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Speaker 1: You're listening to a Muma Mia podcast.

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Speaker 2: Mama Mea acknowledges the traditional owners of the land and

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Speaker 2: waters that this podcast is recorded on.

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Speaker 1: For me, happiness is like it's like the absence of stress.

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Speaker 3: Hello, and welcome to that.

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Speaker 2: Are you happy? The podcast that asks the questions you've

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Speaker 2: always wanted to know from the people who appear to

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Speaker 2: have it all. Josh Thomas is a comedian, actor, and

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Speaker 2: writer who wrote and starred in the beloved ABC series

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Speaker 2: Please Like Me. He is also he admits poor with

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Speaker 2: his time management.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I didn't come to this interview today.

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Speaker 4: How is it?

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Speaker 1: Lunch starts at half an hour, leads I didn't know

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Speaker 1: what was happening, they told me, But I needn't know

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Speaker 1: what's happening.

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Speaker 2: I really wanted to invite Josh on the podcast because

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Speaker 2: he's experienced enormous career success on television and on stage

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Speaker 2: and in Hollywood. But the subject matter of what he

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Speaker 2: creates is steeped in the uncomfortable complexities of life. He's

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Speaker 2: portrayed suicide on screen, grief, dysfunctional relationships, abortion, He explores

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Speaker 2: neuroses and neurodiversity, and sexuality and disability, and he does

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Speaker 2: it with humor and compassion, but I haven't really heard

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Speaker 2: Josh Thomas asked about him. Here's my chat with Josh Thomas.

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Speaker 2: Josh Thomas, you are one of Australia's best known comedians.

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Speaker 2: You're also an actor, writer, creator, showrunner and right now

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Speaker 2: you're in the midst of the Melbourne Comedy Festival with

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Speaker 2: your show. Let's tidy up about how your brain struggles

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Speaker 2: to do the small stuff. You're off and on stage

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Speaker 2: and on our TV screens and in our phones, and

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Speaker 2: you're funny and you're very clever and very creative. But

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Speaker 2: putting aside all of that stuff, we can see what

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Speaker 2: is your life like right now day to day.

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Speaker 1: So last week I've been losing my voice a little bit.

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Speaker 1: That's very scary because that's what I do for a living.

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Speaker 1: So mostly I've been laying in this room that I'm

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Speaker 1: in now, and I have two like very like remedial

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Speaker 1: looking steamers, and they just like steam up the room

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Speaker 1: and it gets very very hot in you and I

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Speaker 1: just lay in here like like and then a bay

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Speaker 1: Marie like a little dumpling rolling around in a bay marine.

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Speaker 1: I've really been liking it, to be honest and then

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Speaker 1: I go and do my show and then I tell

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Speaker 1: everyone that I can't go out because I'm losing my voice,

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Speaker 1: and then I do Yeah.

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Speaker 4: Right.

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Speaker 2: And when you're in Melbourne, do you stay with friends,

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Speaker 2: stay with family or are you.

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Speaker 3: In a hotel?

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Speaker 1: Like?

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Speaker 2: What do you do when you're back in Melbourne.

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Speaker 1: I'm from Melbourne, but I'm in a hotel at the moment. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I'm in a sad, reary hotel.

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Speaker 3: Shouldn't you be it like.

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Speaker 2: The Crown or something. Aren't you famous enough that you

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Speaker 2: stay in all the fancy hotels?

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Speaker 1: I think I should send some emails about the truth is.

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Speaker 1: The truth is I've been I've been onto her since

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Speaker 1: so from October till September, I'll be on to her.

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Speaker 1: I'll be home for maybe eight days in Ali for

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Speaker 1: the whole time. And I just actually like, this hotel

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Speaker 1: is sad, but like posh hotels to me, don't they

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Speaker 1: have no they feel nothing, like, no character, They have

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Speaker 1: no joy, but like the fact that they're posh and

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Speaker 1: like all the stuff that you pay for really doesn't

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Speaker 1: make me that happy anymore. They just feel like very

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Speaker 1: small actually, and there's no washer or dry hour in them.

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Speaker 3: Yes, yes, that's good import to me enjoy.

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Speaker 1: On month six, it's just being able to wash my clothes.

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Speaker 2: Your current show is about the kind of brain you have,

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Speaker 2: and you've been diagnosed with ADHD and autism, and it

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Speaker 2: was actually by making the TV shows you've created that

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Speaker 2: audiences watched and almost diagnosed you with autism. What in

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Speaker 2: hindsight were the hallmarks of that? Like, what do you

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Speaker 2: look back on and think, oh, yeah, now that I've

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Speaker 2: got that diagnosis, that was probably autism.

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Speaker 1: I mean the really obvious ones, like the most present ones,

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Speaker 1: the ones that like you know, like you know, the

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Speaker 1: psychiatrist has decided, like at forty seconds. And I don't

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Speaker 1: like eye contact, Well that's not true. People think autisty

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Speaker 1: people don't like eye contact. Eye contact to autistic people

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Speaker 1: feel very very intense. So I I love eye contact.

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Speaker 1: And if I'm talking to somebody that I feel really

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Speaker 1: safe with, that I'm really comfortable with, then eye contact

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Speaker 1: can be great. But generally it's like just very daunting

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Speaker 1: and it just feels like, I don't know how to

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Speaker 1: explain it. It's just like a physiological reaction to it.

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Speaker 1: It's just a bit extreme, like you were doing something

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Speaker 1: a bit dangerous and you can see that when you

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Speaker 1: see me talk for anybody, my accent is like very

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Speaker 1: autistic or to see people have like weird accents. And

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Speaker 1: I don't think that most people are in their head

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Speaker 1: as much as I am. In social situations. A big

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Speaker 1: thing is sort of not really understand I think a

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Speaker 1: very good instinct for social interactions or like understanding other

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Speaker 1: people's ill to see people generally aren't very good to

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Speaker 1: understand about the people are coming from. And I mean

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Speaker 1: that's like such a generalization. I feel like people will

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Speaker 1: be mad at me anytime I'd say anything that autistic

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Speaker 1: people are. But and then you have to do like

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Speaker 1: a lot of processing to think about why everybody did

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Speaker 1: the stuff that they did. And I'm always just trying

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Speaker 1: to figure out I'm always trying to put together the

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Speaker 1: puzzle of why people are doing what people do, and like,

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Speaker 1: at this age of my life, I'm the best person

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Speaker 1: of the universe at it at like telling you what

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Speaker 1: people were thinking in a particular social situation and what

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Speaker 1: they want. I'm like really good at knowing what people

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Speaker 1: want now in like a creepy way. But when I

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Speaker 1: was a kid, I had like no instinct for.

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Speaker 2: It so is it almost like you understand it now

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Speaker 2: and probably through writing characters and being in writers' rooms

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Speaker 2: you understand it from an intellectual perspective, but instinctively it

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Speaker 2: wasn't there. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. The other big thing actually they made me realize

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Speaker 1: I was autistic when I was playing because I made

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Speaker 1: a TV show about it, is I was so much

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Speaker 1: wisked when I was younger, and when I left high school,

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Speaker 1: my social skills were so low, Like definitely, I started

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Speaker 1: stand up because, like stand up comedy felt like a

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Speaker 1: more safe way to explain who I am than like

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Speaker 1: talking to people at a barbecue like that was less

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Speaker 1: anxiety and joicing. I want to say I was an

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Speaker 1: anxious person. I just like I just didn't know how

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Speaker 1: to do it. I couldn't figure it out. I'm never anxious.

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Speaker 1: And the kind of improvement that I've made at being

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Speaker 1: able to have these social interactions, that's actually not normal,

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Speaker 1: Like you're not meant to improve on a bell cuev

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Speaker 1: in social interactions in your life, and autistic people do

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Speaker 1: that because they're always trying to work things out. They're

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Speaker 1: always trying to make up for that lack of instinct.

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Speaker 1: All autistic people extroverted autistic people are doing this and

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Speaker 1: then sometimes get much better at social skills than people

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Speaker 1: who have a good instinct for those people haven't really

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Speaker 1: been self noting themselves so constantly.

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Speaker 2: Do you think it's also because you found your thing

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Speaker 2: so young and you found your thing and maybe as

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Speaker 2: a result, found your people.

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Speaker 1: I think I'm really lucky that I'm famous, and like,

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Speaker 1: I like, I really think that, like it's really helped me.

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Speaker 1: I didn't like it when I was younger, but like

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Speaker 1: going into social interactions and people kind of knowing who

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Speaker 1: I am and what I'm about, having like a sense

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Speaker 1: of like what it's going to be, that really helps

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Speaker 1: me socially. Like that's great. People just knowing that I

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Speaker 1: think that I'm funny. It's like really helpful people meet

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Speaker 1: talking to people who don't know that I think that

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Speaker 1: I'm funny, They take things really weirdly. They think I'm

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Speaker 1: being really intense or like mean sometimes. Did you know

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Speaker 1: that I think that I'm funny? That's like a really

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Speaker 1: helpful introduction in life.

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Speaker 2: It's incredible that you've almost got this built in level

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Speaker 2: of intimacy with people you meet because they know who

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Speaker 2: you are, they know where you're coming from.

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Speaker 3: You're right.

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Speaker 2: They know that you're funny. So if you say something dry,

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Speaker 2: they know that that's meant to be a joke.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, they know the intense. I mean they might not

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Speaker 1: think that I'm funny. And look, I don't want to

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Speaker 1: sound like I think everybody I talk to knows who

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Speaker 1: I am. But like now people do that I can

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Speaker 1: kind of skip the weird, the weird introduction of trying

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Speaker 1: and explain myself.

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Speaker 2: How about your ADHD when you look back on childhood

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Speaker 2: adolescents anytime before you were diagnosed, what was ADHD that

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Speaker 2: you didn't recognize?

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Speaker 1: I mean, I would say the ADHD at this stage

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Speaker 1: in my life is like much harder than the autism,

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Speaker 1: even though people would think the autism is more hardcore.

