1 00:00:10,614 --> 00:00:15,254 Speaker 1: You're listening to a Muma Mia podcast. Mumma Mea acknowledges 2 00:00:15,334 --> 00:00:18,134 Speaker 1: the traditional owners of land and waters that this podcast 3 00:00:18,214 --> 00:00:22,734 Speaker 1: is recorded on Hi. I'm Claire Murphy. This is Mumma 4 00:00:22,774 --> 00:00:26,414 Speaker 1: MIA's twice daily news podcast, The Quickie. A lot is 5 00:00:26,454 --> 00:00:29,494 Speaker 1: being said after Jimmy Kimmel was suspended for making a 6 00:00:29,534 --> 00:00:32,494 Speaker 1: comment about the way Trump supporters have handled the aftermath 7 00:00:32,614 --> 00:00:36,014 Speaker 1: of the assassination of right wing activist Charlie Kirk. In 8 00:00:36,054 --> 00:00:39,334 Speaker 1: a country so very proud of its constitution and its 9 00:00:39,374 --> 00:00:42,334 Speaker 1: support of freedom of speech, it seems that freedom is 10 00:00:42,374 --> 00:00:45,294 Speaker 1: now under threat. But it's not the first time US 11 00:00:45,374 --> 00:00:49,254 Speaker 1: politics and its entertainment industry have come to blows. Before 12 00:00:49,254 --> 00:00:51,414 Speaker 1: we go there, here's the latest from the Quickie newsroom 13 00:00:51,414 --> 00:00:55,414 Speaker 1: for Monday, September twenty two. Australia, the UK and Canada 14 00:00:55,454 --> 00:00:59,214 Speaker 1: have now formally recognized a Palestinian state, prompting a furious 15 00:00:59,254 --> 00:01:02,374 Speaker 1: response from Israel. The decision by the Trio, which have 16 00:01:02,454 --> 00:01:05,454 Speaker 1: been traditional allies of Israel, align them with more than 17 00:01:05,454 --> 00:01:08,854 Speaker 1: one hundred and forty other countries also backing the Palestinian 18 00:01:08,894 --> 00:01:13,654 Speaker 1: aspiration to forge an independent homeland from the Israeli occupied territories. 19 00:01:13,934 --> 00:01:16,574 Speaker 1: In a bid to build momentum for a two state solution, 20 00:01:16,814 --> 00:01:21,534 Speaker 1: as humanitarians suffering in Gaza worsens Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanya, 21 00:01:21,614 --> 00:01:24,654 Speaker 1: who condemned the move, writing on social media. I have 22 00:01:24,694 --> 00:01:27,934 Speaker 1: a clear message to those leaders who recognize a Palestinian 23 00:01:27,974 --> 00:01:31,574 Speaker 1: state after the horrific massacre of October seven, you are 24 00:01:31,614 --> 00:01:34,934 Speaker 1: giving a huge reward to terrorism, he said, referring to 25 00:01:34,974 --> 00:01:38,774 Speaker 1: Palestinian militant group Hamasa's twenty twenty three attack on Israel 26 00:01:39,054 --> 00:01:41,654 Speaker 1: that triggered the nearly two year war in Gaza. He 27 00:01:41,694 --> 00:01:44,014 Speaker 1: went on to say, and I have another message for you. 28 00:01:44,414 --> 00:01:47,294 Speaker 1: It will not happen. A Palestinian state will not be 29 00:01:47,454 --> 00:01:51,414 Speaker 1: established west of the Jordan River. Meanwhile, Israeli forces have 30 00:01:51,534 --> 00:01:54,614 Speaker 1: blown up more residential buildings in Gaza City, killing at 31 00:01:54,694 --> 00:01:57,974 Speaker 1: least thirty one Palestinians and prompting many others to flee. 32 00:01:58,334 --> 00:02:01,574 Speaker 1: Almost two years into the war, Israel's tanks pushed further 33 00:02:01,654 --> 00:02:05,054 Speaker 1: into the densely populated city that the IDF says is 34 00:02:05,094 --> 00:02:08,934 Speaker 1: the last bastion of Hamas, demolishing housing blocks it says 35 00:02:08,934 --> 00:02:11,774 Speaker 1: are being used by the militant group since launching its 36 00:02:11,774 --> 00:02:14,934 Speaker 1: ground assault in the city earlier in September. A pregnant 37 00:02:14,974 --> 00:02:17,894 Speaker 1: woman and her two children were amongst those killed on Sunday. 