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Speaker 1: You're listening to a MoMA Mia podcast.

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Speaker 2: Mama Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters

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Speaker 2: that this podcast is recorded on Hello and welcome to

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Speaker 2: MoMA Mia. Oh and we're off to the races. Oh, funny,

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Speaker 2: happened to Charlich.

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Speaker 1: That's a glitch. Let's try that again.

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Speaker 2: Hello and welcome to Mom and Mia out Loud and

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Speaker 2: to our Friday show where we just take a break

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Speaker 2: from the news cycle and holy moly, wanted news cycle

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Speaker 2: it has been.

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Speaker 3: Can we breathe out?

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Speaker 2: Today is Friday, the nineteenth of July, and I am

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Speaker 2: Holly Wainwright.

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Speaker 4: And I'm Jesse Stevens. And this week, as of Wednesday,

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Speaker 4: when we just made up this competition, we're running a

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Speaker 4: Christmas in July gift from us. What we want you

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Speaker 4: to do is regular write our social strategy.

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Speaker 3: Come on out louders.

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Speaker 1: I'd like it in a PowerPoint presentation or maybe designed

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Speaker 1: it saying that someone gonna do that.

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Speaker 4: No, all you need to do is post weare you

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Speaker 4: listening to Mummy out Loud wherever it is tag Mummy

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Speaker 4: Outloud on Instagram. We want to see and the weirdest,

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Speaker 4: most interesting place The agular winner prize, and that prize

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Speaker 4: may or may not be signed copies of our books.

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Speaker 4: That are women arms each of us right now, so true.

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Speaker 2: There on the show today, people are paying thousands of

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Speaker 2: dollars to win back their exes. We give you a

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Speaker 2: cheat sheet that you can then set on fire. Plus

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Speaker 2: MEA's new passion project, a hair Confession, and an American

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Speaker 2: horror show its recommendations time and the Best and Worse

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Speaker 2: from our week, which include a panicked call from a teenager,

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Speaker 2: a smug exerciser, and MIA's latest style reinvention. But first

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Speaker 2: Jesse Stevens.

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Speaker 4: In case you missed it. An airline has made it

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Speaker 4: possible for women to choose to avoid sitting next to

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Speaker 4: men on flights. The Indian low cost carrier it's called Indigo,

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Speaker 4: is the first airline to allow female travelers to see

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Speaker 4: which adjacent seats have been booked by other female passengers. Men,

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Speaker 4: on the other hand, will be able to see which

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Speaker 4: seats are free, but not the gender, so women are

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Speaker 4: able to see the gender of people around them. This

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Speaker 4: comes after the airline ran a survey on how they

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Speaker 4: could make women feel more comfortable while traveling and actually

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Speaker 4: in India. This isn't entirely new. All the countries long

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Speaker 4: distance train services have women only compartments. The same exists

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Speaker 4: in Japan in Iran. I want to know, would you

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Speaker 4: choose not to sit next to a man? You can

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Speaker 4: now decide whether would you unless.

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Speaker 3: It was someone I knew or lived with.

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Speaker 4: Okay, so you're choosing. Let's say you're going for business,

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Speaker 4: you're going on your own. You get on and you

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Speaker 4: go which seat do I want to sit in? You

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Speaker 4: decide to sit next to a woman instead of a man?

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Speaker 3: Well, leg groom?

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Speaker 4: Okay, you're using the generalization of men in height.

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Speaker 1: No, man's breading is a thing, and I'm resting, and

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Speaker 1: it's not necessarily their fault. Some men have very big

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Speaker 1: testicles and their legs need to be wide apart.

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Speaker 4: Some women but large flaps, and there need to be.

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Speaker 3: Well less women.

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Speaker 1: Clearly because so many men seem to have very big

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Speaker 1: testicles and their legs need to be very far apart,

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Speaker 1: and more power to them. But best that not infringe

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Speaker 1: on my personal space.

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Speaker 4: Sales discriminatory, Holly, do you discriminate against men based on

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Speaker 4: the side of their testimony?

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Speaker 5: No?

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Speaker 2: I do not, although when I flew to Manchester for

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Speaker 2: my dad's birthday not that long ago. On the flight over,

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Speaker 2: I was in the window seat and next to me

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Speaker 2: were two enormous men. And when I say enormous, I

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Speaker 2: mean like muscly enormous, like bodybuilder dudes with the very

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Speaker 2: involuntary mad spread as described, and it was very uncomfortable.

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Speaker 2: But what I thought about this when I read it

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Speaker 2: is I was like, that is really sad that that

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Speaker 2: has to be a thing.

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Speaker 4: I thought it was sad, no, because on the one hand,

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Speaker 4: I get it, there are a lot of women walking

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Speaker 4: around who have, in all seriousness, been the victim of

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Speaker 4: some sort of sexual violence and sitting next to men

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Speaker 4: can be scary. I get that. On the other hand,

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Speaker 4: we are presupposing that every single man is a potential criminal.

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Speaker 1: That That's not why I said I want to do it,

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Speaker 1: But that's what this is. That's what the safety.

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Speaker 4: It's about. Safety. Like the FBI have come out and

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Speaker 4: said as well that like, instances of sexual violence on

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Speaker 4: planes are high, have become higher, and that's why they

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Speaker 4: do it in India to keep women safe, and that's

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Speaker 4: what they think about it.

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Speaker 1: Like that, I thought about it more in the same

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Speaker 1: way that particularly if you're on a long flight, traveling

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Speaker 1: can be vulnerable because you're asleep, you know, essentially you're unconscious.

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Speaker 1: Some people might be drunk. Don't recommend it, But my

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Speaker 1: point is I saw it more as just in the

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Speaker 1: same yeah, in the same way that there's a ride

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Speaker 1: share company called Siba where if you prefer a female

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Speaker 1: ride share driver you.

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Speaker 3: Can choose that.

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Speaker 2: But again, that's a good thing, but the reason for

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Speaker 2: it is sad. How much would you pay to get

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Speaker 2: your X back? Look, there are plenty of people listening

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Speaker 2: to this who'd be like I would pay for them

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Speaker 2: to have contact me please. But I learned this week

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Speaker 2: that you can employ someone to help you win back

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Speaker 2: your ex and the ex back coaching, as it's called,

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Speaker 2: is big business. Now I've added this to the very

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Speaker 2: long list of things to worry about, because generally speaking,

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Speaker 2: but not always, getting your X back is a terrible idea.

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Speaker 2: Just ask j Lo anyway, YouTube, TikTok Facebook are crawling

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Speaker 2: with coaches who are getting millions of views telling people

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Speaker 2: how to win back their exes. Here is a little

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Speaker 2: grab of some of the kind of advice they're giving.

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Speaker 5: Especially for guys that are needy. They're desperate. They're looking

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Speaker 5: for any reason. Oh, she's liking my Facebook posts? Again,

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Speaker 5: does that mean I call her and ask her on

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Speaker 5: a date? Fucking no way. So they're liking your Facebook

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Speaker 5: posts or even commenting on social media posts does not

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Speaker 5: count as them contacting you. Do not engage in any

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Speaker 5: BS conversation or nonsensical chit chat when they contact you. Again,

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Speaker 5: be direct, be decisive, and go for what you want

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Speaker 5: by saying this, Hey, it's great to hear from I'd

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Speaker 5: love to see you. When are you free to get together?

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Speaker 5: I was super scared a number of months ago when

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Speaker 5: Gabriel coached me to text my ex.

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Speaker 1: But now I rely on Gabriel to give me a.

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Speaker 3: Little remindsers and little preps as I go along the path.

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Speaker 6: And you start to dominantly focus on you and having

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Speaker 6: this incredible life, incredible life.

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Speaker 1: The more you.

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Speaker 6: Are doing you, the less you are doing then the

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Speaker 6: more they we fool the miss in you, and they

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Speaker 6: will feel something has shifted because we are all energetically connected.

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Speaker 4: Yes, this is a shit. My mum told me at

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Speaker 4: fourteen when I was jumped by my first boyfriend. This

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Speaker 4: is not profound.

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Speaker 2: So all these people, how do they make money well.

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Speaker 2: As Jesse beautifully explained on Wednesday when we were explaining

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Speaker 2: TikTok to Andrew Take, social media is marketing. So these

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Speaker 2: people get millions of views with their advice on these

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Speaker 2: various platforms, and then people reach out and say can

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Speaker 2: you help me? And they say, funnily enough, I can.

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Speaker 2: I'll give you one on one coaching session for five

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Speaker 2: hundred bucks.

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Speaker 1: Here.

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Speaker 2: If we want to add on text message coaching, yeah,

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Speaker 2: my course, here's more by my book. Yeah. And apparently

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Speaker 2: you know, the coaches are saying that there could be

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Speaker 2: no more important way to invest your money. As coach Benny,

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Speaker 2: who's one of the guys you heard there and who's

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Speaker 2: one of the big deals in this space, says, think

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Speaker 2: of the worst breakup you've had, would you try to

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Speaker 2: solve it for the price of a PlayStation? I think

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Speaker 2: if they're X said hey, give me a PlayStation and

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Speaker 2: we'll be back together, they do it. So I can

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Speaker 2: sleep at night just fine, because I love that I'm

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Speaker 2: helping people. We want to save you the money.

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Speaker 3: Friends.

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Speaker 2: Most of this advice is play hard to get and

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Speaker 2: work on yourself.

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Speaker 1: What do we think I want to ask? Is it

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Speaker 1: ever a good idea to get back with an X, like,

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Speaker 1: it's not they're an X for a reason.

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Speaker 4: I can think of a few examples in my life

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Speaker 4: where there has been a small like a breakup that

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Speaker 4: lasted a very short amount of time.

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Speaker 2: Shit which last of the year.

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Speaker 4: Your husband is your ex.

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Speaker 2: You're one of the people I was thinking about when

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Speaker 2: because I.

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Speaker 1: Why don't I make these videos? Yes?

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Speaker 4: Yeah, you get your expack.

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Speaker 2: My general position is that it's never a good idea

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Speaker 2: because all the problems you've got are still there. But

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Speaker 2: then I was like, oh, but Maya did it?

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Speaker 4: And wait, Maya, how'd you get your X back?

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Speaker 1: Well, Jesse, if you do my coaching cass and watch

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Speaker 1: my video with my YouTube ads in it, you too

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Speaker 1: could get back with your ex. The thing is ole

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Speaker 1: I watched and listened to none of these, But I

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Speaker 1: just listened to those then, and no, that's true, I

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Speaker 1: didn't before. There's a difference between the advice that the

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Speaker 1: men give and the women give. So the women who

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Speaker 1: do this coaching, their advice is basically, believe in yourself,

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Speaker 1: manifest him back, and also go complete yourself. Essentially, she's like,

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Speaker 1: don't pine, go be great, fill up your own cup.

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Speaker 1: And then you'll be more attractive to him, whereas men

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Speaker 1: is more about tricking. Yeah, like trickery and play hard

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Speaker 1: to get, you know, do this, And I just thought

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Speaker 1: that's really interesting. So I actually think that the woman's advice,

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Speaker 1: which is to go work on yourself, is not bad advice.

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Speaker 2: It's not. But to be honest, a lot of the

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Speaker 2: men in this space say the same thing too. They say,

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Speaker 2: go exercise, make yourself desirable, date other people, and then

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Speaker 2: she'll want you back, which is not exactly rocket science,

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Speaker 2: but you're right here that there are some very specific

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Speaker 2: strategies to be employed, and I'd love to put some

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Speaker 2: of them to you, Jesse and see what you think,

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Speaker 2: because you know you're an expert.

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Speaker 1: Have you two ever got back with X's yes, just

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Speaker 1: XX or actually actually other ones?

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Speaker 2: Was not a good idea, And in fact, you know what,

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Speaker 2: when I did watch a few of these videos for this,

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Speaker 2: a lot of them said, and this is how I

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Speaker 2: got my X back. We're not together.

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Speaker 1: Anything, but anyway they always go. But it was my choice.