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Speaker 1: I mean I didn't come to this interview, did I

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Speaker 1: was at lunch starts at half an hour late. I

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Speaker 1: didn't know what was happening. Love it it all mean,

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Speaker 1: but I didn't know what's happening. I mean my house

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Speaker 1: is like you've seen out there, how much stuff there

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Speaker 1: is just like everywhere, Like there's just stuff everywhere. Turns

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Speaker 1: up at the Art Center and there's a suitcase there.

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Speaker 1: From Channel to end of just like stuff that I

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Speaker 1: left backstage at this show that we filmed. I just

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Speaker 1: got an email from from Chloe, my manager's assistant, asking

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Speaker 1: where I wanted to send the stuff that I left

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Speaker 1: at the other show that we found. Like there's just

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Speaker 1: like stuff whirring around me in circles, like pretty stuff.

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Speaker 1: I just can't keep track or anything.

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Speaker 2: Do you describe yourself as incredibly honest and straightforward and

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Speaker 2: that's contributed to a lot of your success in comedy

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Speaker 2: and TV because you're incisive and direct and you tell

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Speaker 2: the truth and it resonates with people. Over the years,

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Speaker 2: when you've been in the public eye and the culture

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Speaker 2: has changed a little bit where it can kind of

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Speaker 2: be scary to be honest, because what if just earlier,

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Speaker 2: when you were talking about autism you sort of said, oh,

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Speaker 2: some people don't like me talking about autism in this way.

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Speaker 2: Do you get nervous about being at the center of

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Speaker 2: such hot button topics like sexuality and mental health and neurodiversity.

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Speaker 2: Do you get scared about getting things wrong?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, everyone's so scared of being canceled, But then everyone's

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Speaker 1: been canceled so many times by now, Actually that Ukraini

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Speaker 1: of realize is going to be okay. I think that

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Speaker 1: like era of like Twitter, everyone's trying to take everyone

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Speaker 1: down is kind of softened because everybody's been taken down

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Speaker 1: and everyone realize that it's not worth it. Right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: anyone was ever trying to take me down.

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Speaker 5: I was.

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Speaker 1: Two weeks later, I've looked back and they've had their

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Speaker 1: own kafuffle because I started set up when I was seventeen,

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Speaker 1: and I thought, when I was seventeen, I don't know

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Speaker 1: anything about the world. I'm a child, and it's going

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Speaker 1: to be so annoying for everybody to hear me get

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Speaker 1: up and give my opinions about things. So I'm just

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Speaker 1: going to talk about my life and just like share

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Speaker 1: what I've done. And that was like, actually, I just

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Speaker 1: can't believe how smart a thing that was for me

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Speaker 1: to realize when I was seventeen. Seventeen year old's a

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Speaker 1: stupid Actually, it's just like one moment of like insight

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Speaker 1: that I had. So I've always just felt safe for

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Speaker 1: talking about myself. So the reason why I'm like oversharing

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Speaker 1: is you can't get mad at me for telling a

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Speaker 1: story about you know, you mentioned mental health. I did

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Speaker 1: a whole show about my mum attempting suicide, and that's

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Speaker 1: a personal story. That's a safe story to tell as

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Speaker 1: long as she's happy about it. I'm sharing something of myself.

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Speaker 1: Like where I started get nervous is when I start

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Speaker 1: talking about the world or what other people are doing,

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Speaker 1: because I don't know.

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Speaker 2: That's such a smart way of putting it. And I

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Speaker 2: think you're exactly right that by telling your own story

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Speaker 2: that's kind of impenetrable. People can't say that your truth

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Speaker 2: isn't true. But then you've done Q and A a

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Speaker 2: few years ago with Bob Catter. It was so funny

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Speaker 2: you talking to him because I think he believes there's

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Speaker 2: no homosexuals in Queensland.

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Speaker 5: What worries me when I hear you talk like this

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Speaker 5: and I spent let's say, googling you and you're adorable,

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Speaker 5: is you say a lot of really important, powerful things right,

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Speaker 5: like what you've said tonight. I hear it and I

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Speaker 5: think this is a guy that cares and it's really important.

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Speaker 5: When I hear you talk about dairy farmers and you

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Speaker 5: say people in the cities should spend more than two

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Speaker 5: dollars on milk, I agree with you, but then when

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Speaker 5: you go out and you deny the existence of homosexuals

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Speaker 5: in North Queensland, they exist.

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Speaker 1: There's an apphole grinder. I'll put it on your phone. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: he said there was no gains in North Queensland. It

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Speaker 1: was one of against gay marriage. We're on a mental

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Speaker 1: health episode and I just I really went. But I

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Speaker 1: don't think I would do that anymore. I posted that

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Speaker 1: clip recently in afscments. I wrote, this is back when

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Speaker 1: I was brave, But it's just I just I don't

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Speaker 1: want to be on the attack anymore. I'm so tired

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Speaker 1: of seeing people attack people actually online and in these

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Speaker 1: things I think everybody is. It's not nice. It's actually

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Speaker 1: not nice. Even if you're right and you're yelling at

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Speaker 1: somebody about their opinion that you think is wrong, that's

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Speaker 1: a drag like it's just not a nice way to live.

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Speaker 1: So I'm trying more and more and more to just

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Speaker 1: focus on sort of saying what I want to say

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Speaker 1: about the world. I'm like, what I think is like

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Speaker 1: showing the word how I want to show it and

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Speaker 1: kind of ignoring what other people think. Because the other

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Speaker 1: thing about queenness actually is I'm just a bit sick

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Speaker 1: of us begging for people's approval. Fuck them. I don't

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Speaker 1: need buff Kada to like gay people. I don't care.

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Speaker 1: Why does that matter? If he wants to go around

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Speaker 1: not linking gay people, that's his problem. Who cares? What

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Speaker 1: jk rowling thing? Why are we like listening to her

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Speaker 1: when there's so many people in this world that like

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Speaker 1: us and things that're went gool that we can hang

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Speaker 1: out with and I want to go for lunch with us.

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Speaker 1: Let's gope for lunch with those people and ignored jk Rowling. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: she sucks? Who can?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a really interesting way of talking about it,

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Speaker 2: because the Internet, I think, especially when you're a public figure,

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Speaker 2: can become something that really dictates your art. And I

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Speaker 2: can imagine for you there's probably been even in that

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Speaker 2: bobcat A moment, it's funny you felt like you were

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Speaker 2: going him, But to me it didn't feel like that.

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Speaker 2: It felt funny and light and honest that you told

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Speaker 2: him you'd get him on grinder and he'd be able

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Speaker 2: to say that they were gay people in Queensland.

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Speaker 1: This is one of those weird things when you realized, like, why,

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Speaker 1: I really my memory is so unreliable. I always looked

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Speaker 1: back on that moment and felt like I had lost

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Speaker 1: my temper on TV. And I only rewatched it recently

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Speaker 1: after like sinx YenS, And in my memory, I screamed

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Speaker 1: at that man and I was so fired up, and

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Speaker 1: I watched it back recently, I'm like the nicest, sweetest

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Speaker 1: person in my like, I'm being so gentle to this

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Speaker 1: homophobic guard.

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Speaker 3: You keep telling him you like him.

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Speaker 1: I think I told I like him. Yeah, I have

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Speaker 1: no idea why. In my memory, I was so mad.

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Speaker 2: Coming up next what it felt like to be publicly

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Speaker 2: piled on, and why celebrities in LA aren't happier than us,

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Speaker 2: and a story about a huge Hollywood party. There was

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Speaker 2: a moment a few years ago, I remember where you

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Speaker 2: found yourself at the bottom of a very quick moving

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Speaker 2: temporary pylon. How does it feel to be in the

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Speaker 2: moment when people are shitting on you? Does it feel

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Speaker 2: all consuming?

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Speaker 1: There's a real frustration that you feel when you link.

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Speaker 1: That's like a particular clip you're referencing, and it was

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Speaker 1: old and it was small, and it was absolutely like

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Speaker 1: I was being disgusting in it and everything I said,

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Speaker 1: and I regret, like you could have shown me that

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Speaker 1: clip ten minutes later, and I would would have been like,

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Speaker 1: was he talking about there? I don't understand. And it's

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Speaker 1: like people do this thing in these times where they

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Speaker 1: think like, oh, this is the worst thing we've seen

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Speaker 1: you do. This must be the truth, this must be

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Speaker 1: like the man behind the way you've shown yourself. You

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Speaker 1: have all of the right wing people on Twitter trying

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Speaker 1: to find more clips because they want to cancel the canceller,

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Speaker 1: and then you have all of left wing Twitter trying

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Speaker 1: to find clips because they want to I don't know,

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Speaker 1: they just want to prove their point that people in

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Speaker 1: the world to mean and there's nothing else, like nothing

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Speaker 1: else has come up, and I don't know, there's just

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Speaker 1: this really frustrating thing where you feel like you can't

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Speaker 1: defend yourself. All you apologize and I apologize and I

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Speaker 1: meant it, and you don't really get a chance to

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Speaker 1: defend yourself because the more you defend yourself, the more

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Speaker 1: you're creating a press cycle.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Also, I mean in that period of my life, I

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Speaker 1: was about to go to season two on a TV

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Speaker 1: show for Disney that was like that was about me

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Speaker 1: talking badly about diversity. We added to first cast with

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Speaker 1: the first ever autistic girl ever out autistic to be

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Speaker 1: a lead on TV show. We had a diverse cast,

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Speaker 1: with a super diverse crew, Like I had really like

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Speaker 1: taking all the lessons and like and acted and like

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Speaker 1: the really the best I could in this new show.

