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Speaker 1: You're listening to a Muma Mia podcast. Mamma Mia acknowledges

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Speaker 1: the traditional owners of the land and waters that this

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Speaker 1: podcast is recorded.

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Speaker 2: On Hello, we are here. You asked for this out louders,

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Speaker 2: so here we are for real life IRL, so welcome,

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Speaker 2: Welcome fan. This is Parenting out Loud. This is the

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Speaker 2: podcast for parents who don't always listen to parenting podcasts.

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Speaker 2: We're just doing things a little bit differently, so we

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Speaker 2: read everything in parenting culture and trends so you don't

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Speaker 2: have to. So if you're thinking about it, we're going

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Speaker 2: to talk about it. I'm Monique Bowli. You might remember

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Speaker 2: me from very early days of Mumma Mea out Loud.

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Speaker 2: I went and I had some kids and now I'm

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Speaker 2: back slatting it up on the podcast again.

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Speaker 1: Welcome back one, Thank you. I'm Amelia Laster. I am

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Speaker 1: a magazine editor, which is funny because a young person

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Speaker 1: recently asked me what a magazine was and I just

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Speaker 1: wept silently. And I'm Stacy Higgs. I'm their deputy editor

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Speaker 1: of Mum and Maya. I also should mention I do

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Speaker 1: have a child as well, a glorious little four year old,

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Speaker 1: so here I Am.

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Speaker 2: On today's show, there.

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Speaker 1: Is a new reason why young people are saying no

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Speaker 1: to being parents, And a famous man said some beautiful

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Speaker 1: words about being a dad and the internet frothed it,

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Speaker 1: but not all of us did.

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Speaker 2: Plus how often do you text other parents? From mid

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Speaker 2: play date photos to post birthday party photos? Are parents

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Speaker 2: just texting each other way too much?

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Speaker 1: And if you have a third kid, if you want

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Speaker 1: a third kid, if you look at other people with

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Speaker 1: a third kid and think, oh boy, we found the

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Speaker 1: most perfect metaphor for the third child on the internet

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Speaker 1: this week. Once you hear it, you won't be able

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Speaker 1: to unhear it.

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Speaker 2: But first, people lost their minds over a very different

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Speaker 2: kind of sports highlight. It wasn't sort of a game

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Speaker 2: winning kick or like a big moment. It was a

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Speaker 2: teenage boy crying. Archie Wilson, who's nineteenth, fresh out of

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Speaker 2: Melbourne and chasing his dream playing college football in Nebraska,

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Speaker 2: a long way from home, and he was talking at

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Speaker 2: a press conference and he completely broke down when he

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Speaker 2: started talking about missing his mum and his dad and

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Speaker 2: his two little brothers.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I got two little brothers and a moment dad. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: that's the tough part about being here. I love them

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Speaker 3: a lot and I miss them, but it's a I mean,

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Speaker 3: they know this is what's best for me, and it's

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Speaker 3: I can still talk to them plenty of the phone,

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Speaker 3: and they're coming here to see the first first few games,

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Speaker 3: so I'm looking forward to that. Thanks cool, Thanks guys, Minor.

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Speaker 2: Oh my god, I could not have loved this anymore.

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Speaker 1: Initial reactions, I absolutely loved it, Like this is the

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Speaker 1: gold standard. This is where you want your kids to

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Speaker 1: get to, where they're this polite and courteous and kind

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Speaker 1: to the journalists afterwards, It's just gorgeous.

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Speaker 2: The emotional range Amelia, like from the softboy energy of

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Speaker 2: like missing his family and then just snapping into complete

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Speaker 2: manners mode.

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Speaker 1: It was so lovely. It also really made me reflect

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Speaker 1: on my own experience left Australia for the US when

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Speaker 1: I was eighteen to pursue my football dreams, and when

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Speaker 1: I got over there, that's true, not the college football part.

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Speaker 1: I never thought about how hard that was for my parents,

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Speaker 1: and now I look back on it and it must

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Speaker 1: be like losing a limb. So I see Archie, and

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Speaker 1: I see the obvious bond that he has with his

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Speaker 1: parents and I just can't help but pour one out

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Speaker 1: for Archie's parents here and thinking about the sacrifices that

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Speaker 1: they've made for him to pursue his dream. It's really beautiful.

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Speaker 2: But also in the way that they've parented him that

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Speaker 2: he feels like, okay, enough about showing his emotions like this,

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Speaker 2: because that was largely the retrick around this. On the internet,

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Speaker 2: the major themes were Wow, like, his parents have done

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Speaker 2: such a good job, look at this fine young man.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, they were the real heroes, weren't they. Like they

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Speaker 1: must be so toughed. Can you imagine them sitting back

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Speaker 1: being like, yes, yes, we did. I don't know if they.

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Speaker 2: Might be sitting back going oh, like feeling guilty, tearing

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Speaker 2: at the heart strings.

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Speaker 1: Maybe. I just think that there's no way that you

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Speaker 1: can't watch that and know that she is loved and

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Speaker 1: that he loves his parents. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: The other big thing people were saying on the internet,

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Speaker 2: which was super encouraging, was we have to protect this

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Speaker 2: guy at all costs, Like real men cry. This vulnerability

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Speaker 2: is strength, and people responded in droves to this tender

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Speaker 2: teen moment, especially in a culture of football, and seems

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Speaker 2: very sort of marcho It took about ten seconds for

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Speaker 2: this to go farral. It now has around ten million

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Speaker 2: views and there's all manner of people commenting, like Chris

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Speaker 2: Hemsworth fifty eight million followers, thank you very much. Like

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Speaker 2: even the official Blue account hopped onto this and said,

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Speaker 2: you do he great mate?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, he's become like a national hero now, hasn't he?

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Speaker 1: Like all of the champion Aussies are shouting him out.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: I even saw a comment from Jenna Lyons, she's sort

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Speaker 2: of the general fashion icon, real housewife of New York,

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Speaker 2: and she was in the comments loving it too.

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Speaker 1: I love Jennal Lions. She always looks amazing And it's

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Speaker 1: interesting because she's been sort of pushing us to think

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Speaker 1: about what it is to be a boy or a

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Speaker 1: man for some time now. Back when she was the

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Speaker 1: creative director at j Crue, when that was the fashion

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Speaker 1: label that Michelle Obama wore, it was like the hottest

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Speaker 1: label in America. There was a J Crew catalog that

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Speaker 1: came out and it showed Jenna painting the nails of

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Speaker 1: her son, of her young son, and there was all

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Speaker 1: this predictable and ridiculous outrage. How can she be painting

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Speaker 1: her son's nails. And her answer was just because it

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Speaker 1: looks nice and because he wants to.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, says law there with her, I guess yeah, Like

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Speaker 2: this clip has transcended sport, fashion, kids TV. It's just

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Speaker 2: it's everywhere.

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Speaker 1: In case you missed it, we all need to calm

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Speaker 1: the fuck down about protein. Oh good, okay, you have

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Speaker 1: four permission. That's a message that was in a great

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Speaker 1: article in The Cut this week about how the high

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Speaker 1: protein craze has now taken over our toddlers. No, the

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Speaker 1: cottage cheese has come through our topus. Now. I am

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Speaker 1: very happy that this message has come through. As someone

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Speaker 1: who spent one hundred and fifty dollars once on a

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Speaker 1: baby lead weaning guide, we've all done that. Sorry. What

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Speaker 1: was the format of this guide? It wasn't even a

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Speaker 1: real book. It was like a PDF form. But I

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Speaker 1: got got it and then I downloaded it.

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Speaker 2: So I did the same thing. You get tired, you

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Speaker 2: get desperate.

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Speaker 1: Sleep deprivation does crazy shit.

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Speaker 2: H And these brands come they know you're tired, Yeah,

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Speaker 2: come in, They're like, I will solve your problems. You

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Speaker 2: will pay any amount of money.

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Speaker 1: I downloaded it to my phone and then I didn't

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Speaker 1: know how to access the downloads, and I never actually

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Speaker 1: used it. So this is good for me. This is

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Speaker 1: the messaging is basically just to care less. So in

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Speaker 1: the article, Erica Spegenhausen spoke to a recipe developer and

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Speaker 1: a dietitian and they both said that when they post

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Speaker 1: recipes that are marketed as high protein, even for babies,

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Speaker 1: that it goes off. Everyone engages with it, everyone downloads it,

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Speaker 1: wants to cook it. When there's fiber, nothing crickets. No

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Speaker 1: one cares about fiber anymore.

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Speaker 2: Fiber has a massive pr problem, Like how can we

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Speaker 2: help them? Are big Lentil and be Fan just sitting

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Speaker 2: around the conference table being like, guys, everyone's about protein

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Speaker 2: or protein things. They're so good.

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Speaker 1: What about us?

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Speaker 2: How are we going to get our message out there?

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Speaker 1: But here's the problem with fiber. I was told by

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Speaker 1: my GP to start putting sillium husk on my porridge

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Speaker 1: in the mornings, and so I bought the silium husk

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Speaker 1: and it comes in this big packet and it literally

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Speaker 1: says on its scromptious silium husk, And I'm like, don't

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Speaker 1: know if it sell it. Yes, it tastes like sawdust and

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Speaker 1: it makes you poop.

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Speaker 2: Policy.

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Speaker 1: I feel like the universe is telling me this week

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Speaker 1: to just not worry about what I'm feeding my kids,

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Speaker 1: because I did read a quote from Jennifer Ghana this week,

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Speaker 1: and look, anyone who's negotiating co parenting with Ben Affleck

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Speaker 1: already deserves a medal in my book. And she said,

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Speaker 1: kids don't care, families don't care, no one cares. Just

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Speaker 1: make it. Just make for food. And I want that

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Speaker 1: on one of those you know, those neon signs that

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Speaker 1: in the two thousands were in like really rich people's

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Speaker 1: homes and they always like had them in the kitchen.

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Speaker 1: I need one of those neon signs in my flat

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Speaker 1: that says, stop putting, just don just make us make it.

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Speaker 1: There's a book that multiple friends of mine have all

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Speaker 1: of a sudden been swearing by, and I'm curious whether

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Speaker 1: you've heard about it. It's called Adult Children of Emotionally

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Speaker 1: Immature Parents. Ever heard of it?