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Speaker 1: No contact is very big, right. One of the OG

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Speaker 1: guys in this space is a go I called Corey Wayne,

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Speaker 1: and he did this big video like seven Ways to

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Speaker 1: get your expack that's had like millions of views, and

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Speaker 1: you heard a bit of him in there. He was

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Speaker 1: the one who said, just she's liking your Facebook photos

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Speaker 1: so very very big. Here is no contact, he says,

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Speaker 1: walk away if they dump you. This is if they

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Speaker 1: dump you, ye right, and never contact them again for

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Speaker 1: any reason. No birthday, no, sorry your father died, no,

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Speaker 1: like happy Christmas whatever. In order for them to miss you,

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Speaker 1: they need to realize that you're serious and that you

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Speaker 1: are gone, and that there is a space there to

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Speaker 1: be missed.

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Speaker 2: Do we agree with this.

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Speaker 4: One hundred percent? So the best advice anymore I can

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Speaker 4: give you, I have followed it precisely. Never to do

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Speaker 4: it's impossible to do. I was told you need to

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Speaker 4: go no contact, and I was like, yeah, yeah, no

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Speaker 4: I'm not texting.

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Speaker 1: Can I ask, is this advice? Like the market for

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Speaker 1: these videos and courses and stuff, is it always people

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Speaker 1: who were dumped? Or sometimes it's the dumper.

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Speaker 4: It's almost regret people who were dump It's.

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Speaker 2: Nearly it was probably were dumped. But I watched a

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Speaker 2: few that were like, were you dumped because you did

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Speaker 2: something stupid like cheap or and they will they tailor

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Speaker 2: a bit there. They're like, you have to make her

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Speaker 2: understand that you're very sorry. See him. But this guy

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Speaker 2: would be like you state that. He's like, you need

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Speaker 2: to absolutely put your intention out there. So you're like,

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Speaker 2: I want to get back together. I don't want to

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Speaker 2: be friends. Being friends apparently very bad. I want to

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Speaker 2: get back together. I'm very sorry for what I did.

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Speaker 2: And then no contact. Like, so you state your case.

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Speaker 1: So you do say I want to get back together,

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Speaker 1: if that's what you want.

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Speaker 2: See.

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Speaker 4: I think that this is capitalizing on literal addiction. And

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Speaker 4: there's all the studies that you know, we've all heard about.

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Speaker 4: I'm sure about brain scans and how they can tell that.

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Speaker 4: It's like the dopamine centers. It's the same as drug addiction.

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Speaker 4: So it's like the same as if you're an addict

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Speaker 4: and someone offers you something, you'll pay any amount of

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Speaker 4: money because of how desperately you want it. Like there

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Speaker 4: were stages in my life where I would have given

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Speaker 4: every cent to my name to get back with an X.

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Speaker 4: That money would have been seventy two dollars, but like

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Speaker 4: there was a lot of more of it.

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Speaker 1: So what did you do?

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Speaker 3: Did you try anything.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, Yeah, there's definitely been some tearful phone calls where

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Speaker 4: upon reflection, it was begging. Begging.

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Speaker 2: Begging is on the no Begging is very much on

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Speaker 2: the no list for both men and women in these guys.

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Speaker 4: Weird because there's something about selling yourself to someone who

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Speaker 4: doesn't want you, which is particularly bad for the ego,

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Speaker 4: because I think that when you get dumped, I don't

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Speaker 4: think you're chasing your ex. I think you're chasing your

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Speaker 4: ego because it has been obliterated and you're just like

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Speaker 4: to restore some sense of myself and my self worth.

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Speaker 4: I need you back, which is not what you want.

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Speaker 4: But the saddest thing I ever did, and I hadn't

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Speaker 4: thought about it in more than ten years, was I

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Speaker 4: got dumped by this ex boyfriend and his birthday was

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Speaker 4: coming out, and I was trying to do the no

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Speaker 4: contact thing unsuccessfully, and I made him hand made him

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Speaker 4: photo albums from the trip to Europe we've taken together.

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Speaker 4: So I printed out photos with like little comments like

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Speaker 4: for his birthday and no chill in the chill, And

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Speaker 4: I had UNI assignments due and like they were late

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Speaker 4: because I was making the fucking saddest album photos he

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Speaker 4: didn't want to look at.

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Speaker 1: Maybe that's part of your grieving process. That's the general restor.

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Speaker 2: You should have made it and then said it on fire.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, no, I gave it.

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Speaker 2: This guy says his vision for this is no contact,

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Speaker 2: no contact, no contact. Then she or he whoever you know,

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Speaker 2: is going to reach out to you and say, hey,

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Speaker 2: thinking about you today, or how you doing, wondering how

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Speaker 2: you doing? He says, at that point, you engage in

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Speaker 2: no bullshit chit chat, two messages tops. You say, let's

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Speaker 2: get together and have dinner. Like no, don't accept.

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Speaker 1: Any sexy even just the way you sit.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, He's like, don't mess around with any like, oh,

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Speaker 2: you know, what are you doing? I'm just sitting around

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Speaker 2: watching TV. He says this, and this is what you

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Speaker 2: have to do. Make a dinner date. It's got to

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Speaker 2: be evening. It's got to be at your house. You're

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Speaker 2: cooking dinner together, because the idea is we're hanging out,

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Speaker 2: having fun, hooking up. He says, you have to start again,

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Speaker 2: so you have to treat it like a new relationship,

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Speaker 2: no looking back, no credits for previous things. You're like,

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Speaker 2: come around, we'll make dinner together. It'll be great. And

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Speaker 2: if she's not ready to do that, you just go, oh,

302
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Speaker 2: gotta go really busy, give me a call when you are.

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Speaker 5: That's it.

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Speaker 1: That's really sexy.

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Speaker 3: I want to get you. And we never even broke up.

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Speaker 1: Do we think this is good advice? I do a

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Speaker 1: lot of pressure.

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Speaker 4: It is, and there is something that happens when a

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Speaker 4: relation the way you.

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Speaker 1: Just saddle that.

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Speaker 3: I'm like, okay, that's what.

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Speaker 1: Okay, I'll come around.

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Speaker 2: I'll bring some fish.

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Speaker 4: I think the relationship, Yeah, there's something that happens when

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Speaker 4: it deteriorates, where even I have dumped someone, the relationship

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Speaker 4: is ended. They've been trying to do no contact on me.

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Speaker 4: I don't want them back, but I still would like

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Speaker 4: their attention. You have done that, and then you kind

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Speaker 4: of put your line out to be like which is me?

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Speaker 3: Which is me?

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Speaker 1: It's really cral just checking and see if you're okay, Oh.

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Speaker 4: We're going to be friends. I still want to be

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Speaker 4: friends because I like how you made me feel abound.

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Speaker 1: Oh I hope she's not swimming too far away. I'm

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Speaker 1: just going to tug on that. I don't want to

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Speaker 1: catch the fish, but I'm just going to tug on it.

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Speaker 2: I mean, most of my breakups in my life have

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Speaker 2: not been like a someone was dumped. It's just been

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Speaker 2: a kind of collapse, do you know.

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Speaker 7: What I mean?

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Speaker 2: The relationships just collapsed and somebody ultimately has to be

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Speaker 2: the person to call it. But it hasn't been as

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Speaker 2: clear as like you dump me dump So then you're

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Speaker 2: on this like roller coaster of but we really liked

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Speaker 2: each other, maybe we could just be friends and all that.

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Speaker 2: And he's like, never ever agree to that. If friendship

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Speaker 2: isn't what you want, then do not say it, because

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Speaker 2: he's like, this guy is very much If you agree

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Speaker 2: a friendship, you're going to stay in the friendship zone.

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Speaker 2: Except no excuses, he says. If she says or he says,

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Speaker 2: I don't want to come over and make dinner, you

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Speaker 2: have to always say I've got to run, get in

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Speaker 2: touch when you change your mind, and then walk away

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Speaker 2: and never look back. If they refuse to set a

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Speaker 2: date twice, never ask them again.

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Speaker 4: I think that's true because what my mistake was, I

347
00:16:02,007 --> 00:16:06,767
Speaker 4: just gave all of myself freely, and they have untangled

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Speaker 4: themselves from the relationship part, so they owe you literally nothing,

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Speaker 4: but they still have your friendship. So whenever they want

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Speaker 4: something from you, whenever they want the chad or to

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Speaker 4: feel good or whatever, you can such other people exactly right.

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Speaker 3: So that's what happened.

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Speaker 1: When you gave him that, we actually did get back

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Speaker 1: together for a short period of time worked.

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Speaker 4: I think that was a pathetic low point. I think

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Speaker 4: it was actually when I tried the no contact thing,

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Speaker 4: he came back, we got back together, realized that it

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Speaker 4: wasn't working, and then I think I ended it. It

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Speaker 4: was like being a mad person, Like what happened to

360
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Speaker 4: my head? My sense of priority, my sense of self

361
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Speaker 4: worth was so in the toilet, Like I look back

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Speaker 4: and I'm just horrified by some of the things I did.

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Speaker 4: I mean, clearly, the best thing is no contact. Go

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Speaker 4: and I don't know, learn a language.

365
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Speaker 2: It's interesting about these coaches, right because from where I

366
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Speaker 2: am now, that'll do it all my wisdom under my belt,

367
00:17:00,327 --> 00:17:00,727
Speaker 2: et cetera.

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Speaker 3: Blah blah.

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Speaker 2: You were what twenty.

370
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Speaker 4: Five younger like nineteen?

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Speaker 2: So what the hell did you know? Do you know

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Speaker 2: what I mean? And that is where these people step in, right.

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Speaker 4: Why these people have made that album.

374
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Speaker 2: But also this is why they're making all their money.

375
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Speaker 3: Had in my first baby twenty five.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, but like, even so you're nineteen, you're twenty or

377
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Speaker 2: twenty one, what do you know about relationships really and

378
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Speaker 2: how they work and and all that stuff. So that's

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Speaker 2: why everybody's talking to these people because we don't know.

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Speaker 1: I just think it's for the same reason that sometimes

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Speaker 1: psychics and fortune tellers know that the most common time

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Speaker 1: for people to come to them is around a breakup.

383
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Speaker 1: And I think that heartbroken people are really easy to exploit.

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Speaker 1: I'm not saying that everybody does exploit them, but as

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Speaker 1: you said, Jesse, you would do anything, like when someone

386
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Speaker 1: breaks your heart, you would do anything to put it

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Speaker 1: back together again, and you invariably think that the only.

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Speaker 3: Way to do that is getting back together with your ex.

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Speaker 1: Now, I would actually say that the best thing to

390
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Speaker 1: do is to go to therapy to understand what just happened,

391
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Speaker 1: to make sense of what just happened, And I think

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Speaker 1: that's probably the best way to not get pulled back

393
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Speaker 1: into something that Ultimately, if someone breaks up with you,

394
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Speaker 1: they're freeing your future. I think you have to reframe it.

395
00:18:16,767 --> 00:18:20,127
Speaker 1: They're freeing your future because they're saying you're not right

396
00:18:20,167 --> 00:18:22,527
Speaker 1: for me. Or I'm not right for you for each other,

397
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Speaker 1: I don't want to be with you. They're basically saying that.

398
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Speaker 1: Remember when we did the live show, Jesse, and you're

399
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Speaker 1: talking about some really bad breakups.

400
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Speaker 3: This was a few live shows ago.

401
00:18:29,447 --> 00:18:33,167
Speaker 1: But you were talking about how someone's seen got to

402
00:18:33,207 --> 00:18:36,287
Speaker 1: know you really well, seen you naked everything, and gone.

403
00:18:36,167 --> 00:18:38,087
Speaker 3: I don't want that, No thanks.

404
00:18:37,847 --> 00:18:41,607
Speaker 4: I don't want it, and actually crushing worse than that.

405
00:18:42,047 --> 00:18:44,567
Speaker 4: And as someone who's experienced it, is like if you

406
00:18:44,607 --> 00:18:47,207
Speaker 4: then get back with that X who broke up with you,

407
00:18:47,887 --> 00:18:51,087
Speaker 4: the torture of spending prolonged time with someone, you can

408
00:18:51,127 --> 00:18:53,007
Speaker 4: see it in their eyes. They don't feel the same

409
00:18:53,007 --> 00:18:55,887
Speaker 4: way about you. Maybe they're tolerating you. I like you

410
00:18:55,967 --> 00:18:58,767
Speaker 4: anymore like that is more corrosive to itself.