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Speaker 1: I divorced writers room. I had an all female writers

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Speaker 1: room in season one. Like we were really like like

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Speaker 1: like we were really really trying to do everything. I

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Speaker 1: was really my second TV show, and I really like

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Speaker 1: learn how to do all this stuff, and I was

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Speaker 1: working out how to do it well. And I know,

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Speaker 1: I mean Disney never said this, but I know that

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Speaker 1: as this cancelation is going on, that they're having conversations

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Speaker 1: about canceling the show, about all those people getting fired

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Speaker 1: because of this thing that I did. That's really really scary.

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Speaker 1: It did change my attitude to how I entreat public figures. Actually,

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Speaker 1: I mean, I think I'd already decided this years before,

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Speaker 1: like that I'm just not going to be mad at

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Speaker 1: people who make mistakes publicly. But it really like that

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Speaker 1: experience was so it was so bad.

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Speaker 2: And I think you're right that often in those moments

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Speaker 2: is actually ironic if you look at the bigger picture,

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Speaker 2: that you're like, hold on your pilot on a guy

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Speaker 2: who's made a show about autism and is currently creating

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Speaker 2: the most diverse show and has created one of the

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Speaker 2: most diverse shows in Australia. Like, it's incredibly infuriating, And

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Speaker 2: I imagine that must be such a hard position to

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Speaker 2: be in because you're right. You can't fight back because

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Speaker 2: that makes it worse my.

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Speaker 1: Backup makes I do agree with them. I do agree

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Speaker 1: that the clipe was really bad. If I saw someone

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Speaker 1: else do the clip, I'd feel really mad. So what

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Speaker 1: I said on that clip, I'd feel really mad at them.

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Speaker 1: I'd probably want to tweet about how stupid they are.

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Speaker 1: I just don't really understand this thing in human nature

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Speaker 1: where people think that because they've seen the bandside of somebody,

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Speaker 1: that that's the truth of who they really are. I

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Speaker 1: haven't really understood that about anybody really.

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Speaker 2: That is such a brilliant point that the worst thing

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Speaker 2: somebody has done is not a reflection of the complex

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Speaker 2: human being that they are.

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Speaker 3: And it also kind of.

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Speaker 2: Leads to the bigger idea of this show, which is

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Speaker 2: that things can look a certain way from the outside

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Speaker 2: and be very very different behind the scenes, behind closed

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Speaker 2: doors in reality. So I wanted to ask you, you

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Speaker 2: obviously live this incredible life, your very Hollywood. It's pretty amazing.

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Speaker 2: Has there been a moment where the world told you

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Speaker 2: you'd be happy and you actually weren't.

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Speaker 1: Hanging out with Uber's successful people? Sucks?

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Speaker 2: I mean, I was just going to say, like I

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Speaker 2: wouldn't know, but I just offended everyone in my life.

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Speaker 1: The thing about Ali that they don't link and he

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Speaker 1: complaining about Ali because everyone complains about Ala, and I

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Speaker 1: didn't know what it was when I moved there and

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Speaker 1: I made a TV show, I thought it was gonna

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Speaker 1: be really cool. So this is like, really the answer

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Speaker 1: to your question. It just is so empty. Everyone's striving, right,

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Speaker 1: everyone's thinking about their five year plan in a way

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Speaker 1: that I've never experienced in another country. Right in Australia,

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Speaker 1: everyone's just trying to have a fun party. I'm like,

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Speaker 1: if were working on a project, actually make project work.

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Speaker 1: But everybody there is thinking about their next step. But

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Speaker 1: this is like at the club, right's still on their mind.

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Speaker 1: They're still thinking about who's in the club. And I

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Speaker 1: just don't want to lift like that. I find it

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Speaker 1: really boring. And also the other thing is you have

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Speaker 1: a bit of a success, but it's never as big

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Speaker 1: as what you feel like you could be doing or

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Speaker 1: what people around you are doing. I mean, Ali is designing.

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Speaker 1: There's like the Hollywood Hills. They literally put the rich

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Speaker 1: people on the hills to look down on you and link.

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Speaker 1: Everybody feels like they should be doing more, and I

401
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Speaker 1: just I don't know why people think that if they

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Speaker 1: weren't doing more, they would be happier, because it's just

403
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Speaker 1: not true. And I think actually you can just get

404
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Speaker 1: the biggest show or be more famous, Like I don't

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Speaker 1: Beyonce is not that happy, is she? I know?

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Speaker 2: That's literally the point of this podcast is Beyonce happier

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Speaker 2: than the restaurants. Have you found yourself caught up in

408
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Speaker 2: that in La, Like, do you feel yourself absorbing it?

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Speaker 3: By Osmosis?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean you feel like, I mean, I'm just

411
00:20:05,800 --> 00:20:08,920
Speaker 1: not an ambitious person. I'm not link out there doing

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Speaker 1: this stuff like I really want to be able to

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Speaker 1: make TV shows like doing it like I'm not like

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Speaker 1: making moves to the claim a ladder or anything. And

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Speaker 1: you do just always surrounded by it. You start to

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Speaker 1: feel like maybe you're not doing enough, doing enough? What

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Speaker 1: like I couldn't have a pool. It wish I had

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Speaker 1: a pool, I suppose, but I don't know. I would

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Speaker 1: have been in the pool with kids.

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Speaker 2: Yes, okay, I also wish I had a pool. I

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Speaker 2: think about that a lot. I think my goal in

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Speaker 2: life is to have a swimming pool, but I don't

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Speaker 2: think I ever will. But yes, in La, yes, your

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Speaker 2: pool may be full of cuts.

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Speaker 1: We have such a better time getting one of those

426
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Speaker 1: fifteen dollars ones from Big w and blowing it up

427
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Speaker 1: and feeling out with water and yeah sardy, Like I

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Speaker 1: just I was surprised how much I was like, oh

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Speaker 1: I got to get out of here, how much I

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Speaker 1: supped to feel like I was feeling. I'm feeling absolutely

431
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Speaker 1: not like you start feeling why and I in Marvel

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Speaker 1: or something. Yes, I would hate to be Actually, I

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Speaker 1: don't tell them.

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Speaker 2: Man, You'll open to the opportunity if it arrives. You

435
00:21:18,720 --> 00:21:22,520
Speaker 2: auditioned to be Greg in succession the.

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Speaker 1: Only audition I've ever done.

437
00:21:23,960 --> 00:21:28,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, and you didn't get it? Greg is Greg? And

438
00:21:29,040 --> 00:21:32,280
Speaker 2: is that the sort of thing that Hollywood makes you think, like, oh,

439
00:21:32,359 --> 00:21:34,119
Speaker 2: what if I had got that? What if I'd ridden

440
00:21:34,120 --> 00:21:36,240
Speaker 2: that train? What if I was now I can't remember

441
00:21:36,240 --> 00:21:38,240
Speaker 2: that actor's name, and I know your name, so maybe

442
00:21:38,359 --> 00:21:39,200
Speaker 2: it doesn't even matter.

443
00:21:39,240 --> 00:21:42,600
Speaker 1: But yeah, well, let's say they light to you. The

444
00:21:42,640 --> 00:21:44,240
Speaker 1: thing in Alien is they just light to your face.

445
00:21:44,280 --> 00:21:47,760
Speaker 1: And I'm always seeing Australians come over and they do

446
00:21:47,800 --> 00:21:50,320
Speaker 1: all these meetings. They book their meetings for the first

447
00:21:50,320 --> 00:21:52,840
Speaker 1: two meets and they're so excited. Sorry, I sit them

448
00:21:52,840 --> 00:21:56,639
Speaker 1: down and I see they're lying to you. I love you.

449
00:21:57,240 --> 00:21:59,960
Speaker 1: Maybe things are going really well. I'm sure they like you.

450
00:22:00,160 --> 00:22:04,200
Speaker 1: But until there's like a contract. They're taking meetings so

451
00:22:04,240 --> 00:22:07,639
Speaker 1: that they can tell their boss that they took a meeting.

452
00:22:07,920 --> 00:22:10,240
Speaker 1: The agent sending the meetings so they can tell you

453
00:22:10,560 --> 00:22:13,399
Speaker 1: that they set a meeting, and then you're now in

454
00:22:13,480 --> 00:22:16,200
Speaker 1: this meeting and the meeting is not for any reason

455
00:22:16,720 --> 00:22:19,359
Speaker 1: other than so that they all tell each other that

456
00:22:19,359 --> 00:22:21,280
Speaker 1: they took a meeting. So I mean, I don't do

457
00:22:21,359 --> 00:22:24,800
Speaker 1: any meetings anymore unless there's like a real project on

458
00:22:24,880 --> 00:22:26,680
Speaker 1: the table, like unless it's a script or if it's

459
00:22:26,720 --> 00:22:29,400
Speaker 1: somebody that commissions shows and we're pitching trying to sell

460
00:22:29,400 --> 00:22:32,760
Speaker 1: a show. That just is places this weird game with

461
00:22:32,800 --> 00:22:35,760
Speaker 1: you where you feel like, yeah, you always feel like

462
00:22:35,840 --> 00:22:38,480
Speaker 1: someone's about to give you a movie.

463
00:22:39,240 --> 00:22:43,200
Speaker 2: What has it been like when you meet people who

464
00:22:43,480 --> 00:22:46,679
Speaker 2: have massive profiles and have had the big break? What

465
00:22:46,720 --> 00:22:48,920
Speaker 2: does it feel like to meet your idols in that way?

466
00:22:49,080 --> 00:22:50,600
Speaker 3: We're happier, they're not.

467
00:22:51,040 --> 00:22:52,879
Speaker 1: No, no, no no.

468
00:22:54,120 --> 00:22:58,280
Speaker 2: Are they different to how you'd expect? Are they confident?

469
00:22:58,400 --> 00:23:01,520
Speaker 2: Do they come across the way you'd think given public profiles?

470
00:23:01,800 --> 00:23:04,480
Speaker 1: They don't seem like they're having an easier time making friends.

