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Speaker 1: When you actually prioritize your own happiness and well being

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Speaker 1: and yet you get paid less, your happiness will be

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Speaker 1: worth more. Keep something in your school life or your

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Speaker 1: life that you actually like doing. It's not about how

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Speaker 1: you get there. There are a lot of different ways,

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Speaker 1: and there'll never be a clean journey, and if there is,

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Speaker 1: it'll probably be pretty boring and underwhelming.

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Speaker 2: Welcome to the Sees the YA Podcast. Busy and happy

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Speaker 2: are not the same thing. We too rarely question what

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Speaker 2: makes the heart seeing. We work, then we rest, but

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Speaker 2: rarely we play and often don't realize there's more than

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Speaker 2: one way. So this is a platform to hear and

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Speaker 2: explore the stories of those who found lives. They adore

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Speaker 2: the good, bad and ugly. The best and worst day

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Speaker 2: will bear all the facets of seizing your yay. I'm

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Speaker 2: Sarah Davidson or a spoonful of Sarah, a lawyer turned

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Speaker 2: entrepreneur who swapped the suits and heels to co found

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Speaker 2: matcha Maiden and matcha Milk Bark. CZA is a series

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Speaker 2: of conversations on finding a life you love and exploring

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Speaker 2: the self doubt, challenge, joy and fulfillment along the way.

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Speaker 2: I am so excited about this week's guest, and how

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Speaker 2: wild that coincides with the very weekend I landed in

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Speaker 2: Antarctica exactly a year ago. Time has flown so much.

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Speaker 2: I still can't believe that actually happened. It's kind of

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Speaker 2: like a dream of going to a different planet. But

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Speaker 2: how amazing to get to relive it all in this episode.

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Speaker 2: I'm so pumped to have David Knoff with us this week.

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Speaker 2: You'll be able to hear in my voice very quickly,

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Speaker 2: how fascinating I found his apath yay, not only his

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Speaker 2: Antarctic journey, which you'll hear all about, but all the

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Speaker 2: crazy dots that had to connect to get him there.

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Speaker 2: Think starting off with doing woodwork in Vce, do a

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Speaker 2: career as an officer in the Army, commanding a whole

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Speaker 2: platoon with the Regional Assistants Mission at Solomon Islands, turned

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Speaker 2: diplomat at the Australian High Commission in Pakistan, which then

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Speaker 2: became their secretary at the Australian Embassy in Iraq, with

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Speaker 2: a side of professional photography in Turkey, metals for formation,

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Speaker 2: skydiving in Dubai, and even some records in splitboarding, which

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Speaker 2: by the way is a hybrid snowboard that can be

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Speaker 2: separated into cross country skis for ascent. And that's all

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Speaker 2: before he became an Antarctic station leader at Davis Station,

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Speaker 2: which is not only already a uniquely intense and challenging

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Speaker 2: role to Phil let alone, when you get stuck there

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Speaker 2: during an unprecedented global pandemic for five hundred and thirty

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Speaker 2: seven days, you can only imagine how interesting that story is,

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Speaker 2: such that he has written it all into an incredible

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Speaker 2: book which I absolutely poured over. With more exciting projects

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Speaker 2: related to that story on the horizon. I'll let David

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Speaker 2: tell you more about it himself. He's a far better storyteller,

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Speaker 2: but I hope you find it as captivating and invigorating

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Speaker 2: as I did. There is more side note. For some reason,

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Speaker 2: I use the same exact setup with microphones and everything

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Speaker 2: as I usually do, but my audio got a little

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Speaker 2: bit distorted and we don't know why. We've fixed it up.

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Speaker 2: Mostly but his audio is far better than mine. He

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Speaker 2: had a pro set up, So for any of those

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Speaker 2: very accustomed ears who noticed my audio isn't as good

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Speaker 2: as usual, my apologies, but I hope you enjoy it. Nonetheless,

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Speaker 2: David welcome to seize thea.

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Speaker 1: Thanks for having me. I can't wait to delve into this.

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Speaker 2: I am so excited about this. I just mentioned off

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Speaker 2: here that we have been chatting for a little while.

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Speaker 2: In fact, we had one RANDO call that just went

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Speaker 2: for like an hour and a half that was just

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Speaker 2: becoming mates. But also with the Antarctic connection, I landed

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Speaker 2: in Antarctica on this day last year, so this was

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Speaker 2: meant to be.

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Speaker 1: Oh absolutely, And I mean I was just saying as well,

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Speaker 1: like this is quite early in the Antarctic summer to

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Speaker 1: get down there, so it would have been great to go.

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Speaker 1: Like the first time I ever went down was a

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Speaker 1: tourist as well, back in sort of twenty fifteen or something.

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Speaker 1: We went in sort of January and at the peak

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Speaker 1: of summer, whereas you would have still got it in November,

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Speaker 1: you can still get some very very cold temperatures, you

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Speaker 1: still had a lot of sea ice, and the wildlife

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Speaker 1: is still kind of returning from its winter abroad and

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Speaker 1: then they all go back to Antarctica for the summer.

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Speaker 2: And we did hear that. I had a couple of

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Speaker 2: people say who had been in sort of the November,

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Speaker 2: like there were a lot more whales later in the season.

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Speaker 2: But they also were like, oh my god, the smell.

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Speaker 2: And I was like, what smell? We had pristine ice,

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Speaker 2: like nothing had been touched for a whole winter. It

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Speaker 2: was amazing. I didn't smell anything.

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Speaker 1: I love that because I had someone the other day

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Speaker 1: chatting her out because I'm heading back down to Antartica

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Speaker 1: this summer as well, and it was sort of gearing

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Speaker 1: up and doing some training and stuff, and so I

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Speaker 1: was like, I really really wanted to spend a night

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Speaker 1: like out at a penguin colony, just like in and

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Speaker 1: amongst it. And I'm like, well, first of all, under

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Speaker 1: the permitting regulations, you're not really supposed to do that.

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Speaker 1: Second of all, the mini you've smelled a penguin rookery

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Speaker 1: and a colony. It's spectacular, but the smell will put

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Speaker 1: you off ever spending any longer than the minimum amount

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Speaker 1: of time.

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Speaker 2: It's pungent, like not from Antarctica, from other experiences. And

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Speaker 2: we actually did this random thing out in Sorrento where

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Speaker 2: you can swim out to the seal. There's like this

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Speaker 2: I think it's the some famous hut anyway on the peninsula,

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Speaker 2: and all these seals like have made it their home

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Speaker 2: and you can go and dive and with your snorkel on.

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Speaker 2: It's fine. Accidentally took my snorkel off. I was like,

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Speaker 2: I'm going to die, like I am deceased from the

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Speaker 2: scent of the fish and the wee. Oh my god,

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Speaker 2: it was so much so I can't even imagine. But

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Speaker 2: I have just finished your incredible, incredible book, Five hundred

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Speaker 2: and thirty seven Days of Winter, And as you listeners know,

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Speaker 2: I dropped hints last week and a lot of you

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Speaker 2: were already very excited without knowing anything really about David's

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Speaker 2: story that he's an antarctic expert, among so many other things.

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Speaker 2: I cannot wait to get into this. But before we do,

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Speaker 2: I start every episode with a little a little ice

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Speaker 2: freaker never been more relevant, which is to ask, what

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Speaker 2: is the most down to earth thing about you? Because

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Speaker 2: you have an incredibly impressive resume You've done before the

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Speaker 2: Antarctica chapter even starts. You've done incredible things, and I

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Speaker 2: think we all just need to know that you're a

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Speaker 2: regular dude who does weird, quirky, down to earthshit.

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Speaker 1: Oh I regaon the best one at the moment, I'm

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Speaker 1: so excited by my house plants and one of my

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Speaker 1: projects in Lockdown twenty twenty one, amongst writing the book,

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Speaker 1: was seating avocado pips and being like, right, avocados aren't

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Speaker 1: supposed to grow in Melbourne, but I'm going to just

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Speaker 1: every avocado I eat, I'm going to work with the

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Speaker 1: pips and try and grow them. And now I have

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Speaker 1: two years gone after that, one of my avocado trees

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Speaker 1: in the back. I was standing there and stare at it,

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Speaker 1: going like that was a pip that I like, was

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Speaker 1: that was an avocado pip from an avocado I ate,

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Speaker 1: And now look at it, it's a tree. I'm so

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Speaker 1: proud of it. It's just so that's probably the dorkiest,

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Speaker 1: down to us, least adventurous thing about me at the moment.

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Speaker 2: I love how it's like the basic pleasures of not

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Speaker 2: living in Antarctica is that you could have plants like

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Speaker 2: an avocado, Like how exciting, Oh my god, of course

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Speaker 2: you would have had avocados.

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Speaker 1: We have. Yeah, So it's funny with the food we

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Speaker 1: did and didn't have down there, and even you would

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Speaker 1: have seen this on a short trip to the peninsula,

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Speaker 1: like bananas and some of these things they just don't

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Speaker 1: last eve. You just can't freeze them properly. You can

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Speaker 1: dehydrate them, and I did get addicted to dehydrated banana

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Speaker 1: only en half and they're a very acquiet taste. I've

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Speaker 1: tried them now that I'm back, and you're like, nah,

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Speaker 1: not really, but yeah, avocados you have, like guacamole paste,

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Speaker 1: you can you can craze people that. It's just like

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Speaker 1: that's the sort of stuff from your supermarket aisle that

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Speaker 1: you look at it and go, oh, I don't have

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Speaker 1: time to make Guacamoleans buy that, and no one really

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Speaker 1: enjoys it that much. That's all you get. I mean,

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Speaker 1: these are first very problem because in so many ways,

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Speaker 1: the food down there on the Antarctic stations and even

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Speaker 1: some of the more adventurous expeditions, it's pretty good. There's

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Speaker 1: no parasite, like, there's no flies, there's no bugs and ISOs,

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Speaker 1: and it's ninety nine percent of the time it's at

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Speaker 1: least below fridge temperatures, so below four degrees or freezing.

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Speaker 1: You can leave your food outside. He's got to put

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Speaker 1: in the shape with some stew on the top of it.

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Speaker 1: You can just leave anyway, just leave it anyway, Like

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Speaker 1: you just bet people like, oh, what do you do

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Speaker 1: with food? And then you go, well, how much of

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Speaker 1: your diet these days is frozen? And they go oh, yeah, wow,

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Speaker 1: and exactly so we you know, we're stuck there for

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Speaker 1: a year and a half and still right at the

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Speaker 1: end of that we still had eggs. Now, I wouldn't

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Speaker 1: describe them as fresh.

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Speaker 2: Fresh is not the word I'd use.

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Speaker 1: But no, but the especially preserved they but this like

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Speaker 1: oil coating on them, and this company and tassy that

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Speaker 1: do it. Then you keep them at the right temperature

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Speaker 1: and in the right locations, and you just make sure

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Speaker 1: that when you're cracking them, you're cracking them all separately

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Speaker 1: if you're putting a bunch together, so if you get

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Speaker 1: a rotten one, it's not it doesn't small, but you

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Speaker 1: kind of go wow, like, in terms of food technology,

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Speaker 1: we've come a long way from you one hundred years ago.

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Speaker 1: When they went tied together. They kind of have like

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Speaker 1: tinned meat and see a blood, add some pepper to it.

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Speaker 2: I mean, that was one of my favorite parts. I mean,

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Speaker 2: apart from the more awe inspiring and like hated leadership

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Speaker 2: questions and the rescue missions and actually it was like

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Speaker 2: the banal kind of day to day what do you

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Speaker 2: actually do on an Antarctic station that I found so

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Speaker 2: fascinating because it's just so foreign for most people to

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Speaker 2: read about. Like this is what I love about this

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Speaker 2: show is I get to dive into lifestyles that you

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Speaker 2: don't have to live the lifestyle to hear from someone

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Speaker 2: who's done it to kind of like live it yourself.

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Speaker 2: But before we get there, my favorite thing about getting

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Speaker 2: to spend time with people like you is to trace

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Speaker 2: back that people will meet you through your book or

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Speaker 2: through your public speaking and you're an Antarctic expedition leader

195
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Speaker 2: who's gone on this incredibly once in a lifetime journey

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Speaker 2: at a time when the world has never seen you know,

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Speaker 2: there's so many big ticket things, and forget that you

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Speaker 2: were once a kid who had no idea he'd end

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Speaker 2: up here, who had to make decisions about your career,

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Speaker 2: who had an entire career before this. By the way,

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Speaker 2: and I've got you know, in my kind of like

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Speaker 2: weird creep research, have gone back to like the subjects

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Speaker 2: that you studied at school and like what you thought

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Speaker 2: that would translate to. And I think tracing back to

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Speaker 2: who you were as a kid and all the decisions

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Speaker 2: it took to get you here is what's really relatable

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Speaker 2: for people listening who don't know where they could end

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Speaker 2: up one day, and that it could be on an

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Speaker 2: Antarctic station. So can you take us back to three

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Speaker 2: kids in Clint Waverley physics maths would work keeping your

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Speaker 2: options open for after school, your first jobs. You know,

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Speaker 2: what was your childhood like and who did you think

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Speaker 2: you'd be?

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Speaker 1: Well, that that is taking it a long way back.

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Speaker 2: It's my specialty. Let's throw back.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. So yeah, graffic club where there was the

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Speaker 1: second of three kids parents. Parents ran a small business

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Speaker 1: which I think in so many ways set the three

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Speaker 1: of us kids up in terms of we didn't see

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Speaker 1: it as a like the whole family was the business

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Speaker 1: and that yes, dad went to work and mom went

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Speaker 1: to work, and we went to work. There in the

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Speaker 1: school holidays we were running like an automotive parts business.

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Speaker 1: So in the holidays we'd go and working around sticking

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Speaker 1: orders and learning all that stuff which under modern workplace

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Speaker 1: health and safety you would just be completely not You

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Speaker 1: cannot get a twelve year old kid on school holidays

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Speaker 1: to pick orders in a warehouse on a skateboard while

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Speaker 1: there's forklifts in operations.

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Speaker 2: I was going to say, were you fourteen and nine

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Speaker 2: months Let's pretend you were, like yeah, anyway.

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Speaker 1: Won't name the company, but yeah, it was ally it's easy.

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Speaker 1: You got good at skateboarding, and so I think that

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Speaker 1: set us up. We sort of had a good work

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Speaker 1: ethic from a young age. But also we're fairly free

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Speaker 1: range kids. This was in the nineties out in gloomily

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Speaker 1: pretty safe suburb we'd ride bmx's and or skateboards or

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Speaker 1: rollerbades or whatever the phase of your childhood was for

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Speaker 1: your method of transport out into the parklands, and you

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Speaker 1: just you'd go and then you've got to be home

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Speaker 1: by sunset sort of thing. And there was a group

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Speaker 1: of other kids down the street and around the corner,

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Speaker 1: and you kind of just off you went. And I

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Speaker 1: think as well, I was lucky enough to go to

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Speaker 1: a school that had outdoor ed programs, and those memories

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Speaker 1: from school were my favorite ones of those those camps.

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Speaker 1: And it's such a shame here as well now that

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Speaker 1: a lot of schools have shied away from camps and

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Speaker 1: overnight camping for a for whole range of reasons, and

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Speaker 1: I just looked back up. But that was the best

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Speaker 1: part of school. Now, obviously not every kid loves the outdoors,

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Speaker 1: but I really loved getting out saying intense and learning

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Speaker 1: how to do that well. And so yeah, when it

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Speaker 1: got to then academia and school, I wanted to be

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Speaker 1: an engineer, and looking back, I didn't want to be

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Speaker 1: an engineer, but it made sense. I liked building stuff,

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Speaker 1: I've been creative, and I was relatively good at physics

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Speaker 1: and maths and some pretty classic boys sort of skills,

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Speaker 1: and so then that was the path that I was

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Speaker 1: going down. Yet when it got to them picking subjects

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Speaker 1: for year twelve, as you said, I was like, no,

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Speaker 1: I really want to do woodwork, and the cruise adviser

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Speaker 1: is like work for like do another math, So I'm like,

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Speaker 1: I hate the one that's I have to do. Why

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Speaker 1: am I doing two maths? I want to do woodwork.

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Speaker 1: I want to have I want to do something practical.

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Speaker 1: And there was two of us at the school that

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Speaker 1: were doing kind of your physics and advanced maths and

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Speaker 1: would work but keep something in your school life or

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Speaker 1: your life that you actually like doing. And that became

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Speaker 1: such a and then even to this day now when

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Speaker 1: renovating my house, I built my kitchen bench, I built

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Speaker 1: coffee tables around my house, and rebuilt my staircase. All

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Speaker 1: these carpentry skills and someone's like, hey, we have to

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Speaker 1: learn how to do this stuff. I like, I did

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Speaker 1: DC would work? Would work? Yeah. It basically led you

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Speaker 1: to a cabinet maker's apprenticeship, which I didn't go and do.

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Speaker 1: So my cabinet making skills they're not that good, but

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Speaker 1: they're good enough. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: I was going to say that don't sound terrible.

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Speaker 1: Exactly, whereas I have just not used algebra as often

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Speaker 1: in my day to day life. Trigonometry, yes, you do

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Speaker 1: need a bit of that with cabinet making. That was

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Speaker 1: and they got to UNI and started doing an engineering degree,

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Speaker 1: likely it was a double degree engineering Arts, and like

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Speaker 1: two years into that, I just I don't want to

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Speaker 1: be an engineer. Nothing about it inspired me, and I

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Speaker 1: bailed on that spent I joined the Army Reserve. When

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Speaker 1: its transferred to full time service with the Army. I'm like,

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Speaker 1: this is unreal, getting me outdoors, it's leadership, it's all

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Speaker 1: these things I didn't really know I wanted to do

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Speaker 1: in life, and just straight away I found it. I'm like, great,

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Speaker 1: I love this. It's practical, it's adventurous, and it's a

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Speaker 1: good gig. And then I've got to go overseas with

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Speaker 1: the army as well as a platoon commander, so leading

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Speaker 1: sort of thirty soldiers. I've been through officer training. Took

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Speaker 1: a platoon over the Solomon Islands in two thousand and

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Speaker 1: seven on a peacekeeping mission. And while I deferred UNI,

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Speaker 1: you know, most people's gap years, you go to Canada

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Speaker 1: and go snowboarding. Background up.

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Speaker 2: You can just get wasted in pubs in Europe and

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Speaker 2: you're like commanding soldiers in the Solomon.

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Speaker 1: Islands, which was I mean, it was a pretty We

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Speaker 1: called it an armed vacation, so it certainly wasn't it

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Speaker 1: wasn't that dangerous in the war warlike kind of way.

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Speaker 1: But it was still just amazing. And I got back

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Speaker 1: and then went right, that's it. I'm not going back

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Speaker 1: to engineering. I'm going to finish my art's degree. And

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Speaker 1: at the time then had started working with Foreign Affairs

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Speaker 1: and Trade to get a job with them later on

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Speaker 1: and succeeds. We did a lot of joint work with

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Speaker 1: them under the Regional Assistance Mission and Solon Islands. So

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Speaker 1: I got back, finished my Arts degree with the politics major,

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Speaker 1: joined Foreign Affairs and Trade, and spent the next ten

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Speaker 1: years as a diplomat before joining the Antarctic programs.

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Speaker 2: So wild. I love that we actually connected through the

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Speaker 2: wonderful Dean of Arts as both graduates of Wanash University

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Speaker 2: Arts faculty. And how funny it was that you were, like,

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Speaker 2: I am proof that with a plain arts degree, which

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Speaker 2: most people don't know what to do with because it's

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Speaker 2: so broad, you can do these incredible things and go

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Speaker 2: and like I mean, like literally, I've said this to you before,

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Speaker 2: and everyone listening knows. For some random reason that has

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Speaker 2: nothing to do with anything in my life, military and

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Speaker 2: international diplomacy is like my jam. It's like the thing

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Speaker 2: I would have done if I didn't go into business.

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Speaker 2: That's what I would have used law for. So reading

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Speaker 2: about you going, you know, from Solomon Islands to Canberra

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Speaker 2: to then oh, let's just like hang out in this

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Speaker 2: lava bard for like five years before Antarctica. Like, it's

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Speaker 2: just wild that this is your journey, but also a

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Speaker 2: really interesting kind of reiteration of the idea that also

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Speaker 2: your life happens in chapters. So like in the army chapter,

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Speaker 2: you might have thought this is going to be my career.

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Speaker 2: I'll be military, but then actually it's diplomacy. And then

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Speaker 2: you do that for five years or six years or whatever,

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Speaker 2: and then suddenly it's like, no, it's time for a

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Speaker 2: next chapter. And I think we all think that we

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Speaker 2: need to find our dream job, and then we arrive

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Speaker 2: there and then we stay there for the rest of

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Speaker 2: our life. And it's like, actually, life is always evolving

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Speaker 2: in these like these chapters that inevitably you'll kind of

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Speaker 2: like get to one new thing, it'll stretch you, your comfort

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Speaker 2: zone will catch up to you. You know it's time

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Speaker 2: for something new. So I'd love to hear how, firstly,

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Speaker 2: I mean how going from sort of done trun to

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Speaker 2: then changing your whole skill set to diplomacy and then

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Speaker 2: working in these high risk, high intensity environments, what that

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Speaker 2: was like, because that's my favorite big personally. But then

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Speaker 2: also when you know that it's time to move out

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Speaker 2: of something like that into something new.

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Speaker 1: It's so right. And I know so many people that

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Speaker 1: chase their dream job and it's just not what it

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Speaker 1: cracked up to be for so many different reasons, and yeah,

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Speaker 1: that idea of eye I want to and I say

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Speaker 1: this one when I talk to school students, either kind

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Speaker 1: of in an actual session or just one on one. Hey,

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Speaker 1: they want to ask questions. Always say like, there are

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Speaker 1: so many careers out there where there is no path. Now,

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Speaker 1: there's a lot of job You want to be a doctor,

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Speaker 1: you've got to go and do that. You've got good

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Speaker 1: Mark's got to get into medicine. You've got to be

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Speaker 1: a doctor. Then there's like a hundred different types of

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Speaker 1: doctors you can be. You can be a doctor that

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Speaker 1: just sits at one cleaning at their whole life and

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Speaker 1: does the same thing and work with retires after fifty years,

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Speaker 1: or you can go and do a million other things

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Speaker 1: within that career. But yet, there's so many jobs out there,

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Speaker 1: and I look at my kind of job and lifestyle

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Speaker 1: now and there is no set career. PATS. Everyone asked

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Speaker 1: that around around DEFAT. They're like, how did to get

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Speaker 1: into DEFAT? Now? Classic way to get into DEFAT is

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Speaker 1: you do an international relations degree. Like international relations, you

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Speaker 1: get a master's in it or a PhD. And you

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Speaker 1: speak Japanese and Chinese and French and Italian or something

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Speaker 1: like that and you go bang and you're into it,

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Speaker 1: they'll hire you, right, that's what they want. There are

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Speaker 1: so many people within Foreign Affairs and Trade and that

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Speaker 1: represent Australia overseas at our embasses who have just completely

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Speaker 1: illogical career into that, but they're great at it because

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Speaker 1: that's what you need, you mean, diplomats. From what people

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Speaker 1: see is but the most obvious thing they see is

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Speaker 1: dealing with consular issues overseas in Australia that's banged up

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Speaker 1: abroad and something's gone wrong and they're incarcerated or they've

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Speaker 1: lost all their belongings have been robbed, and all the

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Speaker 1: response to say like the Barley bombings or something, the

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Speaker 1: embassy official is going to do that. The last thing

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Speaker 1: you want is a bunch of just PhD students and

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Speaker 1: international relations like you need a combination. And so there's

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Speaker 1: some very very practical backgrounds from all. One of my

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Speaker 1: mates has got an agricultural degree and he's a great

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Speaker 1: diplomat and it's just his pathways into that. So that's

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Speaker 1: something as well I think people forget is it's not

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Speaker 1: about how you get there. That there are a lot

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Speaker 1: of different ways and there will never be a clean journey,

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Speaker 1: and if there is, it'll probably be pretty boring underwhelming.