38 00:02:18,294 --> 00:02:20,974 Speaker 1: Israel did not comment on the civilian debts, but issued 39 00:02:21,014 --> 00:02:24,814 Speaker 1: a statement saying its forces had killed numerous militants. As 40 00:02:24,854 --> 00:02:28,214 Speaker 1: the fallout continues from the OPTAs outage linked to four deaths, 41 00:02:28,214 --> 00:02:31,734 Speaker 1: to Telco's chief executive, Stephen Rue, offered a guarantee that 42 00:02:31,774 --> 00:02:34,094 Speaker 1: Optus would not let a similar thing happen again in 43 00:02:34,134 --> 00:02:37,654 Speaker 1: the future. His assurance came despite a barrage of criticism 44 00:02:37,734 --> 00:02:41,334 Speaker 1: of OPTAs for failing to implement recommendations from a review 45 00:02:41,414 --> 00:02:44,094 Speaker 1: into a similar national outage that crippled the network in 46 00:02:44,174 --> 00:02:47,974 Speaker 1: twenty twenty three. A third of the eighteen review recommendations 47 00:02:48,054 --> 00:02:51,254 Speaker 1: stemming from that outage, which resulted in fines totaling more 48 00:02:51,254 --> 00:02:54,534 Speaker 1: than twelve million dollars, a yet to be implemented. Early 49 00:02:54,574 --> 00:02:58,894 Speaker 1: investigations into Thursday's incident appeared to show established processes were 50 00:02:58,934 --> 00:03:02,534 Speaker 1: not followed, with a botched firewall update blocking hundreds of 51 00:03:02,574 --> 00:03:07,094 Speaker 1: triple zero calls from Optus customers in South Australia, Western Australia, 52 00:03:07,174 --> 00:03:09,534 Speaker 1: parts of Western New South Wales and the Northern Territory 53 00:03:10,214 --> 00:03:12,974 Speaker 1: an eight week old boy from Gaula West, north of Adelaide, 54 00:03:13,054 --> 00:03:15,694 Speaker 1: was among four deaths linked to the fault, but SA 55 00:03:15,774 --> 00:03:18,574 Speaker 1: police say the outage was unlikely to have contributed to 56 00:03:18,614 --> 00:03:22,214 Speaker 1: the boy's death because his grandmother immediately used another phone 57 00:03:22,214 --> 00:03:25,814 Speaker 1: to contact Triple zero after her initial call failed. A 58 00:03:25,854 --> 00:03:28,894 Speaker 1: memorial service for murdered right wing activist Charlie Kirk has 59 00:03:28,894 --> 00:03:31,534 Speaker 1: been held in Phoenix today, with the US President Donald 60 00:03:31,574 --> 00:03:34,894 Speaker 1: Trump expected to address the crowd. Kirk was shot through 61 00:03:34,894 --> 00:03:37,134 Speaker 1: the neck while attending an event at a university in 62 00:03:37,254 --> 00:03:39,974 Speaker 1: Utah on September ten. A twenty two year old man 63 00:03:40,014 --> 00:03:43,094 Speaker 1: has been arrested as the suspected gunman. Guests at the 64 00:03:43,134 --> 00:03:46,574 Speaker 1: service include Elon musk Us, Vice president j d Vance, 65 00:03:46,854 --> 00:03:50,694 Speaker 1: right wing conspiracy theorist Laura Luma, and Kyl Rittenhouse, a 66 00:03:50,694 --> 00:03:53,054 Speaker 1: man who at seventeen shot dead to men at a 67 00:03:53,134 --> 00:03:56,654 Speaker 1: rally in Wisconsin. The crowd inside the event is estimated 68 00:03:56,694 --> 00:04:00,094 Speaker 1: to be more than seventy thousand, with more gathered outside, 69 00:04:00,334 --> 00:04:04,294 Speaker 1: including members of the controversial Westboro Baptist Church, who regularly 70 00:04:04,334 --> 00:04:07,734 Speaker 1: gather at the funerals of members of the LGBTQ community 71 00:04:07,934 --> 00:04:11,294 Speaker 1: to mock mourners, along with Trump speaking. JD Vance will 72 00:04:11,294 --> 00:04:14,534 Speaker 1: also take to the stage, as will defend Secretary Pete Hexeth, 73 00:04:14,774 --> 00:04:19,014 Speaker 1: Donald Trump Junior, and conservative commentator Tucker Carlson. Next, we 74 00:04:19,134 --> 00:04:22,454 Speaker 1: find out why politics and entertainment are clashing in America 75 00:04:22,694 --> 00:04:31,894 Speaker 1: once again. There's actually quite a long history of US 76 00:04:32,014 --> 00:04:35,494 Speaker 1: television being caught up in the country's political controversy of 77 00:04:35,534 --> 00:04:38,854 Speaker 1: the moment. In the nineteen forties and fifties, for example, 78 00:04:39,134 --> 00:04:43,534 Speaker 1: the paranoia fostered by the anti Communist movement and spearheaded 79 00:04:43,574 --> 00:04:47,214 Speaker 1: by Senator Joseph McCarthy, became known as the Red Scare. 80 00:04:48,014 --> 00:04:51,454 Speaker 1: The movement would boycott advertisers on TV shows that employed 81 00:04:51,534 --> 00:04:55,014 Speaker 1: anyone who'd been blacklisted that was based on a list 82 00:04:55,094 --> 00:04:57,854 Speaker 1: created by the FBI of anyone known to be a 83 00:04:57,854 --> 00:05:03,214 Speaker 1: communist or a supporter. They circulated that list amongst TV 84 00:05:03,334 --> 00:05:06,294 Speaker 1: stations and sponsors and called for those individuals to be 85 00:05:06,334 --> 00:05:10,414 Speaker 1: fired immediately and treated as Traitorsullivan, the host of the 86 00:05:10,454 --> 00:05:13,254 Speaker 1: show Toast of the Town, used that list to clear 87 00:05:13,334 --> 00:05:17,534 Speaker 1: any potential guests for the show. That list destroyed careers. 