WEBVTT - How To Build A Healthier Relationship With Ageing 0:00:05.799 --> 0:00:08.519 You're listening to I'mum with Me a podcast. 0:00:11.879 --> 0:00:15.239 Welcome back everyone, I'm a Shandy Dante and this is 0:00:15.319 --> 0:00:17.719 but are you happy? I'm Mother with Me a podcast 0:00:17.799 --> 0:00:21.279 for people curious about their mental health and because of that, 0:00:21.399 --> 0:00:23.839 the chances of having a rest for a weekend are 0:00:23.959 --> 0:00:24.759 very slim. 0:00:25.559 --> 0:00:29.839 And hello again everyone, I'm doctor Anastasia Ronas, clinical psychologist. 0:00:30.359 --> 0:00:34.159 Now are you coming to terms with getting older? More aches, more, 0:00:34.199 --> 0:00:37.959 doctor visits, the endless weight of adult responsibilities? 0:00:38.359 --> 0:00:40.199 If so, this episode is. 0:00:40.119 --> 0:00:42.839 For you, and this topic actually came from one of 0:00:42.839 --> 0:00:44.439 our listeners, Thanks Lisa. 0:00:44.599 --> 0:00:47.919 Today we're going to be talking through the anxiety of aging, 0:00:48.519 --> 0:00:50.199 the anxiety of death. 0:00:50.279 --> 0:00:53.839 And why we feel so much pressure from society to 0:00:53.839 --> 0:00:55.039 stay young and youthful. 0:00:55.559 --> 0:00:56.479 Let's get into it. 0:01:00.639 --> 0:01:04.559 So aging and this concept of getting older is inevitable, 0:01:05.039 --> 0:01:07.319 but it's really interesting because I feel like it can 0:01:07.359 --> 0:01:07.959 bring up. 0:01:07.999 --> 0:01:10.039 So many thoughts and feelings for everyone. 0:01:10.359 --> 0:01:12.559 Yes, and I actually want to start by asking you 0:01:12.679 --> 0:01:13.759 a question, Shani. 0:01:14.039 --> 0:01:16.799 You usually come with a question. 0:01:18.639 --> 0:01:19.599 The turntables? 0:01:20.239 --> 0:01:23.439 Okay, how old do you feel? 0:01:24.079 --> 0:01:24.719 Oh? 0:01:25.039 --> 0:01:30.559 This is a good question because I definitely feel older. 0:01:29.639 --> 0:01:31.959 Than I am. You feel older that I feel older? 0:01:32.159 --> 0:01:33.959 Okay? Yeah, yeah, fascinating. 0:01:34.679 --> 0:01:39.039 I feel like I'm probably late forties, early fifties. 0:01:39.199 --> 0:01:43.679 Oh wow, yeah, okay, yeah, but then it's really weird 0:01:43.719 --> 0:01:46.479 too because I do feel very youthful. 0:01:46.519 --> 0:01:47.839 Too interesting. 0:01:48.039 --> 0:01:50.079 Anyways, there's so many lays to it. How about you, 0:01:50.719 --> 0:01:52.799 how do you feel? 0:01:52.159 --> 0:01:53.759 I oscillate. 0:01:54.399 --> 0:01:56.679 I feel my age. Yeah, so I'm thirty four, I 0:01:57.279 --> 0:02:01.919 feel mid thirties. Yeah, but there's also a part. 0:02:01.679 --> 0:02:03.999 Of me that still feels like twenty seven. 0:02:04.959 --> 0:02:06.439 Yeah, like that specific. 0:02:06.599 --> 0:02:09.399 Yeah, it's like a cusp of like, oh, like I'm 0:02:09.479 --> 0:02:11.959 growing up, but I'm not there yet. I'm still in 0:02:11.999 --> 0:02:14.999 my twenties that like late twenties. Yeah, there's a part 0:02:14.999 --> 0:02:16.039 of me that still feels that. 0:02:16.039 --> 0:02:16.999 That's so interesting. 0:02:17.279 --> 0:02:20.279 The reason I'm curious to ask you the question how 0:02:20.279 --> 0:02:23.639 old you feel? Is because, like, so many people have 0:02:23.719 --> 0:02:28.679 so many perspectives on this, and it's very interesting to 0:02:28.759 --> 0:02:32.199 notice if people feel older or younger than what they 0:02:32.279 --> 0:02:35.839 actually are, and how that kind of internal emotional age 0:02:36.319 --> 0:02:38.479 changes depending on the context we're in or the people 0:02:38.479 --> 0:02:43.199 that we're with, and this idea of like aging, you know, 0:02:43.319 --> 0:02:46.519 biologically aging being this very structured linear thing. 