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Speaker 1: You're listening to a MoMA Mia podcast.

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Speaker 2: Mamma Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters

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Speaker 2: that this podcast is recorded on Hello and welcome to

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Speaker 2: Mamma Mia out loud. It's what women are actually talking

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Speaker 2: about on Wednesday, the fifteenth of October. My name is

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Speaker 2: Hollywayne Wright, my name is Amelia Luster.

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Speaker 3: And I am Jesse Stevens.

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Speaker 2: And here's what's made our agenda for today. I have

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Speaker 2: a very basic question for non basic foreign policy expert Amelia.

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Speaker 2: Did Donald Trump just do something that only he could?

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Speaker 4: And a comedian hurt my feelings recently and that got

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Speaker 4: me thinking about what is okay and not okay to

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Speaker 4: make fun of.

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Speaker 3: Plus, Selena Gomez posted a behind the scenes video from

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Speaker 3: her wedding was actually filmed by Taylor Swift, and Taylor

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Speaker 3: Swift accidentally revealed something but Selena didn't want us to say.

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Speaker 2: She wouldn't be happy.

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Speaker 3: The Internet is not happy with what they saw.

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Speaker 2: But first, we can't go on without discussing a little

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Speaker 2: thing that broke the internet briefly overnight. Our friend Kim Kardashian,

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Speaker 2: she's not your friend, she's my friend. I'm claiming her.

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Speaker 2: The woman who really knows how to make money. Her brand,

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Speaker 2: Skims launched something called the Ultimate Bush Song. And if

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Speaker 2: you're like, what do those words mean? I think if

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Speaker 2: you think about it for another second, you've probably got

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Speaker 2: it in your head.

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Speaker 4: Is it a Steve Erwin inspired flip flop?

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Speaker 2: Really thick like spider proof, soul repellent in it and stuff.

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Speaker 2: It's not that it's not the Ultimate bush Song in

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Speaker 2: an Australian sense, although that's genius. It is a teeny

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Speaker 2: tiny mesh g string that comes in seven different shades

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Speaker 2: and textures that basically is a murkin. So the front part,

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Speaker 2: the little triangle part has fake pubic hair on it

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Speaker 2: to put no final hand washed only, and it comes

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Speaker 2: in all kinds of different shades. You can have straight,

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Speaker 2: you can have curly, you can have full, you can

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Speaker 2: have meat. It's absolutely nuts and although as one common

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Speaker 2: to pointed out, I could grow one of these myself.

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Speaker 2: In forty eight hours, they have sold out at seventy

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Speaker 2: bucks a pop, proving once again that Kim and her

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Speaker 2: mates Emma Green and Co. Are marketing geniuses, but also

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Speaker 2: maybe that the bushes back. I don't know. Jesse wants

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Speaker 2: your take on why we all went crazy for the

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Speaker 2: Well we didn't. I don't know when did you buy one?

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Speaker 3: I tried, but it was all sold out and I

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Speaker 3: couldn't decide between the red curly and the red straight.

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Speaker 3: And I was kind of glad that it all sold

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Speaker 3: out because I didn't like the image of a white

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Speaker 3: head g string just hanging in a warehouse, just not knowing,

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Speaker 3: going into landfill.

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Speaker 2: Like I like, nobody would have bought the white one.

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Speaker 3: There was a white straight one. That made me a

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Speaker 3: bit sad.

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Speaker 4: To be completely honest, Sorry, when we keep talking about

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Speaker 4: them being sold out, do we think that there were

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Speaker 4: any or have they just declared this is like Meghan's jams,

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Speaker 4: like where they're ten.

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Speaker 3: I think there might have been ten. I don't think

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Speaker 3: that they had an abundance of stock.

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Speaker 2: Well who knows, right, because the thing that we do

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Speaker 2: know about Skims because Emma Greed, who is you know,

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Speaker 2: one of the geniuses behind the brand. She has talked

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Speaker 2: about this openly. She said they do something called stunt releasing,

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Speaker 2: and they did it with the nipple bra, where they

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Speaker 2: basically will release a product that will get everybody talking

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Speaker 2: for a hot minute, like we're doing now and the

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Speaker 2: internet is doing right now, and really it just drives

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Speaker 2: people to the website to buy other stuff. What is

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Speaker 2: particularly interesting though about the Bush song is when she

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Speaker 2: was talking about the nipple bra, she said, the nipple

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Speaker 2: bra was designed to sell look at me holding, well,

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Speaker 2: I'm doing this is not appropriate. The nipple bra was

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Speaker 2: kind of to get you to buy a T shirt,

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Speaker 2: to get you to buy a baby tea, because the

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Speaker 2: idea of those baby teas in Kardashian kind of style

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Speaker 2: is it would look cute if your nipples were showing

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Speaker 2: through and whatever.

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Speaker 3: I have seen more nipples since that nipple braw came out.

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Speaker 2: I have, So it was a leader. It was a

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Speaker 2: leader to get So what is the bushy thong trying

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Speaker 2: to get us to buy?

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Speaker 3: Let's not forget that twenty twenty five declared by Vogue

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Speaker 3: as the year of the Bush.

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Speaker 1: It was.

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Speaker 3: There's been Runway You've forgotten, which is really are about today?

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Speaker 3: Full Bush in a bikini training on TikTok has been

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Speaker 3: for the US summer YEP. And then there was Runway

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Speaker 3: Shows twenty four to twenty five that season where the

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Speaker 3: Runway models I think they were mercans, but you could

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Speaker 3: see kind of the outline of pubic hair. And what's

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Speaker 3: really in at the moment is that naked dress where

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Speaker 3: you can see just the underwear underneath. I can see

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Speaker 3: a world in which you wear an American underneath.

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Speaker 1: I can.

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Speaker 2: And also I was thinking about, like, you know those

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Speaker 2: satin bias cut skirts that everybody's wearing. Yes, the moment, yes,

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Speaker 2: is that if you were wearing one of these underneath it,

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Speaker 2: they'd just be like a rippling suggestion of your pubic

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Speaker 2: hare go texture suggestion might be.

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Speaker 1: Hot for some people.

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Speaker 3: I can see, I can see me are doing it

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Speaker 3: in five Oh my godness, she like you wonder why

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Speaker 3: it's sold out? You know who bought it in every

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Speaker 3: color because she doesn't know if she feels like curly Australia.

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Speaker 2: They want you to buy lots of them, even if

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Speaker 2: they've only got ten. This say, match, don't match. Switch

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Speaker 2: it up at midday so you can change the color

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Speaker 2: of your bush throughout the day. Very helpful.

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Speaker 3: Obviously you might want to curl for the evening. We

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Speaker 3: recorded a subscriber episode yesterday about wedding etiquette, Oh, which

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Speaker 3: was very very juicy. But I kind of wish that

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Speaker 3: before we recorded that, we knew more about Selena Gomez's

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Speaker 3: wedding because we've been a little bit late to this story,

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Speaker 3: but I've only just got across it this morning, and

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Speaker 3: I feel as though it raises some thorny ethical questions

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Speaker 3: which we like to explore on this show.

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Speaker 2: Can I ask you something? Yes, So Selena Gomez. Obviously

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Speaker 2: I know all about who Selena Gomez is kinder as in,

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Speaker 2: she's the most followed woman on Instagram, correct, which I

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Speaker 2: don't really understand why that is. But she is a big, big,

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Speaker 2: big big deal music acting being Taylor swisths best.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and it's the evolution, right, She was a Disney star,

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Speaker 3: like and that's where she got really famous. That's why

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Speaker 3: she's got the young people following, and then she went

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Speaker 3: into only medicin building and then that's where she is now.

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Speaker 3: And she's had this incredible singing career, best mates.

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Speaker 1: With Taylor red Beauty, which is made Oh yes, yeah.

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Speaker 3: So these are some of the questions that her wedding raises.

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Speaker 3: Should you vape at your wedding? Should you vape at

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Speaker 3: your wedding if your friend literally donated one of her

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Speaker 3: kidneys to you, and should you have invited that friend

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Speaker 3: who gave you a significant organ.

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Speaker 1: To your wedding.

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Speaker 2: Should she have come right?

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Speaker 3: These I know they're really hard and Selena needs some help.

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Speaker 3: So today Selena is probably texting her friend Taylor Swift,

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Speaker 3: being like, was I in the wrong? Like they're definitely

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Speaker 3: going back and forth, and they're texting about a woman's

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Speaker 3: right to vape. But we're going to go back to

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Speaker 3: the beginning. So we've established to Selena Gomez is and

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Speaker 3: then a few weeks ago she gets married. She's been

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Speaker 3: drip feeding us content as every good bride does. And

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Speaker 3: then I think that she was trying to do a

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Speaker 3: bit of a shout out to Taylor Swift, which now

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Speaker 3: means I have more wedding content to drop.

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Speaker 2: Well, because for the first week there was no Taylor

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Speaker 2: any of the pictures. It's quite a good strategy. She

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Speaker 2: was like, my best friend isn't gonna, you know, completely

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Speaker 2: take over my day. But she was definitely there, everybody,

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Speaker 2: you just haven't seen me yet. And then to coincide

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Speaker 2: with the album launch.

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Speaker 3: She shared a video that Taylor Swift herself had taken,

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Speaker 3: and you can see that the moment the camera pans

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Speaker 3: to Selena, she tries to hide something in her hand,

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Speaker 3: which is very clearly a vape.

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Speaker 1: Now I have something to interrupt with.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, an important piece of advice if you're getting married,

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Speaker 4: or if you're planning on getting married sometime in the

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Speaker 4: near future. Taylor Swift as videographer at your wedding is

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Speaker 4: a really smart choice. And I'll tell you why. The

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Speaker 4: person who is documenting your wedding, either through photos or

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Speaker 4: through video, must be tall.

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Speaker 3: Think about it, and taller than you.

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Speaker 1: Taller than you, which is not hard.

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Speaker 4: Selena's not particularly tall, and Nora is her husband Benny,

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Speaker 4: but Taylor is a tall woman and therefore will take

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Speaker 4: the most flattering video and photos of you at your wedding.

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Speaker 3: That's why take them.

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Speaker 1: Absolutely.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it's not kind to my friends. Now fans are

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Speaker 3: pissed because vaping is not good for your kidneys. And

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Speaker 3: technically her one kidney belongs to a woman named Francia

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Speaker 3: what who donated it to her in twenty seventeen.

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Speaker 2: Twenty seventeen, how old Selena Gomez ish?

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Speaker 3: Thirty three? So she was that was eight years ago,

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Speaker 3: let's go, she was like twenty five ish.

