WEBVTT - Three Months After Her Wedding, Anthea Bradshaw Was Murdered

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<v Speaker 1>You're listening to a MoMA Mia podcast. Mama Mia acknowledges

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<v Speaker 1>the traditional owners of land and waterers. This podcast was

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<v Speaker 1>recorded on it's nine point thirty PM on a Thursday

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<v Speaker 1>night in July nineteen ninety four, and Martin and Roz

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<v Speaker 1>have just settled in at home after closing up their

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<v Speaker 1>news agency in suburban Adelaide. The phone rings. Ros answers

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<v Speaker 1>and is immediately met by an agitated voice. It's Jeff,

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<v Speaker 1>her daughter's husband of three months, and he's dead. He

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<v Speaker 1>tells her. Don't you say that to me? Don't you

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<v Speaker 1>say that to me? She replies. By the time Martin

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<v Speaker 1>runs into the room, his wife is slumped on the

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<v Speaker 1>floor in the fetal positions, screaming. He grabs the phone,

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<v Speaker 1>but Jeff isn't making sense. The couple are in Brunei

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<v Speaker 1>in Southeast Asia. They're in the process of moving over

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<v Speaker 1>there for work, but Anthea was supposed to be coming

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<v Speaker 1>home to Adelaide tomorrow to finish up work at a

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<v Speaker 1>local school before making the move. Permanently killed in a

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<v Speaker 1>burglary gone wrong, Her family is told they've given very

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<v Speaker 1>little information about the circumstances surrounding her death. Forced to

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<v Speaker 1>say goodbye to her in the same church she said

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<v Speaker 1>her vows only a few months prior, but four years

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<v Speaker 1>later they discover information from the night she died that

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<v Speaker 1>rocks them to their core. All this time, the police

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<v Speaker 1>had a name an official suspect in the murder of

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<v Speaker 1>Anthea Bradshaw. I'm Jemma Bass and this is True Crime

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<v Speaker 1>Conversations a Muma mea podcast exploring the world's most notorious

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<v Speaker 1>crimes by speaking to the people who know the most

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<v Speaker 1>about them. The body of twenty six year old Anthea

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<v Speaker 1>Bradshaw was found on the floor of the apartment her

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<v Speaker 1>husband Jeff Hall, was living in in Brunei. South Australian

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<v Speaker 1>police believe there is enough evidence in this case to arrest, charge,

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<v Speaker 1>and potentially convict someone, but Brunei doesn't agree, despite numerous

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<v Speaker 1>attempts by our authorities to make that happen. In twenty

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<v Speaker 1>twenty four nine, senior reporter Ben Avery has been reinvestigating

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<v Speaker 1>this case and he's determined to help put her killer

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<v Speaker 1>behind bars. He's spoken at length to Anthea's family, friends,

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<v Speaker 1>and the Australian police involved in the case in a

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<v Speaker 1>new podcast called The Anthea Bradshaw mystery, Ben joins us.

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<v Speaker 2>Now, Ben, you've been looking back into Anthea Bradshaw's story,

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<v Speaker 2>how has it felt talking to her friends and parents

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<v Speaker 2>and brothers and really getting deep into her life.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah. I think it was about ten years ago that

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<v Speaker 3>Craig Bradshaw, that's Anthea's eldest brother, contacted me in the

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<v Speaker 3>nine News Adelaide news room and I was shocked at

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<v Speaker 3>the time that I hadn't heard about this case. It

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<v Speaker 3>was an innocent South Australian school teacher who went overseas

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<v Speaker 3>to Brunei three months after her wedding and never came home,

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<v Speaker 3>and there really hadn't been a lot of coverage about it.

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<v Speaker 3>And I could tell in Craig's voice that a lot

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<v Speaker 3>of years may have passed, but he was still deeply

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<v Speaker 3>upset and frustrated by not only the fact that he'd

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<v Speaker 3>lost his sister, but also justice hadn't been served in

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<v Speaker 3>a case that seemed somewhat solvable. And so I got

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<v Speaker 3>to know Craig quite well. I've got to know the

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<v Speaker 3>rest of the family quite well, and it's very clear

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<v Speaker 3>to me that they're consumed by this case and that

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<v Speaker 3>they won't rest until it is solved. And so a

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<v Speaker 3>lot of people will say to them, and they get

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<v Speaker 3>frustrated by people saying to them that you should just

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<v Speaker 3>move on, and they just say, look, we don't want

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<v Speaker 3>to move on, and we can't move on. And so

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<v Speaker 3>here we are, thirty years later, still talking about it,

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<v Speaker 3>perhaps no closer to the answers that they need.

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<v Speaker 1>This case was nineteen ninety four. Why do you think

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<v Speaker 1>it didn't get as much media coverage back then?

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<v Speaker 3>I guess back then things were a lot different. I

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<v Speaker 3>feel like if it happened now, there would be a

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<v Speaker 3>lot of coverage about it. Obviously, traveling overseas as a

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<v Speaker 3>journalist perhaps didn't happen as often back then. Getting information

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<v Speaker 3>from overseas was a lot more difficult too, Getting vision

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<v Speaker 3>and pictures from overseas was tricky. And so I went

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<v Speaker 3>through the archives here at Channel nine. I did find

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<v Speaker 3>one story from nineteen ninety four that provided some information

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<v Speaker 3>about what had happened. But obviously, these days, this is

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<v Speaker 3>something that would be covered at length, day in day out,

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<v Speaker 3>perhaps for a good couple of weeks, if not longer.

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<v Speaker 3>And so a very unique situation here where a horrible

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<v Speaker 3>murder of a much loved, innocent South Australia went almost

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<v Speaker 3>unnoticed for a very long time.

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<v Speaker 1>You said that Craig got in contact with you ten

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<v Speaker 1>years ago. That's a long time to be sitting on

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<v Speaker 1>this story, to be thinking about it.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, And I mean I have done stories in those

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<v Speaker 3>ten years from time to time. Obviously there's been quite

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<v Speaker 3>a few developments since then, but nothing that has got

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<v Speaker 3>them to the point that they want. For me, it's

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<v Speaker 3>been a ten year journey, but for the Bradshaw's obviously

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<v Speaker 3>it's been a thirty year journey. And he tells me

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<v Speaker 3>how they got to ten years after the murder and thought,

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<v Speaker 3>we can't believe that it's been ten years and there's

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<v Speaker 3>still nothing. Surely we won't get to the point where

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<v Speaker 3>it's twenty years and there's nothing. And then they get

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<v Speaker 3>to twenty years and think, surely we won't have to

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<v Speaker 3>go another ten years without getting the justice that we need.

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<v Speaker 3>And now we're at the thirty year point and they

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<v Speaker 3>can't even comprehend the fact that they're still living with

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<v Speaker 3>this and that potentially another ten years will pass and

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<v Speaker 3>will be still here.

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<v Speaker 1>Can you take us back to Anthea's childhood. She had

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<v Speaker 1>two brothers, two loving parents. How does her family describe her.

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<v Speaker 1>What are their memories of her as a little girl

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<v Speaker 1>and as a young woman.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, so, her mum Rosalind says she was born in

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<v Speaker 3>the Kapunda Hospital or a country hospital a few hours

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<v Speaker 3>from Adelaide. She was the only baby in the birthing

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<v Speaker 3>ward at the time and so she was immediately the

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<v Speaker 3>center of attention and really that didn't change because she

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<v Speaker 3>was the only daughter in the family. She was bubbly,

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<v Speaker 3>she talked a lot, She liked to sing, and her

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<v Speaker 3>mum has given me a cassette tape that she's never

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<v Speaker 3>listened to. She can't bring herself to listen to it,

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<v Speaker 3>but it's Anthea singing a song Morning Has Broken and

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<v Speaker 3>such a sweet, innocent young voice, and we play that

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<v Speaker 3>on the podcast. And then grew up being the middle child,

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<v Speaker 3>so she was a big sister to her younger brother Paul,

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<v Speaker 3>and Paul says that she really looked after him. She

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<v Speaker 3>always loved children. She helped him a lot growing up

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<v Speaker 3>and that developed, I guess into her growing up to

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<v Speaker 3>ultimately wanting to be a teacher. Her mum was a

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<v Speaker 3>registered nurse, so there was a period where she thought

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<v Speaker 3>she might want to be a registered nurse, but there

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<v Speaker 3>was her love of kids that took her into teaching,

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<v Speaker 3>and she ended up working at a school for underprivileged

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<v Speaker 3>children in murray Bridge, about an hour out of Adelaide.

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<v Speaker 3>It was called the Fraser Park Primary School. And I'm

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<v Speaker 3>told by her brother Craig that these were kids who

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<v Speaker 3>didn't have much support at home for the most part,

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<v Speaker 3>and so they wouldn't get birthday cakes on their birthdays.

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<v Speaker 3>And so Anthea went right through the list of her children,

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<v Speaker 3>found out when their birthdays were and would make a

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<v Speaker 3>birthday cake for them on their birthday. And Craig got

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<v Speaker 3>quite emotional when he told me that story, but it

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<v Speaker 3>just really highlighted how caring she was and how she

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<v Speaker 3>went to those extra lengths and did a lot for

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<v Speaker 3>those children.

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<v Speaker 1>She sounds like miss Honey, remember that childhood character.

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<v Speaker 3>A beautiful soul, absolutely And if you look at photographs

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<v Speaker 3>of Anthea, and I've been shown a lot of them

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<v Speaker 3>and home videos, always smiling, and I've never heard anyone

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<v Speaker 3>say a bad word about her. She was just this

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<v Speaker 3>really gentle, friendly soul who seemed to get along with everyone.

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<v Speaker 1>Her husband, the man she ended up marrying, they got

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<v Speaker 1>together quite young didn't they can you talk us through

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<v Speaker 1>their relationship.

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<v Speaker 3>It was year ten at school though in the same

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<v Speaker 3>year at Pembroke College, a private school here in the

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<v Speaker 3>eastern suburbs of Adelaide, And it started out as a friendship,

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<v Speaker 3>I'm told, or certainly they were telling people it was

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<v Speaker 3>a friendship, and they spend a lot of time together.