88 00:05:19,414 --> 00:05:22,414 Speaker 1: The Smothers Brother's comedy Hour in the nineteen sixties was 89 00:05:22,454 --> 00:05:26,214 Speaker 1: canceled for its anti war and anti establishment material during 90 00:05:26,254 --> 00:05:29,934 Speaker 1: the Vietnam War. Roseanne's reboot was axed after its star 91 00:05:30,134 --> 00:05:34,454 Speaker 1: Roseanne Barr tweeted racist commentary about former Obama AID Valerie 92 00:05:34,534 --> 00:05:39,294 Speaker 1: Jarrett Now. Late last week, US President Donald Trump celebrated 93 00:05:39,294 --> 00:05:42,294 Speaker 1: the suspension of talk show host Jimmy Kimmel for comments 94 00:05:42,334 --> 00:05:45,774 Speaker 1: around the assassination of right wing activist Charlie Kirk. 95 00:05:45,974 --> 00:05:49,734 Speaker 2: The Maga gang desperately trying to characterize this kid who 96 00:05:49,814 --> 00:05:52,534 Speaker 2: murdered Charlie Kirk as anything other than one of them. 97 00:05:52,814 --> 00:05:55,614 Speaker 1: On Air Force One, speaking to reporters as he returned 98 00:05:55,614 --> 00:05:58,334 Speaker 1: to the US from visiting with King Charles, Trump said 99 00:05:58,334 --> 00:06:01,494 Speaker 1: that he'd read that ninety seven percent of television networks 100 00:06:01,494 --> 00:06:05,254 Speaker 1: are against him and only gave him bad publicity, saying 101 00:06:05,294 --> 00:06:09,974 Speaker 1: he thinks maybe their licenses should be taken away. Mension 102 00:06:10,014 --> 00:06:12,454 Speaker 1: comes on the heels of the announcement that Stephen Colbert's 103 00:06:12,494 --> 00:06:15,254 Speaker 1: talk show would be ending in twenty twenty six, Trump 104 00:06:15,294 --> 00:06:18,614 Speaker 1: posting on his social media platform that leaves Jimmy and 105 00:06:18,654 --> 00:06:23,094 Speaker 1: Seth two total losers on fake news NBC. Their ratings 106 00:06:23,094 --> 00:06:27,134 Speaker 1: are also horrible. Do at NBC to waghe through the 107 00:06:27,134 --> 00:06:30,054 Speaker 1: politics of entertainment is the co host of Planet America, 108 00:06:30,254 --> 00:06:34,374 Speaker 1: John Barron. John Baron, thank you so much for joining us. 109 00:06:34,414 --> 00:06:36,694 Speaker 1: There is a lot happening in the world of US 110 00:06:36,854 --> 00:06:39,894 Speaker 1: entertainment and politics right now, and so first of all, 111 00:06:39,894 --> 00:06:42,694 Speaker 1: I wanted to get your idea. Ron. I've given us 112 00:06:42,694 --> 00:06:45,014 Speaker 1: a little bit of a history lesson about the McCarthy 113 00:06:45,054 --> 00:06:48,734 Speaker 1: of the era and how it impacted US entertainers. Are 114 00:06:48,734 --> 00:06:53,174 Speaker 1: we seeing that happening all over again now? Can we 115 00:06:53,254 --> 00:06:56,334 Speaker 1: draw similar conclusions about what we're seeing with hosts like 116 00:06:56,454 --> 00:07:00,894 Speaker 1: Kimmel being suspended for commentary about Charlie Kirk's assassination, Well, 117 00:07:00,894 --> 00:07:01,254 Speaker 1: we can. 118 00:07:01,174 --> 00:07:04,174 Speaker 3: Certainly draw parallels. I'm always of the view clear that 119 00:07:04,334 --> 00:07:08,534 Speaker 3: history doesn't so much repeaters rhyme. We hear similarities, there 120 00:07:08,534 --> 00:07:12,534 Speaker 3: are echoes. It's never an exact replication, but certainly there 121 00:07:12,534 --> 00:07:16,214 Speaker 3: are reasons to feel as though that early nineteen fifties 122 00:07:16,254 --> 00:07:19,494 Speaker 3: of anti communist witch hunt era, where the likes of 123 00:07:19,614 --> 00:07:23,534 Speaker 3: Joe McCarthy and others in the US Congress, including future 124 00:07:23,614 --> 00:07:27,694 Speaker 3: Vice President and President Richard Nixon, we're going after suspected 125 00:07:27,774 --> 00:07:31,294 Speaker 3: communists in branches of government, the military, and of course 126 00:07:31,334 --> 00:07:34,774 Speaker 3: the entertainment industry that led to those blacklists where people 127 00:07:34,774 --> 00:07:38,774 Speaker 3: with communistic tendencies or left wing political views were sometimes 128 00:07:38,774 --> 00:07:42,574 Speaker 3: stopped from working because of the pressure brought to bear 129 00:07:43,134 --> 00:07:45,934 Speaker 3: by those hearings, and to an extent, you can say 130 00:07:46,174 --> 00:07:48,814 Speaker 3: this is a new kind of McCarthyism, the fact that 131 00:07:49,334 --> 00:07:53,414 Speaker 3: the Trump administration is prepared to use whatever leverage they 132 00:07:53,494 --> 00:07:57,454 Speaker 3: have to pressure networks to drop presenters such as Jimmy 133 00:07:57,534 --> 00:08:01,334 Speaker 3: Kimmel that they see as being a thorn in their side, 134 00:08:01,454 --> 00:08:05,414 Speaker 3: not on their side, constantly making jokes at Donald Trump's expense. 