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Speaker 4: Wow?

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Speaker 2: And why did she need a kidney transplant? Or is

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Speaker 2: that none of my business. I suspect it's none of

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Speaker 2: my business, but I still need to know.

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Speaker 3: Of course, she's told you she had a loopus Fler,

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Speaker 3: Her and Francier were good mates. And then what happened

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Speaker 3: was she needed this kidney, Francier donated the kidney. Then

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Speaker 3: in the aftermath things got a bit weird. There was unfollowing,

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Speaker 3: there was tension. There was a weird TikTok video where

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Speaker 3: Selena Gomez made a joke about how much alcohol she

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Speaker 3: drinks and everyone was like, not good for you. One

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Speaker 3: kidney and that's Franciers kidney.

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Speaker 2: So basically, by telling everyone she'd had a kidney transplant,

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Speaker 2: she made her health everybody else's business, and now everybody

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Speaker 2: has a lot of opinions about what she should shouldn't

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Speaker 2: be doing with what's her name is kidney.

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Speaker 3: Because remember she had that documentary years ago, didn't even

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Speaker 3: mention Francier who gave her her kidney. And then in

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Speaker 3: it as well, she had a line where she said,

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Speaker 3: I've only got one friend in the industry, and it's

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Speaker 3: Taylor Swift. Francier commented on that and was like interesting,

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Speaker 3: dot dot dot, and then deleted.

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Speaker 2: It is Francier as big as Taylor Swift.

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Speaker 3: No, but she is in the industry right. Actually, I

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Speaker 3: need to get this on the record too. Francier, giver

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Speaker 3: of the kidney, reportedly not invited. What does it take

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Speaker 3: to get a wedding invite? Polly? Do we have to

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Speaker 3: be more secretive about our bad habits when we're vaping

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Speaker 3: into someone else's kidney.

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Speaker 2: I'm not very good at biology.

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Speaker 3: I googled it.

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Speaker 2: I'm vaping into a kidney.

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Speaker 3: You're vaping kidney something something not good for the kidney.

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Speaker 3: Alcohol probably worse. But she's only got one now, and

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Speaker 3: so does Francis.

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Speaker 2: This is a cautionary tale about sharing too much, you

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Speaker 2: know how, in a different parallel universe, every contestant on

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Speaker 2: the voice, every person, no master chef, they have to

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Speaker 2: have the story right. And when you're earlier in your career,

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Speaker 2: and when, certainly when you're Selena Gomez and you're like

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Speaker 2: transitioning from Disney Star into lots of other things and

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Speaker 2: you're going through something really serious like needing a kidney transplant,

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Speaker 2: might seem like going public with it is a good idea.

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Speaker 3: And she had to postpone work things. She disappeared from

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Speaker 3: Instagram for a while, so she sort of did owe

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Speaker 3: her fans.

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Speaker 2: Otherwise the rumors would have been we know exactly what

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Speaker 2: they would have been, drug abusere no eating disorders, all

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Speaker 2: those things that we definitely think that young stars are

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Speaker 2: getting up to. But the problem is is that, yeah,

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Speaker 2: now she has just ignited the whole Internet, and we

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Speaker 2: know that there is nothing that social media likes more

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Speaker 2: in twenty twenty five than a sleuth. Because I've watched

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Speaker 2: this video several times and you have to look very

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Speaker 2: closely to see the vape like that's a very because

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Speaker 2: very soon she realizes and she just turns her hand

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Speaker 2: to cover it in her hand.

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Speaker 3: You spotted it, they did.

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Speaker 2: Well, I didn't until they pointed it out. But everybody

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Speaker 2: loves to sleuth, and then everybody loves to judge, and

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Speaker 2: then here we are. That's something I think she should do.

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Speaker 2: What she wants her kidney now, it's like you gave

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Speaker 2: it to me, Now it's mine.

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Speaker 3: The story we really want to tell is about the

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Speaker 3: entitlement of celebrities, and people quite love the idea that

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Speaker 3: Selena Goman is one of the most famous women in

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Speaker 3: the world. Somehow hoodwinked another woman into giving her a

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Speaker 3: kidney and then dropped her the second she got it

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Speaker 3: like it is the most ridiculous story that kind of

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Speaker 3: does make you laugh because it brings up questions of

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Speaker 3: what you owe someone and the idea that you are

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Speaker 3: so entitled that you would take someone's organ and then

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Speaker 3: like pillage. It is kind of ridiculous, Amelia, what do

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Speaker 3: you make of it?

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Speaker 1: Do you remember bad art friend?

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Speaker 3: Yeah?

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Speaker 1: Yes, This was an.

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Speaker 4: Internet phenomenon back in twenty twenty one which gets at

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Speaker 4: the fact that we are all really weird about kidney donations.

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Speaker 4: So what happened in this story? There were two people

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Speaker 4: who were friends on Facebook but probably not really friends

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Speaker 4: in real life, both women, both writers. One of them

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Speaker 4: donated a kidney to a stranger and started posting a

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Speaker 4: lot on Facebook about what a wonderful person she was

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Speaker 4: for giving this kidney to a stranger. The other person,

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Speaker 4: the other woman, would never like the posts. She never

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Speaker 4: commented on the post, she never said you're a wonderful person,

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Speaker 4: Well done you, And in the end this led to

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Speaker 4: a confrontation between the two women where the kidney donors said,

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Speaker 4: why did you never acknowledge that they did this amazing thing?

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Speaker 4: And then the other woman thought that was kind of

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Speaker 4: ridiculous and went on to write a very dawning story

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Speaker 4: about someone who donates a kidney and then goes around

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Speaker 4: asking everyone to congratulate her for doing it.

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Speaker 2: Forgot about that glorious.

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Speaker 4: There's a name for these people who do these extremely

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Speaker 4: generous things, and that name is an extreme altruist, and

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Speaker 4: people have identified that we all feel weird about extreme altruists.

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Speaker 4: We should feel great about them because they're doing great

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Speaker 4: things for other people, but they really make us feel bad.

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Speaker 4: So people who donate kidneys and do amazing things other

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Speaker 4: people often receive hostility and suspicion from people, and that's

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Speaker 4: because they're making us feel bad about us about the

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Speaker 4: fact that we wouldn't give our kidney unless we were

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Speaker 4: going to get absolute, concrete proof that that kidney was

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Speaker 4: going to a lived the rest of its life in

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Speaker 4: a beautiful, fancy.

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Speaker 2: Mansion and b be extremely well treated at all times

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Speaker 2: green juice only.

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Speaker 4: But that is not to say that those people are

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Speaker 4: always above board in how they talk about what they've done.

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Speaker 4: And we don't know what went on behind the scenes

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Speaker 4: here between Selena and her friend who donated the kidney

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Speaker 4: a lot of the times, like for instance, with that

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Speaker 4: out friend. What happened was this woman who donated her

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Speaker 4: kidney became objectively insufferable.

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Speaker 1: She never stopped talking about it.

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Speaker 4: She then told The New York Times that the reason

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Speaker 4: why she gave a kidney to a stranger is because

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Speaker 4: she had a very isolated childhood and she wanted to

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Speaker 4: build bridges and make connections in her life, and that's

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Speaker 4: why she did this extraordinary thing. But the story picked

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Speaker 4: up traction because there was something really needy about her,

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Speaker 4: and she kept wanting approval from people for this act.

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Speaker 4: And this is speculation, but I wonder if between Selena

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Speaker 4: and her friend that dynamic became unsustainable. The friend was like,

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Speaker 4: you shouldn't be eating that mayonnaise covered, so you shouldn't

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Speaker 4: be eating fast food. You shouldn't be drinking champagne, which

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Speaker 4: there were also photos of Selena drinking champagne at her

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Speaker 4: wedding too, in a coop. So maybe she just couldn't

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Speaker 4: deal with this friend judging her every move.

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Speaker 2: Jesse, you know more about this story maybe than anyone.

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Speaker 2: There's that track in the TikTok of this. Has the

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Speaker 2: kidney donating friend been talking heaps about it.

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Speaker 3: No, she's kind of retreated a little bit, although.

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Speaker 1: But she did write interesting on that Posty.

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Speaker 3: She write interesting on that post. She unfollowed Selena Gomez

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Speaker 3: and then again she said from the beginning that the

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Speaker 3: doctor told her it was a donation, and when you

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Speaker 3: donate a dollar, you don't walk around asking person who

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Speaker 3: you gave the dollar, two for the dollar back, like

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Speaker 3: she kind of understands that. But there is some interesting

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Speaker 3: tidbits that she didn't interview afterwards, where she said that

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Speaker 3: she had to write a will before she did it,

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Speaker 3: and a social worker said, this is really emotionally difficult

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Speaker 3: because when you give someone your kidney, you watch them

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Speaker 3: almost get better while your body suffers because you are

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Speaker 3: really ill. Yeah, she had post surgery depression. She had

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Speaker 3: to adjust to all of that. She was only in

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Speaker 3: her mid twenties herself.

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Speaker 2: To Amelia's point about why, and obviously this is prejorative language,

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Speaker 2: but why a Dona may become insufferable, one of those

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Speaker 2: good reasons might be because no one seems to understand

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Speaker 2: what you're going through. They just think, oh, that was

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Speaker 2: a nice thing to do, Shut up about it.

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Speaker 4: I wonder if she just ultimately felt like she wasn't

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Speaker 4: properly compensated for it. By that, I don't mean financial compensation.

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Speaker 4: It is illegal to purchase organs from people, but I

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Speaker 4: mean that she feels that Selena wasn't sufficiently great full true.

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Speaker 3: I think it gives way to all of these complex

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Speaker 3: moral questions about what you owe someone who saves your life.

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Speaker 3: Because she did save her life, and there have been

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Speaker 3: moments where Selena Gomez has won an award and she

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Speaker 3: stood on stage and she has said, I owe this

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Speaker 3: to the woman who saved my life. But does she

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Speaker 3: have to do that for the rest of her for

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Speaker 3: the rest of her life and do an appreciation post

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Speaker 3: scheduled every six months? Can she just kind of drop it?

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Speaker 1: I do think she should have invited her to the world.

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Speaker 1: You do, I do?

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Speaker 4: I mean she didn't have to worry about the headcount

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Speaker 4: and keeping it under a certain amount to stick to

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Speaker 4: her budget.

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Speaker 1: So trust her.

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Speaker 2: Though, when you're a celebrity, that's a big deal, right

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Speaker 2: She might think, Oh, it reminds me a little bit

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Speaker 2: of watching the Kardashians once, watching a clip from them

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Speaker 2: talk about their surrogates, and Chloe was asking Courtney, I

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Speaker 2: think is it okay to tell the surrogate for my child,

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Speaker 2: like what they should eat and that I only want

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Speaker 2: them to eat organic and I want and blah blah blah.

