

651
00:33:11,214 --> 00:33:13,934
Speaker 3: be a founder in this.

652
00:33:13,854 --> 00:33:14,574
Speaker 2: Day and age.

653
00:33:15,214 --> 00:33:18,214
Speaker 3: I know that sometimes you'll read something about yourself and

654
00:33:18,214 --> 00:33:20,814
Speaker 3: you're like, eh, whatever, I don't care, And then there

655
00:33:20,814 --> 00:33:23,214
Speaker 3: are things that really upset you, and sometimes you can't

656
00:33:23,214 --> 00:33:27,974
Speaker 3: even articulate why what hurts. In the book, there's certain

657
00:33:27,974 --> 00:33:30,614
Speaker 3: things you can see that really get under kit skin.

658
00:33:30,934 --> 00:33:32,814
Speaker 3: Are there things that get under your skin?

659
00:33:33,534 --> 00:33:36,974
Speaker 2: I think it's assuming our intentions were other than what

660
00:33:37,014 --> 00:33:40,014
Speaker 2: they were. So for me, it's everything we do as

661
00:33:40,054 --> 00:33:45,054
Speaker 2: a brand is intended and designed and carefully calculated to

662
00:33:45,174 --> 00:33:50,534
Speaker 2: be joyful and educational and nurturing. That's what our company does,

663
00:33:50,574 --> 00:33:52,694
Speaker 2: and that's why we put all this effort into producing

664
00:33:52,734 --> 00:33:57,094
Speaker 2: products and marketing them. So when people say that you've

665
00:33:57,134 --> 00:34:00,814
Speaker 2: done otherwise, it shouldn't get under my skin, but it

666
00:34:00,854 --> 00:34:03,854
Speaker 2: really does. Because one of my key areas to work

667
00:34:03,894 --> 00:34:08,534
Speaker 2: on is being defensive when I feel caught out or

668
00:34:08,614 --> 00:34:11,054
Speaker 2: when i'm being a here's something I don't think I did.

669
00:34:11,934 --> 00:34:17,694
Speaker 2: That's my husband. That's fun. So you know, and there's

670
00:34:17,734 --> 00:34:21,174
Speaker 2: a group of founders that I have that when one

671
00:34:21,214 --> 00:34:23,134
Speaker 2: of us are going through something, we'll all check in

672
00:34:23,174 --> 00:34:26,414
Speaker 2: and just say, hey, remember this is not real. This

673
00:34:26,534 --> 00:34:30,534
Speaker 2: is just work and it will pass, and all of

674
00:34:30,574 --> 00:34:34,534
Speaker 2: those wisdom advices that don't really help, but you've got

675
00:34:34,534 --> 00:34:36,534
Speaker 2: to say it so that you know the inn alone.

676
00:34:37,094 --> 00:34:40,254
Speaker 2: So for me, it's just trying not to be absorb

677
00:34:40,294 --> 00:34:41,294
Speaker 2: them so easily.

678
00:34:42,374 --> 00:34:46,414
Speaker 3: When people are talking about Zoe Foster Blake online, is

679
00:34:46,494 --> 00:34:49,934
Speaker 3: that you I heard a podcast recently where someone described

680
00:34:49,974 --> 00:34:53,854
Speaker 3: it as a shadow self, Like you're online person. The

681
00:34:53,894 --> 00:34:55,734
Speaker 3: person you are online is not actually who you are.

682
00:34:55,774 --> 00:34:58,174
Speaker 3: It's a shadow self, and if people are attacking that person,

683
00:34:58,934 --> 00:35:01,294
Speaker 3: you can differentiate because you go, that's not actually me,

684
00:35:01,534 --> 00:35:05,254
Speaker 3: that's some avatar image of me that they don't actually know.

685
00:35:05,854 --> 00:35:09,134
Speaker 3: Are you good at that? Or because you're so authentic

686
00:35:09,214 --> 00:35:14,294
Speaker 3: online and you've built your identity with authenticity, is it

687
00:35:14,334 --> 00:35:15,614
Speaker 3: easy to get it confused?

688
00:35:15,894 --> 00:35:18,014
Speaker 2: It's fie, I think because you're right, it is an avatar.

689
00:35:18,494 --> 00:35:22,894
Speaker 2: And I generally use social just for work now and

690
00:35:22,934 --> 00:35:29,294
Speaker 2: my cats because I don't feel inspired to share much

691
00:35:29,334 --> 00:35:30,974
Speaker 2: more of my life than that. I don't think I

692
00:35:31,054 --> 00:35:33,054
Speaker 2: need to, and that's why I write fiction, so that

693
00:35:33,094 --> 00:35:35,814
Speaker 2: I can experiences that I have I can weave into

694
00:35:35,814 --> 00:35:38,174
Speaker 2: stories and that's the fun of it. I also don't

695
00:35:38,174 --> 00:35:40,774
Speaker 2: think I'm that interesting, so I don't know why I

696
00:35:40,774 --> 00:35:43,774
Speaker 2: would want to share anything more than I do. I

697
00:35:43,774 --> 00:35:48,734
Speaker 2: think we take it personally just because we're human beings, right,

698
00:35:48,974 --> 00:35:51,174
Speaker 2: and I don't want to ever misstep because it's not

699
00:35:51,214 --> 00:35:54,414
Speaker 2: worth the hassle. But I also am aware that it's

700
00:35:54,454 --> 00:35:56,894
Speaker 2: not a real world. You know, put you feet in

701
00:35:56,934 --> 00:35:58,974
Speaker 2: the grass and need a banana, Just go and be

702
00:35:59,054 --> 00:36:00,934
Speaker 2: back in the real world, play with the kids and

703
00:36:01,094 --> 00:36:03,574
Speaker 2: remember what's really happening. And it's funny because something will

704
00:36:03,574 --> 00:36:07,374
Speaker 2: blow up and you'll be so convinced that everyone's thinking

705
00:36:07,414 --> 00:36:09,014
Speaker 2: about or talking about it, and you'll talk to a

706
00:36:09,094 --> 00:36:11,294
Speaker 2: friend and that like, what what do you trying to

707
00:36:11,334 --> 00:36:13,534
Speaker 2: do that? And I love those moments because I was like, yes,

708
00:36:13,614 --> 00:36:15,774
Speaker 2: snap out of it, Okay, head out of your ass

709
00:36:15,814 --> 00:36:18,574
Speaker 2: and get back into nature or whatever's going to help.

