WEBVTT - A Breast Pump, An Airport Lounge & The Detail You Probably Missed 0:00:10.622 --> 0:00:13.342 You're listening to a MoMA Mia podcast. 0:00:13.862 --> 0:00:17.182 Muma Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters 0:00:17.222 --> 0:00:18.741 that this podcast is recorded on. 0:00:19.021 --> 0:00:21.222 I've got something else to tell you that's upsetting. Your 0:00:21.222 --> 0:00:23.622 teeth keep growing as you age. And so I look 0:00:23.622 --> 0:00:26.382 at my kid's teeth and they look like little niblets, 0:00:26.542 --> 0:00:29.102 and they gorgeous little niblets. And then I see mine 0:00:29.101 --> 0:00:31.422 and they're just long in the tooth. 0:00:31.062 --> 0:00:33.142 Long in the tooth, long in the two. 0:00:33.742 --> 0:00:35.862 My teeth is a big enough. Look at a little 0:00:35.942 --> 0:00:38.982 kids teeth and they're just little niblets. They're so cute. 0:00:39.022 --> 0:00:41.022 I'm just all teeth. My whole face is just going 0:00:41.062 --> 0:00:41.462 to be teeth. 0:00:41.502 --> 0:00:43.822 And our noses keep growing and our ears keep growing. 0:00:45.502 --> 0:00:48.782 Welcome to mummya out Loud. It's what women are actually 0:00:48.822 --> 0:00:52.062 talking about on Wednesday, the seventeenth of September. 0:00:52.102 --> 0:00:55.542 I am Jesse Stevens, I'm still Mia Friedman, and I'm Amelia. 0:00:55.262 --> 0:00:58.542 Lester and here's what's on our agenda for today. 0:00:58.862 --> 0:01:01.622 A woman was told she couldn't pump breast milk in 0:01:01.662 --> 0:01:03.782 an airport lounge, and Maya. 0:01:03.662 --> 0:01:05.502 Has an unpopular opinion. 0:01:05.182 --> 0:01:06.142 That I'm going to change. 0:01:06.222 --> 0:01:07.142 I'm going to change that a. 0:01:07.062 --> 0:01:11.021 Bit very quickly, plus some candid admission about actor Bruce 0:01:11.021 --> 0:01:15.382 Willis and why his wife, Emma Heming Willis is facing criticism. 0:01:15.702 --> 0:01:17.662 I'm bringing a little bit of a news segment today 0:01:17.662 --> 0:01:21.222 called birth, death and Marriages, and I'm going to somehow 0:01:21.262 --> 0:01:24.462 manage to shoehorn in the fact that two very famous 0:01:24.462 --> 0:01:27.622 women went to Premiers this week wearing no pants. 0:01:27.902 --> 0:01:31.142 But first, in case you missed it, Donald Trump is 0:01:31.262 --> 0:01:34.702 a dobber. The ABC journalist John Lyons asked Trump yesterday 0:01:34.702 --> 0:01:37.142 about his business dealings and why he keeps making lots 0:01:37.142 --> 0:01:38.581 of money while he's president. 0:01:38.942 --> 0:01:39.702 Was this in person? 0:01:40.022 --> 0:01:42.062 It was in person on the White House lawn. Trump 0:01:42.142 --> 0:01:44.222 was about to go on his trip to the UK. 0:01:44.422 --> 0:01:46.262 He's so excited because he gets to ride in a 0:01:46.262 --> 0:01:49.222 horse drawn carriage with King Charles and stay at Windsor Castle. 0:01:49.382 --> 0:01:51.982 God were indulging him, so he was. 0:01:51.942 --> 0:01:54.142 Not happy to be interrupted on the way to his 0:01:54.262 --> 0:01:56.382 dream trip by John Lyons. But let's have a listen 0:01:56.382 --> 0:01:57.342 to what happened. 0:01:57.542 --> 0:02:01.982 Appropriate President Trump that a president should. 0:02:01.662 --> 0:02:04.582 Be engaged in so much prester's activity. 0:02:04.142 --> 0:02:06.422 Well, I'm really not. My kids are running the business 0:02:06.462 --> 0:02:08.302 and you know what the activity? 0:02:08.501 --> 0:02:11.702 Where are you from from the Australian Broad Catholic and 0:02:12.862 --> 0:02:13.542 the Australias. 0:02:13.542 --> 0:02:16.942 You're hurting Australia right in my opinion, you are hurting 0:02:16.942 --> 0:02:19.862 Australia very much right now. But they want to get 0:02:19.862 --> 0:02:20.422 along with me. 0:02:20.582 --> 0:02:23.181 You know, you're your leader is coming over to see 0:02:23.222 --> 0:02:25.341 me very so I'm going to tell them about you. 0:02:25.342 --> 0:02:32.302 You said a very bad tale in return. 0:02:33.222 --> 0:02:37.222 Yes, that was pointing his finger at John Lyons and saying. 0:02:37.102 --> 0:02:39.702 Quiet, I'm going to try that with Jesse sometimes. 0:02:39.862 --> 0:02:42.222 The reason I love this is because it highlighted for 0:02:42.302 --> 0:02:44.982 me a cultural difference between Australia and the US. When 0:02:44.982 --> 0:02:47.542 my kids started school here last year in Australia after 0:02:47.582 --> 0:02:49.982 having moved from the US, they were immediately told not 0:02:50.102 --> 0:02:52.542 to dob dollary. 0:02:52.142 --> 0:02:54.662 Episodes about it. You cannot dob it is like the 0:02:54.782 --> 0:02:55.782 number one rule. 0:02:55.862 --> 0:02:58.862 But I just tell you that that's an Australian value, 0:02:58.862 --> 0:03:01.422 not an American one, Like kids are not taught that 0:03:01.502 --> 0:03:02.102 in the US. 0:03:02.142 --> 0:03:03.222 So when Trump says. 0:03:03.062 --> 0:03:04.462 I'm going to tell on you and I'm going to 0:03:04.542 --> 0:03:07.502 tell your Prime minister about you, that scene is a 0:03:07.542 --> 0:03:10.342 totally okay thing to do. It's it's you using the system. 0:03:10.422 --> 0:03:13.182 It's like reporting someone who's breaking the rules, Like there's 0:03:13.222 --> 0:03:15.702 no value in America saying you really job. 0:03:15.822 --> 0:03:18.142 What joh Online should have said is don't be a dibbadubber. 0:03:18.582 --> 0:03:20.622 Yeah, he should have because there's a lot of stigma 0:03:20.702 --> 0:03:23.022 here about dobbing. It comes up in loner's books all 0:03:23.022 --> 0:03:27.222 the time. We don't dB unless someone is facing an 0:03:27.222 --> 0:03:28.262 issue with their safety. 0:03:28.302 --> 0:03:28.742 I don't know that. 0:03:28.822 --> 0:03:29.302 Don't tell. 0:03:29.502 --> 0:03:31.862 Also bullying and stuff. We do a courage kids to 0:03:31.942 --> 0:03:32.501 speak up. 0:03:32.822 --> 0:03:36.222 Yeah, true, but generally speaking, I remember at school it 0:03:36.262 --> 0:03:38.142 was like the kid who is a dibber dubber was 0:03:38.262 --> 0:03:39.982 just not with the in crowd. 0:03:40.182 --> 0:03:43.022 The way to dip adob is to set up a 0:03:43.222 --> 0:03:49.262 fake Gmail couch what and then dip adob anonymously. 0:03:49.862 --> 0:03:51.542 Is that what you've been doing with your time off? 0:03:51.662 --> 0:03:53.662 Maybe you've just dip adobbing to people. 0:03:53.742 --> 0:03:55.182 I have some feedback. 0:03:56.622 --> 0:03:57.622 See that person is. 0:03:59.462 --> 0:04:02.142 The main takeaway from this is that Trump's basically saying 0:04:02.142 --> 0:04:04.542 he will in fact meet with that they Albaneasi and 0:04:04.582 --> 0:04:06.742 I bet Albow is happy about that because it's been 0:04:06.822 --> 0:04:08.902 really hard for him to meet with Trump so far. 0:04:10.022 --> 0:04:14.102 Doctor Elise Turner is a GP who was returning from 0:04:14.262 --> 0:04:17.101 a conference in Perth to her Gold Coast home yesterday 0:04:17.262 --> 0:04:20.421 when she stopped off in the Virgin Australia lounge at 0:04:20.462 --> 0:04:23.061 Melbourne Airport, and she was there because she was on 0:04:23.101 --> 0:04:26.062 a stopover on the way back home, and she wanted 0:04:26.061 --> 0:04:30.022 to pump some breast milk in the Virgin lounge and 0:04:30.061 --> 0:04:32.902 a supervisor came over to her and said, you can't 0:04:32.941 --> 0:04:35.541 do that here because there are men and it will 0:04:35.541 --> 0:04:36.741 make people uncomfortable. 0:04:36.902 --> 0:04:39.302 Did she specifically say there are men or did. 0:04:39.342 --> 0:04:42.662 She According to doctor Turner, she did cite the presence 0:04:42.702 --> 0:04:45.782 of men, okay. Doctor Turner says that she explained the 0:04:45.821 --> 0:04:47.981 pump was under her shirt, that there would be no 0:04:48.101 --> 0:04:51.662 nipple showing, but she was allowed to finish pumping, which 0:04:51.702 --> 0:04:53.662 I think is a part of this story that maybe 0:04:53.702 --> 0:04:56.341 was lost in the headlines. So after she finished pumping, 0:04:56.381 --> 0:04:58.302 on her way out of the lounge, she stopped to 0:04:58.301 --> 0:05:01.501 see the supervisor and she told the supervisor that she 0:05:01.621 --> 0:05:04.382 had made her feel pretty cruddy for breast pumping. 0:05:04.462 --> 0:05:05.502 That's the exact phrase. 0:05:06.061 --> 0:05:08.941 And that's when the supervisor said, you got to leave. 0:05:09.022 --> 0:05:11.662 She put her hand on doctor Turner's arm and she said, 0:05:11.662 --> 0:05:14.822 you've got to leave. You're making me uncomfortable and here's 0:05:14.861 --> 0:05:17.821 what doctor Turner said about the experience afterwards, being. 0:05:17.621 --> 0:05:20.902 Told that I can't sit here in the Virgin Lounge 0:05:21.022 --> 0:05:25.462 as a paying business class ticket holder to express breast 0:05:25.462 --> 0:05:29.901 milk that sits under my shirt like this, because this 0:05:30.022 --> 0:05:32.502 is a private business lounge and we don't do that here. 0:05:32.662 --> 0:05:35.261 This is just disgusting that this is twenty twenty five 0:05:35.662 --> 0:05:37.861 and this is the sort of treatment that lactating mothers 0:05:37.902 --> 0:05:39.301 are expected to deal with. 0:05:39.741 --> 0:05:44.342 MAYA, Yes, I think you've got something to say about. 