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Speaker 2: And Kin was like, yeah, absolutely, like send them the food.

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Speaker 2: And then I think he said, you should tell them

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Speaker 2: what TV to watch. You don't want your unborn charpe

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Speaker 2: around any trashy television like.

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Speaker 4: This because in the US you can pay someone to

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Speaker 4: be your surrogate, whereas in Australia you cannot.

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Speaker 2: And it could be in the contract. No reality TV

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Speaker 2: in the house. In a moment, did Donald Trump just

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Speaker 2: do something no one else could do?

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Speaker 3: Andy good evening.

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Speaker 2: We begin with that major breaking news tonight, A.

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Speaker 1: New Dawn hopes rise upter Donald Trump broke as a

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Speaker 1: momentous Middle East peace deal breaking news.

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Speaker 3: President Trump has just announced on social media that Israel

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Speaker 3: and Hamas signed off on the first phase of a

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Speaker 3: peace agreement. US President Donald Trump has hailed the ceasefire

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Speaker 3: deal as a momentous breakthrough.

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Speaker 4: And I can't believe I'm saying this.

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Speaker 2: I gotta give Donald Trump some props here. I have

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Speaker 2: a question for Amelia about peace in the Middle East.

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Speaker 2: So it has been an extraordinary and historic week. As

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Speaker 2: we're recording this, we have to acknowledge there's a very

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Speaker 2: long way to go to understand if the Middle East

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Speaker 2: peace agreement between Israel and Hamas is going to hold,

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Speaker 2: and what rebuilding a devastated Gaza might look like. But

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Speaker 2: what is not in question right now is that US

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Speaker 2: President Donald Trump is claiming responsibility for doing something that

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Speaker 2: no one else has been able to do for two

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Speaker 2: long years since the October seventh attacks, get all surviving

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Speaker 2: hostages returned to Israel, more than two thousand Palestinian detainees released,

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Speaker 2: and get a ceasefire deal signed. This leads me to

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Speaker 2: a question that is bothering liberals everywhere Amilia. Did Donald

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Speaker 2: Trump do something good?

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Speaker 1: Yes?

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Speaker 4: Yes, Look, I just don't know how anyone could see

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Speaker 4: the emotional scenes this week of Israeli hostages being returned

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Speaker 4: to their families, Palestinians who have been in Israeli jails

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Speaker 4: coming home, a ceasefire after some seven hundred and thirty days.

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Speaker 4: I don't know anyone who could look at that and

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Speaker 4: answer that question any other way.

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Speaker 1: Holly. He did do something good.

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Speaker 4: And as you say, there are so many issues to

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Speaker 4: be resolved and which may never be resolved, and we're

401
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Speaker 4: already seeing a lot of backsliding and complications. But this

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Speaker 4: is the Trump way, make the deal and then let

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Speaker 4: other people sort out the details.

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Speaker 2: So why is he the guy who could get this done?

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Speaker 2: So is this a case of well, it kind of

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Speaker 2: had to happen sometime and Trump with the man in

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Speaker 2: the chair, or is this a case of Trump exceptionalism.

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Speaker 1: There's a thing called madman theory. Have you heard of this?

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Speaker 4: No, It comes from political science, and it was actually

410
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Speaker 4: invented by another very polarizing US president, Richard Nixon, And

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Speaker 4: basically it goes that if everyone thinks you're mad, they

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Speaker 4: kind of have to go along with what you want

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Speaker 4: them to do. And this came up for Nixon because

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Speaker 4: during the Cold War, when both the Soviet Union and

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Speaker 4: the United States had their fingers on the nuclear button

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Speaker 4: and they were threatening each other with total annihilation, the

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Speaker 4: Soviet Union didn't want to do anything to upset Richard

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Speaker 4: Nixon because he was just crazy enough seeming that they

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Speaker 4: thought he might in fact blow up the entire world

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Speaker 4: if they upset him.

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Speaker 3: So it's fear and not knowing what they're going to

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Speaker 3: do next.

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Speaker 4: It's fear and the unpredictability of these people, And I

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Speaker 4: think that's why Joe Biden couldn't get this done, but

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Speaker 4: Donald Trump did so. When Trump said he was going

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Speaker 4: to destroy Hamas unless they agreed to this deal, and

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Speaker 4: when he told Netanya, who, hey, you better really follow

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Speaker 4: through on this cease fire and not break it, both

429
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Speaker 4: sides realized they kind of had to go along with it,

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Speaker 4: because when Donald Trump says he's going to destroy you,

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Speaker 4: he might just actually destroy you.

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Speaker 2: So he might have actually done what no other president

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Speaker 2: would do and withdraw support for Israel. So Biden has

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Speaker 2: congratulated Trump.

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Speaker 3: So Bill Clinton, Yeah, everyone, Yeah.

436
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Speaker 2: So a lot of h I mean, I can imagine

437
00:21:03,742 --> 00:21:05,742
Speaker 2: that that was quite difficult for Biden to do given

438
00:21:05,782 --> 00:21:08,742
Speaker 2: their history. Do you think that liberals, and when I

439
00:21:08,742 --> 00:21:12,181
Speaker 2: say liberals, I mean liberals, are worried that acknowledging that

440
00:21:12,262 --> 00:21:14,821
Speaker 2: he did make an audacious deal to get this done

441
00:21:14,982 --> 00:21:17,022
Speaker 2: helps Trump at home? Do you think they're worried about that?

442
00:21:17,422 --> 00:21:19,621
Speaker 1: I think it absolutely helps Trump. If you read the

443
00:21:19,742 --> 00:21:21,462
Speaker 1: US press this week, there's.

444
00:21:21,262 --> 00:21:24,141
Speaker 4: Been a lot of sort of American exceptionalism during the rounds,

445
00:21:24,182 --> 00:21:26,782
Speaker 4: a lot of only the US could have pulled this off.

446
00:21:26,861 --> 00:21:30,262
Speaker 4: A lot of pride, even coming from places that you

447
00:21:30,341 --> 00:21:32,941
Speaker 4: might not expect to be celebrating Donald Trump. There's been

448
00:21:32,982 --> 00:21:36,302
Speaker 4: this kind of surge of national sentiment that the US

449
00:21:36,341 --> 00:21:38,061
Speaker 4: helped well made this piece happen.

450
00:21:38,101 --> 00:21:39,702
Speaker 1: So yeah, it's absolutely going to help him.

451
00:21:39,742 --> 00:21:43,782
Speaker 3: I've seen some political analysts say that Trump, while some

452
00:21:43,901 --> 00:21:49,141
Speaker 3: would suggest that he's kind of this war hungry, chaotic man,

453
00:21:49,262 --> 00:21:52,621
Speaker 3: that he actually likes peace. He wants peace, and he

454
00:21:52,702 --> 00:21:55,901
Speaker 3: wants to follow through on that. Is that true?

455
00:21:55,982 --> 00:21:56,542
Speaker 1: It's true.

456
00:21:56,581 --> 00:21:59,101
Speaker 4: That's why he has been talking about how the award

457
00:21:59,141 --> 00:22:01,542
Speaker 4: he wants more than anything is a Nobel Peace Prize.

458
00:22:01,542 --> 00:22:03,782
Speaker 4: Now he didn't get it last week, but I'm sure

459
00:22:03,821 --> 00:22:06,341
Speaker 4: he's going to be lobbying very aggressively for it next year.

460
00:22:06,621 --> 00:22:09,422
Speaker 4: Back in the eighties, when he was this New York businessman,

461
00:22:09,742 --> 00:22:12,581
Speaker 4: was known for his pension for gold toilets. Even back

462
00:22:12,621 --> 00:22:15,421
Speaker 4: then he talked about his fears about nuclear war. So

463
00:22:15,782 --> 00:22:19,061
Speaker 4: this has been a longstanding obsession of his with this

464
00:22:19,141 --> 00:22:21,061
Speaker 4: notion of peace and being a peace maker.

465
00:22:21,141 --> 00:22:23,101
Speaker 3: Do you think he's actually a contender for that award

466
00:22:23,462 --> 00:22:23,982
Speaker 3: at this point?

467
00:22:24,022 --> 00:22:24,741
Speaker 1: I think he is.

468
00:22:24,782 --> 00:22:26,981
Speaker 4: He's been able to do what no other president in

469
00:22:27,101 --> 00:22:28,702
Speaker 4: recent US history has done.

470
00:22:29,262 --> 00:22:31,262
Speaker 2: Is it fair for those people who are like wrestling

471
00:22:31,302 --> 00:22:33,741
Speaker 2: with the complexity of this the whole, Like, but I

472
00:22:33,782 --> 00:22:36,942
Speaker 2: can't stand what he's doing at home. I can't stand

473
00:22:36,982 --> 00:22:40,262
Speaker 2: the ice raids. I can't stand. It's not like admitting

474
00:22:40,302 --> 00:22:43,221
Speaker 2: that Trump did pull this off means that you have

475
00:22:43,262 --> 00:22:45,421
Speaker 2: to sign off and all that. Right, we can remember that,

476
00:22:45,542 --> 00:22:51,182
Speaker 2: like duality exists, and I don't think that saying this

477
00:22:51,302 --> 00:22:53,141
Speaker 2: was a piece of I don't know if diplomacy is

478
00:22:53,182 --> 00:22:55,061
Speaker 2: the right word with him, but this was a piece

479
00:22:55,061 --> 00:22:59,422
Speaker 2: of deal making that will go down in history. And obviously,

480
00:22:59,462 --> 00:23:01,821
Speaker 2: depending on as we've already said on the complexities of

481
00:23:01,821 --> 00:23:04,982
Speaker 2: what happened next, it's still a historical moment. It doesn't

482
00:23:05,022 --> 00:23:08,181
Speaker 2: mean you have to like suddenly wear a Maga hat.