135 00:08:05,854 --> 00:08:09,694 Speaker 3: The Federal Communications Commission in the United States is using 136 00:08:09,774 --> 00:08:13,614 Speaker 3: the power of threatening to block mergers that some of 137 00:08:13,614 --> 00:08:15,934 Speaker 3: these big media companies want to do, or threatening to 138 00:08:15,974 --> 00:08:19,414 Speaker 3: withdraw the broadcast licenses of if not the major network 139 00:08:19,454 --> 00:08:23,614 Speaker 3: headquarters which are large and powerful, the more vulnerable affiliated 140 00:08:23,694 --> 00:08:27,214 Speaker 3: stations in smaller markets around the United States, who might 141 00:08:27,254 --> 00:08:29,694 Speaker 3: be accused of putting things to air, such as Jimmy 142 00:08:29,734 --> 00:08:32,734 Speaker 3: Kimmel that the FC ide, well, that was fake news, 143 00:08:32,774 --> 00:08:35,614 Speaker 3: that was incorrect, what he said about the alleged killer 144 00:08:35,654 --> 00:08:37,574 Speaker 3: of Charlie Kirk, and so on. In the sense that 145 00:08:37,654 --> 00:08:40,254 Speaker 3: this is a kind of a witch hunt and it 146 00:08:40,334 --> 00:08:44,094 Speaker 3: is coming from politicians, it is similar. The difference, of course, 147 00:08:44,254 --> 00:08:47,174 Speaker 3: is that this is coming from the president. It is 148 00:08:47,254 --> 00:08:51,814 Speaker 3: starting with the President of the United States, and the irony. 149 00:08:51,934 --> 00:08:54,654 Speaker 3: In fact, it's really hypocrisy that this is all being 150 00:08:54,694 --> 00:08:57,774 Speaker 3: done in the name of preserving the legacy of a 151 00:08:57,814 --> 00:09:01,574 Speaker 3: free speech warrior in Charlie Kirk. They are shutting down 152 00:09:01,614 --> 00:09:05,494 Speaker 3: free speech to honor a free speech advocate. It makes 153 00:09:05,534 --> 00:09:06,614 Speaker 3: no logical sense at all. 154 00:09:07,014 --> 00:09:10,654 Speaker 1: We mentioned there about potentially canceling broadcast licenses. Donald Trump 155 00:09:10,694 --> 00:09:12,814 Speaker 1: has said this out loud to report as a couple 156 00:09:12,854 --> 00:09:14,894 Speaker 1: of times now that that's something that he would like 157 00:09:14,974 --> 00:09:17,734 Speaker 1: to see happen. Because he gets so much negative coverage 158 00:09:17,734 --> 00:09:20,254 Speaker 1: from the TV networks. How much power does he have 159 00:09:20,694 --> 00:09:22,934 Speaker 1: to make that actually happen. Can he do that? 160 00:09:23,294 --> 00:09:26,534 Speaker 3: It's an incredible talent that Donald Trump has. Is a 161 00:09:26,534 --> 00:09:29,894 Speaker 3: little bit like the schoolyard bully who can just at 162 00:09:29,934 --> 00:09:34,134 Speaker 3: first glance see that you're sensitive about the glasses you wear, 163 00:09:34,334 --> 00:09:36,214 Speaker 3: or the way you do your hair, or the braces 164 00:09:36,214 --> 00:09:38,494 Speaker 3: on your teeth, and he goes right for that. We 165 00:09:38,534 --> 00:09:42,134 Speaker 3: saw it in real terms when ABC reporter John Lyons 166 00:09:42,574 --> 00:09:45,814 Speaker 3: asked Donald Trump about how much he'd made in business 167 00:09:45,894 --> 00:09:48,694 Speaker 3: since returning to the presidency in January, and to question 168 00:09:48,734 --> 00:09:51,254 Speaker 3: whether it was appropriate for somebody making a huge amount 169 00:09:51,254 --> 00:09:53,294 Speaker 3: of money out of being president of the United States. 170 00:09:53,534 --> 00:09:57,254 Speaker 3: Businesses aren't just continuing without him while he's being president again, 171 00:09:57,334 --> 00:09:59,694 Speaker 3: but that are actually profiting because of the influence in 172 00:09:59,734 --> 00:10:03,614 Speaker 3: the access that Trump has as president. He's monetizing the president. Well. 173 00:10:03,934 --> 00:10:06,294 Speaker 3: Trump's response that we saw and was shown around the 174 00:10:06,294 --> 00:10:08,054 Speaker 3: world this week was to say that John Lyons, you're 175 00:10:08,094 --> 00:10:10,774 Speaker 3: damaging Australia. Entry wants to be nice to me at 176 00:10:10,774 --> 00:10:12,934 Speaker 3: the moment, knowing that Anthony Albanezi is about to go 177 00:10:12,974 --> 00:10:15,454 Speaker 3: over there and they want to keep the Orcat Submarine 178 00:10:15,454 --> 00:10:18,014 Speaker 3: Agreement and they don't want to get tariffs, increased birth 179 00:10:18,054 --> 00:10:20,774 Speaker 3: and the current ten percent that Trump has already imposed 180 00:10:20,774 --> 00:10:22,734 Speaker 3: on Australia and most of the rest of the world. 