710
00:36:18,974 --> 00:36:20,974
Speaker 2: So yeah, they come and go pretty quick. I'm pretty

711
00:36:20,974 --> 00:36:23,854
Speaker 2: good at just going that's not really real life. That's

712
00:36:23,894 --> 00:36:25,374
Speaker 2: not my real life. I'm at home in my tractor

713
00:36:25,414 --> 00:36:27,734
Speaker 2: pants with my kids making dinner. And that's a shiny,

714
00:36:27,734 --> 00:36:31,534
Speaker 2: glamorous girl that someone's got an idea about two different things.

715
00:36:33,494 --> 00:36:36,214
Speaker 3: After the break, Zey talks about the moments where she

716
00:36:36,294 --> 00:36:39,694
Speaker 3: feels the happiest and why there are certain interviews she

717
00:36:39,774 --> 00:36:51,254
Speaker 3: doesn't want to do. Are you happiest when you're writing?

718
00:36:52,014 --> 00:36:54,974
Speaker 2: I am really happy when I'm writing, but I'm like

719
00:36:55,014 --> 00:36:57,654
Speaker 2: a little squirrel who needs treats all the time. So

720
00:36:57,734 --> 00:37:00,654
Speaker 2: I can do deep writing for like maybe an hour

721
00:37:00,734 --> 00:37:03,214
Speaker 2: or two and I feel the same. Then I need something,

722
00:37:04,134 --> 00:37:09,494
Speaker 2: maybe it's a scroll, maybe it's an actual physical scroll.

723
00:37:10,534 --> 00:37:11,894
Speaker 2: And then by the end of the day I'm dying

724
00:37:11,934 --> 00:37:13,534
Speaker 2: for the gigs to get home because I'm literally I

725
00:37:13,574 --> 00:37:16,574
Speaker 2: need to talk to someone and engage. So I love

726
00:37:16,654 --> 00:37:19,374
Speaker 2: the balance and in fact my perfect sort of days

727
00:37:19,814 --> 00:37:23,334
Speaker 2: a bit of family, bit of social as in social interaction,

728
00:37:23,614 --> 00:37:27,214
Speaker 2: bit of riding, and some nature. You know, family time

729
00:37:27,294 --> 00:37:30,734
Speaker 2: is beautiful and built in. I also really love riding

730
00:37:30,814 --> 00:37:33,214
Speaker 2: bikes with my family. I've really found that to be

731
00:37:33,254 --> 00:37:36,174
Speaker 2: a happy place because I can't relax. But that's active

732
00:37:36,214 --> 00:37:39,254
Speaker 2: relaxation for me. I cannot sit still. I don't like

733
00:37:39,374 --> 00:37:42,494
Speaker 2: not being productive. It's a problem I have. So being

734
00:37:42,574 --> 00:37:46,414
Speaker 2: physically moving but in nature and relaxing with my family

735
00:37:46,494 --> 00:37:47,574
Speaker 2: just tick so many boxes.

736
00:37:48,734 --> 00:37:55,134
Speaker 3: You strike me as someone who's somewhat introverted. Oh yes,

737
00:37:55,254 --> 00:38:00,454
Speaker 3: And yet your life is so public and there are

738
00:38:00,894 --> 00:38:03,014
Speaker 3: all sorts of aspects to what you do as a

739
00:38:03,094 --> 00:38:09,534
Speaker 3: career that public facing requires some level of social energy.

740
00:38:11,134 --> 00:38:13,654
Speaker 3: Even as a beauty editor went to like fancy events

741
00:38:13,694 --> 00:38:16,934
Speaker 3: and now you'll be at the logies, You'll be at

742
00:38:16,974 --> 00:38:23,894
Speaker 3: all these very highly social situations. How do you find those?

743
00:38:24,174 --> 00:38:26,374
Speaker 2: We don't get a mini at all if you actually

744
00:38:26,374 --> 00:38:28,414
Speaker 2: think about it, like we'd go to the logis and

745
00:38:28,694 --> 00:38:32,454
Speaker 2: maybe yeah, that's it. Yeah, it does really exhaust me.

746
00:38:32,534 --> 00:38:34,494
Speaker 2: And I probably had a lot more energy for it

747
00:38:34,494 --> 00:38:36,534
Speaker 2: when I was in my twenties and thirties being beater

748
00:38:36,574 --> 00:38:40,214
Speaker 2: and so on, But now I really noticed that drain.

749
00:38:40,974 --> 00:38:43,014
Speaker 2: It's only because of thank you to social media, like

750
00:38:43,014 --> 00:38:45,454
Speaker 2: the language around everything, for me to understand that I'm

751
00:38:45,454 --> 00:38:49,254
Speaker 2: a highly social, skilled introvert, and I can come in

752
00:38:49,294 --> 00:38:52,014
Speaker 2: big and do the thing, and I can be on

753
00:38:52,054 --> 00:38:54,734
Speaker 2: stage and do a signing and whatever and film things,

754
00:38:54,774 --> 00:38:58,334
Speaker 2: and then I'm like shell. Like a lot of us,

755
00:38:58,334 --> 00:38:59,974
Speaker 2: we'd have to go home, put myself clothes on and

756
00:39:00,014 --> 00:39:02,574
Speaker 2: not talk to anybody. What I realized as I got

757
00:39:02,574 --> 00:39:05,094
Speaker 2: older is just just leaving time in between those things

758
00:39:05,134 --> 00:39:07,934
Speaker 2: to regroup, because if I don't look after myself, I'm

759
00:39:07,974 --> 00:39:10,094
Speaker 2: no good to anybody. So even with this to her,

760
00:39:10,694 --> 00:39:12,294
Speaker 2: I was like, I'm not doing back to back events.

761
00:39:12,774 --> 00:39:16,054
Speaker 2: I'd rather take more time and give more, give a

762
00:39:16,054 --> 00:39:18,094
Speaker 2: better version of myself to people than be this tired

763
00:39:18,134 --> 00:39:21,334
Speaker 2: which he's not stringing two words together. I don't know

764
00:39:21,374 --> 00:39:24,974
Speaker 2: how like proper successful famous people do it, like doing

765
00:39:24,974 --> 00:39:28,214
Speaker 2: a full press tour for like a month, or musical

766
00:39:28,214 --> 00:39:30,094
Speaker 2: theater people have to be on stage every night. I

767
00:39:30,174 --> 00:39:32,174
Speaker 2: just yeah, I didn't have it in me at all.

768
00:39:32,374 --> 00:39:34,574
Speaker 3: I'm so fascinated about it. I've always said my worst

769
00:39:34,654 --> 00:39:37,214
Speaker 3: nightmare I think would be being in the Big brother

770
00:39:37,294 --> 00:39:39,054
Speaker 3: House think about it all.

771
00:39:38,934 --> 00:39:41,654
Speaker 2: The time, or Survivor or alone. I have a lot

772
00:39:41,654 --> 00:39:44,054
Speaker 2: of shows I would never go on because.