483
00:23:07,982 --> 00:23:12,821
Speaker 4: Right, No, I didn't bring mine today. No, it absolutely

484
00:23:12,821 --> 00:23:15,222
Speaker 4: doesn't mean that. But I do think that it's been

485
00:23:15,262 --> 00:23:18,981
Speaker 4: a bit of an embarrassing moment for a lot of

486
00:23:19,222 --> 00:23:23,981
Speaker 4: small l liberal commentators and analysts because another element of

487
00:23:23,982 --> 00:23:28,061
Speaker 4: this is, remember Jared Kushna, Avanka Trump's husband, who was

488
00:23:28,302 --> 00:23:31,901
Speaker 4: very involved in foreign policy in Trump's first administration. He

489
00:23:31,982 --> 00:23:34,901
Speaker 4: was working behind the scenes on this too, and so

490
00:23:34,942 --> 00:23:38,141
Speaker 4: people are having to think, well, look, Trump does lean

491
00:23:38,182 --> 00:23:40,422
Speaker 4: on these people who we kind of make fun of

492
00:23:40,502 --> 00:23:42,262
Speaker 4: or who we don't think are up to the task,

493
00:23:42,422 --> 00:23:45,901
Speaker 4: like Jared, But Jared was involved in doing this deal,

494
00:23:46,061 --> 00:23:48,742
Speaker 4: as you say, And no matter what happens next now,

495
00:23:48,742 --> 00:23:50,981
Speaker 4: we certainly hope that the cease fire holds.

496
00:23:51,341 --> 00:23:52,861
Speaker 1: We certainly hope that there can.

497
00:23:52,782 --> 00:23:56,022
Speaker 4: Be a plan for rebuilding Gaza, which really does as

498
00:23:56,022 --> 00:23:59,461
Speaker 4: you say, Holly Lion ruins. But no matter what happens next,

499
00:23:59,581 --> 00:24:04,302
Speaker 4: the achievement of getting Hamas and Netanyahu to agree on

500
00:24:04,341 --> 00:24:06,181
Speaker 4: this stands alone.

501
00:24:06,341 --> 00:24:08,662
Speaker 3: It's very TRUMPI in to claim all the credit, which

502
00:24:08,661 --> 00:24:11,061
Speaker 3: he is absolutely done. I think someone said this was

503
00:24:11,101 --> 00:24:12,982
Speaker 3: one of the biggest things that had happened in fifty years,

504
00:24:12,982 --> 00:24:15,461
Speaker 3: and he was like one hundred, like, that's very Trump.

505
00:24:16,222 --> 00:24:18,701
Speaker 3: Was it actually him as an individual man, or was

506
00:24:18,742 --> 00:24:20,542
Speaker 3: it a bunch of people behind the scenes and he's

507
00:24:20,542 --> 00:24:22,101
Speaker 3: just standing up wanting to be the poster boy.

508
00:24:22,341 --> 00:24:24,302
Speaker 4: There were a bunch of people behind the scenes. Dearrek

509
00:24:24,341 --> 00:24:28,182
Speaker 4: Kushner was one of them. Steve Wikoff, who is a

510
00:24:28,341 --> 00:24:31,262
Speaker 4: deal maker from Trump's New York real estate days, was

511
00:24:31,302 --> 00:24:35,702
Speaker 4: also very involved. But I think, ultimately, and it brings

512
00:24:35,742 --> 00:24:38,502
Speaker 4: me no particular joy to say this. It was Trump

513
00:24:38,581 --> 00:24:40,862
Speaker 4: who got the deal over the line. So Biden had

514
00:24:40,861 --> 00:24:43,702
Speaker 4: tried very hard to make this happen. He had had

515
00:24:43,742 --> 00:24:46,901
Speaker 4: his Secretary of State traveling around the world dozens of

516
00:24:46,982 --> 00:24:49,861
Speaker 4: times trying to get these people to the negotiating table,

517
00:24:50,262 --> 00:24:51,302
Speaker 4: and it didn't work.

518
00:24:51,422 --> 00:24:53,022
Speaker 1: I think that this madman.

519
00:24:52,702 --> 00:24:57,101
Speaker 4: Theory explains to us why Trump has this unique ability

520
00:24:57,141 --> 00:24:58,141
Speaker 4: to get people to do.

521
00:24:58,101 --> 00:24:58,782
Speaker 1: What he wants.

522
00:24:59,462 --> 00:25:01,901
Speaker 4: And there are so many things that have to happen

523
00:25:01,942 --> 00:25:04,581
Speaker 4: at this point. And of course, while this is a

524
00:25:04,621 --> 00:25:07,741
Speaker 4: moment of triumph for Donald Trump and a moment of

525
00:25:07,782 --> 00:25:10,181
Speaker 4: celebration for the region and the world world, we have

526
00:25:10,341 --> 00:25:14,262
Speaker 4: to acknowledge that seventy thousand people or thereabouts have died

527
00:25:14,542 --> 00:25:15,461
Speaker 4: in this conflict.

528
00:25:15,861 --> 00:25:18,381
Speaker 1: That's why it's so important that the ceasefire has to hold.

529
00:25:20,581 --> 00:25:23,502
Speaker 2: In a moment, I am going to share the four

530
00:25:23,821 --> 00:25:26,861
Speaker 2: lines I learned this week to get you through any

531
00:25:26,942 --> 00:25:28,141
Speaker 2: stressful situation.

532
00:25:28,982 --> 00:25:32,942
Speaker 3: Want unlimited out loud access, We drop episodes every Tuesday

533
00:25:32,982 --> 00:25:37,181
Speaker 3: and Thursday exclusively for Mum and MAYA subscribers. Follow the

534
00:25:37,222 --> 00:25:39,102
Speaker 3: link in the show notes to get us in your

535
00:25:39,141 --> 00:25:41,941
Speaker 3: ears five days a week. And a huge thank you

536
00:25:42,101 --> 00:25:43,581
Speaker 3: to all our current subscribers.

537
00:25:49,462 --> 00:25:52,582
Speaker 4: A comedian hurt my feelings recently. Oh can I tell

538
00:25:52,581 --> 00:25:53,221
Speaker 4: you what happened?

539
00:25:53,381 --> 00:25:53,581
Speaker 3: Yes?

540
00:25:54,262 --> 00:25:58,502
Speaker 4: So my greatest fear in life is audience participation. Oh

541
00:25:58,581 --> 00:26:00,341
Speaker 4: me too, greatest fear? What is it?

542
00:26:00,381 --> 00:26:02,581
Speaker 3: Because we're all happy to stand on stage, but I

543
00:26:02,581 --> 00:26:04,862
Speaker 3: would never ask a question and I would never put

544
00:26:04,861 --> 00:26:06,661
Speaker 3: my hand up to go. I'll go on stage and

545
00:26:06,702 --> 00:26:09,341
Speaker 3: be a volunteer. The bravery involved in that.

546
00:26:09,542 --> 00:26:10,181
Speaker 2: I know who would?

547
00:26:10,821 --> 00:26:14,702
Speaker 1: Yes, friend, Oh, we love it.

548
00:26:14,821 --> 00:26:17,142
Speaker 2: He goes to any comedy show and stuff pretty much

549
00:26:17,141 --> 00:26:20,022
Speaker 2: for the T shirt like pick me anyway. But I

550
00:26:20,022 --> 00:26:22,462
Speaker 2: can acknowledge that most of us.

551
00:26:23,861 --> 00:26:26,861
Speaker 4: We're with you. It's why I'm scared of stand up comedy.

552
00:26:27,262 --> 00:26:30,102
Speaker 4: But my partner enjoys a bit of stand up comedy.

553
00:26:30,462 --> 00:26:33,382
Speaker 4: And he recently was in Los Angeles and he went

554
00:26:33,422 --> 00:26:36,542
Speaker 4: to the world Famous Comedy Store in West Hollywood, which

555
00:26:36,581 --> 00:26:39,982
Speaker 4: is in fact world famous and everyone who's everyone has

556
00:26:40,022 --> 00:26:42,942
Speaker 4: performed there. On the night he was there, Mark Maron

557
00:26:42,982 --> 00:26:46,702
Speaker 4: and Ali Wong did set no Bingie Wow, and then

558
00:26:46,821 --> 00:26:49,141
Speaker 4: at the very end of the night, a man named

559
00:26:49,302 --> 00:26:52,941
Speaker 4: Don Barris stood up. He is Jimmy Kimmel's warm up

560
00:26:53,022 --> 00:26:55,941
Speaker 4: act on his TV show, but I'd never heard of

561
00:26:56,022 --> 00:26:58,661
Speaker 4: him before. He stood up, was doing a bit of

562
00:26:58,702 --> 00:27:03,302
Speaker 4: crowd work, and he pointed at my partner and said,

563
00:27:03,661 --> 00:27:05,821
Speaker 4: what was it like to wake up this morning and

564
00:27:05,901 --> 00:27:07,821
Speaker 4: think I'm going to put on the ugliest shirt in

565
00:27:07,821 --> 00:27:11,981
Speaker 4: the world. So I found out about this not because

566
00:27:12,022 --> 00:27:14,542
Speaker 4: he called me in tears immediately, which is what.

567
00:27:14,422 --> 00:27:17,222
Speaker 1: I would have done. I found out about it weeks

568
00:27:17,341 --> 00:27:20,101
Speaker 1: later when we were getting.

569
00:27:19,861 --> 00:27:21,941
Speaker 4: Dressed in the morning and he turns to me and says,

570
00:27:22,022 --> 00:27:24,341
Speaker 4: what do you think of the shirt? And I said, oh, well,

571
00:27:24,381 --> 00:27:27,661
Speaker 4: I like it. I gave it to you and he said, well,

572
00:27:27,702 --> 00:27:30,341
Speaker 4: a comedian didn't like it, and then told me the story.

573
00:27:30,502 --> 00:27:33,861
Speaker 2: So the comedian dissed you because you chose the shirt.

574
00:27:33,982 --> 00:27:36,782
Speaker 4: This is why he had my feelings. I was devastated.

575
00:27:36,861 --> 00:27:39,341
Speaker 4: I'm not going to lie. I'm still carrying it around

576
00:27:39,341 --> 00:27:39,862
Speaker 4: a little bit.

577
00:27:40,661 --> 00:27:42,222
Speaker 1: Sorry. You have to explain to us what the shirt

578
00:27:42,262 --> 00:27:44,341
Speaker 1: looks like. I mean, I think it's a nice show.

579
00:27:44,542 --> 00:27:46,942
Speaker 4: It's one of those like fake rugby jerseys, so it's

580
00:27:46,942 --> 00:27:48,581
Speaker 4: not like got a name of a team on it,

581
00:27:48,621 --> 00:27:49,142
Speaker 4: but it's.

582
00:27:49,022 --> 00:27:53,101
Speaker 3: Very commendance like. It's got a color exactly white color.

583
00:27:53,462 --> 00:27:54,101
Speaker 1: A white collar.

584
00:27:54,422 --> 00:27:55,941
Speaker 4: It's got a sort of I thought it was a

585
00:27:56,061 --> 00:28:00,982
Speaker 4: very Iberian influenced color scheme of reds and vibrant yellows,

586
00:28:01,022 --> 00:28:03,542
Speaker 4: which I thought would really play off my partner's olive

587
00:28:03,581 --> 00:28:04,581
Speaker 4: skin very nicely.