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Speaker 2: Yeah?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, People love this book, and it's not just anecdotal.

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Speaker 1: There was a New York Times article in December of

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Speaker 1: last year about how this book that published ten years

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Speaker 1: ago has been surging in popularity. It's sold one point

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Speaker 1: two million copies. Its biggest year of sales was last year,

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Speaker 1: so something's up. A lot of people think that they

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Speaker 1: are the adult children of emotionally immature parents. Look, it's

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Speaker 1: bioclinical psychologist. The cover copy says it's about parents who

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Speaker 1: have difficulty regulating their emotions, which immediately made me feel

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Speaker 1: really worried that my children are going to read that

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Speaker 1: book when they grow up, because doesn't everyone have difficulty

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Speaker 1: regulating their emotions. But the reason it's spiked, the publisher says,

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Speaker 1: is TikTok. There's a whole wave of content around this

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Speaker 1: idea of family estrangement. On TikTok, call it traumatok. There

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Speaker 1: are hashtags like inner child, healing, childhood wounds, and some

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Speaker 1: signs that you've experienced childhood trauma at the hands of

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Speaker 1: your parents. According to these videos, let me run you

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Speaker 1: through them. You're a people pleaser. You jiggle your legs,

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Speaker 1: people call you an old soul. You procrastinate, you have

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Speaker 1: a hard time asking for help. This is the human

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Speaker 1: conditioning human. This is and maybe having too much coffee,

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Speaker 1: bit leg jiggling. It is a real thing that in

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Speaker 1: the last couple of years, family estrangement has seem to

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Speaker 1: really rise in prominence and popularity.

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Speaker 2: Okay, so we're seeing more of it in social media.

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Speaker 2: Does the data back it up.

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Speaker 1: Yes. There's a psychologist who's quoted in a New Yorker

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Speaker 1: article on this topic who puts the rate of parental

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Speaker 1: estrangement in the US at about thirty percent, and he

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Speaker 1: says that it's probably much higher than that, because that's

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Speaker 1: just people who are answering a survey and being prepared

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Speaker 1: to share that information. And he says that that's much

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Speaker 1: higher than it used to be. And the question is why,

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Speaker 1: And the question is does this have anything to do

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Speaker 1: with our extremely low fertility rates? Let me explain. Michelle Liebowitz,

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Speaker 1: who is a ne York Times writer, has a theory.

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Speaker 1: She says that millennials are not having children, and the

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Speaker 1: reason why is that they think it seems too hard.

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Speaker 1: They think that parenting is too hard. They have all

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Speaker 1: these ideas about how their own parents screwed them up,

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Speaker 1: and they don't want to make those same mistakes, so

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Speaker 1: they're opting out of it entirely. And I think that

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Speaker 1: has the ring of truth to it. I saw a

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Speaker 1: Reddit throat the other day that said, in a generation's time,

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Speaker 1: what are going to be the complaints about our parenting,

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Speaker 1: and some of the answers were gentle parenting that just

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Speaker 1: makes you into a parental doormat, like giving in too much,

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Speaker 1: basically being overprotective, not letting children walk home from school,

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Speaker 1: making them stay at home until they're old enough to

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Speaker 1: vote practically, and not being allowed to go out at night.

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Speaker 1: Or balder parance. That was another really popular answer. Bulldozer

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Speaker 1: parents who bulldoze every obstacle out of their way. I'm

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Speaker 1: really curious if you think that this idea that the

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Speaker 1: over therapization that is a word I just made up,

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Speaker 1: the over therapization of our culture is in part leading

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Speaker 1: to this reluctance to have kids.

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Speaker 2: Interesting theory. It's not the only thing. I mean, there's

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Speaker 2: cost of living, there's work life balance, there's access to childcare,

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Speaker 2: there's all of these other factors, mainly crushing cost of

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Speaker 2: living and housing and job insecurity. But what an interesting

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Speaker 2: theory that takes it beyond that into actually therapy culture.

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Speaker 2: I think therapy culture has has a lot to answer for.

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Speaker 2: It has been great in so many ways. Opening up

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Speaker 2: discussions about mental health is always going to be a

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Speaker 2: good thing, but it's not without its downsides, and I

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Speaker 2: want to talk about I just want to put on

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Speaker 2: the table the idea about friction in relationships for a minute.

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Speaker 2: So I follow this culture analyst, I guess, and he

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Speaker 2: was talking recently about how life is very frictionless for

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Speaker 2: us now that tech companies have made all these apps

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Speaker 2: so that we don't have to experience much discomfort anymore,

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Speaker 2: so that when we do experience it, it feels very jarring

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Speaker 2: to us, and we're not resilient enough to handle it.

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Speaker 2: So there is this stress response I guess, where people

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Speaker 2: will just flee in an uncomfortable situation. Now, that is to say,

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Speaker 2: estrangement is obviously important for so many, like there would

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Speaker 2: be abuse and toxic relationships, and that's fine, But what

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Speaker 2: you're talking about now merely is like this middle ground

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Speaker 2: where people just feel uncomfortable about a relationship and so

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Speaker 2: we'll estrange themselves from their parents. And I think we're

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Speaker 2: very quick to remove friction now from our lives or

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Speaker 2: not be able to sit with it. So is therapy

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Speaker 2: culture making all of our relationships feel impossible to maintain

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Speaker 2: because I think also when.

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Speaker 1: You because it's holding us to impossible standards.

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Speaker 2: Completely and it's bleeding into friendships. So once upon a

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Speaker 2: time you might have had a friend that was a

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Speaker 2: bit for and you'd roll your eyes and you'd be like, oh,

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Speaker 2: come on, get it together. But now you say, no,

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Speaker 2: these are my boundaries and you're toxic and I'm cutting

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Speaker 2: you out of my life. And like in work culture too,

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Speaker 2: I was a manager before I sat behind this microphone,

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Speaker 2: and there's certainly as a manager now you have to

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Speaker 2: have such a responsibility to be emotionally literate. Like there's

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Speaker 2: lots of healing and affirming and trauma proofing that you

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Speaker 2: have to do in the workplace. So is therapy culture.

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Speaker 2: As you said, Amelia, I'm making our relationships hard to maintain.

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Speaker 1: And also just making it feel like parenting is an

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Speaker 1: impossible task, like making people feel like, well, I could

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Speaker 1: never have children because I can never be the perfect

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Speaker 1: parent that i'd want to be. But I think that's

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Speaker 1: just the volume of information there is now. Like I know,

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Speaker 1: when I had my daughter and was struggling in the

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Speaker 1: newborn days, I had this conversation with my mum where

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Speaker 1: she was like, well, it's just that you've got too

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Speaker 1: many answers. Now, you've got too many options She was like,

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Speaker 1: when I did it, I just had to figure it out.

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Speaker 1: And that was kind of just her kind way of

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Speaker 1: being like, can you stop reading about weight windows and

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Speaker 1: just put your baby to sleep when they seem tired?

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Speaker 1: Like you are making this so hard for yourself. And

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Speaker 1: I think I had never even really thought about how

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Speaker 1: I was parented until I became a parent and started

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Speaker 1: getting all these TikTok videos that you speak of, Like

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Speaker 1: I get them come up in my algorithm all the time,

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Speaker 1: saying are you a chronic people pleaser who can sense

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Speaker 1: the you know, the atmosphere change when people's moods change

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Speaker 1: in the room. And I was like, yeah, I can,

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Speaker 1: But I don't think that's my parent's fault. I think

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Speaker 1: that's just my personality type. Like I think I'm just

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Speaker 1: conscious of wanting everyone to be having a nice time.

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Speaker 1: That's not something that they necessarily did wrong.

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Speaker 2: Stacey, have you had therapy before?

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Speaker 1: I only did after having my daughter, so very short

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Speaker 1: amount of sessions after having.

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Speaker 2: It, do you remember, like what one of the first

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Speaker 2: questions I asked you was.

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Speaker 1: It was about my parents. It was all about the

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Speaker 1: dynamic of my parents and almost withholding from me, Ah

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Speaker 1: I've sussed this, and we're going to get to why

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Speaker 1: you're struggling with this now.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I hear that, like one of the first questions

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Speaker 2: you'll get asked in therapy. If you can afford it

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Speaker 2: to go and have it, Please tell me about your childhood,

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Speaker 2: tell me about how you were parented. And so I

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Speaker 2: don't think this is new. We are not the first

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Speaker 2: generation to agonize about having kids or to blame parents

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Speaker 2: for any psychological wobble like I think our parents were. Also,

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Speaker 2: they probably didn't have the language of the words around it,

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Speaker 2: but parents have them too.

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Speaker 1: So fertility rates are at an all time low. So

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Speaker 1: millennials are on track to be the generation with the

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Speaker 1: least children in recorded history. And one point that's made

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Speaker 1: in this article is that when you have children, you

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Speaker 1: suddenly forgive your parents for all their perceived shortcomings because

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Speaker 1: you're like, oh, yeah, this is really hard. Yeah that's true,

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Speaker 1: and I'm just struggling to do. I find myself saying

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Speaker 1: to my children a line that I heard to write

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Speaker 1: my childhood, which is I'm doing the very best I can,

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Speaker 1: and why don't you appreciate the work I'm doing for you?

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Speaker 1: And all of these lines are coming out of me

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Speaker 1: because now I see that they're in fact true. I'm

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Speaker 1: doing the best I can. Why can't you appreciate all

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Speaker 1: the work I'm doing for you? When you have children,

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Speaker 1: you realize that that's true. But if you don't have children,

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Speaker 1: you don't realize that's true. And I wonder if there's

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Speaker 1: a chicken and egg element here, is that what's contributing

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Speaker 1: to these really high rates of family estrangement too, because

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Speaker 1: people are not having that experience of, oh wait, my

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Speaker 1: parents are just human, just like everyone else. Another reason

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Speaker 1: I think that therapy could be contributing to more people

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Speaker 1: choosing to be child free is that there is so

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Speaker 1: much more language now around our partners and the bad

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Speaker 1: behaviors they might have. So you might be able to

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Speaker 1: now recognize when someone is a narcissist, or when someone

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Speaker 1: is gaslighting you, or when someone's just a bit of

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Speaker 1: a douche, and you might choose not to procreate with

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Speaker 1: them for that reason.