181 00:10:22,934 --> 00:10:26,014 Speaker 3: So he was immediately able to say, ah, you're Australian, right, 182 00:10:26,134 --> 00:10:29,014 Speaker 3: here's how I bully you. Trump is doing the same 183 00:10:29,094 --> 00:10:32,054 Speaker 3: thing through the Federal Communications Commission. He's also doing it, 184 00:10:32,054 --> 00:10:35,774 Speaker 3: of course, through the United States Justice Department and the FBI, 185 00:10:36,094 --> 00:10:41,374 Speaker 3: investigating his former political rivals, setting the Justice Department onto 186 00:10:41,454 --> 00:10:44,654 Speaker 3: Joe Biden and Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton and Bill 187 00:10:44,694 --> 00:10:48,454 Speaker 3: Clinton and all of these people that don't like Donald Trump, 188 00:10:48,494 --> 00:10:52,534 Speaker 3: and Donald Trump doesn't like previous presidents have not gone 189 00:10:52,614 --> 00:10:56,414 Speaker 3: this far. Clear, they haven't weaponized the Justice Department, they 190 00:10:56,454 --> 00:11:02,094 Speaker 3: haven't weaponized supposedly independent organizations such as the Federal Communications Commission. 191 00:11:02,374 --> 00:11:05,574 Speaker 3: And indeed, we're seeing the politicization of public health in 192 00:11:05,614 --> 00:11:09,214 Speaker 3: the United States, with unscientific views now being made government 193 00:11:09,254 --> 00:11:12,214 Speaker 3: police and the policy of the Centers for Disease Control 194 00:11:12,254 --> 00:11:15,374 Speaker 3: around things like vaccine safety. We're getting into very, very 195 00:11:15,454 --> 00:11:18,454 Speaker 3: dangerous territory. But there are those who say, look, once 196 00:11:18,454 --> 00:11:21,174 Speaker 3: you start to shut down descent in the form of comedians, 197 00:11:21,774 --> 00:11:24,214 Speaker 3: it may not seem that serious. But one thing that 198 00:11:24,254 --> 00:11:26,574 Speaker 3: all dictators have in common is they don't like to 199 00:11:26,574 --> 00:11:29,454 Speaker 3: be ridiculed. And when you start to silence people for 200 00:11:29,534 --> 00:11:32,894 Speaker 3: making jokes about you, that is actually a very very 201 00:11:32,934 --> 00:11:35,694 Speaker 3: slippery slope. It may not appear as serious as it is. 202 00:11:36,414 --> 00:11:39,934 Speaker 1: John if you were an American late night TV show host, 203 00:11:39,974 --> 00:11:42,654 Speaker 1: and there's dwindling numbers of those now, if you think 204 00:11:42,694 --> 00:11:44,894 Speaker 1: Colbert will be off the air in twenty twenty six, 205 00:11:45,294 --> 00:11:49,174 Speaker 1: would you change the way you approach politics now in 206 00:11:49,214 --> 00:11:53,334 Speaker 1: your opening monologues, would you start to censor yourself in 207 00:11:53,454 --> 00:11:55,574 Speaker 1: order to remain on the air, and how do some 208 00:11:55,614 --> 00:11:59,054 Speaker 1: others get away with it? I mean South Park are notorious. 209 00:11:59,134 --> 00:12:01,734 Speaker 1: I mean they did that episode of Trump literally in 210 00:12:01,774 --> 00:12:05,774 Speaker 1: bed with Satan, Like, will you see self censorship start 211 00:12:05,814 --> 00:12:06,094 Speaker 1: to happen? 212 00:12:06,174 --> 00:12:08,254 Speaker 3: Now you think, well, you're right to suggest that self 213 00:12:08,294 --> 00:12:10,534 Speaker 3: censorship is the other part of this. Trump can exert 214 00:12:10,614 --> 00:12:12,774 Speaker 3: a lot of power over people. It can threaten to 215 00:12:12,814 --> 00:12:15,814 Speaker 3: take away licenses, take away people's liberty, take away their money. 216 00:12:16,014 --> 00:12:18,814 Speaker 3: But it's the chilling effect that that has on people. 