0:02:46.679 --> 0:02:49.159 Every year you have a birthday, you turn a year older. 0:02:49.359 --> 0:02:53.359 So true, but like, internally our emotional age can feel 0:02:53.559 --> 0:02:55.319 so different to our biological age. 0:02:55.359 --> 0:02:56.199 It's so true. 0:02:56.279 --> 0:02:59.199 And it's interesting even just thinking about age because I know, 0:02:59.319 --> 0:03:03.159 for me, I don't really think about my age, but 0:03:03.399 --> 0:03:04.959 I do have to say now that I am in 0:03:04.999 --> 0:03:08.119 my thirties, I do think about it a little bit 0:03:08.159 --> 0:03:11.479 more because you know, the biological clock, just hormones are 0:03:11.559 --> 0:03:13.799 changing things that I didn't even think about before, which 0:03:13.839 --> 0:03:16.359 really ties into this episode because I know, like we 0:03:16.359 --> 0:03:18.639 were talking about, when we get older, we do think 0:03:18.639 --> 0:03:21.079 about our health a bit more, and you know, and 0:03:21.159 --> 0:03:24.079 everything is subjective, right, because people could be tuning in 0:03:24.119 --> 0:03:25.959 who may be older to us and being like oh, 0:03:26.079 --> 0:03:28.919 you youngster, what are you talking about, which is so valid, right, 0:03:29.399 --> 0:03:30.879 And then you know there's people that are younger be 0:03:30.959 --> 0:03:32.679 like oh, yeah, you're older. Like I remember when I 0:03:32.759 --> 0:03:35.279 used to work with teenage girls, like they I would 0:03:35.319 --> 0:03:39.319 share my age and like wow, that's old, and I'm like, yeah. 0:03:39.119 --> 0:03:40.679 It is a it's probably old to them. 0:03:40.839 --> 0:03:41.079 Yeah. 0:03:41.119 --> 0:03:42.279 You know, there's so much of a. 0:03:42.319 --> 0:03:45.879 Charge, an embarrassment or the shame around getting older. 0:03:46.199 --> 0:03:48.879 I feel like I have an interesting relationship with age, 0:03:49.159 --> 0:03:51.639 particularly when it comes to my work, because I work 0:03:52.479 --> 0:03:55.279 at a university as well, so I'm a lecturer, and 0:03:55.679 --> 0:03:57.719 sometimes when I meet people for the first time and 0:03:57.759 --> 0:04:01.239 I tell them I work at the UNI, They'll be like, oh, 0:04:01.239 --> 0:04:04.239 what are you studying. Oh. So I feel this like 0:04:04.719 --> 0:04:08.199 weird relationship with age where I feel underestimated by people 0:04:08.239 --> 0:04:10.439 and people who are potentially older than me as well. 0:04:10.759 --> 0:04:12.839 So I notice a sense of wanting to kind of 0:04:12.919 --> 0:04:15.839 lean into this like more mature part of myself, or 0:04:15.879 --> 0:04:20.039 present myself as more mature than perhaps you know, what 0:04:20.159 --> 0:04:22.639 my biological kind of age would say, because I want 0:04:22.679 --> 0:04:24.079 to present a certain image to people. 0:04:24.119 --> 0:04:24.639 Sometimes. 0:04:24.719 --> 0:04:28.879 Yeah, wow, that's so fascinating. I feel like being underestimated. 0:04:28.199 --> 0:04:31.439 As a whole. Other podcastops in itself. Stay tuned for 0:04:31.479 --> 0:04:31.919 that one. 0:04:32.119 --> 0:04:35.839 But it's interesting too, because I feel like culture does 0:04:35.959 --> 0:04:39.319 play a big role in the way that we perceive aging. 0:04:39.079 --> 0:04:41.879 Right, Yes, especially for women. 