773
00:39:43,814 --> 00:39:46,574
Speaker 3: I'm like, oh my god, imagine having to be just

774
00:39:46,694 --> 00:39:49,574
Speaker 3: on and then it's like I'm like, I'd probably come

775
00:39:49,614 --> 00:39:52,694
Speaker 3: across as quite cold. But it's not coldness.

776
00:39:52,774 --> 00:39:55,174
Speaker 2: It's just tired, yes, and anxiety about what I'm going

777
00:39:55,254 --> 00:39:57,614
Speaker 2: to say. Did I say yeah? Did I say the

778
00:39:57,614 --> 00:39:58,614
Speaker 2: wrong thing? I say too much?

779
00:39:58,774 --> 00:39:59,134
Speaker 1: My god.

780
00:39:59,534 --> 00:40:02,574
Speaker 2: So yeah, I am pretty socially anxious. Even in my

781
00:40:02,574 --> 00:40:05,414
Speaker 2: own office with my team. I just yeah, I'm a

782
00:40:05,414 --> 00:40:07,014
Speaker 2: bit of a geice actually at the heart of it.

783
00:40:07,454 --> 00:40:10,014
Speaker 2: But I can do it good in short pists and

784
00:40:10,054 --> 00:40:11,894
Speaker 2: I'm like, I just get that short burst out. I'll

785
00:40:11,934 --> 00:40:15,014
Speaker 2: be right. Do you like interviews, Well, I used to

786
00:40:15,054 --> 00:40:17,094
Speaker 2: be on the other side of them, which is probably

787
00:40:17,134 --> 00:40:19,614
Speaker 2: a bit easier. I don't mind them if it's about

788
00:40:19,614 --> 00:40:22,134
Speaker 2: the work, No, I love I can go so deep

789
00:40:22,174 --> 00:40:25,374
Speaker 2: talking about creativity and marketing and ideas and writing. I

790
00:40:25,414 --> 00:40:27,574
Speaker 2: really love that stuff. I don't get asked it very often, though,

791
00:40:28,654 --> 00:40:30,974
Speaker 2: it's not usually the questions that people want to.

792
00:40:31,054 --> 00:40:33,534
Speaker 3: Yeah, people are like, let me ask you about the

793
00:40:33,574 --> 00:40:44,254
Speaker 3: gossip your career. It spans so many creative industries. And

794
00:40:45,614 --> 00:40:49,574
Speaker 3: do you worry in terms of looking at the future

795
00:40:50,934 --> 00:40:53,774
Speaker 3: where to put your energy and that it's going to

796
00:40:53,854 --> 00:40:58,254
Speaker 3: be finite, Like if you look at the next couple

797
00:40:58,254 --> 00:41:01,854
Speaker 3: of decades, does it feel like you really have to

798
00:41:01,894 --> 00:41:05,254
Speaker 3: intentionally choose where to put your energy?

799
00:41:05,494 --> 00:41:08,174
Speaker 2: I guess you should, but I don't. I love the

800
00:41:08,374 --> 00:41:10,854
Speaker 2: surprise and delight of life life like it could be

801
00:41:10,974 --> 00:41:14,854
Speaker 2: that my all, my husband's work could change big time

802
00:41:14,854 --> 00:41:16,774
Speaker 2: at any point, we could move and we could like

803
00:41:16,854 --> 00:41:20,014
Speaker 2: anything could happen. I also love that writing has no

804
00:41:20,134 --> 00:41:22,014
Speaker 2: expiration date and I can still be doing it when

805
00:41:22,014 --> 00:41:24,974
Speaker 2: it's seventy five unless AI comes in and does a

806
00:41:24,974 --> 00:41:27,734
Speaker 2: better job of it. Be nervous about that. So I

807
00:41:27,734 --> 00:41:33,214
Speaker 2: feel like I'm able to always have that work. Thankfully,

808
00:41:33,494 --> 00:41:36,174
Speaker 2: I don't need to be young or glamorous for it.

809
00:41:36,214 --> 00:41:38,654
Speaker 2: I can just always write, and same with running a

810
00:41:38,694 --> 00:41:40,174
Speaker 2: business and doing it well as long as I have

811
00:41:40,214 --> 00:41:42,454
Speaker 2: the ideas, and I do have so many ideas. It's

812
00:41:42,494 --> 00:41:45,134
Speaker 2: that not the lack of ideas, it's the follow through

813
00:41:45,134 --> 00:41:47,494
Speaker 2: in the execution and which ones are actually worth backing

814
00:41:48,014 --> 00:41:50,414
Speaker 2: is probably the big question for us. So now I

815
00:41:50,454 --> 00:41:52,774
Speaker 2: get excited about what's next. You never know what could happen.

816
00:41:52,814 --> 00:41:56,094
Speaker 2: I was just like, I'll be doing my fifties sixties,

817
00:41:56,174 --> 00:41:58,814
Speaker 2: and I'm like, who knows, who cares? Like, just go

818
00:41:58,934 --> 00:42:02,254
Speaker 2: for it, Like could be writing for TV or I

819
00:42:02,254 --> 00:42:02,934
Speaker 2: have no idea.

820
00:42:03,454 --> 00:42:08,054
Speaker 3: I love that when you think about your life, what

821
00:42:08,294 --> 00:42:11,814
Speaker 3: do you think is the thing that when you're an

822
00:42:11,894 --> 00:42:15,374
Speaker 3: old woman, I'm going to say like one hundred and

823
00:42:15,414 --> 00:42:17,894
Speaker 3: twenty because about how old is going to live too?

824
00:42:19,174 --> 00:42:21,814
Speaker 3: What is it when you look back on your life

825
00:42:22,094 --> 00:42:25,374
Speaker 3: that will have made you happy, Like when you really

826
00:42:25,494 --> 00:42:29,494
Speaker 3: zoom out, what is it that is the happiness?

827
00:42:29,734 --> 00:42:33,854
Speaker 2: I think it's human connection. I put that to being

828
00:42:33,894 --> 00:42:37,454
Speaker 2: a good partner, being the kind of parent who doesn't

829
00:42:37,454 --> 00:42:40,134
Speaker 2: fuck up their kids too much. No, I'm going to

830
00:42:40,214 --> 00:42:43,374
Speaker 2: do it without knowing what I'm doing, but that legacy

831
00:42:43,454 --> 00:42:46,974
Speaker 2: of parenting well, which is a full time job now.