217 00:12:18,814 --> 00:12:21,214 Speaker 3: And this is one of the ways that in beyond 218 00:12:21,294 --> 00:12:26,254 Speaker 3: American politics, some media proprietors media moguls have exerted ideological 219 00:12:26,294 --> 00:12:30,134 Speaker 3: influence over their mast heads and their media outlets, not 220 00:12:30,174 --> 00:12:33,374 Speaker 3: necessarily by sending a memo to every journalist every week 221 00:12:33,454 --> 00:12:35,934 Speaker 3: to say this is our stance on this issue and 222 00:12:35,974 --> 00:12:37,774 Speaker 3: I want you to write this or whatever. But people 223 00:12:37,854 --> 00:12:40,094 Speaker 3: get a sense of what is approved and what is not, 224 00:12:40,174 --> 00:12:42,414 Speaker 3: what line to take on issues like climate change, and 225 00:12:42,774 --> 00:12:44,694 Speaker 3: what story is to you know, don't go too heavily 226 00:12:44,734 --> 00:12:47,254 Speaker 3: on these s'ts of stories. The bosses won't like it, 227 00:12:47,334 --> 00:12:49,574 Speaker 3: or in this case, the President won't like it. That's 228 00:12:49,574 --> 00:12:51,614 Speaker 3: the what effect this has on the other late night shows. 229 00:12:51,734 --> 00:12:54,014 Speaker 3: If you go back to the nineteen nineties, look at 230 00:12:54,014 --> 00:12:58,094 Speaker 3: an old episode of David Letterman's Tonight Show. He didn't 231 00:12:58,094 --> 00:13:00,214 Speaker 3: talk politics that much, and if he did, you didn't 232 00:13:00,214 --> 00:13:01,814 Speaker 3: really know what he thought about it. He was just 233 00:13:01,814 --> 00:13:05,214 Speaker 3: as likely to have Republican presidential candidate Bob Dole on 234 00:13:05,334 --> 00:13:07,494 Speaker 3: in nineteen ninety six as he was to have President 235 00:13:07,534 --> 00:13:12,094 Speaker 3: Clinton on the program. He would make jokes about both sides, 236 00:13:12,174 --> 00:13:13,734 Speaker 3: and certainly that was the case. You get back to 237 00:13:13,734 --> 00:13:17,134 Speaker 3: the seventies and eighties Johnny Carson before him, Johnny Carson 238 00:13:17,134 --> 00:13:19,974 Speaker 3: would occasionally make jokes about what was in the news, 239 00:13:20,414 --> 00:13:23,854 Speaker 3: but it wasn't a constant narrative to essentially say Donald 240 00:13:23,894 --> 00:13:26,934 Speaker 3: Trump is ridiculous and a bad person. That is the 241 00:13:26,974 --> 00:13:30,334 Speaker 3: heart of most of the humor that Jimmy Kimmel, Jimmy fallon. 242 00:13:30,334 --> 00:13:33,694 Speaker 3: To a lesser extent, certainly Seth Myers and Stephen Colbert, 243 00:13:34,054 --> 00:13:37,294 Speaker 3: they're anti Trump. There's nothing illegal about that. In fact, 244 00:13:37,454 --> 00:13:40,214 Speaker 3: it is guaranteed by the American Constitution, the right to 245 00:13:40,254 --> 00:13:43,614 Speaker 3: free speech. It's the first Amendment. They're allowed to do that. 246 00:13:43,734 --> 00:13:46,134 Speaker 3: Then it's just up to individuals just where they choose 247 00:13:46,214 --> 00:13:48,974 Speaker 3: to watch that for their nightly entertainment. But Jimmy Kimmel 248 00:13:49,094 --> 00:13:51,374 Speaker 3: and the other late night hosts are at a vulnerable 249 00:13:51,414 --> 00:13:55,894 Speaker 3: moment now because, as we know, broadcast TV audiences are dwindling, 250 00:13:56,174 --> 00:14:00,174 Speaker 3: so they can command less money from their advertisers. Those 251 00:14:00,174 --> 00:14:03,614 Speaker 3: shows are expensive, those our long shows which sometimes go 252 00:14:03,694 --> 00:14:06,454 Speaker 3: to eric midnight one o'clock in the morning, They've got 253 00:14:06,494 --> 00:14:09,294 Speaker 3: a live studio audience that needs to be wrangled. They've 254 00:14:09,294 --> 00:14:12,334 Speaker 3: got a live band in many cases, although Seth Myers 255 00:14:12,374 --> 00:14:15,014 Speaker 3: gave his up as a cost cutting measure, But that 256 00:14:15,134 --> 00:14:18,374 Speaker 3: old variety tonight show format pioneered back in the nineteen 257 00:14:18,454 --> 00:14:20,854 Speaker 3: fifties with the likes of Jack Parr and Steve Allen 258 00:14:20,894 --> 00:14:23,614 Speaker 3: and then Johnny Carson. It's old school TV that is 259 00:14:23,694 --> 00:14:25,814 Speaker 3: dying a slow death. It died in Australia, I guess 260 00:14:25,814 --> 00:14:28,654 Speaker 3: with the Don Lane Show in the nineteen eighties. It's 261 00:14:28,734 --> 00:14:30,854 Speaker 3: no longer really viable in the US, which is why 262 00:14:30,894 --> 00:14:33,814 Speaker 3: they're winding them down and why Jimmy Kimmel was vulnerable 263 00:14:33,854 --> 00:14:35,974 Speaker 3: to being taken off this week for saying things I 264 00:14:36,054 --> 00:14:38,014 Speaker 3: might add as to whether it would be a have 265 00:14:38,054 --> 00:14:39,934 Speaker 3: a chilling effect on me if I was in that situation. 