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Speaker 2: I don't think you necessarily need to have had a child, though,

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Speaker 2: to come to that understanding. So I've had seven years

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Speaker 2: of therapy, I've spent fortune on it. Or save you

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Speaker 2: the time and the.

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Speaker 1: Money, and part therapy.

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Speaker 2: One of the best things that my therapist ever said

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Speaker 2: to me was, what if they were just doing the

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Speaker 2: best they could with the tools they had, And maybe

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Speaker 2: that's the antidote to this therapy culture perfectionism. What if

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Speaker 2: everyone is just doing the best they can.

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Speaker 1: Pretty much everyone is doing the best they can. Apart

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Speaker 1: from the person who didn't let me in when I

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Speaker 1: was trying to turn this morning, Yeah, they should have

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Speaker 1: done better.

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Speaker 2: I've got one to file. Under men talking about their feelings.

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Speaker 2: People love it because this week I saw an absolute scorcher.

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Speaker 2: There was this viral clip on Instagram of the actor

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Speaker 2: Bob Odenkirk.

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Speaker 1: I love him.

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Speaker 2: You know who he is?

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Speaker 1: I don't know. He was in Breaking Bad and the

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Speaker 1: greatest TV show of all time Better Call Saul.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Also like a tough guy, like a rich, cool guy,

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Speaker 1: median but very cool.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, comedian, writer, actor, And he was talking about being

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Speaker 2: a dad.

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Speaker 4: Who are you jealous of anybody who's still got little

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Speaker 4: kids at home growing up? Yeah, there's no question I

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Speaker 4: knew what I was doing when I had kids growing up.

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Speaker 4: I was being a dad. I mean that was my

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Speaker 4: job and I didn't have to ask myself what am

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Speaker 4: I doing here? What am I doing? How can I

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Speaker 4: be a part of this world? How can I be meaningful?

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Speaker 1: Today?

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Speaker 4: I didn't have to ask that question because an answer

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Speaker 4: is pick up everything between here and the door and

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Speaker 4: make sure they get to school and have a laugh

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Speaker 4: with them. Yeah, you know, life was I understood my purpose.

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Speaker 1: That's the answer.

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Speaker 2: Oh so profound, Amelia. You and I had really different

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Speaker 2: reactions to this. We had quite a robust discussion. Tell

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Speaker 2: me what I'm not seeing?

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Speaker 1: Okay, Well, first of all, I do want to reiterate

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Speaker 1: that I love Bob Odenkirk. I mean his voice. He's

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Speaker 1: just got the best voice that said. I did not

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Speaker 1: love this. It made me feel rotten. Let me paint

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Speaker 1: you a picture. Got home from a very long day,

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Speaker 1: had left my flat early in the morning for work.

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Speaker 1: I got back after having dinner with a friend, and

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Speaker 1: I watched this and I thought, oh, I'm doing everything wrong.

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Speaker 1: I didn't even see my children today, these precious moments

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Speaker 1: when they are little, and I'm not spending enough time

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Speaker 1: with them, and I should just be soaking up every

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Speaker 1: bath time and I should never go out to dinner

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Speaker 1: with my friends again because this time is so precious

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Speaker 1: and rare and I'm going to look back and miss

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Speaker 1: these days. And then the spiral of guilt continued and

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00:19:18,685 --> 00:19:21,245
Speaker 1: I couldn't sleep that night. This is a whole genre

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Speaker 1: of guilt content for parents. We're constantly being told how

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Speaker 1: irreplaceable and special these days are, and yet we also know,

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Speaker 1: because we're living them, how hard it is to truly

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Speaker 1: be in the moment with the children when they are

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Speaker 1: pushing your buttons, when they're refusing to get in the bath,

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Speaker 1: when they're refusing to sleep. And this is a whole

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Speaker 1: trend now though, Amelia of parents pushing back on this

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Speaker 1: because good. Yeah, there is this song by Trace Adkins

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Speaker 1: called You're going to Miss this? Have you heard I'll

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Speaker 1: sing a line to you country?

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Speaker 2: Do you want me to sing?

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Speaker 1: Yeah? Actually you've got skills. Can you add a little

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Speaker 1: bit of auto tune for me as well? But he

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Speaker 1: basically goes like, you're gonna make us this, You're gonna

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Speaker 1: want this bag and it's all about how you are

417
00:20:03,365 --> 00:20:09,365
Speaker 1: so talented? Wwang am I a country song? This song

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Speaker 1: is basically all about how you going to want those

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Speaker 1: days back, like you're going to miss this thing that

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Speaker 1: you're in. But now parents have taken it and are

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Speaker 1: using it and overlaying it over their children. Absolutely, So

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Speaker 1: they're using it as they're like forcing their child into

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Speaker 1: their car seat and they won't get in, or when

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Speaker 1: they're like carrying a bike over one shoulder and their

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Speaker 1: child over another shoulder back to the car. So they're

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Speaker 1: kind of saying like, that's so nice of you to

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Speaker 1: say once you're out of that season of your life,

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Speaker 1: but when you're in it, this is what it looks like,

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Speaker 1: and I'm not going to miss it. I'm not going

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Speaker 1: to miss this exact part.

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Speaker 2: Okay, So why did you like it? Well, it's so

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Speaker 2: interesting what you said about your reaction to it. It's

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Speaker 2: like when you go to a psychiatrist and they held

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00:20:48,165 --> 00:20:50,285
Speaker 2: up the ink pictures and you say, I see this,

435
00:20:54,645 --> 00:20:56,405
Speaker 2: that's not at all what I saw. Yeah, I'll tell

436
00:20:56,405 --> 00:20:59,085
Speaker 2: you what I saw. I actually thought, because I do

437
00:20:59,125 --> 00:21:01,965
Speaker 2: love Bob Odenkirk as well, but I watched this and

438
00:21:02,005 --> 00:21:07,605
Speaker 2: I thought the bar is so low culturally for men

439
00:21:07,725 --> 00:21:10,764
Speaker 2: in the parenting space, like are we so starved of

440
00:21:10,885 --> 00:21:14,965
Speaker 2: good men and good dads that when Bob Odenkirk says

441
00:21:15,005 --> 00:21:18,685
Speaker 2: something that millions of mothers know or say every day,

442
00:21:19,165 --> 00:21:21,405
Speaker 2: that the internet faints with sort of how profound and

443
00:21:21,445 --> 00:21:24,405
Speaker 2: beautiful it is. And nothing against Bob od Kirk, nothing

444
00:21:24,445 --> 00:21:27,484
Speaker 2: against great fathers. It's so important we see them. I

445
00:21:27,525 --> 00:21:30,524
Speaker 2: feel like if a mum said this firstly, it's not

446
00:21:30,565 --> 00:21:32,564
Speaker 2: going to go viral, and it's just going to be

447
00:21:32,605 --> 00:21:36,564
Speaker 2: filed under like a obvious like scroll past. I just wonder.

448
00:21:37,245 --> 00:21:39,005
Speaker 2: I don't know men with feelings on the Internet. People

449
00:21:39,005 --> 00:21:40,885
Speaker 2: seem to really frothy in a way that I think

450
00:21:41,405 --> 00:21:43,365
Speaker 2: maybe we are starved of this kind of content.

451
00:21:43,445 --> 00:21:46,405
Speaker 1: But I think we've got to check ourselves on that reaction.

452
00:21:46,685 --> 00:21:50,605
Speaker 1: Because the other night, during these precious moments with my

453
00:21:50,925 --> 00:21:54,605
Speaker 1: very young children, I completely wasted my evening by listening

454
00:21:54,605 --> 00:21:57,925
Speaker 1: to a podcast interview with US Vice President J d Vance.

455
00:21:58,445 --> 00:22:00,605
Speaker 1: Now why did I do this, I don't know. But

456
00:22:00,885 --> 00:22:04,045
Speaker 1: he was being interviewed by an interviewer who was interested

457
00:22:04,085 --> 00:22:06,965
Speaker 1: in how he's balancing being vice president with being the

458
00:22:07,045 --> 00:22:08,165
Speaker 1: father to three child. Oh.

459
00:22:08,245 --> 00:22:10,085
Speaker 2: Someone actually asked him that that's.

460
00:22:09,965 --> 00:22:13,965
Speaker 1: Great, okay, but she's a conservative podcast influencer. And I

461
00:22:14,085 --> 00:22:18,844
Speaker 1: found that my instinctive reaction was annoyance. Why because I

462
00:22:18,925 --> 00:22:21,044
Speaker 1: had to unpack it. He was talking about how he

463
00:22:21,125 --> 00:22:23,925
Speaker 1: and his wife, Usha Vance liked to take the kids

464
00:22:24,005 --> 00:22:26,925
Speaker 1: on his overseas trips in his capacity as vice president,

465
00:22:27,365 --> 00:22:29,925
Speaker 1: and how it's sometimes difficult when they're stepping off the

466
00:22:30,005 --> 00:22:32,764
Speaker 1: presidential plane to get the kids to not have a

467
00:22:32,805 --> 00:22:34,925
Speaker 1: tantrum when the world's cameras are on them, and when

468
00:22:34,965 --> 00:22:38,205
Speaker 1: they're about to meet you know, Emmanuel Macron in France.

469
00:22:38,645 --> 00:22:40,925
Speaker 1: I just like saying his name, to be honest, But

470
00:22:41,085 --> 00:22:43,205
Speaker 1: I really had to figure out why I was annoyed.

471
00:22:43,285 --> 00:22:44,845
Speaker 1: First of all, I think I was annoyed because I

472
00:22:44,965 --> 00:22:48,845
Speaker 1: find JD. Vance himself personally annoying. But then I had

473
00:22:48,885 --> 00:22:51,365
Speaker 1: to stop and think, it's actually kind of great that

474
00:22:51,445 --> 00:22:54,085
Speaker 1: this person who I may not agree with politically, who

475
00:22:54,125 --> 00:22:57,244
Speaker 1: was on the other side of a fence politically, is

476
00:22:57,525 --> 00:23:01,885
Speaker 1: trying to talk about integrating children not just into his

477
00:23:02,005 --> 00:23:05,445
Speaker 1: professional life but into public life, going on a state

478
00:23:05,525 --> 00:23:08,205
Speaker 1: trip and saying, I'm bringing my children along because these

479
00:23:08,285 --> 00:23:11,765
Speaker 1: children shouldn't just be my part responsibility. But I want

480
00:23:11,805 --> 00:23:13,965
Speaker 1: you to explain why I was annoyed why.