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<v Speaker 3>Jeff would be around at the Bradshaw family home a

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<v Speaker 3>lot of the time, and he was welcomed with open arms.

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<v Speaker 3>The brothers Craig and Paul got along with him really well.

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<v Speaker 3>They became mates, the three of them, and it was

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<v Speaker 3>a relationship that continued right through high school into obviously,

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<v Speaker 3>you know, their late teenage years early twenties. And the

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<v Speaker 3>family says that it was always a really good relationship

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<v Speaker 3>that they got along well. They didn't see any signs

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<v Speaker 3>of tension. Maybe the odd argument here and there, but

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<v Speaker 3>definitely and if you look at the photographs and the

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<v Speaker 3>home videos, to me, it just looked like he was

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<v Speaker 3>really welcomed and he was part of that Bradshaw extended family.

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<v Speaker 1>I guess that makes this case quite unique in that

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<v Speaker 1>the family did know Jeff so intimately because he basically

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<v Speaker 1>grew up alongside.

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<v Speaker 3>Them absolutely, and they all make a point of saying

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<v Speaker 3>that that this wasn't one of those situations where it's

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<v Speaker 3>a son in law and a brother in law that

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<v Speaker 3>sort of comes in and is a little bit on

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<v Speaker 3>the outside. He was embraced totally, and the brothers say

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<v Speaker 3>they can't even remember him coming into their lives. It's

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<v Speaker 3>like he was just always there, almost an extension of

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<v Speaker 3>the family. And that's what makes this case, I think

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<v Speaker 3>so shocking, is to know some of the allegations and

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<v Speaker 3>the suspicions and the fact now that there is this

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<v Speaker 3>wedge between the Bradshaws and Jeff Hall all of these

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<v Speaker 3>years later, and that's just a horrible thing to lose

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<v Speaker 3>your sister or your daughter, but then also have that

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<v Speaker 3>shadow in the background.

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<v Speaker 1>So in their twenties, Jeff and Anthea kind of traveled

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<v Speaker 1>the world together, did all of those early twenty backpacker

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<v Speaker 1>kind of things. And then they got married in nineteen

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<v Speaker 1>ninety four. What does her family remember of that day?

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<v Speaker 1>Was it a great wedding day for the couple?

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, they find that hard to talk about now. And

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<v Speaker 3>I have watched the wedding video and it did look

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<v Speaker 3>like a beautiful day, a really typical Adelaide wedding Tusmore

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<v Speaker 3>Park Uniting Church in the eastern suburbs of Adelaide. Anthea

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<v Speaker 3>arrives in a ford falcon Saedan gets out of the

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<v Speaker 3>car and her dad approaches and takes her by the arm.

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<v Speaker 3>She has her two bridesmaids in front of her. They

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<v Speaker 3>then walk into the church. You know, lots of smiling

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<v Speaker 3>friends and family. Her brothers were there, all of Jeff's

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<v Speaker 3>family were there. Anthea looked extremely happy, not a worry

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<v Speaker 3>in the world, as she always did, and it just

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<v Speaker 3>looked like your every day suburban wedding. I've also seen

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<v Speaker 3>video of the reception, and a typical reception as well,

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<v Speaker 3>lots of drinking and laughing. You see all of the speeches,

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<v Speaker 3>really funny speeches. Lots of people spoke. Anthea's eldest brother

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<v Speaker 3>was the MC for the wedding and he tells me

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<v Speaker 3>that it was the best wedding he'd ever been to,

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<v Speaker 3>and a few people have said that, and really difficult

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<v Speaker 3>to watch that now knowing what would happen only ninety

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<v Speaker 3>six days later.

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<v Speaker 1>It was what were the plans for after the wedding?

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<v Speaker 1>Because things happened quite quickly in that Jeff moved overseas

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<v Speaker 1>and Anthea was trying to wrap things up. What was

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<v Speaker 1>the plan there.

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<v Speaker 3>They had done a lot of travel and then they

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<v Speaker 3>get married and Jeff gets a job in Brunei, a

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<v Speaker 3>country on the island of Borney, an oil rich country

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<v Speaker 3>where there's a lot of money, and he gets a

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<v Speaker 3>job as a radiographer at a medical clinic that was

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<v Speaker 3>owned by the Brunei royal family at the time. It

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<v Speaker 3>was quite a lucrative position in that it paid reasonably

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<v Speaker 3>well and he was also put up in accommodation so

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<v Speaker 3>he didn't need to pay for his apartment. So he

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<v Speaker 3>went over there pretty soon after the wedding. Anthea, though,

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<v Speaker 3>was going to stay at home because she was still

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<v Speaker 3>teaching at the Fraser Park Primary School in murray Bridge,

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<v Speaker 3>and so she wanted to finish that teaching contract before

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<v Speaker 3>she would eventually move over to join him permanently. Now

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<v Speaker 3>there was then a decision though, that she would go

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<v Speaker 3>and visit in this period while Jeff was over there alone,

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<v Speaker 3>and so she organized to go over to Brunei for

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<v Speaker 3>ten days. She would obviously catch up with her husband

0:13:00.262 --> 0:13:04.262
<v Speaker 3>and socialize with him and his workmates, and she would

0:13:04.342 --> 0:13:06.262
<v Speaker 3>also want to look for jobs, so she would go

0:13:06.302 --> 0:13:09.342
<v Speaker 3>and visit other schools in Brunei to see if she

0:13:09.342 --> 0:13:12.222
<v Speaker 3>could organize a job for when she did move over permanently.

0:13:13.022 --> 0:13:15.262
<v Speaker 3>And so her mum and dad recall taking her to

0:13:15.342 --> 0:13:18.662
<v Speaker 3>the airport. She gets on the plane to fly over

0:13:18.742 --> 0:13:22.382
<v Speaker 3>for this visit, sadly not knowing that she would never

0:13:22.462 --> 0:13:27.102
<v Speaker 3>return home. And back then there were no mobile phones.

0:13:27.382 --> 0:13:32.142
<v Speaker 3>Communication was more difficult. There was no Facebook or email,

0:13:32.302 --> 0:13:36.422
<v Speaker 3>certainly not what they used anyway, and Anthea had told

0:13:36.502 --> 0:13:39.782
<v Speaker 3>her mum and dad, look, don't ring me while I'm

0:13:39.782 --> 0:13:44.622
<v Speaker 3>in Brunei because Jeff is worried about phone tapping. He

0:13:44.782 --> 0:13:49.902
<v Speaker 3>was worried that Brunei authorities listened to phone calls and

0:13:49.982 --> 0:13:52.782
<v Speaker 3>he told Anthea that before she went over as well,

0:13:52.822 --> 0:13:55.382
<v Speaker 3>so she didn't have much contact with him either while

0:13:55.382 --> 0:13:59.262
<v Speaker 3>he was there alone. And so Anthea's mum and dad

0:13:59.302 --> 0:14:01.782
<v Speaker 3>took this on board, although they do tell me now

0:14:02.222 --> 0:14:05.902
<v Speaker 3>that they would not have cared if Brunei authorities were

0:14:05.902 --> 0:14:07.902
<v Speaker 3>listening to their phone calls, because they would just ring

0:14:07.942 --> 0:14:09.502
<v Speaker 3>and say how are you going? Are you safe?

0:14:10.422 --> 0:14:14.142
<v Speaker 1>It's not exactly controversial, not controversial.

0:14:13.502 --> 0:14:16.262
<v Speaker 3>And that's something they think about a lot now about

0:14:16.822 --> 0:14:20.462
<v Speaker 3>why Jeff was worried about that and what it meant

0:14:20.662 --> 0:14:23.702
<v Speaker 3>was that Anthea had been there for nine days and

0:14:24.102 --> 0:14:28.022
<v Speaker 3>they hadn't had any contact with her in any form.

0:14:28.902 --> 0:14:32.702
<v Speaker 1>Then what happened to Anthea on July twenty one, nineteen

0:14:32.742 --> 0:14:34.502
<v Speaker 1>ninety four, So this.

0:14:34.582 --> 0:14:37.102
<v Speaker 3>Was the day before she was to go home back

0:14:37.102 --> 0:14:41.062
<v Speaker 3>to South Australia. And I might tell you what happened

0:14:41.102 --> 0:14:44.302
<v Speaker 3>from Jeff's perspective because I've seen his full witness statement

0:14:44.302 --> 0:14:45.942
<v Speaker 3>and that can give us a bit of an idea

0:14:46.422 --> 0:14:49.782
<v Speaker 3>into how he says the day unfolded. They'd been out

0:14:49.782 --> 0:14:52.862
<v Speaker 3>for dinner the night before with some friends. They woke

0:14:52.942 --> 0:14:55.702
<v Speaker 3>up reasonably early. They had to go and visit a

0:14:55.702 --> 0:14:58.982
<v Speaker 3>school called the Jigsaw School, where Anthea was going to

0:14:59.022 --> 0:15:02.222
<v Speaker 3>talk to the school about a potential teaching job. So

0:15:02.262 --> 0:15:05.422
<v Speaker 3>they went there in the morning. They had that interview.

0:15:06.022 --> 0:15:10.342
<v Speaker 3>They get back to the apartment complex at Geredong Park,

0:15:10.942 --> 0:15:13.902
<v Speaker 3>which is not far from where Jeff works, at about

0:15:13.942 --> 0:15:17.622
<v Speaker 3>eleven o'clock in the morning. Jeff has a shower, they

0:15:17.662 --> 0:15:19.902
<v Speaker 3>have something to eat, both of them. Again, this is

0:15:19.942 --> 0:15:24.062
<v Speaker 3>Jeff's story from his witness statement, and then his shift

0:15:24.182 --> 0:15:27.542
<v Speaker 3>was beginning at the Geredong Park Sports Medicine Center at

0:15:27.662 --> 0:15:31.062
<v Speaker 3>midday that day. He had a car there, a red

0:15:31.102 --> 0:15:35.662
<v Speaker 3>Toyota Salika, and Anthea was going to drive him to work.