411
00:18:58,887 --> 00:19:02,207
Speaker 2: I don't like that characterization of what breakups are, because

412
00:19:02,287 --> 00:19:05,247
Speaker 2: of course it feels like that. But when you've done

413
00:19:05,287 --> 00:19:07,727
Speaker 2: it the other way, right, you know, when you've broken

414
00:19:07,807 --> 00:19:11,127
Speaker 2: up with someone, you rarely disgusted by them. It's rarely

415
00:19:11,207 --> 00:19:13,847
Speaker 2: like I hate everything about you, You're awful. It just

416
00:19:13,927 --> 00:19:16,047
Speaker 2: isn't right for you. And so I know it's such

417
00:19:16,047 --> 00:19:18,367
Speaker 2: a cliche where just this time isn't right, this isn't

418
00:19:18,367 --> 00:19:20,407
Speaker 2: the right moment. But when you're on the other side

419
00:19:20,407 --> 00:19:21,967
Speaker 2: of it, that's usually how you feel.

420
00:19:22,047 --> 00:19:22,807
Speaker 1: You rarely are.

421
00:19:22,807 --> 00:19:24,607
Speaker 2: Standing looking at somebody in front of you and going

422
00:19:25,127 --> 00:19:26,567
Speaker 2: you're just like, no.

423
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Speaker 1: I don't think that. That's what Jesse was implying then,

424
00:19:29,487 --> 00:19:32,887
Speaker 1: that they're going vomitsh. I mean breakups are really I mean,

425
00:19:32,967 --> 00:19:35,487
Speaker 1: hopefully they're not cruel. I mean sometimes people cheating stuff,

426
00:19:35,567 --> 00:19:38,047
Speaker 1: but most people don't go, I think you're disgusting.

427
00:19:38,047 --> 00:19:39,167
Speaker 3: I don't want to be with you anymore.

428
00:19:39,167 --> 00:19:39,487
Speaker 1: I don't.

429
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Speaker 2: But what I'm arguing with is not that I'm not

430
00:19:41,167 --> 00:19:43,607
Speaker 2: saying they're saying that, but that's even not what they're thinking.

431
00:19:43,807 --> 00:19:45,167
Speaker 3: No, but Ie, you're telling yourself.

432
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Speaker 1: I think what.

433
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Speaker 3: They are doing is saying, I don't want to be

434
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Speaker 3: with you.

435
00:19:48,447 --> 00:19:51,927
Speaker 1: So even in the nicest way, it's like there's nothing

436
00:19:51,967 --> 00:19:54,567
Speaker 1: more vulnerable. I've seen you naked, I've spent all this

437
00:19:54,647 --> 00:19:56,567
Speaker 1: intimate time with you. I've seen you in your highs

438
00:19:56,567 --> 00:19:58,887
Speaker 1: and your lows, and you know what, not for me.

439
00:19:58,927 --> 00:20:01,287
Speaker 1: It's not for me, I know, lovely not for me.

440
00:20:01,407 --> 00:20:03,607
Speaker 2: But the point I'm making is that I don't think

441
00:20:03,647 --> 00:20:06,327
Speaker 2: it's that simple. It's not that you're not for them.

442
00:20:06,407 --> 00:20:08,727
Speaker 2: It's that you two aren't right for each other in

443
00:20:08,767 --> 00:20:12,247
Speaker 2: that way I had anyway, it's nitpicking. I'd like to

444
00:20:12,287 --> 00:20:14,727
Speaker 2: know if we think rules and games work right, because really,

445
00:20:14,767 --> 00:20:16,887
Speaker 2: when I listened to all these I was just like,

446
00:20:16,927 --> 00:20:18,687
Speaker 2: this is like the rules from back in the day,

447
00:20:18,727 --> 00:20:22,127
Speaker 2: those dating books. I'd never call him, don't chase him.

448
00:20:22,167 --> 00:20:24,647
Speaker 2: It's basically play hard to get and make yourself seem

449
00:20:24,687 --> 00:20:27,967
Speaker 2: like a really high valued property. Remember that person, so

450
00:20:28,087 --> 00:20:30,167
Speaker 2: you know you work on yourself. They see you out

451
00:20:30,167 --> 00:20:32,767
Speaker 2: and about. Kate Middleton did this brilliantly. Remember back in

452
00:20:32,767 --> 00:20:34,407
Speaker 2: the day when she and William broke up.

453
00:20:34,487 --> 00:20:36,007
Speaker 1: Take us back, So back.

454
00:20:35,847 --> 00:20:38,007
Speaker 2: In the day when they broke up, they'd been together

455
00:20:38,007 --> 00:20:41,367
Speaker 2: for quite a long time. He hadn't proposed. The media

456
00:20:41,407 --> 00:20:43,927
Speaker 2: were being awful to her, wady katy, wady katy, when's

457
00:20:43,927 --> 00:20:46,127
Speaker 2: he going to propose? And for a short term that

458
00:20:46,167 --> 00:20:50,647
Speaker 2: he broke up, and that summer she suddenly was photographed

459
00:20:50,647 --> 00:20:53,567
Speaker 2: out at all these clubs in Chelsea. She was looking gorgeous,

460
00:20:53,607 --> 00:20:55,687
Speaker 2: she was wearing short skirts, she was.

461
00:20:55,687 --> 00:20:58,847
Speaker 3: Like laughing, smiling, she was rowing.

462
00:20:58,687 --> 00:21:01,167
Speaker 2: Yep, she was rowing. She was doing all these things

463
00:21:01,207 --> 00:21:03,927
Speaker 2: that were like very look how amazing I am. And

464
00:21:03,967 --> 00:21:05,887
Speaker 2: I'm sure she was probably having a hot girl summer,

465
00:21:06,247 --> 00:21:10,567
Speaker 2: but it worked brilliantly. Right, do get games work? Because

466
00:21:10,567 --> 00:21:13,327
Speaker 2: that I hate those kind of rule things. A. I'm

467
00:21:13,327 --> 00:21:15,207
Speaker 2: not very good at them, like you, Jesse. I'm just like,

468
00:21:15,247 --> 00:21:16,807
Speaker 2: if I want something, I want it and I'm going

469
00:21:16,887 --> 00:21:19,047
Speaker 2: to just call it up and do it. I'm not

470
00:21:19,127 --> 00:21:22,407
Speaker 2: very good at like denying myself. But do we think

471
00:21:22,447 --> 00:21:25,287
Speaker 2: that all relationships have a portion of game playing. It's

472
00:21:25,327 --> 00:21:26,567
Speaker 2: just whether you're honest about it or not.

473
00:21:26,927 --> 00:21:30,927
Speaker 4: No amount of game playing changes the unfortunate reality that

474
00:21:31,007 --> 00:21:33,687
Speaker 4: the other person has this little thing called free will.

475
00:21:34,487 --> 00:21:36,527
Speaker 4: And that's a problem with the game as well, is

476
00:21:36,567 --> 00:21:39,207
Speaker 4: that people can pull all the tricks, but if the

477
00:21:39,247 --> 00:21:42,327
Speaker 4: other person doesn't want you, you can juggle and stand

478
00:21:42,407 --> 00:21:44,447
Speaker 4: upside down, But.

479
00:21:44,407 --> 00:21:47,247
Speaker 1: It comes down to why you broke up, and that

480
00:21:47,407 --> 00:21:51,007
Speaker 1: some things are fixable and some things are not fixable.

481
00:21:51,087 --> 00:21:54,887
Speaker 1: So I once read this thing called the ninety ten

482
00:21:55,087 --> 00:22:00,127
Speaker 1: rule of breakups that most people after they end a relationship,

483
00:22:00,487 --> 00:22:02,527
Speaker 1: not in every case, but it will often be because

484
00:22:02,887 --> 00:22:06,007
Speaker 1: the person that they were with, they're like ninety percent

485
00:22:06,047 --> 00:22:09,407
Speaker 1: of them and ten percent they just couldn't stand. So

486
00:22:09,447 --> 00:22:14,047
Speaker 1: the next person that they go out with will be

487
00:22:14,527 --> 00:22:15,287
Speaker 1: the ten percent.

488
00:22:15,807 --> 00:22:17,727
Speaker 4: Affairs often fall flash, Yeah, because you.

489
00:22:17,727 --> 00:22:20,607
Speaker 1: Chose the ten and then that's why it's a rebound,

490
00:22:20,647 --> 00:22:23,007
Speaker 1: because you're really attracted to the ten percent that was

491
00:22:23,047 --> 00:22:25,967
Speaker 1: wrong with your ex and this person has and then

492
00:22:26,407 --> 00:22:28,727
Speaker 1: you realize that's not self sustaining, so then you go, oh,

493
00:22:28,767 --> 00:22:30,727
Speaker 1: you know what, the ninety percent was actually quite good,

494
00:22:30,967 --> 00:22:33,607
Speaker 1: and then you go back. So I think that's there

495
00:22:33,607 --> 00:22:34,567
Speaker 1: are a lot of reasons there.

496
00:22:34,727 --> 00:22:36,447
Speaker 4: I'm thinking of a few couples I know who are

497
00:22:36,447 --> 00:22:40,887
Speaker 4: married who kind of just before the marriage or significantly

498
00:22:40,887 --> 00:22:43,087
Speaker 4: into the relationship, there was a hiccup where they split

499
00:22:43,447 --> 00:22:45,687
Speaker 4: for actually one was a weekend and the other one

500
00:22:45,727 --> 00:22:48,407
Speaker 4: was months and months and months, and it was about commitment.

501
00:22:48,807 --> 00:22:53,047
Speaker 4: It was about a crossroads in their relationship, and both

502
00:22:53,087 --> 00:22:56,807
Speaker 4: of them are together, are still together, you know, decades later.

503
00:22:56,927 --> 00:22:59,327
Speaker 2: I'm a firm believer that the most important thing in

504
00:22:59,367 --> 00:23:03,167
Speaker 2: relationships is timing, Like it just is. It's not even compatibility.

505
00:23:03,207 --> 00:23:06,647
Speaker 2: It's like, if you're looking to settle down in averted comments,

506
00:23:07,047 --> 00:23:09,567
Speaker 2: you both have to want that. The classic sex City

507
00:23:09,607 --> 00:23:13,007
Speaker 2: line about whether your lights on or not. Timing is everything.

508
00:23:13,487 --> 00:23:15,767
Speaker 4: I had a friend who Tolmy two helpful things if

509
00:23:15,807 --> 00:23:19,127
Speaker 4: you're still pining over an X. The first is that

510
00:23:19,207 --> 00:23:21,327
Speaker 4: the person that you want is not the same person

511
00:23:21,567 --> 00:23:23,407
Speaker 4: who you were with. It's often a very because the

512
00:23:23,407 --> 00:23:26,487
Speaker 4: person you are with actually liked you. This person, this

513
00:23:26,647 --> 00:23:29,767
Speaker 4: version of them, isn't like that anymore. And the second

514
00:23:30,167 --> 00:23:32,847
Speaker 4: is that you're not grieving them. You're grieving what you

515
00:23:32,887 --> 00:23:34,767
Speaker 4: thought your future was going to look like, and it's

516
00:23:34,807 --> 00:23:36,727
Speaker 4: not going to look like that anymore. And I thought

517
00:23:36,767 --> 00:23:39,647
Speaker 4: that was very helpful. It's not about the person. It's

518
00:23:39,647 --> 00:23:42,487
Speaker 4: often in the situation where I've got the X back,

519
00:23:42,807 --> 00:23:44,847
Speaker 4: I've looked at them and gone, oh, I actually don't

520
00:23:44,847 --> 00:23:45,687
Speaker 4: want you anymore.

521
00:23:45,847 --> 00:23:49,687
Speaker 1: Do you know everyone's got that vision of themselves. I

522
00:23:49,727 --> 00:23:53,887
Speaker 1: assume everyone to everyone who's been dumped at their most pathetic.

523
00:23:54,007 --> 00:23:56,647
Speaker 3: And for you, it's looking through the photo albums.