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Speaker 1: But to back up then to your real question, there

398
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Speaker 1: is around like okay, well, how do you know when

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Speaker 1: to change careers? And you're right, Like, when I was

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Speaker 1: in the army, I loved it. I was really enjoyed

401
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Speaker 1: being being an officer and being an infantry soldier as well.

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Speaker 1: Like it it was everything I wanted and I kind

403
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Speaker 1: of felt that when I got back from my trip

404
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Speaker 1: to the Sollis, I'm like Geez and most of the

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Speaker 1: other old old veterans and everyone and other people I

406
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Speaker 1: spoke to, they were like, it doesn't get much better

407
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Speaker 1: than that, like leading your platoon on your first TRIPID

408
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Speaker 1: And I'm like, now, I really I wanted to go

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Speaker 1: to war in so many it sounds so stupid, but

410
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Speaker 1: you do. When you're a soldier, you kind of wanting,

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Speaker 1: you want to go and do something. And I'm like,

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Speaker 1: maybe that was enough. I got to lead a peacekeeping

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Speaker 1: patrol and did some cool little bits in there, and

414
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Speaker 1: there's a great story at the end of the book

415
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Speaker 1: around that of kind of like, oh, that's that's about

416
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Speaker 1: as good as it gets for an infantry officer. And

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Speaker 1: at the time then I realized that the Army doesn't

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Speaker 1: give you a lot of choice in your career. It'll

419
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Speaker 1: tell you where you're going, and you can have And

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Speaker 1: I know some stellar army officers who just through no

421
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Speaker 1: fault of their own, missed out on a lot of troops,

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Speaker 1: didn't get to Afghanistan, or went once in a kind

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Speaker 1: of advisory headquarters role where they don't feel like they

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Speaker 1: really did what they wanted to do. And so I

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Speaker 1: kind of saw that and went, nah, I don't want

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Speaker 1: to do that. I want more control. And Front Affairs

427
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Speaker 1: gave me a lot more control everywhere to go, because

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Speaker 1: I ended up going to places like Pakistan and Iraq

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Speaker 1: and not going to the embassies in Paris or Tokyo

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Speaker 1: or new and yet, because you could do that, you

431
00:20:26,320 --> 00:20:28,639
Speaker 1: could do that later when you've got a family. But

432
00:20:28,800 --> 00:20:31,720
Speaker 1: b we get along in those like this. It's fascinating work.

433
00:20:31,720 --> 00:20:32,840
Speaker 1: But I'm like, no, I want to go and work

434
00:20:32,880 --> 00:20:36,000
Speaker 1: at an embassy where we don't get along. And then

435
00:20:36,480 --> 00:20:38,960
Speaker 1: a decade after that, in and around the conflict zones,

436
00:20:39,000 --> 00:20:41,960
Speaker 1: I just realized I'm like, you know what, I'm pretty

437
00:20:42,000 --> 00:20:45,520
Speaker 1: tired of this. I then cornered myself with that career

438
00:20:45,560 --> 00:20:49,320
Speaker 1: that I probably wasn't that competitive to then get a

439
00:20:49,440 --> 00:20:52,240
Speaker 1: job in Vienna or London or somewhere like that. I

440
00:20:52,280 --> 00:20:53,600
Speaker 1: was going to have to go back to Canberra for

441
00:20:53,640 --> 00:20:57,879
Speaker 1: a while, wait another couple of years, reskill internally to

442
00:20:58,040 --> 00:21:00,320
Speaker 1: get out to one of those places. And I'm like,

443
00:21:00,359 --> 00:21:03,760
Speaker 1: you know what, three years in camera just doesn't do

444
00:21:03,840 --> 00:21:04,280
Speaker 1: it for me.

445
00:21:04,600 --> 00:21:06,600
Speaker 2: Oh really, that's so surprising.

446
00:21:06,920 --> 00:21:08,160
Speaker 1: Nothing against camera.

447
00:21:08,000 --> 00:21:11,400
Speaker 2: Especially with your personality as is emerging from the things.

448
00:21:11,200 --> 00:21:14,320
Speaker 1: You like to do well. I I spent two years

449
00:21:14,320 --> 00:21:16,720
Speaker 1: in camera and I did love it. You could get

450
00:21:16,720 --> 00:21:19,399
Speaker 1: mountain biking for work and it's two hours from the

451
00:21:19,400 --> 00:21:22,000
Speaker 1: ski fields, two hours from the coaster. It's not too bad.

452
00:21:23,080 --> 00:21:26,240
Speaker 2: I mean it's no Pakistan or the Antarctic Peninsula, but

453
00:21:26,280 --> 00:21:27,520
Speaker 2: it's got a lot going for it.

454
00:21:28,240 --> 00:21:31,000
Speaker 1: Like Islamabad, the great mountain biking story before worked then in.

455
00:21:33,240 --> 00:21:36,400
Speaker 2: Camera is Lamabad Safe safe, you know, just.

456
00:21:36,359 --> 00:21:39,640
Speaker 1: Both designed by so Walter Burley Griffin had a hand

457
00:21:39,680 --> 00:21:43,000
Speaker 1: stop it dead set, dead set Burley Griffin had I'm

458
00:21:43,080 --> 00:21:47,040
Speaker 1: pretty big. I'm pretty sure that was the room of it.

459
00:21:47,040 --> 00:21:50,760
Speaker 1: It is roundabouts and straight lines everywhere. Islamabad is designed

460
00:21:50,760 --> 00:21:52,480
Speaker 1: by the same guy, but so I have my mountain

461
00:21:52,480 --> 00:21:54,960
Speaker 1: bike over there, and Islamabad is nestled up against a

462
00:21:54,960 --> 00:21:57,399
Speaker 1: set of hills called the Margala Hills, which essentially start

463
00:21:57,440 --> 00:22:02,160
Speaker 1: from the kind of flatness of the Punjab province of Pakistan,

464
00:22:02,240 --> 00:22:04,800
Speaker 1: but then it heads so from Lamabad north is the

465
00:22:04,800 --> 00:22:07,440
Speaker 1: Margala Hills and then eventually gets into the Characa Range

466
00:22:07,440 --> 00:22:09,159
Speaker 1: and then heads up into the kind of you know,

467
00:22:09,160 --> 00:22:12,160
Speaker 1: the highest points of Earth and hits k two, et cetera. Okay,

468
00:22:12,280 --> 00:22:15,040
Speaker 1: so you've got these just spectacular hills that go straight

469
00:22:15,040 --> 00:22:17,000
Speaker 1: out of Zlamabad. And I had when a couple of

470
00:22:17,000 --> 00:22:18,560
Speaker 1: mates of minds I had mountain bikes having we go

471
00:22:18,600 --> 00:22:20,679
Speaker 1: before work and you go up these hiking trails that

472
00:22:21,359 --> 00:22:23,160
Speaker 1: weren't really mountain bike trails, but if you went early

473
00:22:23,200 --> 00:22:24,840
Speaker 1: enough on a day, you just you didn't think there

474
00:22:24,920 --> 00:22:26,600
Speaker 1: be people. But one morning I was I was honing

475
00:22:27,000 --> 00:22:29,600
Speaker 1: honing down the hills on my mountain bike having a ball,

476
00:22:30,480 --> 00:22:33,919
Speaker 1: when like a wild ball ran in front of me

477
00:22:34,000 --> 00:22:35,959
Speaker 1: and I'm like, oh wow, like ah, and that's not

478
00:22:36,160 --> 00:22:38,879
Speaker 1: it wasn't too crazy. But then like a bunch of

479
00:22:39,000 --> 00:22:43,280
Speaker 1: dudes just started firing rifles and were like hunting and

480
00:22:43,359 --> 00:22:47,280
Speaker 1: chasing the boar, and I'm like, Okay, that's about a dang,

481
00:22:47,440 --> 00:22:50,960
Speaker 1: Like I was just killed nobody cross fire, because like

482
00:22:51,000 --> 00:22:53,080
Speaker 1: these these dudes are obviously going like, oh, if we

483
00:22:53,160 --> 00:22:55,359
Speaker 1: go hunting in the hills, no one's hiking this early.

484
00:22:55,840 --> 00:22:58,600
Speaker 1: They hadn't expected that idiots would be mountain biking that early.

485
00:22:58,720 --> 00:23:01,640
Speaker 1: So you kind of yeah, one of those moments.

486
00:23:02,240 --> 00:23:05,320
Speaker 2: So do you think that, Like one of the things

487
00:23:05,320 --> 00:23:09,240
Speaker 2: that fascinates me is that we are just conditioned to

488
00:23:09,359 --> 00:23:13,040
Speaker 2: sort of think that certain pathways are better than others,

489
00:23:13,280 --> 00:23:16,800
Speaker 2: or that we should be siloed in this particular way

490
00:23:16,840 --> 00:23:19,680
Speaker 2: if our personality is X, y Z, And it fascinates

491
00:23:19,680 --> 00:23:22,360
Speaker 2: me that actually we're just all built to find what

492
00:23:22,400 --> 00:23:24,720
Speaker 2: I call yay, like your fulfillment or your joy or

493
00:23:24,720 --> 00:23:27,280
Speaker 2: whatever it is, in completely different things. So what I

494
00:23:27,359 --> 00:23:30,040
Speaker 2: would think of, I mean, probably there's a part of

495
00:23:30,040 --> 00:23:32,960
Speaker 2: my personality that would have been very suited to that,

496
00:23:33,000 --> 00:23:36,520
Speaker 2: because I do really thrive on that adrenaline and risk

497
00:23:37,119 --> 00:23:40,600
Speaker 2: and danger in a diplomacy context, like I love the

498
00:23:40,680 --> 00:23:44,480
Speaker 2: idea of working on international conflicts. But some people would

499
00:23:44,520 --> 00:23:47,720
Speaker 2: think what you did in Pakistan and in that diplomacy

500
00:23:47,760 --> 00:23:49,920
Speaker 2: chapter of your life is their nightmare, not only would

501
00:23:49,920 --> 00:23:53,000
Speaker 2: they not actively seek it. It's like they would never

502
00:23:53,240 --> 00:23:55,280
Speaker 2: You couldn't pay them to go and do that. But

503
00:23:55,359 --> 00:23:58,840
Speaker 2: obviously for you it was like something that felt like

504
00:23:58,880 --> 00:24:01,840
Speaker 2: an amazing career at that time. So like, what was

505
00:24:01,880 --> 00:24:03,520
Speaker 2: it that drew you to it? Was it the challenge?

506
00:24:03,520 --> 00:24:05,160
Speaker 2: Was it outdoors? Was it the risk?

507
00:24:05,240 --> 00:24:05,320
Speaker 1: Like?

508
00:24:05,359 --> 00:24:06,720
Speaker 2: Are you an adrenaline junkie?

509
00:24:06,840 --> 00:24:08,720
Speaker 1: I have been told I'm an adrenaline junkie.

510
00:24:09,080 --> 00:24:10,080
Speaker 2: I have been informed.

511
00:24:10,840 --> 00:24:15,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, I resent the term because I like, I take

512
00:24:15,240 --> 00:24:17,879
Speaker 1: calculated risks. And you're absolutely right. The reason I went

513
00:24:17,920 --> 00:24:20,840
Speaker 1: into the army and diplomacy and the stuff I do now,

514
00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:24,119
Speaker 1: the Antarctic program and those trips. Yeah, there's elements of

515
00:24:24,520 --> 00:24:29,600
Speaker 1: uncertainty and danger, but that's life, the natural order of things.

516
00:24:29,600 --> 00:24:32,720
Speaker 1: And you look at the animal world and our evolution

517
00:24:32,800 --> 00:24:36,000
Speaker 1: as a species. We never knew where our meals were

518
00:24:36,000 --> 00:24:38,960
Speaker 1: coming from, and then we created all society and order

519
00:24:39,000 --> 00:24:40,760
Speaker 1: and all these things to kind of give you you

520
00:24:40,840 --> 00:24:43,160
Speaker 1: want a balance of Okay, we know that if we've

521
00:24:43,200 --> 00:24:45,720
Speaker 1: got we've got grains and crops. Now we've got a

522
00:24:45,800 --> 00:24:48,080
Speaker 1: village of one hundred and fifty people, and we can

523
00:24:48,160 --> 00:24:49,800
Speaker 1: go from there and you could start any but still

524
00:24:49,840 --> 00:24:53,280
Speaker 1: you would go off on the hunt, or the season's changing,

525
00:24:53,320 --> 00:24:55,600
Speaker 1: we need to move higher ground as a community, and

526
00:24:55,680 --> 00:24:57,280
Speaker 1: everyone packs up and you bring the kids, and you

527
00:24:57,320 --> 00:24:59,600
Speaker 1: do all the stuff, and you go out the front door,

528
00:24:59,640 --> 00:25:01,600
Speaker 1: and you have to go on these adventures. That's how

529
00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:03,879
Speaker 1: we're designed to operate. That's how every other species on

530
00:25:03,920 --> 00:25:06,720
Speaker 1: the planet operates. They don't have the comfort zones and

531
00:25:06,760 --> 00:25:09,119
Speaker 1: everything that we've created, all these man made structures. And

532
00:25:09,240 --> 00:25:11,320
Speaker 1: even I love one of my favorite quotes that I

533
00:25:11,680 --> 00:25:14,480
Speaker 1: don't know where it's from, but someone was telling me

534
00:25:14,480 --> 00:25:16,600
Speaker 1: this morning about oh, we're trying to get some cargo

535
00:25:16,640 --> 00:25:18,040
Speaker 1: and one of the flights we've got and they're like, oh,

536
00:25:18,040 --> 00:25:19,400
Speaker 1: we might have to stuff it in our own bags,

537
00:25:19,440 --> 00:25:21,680
Speaker 1: and I'm like, no, forget about it. We own the planes,

538
00:25:21,760 --> 00:25:23,800
Speaker 1: we own the contracts, we can all of these rules

539
00:25:23,840 --> 00:25:25,679
Speaker 1: are man made. There is no man made law that

540
00:25:25,720 --> 00:25:30,280
Speaker 1: can't be broken. Nice great only laws that matter are

541
00:25:30,320 --> 00:25:32,600
Speaker 1: the laws of physics, because everything else is a man

542
00:25:32,640 --> 00:25:35,760
Speaker 1: made construct, and there's probably a way around it in

543
00:25:35,840 --> 00:25:37,920
Speaker 1: terms of we can get approvals or we can change this.

544
00:25:38,000 --> 00:25:40,440
Speaker 1: And half the time, especially if it's a government funded trip,

545
00:25:40,480 --> 00:25:44,440
Speaker 1: you're like, well, we probably wrote the blood guidelines, so

546
00:25:44,960 --> 00:25:48,440
Speaker 1: we can probably there's been some government is so hello,

547
00:25:48,560 --> 00:25:50,760
Speaker 1: this is I always like love debugging conspiracy theories to

548
00:25:50,760 --> 00:25:52,359
Speaker 1: people like, oh the government does this, and like what

549
00:25:52,359 --> 00:25:54,439
Speaker 1: about Antarctica. There's like, you know, secret bases and all

550
00:25:54,480 --> 00:25:56,160
Speaker 1: these things, Like have you met the government?

551
00:25:56,400 --> 00:25:58,120
Speaker 2: Governments?

552
00:25:57,880 --> 00:26:01,399
Speaker 1: There's no way that the government couldn't conspiracy.

553
00:26:02,080 --> 00:26:06,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, they're struggling with the things that are overt.

554
00:26:05,160 --> 00:26:09,399
Speaker 1: The rest I mean, and that's just a function of

555
00:26:09,440 --> 00:26:11,400
Speaker 1: the size of how compling up the amount of times

556
00:26:11,440 --> 00:26:14,120
Speaker 1: government is fighting. I've gone way off track.

557
00:26:14,320 --> 00:26:17,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, actually the government versus government thing has brought

558
00:26:17,560 --> 00:26:22,320
Speaker 2: me back to your Antarctic adventure because there's a huge

559
00:26:22,560 --> 00:26:25,040
Speaker 2: operation in the books that I'll get to that involve

560
00:26:25,080 --> 00:26:27,320
Speaker 2: different governments, which again is like so fascinating to me.

561
00:26:27,400 --> 00:26:29,720
Speaker 2: But I personally would love to spend more time on

562
00:26:29,760 --> 00:26:32,760
Speaker 2: the military and on diplomacy because that's my jam, but

563
00:26:33,240 --> 00:26:34,639
Speaker 2: I want to spend a lot of the episode on

564
00:26:34,640 --> 00:26:38,840
Speaker 2: your Awntarctic experience. So moving on to sort of the

565
00:26:38,920 --> 00:26:43,800
Speaker 2: transition away from one career again to this totally new career,

566
00:26:43,800 --> 00:26:45,919
Speaker 2: which seems like it has a lot in common with

567
00:26:45,960 --> 00:26:49,679
Speaker 2: the outdoors and leadership and all that, but obviously is

568
00:26:49,880 --> 00:26:53,560
Speaker 2: completely different. You had to retrain. You also had this

569
00:26:53,600 --> 00:26:56,760
Speaker 2: transitional period where guys like this guy come on. He

570
00:26:57,080 --> 00:27:01,320
Speaker 2: then worked as a freelance photographer, made like skydiving records,

571
00:27:01,400 --> 00:27:04,000
Speaker 2: has qualified in open water diving, Like there's basically nothing

572
00:27:04,000 --> 00:27:06,680
Speaker 2: he can't do. It became like a hybrid snowboarder who

573
00:27:06,720 --> 00:27:09,159
Speaker 2: like broke all these records, Like just just a really

574
00:27:09,400 --> 00:27:12,560
Speaker 2: relaxed gardening leave that you took in between your two jobs.

575
00:27:13,240 --> 00:27:15,560
Speaker 2: How did you know that you were at the end

576
00:27:15,560 --> 00:27:19,200
Speaker 2: of a chapter? And then I think what's most overwhelming

577
00:27:19,240 --> 00:27:22,240
Speaker 2: for people, particularly if they get thrown into that involuntarily

578
00:27:22,280 --> 00:27:26,280
Speaker 2: like soral redundancy or COVID or whatever. How do you

579
00:27:26,440 --> 00:27:30,720
Speaker 2: rEFInd a new pathway then and find your place in

580
00:27:30,720 --> 00:27:32,000
Speaker 2: the water. It's like you're almost going back to the

581
00:27:32,080 --> 00:27:34,359
Speaker 2: end of high school and it's like, hey, be whoever

582
00:27:34,440 --> 00:27:36,240
Speaker 2: you want now, Like, how do you do that?

583
00:27:36,760 --> 00:27:39,240
Speaker 1: I think the minute you know and I don't know

584
00:27:39,359 --> 00:27:41,560
Speaker 1: where you got things. I don't hold any records from

585
00:27:41,760 --> 00:27:43,760
Speaker 1: I've done. I've certainly done a lot of stuff.

586
00:27:43,960 --> 00:27:46,160
Speaker 2: One of the first people to snowboard down a range

587
00:27:46,160 --> 00:27:48,520
Speaker 2: of peaks on the Antarctic pinicially using slip boards.

588
00:27:48,960 --> 00:27:55,880
Speaker 1: Okay, that's Guinness record. It's just a record hard place

589
00:27:55,920 --> 00:27:58,040
Speaker 1: to get to that few people have away.

590
00:27:59,200 --> 00:28:01,320
Speaker 2: He's humble, guy is humble. Yeah.

591
00:28:01,760 --> 00:28:04,359
Speaker 1: But I think that the look, and I use that

592
00:28:04,560 --> 00:28:08,320
Speaker 1: in my talks and stuff, is around the link to resilience.

593
00:28:08,359 --> 00:28:10,040
Speaker 1: People go, how do you get so resilient? I'm like,

594
00:28:10,119 --> 00:28:12,160
Speaker 1: just you need to know why you're doing something. The

595
00:28:12,200 --> 00:28:14,200
Speaker 1: minute you know why you're doing it, and you've you've

596
00:28:14,240 --> 00:28:17,440
Speaker 1: got a high level of desire to succeed or even

597
00:28:17,520 --> 00:28:20,879
Speaker 1: get to a location or achieve that goal your set.

598
00:28:21,520 --> 00:28:23,320
Speaker 1: But the minute you don't, and the minute you kind

599
00:28:23,320 --> 00:28:25,520
Speaker 1: of find yourself going like, oh why am I doing this?

600
00:28:25,680 --> 00:28:27,879
Speaker 1: Or oh you know, it's a good paycheck, or it

601
00:28:28,359 --> 00:28:30,280
Speaker 1: you know, it's you know, it's just like I need

602
00:28:30,320 --> 00:28:33,040
Speaker 1: to do this for another two years too, And then

603
00:28:33,080 --> 00:28:35,480
Speaker 1: I can be like nah, the minute you're talking like that,

604
00:28:35,600 --> 00:28:37,320
Speaker 1: or you're telling that to yourself or you hear yourself

605
00:28:37,359 --> 00:28:41,040
Speaker 1: telling that story to others, you need to get out

606
00:28:41,040 --> 00:28:45,240
Speaker 1: of it now. It's the world is a complicated, complicated place,

607
00:28:45,280 --> 00:28:47,200
Speaker 1: so you do have to factor in like, Okay, I

608
00:28:47,200 --> 00:28:50,800
Speaker 1: can't just quit my job and do something else. But

609
00:28:51,280 --> 00:28:53,640
Speaker 1: I think COVID taught This lesson to a lot of people.