266 00:14:40,134 --> 00:14:42,374 Speaker 3: We made pretty much the same jokes as Jimmy Kimmel 267 00:14:42,374 --> 00:14:45,494 Speaker 3: about Trump's weird reaction when he was asked about Charlie 268 00:14:45,574 --> 00:14:48,334 Speaker 3: Kirk's death, and Trump very quickly says, yeah, well, we're 269 00:14:48,334 --> 00:14:51,054 Speaker 3: building a fantastic ballroom here at the White House. It 270 00:14:51,134 --> 00:14:53,494 Speaker 3: was a strange pivot. Maybe there's something done out of 271 00:14:53,534 --> 00:14:56,094 Speaker 3: grief not wanting to show his sadness, or maybe Trump 272 00:14:56,134 --> 00:14:58,334 Speaker 3: really just you know, it's kind of a bumblebee going 273 00:14:58,334 --> 00:15:00,254 Speaker 3: from one topic to another. Yeah, I'm sad about Charlie, 274 00:15:00,294 --> 00:15:02,254 Speaker 3: but hey, we're putting a lot more gold leaf into 275 00:15:02,254 --> 00:15:05,214 Speaker 3: the White House and there's ballroom we're building. It's hard 276 00:15:05,254 --> 00:15:07,134 Speaker 3: to know what was going through his mind. Jimmy Kimmel 277 00:15:07,254 --> 00:15:10,574 Speaker 3: was kind of raising an eyebrow at it. Did we 278 00:15:10,574 --> 00:15:13,334 Speaker 3: we got complaints, We got people saying that we shouldn't 279 00:15:13,334 --> 00:15:16,614 Speaker 3: be saying anything bad about Charlie Kirk, that we shouldn't 280 00:15:16,654 --> 00:15:19,534 Speaker 3: be making jokes, that we shouldn't be pointing out ridiculous 281 00:15:19,534 --> 00:15:22,574 Speaker 3: things that Trump says. Fortunately, ABC Australia is a little 282 00:15:22,574 --> 00:15:24,934 Speaker 3: bit more forgiving than ABC America because I guess we've 283 00:15:24,934 --> 00:15:26,134 Speaker 3: got a different funding structure. 284 00:15:26,654 --> 00:15:29,414 Speaker 1: Just finally, John, I want to does get your idea 285 00:15:29,454 --> 00:15:32,454 Speaker 1: on what freedom of speech actually means to Americans because 286 00:15:32,894 --> 00:15:35,414 Speaker 1: it's in the Constitution. As you said, it's a point 287 00:15:35,454 --> 00:15:37,454 Speaker 1: that is made over and over and over again in 288 00:15:37,494 --> 00:15:39,654 Speaker 1: any debate that seems to happen in any kind of 289 00:15:39,774 --> 00:15:42,694 Speaker 1: US political circles, and yet it seems either side are 290 00:15:42,774 --> 00:15:45,094 Speaker 1: very quick to shut down the other when it comes 291 00:15:45,094 --> 00:15:47,734 Speaker 1: to anything that they don't want to hear. Is freedom 292 00:15:47,734 --> 00:15:49,734 Speaker 1: of speech real for Americans? 293 00:15:50,494 --> 00:15:51,974 Speaker 3: It's real in the sense that it is in the 294 00:15:51,974 --> 00:15:55,934 Speaker 3: Constitution and has been tested many, many times. Most famously, 295 00:15:55,974 --> 00:15:58,934 Speaker 3: the test was you're free to say many, many things, 296 00:15:59,014 --> 00:16:02,334 Speaker 3: but you're not free to shout fire in a crowded theater. 297 00:16:02,574 --> 00:16:05,214 Speaker 3: That was an analogy that was used by a Supreme 298 00:16:05,254 --> 00:16:08,294 Speaker 3: Court justice over a century ago. So you can't say 299 00:16:08,374 --> 00:16:12,014 Speaker 3: things that are going to incite panic and potentially risk lives. 300 00:16:12,254 --> 00:16:14,614 Speaker 3: The test for what is free speech and what is 301 00:16:14,654 --> 00:16:18,014 Speaker 3: hate speech in the United States has also been explored, 302 00:16:18,254 --> 00:16:19,974 Speaker 3: and it really goes down to you can say a 303 00:16:19,974 --> 00:16:22,214 Speaker 3: lot of things, a lot of bad things, but unless 304 00:16:22,254 --> 00:16:24,814 Speaker 3: you're literally saying and I want you to go out 305 00:16:24,854 --> 00:16:28,374 Speaker 3: and kill people who we don't agree with, if it's 306 00:16:28,414 --> 00:16:32,254 Speaker 3: not an immediate incitement to violence, then it is covered. 