524
00:23:57,047 --> 00:24:02,287
Speaker 1: For me, it's sitting in my car outside his apartment,

525
00:24:02,847 --> 00:24:06,447
Speaker 1: counting up the level of flaws to see if his

526
00:24:06,607 --> 00:24:08,927
Speaker 1: lights on or not because he got back with his

527
00:24:09,487 --> 00:24:12,487
Speaker 1: I was the interim thing he got back with, and

528
00:24:12,527 --> 00:24:15,927
Speaker 1: then calling a restaurant that we liked to go to

529
00:24:15,927 --> 00:24:16,647
Speaker 1: to see if he.

530
00:24:16,607 --> 00:24:17,847
Speaker 3: Had a booking with her.

531
00:24:18,167 --> 00:24:20,407
Speaker 1: Oh that's so and I used to do it every day.

532
00:24:20,887 --> 00:24:23,047
Speaker 2: I once I think I told you this story at

533
00:24:23,047 --> 00:24:25,407
Speaker 2: a live show, which is a low moment in itself.

534
00:24:25,887 --> 00:24:28,767
Speaker 2: I'll never forget the heartbreak of my ex, who I

535
00:24:28,807 --> 00:24:31,127
Speaker 2: was so crazy about, and we were pretending we are friends.

536
00:24:31,167 --> 00:24:33,607
Speaker 2: This is the problem with pretending you're friends. Yeah, I

537
00:24:33,647 --> 00:24:37,247
Speaker 2: was staying at his house and sleeping on his couch

538
00:24:37,247 --> 00:24:39,367
Speaker 2: and listening to him having really hot sex with his

539
00:24:39,527 --> 00:24:41,167
Speaker 2: new girlfriend. That's through the wall.

540
00:24:41,927 --> 00:24:43,487
Speaker 1: I've never been more miserable.

541
00:24:43,167 --> 00:24:43,607
Speaker 2: In my life.

542
00:24:43,607 --> 00:24:46,207
Speaker 4: Actually, that reminds me of being on one of my

543
00:24:46,807 --> 00:24:49,367
Speaker 4: coming back one of my phone calls where I was

544
00:24:49,407 --> 00:24:51,967
Speaker 4: doing a little bit of the begging and hearing something

545
00:24:52,007 --> 00:24:54,927
Speaker 4: in the background and going, oh, you're actually with another

546
00:24:55,007 --> 00:24:58,367
Speaker 4: girl right now, right now.

547
00:24:58,407 --> 00:25:00,927
Speaker 2: Friends, you don't need a break up coach on YouTube.

548
00:25:00,967 --> 00:25:02,287
Speaker 2: You just need us and each other.

549
00:25:02,527 --> 00:25:05,367
Speaker 1: We want to hear your stories. Out Louders, share your

550
00:25:05,447 --> 00:25:08,407
Speaker 1: stories with us. Either send us a voice note, go

551
00:25:08,447 --> 00:25:10,767
Speaker 1: in the out Louders Facebook group, will leave a little

552
00:25:10,767 --> 00:25:12,287
Speaker 1: message for us on Instagram.

553
00:25:12,367 --> 00:25:13,207
Speaker 4: It's not fake.

554
00:25:13,727 --> 00:25:18,607
Speaker 7: His lighter is on, that's all what late men are

555
00:25:18,647 --> 00:25:22,367
Speaker 7: like cabs. When they're available, their life goes on. They

556
00:25:22,407 --> 00:25:24,887
Speaker 7: wake up one day and they decide they're ready to

557
00:25:24,927 --> 00:25:28,007
Speaker 7: settle down, have babies, whatever, and they turn their light up.

558
00:25:28,247 --> 00:25:30,047
Speaker 7: The next woman they pick up, Boom, that's the one

559
00:25:30,047 --> 00:25:33,767
Speaker 7: they'll marry. It's not fake, it's dumb, luck Loud.

560
00:25:35,847 --> 00:25:38,887
Speaker 1: It's Friday out Louders. So we want to help set

561
00:25:38,967 --> 00:25:43,647
Speaker 1: up your weekend with our best recommendations. And I don't

562
00:25:43,647 --> 00:25:45,527
Speaker 1: think I'm going to go first because mine's a little

563
00:25:45,567 --> 00:25:46,527
Speaker 1: bit self involved.

564
00:25:47,007 --> 00:25:50,527
Speaker 3: Holly, what do you suggest can we get stuck into

565
00:25:50,607 --> 00:25:51,367
Speaker 3: over the weekend.

566
00:25:51,487 --> 00:25:53,287
Speaker 2: This is one of those recommendations I do all the

567
00:25:53,287 --> 00:25:54,287
Speaker 2: time that I'm not sure it's a.

568
00:25:54,287 --> 00:25:55,807
Speaker 1: Recommendation, you know what.

569
00:25:55,807 --> 00:25:58,847
Speaker 2: I'm always like you might not like it, but I'm.

570
00:25:58,687 --> 00:26:00,967
Speaker 4: Bringing a good recommendation, luckily, but go HOLLI.

571
00:26:01,207 --> 00:26:03,487
Speaker 2: Okay. This is for those of us who are leaning

572
00:26:03,527 --> 00:26:06,207
Speaker 2: into the American horror show at the moment. We've been

573
00:26:06,247 --> 00:26:09,447
Speaker 2: talking obviously about the American election on the pop US

574
00:26:09,487 --> 00:26:11,207
Speaker 2: this week. We talked about it on Monday and Wednesday,

575
00:26:11,487 --> 00:26:12,767
Speaker 2: so I'm not going to go on about it. But

576
00:26:13,487 --> 00:26:15,967
Speaker 2: if you are finding yourself obsessed with it, there are

577
00:26:15,967 --> 00:26:18,927
Speaker 2: two things which and neither of them will cheer you up.

578
00:26:19,087 --> 00:26:21,407
Speaker 2: Just to be really clear, neither of them will cheer

579
00:26:21,407 --> 00:26:24,127
Speaker 2: you up, but they will indulge your obsession. The first

580
00:26:24,487 --> 00:26:27,287
Speaker 2: is four Corners from Monday Night, which is obviously ABC's

581
00:26:27,327 --> 00:26:30,927
Speaker 2: investigative reporting show. They are doing a two parter on

582
00:26:31,047 --> 00:26:33,447
Speaker 2: what a Donald Trump presidency.

583
00:26:33,007 --> 00:26:33,607
Speaker 1: Will look like.

584
00:26:33,687 --> 00:26:36,167
Speaker 2: It's called Retribution. That gives you a little hint.

585
00:26:37,127 --> 00:26:40,127
Speaker 1: It's about Project twenty twenty five, isn't it saying.

586
00:26:41,567 --> 00:26:42,447
Speaker 2: It's hop line?

587
00:26:42,647 --> 00:26:44,887
Speaker 1: This is no man's land. This is where the bad

588
00:26:44,927 --> 00:26:45,447
Speaker 1: guys are.

589
00:26:45,607 --> 00:26:46,567
Speaker 3: Who are these people?

590
00:26:46,727 --> 00:26:47,887
Speaker 1: This is an invasion.

591
00:26:48,127 --> 00:26:50,487
Speaker 3: We've been called murderers, baby killers.

592
00:26:50,687 --> 00:26:51,367
Speaker 7: We've all seen them.

593
00:26:51,607 --> 00:26:53,927
Speaker 1: Sha black men find it relatively admirable.

594
00:26:54,127 --> 00:26:56,407
Speaker 2: Is it clear President Trump wanted you to overturn the result?

595
00:26:56,447 --> 00:26:57,367
Speaker 1: In of course he did.

596
00:27:00,287 --> 00:27:02,527
Speaker 5: Donald Trump will go down as one of the greatest

597
00:27:02,567 --> 00:27:03,807
Speaker 5: presidents in history.

598
00:27:03,967 --> 00:27:07,407
Speaker 6: If we don't lean as time, America's or terrifying.

599
00:27:07,527 --> 00:27:11,647
Speaker 2: So basically, Mark has spent months and got amazing access

600
00:27:11,647 --> 00:27:13,967
Speaker 2: and interviews with lots of people who worked with Trump

601
00:27:13,967 --> 00:27:16,887
Speaker 2: in the past administration and lots of people who want

602
00:27:16,927 --> 00:27:18,327
Speaker 2: to work with him in this next one, and got

603
00:27:18,327 --> 00:27:20,927
Speaker 2: all this insight into what's going on. If you're hearing

604
00:27:21,007 --> 00:27:22,807
Speaker 2: the term Project twenty twenty five, I mean go and

605
00:27:22,847 --> 00:27:25,607
Speaker 2: watch four corners. But the top line is a group

606
00:27:25,727 --> 00:27:28,767
Speaker 2: of Trumpists who are very well placed in lots and

607
00:27:28,807 --> 00:27:31,807
Speaker 2: lots of different arms of the government and just outside

608
00:27:31,807 --> 00:27:34,807
Speaker 2: the arms of the government in America making their plans

609
00:27:34,847 --> 00:27:36,727
Speaker 2: for what they're going to do on day one of

610
00:27:36,727 --> 00:27:39,287
Speaker 2: a Trump presidency so he can hit the ground running right.

611
00:27:39,567 --> 00:27:41,127
Speaker 2: And it's called Project twenty twenty.

612
00:27:40,887 --> 00:27:45,887
Speaker 1: Five twenty two Democracy is it's largely about replacing civil

613
00:27:45,927 --> 00:27:50,687
Speaker 1: servants who aren't sympathetic to Trump, replacing civil servants in

614
00:27:50,767 --> 00:27:53,887
Speaker 1: lots of departments like the Departure of Justice and judges,

615
00:27:54,207 --> 00:27:55,247
Speaker 1: so that Trump.

616
00:27:54,927 --> 00:27:56,807
Speaker 2: Will have no obstacles to what he wants to do

617
00:27:56,847 --> 00:27:59,767
Speaker 2: and what he wants to do. Their priorities are reproductive rights,

618
00:28:00,207 --> 00:28:02,367
Speaker 2: oil drilling, which I mean he talks about all the

619
00:28:02,367 --> 00:28:04,167
Speaker 2: time is just like drill, drill, drill, I'm going to

620
00:28:04,247 --> 00:28:06,567
Speaker 2: drill like crazy, opening up lots of nature reserves to

621
00:28:06,567 --> 00:28:10,847
Speaker 2: trash them. And immigration, mass deportation. So these three things,

622
00:28:11,207 --> 00:28:12,807
Speaker 2: which you know, maybe you think they're good.

623
00:28:12,847 --> 00:28:14,407
Speaker 1: I'm not here to judge anyway.

624
00:28:14,767 --> 00:28:16,927
Speaker 2: If you want to know more, feel more armed, and

625
00:28:16,927 --> 00:28:19,727
Speaker 2: also freak yourself out a little brilliantly reported. But if

626
00:28:19,727 --> 00:28:21,967
Speaker 2: you really want to lean yourself into the freaking out

627
00:28:22,127 --> 00:28:25,007
Speaker 2: on Saturday night, Brent, and this was terrible timing. Brent,

628
00:28:25,047 --> 00:28:27,087
Speaker 2: and I watched a movie that is on Apple TV

629
00:28:27,167 --> 00:28:29,247
Speaker 2: now because it is relatively new, so you rent it

630
00:28:29,287 --> 00:28:31,047
Speaker 2: and I'm sure it will go to a streaming service soon.

631
00:28:31,287 --> 00:28:33,527
Speaker 2: It's called Civil War and it was written and directed

632
00:28:33,567 --> 00:28:35,207
Speaker 2: I think by Alex Garland, who you know did The

633
00:28:35,247 --> 00:28:39,127
Speaker 2: Beach and those kind of shows. Anyway, he's actually British.

634
00:28:39,207 --> 00:28:42,567
Speaker 2: Is that Beaches with midlanea the Beach.

635
00:28:45,327 --> 00:28:45,727
Speaker 3: Sures?

636
00:28:45,807 --> 00:28:49,607
Speaker 2: Yeah. Anyway, this movie is very dark. It did get

637
00:28:49,647 --> 00:28:53,007
Speaker 2: a cinematic release. It stars Cursed and Dunst and she's amazing.