0:05:44.061 --> 0:05:47.981 This, Okay, So my opinion is exactly what's wrong with 0:05:48.061 --> 0:05:50.062 the world in twenty twenty five, because when I first 0:05:50.101 --> 0:05:53.101 heard about this story, I hadn't seen any pictures and 0:05:53.142 --> 0:05:56.861 I didn't know any details. I thought woman tried to 0:05:56.861 --> 0:05:59.461 pump in a lounge, was asked to maybe do it 0:05:59.462 --> 0:06:02.181 in the bathroom, She said no, do you prepare your 0:06:02.222 --> 0:06:05.861 meals in a toilet? Was asked to leave, And I 0:06:05.981 --> 0:06:10.182 was like, you know, I've breastfed three children everywhere funerals, 0:06:10.222 --> 0:06:14.701 at weddings, in public, in meetings, at airports, on planes, 0:06:14.902 --> 0:06:18.101 in front of all manner of people, and there is 0:06:18.142 --> 0:06:19.902 a difference between breastfeeding and pumping. 0:06:20.101 --> 0:06:22.861 Yeah, talk me through that. I don't know if I agree. 0:06:22.902 --> 0:06:27.061 So when you breastfeed, there's a baby's head in front 0:06:27.101 --> 0:06:29.901 of your boob, and the baby has a group on 0:06:29.941 --> 0:06:31.781 your nipple, there might be a little bit of access 0:06:31.821 --> 0:06:32.381 when you. 0:06:33.741 --> 0:06:35.582 But your second, do you think you're safe the baby 0:06:35.582 --> 0:06:37.462 starts to go and play with something and your nip's 0:06:37.501 --> 0:06:39.501 just out and your nipple has never been darker. 0:06:39.662 --> 0:06:44.621 Sometimes that happens, right, but generally it's different to when 0:06:44.662 --> 0:06:48.782 you are pumping. And if you haven't pumped before, and 0:06:48.782 --> 0:06:51.381 I've pumped a ton again, I've pumped in all different 0:06:51.421 --> 0:06:54.181 places and including bathrooms, and I agree it's horrible to 0:06:54.222 --> 0:06:55.581 have to do it in a toilet where you have 0:06:55.621 --> 0:06:59.462 to smell everybody else's pooh. That's disgusting and it's not hygienic. 0:06:59.541 --> 0:07:01.342 It's not because you've got to keep it all very stale. 0:07:01.342 --> 0:07:04.381 But when you're pumping, you actually, depending on the pump, 0:07:04.702 --> 0:07:07.381 you can often see the nipple and the milk coming out. 0:07:07.702 --> 0:07:11.582 It also makes a lot of noise. If you've got 0:07:11.622 --> 0:07:13.382 a handheld one then it can be just a bit 0:07:13.381 --> 0:07:18.102 more squelch, squelch, squelch. I didn't realize that she was 0:07:18.182 --> 0:07:18.902 under her shirt. 0:07:19.182 --> 0:07:20.862 I didn't realize the white corner. 0:07:21.102 --> 0:07:25.422 So my unpopular opinion, which is that pumping and breastfeeding 0:07:25.422 --> 0:07:29.622 in public is not the same, I kind of retract. 0:07:29.302 --> 0:07:31.942 Okay, I disagree with you that they're not the same. 0:07:32.262 --> 0:07:34.581 Another detail of this story that's getting missed, which I've 0:07:34.582 --> 0:07:38.182 become quite obsessed with, is that doctor Elise Turner isn't 0:07:38.182 --> 0:07:40.901 the mother of one new one. She's got twins. She 0:07:40.902 --> 0:07:41.901 has six month old twins. 0:07:41.941 --> 0:07:44.422 Now, oh okay, because my fact. 0:07:44.222 --> 0:07:47.261 Mother has two sets of twins. I'm obsessed with the 0:07:47.342 --> 0:07:49.862 logistics of that. My mum lasted maybe four days of 0:07:50.381 --> 0:07:54.142 breastfeeding twins is one of the hardest you need a 0:07:54.182 --> 0:07:58.101 PhD in like when it comes to supply the fact 0:07:58.142 --> 0:08:00.182 that she's got to six months breastfeeding with twins, that 0:08:00.222 --> 0:08:01.782 woman deserves an order of Australian metal. 0:08:02.062 --> 0:08:04.782 But I reckon I just accidentally keep feeding the same twin. 0:08:05.102 --> 0:08:07.381 Get that one really fat, like you need you'd need 0:08:07.502 --> 0:08:10.821 a spreadsheet or something. The thing about pumping that I 0:08:10.821 --> 0:08:13.342 didn't understand until I had to pump was that when 0:08:13.381 --> 0:08:15.222 you have to pump, you have to pump. Now you 0:08:15.262 --> 0:08:17.342 cannot do it on someone else's schedule. It's the same 0:08:17.342 --> 0:08:20.462 as breastfeeding in that way. In order to keep up supply, 0:08:21.502 --> 0:08:24.102 you need to be on a particular schedule, and you 0:08:24.262 --> 0:08:27.141 also get engaged. So I had a situation on a 0:08:27.182 --> 0:08:30.222 plane where the plane was delayed, delayed, delayed, and I 0:08:30.262 --> 0:08:33.422 could feel myself getting engaged, and I'm thinking, Mastidis is 0:08:33.502 --> 0:08:35.661 fifteen minutes away, Like I need. 0:08:35.422 --> 0:08:36.022 To relieve this. 0:08:36.422 --> 0:08:38.182 We'll get ushered onto the plane. I'm like, it's fine. 0:08:38.182 --> 0:08:40.062 Once we're off, I'll go into the bathroom and I'll 0:08:40.102 --> 0:08:42.542 pump and I sit in my seat. And ten minutes past, 0:08:42.702 --> 0:08:44.862 fifteen minutes gets to about thirty minutes, and I was 0:08:44.902 --> 0:08:46.822 like this is I'm like leaking, Like this is this 0:08:46.862 --> 0:08:47.382 is really bad. 0:08:47.422 --> 0:08:49.822 I mean it's painful, it's really painstules. 0:08:49.902 --> 0:08:51.822 Yeah, and it just started feeling hot and awful, and 0:08:51.902 --> 0:08:53.702 I'm starting to get anxious, and I went, I've just 0:08:53.702 --> 0:08:54.822 got to go to the bathroom. So I took my 0:08:54.862 --> 0:08:56.022 bag and I went to go to the bathroom, and 0:08:56.062 --> 0:08:58.982 there was an announcement over the plane going basically, get 0:08:58.982 --> 0:09:00.982 in your seats. You're not allowed to stand up, like 0:09:01.022 --> 0:09:03.742 where where something was going on with the plane. You know, 0:09:03.782 --> 0:09:05.382 when you've got to have your belt on before take. 0:09:05.262 --> 0:09:06.102 Off, conturbulent. 0:09:06.222 --> 0:09:08.902 Often, No, the plane haven't left, but we've been sitting 0:09:08.942 --> 0:09:10.742 there for thirty minut So I was like, well, can 0:09:10.782 --> 0:09:13.862 I just get some clarity. I got to relieve myself anyway. 0:09:13.942 --> 0:09:16.342 I went back to my seat, full flight, two businessmen 0:09:16.462 --> 0:09:16.902 next to me. 0:09:17.102 --> 0:09:18.582 You know, six o'clock. Were you in the middle? 0:09:18.742 --> 0:09:23.262 I was in the middle. No, I have no choice 0:09:23.342 --> 0:09:26.342 right now except to pump. And I didn't have one 0:09:26.382 --> 0:09:29.742 of the really cool wearable ones. It was quite bulky. 0:09:29.942 --> 0:09:31.422 Was it electric or was it? 0:09:31.422 --> 0:09:32.342 It was electric? 0:09:32.422 --> 0:09:32.822 And it was. 0:09:33.062 --> 0:09:34.982 It was loud, but you know the ones that can 0:09:35.022 --> 0:09:37.422 hide in your brain. It wasn't that I could hide, 0:09:37.422 --> 0:09:40.582 like they couldn't see my nipples. But I sat there 0:09:40.662 --> 0:09:44.142 with tears streaming down my face, just going I don't 0:09:44.182 --> 0:09:48.262 want to do this, but like, I have no choice. 0:09:48.262 --> 0:09:49.742 And I found that even in the workplace. 0:09:49.862 --> 0:09:51.622 Did you say something to the men or did they 0:09:51.662 --> 0:09:52.542 say anything to you? 0:09:52.622 --> 0:09:54.582 No, they were actually they kind of looked looked the 0:09:54.622 --> 0:09:56.702 other way. And I remember at one stage making eye 0:09:56.702 --> 0:09:58.902 contact with a flight attendant and being like, if you 0:09:59.182 --> 0:10:01.862 say a word, I am going to riot. Like I 0:10:02.342 --> 0:10:05.502 think there's a sensitivity to that. You're incredibly because you're 0:10:05.542 --> 0:10:09.342 just going. There is so much pressure on me and 0:10:09.782 --> 0:10:12.502 Release Turner and every other woman to keep breastfeed. We 0:10:12.542 --> 0:10:16.302 are trying our very best. Pumping is the only way 0:10:16.342 --> 0:10:21.382 that most women can feasibly do it, alongside work, which 0:10:21.422 --> 0:10:23.662 we often need to get back to because of you know, 0:10:23.822 --> 0:10:27.302 two parent working households, whatever. And then when there's any 0:10:27.422 --> 0:10:30.622 shame or stigma or anything that makes you feel embarrassed 0:10:30.622 --> 0:10:33.462 about it, you get so angry. 0:10:33.782 --> 0:10:37.222 But Amelia, don't you think that doctor Turner and Jesse 0:10:37.302 --> 0:10:39.982 should have been at home with their baby? You can 0:10:40.022 --> 0:10:41.542 really why were they on planes? 0:10:42.262 --> 0:10:45.782 You can hear the emotion, can't you, in Doctor Turner's voice, 0:10:45.822 --> 0:10:49.902 And it's because six months postpardon, there's so much that's 0:10:49.942 --> 0:10:53.182 going on chemically in her body is still as well, 0:10:53.742 --> 0:10:58.622 and being away from your baby, or babies when they're 0:10:58.662 --> 0:11:01.982 still six months old, you've already got a heightened level 0:11:01.982 --> 0:11:05.302 of anxiety coursing through your veins because your body is 0:11:05.342 --> 0:11:07.742 telling you that you should not be away from the baby. 0:11:08.182 --> 0:11:10.262 And so then to have some one come up to 0:11:10.342 --> 0:11:13.342 you and make you feel embarrassed, I can see how 0:11:13.382 --> 0:11:16.342 that really sent her spiraling, and I have so much 0:11:16.382 --> 0:11:19.582 sympathy for her what's interesting about pumping is I dug 0:11:19.622 --> 0:11:23.382 into this and doctor Churner's pointed out that breastfeeding and 0:11:23.502 --> 0:11:27.342 pumping are both protected acts under the Sex Discrimination Act 0:11:27.342 --> 0:11:29.342 of nineteen eighty four, But back in nineteen eighty four, 0:11:29.382 --> 0:11:31.862 pumping was nowhere near as common as it is now, 0:11:32.342 --> 0:11:35.622 and the actual wording of that act talks about breastfeeding 0:11:35.662 --> 0:11:39.222 and expressing. Now expressing for those who don't know, is 0:11:39.262 --> 0:11:41.422 this kind of like milk made act where you have 0:11:41.462 --> 0:11:42.862 to kind of fondle your own. 0:11:42.662 --> 0:11:45.822 Breasts and the kept milk. Think of a cow never 0:11:45.862 --> 0:11:46.942 mastered it tricky. 