0:15:36.142 --> 0:15:38.862
<v Speaker 3>And so shortly before midday they get in the car,

0:15:38.902 --> 0:15:42.062
<v Speaker 3>they make the very short journey to Geredong Park Sports

0:15:42.142 --> 0:15:46.022
<v Speaker 3>Medicine Center. Anthea drops Jeff off, he goes to work,

0:15:46.422 --> 0:15:49.702
<v Speaker 3>she goes back to the apartment complex. Now, Jeff says

0:15:49.862 --> 0:15:53.342
<v Speaker 3>that he was at work for all of that day

0:15:53.342 --> 0:15:57.422
<v Speaker 3>in terms of from midday until five pm, and then

0:15:57.462 --> 0:15:59.862
<v Speaker 3>he goes out for his dinner break, and the plan

0:16:00.062 --> 0:16:02.502
<v Speaker 3>was that Anthea would come and pick him up from

0:16:02.502 --> 0:16:05.662
<v Speaker 3>the medical center for that dinner break. So he's standing

0:16:05.742 --> 0:16:08.862
<v Speaker 3>out the front of the medical center along with a

0:16:08.902 --> 0:16:10.822
<v Speaker 3>few other people as they were either lead for the

0:16:10.902 --> 0:16:14.102
<v Speaker 3>day or leaving for dinner, and he's waiting for Anthea.

0:16:14.222 --> 0:16:16.382
<v Speaker 3>And I've spoken to lots of witnesses and I've seen

0:16:16.542 --> 0:16:19.582
<v Speaker 3>lots of witness statements. People that saw Jeff standing there

0:16:19.662 --> 0:16:22.502
<v Speaker 3>and they went to him and said, would you like

0:16:22.502 --> 0:16:24.182
<v Speaker 3>a rite home, because a lot of them lived in

0:16:24.222 --> 0:16:27.982
<v Speaker 3>the same apartment complex or nearby, and Jeff was repeatedly

0:16:28.022 --> 0:16:30.542
<v Speaker 3>saying no, No, Anthea is coming to pick me up.

0:16:30.582 --> 0:16:33.222
<v Speaker 3>She shouldn't be too long, and this happened, as I say,

0:16:33.262 --> 0:16:37.182
<v Speaker 3>with several witnesses I've spoken to. However, as time went

0:16:37.262 --> 0:16:39.302
<v Speaker 3>on and I think, you know, maybe ten to fifteen

0:16:39.302 --> 0:16:43.382
<v Speaker 3>minutes past. Jeff then made a phone call to one

0:16:43.382 --> 0:16:46.222
<v Speaker 3>of his colleagues, a woman named Peter, who lived in

0:16:46.222 --> 0:16:49.982
<v Speaker 3>the apartment complex, and Peter said, yeah, look, the car

0:16:50.022 --> 0:16:54.502
<v Speaker 3>is still here, so I will try and ring, and

0:16:54.542 --> 0:16:57.142
<v Speaker 3>I think she made a phone call to the apartment complex.

0:16:57.262 --> 0:17:00.622
<v Speaker 3>Nobody answered, so Peter went and picked up Jeff from

0:17:00.662 --> 0:17:05.142
<v Speaker 3>the medical center. Then Peter says that Jeff was worried

0:17:05.182 --> 0:17:08.742
<v Speaker 3>about where Anthea was, and they made a decision to

0:17:08.902 --> 0:17:12.222
<v Speaker 3>drive around where she may have gone walking or running

0:17:12.262 --> 0:17:14.782
<v Speaker 3>because she'd been doing that while she was in Brunei.

0:17:15.662 --> 0:17:18.182
<v Speaker 3>There was no sign of Anthea, so a short time

0:17:18.262 --> 0:17:21.662
<v Speaker 3>later they returned to the apartment complex. Peter and Jeff

0:17:21.662 --> 0:17:23.822
<v Speaker 3>get out of the car. Peter says, she heads to

0:17:23.942 --> 0:17:27.902
<v Speaker 3>her apartment and says, I'll see you again soon. Jeff

0:17:27.982 --> 0:17:31.062
<v Speaker 3>goes to his apartment, which is on the third floor.

0:17:31.742 --> 0:17:34.942
<v Speaker 3>He opens the door and Anthea is in a pool

0:17:34.982 --> 0:17:38.782
<v Speaker 3>of blood and it is clear that her body's cold

0:17:39.342 --> 0:17:43.222
<v Speaker 3>and that she's dead, and he screams out to Peter,

0:17:43.302 --> 0:17:48.142
<v Speaker 3>because Peter's a nurse. Peter comes up sadly. It's clear

0:17:48.182 --> 0:17:51.822
<v Speaker 3>that there's nothing anyone can do by that point, and

0:17:51.942 --> 0:17:55.382
<v Speaker 3>really that's where this mystery begins.

0:17:55.822 --> 0:17:58.342
<v Speaker 1>Because she'd been quite brutally murdered, hadn't she.

0:17:59.542 --> 0:18:02.222
<v Speaker 3>So the post mortem would find that she had been

0:18:02.262 --> 0:18:05.742
<v Speaker 3>strangled to death, and then after she was already dead,

0:18:06.542 --> 0:18:10.662
<v Speaker 3>she was stabbed multiple times, and it has never been

0:18:10.702 --> 0:18:16.022
<v Speaker 3>explained why the killer stabbed her lifeless body.

0:18:16.422 --> 0:18:19.862
<v Speaker 1>Was there any other evidence in the apartment in the room,

0:18:19.942 --> 0:18:21.182
<v Speaker 1>was there anything else out of place?

0:18:22.302 --> 0:18:25.102
<v Speaker 3>Some furniture had been displaced in the bedroom, so the

0:18:25.142 --> 0:18:28.422
<v Speaker 3>bed that Anthea and Jeff slept in had been moved,

0:18:28.942 --> 0:18:31.422
<v Speaker 3>and a chair in that room had also been knocked over.

0:18:31.622 --> 0:18:34.422
<v Speaker 3>Now that has been explained by Jeff very early on

0:18:34.502 --> 0:18:37.342
<v Speaker 3>in his original witness statement. He says when he found

0:18:37.342 --> 0:18:40.982
<v Speaker 3>his wife's body, he went into the bedroom and kicked

0:18:40.982 --> 0:18:44.462
<v Speaker 3>the bed and kicked the chair out of frustration. So

0:18:44.502 --> 0:18:48.622
<v Speaker 3>that's how he explains that. There are also photographs that

0:18:48.662 --> 0:18:53.302
<v Speaker 3>show a bloodstained knife, which was presumably the murder weapon,

0:18:53.782 --> 0:18:56.902
<v Speaker 3>near the front door, so the killer had discarded the

0:18:56.942 --> 0:18:59.662
<v Speaker 3>knife right near the front door on the way out

0:19:00.062 --> 0:19:02.622
<v Speaker 3>is what we can take out of that. Another thing

0:19:02.662 --> 0:19:05.182
<v Speaker 3>to note about that knife is that people I've spoken

0:19:05.222 --> 0:19:09.262
<v Speaker 3>to from the other apartments say it appears to be

0:19:09.822 --> 0:19:13.902
<v Speaker 3>the standard issue knife for all of the apartments, which

0:19:13.902 --> 0:19:17.502
<v Speaker 3>indicates that perhaps, and this hasn't been confirmed, that perhaps

0:19:17.542 --> 0:19:21.702
<v Speaker 3>that knife came from Jeff's kitchen. There was also an

0:19:21.702 --> 0:19:24.222
<v Speaker 3>ironing board out, and there was a business shirt draped

0:19:24.262 --> 0:19:27.582
<v Speaker 3>over the ironing board. The iron was plugged in and

0:19:27.622 --> 0:19:32.222
<v Speaker 3>it was still switched on, so it appeared that someone

0:19:32.302 --> 0:19:35.102
<v Speaker 3>had been ironing a shirt and for whatever reason, stopped

0:19:35.102 --> 0:19:39.142
<v Speaker 3>abruptly there. I guess the key pieces of evidence from

0:19:39.542 --> 0:19:43.782
<v Speaker 3>inside the apartment. Piecing it all together is difficult. I

0:19:43.822 --> 0:19:45.742
<v Speaker 3>guess it can tell a story whatever way you look

0:19:45.782 --> 0:19:48.702
<v Speaker 3>at it, but this would form part of that initial

0:19:48.942 --> 0:19:50.462
<v Speaker 3>Brunei police investigation.

0:19:51.302 --> 0:19:54.542
<v Speaker 1>How did the Bradshaws find out about this all happening?

0:19:55.582 --> 0:19:58.302
<v Speaker 3>So it was a Thursday evening, Adelaide time, nine point

0:19:58.302 --> 0:20:01.342
<v Speaker 3>thirty pm on the twenty first of July nineteen ninety four.