0:04:42.199 --> 0:04:47.199 Yeah right, Gosh, there is such a sidal expectations and 0:04:47.359 --> 0:04:53.759 pressures on women to stay young and youthful and beautiful. Yeah, 0:04:53.799 --> 0:04:58.279 and it's a shame because when we look historically to 0:04:58.439 --> 0:05:01.239 how women have been portrayed in the media, older women 0:05:01.479 --> 0:05:04.519 in the media, you know, we think about like kids, nursery, 0:05:04.639 --> 0:05:07.559 rhymes and things like this. It's like Hansel and Gretel, 0:05:07.599 --> 0:05:10.199 and it's like the old grandma who like puts kids 0:05:10.199 --> 0:05:12.839 in the oven and eats them, and like Kruella de 0:05:13.039 --> 0:05:16.359 Ville and like in Snow White, the evil stepmother. Like, 0:05:16.679 --> 0:05:19.279 older women have often kind of taken on this role 0:05:19.359 --> 0:05:23.359 that has been like either grumpy or manipulative or mean 0:05:23.519 --> 0:05:25.719 or just kind of like gross in some way. And 0:05:25.719 --> 0:05:28.679 so I think we've really done women a disservice when 0:05:28.679 --> 0:05:32.279 it comes to representing the aging process for them. 0:05:32.279 --> 0:05:35.879 It's so true because it's like there is so much 0:05:36.079 --> 0:05:38.759 beauty with getting older, and you know, I really admire 0:05:38.879 --> 0:05:42.359 women in my life who are older because they're not grumpy. 0:05:42.399 --> 0:05:45.279 It's like maybe it's just they know what they want, 0:05:45.599 --> 0:05:48.359 you know what I mean? Like, is this confidence that 0:05:48.439 --> 0:05:50.759 women have that are older than me, They just they 0:05:50.799 --> 0:05:52.559 know what they want, they know what they're going to tolerate, 0:05:52.599 --> 0:05:54.159 they know what they're not going to tolerate, and they 0:05:54.159 --> 0:05:56.879 don't care. And I just I get really passionate about 0:05:56.879 --> 0:05:58.959 this because I think a lot of my work previously 0:05:59.079 --> 0:06:01.959 was all around, you know, supporting teenager girls to coming 0:06:01.959 --> 0:06:03.919 to themselves know what they want. But I know that 0:06:03.919 --> 0:06:07.159 that life lesson is endless. But it's just like we 0:06:07.279 --> 0:06:10.959 spend so much time trying to look the part, say 0:06:11.039 --> 0:06:12.039 the right things. 0:06:11.759 --> 0:06:12.599 To be accepted. 0:06:12.679 --> 0:06:15.799 But I feel like there's some life lesson we get eventually. 0:06:16.159 --> 0:06:18.399 I'm still on the journey where it's like you don't 0:06:18.439 --> 0:06:22.159 really care anymore and you just follow your internal compass. 0:06:22.399 --> 0:06:25.759 Yes, yeah, you believe in yourself. You have that self 0:06:25.759 --> 0:06:29.039 assuredness and confidence in who you are and what you 0:06:29.039 --> 0:06:31.719 want in the world, which is wonderful, yeah, and which 0:06:32.079 --> 0:06:36.039 feels very contrary to a lot of the social media 0:06:36.079 --> 0:06:36.999 trends that. 0:06:36.919 --> 0:06:38.439 We see nowadays as well. 0:06:38.559 --> 0:06:43.159 Yes, I mean I really try not to intentionally engage 0:06:43.199 --> 0:06:46.399 with this kind of content, but like all the stuff 0:06:46.439 --> 0:06:49.319 about you know what was it, Korean beauty trends and 0:06:49.439 --> 0:06:53.399 skin and I went on a deep dive or like 0:06:53.919 --> 0:06:54.479 it wasn't. 0:06:54.279 --> 0:06:55.319 Even deep, it was a dive. 0:06:55.439 --> 0:06:57.799 I was too scared to go deep to be honest 0:06:58.239 --> 0:07:02.679 into like looks Maxing, looks Maxing, looks Maxing. 