832
00:42:47,494 --> 00:42:50,294
Speaker 2: As we all know, my Mum's always like, God, your generation,

833
00:42:50,494 --> 00:42:52,974
Speaker 2: you really deep dive on this stuff, and I'm like, yeah,

834
00:42:52,974 --> 00:42:58,734
Speaker 2: well do I. And the connections that I have with

835
00:42:59,094 --> 00:43:01,294
Speaker 2: friends and people in the world. I really think that

836
00:43:01,414 --> 00:43:04,894
Speaker 2: human connection and community also that purpose. Someone asked me

837
00:43:04,934 --> 00:43:06,494
Speaker 2: that what do you think your purpose is? And it

838
00:43:06,574 --> 00:43:09,014
Speaker 2: is a great question, and I'm not still confident in

839
00:43:09,014 --> 00:43:11,014
Speaker 2: the answer, but I think it might be teaching, and

840
00:43:11,134 --> 00:43:17,094
Speaker 2: not teaching in terms of teaching, but teaching people how

841
00:43:17,094 --> 00:43:19,854
Speaker 2: to look after the skin, teaching people how to do

842
00:43:19,974 --> 00:43:22,534
Speaker 2: a business, teaching people how to all the romans and

843
00:43:22,574 --> 00:43:26,134
Speaker 2: writing relationships stuff I did, or even with the picture books,

844
00:43:26,134 --> 00:43:29,174
Speaker 2: teaching kids how to write funny stories. I don't know,

845
00:43:29,294 --> 00:43:32,054
Speaker 2: but vaguely I feel like that's sort of the thread

846
00:43:32,094 --> 00:43:35,374
Speaker 2: through all of them is just that, and not because

847
00:43:35,374 --> 00:43:38,014
Speaker 2: I'm in the position of expertise, but just because I

848
00:43:38,054 --> 00:43:39,894
Speaker 2: also love the example of just being a rap from

849
00:43:39,934 --> 00:43:43,094
Speaker 2: the bush who's come in and with no clue and

850
00:43:43,374 --> 00:43:46,214
Speaker 2: accidentally done a good job of business. I think that's

851
00:43:46,694 --> 00:43:49,374
Speaker 2: something to be proud of, because I know a lot

852
00:43:49,374 --> 00:43:51,414
Speaker 2: of people put a lot more time and energy into

853
00:43:51,454 --> 00:43:55,774
Speaker 2: learning how to business and I somehow snug through and

854
00:43:55,854 --> 00:43:56,534
Speaker 2: did it too.

855
00:43:57,054 --> 00:44:00,854
Speaker 3: Really, that's really interesting, that idea of teaching. And I

856
00:44:00,894 --> 00:44:04,134
Speaker 3: do think that that is a thread through your entire

857
00:44:04,214 --> 00:44:07,334
Speaker 3: career because so many people I know who love you.

858
00:44:08,214 --> 00:44:10,654
Speaker 3: People have come in at different moments and like, I've

859
00:44:10,694 --> 00:44:13,374
Speaker 3: got a friend who went through a breakup and you

860
00:44:13,534 --> 00:44:17,254
Speaker 3: were her absolute All she talked about was how you

861
00:44:17,334 --> 00:44:20,614
Speaker 3: were her guru. And when I was pregnant, I had

862
00:44:20,694 --> 00:44:22,614
Speaker 3: all with pelvic pais.

863
00:44:22,374 --> 00:44:24,054
Speaker 2: Oh my god, I'm so sorry.

864
00:44:24,334 --> 00:44:27,374
Speaker 3: I went so deep. I'm like, like, what do you do?

865
00:44:27,374 --> 00:44:28,534
Speaker 2: Okay?

866
00:44:28,214 --> 00:44:31,414
Speaker 3: Like, there are all these different avenues where people connect

867
00:44:31,454 --> 00:44:34,494
Speaker 3: to you, and I think it's because you're very generous

868
00:44:34,734 --> 00:44:37,894
Speaker 3: with what you share and how you share it, and

869
00:44:38,454 --> 00:44:44,654
Speaker 3: recommendations and being honest about the things that maybe people

870
00:44:44,974 --> 00:44:47,614
Speaker 3: aren't always honest about. It's like, especially when it comes

871
00:44:47,654 --> 00:44:49,894
Speaker 3: to something like business at the moment, like that, so

872
00:44:49,974 --> 00:44:55,694
Speaker 3: many people are quite they gay cape gaykeepe the business information.

873
00:44:55,854 --> 00:44:58,214
Speaker 2: It's weird, isn't that There's a very specific character in

874
00:44:58,254 --> 00:45:01,094
Speaker 2: the book who is really generous and she's got an

875
00:45:01,094 --> 00:45:04,214
Speaker 2: American sensibility to business which is very different to Australian,

876
00:45:04,614 --> 00:45:06,974
Speaker 2: which is, oh, I know a guy, I'll hook you up.

877
00:45:07,094 --> 00:45:09,934
Speaker 2: Oh no, it is and often unfortunately in Australia when

878
00:45:09,934 --> 00:45:13,294
Speaker 2: I was starting out, no one would share their chemist

879
00:45:13,454 --> 00:45:16,974
Speaker 2: or their factories or anything they're packaging people. Now, of

880
00:45:16,974 --> 00:45:19,014
Speaker 2: course you've got full service companies that will do that

881
00:45:19,054 --> 00:45:22,374
Speaker 2: all for you. It's changed so much. But I don't

882
00:45:22,374 --> 00:45:23,774
Speaker 2: want to be that guy. I want to be the

883
00:45:23,814 --> 00:45:26,294
Speaker 2: guy that helps everybody. There is enough pie for everybody,

884
00:45:26,334 --> 00:45:30,734
Speaker 2: and I think a greedy gatekeeping mindset it will only

885
00:45:30,734 --> 00:45:34,574
Speaker 2: come back to you. Generosity doesn't cost anything. You're helping

886
00:45:34,574 --> 00:45:36,574
Speaker 2: so many people. I get tearing when people come up

887
00:45:36,614 --> 00:45:38,174
Speaker 2: to me and say, oh I read record boss, and

888
00:45:38,214 --> 00:45:39,814
Speaker 2: then I gave it to seven of my friends. It

889
00:45:39,894 --> 00:45:42,534
Speaker 2: really really helped, or thank you your face helped my

890
00:45:42,574 --> 00:45:45,174
Speaker 2: exmorer whatever it may be, because I'm like, I didn't

891
00:45:45,174 --> 00:45:47,614
Speaker 2: intend for that to be the outcome, but so that

892
00:45:47,774 --> 00:45:49,894
Speaker 2: I did. Or even like I took your restaurant recommendation

893
00:45:49,934 --> 00:45:52,534
Speaker 2: with Queenstown, I'm like, great, I saved you some time

894
00:45:52,934 --> 00:45:55,014
Speaker 2: and you had a good meal off that. I love

895
00:45:55,094 --> 00:45:57,094
Speaker 2: that because I wish for that. I just want the

896
00:45:57,214 --> 00:45:59,614
Speaker 2: edit of life. Please? Can I have the edit? What

897
00:45:59,734 --> 00:46:02,174
Speaker 2: supplement do I take? What's the meditation app that I

898
00:46:02,214 --> 00:46:04,614
Speaker 2: should be using what's the book to read? Like clear

899
00:46:04,654 --> 00:46:06,894
Speaker 2: the clutter and just let me get to it. And

900
00:46:06,934 --> 00:46:10,814
Speaker 2: it's also a bit of a fast track to human connection.