481
00:23:14,005 --> 00:23:16,004
Speaker 2: It might just be that you're confusing the political with

482
00:23:16,045 --> 00:23:17,445
Speaker 2: the emotional maybe, or it.

483
00:23:17,405 --> 00:23:20,085
Speaker 1: Could be that we automatically think that men who talk

484
00:23:20,125 --> 00:23:21,725
Speaker 1: about parenting are show voting.

485
00:23:22,045 --> 00:23:24,565
Speaker 2: If I was a PR agent, if I was managing

486
00:23:24,645 --> 00:23:26,965
Speaker 2: some celebrities, I would be saying to them, say, I'm

487
00:23:27,165 --> 00:23:29,885
Speaker 2: managing Ryan Reynolds. You know he's got a bit of ick.

488
00:23:30,085 --> 00:23:32,244
Speaker 2: There's a bit of a stink about him. I'd say, Ryan,

489
00:23:32,685 --> 00:23:35,805
Speaker 2: go on a podcast and talk about get emotional about

490
00:23:35,805 --> 00:23:39,004
Speaker 2: being a father, show some vulnerability, because there's nothing the

491
00:23:39,085 --> 00:23:41,405
Speaker 2: internet loves more than that. Right now, there's nothing the

492
00:23:41,445 --> 00:23:44,165
Speaker 2: culture loves more than a dad talking about their feelings.

493
00:23:44,405 --> 00:23:46,925
Speaker 1: Another example is I work with a lot of men

494
00:23:47,045 --> 00:23:49,524
Speaker 1: in my day job, and whenever one of them is

495
00:23:49,565 --> 00:23:51,725
Speaker 1: like I have to go to my kids school parade,

496
00:23:52,285 --> 00:23:55,045
Speaker 1: I feel annoyed. What is going on with me? That's

497
00:23:55,085 --> 00:23:57,725
Speaker 1: great that he's taking the time. I think it's because

498
00:23:58,125 --> 00:24:00,085
Speaker 1: it just feels performative in a way.

499
00:24:00,205 --> 00:24:02,005
Speaker 2: You're feeling defensive about it.

500
00:24:02,045 --> 00:24:04,445
Speaker 1: Maybe I do feel the same though. Listening to that

501
00:24:04,525 --> 00:24:07,405
Speaker 1: clip from Bob oden Kirk as well, I was like, Oh,

502
00:24:07,484 --> 00:24:09,245
Speaker 1: that's easy. You just picked up the things and drop

503
00:24:09,325 --> 00:24:13,245
Speaker 1: them off and then you left. You didn't think about

504
00:24:13,245 --> 00:24:16,605
Speaker 1: the permission sleep if you book the daycare school holidays.

505
00:24:16,605 --> 00:24:19,085
Speaker 1: Bob Odenkirk, did you just pick up the toys? Yeah?

506
00:24:19,085 --> 00:24:20,484
Speaker 1: I did think, well, I would quite like to be

507
00:24:20,525 --> 00:24:22,445
Speaker 1: a dad when my kid's a little too, which is

508
00:24:22,565 --> 00:24:25,765
Speaker 1: very unfair because I don't know his circumstances. He's obviously

509
00:24:25,845 --> 00:24:26,645
Speaker 1: very involved.

510
00:24:26,725 --> 00:24:29,125
Speaker 2: So I'm okay with the showboating. I think there has

511
00:24:29,125 --> 00:24:31,165
Speaker 2: to be a period where they do show bird, where

512
00:24:31,205 --> 00:24:34,485
Speaker 2: it is seen as aspirational and fantastic to do, and

513
00:24:34,525 --> 00:24:36,685
Speaker 2: that you get a lot of points from women for

514
00:24:36,765 --> 00:24:40,165
Speaker 2: doing it. Like I roll, that's the only way the

515
00:24:40,245 --> 00:24:40,925
Speaker 2: needles right.

516
00:24:41,645 --> 00:24:43,205
Speaker 1: We've got to give them the points. You're right.

517
00:24:43,365 --> 00:24:46,885
Speaker 2: It's like when my husband makes a terrible dinner. Oh

518
00:24:46,965 --> 00:24:50,085
Speaker 2: the praise I am doing so full of it. I

519
00:24:50,165 --> 00:24:52,524
Speaker 2: am like, this is the best thing I've ever eaten

520
00:24:52,645 --> 00:24:54,845
Speaker 2: because guess what, I didn't have to cook it. And then,

521
00:24:55,125 --> 00:24:55,805
Speaker 2: just like a bit of.

522
00:24:56,085 --> 00:24:59,765
Speaker 1: Okay generation, the next time someone on slack, a man

523
00:24:59,805 --> 00:25:01,765
Speaker 1: on slack tells me that he can't do something because

524
00:25:01,765 --> 00:25:03,805
Speaker 1: he's going to his kid's school parade, I'm going to

525
00:25:03,885 --> 00:25:07,565
Speaker 1: give the party hat emoji and the high five emotion.

526
00:25:07,685 --> 00:25:10,325
Speaker 2: Amelily, I do think you should, because I also think.

527
00:25:10,165 --> 00:25:14,965
Speaker 1: That cultural progressive thumbs naturally, we.

528
00:25:15,045 --> 00:25:17,244
Speaker 2: Do need to kind of move the needle on this stuff.

529
00:25:17,725 --> 00:25:20,325
Speaker 2: Dads that need to start to lift point taken.

530
00:25:21,365 --> 00:25:23,725
Speaker 1: So I moved back to Australia last year after many

531
00:25:23,805 --> 00:25:27,045
Speaker 1: years overseas, and I realized a few months in that

532
00:25:27,205 --> 00:25:30,285
Speaker 1: I was committing a big parenting faux pa. Do you

533
00:25:30,325 --> 00:25:31,085
Speaker 1: want to guess what it was?

534
00:25:31,325 --> 00:25:33,725
Speaker 2: Yeah, you flirted with another data I fashion him.

535
00:25:33,845 --> 00:25:36,565
Speaker 1: No, just my kid was in kindergarten. So I was

536
00:25:36,565 --> 00:25:38,885
Speaker 1: getting invite to a lot of parties because in kindergarten,

537
00:25:39,005 --> 00:25:42,805
Speaker 1: I think the sort of conventional wisdom is that, if possible,

538
00:25:42,885 --> 00:25:45,084
Speaker 1: invite the whole class to the party. So there were

539
00:25:45,125 --> 00:25:47,725
Speaker 1: a lot of parties. That he was at a public school,

540
00:25:47,765 --> 00:25:49,405
Speaker 1: so it was a huge class, and so you know,

541
00:25:49,765 --> 00:25:55,004
Speaker 1: every weekend, another party. And what happened was that I

542
00:25:55,165 --> 00:25:58,885
Speaker 1: noticed after the parties, parents were writing to the class

543
00:25:58,965 --> 00:26:04,244
Speaker 1: WhatsApp with these effusive notes of gratitude and praise for

544
00:26:04,325 --> 00:26:07,445
Speaker 1: the party. This is with everyone in so much. It

545
00:26:07,605 --> 00:26:09,965
Speaker 1: was just so great of you to invite little Billy

546
00:26:10,005 --> 00:26:15,125
Speaker 1: to this party. I particularly liked the cakes frosting, or

547
00:26:15,285 --> 00:26:20,165
Speaker 1: I particularly liked the dejected spider Man party entertaining you hired.

548
00:26:20,245 --> 00:26:21,885
Speaker 1: You know, there was just it was like these really

549
00:26:22,005 --> 00:26:24,325
Speaker 1: thoughtful notes, the kind that I would normally write to

550
00:26:24,405 --> 00:26:26,445
Speaker 1: my aunt when I was ten years old, after she

551
00:26:26,525 --> 00:26:28,844
Speaker 1: sent me ten dollars in the mail, but they were

552
00:26:28,845 --> 00:26:32,365
Speaker 1: writing them to the class WhatsApp. I asked a friend, Well, actually,

553
00:26:32,405 --> 00:26:33,845
Speaker 1: I complained to a friend. I was like, this is

554
00:26:33,885 --> 00:26:36,405
Speaker 1: so annoying. After every party, I get these notes. And

555
00:26:36,484 --> 00:26:38,285
Speaker 1: she looked at me and she said, Amelia, are you

556
00:26:38,405 --> 00:26:40,845
Speaker 1: not writing a thank you note for attending a party?

557
00:26:40,885 --> 00:26:43,125
Speaker 1: And I said no, I'm not. Why am I thanking them?

558
00:26:43,645 --> 00:26:45,805
Speaker 1: She said, in Australia you have to write a thank

559
00:26:45,845 --> 00:26:49,004
Speaker 1: you note for attending the kids party. And then another

560
00:26:49,085 --> 00:26:51,524
Speaker 1: thing I noticed is that when I hosted a party,

561
00:26:52,085 --> 00:26:54,685
Speaker 1: I have to write a thank you note for attending

562
00:26:54,845 --> 00:26:57,125
Speaker 1: the party to the parents. And it's just getting out

563
00:26:57,165 --> 00:27:00,004
Speaker 1: of control. So when I saw an article in New

564
00:27:00,085 --> 00:27:03,125
Speaker 1: York magazine called Fellow Parents, May I please text less?

565
00:27:03,765 --> 00:27:06,605
Speaker 1: It really made me feel seen. First of all, I

566
00:27:06,645 --> 00:27:09,365
Speaker 1: want to interrupt and say did you know this instinctively

567
00:27:09,405 --> 00:27:10,764
Speaker 1: about the parties and the thank.

568
00:27:10,645 --> 00:27:13,485
Speaker 2: You I'm hearing you say this, and I'm like, yeah,

569
00:27:13,525 --> 00:27:14,885
Speaker 2: that's just manners, Amelia.