0:07:02.919 --> 0:07:04.359 Yeah, it's the lingo of. 0:07:05.999 --> 0:07:09.799 That is that the gen Z stuff that looks it 0:07:09.879 --> 0:07:12.639 looks max I love that you say to it again, 0:07:12.719 --> 0:07:14.919 because I gotta get it, like. 0:07:17.239 --> 0:07:23.839 It's it's the trend of like maximal physical appearance and sadly, 0:07:23.999 --> 0:07:25.879 like I know we often speak to kind of a 0:07:25.879 --> 0:07:29.119 female audience, but looks maxing is very much also targeted 0:07:29.159 --> 0:07:32.759 towards young men as well. It's like ultimate Patrick Bateman 0:07:33.679 --> 0:07:38.559 American psycho vibes of like you need to look your 0:07:38.719 --> 0:07:41.039 absolute best and here's all the ways in which you 0:07:41.079 --> 0:07:43.319 can do that. And if you look good, then you 0:07:43.359 --> 0:07:45.839 are a more attractive to females and b you own 0:07:45.999 --> 0:07:49.039 respect from other men. And I was even listening to 0:07:49.679 --> 0:07:51.719 a podcast, and I'm really worried about what's going to 0:07:51.759 --> 0:07:54.199 happen to my algorithms now after looking. 0:07:53.879 --> 0:07:55.839 At all this content. That's my biggest concern. 0:07:56.239 --> 0:07:58.639 I was listening to a podcast where a guy was 0:07:58.839 --> 0:08:03.999 being interviewed about this, and he was making these comments about, 0:08:04.279 --> 0:08:06.919 you know that men are expected to be providers for 0:08:06.999 --> 0:08:10.719 women these days, and so if every man's a provider, 0:08:10.759 --> 0:08:12.559 what's going to set you apart from the next guy? 0:08:12.839 --> 0:08:15.919 It's your looks And that was like, that was the takeaway, 0:08:16.039 --> 0:08:19.039 and I was like hyperventilating as I was driving to 0:08:19.079 --> 0:08:22.719 work listening to that, right, because what kind of pressure 0:08:22.759 --> 0:08:26.159 and expectations does that put on young men and young 0:08:26.199 --> 0:08:30.239 women and society as a whole to be so focused 0:08:30.239 --> 0:08:33.999 on appearance and focused on being youthful and young. 0:08:34.239 --> 0:08:35.039 Yeah, so true. 0:08:35.079 --> 0:08:38.639 And it's like you don't see often such a diversity 0:08:38.679 --> 0:08:42.279 represented in age in media as well, Like I think 0:08:42.479 --> 0:08:46.639 it's coming a little bit into the space. Like I 0:08:46.639 --> 0:08:50.719 definitely have seen older women that are modeling products or campaigns, 0:08:50.719 --> 0:08:53.359 and I'm like, that's amazing, Like we're definitely turning the 0:08:53.439 --> 0:08:56.559 dial very slightly. So I'm like, okay, let's celebrate that. 0:08:56.639 --> 0:08:58.399 But also it isn't. 0:08:58.639 --> 0:09:00.039 It's not the majority. 0:09:00.319 --> 0:09:03.759 Absolutely, and so much so that I actually found a 0:09:03.799 --> 0:09:06.639 report that was done by the Australian Human Rights Commission 0:09:07.039 --> 0:09:09.479 and they literally state that older people in the media 0:09:09.519 --> 0:09:14.479 are often portrayed as frail, weak victims or in poor health, 0:09:14.559 --> 0:09:17.319 and that those age sixty five and over rarely feature 0:09:17.319 --> 0:09:19.839 in advertising campaigns or editorial media. 0:09:20.159 --> 0:09:21.999 Wow. So it's crazy. 0:09:22.279 --> 0:09:27.239 I think what that creates is this perhaps unconscious bias 0:09:27.319 --> 0:09:33.039 within us to be biased against older people, but potentially 0:09:33.119 --> 0:09:35.879 even our own older selves. 0:09:36.159 --> 0:09:37.879 Yeah, that's so true. 0:09:38.359 --> 0:09:40.279 You know, the reality is as you get older, you 0:09:40.359 --> 0:09:43.479 actually become all wiser, Like that's just inevitable. Like the 0:09:43.519 --> 0:09:45.839 amount of friends that I have or mentors that are 0:09:45.839 --> 0:09:48.279 older than me, and I love beating their presence, Like 0:09:48.559 --> 0:09:51.519 I'm just sitting there just soaking up like a sponge 0:09:51.599 --> 0:09:54.719 because they have so many things that they want to share, 0:09:54.839 --> 0:09:57.519 and I think so often in today's society we don't 0:09:57.639 --> 0:10:01.919 value those in that internal journey as much as we 0:10:02.039 --> 0:10:03.799 do with that outward appearance. 