901
00:46:11,134 --> 00:46:14,414
Speaker 2: I think it is is that you're able to like

902
00:46:14,454 --> 00:46:16,854
Speaker 2: I went to read a book the other day and

903
00:46:16,894 --> 00:46:18,374
Speaker 2: I'm like, oh, yeah, it's got recommended to me.

904
00:46:18,374 --> 00:46:20,494
Speaker 3: And I'm like, I saw it old Zami's Instagram.

905
00:46:21,454 --> 00:46:24,214
Speaker 2: It's not recommended. What was it? Do you love it?

906
00:46:24,214 --> 00:46:28,814
Speaker 3: It's the Taffy Yeah, I was like, oh I loved

907
00:46:28,854 --> 00:46:29,374
Speaker 3: her first book.

908
00:46:29,414 --> 00:46:31,294
Speaker 2: I must read it. Yes, and she's Brilli.

909
00:46:31,414 --> 00:46:33,174
Speaker 3: But it is that idea of having somebody you can

910
00:46:33,214 --> 00:46:36,574
Speaker 3: trust and you know their recommendations have served you well

911
00:46:36,574 --> 00:46:39,534
Speaker 3: in the past. You feel connected to them again.

912
00:46:39,574 --> 00:46:41,694
Speaker 2: It's the hoobers because I'm like, who's to say my

913
00:46:41,814 --> 00:46:44,294
Speaker 2: taste is your taste? But it's not like I chose

914
00:46:44,334 --> 00:46:46,254
Speaker 2: that book out of like the usually prized. When it's

915
00:46:46,614 --> 00:46:49,534
Speaker 2: very I'm like, if you haven't read this, you do,

916
00:46:49,934 --> 00:46:53,014
Speaker 2: it's amazing. But yeah, I like the time saving aspect,

917
00:46:53,494 --> 00:46:55,094
Speaker 2: and it's really just putting out what I want to

918
00:46:55,134 --> 00:46:58,134
Speaker 2: get back, which is now you recommend me something, you

919
00:46:58,174 --> 00:46:59,414
Speaker 2: won't help each other out.

920
00:46:59,934 --> 00:47:02,414
Speaker 3: What currently keeps you from happiness?

921
00:47:02,934 --> 00:47:07,654
Speaker 2: Keeps me from happiness. I think it's usually sleep. I

922
00:47:07,654 --> 00:47:09,894
Speaker 2: think sleep. It's very well known for a lot of

923
00:47:09,934 --> 00:47:14,534
Speaker 2: people that sleep is my number one mental health kryptonite.

924
00:47:15,054 --> 00:47:19,974
Speaker 2: So I prioritize it all costs. And if I've slept,

925
00:47:19,974 --> 00:47:22,614
Speaker 2: I can do anything. I haven't slept on a monster,

926
00:47:23,214 --> 00:47:26,254
Speaker 2: And I've become very good at power napping to get

927
00:47:26,294 --> 00:47:28,774
Speaker 2: back on track, like to start the day again, to

928
00:47:28,814 --> 00:47:31,774
Speaker 2: take the nap to start fresh, which I think there's

929
00:47:31,974 --> 00:47:34,414
Speaker 2: napping's got a bad stigma, but a lot of writers nap.

930
00:47:34,534 --> 00:47:37,374
Speaker 2: It's better than their fourth coffee, or it's a twenty

931
00:47:37,414 --> 00:47:41,214
Speaker 2: minute meditation, or you're gonna do something. So sleep is

932
00:47:41,214 --> 00:47:44,934
Speaker 2: what keeps me from happiness. And probably fear a little

933
00:47:44,934 --> 00:47:47,534
Speaker 2: bit just what we're going back to before about like

934
00:47:48,094 --> 00:47:50,694
Speaker 2: putting things out into the world and hoping that it hits.

935
00:47:51,334 --> 00:47:53,214
Speaker 2: And in the amount of times we put up a

936
00:47:53,254 --> 00:47:55,614
Speaker 2: new product or launch or something, and I'm waiting for

937
00:47:55,694 --> 00:47:58,254
Speaker 2: the thing we did wrong? What's going to blindside me here?

938
00:47:58,894 --> 00:48:01,414
Speaker 2: Even with the book, I'm like, oh, you know, have

939
00:48:01,494 --> 00:48:04,134
Speaker 2: I offended someone? Or have I that world we live

940
00:48:04,134 --> 00:48:06,774
Speaker 2: in now where I'm on edge of that vigilance of

941
00:48:06,814 --> 00:48:10,014
Speaker 2: like what can they get me for here, which is

942
00:48:10,094 --> 00:48:14,174
Speaker 2: very telling, I think. So I'm always aware that that's

943
00:48:14,214 --> 00:48:17,614
Speaker 2: going to happen without trying to preempt it or manifest it.

944
00:48:17,614 --> 00:48:20,374
Speaker 2: It's a fine line. Yeah, I think I'm happy to

945
00:48:20,414 --> 00:48:22,214
Speaker 2: take risks, but I'm also aware that it's not for everyone,

946
00:48:22,254 --> 00:48:24,494
Speaker 2: and that's okay. I don't want to be for everyone. No.

947
00:48:24,694 --> 00:48:26,734
Speaker 2: I think there's that saying that if you try and

948
00:48:26,814 --> 00:48:31,334
Speaker 2: be for everyone, you are by definition average. So definitely, yeah,

949
00:48:31,414 --> 00:48:33,934
Speaker 2: definitely just find your people and write for them.

950
00:48:35,174 --> 00:48:39,014
Speaker 3: In terms of sleep, because I think maybe a lot

951
00:48:39,054 --> 00:48:41,614
Speaker 3: of people realize the importance of sleep when they have

952
00:48:41,974 --> 00:48:44,574
Speaker 3: a child for the first time, and you're like, oh, yeah,

953
00:48:44,574 --> 00:48:48,654
Speaker 3: I thought i'd been I strived before. No lack of sleep.

954
00:48:48,694 --> 00:48:50,774
Speaker 3: How does that manifest in terms of mental health?