0:11:47.062 --> 0:11:49.782 I've had to do it because the logistics of remembering 0:11:49.782 --> 0:11:52.262 all your pump parts, Like I would forget one part, 0:11:52.382 --> 0:11:54.542 I'd get to work and go, oh, I fucked, and 0:11:54.582 --> 0:11:56.542 I'd have to go into the bathroom and like a 0:11:56.582 --> 0:11:59.462 cow with a tea, really milk myself so that I 0:11:59.462 --> 0:12:00.262 didn't get massed out. 0:12:00.662 --> 0:12:04.302 I think what you said, Jess is so interesting about 0:12:04.342 --> 0:12:09.502 the shame from both ends, because as a mother, Avenue born, 0:12:10.062 --> 0:12:12.582 and you know, those first few months particularly, there's so 0:12:12.702 --> 0:12:14.862 much pressure to breastfeed, often when it's not the right 0:12:14.862 --> 0:12:16.222 thing for your baby, and it's not the right thing 0:12:16.222 --> 0:12:18.502 for you. So you already feel ashamed if you can't 0:12:18.502 --> 0:12:20.102 do it right, if your baby's not putting on weight, 0:12:20.462 --> 0:12:22.742 if you don't like it, you know, if you stop 0:12:22.782 --> 0:12:25.062 too early or you supplement before, if your baby doesn't 0:12:25.102 --> 0:12:27.702 like it, by the way, like this, but to then 0:12:27.742 --> 0:12:30.582 get shamed by the other side as well. Now I'm 0:12:30.622 --> 0:12:34.742 remembering I used to breastfeed quite aggressively in public, particularly 0:12:34.742 --> 0:12:37.302 with babies two and three, because I think I was 0:12:37.302 --> 0:12:38.902 a little bit bored and I was just like, come 0:12:38.942 --> 0:12:42.182 at me. I was like waiting for someone to say something, 0:12:42.542 --> 0:12:45.702 so I'd like do it everywhere. No one ever said anything. 0:12:46.022 --> 0:12:47.302 I was a bit disappointed. 0:12:47.942 --> 0:12:50.342 There's also some cultural norms run it in different places, 0:12:50.382 --> 0:12:53.462 Like I lived in Japan with a newborn, and it's 0:12:53.502 --> 0:12:56.062 just a fact that you would not breastfeed in public there, 0:12:56.302 --> 0:12:58.182 like we just it is not accepted. 0:12:58.662 --> 0:13:02.262 It's breastfeeding culturally expected well here and encouraged. 0:13:02.702 --> 0:13:06.142 It is culturally accepted and encouraged, but unlike in the West, 0:13:06.262 --> 0:13:09.542 they've actually decided to allow for women to do it 0:13:09.582 --> 0:13:12.662 in nice spaces. So while you cannot breastfeed in public, 0:13:13.022 --> 0:13:14.622 they make sure that, for instance, if you go to 0:13:14.622 --> 0:13:17.542 the shopping mall, there is a literal lounge in every 0:13:17.622 --> 0:13:20.902 shopping mall for breastfeeding mothers to just lounge around with 0:13:20.942 --> 0:13:22.982 their babies in this safe, clean place. 0:13:22.982 --> 0:13:26.502 There's a place for hot water. It's totally nice. In Australia, 0:13:26.582 --> 0:13:27.062 have too. 0:13:27.462 --> 0:13:29.942 I actually kind of prefer that I've been out with 0:13:29.982 --> 0:13:33.502 friends at the pub, at a restaurant, at a concert 0:13:33.862 --> 0:13:34.902 and they've been pumping. 0:13:35.102 --> 0:13:37.822 My sister might have pumped a Tailors concert. 0:13:37.982 --> 0:13:39.022 She absolutely did. 0:13:39.102 --> 0:13:40.422 I think Taylor would approve of that. 0:13:40.502 --> 0:13:43.902 Another interesting detail about this was that I read somewhere 0:13:44.142 --> 0:13:46.422 that she was then encouraged to go into one of 0:13:46.422 --> 0:13:48.502 the private rooms, but you had to pay no. 0:13:48.662 --> 0:13:51.782 So she asked before she started pumping, Hey do you 0:13:51.822 --> 0:13:54.022 have a space for me to do this? And they 0:13:54.142 --> 0:13:56.502 said that you've got two options. You can hire a 0:13:56.502 --> 0:13:59.262 boardroom for one hundred dollars, or you can use the bathroom. 0:13:59.342 --> 0:14:00.662 And what I was going to say about the Japan 0:14:00.742 --> 0:14:03.982 example is if you're not comfortable with women breastfeeding and 0:14:04.022 --> 0:14:06.982 pumping in public, you have to be able to provide 0:14:07.022 --> 0:14:08.862 a space for them to do it, because, as you 0:14:08.902 --> 0:14:11.782 point out, Jess, it is kind of a physical act 0:14:12.062 --> 0:14:15.102 that can lead to harm if it's not done. And 0:14:15.182 --> 0:14:17.782 so that's where I think is the trip up here. 0:14:18.302 --> 0:14:20.382 You can't have it both ways. You can't say don't 0:14:20.422 --> 0:14:22.222 do it in public, but then we're not giving you 0:14:22.262 --> 0:14:22.702 a space. 0:14:22.822 --> 0:14:25.182 Please stop telling women to do it in toilets. Have 0:14:25.302 --> 0:14:27.622 you ever hung out in a toilet? It's true? Would 0:14:27.622 --> 0:14:29.382 you like to prepare a meal in a toilet? 0:14:29.422 --> 0:14:32.902 The issue with the toilet too. I pumped in a 0:14:32.942 --> 0:14:37.062 plane cubicle once during turbulence, and everything I pumped went 0:14:37.102 --> 0:14:39.982 all over the walls, like it just wasn't logistically possible. 0:14:40.342 --> 0:14:43.702 But you need a lot of milk, probably the. 0:14:43.662 --> 0:14:46.622 Same flight I probably went on one fly and it's 0:14:46.782 --> 0:14:50.782 just always. But you need a table like you have 0:14:52.222 --> 0:14:55.582 because the one that I had, and this is then 0:14:55.622 --> 0:14:57.262 it's like if you have the one that you tuck 0:14:57.302 --> 0:14:58.942 into your bra, they're like, you know, that's not very 0:14:58.942 --> 0:15:00.742 good for supply, so you should really get the one 0:15:00.742 --> 0:15:02.862 that's got forty five pieces and costs you eight hundred 0:15:02.862 --> 0:15:05.422 dollars and you're just like, oh okay. And I had 0:15:05.462 --> 0:15:08.182 like bottles that went onto a thing that I had 0:15:08.182 --> 0:15:10.022 a special bra. I had to put on all of 0:15:10.022 --> 0:15:11.942 that to do it, like am I meant to do 0:15:11.942 --> 0:15:14.902 it on the toilet see with my sterilized look. 0:15:14.982 --> 0:15:17.822 I think the planes are slightly different because you can't 0:15:17.862 --> 0:15:21.142 have a dedicated breastfeeding room on every plane, like you 0:15:21.222 --> 0:15:23.782 also have to say you can't have a dedicated breastfeeding 0:15:23.862 --> 0:15:27.382 room in every workplace permanently. As an employer, I do 0:15:27.502 --> 0:15:29.502 believe you might be legally. 0:15:29.102 --> 0:15:30.902 Required to that's not a bathroom. 0:15:31.102 --> 0:15:32.102 That's not a bathroom. 0:15:32.502 --> 0:15:34.022 But and you've got to let me put it in 0:15:34.022 --> 0:15:34.582 the fridge. 0:15:34.742 --> 0:15:36.702 When I was at Channel nine and I used to breastfeed, 0:15:36.862 --> 0:15:38.742 literally it was a whole lot of beers and my 0:15:38.822 --> 0:15:42.022 breast and that said everything you needed to know about that. 0:15:42.342 --> 0:15:45.302 But is meant to stimulate breast milk, right, old wives tale. 0:15:45.982 --> 0:15:48.382 But I was going to say, for people who were 0:15:48.422 --> 0:15:51.702 not familiar with breast pumps, they do look weird. I 0:15:51.742 --> 0:15:54.342 do want to put that out there, and there's something 0:15:54.462 --> 0:15:57.662 a little bit confronting about them, because I remember when 0:15:57.742 --> 0:16:00.062 Rachel McAdams there was a photo of taken of her 0:16:00.182 --> 0:16:02.982 on a film set looking impossibly glamorous and beautiful because 0:16:02.982 --> 0:16:05.262 she's Rachel McAdams and she had her too. I think 0:16:05.262 --> 0:16:06.942 it was the cover of a magazine and she had 0:16:07.742 --> 0:16:10.262 she's the one that looked breastmats does strikingly. 0:16:10.422 --> 0:16:12.822 That's the one that I had a very similar breast paper. 0:16:13.062 --> 0:16:15.782 She had like two breast pumps with the bottom on 0:16:15.822 --> 0:16:18.542 each nipple. And you've got to say that there's some 0:16:18.622 --> 0:16:20.582 part about it that looks like in the same way 0:16:20.622 --> 0:16:22.942 that a polate's reformer matt looks a little bit like 0:16:22.982 --> 0:16:25.862 a kind of fetish device. There's something about pumping that's 0:16:25.902 --> 0:16:28.342 a I can see how aesthetically it's confronting to people 0:16:28.342 --> 0:16:29.622 who are not familiar with the equipment. 