0:10:04.559 --> 0:10:08.559 Well, it's such a good point about culture because there 0:10:08.559 --> 0:10:12.079 are so many cultures that have, you know, the elders totally. 0:10:12.159 --> 0:10:16.079 There are the wise members of society that you go 0:10:16.159 --> 0:10:22.399 to for guidance and wisdom and advice. Yeah, and we've 0:10:22.399 --> 0:10:26.319 perhaps lost that in certain ways, you know, valuing the 0:10:26.399 --> 0:10:28.639 wisdom that comes with age and experience. 0:10:28.839 --> 0:10:31.999 Definitely, I mean definitely if we just take a snapshot 0:10:32.039 --> 0:10:34.759 of where things are in the world, like you know, 0:10:34.879 --> 0:10:36.919 the fact that elders aren't involved in a lot of 0:10:36.959 --> 0:10:39.719 conversations like that just shows, you know, because yeah, a 0:10:39.719 --> 0:10:41.759 lot of I know previously, for me, I've done a 0:10:41.759 --> 0:10:43.679 lot of work in the rights of passage space and 0:10:43.719 --> 0:10:45.959 we would talk about with young people around a lot 0:10:45.999 --> 0:10:49.399 of those traditional Eastern cultures where they do have certain 0:10:49.479 --> 0:10:51.839 rituals when young people come of age and then they 0:10:51.879 --> 0:10:55.079 have I know for women. I think it was the 0:10:55.119 --> 0:10:58.559 Apache women. It's a certain tribe and they have when 0:10:58.639 --> 0:11:00.639 a woman is bleeding, a girl is bleeding for the 0:11:00.639 --> 0:11:03.079 first time, so that's her coming of age. She would 0:11:03.119 --> 0:11:07.279 sit in a hollow tree and bleed throughout the whole week, 0:11:07.359 --> 0:11:09.839 and the only people that can visit her were women 0:11:09.959 --> 0:11:12.519 or elders in the community, and they would like talk 0:11:12.559 --> 0:11:15.479 to her about the responsibilities that come from being a woman. 0:11:15.559 --> 0:11:18.839 And it's just like, even just hearing that story, you're. 0:11:18.639 --> 0:11:21.799 Like, wow, we really have lost touch of those really 0:11:21.839 --> 0:11:23.799 beautiful aspects of eldership. 0:11:24.239 --> 0:11:27.439 And how different is that experience to perhaps when a 0:11:27.439 --> 0:11:29.719 young girl or a woman bleeds for the first time. Now, 0:11:29.759 --> 0:11:32.959 where it's something that's like hidden away, it's very private, 0:11:33.039 --> 0:11:35.559 it's not to be discussed, you know, it's like kept 0:11:35.559 --> 0:11:37.879 in the corner in a dark secret somewhere, as opposed 0:11:37.959 --> 0:11:39.359 to the story that you've. 0:11:39.239 --> 0:11:42.199 Just shared exactly exactly, And there's so much like in 0:11:42.199 --> 0:11:46.119 those moments where we feel certain ways. That's why we 0:11:46.199 --> 0:11:48.439 can lean on elders be like, oh, I had that 0:11:48.519 --> 0:11:51.519 same feeling. Don't worry, this is what I did. Like 0:11:51.919 --> 0:11:54.399 be kinder to yourself. So anyways, it's just I just 0:11:54.439 --> 0:11:56.639 find it really interesting because we don't value it as 0:11:56.719 --> 0:12:00.919 much yet I feel like it's just so valuable. So 0:12:01.039 --> 0:12:03.839 we have spoken about grief before on the pod, so 0:12:03.879 --> 0:12:06.119 if you haven't into the episode, go check it out. 0:12:06.559 --> 0:12:09.119 But I feel like there is a grief that comes 0:12:09.159 --> 0:12:12.039 with getting older. It's like you're grieving younger versions of 0:12:12.079 --> 0:12:13.319 yourself in a way. 0:12:13.279 --> 0:12:18.239 Yeah, past our past self, past identity, but also like, 0:12:18.799 --> 0:12:21.759 you know, my past body that was maybe a little 0:12:21.759 --> 0:12:22.719 bit more able than my. 0:12:22.719 --> 0:12:29.719 Current body is. Or you know what I grieve, Yeah, innocence. Oh, 0:12:29.759 --> 0:12:30.479 and I guess. 