0:20:02.102 --> 0:20:04.942
<v Speaker 3>The Bradshaws owned a news agency in the eastern suburbs

0:20:04.982 --> 0:20:08.582
<v Speaker 3>of Adelaide. They just got home from late night shopping

0:20:09.022 --> 0:20:11.622
<v Speaker 3>and Martin Bradshaw had got on upstairs to watch the

0:20:11.742 --> 0:20:15.182
<v Speaker 3>Channel nine AFL football show. That's how he remembers the time,

0:20:15.302 --> 0:20:17.742
<v Speaker 3>because he said that the show was just starting and

0:20:17.782 --> 0:20:20.782
<v Speaker 3>the phone rang and he said he could hear Roz

0:20:20.862 --> 0:20:24.462
<v Speaker 3>answering the phone. Roz says that she picked up the

0:20:24.542 --> 0:20:27.862
<v Speaker 3>phone and it was Jeff and he didn't say hello,

0:20:28.222 --> 0:20:32.062
<v Speaker 3>he just said and he's dead. And she doesn't remember

0:20:32.142 --> 0:20:34.702
<v Speaker 3>much from that point apart from saying, don't say that

0:20:34.782 --> 0:20:37.902
<v Speaker 3>to me. Don't say that to me. Martin says he

0:20:37.902 --> 0:20:40.422
<v Speaker 3>heard this commotion, he went downstairs and by this point

0:20:40.502 --> 0:20:44.102
<v Speaker 3>Roz was curled up in the fetal position. He took

0:20:44.142 --> 0:20:47.422
<v Speaker 3>the phone, and he says that Jeff was that hysterical

0:20:47.502 --> 0:20:49.942
<v Speaker 3>he could barely understand what he was saying. So he

0:20:50.022 --> 0:20:53.062
<v Speaker 3>was asking for someone else to take over the phone call,

0:20:53.182 --> 0:20:55.862
<v Speaker 3>you know, put someone else on the phone, and eventually,

0:20:55.942 --> 0:20:58.062
<v Speaker 3>and he doesn't know who it was, but eventually someone

0:20:58.182 --> 0:21:02.582
<v Speaker 3>told him that his daughter had been murdered. And then

0:21:03.382 --> 0:21:06.902
<v Speaker 3>he says, Martin says that he thought that he was

0:21:06.942 --> 0:21:09.182
<v Speaker 3>the calm one in the room, rose obviously in the

0:21:09.182 --> 0:21:12.622
<v Speaker 3>fetal position, but he looked down and realized that he

0:21:12.702 --> 0:21:16.542
<v Speaker 3>had urinated in his trousers after hearing that news.

0:21:17.942 --> 0:21:20.382
<v Speaker 1>What about the brothers, You've spoken to them about finding

0:21:20.382 --> 0:21:22.822
<v Speaker 1>out as well, And they also had their own stories.

0:21:23.622 --> 0:21:27.782
<v Speaker 3>Craig Bradshaw was living in a sharehouse. He was working

0:21:27.982 --> 0:21:31.542
<v Speaker 3>in radio on commercial radio, and that evening he had

0:21:31.582 --> 0:21:33.542
<v Speaker 3>to go to bed early because he had an early

0:21:33.582 --> 0:21:36.502
<v Speaker 3>start the next day. His friends had all gone to

0:21:36.542 --> 0:21:38.542
<v Speaker 3>the pub. The people that he was living with went

0:21:38.622 --> 0:21:41.422
<v Speaker 3>to the pub. But then at around nine point thirty

0:21:41.502 --> 0:21:44.422
<v Speaker 3>or a little bit after, one of his friends came

0:21:44.462 --> 0:21:48.102
<v Speaker 3>and woke him up in the bedroom and said, Craig,

0:21:48.222 --> 0:21:51.262
<v Speaker 3>you need to go home. Presumably he had somehow found

0:21:51.302 --> 0:21:55.062
<v Speaker 3>out from Martin and Ross Craig's parents, and Craig hopped

0:21:55.062 --> 0:21:56.662
<v Speaker 3>in his car. He didn't know what was going on.

0:21:56.702 --> 0:21:59.742
<v Speaker 3>His friend didn't tell him, and so he had that

0:21:59.982 --> 0:22:02.902
<v Speaker 3>painful drive to his mum and dad's house, and he

0:22:02.942 --> 0:22:06.182
<v Speaker 3>said the moment he arrived, he approached the front door

0:22:06.262 --> 0:22:10.262
<v Speaker 3>and he could hear his mum howling, absolutely howling inside

0:22:10.262 --> 0:22:15.342
<v Speaker 3>the house. And went in and again he was given

0:22:15.342 --> 0:22:18.262
<v Speaker 3>a phone and it was Jeff, and Jeff said that

0:22:18.622 --> 0:22:22.302
<v Speaker 3>Annie had been murdered, and Craig then had to try

0:22:22.342 --> 0:22:24.622
<v Speaker 3>and get his head around that, and obviously couldn't get

0:22:24.742 --> 0:22:28.102
<v Speaker 3>his head around that, because why would anyone murder her?

0:22:28.102 --> 0:22:30.782
<v Speaker 3>It was a relatively safe country. She'd been there for

0:22:30.862 --> 0:22:33.262
<v Speaker 3>nine days, she didn't know anyone apart from Jeff and

0:22:33.302 --> 0:22:36.302
<v Speaker 3>perhaps some of his other colleagues who she would have

0:22:36.342 --> 0:22:40.102
<v Speaker 3>only just been introduced to, So almost an impossible thing

0:22:40.142 --> 0:22:44.382
<v Speaker 3>to fathom for Craig Bradshaw. And he says that he

0:22:44.422 --> 0:22:46.942
<v Speaker 3>then tried to get hold of his other brother, Paul,

0:22:47.982 --> 0:22:50.702
<v Speaker 3>and he was out at the pub that night, and obviously,

0:22:50.742 --> 0:22:53.022
<v Speaker 3>again mobile phones weren't a thing, so they struggled to

0:22:53.022 --> 0:22:55.462
<v Speaker 3>get hold of him. Paul was still living at home

0:22:55.622 --> 0:22:58.262
<v Speaker 3>and late that night he came home in his car

0:22:59.022 --> 0:23:02.222
<v Speaker 3>and he saw all of the cars in the front yard.

0:23:02.342 --> 0:23:04.662
<v Speaker 3>So by then, I guess a lot of the extended

0:23:04.662 --> 0:23:07.622
<v Speaker 3>family had arrived at the house, and he just looked

0:23:07.662 --> 0:23:10.382
<v Speaker 3>and thought, what is going on here? And he said

0:23:10.542 --> 0:23:13.782
<v Speaker 3>that he was that concerned and confused that he actually

0:23:14.062 --> 0:23:16.302
<v Speaker 3>didn't go into the house. He drove up and parked

0:23:16.302 --> 0:23:19.342
<v Speaker 3>on the side of the road for an hour, just

0:23:19.382 --> 0:23:21.902
<v Speaker 3>sat there. Perhaps he knew at that point that his

0:23:22.022 --> 0:23:24.342
<v Speaker 3>life was about to change, and that if he could

0:23:24.342 --> 0:23:27.062
<v Speaker 3>have another hour without knowing then he would take that.

0:23:27.702 --> 0:23:29.942
<v Speaker 3>But eventually he went into the house, and he says

0:23:30.022 --> 0:23:32.542
<v Speaker 3>that he thinks it was his auntie who told him

0:23:33.142 --> 0:23:33.902
<v Speaker 3>what had happened.

0:23:38.582 --> 0:23:42.342
<v Speaker 1>You're listening to true crime Conversations with me, Jemma Bass.

0:23:42.702 --> 0:23:46.342
<v Speaker 1>I'm speaking with Ben Avery about the murder of Anthea Bradshaw.

0:23:46.982 --> 0:23:49.862
<v Speaker 1>Up next, we find out how far the Bradshaw family

0:23:49.902 --> 0:23:59.222
<v Speaker 1>will go in their fight for justice. What did the

0:23:59.262 --> 0:24:02.862
<v Speaker 1>next few days and weeks look like. Obviously in Brunei,

0:24:02.902 --> 0:24:06.062
<v Speaker 1>we've got police investigating Jeff still over there. Does her

0:24:06.142 --> 0:24:09.302
<v Speaker 1>family get on a plane, how do they get Anthea's

0:24:09.302 --> 0:24:10.262
<v Speaker 1>body back? What does that?

0:24:11.382 --> 0:24:13.782
<v Speaker 3>So there are a lot of discussions around that. Craig

0:24:14.422 --> 0:24:17.582
<v Speaker 3>spoke with various members of his family about whether he

0:24:17.622 --> 0:24:21.902
<v Speaker 3>should go over to be there with Jeff and to

0:24:21.982 --> 0:24:25.102
<v Speaker 3>talk to the police about what's happened here. I think

0:24:25.142 --> 0:24:27.622
<v Speaker 3>one of his aunties offered to pay the cost of

0:24:27.742 --> 0:24:30.262
<v Speaker 3>him to fly over and to stay over there for

0:24:30.302 --> 0:24:33.382
<v Speaker 3>a period of time, but Craig says that he was

0:24:33.462 --> 0:24:36.982
<v Speaker 3>talked out of doing that by various people, including Jeff,

0:24:37.462 --> 0:24:41.702
<v Speaker 3>that Jeff had said, there's nothing you can do. Leave

0:24:41.742 --> 0:24:45.022
<v Speaker 3>it with me, essentially, and so no member of the

0:24:45.022 --> 0:24:47.822
<v Speaker 3>Bradshaw family went to Brunei and that's something that they

0:24:47.902 --> 0:24:52.862
<v Speaker 3>regret to this day. Instead, Jeff Hall's father went over

0:24:53.182 --> 0:24:58.662
<v Speaker 3>and Jeff Hawlls best mate went over together. And I

0:24:58.742 --> 0:25:01.502
<v Speaker 3>think what the Bradshaws perhaps didn't know at that time,

0:25:01.942 --> 0:25:04.542
<v Speaker 3>well I'm almost certain they didn't know at the time

0:25:05.622 --> 0:25:08.222
<v Speaker 3>was that Jeff was being treated as a suspect by

0:25:08.262 --> 0:25:12.422
<v Speaker 3>the Brunei police. He was actually in custody. I was

0:25:12.462 --> 0:25:16.342
<v Speaker 3>told by one of Jeff's colleagues in the podcast that

0:25:17.342 --> 0:25:19.502
<v Speaker 3>he had been held for questioning and that they went

0:25:19.542 --> 0:25:23.502
<v Speaker 3>and visited him and he was behind bars. So he

0:25:23.622 --> 0:25:25.982
<v Speaker 3>was in some form of custody at that point, and

0:25:26.022 --> 0:25:29.622
<v Speaker 3>he was beside himself. He was crying and saying that

0:25:29.662 --> 0:25:32.982
<v Speaker 3>he was innocent. Again, these are all things that the

0:25:33.022 --> 0:25:35.982
<v Speaker 3>Bradshaw family weren't aware of at the time, and they

0:25:36.022 --> 0:25:39.462
<v Speaker 3>really do wish that that had some representation I guess

0:25:39.502 --> 0:25:43.022
<v Speaker 3>as a family over there in those initial days.