610
00:28:53,640 --> 00:28:55,640
Speaker 1: If you haven't learned this through COVID, learn it now

611
00:28:55,640 --> 00:29:00,160
Speaker 1: on this podcast, is that when you actually prioritize your

612
00:29:00,200 --> 00:29:04,360
Speaker 1: own happiness and well being and yet you get paid less,

613
00:29:04,440 --> 00:29:07,200
Speaker 1: you'll be your happiness will be worth more and then

614
00:29:07,240 --> 00:29:09,800
Speaker 1: you'll find you you're better at it and you'll just

615
00:29:09,840 --> 00:29:13,000
Speaker 1: the whole thing works better when you've got more time

616
00:29:13,040 --> 00:29:15,160
Speaker 1: with your family or more time to focus on your

617
00:29:15,200 --> 00:29:18,680
Speaker 1: side hustle all your passions, but your your core money

618
00:29:18,720 --> 00:29:22,600
Speaker 1: earner or bread breadwinning kind of job. Don't let that

619
00:29:22,680 --> 00:29:25,400
Speaker 1: define you. And I tell peoples well, like don't get

620
00:29:25,400 --> 00:29:28,400
Speaker 1: out of bed for someone other than yourself. Like you're

621
00:29:28,400 --> 00:29:31,080
Speaker 1: getting out of bed to do something you want to do.

622
00:29:31,280 --> 00:29:32,800
Speaker 1: And if that and yeah, if you've got to get

623
00:29:32,840 --> 00:29:33,920
Speaker 1: up and you've got to be at work at seven

624
00:29:33,920 --> 00:29:35,960
Speaker 1: o'clock in the morning, are cool, Get you're getting up

625
00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:38,560
Speaker 1: at five so you can then do something that you

626
00:29:38,600 --> 00:29:40,560
Speaker 1: want to do. And that might be standing in the

627
00:29:40,560 --> 00:29:44,200
Speaker 1: backyard and look at your avocado and like avocado flap,

628
00:29:44,600 --> 00:29:47,640
Speaker 1: I did that, or your kids or your dog, or

629
00:29:47,680 --> 00:29:49,239
Speaker 1: you have some fitness stuff, or get up and read

630
00:29:49,280 --> 00:29:50,560
Speaker 1: a book, because then you get out of bed and

631
00:29:50,560 --> 00:29:52,400
Speaker 1: you did something you wanted to do and then you go,

632
00:29:52,480 --> 00:29:54,960
Speaker 1: I now better go earn some money and pay the bills,

633
00:29:54,960 --> 00:29:57,800
Speaker 1: because you know life. But then outside of that, and

634
00:29:57,800 --> 00:29:59,760
Speaker 1: one of the cool things on the Antarctic stations is, yeah,

635
00:29:59,760 --> 00:30:01,400
Speaker 1: we will work sort of eight or nine hours a

636
00:30:01,480 --> 00:30:04,280
Speaker 1: day and you're always you're kind of always working, but

637
00:30:04,320 --> 00:30:06,200
Speaker 1: you're actually without the commute to work and a whole

638
00:30:06,280 --> 00:30:09,680
Speaker 1: range of other factors. You then still have hours to

639
00:30:09,800 --> 00:30:13,400
Speaker 1: do other things. And some of the hobbies and the

640
00:30:13,440 --> 00:30:15,840
Speaker 1: sessions we run down there, this is kind of delving

641
00:30:15,880 --> 00:30:18,000
Speaker 1: into the depths of the story as well, but then

642
00:30:18,120 --> 00:30:20,600
Speaker 1: use your professional development side of it. And we used

643
00:30:20,640 --> 00:30:22,120
Speaker 1: to rhyme like some of the best stuff we do

644
00:30:22,120 --> 00:30:25,040
Speaker 1: down there is every Wednesday night we'd run different talks,

645
00:30:25,520 --> 00:30:28,480
Speaker 1: so and if you've never done public speaking before banging,

646
00:30:28,480 --> 00:30:30,880
Speaker 1: there's a chance get up back yourself in. We'd run

647
00:30:30,920 --> 00:30:37,200
Speaker 1: for group fitness classes, workshops, hobby heart sessions, building development,

648
00:30:37,320 --> 00:30:40,360
Speaker 1: language things, music lessons, whatever it was. Everyone would learn

649
00:30:40,360 --> 00:30:41,880
Speaker 1: from each other and do different things and it's a

650
00:30:41,920 --> 00:30:43,959
Speaker 1: real unique thing. You probably even had this on your

651
00:30:43,960 --> 00:30:46,800
Speaker 1: own Tarctic voyage. Like the talks and learning from those

652
00:30:46,840 --> 00:30:52,120
Speaker 1: around you is so important and workplaces that value professional development,

653
00:30:52,160 --> 00:30:53,960
Speaker 1: which I really enjoyed because one of the people that

654
00:30:54,000 --> 00:30:55,920
Speaker 1: get in to come and talk about this effect. But

655
00:30:56,360 --> 00:30:59,120
Speaker 1: the minute you go to a workplace that actually encourages

656
00:30:59,160 --> 00:31:01,800
Speaker 1: that their ability retain people and keep them going, and

657
00:31:01,840 --> 00:31:04,240
Speaker 1: people go, we don't have the budget to get in speakers,

658
00:31:04,240 --> 00:31:07,080
Speaker 1: you like, use your own people, like, you don't need

659
00:31:07,120 --> 00:31:09,880
Speaker 1: to go and higher. You know, you don't need expensive speakers,

660
00:31:09,920 --> 00:31:12,600
Speaker 1: you don't even need anyone from outside. Use your own people,

661
00:31:13,080 --> 00:31:15,280
Speaker 1: encourage them to develop and learn from each other, and

662
00:31:15,320 --> 00:31:19,000
Speaker 1: you can just and you see the group come together,

663
00:31:19,200 --> 00:31:22,680
Speaker 1: you see people backing each other up, and everyone then

664
00:31:22,760 --> 00:31:24,800
Speaker 1: can can grow. Like I'm not good at public speaking,

665
00:31:24,800 --> 00:31:26,880
Speaker 1: You're like, cool, Well, what better way to get better

666
00:31:26,920 --> 00:31:28,880
Speaker 1: than to go start with a small group of people.

667
00:31:28,920 --> 00:31:31,680
Speaker 1: You know, they'll help you out, they'll give you some pointers,

668
00:31:31,720 --> 00:31:33,520
Speaker 1: it's a feedback or whatever it is, and you can

669
00:31:33,800 --> 00:31:35,760
Speaker 1: you can grow and learn. So when you're going to

670
00:31:35,760 --> 00:31:37,920
Speaker 1: get right back to your question, how do you know that?

671
00:31:38,320 --> 00:31:41,160
Speaker 1: I think the minute you're questioning, like, all right, why

672
00:31:41,160 --> 00:31:43,560
Speaker 1: am I doing this? You go and I think for me,

673
00:31:43,800 --> 00:31:47,200
Speaker 1: at the end of my career in diplomacy, I was

674
00:31:47,440 --> 00:31:49,520
Speaker 1: I've been in Iraq for about a year and a bit,

675
00:31:49,840 --> 00:31:52,200
Speaker 1: you know, back and forth a lot of times, and

676
00:31:52,520 --> 00:31:54,640
Speaker 1: I was looking at other people around me. I was

677
00:31:54,920 --> 00:31:58,480
Speaker 1: tired of a lot of the complicated elements around what

678
00:31:58,560 --> 00:32:01,600
Speaker 1: we're doing in Iraq. Fascinating at the start, but by

679
00:32:01,680 --> 00:32:04,000
Speaker 1: the end you're like, this is pretty complicated. And I

680
00:32:04,080 --> 00:32:06,680
Speaker 1: loved delving into the thousands of years of history of

681
00:32:06,720 --> 00:32:09,280
Speaker 1: what on earth we were doing there and trying to

682
00:32:09,320 --> 00:32:11,040
Speaker 1: explain that. I remember once trying to explain this to

683
00:32:11,120 --> 00:32:13,360
Speaker 1: I was working with an ANZAC task group as well.

684
00:32:13,480 --> 00:32:16,680
Speaker 1: This is newly a arrived group of Kiwis. I'd say,

685
00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:18,240
Speaker 1: I was about to say little that they were not little,

686
00:32:18,320 --> 00:32:19,680
Speaker 1: these units.

687
00:32:20,880 --> 00:32:24,240
Speaker 2: Little baby soldiers exactly exactly.

688
00:32:24,320 --> 00:32:27,240
Speaker 1: They're like, so, what's what's what's this all about? What

689
00:32:27,320 --> 00:32:28,800
Speaker 1: are we doing here? From your point of it? And

690
00:32:28,880 --> 00:32:31,440
Speaker 1: I'm like, right, cool, So let's go back, Like, first

691
00:32:31,440 --> 00:32:32,680
Speaker 1: of all, we're going to go back one hundred years

692
00:32:32,680 --> 00:32:34,719
Speaker 1: to the Sykes Peako Agreement, but then we're also going

693
00:32:34,760 --> 00:32:36,000
Speaker 1: to go back to the Ottoman Empire.

694
00:32:36,000 --> 00:32:40,320
Speaker 2: But then we're my god, sykes Peako, and you just go.

695
00:32:40,720 --> 00:32:43,040
Speaker 1: And you're starting to go like all right, I'm kind

696
00:32:43,080 --> 00:32:45,720
Speaker 1: of I'm sick of all this, let's do something else.

697
00:32:45,760 --> 00:32:49,000
Speaker 1: And for me that was a shift away from diplomacy

698
00:32:49,240 --> 00:32:52,520
Speaker 1: in war zones to the austral Antarctic Program and working

699
00:32:52,560 --> 00:32:55,080
Speaker 1: on climate science. And now I'm not a scientist, as

700
00:32:55,080 --> 00:32:58,280
Speaker 1: we established earlier, but the way I can help that

701
00:32:58,600 --> 00:33:01,080
Speaker 1: is to get down there and and work around them

702
00:33:01,080 --> 00:33:02,480
Speaker 1: and get them to where they need to go and

703
00:33:02,960 --> 00:33:05,560
Speaker 1: be part of that, and then communicate it to others

704
00:33:05,640 --> 00:33:09,320
Speaker 1: and tell everyone I can about some of the work

705
00:33:09,320 --> 00:33:10,960
Speaker 1: that gets done down there and the importance of it

706
00:33:11,000 --> 00:33:14,640
Speaker 1: and how we're trying to understand what's happening down in Antarctic.

707
00:33:14,720 --> 00:33:18,240
Speaker 1: And that for me became the new renewed sense of like,

708
00:33:18,240 --> 00:33:23,040
Speaker 1: all right, I'm good at logistics and operations and adventurous places,

709
00:33:23,040 --> 00:33:26,320
Speaker 1: and I'm also good at understanding that nuances and complexity

710
00:33:26,320 --> 00:33:28,960
Speaker 1: of government funded operations. So I'm like, great, let's just

711
00:33:29,000 --> 00:33:31,480
Speaker 1: put all of that together and get down and work

712
00:33:31,520 --> 00:33:35,040
Speaker 1: with And I've been down six times, i think in total,

713
00:33:35,640 --> 00:33:39,040
Speaker 1: on various different voyages and expeditions. I'm heading back down

714
00:33:39,080 --> 00:33:42,080
Speaker 1: this summer and I think after this trip that'll probably

715
00:33:42,120 --> 00:33:43,640
Speaker 1: be it, and I'll be like, all right, let's if

716
00:33:43,640 --> 00:33:45,120
Speaker 1: you've done a lot of Antarctic. I've been to all

717
00:33:45,120 --> 00:33:48,240
Speaker 1: Australia stations. You've led teams, small teams, big teams, done

718
00:33:48,240 --> 00:33:51,880
Speaker 1: some complicated stuff, written a book about it. Like I

719
00:33:51,920 --> 00:33:54,160
Speaker 1: think I'm going, I'm gonna be ready for what's next.

720
00:33:54,400 --> 00:33:58,160
Speaker 1: And again when you are, so I'm in that phase now,

721
00:33:58,240 --> 00:34:03,160
Speaker 1: and you go, don't be to ration and try and

722
00:34:03,320 --> 00:34:06,800
Speaker 1: latch onto something too quickly. Be content to sit back

723
00:34:06,840 --> 00:34:09,439
Speaker 1: a bit and go all right, might have to wait

724
00:34:09,520 --> 00:34:11,640
Speaker 1: and see what comes up. And again, you've got to

725
00:34:11,640 --> 00:34:13,719
Speaker 1: pay the bills, so you might have to take some

726
00:34:13,760 --> 00:34:16,800
Speaker 1: sort of backward step where you are, but be honest

727
00:34:16,800 --> 00:34:18,920
Speaker 1: with yourself with that, go this isn't a great opportunity.

728
00:34:18,920 --> 00:34:21,200
Speaker 1: This is this right. I need to make that amount

729
00:34:21,200 --> 00:34:23,120
Speaker 1: of money a year to pay my mortgage, so I'll

730
00:34:23,160 --> 00:34:26,440
Speaker 1: take that. But then that gives me four hours a

731
00:34:26,520 --> 00:34:30,440
Speaker 1: day to do my side hustle. And then as that grows,

732
00:34:30,520 --> 00:34:33,040
Speaker 1: I remember saying, like seeing a great thing. When I

733
00:34:33,080 --> 00:34:35,360
Speaker 1: sort of transitioned to what I do now, I was like,

734
00:34:35,760 --> 00:34:37,840
Speaker 1: don't quit your job to focus on your side hustle.

735
00:34:38,160 --> 00:34:40,360
Speaker 1: Focus on your side hustle until you get fired. I'm like,

736
00:34:42,600 --> 00:34:45,320
Speaker 1: I didn't get to that, but it gave me a

737
00:34:45,360 --> 00:34:48,120
Speaker 1: good mindset of like, don't just quit everything and go right,

738
00:34:48,640 --> 00:34:50,360
Speaker 1: I'm finished with that. I'm now going to be a

739
00:34:50,400 --> 00:34:54,200
Speaker 1: podcaster and do this stuff. Start all of that in

740
00:34:54,239 --> 00:34:57,080
Speaker 1: your spare time until you get to a point where

741
00:34:57,120 --> 00:34:59,360
Speaker 1: you're starting to make money with your side hustle or

742
00:34:59,360 --> 00:35:01,719
Speaker 1: your other job, and you go right, I could now

743
00:35:01,840 --> 00:35:04,200
Speaker 1: turn off again. I'm using my hands too often for

744
00:35:04,200 --> 00:35:04,760
Speaker 1: a podcast.

745
00:35:05,440 --> 00:35:07,839
Speaker 2: No, I love it. But I also I love that

746
00:35:07,920 --> 00:35:11,040
Speaker 2: you're like the perfect speaker for this entire show because

747
00:35:11,120 --> 00:35:15,200
Speaker 2: everything is just slightly different wording on what I like

748
00:35:15,520 --> 00:35:19,120
Speaker 2: hammer into people about the idea that you know, everyone's

749
00:35:19,360 --> 00:35:21,600
Speaker 2: yay is a jigsaw puzzle, and you're always adding new

750
00:35:21,600 --> 00:35:23,360
Speaker 2: pieces and getting rid of other pieces, and at some

751
00:35:23,600 --> 00:35:27,640
Speaker 2: times your joy and your job overlap, at sometimes they don't.

752
00:35:27,719 --> 00:35:30,160
Speaker 2: It's like, this is the reality. Pay the bills, do

753
00:35:30,239 --> 00:35:32,440
Speaker 2: the stuff, and then but you find your joy elsewhere,

754
00:35:32,440 --> 00:35:34,120
Speaker 2: and as long as the puzzle is kind of all

755
00:35:34,680 --> 00:35:37,880
Speaker 2: somewhat balancing, it doesn't matter where you're getting that fulfillment

756
00:35:37,920 --> 00:35:40,000
Speaker 2: as long as you're finding it somewhere. But I think

757
00:35:40,000 --> 00:35:42,239
Speaker 2: the other part of that, when you're transitioning from one

758
00:35:42,360 --> 00:35:45,480
Speaker 2: joy to the next is and I'm really interested to

759
00:35:45,480 --> 00:35:48,520
Speaker 2: hear your answer on this, because this question varies a

760
00:35:48,560 --> 00:35:52,280
Speaker 2: lot often between the genders, mass generalization, no scientific research

761
00:35:52,320 --> 00:35:54,080
Speaker 2: behind this, but I'd love to know your view on

762
00:35:54,120 --> 00:35:57,520
Speaker 2: the fact that when you are doing something that requires

763
00:35:58,400 --> 00:36:00,160
Speaker 2: to us on the outside, is very obvious that your

764
00:36:00,160 --> 00:36:05,000
Speaker 2: skills are transferable from diplomacy to Antarctic expeditions. But you've

765
00:36:05,040 --> 00:36:08,840
Speaker 2: gone from somewhere where you're awarded service medals and defense

766
00:36:08,880 --> 00:36:13,239
Speaker 2: medals and like very qualified and accomplished to like never

767
00:36:13,239 --> 00:36:16,960
Speaker 2: been to Antarctica, had never Like I want to ask

768
00:36:16,960 --> 00:36:18,759
Speaker 2: you also about how you become qualified. And I know

769
00:36:18,800 --> 00:36:22,319
Speaker 2: the training and the testing was like extreme. How do

770
00:36:22,320 --> 00:36:25,120
Speaker 2: you deal with like the doubt or imposter syndrome that

771
00:36:25,120 --> 00:36:28,080
Speaker 2: creeps into your mind of like whoa I was like

772
00:36:28,200 --> 00:36:30,960
Speaker 2: senior and now I'm junior and I don't know what

773
00:36:31,040 --> 00:36:33,640
Speaker 2: I'm doing here and like this is a whole new world.

774
00:36:33,719 --> 00:36:34,600
Speaker 2: Did you have.

775
00:36:34,440 --> 00:36:37,520
Speaker 1: That that is not that is tough and that the

776
00:36:37,560 --> 00:36:40,120
Speaker 1: older you get, the harder that becomes, Like how do

777
00:36:40,200 --> 00:36:42,480
Speaker 1: I start again? How do I go from being an

778
00:36:42,520 --> 00:36:46,719
Speaker 1: expert in your field to I've never been an Antarctic

779
00:36:46,719 --> 00:36:50,120
Speaker 1: station leader, I've never been with the Australian program. Didn't know,

780
00:36:50,239 --> 00:36:54,439
Speaker 1: and being humble in that is important, but also you'll

781
00:36:54,480 --> 00:36:59,000
Speaker 1: quickly understand where you know. Your skill sets feed into that.

782
00:36:59,160 --> 00:37:02,040
Speaker 1: Even if you're starting again, you're starting with a lot

783
00:37:02,080 --> 00:37:07,040
Speaker 1: of experience from something hopefully similar and also also might

784
00:37:07,040 --> 00:37:09,000
Speaker 1: be completely do And actually would just said about this

785
00:37:09,000 --> 00:37:12,239
Speaker 1: before you going into being a parent, how on earth

786
00:37:12,280 --> 00:37:14,040
Speaker 1: do you don't what to do? But you go, no,

787
00:37:14,640 --> 00:37:17,959
Speaker 1: I've got a lifetime of experience of doing all sorts

788
00:37:17,960 --> 00:37:21,520
Speaker 1: of other stuff that when you become a parent, you'd

789
00:37:21,520 --> 00:37:26,200
Speaker 1: be like, oh great, it's just you know, organizing chaos

790
00:37:26,680 --> 00:37:29,319
Speaker 1: twenty four hours a day and that's that. And you'll

791
00:37:29,320 --> 00:37:32,400
Speaker 1: have done sleep deprivation when you're a teenager, and like

792
00:37:32,440 --> 00:37:33,839
Speaker 1: all these things that you're now gonna have to do

793
00:37:34,080 --> 00:37:37,919
Speaker 1: you can. You'll realize that everything in life is kind

794
00:37:37,920 --> 00:37:40,560
Speaker 1: of the same, it's just the context will be different.

795
00:37:41,000 --> 00:37:42,759
Speaker 1: So I think that that can be part of it.

796
00:37:42,800 --> 00:37:45,080
Speaker 1: But for me, I was I was pretty humble going

797
00:37:45,120 --> 00:37:47,600
Speaker 1: into the Antarctic program, and then now only a few

798
00:37:47,640 --> 00:37:49,560
Speaker 1: years later, I've got quite a lot of experience. I

799
00:37:49,560 --> 00:37:52,520
Speaker 1: still never think you've got a you've got the market

800
00:37:52,520 --> 00:37:54,840
Speaker 1: cornered on experience and knowledge. There's still a lot you

801
00:37:55,280 --> 00:37:58,120
Speaker 1: will never know. And if you ever think you know everything,

802
00:37:58,160 --> 00:38:00,399
Speaker 1: you're kidding yourself and you need a realiz to check.

803
00:38:00,440 --> 00:38:03,960
Speaker 1: Because even the most expert people in the world will

804
00:38:04,400 --> 00:38:06,440
Speaker 1: scientists and stuff are probably some of the best examples

805
00:38:06,480 --> 00:38:09,080
Speaker 1: of this. They will still go, oh, we don't understand this,

806
00:38:09,160 --> 00:38:11,959
Speaker 1: or we don't know what's going on here, and they'll

807
00:38:12,000 --> 00:38:14,439
Speaker 1: seek an answer and they'll try and learn and find

808
00:38:14,480 --> 00:38:17,239
Speaker 1: a way. And that for me, is a way to

809
00:38:17,280 --> 00:38:20,759
Speaker 1: approach any problem, especially when you're changing careers or you're

810
00:38:21,000 --> 00:38:24,759
Speaker 1: changing lifestyle, changing locations. Is knowledge to spells. Fear is

811
00:38:24,760 --> 00:38:28,920
Speaker 1: a great quote from this parachute training school, and I

812
00:38:29,080 --> 00:38:30,680
Speaker 1: use that in so many different places. You guys, ye

813
00:38:30,920 --> 00:38:34,080
Speaker 1: I don't know something, learn about it, you know. The

814
00:38:34,080 --> 00:38:35,960
Speaker 1: more you can then learn and go, Okay, well I

815
00:38:36,000 --> 00:38:40,000
Speaker 1: don't know anything about this particular topic. Let's learn and

816
00:38:40,080 --> 00:38:42,080
Speaker 1: read everything, talk to others about it, and they make

817
00:38:42,080 --> 00:38:45,080
Speaker 1: your own opinion. I think that's probably the more important

818
00:38:45,080 --> 00:38:48,000
Speaker 1: one of still backing yourself to make your own decisions

819
00:38:48,320 --> 00:38:49,439
Speaker 1: on the information you've got.