307 00:16:32,294 --> 00:16:35,934 Speaker 3: It is protected free speech. So you can be racist, 308 00:16:35,974 --> 00:16:38,174 Speaker 3: you can be transphobic, you can say a lot of 309 00:16:38,214 --> 00:16:41,814 Speaker 3: things that people will find objectionable and it is still 310 00:16:41,894 --> 00:16:43,934 Speaker 3: protected by the Constitution. But you're right, there is a 311 00:16:44,014 --> 00:16:47,494 Speaker 3: huge amount of hypocrisy both sides of politics. Claire tend 312 00:16:47,534 --> 00:16:49,974 Speaker 3: to say, free speech is what I believe, and I'm 313 00:16:49,974 --> 00:16:51,254 Speaker 3: going to say what I want to say. But if 314 00:16:51,254 --> 00:16:53,334 Speaker 3: you say something I don't agree with, you should be stopped. 315 00:16:53,334 --> 00:16:55,694 Speaker 3: You shouldn't be allowed to say those things. And it's 316 00:16:55,694 --> 00:16:58,134 Speaker 3: something that a lot of people, all of us have 317 00:16:58,494 --> 00:17:01,454 Speaker 3: our blind spots, and this is a massive blind spot, 318 00:17:01,494 --> 00:17:04,254 Speaker 3: and right now that we're seeing the Trump administration essentially 319 00:17:04,614 --> 00:17:08,974 Speaker 3: say that if you even joke about Donald Trump, you 320 00:17:09,054 --> 00:17:13,534 Speaker 3: are supporting left wing terrorism. Because Donald Trump was the 321 00:17:13,574 --> 00:17:16,374 Speaker 3: target of an attempt assassination twice last year Charlie Kirk, 322 00:17:16,414 --> 00:17:19,854 Speaker 3: they killed him. So you're mocking of Trump. You're not 323 00:17:19,894 --> 00:17:22,854 Speaker 3: even mocking him. You're seriously saying he's showing autocratic or 324 00:17:22,854 --> 00:17:25,814 Speaker 3: fascistic tendencies, or that he's a racist, or that he 325 00:17:25,894 --> 00:17:28,494 Speaker 3: is a sexist, or he's a transphone. Even if you 326 00:17:28,534 --> 00:17:31,414 Speaker 3: believe those things they're saying, don't say them because you 327 00:17:31,494 --> 00:17:34,654 Speaker 3: are inciting violence, and that goes to what is the 328 00:17:34,694 --> 00:17:37,734 Speaker 3: definition of hate speech? So there is method to this, 329 00:17:38,174 --> 00:17:39,854 Speaker 3: but it is profoundly hypocritical. 330 00:17:40,774 --> 00:17:43,374 Speaker 1: So how did John Stewart react when he sat down 331 00:17:43,414 --> 00:17:45,414 Speaker 1: on the Daily Show desk that next night? 332 00:17:45,934 --> 00:17:47,814 Speaker 4: But in America, we have a little something called the 333 00:17:47,854 --> 00:17:50,534 Speaker 4: First Amendment. And let me tell you how it works. 334 00:17:51,254 --> 00:17:58,574 Speaker 5: There's something called a talent ometer. It's a completely scientific 335 00:17:58,614 --> 00:18:01,814 Speaker 5: instrument that is kept on the President's desk and it 336 00:18:01,934 --> 00:18:09,254 Speaker 5: tells the president when a performer's tick talent Porsche, measured mostly. 337 00:18:08,934 --> 00:18:13,094 Speaker 4: By nice to the President goes below a certain level, 338 00:18:13,134 --> 00:18:15,734 Speaker 4: at which point the FCC must be notified to threaten 339 00:18:15,774 --> 00:18:18,814 Speaker 4: the acquisition prospects for billion dollar mergers of network affiliates. 340 00:18:18,854 --> 00:18:21,174 Speaker 4: These affiliates are then asked to give ultimatums to the 341 00:18:21,214 --> 00:18:23,854 Speaker 4: even larger mega corporation that controls the flow of state 342 00:18:23,894 --> 00:18:26,094 Speaker 4: of proof content or the FCZ. He can just choose 343 00:18:26,094 --> 00:18:27,614 Speaker 4: to threaten those licenses directly. 344 00:18:28,214 --> 00:18:29,254 Speaker 3: It's basic science. 345 00:18:31,094 --> 00:18:33,334 Speaker 1: Well, how about Jimmy Fallon over on the tonight show. 346 00:18:34,694 --> 00:18:37,014 Speaker 2: Yeah, a lot of people are worried that we won't 347 00:18:37,094 --> 00:18:39,094 Speaker 2: keep saying what we want to say, or that will 348 00:18:39,134 --> 00:18:42,254 Speaker 2: be censored. But I'm going to cover the President's trip 349 00:18:42,334 --> 00:18:51,334 Speaker 2: to the UK, just like I normally would. Here we go, Well, guys, 350 00:18:51,374 --> 00:18:53,854 Speaker 2: President Trump just wrapped up his three day trip to 351 00:18:53,894 --> 00:18:54,574 Speaker 2: the UK. 352 00:18:54,734 --> 00:18:56,974 Speaker 3: And he looked incredibly hands. 353 00:18:59,934 --> 00:19:04,894 Speaker 1: That seems they didn't receive Trump's memo thanks for taking 354 00:19:04,894 --> 00:19:06,694 Speaker 1: some time to feed your mind with us today. The 355 00:19:06,774 --> 00:19:09,934 Speaker 1: quickie is produced by me Claire Murphy, with audio production 356 00:19:10,094 --> 00:19:10,774 Speaker 1: by lu Hill.