0:25:44.142 --> 0:25:47.222
<v Speaker 1>We'll get to this, but they didn't find that information

0:25:47.302 --> 0:25:49.622
<v Speaker 1>out for another four or so years. So what did

0:25:49.702 --> 0:25:54.262
<v Speaker 1>they believe had happened to Anthea in that timeframe, Well,

0:25:54.302 --> 0:25:54.942
<v Speaker 1>there hadn't.

0:25:54.742 --> 0:25:56.382
<v Speaker 3>Been a lot of information, it has to be said.

0:25:56.422 --> 0:26:00.942
<v Speaker 3>In those early months and years. There was a theory though,

0:26:00.982 --> 0:26:04.142
<v Speaker 3>that had been prominent to my understanding, and that is

0:26:04.182 --> 0:26:07.062
<v Speaker 3>that there was an unknown man spotted outside of the

0:26:07.102 --> 0:26:11.862
<v Speaker 3>apartment complex who no one recognized. And when I say

0:26:11.942 --> 0:26:14.502
<v Speaker 3>no one, there was only one person I'm aware of

0:26:14.542 --> 0:26:17.262
<v Speaker 3>who saw that man, and I've spoken to her and

0:26:17.302 --> 0:26:22.142
<v Speaker 3>she's described him as being of Thai or Vietnamese descent,

0:26:22.782 --> 0:26:25.022
<v Speaker 3>that he had a cap, and that cap was pulled

0:26:25.022 --> 0:26:27.262
<v Speaker 3>down over his face to the extent that she couldn't

0:26:27.342 --> 0:26:31.902
<v Speaker 3>really make out any distinguishing features. And this was looked

0:26:31.942 --> 0:26:34.382
<v Speaker 3>at thoroughly by the Brunei police. They did a photo

0:26:34.462 --> 0:26:37.622
<v Speaker 3>fit of this man, even though the woman who spotted

0:26:37.702 --> 0:26:40.382
<v Speaker 3>him says that that was pretty pointless because she didn't

0:26:40.382 --> 0:26:44.502
<v Speaker 3>know what he looked like anyway. And news would filter

0:26:44.582 --> 0:26:47.222
<v Speaker 3>back to the Bradshaw's that there was this theory of

0:26:47.542 --> 0:26:52.022
<v Speaker 3>an itinerant worker, a tie worker perhaps, who may have

0:26:52.102 --> 0:26:55.662
<v Speaker 3>worked in maintenance on the apartment complex, or who may

0:26:55.702 --> 0:26:58.382
<v Speaker 3>have worked on a nearby construction site and may have

0:26:58.422 --> 0:27:02.662
<v Speaker 3>gone up to that third floor apartment and killed Anthea,

0:27:02.702 --> 0:27:08.062
<v Speaker 3>And they, to an extent, I guess, accepted that they

0:27:08.142 --> 0:27:13.222
<v Speaker 3>accepted that perhaps this was an unfortunate random killing.

0:27:14.262 --> 0:27:17.222
<v Speaker 1>How did they find out that jeff had been a suspect?

0:27:18.142 --> 0:27:20.542
<v Speaker 3>So it was four years later, in nineteen ninety eight,

0:27:21.262 --> 0:27:25.422
<v Speaker 3>that the coroner released its findings to the Bradshaw family

0:27:25.902 --> 0:27:28.342
<v Speaker 3>and so they got a letter in the mail and

0:27:28.462 --> 0:27:31.702
<v Speaker 3>Rosalind tells me about the moment that she opened that letter.

0:27:31.822 --> 0:27:35.822
<v Speaker 3>It was a very short report, only a few pages long,

0:27:35.902 --> 0:27:39.742
<v Speaker 3>but at the end it said that the only apparent

0:27:39.822 --> 0:27:43.622
<v Speaker 3>suspect in the case appears to be the deceased husband,

0:27:44.022 --> 0:27:48.262
<v Speaker 3>one Jeffrey John Hall. However, the finding also said police

0:27:48.262 --> 0:27:52.182
<v Speaker 3>investigations could not find any evidence to justify any charge

0:27:52.222 --> 0:27:53.182
<v Speaker 3>against him.

0:27:53.622 --> 0:27:54.742
<v Speaker 1>How did they react to that?

0:27:55.342 --> 0:27:58.462
<v Speaker 3>Rose couldn't believe it. She just hadn't even given thought

0:27:58.502 --> 0:28:00.702
<v Speaker 3>to that in those four years, none of them had,

0:28:01.342 --> 0:28:05.462
<v Speaker 3>and so she was shocked, absolutely shocked. And she says

0:28:05.502 --> 0:28:08.622
<v Speaker 3>that that was the moment she started to wonder whether

0:28:08.742 --> 0:28:10.742
<v Speaker 3>her son in law had some questions to answer.

0:28:11.782 --> 0:28:13.742
<v Speaker 1>What did they do? Well, what can they do? It's

0:28:13.782 --> 0:28:17.422
<v Speaker 1>four years later. Do they contact Brunei police, do they

0:28:17.422 --> 0:28:19.462
<v Speaker 1>go to Australian police? What are their next moves?

0:28:20.822 --> 0:28:23.342
<v Speaker 3>So then Rod starts to think where she can go

0:28:23.422 --> 0:28:27.502
<v Speaker 3>from here? And I'm not entirely sure how the South

0:28:27.542 --> 0:28:30.862
<v Speaker 3>Australian Police became involved. I know that they were contacted

0:28:30.902 --> 0:28:33.502
<v Speaker 3>in the early days of the Brunei police investigation, so

0:28:33.582 --> 0:28:39.102
<v Speaker 3>that had some involvement. And then following this revelation in

0:28:39.182 --> 0:28:42.902
<v Speaker 3>nineteen ninety eight, there is some communication between Essay Police

0:28:42.902 --> 0:28:46.302
<v Speaker 3>and the Bradshaw family and a detective with the South

0:28:46.342 --> 0:28:52.142
<v Speaker 3>Australian Major Crime Branch, Detective Brenton Rownie, begins looking at

0:28:52.142 --> 0:28:56.982
<v Speaker 3>the case. There's no jurisdiction obviously for South Australian Police

0:28:57.102 --> 0:29:01.622
<v Speaker 3>in Brunei, but that doesn't stop them from making their

0:29:01.662 --> 0:29:06.102
<v Speaker 3>own inquiries. And so that started to begin and really

0:29:06.222 --> 0:29:09.822
<v Speaker 3>ramp up in the early two thousands, led primarily initially

0:29:09.942 --> 0:29:11.502
<v Speaker 3>by Detective Rownie.

0:29:12.142 --> 0:29:16.502
<v Speaker 1>Well, Brunei actually allows one of these police officers to

0:29:16.582 --> 0:29:19.342
<v Speaker 1>go over and review the case in person. That's quite unusual,

0:29:19.382 --> 0:29:20.222
<v Speaker 1>isn't it.

0:29:20.222 --> 0:29:22.542
<v Speaker 3>It is extremely unusual, and the reason that that came

0:29:22.582 --> 0:29:26.982
<v Speaker 3>about was almost pure chance. So Brenton Rownie's looking at

0:29:27.022 --> 0:29:30.222
<v Speaker 3>all of this information, He's starting to see that it

0:29:30.342 --> 0:29:33.982
<v Speaker 3>warrants further investigation and that perhaps the case needs some

0:29:34.022 --> 0:29:36.822
<v Speaker 3>more expertise that the Brunei police may not have had.

0:29:37.822 --> 0:29:42.422
<v Speaker 3>And as I say, by chance the Brunei authorities were

0:29:42.422 --> 0:29:45.542
<v Speaker 3>coming to Adelaide, or some of them were coming to Adelaide.

0:29:45.862 --> 0:29:48.022
<v Speaker 3>You may have heard of the police tattoo that is

0:29:48.502 --> 0:29:50.742
<v Speaker 3>held around the world and police forces will come with

0:29:50.782 --> 0:29:53.742
<v Speaker 3>their police bans and things like that. Well that was

0:29:53.742 --> 0:29:58.542
<v Speaker 3>being held in Adelaide this year, and so the Royal

0:29:58.622 --> 0:30:03.182
<v Speaker 3>Brunei Police Force Band was coming and so as part

0:30:03.222 --> 0:30:06.622
<v Speaker 3>of that, Brenton Rownie organized for the South Australian Police

0:30:06.662 --> 0:30:09.622
<v Speaker 3>Commissioner at the time to meet with a high ranking

0:30:09.622 --> 0:30:12.102
<v Speaker 3>official from and they had a meeting when they were

0:30:12.102 --> 0:30:14.982
<v Speaker 3>here for the police tattoo, and as a result of

0:30:15.022 --> 0:30:18.222
<v Speaker 3>that meeting, Brunei said yes, look, we are prepared to

0:30:18.222 --> 0:30:21.902
<v Speaker 3>pay for the flights and accommodation of your detective to

0:30:22.022 --> 0:30:25.862
<v Speaker 3>come over to Brunei wow and conduct his own inquiries,

0:30:25.902 --> 0:30:29.182
<v Speaker 3>which was a real breakthrough for the Bradshaws and for

0:30:29.382 --> 0:30:32.342
<v Speaker 3>say police they could go over and for the first

0:30:32.422 --> 0:30:36.102
<v Speaker 3>time have a look at this for themselves in terms

0:30:36.102 --> 0:30:39.342
<v Speaker 3>of someone from South Australia at least, and so that happened.

0:30:39.382 --> 0:30:42.382
<v Speaker 3>It was in two thousand and four that Brenton Rownie

0:30:42.662 --> 0:30:47.382
<v Speaker 3>bordered a plane and headed over to the place where Anthea.