0:12:30.239 --> 0:12:34.319 When I say innocence, I'm thinking about a younger version 0:12:34.359 --> 0:12:37.479 of myself. This is gonna sound sad, but like a 0:12:37.479 --> 0:12:41.319 younger version of myself that wasn't as aware of how 0:12:41.479 --> 0:12:45.079 hard the world can be. And I think that's something 0:12:45.079 --> 0:12:47.599 that we learn just as we get older, we're exposed 0:12:47.639 --> 0:12:50.159 to more hardships in life, whether it's our own hardships 0:12:50.239 --> 0:12:53.039 or whether it's the hardships of others. There's kind of 0:12:53.039 --> 0:12:56.119 an innocence that comes with like being young or even 0:12:56.119 --> 0:12:58.719 a teenager in your early twenties, and everything can just 0:12:58.879 --> 0:13:02.159 feel really like fresh and great, and it's not to 0:13:02.199 --> 0:13:05.119 say it doesn't now, but there is a of a 0:13:05.199 --> 0:13:08.039 tinge there. There's a lens of also knowing how hard 0:13:08.559 --> 0:13:10.559 life can be for so many people. 0:13:10.839 --> 0:13:12.879 I don't know about you, but I definitely feel like 0:13:13.199 --> 0:13:16.439 time speeds up as we get older. You know, there's 0:13:16.479 --> 0:13:19.159 some quickening that's been happening. I don't know, I'm noticing 0:13:19.199 --> 0:13:22.519 it more. The perception of time changes. 0:13:22.559 --> 0:13:23.439 It's definitely the case. 0:13:23.519 --> 0:13:25.479 I feel it as well, where like a whole other 0:13:25.559 --> 0:13:27.879 year passes and I'm like, it's already Christmas. 0:13:28.639 --> 0:13:29.879 Didn't we just do that? 0:13:30.199 --> 0:13:30.879 True? 0:13:31.599 --> 0:13:32.239 This is an. 0:13:32.079 --> 0:13:39.839 Interesting concept because as we get older, we have more routine, 0:13:40.599 --> 0:13:44.399 more structure, and less novelty in our day to day life. 0:13:44.919 --> 0:13:47.759 When we're young, a lot of things are very new 0:13:47.879 --> 0:13:50.879 and fresh and exciting. But when we're older, we settle 0:13:50.919 --> 0:13:55.919 into our routines, and so this sense of sameness can 0:13:56.159 --> 0:14:00.079 can make it feel like time is passing quite fast, 0:14:00.119 --> 0:14:01.919 and when we look back at like the past week 0:14:02.039 --> 0:14:04.399 or the past month, we're like, gosh, it just sort 0:14:04.399 --> 0:14:07.679 of flu by because I was so set in my 0:14:07.839 --> 0:14:10.039 routines and doing the same thing. You know, I get up, 0:14:10.039 --> 0:14:11.959 I go to the gym, I go to work. I 0:14:11.959 --> 0:14:13.679 don't go to gym the morning. I'm just saying, case 0:14:13.679 --> 0:14:15.359 people do go to the gym in the morning, put 0:14:15.399 --> 0:14:18.719 on you clarify that. You know, if people get up, 0:14:18.719 --> 0:14:20.439 they have their morning routine, they go to work, they 0:14:20.519 --> 0:14:22.599 come home, they make dinner, they go to bed. You know, 0:14:22.639 --> 0:14:25.159 that sense of sameness five days a week or whatever 0:14:25.199 --> 0:14:28.279 it might be, creates this feeling of time just sort 0:14:28.279 --> 0:14:31.639 of slipping by. So to that, I would suggest a 0:14:31.679 --> 0:14:34.399 couple of sort of antidotes or ways we can overcome that. 0:14:34.799 --> 0:14:37.119 First of all, savor. 0:14:36.719 --> 0:14:39.879 The moments, yea, even if their routine moments, just like 0:14:39.999 --> 0:14:41.879 savor them when you sit in the morning with that 0:14:41.959 --> 0:14:44.679 cup of coffee and you take those few SIPs. Savor 0:14:44.719 --> 0:14:47.399 them when you're having that really nice lunch and the 0:14:47.439 --> 0:14:49.759 sun is shining down on you and you can feel 0:14:49.759 --> 0:14:53.079 the sun against your skin. Savor those moments. Be really 0:14:53.119 --> 0:14:55.999 mindful and present with them is one way to sort 0:14:55.999 --> 0:14:58.639 of help kind of slow down time, to actually be 0:14:58.759 --> 0:15:01.759 mindful rather than mindless and thinking about other things. 