820
00:38:49,520 --> 00:38:52,760
Speaker 2: Oh, I love that. And then having said that, reading

821
00:38:52,840 --> 00:38:55,080
Speaker 2: the book about your five hundred and thirty seven days

822
00:38:55,080 --> 00:38:58,239
Speaker 2: are being thrown into not just being a station leader,

823
00:38:58,239 --> 00:39:01,800
Speaker 2: which was already foreign, but then not getting your reinforcements

824
00:39:01,800 --> 00:39:03,960
Speaker 2: at particular times and the experts that you were meant

825
00:39:04,000 --> 00:39:05,919
Speaker 2: to have on hand, and like, it just got even

826
00:39:05,960 --> 00:39:08,680
Speaker 2: more chaotic. So I am so excited to enter the

827
00:39:08,680 --> 00:39:13,279
Speaker 2: Antarctic chapter. Now, tell us, so you became station leader

828
00:39:13,320 --> 00:39:16,080
Speaker 2: at the Devas Station from twenty nineteen to twenty twenty

829
00:39:16,160 --> 00:39:19,280
Speaker 2: which ended up being over five hundred days because COVID

830
00:39:19,480 --> 00:39:24,200
Speaker 2: the world changed and you couldn't get home. Can you

831
00:39:24,239 --> 00:39:26,479
Speaker 2: first give us a lay of the land for people

832
00:39:26,520 --> 00:39:29,360
Speaker 2: who have never been to Antarctica and don't know the

833
00:39:29,440 --> 00:39:33,839
Speaker 2: layout sort of what the Australian stations are. Who else

834
00:39:33,880 --> 00:39:36,719
Speaker 2: has stations around? Like how you got there? I've only

835
00:39:36,719 --> 00:39:39,680
Speaker 2: ever shared it from a tourist perspective, which was obviously

836
00:39:40,200 --> 00:39:43,279
Speaker 2: South America. We only did the peninsula. We stayed on

837
00:39:43,320 --> 00:39:46,280
Speaker 2: a boat, there was no landing, whereas Davis is a station,

838
00:39:47,040 --> 00:39:49,560
Speaker 2: it's in Antarctica and you're not on a boat the

839
00:39:49,560 --> 00:39:52,480
Speaker 2: whole time. So first, just like lay out the logistics

840
00:39:52,480 --> 00:39:54,400
Speaker 2: of it all and how you became the station leader

841
00:39:55,120 --> 00:39:57,359
Speaker 2: so people understand kind of the context that the rest

842
00:39:57,360 --> 00:39:58,799
Speaker 2: of the story comes out in all.

843
00:39:58,760 --> 00:40:02,520
Speaker 1: Right, So twenty nineteen. I've left Marther, Korea, and I've

844
00:40:02,520 --> 00:40:05,040
Speaker 1: decided to take a job as an Antarctic station leader.

845
00:40:05,520 --> 00:40:09,520
Speaker 1: The Australian Antarctic Program manages our three continental Antarctic stations

846
00:40:09,840 --> 00:40:12,440
Speaker 1: of Casey, Davis, and Mawson. Casey is pretty much due

847
00:40:12,520 --> 00:40:15,120
Speaker 1: south of Hobart, maybe a little bit west, about four

848
00:40:15,160 --> 00:40:18,000
Speaker 1: thousand kilometers away. Davis is a bit further west, maybe

849
00:40:18,080 --> 00:40:21,520
Speaker 1: due south of kind of Perth ish and about five

850
00:40:21,560 --> 00:40:24,720
Speaker 1: thousand k's away, and then Mawson is due south of

851
00:40:24,760 --> 00:40:26,560
Speaker 1: Herd Island, which is off the coast of westerns Trail

852
00:40:26,560 --> 00:40:29,520
Speaker 1: amount you six thousand sort of kilometers away. It takes

853
00:40:29,520 --> 00:40:31,440
Speaker 1: two weeks to sail there on an ice breaking ship.

854
00:40:31,480 --> 00:40:33,960
Speaker 1: You can fly to Casey if you're lucky in the

855
00:40:34,200 --> 00:40:36,719
Speaker 1: weather windows, and then using smaller planes you can you

856
00:40:36,760 --> 00:40:39,160
Speaker 1: can ferry between the stations, but only in the summertime,

857
00:40:39,160 --> 00:40:41,920
Speaker 1: from kind of November through to sort of March April,

858
00:40:42,160 --> 00:40:44,800
Speaker 1: it's the end of flying operations and even the ships.

859
00:40:45,280 --> 00:40:47,960
Speaker 1: So what we do is to man those stations in

860
00:40:48,000 --> 00:40:50,560
Speaker 1: the summer time. They'll have scientists in there and they

861
00:40:50,640 --> 00:40:52,359
Speaker 1: might be up to Casey Davis about one hundred people

862
00:40:52,400 --> 00:40:54,800
Speaker 1: at each station maybe a fifty to fifty split of

863
00:40:54,840 --> 00:40:57,799
Speaker 1: science and operational support. But the core group on the

864
00:40:57,840 --> 00:41:00,799
Speaker 1: stations is always the wintering team, which will be about

865
00:41:00,840 --> 00:41:03,400
Speaker 1: twenty people give or take depending on what's going on

866
00:41:03,400 --> 00:41:06,799
Speaker 1: for that particularly year. So twenty four of us went

867
00:41:06,920 --> 00:41:09,680
Speaker 1: down on the Aurora Australis, which was the ice breaking ship.

868
00:41:10,000 --> 00:41:13,399
Speaker 1: We left on twenty third of October twenty nineteen on

869
00:41:13,440 --> 00:41:15,560
Speaker 1: a one year contract of like, right, you're going to

870
00:41:15,640 --> 00:41:17,960
Speaker 1: go down for a year. You'll spend that first summer

871
00:41:18,360 --> 00:41:21,160
Speaker 1: with one hundred odd scientists. Today you've got helicopters and

872
00:41:21,160 --> 00:41:23,239
Speaker 1: small boats and it'll be all the things you wanted

873
00:41:23,239 --> 00:41:28,520
Speaker 1: twenty four hours at daylight, hashtag and penguins, And honestly

874
00:41:28,640 --> 00:41:30,760
Speaker 1: is that the leader in that situation is pretty straightforward.

875
00:41:30,760 --> 00:41:33,880
Speaker 1: You've got maritime experts, aviation experts that just run everything

876
00:41:33,920 --> 00:41:35,520
Speaker 1: for you and just sit back and go Maybe if

877
00:41:35,560 --> 00:41:37,040
Speaker 1: we communicate better this week.

878
00:41:37,200 --> 00:41:39,560
Speaker 2: Yes, let's take out with more penguins tomorrow.

879
00:41:40,520 --> 00:41:43,839
Speaker 1: But when it got to March twenty twenty, so we're

880
00:41:43,880 --> 00:41:46,399
Speaker 1: a few months in, the ship came back to pick

881
00:41:46,480 --> 00:41:48,000
Speaker 1: up all the scientists and go home, and that was

882
00:41:48,040 --> 00:41:51,680
Speaker 1: the last ever visit of the Aurora Australas ship to

883
00:41:52,120 --> 00:41:54,720
Speaker 1: Antarctica because we were supposed to come home in November

884
00:41:54,719 --> 00:41:59,400
Speaker 1: twenty twenty Australia on Australia's brand new icebreaker, the RSV Noiiner,

885
00:41:59,440 --> 00:42:02,080
Speaker 1: which was being built in Romania, and there's gonna be

886
00:42:02,080 --> 00:42:05,239
Speaker 1: fitted out in the Netherlands, commissioned and sail down and

887
00:42:05,239 --> 00:42:07,440
Speaker 1: pick us up on its maiden voyage. And so we

888
00:42:08,280 --> 00:42:10,319
Speaker 1: it's March twenty twenty. We're like, yep, no worries. We've

889
00:42:10,360 --> 00:42:13,120
Speaker 1: heard about COVID. Everyone was still in this phase of like, oh, yeah,

890
00:42:13,120 --> 00:42:16,160
Speaker 1: there'll be some travel restrictions and a little lockdown, you know,

891
00:42:16,200 --> 00:42:19,160
Speaker 1: two weeks to flatten the curve, you know whatever flat curb.

892
00:42:19,239 --> 00:42:22,320
Speaker 2: Oh my god, yeah PTSD exactly.

893
00:42:23,040 --> 00:42:25,400
Speaker 1: So we're all we all just went okay, great, what

894
00:42:25,480 --> 00:42:29,920
Speaker 1: a year to winter in Antarctica. And as a spoiler alert,

895
00:42:30,000 --> 00:42:35,319
Speaker 1: as the year rolled on, it went from bad to

896
00:42:35,400 --> 00:42:38,399
Speaker 1: worse in terms of yeah, we're the novelty phase when

897
00:42:38,440 --> 00:42:40,719
Speaker 1: it was like people are calling us, going what do

898
00:42:40,800 --> 00:42:43,480
Speaker 1: you do on the Antarctic stations during lockdowns? And we

899
00:42:43,520 --> 00:42:45,840
Speaker 1: did these great little social media media video clips and

900
00:42:45,880 --> 00:42:47,680
Speaker 1: we were all having a ball going on, this is great.

901
00:42:47,680 --> 00:42:51,239
Speaker 1: We have plenty to do, but by midwinter, so we

902
00:42:51,280 --> 00:42:53,840
Speaker 1: celebrate Midwinter's Day. It was is the winter solstice twenty

903
00:42:53,840 --> 00:42:57,040
Speaker 1: first to June twenty twenty, and we celebrate that by

904
00:42:57,080 --> 00:42:59,600
Speaker 1: doing a very formal dinner. But we also go for

905
00:42:59,680 --> 00:43:02,799
Speaker 1: a swim. So at the time it's minus twenty two

906
00:43:02,800 --> 00:43:06,480
Speaker 1: degrees outside on that particular day, ocean's two meters snick

907
00:43:06,520 --> 00:43:08,279
Speaker 1: of sea ice. You've got to cut a hole in

908
00:43:08,320 --> 00:43:11,080
Speaker 1: the ice. You with a little pool, not at the

909
00:43:11,080 --> 00:43:12,719
Speaker 1: same time. One at a time. You jump in for

910
00:43:12,840 --> 00:43:15,080
Speaker 1: up to a minute. I think I'll last about twenty seconds,

911
00:43:15,520 --> 00:43:18,439
Speaker 1: and you go swim around a bit, get out and go, wow,

912
00:43:18,600 --> 00:43:21,040
Speaker 1: what a cool stupid thing we've done, is go swimming

913
00:43:21,120 --> 00:43:24,120
Speaker 1: in the middle of Antarctic winter. And for us, even

914
00:43:24,160 --> 00:43:26,200
Speaker 1: though that's the midwinter's halfway point, for us, it was

915
00:43:26,200 --> 00:43:27,719
Speaker 1: actually two thirds of the way through our journey. We

916
00:43:27,719 --> 00:43:30,000
Speaker 1: was supposed to come home a couple of months after that.

917
00:43:30,120 --> 00:43:32,319
Speaker 1: So for us, we're like, great, let's see it after this.

918
00:43:32,440 --> 00:43:33,840
Speaker 1: You know, you get twenty fo hours of darkness at

919
00:43:33,840 --> 00:43:35,359
Speaker 1: that time as well, you go all right every day

920
00:43:35,360 --> 00:43:37,239
Speaker 1: after this to be seven more minutes of daylight and

921
00:43:37,520 --> 00:43:40,120
Speaker 1: one hundred and fifty odd days later we'll be coming home.

922
00:43:40,600 --> 00:43:44,200
Speaker 1: Yet two days after that swim and the dinner, twenty

923
00:43:44,200 --> 00:43:46,760
Speaker 1: third of June twenty twenty was when we were told

924
00:43:46,920 --> 00:43:50,959
Speaker 1: was I was told first by the operations managers like look, Dave,

925
00:43:51,520 --> 00:43:55,879
Speaker 1: the new ship the dockyard in Romania's shut down. It's

926
00:43:55,880 --> 00:43:58,319
Speaker 1: not going to be finished in twenty twenty, probably not

927
00:43:58,360 --> 00:44:01,279
Speaker 1: even twenty twenty one. So there's no ship there. We

928
00:44:01,320 --> 00:44:03,080
Speaker 1: can't use the old ship that's been on sold to

929
00:44:03,120 --> 00:44:05,920
Speaker 1: a different company. Australia doesn't own it anymore. You can't

930
00:44:06,120 --> 00:44:08,560
Speaker 1: come home that way. We can't do the aviational link

931
00:44:08,560 --> 00:44:10,880
Speaker 1: because all the planes we used to ferry around the stations,

932
00:44:10,960 --> 00:44:12,839
Speaker 1: all those planes are stuck in North America and can't

933
00:44:12,880 --> 00:44:16,279
Speaker 1: get through Central America because of the COVID lockdowns. And

934
00:44:16,520 --> 00:44:19,320
Speaker 1: we have a lot of great relationships with the partner nations,

935
00:44:19,520 --> 00:44:22,560
Speaker 1: and namely the French, the Italians, the Americans, the Japanese,

936
00:44:22,640 --> 00:44:25,040
Speaker 1: the Chinese, the Indians, the Russians, who all have stations

937
00:44:25,560 --> 00:44:29,520
Speaker 1: in and around Australias. We normally share a lot of logistics.

938
00:44:29,520 --> 00:44:31,759
Speaker 1: We share flights, We pill cargo on different ships, put people

939
00:44:31,800 --> 00:44:34,279
Speaker 1: on different ships at times, and move around. They were

940
00:44:34,320 --> 00:44:37,880
Speaker 1: like because of COVID. No one's cooperating. It's just bang

941
00:44:38,040 --> 00:44:40,319
Speaker 1: every man for themselves or every nation on their own.

942
00:44:40,480 --> 00:44:43,880
Speaker 1: And we were stuck in this weird sixty year swing

943
00:44:43,920 --> 00:44:46,560
Speaker 1: where we'd had one ice breaker for thirty years, we're

944
00:44:46,640 --> 00:44:48,879
Speaker 1: due to have a new ice breaker commission for thirty years,

945
00:44:48,920 --> 00:44:51,640
Speaker 1: and the one year in between those two ice breakers

946
00:44:52,239 --> 00:44:53,680
Speaker 1: was COVID and the year we were.

947
00:44:53,560 --> 00:44:56,680
Speaker 2: There, what are the chances the boat would be scheduled

948
00:44:56,680 --> 00:44:57,839
Speaker 2: for renewal that year?

949
00:44:58,160 --> 00:45:01,239
Speaker 1: Oh, and look, there's so many variables in that. And

950
00:45:01,280 --> 00:45:02,840
Speaker 1: people go, but you know, why didn't they have a

951
00:45:02,840 --> 00:45:06,880
Speaker 1: better transition period, and you go, well, obviously, but in

952
00:45:06,960 --> 00:45:09,680
Speaker 1: so many ways they didn't need to worry about that

953
00:45:09,800 --> 00:45:12,640
Speaker 1: as much because they knew, well, okay, if the ship's late,

954
00:45:12,960 --> 00:45:14,799
Speaker 1: we can fly everyone in and out, and then we

955
00:45:14,800 --> 00:45:17,360
Speaker 1: can use we can borrow the French will do a

956
00:45:17,440 --> 00:45:20,440
Speaker 1: voyage for us, and we can share logistics with the Chinese,

957
00:45:20,480 --> 00:45:22,719
Speaker 1: or we can charter another ship, or we could do

958
00:45:22,800 --> 00:45:25,880
Speaker 1: something in a normal year. But when it was twenty

959
00:45:25,880 --> 00:45:28,719
Speaker 1: twenty in the COVID year, none of that was available.

960
00:45:28,880 --> 00:45:32,399
Speaker 1: So the program did have levels of redundancy to deal

961
00:45:32,440 --> 00:45:35,120
Speaker 1: with any one of those incidents or even two of

962
00:45:35,120 --> 00:45:38,240
Speaker 1: those incidents, but when you had all of them multiple, yeah,

963
00:45:38,640 --> 00:45:40,799
Speaker 1: it was. It was kind of crazy because they had

964
00:45:40,800 --> 00:45:43,360
Speaker 1: to have we have and any of your corporate listeners

965
00:45:43,360 --> 00:45:46,520
Speaker 1: and others will know these structures like your emergency business

966
00:45:46,560 --> 00:45:49,759
Speaker 1: continuity plans and your incident management groups and teams. We

967
00:45:50,640 --> 00:45:53,959
Speaker 1: ended up like we had the Umbrella Incident Management team

968
00:45:54,000 --> 00:45:56,240
Speaker 1: of COVID and then you had all these other sub

969
00:45:56,280 --> 00:45:59,040
Speaker 1: incident groups and it just started to get and I'm

970
00:45:59,080 --> 00:46:01,360
Speaker 1: sure businesses had this is well, you're going geez. We

971
00:46:01,440 --> 00:46:05,080
Speaker 1: planned on okay, that's how we set up for one incident,

972
00:46:05,440 --> 00:46:09,399
Speaker 1: but no one had ever thought that'd be incidents within

973
00:46:09,440 --> 00:46:12,400
Speaker 1: the incidents that require different breakout groups and you're just

974
00:46:13,280 --> 00:46:16,520
Speaker 1: trying to manage that and navigate it. And for us,

975
00:46:16,960 --> 00:46:19,840
Speaker 1: in so many ways though, there was a simplicity to

976
00:46:19,880 --> 00:46:22,319
Speaker 1: being stuck on an Antarctic station. It's twenty four of us.

977
00:46:22,360 --> 00:46:24,759
Speaker 1: We had two years worth of food and fuel and

978
00:46:24,840 --> 00:46:26,919
Speaker 1: for some reason, five years of toilet paper, which makes

979
00:46:26,960 --> 00:46:27,359
Speaker 1: no sense.

980
00:46:27,440 --> 00:46:29,800
Speaker 2: Oh, you were the reason why Australia had the toilet

981
00:46:29,800 --> 00:46:31,880
Speaker 2: paper shortage because it was all in bloody Antarctic with

982
00:46:31,920 --> 00:46:32,360
Speaker 2: you guys.

983
00:46:34,800 --> 00:46:39,759
Speaker 1: You can't eat it though, well, have you tried. I'm

984
00:46:39,800 --> 00:46:42,000
Speaker 1: sure people were given the rate it was selling back here,

985
00:46:42,000 --> 00:46:44,640
Speaker 1: but anyway, so that had a simplicity of like, great,

986
00:46:44,719 --> 00:46:47,120
Speaker 1: we were stuck here, and we knew we'd be there

987
00:46:47,160 --> 00:46:50,520
Speaker 1: into sometime into twenty twenty one, and that we went around.

988
00:46:50,560 --> 00:46:53,120
Speaker 1: We were involved in some of the planning and thinking around,

989
00:46:53,400 --> 00:46:56,600
Speaker 1: well what are the options, but largely it was left

990
00:46:56,600 --> 00:46:59,359
Speaker 1: to our bosses back in Hobart to go, We'll come

991
00:46:59,400 --> 00:47:01,040
Speaker 1: up with a plan how to get a different ship

992
00:47:01,120 --> 00:47:03,839
Speaker 1: or a different aircraft or whatever. And part of our

993
00:47:03,880 --> 00:47:08,640
Speaker 1: mind was prepared for staying another winter and an entire

994
00:47:08,719 --> 00:47:11,799
Speaker 1: other year, which would have got pretty interesting. If I've said,

995
00:47:11,800 --> 00:47:13,719
Speaker 1: you know, the book at the moments called Fire and

996
00:47:13,760 --> 00:47:15,480
Speaker 1: thirty seven Days of Winter, I'm like, if it'd have

997
00:47:15,480 --> 00:47:18,000
Speaker 1: gone another year, the book would be like a thousand

998
00:47:18,080 --> 00:47:21,879
Speaker 1: days of mutiny, mayhem and cho of hell. It would

999
00:47:21,920 --> 00:47:24,320
Speaker 1: have got pretty messy. But or it would have been fine.

1000
00:47:24,360 --> 00:47:27,239
Speaker 1: Like it was a great team, and I know we

1001
00:47:27,280 --> 00:47:30,440
Speaker 1: all had ups and downs along the way, yet by

1002
00:47:30,480 --> 00:47:33,920
Speaker 1: and large you came back as professional colleagues with a

1003
00:47:34,000 --> 00:47:37,160
Speaker 1: very interesting shared experience and that we would have otherwise

1004
00:47:37,200 --> 00:47:39,680
Speaker 1: never met. And one of the kind of interesting things

1005
00:47:39,760 --> 00:47:43,440
Speaker 1: I think your listeners would appreciate, though, was the ability

1006
00:47:43,800 --> 00:47:47,360
Speaker 1: for not just myself but the entire team to reframe

1007
00:47:47,480 --> 00:47:51,200
Speaker 1: that's almost straight away and go, Okay, we signed up

1008
00:47:51,200 --> 00:47:53,880
Speaker 1: for an Antarctic adventure for a year. We've now been

1009
00:47:53,920 --> 00:47:55,880
Speaker 1: told that's going to be a year and a half,

1010
00:47:56,120 --> 00:47:58,279
Speaker 1: and it has a whole other way of uncertainty of well,

1011
00:47:58,280 --> 00:48:00,920
Speaker 1: what does home even look like? Not just you're there longer,

1012
00:48:00,960 --> 00:48:03,399
Speaker 1: but also when you get home it's going to be weird.

1013
00:48:04,520 --> 00:48:06,719
Speaker 1: But everyone was really able to just go, oh, let's

1014
00:48:06,719 --> 00:48:09,640
Speaker 1: make the most of this. There's some really unique elements too.

1015
00:48:09,719 --> 00:48:11,719
Speaker 1: We've got to do a lot more science in that

1016
00:48:11,800 --> 00:48:14,439
Speaker 1: second somewhere because there weren't all the other scientists down

1017
00:48:14,440 --> 00:48:16,440
Speaker 1: there to help out and do what they would normally do,

1018
00:48:16,520 --> 00:48:18,480
Speaker 1: so we got to jump in and do some of that.

1019
00:48:18,520 --> 00:48:20,960
Speaker 1: We're able to give the group more freedom on account

1020
00:48:21,000 --> 00:48:23,000
Speaker 1: of Okay, ordinarily, and you would have found this with

1021
00:48:23,040 --> 00:48:25,759
Speaker 1: your trip. You know, you're fairly controlled. You can do this.

1022
00:48:25,880 --> 00:48:27,279
Speaker 1: You can't do that. You've got to go out in

1023
00:48:27,520 --> 00:48:29,560
Speaker 1: pairs and take this equipment and take these things. But

1024
00:48:30,280 --> 00:48:32,279
Speaker 1: when I was able to say, well, actually everyone's been

1025
00:48:32,320 --> 00:48:34,440
Speaker 1: here for a year, they know what they're doing. We

1026
00:48:34,520 --> 00:48:38,400
Speaker 1: can change the way we interpret some of these regulations

1027
00:48:38,400 --> 00:48:40,279
Speaker 1: to give so rather than people having to come and

1028
00:48:40,320 --> 00:48:41,920
Speaker 1: ask me for oh, can we go and do this,

1029
00:48:42,000 --> 00:48:43,920
Speaker 1: and be like, well, you know the conditions, you know

1030
00:48:43,960 --> 00:48:45,360
Speaker 1: the equipment required.

1031
00:48:45,120 --> 00:48:45,879
Speaker 2: Just go for a walk.