0:30:46.982 --> 0:30:50.662
<v Speaker 1>Lost her life, and what did he do when he

0:30:50.702 --> 0:30:54.142
<v Speaker 1>got there? He obviously was going to look into Jeff

0:30:54.302 --> 0:30:56.262
<v Speaker 1>being a potential suspect. Did he look at any other

0:30:56.302 --> 0:30:58.502
<v Speaker 1>possible theories? Was there anything else that came out of

0:30:58.582 --> 0:30:59.822
<v Speaker 1>him being on the ground.

0:31:00.902 --> 0:31:02.862
<v Speaker 3>He says he went into it with a very open

0:31:02.902 --> 0:31:06.462
<v Speaker 3>mind and so one of the things though, that became

0:31:06.582 --> 0:31:09.102
<v Speaker 3>clear when he got there, and one of the first

0:31:09.102 --> 0:31:11.662
<v Speaker 3>things that jumped out to him was that the Brunei

0:31:11.782 --> 0:31:16.622
<v Speaker 3>police were not very experienced dealing with murders, and he

0:31:16.662 --> 0:31:21.502
<v Speaker 3>says that's because murder was almost unheard of in that country. Now,

0:31:21.942 --> 0:31:26.022
<v Speaker 3>I've looked into this and there's one News Corp particle

0:31:26.102 --> 0:31:29.142
<v Speaker 3>here in Australia that said there'd been only three murders

0:31:29.902 --> 0:31:33.262
<v Speaker 3>in the decade preceding Anthea's death. I haven't been able

0:31:33.302 --> 0:31:36.822
<v Speaker 3>to confirm that because the stats from Brunei are very

0:31:36.862 --> 0:31:39.822
<v Speaker 3>patchy and unclear. Probably the best data I could get

0:31:40.062 --> 0:31:44.422
<v Speaker 3>was from the United Nations. Actually that showed between nineteen

0:31:44.462 --> 0:31:46.742
<v Speaker 3>ninety six and twenty thirteen, so this is a period

0:31:46.782 --> 0:31:49.302
<v Speaker 3>really after the murder, But probably the best data I

0:31:49.342 --> 0:31:53.662
<v Speaker 3>could get there were fifty four murders, an average of

0:31:53.702 --> 0:31:56.742
<v Speaker 3>around three per year for that period. Now it is

0:31:56.782 --> 0:31:59.942
<v Speaker 3>a small country, about around half a million people, but still,

0:32:00.622 --> 0:32:03.102
<v Speaker 3>even if you go off that data, it's fair to

0:32:03.142 --> 0:32:06.502
<v Speaker 3>say that murders were quite rare, and so the police

0:32:06.502 --> 0:32:09.542
<v Speaker 3>force over there wouldn't have had the same skills that

0:32:09.582 --> 0:32:13.022
<v Speaker 3>someone from South Eastutralia would have. Brenton Rownie would have

0:32:13.062 --> 0:32:16.182
<v Speaker 3>investigated other murders before. The major crime branch here in

0:32:16.222 --> 0:32:19.422
<v Speaker 3>South Australia handles a lot of murders and a lot

0:32:19.422 --> 0:32:23.022
<v Speaker 3>of cold cases too ongoing. So that's the first thing

0:32:23.022 --> 0:32:26.222
<v Speaker 3>that stood out to him. And he also learned for

0:32:26.262 --> 0:32:28.942
<v Speaker 3>the first time that Jeff had been held in some

0:32:28.982 --> 0:32:32.622
<v Speaker 3>form of custody after the murder, and he says that's

0:32:32.622 --> 0:32:36.622
<v Speaker 3>something that he didn't know previously, and obviously, as I've mentioned,

0:32:36.862 --> 0:32:40.702
<v Speaker 3>the Bradshaw family wasn't aware of either. He says that

0:32:40.742 --> 0:32:45.102
<v Speaker 3>the Brunei police were helpful to an extent. They provided

0:32:45.182 --> 0:32:48.062
<v Speaker 3>him with exhibits from the case, he was able to

0:32:48.742 --> 0:32:52.622
<v Speaker 3>visit Geredong Park where this murder took place, and he

0:32:52.742 --> 0:32:57.102
<v Speaker 3>ultimately returned home after four days with dozens of exhibits

0:32:57.102 --> 0:33:00.102
<v Speaker 3>that he was allowed to physically take back to South Australia.

0:33:01.582 --> 0:33:03.822
<v Speaker 1>Before we get further into that. I want to give

0:33:03.822 --> 0:33:07.022
<v Speaker 1>a bit more context about Brunei because you've said there

0:33:07.022 --> 0:33:09.462
<v Speaker 1>weren't many murders, so to speak, and it was a

0:33:09.502 --> 0:33:12.622
<v Speaker 1>relatively safe but it's actually a very strict country. It

0:33:12.662 --> 0:33:16.862
<v Speaker 1>has some extreme punishments, some very backwards laws. In our

0:33:16.982 --> 0:33:19.262
<v Speaker 1>Australian eyes, doesn't it very much.

0:33:19.302 --> 0:33:23.782
<v Speaker 3>So it's an Islamic country, very strict laws, as you say,

0:33:24.862 --> 0:33:29.262
<v Speaker 3>including punishment for homosexuality, and when it comes to murder,

0:33:30.342 --> 0:33:34.382
<v Speaker 3>the death penalty, So anyone convicted of murder can face

0:33:34.422 --> 0:33:39.142
<v Speaker 3>the death penalty. It isn't always enforced, but certainly murder

0:33:39.222 --> 0:33:43.022
<v Speaker 3>is punishable by death. And for this reason, because it

0:33:43.102 --> 0:33:46.222
<v Speaker 3>was so strict, crimes were very unusual. So I'm not

0:33:46.262 --> 0:33:51.742
<v Speaker 3>just talking about murders. I'm talking about break ins, robberies, thefts,

0:33:52.102 --> 0:33:56.582
<v Speaker 3>sexual assaults. It didn't happen very often for that reason.

0:33:57.582 --> 0:34:00.022
<v Speaker 3>Hence why a lot of people I've spoken to said

0:34:00.022 --> 0:34:02.422
<v Speaker 3>that this murder of Anthea Bradshaw was very out of

0:34:02.422 --> 0:34:02.862
<v Speaker 3>the box.

0:34:04.302 --> 0:34:09.982
<v Speaker 1>What did Rowney determine after investigating everything to do with this.

0:34:10.022 --> 0:34:14.222
<v Speaker 3>Case, He was firmly of the opinion that Jeff Hall

0:34:14.342 --> 0:34:18.062
<v Speaker 3>had questions to answer about the murder. He brought back

0:34:18.542 --> 0:34:21.062
<v Speaker 3>a lot of exhibits, some of them I've spoken about

0:34:21.102 --> 0:34:24.222
<v Speaker 3>those photos that showed the bed had been moved, the

0:34:24.302 --> 0:34:27.222
<v Speaker 3>chair had been kicked over, the blood stained knife. There

0:34:27.262 --> 0:34:31.182
<v Speaker 3>was also forensic evidence, though. He brought back a shirt

0:34:31.222 --> 0:34:33.862
<v Speaker 3>that Jeff Hall was wearing on the day of the murder,

0:34:34.342 --> 0:34:37.822
<v Speaker 3>and this would become a very important piece of evidence,

0:34:37.822 --> 0:34:41.062
<v Speaker 3>and that's because it was clear that there were blood

0:34:41.182 --> 0:34:45.662
<v Speaker 3>like stains on Jeff's shirt. Now, there would be various

0:34:45.702 --> 0:34:51.142
<v Speaker 3>forensic reports done that looked at that shirt, and a

0:34:51.262 --> 0:34:56.022
<v Speaker 3>DNA examination of the shirt found that the blood stains

0:34:56.142 --> 0:35:00.222
<v Speaker 3>on Antia's shirt weren't Jeff's blood, ruled out that it

0:35:00.262 --> 0:35:03.782
<v Speaker 3>was Jeff's blood, and one report from Singapore found that

0:35:03.822 --> 0:35:06.462
<v Speaker 3>there was only a one in fifteen chance that that

0:35:06.502 --> 0:35:09.702
<v Speaker 3>blood was anyone else's but anteis, So we can take

0:35:09.742 --> 0:35:12.582
<v Speaker 3>out of that there was a high likelihood without being

0:35:12.582 --> 0:35:16.542
<v Speaker 3>one hundred percent, that Jeff Hall had his wife's blood

0:35:16.622 --> 0:35:19.022
<v Speaker 3>on his shirt on the day of the murder. Now

0:35:19.182 --> 0:35:21.262
<v Speaker 3>that's obviously significant, But the other thing you need to

0:35:21.262 --> 0:35:23.702
<v Speaker 3>look at then is how did the blood get there,

0:35:24.422 --> 0:35:27.382
<v Speaker 3>Because he does say that he went and checked his

0:35:27.422 --> 0:35:29.662
<v Speaker 3>wife's body when he got back to the apartment and

0:35:29.662 --> 0:35:32.302
<v Speaker 3>saw her on the ground, so very possible it could

0:35:32.302 --> 0:35:35.822
<v Speaker 3>have happened then, and that's why you need to look

0:35:36.022 --> 0:35:39.342
<v Speaker 3>further into the evidence and further at those blood stains

0:35:39.382 --> 0:35:42.502
<v Speaker 3>and further at the crime scene to try and work out, okay, well,

0:35:42.902 --> 0:35:45.342
<v Speaker 3>how did he get that blood on his shirt. There

0:35:45.382 --> 0:35:48.542
<v Speaker 3>was a report done in the year or two after

0:35:48.622 --> 0:35:52.382
<v Speaker 3>the murder by a forensic scientist named doctor Henry C.

0:35:52.582 --> 0:35:56.542
<v Speaker 3>Lee from Connecticut. He worked for the Connecticut State Laboratory,

0:35:56.582 --> 0:35:59.742
<v Speaker 3>and he was very well known. He's worked on thousands

0:35:59.782 --> 0:36:03.342
<v Speaker 3>and thousands of cases. He worked on the OJ Simpson case,

0:36:03.342 --> 0:36:06.342
<v Speaker 3>he worked on the John Benet Ramsey case. And I

0:36:06.342 --> 0:36:08.902
<v Speaker 3>was only watching a Netflix documentary the other night called

0:36:08.902 --> 0:36:12.342
<v Speaker 3>The Staircase, and in it he was used by the defense.