638
00:28:53,967 --> 00:28:54,727
Speaker 1: Movie gets new.

639
00:28:55,247 --> 00:28:58,767
Speaker 2: She plays a war photographer who has been you know,

640
00:28:58,807 --> 00:29:01,927
Speaker 2: all over the world documenting wars. She's like tough as.

641
00:29:01,807 --> 00:29:04,167
Speaker 1: Is it a period pigs about civil war?

642
00:29:04,247 --> 00:29:04,367
Speaker 5: No?

643
00:29:04,367 --> 00:29:07,527
Speaker 2: No, no, no no. It's an dystopian vision of like

644
00:29:07,927 --> 00:29:11,647
Speaker 2: next year, right, So it's called a civil War and

645
00:29:11,807 --> 00:29:16,567
Speaker 2: Kirstin Dunst is a photographer. The amazing actor Wagnamura who

646
00:29:16,647 --> 00:29:18,567
Speaker 2: played if you watched Narco's.

647
00:29:18,167 --> 00:29:20,527
Speaker 4: Did you watch he played Pablo.

648
00:29:22,127 --> 00:29:24,247
Speaker 2: He's brilliant and he's really hot in this too. He

649
00:29:24,367 --> 00:29:27,327
Speaker 2: was not so much anyway, he's the reporter. She's the photographer,

650
00:29:27,567 --> 00:29:31,687
Speaker 2: and it's an unspecified future in America where America is

651
00:29:31,687 --> 00:29:32,847
Speaker 2: basically having a civil war.

652
00:29:32,927 --> 00:29:34,167
Speaker 4: Handmaid's Tales start.

653
00:29:35,407 --> 00:29:39,087
Speaker 2: Follows Kirsten Dunt's character and Wagnamura's character as they try

654
00:29:39,127 --> 00:29:41,687
Speaker 2: and travel from New York City to the White House

655
00:29:41,727 --> 00:29:44,487
Speaker 2: where they are going to try and interview and photograph

656
00:29:44,527 --> 00:29:49,367
Speaker 2: this charismatic dictator president. Oh my god, it is very grim,

657
00:29:49,487 --> 00:29:52,607
Speaker 2: it is very tense. It is very well made. Kirstin

658
00:29:52,687 --> 00:29:55,527
Speaker 2: Dunst is brilliant in it. And then I woke up

659
00:29:55,567 --> 00:29:58,127
Speaker 2: in the morning to the news assassination attempt, and I

660
00:29:58,167 --> 00:30:01,007
Speaker 2: was like, oh, so really good, but maybe not great

661
00:30:01,047 --> 00:30:03,167
Speaker 2: if you're suffering anxiety. Mia is banned from watching it,

662
00:30:03,207 --> 00:30:06,127
Speaker 2: but I'm recommending it because hey, we.

663
00:30:06,127 --> 00:30:06,927
Speaker 1: Might as well lean in.

664
00:30:07,247 --> 00:30:09,247
Speaker 4: I would like to recommend a hair roller.

665
00:30:09,647 --> 00:30:10,887
Speaker 2: That's good times.

666
00:30:11,127 --> 00:30:16,167
Speaker 4: I'll explain. I went to the hairdresser recently. My hairdresser,

667
00:30:16,167 --> 00:30:17,607
Speaker 4: who is an out louder. Her name is Elle.

668
00:30:19,287 --> 00:30:19,847
Speaker 1: Hairdresser.

669
00:30:19,967 --> 00:30:20,487
Speaker 4: Yes she is.

670
00:30:20,487 --> 00:30:22,567
Speaker 1: She's the official hairdresser of the podcast.

671
00:30:22,767 --> 00:30:26,287
Speaker 4: She understands the assignment and she was teaching me this thing.

672
00:30:26,327 --> 00:30:28,247
Speaker 4: What she said, what you should do is get a

673
00:30:28,447 --> 00:30:30,607
Speaker 4: hair roller and put it in sort of the front

674
00:30:30,607 --> 00:30:33,047
Speaker 4: of your hair and roll it up and then when

675
00:30:33,087 --> 00:30:34,567
Speaker 4: you take it out, it makes it look like you've

676
00:30:34,567 --> 00:30:36,087
Speaker 4: got a blow dry, you know how you can sometimes

677
00:30:36,127 --> 00:30:37,687
Speaker 4: feel like the front of your hair is just a

678
00:30:37,687 --> 00:30:40,167
Speaker 4: bit flat and just doesn't have a lot of shape.

679
00:30:40,247 --> 00:30:43,127
Speaker 3: Now you've got curtain bangs, and I don't.

680
00:30:42,887 --> 00:30:44,887
Speaker 4: I don't think that matters. I think you can still

681
00:30:44,887 --> 00:30:45,167
Speaker 4: do it.

682
00:30:45,247 --> 00:30:47,487
Speaker 1: So it's just for the front part of your the

683
00:30:47,527 --> 00:30:47,927
Speaker 1: front part.

684
00:30:47,967 --> 00:30:49,807
Speaker 4: I mean, people on TikTok deal with all of it.

685
00:30:49,847 --> 00:30:52,607
Speaker 4: But who has big is the roller? I have just

686
00:30:52,647 --> 00:30:54,047
Speaker 4: a medium size, like the.

687
00:30:54,007 --> 00:30:55,567
Speaker 1: Size of a toilet roll like that.

688
00:30:55,687 --> 00:30:58,527
Speaker 4: Kind of mine's probably a bit smaller than that because

689
00:30:58,567 --> 00:31:00,087
Speaker 4: I just used whatever it had in my drawer, and

690
00:31:00,127 --> 00:31:00,807
Speaker 4: it was from Kmart.

691
00:31:00,807 --> 00:31:02,807
Speaker 1: It was for I mean, whatever you had in your drawer.

692
00:31:02,807 --> 00:31:04,207
Speaker 1: Who has vilcrow hair rolls?

693
00:31:04,367 --> 00:31:06,927
Speaker 4: I had one from a ten years ago that I

694
00:31:06,967 --> 00:31:11,007
Speaker 4: didn't throw out anyway. So what I do now is

695
00:31:11,167 --> 00:31:12,887
Speaker 4: get out of the shower kind of drive off my

696
00:31:12,927 --> 00:31:14,527
Speaker 4: hair and then I put in my hair roller at

697
00:31:14,527 --> 00:31:16,127
Speaker 4: the front. What's great as well as it keeps your

698
00:31:16,127 --> 00:31:17,887
Speaker 4: hair out of your face when you're doing your makeup,

699
00:31:18,327 --> 00:31:20,487
Speaker 4: So then I put some makeup on I take it

700
00:31:20,527 --> 00:31:22,567
Speaker 4: out last thing, and it just falls and it just

701
00:31:22,607 --> 00:31:26,127
Speaker 4: gives a lot more volume and it hasn't actually fall

702
00:31:26,167 --> 00:31:28,927
Speaker 4: across your face rather than back, and it means I

703
00:31:28,927 --> 00:31:30,887
Speaker 4: don't have to spend heaps of time blow drying it. It

704
00:31:30,887 --> 00:31:31,807
Speaker 4: feels better for my hair.

705
00:31:31,927 --> 00:31:33,767
Speaker 2: In order to realize the other day, I don't have

706
00:31:33,807 --> 00:31:36,487
Speaker 2: a hair dryer anymore. What I went looking for a

707
00:31:36,527 --> 00:31:39,647
Speaker 2: hair dryer at home because my children needed to dry

708
00:31:39,647 --> 00:31:42,887
Speaker 2: a hair and I couldn't find it, and I realized

709
00:31:42,927 --> 00:31:43,647
Speaker 2: I don't have one.

710
00:31:44,167 --> 00:31:44,527
Speaker 3: Animal.

711
00:31:44,807 --> 00:31:47,767
Speaker 4: How do you get your hair dry from.

712
00:31:47,127 --> 00:31:48,887
Speaker 3: The part where you don't have a shower cap?

713
00:31:50,087 --> 00:31:52,487
Speaker 4: But your hair? How do you dry it?

714
00:31:52,767 --> 00:31:53,287
Speaker 3: Just wash it?

715
00:31:53,367 --> 00:31:57,767
Speaker 2: And I leave it to dry winter.

716
00:31:58,207 --> 00:31:59,407
Speaker 1: How often do you wash it?

717
00:31:59,447 --> 00:32:02,087
Speaker 2: Like once a second every second day.

718
00:32:02,087 --> 00:32:04,087
Speaker 3: I wash my hair at night or in the morning.

719
00:32:04,167 --> 00:32:06,407
Speaker 2: In the morning, then you've got to get in the

720
00:32:06,487 --> 00:32:08,887
Speaker 2: car and drive and it dries.

721
00:32:09,447 --> 00:32:10,887
Speaker 4: Kidding you got so much hair though?

722
00:32:11,247 --> 00:32:15,287
Speaker 2: Has it dried? I get in the car with hair

723
00:32:15,567 --> 00:32:17,327
Speaker 2: and by the time I've got to Sindy, my hair

724
00:32:17,407 --> 00:32:17,727
Speaker 2: is dry.

725
00:32:17,807 --> 00:32:19,327
Speaker 3: Now we know why she's getting head eggs.

726
00:32:19,767 --> 00:32:20,967
Speaker 4: Oh my goodness.

727
00:32:21,527 --> 00:32:24,927
Speaker 2: Anyway, I probably need to invest in it because the

728
00:32:24,967 --> 00:32:26,767
Speaker 2: hair dryer I was looking for. I was trying to

729
00:32:26,807 --> 00:32:28,487
Speaker 2: remember when I bought it, and I bought it twenty

730
00:32:28,607 --> 00:32:30,247
Speaker 2: years ago. I need a new hair.

731
00:32:30,727 --> 00:32:33,647
Speaker 3: This is why I'll bring it in. I'm very anxious.

732
00:32:33,647 --> 00:32:35,727
Speaker 4: This is why she's been cranky because she's wet hair.

733
00:32:36,327 --> 00:32:38,007
Speaker 1: She got a chill at the back of she's got

734
00:32:38,007 --> 00:32:38,327
Speaker 1: a chill.

735
00:32:38,367 --> 00:32:39,127
Speaker 2: She's always ill.

736
00:32:39,367 --> 00:32:41,367
Speaker 1: Okay, who's got time?

737
00:32:41,447 --> 00:32:42,287
Speaker 4: I used my hair.

738
00:32:42,367 --> 00:32:44,087
Speaker 1: Daughter, that lives in your hair.

739
00:32:44,247 --> 00:32:46,767
Speaker 2: She also lets her hair hair driven.

740
00:32:47,087 --> 00:32:49,487
Speaker 4: How does Brench get his hair d anywhere?

741
00:32:49,767 --> 00:32:50,327
Speaker 3: Let's move on.

742
00:32:50,607 --> 00:32:52,727
Speaker 2: I what's your recommendation, Well.

743
00:32:53,607 --> 00:32:54,367
Speaker 4: Bring household.

744
00:32:54,487 --> 00:32:56,367
Speaker 1: I'm going to bring it back to my favorite topic,

745
00:32:56,407 --> 00:33:02,207
Speaker 1: which is me. Now I have stopped riding on the internet.

746
00:33:02,247 --> 00:33:04,447
Speaker 1: I've stopped wanting to write on the internet. I've stopped

747
00:33:04,447 --> 00:33:07,647
Speaker 1: writing on the internet. But I also just don't feel

748
00:33:07,807 --> 00:33:10,367
Speaker 1: really myself when I'm not writing. I don't know if

749
00:33:10,367 --> 00:33:13,607
Speaker 1: you guys have that. Like we all began our careers

750
00:33:13,327 --> 00:33:16,767
Speaker 1: in media as writers. There's something about writing. It's not

751
00:33:16,767 --> 00:33:19,727
Speaker 1: an original thought, but I just I feel most myself

752
00:33:19,767 --> 00:33:21,607
Speaker 1: when I'm writing. I also now I feel most myself

753
00:33:21,647 --> 00:33:24,367
Speaker 1: when I'm talking to you bitches as well. But I

754
00:33:24,407 --> 00:33:27,207
Speaker 1: really miss it. So what I've started doing. I started

755
00:33:27,207 --> 00:33:30,407
Speaker 1: this newsletter called Babbel based on Insta babble when I

756
00:33:30,447 --> 00:33:31,847
Speaker 1: just talk into my phone.