1032
00:48:46,000 --> 00:48:47,560
Speaker 1: You need to tell someone and you need to take

1033
00:48:47,600 --> 00:48:49,759
Speaker 1: the communication strategies so if you've got a problem, but

1034
00:48:50,239 --> 00:48:51,960
Speaker 1: you don't have to come and find me. And that

1035
00:48:52,239 --> 00:48:55,680
Speaker 1: giving people more autonomy and control was really important, and

1036
00:48:55,760 --> 00:48:58,000
Speaker 1: letting them get out and about and make their own

1037
00:48:58,520 --> 00:49:01,160
Speaker 1: fun and make the most of that unique opportunity because

1038
00:49:01,400 --> 00:49:04,040
Speaker 1: for so many people that's their one trip to Antarctica.

1039
00:49:04,360 --> 00:49:06,520
Speaker 1: You do your winter. It's the only winter I've done.

1040
00:49:06,520 --> 00:49:09,080
Speaker 1: I've done multiple other summer trips, but winters are rarer.

1041
00:49:09,480 --> 00:49:11,359
Speaker 1: Some people do, you know, dozens of them, but it's

1042
00:49:11,400 --> 00:49:13,960
Speaker 1: pretty rare, and I think that's something that you can go.

1043
00:49:14,040 --> 00:49:17,080
Speaker 1: There's always a uniqueness to whatever situation you're in, especially

1044
00:49:17,080 --> 00:49:19,120
Speaker 1: when it's hard, and that was something that got me

1045
00:49:19,280 --> 00:49:22,880
Speaker 1: through it. Of Hey, you wanted an Antarctic challenge, you

1046
00:49:22,920 --> 00:49:25,279
Speaker 1: wanted to be a station leader. If it had gone

1047
00:49:25,320 --> 00:49:27,600
Speaker 1: to plan and been a normal year, it would have

1048
00:49:27,600 --> 00:49:30,880
Speaker 1: been interesting, but jeez, it wouldn't have been everything that

1049
00:49:30,920 --> 00:49:33,000
Speaker 1: it became. And as it went from bad to worse,

1050
00:49:33,080 --> 00:49:35,520
Speaker 1: and all of the things that came up along the way,

1051
00:49:36,440 --> 00:49:38,440
Speaker 1: none of them were unique. They'd all happened before, and

1052
00:49:38,520 --> 00:49:41,520
Speaker 1: all happened again. That never all happened in one year.

1053
00:49:43,160 --> 00:49:47,279
Speaker 1: And that's what became really really bizarre. That when we

1054
00:49:47,400 --> 00:49:49,359
Speaker 1: were standing there trying to do a couple of other

1055
00:49:49,400 --> 00:49:50,719
Speaker 1: members of the team to just go and there's a

1056
00:49:50,719 --> 00:49:53,160
Speaker 1: great quote I think in the book around that of

1057
00:49:53,360 --> 00:49:56,480
Speaker 1: just like, well, besides the pandemic, besides this, and besides that, like,

1058
00:49:56,680 --> 00:49:59,440
Speaker 1: oh what else could be wrong? And it was just

1059
00:49:59,800 --> 00:50:02,759
Speaker 1: a funny moment to list everything that had happened, what.

1060
00:50:03,160 --> 00:50:07,839
Speaker 2: We coped with that through that well, before we get

1061
00:50:07,840 --> 00:50:10,600
Speaker 2: to some of the more colorful moments and how you

1062
00:50:10,640 --> 00:50:13,960
Speaker 2: got through them. I think I loved it as an

1063
00:50:14,000 --> 00:50:18,880
Speaker 2: Antarctica lover but also someone who finds human nature and

1064
00:50:18,920 --> 00:50:21,839
Speaker 2: behavior fascinating and then how that leads to leadership. I mean,

1065
00:50:22,360 --> 00:50:28,080
Speaker 2: your experience was like an extreme, like microcosm example of

1066
00:50:28,160 --> 00:50:32,120
Speaker 2: leadership everywhere, except that you also became like a mother

1067
00:50:32,640 --> 00:50:36,719
Speaker 2: and an emergency services coordinator, the main doctor, the main

1068
00:50:36,880 --> 00:50:39,239
Speaker 2: like you were making calls on everything but there were

1069
00:50:39,239 --> 00:50:40,680
Speaker 2: so many lessons to pull out of that in the

1070
00:50:40,800 --> 00:50:43,839
Speaker 2: tougher moments, but just before we get to when it

1071
00:50:43,840 --> 00:50:47,759
Speaker 2: got difficult. What I found so interesting about Antarctica is

1072
00:50:47,800 --> 00:50:50,879
Speaker 2: not only that any rules of life just go out

1073
00:50:50,880 --> 00:50:55,000
Speaker 2: the window because talk about humility and Doubtaca humbles you

1074
00:50:55,080 --> 00:51:00,200
Speaker 2: as a human, like nature doesn't care what you want

1075
00:51:00,239 --> 00:51:03,799
Speaker 2: to do. You're visiting there and it will just ruin

1076
00:51:03,840 --> 00:51:06,719
Speaker 2: any plans that you have. But also the conditions you

1077
00:51:06,760 --> 00:51:09,360
Speaker 2: live under, like what's normal in Antarctica is so different.

1078
00:51:09,440 --> 00:51:12,439
Speaker 2: So you had Wi Fi, but it was patchy. Your

1079
00:51:12,440 --> 00:51:17,120
Speaker 2: sunlight in summer is constant, your darkness in winter is constant.

1080
00:51:17,680 --> 00:51:19,480
Speaker 2: Like what was your day to day life, what did

1081
00:51:19,480 --> 00:51:21,480
Speaker 2: you have access to? And also the fact that when

1082
00:51:21,520 --> 00:51:23,960
Speaker 2: you're you said you were working all the time. You're

1083
00:51:24,000 --> 00:51:26,480
Speaker 2: living with your colleagues, so that in itself is like

1084
00:51:26,600 --> 00:51:29,520
Speaker 2: you get no escape from each other. You do have downtime,

1085
00:51:29,640 --> 00:51:32,840
Speaker 2: but everyone, including scientists, would have to get involved in

1086
00:51:32,880 --> 00:51:36,160
Speaker 2: some of the water plumbing activities because you're just all

1087
00:51:36,239 --> 00:51:38,560
Speaker 2: there to make it work for everyone, and that's not

1088
00:51:39,360 --> 00:51:42,719
Speaker 2: normal in human life. So can you explain some more

1089
00:51:42,719 --> 00:51:45,279
Speaker 2: of the logistics of living, like how you you know,

1090
00:51:45,480 --> 00:51:47,200
Speaker 2: did you have a doctor there all the time?

1091
00:51:47,400 --> 00:51:47,520
Speaker 1: Like?

1092
00:51:48,239 --> 00:51:50,680
Speaker 2: Did was there a gym? Like? What was life like?

1093
00:51:51,080 --> 00:51:53,480
Speaker 1: Yeah? So life's actually pretty good when you look at it,

1094
00:51:53,840 --> 00:51:55,920
Speaker 1: especially the Australian stations. It'll have been about a dozen

1095
00:51:55,960 --> 00:51:58,000
Speaker 1: other national stations as well. They were pretty much the

1096
00:51:58,000 --> 00:52:00,719
Speaker 1: same and they'll all have different pros and cons. So,

1097
00:52:00,840 --> 00:52:03,640
Speaker 1: and the previous director of the Istralian program used to

1098
00:52:03,680 --> 00:52:05,319
Speaker 1: describe them a ski resorts. I'm like, yeah, but if

1099
00:52:05,320 --> 00:52:06,719
Speaker 1: you spend a year and a half with your twenty

1100
00:52:06,719 --> 00:52:09,960
Speaker 1: four best mates on a ski resort, it's not all sunshine. Yeah,

1101
00:52:11,040 --> 00:52:13,520
Speaker 1: but yeah, there's there's a gym, there's a sauna, there's

1102
00:52:13,520 --> 00:52:16,560
Speaker 1: a hot tub, there's a library, there's a cinema, there's

1103
00:52:16,600 --> 00:52:18,919
Speaker 1: a bar, there's a kitchen. Everyone gets their own room

1104
00:52:18,960 --> 00:52:21,440
Speaker 1: on the AUSSY stations as long as you're there for

1105
00:52:21,560 --> 00:52:23,360
Speaker 1: more than a couple of weeks. Sometimes we have to

1106
00:52:23,680 --> 00:52:26,879
Speaker 1: share during resupplies and really busy times, but or less,

1107
00:52:26,880 --> 00:52:28,960
Speaker 1: you get your own room way for thin walls. So

1108
00:52:29,080 --> 00:52:34,319
Speaker 1: if you you know, it's not pretty good, but you're

1109
00:52:34,320 --> 00:52:38,160
Speaker 1: absolutely right. The worst part about it is that there's

1110
00:52:38,200 --> 00:52:40,799
Speaker 1: there's really little privacy, even if you are locked in

1111
00:52:40,840 --> 00:52:42,600
Speaker 1: your own room and you've shut the door and you're

1112
00:52:42,600 --> 00:52:45,239
Speaker 1: trying to watch a movie or nap during the day

1113
00:52:45,320 --> 00:52:47,480
Speaker 1: or whatever it is, someone will slam a door or

1114
00:52:47,600 --> 00:52:50,759
Speaker 1: cough loudly or snore or fart or my room was

1115
00:52:50,760 --> 00:52:51,520
Speaker 1: really close to wear.

1116
00:52:52,200 --> 00:52:55,760
Speaker 2: Haircuts, Oh my god, haircuts, of course.

1117
00:52:55,800 --> 00:52:59,359
Speaker 1: So we had one guy that even did a great job,

1118
00:52:59,640 --> 00:53:01,040
Speaker 1: and a couple of girls in the team as well,

1119
00:53:01,080 --> 00:53:02,760
Speaker 1: and he did. One of them had really long, curly

1120
00:53:02,800 --> 00:53:05,360
Speaker 1: hair and the hair dress. He was one of the mechanics.

1121
00:53:05,400 --> 00:53:07,120
Speaker 1: He did a great job one day where they just

1122
00:53:07,200 --> 00:53:09,719
Speaker 1: parked in the bar, set up, the whole barbershop set up,

1123
00:53:09,719 --> 00:53:12,160
Speaker 1: and he just he'd watched a few YouTube clips on

1124
00:53:12,200 --> 00:53:15,239
Speaker 1: how to do women's hair, and off he went. Then

1125
00:53:15,760 --> 00:53:18,160
Speaker 1: it did an amazing job. So there was some of

1126
00:53:18,200 --> 00:53:19,759
Speaker 1: those things that, Yeah, I mean, if you look at

1127
00:53:19,800 --> 00:53:21,400
Speaker 1: the photos of me at the end of the year

1128
00:53:21,440 --> 00:53:24,120
Speaker 1: and a half, pretty that's the longest hair i'd had

1129
00:53:24,160 --> 00:53:26,719
Speaker 1: a long walt and a lot of people got some

1130
00:53:26,760 --> 00:53:30,160
Speaker 1: pretty interesting twenty twenty eight ish haircuts, I think. Yeah,

1131
00:53:30,200 --> 00:53:31,680
Speaker 1: the photo of me at the airport.

1132
00:53:31,360 --> 00:53:32,920
Speaker 2: The photo section in the middle of the book is

1133
00:53:32,920 --> 00:53:35,280
Speaker 2: my favorite, I know, with your fancy shirt.

1134
00:53:35,440 --> 00:53:38,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, the fancy shirt, which was a lot darker blue

1135
00:53:38,160 --> 00:53:39,799
Speaker 1: at the start of the year, not the faded blue

1136
00:53:39,800 --> 00:53:42,160
Speaker 1: bother you and a half. So you have to do

1137
00:53:42,200 --> 00:53:44,360
Speaker 1: all those things yourself. And yeah, there's there's one doctor,

1138
00:53:44,520 --> 00:53:47,040
Speaker 1: and then there's there's one builder, and there's a couple

1139
00:53:47,080 --> 00:53:49,799
Speaker 1: of builders actually, and then your builders, electronics technicians and

1140
00:53:50,480 --> 00:53:55,520
Speaker 1: engineers and meteorologists and all. Everyone's got their job. And

1141
00:53:55,600 --> 00:53:57,480
Speaker 1: I used to say as well, and the best way

1142
00:53:57,520 --> 00:54:00,520
Speaker 1: to approach it is, yes, you've got job, and if

1143
00:54:00,520 --> 00:54:05,759
Speaker 1: your hierarchy of work, but socially and there's a community,

1144
00:54:06,040 --> 00:54:09,520
Speaker 1: everyone's equal. It doesn't matter like everyone. There's a roster

1145
00:54:09,600 --> 00:54:11,680
Speaker 1: for it that you know, I do the roster. But

1146
00:54:11,719 --> 00:54:13,880
Speaker 1: if really you could, anyone could do it. It's just

1147
00:54:13,960 --> 00:54:16,200
Speaker 1: it just repeats and you've got to shuffle. So at

1148
00:54:16,200 --> 00:54:18,400
Speaker 1: any point, you've got six people that are on the

1149
00:54:18,400 --> 00:54:20,839
Speaker 1: fire team and the emergency response team, so that if

1150
00:54:20,840 --> 00:54:24,000
Speaker 1: anything goes wrong, they can man the fire hoses because

1151
00:54:24,040 --> 00:54:26,200
Speaker 1: then we do some great firefighter training before we leave,

1152
00:54:26,239 --> 00:54:29,520
Speaker 1: which is really cool. There's surgical assistance, so to help

1153
00:54:29,560 --> 00:54:32,280
Speaker 1: the one doctor, four people are trained as surgical assistant,

1154
00:54:32,360 --> 00:54:34,640
Speaker 1: so they spend two weeks in the er and Hobart

1155
00:54:34,960 --> 00:54:39,560
Speaker 1: doing everything from like delivering babies to car accidents, and

1156
00:54:39,760 --> 00:54:43,040
Speaker 1: also just as the assistant, so they get probably I

1157
00:54:43,040 --> 00:54:46,680
Speaker 1: think some of the coolest, most unique. You can't just say, oh, hey,

1158
00:54:46,680 --> 00:54:48,080
Speaker 1: I want to go spend two weeks in the er

1159
00:54:48,160 --> 00:54:51,520
Speaker 1: as a scrubbed in surgical assistant any other hospitality to

1160
00:54:51,520 --> 00:54:52,400
Speaker 1: get stuck.

1161
00:54:52,200 --> 00:54:54,080
Speaker 2: Unless you're going to Antarctica.

1162
00:54:53,680 --> 00:54:55,960
Speaker 1: Unless you go to Antarctica or a nursing student or something.

1163
00:54:56,000 --> 00:54:58,600
Speaker 1: So that that's pretty cool, and because if anything happens,

1164
00:54:58,760 --> 00:55:02,600
Speaker 1: and all this stuff happened, it's it's just you that

1165
00:55:03,080 --> 00:55:05,319
Speaker 1: people have to then help out at one point when

1166
00:55:05,800 --> 00:55:07,480
Speaker 1: none of them are available. I actually helped have to

1167
00:55:07,600 --> 00:55:09,800
Speaker 1: suiture some dude's head. He just banged his head on

1168
00:55:09,920 --> 00:55:14,360
Speaker 1: a staircase and I was and the doctor saw it happen.

1169
00:55:14,440 --> 00:55:15,920
Speaker 1: He's like, oh what are you doing. I'm like, oh,

1170
00:55:16,120 --> 00:55:17,640
Speaker 1: not much, and he's like it just gives a hand.

1171
00:55:17,680 --> 00:55:19,560
Speaker 1: And so he's just in there with your gloves on

1172
00:55:19,640 --> 00:55:22,480
Speaker 1: holding skin together while he's stitching, and you're going, this

1173
00:55:22,520 --> 00:55:26,680
Speaker 1: is this is unreal because there's that's it. It's it's

1174
00:55:26,800 --> 00:55:27,720
Speaker 1: just your team.

1175
00:55:27,920 --> 00:55:29,479
Speaker 2: That's human agility right there.

1176
00:55:30,120 --> 00:55:33,359
Speaker 1: And it's so fascinating learning all those the other one,

1177
00:55:33,520 --> 00:55:34,960
Speaker 1: the one I really love about. I say, this is

1178
00:55:35,000 --> 00:55:36,839
Speaker 1: a look out the window, it's a nice blue sky day.

1179
00:55:37,440 --> 00:55:40,640
Speaker 1: Is really becoming quite in tune with nature and the

1180
00:55:40,680 --> 00:55:44,239
Speaker 1: conditions that now, if it's a beautiful day back here,

1181
00:55:44,360 --> 00:55:49,000
Speaker 1: my ability to stay inside and do any work, I'm like, no,

1182
00:55:49,080 --> 00:55:50,800
Speaker 1: I've got to go for a walk over running and

1183
00:55:50,880 --> 00:55:53,200
Speaker 1: to do stuff like got to get out and about.

1184
00:55:53,200 --> 00:55:55,439
Speaker 1: And then on a rainy day, I'm like, great blizz day,

1185
00:55:56,360 --> 00:55:58,759
Speaker 1: today's the day you work. And now that works better

1186
00:55:58,760 --> 00:56:00,839
Speaker 1: Arountarctica because it's sort of works since sort of these

1187
00:56:00,840 --> 00:56:04,520
Speaker 1: three day swings give or take, but it means you'll

1188
00:56:04,560 --> 00:56:07,080
Speaker 1: get a good balance done. The problem is Australia has

1189
00:56:07,120 --> 00:56:10,680
Speaker 1: generally pretty good weather, so it can be tough. But

1190
00:56:10,760 --> 00:56:13,400
Speaker 1: I think that's something I think in the modern world

1191
00:56:13,560 --> 00:56:16,200
Speaker 1: where not very in tune with nature, and it doesn't

1192
00:56:16,239 --> 00:56:19,480
Speaker 1: matter what the conditions are, because we've created a society

1193
00:56:19,560 --> 00:56:22,799
Speaker 1: and buildings and infrastructure and everything to mean that we

1194
00:56:22,800 --> 00:56:25,120
Speaker 1: can deal with it. And yet you go and chat

1195
00:56:25,160 --> 00:56:28,200
Speaker 1: to Norwegians and Canadians, they're very in tune with the

1196
00:56:28,200 --> 00:56:30,680
Speaker 1: weather and the conditions because over there they have to

1197
00:56:31,320 --> 00:56:34,120
Speaker 1: still deal with it. But for us, it's a bit different,

1198
00:56:34,200 --> 00:56:36,200
Speaker 1: and that's one of my favorite takeaways is all those

1199
00:56:36,200 --> 00:56:39,920
Speaker 1: little soft skills and community things that you don't have

1200
00:56:39,960 --> 00:56:41,919
Speaker 1: to do back here, but we have to do down there.

1201
00:56:42,080 --> 00:56:44,160
Speaker 2: I feel like, even in just such a short time

1202
00:56:44,160 --> 00:56:48,319
Speaker 2: that we were there, you can't ignore, especially because we

1203
00:56:48,360 --> 00:56:51,359
Speaker 2: went with Intrepid and their becore certification meant there were

1204
00:56:51,400 --> 00:56:54,720
Speaker 2: so many scientists on board, and the sessions are amazing.

1205
00:56:54,760 --> 00:56:57,120
Speaker 2: They make it without shoving it down your throat. They

1206
00:56:57,120 --> 00:56:59,480
Speaker 2: make it impossible for you to visit without appreciating the

1207
00:56:59,680 --> 00:57:02,800
Speaker 2: enormal of nature there, which then makes you reflect on

1208
00:57:02,840 --> 00:57:06,640
Speaker 2: the normality of nature everywhere. You just block it out

1209
00:57:06,920 --> 00:57:10,960
Speaker 2: when you're back home, but having to see how nature

1210
00:57:11,040 --> 00:57:14,040
Speaker 2: is just like in its most pristine, untouched by humans,

1211
00:57:14,960 --> 00:57:17,520
Speaker 2: and how you're just at the mercy of weather like

1212
00:57:17,560 --> 00:57:19,640
Speaker 2: it's literally there's nothing you can do. Someone's having a

1213
00:57:19,680 --> 00:57:21,280
Speaker 2: heart attack, you can't fly. If you can't fly, you

1214
00:57:21,280 --> 00:57:22,960
Speaker 2: can't fly like you just can't get them there. It's

1215
00:57:23,000 --> 00:57:27,960
Speaker 2: a modern science has absolutely no strength compared to Mother Nature,

1216
00:57:28,000 --> 00:57:30,600
Speaker 2: and it changes the way you think about everything. It's

1217
00:57:30,680 --> 00:57:31,520
Speaker 2: so interesting.

1218
00:57:31,720 --> 00:57:35,040
Speaker 1: I think even things around like rubbish and sustainability and recycling,

1219
00:57:35,160 --> 00:57:38,720
Speaker 1: like for us we're pretty very environmentally conscious down there

1220
00:57:38,760 --> 00:57:40,320
Speaker 1: and have really strict rules around all these things. You

1221
00:57:40,320 --> 00:57:42,960
Speaker 1: can't take polystyrene and you're doing all these different things,

1222
00:57:43,120 --> 00:57:46,080
Speaker 1: and you can't use certain types of hair products and

1223
00:57:46,120 --> 00:57:47,960
Speaker 1: soaps because they're bad for the water set. And we

1224
00:57:48,000 --> 00:57:50,400
Speaker 1: treat all the water and like the water that does

1225
00:57:50,440 --> 00:57:53,800
Speaker 1: get discharged is drinking level quality, et cetera. That goes

1226
00:57:53,840 --> 00:57:56,479
Speaker 1: back out into the ocean, and we just desalinate water

1227
00:57:56,560 --> 00:57:58,360
Speaker 1: and all sorts of different things or will melt ice

1228
00:57:58,440 --> 00:58:01,800
Speaker 1: to get it. So you your water is actually coming

1229
00:58:01,800 --> 00:58:04,760
Speaker 1: from diesel because you're like, well, it's either frozen or salty,

1230
00:58:04,840 --> 00:58:07,160
Speaker 1: so we've got to either decalerate or melt it, and

1231
00:58:07,200 --> 00:58:10,560
Speaker 1: that's going to cost diesel. So if you're showering, imagine

1232
00:58:10,560 --> 00:58:13,600
Speaker 1: yourself showering and diesel, because if you have a long shower,

1233
00:58:14,200 --> 00:58:16,440
Speaker 1: you're just burning more fossil fuels to do that. And

1234
00:58:16,480 --> 00:58:19,520
Speaker 1: even then the recycling, like when you be on rubbish study,

1235
00:58:19,520 --> 00:58:21,600
Speaker 1: which every other week or something, you probably in a

1236
00:58:21,640 --> 00:58:23,440
Speaker 1: rubbis studio every day you go, oh, it turns out

1237
00:58:23,720 --> 00:58:25,959
Speaker 1: and you just realize how much rubbish twenty four people

1238
00:58:26,000 --> 00:58:27,920
Speaker 1: are accumulating and how we deal with that in terms

1239
00:58:27,960 --> 00:58:30,600
Speaker 1: of cycling, recycling some of it and do you have

1240
00:58:30,600 --> 00:58:32,960
Speaker 1: to incinerate other bits and incinerate human waste from the

1241
00:58:32,960 --> 00:58:34,960
Speaker 1: field and different things you kind of and you look

1242
00:58:35,000 --> 00:58:37,200
Speaker 1: at how much that's you know, that's twenty four people.