0:36:12.942 --> 0:36:15.542
<v Speaker 3>So this was a well known forensic scientist. He looked

0:36:15.542 --> 0:36:19.182
<v Speaker 3>at the blood stains that was his speciality, and he

0:36:20.142 --> 0:36:25.102
<v Speaker 3>determined that there were what he called medium velocity blood stains,

0:36:25.142 --> 0:36:27.902
<v Speaker 3>which sounds very technical, but essentially what it means is

0:36:27.942 --> 0:36:32.782
<v Speaker 3>that there were microscopic droplets that appeared to have got

0:36:32.822 --> 0:36:36.142
<v Speaker 3>there after traveling through the air. So this wasn't a smear,

0:36:36.462 --> 0:36:39.462
<v Speaker 3>it wasn't a white that there had been some kind

0:36:39.502 --> 0:36:43.662
<v Speaker 3>of projected mechanism that got the blood on Jeff's shirt.

0:36:44.462 --> 0:36:48.102
<v Speaker 3>Now that's significant. It doesn't necessarily say that it got

0:36:48.102 --> 0:36:52.182
<v Speaker 3>there through the process of stabbing Anthea, but it does

0:36:52.262 --> 0:36:55.382
<v Speaker 3>say that perhaps some of the blood got there through

0:36:56.062 --> 0:36:58.102
<v Speaker 3>traveling through the air. And so then you need to

0:36:58.102 --> 0:37:01.022
<v Speaker 3>think about, Okay, how could Jeff have got the projected

0:37:01.022 --> 0:37:05.422
<v Speaker 3>blood onto his shirt by just viewing and checking Anthea's body.

0:37:06.182 --> 0:37:08.462
<v Speaker 3>And it's possible he could have stepped in the pool

0:37:08.502 --> 0:37:10.622
<v Speaker 3>of blood, for example, and it could have splashed up

0:37:10.662 --> 0:37:13.822
<v Speaker 3>onto his shirt. He could have had the blood wipe

0:37:13.862 --> 0:37:15.782
<v Speaker 3>onto his shirt and then that could have gripped from

0:37:15.862 --> 0:37:19.822
<v Speaker 3>one sleeve to the other. That's also possible. But it

0:37:19.902 --> 0:37:24.542
<v Speaker 3>was definitely evidence that would support a theory that perhaps

0:37:24.822 --> 0:37:28.422
<v Speaker 3>it had got there through the process of stabbing Anthea.

0:37:29.182 --> 0:37:34.742
<v Speaker 3>And then it became about not necessarily just taking Henry C.

0:37:35.102 --> 0:37:38.662
<v Speaker 3>Lee's word for it, because in these cases there are

0:37:38.742 --> 0:37:41.622
<v Speaker 3>varying opinions and if you go to another forensic scientist

0:37:41.622 --> 0:37:43.542
<v Speaker 3>it can be different. And that's what police did. They

0:37:43.582 --> 0:37:46.342
<v Speaker 3>went to someone in Western Australia who looked at the

0:37:46.342 --> 0:37:49.862
<v Speaker 3>evidence as well and wasn't as convinced that there was

0:37:49.942 --> 0:37:53.182
<v Speaker 3>this medium velocity blood. He said that it was possible

0:37:53.222 --> 0:37:56.702
<v Speaker 3>that there was projected blood stains on the shirt. And

0:37:57.702 --> 0:38:01.502
<v Speaker 3>there were also similar findings from a South Australian forensic

0:38:01.582 --> 0:38:04.742
<v Speaker 3>scientist who said the same thing. But one thing that

0:38:04.782 --> 0:38:07.622
<v Speaker 3>they all agreed on was that there was blood or

0:38:07.662 --> 0:38:10.102
<v Speaker 3>at least blood like stains on the shirt. And then

0:38:11.102 --> 0:38:13.982
<v Speaker 3>to wrap that up, they need to then go, okay, well,

0:38:14.062 --> 0:38:17.582
<v Speaker 3>let's look at the crime scene. Let's see how Jeff

0:38:17.622 --> 0:38:21.062
<v Speaker 3>may have got that blood on his shirt without being

0:38:21.102 --> 0:38:23.862
<v Speaker 3>too graphic anthey's on the ground, there's a pull of

0:38:23.902 --> 0:38:27.502
<v Speaker 3>blood off to one side of her body. And there's

0:38:27.542 --> 0:38:33.382
<v Speaker 3>a pathologist here in South Australia named Roger Bayard, Professor

0:38:33.502 --> 0:38:38.302
<v Speaker 3>Roger Bayard, who looked at the crime scene photographs and

0:38:38.422 --> 0:38:41.382
<v Speaker 3>was asked to make a determination on how Jeff could

0:38:41.422 --> 0:38:44.182
<v Speaker 3>have got the blood on his shirt in checking the body.

0:38:44.222 --> 0:38:46.902
<v Speaker 3>And I've spoken to Roger in the podcast and he

0:38:46.942 --> 0:38:51.422
<v Speaker 3>tells me that when he looks at the photo, he

0:38:51.462 --> 0:38:54.262
<v Speaker 3>thinks if Jeff had come around from one side and

0:38:54.342 --> 0:38:56.702
<v Speaker 3>approached her. And we need to keep in mind, and

0:38:56.702 --> 0:38:58.542
<v Speaker 3>this is something that I might not have mentioned. Jeff

0:38:58.542 --> 0:39:02.022
<v Speaker 3>has been specific about what he did he touched Anthea's face,

0:39:02.222 --> 0:39:05.862
<v Speaker 3>he checked her pulse, and he touched her leg. And

0:39:05.942 --> 0:39:08.982
<v Speaker 3>Roger says that if he had come from one side

0:39:08.982 --> 0:39:11.982
<v Speaker 3>of the body and done those things, he can't see

0:39:12.022 --> 0:39:14.222
<v Speaker 3>how Jeff could have got blood on him because there

0:39:14.262 --> 0:39:18.062
<v Speaker 3>wasn't any blood on that side. Then Roger says, Okay,

0:39:18.102 --> 0:39:20.302
<v Speaker 3>if he went around the other side, yes he could

0:39:20.302 --> 0:39:23.102
<v Speaker 3>have got blood on him, but he would have disturbed

0:39:23.182 --> 0:39:25.902
<v Speaker 3>the pool of blood. And when you look at the photograph,

0:39:26.182 --> 0:39:29.782
<v Speaker 3>there is no evidence that there was any disruption to

0:39:29.862 --> 0:39:33.382
<v Speaker 3>that pool of blood. And so this became important evidence

0:39:33.422 --> 0:39:38.622
<v Speaker 3>as well in that it raises doubt about whether Jeff

0:39:38.662 --> 0:39:40.582
<v Speaker 3>could have got blood on his shirt when he checked

0:39:40.582 --> 0:39:41.342
<v Speaker 3>Anthea's body.

0:39:42.182 --> 0:39:44.142
<v Speaker 1>What does Bruneye do with all of this information?

0:39:45.102 --> 0:39:47.862
<v Speaker 3>This was all given to Brunei police because they still

0:39:47.902 --> 0:39:50.942
<v Speaker 3>had jurisdiction. Sow. The Australian police might have been investigating,

0:39:50.942 --> 0:39:53.342
<v Speaker 3>but they had jurisdiction. And I need to point out

0:39:53.422 --> 0:39:57.262
<v Speaker 3>that that blood stained evidence I talk about is significant,

0:39:57.262 --> 0:40:01.422
<v Speaker 3>but I don't think it's conclusive, and it was given

0:40:01.502 --> 0:40:05.662
<v Speaker 3>to the Bruney police. They made a determination not just

0:40:05.702 --> 0:40:09.062
<v Speaker 3>based on that, but also based on alibi accounts that

0:40:09.102 --> 0:40:12.822
<v Speaker 3>we should talk about at some point, witness accounts that

0:40:12.982 --> 0:40:16.902
<v Speaker 3>there wasn't enough evidence to prosecute jeffrel.

0:40:16.462 --> 0:40:19.102
<v Speaker 1>Let's talk about the alibi stuff. Now, how does that

0:40:19.142 --> 0:40:19.782
<v Speaker 1>come into play?

0:40:20.582 --> 0:40:22.622
<v Speaker 3>As I've mentioned Jeff was at work, well, he says

0:40:22.662 --> 0:40:26.142
<v Speaker 3>that he was at work that afternoon, and so then

0:40:26.182 --> 0:40:30.382
<v Speaker 3>the question becomes time of death very important. Here did

0:40:30.502 --> 0:40:33.822
<v Speaker 3>Anthea die in the morning, for example, before Jeff even

0:40:33.862 --> 0:40:37.862
<v Speaker 3>went to work. This is where the witness has become important.

0:40:37.902 --> 0:40:39.782
<v Speaker 3>And I've spoken to the key ones. There's a woman

0:40:39.862 --> 0:40:44.702
<v Speaker 3>named nur Angela Hillyard who worked with Jeff lived at

0:40:44.742 --> 0:40:48.862
<v Speaker 3>the apartment complex, in the apartment directly under Jeff's and

0:40:48.902 --> 0:40:53.102
<v Speaker 3>she says that that day she was at work as well. However,

0:40:53.142 --> 0:40:56.422
<v Speaker 3>she went home for lunch, and she did this at

0:40:56.422 --> 0:40:59.262
<v Speaker 3>around one pm, and there was a shuttle service, so

0:40:59.302 --> 0:41:01.782
<v Speaker 3>there was a van that the employees could get in

0:41:02.102 --> 0:41:04.902
<v Speaker 3>at the medical center and then make the short journey

0:41:05.262 --> 0:41:07.582
<v Speaker 3>to the apartment complex. So she went home for lunch,

0:41:08.182 --> 0:41:11.582
<v Speaker 3>and then at around one point fifty she went back

0:41:11.622 --> 0:41:14.262
<v Speaker 3>into the van to go back to the medical center,

0:41:14.302 --> 0:41:16.702
<v Speaker 3>and she said she looked up at Jeff and Anthea's

0:41:16.702 --> 0:41:21.262
<v Speaker 3>apartment and Anthea was on the balcony, and so this

0:41:21.422 --> 0:41:25.262
<v Speaker 3>is a sighting of Anthea alive at one fifty pm.