757
00:33:32,767 --> 00:33:34,407
Speaker 4: The subject line I didn't click because it was from

758
00:33:34,447 --> 00:33:36,887
Speaker 4: you and I sing about Harry Pits you go on

759
00:33:36,927 --> 00:33:37,647
Speaker 4: your arm pits out.

760
00:33:37,807 --> 00:33:42,647
Speaker 1: You'll have to open it. I know it's don't tell her, don't't, don't,

761
00:33:43,007 --> 00:33:44,007
Speaker 1: don't tell her.

762
00:33:44,527 --> 00:33:46,407
Speaker 2: I'm not going to tell her. She's think I'm going

763
00:33:46,487 --> 00:33:49,527
Speaker 2: to say open rate, don't. I'm not going to spoilers

764
00:33:49,527 --> 00:33:52,207
Speaker 2: here about Jesse. When you read it, you'll recognize that

765
00:33:52,247 --> 00:33:54,327
Speaker 2: it's a topic she's been trying to get us to

766
00:33:54,447 --> 00:33:56,927
Speaker 2: talk about, and we won't talk about it.

767
00:33:57,047 --> 00:34:01,407
Speaker 1: So this is what's great because on this show we

768
00:34:01,487 --> 00:34:05,207
Speaker 1: need consensus. It's annoying. And on my Babbel newsletter where

769
00:34:05,207 --> 00:34:07,487
Speaker 1: I do the Sexy six and it's the place that

770
00:34:07,527 --> 00:34:09,407
Speaker 1: I write every week, thank you.

771
00:34:09,287 --> 00:34:11,407
Speaker 2: I love it and I really like this invention of it,

772
00:34:11,447 --> 00:34:13,207
Speaker 2: the Sexy six version. I really enjoyed it.

773
00:34:13,207 --> 00:34:15,927
Speaker 4: There's no way I voluntarily signed up to this. I

774
00:34:15,967 --> 00:34:19,647
Speaker 4: don't know how I got on my mailing address.

775
00:34:19,687 --> 00:34:20,127
Speaker 2: That didn't you.

776
00:34:20,207 --> 00:34:24,767
Speaker 1: It's just a maya. You can't escape me and so

777
00:34:24,967 --> 00:34:27,927
Speaker 1: out louders of course, hopefully you subscribe to the out

778
00:34:27,927 --> 00:34:30,047
Speaker 1: Loud newsletter, which is a different thing. But this is

779
00:34:30,087 --> 00:34:32,447
Speaker 1: me writing and being silly and showing my clothes, and

780
00:34:32,487 --> 00:34:34,927
Speaker 1: I'm just enjoying it so much and I'm trying to

781
00:34:34,967 --> 00:34:38,767
Speaker 1: grow it and I'm also trying to increase my open rate.

782
00:34:38,847 --> 00:34:41,647
Speaker 1: So Jesse bloody open it. We'll put a link in

783
00:34:41,687 --> 00:34:45,207
Speaker 1: the show notes and also just everywhere. We'll put links

784
00:34:45,247 --> 00:34:47,447
Speaker 1: everywhere everywhere, goodness.

785
00:34:50,007 --> 00:34:53,567
Speaker 2: Every Tuesday and Thursday, we drop new segments of Mom

786
00:34:53,607 --> 00:34:55,927
Speaker 2: and Me Are out Loud just for Mom and Me

787
00:34:56,007 --> 00:34:58,967
Speaker 2: are subscribers. Follow the link in the show notes to

788
00:34:58,967 --> 00:35:01,647
Speaker 2: get your daily dose of out Loud and a big

789
00:35:01,727 --> 00:35:05,007
Speaker 2: thank you to all our current subscribers.

790
00:35:14,687 --> 00:35:16,647
Speaker 4: It's time for best and worst. My worst is being

791
00:35:16,687 --> 00:35:19,127
Speaker 4: spammed by me. I find a different worst. But this

792
00:35:19,287 --> 00:35:21,287
Speaker 4: is part of the show where we share a little

793
00:35:21,287 --> 00:35:24,367
Speaker 4: bit for our personal lives. Highs and loads of the weak. Holly,

794
00:35:24,687 --> 00:35:25,487
Speaker 4: what's your worst?

795
00:35:26,447 --> 00:35:28,607
Speaker 2: Okay, my worst is controversial, so I'm going to speak

796
00:35:28,607 --> 00:35:33,127
Speaker 2: in code speaking of things that sometimes don't make it

797
00:35:33,127 --> 00:35:36,167
Speaker 2: onto the show. So this is genuine behind the scenes information,

798
00:35:36,247 --> 00:35:38,127
Speaker 2: like we'll discuss every morning. We want to talk about this,

799
00:35:38,167 --> 00:35:40,607
Speaker 2: we want to talk about that, and sometimes we'll go, oh,

800
00:35:40,647 --> 00:35:42,127
Speaker 2: that's a good thing to talk about, but maybe we

801
00:35:42,167 --> 00:35:44,447
Speaker 2: don't know enough yet, or maybe we should wait, or

802
00:35:44,487 --> 00:35:47,327
Speaker 2: maybe this or maybe that. And weirdly, although not weirdly

803
00:35:47,327 --> 00:35:49,487
Speaker 2: because Jesse Stevens obviously has her finger on the pulse,

804
00:35:49,527 --> 00:35:52,327
Speaker 2: on Monday morning, she wanted to talk about a health issue, right,

805
00:35:53,007 --> 00:35:55,247
Speaker 2: and we were like, oh, we're not doctors, or I

806
00:35:55,247 --> 00:35:57,647
Speaker 2: don't we don't want to spread misinformation. Let's just wait

807
00:35:57,687 --> 00:36:00,647
Speaker 2: and see the next day. The very next day, I'm

808
00:36:00,807 --> 00:36:02,647
Speaker 2: sitting near me or somewhere in the office and my

809
00:36:02,687 --> 00:36:05,247
Speaker 2: phone's pinging, which is irritating. It's by teenage daughter, which

810
00:36:05,287 --> 00:36:08,007
Speaker 2: is irritating. I love her, but still wait till Luna

811
00:36:08,087 --> 00:36:10,407
Speaker 2: is old enough to text you all the time, school holiday,

812
00:36:10,647 --> 00:36:12,247
Speaker 2: school holiday, and bless her.

813
00:36:12,247 --> 00:36:14,887
Speaker 1: I understand why. And she has seen on TikTok this

814
00:36:15,087 --> 00:36:18,647
Speaker 1: very health worry, right, and she is like, mom, Mom,

815
00:36:18,727 --> 00:36:20,647
Speaker 1: I've seen on TikTok that if I do this thing,

816
00:36:20,647 --> 00:36:23,767
Speaker 1: I'm going to get cancer and die, right. And I'm like, baby,

817
00:36:23,807 --> 00:36:24,887
Speaker 1: you're not You're not well.

818
00:36:24,887 --> 00:36:27,127
Speaker 2: It's all over TikTok. And I'm like, Mia told me

819
00:36:27,127 --> 00:36:28,927
Speaker 2: to say this. I asked Mia what to do because

820
00:36:29,047 --> 00:36:30,327
Speaker 2: as much as I take the pie out of her,

821
00:36:30,367 --> 00:36:32,567
Speaker 2: she is quite good, does give quite good parenting.

822
00:36:33,007 --> 00:36:35,407
Speaker 4: I think, maybe why don't you give Auntie Jesse a call?

823
00:36:35,727 --> 00:36:39,287
Speaker 4: Could have helped she would have wound each other up.

824
00:36:39,367 --> 00:36:41,767
Speaker 2: That's also true. And then she said, why don't you

825
00:36:41,767 --> 00:36:43,967
Speaker 2: tell her we don't get our health information from TikTok,

826
00:36:44,007 --> 00:36:46,687
Speaker 2: so our text, we don't get our health information from TikTok.

827
00:36:46,727 --> 00:36:47,047
Speaker 1: Correct.

828
00:36:47,047 --> 00:36:49,047
Speaker 2: So then she sent me a screenshot of Google.

829
00:36:49,367 --> 00:36:52,207
Speaker 1: Yeah, bloody too.

830
00:36:52,047 --> 00:36:56,607
Speaker 2: Smart, kept going and in all seriousness, this is one

831
00:36:56,607 --> 00:37:00,127
Speaker 2: of the challenges, right of having teenagers who We were

832
00:37:00,127 --> 00:37:02,087
Speaker 2: talking about it again today and Jesse made the very

833
00:37:02,087 --> 00:37:04,567
Speaker 2: good point she's so wise this week. It annoys me that,

834
00:37:04,687 --> 00:37:07,967
Speaker 2: you know, media used to be created for adults, you know,

835
00:37:08,647 --> 00:37:11,327
Speaker 2: and now it's created for anyone who wants it in

836
00:37:11,487 --> 00:37:14,447
Speaker 2: very digestible and attractive formats. And so my daughter's getting

837
00:37:14,447 --> 00:37:18,567
Speaker 2: all kinds of information from political to you know, wars

838
00:37:18,567 --> 00:37:20,967
Speaker 2: in different parts of the world, to whether or not

839
00:37:21,007 --> 00:37:23,687
Speaker 2: this product is going to make her sick, all on

840
00:37:23,727 --> 00:37:27,007
Speaker 2: her phone, on her own, with no one counterbalancing. And you,

841
00:37:27,207 --> 00:37:29,847
Speaker 2: as parents know you're always going so tell me what.

842
00:37:29,807 --> 00:37:32,087
Speaker 1: You learned on the TikTok today, whatever.

843
00:37:31,767 --> 00:37:34,687
Speaker 2: You say, whatever bullshit you say excivity toilet and they're

844
00:37:34,887 --> 00:37:38,407
Speaker 2: excivty toilet exactly, and then you're saying, what does that mean?

845
00:37:38,447 --> 00:37:40,447
Speaker 2: And then they always struggle to explain that because the

846
00:37:40,487 --> 00:37:42,807
Speaker 2: internet doesn't really make any sense, and then you know where.

847
00:37:42,847 --> 00:37:45,367
Speaker 2: So anyway, my worst was that, But my best is

848
00:37:45,407 --> 00:37:47,567
Speaker 2: also family related, which is I was saying last week

849
00:37:47,567 --> 00:37:49,527
Speaker 2: and the week before I was winging about my headaches

850
00:37:49,527 --> 00:37:51,967
Speaker 2: and have been feeling really rubbish. I gave myself a

851
00:37:51,967 --> 00:37:54,247
Speaker 2: few days off at the end of last week because

852
00:37:54,247 --> 00:37:56,247
Speaker 2: I've been working to a book deadline lately. I haven't

853
00:37:56,287 --> 00:37:58,967
Speaker 2: really had weekends for a while, and I gave myself

854
00:37:59,207 --> 00:38:01,127
Speaker 2: like just a few days to just to hang out

855
00:38:01,127 --> 00:38:04,007
Speaker 2: with the family, school holidays and just fucking breathe out

856
00:38:04,007 --> 00:38:04,567
Speaker 2: and enjoy it.

857
00:38:04,887 --> 00:38:08,367
Speaker 1: Guess what feel so much? Hatter who knew?

858
00:38:08,567 --> 00:38:10,607
Speaker 2: And we had the best family weekend. We went and

859
00:38:10,687 --> 00:38:12,527
Speaker 2: hunted out dumplings, which is our favorite thing to do

860
00:38:12,567 --> 00:38:14,567
Speaker 2: in the world, and made the children go on a

861
00:38:14,567 --> 00:38:16,767
Speaker 2: bush walk with me, which they didn't enjoy but personally

862
00:38:16,807 --> 00:38:20,767
Speaker 2: I did. We saw wombats, we saw wallabies, we walked

863
00:38:20,807 --> 00:38:25,447
Speaker 2: the dog. It was wholesome family stuff and I really

864
00:38:25,487 --> 00:38:27,487
Speaker 2: really enjoyed it, and so my best of the week

865
00:38:27,567 --> 00:38:30,847
Speaker 2: was definitely just family hangs. And actually I did a

866
00:38:30,847 --> 00:38:34,447
Speaker 2: little Instagram highlights of recommendations for the South Coast because

867
00:38:34,447 --> 00:38:36,047
Speaker 2: that's where I live and lots of people go there

868
00:38:36,047 --> 00:38:38,247
Speaker 2: on holidays, and I was like, these are the cool

869
00:38:38,247 --> 00:38:38,807
Speaker 2: places to go.