471
00:23:05,440 --> 00:23:09,240
Speaker 1: And actually, definitely what happens is really famous people and

472
00:23:09,280 --> 00:23:12,959
Speaker 1: really rich people get into this dictator's dilemma, you know,

473
00:23:13,120 --> 00:23:15,400
Speaker 1: where it seems like everyone really loves them, but they

474
00:23:15,400 --> 00:23:18,320
Speaker 1: have no choice but to love them. And you see

475
00:23:18,359 --> 00:23:22,280
Speaker 1: that a lot with like every super rich person. They

476
00:23:22,320 --> 00:23:25,600
Speaker 1: can't trust that anybody likes them for them. Wow, and

477
00:23:25,640 --> 00:23:30,159
Speaker 1: it's incredibly sad. Yeah, are you staying out with this?

478
00:23:30,200 --> 00:23:32,760
Speaker 1: Director of those counseled terms. I was really really bad

479
00:23:32,800 --> 00:23:34,720
Speaker 1: guy and I did a show about it in I

480
00:23:34,760 --> 00:23:37,480
Speaker 1: did a sorry about my last show, and he just

481
00:23:37,600 --> 00:23:43,000
Speaker 1: couldn't handle having that much power, didn't know what to

482
00:23:43,040 --> 00:23:45,280
Speaker 1: do with it, and then became a real bad villain.

483
00:23:45,880 --> 00:23:48,240
Speaker 1: And then other people that just went to brunch a

484
00:23:48,280 --> 00:23:51,320
Speaker 1: one famous person's house. I don't want to tell you who.

485
00:23:52,120 --> 00:23:53,960
Speaker 1: Then it was like just because I'm talking about that,

486
00:23:54,040 --> 00:23:56,400
Speaker 1: they were really funny and nice, but like I looked

487
00:23:56,440 --> 00:23:58,480
Speaker 1: around the table and I was like, oh, that's your producer,

488
00:23:58,520 --> 00:24:00,520
Speaker 1: and these are like three girls that you barely know,

489
00:24:00,600 --> 00:24:03,280
Speaker 1: and like, I'm here, you don't know me, Like you

490
00:24:03,359 --> 00:24:05,359
Speaker 1: don't really have friends.

491
00:24:05,720 --> 00:24:08,640
Speaker 2: Yes, it's like people who travel with like their hairdresser

492
00:24:08,640 --> 00:24:10,879
Speaker 2: and their makeup artist, and it's a little bit like

493
00:24:11,359 --> 00:24:13,080
Speaker 2: are they your friends or there your stuff?

494
00:24:13,920 --> 00:24:16,119
Speaker 1: Yes, exactly, like a creepy middle crown.

495
00:24:16,440 --> 00:24:17,440
Speaker 4: Yeah.

496
00:24:17,600 --> 00:24:20,679
Speaker 2: You have a TikTok video about how you're at a

497
00:24:20,680 --> 00:24:22,840
Speaker 2: party and you saw somebody wearing a John Meyer shirt

498
00:24:22,880 --> 00:24:23,920
Speaker 2: and it was actually john Nyam.

499
00:24:24,480 --> 00:24:25,920
Speaker 1: Yeah. I was really annoyed, and let me go to

500
00:24:26,000 --> 00:24:27,800
Speaker 1: this straight pani. So this party is so straight that

501
00:24:27,800 --> 00:24:29,600
Speaker 1: boys isn't. John may emerged and it was John Mayer.

502
00:24:29,840 --> 00:24:32,360
Speaker 1: You've actually had drinks to John Mayer. He's really funny.

503
00:24:32,720 --> 00:24:34,359
Speaker 1: I really like John Maya, and he does sort of

504
00:24:34,359 --> 00:24:37,440
Speaker 1: seem like he's having fun. He's just like scowlsing around town,

505
00:24:37,520 --> 00:24:40,639
Speaker 1: popping in. Okay, the most fancy party he went to.

506
00:24:41,640 --> 00:24:45,040
Speaker 1: Seth McFarland. He's the creator of Family Guy yeah, yes,

507
00:24:45,200 --> 00:24:48,160
Speaker 1: his holiday party. And he has this same holiday party

508
00:24:48,200 --> 00:24:50,560
Speaker 1: where they build like a giant white tent over his

509
00:24:50,600 --> 00:24:54,840
Speaker 1: tennis court, and he hires the La Philharmonic Orchestra to

510
00:24:54,840 --> 00:24:56,480
Speaker 1: play all night and people sing in front of the

511
00:24:56,600 --> 00:24:59,960
Speaker 1: La Philharmonic Orchestra for some reason this year, not that

512
00:24:59,960 --> 00:25:01,840
Speaker 1: many people saying, it's kind of like a karaoke night,

513
00:25:01,840 --> 00:25:03,800
Speaker 1: and like Christina Aguilera was supposed to get up and

514
00:25:03,840 --> 00:25:05,840
Speaker 1: she got nervous, so he mostly just because he likes

515
00:25:05,880 --> 00:25:08,000
Speaker 1: to crew, and so he mostly just sings the whole night.

516
00:25:08,400 --> 00:25:10,280
Speaker 1: And there's lots of famous people that I'm sorry, I

517
00:25:10,320 --> 00:25:12,520
Speaker 1: just can't remember that many of them, but I think

518
00:25:12,640 --> 00:25:13,919
Speaker 1: like zac Efron was there.

519
00:25:14,960 --> 00:25:16,000
Speaker 3: Oh my god.

520
00:25:16,440 --> 00:25:19,400
Speaker 1: I got the story though, So my boyfriend he looked

521
00:25:19,400 --> 00:25:21,720
Speaker 1: like Dave Grohl. My boyfriend, he tells me on the

522
00:25:21,840 --> 00:25:24,280
Speaker 1: jouder and he says, I just saw Courtney loved Tap

523
00:25:24,359 --> 00:25:26,840
Speaker 1: Marilyn Manson and freak out because you thought I was

524
00:25:26,920 --> 00:25:29,840
Speaker 1: Dave Grohl. And it turns out that these two have

525
00:25:29,960 --> 00:25:33,120
Speaker 1: like a long running feud. Okay to do with them

526
00:25:33,640 --> 00:25:36,600
Speaker 1: Cobain And I said to my said, Josh, his name

527
00:25:36,640 --> 00:25:38,879
Speaker 1: is Josh with the same name, except I promise you

528
00:25:38,920 --> 00:25:40,119
Speaker 1: when never moved one this story for the rest of

529
00:25:40,200 --> 00:25:42,359
Speaker 1: all life. I will not say that it's not true.

530
00:25:42,359 --> 00:25:45,160
Speaker 1: But that did not just happen. And then he re done,

531
00:25:45,280 --> 00:25:48,159
Speaker 1: Like maybe twenty minutes later, Marilyn Manson had torn his

532
00:25:48,280 --> 00:25:50,520
Speaker 1: pants off. He's just walking around in torn.

533
00:25:50,320 --> 00:25:52,720
Speaker 2: Pants because he really did think it was Dave girl.

534
00:25:53,280 --> 00:25:54,560
Speaker 1: No, they did it as a joke.

535
00:25:55,840 --> 00:25:59,200
Speaker 2: That's pretty such a weird thing to do, but also

536
00:25:59,240 --> 00:26:01,560
Speaker 2: something I fully believe Marilyn Manson would do.

537
00:26:01,920 --> 00:26:05,000
Speaker 3: Oh my gosh. See those parties, like they're not fun.

538
00:26:05,080 --> 00:26:08,639
Speaker 1: Everyone's just standing around, just looking around with their eyes.

539
00:26:08,800 --> 00:26:12,000
Speaker 1: Like even the famous people you're standing around looking around

540
00:26:12,040 --> 00:26:15,639
Speaker 1: with their eyes, thinking about when they'll tell the story

541
00:26:15,640 --> 00:26:18,520
Speaker 1: on the podcast like I have now. That party was

542
00:26:18,560 --> 00:26:21,560
Speaker 1: a million dollars at least, and it's not the best

543
00:26:21,600 --> 00:26:23,200
Speaker 1: party I've ever been. Yeah.

544
00:26:23,280 --> 00:26:23,760
Speaker 3: Yeah.

545
00:26:24,000 --> 00:26:27,960
Speaker 2: There's often talk about toxic positivity, and I feel like

546
00:26:28,000 --> 00:26:30,240
Speaker 2: it's a little bit American. It's a little bit the

547
00:26:30,320 --> 00:26:33,640
Speaker 2: idea of just you can't say anything bad, you can't

548
00:26:33,680 --> 00:26:37,440
Speaker 2: be self deprecating, because you just have to be positive, positive,

549
00:26:37,480 --> 00:26:42,480
Speaker 2: positive all the time. And sometimes that toxic positivity can

550
00:26:42,520 --> 00:26:46,320
Speaker 2: really contribute to making you not feel happy because you

551
00:26:46,400 --> 00:26:50,679
Speaker 2: feel crazy that you're not actually experiencing positive emotions all

552
00:26:50,680 --> 00:26:54,880
Speaker 2: the time. Have you had any experience with that, especially

553
00:26:54,880 --> 00:26:55,600
Speaker 2: in America?

554
00:26:56,240 --> 00:26:59,520
Speaker 1: Obviously, I don't like toxic positivity. People think that things

555
00:26:59,520 --> 00:27:01,400
Speaker 1: need to be green all the time is crazy. Things

556
00:27:01,400 --> 00:27:04,399
Speaker 1: are supposed to be average, things are supposed to be

557
00:27:04,400 --> 00:27:07,560
Speaker 1: just fine. If things are fine, then that's good. If

558
00:27:07,560 --> 00:27:10,600
Speaker 1: things are fine, we're not complaining about them because fine,

559
00:27:10,680 --> 00:27:13,280
Speaker 1: we'll take this day. We'll take this day. That's fine,

560
00:27:13,560 --> 00:27:16,000
Speaker 1: and we'll enjoy it. I don't wanting about people winging

561
00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:18,480
Speaker 1: about their length unless it's like really bad, And I

562
00:27:18,480 --> 00:27:21,480
Speaker 1: don't want to hear people talking about what they're missing

563
00:27:21,520 --> 00:27:23,240
Speaker 1: in their life. I feel like a lot of the

564
00:27:23,280 --> 00:27:27,800
Speaker 1: podcasts when other people talk about it, I'm.