588
00:28:05,302 --> 00:28:06,061
Speaker 1: And look, I know.

589
00:28:06,061 --> 00:28:08,581
Speaker 4: I'm not great at clothes. I don't pretend to be

590
00:28:08,621 --> 00:28:11,261
Speaker 4: great at clothes. But I had bought that as an

591
00:28:11,262 --> 00:28:13,262
Speaker 4: act of love, as a gesture of love, and I

592
00:28:13,381 --> 00:28:14,101
Speaker 4: thought it through.

593
00:28:14,222 --> 00:28:18,142
Speaker 1: And then to have this comedian shit on my clothing choices,

594
00:28:18,262 --> 00:28:18,861
Speaker 1: it's stung.

595
00:28:19,061 --> 00:28:19,941
Speaker 2: That is so funny.

596
00:28:19,942 --> 00:28:23,662
Speaker 3: Can I ask if Johnny your husbands has he worn

597
00:28:23,702 --> 00:28:24,101
Speaker 3: it since?

598
00:28:24,422 --> 00:28:24,582
Speaker 2: Oh?

599
00:28:24,661 --> 00:28:25,302
Speaker 1: Absolutely.

600
00:28:25,702 --> 00:28:27,581
Speaker 4: The point of him bringing it up with me was

601
00:28:27,621 --> 00:28:29,821
Speaker 4: not that it bothered him that the comedian said this.

602
00:28:30,182 --> 00:28:31,741
Speaker 4: The point of him bringing it up was that it

603
00:28:31,821 --> 00:28:34,181
Speaker 4: was genuinely confusing to him that a shirt that he

604
00:28:34,302 --> 00:28:38,862
Speaker 4: quite liked was being described as ugly, Because to him,

605
00:28:39,382 --> 00:28:41,902
Speaker 4: with the confidence of a man who enjoys crowd work,

606
00:28:41,982 --> 00:28:44,022
Speaker 4: he just thought, oh, that's confusing.

607
00:28:44,182 --> 00:28:46,582
Speaker 1: I like this shirt. That comedian doesn't like it.

608
00:28:46,702 --> 00:28:49,622
Speaker 2: The thing is so great about that story, and maybe

609
00:28:49,702 --> 00:28:52,382
Speaker 2: let's be generous. Maybe the comedian just does that gag

610
00:28:52,462 --> 00:28:54,221
Speaker 2: every night and just picks anyone and he's not.

611
00:28:54,222 --> 00:28:56,622
Speaker 1: Really, but he's still got to pick someone.

612
00:28:56,661 --> 00:28:58,902
Speaker 2: And you don't want to be that person. But as

613
00:28:58,942 --> 00:29:01,422
Speaker 2: you said, how you would react, and I would represent

614
00:29:01,462 --> 00:29:04,902
Speaker 2: for most women I know, they could never They could

615
00:29:04,982 --> 00:29:07,702
Speaker 2: never wear that shirt again, like that shit has now

616
00:29:07,822 --> 00:29:12,382
Speaker 2: been tainted. What other people think of your clothes. It

617
00:29:12,422 --> 00:29:16,382
Speaker 2: says something about your psyche or your past everything.

618
00:29:16,542 --> 00:29:18,102
Speaker 4: When he asked me what I thought of the shirt,

619
00:29:18,102 --> 00:29:19,342
Speaker 4: and I said I like it, and then he told

620
00:29:19,382 --> 00:29:19,822
Speaker 4: me the story.

621
00:29:19,862 --> 00:29:22,102
Speaker 1: He then proceeded to wear the shirt that day.

622
00:29:22,382 --> 00:29:25,462
Speaker 3: I think I've got a bit of Johnny. I reckon that. Yeah,

623
00:29:25,622 --> 00:29:28,062
Speaker 3: I reckon. If I looked at it and went I

624
00:29:28,222 --> 00:29:30,422
Speaker 3: like it, then I think I'd put on the shirt

625
00:29:30,462 --> 00:29:31,302
Speaker 3: and go about my day.

626
00:29:31,302 --> 00:29:33,181
Speaker 2: Because I just tell you often that she doesn't like

627
00:29:33,222 --> 00:29:33,661
Speaker 2: your clothes.

628
00:29:33,742 --> 00:29:37,902
Speaker 3: Yeah, I just go, No one's really thinking that much

629
00:29:37,942 --> 00:29:40,461
Speaker 3: about me, And if it's making me feel good, then

630
00:29:40,502 --> 00:29:41,222
Speaker 3: I don't really care.

631
00:29:41,342 --> 00:29:43,421
Speaker 4: Mia once told me she didn't like my shirt. It

632
00:29:43,542 --> 00:29:46,942
Speaker 4: was a short sleeved linen shirt and she said that

633
00:29:47,022 --> 00:29:48,142
Speaker 4: it wasn't a good look on me.

634
00:29:48,422 --> 00:29:50,702
Speaker 1: She said that with love, not like this awful comedian.

635
00:29:50,782 --> 00:29:52,062
Speaker 1: But I never wore the shirt.

636
00:29:51,822 --> 00:29:55,462
Speaker 2: Again, and I drove that shirt immediately. The Vinies actually

637
00:29:55,502 --> 00:29:58,222
Speaker 2: exactly what I gave it to them and said, set

638
00:29:58,222 --> 00:30:01,702
Speaker 2: this free. Don't tell anyone what me a freaking said

639
00:30:01,742 --> 00:30:04,062
Speaker 2: about it? Is it okay to take the piss out

640
00:30:04,062 --> 00:30:05,302
Speaker 2: of people's clothes?

641
00:30:05,422 --> 00:30:05,542
Speaker 3: Like?

642
00:30:06,182 --> 00:30:08,221
Speaker 4: Well, that's what I wanted to bring to you today

643
00:30:08,302 --> 00:30:10,542
Speaker 4: because there was an article that Sit Harold this morning

644
00:30:11,142 --> 00:30:14,822
Speaker 4: by Chris Harrison. It was titled if you can call

645
00:30:14,902 --> 00:30:17,022
Speaker 4: me bald, I can call you fat.

646
00:30:18,142 --> 00:30:18,582
Speaker 1: Okay.

647
00:30:18,822 --> 00:30:22,021
Speaker 4: He makes the point that in our very PC world,

648
00:30:22,062 --> 00:30:25,782
Speaker 4: as he puts it, baldness is still deemed acceptable for ridicule.

649
00:30:25,902 --> 00:30:27,661
Speaker 4: And he says, why is that Because it's not like

650
00:30:27,742 --> 00:30:29,062
Speaker 4: men can control.

651
00:30:28,661 --> 00:30:30,182
Speaker 1: Whether or not they're bald.

652
00:30:30,542 --> 00:30:33,622
Speaker 4: And I wonder if that's the issue, Because you can

653
00:30:33,622 --> 00:30:36,502
Speaker 4: control what clothes you put on, you cannot control what

654
00:30:36,622 --> 00:30:37,382
Speaker 4: is happening on.

655
00:30:37,302 --> 00:30:40,462
Speaker 1: Your head with your hair. No bus is that the line?

656
00:30:40,661 --> 00:30:45,062
Speaker 2: That's true? However? And I know how really painful hair

657
00:30:45,062 --> 00:30:47,862
Speaker 2: loss is for men and women, but more common for

658
00:30:47,942 --> 00:30:50,782
Speaker 2: men and a more common side effective eating. And it

659
00:30:50,822 --> 00:30:53,542
Speaker 2: can be devastating, you know, it can be absolutely devastating

660
00:30:53,542 --> 00:30:56,421
Speaker 2: to confidence. But it's true that that could be a line.

661
00:30:56,422 --> 00:30:58,982
Speaker 2: But then in this day and age, and he goes

662
00:30:59,022 --> 00:31:02,582
Speaker 2: into this, Chris Harrison in this article, Yes, the baldness

663
00:31:02,622 --> 00:31:04,582
Speaker 2: is happening, but you do have choices about what to

664
00:31:04,622 --> 00:31:06,662
Speaker 2: do about it, just as you could say for all

665
00:31:06,702 --> 00:31:09,422
Speaker 2: of us. But women get this pressure more. The wrinkles

666
00:31:09,422 --> 00:31:11,701
Speaker 2: are happening, but you now have a whole lot of

667
00:31:11,782 --> 00:31:13,622
Speaker 2: choices about what to do about them, you know what

668
00:31:13,661 --> 00:31:17,342
Speaker 2: I mean. So there makes feel so much worse. So yeah, yeah,

669
00:31:17,462 --> 00:31:20,062
Speaker 2: there's still judgment attached then, because it's kind of like, oh,

670
00:31:20,142 --> 00:31:22,502
Speaker 2: you don't see it because choice, buddy, you know what

671
00:31:22,542 --> 00:31:22,701
Speaker 2: I mean.

672
00:31:22,702 --> 00:31:24,342
Speaker 3: And it's like, maybe I should tell you so that

673
00:31:24,462 --> 00:31:27,421
Speaker 3: you know that there are treatments that would fix.

674
00:31:27,182 --> 00:31:29,661
Speaker 2: Your eye exactly like your wrinkles. You don't have to

675
00:31:29,702 --> 00:31:32,302
Speaker 2: wear those on your face. Have you heard about injections?

676
00:31:32,422 --> 00:31:36,062
Speaker 3: There's this social irritation with people who So the big

677
00:31:36,062 --> 00:31:38,662
Speaker 3: one of the last week or two has been Rafael Nadal,

678
00:31:38,742 --> 00:31:42,102
Speaker 3: who is the tennis player who has been experiencing hair

679
00:31:42,142 --> 00:31:45,542
Speaker 3: loss since his twenties. Very handsome and early in his

680
00:31:45,582 --> 00:31:48,262
Speaker 3: career he had long, luscious, thick hair.

681
00:31:48,342 --> 00:31:51,262
Speaker 1: He would look lovely in the rugby shirt but oh.

682
00:31:51,062 --> 00:31:53,981
Speaker 3: My goodness, it was made for him. And just recently

683
00:31:53,982 --> 00:31:56,262
Speaker 3: and images come up of him posing with a fan

684
00:31:56,342 --> 00:32:00,262
Speaker 3: smiling and his hair loss. People have commented and just said,

685
00:32:00,302 --> 00:32:02,222
Speaker 3: you need to get to Turkey. You need to get

686
00:32:02,222 --> 00:32:06,062
Speaker 3: those hair transplants. Like people are being so mean to him.