870
00:38:38,887 --> 00:38:40,527
Speaker 4: I'm going to be there soon, so I'm very excit.

871
00:38:40,527 --> 00:38:41,367
Speaker 2: Look at that, my friend.

872
00:38:41,407 --> 00:38:44,647
Speaker 1: Anyway, that's me my worst of the week. I know

873
00:38:44,727 --> 00:38:46,847
Speaker 1: we're sort of news free and I'm not going to

874
00:38:46,887 --> 00:38:51,687
Speaker 1: talk about the actual news, but is needing to consciously

875
00:38:51,767 --> 00:38:54,487
Speaker 1: uncouple from America again.

876
00:38:54,287 --> 00:38:56,287
Speaker 2: You've done a show job on this podcast, and so

877
00:38:56,407 --> 00:39:02,367
Speaker 2: not watching Civil War won't be I have found myself.

878
00:39:02,567 --> 00:39:05,487
Speaker 1: Longtime listeners of the show will know that I went

879
00:39:05,527 --> 00:39:10,727
Speaker 1: into an absolute hyper focus from about twenty fifteen to

880
00:39:11,207 --> 00:39:15,247
Speaker 1: about twenty twenty one. Pretty much with the inauguration of

881
00:39:15,287 --> 00:39:18,487
Speaker 1: Joe Biden. I shifted my focus away from America and

882
00:39:18,527 --> 00:39:21,087
Speaker 1: American politics. So for a lot of years I co

883
00:39:21,167 --> 00:39:24,127
Speaker 1: hosted a podcast about American politics. I was that into it.

884
00:39:24,167 --> 00:39:27,087
Speaker 1: I was obsessed. I would spend like honestly hours every

885
00:39:27,167 --> 00:39:29,807
Speaker 1: day reading things, listening to podcasts. It was my area

886
00:39:29,847 --> 00:39:33,967
Speaker 1: of expertise. After that, I felt completely exhausted and drained,

887
00:39:34,367 --> 00:39:37,367
Speaker 1: and I was like, Okay, I'm looking away. And over

888
00:39:37,407 --> 00:39:39,767
Speaker 1: the last few months I think I'm probably a basic

889
00:39:39,807 --> 00:39:42,927
Speaker 1: bitch in this regard. I've been drawn back in. And

890
00:39:44,207 --> 00:39:46,967
Speaker 1: one of my closest friends, Amelia, we've actually met and

891
00:39:47,007 --> 00:39:51,527
Speaker 1: bonded over US politics back in twenty fifteen, we hilariously

892
00:39:51,567 --> 00:39:54,007
Speaker 1: co hosted this podcast together. For the last four or

893
00:39:54,007 --> 00:39:57,047
Speaker 1: five years, we've not spoken about US politics one time,

894
00:39:57,327 --> 00:40:00,087
Speaker 1: but now she independently. We both compared notes the other day.

895
00:40:00,127 --> 00:40:02,647
Speaker 1: We've both deep dived in and I don't imagine why,

896
00:40:03,247 --> 00:40:05,807
Speaker 1: and exactly lots of people have. It's very engaging, and

897
00:40:05,887 --> 00:40:08,927
Speaker 1: it feels also quite existential, like and I have to

898
00:40:08,927 --> 00:40:11,727
Speaker 1: just keep reminding myself, this isn't my country.

899
00:40:12,207 --> 00:40:14,327
Speaker 4: Yeah, why do you think you have such an emotional

900
00:40:14,567 --> 00:40:17,167
Speaker 4: attachment to it given that it is the other side

901
00:40:17,207 --> 00:40:17,607
Speaker 4: of the world.

902
00:40:18,367 --> 00:40:20,207
Speaker 2: There's a very good reason that we all do. And

903
00:40:20,247 --> 00:40:23,767
Speaker 2: that's because everyone in the West has been conditioned by

904
00:40:23,767 --> 00:40:25,447
Speaker 2: all the culture that we swim in, the soup that

905
00:40:25,487 --> 00:40:28,207
Speaker 2: we swim in, that America is all of our overlord, right,

906
00:40:28,327 --> 00:40:31,207
Speaker 2: so if shit's going down there, we consider that we

907
00:40:31,247 --> 00:40:33,007
Speaker 2: are as they say of America sneeze is you know,

908
00:40:33,087 --> 00:40:36,167
Speaker 2: blah blah. I think we've kind of decided that American

909
00:40:36,207 --> 00:40:38,607
Speaker 2: politics is world politics, and it isn't. But then it

910
00:40:38,647 --> 00:40:41,887
Speaker 2: also kind of is because they're so powerful, so influential, etc.

911
00:40:42,167 --> 00:40:44,327
Speaker 4: And they're an ally and what's happening, Yeah, could have

912
00:40:44,407 --> 00:40:45,567
Speaker 4: ramifications for Australia.

913
00:40:45,647 --> 00:40:48,527
Speaker 1: Ironically, also growing up in the eighties, it's a genexa.

914
00:40:49,207 --> 00:40:53,087
Speaker 1: I was obsessed with American politics when I was like

915
00:40:53,127 --> 00:40:56,287
Speaker 1: in primary school because Holly and I lived through anil

916
00:40:56,287 --> 00:40:58,087
Speaker 1: he said, the Civil War, the Cold War like another

917
00:40:58,167 --> 00:41:01,007
Speaker 1: Cold War, and then Clinton no before the drama there was.

918
00:41:01,167 --> 00:41:03,687
Speaker 1: I grew up very scared of nuclear war. Like around

919
00:41:03,727 --> 00:41:06,567
Speaker 1: the eighties. It was Reagan and I think it was

920
00:41:06,807 --> 00:41:11,207
Speaker 1: Gorge and I remember but saying my prayers every night.

921
00:41:11,807 --> 00:41:13,567
Speaker 1: And I was aware even then that it was these

922
00:41:13,607 --> 00:41:15,927
Speaker 1: two old men that were in charge of the world

923
00:41:16,047 --> 00:41:19,167
Speaker 1: and how we needed younger men to didn't even cour

924
00:41:19,207 --> 00:41:20,807
Speaker 1: to me it could be a women, younger men to

925
00:41:20,887 --> 00:41:23,487
Speaker 1: be in charge of these countries because these older men

926
00:41:23,567 --> 00:41:26,727
Speaker 1: had nothing to lose. So it's interesting and I think

927
00:41:26,767 --> 00:41:30,207
Speaker 1: that it feels again to me similar to that in

928
00:41:30,287 --> 00:41:33,407
Speaker 1: that it's an existential threat because I feel like Donald

929
00:41:33,447 --> 00:41:36,087
Speaker 1: Trump and trump Ism and now Jeddevans and all of

930
00:41:36,127 --> 00:41:39,287
Speaker 1: that is so much a symbol of the patriarchy of

931
00:41:39,967 --> 00:41:43,367
Speaker 1: holding back women, of winding back the clock on everything

932
00:41:43,447 --> 00:41:49,447
Speaker 1: progressive about the world, from racism to homophobia to gender equality.

933
00:41:49,687 --> 00:41:52,367
Speaker 1: I feel like it's literally taking the rights away from women,

934
00:41:52,807 --> 00:41:55,167
Speaker 1: and so I think it does feel like an existential

935
00:41:55,207 --> 00:41:57,447
Speaker 1: threat again, and that thing about when America's needs as

936
00:41:57,447 --> 00:41:59,727
Speaker 1: the world catches cold, as you said, but like it

937
00:41:59,767 --> 00:42:02,367
Speaker 1: feels like that could catch on here. We know that

938
00:42:02,407 --> 00:42:07,167
Speaker 1: politically it can influence other countries anyway, So you're not spiraling.

939
00:42:06,887 --> 00:42:10,007
Speaker 4: That's just a spiraling at all. You're worst.

940
00:42:10,207 --> 00:42:13,567
Speaker 3: My mum and I are both spiral. Feel My best

941
00:42:14,167 --> 00:42:15,847
Speaker 3: is I think I've mentioned it before.

942
00:42:15,847 --> 00:42:17,887
Speaker 1: I've been in a little bit of a clothes funk lately,

943
00:42:18,007 --> 00:42:20,167
Speaker 1: and I've been thinking that there are two reasons for it.

944
00:42:20,607 --> 00:42:23,247
Speaker 3: One is that fashion has.

945
00:42:23,087 --> 00:42:26,007
Speaker 1: Had a big time of quiet luxury, which I've thought

946
00:42:26,047 --> 00:42:27,967
Speaker 1: is really really boring. But if you see stuff enough

947
00:42:28,447 --> 00:42:32,207
Speaker 1: like minimalist dressing quiet luxury, you know, I think I

948
00:42:32,247 --> 00:42:34,647
Speaker 1: just wore sequence and all those bright colors so much

949
00:42:34,687 --> 00:42:36,527
Speaker 1: I just got sick of it. So that felt to

950
00:42:36,567 --> 00:42:39,127
Speaker 1: me really refreshing and interesting. And I always like, that's

951
00:42:39,127 --> 00:42:42,087
Speaker 1: what the fashion industry is based on, is that sort

952
00:42:42,127 --> 00:42:45,807
Speaker 1: of whiplash of something different, something different, something different, And

953
00:42:45,887 --> 00:42:48,087
Speaker 1: so I sort of did that, combined with the fact

954
00:42:48,127 --> 00:42:49,807
Speaker 1: that I got my colors done, discovered I was an

955
00:42:49,847 --> 00:42:52,487
Speaker 1: autumn realized that those colors really suit me, like browns

956
00:42:52,527 --> 00:42:55,767
Speaker 1: and neutrals like cream and stuff. So then I went

957
00:42:56,127 --> 00:42:59,367
Speaker 1: like really strongly into those colors instead of bright colors.

958
00:42:59,447 --> 00:43:03,847
Speaker 1: So the combination of minimalist dressing, quiet luxury dressing, and

959
00:43:03,967 --> 00:43:09,847
Speaker 1: me wearing brown suddenly I became quite sad. My clothes

960
00:43:09,887 --> 00:43:11,767
Speaker 1: were making me sad, because my clothes bring me joy.

961
00:43:11,847 --> 00:43:14,087
Speaker 1: I did an Insta bubble and someone said a lovely comment,

962
00:43:14,127 --> 00:43:16,767
Speaker 1: is said in a very respectful way. Is it just me?

963
00:43:17,007 --> 00:43:19,327
Speaker 1: Or since you've got your colors done, is it a

964
00:43:19,327 --> 00:43:21,527
Speaker 1: bit sad? I just really love seeing you in bright colours.

965
00:43:21,527 --> 00:43:25,007
Speaker 1: And I was like, so did I. And I've remembered

966
00:43:25,007 --> 00:43:29,607
Speaker 1: that my fashion inspiration, my true fashion inspiration, is Carry Bradshaw,

967
00:43:30,487 --> 00:43:33,367
Speaker 1: not the ridiculous over the top stuff, but so much

968
00:43:33,367 --> 00:43:36,367
Speaker 1: to give her credit for something, yeah, Carry Bradshaw. Oh,

969
00:43:36,407 --> 00:43:38,407
Speaker 1: she was so meaningful and just the way of you know,

970
00:43:38,487 --> 00:43:41,327
Speaker 1: mixing patterns and having fun with clothes, like carry is

971
00:43:41,367 --> 00:43:45,207
Speaker 1: nothing if not creative with clothes. And so I'm now

972
00:43:45,247 --> 00:43:48,287
Speaker 1: just re looking at my cupboard putting away some of

973
00:43:48,327 --> 00:43:51,367
Speaker 1: my brown jackets, or wearing my brown jackets with a

974
00:43:51,367 --> 00:43:53,567
Speaker 1: bit of a sequin with a bit of a bright

975
00:43:53,647 --> 00:43:56,367
Speaker 1: color that might not be my color, but that makes

976
00:43:56,407 --> 00:43:58,207
Speaker 1: me happy. It might have been the most flattering color

977
00:43:58,247 --> 00:44:00,647
Speaker 1: on me, but it actually gives me joy to look

978
00:44:00,647 --> 00:44:01,127
Speaker 1: at it.