565
00:27:27,680 --> 00:27:32,320
Speaker 2: A little bit like rethinking by this entire podcast. But also,

566
00:27:32,560 --> 00:27:37,840
Speaker 2: the idea of things being fine is exactly right. And

567
00:27:37,840 --> 00:27:40,399
Speaker 2: I think it's the expectation that we're always going to

568
00:27:40,440 --> 00:27:43,919
Speaker 2: be elated and that every experience is exciting, and that

569
00:27:43,960 --> 00:27:45,520
Speaker 2: there are going to be these days that are the

570
00:27:45,520 --> 00:27:47,359
Speaker 2: most perfect days of your life. I think that is

571
00:27:47,400 --> 00:27:53,320
Speaker 2: actually what really messes with our happiness and our well being.

572
00:27:53,960 --> 00:27:58,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, we can't live in link a romantic comedy monitors. Yeah, retiring, Yes,

573
00:27:58,960 --> 00:27:59,960
Speaker 1: I actually wouldn't want to.

574
00:28:00,160 --> 00:28:02,280
Speaker 2: I always think that with traveling, that it's like you

575
00:28:02,359 --> 00:28:04,399
Speaker 2: go somewhere, you go to the place you've seen on

576
00:28:04,440 --> 00:28:07,320
Speaker 2: Instagram and you go there, but it's like you need

577
00:28:07,400 --> 00:28:09,760
Speaker 2: to pee, you know what I mean, Like you forget that.

578
00:28:09,800 --> 00:28:11,879
Speaker 2: It's like you get in the moment, but it's not

579
00:28:12,040 --> 00:28:15,280
Speaker 2: a photo. You're a bit hot and it's crowded and

580
00:28:15,600 --> 00:28:19,680
Speaker 2: you need to wear Yeah, at you.

581
00:28:19,680 --> 00:28:22,520
Speaker 1: Just because you keep being you all on vacation.

582
00:28:23,200 --> 00:28:26,679
Speaker 2: And it's fine and it's just fine and that's okay.

583
00:28:28,000 --> 00:28:32,880
Speaker 2: After the break, Josh talks about his mum's bipolar and

584
00:28:32,920 --> 00:28:36,280
Speaker 2: how she felt when he wrote his show and made

585
00:28:36,280 --> 00:28:47,680
Speaker 2: a character based on her. So you're growing up in

586
00:28:47,760 --> 00:28:53,760
Speaker 2: Queensland and your mum had bipolar, but you didn't know

587
00:28:53,880 --> 00:28:56,360
Speaker 2: that when you were growing up. You didn't know that,

588
00:28:56,480 --> 00:29:02,000
Speaker 2: not obviously, and please, like me, you grappled with bipolar

589
00:29:02,280 --> 00:29:06,000
Speaker 2: and there was a suicide at the end of the season.

590
00:29:07,680 --> 00:29:12,520
Speaker 2: What do you think having someone close to you who

591
00:29:12,720 --> 00:29:15,920
Speaker 2: lives with bipolar disorder has taught you about happiness?

592
00:29:16,680 --> 00:29:19,280
Speaker 1: There's all kind of separate to me because I see it.

593
00:29:19,280 --> 00:29:22,600
Speaker 1: It's like they're not thinking straight right, Like she couldn't

594
00:29:22,600 --> 00:29:24,560
Speaker 1: help herself. It's just just just no way that she

595
00:29:24,560 --> 00:29:26,560
Speaker 1: could help herself. No one could help her, and she

596
00:29:26,600 --> 00:29:30,120
Speaker 1: couldn't help herself, and she had to work out how

597
00:29:30,120 --> 00:29:32,040
Speaker 1: to help herself. As something that I worked out after

598
00:29:32,080 --> 00:29:34,560
Speaker 1: a few years. I think no one can help her.

599
00:29:34,600 --> 00:29:36,560
Speaker 1: I mean, like, of course we can turn up and stuff,

600
00:29:36,560 --> 00:29:38,760
Speaker 1: but it's not really like something's got to change in

601
00:29:38,800 --> 00:29:40,840
Speaker 1: her brain one day or something and she's great.

602
00:29:40,920 --> 00:29:43,840
Speaker 2: Now, how do you work out what you want to

603
00:29:43,880 --> 00:29:46,400
Speaker 2: share and what you're actually not comfortable sharing.

604
00:29:47,200 --> 00:29:49,280
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm happy to share anything about me. Really,

605
00:29:49,760 --> 00:29:52,760
Speaker 1: I don't feel ashamed. I don't have that emotion. I

606
00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:55,320
Speaker 1: don't think, and I'm always surprised when people are like, oh,

607
00:29:55,320 --> 00:29:58,000
Speaker 1: you're really oversharing. I'm like, what do you care if

608
00:29:58,040 --> 00:29:58,680
Speaker 1: you know about this?

609
00:29:59,040 --> 00:30:01,200
Speaker 2: How liberating to not have shame?

610
00:30:01,960 --> 00:30:05,760
Speaker 1: I mean, do I have shame? Sometimes I feel sharing

611
00:30:05,800 --> 00:30:09,080
Speaker 1: other people's story is scarier my mum and mental health stuff.

612
00:30:09,120 --> 00:30:13,280
Speaker 1: I always want make sure there's a reason, Like I

613
00:30:13,280 --> 00:30:15,080
Speaker 1: feel like I'm telling this story and it'll help people,

614
00:30:15,120 --> 00:30:16,720
Speaker 1: and I don't want to say it like that, but

615
00:30:17,240 --> 00:30:19,120
Speaker 1: like I say, it's a story that hasn't been told before,

616
00:30:19,120 --> 00:30:21,000
Speaker 1: and I feel like I could show people this side

617
00:30:21,040 --> 00:30:24,840
Speaker 1: of mental health. That's why she let me do please

618
00:30:24,880 --> 00:30:26,120
Speaker 1: let me in the first place.

619
00:30:26,520 --> 00:30:28,320
Speaker 2: Was she happy with that representation?

620
00:30:29,440 --> 00:30:31,280
Speaker 1: So she read the script so my mama like she

621
00:30:31,360 --> 00:30:33,800
Speaker 1: was a full approval because because my character saints Josh,

622
00:30:33,800 --> 00:30:36,080
Speaker 1: she's a mom like for defamation reason. She she had

623
00:30:36,080 --> 00:30:37,800
Speaker 1: the highest level of approval on the show.

624
00:30:38,280 --> 00:30:38,760
Speaker 3: Wow.

625
00:30:39,280 --> 00:30:41,600
Speaker 1: She watched it alone and was really unsure about it.

626
00:30:42,320 --> 00:30:45,680
Speaker 1: That was tough. And then it went to air and

627
00:30:46,840 --> 00:30:48,680
Speaker 1: so that's a script stage. She has approval, she doesn't

628
00:30:48,680 --> 00:30:53,240
Speaker 1: have approval of other cuts. Obviously reshoot things, and she

629
00:30:53,360 --> 00:30:55,600
Speaker 1: got really excited and now she really really loves it

630
00:30:55,600 --> 00:30:58,280
Speaker 1: and it's like on board. But it's very hard when

631
00:30:58,280 --> 00:31:00,120
Speaker 1: you haven't when you've seen a show that your son

632
00:31:00,240 --> 00:31:02,880
Speaker 1: made that's about you attempting suicide, and no one else

633
00:31:02,880 --> 00:31:04,720
Speaker 1: in the world has seen it, and she's just wondering

634
00:31:04,720 --> 00:31:05,240
Speaker 1: how they're.

635
00:31:05,040 --> 00:31:05,600
Speaker 3: Going to take it.

636
00:31:05,600 --> 00:31:08,600
Speaker 1: She wasn't corrased about herself. She just doesn't. She doesn't

637
00:31:08,600 --> 00:31:10,520
Speaker 1: really like the idea of like a drama need her.

638
00:31:10,720 --> 00:31:12,800
Speaker 1: It's like a little bit it's not to her taste,

639
00:31:12,880 --> 00:31:15,600
Speaker 1: you know, She's not of that generation. Yeah, yeah, you

640
00:31:15,680 --> 00:31:17,080
Speaker 1: just couldn't understand why it was sad.

641
00:31:17,120 --> 00:31:25,640
Speaker 2: Sometimes, do you think having experienced something so scary as

642
00:31:25,680 --> 00:31:28,280
Speaker 2: your mum having a suicide attempt, do you think it

643
00:31:28,320 --> 00:31:30,680
Speaker 2: kind of puts things into perspective and makes you realize

644
00:31:30,720 --> 00:31:32,000
Speaker 2: what is and isn't important.

645
00:31:32,920 --> 00:31:37,240
Speaker 3: No, thank you for your honest chancel.

646
00:31:38,080 --> 00:31:38,280
Speaker 5: Yeah.

647
00:31:38,320 --> 00:31:40,800
Speaker 1: I never thought that, and I mean, this is how

648
00:31:40,800 --> 00:31:44,840
Speaker 1: I survived it. I thought, whoa, this is mental illness.

649
00:31:45,560 --> 00:31:48,080
Speaker 1: I feel like so many people after a suicide attempt

650
00:31:48,720 --> 00:31:50,600
Speaker 1: of like a friend or a loved one, they get

651
00:31:50,600 --> 00:31:53,720
Speaker 1: obsessed with trying to figure out why the person did

652
00:31:53,760 --> 00:31:56,000
Speaker 1: it or like or they think, like if I had

653
00:31:56,040 --> 00:31:58,640
Speaker 1: done something different for this person, would they have wanted

654
00:31:58,680 --> 00:32:03,040
Speaker 1: to commit suicide? And they're trying to find logic and

655
00:32:03,080 --> 00:32:06,680
Speaker 1: this decision that this person has made it was illogical.