955
00:48:50,974 --> 00:48:55,934
Speaker 2: I'm a bitch, I'm snappy with my children, my anxiety ramps,

956
00:48:56,254 --> 00:49:00,494
Speaker 2: I can't write. My dopamine hunting is increased one hundred

957
00:49:00,494 --> 00:49:04,854
Speaker 2: folds by food, by scrolling, by just silly tasks that

958
00:49:04,854 --> 00:49:08,694
Speaker 2: don't actually need doing. I just feel wayward. So I

959
00:49:08,694 --> 00:49:11,454
Speaker 2: don't have that focus and I really need that. And

960
00:49:11,494 --> 00:49:13,454
Speaker 2: I think, you know, I'm forty four, so perimenopause is

961
00:49:13,454 --> 00:49:17,494
Speaker 2: a real thing. The anxiety and the sleeplessness big thing.

962
00:49:17,774 --> 00:49:21,574
Speaker 2: So I've I've had my diagnostics and I've got something

963
00:49:21,574 --> 00:49:27,454
Speaker 2: to help me sleep now and it's medicinal CBD and fabulous,

964
00:49:27,654 --> 00:49:30,694
Speaker 2: Hi the right and yeah, so I just needed to

965
00:49:31,574 --> 00:49:34,574
Speaker 2: sort that out. Like I said before, anything else would

966
00:49:34,694 --> 00:49:37,734
Speaker 2: work because I have this limit of three nights bad sleep,

967
00:49:37,814 --> 00:49:40,414
Speaker 2: and yeah, I will book a fucking hotel. Yeah, I

968
00:49:40,494 --> 00:49:44,214
Speaker 2: need to sleep. Something's got to give. So yeah, I've

969
00:49:44,254 --> 00:49:46,134
Speaker 2: never got to that stage, but that's how I feel.

970
00:49:46,614 --> 00:49:49,374
Speaker 3: Yeah, because one night you can one night adrenaline. Yeah,

971
00:49:49,374 --> 00:49:51,774
Speaker 3: two nights you feel terrible. Three nights I'm a rash.

972
00:49:52,414 --> 00:49:55,454
Speaker 3: I've lost all rationality. And then I actually start convincing

973
00:49:55,494 --> 00:49:57,614
Speaker 3: myself I don't need sleep, and that's when you know

974
00:49:57,734 --> 00:50:00,494
Speaker 3: you've gone nuts. If you're like sleep, who needs sleep?

975
00:50:00,614 --> 00:50:01,774
Speaker 3: And then you're like I need.

976
00:50:04,214 --> 00:50:06,294
Speaker 2: That's very hard. With growing child, it's very hard. And

977
00:50:06,294 --> 00:50:09,014
Speaker 2: I had my anxiety only started when I had children.

978
00:50:09,534 --> 00:50:11,654
Speaker 2: I have characterized myself as an anxious person prior to that,

979
00:50:11,694 --> 00:50:14,414
Speaker 2: but a baby who I had to keep alive was

980
00:50:14,454 --> 00:50:18,414
Speaker 2: a big deal and sleep was not great. No bad

981
00:50:18,494 --> 00:50:20,134
Speaker 2: cycle contributes.

982
00:50:19,614 --> 00:50:26,134
Speaker 3: To it when you are tired, getting defensive, not being

983
00:50:26,134 --> 00:50:30,054
Speaker 3: your best self. Are there people around you? Because I

984
00:50:30,054 --> 00:50:34,694
Speaker 3: think sometimes in terms of our happiness, sometimes we're not

985
00:50:34,814 --> 00:50:38,854
Speaker 3: even the best person to know how to make ourselves happy.

986
00:50:38,894 --> 00:50:41,174
Speaker 3: Sometimes the people around us are way better at saying

987
00:50:41,174 --> 00:50:44,414
Speaker 3: things objectively. Are there people who call you out and

988
00:50:44,414 --> 00:50:45,134
Speaker 3: pull you into line?

989
00:50:45,374 --> 00:50:48,854
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, my husband, he's a very lovely man, and

990
00:50:48,894 --> 00:50:51,534
Speaker 2: it's not his first instinct who usually cop a few

991
00:50:51,534 --> 00:50:54,334
Speaker 2: blows before I'll be like, what's wrong with you? But

992
00:50:54,334 --> 00:50:56,534
Speaker 2: I would have already prefaced it. I'm like, I'm tired,

993
00:50:56,974 --> 00:50:59,294
Speaker 2: I didn't say the worst sleep last night. Why did

994
00:50:59,294 --> 00:51:01,094
Speaker 2: the garbage man come at five in the morning? You know?

995
00:51:01,214 --> 00:51:04,974
Speaker 2: La la la, So I've already let everybody know. Yeah yeah,

996
00:51:05,014 --> 00:51:07,494
Speaker 2: so yeah he calls me and of course and my

997
00:51:07,654 --> 00:51:13,014
Speaker 2: kids were just heartbreaking, like are you being so snappy?

998
00:51:14,374 --> 00:51:17,894
Speaker 2: That's horrible? So yeah, I know when i'm it's a

999
00:51:17,934 --> 00:51:19,654
Speaker 2: wake up in the morning feeling. Yeah, I cur ready

1000
00:51:19,774 --> 00:51:21,934
Speaker 2: know it's there. I tell myself, oh, you're being a bitch,

1001
00:51:22,054 --> 00:51:24,814
Speaker 2: like sort your shit, and it's twenty minutes. I just

1002
00:51:24,854 --> 00:51:27,854
Speaker 2: need twenty minutes to just go and meditate or something. Yeah,

1003
00:51:27,894 --> 00:51:30,414
Speaker 2: I'm such a better person and I'm really okay with

1004
00:51:30,534 --> 00:51:32,814
Speaker 2: asking for that now, Like even in big family function

1005
00:51:32,934 --> 00:51:36,134
Speaker 2: moments where by law you're not allowed to just excuse

1006
00:51:36,134 --> 00:51:38,974
Speaker 2: yourself to do anything, but I'm like, ah, I don't

1007
00:51:39,214 --> 00:51:41,294
Speaker 2: like any of you for a minute. I'm going to

1008
00:51:41,374 --> 00:51:43,334
Speaker 2: go just become a nicer person. Then we're gonna have

1009
00:51:43,334 --> 00:51:45,894
Speaker 2: a great day. I think maybe I need to do that.