1243
00:58:37,920 --> 00:58:41,360
Speaker 1: If more people back home realize what happens when you

1244
00:58:41,400 --> 00:58:42,880
Speaker 1: put stuff in your bin and where it goes. And

1245
00:58:42,880 --> 00:58:44,520
Speaker 1: I think there's a great SBS thing on this now

1246
00:58:44,520 --> 00:58:46,160
Speaker 1: as well, like the war on trash or whatever one

1247
00:58:46,200 --> 00:58:48,440
Speaker 1: of the chaser guys some of that of looking at

1248
00:58:48,440 --> 00:58:51,320
Speaker 1: the chain of what happens to all this and like

1249
00:58:52,560 --> 00:58:56,520
Speaker 1: massive hate but beyond a pet hate now just again

1250
00:58:56,560 --> 00:59:00,200
Speaker 1: like the amount of freaking packaging and everything, and just

1251
00:59:00,240 --> 00:59:02,160
Speaker 1: look at it and go, why is all this stuff

1252
00:59:02,160 --> 00:59:04,760
Speaker 1: individually wrapped? And I make a real good point of

1253
00:59:05,480 --> 00:59:08,040
Speaker 1: my Hessian bags and everything at the supermarket, like never

1254
00:59:08,160 --> 00:59:10,439
Speaker 1: using the other ones to like put all your other

1255
00:59:10,640 --> 00:59:12,600
Speaker 1: fruits together. And I think the woman and all the

1256
00:59:13,320 --> 00:59:15,200
Speaker 1: check out people at the market I go to, they

1257
00:59:15,200 --> 00:59:15,600
Speaker 1: look at.

1258
00:59:15,600 --> 00:59:19,640
Speaker 3: Like individual like everything which is the chaos that has

1259
00:59:19,640 --> 00:59:21,760
Speaker 3: to go in a Hessian bag and it all rolls

1260
00:59:21,760 --> 00:59:29,400
Speaker 3: off the thing like no.

1261
00:59:26,360 --> 00:59:29,240
Speaker 1: But you go, I just I can. I don't want

1262
00:59:29,280 --> 00:59:32,479
Speaker 1: to use any bags unless I absolutely have to use

1263
00:59:33,560 --> 00:59:36,440
Speaker 1: a plastic bag or something. And so that stuff becomes

1264
00:59:37,200 --> 00:59:39,320
Speaker 1: really because you have to see it and you have

1265
00:59:39,360 --> 00:59:40,760
Speaker 1: to deal with it. So you go, I need I

1266
00:59:40,760 --> 00:59:42,640
Speaker 1: want to create less rubbish because I'm going to have

1267
00:59:42,680 --> 00:59:44,800
Speaker 1: to deal with the rubbish or I'm going to have

1268
00:59:44,800 --> 00:59:47,320
Speaker 1: to carry the rubbish walking around with me. So before

1269
00:59:47,360 --> 00:59:49,640
Speaker 1: you go out, the armies, good at this. Taking me

1270
00:59:49,680 --> 00:59:51,520
Speaker 1: this as well, Like, don't take anything into the field

1271
00:59:51,520 --> 00:59:52,440
Speaker 1: because you've got to carry.

1272
00:59:52,280 --> 00:59:53,439
Speaker 2: It for the rest of the ever.

1273
00:59:54,960 --> 01:00:00,640
Speaker 1: People cut their toothbrushes in half. That's an It's just

1274
01:00:00,800 --> 01:00:02,640
Speaker 1: like yeah, right, But.

1275
01:00:02,680 --> 01:00:05,280
Speaker 2: I actually love that. It makes you think in a

1276
01:00:05,360 --> 01:00:09,680
Speaker 2: way that like you can easily ignore where things go,

1277
01:00:09,760 --> 01:00:12,120
Speaker 2: but when you're in Antarctica, you can't because like you

1278
01:00:12,240 --> 01:00:14,240
Speaker 2: see where it goes, like there's nowhere for it to

1279
01:00:14,280 --> 01:00:15,800
Speaker 2: go because you live in a station and like you're

1280
01:00:15,800 --> 01:00:18,600
Speaker 2: trying to keep your footprint small, and I feel like

1281
01:00:18,640 --> 01:00:22,520
Speaker 2: you just you have to confront that. I think we

1282
01:00:22,560 --> 01:00:25,280
Speaker 2: get so accustomed to thinking we're so advanced as a

1283
01:00:25,360 --> 01:00:27,480
Speaker 2: human race that we're like, there's a way we can

1284
01:00:27,480 --> 01:00:30,320
Speaker 2: solve everything. But then I feel like in Antarctica, every

1285
01:00:30,360 --> 01:00:34,520
Speaker 2: problem you had was like like sometimes there's just no solution,

1286
01:00:34,640 --> 01:00:37,480
Speaker 2: Like humans can't outthink the fact that there's a blizzard

1287
01:00:37,480 --> 01:00:39,680
Speaker 2: and I'm stuck at in the hut that's far away

1288
01:00:39,680 --> 01:00:41,400
Speaker 2: from where I'm meant to be, but I can't get back,

1289
01:00:41,400 --> 01:00:44,120
Speaker 2: So I just have to wait three days with this

1290
01:00:44,200 --> 01:00:46,640
Speaker 2: one dude with a puzzle, and that's just what I'm

1291
01:00:46,640 --> 01:00:49,200
Speaker 2: going to have to do. And I think it that's

1292
01:00:49,240 --> 01:00:51,560
Speaker 2: so interesting because in our daily life back here, you're

1293
01:00:51,600 --> 01:00:54,800
Speaker 2: never forced into discomfort like that. So what were some

1294
01:00:54,880 --> 01:00:58,480
Speaker 2: of your toughest moments in that five hundred and thirty

1295
01:00:58,480 --> 01:01:02,280
Speaker 2: seven days and then some of the coolest examples of

1296
01:01:02,360 --> 01:01:03,480
Speaker 2: humanity that came out of it?

1297
01:01:03,680 --> 01:01:05,320
Speaker 1: Well, I think the story was talking about it is

1298
01:01:05,320 --> 01:01:06,520
Speaker 1: the story in the book. Or we get stuck in

1299
01:01:06,560 --> 01:01:07,920
Speaker 1: one of the field huts, which I mean a lot

1300
01:01:07,920 --> 01:01:09,800
Speaker 1: of ways were safe. Because we were stuck in a hut.

1301
01:01:09,800 --> 01:01:12,080
Speaker 1: It was just me and one other guy, and we

1302
01:01:12,160 --> 01:01:14,360
Speaker 1: hadn't planned on it, so we didn't have We had

1303
01:01:14,480 --> 01:01:16,920
Speaker 1: enough like the huts of stock with food and supplies,

1304
01:01:17,560 --> 01:01:22,080
Speaker 1: but I didn't have I didn't have like my headphones,

1305
01:01:22,160 --> 01:01:23,680
Speaker 1: I didn't have a book that I was reading, so

1306
01:01:23,720 --> 01:01:25,440
Speaker 1: I was just stuck with Right, what have we got

1307
01:01:25,440 --> 01:01:28,120
Speaker 1: in this hut and it was it was blowing like

1308
01:01:28,120 --> 01:01:30,960
Speaker 1: one hundred kilometers an hour winds outside for a good

1309
01:01:31,000 --> 01:01:32,880
Speaker 1: few days, so we just couldn't go outside. The only

1310
01:01:33,000 --> 01:01:35,760
Speaker 1: job outside we had was every few hours one of

1311
01:01:35,800 --> 01:01:38,880
Speaker 1: us would like open the door and shovel the doorway clear,

1312
01:01:38,960 --> 01:01:41,520
Speaker 1: so we knew that we could still get out, and

1313
01:01:41,520 --> 01:01:43,880
Speaker 1: that was great because you're cool. And we started to

1314
01:01:43,880 --> 01:01:46,080
Speaker 1: have a problem with the amount of waste and human

1315
01:01:46,160 --> 01:01:47,760
Speaker 1: wasts we were accumulating.

1316
01:01:47,280 --> 01:01:48,080
Speaker 2: In the hut.

1317
01:01:48,480 --> 01:01:52,840
Speaker 1: In the hut, which was getting it. We're like, oh,

1318
01:01:52,960 --> 01:01:56,600
Speaker 1: this is getting interesting. Don't drink too much, but I

1319
01:01:56,720 --> 01:02:00,480
Speaker 1: drink just enough. And then it'd be like, get really

1320
01:02:00,520 --> 01:02:03,400
Speaker 1: excited because I've got a cook dinner today and you

1321
01:02:03,680 --> 01:02:05,760
Speaker 1: started cooking it one day. You start at five o'clock,

1322
01:02:05,800 --> 01:02:07,360
Speaker 1: then you start at four thirty. Is that at four

1323
01:02:07,400 --> 01:02:08,040
Speaker 1: and started.

1324
01:02:08,000 --> 01:02:11,280
Speaker 2: Three clutching at straws here, paper straws.

1325
01:02:11,320 --> 01:02:14,480
Speaker 1: Obviously, yeah, exactly, you've got nothing else to do. So

1326
01:02:14,560 --> 01:02:17,400
Speaker 1: that was but I think that was a really cool moment,

1327
01:02:17,440 --> 01:02:20,240
Speaker 1: and he and I both agreed later that and even

1328
01:02:20,520 --> 01:02:22,400
Speaker 1: at the time, we're like, well, it's always been on

1329
01:02:22,440 --> 01:02:24,640
Speaker 1: our Antarctic bucket list, like get stuck at a field

1330
01:02:24,720 --> 01:02:27,080
Speaker 1: hut away from station for an extended period of time.

1331
01:02:27,120 --> 01:02:27,800
Speaker 1: So it was kind of cool.

1332
01:02:27,840 --> 01:02:29,919
Speaker 2: That was a new bucket list to get stuck.

1333
01:02:29,920 --> 01:02:31,560
Speaker 1: I think. So, I think it's a good one of

1334
01:02:31,720 --> 01:02:33,840
Speaker 1: like it was. You know, we had no Wi Fi.

1335
01:02:33,920 --> 01:02:36,080
Speaker 1: We only had we had a VHF radio back to

1336
01:02:36,120 --> 01:02:39,800
Speaker 1: station was our only means of communication. And yeah, we're

1337
01:02:39,800 --> 01:02:43,560
Speaker 1: probably only probably thirty or forty ks away, but we

1338
01:02:43,600 --> 01:02:45,680
Speaker 1: may as well have been hundreds of k's away. With that,

1339
01:02:45,760 --> 01:02:48,720
Speaker 1: the weather meant we just couldn't couldn't go anywhere, and

1340
01:02:49,000 --> 01:02:51,000
Speaker 1: that was That's not a low point. That was a

1341
01:02:51,120 --> 01:02:54,360
Speaker 1: tough time. I think when that happened as well, that

1342
01:02:54,480 --> 01:02:56,919
Speaker 1: was right around our extension. We've been there for a year,

1343
01:02:57,760 --> 01:03:01,640
Speaker 1: and that period of time the toughest. So we'd had

1344
01:03:02,040 --> 01:03:05,280
Speaker 1: members of the group that had decided yep, I'm not

1345
01:03:05,360 --> 01:03:07,520
Speaker 1: dealing with this well, and they were wavering, and I

1346
01:03:07,520 --> 01:03:10,480
Speaker 1: felt the group was fracturing at that point where it

1347
01:03:10,560 --> 01:03:14,760
Speaker 1: always had different like not necessarily clicks, but different just groups,

1348
01:03:14,800 --> 01:03:17,480
Speaker 1: you know, very different bunch of people, so you have

1349
01:03:17,560 --> 01:03:20,120
Speaker 1: very different conversations, and I felt at that point people

1350
01:03:20,120 --> 01:03:22,880
Speaker 1: were kind of sick of trying to make it all work.

1351
01:03:22,920 --> 01:03:24,600
Speaker 1: And they're like, you know what, I got my four friends.

1352
01:03:25,400 --> 01:03:27,600
Speaker 1: I'll get along with everyone, but I don't care anymore.

1353
01:03:27,640 --> 01:03:31,960
Speaker 1: Like everyone had lost like motivation to motivation, and we

1354
01:03:32,080 --> 01:03:34,400
Speaker 1: dealt with that a couple of ways. We got everyone

1355
01:03:34,400 --> 01:03:36,400
Speaker 1: together and did a kind of wellness week where we

1356
01:03:36,440 --> 01:03:39,000
Speaker 1: took some reduced work hours and were able to prioritize

1357
01:03:39,040 --> 01:03:41,800
Speaker 1: some field trips and learn from each other again of hey,

1358
01:03:41,840 --> 01:03:44,680
Speaker 1: what strategies are you using because stuff that we were

1359
01:03:44,760 --> 01:03:47,440
Speaker 1: using a year before didn't work, and as a community,

1360
01:03:47,600 --> 01:03:49,640
Speaker 1: to acknowledge that we're all struggling in our own way

1361
01:03:49,840 --> 01:03:52,440
Speaker 1: and we're all in the same boat, that became important.

1362
01:03:52,480 --> 01:03:54,480
Speaker 1: But it didn't work for everyone. And I think at

1363
01:03:54,520 --> 01:03:56,960
Speaker 1: moments there were people that I'm like, oh, this would

1364
01:03:57,000 --> 01:04:00,320
Speaker 1: be great for you know, Sarah to do this thisvity

1365
01:04:00,360 --> 01:04:01,560
Speaker 1: and then of course you're not going to turn up

1366
01:04:01,600 --> 01:04:02,960
Speaker 1: to an activity because you don't want to do it,

1367
01:04:03,600 --> 01:04:06,240
Speaker 1: so you just go and I'm like, oh, man, in

1368
01:04:06,280 --> 01:04:10,280
Speaker 1: the first half, people would always turn up to everything,

1369
01:04:10,400 --> 01:04:12,760
Speaker 1: And then you know, by that point you're running an

1370
01:04:12,760 --> 01:04:15,960
Speaker 1: event or you're running a professional development session and you're

1371
01:04:15,960 --> 01:04:18,959
Speaker 1: getting like two attendees, You're like, OK, what's everyone doing?

1372
01:04:19,000 --> 01:04:22,360
Speaker 1: And yet and also once we were able to then

1373
01:04:22,440 --> 01:04:24,920
Speaker 1: just just get through that lull and know that the

1374
01:04:25,000 --> 01:04:27,040
Speaker 1: lull at all end, it was always going to be

1375
01:04:27,080 --> 01:04:30,440
Speaker 1: a really tough time that anniversary when we still kind

1376
01:04:30,440 --> 01:04:33,880
Speaker 1: of had months to go and we didn't quite know

1377
01:04:33,920 --> 01:04:36,000
Speaker 1: exactly what the end was going to look like. And

1378
01:04:36,240 --> 01:04:38,600
Speaker 1: I was trying to get some answers and some definitive

1379
01:04:38,760 --> 01:04:41,720
Speaker 1: advice on what does the end look like, what does

1380
01:04:41,720 --> 01:04:43,560
Speaker 1: home look like, and what is the end going to

1381
01:04:43,600 --> 01:04:45,880
Speaker 1: be like? So we've got something to horizon to swim too,

1382
01:04:45,920 --> 01:04:49,080
Speaker 1: as they call it. That wasn't the solution to everything though,

1383
01:04:49,120 --> 01:04:51,360
Speaker 1: It was just you had to just ride that lull.

1384
01:04:51,760 --> 01:04:54,880
Speaker 1: And then there was a great moment where we ran

1385
01:04:55,120 --> 01:04:57,000
Speaker 1: an art show. So in the first summer, we'd run

1386
01:04:57,000 --> 01:04:59,160
Speaker 1: an art show the first year, and then we did

1387
01:04:59,240 --> 01:05:02,000
Speaker 1: it almost on the word new anniversary in that second summer,

1388
01:05:02,040 --> 01:05:03,720
Speaker 1: and for me that was a bit of a turning

1389
01:05:03,760 --> 01:05:06,000
Speaker 1: point where everyone had then got these projects and there

1390
01:05:06,000 --> 01:05:09,320
Speaker 1: were some great then memorabilia of our year and some

1391
01:05:09,680 --> 01:05:12,320
Speaker 1: amazing watercolor of the station, and we had framed photos

1392
01:05:12,320 --> 01:05:15,600
Speaker 1: of everyone on the field trips and the team team

1393
01:05:15,680 --> 01:05:20,960
Speaker 1: photo and framed flags and cool mementos of everything. We've done,

1394
01:05:21,200 --> 01:05:23,560
Speaker 1: and I think from that kind of moment people started

1395
01:05:23,600 --> 01:05:25,720
Speaker 1: to go, this is pretty special, this is pretty interesting,

1396
01:05:25,760 --> 01:05:28,880
Speaker 1: and it will end and we'll get home. That was

1397
01:05:28,880 --> 01:05:31,080
Speaker 1: a low point, and I think you always have to

1398
01:05:31,160 --> 01:05:33,800
Speaker 1: just admit that you'll always have your low points, and

1399
01:05:34,080 --> 01:05:36,680
Speaker 1: then it can be quite empowering to go all right,

1400
01:05:36,800 --> 01:05:40,240
Speaker 1: that's what rock Bottom was. Cool's let's find a way

1401
01:05:40,320 --> 01:05:43,720
Speaker 1: up from there, and don't be afraid of failing or

1402
01:05:43,840 --> 01:05:47,480
Speaker 1: feeling like you're struggling, because that's the human experience and

1403
01:05:48,000 --> 01:05:49,200
Speaker 1: you'll learn from it and you'll be better.

1404
01:05:49,280 --> 01:05:51,360
Speaker 2: It was so interesting because even in our show, I

1405
01:05:51,400 --> 01:05:54,080
Speaker 2: think it was twelve days or something, including our Drake

1406
01:05:54,120 --> 01:05:57,280
Speaker 2: Passage sailing, there were moments where, for absolutely no reason,

1407
01:05:57,400 --> 01:05:59,560
Speaker 2: like we had really good we had a really rough

1408
01:05:59,600 --> 01:06:01,320
Speaker 2: drap pass it on the way back, but really smooth

1409
01:06:01,360 --> 01:06:03,520
Speaker 2: on the way over, and still nothing, No one was

1410
01:06:03,920 --> 01:06:07,360
Speaker 2: in actual danger. I still had moments where I was

1411
01:06:07,400 --> 01:06:09,640
Speaker 2: so remote, just your brain getting used to it all,

1412
01:06:09,640 --> 01:06:11,680
Speaker 2: where I was like, I'm going to die, like this

1413
01:06:11,800 --> 01:06:14,440
Speaker 2: is really scary and I can't come home, let alone.

1414
01:06:14,560 --> 01:06:18,080
Speaker 2: If I was in winter when there's no light, you're

1415
01:06:18,120 --> 01:06:20,080
Speaker 2: just not used to that. And as an Australian. We

1416
01:06:20,160 --> 01:06:23,680
Speaker 2: just never have that. And then you're stuck, literally stuck

1417
01:06:23,800 --> 01:06:26,440
Speaker 2: being told you can't come home, Like I can't imagine.

1418
01:06:26,480 --> 01:06:29,960
Speaker 2: Did you have fear around that of like, oh my god,

1419
01:06:30,000 --> 01:06:32,840
Speaker 2: like I'm almost like claustrophobia even though you're in a

1420
01:06:32,840 --> 01:06:33,320
Speaker 2: big space.

1421
01:06:33,840 --> 01:06:36,400
Speaker 1: I never had any fears or doubts that we wouldn't

1422
01:06:36,440 --> 01:06:39,560
Speaker 1: make it through. Yeah, okay, it was around what's this

1423
01:06:39,640 --> 01:06:41,600
Speaker 1: going to look like at the end. Yeah, my one

1424
01:06:41,680 --> 01:06:43,880
Speaker 1: goal and the goal of everyone was get everyone home

1425
01:06:43,920 --> 01:06:47,880
Speaker 1: safely just became the goal. And besides all the other

1426
01:06:47,920 --> 01:06:50,560
Speaker 1: scientific research, all that other stuff, it's just get everyone

1427
01:06:50,560 --> 01:06:53,440
Speaker 1: home safely. That's it. That's the bar. If you achieve that,

1428
01:06:53,840 --> 01:06:56,360
Speaker 1: you've done your job. You've done your job. It's not

1429
01:06:56,360 --> 01:06:57,840
Speaker 1: going to be pretty. You're not all going to be

1430
01:06:57,840 --> 01:07:00,240
Speaker 1: friends at the end of it. And I had to

1431
01:07:00,320 --> 01:07:02,280
Speaker 1: give up on that and that as a leader. That's

1432
01:07:02,280 --> 01:07:04,720
Speaker 1: something I think you asked a little bit earlier about

1433
01:07:04,720 --> 01:07:07,400
Speaker 1: imposter syndrome, some of those things as a leader, making

1434
01:07:07,440 --> 01:07:10,800
Speaker 1: my peace with being unpopular or just not being able.

1435
01:07:10,560 --> 01:07:11,919
Speaker 2: To everyone to love you.

1436
01:07:12,200 --> 01:07:14,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, that was a moment years ago. You know what,

1437
01:07:15,280 --> 01:07:17,360
Speaker 1: You're just not going to achieve that anymore let it

1438
01:07:17,400 --> 01:07:20,240
Speaker 1: go and I could have maybe a better leader could

1439
01:07:20,280 --> 01:07:23,000
Speaker 1: have done it better and all come home as absolute

1440
01:07:23,080 --> 01:07:25,800
Speaker 1: best friends. But I just I felt that wasn't at

1441
01:07:25,800 --> 01:07:30,320
Speaker 1: all got to be and accepting that and going but

1442
01:07:30,360 --> 01:07:32,160
Speaker 1: it doesn't matter if you get everyone home, get everyone

1443
01:07:32,200 --> 01:07:35,760
Speaker 1: home safely, and most pretty much everyone's still in touch

1444
01:07:35,800 --> 01:07:37,200
Speaker 1: in some way.

1445
01:07:37,360 --> 01:07:38,480
Speaker 2: Oh that's so nice.

1446
01:07:38,640 --> 01:07:40,720
Speaker 1: And more than half the group have actually either been

1447
01:07:40,800 --> 01:07:45,200
Speaker 1: back or still involved in the Antarctic program in some way.