570
00:27:15,325 --> 00:27:17,805
Speaker 1: See, I just was like, I don't want to impinge

571
00:27:17,845 --> 00:27:21,205
Speaker 1: on people's inboxes. I don't want to write unnecessary messages. Well,

572
00:27:21,245 --> 00:27:23,085
Speaker 1: I didn't realize that this was all happening in like

573
00:27:23,165 --> 00:27:26,725
Speaker 1: a group forum. So surely there's some eagle eyed person

574
00:27:26,845 --> 00:27:30,165
Speaker 1: in there making sure that everyone actually the party. If

575
00:27:30,165 --> 00:27:33,004
Speaker 1: I had to dride up this year party about up funny,

576
00:27:33,205 --> 00:27:36,205
Speaker 1: maybe that's why so. Catherine Gesu Morton, who writes a

577
00:27:36,325 --> 00:27:39,645
Speaker 1: great parenting column for New York which I highly recommend,

578
00:27:39,805 --> 00:27:42,524
Speaker 1: writes about the experience of dropping her kids off for

579
00:27:42,605 --> 00:27:46,165
Speaker 1: playdates and how it's assumed that you have to show

580
00:27:46,484 --> 00:27:49,764
Speaker 1: your concern and your diligence as a parent by checking

581
00:27:49,845 --> 00:27:52,484
Speaker 1: in constantly while the kid is on the playdate, and

582
00:27:52,685 --> 00:27:55,044
Speaker 1: also the parent during the hosting of the playdate has

583
00:27:55,085 --> 00:27:57,284
Speaker 1: to be constantly checking in, Oh, is it okay if

584
00:27:57,325 --> 00:28:00,045
Speaker 1: I give little Billy some biscuits? Or is it okay

585
00:28:00,085 --> 00:28:02,085
Speaker 1: if he has a fruit juice? This is constant back

586
00:28:02,085 --> 00:28:04,725
Speaker 1: and forth of communication. She says that she used to

587
00:28:04,765 --> 00:28:07,205
Speaker 1: live in Mexico, which flex I would love to live

588
00:28:07,245 --> 00:28:09,885
Speaker 1: in Mexico, and when she would drop off her kid

589
00:28:09,925 --> 00:28:12,085
Speaker 1: at a play date, she would say to the parent,

590
00:28:12,205 --> 00:28:14,685
Speaker 1: as she has been trained to do, oh, when should

591
00:28:14,685 --> 00:28:16,484
Speaker 1: I pick my kid up? And the parent would look

592
00:28:16,525 --> 00:28:19,365
Speaker 1: vaguely annoyed and say, I don't know like before bedtime,

593
00:28:19,845 --> 00:28:23,085
Speaker 1: go away. Essentially just leave us alone, trust me to

594
00:28:23,205 --> 00:28:26,764
Speaker 1: do this, And so from her Mexico experience, she resolved

595
00:28:26,805 --> 00:28:29,405
Speaker 1: to become more of a minimalist text She says that

596
00:28:29,525 --> 00:28:32,244
Speaker 1: in fact, every time you text a fellow parent, you

597
00:28:32,405 --> 00:28:34,645
Speaker 1: are asking them to use their time and energy on

598
00:28:34,725 --> 00:28:36,844
Speaker 1: both reading the message, thinking about the message, and then

599
00:28:36,885 --> 00:28:39,125
Speaker 1: responding to the message. And she suggests that we all

600
00:28:39,205 --> 00:28:42,685
Speaker 1: need to take a pact to text less. Mon's are

601
00:28:42,725 --> 00:28:44,605
Speaker 1: you going to be joining Catherine in this pledge? I

602
00:28:44,845 --> 00:28:45,205
Speaker 1: hear that.

603
00:28:45,525 --> 00:28:48,845
Speaker 2: I think it's about agent stage. So first of all,

604
00:28:48,885 --> 00:28:52,165
Speaker 2: I would say, what's wrong with a bit of over communication?

605
00:28:52,405 --> 00:28:55,565
Speaker 2: I think we are saturated with over communication from schools

606
00:28:55,605 --> 00:28:57,525
Speaker 2: and childcares and all that. So the standard has been

607
00:28:57,605 --> 00:29:01,005
Speaker 2: set like in the vacuum that we are in, in

608
00:29:01,125 --> 00:29:04,165
Speaker 2: the culture that we are in, is all about over communicating.

609
00:29:04,845 --> 00:29:08,245
Speaker 2: But I do think it definitely creeps up. I also

610
00:29:08,285 --> 00:29:10,245
Speaker 2: think it's about the agent stage. So if you're in

611
00:29:10,485 --> 00:29:12,685
Speaker 2: new parent, if you've joined a new school, it's the

612
00:29:12,805 --> 00:29:17,005
Speaker 2: first playdate. Then it is about building the trust, and

613
00:29:17,605 --> 00:29:20,685
Speaker 2: it's code for I'm a conscientious parent. It's like trust me,

614
00:29:20,845 --> 00:29:22,885
Speaker 2: and it's this weird thing of like the more you

615
00:29:23,045 --> 00:29:26,125
Speaker 2: check in, the more sort of conscientious and caring you become.

616
00:29:26,325 --> 00:29:29,605
Speaker 2: And so texting has become kind of this false way

617
00:29:29,685 --> 00:29:32,245
Speaker 2: of performing virtue, I guess, and I'm guilty of it.

618
00:29:32,405 --> 00:29:34,085
Speaker 2: Like I text a lot because I want to fast

619
00:29:34,165 --> 00:29:36,085
Speaker 2: track the trust so that I can get to the

620
00:29:36,125 --> 00:29:38,925
Speaker 2: point where I'm the Mexican parent saying just drop them

621
00:29:38,965 --> 00:29:40,805
Speaker 2: and come back when you feel like it. But I

622
00:29:40,885 --> 00:29:43,565
Speaker 2: do think it's a sliding scale. It starts with everyone

623
00:29:43,725 --> 00:29:46,045
Speaker 2: very keen on the texting, and then I'm hoping by

624
00:29:46,205 --> 00:29:47,885
Speaker 2: middle school it'll just die right off.

625
00:29:48,205 --> 00:29:51,045
Speaker 1: See, maybe I'm guilty of being one of these overtexters.

626
00:29:51,125 --> 00:29:53,525
Speaker 1: I'm not at the kindergarten school parties yet, so I

627
00:29:53,605 --> 00:29:56,245
Speaker 1: can see that that would be an absolute punished I

628
00:29:56,365 --> 00:29:59,405
Speaker 1: have to reply to all of those. But my daughter

629
00:29:59,525 --> 00:30:03,285
Speaker 1: being four now, she recently went to a gorgeous friend's

630
00:30:03,325 --> 00:30:05,565
Speaker 1: house to look after my daughter while I worked, and

631
00:30:06,245 --> 00:30:08,565
Speaker 1: she was texting me a lot. She was texting me,

632
00:30:08,965 --> 00:30:11,645
Speaker 1: they're having an ice cream together, they're on the swing together,

633
00:30:11,845 --> 00:30:14,765
Speaker 1: they're doing this And I probably wouldn't have thought to

634
00:30:14,845 --> 00:30:16,565
Speaker 1: do the same for her if it was the other

635
00:30:16,565 --> 00:30:18,445
Speaker 1: way around. But when she did it, I bloody loved

636
00:30:18,485 --> 00:30:21,045
Speaker 1: it because it actually took the guilt for me out

637
00:30:21,045 --> 00:30:23,325
Speaker 1: of the fact that I wasn't there. I was like, yep, great,

638
00:30:23,365 --> 00:30:26,325
Speaker 1: she's cool. Yep, great, she's still cool. Yeah, it's a lot.

639
00:30:26,765 --> 00:30:29,525
Speaker 2: We're all anxious, Amelia, but we're an anxious generation. We

640
00:30:29,645 --> 00:30:30,725
Speaker 2: need the constant checking.

641
00:30:31,005 --> 00:30:33,005
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it's gotten out of control. Like when

642
00:30:33,045 --> 00:30:38,165
Speaker 1: my kids started school here, I had to download four apps,

643
00:30:38,765 --> 00:30:43,485
Speaker 1: four different ways of communicating with the school and ways

644
00:30:43,485 --> 00:30:46,725
Speaker 1: that they could communicate with me. That's too many apps.

645
00:30:47,005 --> 00:30:50,845
Speaker 1: We know too much. I think, particularly with school, I

646
00:30:51,005 --> 00:30:53,525
Speaker 1: don't really think that it's my business what my kids

647
00:30:53,565 --> 00:30:56,605
Speaker 1: are getting up to at school. I just don't think

648
00:30:56,685 --> 00:30:59,765
Speaker 1: it's my concern. I feel the opposite. I froth those

649
00:30:59,845 --> 00:31:02,685
Speaker 1: weekly updates. When my daughter went to a daycare, we

650
00:31:02,765 --> 00:31:05,085
Speaker 1: never got any, and I was just desperate for a crumber.

651
00:31:05,085 --> 00:31:06,485
Speaker 1: I was like, just send me one picture of her

652
00:31:06,525 --> 00:31:08,485
Speaker 1: doing a little finger painting and I'll be so happy

653
00:31:08,965 --> 00:31:11,165
Speaker 1: that she had a good day. And now at her

654
00:31:11,365 --> 00:31:13,965
Speaker 1: prep school we get like this week, we learn about this,

655
00:31:14,445 --> 00:31:18,245
Speaker 1: the letter of the week is this, and I try.

656
00:31:19,245 --> 00:31:21,845
Speaker 1: Oh I love it. Do you have your phones on

657
00:31:22,005 --> 00:31:25,725
Speaker 1: no notifications because you cannot deny that every time your

658
00:31:25,805 --> 00:31:29,165
Speaker 1: phone pings, your QUOTASOL levels spike and you feel a

659
00:31:29,285 --> 00:31:31,845
Speaker 1: little pang of anxiety and stress. Don't you want to

660
00:31:31,925 --> 00:31:34,565
Speaker 1: minimize that? I guess so, at least for me, it's

661
00:31:34,765 --> 00:31:36,805
Speaker 1: only once a week when that's happening. But I guess

662
00:31:36,845 --> 00:31:39,005
Speaker 1: if you were getting those constantly, that would be stressed.