0:16:29.662 --> 0:16:30.142 Let's put it that. 0:16:30.302 --> 0:16:32.622 I think it's athetically confronting to the person using it 0:16:32.702 --> 0:16:34.942 and to the baby. I hate it. But did you 0:16:34.942 --> 0:16:35.822 always a pump? 0:16:36.182 --> 0:16:38.582 Did you, guys ever pump in front of anybody like 0:16:38.622 --> 0:16:40.702 that you knew, like just in your house, like you 0:16:40.742 --> 0:16:43.262 were always quite private, even with breastfeeding, you would often 0:16:43.302 --> 0:16:44.782 go into another room. Jesse. Yeah. 0:16:44.822 --> 0:16:47.462 I think people expect that just because you've had a baby, 0:16:47.502 --> 0:16:49.222 all of a sudden, you have no modesty. And I 0:16:49.422 --> 0:16:52.542 never ever found it comfortable to sit in a cafe 0:16:52.622 --> 0:16:54.582 and I was like, I don't want to be stared at. 0:16:54.622 --> 0:16:56.262 Sometimes you have to do it. I think that's why 0:16:56.302 --> 0:16:58.902 there's a sensitivity too, is that it's like I'd prefer 0:16:58.982 --> 0:17:00.582 not to, but I'm doing my best. 0:17:00.622 --> 0:17:03.142 The hard thing about pumping, too is with breast feeding, 0:17:03.262 --> 0:17:07.702 there's a sort of like unspoken relationship which is communicated 0:17:07.742 --> 0:17:11.262 through smell and behavior and between the parent and the 0:17:11.341 --> 0:17:14.662 child about when the breastfeeding is going to occur, and 0:17:14.702 --> 0:17:17.142 there's some way that you can communicate with that baby 0:17:17.422 --> 0:17:20.021 where you're like not now essentially, But the problem when 0:17:20.061 --> 0:17:22.141 you're away from the baby is those cues are gone. 0:17:22.222 --> 0:17:25.182 And so when you need to pump, you need to pump, yeah, and. 0:17:25.141 --> 0:17:26.702 The milk comes out and they can see the milk 0:17:26.742 --> 0:17:28.181 and I don't know about you guys, but might have 0:17:28.341 --> 0:17:30.462 like a blue eytinge yeah yeah. 0:17:30.502 --> 0:17:32.861 And also it comes out like a sprinkler, yeah, which 0:17:32.901 --> 0:17:36.261 most people don't know. But I remember very distinctly the 0:17:36.302 --> 0:17:38.221 first time I pumped in front of my brother in 0:17:38.262 --> 0:17:41.542 law and because I needed to pump and he was 0:17:41.581 --> 0:17:44.662 over and I was like, is this where I didn't care? 0:17:44.942 --> 0:17:47.422 He was cool with it. I don't know if i'd 0:17:47.422 --> 0:17:50.022 do it like in front of my dad. I just 0:17:50.061 --> 0:17:51.741 sort of didn't care as long as it was my 0:17:51.861 --> 0:17:53.981 decision and no one was looking like leering it. 0:17:54.022 --> 0:17:56.662 But that's an interesting question because now that I think 0:17:56.661 --> 0:17:59.262 about it, breastfeeding I was fine doing in front of people. 0:17:59.381 --> 0:18:01.381 Pumping I was not fine doing in front of people. 0:18:01.422 --> 0:18:02.621 Definitely feels more intimate. 0:18:02.661 --> 0:18:05.061 Weirdly, I think if you want to do it privately, 0:18:05.182 --> 0:18:06.581 the idea I used to go and hide in a 0:18:06.661 --> 0:18:09.421 video studio and do it at work, which I always 0:18:09.821 --> 0:18:12.581 And the irony is I probably if pumping wasn't such 0:18:12.581 --> 0:18:15.581 a terrible experience in terms of you're sitting in a 0:18:15.621 --> 0:18:17.701 meeting that's running fifteen minutes over and you're going I 0:18:17.782 --> 0:18:21.141 really got to run and pump, and then the breastfeeding 0:18:21.222 --> 0:18:23.942 journey probably would have been longer. But for a lot 0:18:23.942 --> 0:18:26.782 of people, they just go, this is far too hard. 0:18:26.782 --> 0:18:28.422 But I love the idea some A friend of mine 0:18:28.462 --> 0:18:30.821 recently went to a doctor's appointment and the doctor was 0:18:30.821 --> 0:18:33.461 sitting there with a pump on during the appointment, and 0:18:33.542 --> 0:18:35.302 I was like, I kind of love that. 0:18:35.302 --> 0:18:37.061 That's better than when I went to the doctor once 0:18:37.061 --> 0:18:39.181 for a perhap smear and she finished up her curry 0:18:39.222 --> 0:18:43.861 before the perapsner began. Look, doctor Channer, I just want 0:18:43.861 --> 0:18:47.381 to say, well done. I think having twins and breastfeedings 0:18:47.381 --> 0:18:48.262 done really hard. 0:18:49.022 --> 0:18:53.101 We salute you in a moment Emma Heming Willis and 0:18:53.141 --> 0:19:00.902 the impossible decisions facing caregivers. When Emma Heming Willis says 0:19:00.942 --> 0:19:04.022 it's not up for debate, It's not up for effing debate. 0:19:04.621 --> 0:19:07.781 Those words were published on Laney Gossip last week in 0:19:07.821 --> 0:19:10.662 regards to a choice made by forty seven year old 0:19:10.702 --> 0:19:13.821 Emma Heming Willis, who is the wife of seventy year 0:19:13.861 --> 0:19:16.742 old Bruce Willis, who is living with a devastating condition 0:19:17.222 --> 0:19:21.462 called fronto temporal dementia. The reason you might be hearing 0:19:21.502 --> 0:19:23.502 a lot about the Willis family at the moment is 0:19:23.542 --> 0:19:26.302 because Emma has written a book. It is called The 0:19:26.381 --> 0:19:31.061 Unexpected Journey, Finding Strength, Hope and Yourself on the Caregiving Path, 0:19:31.182 --> 0:19:36.861 and it's all about Bruce Willis's diagnosis and illness. Last month, 0:19:36.901 --> 0:19:39.302 Emma also shared that Bruce is now in his own 0:19:39.381 --> 0:19:42.941 home with twenty four hour care. Emma and Bruce Willis 0:19:42.942 --> 0:19:46.262 shared two children, they're eleven and thirteen, and she has 0:19:46.302 --> 0:19:49.101 been open about how Bruce would want them to be 0:19:49.262 --> 0:19:51.982 in their own environment that's suited to them and their needs, 0:19:52.022 --> 0:19:54.502 where they can be noisy and be adolescents. 0:19:54.581 --> 0:19:56.302 And this all sounds very sensible. 0:19:56.422 --> 0:19:59.181 Yes, and Bruce needs his own environment at the moment 0:19:59.262 --> 0:20:03.982 because of his particular set of needs. Now, since that admission, 0:20:04.141 --> 0:20:08.701 Emma says she's received just this onslaught of online criticism 0:20:08.861 --> 0:20:12.382 from strangers, just saying I cannot believe that you've put 0:20:12.462 --> 0:20:14.941 him in care like that. Basically it's your job to 0:20:14.942 --> 0:20:17.621 look after him. She said she anticipated that when sharing 0:20:17.621 --> 0:20:20.302 her story, and in an interview with Diane Sawyer, she said, 0:20:20.742 --> 0:20:23.302 I feel like caregivers are so judged. You have to 0:20:23.341 --> 0:20:25.101 do what is right for your family and what is 0:20:25.141 --> 0:20:27.302 going to keep your loved ones safe as well as 0:20:27.341 --> 0:20:28.462 your young children. 0:20:28.661 --> 0:20:30.901 Yeah, I thought this was so interesting, and I think 0:20:30.942 --> 0:20:33.302 that the reason for the backlash. I mean there's a 0:20:33.341 --> 0:20:36.302 backlash to everything in these days, because had she said 0:20:36.341 --> 0:20:39.542 we're putting him into full time care, into a home 0:20:40.462 --> 0:20:43.782 because we can't meet his needs anymore, no one would 0:20:43.821 --> 0:20:44.582 have said anything. 0:20:44.861 --> 0:20:47.182 What do you think it was about the language that. 0:20:46.901 --> 0:20:49.581 It's that they're rich. I think the people who would 0:20:49.581 --> 0:20:51.662 have been angry are the people who were like, well, 0:20:51.702 --> 0:20:54.542 that'd be nice, that'd be nice to have two houses. 0:20:55.182 --> 0:20:58.542 I feel too guilty to put my person that I 0:20:58.581 --> 0:21:01.022 have to care for into a home or I can't 0:21:01.061 --> 0:21:02.862 afford to because full time care out of the home 0:21:02.942 --> 0:21:06.581 is too expensive or too heart wrenching. Must be nice, right, 0:21:06.661 --> 0:21:08.181 I think that's what it is, and I think it 0:21:08.262 --> 0:21:11.141 comes from a place I think some people are just 0:21:11.222 --> 0:21:13.942 judgmental dickheads, but we don't care about those. I think 0:21:13.942 --> 0:21:17.101 that there would have been a real sense of pain 0:21:17.381 --> 0:21:20.102 and envy. Yeah, I hope they can afford that. 0:21:20.262 --> 0:21:23.981 I wondered if the strangers and the anger, if that 0:21:24.061 --> 0:21:26.261 was coming from people who had never been in that 0:21:26.302 --> 0:21:29.942 situation before and couldn't imagine what it was like and 0:21:30.061 --> 0:21:33.141 maybe identifying. So there was a report that came out 0:21:33.141 --> 0:21:36.101 a few days ago that said dementia is the number 0:21:36.101 --> 0:21:39.061 one killer for people in Australia. It is everywhere. If 0:21:39.061 --> 0:21:41.821 you are not currently caring for someone with dementia, it 0:21:41.861 --> 0:21:42.542 is likely going to come. 0:21:42.702 --> 0:21:45.342 Wow, that must have overtaken heart disease just. 0:21:45.302 --> 0:21:48.061 In the last couple of days. And so I think 0:21:48.182 --> 0:21:50.941 when we hear stories like this, we either identify really 0:21:50.982 --> 0:21:54.422 strongly with the person with dementia, which is reasonable given 0:21:54.462 --> 0:21:57.461 the rates, or we go I'm also going to be 0:21:57.462 --> 0:22:00.461 someone probably looking after someone with dementia, right, and so 0:22:00.661 --> 0:22:03.821 if you identify with that camp, you probably have a 0:22:03.821 --> 0:22:07.821 bit more empathy for what that does to a life, 0:22:07.982 --> 0:22:11.662 how many years it takes up. And also Emma has 0:22:11.702 --> 0:22:14.142 done such a service to the subject of dementia because 0:22:14.141 --> 0:22:16.181 she's talking about all the different kinds and this is 0:22:16.222 --> 0:22:21.061 a really specific type of dementia where symptoms include a 0:22:21.141 --> 0:22:24.262 lack of empathy, his personality changed. 