0:15:01.799 --> 0:15:02.519 So true. 0:15:02.919 --> 0:15:09.279 But the second is find novelty, have new experiences, try. 0:15:09.199 --> 0:15:12.559 New hobbies, new activities, go out, meet new people, chat 0:15:12.599 --> 0:15:15.679 with the person at the bus stop. Newness and novelty 0:15:16.039 --> 0:15:19.359 will also help it feel like there's more actually happening 0:15:19.479 --> 0:15:21.439 in your day to day life, and the brain is 0:15:21.519 --> 0:15:25.359 more likely to remember those new novel experiences than the 0:15:25.399 --> 0:15:28.439 more kind of mundane routine things that we're doing. 0:15:28.759 --> 0:15:31.119 I love that because I feel like, in a way 0:15:31.639 --> 0:15:33.959 for me, when I think about a new hobby and 0:15:33.999 --> 0:15:37.359 as you're talking about it, what comes up is like, oh, 0:15:37.599 --> 0:15:41.039 I have to go out and socialize, Like, oh do 0:15:41.119 --> 0:15:43.399 I have to? And it's interesting because it's so funny. 0:15:43.439 --> 0:15:45.079 I go through the same loop where I'm like. 0:15:46.559 --> 0:15:48.679 Feeling stuck and then you're like, hey, you should go 0:15:48.759 --> 0:15:50.799 out and connect, and I'm like, oh, I don't know 0:15:50.839 --> 0:15:52.679 if I want to connect. And then I go out 0:15:52.679 --> 0:15:54.639 and connect and I come back I'm like that was great. 0:15:54.759 --> 0:15:57.759 You know, it's like we're so so stuck in our 0:15:57.799 --> 0:16:00.079 ways that we can be a little bit stubborn. 0:16:00.479 --> 0:16:00.759 I e. 0:16:01.119 --> 0:16:03.879 I can be stubborn to like be a little bit 0:16:03.919 --> 0:16:05.079 more fluid. You know. 0:16:05.399 --> 0:16:08.999 Yes, yes, it's interesting because different people like different kind 0:16:08.999 --> 0:16:12.359 of personality traits will mean that some people are more 0:16:12.439 --> 0:16:15.719 kind of open to new experiences and other people are less. 0:16:15.999 --> 0:16:19.239 And you know, I know for myself, I'm certainly like, 0:16:19.319 --> 0:16:22.199 I hate routine, I hate structure in my week. 0:16:22.599 --> 0:16:24.239 I like every day to be different. 0:16:24.439 --> 0:16:27.639 Yeah, despite the chaos that that can sometimes bring. But 0:16:27.719 --> 0:16:30.359 I'm not a kind of routined person and I love 0:16:30.999 --> 0:16:34.759 new things. I will try a lot of things, not 0:16:34.799 --> 0:16:36.639 all things, a lot of things. 0:16:36.759 --> 0:16:38.559 Yeah, I find it very exciting. 0:16:38.719 --> 0:16:41.639 I can imagine as well. We can feel a lot 0:16:41.679 --> 0:16:45.319 of different things when the reality is as you're getting older, 0:16:45.359 --> 0:16:48.999 you're getting closer to death, and that's that's a lot 0:16:49.039 --> 0:16:50.279 to sit with sometimes. 0:16:50.559 --> 0:16:54.399 Yes, yeah, there's the fear of the unknown totally, the 0:16:54.439 --> 0:16:58.279 fear of change, but also the fear of death that 0:16:58.319 --> 0:17:02.759 can be a very real source of anxiety for a 0:17:02.759 --> 0:17:05.519 lot of people. In fact, there's this sort of body 0:17:05.559 --> 0:17:09.839 of work and research in psychological literature around death anxiety 0:17:09.959 --> 0:17:12.439 as an actual condition that exists. 0:17:12.559 --> 0:17:13.279 It's a condition. 0:17:13.399 --> 0:17:18.239 Well yeah, there are two leading clinical psychologists in Australia, 0:17:18.439 --> 0:17:21.919 Rachel and Ross Menzies, who do fabulous work in this space. 