656
00:32:06,760 --> 00:32:09,160
Speaker 1: This person's mentally they don't know why they're doing it.

657
00:32:09,200 --> 00:32:11,120
Speaker 1: I mean, I almost my mum about it now and

658
00:32:11,160 --> 00:32:12,520
Speaker 1: I've written about it in the show, and I just

659
00:32:12,560 --> 00:32:15,280
Speaker 1: want to understand what her thinking process was. And there

660
00:32:15,320 --> 00:32:17,960
Speaker 1: was stupid. It doesn't make any sense. You can't look

661
00:32:18,000 --> 00:32:19,880
Speaker 1: at it from the outside. You can't look at mentally

662
00:32:19,920 --> 00:32:22,880
Speaker 1: ill people from the outside, and think that you, as

663
00:32:22,880 --> 00:32:25,200
Speaker 1: a non without that specific mental illness, are going to

664
00:32:25,280 --> 00:32:27,560
Speaker 1: understand why they're doing what they're doing. That's the point.

665
00:32:27,880 --> 00:32:30,520
Speaker 1: It's very, very silly what they're doing. It doesn't make sense.

666
00:32:31,120 --> 00:32:34,480
Speaker 2: Do you feel like you are in any way predisposed

667
00:32:34,520 --> 00:32:38,480
Speaker 2: to depression or anything similar because of genetics and because

668
00:32:38,560 --> 00:32:39,000
Speaker 2: of your mom?

669
00:32:39,080 --> 00:32:39,240
Speaker 3: Yeah?

670
00:32:39,320 --> 00:32:41,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, well I'll probably right.

671
00:32:43,520 --> 00:32:45,800
Speaker 2: Do you think that there are strategies that you live

672
00:32:45,880 --> 00:32:50,800
Speaker 2: by that actually stop you from getting into that place?

673
00:32:51,320 --> 00:32:53,760
Speaker 1: I don't actually think I got the mental illness gene

674
00:32:54,320 --> 00:32:57,400
Speaker 1: of bipolar gene. I don't think I have it, but

675
00:32:57,440 --> 00:33:01,080
Speaker 1: who knows. Things could turn. I feel weird saying this

676
00:33:01,120 --> 00:33:02,880
Speaker 1: a lot, but I know that, like, the two big

677
00:33:02,920 --> 00:33:07,200
Speaker 1: things in mental illness are delusions and paranoia. These are

678
00:33:07,200 --> 00:33:09,720
Speaker 1: the tool thing. If you're writing a character that's mentally ill,

679
00:33:10,240 --> 00:33:13,240
Speaker 1: it's gonna be delusions of paranoia that the two big sayings.

680
00:33:14,000 --> 00:33:16,720
Speaker 1: And sometimes I'll just feel myself. I don't know, I'll

681
00:33:16,720 --> 00:33:18,840
Speaker 1: just feel myself and I'll realize, like, oh, for like

682
00:33:18,840 --> 00:33:22,640
Speaker 1: a few beans, they've thought everyone hated me. That's not

683
00:33:22,800 --> 00:33:26,200
Speaker 1: actually probably definitely not true. And just like try and

684
00:33:26,240 --> 00:33:28,600
Speaker 1: like switch something up in your life and the scene

685
00:33:28,600 --> 00:33:31,280
Speaker 1: with delusions. That's scary to me as well. So I'm

686
00:33:31,320 --> 00:33:34,240
Speaker 1: just like very aware of those two thinking patterns and

687
00:33:34,280 --> 00:33:38,080
Speaker 1: trying not to, like really early on, be conscious that

688
00:33:38,360 --> 00:33:39,600
Speaker 1: they're not good ways to behave.

689
00:33:40,520 --> 00:33:42,680
Speaker 2: It's like when people have panic attacks, and as soon

690
00:33:42,720 --> 00:33:44,520
Speaker 2: as they learn that it's a panic attack and not

691
00:33:44,560 --> 00:33:47,560
Speaker 2: a heart attack, the panic attack jobs, and for you,

692
00:33:47,760 --> 00:33:51,600
Speaker 2: it's like you can actually recognize this is paranoia, and

693
00:33:51,640 --> 00:33:55,800
Speaker 2: so it stop like that's actually incredibly powerful. But it

694
00:33:55,840 --> 00:33:57,640
Speaker 2: sounds like you've got a lot of kind of insight

695
00:33:57,800 --> 00:34:02,080
Speaker 2: and a healthy mental attitude that has maybe been formed

696
00:34:02,160 --> 00:34:08,040
Speaker 2: by your own life experiences. I saw a TikTok video

697
00:34:08,279 --> 00:34:10,640
Speaker 2: where you were talking about the hardest part of being

698
00:34:10,640 --> 00:34:14,959
Speaker 2: in your thirties being that everybody has babies and you

699
00:34:15,200 --> 00:34:18,799
Speaker 2: have to pretend to like the babies when babies are

700
00:34:18,839 --> 00:34:23,120
Speaker 2: actually slugs. And I have a four month old, and

701
00:34:23,160 --> 00:34:25,600
Speaker 2: I agree babies are actually slugs. You're not wrong on that.

702
00:34:26,439 --> 00:34:32,279
Speaker 2: But having grown up and you've got your family and siblings,

703
00:34:33,279 --> 00:34:35,879
Speaker 2: do you think that we're told that happiness needs to

704
00:34:35,919 --> 00:34:39,600
Speaker 2: be contingent on having a family, having kids, having a partner.

705
00:34:40,319 --> 00:34:43,359
Speaker 1: Oh god, I have no idea. I never really have

706
00:34:43,479 --> 00:34:46,319
Speaker 1: never considered having a family, not even a little bit.

707
00:34:46,359 --> 00:34:50,040
Speaker 1: I've been asked for my spam four times to donate

708
00:34:50,080 --> 00:34:50,799
Speaker 1: my spam.

709
00:34:51,160 --> 00:34:53,399
Speaker 3: Oh really yeah, I.

710
00:34:53,319 --> 00:34:56,679
Speaker 1: Said, nah, absolutely not. I don't even like me that much.

711
00:34:56,719 --> 00:34:58,439
Speaker 1: I don't need to donate my spam. Like I think

712
00:34:58,439 --> 00:35:01,519
Speaker 1: I'm doing fine. Like that's because I mean jeans. It's

713
00:35:01,560 --> 00:35:03,839
Speaker 1: just hard because friendships are so important to me. Friendships

714
00:35:03,879 --> 00:35:06,080
Speaker 1: are so like a lot of gay people. But that

715
00:35:06,080 --> 00:35:09,160
Speaker 1: seems like a weird thing to say. Friendships like really

716
00:35:09,160 --> 00:35:11,680
Speaker 1: a link rock star. And if you're not having kids

717
00:35:11,759 --> 00:35:14,439
Speaker 1: in your thirties, it's kind of like you need to

718
00:35:14,439 --> 00:35:16,559
Speaker 1: find other friends that aren't having kids, right so that

719
00:35:16,560 --> 00:35:18,520
Speaker 1: they have the same priorities of you. Because of course,

720
00:35:18,600 --> 00:35:20,399
Speaker 1: like once someone has a kid, I'm not going to

721
00:35:20,399 --> 00:35:22,839
Speaker 1: be very high in their numbers of priorities. That's like

722
00:35:22,879 --> 00:35:25,639
Speaker 1: how it has to be, which is understandable, but it's

723
00:35:25,640 --> 00:35:29,439
Speaker 1: not that fun for me. Not that fun for me

724
00:35:29,520 --> 00:35:33,199
Speaker 1: to be fourth priority. So a lot of my friends

725
00:35:33,200 --> 00:35:36,039
Speaker 1: since high school or since there's in my early twenties,

726
00:35:36,560 --> 00:35:39,600
Speaker 1: so once they have children, what are we going to

727
00:35:39,640 --> 00:35:40,040
Speaker 1: do together?

728
00:35:40,359 --> 00:35:40,680
Speaker 3: Yeah?

729
00:35:40,879 --> 00:35:43,399
Speaker 1: To be clear, I go, I see them, but it's

730
00:35:43,439 --> 00:35:45,439
Speaker 1: not like it's like, oh, like I'm not your main

731
00:35:45,479 --> 00:35:47,880
Speaker 1: friend anymore. You're not going to be my main friend anymore,

732
00:35:47,959 --> 00:35:49,719
Speaker 1: Like I have to find another main friend, and that's

733
00:35:49,719 --> 00:35:50,319
Speaker 1: a cutbreak.

734
00:35:50,399 --> 00:35:54,640
Speaker 2: Actually, I think that that's actually an important point that

735
00:35:54,719 --> 00:35:57,399
Speaker 2: you feel, even when you do have kids, that you

736
00:35:57,439 --> 00:35:59,279
Speaker 2: know that the nature of your friendships is always going

737
00:35:59,319 --> 00:36:02,079
Speaker 2: to be different, that there's always somebody else you have

738
00:36:02,120 --> 00:36:07,079
Speaker 2: to consider before that. Do you ever wonder, ten years

739
00:36:07,120 --> 00:36:10,599
Speaker 2: down the track, twenty is down the track, if you

740
00:36:11,160 --> 00:36:14,999
Speaker 2: will want kids? No, Because there's definitely a kind of

741
00:36:15,040 --> 00:36:19,080
Speaker 2: movement in around women thinking I don't want kids, and

742
00:36:19,120 --> 00:36:21,359
Speaker 2: I'm fine with that, and I love it, and I

743
00:36:21,399 --> 00:36:25,439
Speaker 2: think it must be really exciting to be able to

744
00:36:25,520 --> 00:36:31,520
Speaker 2: rewrite the traditional narrative of what of what life should

745
00:36:31,680 --> 00:36:33,839
Speaker 2: of what life should be. I think that's really liberating.