1448
01:07:45,360 --> 01:07:47,120
Speaker 1: So I think that was testament to that. As tough

1449
01:07:47,120 --> 01:07:49,840
Speaker 1: as it was for everyone, when more than half the group.

1450
01:07:49,560 --> 01:07:55,800
Speaker 2: Are voluntarily going back there, it wasn't that bad.

1451
01:07:56,600 --> 01:07:58,720
Speaker 1: And so that was that was part of it that

1452
01:07:58,800 --> 01:08:01,680
Speaker 1: helps you get through just the darkness of like, all right,

1453
01:08:01,760 --> 01:08:04,640
Speaker 1: this is this is so I wasn't fearful. I was

1454
01:08:04,920 --> 01:08:09,920
Speaker 1: worried at times about what like reintegrating home. That became

1455
01:08:10,120 --> 01:08:12,600
Speaker 1: a worry of far out what do we all do

1456
01:08:12,720 --> 01:08:14,800
Speaker 1: after this? We'd all signed up to go away for

1457
01:08:14,840 --> 01:08:18,679
Speaker 1: a year, but you know, a year and a half change,

1458
01:08:18,680 --> 01:08:20,840
Speaker 1: and you kind of then you rebuild your comfort zone.

1459
01:08:20,880 --> 01:08:23,720
Speaker 1: So then you've got that Stockholm syndrome of and you know,

1460
01:08:24,080 --> 01:08:26,800
Speaker 1: how do I now reintegrate into the world, and a

1461
01:08:26,840 --> 01:08:28,639
Speaker 1: lot of people went out of the group, went back

1462
01:08:28,640 --> 01:08:32,000
Speaker 1: and changed careers. And you'd argue that when you've signed

1463
01:08:32,040 --> 01:08:33,920
Speaker 1: up for a year in our tart, your other career

1464
01:08:33,960 --> 01:08:34,839
Speaker 1: probably wasn't.

1465
01:08:34,920 --> 01:08:36,200
Speaker 2: Your top priority.

1466
01:08:37,880 --> 01:08:39,720
Speaker 1: You probably has pretty good stats that you're going to

1467
01:08:39,760 --> 01:08:42,400
Speaker 1: change careers. But for me, it was that was a

1468
01:08:42,479 --> 01:08:45,000
Speaker 1: daunting experience of what am I going to do when

1469
01:08:45,000 --> 01:08:46,840
Speaker 1: I get home? Do I want to go back to

1470
01:08:46,840 --> 01:08:49,320
Speaker 1: what I was doing? Do I want to work with

1471
01:08:49,320 --> 01:08:52,479
Speaker 1: the entireic program more? And that that becomes a challenge,

1472
01:08:52,479 --> 01:08:54,479
Speaker 1: and I probably am a bit of a day dream

1473
01:08:54,479 --> 01:08:57,680
Speaker 1: and I think that'll always help you get through your

1474
01:08:57,760 --> 01:09:01,160
Speaker 1: dark moments and your fears of going well, well, yeap,

1475
01:09:01,280 --> 01:09:04,280
Speaker 1: crossing the drake passage on a rough day, that's that's

1476
01:09:04,320 --> 01:09:07,000
Speaker 1: pretty yeah, I've done that, and yeah, you're right, you

1477
01:09:07,040 --> 01:09:09,599
Speaker 1: go geez if if something is wrong with the.

1478
01:09:09,520 --> 01:09:12,920
Speaker 2: Boat we are rolling, Yeah.

1479
01:09:13,120 --> 01:09:15,599
Speaker 1: I remember that I did it on a sixty three

1480
01:09:15,600 --> 01:09:19,000
Speaker 1: foot yacht. We were like and the change to the

1481
01:09:19,040 --> 01:09:20,760
Speaker 1: captain about him like, well, what happens if someone goes

1482
01:09:20,800 --> 01:09:24,680
Speaker 1: overboard here? He's like, He's like, you're gone, mate? Is

1483
01:09:24,680 --> 01:09:27,000
Speaker 1: a my ability to even turn the yacht around? He's

1484
01:09:27,000 --> 01:09:29,760
Speaker 1: like would compromise the whole yacht. So well, we'll throw

1485
01:09:29,800 --> 01:09:32,360
Speaker 1: you a life ring and hope you drift.

1486
01:09:32,160 --> 01:09:36,240
Speaker 2: North, hope for the best. Well, then this is the thing,

1487
01:09:36,360 --> 01:09:39,800
Speaker 2: like you're reading the book was so interesting because you're

1488
01:09:39,840 --> 01:09:43,800
Speaker 2: reading it as a participant in this experience, but also

1489
01:09:43,840 --> 01:09:46,280
Speaker 2: through the person who is the leader of that experience.

1490
01:09:46,320 --> 01:09:49,640
Speaker 2: So and in Antargaga, it's so unique because you're like

1491
01:09:49,720 --> 01:09:51,800
Speaker 2: the legal leader as well. You're not just on a

1492
01:09:51,840 --> 01:09:55,640
Speaker 2: school camp where you're kind of in charge nominally, but

1493
01:09:55,680 --> 01:09:58,120
Speaker 2: then there's like the police, and then there's like the government.

1494
01:09:58,280 --> 01:10:01,759
Speaker 2: You're in this like ungoverned territory that doesn't belong to anyone,

1495
01:10:01,800 --> 01:10:04,880
Speaker 2: where you literally are making big legal calls at a

1496
01:10:04,880 --> 01:10:07,519
Speaker 2: time when there's no precedent for this. Like you're the

1497
01:10:07,600 --> 01:10:09,880
Speaker 2: messenger for all the shit news as well, And then

1498
01:10:10,000 --> 01:10:12,439
Speaker 2: you can't be best friends with everyone because like that

1499
01:10:12,560 --> 01:10:14,599
Speaker 2: dude who just quit halfway through and was like, I'm

1500
01:10:14,600 --> 01:10:17,400
Speaker 2: stuck here, but I'm quitting. The fact that you came

1501
01:10:17,439 --> 01:10:19,680
Speaker 2: out at the end and people have wanted to go

1502
01:10:19,760 --> 01:10:22,519
Speaker 2: back is a huge testament to your ability to lead,

1503
01:10:22,560 --> 01:10:25,720
Speaker 2: which is incredible. But I love that you brought up

1504
01:10:25,760 --> 01:10:28,280
Speaker 2: the idea of reintegration because I again on like the

1505
01:10:28,520 --> 01:10:34,400
Speaker 2: smallest level after twelve days of pure simplicity, like the

1506
01:10:34,439 --> 01:10:37,080
Speaker 2: basics of life, no Wi Fi. We didn't have Wi

1507
01:10:37,160 --> 01:10:40,680
Speaker 2: Fi at all, the starlink wasn't working, and just immersion

1508
01:10:40,720 --> 01:10:42,920
Speaker 2: in nature and waking up with light and going to

1509
01:10:42,960 --> 01:10:46,680
Speaker 2: sleep with dark and eating when like, just everything was

1510
01:10:46,760 --> 01:10:51,639
Speaker 2: so basic and simple in a complicated way, but blocking

1511
01:10:51,640 --> 01:10:53,200
Speaker 2: out the rest of the noise of the world. I

1512
01:10:53,360 --> 01:10:55,360
Speaker 2: did not like coming back. I was like, I just

1513
01:10:55,400 --> 01:10:58,360
Speaker 2: want to go back and live on a ship and

1514
01:10:58,600 --> 01:10:59,920
Speaker 2: live in Antarctic.

1515
01:10:59,479 --> 01:11:02,400
Speaker 1: Or and just be nature and the simple life. You

1516
01:11:02,439 --> 01:11:05,479
Speaker 1: don't need all of the stuff we create around ourselves here.

1517
01:11:05,560 --> 01:11:07,760
Speaker 1: You start to go, I don't need that.

1518
01:11:07,920 --> 01:11:09,599
Speaker 2: Was it hard for you to come home? Then?

1519
01:11:10,160 --> 01:11:13,519
Speaker 1: It was really the hardest part coming home, I found

1520
01:11:13,760 --> 01:11:17,160
Speaker 1: was telling the story, understanding what on Earth had gone on,

1521
01:11:17,360 --> 01:11:20,040
Speaker 1: And that was weird. Everyone had this idea of like, oh, geez,

1522
01:11:20,040 --> 01:11:21,760
Speaker 1: you were lucky you missed out on twenty twenty. You know,

1523
01:11:21,840 --> 01:11:23,840
Speaker 1: you were stuck in Antarctica, Like what, And I'm like,

1524
01:11:23,920 --> 01:11:28,320
Speaker 1: do you have any idea? It's pretty rough down there, man.

1525
01:11:28,920 --> 01:11:31,920
Speaker 1: But I also then realized it's about people's perception. So

1526
01:11:32,400 --> 01:11:35,760
Speaker 1: there were some people never I never ever discount how

1527
01:11:35,840 --> 01:11:38,320
Speaker 1: hard it was for people to get through the last

1528
01:11:38,320 --> 01:11:40,400
Speaker 1: couple of years of COVID, but even just get through life.

1529
01:11:40,520 --> 01:11:43,559
Speaker 1: Like everyone's struggle in their own everyone's their own first

1530
01:11:43,560 --> 01:11:48,720
Speaker 1: person narrative, and some people's struggles are just insane for

1531
01:11:48,840 --> 01:11:51,600
Speaker 1: a whole range of reasons. And so you see this

1532
01:11:51,640 --> 01:11:54,160
Speaker 1: a bit around PTSD. It's not just someone that was

1533
01:11:54,560 --> 01:11:57,839
Speaker 1: in the middle of the last days of carble and

1534
01:11:57,880 --> 01:12:00,360
Speaker 1: fighting over the walls to get to plane and getting

1535
01:12:00,360 --> 01:12:03,200
Speaker 1: shot into. Yeah, that's probably going to put you on

1536
01:12:03,200 --> 01:12:05,360
Speaker 1: the spectrum, but there can be a whole range of

1537
01:12:05,400 --> 01:12:07,560
Speaker 1: other things that can give you elements of trauma and

1538
01:12:08,080 --> 01:12:10,240
Speaker 1: that you don't realize. And that's when trauma can really

1539
01:12:10,280 --> 01:12:12,160
Speaker 1: hurt you, as if you haven't acknowledged it and realized it.

1540
01:12:12,200 --> 01:12:14,720
Speaker 1: So for me, when I got back, understanding what had

1541
01:12:14,720 --> 01:12:17,160
Speaker 1: happened back here was tough, but taking some time to

1542
01:12:17,200 --> 01:12:20,439
Speaker 1: myself to just almost lock myself in my cave, run

1543
01:12:20,479 --> 01:12:23,720
Speaker 1: about my house and not socialize and not really get

1544
01:12:23,760 --> 01:12:27,400
Speaker 1: out there. And it took a few months to really

1545
01:12:28,439 --> 01:12:31,160
Speaker 1: really make the decision and start putting pen to paper

1546
01:12:31,160 --> 01:12:33,439
Speaker 1: with the book. And when it I had a couple

1547
01:12:33,439 --> 01:12:35,360
Speaker 1: of publishers chasing me, and I knew I was on

1548
01:12:35,840 --> 01:12:37,519
Speaker 1: a story that was that was going to get a

1549
01:12:37,520 --> 01:12:39,759
Speaker 1: book deal, which was quite empowering me. Like, Okay, great,

1550
01:12:40,080 --> 01:12:42,000
Speaker 1: I'll get it. I'll get a good deal out of this,

1551
01:12:42,080 --> 01:12:45,000
Speaker 1: and unless I've really stuff it up, it should sell

1552
01:12:45,000 --> 01:12:45,639
Speaker 1: pretty well.

1553
01:12:47,360 --> 01:12:49,679
Speaker 2: And be therapeutic for you almost in the process.

1554
01:12:49,840 --> 01:12:52,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's exactly what I was going to say. So

1555
01:12:52,280 --> 01:12:56,000
Speaker 1: the person I wrote the book for the first draft,

1556
01:12:56,080 --> 01:12:59,080
Speaker 1: I wrote for myself, and I love to just write

1557
01:12:59,120 --> 01:13:01,320
Speaker 1: the story, to get the story down. Of whether or

1558
01:13:01,320 --> 01:13:04,960
Speaker 1: not it works commercially became a secondary element to because

1559
01:13:04,960 --> 01:13:06,840
Speaker 1: you have the public publisher who Affirm Press did a

1560
01:13:06,880 --> 01:13:09,080
Speaker 1: great job and was so easy to work with and

1561
01:13:09,120 --> 01:13:12,320
Speaker 1: gave me so much freedom or autonomy for an unknown author,

1562
01:13:12,360 --> 01:13:14,320
Speaker 1: which was great as well, But in so many ways

1563
01:13:14,320 --> 01:13:16,080
Speaker 1: they wanted it to be like Jack Ryan goes to

1564
01:13:16,280 --> 01:13:18,920
Speaker 1: entire Yeah.

1565
01:13:18,000 --> 01:13:19,799
Speaker 2: And you're like, yeah, I'll play into that or whatever.

1566
01:13:20,200 --> 01:13:22,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm like sure, And that's why you can see

1567
01:13:22,240 --> 01:13:25,200
Speaker 1: elements in the book that it has a bit of that,

1568
01:13:25,280 --> 01:13:27,400
Speaker 1: but it has to be commercially successful as well.

1569
01:13:27,439 --> 01:13:30,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, And it was true. Some of those operations, like

1570
01:13:30,360 --> 01:13:34,439
Speaker 2: the evacuating medical evacuation. I was like, that's a movie.

1571
01:13:34,640 --> 01:13:37,200
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that was one of the moments because people

1572
01:13:37,200 --> 01:13:39,080
Speaker 1: do that when you decide to write the book. I'm like, yeah,

1573
01:13:39,080 --> 01:13:41,760
Speaker 1: we did the medical evacuation on Christmas twenty twenty, using

1574
01:13:41,800 --> 01:13:44,240
Speaker 1: the Chinese and American programs to help us there. And

1575
01:13:44,280 --> 01:13:46,240
Speaker 1: that was like a two week operation, working around the

1576
01:13:46,240 --> 01:13:49,280
Speaker 1: clock right on the on Christmas for a Christmas miracles

1577
01:13:49,280 --> 01:13:53,400
Speaker 1: and it had everything. It's got helicopters, it's got tension,

1578
01:13:53,400 --> 01:13:56,120
Speaker 1: it's got drama, it's got medical problems.

1579
01:13:55,760 --> 01:13:58,719
Speaker 2: And like international cooperation. I was like, oh my god.

1580
01:14:00,080 --> 01:14:02,720
Speaker 1: Briefing the Chinese pilots was so much fun because we

1581
01:14:02,760 --> 01:14:04,479
Speaker 1: had to do it under COVID protocols as well, so

1582
01:14:05,360 --> 01:14:09,439
Speaker 1: I've laminated like giant meteorological charts and all these like

1583
01:14:09,479 --> 01:14:12,000
Speaker 1: photos that normally would use a PowerPoint in the briefing room,

1584
01:14:12,000 --> 01:14:14,920
Speaker 1: but we had to do it outside with masters, so

1585
01:14:15,640 --> 01:14:18,080
Speaker 1: outside like minus ten degrees. Luck, it wasn't that windy,

1586
01:14:18,120 --> 01:14:21,400
Speaker 1: but briefing these pilots using like hand signals and broken English,

1587
01:14:21,479 --> 01:14:23,839
Speaker 1: and it was just like, this is the coolest aviation

1588
01:14:23,960 --> 01:14:26,360
Speaker 1: briefing ever in.

1589
01:14:26,320 --> 01:14:27,720
Speaker 2: The history of humanity.

1590
01:14:27,960 --> 01:14:30,680
Speaker 1: All the most ridiculous. It was just it was so

1591
01:14:31,160 --> 01:14:34,799
Speaker 1: and the Chinese pilots were freaking unreal and spoke great,

1592
01:14:34,840 --> 01:14:36,559
Speaker 1: pretty good. Well, they spoke a lot better English than

1593
01:14:36,600 --> 01:14:39,479
Speaker 1: I did Mandarin, for one, And that was just this

1594
01:14:39,560 --> 01:14:41,720
Speaker 1: cool moment. And then watching that helicopter take off and

1595
01:14:42,040 --> 01:14:44,360
Speaker 1: take the team up to the runway that that'd spend

1596
01:14:44,360 --> 01:14:46,320
Speaker 1: a week in land building the runway before we could

1597
01:14:46,360 --> 01:14:49,840
Speaker 1: even evacuate the patient. But watching that helicopter fly off

1598
01:14:50,040 --> 01:14:52,920
Speaker 1: kind of into the sunset was one of the moments

1599
01:14:52,920 --> 01:14:57,400
Speaker 1: I'm like, jeez, this is getting pretty movie, yesque, yeah,

1600
01:14:57,439 --> 01:15:01,360
Speaker 1: this is getting there. And then and then later on,

1601
01:15:01,520 --> 01:15:03,680
Speaker 1: like as I get another spoiler alert, and then there's a

1602
01:15:03,680 --> 01:15:05,360
Speaker 1: photo of it in the book anyway, and it's mentioned

1603
01:15:05,400 --> 01:15:08,400
Speaker 1: in the forward. But so halfway home, the whole thing's over.

1604
01:15:08,439 --> 01:15:10,559
Speaker 1: Like day five hundred and twenty eight or something like that,

1605
01:15:10,640 --> 01:15:13,200
Speaker 1: fifth of April ten fifty eight in the morning, the

1606
01:15:13,240 --> 01:15:14,919
Speaker 1: ship has a catastrophic explosion.

1607
01:15:15,080 --> 01:15:16,960
Speaker 2: This is a fire on your rescue ship.

1608
01:15:17,479 --> 01:15:21,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, we just like everyone there in the ship, disabled,

1609
01:15:21,160 --> 01:15:23,920
Speaker 1: rocking side to side in the Southern Ocean, standing there

1610
01:15:23,920 --> 01:15:26,559
Speaker 1: with life jackets on, ready to abandon ship. And we

1611
01:15:26,600 --> 01:15:29,080
Speaker 1: stood there for kind of hours while they fought the fire,

1612
01:15:29,200 --> 01:15:31,720
Speaker 1: got it under control, and then eventually six hours later

1613
01:15:31,800 --> 01:15:34,719
Speaker 1: got the ship restarted on one engine and then toned

1614
01:15:34,720 --> 01:15:39,760
Speaker 1: to fremantle. And I'm like in that moment, standing in

1615
01:15:39,800 --> 01:15:42,519
Speaker 1: the forecastle of the ship, ready like next to the lifeboats,

1616
01:15:42,560 --> 01:15:45,439
Speaker 1: ready to abandon ship, but everyone around you just looking

1617
01:15:45,439 --> 01:15:48,160
Speaker 1: into the distance, like thousand yards stairs just going in

1618
01:15:48,360 --> 01:15:52,160
Speaker 1: every direction of just like just like like this is

1619
01:15:52,160 --> 01:15:53,960
Speaker 1: how it ends. We have to abandon ship, Like you're

1620
01:15:54,600 --> 01:15:57,680
Speaker 1: kidding me. I'm like, this is definitely going to get

1621
01:15:57,720 --> 01:15:58,839
Speaker 1: me a book deal.

1622
01:15:58,680 --> 01:16:01,240
Speaker 2: And James Cameron should make movie, just saying.

1623
01:16:01,600 --> 01:16:04,519
Speaker 1: Well, I kind of want because I've had a couple

1624
01:16:04,520 --> 01:16:06,640
Speaker 1: of meetings that started to get towards okay, how do

1625
01:16:06,680 --> 01:16:10,040
Speaker 1: I TV actually do? Yeah, well, I'd want to get

1626
01:16:10,080 --> 01:16:12,639
Speaker 1: like Tykle with t and Chris hanswith Tiger.

1627
01:16:13,080 --> 01:16:14,479
Speaker 2: That'd be amazing, I know.

1628
01:16:14,560 --> 01:16:16,479
Speaker 1: I just don't know how I'm about to get them.

1629
01:16:16,920 --> 01:16:19,160
Speaker 2: We're actually friends with the Hamsweth so we can, well,

1630
01:16:19,200 --> 01:16:21,320
Speaker 2: we can make the imagine being like I want Chris

1631
01:16:21,320 --> 01:16:22,120
Speaker 2: Hamsweth to play me.

1632
01:16:22,240 --> 01:16:23,880
Speaker 1: Well I do, and I've said that and he just

1633
01:16:23,920 --> 01:16:26,600
Speaker 1: does and people just laugh at me. I'm like, I

1634
01:16:26,680 --> 01:16:29,000
Speaker 1: really love it. Who else would do it?

1635
01:16:30,720 --> 01:16:34,839
Speaker 2: You definitely have some humor and drama injected into it exactly.

1636
01:16:34,920 --> 01:16:36,760
Speaker 1: I think other classics of people are like, oh maybe

1637
01:16:36,760 --> 01:16:42,000
Speaker 1: Sam Worthington. I'm like, maybe if we can't get a Hemsworth.

1638
01:16:41,680 --> 01:16:44,080
Speaker 2: I bet young knew at done true. Never thought you'd

1639
01:16:44,080 --> 01:16:46,640
Speaker 2: be picking Hollywood stars to actually maybe play you in

1640
01:16:46,720 --> 01:16:51,160
Speaker 2: a in a like epic, a Hollywood epic about the adventure.

1641
01:16:51,600 --> 01:16:55,559
Speaker 1: No, but why not? I mean why not? Dream? This

1642
01:16:55,600 --> 01:16:57,519
Speaker 1: is the same with the book deal. There was there

1643
01:16:57,560 --> 01:16:59,880
Speaker 1: was people that said, I know books, no one reads

1644
01:16:59,880 --> 01:17:03,400
Speaker 1: it anymore than the like you'll be you're such a wanker,

1645
01:17:03,640 --> 01:17:08,519
Speaker 1: like what like you know, like it's so funny. You

1646
01:17:08,600 --> 01:17:10,800
Speaker 1: probably get this with podcasting and other and the stuff,

1647
01:17:10,840 --> 01:17:13,000
Speaker 1: you know, like people like the haters or the trolls.

1648
01:17:13,720 --> 01:17:17,120
Speaker 1: It's the worst part of our society. But Jesus hard

1649
01:17:17,160 --> 01:17:17,639
Speaker 1: to ignore.

1650
01:17:17,800 --> 01:17:21,120
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, Tall Poppy in Australia's Wow, it's.