0:22:24.982 --> 0:22:28.182 You can become violent, you can become unpredictable, you can 0:22:28.341 --> 0:22:31.542 be unsafe in your own home, like maybe the home 0:22:31.661 --> 0:22:33.701 that they were in just wasn't suitable, maybe there was 0:22:33.742 --> 0:22:35.782 a pool that didn't have a fence, like you just 0:22:35.821 --> 0:22:39.381 don't know. And also, poor Emma, to me, this also 0:22:39.502 --> 0:22:43.701 speaks of the impossible pressure and expectations we have of caregivers. 0:22:44.262 --> 0:22:47.102 She's got two little girls on one hand, who are 0:22:47.222 --> 0:22:50.662 eleven and thirteen. It's not like Bruce's adult children, who 0:22:50.742 --> 0:22:53.342 many of whom have children of their own. And then 0:22:53.341 --> 0:22:56.982 she's got her husband who is only seventy and she's 0:22:57.101 --> 0:22:59.461 a fair bit younger than him, And one of her 0:22:59.502 --> 0:23:02.182 biggest supporters is actually Demi. More because there are sort 0:23:02.222 --> 0:23:06.181 of still a blended family and Demi and her girls 0:23:06.341 --> 0:23:09.341 that she shares with Bruce Willison all very close, and 0:23:10.422 --> 0:23:13.581 they've all lined up behind her and said, nobody understands, 0:23:13.821 --> 0:23:17.462 and Bruce wouldn't want that burden on his young daughters. 0:23:17.821 --> 0:23:20.421 What do you think about the admission, Amelia, Because she 0:23:20.422 --> 0:23:22.022 didn't have to tell us any of this. She could 0:23:22.022 --> 0:23:24.981 have just gone, I'm going to make my private decisions 0:23:25.422 --> 0:23:27.742 with Bruce. Probably didn't even need to tell us about 0:23:27.742 --> 0:23:29.941 the diagnosis, right, And once you put anything on the 0:23:29.942 --> 0:23:32.782 public record, once you write a book and you're doing interviews. 0:23:32.982 --> 0:23:35.901 No, she had to because he's a public figure, and 0:23:35.942 --> 0:23:37.941 he had a big career, and he was still making 0:23:37.982 --> 0:23:40.542 movies towards the end, and they were trying to get 0:23:40.581 --> 0:23:43.382 around it by having ear pieces in his ears where 0:23:43.422 --> 0:23:45.302 someone would feed in the lines, and so it was 0:23:45.381 --> 0:23:48.341 quite well known in Hollywood that something was up. 0:23:48.861 --> 0:23:51.621 I think you raised a really interesting point before, Jesse, 0:23:51.702 --> 0:23:53.821 when you talked about how there are the people who 0:23:53.821 --> 0:23:56.462 maybe identify with the caregiver here, and there are people 0:23:56.502 --> 0:24:00.302 who identify with Bruce who has dementia. The problem with 0:24:00.462 --> 0:24:03.181 identifying with Bruce here and saying, well, Bruce, how can 0:24:03.222 --> 0:24:05.821 Bruce enjoy living in this house without his children? Is 0:24:05.861 --> 0:24:09.181 that thinking about how to treat dementia and how to 0:24:09.222 --> 0:24:12.782 respond to people with dementia is changing. Even now, even 0:24:12.782 --> 0:24:15.421 how widespread it is, there's still a lot of different 0:24:15.422 --> 0:24:18.262 schools of thought in terms of how people should respond 0:24:18.302 --> 0:24:20.941 to dementia. I read a really interesting article in The 0:24:20.982 --> 0:24:23.061 New Yorker from a few years ago called The Comforting 0:24:23.101 --> 0:24:26.542 Fictions of Dementia Care, and it talked about how fifty 0:24:26.621 --> 0:24:30.022 years ago, when someone with dementia would say where's my 0:24:30.341 --> 0:24:34.022 husband or wife? The appropriate response, it was thought, was 0:24:34.061 --> 0:24:36.621 to be completely honest with them and say they've died. 0:24:37.581 --> 0:24:39.661 And if that meant saying your husband or wife has 0:24:39.702 --> 0:24:42.302 died fifty times a day, then that that was the 0:24:42.341 --> 0:24:45.381 medically appropriate thing to do. Well in the years since, 0:24:45.422 --> 0:24:47.661 there's now been a new school of thought that says, 0:24:48.061 --> 0:24:51.381 we don't need to be constantly giving these uncomfortable and 0:24:51.422 --> 0:24:52.821 hard truths to these people. 0:24:53.502 --> 0:24:55.662 They've lost that person again and again and again. 0:24:56.901 --> 0:24:59.341 There's a whole new school of thought that says that 0:24:59.502 --> 0:25:02.581 comforting fictions like saying to them, Oh, they must have 0:25:02.661 --> 0:25:05.341 just gone to the shops, is an absolutely fine thing 0:25:05.422 --> 0:25:05.981 to do. Now. 0:25:06.022 --> 0:25:08.821 Again, that's just one school. Is that what you've discovered, Jesse, 0:25:09.742 --> 0:25:10.582 that's really interesting. 0:25:10.621 --> 0:25:13.502 You say that my grandfather is in an age care 0:25:13.581 --> 0:25:18.421 a brilliant age care facility with dementia, and your impulse 0:25:18.661 --> 0:25:23.101 is to try and keep their connection to reality strong. 0:25:23.302 --> 0:25:25.381 So he starts talking about how his mother was just 0:25:25.422 --> 0:25:28.341 in the room and his wife and he's still looking 0:25:28.381 --> 0:25:32.061 after Simon, his grandson, and we would go, no, Simon 0:25:32.101 --> 0:25:34.422 lives over here now, like that was our instinct, right, 0:25:34.742 --> 0:25:36.461 And then we did all of this research and it 0:25:36.542 --> 0:25:40.502 was basically like, how confusing. Imagine if you said I'm 0:25:40.502 --> 0:25:42.661 going on to see my kids and I was like, 0:25:42.742 --> 0:25:46.461 you don't have, Like that would be so destabilizing all 0:25:46.502 --> 0:25:49.542 the time. It actually doesn't help. What's been lovely with 0:25:49.581 --> 0:25:52.341 my pop, which is not everyone's experience, is that emotionally 0:25:52.381 --> 0:25:55.782 he's okay, Like he's fine. If he thinks that Simon 0:25:55.901 --> 0:25:58.581 just went up to the shop, then that's absolutely fine. 0:25:58.621 --> 0:26:02.421 We don't have to kind of confront him with reality 0:26:02.462 --> 0:26:02.942 all the time. 0:26:03.061 --> 0:26:06.141 The issue is that for caregivers who've made this realization, 0:26:06.381 --> 0:26:08.581 it can lead to something called deception guilt. 0:26:08.982 --> 0:26:11.581 This is a real if caregivers. 0:26:11.061 --> 0:26:14.222 Are constantly lying, and we've been taught from a very 0:26:14.222 --> 0:26:16.821 early age that lying is a sign of disrespect, You're 0:26:16.821 --> 0:26:20.661 not treating the person with respectety and dignity. It leads 0:26:20.702 --> 0:26:23.542 to this feeling, am I doing something wrong? Even if 0:26:23.621 --> 0:26:26.462 medical professionals are telling you that that's the accepted path. 0:26:26.581 --> 0:26:29.941 And so that's a really hard thing for Emma to 0:26:29.982 --> 0:26:32.182 have to deal with that she's being told no, it's 0:26:32.182 --> 0:26:35.622 fine to lie. In fact, that's probably medically advisable. That's 0:26:35.661 --> 0:26:38.381 going to weigh on her over time. And that's why 0:26:38.542 --> 0:26:41.061 a lot of caregivers apparently speak about this idea that 0:26:41.101 --> 0:26:44.142 they're no longer caring for their wife or their husband, 0:26:44.581 --> 0:26:48.941 They've become a nurse, and that feeling of I'm no 0:26:49.061 --> 0:26:50.581 longer in that relationship. 0:26:50.661 --> 0:26:51.302 I'm a nurse. 0:26:51.422 --> 0:26:53.462 I'm someone who's lying to this person all the time 0:26:53.502 --> 0:26:54.862 because that's what I've been told to do. 0:26:55.341 --> 0:26:57.102 I mean, who is anyone to judge that. 0:26:57.581 --> 0:26:59.661 I think that what that spakes you as well is 0:26:59.661 --> 0:27:03.222 that we just do not understand enough about the subjectivity 0:27:03.262 --> 0:27:05.861 of the person living with the illness. We cannot understand 0:27:06.462 --> 0:27:09.222 because they can't really tell us in the early stages. Yes, 0:27:09.782 --> 0:27:13.981 but even reading what Emma has written about Bruce is 0:27:14.061 --> 0:27:16.982 like when they went to the doctor to get that diagnosis. 0:27:17.462 --> 0:27:19.902 It was like she was the only one in the room. 0:27:20.262 --> 0:27:24.381 He didn't even acknowledge the diagnosis. So it's not like 0:27:24.502 --> 0:27:26.542 you've got someone that you can discuss it with or 0:27:26.581 --> 0:27:29.942 go what do we do next? You don't know what 0:27:30.022 --> 0:27:33.262 that person wants and what they're thinking, and what their 0:27:33.302 --> 0:27:36.581 needs and desires are because they've evolved so much. 0:27:36.422 --> 0:27:38.542 And that's why there's such a vigorous debate amongst the 0:27:38.581 --> 0:27:41.022 experts about how to treat them and what the best 0:27:41.061 --> 0:27:43.382 thing to say is, Yeah, exactly. 0:27:43.782 --> 0:27:46.782 After the break, there's a birth, a death, and a marriage. 0:27:47.782 --> 0:27:50.542 Do you want daily outloud access? Why wouldn't you? We 0:27:50.661 --> 0:27:55.702 dropped episodes every Tuesday and Thursday exclusively for Muma MEA subscribers. 0:27:55.982 --> 0:27:57.661 Follow the link in the show notes to get us 0:27:57.702 --> 0:28:00.222 in your ears five days a week and a huge 0:28:00.262 --> 0:28:08.861 thank you. If you're already a subscriber. You might have 0:28:08.942 --> 0:28:12.381 heard on the new Is that Robert Redford died overnight. 0:28:12.581 --> 0:28:15.382 He was eighty nine. I don't know if you are 0:28:15.502 --> 0:28:17.982 very familiar with him as younger millennials. 0:28:18.381 --> 0:28:20.222 My first thought was my nun would be really sad 0:28:20.222 --> 0:28:22.302 about this, and then I remembered that my nan died 0:28:22.542 --> 0:28:24.982 twenty years ago. But She talked about Robert Redford a lot. 0:28:25.022 --> 0:28:26.422 He was originally in The Great Out. 0:28:26.861 --> 0:28:28.942 She was kind of like the Leo of his generation. 