746
00:36:34,680 --> 00:36:37,399
Speaker 1: I've never even considered having kids, Like it's not even

747
00:36:37,479 --> 00:36:39,839
Speaker 1: like this is the first time I've ever considered that.

748
00:36:39,919 --> 00:36:42,719
Speaker 1: It's weird because conversation right now, even my mom said

749
00:36:42,759 --> 00:36:44,919
Speaker 1: to me. My mom said to me a few years ago,

750
00:36:45,040 --> 00:36:48,479
Speaker 1: she said, I never thought you'd have children, She said,

751
00:36:48,520 --> 00:36:49,999
Speaker 1: even when you were a kid, I thought he's not

752
00:36:50,000 --> 00:36:53,319
Speaker 1: going to have kids, And I thought, trust all, that's

753
00:36:53,359 --> 00:36:55,799
Speaker 1: not a compliment. Is it you're looking at me at

754
00:36:55,839 --> 00:36:57,479
Speaker 1: eight years old thinking that I'm never going to be

755
00:36:57,520 --> 00:36:59,359
Speaker 1: a kid. Like if somebody looks at you and says, wow,

756
00:36:59,399 --> 00:37:01,279
Speaker 1: he'd be such a good dad. That's a nice thing.

757
00:37:01,759 --> 00:37:04,239
Speaker 1: You're looking at me at eight years old and being like,

758
00:37:04,279 --> 00:37:06,079
Speaker 1: he's never going to want to have kids. My brother

759
00:37:06,160 --> 00:37:07,879
Speaker 1: and my sister she's always like, no, you will one day.

760
00:37:07,879 --> 00:37:09,519
Speaker 1: And me she's always been like, you old and I

761
00:37:09,520 --> 00:37:14,879
Speaker 1: haven't to do what? Where aware? Watch what?

762
00:37:16,040 --> 00:37:16,719
Speaker 3: Absolutely not.

763
00:37:17,839 --> 00:37:21,160
Speaker 2: I think kids would absolutely love you, though, And that's

764
00:37:21,200 --> 00:37:23,640
Speaker 2: what's so funny about it, that kids must just be

765
00:37:23,759 --> 00:37:27,039
Speaker 2: like that guy's fun and you're like, nah, I don't

766
00:37:27,080 --> 00:37:33,960
Speaker 2: have the time. Is there anything in your professional life

767
00:37:34,040 --> 00:37:37,079
Speaker 2: or your personal life that you look back on and

768
00:37:37,160 --> 00:37:41,239
Speaker 2: consider a failure that you learnt from because you were

769
00:37:41,479 --> 00:37:44,359
Speaker 2: really young and doing stand up comedy? Did that ever

770
00:37:44,640 --> 00:37:47,959
Speaker 2: affect your happiness? Do you ever feel like your happiness

771
00:37:48,000 --> 00:37:49,839
Speaker 2: was contingent on how well you were performing?

772
00:37:50,600 --> 00:37:53,119
Speaker 1: You just have to train your happiness in this way.

773
00:37:53,359 --> 00:37:54,879
Speaker 1: And I feel like I don't know how to really

774
00:37:55,000 --> 00:37:57,519
Speaker 1: describe it, but you get so used to when I

775
00:37:57,759 --> 00:37:59,200
Speaker 1: was younger, so like the first gig I did on

776
00:37:59,200 --> 00:38:02,239
Speaker 1: my only first seventeen, I won the one Morall comedy, right,

777
00:38:02,359 --> 00:38:05,920
Speaker 1: So I had like a confidence, right, which is helpful.

778
00:38:05,919 --> 00:38:08,479
Speaker 1: I think like if things went bad, I was like, oh,

779
00:38:08,520 --> 00:38:11,279
Speaker 1: that went bad, and I never sort of thought I

780
00:38:11,319 --> 00:38:11,919
Speaker 1: can't do this.

781
00:38:12,560 --> 00:38:15,600
Speaker 2: You're coming from a baseline of white people say I

782
00:38:15,640 --> 00:38:16,039
Speaker 2: can do this.

783
00:38:16,319 --> 00:38:18,239
Speaker 1: Yeah, people say you can do this, right, And that's

784
00:38:18,439 --> 00:38:21,919
Speaker 1: so nice. Like having that base level of confidence, I

785
00:38:21,919 --> 00:38:25,239
Speaker 1: never would have survived otherwise. Yeah, you just get used

786
00:38:25,279 --> 00:38:27,600
Speaker 1: to rooms, so people hating you, and and then I

787
00:38:27,719 --> 00:38:29,480
Speaker 1: just sort of like you would make you really depressed

788
00:38:29,520 --> 00:38:31,680
Speaker 1: for a while. But then I just eventually, after a

789
00:38:31,719 --> 00:38:33,759
Speaker 1: little while, you're just like, no, this isn't I would

790
00:38:33,759 --> 00:38:37,279
Speaker 1: always think it's not allowed to go to bed, out

791
00:38:37,319 --> 00:38:40,279
Speaker 1: of the out of my system before I go to bed,

792
00:38:40,319 --> 00:38:42,879
Speaker 1: and then there's no point thinking about this thing anymore.

793
00:38:43,719 --> 00:38:45,600
Speaker 1: You like train yourself to do that. I don't know

794
00:38:45,600 --> 00:38:47,639
Speaker 1: how to explain it. You just train yourself to move on.

795
00:38:48,000 --> 00:38:50,559
Speaker 1: But the flip side of that is I don't think

796
00:38:50,640 --> 00:38:53,480
Speaker 1: I also can't take to bed like things that are exciting,

797
00:38:54,000 --> 00:38:55,799
Speaker 1: because you don't want to be like living in the

798
00:38:55,839 --> 00:38:57,999
Speaker 1: winds of the highs and the lows. Because also like

799
00:38:58,040 --> 00:39:01,279
Speaker 1: the idea of like learning a lesson is like creative

800
00:39:01,319 --> 00:39:04,319
Speaker 1: work is so complicated, and you're doing stuff because you

801
00:39:04,319 --> 00:39:06,279
Speaker 1: think it's going to be a vibe. Like I just

802
00:39:06,319 --> 00:39:07,759
Speaker 1: think it's gonna be a vibe. I think people will

803
00:39:07,799 --> 00:39:09,079
Speaker 1: think this is a vibe and then they're like, it's

804
00:39:09,080 --> 00:39:12,120
Speaker 1: not a vibe. You can't really sit down and like

805
00:39:13,520 --> 00:39:15,920
Speaker 1: there's not a spreadsheet you can go through each joyce

806
00:39:16,000 --> 00:39:19,159
Speaker 1: and see where, like what decision went wrong? You can't

807
00:39:19,200 --> 00:39:20,999
Speaker 1: really you just have to get up and think about

808
00:39:21,040 --> 00:39:22,559
Speaker 1: what do you think the next thing will be a

809
00:39:22,640 --> 00:39:25,279
Speaker 1: vibe again? That's the only way you can survive. Does

810
00:39:25,319 --> 00:39:26,360
Speaker 1: that make sense what I'm saying?

811
00:39:26,479 --> 00:39:26,799
Speaker 3: Yes?

812
00:39:26,919 --> 00:39:30,319
Speaker 2: And I think it's actually incredibly mentally healthy.

813
00:39:31,160 --> 00:39:31,359
Speaker 3: Yeah.

814
00:39:31,359 --> 00:39:34,359
Speaker 1: I think it's actually really healthy sitting down and thinking

815
00:39:34,359 --> 00:39:36,919
Speaker 1: why did that go wrong? That was so bad? Maybe

816
00:39:37,000 --> 00:39:39,319
Speaker 1: next time I need to do this different or that different,

817
00:39:39,479 --> 00:39:42,559
Speaker 1: or maybe this show didn't connect with people because of

818
00:39:42,600 --> 00:39:45,439
Speaker 1: the demographic or something. It's like, well, there's no point,

819
00:39:45,520 --> 00:39:46,279
Speaker 1: it's done now.

820
00:39:46,759 --> 00:39:49,640
Speaker 2: You do seem to have a very healthy attitude towards

821
00:39:50,000 --> 00:39:55,399
Speaker 2: your work and creativity, which is not overthinking. Just do it,

822
00:39:55,839 --> 00:39:57,719
Speaker 2: Like I just tell my story. That's what I do

823
00:39:58,520 --> 00:40:02,599
Speaker 2: when it comes to happiness, and I assume you get

824
00:40:02,640 --> 00:40:04,919
Speaker 2: some of your happiness through your work and through the

825
00:40:04,959 --> 00:40:08,839
Speaker 2: meaning of the work you produce. What does it mean

826
00:40:08,919 --> 00:40:12,160
Speaker 2: to you? Like when you think about looking back as

827
00:40:12,200 --> 00:40:15,600
Speaker 2: an old man, what do you think it will be

828
00:40:16,799 --> 00:40:17,759
Speaker 2: that made you happy?

829
00:40:18,719 --> 00:40:20,239
Speaker 1: I mean, I know, definitely know what I like to do,

830
00:40:20,279 --> 00:40:21,799
Speaker 1: Like to hang out with my friends, hang out with

831
00:40:21,839 --> 00:40:25,600
Speaker 1: my boyfriends, eat little snacks, have some drinks. That's what

832
00:40:25,640 --> 00:40:27,879
Speaker 1: I want to be doing. I have a little dance, right,

833
00:40:27,919 --> 00:40:29,999
Speaker 1: That's what I'm like to be doing. And for me,

834
00:40:30,200 --> 00:40:33,120
Speaker 1: if I have access to that, I'm sweet. I'm great.

835
00:40:33,359 --> 00:40:37,439
Speaker 1: To me. Happiness is like it's like the absence of stress.

836
00:40:39,439 --> 00:40:44,560
Speaker 2: I think that idea of absence of stress is so universal.

837
00:40:44,839 --> 00:40:47,400
Speaker 2: Like it sounds like you're not very neurotic about your work,

838
00:40:47,799 --> 00:40:49,039
Speaker 2: like you kind of just get it done.