687
00:32:06,102 --> 00:32:09,502
Speaker 3: The irony is that reportedly he has had two treatments

688
00:32:09,742 --> 00:32:13,421
Speaker 3: to try and salvage what hair he has left. But

689
00:32:13,462 --> 00:32:16,182
Speaker 3: people's irritation is like, how can you be so rich

690
00:32:16,822 --> 00:32:19,261
Speaker 3: and not have this sorted? And if you're not going

691
00:32:19,342 --> 00:32:21,062
Speaker 3: to sort it, then shave your head.

692
00:32:21,262 --> 00:32:22,142
Speaker 2: I don't want to look at it.

693
00:32:22,182 --> 00:32:23,222
Speaker 3: I don't want to look at it.

694
00:32:23,382 --> 00:32:23,582
Speaker 4: You know.

695
00:32:23,661 --> 00:32:26,622
Speaker 2: It's interesting because when I first read this article, I

696
00:32:26,742 --> 00:32:29,262
Speaker 2: thought I would never take the piss out of a

697
00:32:29,262 --> 00:32:31,142
Speaker 2: boarding man. I thought that's a terrible thing to do

698
00:32:31,182 --> 00:32:34,822
Speaker 2: it same and then I thought about things I may

699
00:32:34,862 --> 00:32:38,502
Speaker 2: have said about Princess William and Harry over the years,

700
00:32:39,102 --> 00:32:45,382
Speaker 2: particularly William increasingly Harry, that are ungenerous because to the

701
00:32:45,422 --> 00:32:48,302
Speaker 2: point Chris Harrison is making in this article, there is

702
00:32:48,422 --> 00:32:53,302
Speaker 2: pleasure somehow in mocking a man. Prince William has been

703
00:32:53,302 --> 00:32:55,221
Speaker 2: copying shit about the fact that his hairline has been

704
00:32:55,222 --> 00:32:57,022
Speaker 2: receiving for a very long time. I think if Prince

705
00:32:57,062 --> 00:32:58,941
Speaker 2: Harry makes a joke about it in his book, I

706
00:32:58,982 --> 00:33:00,902
Speaker 2: was that to say, yeah, I mean he should he

707
00:33:00,942 --> 00:33:03,222
Speaker 2: wouldn't be laughing now because he's definitely facing some of

708
00:33:03,262 --> 00:33:05,622
Speaker 2: the same stuff. But he made a joke about it

709
00:33:05,661 --> 00:33:09,502
Speaker 2: in his book. Is there's something that's kind of open

710
00:33:09,862 --> 00:33:12,542
Speaker 2: and a little bit suddenly, Do I want to say

711
00:33:12,582 --> 00:33:15,502
Speaker 2: I'm masculating? And I definitely, when I think about it,

712
00:33:15,982 --> 00:33:19,701
Speaker 2: probably have made those jokes about Prince William or a

713
00:33:19,782 --> 00:33:21,941
Speaker 2: rich and powerful man who's losing his hair, almost like

714
00:33:22,622 --> 00:33:24,382
Speaker 2: and I am not proud of this, almost like ha,

715
00:33:24,782 --> 00:33:26,782
Speaker 2: you've got it all, but not that, And that is

716
00:33:26,902 --> 00:33:30,181
Speaker 2: ugly right in me, I mean, not in them. I

717
00:33:30,982 --> 00:33:32,422
Speaker 2: don't mean that they're ugly. Oh my god.

718
00:33:34,182 --> 00:33:37,022
Speaker 4: Chris Harrison writes, people assume making fun of the ball

719
00:33:37,062 --> 00:33:39,862
Speaker 4: guy is harmless, a punchline with no real victim.

720
00:33:39,902 --> 00:33:42,022
Speaker 1: That's true, by the way. I think that's absolutely true.

721
00:33:42,262 --> 00:33:45,582
Speaker 1: They think baldness invites less emotional vulnerability than say a

722
00:33:45,661 --> 00:33:48,902
Speaker 1: joke about weight or appearance, But such assumptions ignore the

723
00:33:48,942 --> 00:33:52,782
Speaker 1: deep personal impact hair loss can have on self esteem, identity,

724
00:33:52,902 --> 00:33:55,421
Speaker 1: and even perceptions of aging or viriality.

725
00:33:55,622 --> 00:34:00,102
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that's totally a thing. However, I think

726
00:34:00,182 --> 00:34:05,062
Speaker 3: that the comparison to weight is imperfect. Yeah, I think

727
00:34:05,102 --> 00:34:09,261
Speaker 3: that when it comes to men, and baldness. I think

728
00:34:09,542 --> 00:34:11,062
Speaker 3: most people know you wouldn't comment.

729
00:34:11,222 --> 00:34:13,902
Speaker 2: I hope that well, you know, I bet you that

730
00:34:14,062 --> 00:34:15,622
Speaker 2: men get a lot of why don't you just shave

731
00:34:15,661 --> 00:34:19,741
Speaker 2: it like a lot of masquerading as you know, in

732
00:34:19,781 --> 00:34:21,462
Speaker 2: the same way that they might say you can do

733
00:34:21,502 --> 00:34:25,582
Speaker 2: something about those wrinkles, Holly, they might say, you know,

734
00:34:25,781 --> 00:34:27,822
Speaker 2: you should just shave it off. People have very strong

735
00:34:27,862 --> 00:34:30,222
Speaker 2: feelings about that, don't they like, yeah, are you holding

736
00:34:30,261 --> 00:34:30,981
Speaker 2: onto that hair?

737
00:34:31,142 --> 00:34:34,341
Speaker 3: I think the difference is if you looked in most boardrooms,

738
00:34:34,462 --> 00:34:37,221
Speaker 3: if you looked at politicians, if you looked at who

739
00:34:37,261 --> 00:34:40,622
Speaker 3: is currently leading our country, you'd find examples of men

740
00:34:40,781 --> 00:34:41,941
Speaker 3: who don't have a lot of hair.

741
00:34:42,261 --> 00:34:43,341
Speaker 2: So you think it's punching off.

742
00:34:43,422 --> 00:34:43,982
Speaker 4: I think it's.

743
00:34:43,862 --> 00:34:47,902
Speaker 3: Power, and I think that that's why it feels different.

744
00:34:48,102 --> 00:34:50,861
Speaker 3: That doesn't mean it's so kay. And I also thought

745
00:34:50,862 --> 00:34:54,502
Speaker 3: that there are heaps of examples Vin Diesel, Andre Agassi,

746
00:34:54,701 --> 00:34:59,302
Speaker 3: Joe Rogan. He's one of the most powerful masculine coded

747
00:34:59,542 --> 00:35:01,622
Speaker 3: men in our culture and he doesn't have any hair.

748
00:35:01,942 --> 00:35:04,942
Speaker 3: But I also do see how it can be colored.

749
00:35:05,022 --> 00:35:07,902
Speaker 3: Is almost the buffoon, and that's what so Homer Simpson

750
00:35:08,261 --> 00:35:11,502
Speaker 3: was like the guy with that it's like the suburban dad.

751
00:35:11,862 --> 00:35:15,462
Speaker 3: And I understand that if you have hang ups about aging,

752
00:35:15,542 --> 00:35:17,741
Speaker 3: that can be really confronting to kind of look in

753
00:35:17,741 --> 00:35:19,582
Speaker 3: the mirror and go, oh, my goodness, I'm looking like

754
00:35:19,622 --> 00:35:19,941
Speaker 3: my father.

755
00:35:20,102 --> 00:35:21,902
Speaker 4: Well, and you're making me realize a bit of a

756
00:35:21,942 --> 00:35:25,381
Speaker 4: phenomenon that I've noticed, which is when you're in a

757
00:35:25,422 --> 00:35:29,542
Speaker 4: group with a man who is bald, more often than not,

758
00:35:30,142 --> 00:35:34,661
Speaker 4: he will make a joke drawing attention to it. You've

759
00:35:34,701 --> 00:35:35,701
Speaker 4: been in a moment like.

760
00:35:35,741 --> 00:35:39,542
Speaker 2: Death, but that's quite a female defensively where we'll do that.

761
00:35:39,622 --> 00:35:41,461
Speaker 2: You know, will be like, oh, I know I look

762
00:35:41,622 --> 00:35:42,302
Speaker 2: like this today.

763
00:35:42,661 --> 00:35:44,381
Speaker 1: Well, now I understand why they're doing it.

764
00:35:44,382 --> 00:35:47,221
Speaker 4: They're doing it because it is actually hurtful to have

765
00:35:47,302 --> 00:35:50,142
Speaker 4: those jokes made, and yet they're expected to shrug them off.

766
00:35:50,221 --> 00:35:53,341
Speaker 4: So in an effort to gain control over the situation

767
00:35:53,622 --> 00:35:56,661
Speaker 4: and call it out before anyone else does, that's.

768
00:35:56,462 --> 00:35:57,181
Speaker 1: Why they do it.

769
00:35:57,261 --> 00:35:59,941
Speaker 2: What about amongst friends, We've talked about this before, that

770
00:35:59,942 --> 00:36:03,862
Speaker 2: that joshing and taking the peace culture, which is enormous

771
00:36:03,902 --> 00:36:08,021
Speaker 2: among certainly Australian men, I would say definitely englishmen too.

772
00:36:08,582 --> 00:36:10,582
Speaker 2: The sign of love is how much shit you give

773
00:36:10,622 --> 00:36:13,741
Speaker 2: each other, and it may sting but that's part of it.

774
00:36:14,342 --> 00:36:16,821
Speaker 2: And we've said that women we have a slightly more

775
00:36:16,862 --> 00:36:20,622
Speaker 2: complicated situation with that because we often know that it's pointed,

776
00:36:20,822 --> 00:36:23,741
Speaker 2: or we know that our worth and verticomas is more

777
00:36:23,781 --> 00:36:26,102
Speaker 2: tied to our appearance, so it hurts more. But is

778
00:36:26,102 --> 00:36:29,421
Speaker 2: it okay within a friend group to take the piss

779
00:36:29,462 --> 00:36:30,702
Speaker 2: out of each other about aging?

780
00:36:30,982 --> 00:36:33,301
Speaker 3: I still wouldn't my closest male friends. There is no

781
00:36:33,302 --> 00:36:35,181
Speaker 3: way I would make a joke about them losing their hair.

782
00:36:35,261 --> 00:36:38,542
Speaker 3: It is too sensitive. I can tell from a mile away.

783
00:36:38,741 --> 00:36:41,381
Speaker 3: And maybe it's my age group as well, that the

784
00:36:41,422 --> 00:36:43,462
Speaker 3: men that I know are in the early stages of it.