0:28:29.182 --> 0:28:30.622 Yeah, I saw eighty nine. 0:28:30.702 --> 0:28:31.942 I was like, that's young. 0:28:32.462 --> 0:28:36.422 Like, yeah, I thought the man gone before his time. 0:28:36.502 --> 0:28:37.302 It feels young man. 0:28:37.341 --> 0:28:39.622 I get him and Paul Newman a little bit mixed 0:28:39.661 --> 0:28:42.382 up also Jed but he's Salah dressing Butch Cassidy and 0:28:42.422 --> 0:28:44.941 the Sundance Kid the way we were and the sting 0:28:45.102 --> 0:28:46.382 with some of the movies he was in, and then 0:28:46.382 --> 0:28:50.382 he became a director, an acclaimed director, and he also 0:28:50.502 --> 0:28:53.182 was the co founder of the Sundance Film Festival. Yeah, 0:28:53.462 --> 0:28:54.542 so he seemed like a. 0:28:54.502 --> 0:28:58.221 Really nice person, Like I was reading people, remember, everyone 0:28:58.222 --> 0:28:59.062 said he was lovely. 0:28:59.782 --> 0:29:04.102 You know who got married? Also reportedly recently it's Keanu 0:29:04.182 --> 0:29:06.622 Reeves at the age of sixty one. I didn't know 0:29:06.661 --> 0:29:07.262 they got married. 0:29:07.302 --> 0:29:08.382 Yeah, I knew they were together. 0:29:08.742 --> 0:29:11.782 What was interesting about this, You may remember we've spoken 0:29:11.782 --> 0:29:14.342 about on the show before. There were pictures of Keanu 0:29:14.382 --> 0:29:18.302 Reeves and his girlfriend Alexandra Grant. They've been together since 0:29:18.302 --> 0:29:21.782 about twenty nineteen, and everyone was so excited because she 0:29:21.862 --> 0:29:25.461 has gray hairs, and we were like, thank you Kianu. 0:29:25.902 --> 0:29:29.142 She's only fifty two, so she's almost ten years younger 0:29:29.142 --> 0:29:32.102 than him. Still, she's an artist. She's an artist, and 0:29:32.142 --> 0:29:33.862 they work together for a long time. They were very 0:29:33.862 --> 0:29:37.022 good friends and things turned romantic. About six years ago. 0:29:37.222 --> 0:29:39.742 They reportedly got married in Europe over summer. They haven't 0:29:39.902 --> 0:29:43.181 given too many details about it because Keiana's famously very private. 0:29:43.342 --> 0:29:46.502 I read an article like the Absolute salivating over this 0:29:46.782 --> 0:29:49.102 story for the last six or so years. Is just 0:29:49.182 --> 0:29:53.102 like Keanu Reeves touches woman with gray hair, and Keanu 0:29:53.142 --> 0:29:55.742 Reeves puts arm around grayhaired woman. 0:29:55.582 --> 0:29:57.262 And I'm like, she's she's my age. 0:29:57.582 --> 0:30:01.382 Yeah, Like they really seem excited that a grayhaired woman exists. 0:30:01.462 --> 0:30:03.862 I bet she had a wedding dress with an asymmetric ham. 0:30:03.982 --> 0:30:05.822 She's very conceptual in her style. 0:30:06.342 --> 0:30:07.182 She's very cool. 0:30:07.342 --> 0:30:10.822 Gen X's represent And the birth that I wanted to 0:30:10.862 --> 0:30:12.782 tell you about is one that happened a year ago, 0:30:12.902 --> 0:30:15.262 so it's not exactly breaking news, but you might know 0:30:15.542 --> 0:30:18.421 that Margot Robbie had her first baby, a son, with 0:30:18.502 --> 0:30:22.262 her husband Tom Ackley, who's also her producing partner. They 0:30:22.342 --> 0:30:24.662 had their little boy, whose name they have not revealed, 0:30:24.782 --> 0:30:28.582 October last year, so he'd be almost one. October could 0:30:28.582 --> 0:30:31.582 be a good name. You could start that rumor. But 0:30:31.702 --> 0:30:34.222 the reason that she's top of mind is that this 0:30:34.302 --> 0:30:37.502 week you may have heard or seen some photos of 0:30:37.542 --> 0:30:40.102 her at a premiere. She's hitting the red carpet for 0:30:40.182 --> 0:30:43.941 the first time since her Barbie promotional tour in twenty 0:30:43.942 --> 0:30:46.701 twenty three, and you really couldn't miss it because she 0:30:46.822 --> 0:30:50.382 was pretty much nude. She's promoting this movie called A Big, Bold, 0:30:50.542 --> 0:30:55.262 Beautiful Journey with Colin Farrell, and what was so striking 0:30:55.302 --> 0:30:58.302 about the pictures A couple of things. They were in London, 0:30:58.742 --> 0:31:02.302 it was the evening. There's Colin Farrell in a suit, 0:31:02.422 --> 0:31:05.462 a full suit with a big trench coat over the top. 0:31:05.502 --> 0:31:06.902 He looks very dapper, but. 0:31:07.182 --> 0:31:08.662 He's looking very different seasons. 0:31:08.742 --> 0:31:12.302 Yeah, she is in a completely see through dress. From 0:31:12.342 --> 0:31:14.222 the back you can see her whole bum. She's wearing 0:31:14.222 --> 0:31:17.142 a g string. It goes down to just above her bum. 0:31:17.342 --> 0:31:19.062 Admits she'll bum amazing. 0:31:19.102 --> 0:31:21.262 Oh, I'm not saying it's not that she doesn't look amazing, 0:31:21.302 --> 0:31:23.302 And in the front she looks like completely nude. A 0:31:23.342 --> 0:31:25.782 couple of nights later she went to another premiere, probably 0:31:25.782 --> 0:31:29.342 in la and she was wearing another dress that was 0:31:29.382 --> 0:31:31.382 sort of just like a little kind of like a 0:31:31.422 --> 0:31:34.262 strapless imagine a strapless white swimsuit with just a few 0:31:34.302 --> 0:31:38.742 pieces of black fabric. Again down no notes, a couple 0:31:38.782 --> 0:31:42.062 of things interesting. She didn't used to dress like this. 0:31:42.382 --> 0:31:46.382 So Margot Robbie has always had a phenomenal body. She's 0:31:46.502 --> 0:31:49.342 one of the most beautiful women in the world. Everyone 0:31:49.422 --> 0:31:51.701 knows that, but she's never shown a lot of flesh 0:31:51.782 --> 0:31:53.502 on a red carpet. It's not really been her thing. 0:31:54.542 --> 0:31:56.302 But the other person who was in a dress that 0:31:56.422 --> 0:31:58.102 was almost nude this week, and you know, this is 0:31:58.142 --> 0:32:00.262 my area of expertise. I'd like to do my PhD 0:32:00.302 --> 0:32:02.062 and famous women wearing no pants. 0:32:02.102 --> 0:32:04.022 You know you have to do an undergraduate degree before 0:32:04.062 --> 0:32:04.742 you do a PhD. 0:32:04.902 --> 0:32:05.822 I'll download one. 0:32:07.302 --> 0:32:10.782 Amelia and I are you two to education. 0:32:11.942 --> 0:32:16.262 Dakotah Johnson. She was going to a charity fundraiser for 0:32:16.342 --> 0:32:18.981 the Caring Foundation, who it was to raise money for 0:32:19.062 --> 0:32:21.502 women who are the victims of dramestic violence. And she 0:32:21.622 --> 0:32:24.142 was wearing literally a black bra, black undies, and a 0:32:24.182 --> 0:32:26.421 completely sheer black long dress. 0:32:26.502 --> 0:32:30.262 Whenever I see women wearing visible underwear, I just automatically 0:32:30.302 --> 0:32:32.102 screenshot it and send it to you because I know 0:32:32.222 --> 0:32:34.022 that it will ruin your day reliably. 0:32:34.062 --> 0:32:36.501 I'll get riled up now. I'm not going to get 0:32:36.542 --> 0:32:38.982 riled up today. But what I thought was interesting about 0:32:39.022 --> 0:32:41.502 both of these women is the idea that they've both 0:32:41.502 --> 0:32:44.102 had big life changes recently. Margo's become a mother. This 0:32:44.142 --> 0:32:47.262 is her first time out really publicly on a red 0:32:47.262 --> 0:32:50.302 carpet since then. And Dakota Johnson also had a big 0:32:50.342 --> 0:32:52.461 identity change she became single. 0:32:52.502 --> 0:32:56.382 Oh wait, is this confirmed from Chris Martin. Yeah, I 0:32:56.422 --> 0:32:58.302 didn't know this. This is brand new information. 0:32:58.462 --> 0:32:59.382 I'm confirming it now. 0:32:59.422 --> 0:33:00.462 Oh my goodness. 0:33:00.782 --> 0:33:03.062 And what's interesting to me is that both of these 0:33:03.102 --> 0:33:06.902 women new dresses aren't new. No pants aren't new. They're 0:33:06.942 --> 0:33:09.662 not even necessarily new for these women because Dakotah Johnson's 0:33:09.702 --> 0:33:11.302 been doing it a couple of times since this room 0:33:11.342 --> 0:33:13.862 had break up, which happened a few months ago. But 0:33:13.902 --> 0:33:16.862 for my god, it's different. To me. It's reclaiming of identity. 0:33:17.382 --> 0:33:19.462 After something big happens in your life, you want to 0:33:19.502 --> 0:33:23.382 reclaim your identity, and it's reclaiming your identity by showing 0:33:23.542 --> 0:33:26.302 the world that you have a hot body. In what 0:33:26.342 --> 0:33:28.062 I would say is a pretty male gaysy way. 0:33:28.182 --> 0:33:30.582 Oh no, no, no, no, no, no no. So it's a 0:33:30.582 --> 0:33:33.422 relaunch of a kind. And I think that everyone does 0:33:33.422 --> 0:33:36.822 a relaunch man, woman peacock, like we all do a res. 0:33:36.542 --> 0:33:41.182 It's Chris Martin's relaunch. He's just I don't I think 0:33:41.182 --> 0:33:46.182 this says an aggressively. My body is back. I've raised 0:33:46.302 --> 0:33:47.902 all the signs that. 0:33:49.142 --> 0:33:51.782 Chris Martin was walking around in his spitos because he'd 0:33:51.822 --> 0:33:53.142 just broken up with Dakotas. 0:33:53.262 --> 0:33:56.582 Someone did a relaunch recently, a man who just started dressing. 0:33:56.661 --> 0:33:58.982 It was Ben Affleck after j Lo, and he got 0:33:58.982 --> 0:34:00.862 his leather jacket on and he went full mid life. 0:34:01.182 --> 0:34:04.382 But imagine if man after they became fathers walked red 0:34:04.422 --> 0:34:07.142 carpets with no shirts. 