1010
00:51:46,174 --> 00:51:47,894
Speaker 3: I need to do that in a lot of social

1011
00:51:47,934 --> 00:51:50,294
Speaker 3: situations because otherwise I push through. And I'm like, it's

1012
00:51:50,294 --> 00:51:54,174
Speaker 3: written all over my face. Yes, everybody knows how I'm feeling. Yes,

1013
00:51:54,254 --> 00:51:56,614
Speaker 3: I think I'm hiding it. Yeah, no, no, no, no,

1014
00:51:57,214 --> 00:51:59,854
Speaker 3: right now, you've got a new novel out. Things will

1015
00:51:59,854 --> 00:52:05,694
Speaker 3: calm down soon. You've got a wildly successful business. Are

1016
00:52:05,694 --> 00:52:06,454
Speaker 3: you happy?

1017
00:52:06,734 --> 00:52:10,254
Speaker 2: Yeah, to the point where when this book was pitched,

1018
00:52:10,254 --> 00:52:12,174
Speaker 2: I was like, no, I can't do that. I am happy.

1019
00:52:13,214 --> 00:52:17,054
Speaker 2: Won't be very interesting genius there and pretend like I'm

1020
00:52:17,054 --> 00:52:19,854
Speaker 2: not the most lucky woman on it. Now I feel

1021
00:52:20,934 --> 00:52:24,334
Speaker 2: not only happy, but thriving. I feel inspired. I feel

1022
00:52:25,574 --> 00:52:28,654
Speaker 2: very fortunate. I know we're not allowed to say lucky,

1023
00:52:28,694 --> 00:52:31,734
Speaker 2: but I do feel lucky. I feel grateful. I think

1024
00:52:31,774 --> 00:52:38,854
Speaker 2: gratitude is my massive antidote to sadness or anger, irritability

1025
00:52:38,974 --> 00:52:42,294
Speaker 2: is just to switch it to a mindset of gratitude,

1026
00:52:42,494 --> 00:52:45,014
Speaker 2: which is does sound like a privileged thing to say,

1027
00:52:45,014 --> 00:52:48,854
Speaker 2: but anyone, no matter a situation, can turn to gratitude.

1028
00:52:49,494 --> 00:52:52,614
Speaker 2: Just for the health of my children, my family, this

1029
00:52:52,734 --> 00:52:55,974
Speaker 2: incredibly fortunate life I'm living. So I'm very happy and

1030
00:52:56,014 --> 00:52:58,614
Speaker 2: I feel excited and compelled, and that is because I

1031
00:52:58,654 --> 00:53:01,854
Speaker 2: took care of myself this year when I wrote this

1032
00:53:01,894 --> 00:53:04,014
Speaker 2: book things will come down soon with something I would

1033
00:53:04,014 --> 00:53:05,894
Speaker 2: throw out all the time and we would laugh ha

1034
00:53:05,934 --> 00:53:07,934
Speaker 2: ha ha, No, I won't hamishould be like that is

1035
00:53:07,974 --> 00:53:11,814
Speaker 2: your life, you idiot. Come on. But then this June,

1036
00:53:12,014 --> 00:53:14,294
Speaker 2: I actually for the first time had a proper break

1037
00:53:14,334 --> 00:53:17,014
Speaker 2: from work because the book was in at the printers

1038
00:53:17,014 --> 00:53:20,574
Speaker 2: when you can't do anymore except start publicity and go

1039
00:53:20,694 --> 00:53:22,774
Speaker 2: to was in a bit of a production phase that

1040
00:53:22,774 --> 00:53:25,414
Speaker 2: there was a lull and I was able to just

1041
00:53:25,454 --> 00:53:28,774
Speaker 2: take a couple of weeks to not be the sort

1042
00:53:28,774 --> 00:53:31,214
Speaker 2: of level of stress Kit is in Living Dead Yay,

1043
00:53:31,734 --> 00:53:33,494
Speaker 2: which was very normal for me for about three years

1044
00:53:33,494 --> 00:53:35,534
Speaker 2: because I had two deals and a novel and day

1045
00:53:35,574 --> 00:53:38,854
Speaker 2: to day work and young family, and I felt like

1046
00:53:38,894 --> 00:53:41,054
Speaker 2: a different person because I was very burnt out at

1047
00:53:41,054 --> 00:53:43,854
Speaker 2: the start of the year, burnt out at Jason and

1048
00:53:43,894 --> 00:53:45,454
Speaker 2: I went to a health camp, which I hadn't done

1049
00:53:45,454 --> 00:53:49,774
Speaker 2: since for eight years, and I was a different person

1050
00:53:49,814 --> 00:53:51,414
Speaker 2: when I came back. And I remember at the start

1051
00:53:51,414 --> 00:53:53,574
Speaker 2: of the year, my mum, she always does my neurology.

1052
00:53:53,974 --> 00:53:56,934
Speaker 2: She's like, you're in a seven year Fuck it, I

1053
00:53:56,974 --> 00:53:59,134
Speaker 2: need to be in a four year four years of work. Yere,

1054
00:53:59,214 --> 00:54:01,774
Speaker 2: She goes, you've done your four years. Yeah, you're in

1055
00:54:01,814 --> 00:54:03,774
Speaker 2: a seven year. And I'm like, but that's like it's

1056
00:54:03,854 --> 00:54:06,414
Speaker 2: inner and it's meditative, and you learn your skills and

1057
00:54:06,414 --> 00:54:08,574
Speaker 2: you'll take care of yourself and you go in. And

1058
00:54:08,614 --> 00:54:10,134
Speaker 2: she said, but can't you see how important that is

1059
00:54:10,134 --> 00:54:11,374
Speaker 2: in this year. And I'm like, no, no, this is

1060
00:54:11,414 --> 00:54:13,574
Speaker 2: my big year. This is our go to s tenth birthday.

1061
00:54:13,654 --> 00:54:15,934
Speaker 2: My book's out and I've got two children's books out.

1062
00:54:16,214 --> 00:54:18,574
Speaker 2: I need to be the peacock this year. And she said,

1063
00:54:18,574 --> 00:54:20,014
Speaker 2: but you can't do any of that if you haven't

1064
00:54:20,014 --> 00:54:22,454
Speaker 2: looked after yourself. And so that's why I have boundaries

1065
00:54:22,494 --> 00:54:26,014
Speaker 2: around eventing or filming or anything that takes a lot

1066
00:54:26,014 --> 00:54:28,614
Speaker 2: of energy from me. And all family time weekend is

1067
00:54:28,614 --> 00:54:30,774
Speaker 2: family time. And all of those boundaries are in place

1068
00:54:31,294 --> 00:54:33,494
Speaker 2: to protect me so that I can do better work

1069
00:54:33,534 --> 00:54:37,174
Speaker 2: and have a better mindset and be happier and sleep.