1651
01:17:21,120 --> 01:17:24,200
Speaker 1: Rough And I've had a few people kind of go

1652
01:17:24,320 --> 01:17:25,640
Speaker 1: hard on it and they're like, oh, I how did

1653
01:17:25,760 --> 01:17:27,360
Speaker 1: why did you think you had the right to write

1654
01:17:27,400 --> 01:17:29,400
Speaker 1: that book. I'm like, what's the true story mate? Like,

1655
01:17:29,479 --> 01:17:32,080
Speaker 1: and it actually happened. It happened, and it was vetted

1656
01:17:32,080 --> 01:17:35,000
Speaker 1: by a number of My team helped with fact checking

1657
01:17:35,040 --> 01:17:39,240
Speaker 1: stuff and making sure I didn't over state different things

1658
01:17:39,360 --> 01:17:42,160
Speaker 1: or like got that right, got that checked by the experts, checked,

1659
01:17:42,160 --> 01:17:45,320
Speaker 1: the logs checked, my diaries checked foight, like it's it's

1660
01:17:45,360 --> 01:17:47,680
Speaker 1: as accurate as it can be. And they're like, oh,

1661
01:17:47,840 --> 01:17:49,320
Speaker 1: you know I've done more than you. I don't have

1662
01:17:49,320 --> 01:17:54,240
Speaker 1: a book. And I'm like, we'll go right, well, I'm

1663
01:17:54,280 --> 01:17:56,599
Speaker 1: not stopping you, and and that sort of Look there

1664
01:17:56,640 --> 01:17:59,320
Speaker 1: they are one percent and we've sold nearly fourteen thousand copies.

1665
01:18:00,560 --> 01:18:01,360
Speaker 2: You're a bestseller.

1666
01:18:01,640 --> 01:18:03,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, bestseller. It was the top in the top ten

1667
01:18:04,880 --> 01:18:09,840
Speaker 1: best selling Australian autobiographies last year. That's amazing, which is

1668
01:18:09,920 --> 01:18:12,599
Speaker 1: just incredible. And and so you go, okay, and one

1669
01:18:12,640 --> 01:18:13,759
Speaker 1: guy was like, you were a wenker.

1670
01:18:13,920 --> 01:18:15,960
Speaker 2: He's the loudest though they're always the loudest.

1671
01:18:16,120 --> 01:18:20,640
Speaker 1: Other thirteen thousand people I do the reading reviews and

1672
01:18:20,680 --> 01:18:23,320
Speaker 1: getting fan mail and stuff. It is, that's pretty cool.

1673
01:18:23,360 --> 01:18:26,800
Speaker 1: But I find that. But yet, when so anyone out

1674
01:18:26,840 --> 01:18:28,920
Speaker 1: there listening that that does want to write a book

1675
01:18:29,000 --> 01:18:31,080
Speaker 1: or do something that someone's telling you not to do,

1676
01:18:31,800 --> 01:18:33,680
Speaker 1: forget about them and speak to someone that's done it

1677
01:18:33,720 --> 01:18:38,599
Speaker 1: because every author I spoke to said nothing other than

1678
01:18:38,640 --> 01:18:41,719
Speaker 1: like best thing you'll ever do. Like they were super supportive.

1679
01:18:41,760 --> 01:18:44,680
Speaker 1: That was super helpful with like who to speak to

1680
01:18:44,800 --> 01:18:47,280
Speaker 1: and how to structure things, and then same with like

1681
01:18:47,360 --> 01:18:49,400
Speaker 1: do we go down the path of trying to get

1682
01:18:49,400 --> 01:18:51,160
Speaker 1: a movie deal out of it? And that, and yeah,

1683
01:18:51,160 --> 01:18:52,760
Speaker 1: there's some people like, oh, you're such a wanker for

1684
01:18:52,760 --> 01:18:56,080
Speaker 1: thinking that. I'm like, yeah, but why not? Like it's

1685
01:18:56,080 --> 01:18:59,640
Speaker 1: sold enough copies, it's a great true story and you

1686
01:18:59,680 --> 01:19:01,479
Speaker 1: can just see it. You're like, yeah, why not. I

1687
01:19:01,479 --> 01:19:03,920
Speaker 1: mean it might take twenty years or thirties, I'll never

1688
01:19:03,960 --> 01:19:06,599
Speaker 1: get done and just another project, but you go give

1689
01:19:06,640 --> 01:19:07,000
Speaker 1: it a shot.

1690
01:19:07,040 --> 01:19:07,519
Speaker 2: Why not?

1691
01:19:07,960 --> 01:19:10,640
Speaker 1: I think that's something again, Like I'd never written a

1692
01:19:10,640 --> 01:19:14,320
Speaker 1: book before, and I thought, maybe get a ghost write.

1693
01:19:14,320 --> 01:19:15,800
Speaker 1: I'm like, no, I'll just learn how to write a book.

1694
01:19:15,800 --> 01:19:17,960
Speaker 1: So probably like there's a how to write a book

1695
01:19:18,120 --> 01:19:22,519
Speaker 1: book behind you, behind me there somewhere, and how to author. Yeah.

1696
01:19:22,520 --> 01:19:25,280
Speaker 1: It was a fun process to go, Okay, Well, I'll

1697
01:19:25,320 --> 01:19:29,200
Speaker 1: just reread like my ten favorite books that are adventury kind,

1698
01:19:29,280 --> 01:19:32,519
Speaker 1: like things like inter Thinner, Yeah to zero and these

1699
01:19:32,520 --> 01:19:35,120
Speaker 1: sorts of bings. Go Okay, I'll read them and look

1700
01:19:35,160 --> 01:19:37,360
Speaker 1: at them through the lens of how they structured, yeah,

1701
01:19:37,400 --> 01:19:39,960
Speaker 1: the photo bit in the middle and all that stuff,

1702
01:19:40,280 --> 01:19:43,040
Speaker 1: and then start writing and then just get better and better.

1703
01:19:43,080 --> 01:19:44,800
Speaker 1: And some of the early drafts are terrible. I think

1704
01:19:44,840 --> 01:19:48,519
Speaker 1: my brother, who is really helpful, his feedback of the

1705
01:19:48,520 --> 01:19:52,559
Speaker 1: first draft, He's like, well, it's a good story, you

1706
01:19:52,680 --> 01:19:53,559
Speaker 1: just haven't told it.

1707
01:19:53,600 --> 01:19:57,639
Speaker 2: Well, you're just telling it shit. Yeah, I mean honest

1708
01:19:57,800 --> 01:20:01,240
Speaker 2: advice is very so good.

1709
01:20:01,280 --> 01:20:03,120
Speaker 1: And then the best I love this story. So there's

1710
01:20:03,160 --> 01:20:04,280
Speaker 1: a thank you in the back of the book. I

1711
01:20:04,280 --> 01:20:05,840
Speaker 1: haven't been able to track he Daniel a thank you

1712
01:20:05,880 --> 01:20:07,639
Speaker 1: in the book to someone, to a girl called Coco

1713
01:20:08,080 --> 01:20:10,840
Speaker 1: who worked at the office works right near my house.

1714
01:20:10,880 --> 01:20:14,200
Speaker 1: Because every this process of writing where every Friday I'd

1715
01:20:14,240 --> 01:20:17,120
Speaker 1: print out the current draft or the chapters that I've

1716
01:20:17,160 --> 01:20:19,200
Speaker 1: been working on, and then i'd review it, read petted

1717
01:20:19,240 --> 01:20:20,800
Speaker 1: over the weekend, and then we got back to Monday

1718
01:20:20,840 --> 01:20:24,040
Speaker 1: morning I'd start rewriting. And so every week I was

1719
01:20:24,080 --> 01:20:27,200
Speaker 1: in there dropping off, you know, behind masks, behind plastic screens,

1720
01:20:27,280 --> 01:20:30,559
Speaker 1: dropping off the books. But then one day she kind

1721
01:20:30,560 --> 01:20:32,800
Speaker 1: of goes, is this you or like behind my own

1722
01:20:33,360 --> 01:20:37,920
Speaker 1: I'm like, this is this your own book. I'm like yeah,

1723
01:20:37,920 --> 01:20:39,719
Speaker 1: she's like I was. I was like, do you mind

1724
01:20:39,720 --> 01:20:41,960
Speaker 1: if I print my own copy and or have a

1725
01:20:42,080 --> 01:20:44,080
Speaker 1: read And I'm like yeah, one hundred percent. So she

1726
01:20:44,600 --> 01:20:46,200
Speaker 1: and I'm like, but give me, give me some feedback.

1727
01:20:46,240 --> 01:20:47,439
Speaker 1: She's like, yeah, for sure. And she was the first

1728
01:20:47,479 --> 01:20:49,559
Speaker 1: person to read the book that didn't know me, which

1729
01:20:49,600 --> 01:20:52,639
Speaker 1: was really cool. But then Roman's great book report on

1730
01:20:53,280 --> 01:20:55,479
Speaker 1: what was good was what didn't work or how to

1731
01:20:55,720 --> 01:20:58,880
Speaker 1: so lovely of her and it was so good. So yeah,

1732
01:20:58,920 --> 01:21:00,240
Speaker 1: she gets she got to thank you in the the

1733
01:21:00,240 --> 01:21:03,880
Speaker 1: book and has a very early raw draft of it

1734
01:21:04,200 --> 01:21:06,599
Speaker 1: as well, and that was something. And I'm like, oh,

1735
01:21:06,600 --> 01:21:10,280
Speaker 1: that's that's cool. If the random office works photocopy of it,

1736
01:21:10,479 --> 01:21:13,840
Speaker 1: loves it, loves it, who would see a lot of

1737
01:21:13,920 --> 01:21:16,519
Speaker 1: I'm sure they see a lot of mediocre books that

1738
01:21:16,560 --> 01:21:18,080
Speaker 1: they have to print. So that was that was kind

1739
01:21:18,080 --> 01:21:19,519
Speaker 1: of a cool story. But so again, that's sort of

1740
01:21:19,560 --> 01:21:21,600
Speaker 1: to people that if you're worried about then't just go

1741
01:21:21,640 --> 01:21:24,720
Speaker 1: and learn learn about it, think about it, and then

1742
01:21:25,200 --> 01:21:27,479
Speaker 1: back yourself in to go and any Again, this kind

1743
01:21:27,479 --> 01:21:29,600
Speaker 1: of comes back with my law of physics quote, like

1744
01:21:29,760 --> 01:21:32,599
Speaker 1: anything that humans do is a learned skill. No one

1745
01:21:32,680 --> 01:21:35,360
Speaker 1: was born knowing how to do all the things we

1746
01:21:35,439 --> 01:21:38,599
Speaker 1: know how to do the learned skills. NASA only takes

1747
01:21:38,640 --> 01:21:40,360
Speaker 1: like twenty four months to train astronauts. You know, they

1748
01:21:40,360 --> 01:21:43,919
Speaker 1: obviously that with degrees and shit, but their core astronauts

1749
01:21:43,960 --> 01:21:44,840
Speaker 1: training is like, what do you need to.

1750
01:21:44,800 --> 01:21:46,200
Speaker 2: Be an astronaut? Degrees and shit?

1751
01:21:46,520 --> 01:21:49,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, degrees and shit. Yeah some of them. I mean,

1752
01:21:49,320 --> 01:21:54,479
Speaker 1: these overachievers just calm down with some of their stuff.

1753
01:21:54,520 --> 01:22:00,080
Speaker 2: But dear astronauts, calm down. Calm down, it says the

1754
01:22:00,120 --> 01:22:04,559
Speaker 2: ex defense diplomat Antarctic Expedition leader author speaker.

1755
01:22:04,720 --> 01:22:07,559
Speaker 1: Hey yeah, but I just have an arts degree.

1756
01:22:07,680 --> 01:22:09,760
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, true. But you also I did find one

1757
01:22:09,760 --> 01:22:11,080
Speaker 2: other fun fact when you were like, I don't have

1758
01:22:11,080 --> 01:22:14,160
Speaker 2: any awards, and like, didn't you win like some silver

1759
01:22:14,320 --> 01:22:18,000
Speaker 2: medal for like performed skydiving in Dubai.

1760
01:22:18,560 --> 01:22:20,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, that was a skyliven compatation.

1761
01:22:20,680 --> 01:22:26,639
Speaker 2: It's like Australian Defense Medal diving skyd.

1762
01:22:26,520 --> 01:22:30,920
Speaker 1: I could see that twelve skyd off Dubai freestyle.

1763
01:22:32,960 --> 01:22:35,599
Speaker 2: But I mean, you are a wonderful, wonderful example, and

1764
01:22:35,640 --> 01:22:37,720
Speaker 2: I love that you brought up that whole haters controlling

1765
01:22:37,760 --> 01:22:40,960
Speaker 2: thing that no matter what you do, even if it's

1766
01:22:41,000 --> 01:22:43,640
Speaker 2: the coolest story ever, Like, there will always be the

1767
01:22:43,680 --> 01:22:46,800
Speaker 2: small percentage of people who just resent your success, and

1768
01:22:46,880 --> 01:22:48,840
Speaker 2: they're always the loudest, They're always the ones that are

1769
01:22:48,880 --> 01:22:52,840
Speaker 2: impossible to ignore. But if you let them dictate your decisions,

1770
01:22:52,920 --> 01:22:56,920
Speaker 2: then literally the fifteen thousand and that's only the people

1771
01:22:56,960 --> 01:22:58,640
Speaker 2: you know who bought the book let alone, who it

1772
01:22:58,720 --> 01:23:01,760
Speaker 2: was passed on to it, Like every copy gets read,

1773
01:23:01,960 --> 01:23:05,760
Speaker 2: you know, a million times, and if you had let

1774
01:23:05,840 --> 01:23:08,040
Speaker 2: one person who was loud dictate that that you would

1775
01:23:08,040 --> 01:23:10,240
Speaker 2: have deprived all of those people of the story that

1776
01:23:10,280 --> 01:23:14,240
Speaker 2: they wanted to hear. And like it's it's absolutely fascinating,

1777
01:23:14,280 --> 01:23:16,960
Speaker 2: and I think we are too controlled by what other

1778
01:23:17,000 --> 01:23:19,559
Speaker 2: people think listen to the loudest voice is not the

1779
01:23:19,560 --> 01:23:23,080
Speaker 2: most important ones and miss out on so many opportunities

1780
01:23:23,120 --> 01:23:25,280
Speaker 2: that way. Whereas it's become your career. Now you're on

1781
01:23:25,320 --> 01:23:27,280
Speaker 2: the speaking circuit, you have a book, you've got the

1782
01:23:27,280 --> 01:23:30,559
Speaker 2: potential for a movie which would absolutely blow the big

1783
01:23:30,600 --> 01:23:34,040
Speaker 2: screen away. Like I think it's just it's almost a

1784
01:23:34,080 --> 01:23:36,760
Speaker 2: sign that you've made it when someone is invested enough

1785
01:23:36,760 --> 01:23:38,639
Speaker 2: in what you're doing to be a hater, Like that's

1786
01:23:38,640 --> 01:23:40,120
Speaker 2: all you have to think of it as is, pat

1787
01:23:40,120 --> 01:23:42,080
Speaker 2: myself on the back. I'm going to hate I'm made.

1788
01:23:42,360 --> 01:23:44,120
Speaker 1: That is a great way to look at it, Like, wow,

1789
01:23:44,160 --> 01:23:47,400
Speaker 1: I've got trolls and haters. You're like made it, I'm famous.

1790
01:23:47,560 --> 01:23:50,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, Like that's how I see it. I'm like,

1791
01:23:50,439 --> 01:23:53,439
Speaker 2: the minute I had someone who was passionate enough to

1792
01:23:53,560 --> 01:23:57,200
Speaker 2: express their dislike, I was like, shit, man, that's impact.

1793
01:23:57,520 --> 01:23:59,679
Speaker 2: Negative impact, but it's still impact.

1794
01:24:00,080 --> 01:24:02,959
Speaker 1: I love the one that when you're flying to Hobart,

1795
01:24:02,960 --> 01:24:06,080
Speaker 1: like Mona the Gallery, they've got all their billboards, they

1796
01:24:06,120 --> 01:24:08,120
Speaker 1: just have all the bad reviews. Yes.

1797
01:24:08,800 --> 01:24:11,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, you're never going to please everyone anyway, that's not

1798
01:24:11,760 --> 01:24:13,320
Speaker 2: the point. I feel like, if you stood for everything,

1799
01:24:13,320 --> 01:24:16,920
Speaker 2: you'd stood for nothing. So well, I have already taken

1800
01:24:17,000 --> 01:24:19,040
Speaker 2: up so much of your time and I could talk

1801
01:24:19,040 --> 01:24:20,880
Speaker 2: to you. I mean, obviously we could talk for hours.

1802
01:24:20,880 --> 01:24:22,920
Speaker 2: This is like our third hour of just chatting shit

1803
01:24:22,920 --> 01:24:26,080
Speaker 2: about life. But I will let you get on with

1804
01:24:26,120 --> 01:24:28,200
Speaker 2: the rest of your day. But where can people find

1805
01:24:28,240 --> 01:24:31,599
Speaker 2: the book? Where can people find you if they want

1806
01:24:31,640 --> 01:24:34,519
Speaker 2: to engage you for leadership speaking, because I know that's

1807
01:24:34,520 --> 01:24:36,760
Speaker 2: something you're incredibly good at. Where can they find you?

1808
01:24:36,960 --> 01:24:38,720
Speaker 1: Yeah? So the books five hundred and thirty seven days

1809
01:24:38,720 --> 01:24:41,439
Speaker 1: of winter. It's in all good bookstores around the Australian

1810
01:24:41,439 --> 01:24:43,719
Speaker 1: newsales and a lot of the airport bookstores. It seems

1811
01:24:43,720 --> 01:24:46,160
Speaker 1: to be very well stopped there. Those otherwise online through

1812
01:24:46,600 --> 01:24:49,360
Speaker 1: book Topia or whoever you like to use there or

1813
01:24:49,360 --> 01:24:51,479
Speaker 1: a lot of little community libraries. Anytime I stuff up

1814
01:24:51,479 --> 01:24:56,040
Speaker 1: a signature, I put one in a community library. I

1815
01:24:56,080 --> 01:24:58,040
Speaker 1: stuff up a lot of signatures for someone that wrote

1816
01:24:58,040 --> 01:24:58,360
Speaker 1: a book.

1817
01:24:58,439 --> 01:25:01,599
Speaker 2: Is there one in the Davis Library, Davistation Library, they.

1818
01:25:01,560 --> 01:25:03,080
Speaker 1: Are in the Australian at tytic state. I don't know

1819
01:25:03,080 --> 01:25:04,920
Speaker 1: that there's a few. And there's one on the ship

1820
01:25:04,920 --> 01:25:07,479
Speaker 1: that was supposed to bring me home amazing, so they

1821
01:25:07,479 --> 01:25:10,320
Speaker 1: are down if you're on an attactic station, grab a copy.

1822
01:25:10,439 --> 01:25:13,479
Speaker 1: Otherwise for speaking, Yeah, through my website www dot david

1823
01:25:13,520 --> 01:25:16,400
Speaker 1: off dot com, or through Saxton Speakers who do a

1824
01:25:16,400 --> 01:25:19,479
Speaker 1: great job book me out and everything. And yeah, and

1825
01:25:19,640 --> 01:25:22,080
Speaker 1: I'd love to love to come and chat to companies

1826
01:25:22,080 --> 01:25:25,720
Speaker 1: and schools and different community groups about anything from either

1827
01:25:25,760 --> 01:25:27,160
Speaker 1: just telling the story of orders like to run an

1828
01:25:27,160 --> 01:25:31,440
Speaker 1: antatic station during a pandemic, or around my mental health strategies,

1829
01:25:31,560 --> 01:25:35,280
Speaker 1: leadership experiences. Leadership training for junior leaders is probably one

1830
01:25:35,280 --> 01:25:37,360
Speaker 1: of my favorite workshops to run is to get out

1831
01:25:37,400 --> 01:25:40,280
Speaker 1: there with people that want to start their leadership journey

1832
01:25:40,280 --> 01:25:41,960
Speaker 1: and they don't quite know where it's going to take them,

1833
01:25:42,000 --> 01:25:44,719
Speaker 1: and that's that's always great to get some young minds

1834
01:25:44,760 --> 01:25:46,960
Speaker 1: and all right, careful what you wish for?

1835
01:25:49,080 --> 01:25:51,040
Speaker 2: Well, I'll include the direct links to all of that

1836
01:25:51,120 --> 01:25:53,400
Speaker 2: in the show notes for anyone who's interested, which I'm

1837
01:25:53,400 --> 01:25:56,120
Speaker 2: sure will be everyone we've already had. Literally it was

1838
01:25:56,120 --> 01:25:57,680
Speaker 2: like a teaser and people like, who is he?

1839
01:25:57,880 --> 01:25:58,360
Speaker 1: Where can I.

1840
01:25:58,320 --> 01:26:01,040
Speaker 2: Get his book? God, this is very exciting, so I

1841
01:26:01,040 --> 01:26:03,040
Speaker 2: will share all that. Thank you so much for sharing

1842
01:26:03,120 --> 01:26:05,599
Speaker 2: your story. I wish we could do like a full

1843
01:26:05,680 --> 01:26:07,680
Speaker 2: Joe Ragan five hour episode because I would have just

1844
01:26:07,760 --> 01:26:10,040
Speaker 2: kept chatting, but I'll make sure everyone gets their copy

1845
01:26:10,040 --> 01:26:14,000
Speaker 2: of the book instead. And good luck this summer. Wish

1846
01:26:14,000 --> 01:26:15,720
Speaker 2: I was coming with you, going to be.

1847
01:26:15,760 --> 01:26:17,920
Speaker 1: It's going to be good chaos, I think this summer.

1848
01:26:17,960 --> 01:26:19,880
Speaker 1: But now, thanks so much for Amian. I was cracked out.

1849
01:26:20,080 --> 01:26:22,200
Speaker 1: I could chat to you for hours as well, So

1850
01:26:22,400 --> 01:26:24,240
Speaker 1: best to like with it with the podcast and what's

1851
01:26:24,240 --> 01:26:25,080
Speaker 1: in your future as well.

1852
01:26:25,240 --> 01:26:28,920
Speaker 2: Thank you Jeers, what a man, what an adventure. I

1853
01:26:29,040 --> 01:26:32,439
Speaker 2: highly recommend you read David's book, and as mentioned, I'll

1854
01:26:32,439 --> 01:26:35,000
Speaker 2: pop the direct link with his speaking links and website

1855
01:26:35,040 --> 01:26:38,120
Speaker 2: as well into the show notes. Please do show him

1856
01:26:38,120 --> 01:26:40,400
Speaker 2: some love for squeezing us he into his busy schedule

1857
01:26:40,439 --> 01:26:42,360
Speaker 2: before he heads back down south. I think even in

1858
01:26:42,400 --> 01:26:45,759
Speaker 2: a couple of days, by sharing the episode and tagging

1859
01:26:45,840 --> 01:26:48,880
Speaker 2: at five hundred and thirty seven days of Winter. If

1860
01:26:48,880 --> 01:26:52,000
Speaker 2: you enjoyed listening along In the meantime, I hope you're

1861
01:26:52,040 --> 01:26:55,360
Speaker 2: all having an amazing week and are seizing your yay.

1862
01:27:01,840 --> 01:27:06,519
Speaker 1: What think? Yeah,