839
00:40:49,560 --> 00:40:51,959
Speaker 1: I do it. I mean, I'm really meticulous and we're

840
00:40:52,000 --> 00:40:54,480
Speaker 1: building it. I'm like, oh, I never lose my temper

841
00:40:54,520 --> 00:40:57,719
Speaker 1: on set. When I see people lose their temper on set,

842
00:40:57,799 --> 00:41:01,479
Speaker 1: I go up to let him, like, bab were at work, chill,

843
00:41:01,600 --> 00:41:03,399
Speaker 1: that's not my show. That was in their temper about

844
00:41:03,399 --> 00:41:04,719
Speaker 1: something going wrong about my own show. It's like we

845
00:41:04,719 --> 00:41:07,200
Speaker 1: don't need to do this. Yeah, that's relax. You don't

846
00:41:07,239 --> 00:41:10,120
Speaker 1: need to cry here. There's no reason. It's a TV show. Yeah,

847
00:41:10,479 --> 00:41:13,319
Speaker 1: everything's so random that you can't really know if it's

848
00:41:13,319 --> 00:41:16,479
Speaker 1: going to be good or not. So that's in making

849
00:41:16,520 --> 00:41:18,239
Speaker 1: a TV show where you're trying to create like a

850
00:41:18,239 --> 00:41:20,879
Speaker 1: special little moment of chemistry and a warehouse where you've

851
00:41:20,879 --> 00:41:23,239
Speaker 1: got all these men and gaffer tape and equipment and

852
00:41:23,239 --> 00:41:25,160
Speaker 1: you're trying to get this little kiss that feels magic

853
00:41:25,200 --> 00:41:27,600
Speaker 1: to people. I don't really know whether that's going to

854
00:41:27,640 --> 00:41:29,439
Speaker 1: work in the warehouse when we're there or not. I

855
00:41:29,439 --> 00:41:31,759
Speaker 1: find out another day, and there's no point stressing about

856
00:41:31,759 --> 00:41:33,200
Speaker 1: it while we're there. But I think it's the same

857
00:41:33,879 --> 00:41:36,600
Speaker 1: in life. I think people who try so hard to

858
00:41:36,719 --> 00:41:39,399
Speaker 1: manufacture happiness, and this is kind of everything what I

859
00:41:39,439 --> 00:41:40,999
Speaker 1: was trying to say about these people in LA They

860
00:41:41,040 --> 00:41:43,719
Speaker 1: try so hard to get this thing that they assume

861
00:41:43,719 --> 00:41:45,040
Speaker 1: it's going to make them happy, but they don't know

862
00:41:45,080 --> 00:41:47,359
Speaker 1: what's going to make them happy. Often people get it

863
00:41:47,520 --> 00:41:50,399
Speaker 1: and they're not happy. And actually it's just like making

864
00:41:50,439 --> 00:41:52,120
Speaker 1: the most of what you're doing and just trying not

865
00:41:52,239 --> 00:41:53,799
Speaker 1: to do bad things.

866
00:41:54,919 --> 00:41:58,120
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, I think that's exactly it. And that is

867
00:41:58,200 --> 00:42:01,399
Speaker 2: literally literally the idea of this podcast that I think

868
00:42:01,399 --> 00:42:04,200
Speaker 2: a lot of what we think will make us happy

869
00:42:04,479 --> 00:42:07,399
Speaker 2: actually doesn't, and the things we take for granted are

870
00:42:07,479 --> 00:42:11,719
Speaker 2: the things that make us happy. Well, Josh Thomas, you

871
00:42:11,879 --> 00:42:15,559
Speaker 2: have a wildly impressive career. You have fans all over

872
00:42:15,600 --> 00:42:18,519
Speaker 2: the world. You fell theaters with people who want to

873
00:42:18,520 --> 00:42:20,440
Speaker 2: hear what you have to say, and you have people

874
00:42:20,479 --> 00:42:23,160
Speaker 2: watch shows you starre in with the words you wrote

875
00:42:23,160 --> 00:42:26,600
Speaker 2: and the ideas you had. But are you happy?

876
00:42:27,040 --> 00:42:29,639
Speaker 1: I'm really happy. I'm having a good time out here.

877
00:42:30,799 --> 00:42:32,040
Speaker 3: You seem bloody happy.

878
00:42:32,719 --> 00:42:35,079
Speaker 1: People say they're happy at the end. Who says they're

879
00:42:35,080 --> 00:42:35,560
Speaker 1: not happy?

880
00:42:35,919 --> 00:42:38,560
Speaker 2: We've had a few people say that they're not happy.

881
00:42:38,640 --> 00:42:41,560
Speaker 2: But I think you learn a lot from people who

882
00:42:42,200 --> 00:42:45,319
Speaker 2: are really happy in their lives right now. Interestingly, I

883
00:42:45,359 --> 00:42:48,559
Speaker 2: think a lot of what you've said is you're not

884
00:42:48,640 --> 00:42:52,239
Speaker 2: happy because you have all the shiny stuff. You're happy

885
00:42:52,479 --> 00:42:53,639
Speaker 2: because you're doing what you love.

886
00:42:54,479 --> 00:42:56,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm going out and doing fun thing.

887
00:42:56,439 --> 00:42:58,080
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah exactly.

888
00:42:58,520 --> 00:43:05,520
Speaker 2: Not because you're in the fancy restaurant. Since I interviewed Josh,

889
00:43:05,680 --> 00:43:08,399
Speaker 2: I have not been able to stop telling people that

890
00:43:08,520 --> 00:43:12,160
Speaker 2: things are just meant to be fine, it's so funny,

891
00:43:12,200 --> 00:43:16,479
Speaker 2: but it's also really quite profound. I'm really grappling with

892
00:43:16,560 --> 00:43:20,319
Speaker 2: the fact that what complicates our lives and our experience

893
00:43:20,439 --> 00:43:24,320
Speaker 2: of the world is our expectations. We want to feel

894
00:43:24,439 --> 00:43:27,999
Speaker 2: euphoric on holiday and bursting with joy on our birthday,

895
00:43:28,200 --> 00:43:30,879
Speaker 2: and ecstatic on our wedding day, and we want to

896
00:43:30,919 --> 00:43:34,040
Speaker 2: cry when our baby is born, and sometimes we don't,

897
00:43:34,319 --> 00:43:38,639
Speaker 2: and there's absolutely nothing pathological about that. It's just how

898
00:43:38,759 --> 00:43:42,759
Speaker 2: life is meant to be. It's our expectations that end

899
00:43:42,839 --> 00:43:47,399
Speaker 2: up crippling us. I think the metaphor of Hollywood is

900
00:43:47,399 --> 00:43:50,279
Speaker 2: a clever one because, as Josh says, it's a bunch

901
00:43:50,279 --> 00:43:53,120
Speaker 2: of people thinking that the thing that will make them

902
00:43:53,160 --> 00:43:56,480
Speaker 2: happy might be just around the corner, and as a result,

903
00:43:56,759 --> 00:43:59,919
Speaker 2: they're never living in the now and what they're searching

904
00:43:59,959 --> 00:44:02,640
Speaker 2: for might never come, and even if it does, it

905
00:44:02,759 --> 00:44:06,319
Speaker 2: probably won't feel the way they think it will. Josh

906
00:44:06,359 --> 00:44:09,359
Speaker 2: Thomas seems to be happy because he doesn't expect to

907
00:44:09,399 --> 00:44:12,719
Speaker 2: be Join me next week for a conversation with actor

908
00:44:12,879 --> 00:44:15,839
Speaker 2: and Gowerie Rice, who you might know from Spider Man

909
00:44:15,959 --> 00:44:20,319
Speaker 2: and Mean Girls that also involves her mum. We talk

910
00:44:20,359 --> 00:44:22,879
Speaker 2: about what it's like to be a teenager working in

911
00:44:22,919 --> 00:44:27,359
Speaker 2: Hollywood and her recent experience of landing her dream role

912
00:44:27,439 --> 00:44:29,680
Speaker 2: in Mean Girls and being trolled for it.

913
00:44:30,040 --> 00:44:32,200
Speaker 4: I'm going to take that experience and hold on to

914
00:44:32,359 --> 00:44:36,039
Speaker 4: it as something that was ultimately really positive for me,

915
00:44:37,080 --> 00:44:40,679
Speaker 4: and I don't want other people to ruin that positivity

916
00:44:41,080 --> 00:44:43,039
Speaker 4: that I got from that experience.

917
00:44:43,759 --> 00:44:46,960
Speaker 2: And Gowy is clever and passionate, and her mum, Kate,

918
00:44:47,080 --> 00:44:51,960
Speaker 2: offers a fascinating perspective about deciding to encourage her daughter

919
00:44:52,040 --> 00:44:55,839
Speaker 2: to pursue acting when her own experiences with the industry

920
00:44:55,959 --> 00:44:59,519
Speaker 2: were not always positive. That's next week on But are

921
00:44:59,520 --> 00:45:03,600
Speaker 2: you happy? If you enjoyed the podcast, please review and

922
00:45:03,640 --> 00:45:07,279
Speaker 2: subscribe wherever you get your podcasts. If you'd like to

923
00:45:07,319 --> 00:45:09,919
Speaker 2: suggest someone for the podcast, you can get in touch

924
00:45:09,959 --> 00:45:14,160
Speaker 2: with me directly. My Instagram handle is Claire dot Stevens

925
00:45:14,200 --> 00:45:17,159
Speaker 2: with two s's, or you can email us here at

926
00:45:17,239 --> 00:45:21,600
Speaker 2: podcast at mamameya dot com dot au. This episode was

927
00:45:21,600 --> 00:45:25,319
Speaker 2: produced by Tarlie Blackman, with audio production by Scott Stronik.

928
00:45:25,600 --> 00:45:26,399
Speaker 3: See you next week,