785
00:36:43,781 --> 00:36:46,781
Speaker 3: And this guy says balding is a lot harder than

786
00:36:46,822 --> 00:36:50,301
Speaker 3: being bald, like, that's a really awkward process. I think

787
00:36:50,342 --> 00:36:54,102
Speaker 3: any comment about someone's appearance that makes them feel conspicuous

788
00:36:54,142 --> 00:36:57,022
Speaker 3: and visible, they can joke about it. You can't. I

789
00:36:57,062 --> 00:36:59,582
Speaker 3: can tell anything I want about how big I am,

790
00:37:00,102 --> 00:37:02,382
Speaker 3: but I just reckon. You don't know how that person

791
00:37:02,422 --> 00:37:04,702
Speaker 3: is today. You don't know how many comments they've got.

792
00:37:04,822 --> 00:37:07,582
Speaker 3: I just wouldn't. I think that's a good rule. And

793
00:37:07,622 --> 00:37:10,302
Speaker 3: this guy was saying he's in meetings people are joking

794
00:37:10,302 --> 00:37:13,021
Speaker 3: about Oh all the lights went off, like something about

795
00:37:13,022 --> 00:37:15,661
Speaker 3: his bald head and solar panels. Like in the workplace,

796
00:37:15,701 --> 00:37:16,941
Speaker 3: you just go drop it.

797
00:37:17,302 --> 00:37:19,902
Speaker 4: Yeah, I wonder if the female equivalent is gray hair,

798
00:37:20,062 --> 00:37:25,022
Speaker 4: because they're both like visible signs of aging on top

799
00:37:25,102 --> 00:37:28,661
Speaker 4: of your head, and you would never casually point out

800
00:37:28,701 --> 00:37:31,301
Speaker 4: that a woman had gray hair, even a friend of yours.

801
00:37:31,382 --> 00:37:33,542
Speaker 4: I don't think. I think we kind of are agreeing

802
00:37:33,582 --> 00:37:36,382
Speaker 4: that we're not talking about that. But on the punching

803
00:37:36,462 --> 00:37:40,582
Speaker 4: up thing. Carolina Donna, who who hosts Sentimental Garbage that podcast.

804
00:37:41,062 --> 00:37:44,062
Speaker 4: She was talking in the context of Taylor Swift's new album,

805
00:37:44,181 --> 00:37:47,502
Speaker 4: and Taylor Swift has been criticized for punching down in

806
00:37:47,542 --> 00:37:50,142
Speaker 4: a song that people have interpreted as a disk track

807
00:37:50,622 --> 00:37:54,261
Speaker 4: targeting Charlie XCX. She says she doesn't believe in the

808
00:37:54,261 --> 00:37:56,902
Speaker 4: concept of punching down or punching up in humor. She

809
00:37:57,022 --> 00:38:00,341
Speaker 4: says that the only real test of whether a joke

810
00:38:00,462 --> 00:38:03,861
Speaker 4: is okay is if it lands if it's funny. So

811
00:38:04,022 --> 00:38:06,341
Speaker 4: I just want to ask in this case.

812
00:38:06,302 --> 00:38:09,342
Speaker 2: I don't buy that because the question of if it's funny.

813
00:38:09,102 --> 00:38:11,382
Speaker 3: Can be fun everyone in the room except the person who.

814
00:38:11,502 --> 00:38:15,582
Speaker 2: Who was a very subjective question, you know, everyone else

815
00:38:15,622 --> 00:38:17,861
Speaker 2: might think that song is hilarious about Charlie XX, or

816
00:38:17,862 --> 00:38:21,181
Speaker 2: that the ball joke is great. But if he doesn't, yeah.

817
00:38:21,022 --> 00:38:23,382
Speaker 4: I guess bringing it back to the shirt incident that

818
00:38:23,502 --> 00:38:26,661
Speaker 4: inspired this, yes, that's not a very funny joke.

819
00:38:26,902 --> 00:38:30,222
Speaker 3: I don't think it's funny. I really cringe at crowd

820
00:38:30,221 --> 00:38:32,142
Speaker 3: work for that exact reason that I just think. I

821
00:38:32,221 --> 00:38:36,421
Speaker 3: do not find anything that embarrasses someone funny. And maybe

822
00:38:36,422 --> 00:38:38,422
Speaker 3: it's a female thing that I just go. I've had

823
00:38:38,502 --> 00:38:40,942
Speaker 3: enough experiences where I've felt mocked or made fun of,

824
00:38:41,062 --> 00:38:43,982
Speaker 3: in conspicuous or conspicuous, and I just want to be invisible.

825
00:38:44,022 --> 00:38:46,702
Speaker 2: Or the reason they do it now and obviously comedians

826
00:38:46,741 --> 00:38:48,341
Speaker 2: have always done it, but the reason they do it

827
00:38:48,382 --> 00:38:50,022
Speaker 2: now and it is because it's the bit you can

828
00:38:50,102 --> 00:38:52,941
Speaker 2: put on social because you've got your set, and your

829
00:38:52,942 --> 00:38:55,542
Speaker 2: sets the same every night mostly right. So if I

830
00:38:55,622 --> 00:38:59,021
Speaker 2: go and see Mark Maron, he's worked out his hour

831
00:38:59,502 --> 00:39:01,301
Speaker 2: and he can't put that on social because then you're

832
00:39:01,302 --> 00:39:02,502
Speaker 2: not going to go and see him. But you can

833
00:39:02,542 --> 00:39:04,701
Speaker 2: put the crowd work bit on social over and over again.

834
00:39:04,781 --> 00:39:07,661
Speaker 2: So now it's become even more important and they've got

835
00:39:07,701 --> 00:39:08,622
Speaker 2: to walk that line.

836
00:39:08,781 --> 00:39:11,781
Speaker 4: We're going to pour a picture of the shirt that

837
00:39:11,942 --> 00:39:17,301
Speaker 4: I purchased for Johnny on Instagram and you can tell

838
00:39:17,342 --> 00:39:18,821
Speaker 4: me if I screwed up or not.

839
00:39:20,302 --> 00:39:22,181
Speaker 2: I want to leave us with a bit of wisdom

840
00:39:22,221 --> 00:39:24,582
Speaker 2: today and it's not my wisdom, but I've stolen it

841
00:39:24,781 --> 00:39:26,942
Speaker 2: and I am implementing it and I am handing it

842
00:39:26,982 --> 00:39:28,661
Speaker 2: around like Lolly's. Would you like to hear it?

843
00:39:28,822 --> 00:39:29,142
Speaker 3: Yes?

844
00:39:29,582 --> 00:39:31,382
Speaker 2: So, Amelia, I don't know if you mind me saying this.

845
00:39:31,542 --> 00:39:33,421
Speaker 2: So you had something big and important to do last night.

846
00:39:33,542 --> 00:39:33,861
Speaker 1: I did.

847
00:39:33,982 --> 00:39:34,502
Speaker 2: What did you do?

848
00:39:34,582 --> 00:39:37,462
Speaker 1: Test? I was one of the Boyer lecturers.

849
00:39:37,502 --> 00:39:40,701
Speaker 4: That's an ABC lecture series about the future of Australia.

850
00:39:41,022 --> 00:39:44,181
Speaker 2: That's no big deal, just the future of Australia with

851
00:39:44,382 --> 00:39:46,261
Speaker 2: like all the really big brains.

852
00:39:46,622 --> 00:39:47,662
Speaker 3: So where was it?

853
00:39:47,661 --> 00:39:51,142
Speaker 4: It was at the ABC studios. Johnny showed up in

854
00:39:51,382 --> 00:39:55,022
Speaker 4: a polo shirt, but not the I was relieved by

855
00:39:55,062 --> 00:39:57,901
Speaker 4: because otherwise Julia Baird, who was hosting.

856
00:39:59,542 --> 00:40:01,902
Speaker 2: Anyway, we were in the afternoon. Melia was prepping and

857
00:40:01,902 --> 00:40:03,942
Speaker 2: while I was sitting next to her, she was nervous.

858
00:40:03,942 --> 00:40:07,062
Speaker 2: We talked about being nervous and I immediately had to

859
00:40:07,062 --> 00:40:08,982
Speaker 2: pull out my phone to share something with it. I

860
00:40:09,022 --> 00:40:11,102
Speaker 2: had one of those moment's recently when you're listening to

861
00:40:11,102 --> 00:40:12,701
Speaker 2: something and I had to pull the car over to

862
00:40:12,741 --> 00:40:15,022
Speaker 2: make a note on my notes app. It was on

863
00:40:15,062 --> 00:40:18,622
Speaker 2: a podcast called wild Card, which is an interview show

864
00:40:18,822 --> 00:40:21,821
Speaker 2: hosted by this NPR journalist American called Rachel Martin, and

865
00:40:21,862 --> 00:40:24,861
Speaker 2: basically it's like you pull random cards and you answer

866
00:40:24,902 --> 00:40:27,542
Speaker 2: the questions on it. This one was with Selene Song.

867
00:40:27,622 --> 00:40:29,901
Speaker 2: She is a movie director. She is amazing. She made

868
00:40:29,902 --> 00:40:32,382
Speaker 2: Past Lives, which is one of my favorite films. She

869
00:40:32,462 --> 00:40:36,142
Speaker 2: also made Materialists, which is not but still she's very talented.

870
00:40:36,741 --> 00:40:39,301
Speaker 2: The last card that she pulled, the question was what

871
00:40:39,502 --> 00:40:44,022
Speaker 2: truth guides your life more than any other? And what

872
00:40:44,142 --> 00:40:47,062
Speaker 2: Selene's song then shared was like a mantra, like these

873
00:40:47,102 --> 00:40:51,102
Speaker 2: four lines that she herself had learnt from her professor

874
00:40:51,102 --> 00:40:55,342
Speaker 2: at Columbia or something like another big important person. Selene's

875
00:40:55,342 --> 00:40:58,102
Speaker 2: song describes them as the four rules for anything we

876
00:40:58,181 --> 00:41:00,861
Speaker 2: have to do as humans, Right, Okay, I had to

877
00:41:00,902 --> 00:41:03,181
Speaker 2: immediately put them down. So you're turning up to a

878
00:41:03,261 --> 00:41:06,022
Speaker 2: thing like a conversation with someone that you know is

879
00:41:06,062 --> 00:41:08,261
Speaker 2: going to be difficult, a meeting that might be confrontational,

880
00:41:08,462 --> 00:41:11,582
Speaker 2: something for work, boy lecture, or something more relatable in

881
00:41:11,622 --> 00:41:14,341
Speaker 2: your life that makes you nervous and worried, arguing with

882
00:41:14,382 --> 00:41:15,462
Speaker 2: your landlord, whatever it is.