979
00:44:02,527 --> 00:44:05,087
Speaker 2: I like it or carries back SI, have you been

980
00:44:05,127 --> 00:44:06,247
Speaker 2: watching the Fashion Horse?

981
00:44:07,207 --> 00:44:11,127
Speaker 4: My worst very criptic, but basically I've talked about this before.

982
00:44:11,247 --> 00:44:13,647
Speaker 4: But when you've got people in your life who are

983
00:44:13,647 --> 00:44:17,167
Speaker 4: really struggling with their mental health and how it's a

984
00:44:17,527 --> 00:44:21,167
Speaker 4: very specific type of heartbreak and we're talking about ex's,

985
00:44:21,167 --> 00:44:22,487
Speaker 4: it's like you feel like you'd give all the money

986
00:44:22,527 --> 00:44:25,047
Speaker 4: in the world just like make them feel better, and

987
00:44:25,087 --> 00:44:28,007
Speaker 4: you can't to just make them feel happy. But my best,

988
00:44:28,087 --> 00:44:31,967
Speaker 4: I'm going to be insufferable. My best is Jim chat

989
00:44:32,727 --> 00:44:33,487
Speaker 4: so jealous.

990
00:44:33,727 --> 00:44:36,367
Speaker 2: Yeah, of my life, I'm failing at the moment.

991
00:44:36,567 --> 00:44:38,847
Speaker 4: So I spoke a few months ago about how I'd

992
00:44:38,847 --> 00:44:40,967
Speaker 4: gone to Cairo and my back was like lesare and

993
00:44:41,007 --> 00:44:43,087
Speaker 4: hips and blah blah blah. And I was speaking to

994
00:44:43,127 --> 00:44:45,407
Speaker 4: a few friends and they've been saying to me for years,

995
00:44:45,487 --> 00:44:47,167
Speaker 4: you've got to do your strength training. You've got to

996
00:44:47,167 --> 00:44:50,607
Speaker 4: do weight training. I'm like, I can't see myself lifting weights.

997
00:44:50,607 --> 00:44:53,367
Speaker 4: I'm not a strong person. I do my pilates, which

998
00:44:53,367 --> 00:44:55,487
Speaker 4: I've always loved. But they said, no, it will improve

999
00:44:55,487 --> 00:44:59,207
Speaker 4: your back, it'll take away the pain. It's good for functionality. Anyway.

1000
00:44:59,247 --> 00:45:01,167
Speaker 4: So I joined this new gym and they had a

1001
00:45:01,207 --> 00:45:03,567
Speaker 4: thing where you sit with a personal trainer, like just

1002
00:45:03,567 --> 00:45:05,167
Speaker 4: a one on one session. Because I didn't want to

1003
00:45:05,167 --> 00:45:08,247
Speaker 4: get locked into any seeing a personal trainer multiple times

1004
00:45:08,247 --> 00:45:10,687
Speaker 4: a week, I wanted one. I wanted it to be

1005
00:45:10,727 --> 00:45:13,527
Speaker 4: a female. We're funny what we're talking about. I wanted

1006
00:45:13,567 --> 00:45:14,967
Speaker 4: it to be a female because.

1007
00:45:14,967 --> 00:45:17,407
Speaker 2: I only like female trainers now. Also, I like them

1008
00:45:17,767 --> 00:45:21,127
Speaker 2: for thirty sad not load. It's not because I'm scared

1009
00:45:21,167 --> 00:45:23,087
Speaker 2: of that's not because I'm scared to relate.

1010
00:45:23,807 --> 00:45:25,967
Speaker 4: Yeah, the reason I'm a woman was because years ago

1011
00:45:25,967 --> 00:45:27,807
Speaker 4: I got burned. But I want to see a man

1012
00:45:28,047 --> 00:45:30,407
Speaker 4: who was like, you need to eat more protein. You

1013
00:45:30,447 --> 00:45:33,167
Speaker 4: want to look like this, you want your absolutely to

1014
00:45:33,167 --> 00:45:35,327
Speaker 4: look like this, And then you'd have me with really

1015
00:45:35,367 --> 00:45:37,687
Speaker 4: heavy weights, and I was like, you're not understanding the assignment.

1016
00:45:37,927 --> 00:45:39,967
Speaker 4: I have a sore back and I would like it

1017
00:45:40,007 --> 00:45:42,527
Speaker 4: to be less. So anyway, she gave me this program,

1018
00:45:42,727 --> 00:45:44,367
Speaker 4: like she showed me how to do it all. And

1019
00:45:44,367 --> 00:45:45,807
Speaker 4: I've been doing it for like a month. I go

1020
00:45:45,927 --> 00:45:48,927
Speaker 4: three times a week, which is what I can commit to,

1021
00:45:49,807 --> 00:45:53,447
Speaker 4: and I feel bloody great. Like I walk out afterwards.

1022
00:45:53,567 --> 00:45:55,367
Speaker 4: I feel like it's doing one just for my posture.

1023
00:45:55,767 --> 00:45:57,447
Speaker 1: So you don't have to see her anymore, but you

1024
00:45:57,487 --> 00:45:59,087
Speaker 1: feel like you go in there and you've got.

1025
00:45:58,967 --> 00:46:01,167
Speaker 4: You know, I know what I'm doing because my worry

1026
00:46:01,327 --> 00:46:02,847
Speaker 4: was I'm going to go hurt myself. I'm going to

1027
00:46:02,927 --> 00:46:04,687
Speaker 4: lift something and I'm gonna do it roight. Yeah, But

1028
00:46:04,727 --> 00:46:06,487
Speaker 4: she showed me exactly how to do it, and I

1029
00:46:06,567 --> 00:46:08,887
Speaker 4: do exactly the same things, stretching and doing a bit

1030
00:46:08,927 --> 00:46:10,687
Speaker 4: of cardio or whatever I feel like, and I just

1031
00:46:10,767 --> 00:46:13,647
Speaker 4: feel fantastic and it's helping so much with like back pain.

1032
00:46:13,727 --> 00:46:14,847
Speaker 3: So is it weight bearing stuff?

1033
00:46:14,887 --> 00:46:14,967
Speaker 1: Like?

1034
00:46:15,007 --> 00:46:15,687
Speaker 3: What is it?

1035
00:46:15,727 --> 00:46:20,047
Speaker 4: So it's like, for example, I'll do like lunges or

1036
00:46:20,487 --> 00:46:23,487
Speaker 4: like shoulder presses and we're not talking heavy, we're talking

1037
00:46:23,487 --> 00:46:24,247
Speaker 4: about eight kilos.

1038
00:46:24,327 --> 00:46:27,127
Speaker 1: So is it a bit. The machines, like the weights machines.

1039
00:46:27,167 --> 00:46:29,007
Speaker 4: It's a lot of it actually isn't a lot of.

1040
00:46:29,047 --> 00:46:31,767
Speaker 4: It's just like getting a weight and doing a very

1041
00:46:31,767 --> 00:46:34,527
Speaker 4: specific There are these muscles between your shoulder blades which

1042
00:46:34,567 --> 00:46:38,127
Speaker 4: are really important for posture and keeping it, especially if

1043
00:46:38,127 --> 00:46:40,167
Speaker 4: you suit a computer a lot. Like I've gone to

1044
00:46:40,167 --> 00:46:42,367
Speaker 4: the gym and gone, I don't need a six mack,

1045
00:46:42,487 --> 00:46:45,167
Speaker 4: I don't need a big bottom. What I need is

1046
00:46:45,607 --> 00:46:47,327
Speaker 4: to stand up straight and not be in pain when

1047
00:46:47,327 --> 00:46:49,607
Speaker 4: I'm seventy or five so not good, and to feel great.

1048
00:46:49,767 --> 00:46:51,847
Speaker 2: You know, it's interesting because obviously you're not there yet,

1049
00:46:51,887 --> 00:46:54,447
Speaker 2: but all the midwomen I know are obsessed with lifting

1050
00:46:54,447 --> 00:46:57,527
Speaker 2: weights now, not because they want for all the reasons

1051
00:46:57,527 --> 00:47:00,607
Speaker 2: you just said. It's about bone strength, body strength, being

1052
00:47:00,647 --> 00:47:03,207
Speaker 2: able to keep moving. It's not about like I want,

1053
00:47:03,327 --> 00:47:05,687
Speaker 2: Michelle Obamara, No, I love feeling strong.

1054
00:47:05,767 --> 00:47:08,087
Speaker 4: And ten years ago or fifteen years ago, when I

1055
00:47:08,127 --> 00:47:10,847
Speaker 4: went and saw that mailpta end uphurting myself, it was

1056
00:47:10,967 --> 00:47:13,327
Speaker 4: all men doing weights right. And now you walk into

1057
00:47:13,327 --> 00:47:15,407
Speaker 4: the weight section of any gym and it's at least

1058
00:47:15,407 --> 00:47:18,087
Speaker 4: fifty percent women, and there's no men telling you how

1059
00:47:18,127 --> 00:47:20,167
Speaker 4: to do when you're squating wrong and blah blah blah

1060
00:47:20,167 --> 00:47:20,607
Speaker 4: like you just.

1061
00:47:22,487 --> 00:47:22,727
Speaker 6: All that.

1062
00:47:23,047 --> 00:47:24,527
Speaker 4: If you haven't been to the gym for ages and

1063
00:47:24,567 --> 00:47:27,607
Speaker 4: you got burned, try it again because the culture has

1064
00:47:27,647 --> 00:47:30,847
Speaker 4: really changed and feeling amazing.

1065
00:47:32,407 --> 00:47:34,847
Speaker 2: That's all We've got time for my friends on this

1066
00:47:34,927 --> 00:47:37,767
Speaker 2: week's For this week's out loud see, I started badly,

1067
00:47:37,927 --> 00:47:38,967
Speaker 2: I've ended badly.

1068
00:47:39,607 --> 00:47:41,127
Speaker 3: It's all right, out loud as next week.

1069
00:47:41,007 --> 00:47:42,647
Speaker 1: I'll be better, will be better.

1070
00:47:42,687 --> 00:47:45,047
Speaker 2: I promise I'll be able to talk and everything. But

1071
00:47:45,127 --> 00:47:47,087
Speaker 2: I want to thank you out louders for being with

1072
00:47:47,167 --> 00:47:49,727
Speaker 2: us today. Remember, as we said on Wednesday, follow us

1073
00:47:49,767 --> 00:47:52,367
Speaker 2: wherever you are. Follow us just in the app that's

1074
00:47:52,407 --> 00:47:52,927
Speaker 2: in your hand.

1075
00:47:52,967 --> 00:47:56,807
Speaker 4: Get it to follow, Follow and also share where you've

1076
00:47:56,807 --> 00:47:58,007
Speaker 4: been listening. We really want to see.

1077
00:47:58,087 --> 00:48:00,207
Speaker 2: Yeah, Jesse wants to know. And thank you to our

1078
00:48:00,207 --> 00:48:03,207
Speaker 2: brilliant team. This episode was produced by Emili and Gazillas.

1079
00:48:03,287 --> 00:48:05,967
Speaker 2: There's been audio production for Lea Porgees was so all

1080
00:48:06,007 --> 00:48:06,687
Speaker 2: on Monday.

1081
00:48:06,727 --> 00:48:07,127
Speaker 7: Bye.

1082
00:48:08,447 --> 00:48:11,727
Speaker 1: Shout out to any Muma Miya subscribers listening. If you

1083
00:48:11,887 --> 00:48:14,207
Speaker 1: love the show and want to support us as well,

1084
00:48:14,447 --> 00:48:16,967
Speaker 1: subscribing to MoMA Miya is the very best way to

1085
00:48:17,007 --> 00:48:19,407
Speaker 1: do so. There is a link in the episode description