1070
00:54:37,334 --> 00:54:40,734
Speaker 2: You know, sleep our whole family. I made them obsessed

1071
00:54:40,734 --> 00:54:43,254
Speaker 2: about sleep. The kids don't care aish and I are

1072
00:54:43,414 --> 00:54:46,534
Speaker 2: very devout sleep. Sleep is our religion.

1073
00:54:47,294 --> 00:54:51,454
Speaker 3: Do you feel like now that the book is out

1074
00:54:52,134 --> 00:54:56,254
Speaker 3: and the business, I mean, as somebody who doesn't understand

1075
00:54:56,334 --> 00:54:58,694
Speaker 3: business at all, the business isn't a really good place.

1076
00:54:59,054 --> 00:55:00,014
Speaker 3: Have things calm down?

1077
00:55:00,214 --> 00:55:01,854
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's what I mean. Like it's a weird time

1078
00:55:01,894 --> 00:55:04,054
Speaker 2: to be talking about the book because things did calm

1079
00:55:04,094 --> 00:55:09,694
Speaker 2: down for June and now I'm physy again. But I

1080
00:55:09,734 --> 00:55:12,534
Speaker 2: think I needed to know that it could calm down,

1081
00:55:13,374 --> 00:55:16,254
Speaker 2: but the soon was coming. Yeah, I just I needed

1082
00:55:16,294 --> 00:55:18,054
Speaker 2: to know it was a fact, not just this myth

1083
00:55:18,214 --> 00:55:21,494
Speaker 2: of this carrot dangling of like one day, so I

1084
00:55:21,534 --> 00:55:23,854
Speaker 2: know it can be calm And I know this. It's

1085
00:55:23,934 --> 00:55:27,174
Speaker 2: on me. It's how much I undertake. But I love

1086
00:55:27,494 --> 00:55:29,734
Speaker 2: new projects, you know. I love studying a new book.

1087
00:55:29,734 --> 00:55:31,774
Speaker 2: I'm already excited to write a new book. I like

1088
00:55:31,854 --> 00:55:33,614
Speaker 2: to be busy. I like to be working. I like

1089
00:55:33,654 --> 00:55:35,614
Speaker 2: to do good work, to the point where even if

1090
00:55:35,654 --> 00:55:37,294
Speaker 2: they weren't published and weren't read, and I would still

1091
00:55:37,294 --> 00:55:41,974
Speaker 2: want to do it. So yeah, it's me not starting

1092
00:55:42,014 --> 00:55:43,494
Speaker 2: a new project too quickly, and I've got to hold

1093
00:55:43,494 --> 00:55:46,414
Speaker 2: myself back. I'm like, get this baby out first. Please

1094
00:55:46,534 --> 00:55:49,014
Speaker 2: just focus on this book, don't stund new one yet.

1095
00:55:49,414 --> 00:55:51,574
Speaker 2: So I'm back. Feels good.

1096
00:55:52,254 --> 00:55:54,014
Speaker 3: Thank you so much for your time today. I really

1097
00:55:54,094 --> 00:55:59,294
Speaker 3: appreciate it. That's all we've got time for on today's

1098
00:55:59,334 --> 00:56:02,694
Speaker 3: episode of That Are You Happy. Zoe Foster Blake's latest

1099
00:56:02,694 --> 00:56:05,454
Speaker 3: novel about the chaos of business and being a founder

1100
00:56:05,494 --> 00:56:08,534
Speaker 3: and juggling a family between it all, is called Things

1101
00:56:08,534 --> 00:56:10,894
Speaker 3: Will Calm Down Soon, and it's out on the first

1102
00:56:10,894 --> 00:56:14,134
Speaker 3: of October. It's brilliant and I can promise you will

1103
00:56:14,174 --> 00:56:16,134
Speaker 3: not be able to put it down. But it's also

1104
00:56:16,214 --> 00:56:19,454
Speaker 3: incredibly insightful and challenges a lot of ideas we hold

1105
00:56:19,534 --> 00:56:23,254
Speaker 3: about women and money and success and power. Will pop

1106
00:56:23,374 --> 00:56:28,334
Speaker 3: a link into the show notes. This conversation went beyond

1107
00:56:28,374 --> 00:56:31,574
Speaker 3: the veneer of the glamorous, aspirational life of Zoe Foster

1108
00:56:31,654 --> 00:56:35,534
Speaker 3: Blake to the charismatic, clever and generous person who sat

1109
00:56:35,534 --> 00:56:38,294
Speaker 3: opposite me in the studio. I want to thank her

1110
00:56:38,334 --> 00:56:41,734
Speaker 3: for everything she shared in our conversation, and if there's

1111
00:56:41,774 --> 00:56:44,414
Speaker 3: anyone you know who you think might get something out

1112
00:56:44,414 --> 00:56:46,854
Speaker 3: of this episode, please share it with them. If you

1113
00:56:46,894 --> 00:56:49,254
Speaker 3: want to recommend anyone for the show, you can message

1114
00:56:49,254 --> 00:56:51,894
Speaker 3: me on Instagram, and if you like the show, leave

1115
00:56:51,974 --> 00:56:56,694
Speaker 3: us a review. We always love your feedback. Next week,

1116
00:56:56,934 --> 00:56:59,934
Speaker 3: I speak to Amy Shark about the tension of getting

1117
00:56:59,974 --> 00:57:04,694
Speaker 3: everything you ever wanted. The executive producer, but are you Happy,

1118
00:57:04,814 --> 00:57:08,174
Speaker 3: is Niama Brown and the producer is Charlie Blackman. Audio

1119
00:57:08,334 --> 00:57:11,694
Speaker 3: editing by Scott Stronnick. I'm your host, Class Stevens, and

1120
00:57:11,734 --> 00:57:12,654
Speaker 3: we'll see you next week.

1121
00:57:19,094 --> 00:57:22,054
Speaker 1: Hey QUICKI friends, Grace here again. We hope you enjoyed

1122
00:57:22,094 --> 00:57:24,934
Speaker 1: this episode of Mum and MEA's award winning podcast, But

1123
00:57:25,054 --> 00:57:28,374
Speaker 1: are you Happy? Featuring Zoe Foster Blake. If you did,

1124
00:57:28,414 --> 00:57:32,174
Speaker 1: there are three seasons of this podcast. They're full of advice, wisdom,

1125
00:57:32,214 --> 00:57:35,614
Speaker 1: and maybe more importantly, stories of failure from some of

1126
00:57:35,654 --> 00:57:39,174
Speaker 1: our most beloved celebrities. You can check out those episodes

1127
00:57:39,214 --> 00:57:41,334
Speaker 1: by the link in our show notes. We'll catch you

1128
00:57:41,374 --> 00:57:43,294
Speaker 1: again for the Quikie at six am Monday,