663
00:31:39,005 --> 00:31:41,245
Speaker 1: I just think it's about the class, WhatsApp groups mons.

664
00:31:41,365 --> 00:31:42,645
Speaker 1: Have you muted your class?

665
00:31:42,685 --> 00:31:45,365
Speaker 2: What's I am the rogue parent that does not check

666
00:31:45,445 --> 00:31:46,045
Speaker 2: the messages?

667
00:31:46,245 --> 00:31:48,925
Speaker 1: So I, oh, you're that parent and you're the one

668
00:31:48,965 --> 00:31:51,245
Speaker 1: who comes in after like a month and it's like, sorry,

669
00:31:51,325 --> 00:31:52,485
Speaker 1: when's book week? Yes?

670
00:31:52,605 --> 00:31:54,965
Speaker 2: Completely, I'm the one that took my kid at a

671
00:31:55,005 --> 00:31:57,365
Speaker 2: school in their school uniform on casual day because I

672
00:31:57,445 --> 00:31:59,965
Speaker 2: don't check the apps. It was an easy fix and

673
00:32:00,045 --> 00:32:03,245
Speaker 2: it was a teachable moment. I think, what if you

674
00:32:03,485 --> 00:32:07,205
Speaker 2: don't text Amelia? What if you are the rogue parent?

675
00:32:07,685 --> 00:32:11,325
Speaker 2: Is that kind of code for she's careless and that's

676
00:32:11,405 --> 00:32:12,965
Speaker 2: why no one comes to play our house?

677
00:32:13,125 --> 00:32:13,845
Speaker 1: Yeah? Maybe?

678
00:32:14,005 --> 00:32:14,205
Speaker 3: I mean.

679
00:32:14,365 --> 00:32:17,205
Speaker 1: Catherine says that part of this pledge to text less,

680
00:32:17,325 --> 00:32:20,285
Speaker 1: what you have to be aware of is that people

681
00:32:20,445 --> 00:32:23,165
Speaker 1: will be mad at you. People will be angry at you.

682
00:32:23,725 --> 00:32:26,845
Speaker 1: There's going to be some social blowback from texting less.

683
00:32:27,285 --> 00:32:28,845
Speaker 1: That's absolutely true.

684
00:32:29,805 --> 00:32:31,605
Speaker 2: I tried something new the other day when I was

685
00:32:31,645 --> 00:32:34,605
Speaker 2: texting another mum where I gave options. I treated it

686
00:32:34,765 --> 00:32:37,165
Speaker 2: like I was going to text my boss. And if

687
00:32:37,205 --> 00:32:39,005
Speaker 2: you're in a workplace and you know how to manage up,

688
00:32:39,165 --> 00:32:41,165
Speaker 2: you sort of like offer a problem and then offer

689
00:32:41,205 --> 00:32:43,565
Speaker 2: the solution and then give the recommendation in the one thing.

690
00:32:43,685 --> 00:32:46,965
Speaker 2: So I said, Hi, Sally, we'd love to have Ari

691
00:32:47,245 --> 00:32:50,525
Speaker 2: over for a playdate two till four. You can a

692
00:32:51,005 --> 00:32:52,805
Speaker 2: kiss and drop and we'll see you in a few hours.

693
00:32:53,205 --> 00:32:56,565
Speaker 2: B get regular text updates and photos on all their activities,

694
00:32:56,685 --> 00:32:58,365
Speaker 2: or see stay and have a cup of tea and

695
00:32:58,445 --> 00:33:01,405
Speaker 2: hang out too. Now what this? And then short and

696
00:33:01,485 --> 00:33:04,405
Speaker 2: then I said, I'm the parent that always chooses a

697
00:33:04,845 --> 00:33:08,005
Speaker 2: loll but whatever you feel most comfortable with. So it

698
00:33:08,125 --> 00:33:11,325
Speaker 2: stops the back and forth. It sets the intention. It's

699
00:33:11,405 --> 00:33:14,205
Speaker 2: like if you choose what you want, choose your own adventure,

700
00:33:14,605 --> 00:33:17,525
Speaker 2: and then everyone's happy, and what parent, and merely what

701
00:33:17,725 --> 00:33:20,165
Speaker 2: parent is going to say, yeah, I want text updates

702
00:33:20,205 --> 00:33:20,645
Speaker 2: every hour?

703
00:33:20,725 --> 00:33:24,005
Speaker 1: Then not that, and you know what would have taken

704
00:33:24,045 --> 00:33:25,845
Speaker 1: it to the next level. Did you do it like

705
00:33:25,925 --> 00:33:30,325
Speaker 1: a poll in what's that button? That would have been

706
00:33:30,605 --> 00:33:31,085
Speaker 1: next level?

707
00:33:31,285 --> 00:33:33,365
Speaker 2: I just went ABC because I also am aware that,

708
00:33:33,485 --> 00:33:36,605
Speaker 2: like the mental load with texting back and forth is crippling.

709
00:33:36,805 --> 00:33:37,485
Speaker 1: So what she picked?

710
00:33:37,805 --> 00:33:39,045
Speaker 2: She picked a kiss and drop.

711
00:33:39,125 --> 00:33:40,725
Speaker 1: Yeah, I love it. Who wouldn't. But do you know

712
00:33:40,805 --> 00:33:43,325
Speaker 1: why she did pick A and why I would pick

713
00:33:43,405 --> 00:33:45,805
Speaker 1: A in that circumstance when really I love getting all

714
00:33:45,845 --> 00:33:48,645
Speaker 1: the updates? Is that you set up that you're that person.

715
00:33:48,925 --> 00:33:51,125
Speaker 1: That's the genius of it that you said, I'm a

716
00:33:51,205 --> 00:33:54,565
Speaker 1: mom who does a loll like I'm chill, so I'm

717
00:33:54,605 --> 00:33:58,245
Speaker 1: expecting you to be chill and not asking. We're sort

718
00:33:58,325 --> 00:34:00,845
Speaker 1: of like sending some parameters breadcrumb.

719
00:34:00,925 --> 00:34:02,885
Speaker 2: But look, she could have chosen B or C and

720
00:34:02,925 --> 00:34:03,805
Speaker 2: I would have been happy with that.

721
00:34:04,445 --> 00:34:07,285
Speaker 1: Genuinely okay with B, which was provide constant updates.

722
00:34:07,365 --> 00:34:09,565
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's fine. If a parent wants that from me

723
00:34:09,725 --> 00:34:12,125
Speaker 2: and needs that feel safe and build the trust with

724
00:34:12,285 --> 00:34:14,765
Speaker 2: me with her child, then that's absolutely fine. It just

725
00:34:14,844 --> 00:34:15,964
Speaker 2: puts the burden back on her.

726
00:34:17,525 --> 00:34:20,084
Speaker 1: So we published a story on the site about how

727
00:34:20,165 --> 00:34:22,924
Speaker 1: having kids is basically like ordering food at a restaurant,

728
00:34:23,044 --> 00:34:25,685
Speaker 1: and it's so brilliant that I need everyone to hear it.

729
00:34:26,245 --> 00:34:30,084
Speaker 1: So the article by Francesca Hornack was titled why a

730
00:34:30,165 --> 00:34:33,884
Speaker 1: third kid is like ordering dessert, and she basically runs

731
00:34:33,924 --> 00:34:36,884
Speaker 1: through his metaphorical restaurant of childbearing. So I'll give you

732
00:34:37,004 --> 00:34:40,245
Speaker 1: some of them. So with starters, she's like, you know

733
00:34:40,364 --> 00:34:44,565
Speaker 1: the drill, everyone gets there, we're all really excited. You're drinking,

734
00:34:44,725 --> 00:34:47,324
Speaker 1: and everyone starts ordering the first round of entrees, which

735
00:34:47,404 --> 00:34:50,245
Speaker 1: is the first round of babies. And she's like, everyone's

736
00:34:50,285 --> 00:34:52,484
Speaker 1: really excited when they come because you're ravenous, Like you're

737
00:34:52,524 --> 00:34:55,245
Speaker 1: all so excited by this, and you secretly start comparing,

738
00:34:55,364 --> 00:34:58,205
Speaker 1: like who got the best starter. Then everyone's having a

739
00:34:58,245 --> 00:34:58,644
Speaker 1: great time.

740
00:34:58,725 --> 00:35:00,724
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like it's a vibe. The first entrees is a vibe.

741
00:35:00,765 --> 00:35:03,004
Speaker 2: You're in the restaurant, you're feeling it. Yeah, like, here

742
00:35:03,084 --> 00:35:04,325
Speaker 2: it comes, we are ready.

743
00:35:04,404 --> 00:35:06,484
Speaker 1: You're really excited for you ever got the barada because

744
00:35:06,484 --> 00:35:10,604
Speaker 1: that's obviously the superior entrey, Like very exciting stuff. Yanes

745
00:35:10,685 --> 00:35:14,804
Speaker 1: as your second kid, that makes sense following this pork chop, Yeah, yeah,

746
00:35:14,924 --> 00:35:18,084
Speaker 1: pork chop. You know, everyone's less excited in your food

747
00:35:18,245 --> 00:35:20,245
Speaker 1: because they've got their own food to worry about.

748
00:35:20,524 --> 00:35:22,685
Speaker 2: But great, you're not so hungry anymore.

749
00:35:22,805 --> 00:35:24,805
Speaker 1: Yeah, but you're all settled in, you know the score,

750
00:35:25,084 --> 00:35:28,765
Speaker 1: so it's a little bit easier. You're enjoying yourselves. The

751
00:35:28,844 --> 00:35:31,164
Speaker 1: best one she has is when they come around and say,

752
00:35:31,245 --> 00:35:33,205
Speaker 1: would you like the dessert menu? And I'm going to

753
00:35:33,245 --> 00:35:35,205
Speaker 1: read you what she wrote here because it's so brilliant,

754
00:35:35,964 --> 00:35:39,124
Speaker 1: she says. Nearly everyone at the table says no, thanks immediately,

755
00:35:39,404 --> 00:35:41,964
Speaker 1: without pausing or even looking at each other. But you're

756
00:35:41,964 --> 00:35:45,564
Speaker 1: a little surprised pudding would be delicious, and you don't

757
00:35:45,604 --> 00:35:48,765
Speaker 1: feel quite finished or balanced. It's all been a bit savory.