0:34:08.262 --> 0:34:11.741 Men's bodies quite literally in service for a minimum of 0:34:11.782 --> 0:34:17.341 twelve months, right in service of the growth and sustaining life. 0:34:17.422 --> 0:34:19.542 So it be That's exactly my point. It would be 0:34:19.582 --> 0:34:21.502 easier for the man to do that because they didn't 0:34:21.502 --> 0:34:24.422 have to actually carry and then possibly feed a baby. 0:34:24.462 --> 0:34:26.422 But the thing about Margo, so she had the Barbie 0:34:26.422 --> 0:34:29.422 premiere and then she was pregnant, she just had this baby. 0:34:30.181 --> 0:34:31.701 There is a moment and I see it with so 0:34:31.781 --> 0:34:33.781 many women who have just had a baby, and often 0:34:33.822 --> 0:34:36.222 when you've finished breastfeeding, which we were just talking about, 0:34:36.502 --> 0:34:39.262 where you get your body back. I don't mean literally, 0:34:39.342 --> 0:34:41.022 I don't mean you fit into your old jeans. I 0:34:41.022 --> 0:34:43.261 don't even mean that. It's just like the contours of 0:34:43.302 --> 0:34:45.022 my body now belong to me, and I'm on a 0:34:45.022 --> 0:34:47.502 red carpet. There's no one to touch, and all power 0:34:47.542 --> 0:34:50.102 to her like I reckon that. That is one element 0:34:50.142 --> 0:34:52.701 of why she's dressing like that. The other element is 0:34:52.741 --> 0:34:55.142 that Margo Robbie is not choosing what she's wearing on 0:34:55.181 --> 0:34:56.741 these red carpets. 0:34:55.942 --> 0:34:58.261 That's she's got enormous power. 0:34:58.342 --> 0:35:02.582 She's a no, she has one of the best stylistships. 0:35:01.942 --> 0:35:05.142 She does and it's a decision. The celebrity always has 0:35:05.221 --> 0:35:07.821 the last word because they're wearing the dress. 0:35:08.221 --> 0:35:10.901 You think someone's telling Margo Robbie, I think that she's 0:35:10.942 --> 0:35:12.822 showing up and she has been given a wardrobe. 0:35:12.822 --> 0:35:12.942 Now. 0:35:12.982 --> 0:35:15.821 The reason why she's dressing sexy, no, is that from 0:35:15.902 --> 0:35:20.062 Barbie to Once upon a Time in Hollywood, everything from 0:35:20.102 --> 0:35:22.382 like the clip in her hair to the bow on 0:35:22.422 --> 0:35:25.622 her shoes is like all in theme with the film 0:35:25.661 --> 0:35:28.181 so on Barbie. She was dressed as a doll the 0:35:28.422 --> 0:35:29.142 entire premiere. 0:35:29.261 --> 0:35:32.982 Yeah, and that was an extraordinary collaboration between her and 0:35:32.982 --> 0:35:35.781 Andrew maccamal is, her stylist, one of the most sought 0:35:35.822 --> 0:35:38.502 after stylists in the world right and very famous stylists 0:35:38.502 --> 0:35:42.461 like law Roachinzindia. It's very much a partnership and Mago Robbie. 0:35:42.502 --> 0:35:45.421 The way these big tools work now because once upon 0:35:45.422 --> 0:35:47.102 a time a celebrity would do the cover of a 0:35:47.382 --> 0:35:50.582 magazine and go my post baby body and they'd pose. Now, 0:35:50.622 --> 0:35:53.542 red carpets are that they don't need magazines anymore. So 0:35:53.582 --> 0:35:55.022 what happens at the beginning of our press to her 0:35:55.062 --> 0:35:57.142 is that they sit down, there's a mood board, they decide, 0:35:57.142 --> 0:35:58.542 there's a whole lot of things. So it's like, we'll 0:35:58.622 --> 0:36:00.701 use that for the La Premiere, will do this for 0:36:00.741 --> 0:36:03.982 the blah blah. And so my point is that it's 0:36:04.022 --> 0:36:06.702 a very deliberate choice. And I'm not criticizing that choice, 0:36:06.741 --> 0:36:10.422 to be clear, but I'm saying I'm observing that in 0:36:10.502 --> 0:36:14.782 our culture, and particularly in Hollywood, the way to say 0:36:14.902 --> 0:36:19.622 I'm back baby is to have erased every sign of 0:36:19.661 --> 0:36:21.822 your pregnancy from your body. 0:36:22.022 --> 0:36:25.462 Okay, be hot, I disagree that that's what's going on, 0:36:25.542 --> 0:36:28.582 because so she's working with that stylist for this press 0:36:28.661 --> 0:36:31.462 run as well. And Tamara Davis, who's a fashion and 0:36:31.502 --> 0:36:34.221 lifestyle writer here at Mummeya, posted something on Instagram the 0:36:34.261 --> 0:36:37.062 other day I thought was very astute kind of theory 0:36:37.102 --> 0:36:40.062 about what was going on, which is that this movie 0:36:40.542 --> 0:36:42.901 was never going to be the blockbuster of Barbie, right. 0:36:43.062 --> 0:36:46.022 It was never going to have the same vibe around it, 0:36:46.142 --> 0:36:49.502 the same momentum. So if you're ever gonna get your 0:36:49.582 --> 0:36:51.741 legs out, you're gonna get it out for this movie 0:36:51.741 --> 0:36:52.902 because it needs your publicity. 0:36:52.902 --> 0:36:56.062 Now, Okay, Jesse, You've just actually completely made my point. 0:36:56.342 --> 0:36:58.261 I'm saying that this is not in service of look 0:36:58.261 --> 0:37:00.542 at my post baby body. It's in service of this movie, 0:37:00.582 --> 0:37:04.902 which the genre is that it is a romantic fantasy. 0:37:04.982 --> 0:37:06.902 That's what she's dressing as a romantic fantasy. 0:37:06.982 --> 0:37:08.862 She's working. 0:37:09.542 --> 0:37:13.062 Not criticizing her either, but I feel a little bit 0:37:13.221 --> 0:37:18.261 sad because it feels a little bit like reassuring us 0:37:18.582 --> 0:37:21.461 that the baby's not going to change anything, that she's 0:37:21.542 --> 0:37:23.822 still just as sexy and attracted. 0:37:26.342 --> 0:37:29.261 Yes, I think that that is not an emotion that 0:37:29.302 --> 0:37:32.142 we haven't all felt. Whether it's getting back into your genes, 0:37:32.181 --> 0:37:34.622 it's somehow saying hey, I'm still here. 0:37:34.982 --> 0:37:37.542 I think she's saying I am still a working woman. 0:37:37.582 --> 0:37:38.942 She's got wathering heights coming up. 0:37:39.022 --> 0:37:41.702 Sorry, I'm still a working woman. Here's my bum. 0:37:42.302 --> 0:37:45.662 But it is consistent, it is thematically consistent. Wathering heights 0:37:45.661 --> 0:37:49.221 will be a completely different wardrobe. This totally makes sense 0:37:49.221 --> 0:37:51.902 with with what she's doing. If she was doing Inside 0:37:52.022 --> 0:37:55.902 out too or some like animation, she wouldn't be wearing 0:37:55.902 --> 0:37:57.861 these clothes. This is part of her job. 0:37:58.142 --> 0:38:01.102 Can we not deconstruct the fact that her job and 0:38:01.142 --> 0:38:05.862 getting attention in this economy involves the story Margo Robbie's 0:38:06.022 --> 0:38:09.261 hottest body in the world. She's back baby, forget the 0:38:09.302 --> 0:38:12.982 bab baby what baby? Well, Colin Farrell, who's in the 0:38:13.022 --> 0:38:16.022 same movie, gets to dress and say, it's a gadget. 0:38:16.102 --> 0:38:18.582 I looked up and it was thirteen degrees in lond. 0:38:18.502 --> 0:38:19.982 Yeah, you can tell she was actually shaking when she 0:38:20.062 --> 0:38:23.301 was freezing. This is always It happened with Wicked. It 0:38:23.302 --> 0:38:25.302 happens with every press tool. Like they're still in character. 0:38:25.382 --> 0:38:27.741 She's in character. She's wearing a character outfit. She's doing 0:38:27.741 --> 0:38:29.582 her job, she's getting paid, all power to her. 0:38:29.822 --> 0:38:31.142 Her character is naked. 0:38:31.422 --> 0:38:35.022 Yeah, romantic fantasy. As if you don't say that and 0:38:35.102 --> 0:38:37.702 go oh man, looking at Muga Robbie for two hours, 0:38:37.902 --> 0:38:38.622 I feel like that. 0:38:38.862 --> 0:38:41.781 I just think there's a level of anxiety revealed in 0:38:41.862 --> 0:38:44.221 dressing like that, Like I still. 0:38:43.942 --> 0:38:46.062 Want to be relevant, I still want to be here. 0:38:46.221 --> 0:38:48.382 I still want to be the femfertale enge and you, 0:38:48.582 --> 0:38:51.542 and it's like, yeah, Margot Robbie is not only is 0:38:51.582 --> 0:38:55.741 she a stunningly successful actor, she's also an amazing producer. 0:38:55.862 --> 0:38:59.661 She produced the Barbie movie, she's producing Wuthering Heights. Isn't 0:38:59.661 --> 0:39:02.022 there a point at which she can get our attention 0:39:02.302 --> 0:39:03.342 not through her body? 0:39:03.462 --> 0:39:06.261 So okay, now that she's had a baby, does she 0:39:06.342 --> 0:39:07.782 need to be wearing her moomoo? 0:39:08.022 --> 0:39:10.942 That's what helds, That's what a little bonnet? Is that 0:39:10.982 --> 0:39:13.502 what we want? No to me, it's I think it's 0:39:13.582 --> 0:39:17.542 revealing of the system and revealing of the system in 0:39:17.582 --> 0:39:21.422 which Margot Robbie works, which is I have to reassure 0:39:21.462 --> 0:39:25.182 everybody that I'm not mumsy, that I'm not in any 0:39:25.221 --> 0:39:30.342 way changed, that I'm even hotter than I was before 0:39:30.382 --> 0:39:33.181 I had a baby, and everyone's going to say it's 0:39:33.181 --> 0:39:35.221 her right to wear whatever she wants. Of course it is. 0:39:35.261 --> 0:39:38.781 We're talking about the system that rewards I've got my 0:39:38.902 --> 0:39:41.862 bum out, and it's not in the free way forward. 0:39:41.982 --> 0:39:45.022 Like I would posit that Jennifer Lawrence recently had a 0:39:45.062 --> 0:39:48.181 baby and then had a second baby in fairly quick succession, 0:39:48.741 --> 0:39:51.862 did not go down this exact path. And it's surprising 0:39:51.942 --> 0:39:55.301 to me because i'mlike Margot Robbie, Jennifer Lawrence isn't a 0:39:55.342 --> 0:39:56.781 power broker in Hollywood. 