0:17:21.959 --> 0:17:23.879 They've written a book called Mortals if. 0:17:23.799 --> 0:17:27.799 Anyone's interested in reading more about death and death anxiety. 0:17:28.239 --> 0:17:31.999 But it really is this fascinating concept that there are 0:17:32.079 --> 0:17:34.759 some of us who think more about death than others, 0:17:35.119 --> 0:17:37.519 and for some of us. That thought process can become 0:17:37.799 --> 0:17:41.079 all consuming, overwhelming. It can lead to panic attacks, it 0:17:41.079 --> 0:17:44.719 can lead to feeling quite paralyzed in life, or feeling 0:17:44.799 --> 0:17:46.799 constantly anxious as we go through the world. 0:17:47.719 --> 0:17:51.959 Totally, I'm really glad to hear that there is something 0:17:51.999 --> 0:17:55.239 around this because I definitely, whether it's myself or friends 0:17:55.239 --> 0:18:00.519 that are older, like we talk about, you know, death 0:18:00.679 --> 0:18:03.079 in a way and noticing like for me, even just 0:18:03.079 --> 0:18:05.359 saying the word death and it's like wow, Like it 0:18:05.479 --> 0:18:09.079 is such a taboo word. We don't talk about it enough, 0:18:09.119 --> 0:18:11.959 and it's important we do. But it's just good to 0:18:11.999 --> 0:18:15.319 know that it's a normal thing to feel as well 0:18:15.359 --> 0:18:16.519 as you get older, right. 0:18:16.799 --> 0:18:20.439 Yeah, absolutely, to become more aware of it, more conscious 0:18:20.479 --> 0:18:23.599 of it, and you know, being aware of our own 0:18:23.639 --> 0:18:26.479 mortality is not a bad thing. It can be really 0:18:26.599 --> 0:18:30.599 useful to help us make some really values aligned decisions 0:18:30.639 --> 0:18:34.159 for ourselves. What we don't want is it to riddle 0:18:34.239 --> 0:18:36.119 us with anxiety to the point where we feel like 0:18:36.159 --> 0:18:38.119 we can't move through the world in the way we 0:18:38.159 --> 0:18:38.479 want to. 0:18:41.279 --> 0:18:43.799 After this break, we're going to be teaching you how 0:18:43.839 --> 0:18:49.679 to build a healthier relationship with aging. Stay with us, Okay, 0:18:49.719 --> 0:18:52.639 So how do we build a healthier relationship with aging 0:18:52.719 --> 0:18:54.799 because it is happening to all of us. 0:18:55.239 --> 0:19:01.199 Yeah, no one gets out of this life alive. Sorry, 0:19:02.519 --> 0:19:03.239 was that too much? 0:19:04.599 --> 0:19:08.639 I don't know why it sounds. Really, you're all stucky, 0:19:09.239 --> 0:19:14.479 you're all gonna die. Oh my god, you're all trapped 0:19:14.519 --> 0:19:21.239 in this body. 0:19:19.359 --> 0:19:24.559 To make friends at parties. Okay, I'll keep. 0:19:24.399 --> 0:19:26.279 That one inside my head. 0:19:26.799 --> 0:19:27.559 Oh, I feel like. 0:19:28.039 --> 0:19:31.239 So that's the first takeaway. 0:19:31.399 --> 0:19:32.479 But my point is. 0:19:34.479 --> 0:19:36.719 Now, I feel like anything I'm gonna say is just 0:19:36.759 --> 0:19:38.799 be Death is inevitable. 0:19:39.199 --> 0:19:42.639 But it's true. Like you saw me stuttering over the world, I. 0:19:42.559 --> 0:19:46.399 Was like, and you'm just more used to talking about 0:19:46.439 --> 0:19:47.199 things like this. 0:19:47.519 --> 0:19:48.519 I think that's what it is. 0:19:48.959 --> 0:19:50.679 Okay, But I guess what the point I'm trying to 0:19:50.679 --> 0:19:53.719 get at is that, you know, we need to acknowledge 0:19:54.399 --> 0:19:57.919 death is being inevitable for everyone. Aging is being inevitable. 0:19:57.959 --> 0:19:59.799 It's gonna happen to all of us, and no matter 0:19:59.839 --> 0:20:03.159 how hard we try to resist it with all the 0:20:03.439 --> 0:20:06.999