758
00:35:49,165 --> 00:35:50,964
Speaker 1: This is when you try for a third after having

759
00:35:51,004 --> 00:35:53,564
Speaker 1: two kids of the same sex. The thing is, you

760
00:35:53,685 --> 00:35:56,565
Speaker 1: aren't sure you should actually be having a hole pudding.

761
00:35:56,725 --> 00:35:59,044
Speaker 1: You're not sure you can fit a whole pudding. But

762
00:35:59,165 --> 00:36:01,725
Speaker 1: you also know deep down that you aren't ready to

763
00:36:01,805 --> 00:36:04,964
Speaker 1: leave the restaurant. This is not throwing out the newborn sleepsuits,

764
00:36:05,404 --> 00:36:07,604
Speaker 1: and you can delay going out into the cold, dark

765
00:36:07,725 --> 00:36:10,805
Speaker 1: night by ordering another course. Its purpose.

766
00:36:10,884 --> 00:36:11,325
Speaker 2: I loved this.

767
00:36:11,564 --> 00:36:15,884
Speaker 1: No, it's yeah, so so many amazing analogies in there.

768
00:36:15,924 --> 00:36:17,604
Speaker 1: We'll put the whole story in the show notes for

769
00:36:17,685 --> 00:36:20,004
Speaker 1: you so you can read the others. But for me,

770
00:36:20,165 --> 00:36:23,604
Speaker 1: selfishly with my situation. My favorite was when she says

771
00:36:23,884 --> 00:36:26,685
Speaker 1: what ordering the salad to come with the mains is like,

772
00:36:27,084 --> 00:36:29,404
Speaker 1: and she said, that's like having an only child. It

773
00:36:29,524 --> 00:36:32,645
Speaker 1: might seem lighter, but the goat's cheese is very demanding,

774
00:36:33,084 --> 00:36:34,605
Speaker 1: so brilliant.

775
00:36:34,805 --> 00:36:37,084
Speaker 2: The trouble with the dessert is what if you don't

776
00:36:37,084 --> 00:36:38,725
Speaker 2: get to choose it. What if it's just like it

777
00:36:38,805 --> 00:36:40,684
Speaker 2: comes out and it might be a lemon merangue pie

778
00:36:40,765 --> 00:36:42,604
Speaker 2: and then you're like, shit, I don't want this.

779
00:36:43,325 --> 00:36:46,445
Speaker 1: I'd love a lemon merangue pie. That's the I'm re ordering.

780
00:36:47,044 --> 00:36:49,644
Speaker 2: Could we also apply this metaphor to other areas of

781
00:36:49,685 --> 00:36:52,884
Speaker 2: our life, like what other items like if it was

782
00:36:52,884 --> 00:36:56,444
Speaker 2: a kitchen appliance. So my first born is probably my

783
00:36:56,604 --> 00:37:01,484
Speaker 2: thermomix because it's like extremely expensive. We poured everything into

784
00:37:01,564 --> 00:37:03,924
Speaker 2: it and then we just don't stop yapping about how

785
00:37:03,964 --> 00:37:04,484
Speaker 2: amazing it.

786
00:37:04,604 --> 00:37:05,884
Speaker 1: Is, like shut up.

787
00:37:06,285 --> 00:37:08,364
Speaker 2: And then my second child's more like an anchor toaster.

788
00:37:08,524 --> 00:37:11,285
Speaker 2: It's just like gets the job. What would a third

789
00:37:11,364 --> 00:37:11,685
Speaker 2: child be?

790
00:37:12,125 --> 00:37:14,884
Speaker 1: I feel like a third child would be like an

791
00:37:14,964 --> 00:37:17,924
Speaker 1: air fryer that you get gifted by someone else. So

792
00:37:18,044 --> 00:37:20,364
Speaker 1: it kind of was a surprise that got thrown into

793
00:37:20,404 --> 00:37:23,205
Speaker 1: the mix and you don't quite know what to do

794
00:37:23,325 --> 00:37:24,765
Speaker 1: with it, but you can throw everything at it and

795
00:37:24,844 --> 00:37:27,924
Speaker 1: it survives like it doesn't trying to persuade everyone else

796
00:37:27,964 --> 00:37:30,245
Speaker 1: that they needed yes, yeah, and.

797
00:37:30,325 --> 00:37:32,044
Speaker 2: Then you're like, how did I live my life without

798
00:37:32,125 --> 00:37:32,644
Speaker 2: this air fight?

799
00:37:32,765 --> 00:37:34,484
Speaker 1: Exactly? All right?

800
00:37:34,524 --> 00:37:35,924
Speaker 2: To wrap up todays show, we're going to share the

801
00:37:35,964 --> 00:37:38,165
Speaker 2: things that we're loving, sick at the moment. Things we

802
00:37:38,245 --> 00:37:40,044
Speaker 2: might text to our friends or put in the mum's

803
00:37:40,084 --> 00:37:43,405
Speaker 2: group chat, just helpful, helpful stuff. I should say dad's

804
00:37:43,404 --> 00:37:46,564
Speaker 2: group chat as well. Dads probably have group chats, all right.

805
00:37:46,524 --> 00:37:51,205
Speaker 1: I don't think, don't they've taken the pledge.

806
00:37:52,725 --> 00:37:54,725
Speaker 2: I've gone back to basics with this one. So this

807
00:37:54,884 --> 00:37:59,165
Speaker 2: is a recipe that is a lunchbox snack that's fast, cheap,

808
00:37:59,524 --> 00:38:01,044
Speaker 2: and you can keep it in the freezer in a

809
00:38:01,125 --> 00:38:06,084
Speaker 2: giant bag. For ingredients, wheatbix balls, Guys, whatever happened to

810
00:38:06,084 --> 00:38:09,004
Speaker 2: wheatbix balls. We're all about the kito and the protein

811
00:38:09,044 --> 00:38:11,925
Speaker 2: and the chia seed and the pre no. I'm telling

812
00:38:11,964 --> 00:38:16,165
Speaker 2: you four ingredients. You take eight wheatbicks and then crush

813
00:38:16,364 --> 00:38:18,564
Speaker 2: them up and chuck them in a bowl. You can

814
00:38:18,645 --> 00:38:21,245
Speaker 2: also use the Wheatbix rubble that ends up at the

815
00:38:21,245 --> 00:38:23,764
Speaker 2: bottom of the packet that no one ever uses. Throw

816
00:38:23,884 --> 00:38:26,044
Speaker 2: that into You're going to take a quarter of a

817
00:38:26,165 --> 00:38:29,685
Speaker 2: cup of cocoa and then one cup of desiccated coconut

818
00:38:29,924 --> 00:38:32,645
Speaker 2: and just a can of condensed milky.

819
00:38:33,004 --> 00:38:33,484
Speaker 1: That's it.

820
00:38:33,884 --> 00:38:38,044
Speaker 2: Stir it together, roll it into balls, roll it in coconut,

821
00:38:38,325 --> 00:38:41,445
Speaker 2: store it in a bag in the freezer for wheat

822
00:38:41,564 --> 00:38:44,045
Speaker 2: bis bolts bowls.

823
00:38:45,205 --> 00:38:48,205
Speaker 1: Look, I love that we're giving depression. You're apparenting with

824
00:38:48,325 --> 00:38:49,964
Speaker 1: directs this week. So I'm going to jump in because

825
00:38:49,964 --> 00:38:56,444
Speaker 1: I've got one question. Mine is a recommendation which came

826
00:38:56,484 --> 00:38:58,844
Speaker 1: by my mother. My son was sick. He was over

827
00:38:58,924 --> 00:39:01,285
Speaker 1: at her place. He saw a hot water bottle and

828
00:39:01,444 --> 00:39:04,165
Speaker 1: his mind was blown in a way that I didn't

829
00:39:04,205 --> 00:39:06,884
Speaker 1: think could happen to him outside of watching the Minecraft movie.

830
00:39:07,044 --> 00:39:10,165
Speaker 1: Like he just had this sort of like incredibly touching

831
00:39:11,004 --> 00:39:14,884
Speaker 1: childhood wonderment at the hot water bottle. And so now

832
00:39:15,004 --> 00:39:17,964
Speaker 1: my children think I'm like some kind of literal magician

833
00:39:18,165 --> 00:39:20,765
Speaker 1: because every night I give them this weird contraption and

834
00:39:20,844 --> 00:39:22,644
Speaker 1: they take it to bed and it soothes them and

835
00:39:22,725 --> 00:39:25,685
Speaker 1: it calms them and it eases their growing pains. And

836
00:39:25,805 --> 00:39:26,765
Speaker 1: I need to get one myself.

837
00:39:26,844 --> 00:39:27,724
Speaker 2: They're so good.

838
00:39:27,884 --> 00:39:29,765
Speaker 1: Now you may be asking where do you get one?

839
00:39:29,844 --> 00:39:31,964
Speaker 1: That's what I asked, because I truly hadn't thought about

840
00:39:32,004 --> 00:39:34,644
Speaker 1: them in decades. It turns out they're everywhere, Okay, I

841
00:39:34,805 --> 00:39:38,844
Speaker 1: sware house, They're everywhere, and they're not expensive. And one tip,

842
00:39:39,084 --> 00:39:40,924
Speaker 1: because my son had to tell me this, now, I'm

843
00:39:40,964 --> 00:39:43,725
Speaker 1: aware that people listening will think that I'm extremely silly

844
00:39:43,844 --> 00:39:45,685
Speaker 1: for not knowing this. You're not meant to put boiling

845
00:39:45,765 --> 00:39:46,124
Speaker 1: water in.

846
00:39:46,444 --> 00:39:47,924
Speaker 2: No, they can burst, no can.

847
00:39:48,325 --> 00:39:50,084
Speaker 1: My son told me that you just have to like

848
00:39:50,404 --> 00:39:53,684
Speaker 1: get hot water, not boiling water. But I think it's great.

849
00:39:54,004 --> 00:39:56,084
Speaker 2: Oh that's so good. I think it's the sound they make,

850
00:39:56,285 --> 00:39:58,924
Speaker 2: like the slushy sloshy is so delightful.

851
00:39:59,084 --> 00:40:00,404
Speaker 1: I want I want one.