883
00:41:15,741 --> 00:41:16,782
Speaker 1: The White Merchant.

884
00:41:17,221 --> 00:41:22,181
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, yes, Number one show up Now I think

885
00:41:22,221 --> 00:41:23,741
Speaker 2: what they mean by show up we all know in

886
00:41:23,862 --> 00:41:27,501
Speaker 2: common parlance now that means be present, be there right.

887
00:41:28,102 --> 00:41:32,421
Speaker 2: Number two, pay attention. This is my favorite. Number three

888
00:41:32,701 --> 00:41:36,901
Speaker 2: speak from the heart, and number four the hardest, Have

889
00:41:37,102 --> 00:41:38,822
Speaker 2: no expectations.

890
00:41:39,822 --> 00:41:41,582
Speaker 1: So I like that.

891
00:41:41,741 --> 00:41:45,341
Speaker 2: I loved it so much because whenever you have to

892
00:41:45,342 --> 00:41:47,742
Speaker 2: do anything that you're nervous about, or you've been thinking

893
00:41:47,741 --> 00:41:50,262
Speaker 2: about a lot, or that activates you in any way

894
00:41:50,741 --> 00:41:52,301
Speaker 2: in your mind, you always play out and this is

895
00:41:52,302 --> 00:41:53,902
Speaker 2: how it's going to go, and this is the outcome

896
00:41:53,942 --> 00:41:55,582
Speaker 2: I want, and all those things. And if you get

897
00:41:55,582 --> 00:41:57,701
Speaker 2: that outcome, you feel like you've been successful, and if

898
00:41:57,701 --> 00:42:00,102
Speaker 2: you don't get that outcome, you feel like you've failed.

899
00:42:00,382 --> 00:42:03,941
Speaker 2: And in reality, it's very unlikely that you affected whether

900
00:42:04,022 --> 00:42:05,701
Speaker 2: or not you've got that outcome. A whole lot of

901
00:42:05,701 --> 00:42:08,221
Speaker 2: different things will have affected that. So I love have

902
00:42:08,302 --> 00:42:11,102
Speaker 2: no expectations, although it's not a question the hardest one,

903
00:42:11,701 --> 00:42:16,102
Speaker 2: and I love pay attention because I think everything from

904
00:42:16,422 --> 00:42:19,142
Speaker 2: sitting down to do this show every day to having

905
00:42:19,142 --> 00:42:23,181
Speaker 2: a difficult conversation with my teenager. If I'm listening and

906
00:42:23,261 --> 00:42:25,942
Speaker 2: I'm really there and I'm paying attention and I'm not

907
00:42:26,022 --> 00:42:27,861
Speaker 2: thinking in my head, oh that thing I just said,

908
00:42:27,902 --> 00:42:30,142
Speaker 2: I shouldn't have said that thing, you know what I mean,

909
00:42:30,781 --> 00:42:34,582
Speaker 2: then I always the outcome is better every single time.

910
00:42:34,661 --> 00:42:36,661
Speaker 4: But every one of these was so helpful to me

911
00:42:36,741 --> 00:42:39,542
Speaker 4: because just take the first one. Show up sounds obvious,

912
00:42:40,022 --> 00:42:42,221
Speaker 4: but what that speaks to is this was a very

913
00:42:42,261 --> 00:42:44,861
Speaker 4: intimidating thing for me to do, and I had to

914
00:42:44,942 --> 00:42:48,982
Speaker 4: work through, uncharacteristically for me, some imposter syndrome around it.

915
00:42:49,342 --> 00:42:52,221
Speaker 1: But show up says you just got to show up.

916
00:42:52,462 --> 00:42:55,022
Speaker 4: Yeah, someone's going to show up, may as well be you,

917
00:42:55,181 --> 00:42:57,062
Speaker 4: And I found that really powerful as well.

918
00:42:57,542 --> 00:43:00,261
Speaker 2: Speak from the hearts quite hard because I think that

919
00:43:00,261 --> 00:43:03,261
Speaker 2: that's a vulnerability, you know. I like to sort of

920
00:43:03,261 --> 00:43:06,462
Speaker 2: say this is how I'm feeling, I guess or whatever

921
00:43:06,462 --> 00:43:09,382
Speaker 2: it is. But that also just means be authentic, really know.

922
00:43:09,862 --> 00:43:10,102
Speaker 4: Yeah.

923
00:43:10,142 --> 00:43:13,062
Speaker 3: I got a tip once from a performance psychologist which

924
00:43:13,102 --> 00:43:15,861
Speaker 3: was when you feel your brain start to wonder, which

925
00:43:15,902 --> 00:43:18,662
Speaker 3: happens whether you're on stage, sometimes when you're doing a speech,

926
00:43:18,741 --> 00:43:21,701
Speaker 3: sometimes when you're in an important meeting like focusing on

927
00:43:21,822 --> 00:43:24,142
Speaker 3: tiny little things like if I'm speaking to you holy

928
00:43:24,302 --> 00:43:26,102
Speaker 3: like even if you just have to go look at

929
00:43:26,102 --> 00:43:28,461
Speaker 3: their eyebrows, look at their blood, like take yourself back

930
00:43:28,502 --> 00:43:31,982
Speaker 3: into the moment in kind of like minuscule details that

931
00:43:32,062 --> 00:43:35,502
Speaker 3: should like reorient you to that moment. But little mantras

932
00:43:35,542 --> 00:43:37,022
Speaker 3: they make such a difference, don't they do.

933
00:43:37,142 --> 00:43:38,982
Speaker 2: So now this is on notes up in my phone.

934
00:43:38,982 --> 00:43:41,102
Speaker 2: I welcome you put on notes up in your phone

935
00:43:41,142 --> 00:43:41,862
Speaker 2: if you want it.

936
00:43:41,862 --> 00:43:42,822
Speaker 1: It was really helpful.

937
00:43:43,142 --> 00:43:45,381
Speaker 2: And I'm gonna see if it's going to change my life.

938
00:43:45,382 --> 00:43:46,902
Speaker 2: You know, I'm always looking for them that's going to

939
00:43:47,022 --> 00:43:47,742
Speaker 2: change my life.

940
00:43:48,622 --> 00:43:50,741
Speaker 3: Has changed my life. And I say, I felt nerves

941
00:43:50,781 --> 00:43:52,582
Speaker 3: the other day and I said, my mantrat, nerves went

942
00:43:52,982 --> 00:43:55,902
Speaker 3: excellence over perfection. I say that all the time myself.

943
00:43:56,502 --> 00:44:00,062
Speaker 2: That's it for today's show. A massive thank you to

944
00:44:00,142 --> 00:44:02,381
Speaker 2: all of you out louders for listening or maybe even

945
00:44:02,422 --> 00:44:04,741
Speaker 2: watching us on YouTube. Remember you can always do that.

946
00:44:05,261 --> 00:44:07,582
Speaker 2: And thank you, of course to our amazing team for

947
00:44:07,661 --> 00:44:09,942
Speaker 2: putting it together. Before we go, I want to tell

948
00:44:09,942 --> 00:44:13,662
Speaker 2: you about something else on tomorrow's subset. We are doing

949
00:44:13,661 --> 00:44:16,702
Speaker 2: this thing well, jesse M and I all answer the question,

950
00:44:17,542 --> 00:44:19,622
Speaker 2: what did you do yesterday, and I promise you in

951
00:44:19,622 --> 00:44:22,341
Speaker 2: the episode we explain why I'm asking this question, but

952
00:44:22,542 --> 00:44:24,421
Speaker 2: quite a lot of you have already answered it because

953
00:44:24,502 --> 00:44:26,582
Speaker 2: yesterday I jumped in the outluders Facebook group, which is

954
00:44:26,582 --> 00:44:29,261
Speaker 2: where we have conversations about the show, and I asked

955
00:44:29,261 --> 00:44:31,942
Speaker 2: the outlouders to tell me in three sentences is what

956
00:44:31,982 --> 00:44:35,741
Speaker 2: they did yesterday? And oh my god, the outlouders are

957
00:44:35,741 --> 00:44:37,941
Speaker 2: doing such interesting things. Not all of them. I mean,

958
00:44:37,982 --> 00:44:39,661
Speaker 2: some people are on holiday and they're having a great

959
00:44:39,661 --> 00:44:42,382
Speaker 2: time and that's nice, but also where they are what

960
00:44:42,502 --> 00:44:44,502
Speaker 2: they're doing. You have to go and look at this thread.

961
00:44:44,542 --> 00:44:45,742
Speaker 2: It is so great.

962
00:44:46,102 --> 00:44:47,702
Speaker 1: That's such a great prompt.

963
00:44:47,942 --> 00:44:51,462
Speaker 4: And hey, don't forget to be listening to Parenting out Loud,

964
00:44:51,502 --> 00:44:55,542
Speaker 4: which drops every week on a Saturday. This Saturday, we're

965
00:44:55,582 --> 00:44:58,462
Speaker 4: going to be asking how much would you pay for

966
00:44:58,502 --> 00:45:02,861
Speaker 4: the perfect baby name? And we tackle Halloween. Is it

967
00:45:02,902 --> 00:45:05,142
Speaker 4: bringing a sense of community or is it just a

968
00:45:05,221 --> 00:45:08,261
Speaker 4: punish for parents? Find it in its own feed by

969
00:45:08,261 --> 00:45:11,781
Speaker 4: searching Parenting out Loud and tap follow so you don't

970
00:45:11,822 --> 00:45:12,582
Speaker 4: miss an episode.

971
00:45:12,701 --> 00:45:14,622
Speaker 2: Jesse, you need two baby names? How much you need

972
00:45:14,701 --> 00:45:15,181
Speaker 2: to pay for them?

973
00:45:15,542 --> 00:45:17,181
Speaker 3: Well, you know, I'm just going with my f one,

974
00:45:17,382 --> 00:45:18,701
Speaker 3: Blando and Lewis there we go.

975
00:45:20,181 --> 00:45:25,981
Speaker 2: L goodbye, out loud eye. Shout out to any Mamma

976
00:45:26,062 --> 00:45:28,861
Speaker 2: Mia subscribers listening. If you love the show and you

977
00:45:28,942 --> 00:45:31,821
Speaker 2: want to support us, subscribing to Mamma Mia is the

978
00:45:31,982 --> 00:45:34,102
Speaker 2: very best way to do it. There's a link in

979
00:45:34,142 --> 00:45:35,261
Speaker 2: the episode description