0:39:56.781 --> 0:39:57.542 Margot Robbie. 0:39:57.542 --> 0:39:59.182 Now if she says I want to make a movie 0:39:59.181 --> 0:40:01.821 of that book, that movie gets made and it's a hit. 0:40:02.102 --> 0:40:05.502 Jennifer Lawrence doesn't have that power. And yet, interestingly did 0:40:05.622 --> 0:40:08.262 choose a different path in terms of how she presented 0:40:08.302 --> 0:40:09.542 herself after having a baby. 0:40:10.022 --> 0:40:12.422 I think we've got a bit Pearl clutchy about mothers 0:40:12.462 --> 0:40:14.942 who are still like, I'm sexy, look at my legs, 0:40:14.942 --> 0:40:17.062 and you know what if she looks like that after 0:40:17.102 --> 0:40:18.741 having a baby and she's done. 0:40:18.661 --> 0:40:20.462 The movie and have to Kota. 0:40:21.102 --> 0:40:23.821 I hadn't even seen that picture actually yet, but I 0:40:23.942 --> 0:40:25.901 kind of love her. I think, yeah, great, I think 0:40:25.902 --> 0:40:28.341 that she's hilarious. Red carpets are about attention, and then 0:40:28.342 --> 0:40:30.142 we look at things the look you're being attention sticking 0:40:30.181 --> 0:40:31.821 on the red conic where your job is too good. 0:40:32.661 --> 0:40:34.622 I just think it's really interesting. 0:40:34.221 --> 0:40:37.421 The way Colin's inspector gadget like I do. Come back 0:40:37.462 --> 0:40:40.741 to that, like he is wearing the most covered up 0:40:40.781 --> 0:40:44.022 outfit you could possibly wear, which is a trench. 0:40:44.422 --> 0:40:46.622 So the marketing, what you're saying is the marketing of 0:40:46.661 --> 0:40:48.781 a movie now evolves. 0:40:48.502 --> 0:40:51.702 Around the quardrobe of the female start. Yes, that's exactly 0:40:51.701 --> 0:40:55.382 what I progress. Before we go. I came across a 0:40:55.422 --> 0:41:00.181 substack last night by Marina Cooley called seventeen household Habits 0:41:00.302 --> 0:41:04.062 that clear mental clutter. And I'm always looking for ways 0:41:04.062 --> 0:41:06.902 to drastically improve my life. On a Wednesday, I wanted 0:41:06.942 --> 0:41:09.341 to know how can I rearrange my home, my life 0:41:09.382 --> 0:41:12.861 so that there's no longer any stress. Well, she's got 0:41:12.862 --> 0:41:15.142 some tips. Okay, do you want to hear some of them? 0:41:15.181 --> 0:41:17.982 These are her tips for how we are going to 0:41:18.022 --> 0:41:21.942 improve our lives. First, one exit zone by the door. Now, 0:41:22.022 --> 0:41:24.781 an exit zone means that you have everything you would 0:41:24.822 --> 0:41:27.701 ever need before walking out the door. So right near 0:41:27.741 --> 0:41:31.102 the door you need either a cabinet or a cupboard 0:41:31.661 --> 0:41:36.301 or something that has your sonnies a piece off exactly, 0:41:36.661 --> 0:41:43.422 hats everything you need, second barrel exactly, but exactly. 0:41:44.062 --> 0:41:47.622 People have that, like the keys and stuff near the door, right. 0:41:47.661 --> 0:41:50.741 Keys, yes, but we have only recently had like a 0:41:50.781 --> 0:41:53.142 cupboard near the door that has like my hat and 0:41:53.181 --> 0:41:53.661 stuff in it. 0:41:53.741 --> 0:41:56.862 God, it's life. Change shoes inside your house. 0:41:57.102 --> 0:41:59.701 I sometimes do, but Luca doesn't like it. And so 0:42:00.181 --> 0:42:02.421 is there a collection of shoes there out the front door? 0:42:02.502 --> 0:42:02.701 Yeah? 0:42:02.781 --> 0:42:07.302 Yeah, Louca likes that. It'd be barefoot and maybe pregnant. 0:42:08.942 --> 0:42:12.942 Second thing, always buy in duplicates. So if you know 0:42:13.022 --> 0:42:15.622 you're going to consistently use something, you're out of hand soap, 0:42:15.661 --> 0:42:19.221 you're out of detergent, you're around your laundry stuff. You're 0:42:19.221 --> 0:42:21.381 not buying one, you're buying two. You're going to use it. 0:42:21.382 --> 0:42:23.301 It's not going to expire. That's the rule. 0:42:23.462 --> 0:42:23.582 Right. 0:42:23.781 --> 0:42:27.342 Expensive, It is expensive, but you're gonna buy it anyway, 0:42:27.462 --> 0:42:28.622 right like always. 0:42:28.422 --> 0:42:30.582 Everybody I'm just going to say, not everybody has because 0:42:30.582 --> 0:42:32.221 he leaves. Not everybody's got that's their cash. 0:42:32.302 --> 0:42:36.342 Keep going, all right, it's the latest and privilege. Okay, 0:42:36.382 --> 0:42:38.981 here's another one put the house to bed, so every 0:42:39.102 --> 0:42:41.901 night you have to do a close down where you like, 0:42:42.022 --> 0:42:45.381 everything goes away so that in the morning you come 0:42:45.422 --> 0:42:46.221 and have a look and you go. 0:42:46.422 --> 0:42:49.022 Very important to me, okay, is the rule that the 0:42:49.102 --> 0:42:52.542 last person who goes to bed is responsible for the 0:42:52.582 --> 0:42:53.181 closed down. 0:42:53.701 --> 0:42:56.661 No, that's too much pressure. I think that everyone is 0:42:56.701 --> 0:42:59.102 doing closed down. It's like a when I worked at 0:42:59.102 --> 0:43:01.942 a bar and you were doing the night shift and 0:43:01.942 --> 0:43:04.022 everyone would go, all right, we're closing everything down. I 0:43:04.022 --> 0:43:05.902 think there's got to be like a five to ten minute. 0:43:05.982 --> 0:43:07.982 The problem is if you live in a house, most 0:43:08.022 --> 0:43:10.421 people have very different sort of schedule. So someone might 0:43:10.502 --> 0:43:13.261 go into their room to witch movie or whatever, play 0:43:13.261 --> 0:43:17.502 their vibrator earlier than oh my god, so you never 0:43:17.582 --> 0:43:20.782 know people might be coming and going, so not everyone's 0:43:20.781 --> 0:43:23.582 always together to close down, and you can't close down 0:43:23.622 --> 0:43:25.181 at six. Well, let's be real. 0:43:25.261 --> 0:43:26.701 The person who does the closed down is the person 0:43:26.741 --> 0:43:28.221 who cares about doing the closed down. 0:43:28.582 --> 0:43:30.502 Yeah, exactly right, Thank god, it's not me. 0:43:30.942 --> 0:43:34.062 Okay. Here's my other one. A two week meal loop. 0:43:34.261 --> 0:43:37.422 So that means that you have ten weekly dinners same 0:43:37.462 --> 0:43:40.341 ones for those two weeks, and then you just have 0:43:40.462 --> 0:43:42.821 them on repeat. My shoe is I can't think of 0:43:42.862 --> 0:43:43.382 ten dinners. 0:43:43.502 --> 0:43:45.502 And my issue with these tips is they really went 0:43:45.542 --> 0:43:48.582 off the rails. They started getting really ridiculous some of 0:43:48.622 --> 0:43:51.542 the hips, and I feel like household hags always end 0:43:51.622 --> 0:43:53.901 up there. She started talking about how she has some 0:43:53.942 --> 0:43:56.661 fancy electronic gadget that puts everyone's schedule. 0:43:56.942 --> 0:43:57.102 Yeah. 0:43:57.221 --> 0:43:59.701 I was like, no, no, no, no, no affiliate link. 0:43:59.942 --> 0:44:00.822 Yeah. 0:44:00.862 --> 0:44:03.861 And she also had once a year. You're like, oh, 0:44:03.942 --> 0:44:06.142 once a year you need to sit down with your family, yes, 0:44:06.181 --> 0:44:08.781 including all your children and have what she calls a 0:44:08.862 --> 0:44:13.821 yearly fine out summit where you talk about things like goals, budgets, savings. 0:44:14.022 --> 0:44:16.062 What do you think of that? Well? I tried to 0:44:16.382 --> 0:44:18.701 organize a Zoom meeting the other day, as you know, Jesse, 0:44:18.822 --> 0:44:21.982 because you're invited. It didn't really attend in very family 0:44:22.062 --> 0:44:24.422 meeting I did. I said, guys, family Zoom because we 0:44:24.462 --> 0:44:26.701 had to discuss arrangements for the dogs when I was 0:44:26.942 --> 0:44:31.342 beeway and just howses and various things, and the family 0:44:31.422 --> 0:44:32.342 wasn't very supportive. 0:44:32.462 --> 0:44:34.741 A highlight was when Luca thought the call was over 0:44:34.862 --> 0:44:37.022 and he said, that was an effing waste of time. 0:44:37.181 --> 0:44:40.741 And I'm still there I still still there, do you 0:44:40.781 --> 0:44:42.542 know what I mean? And also one of my children 0:44:42.542 --> 0:44:45.462 that will remain nameless, Remy just kept making himself like 0:44:45.502 --> 0:44:47.221 into a watermelon or into. 0:44:46.982 --> 0:44:48.782 A cash that's your finance summit. 0:44:48.822 --> 0:44:49.422 That was funny. 0:44:49.982 --> 0:44:51.861 A big thank you to all of you the out 0:44:51.902 --> 0:44:55.181 louders for listening to today's show and our fabulous team 0:44:55.422 --> 0:44:58.622 for putting this show together. And do not forget you 0:44:58.622 --> 0:45:00.741 can watch us on YouTube. Mayor has a spark this 0:45:00.822 --> 0:45:02.102 show and she'd like you to see it. 0:45:02.142 --> 0:45:04.022 I do, And I'm going to be here all week. 0:45:04.181 --> 0:45:06.142 Yeah, you're going to join us for I'm. 0:45:06.102 --> 0:45:08.022 Having a nice time. Thanks for having me, Oh my 0:45:08.062 --> 0:45:08.941 goodness being great. 0:45:09.221 --> 0:45:11.382 We will be back in your ears tomorrow. 0:45:11.422 --> 0:45:12.182 Bye bye. 0:45:13.062 --> 0:45:15.582 Shout out to any Mom and me A subscribers listening. 0:45:15.822 --> 0:45:17.982 If you love the show and you want to support us, 0:45:18.221 --> 0:45:20.702 subscribing to Mom and Me I is the very best 0:45:20.741 --> 0:45:23.622 way to do so. There's a link in the episode description.