852
00:40:00,765 --> 00:40:02,604
Speaker 2: Do you put them in a little baggie or is

853
00:40:02,645 --> 00:40:05,205
Speaker 2: it just raw plastic rubber?

854
00:40:05,805 --> 00:40:08,524
Speaker 1: Yeah, skin, I probably could get one of those. You

855
00:40:08,604 --> 00:40:11,644
Speaker 1: know how church fates always have those nitched.

856
00:40:12,725 --> 00:40:15,444
Speaker 2: Keep it raw dogging. And also because the smell of

857
00:40:15,524 --> 00:40:18,844
Speaker 2: the rubber is so good too. Oh man, what have

858
00:40:18,924 --> 00:40:19,525
Speaker 2: you got, Stacey?

859
00:40:20,044 --> 00:40:23,164
Speaker 1: So my reco this week does not give depression error.

860
00:40:23,364 --> 00:40:26,324
Speaker 1: So I've gone a very different direction this week. Mine

861
00:40:26,484 --> 00:40:28,325
Speaker 1: is to just grab one of your friends and go

862
00:40:28,444 --> 00:40:31,804
Speaker 1: and have a little dance around your handbag, yes, which

863
00:40:31,884 --> 00:40:34,645
Speaker 1: I had not actually done in so long but always

864
00:40:34,725 --> 00:40:38,125
Speaker 1: used to love doing. So. It's bloody cold. My legs

865
00:40:38,165 --> 00:40:40,404
Speaker 1: have not seen the light of day in months. Like

866
00:40:40,725 --> 00:40:43,084
Speaker 1: if they were a Duluxe paint swatch, it would be

867
00:40:43,125 --> 00:40:46,285
Speaker 1: called like dry, flaky snowstorm or something like that. But

868
00:40:46,404 --> 00:40:49,805
Speaker 1: I cracked out a can of fake tan, fake tanned myself,

869
00:40:50,125 --> 00:40:53,205
Speaker 1: put some sparkles on. I thought of ten different reasons

870
00:40:53,205 --> 00:40:55,325
Speaker 1: I could get it's just starting to sound like a lot.

871
00:40:55,364 --> 00:40:56,844
Speaker 1: I thought, you just meant in your living room? You

872
00:40:56,924 --> 00:41:00,404
Speaker 1: mean yeah. I went out in the city, which for

873
00:41:00,524 --> 00:41:02,724
Speaker 1: me when I'm in the western suburbs, it was even

874
00:41:02,765 --> 00:41:05,525
Speaker 1: a long way to get this good. It was actually

875
00:41:05,685 --> 00:41:07,884
Speaker 1: so good. The one I went to was called House

876
00:41:07,924 --> 00:41:11,205
Speaker 1: of Zim. But they're just these women only dance clubs

877
00:41:11,325 --> 00:41:15,044
Speaker 1: like this, disco club, baby, yeah, disco club like Lisa

878
00:41:15,084 --> 00:41:17,125
Speaker 1: and Sarah are friends of the podcast. They have disco

879
00:41:17,245 --> 00:41:19,725
Speaker 1: club like women go and have the best time. And

880
00:41:19,805 --> 00:41:21,965
Speaker 1: then the one I went to was over at ten pm.

881
00:41:22,084 --> 00:41:25,484
Speaker 2: Ye shut seeing these, Amelia, have you seen them everywhere?

882
00:41:26,484 --> 00:41:27,404
Speaker 2: You put sneakers on.

883
00:41:27,645 --> 00:41:30,444
Speaker 1: Oh good, Yeah, you wear flat shoes. What is the

884
00:41:30,524 --> 00:41:32,684
Speaker 1: music that they play at these? Is it like nineties hits?

885
00:41:33,645 --> 00:41:35,805
Speaker 1: You calling it nineties hits means you need to be

886
00:41:35,884 --> 00:41:36,964
Speaker 1: coming with me one of these.

887
00:41:38,245 --> 00:41:41,324
Speaker 2: What's the nineties hit like the Spice.

888
00:41:41,044 --> 00:41:43,765
Speaker 1: Girl's Baby, right they were nineties? Yeah, I don't know.

889
00:41:43,924 --> 00:41:47,684
Speaker 1: Boys two men on the shot, but yes, it's all

890
00:41:47,765 --> 00:41:49,765
Speaker 1: of that music. Like you can belt out a Selene

891
00:41:49,844 --> 00:41:50,325
Speaker 1: banger at the.

892
00:41:50,325 --> 00:41:54,764
Speaker 2: Top bangers and you go hard. The women go so hard. Yeah,

893
00:41:54,765 --> 00:41:55,724
Speaker 2: I saw the next day.

894
00:41:56,125 --> 00:41:57,844
Speaker 1: I was a bit sore in the hips. I'm not

895
00:41:57,924 --> 00:42:00,964
Speaker 1: gonna lie. My hips were sore. But it was so good.

896
00:42:01,004 --> 00:42:04,364
Speaker 1: I wore flat shoes. I was so comfy, great time.

897
00:42:04,924 --> 00:42:07,444
Speaker 1: You know you're seeing like belt out Selene like it's

898
00:42:07,484 --> 00:42:10,684
Speaker 1: the best. I have another question. No men, no mess women,

899
00:42:11,044 --> 00:42:14,644
Speaker 1: no man. No men are present and people drinking. Yeah,

900
00:42:15,125 --> 00:42:16,444
Speaker 1: so you don't have it's not one of those like

901
00:42:16,685 --> 00:42:18,244
Speaker 1: sober coffee dance pot.

902
00:42:18,444 --> 00:42:18,844
Speaker 3: No, no, no.

903
00:42:18,964 --> 00:42:21,644
Speaker 1: There were many margaritas consumed, but I think just in

904
00:42:21,725 --> 00:42:23,644
Speaker 1: a group of women, like everyone was there for the

905
00:42:23,685 --> 00:42:26,805
Speaker 1: same reason. Everyone had gotten a baby or you know,

906
00:42:26,924 --> 00:42:29,325
Speaker 1: found their way to be out. Everyone just chucked their

907
00:42:29,364 --> 00:42:31,284
Speaker 1: bags in a corner like it was great.

908
00:42:31,444 --> 00:42:34,564
Speaker 2: It's so good when you're this age because you you

909
00:42:34,765 --> 00:42:37,044
Speaker 2: maximize your time. Like when you were younger and you

910
00:42:37,084 --> 00:42:39,805
Speaker 2: were going out clubbing, the night would stretch on and

911
00:42:39,924 --> 00:42:40,245
Speaker 2: on and on.

912
00:42:40,484 --> 00:42:41,805
Speaker 1: Yeap, who even knew what.

913
00:42:41,884 --> 00:42:44,924
Speaker 2: You were doing next? But this we are so efficient.

914
00:42:45,044 --> 00:42:46,844
Speaker 2: The women at this age are so efficient. It's like

915
00:42:47,044 --> 00:42:50,164
Speaker 2: get in, get your dance done, go hard, go home

916
00:42:50,205 --> 00:42:51,364
Speaker 2: and get into bed by ten thirty.

917
00:42:51,484 --> 00:42:53,924
Speaker 1: Yeah, it was the best. Woke up, parented my child

918
00:42:54,044 --> 00:42:54,924
Speaker 1: like nothing of home.

919
00:42:55,444 --> 00:42:58,844
Speaker 2: Okap ah, that's all we have time for on Parenting

920
00:42:58,844 --> 00:43:01,485
Speaker 2: out Loud today. But hey, before you go, a warning

921
00:43:01,645 --> 00:43:05,725
Speaker 2: not to you Tube if you know this, but this

922
00:43:05,964 --> 00:43:09,564
Speaker 2: show is a ticking time bomb. No pressure, so listen.

923
00:43:09,645 --> 00:43:13,045
Speaker 2: If you quite liked this show and you would listen again,

924
00:43:13,685 --> 00:43:15,685
Speaker 2: we need to ask for your help. We need to

925
00:43:15,725 --> 00:43:17,684
Speaker 2: ask a favor. I know it's more on the mental load.

926
00:43:17,844 --> 00:43:20,124
Speaker 2: But the best way to help us is to do

927
00:43:20,325 --> 00:43:23,884
Speaker 2: one thing. It's to search for Parenting out Loud in

928
00:43:23,964 --> 00:43:27,205
Speaker 2: your podcast app. Find the show. It's got a purple logo,

929
00:43:27,364 --> 00:43:29,604
Speaker 2: and just hit follow. So it's like a little plus

930
00:43:29,645 --> 00:43:32,124
Speaker 2: sign in Spotify or Apple or wherever you listen. Now,

931
00:43:32,205 --> 00:43:34,805
Speaker 2: this is free it's free to do that. But what

932
00:43:34,964 --> 00:43:37,285
Speaker 2: it means is that when we get cut off the teat,

933
00:43:37,685 --> 00:43:40,364
Speaker 2: when the milk stops flowing out of the nipple of

934
00:43:40,484 --> 00:43:41,285
Speaker 2: out loud.

935
00:43:41,044 --> 00:43:45,124
Speaker 1: The baby lead weaning peopleout having to pure carrots ourselves. Yeah,

936
00:43:45,205 --> 00:43:46,084
Speaker 1: knew it had come in hand.

937
00:43:46,125 --> 00:43:49,205
Speaker 2: You will be okay, we won't starve, So come on

938
00:43:49,325 --> 00:43:50,404
Speaker 2: over to parenting out there.

939
00:43:50,444 --> 00:43:53,444
Speaker 1: We would love to have you there and that's so important.

940
00:43:53,564 --> 00:43:55,645
Speaker 1: Please do Yeah, yeah, I'll.

941
00:43:55,564 --> 00:43:58,004
Speaker 2: Leave you with that big ass. Thanks to our team

942
00:43:58,245 --> 00:44:02,565
Speaker 2: group ep Ruth Divine produces Leoporgus and Sashatanic and research

943
00:44:02,765 --> 00:44:05,364
Speaker 2: from Tessa Kotovich. Have a great week. We'll talk to

944
00:44:05,404 --> 00:44:06,564
Speaker 2: you next Saturday morning.

945
00:44:06,725 --> 00:44:07,685
Speaker 1: See you then bye,