0:41:27.382 --> 0:41:31.542
<v Speaker 3>It's also important to note that a short time after that,

0:41:31.702 --> 0:41:35.822
<v Speaker 3>around two ten PM, another woman who was living at

0:41:35.822 --> 0:41:41.102
<v Speaker 3>that apartment complex named Carolyn Chilcott, heard a domestic dispute

0:41:41.102 --> 0:41:43.742
<v Speaker 3>and she's described it to Brunei police as a domestic

0:41:43.822 --> 0:41:48.182
<v Speaker 3>dispute at around two ten pm, the sound of a

0:41:48.262 --> 0:41:51.902
<v Speaker 3>man and a woman having an argument and also the

0:41:51.942 --> 0:41:55.982
<v Speaker 3>sound of furniture being moved. She says that went for

0:41:55.982 --> 0:41:59.222
<v Speaker 3>about seven minutes, and then she heard the sound of

0:41:59.262 --> 0:42:04.182
<v Speaker 3>footsteps going down the stairs and out of the apartment complex.

0:42:06.022 --> 0:42:07.862
<v Speaker 3>So we have a sighting of Anthea alive at one

0:42:07.862 --> 0:42:10.662
<v Speaker 3>point fifty we have the sound of a domestic dispute

0:42:10.822 --> 0:42:14.982
<v Speaker 3>at two ten, not necessarily coming from Jeff and Anthea's apartment,

0:42:15.022 --> 0:42:19.982
<v Speaker 3>but certainly from somewhere in the apartment complex. If the

0:42:20.062 --> 0:42:24.262
<v Speaker 3>sighting and that sound is linked to Anthea's murder, then

0:42:24.342 --> 0:42:30.102
<v Speaker 3>Jeff Hall is at work at the time. Few things

0:42:30.102 --> 0:42:34.302
<v Speaker 3>we need to question there. Firstly, there was only one

0:42:34.302 --> 0:42:39.302
<v Speaker 3>person that saw Anthea alive, and identifications like that have

0:42:39.422 --> 0:42:43.422
<v Speaker 3>been notoriously unreliable. I've interviewed neur Angela. I think she

0:42:43.742 --> 0:42:46.822
<v Speaker 3>is credible and one hundred percent believe she saw Anthea.

0:42:47.462 --> 0:42:50.462
<v Speaker 3>But that has been the case in many murder investigations

0:42:50.462 --> 0:42:53.702
<v Speaker 3>where those accounts have turned out to be wrong. So

0:42:53.742 --> 0:42:55.302
<v Speaker 3>we need to take that for what it is. And

0:42:55.342 --> 0:43:00.022
<v Speaker 3>I've been told by prosecution experts that in any trial

0:43:00.782 --> 0:43:03.342
<v Speaker 3>that would become under a lot of scrutiny, there'd be

0:43:03.382 --> 0:43:06.102
<v Speaker 3>a lot of questions asked about that sighting. The other

0:43:06.142 --> 0:43:08.502
<v Speaker 3>thing obviously we need to ask, is well, are we

0:43:08.622 --> 0:43:11.542
<v Speaker 3>sure that the sound of the dispute came from Jeff

0:43:11.582 --> 0:43:14.062
<v Speaker 3>and Anthea's apartment. It could have been someone else, could

0:43:14.062 --> 0:43:16.942
<v Speaker 3>have been a complete coincidence. And the police say that

0:43:17.022 --> 0:43:19.982
<v Speaker 3>any investigation there will be red herrings like this. They're

0:43:19.982 --> 0:43:22.222
<v Speaker 3>the first two things we need to consider. But then

0:43:22.222 --> 0:43:25.342
<v Speaker 3>we also need to look at Jeff Hall's version of events.

0:43:25.622 --> 0:43:27.862
<v Speaker 3>Was he really at work that whole time? Who saw

0:43:27.942 --> 0:43:30.302
<v Speaker 3>him at work was as someone that can account for

0:43:30.382 --> 0:43:33.902
<v Speaker 3>him being there every minute of the day between twelve

0:43:33.902 --> 0:43:37.902
<v Speaker 3>and five. And I have to say there are alibi

0:43:37.942 --> 0:43:41.222
<v Speaker 3>witnesses for Jeff Hall, people who say they saw him

0:43:41.422 --> 0:43:44.822
<v Speaker 3>around two point fifteen, although they couldn't be completely sure

0:43:44.862 --> 0:43:47.822
<v Speaker 3>of the time. But I think just to simplify it

0:43:47.822 --> 0:43:50.462
<v Speaker 3>a little bit, because Jeff Hall's version of events is

0:43:50.502 --> 0:43:54.142
<v Speaker 3>probably most important. He said in his original police statement

0:43:54.222 --> 0:43:56.822
<v Speaker 3>that he had a coffee break at two o'clock in

0:43:56.822 --> 0:43:59.822
<v Speaker 3>the afternoon. He says that he had that coffee break

0:44:00.382 --> 0:44:02.902
<v Speaker 3>on the clinic grounds. He never went home. He says

0:44:02.902 --> 0:44:05.102
<v Speaker 3>he never went back to the apartment and he says

0:44:05.102 --> 0:44:09.102
<v Speaker 3>that he had that coffee break with his superior Varghi's Powlos,

0:44:09.342 --> 0:44:12.982
<v Speaker 3>who was the head of the MRI department where he worked.

0:44:13.582 --> 0:44:17.742
<v Speaker 3>Problem is Fagie's powerloss in his statement says, yes, I

0:44:17.782 --> 0:44:20.422
<v Speaker 3>did have a coffee break with Jeff Hall, but that

0:44:20.582 --> 0:44:24.182
<v Speaker 3>was at two forty five, and so there's a difference

0:44:24.222 --> 0:44:28.982
<v Speaker 3>in timings there, and it is possible that one of

0:44:28.982 --> 0:44:31.182
<v Speaker 3>them has just got their time wrong. But a fact

0:44:31.262 --> 0:44:33.302
<v Speaker 3>of this case is that Jeff says he had a

0:44:33.302 --> 0:44:35.902
<v Speaker 3>coffee break at two and the person he says he

0:44:35.942 --> 0:44:38.822
<v Speaker 3>had a coffee break with says, no, it happened at

0:44:38.822 --> 0:44:42.382
<v Speaker 3>two forty five. Crucial timing when you consider the sound

0:44:42.422 --> 0:44:45.422
<v Speaker 3>of the domestic dispute at the apartment complex at about

0:44:45.462 --> 0:44:48.942
<v Speaker 3>two ten pm. The other important thing to note there

0:44:49.222 --> 0:44:53.582
<v Speaker 3>is that whilst Jeff's car wasn't with him by all reports.

0:44:53.582 --> 0:44:56.942
<v Speaker 3>At the medical center. It's a fairly short walk. I've

0:44:56.982 --> 0:44:59.142
<v Speaker 3>looked at it on Google Maps. As the crow flies,

0:44:59.182 --> 0:45:03.022
<v Speaker 3>it's less than a kilometer from the apartment complex to

0:45:03.422 --> 0:45:06.342
<v Speaker 3>the clinic. Jeff was a fit man. If he wanted

0:45:06.342 --> 0:45:09.142
<v Speaker 3>to run, he'd cover a kilometer in five minutes. If

0:45:09.182 --> 0:45:12.982
<v Speaker 3>he walked, he might take ten to fifteen. He could

0:45:12.982 --> 0:45:17.742
<v Speaker 3>get a ride. That's something that has been investigated. What

0:45:17.782 --> 0:45:23.102
<v Speaker 3>it essentially shows is that there is a possibility that

0:45:23.222 --> 0:45:27.062
<v Speaker 3>Jeff could have gone home during that five hour period.

0:45:27.502 --> 0:45:30.782
<v Speaker 3>I will repeat, though, that there were several people who

0:45:30.902 --> 0:45:33.422
<v Speaker 3>certainly say that they were with Jeff the large chunks

0:45:33.462 --> 0:45:35.302
<v Speaker 3>of the day. The other thing that Jeff said was

0:45:35.342 --> 0:45:38.182
<v Speaker 3>that he spent a lot of that afternoon with var

0:45:38.262 --> 0:45:43.142
<v Speaker 3>Geese and with another colleague, Emmett Timperley. Emma has been

0:45:43.142 --> 0:45:45.462
<v Speaker 3>supportive in her witness statement of what I've seen in

0:45:45.502 --> 0:45:48.182
<v Speaker 3>terms of spending a lot of time with Jeff. Var Geese, though,

0:45:48.222 --> 0:45:51.542
<v Speaker 3>who I've interviewed, has said that he would have only

0:45:51.622 --> 0:45:53.862
<v Speaker 3>spent a few minutes here and there with Jeff, and

0:45:54.022 --> 0:45:56.142
<v Speaker 3>certainly doesn't think he would have spent a large chunk

0:45:56.142 --> 0:46:09.142
<v Speaker 3>of the afternoon with him.

0:46:09.462 --> 0:46:13.182
<v Speaker 1>So Rownie has all of this evidence and investigation, what

0:46:13.222 --> 0:46:15.862
<v Speaker 1>does he do with it in terms of the Australian authorities.

0:46:16.982 --> 0:46:19.942
<v Speaker 3>So he wanted an opinion as to whether or not

0:46:20.302 --> 0:46:23.782
<v Speaker 3>what he had gathered was enough for a prosecution, and

0:46:23.822 --> 0:46:26.062
<v Speaker 3>so he went to the South Australian Director of Public

0:46:26.102 --> 0:46:29.382
<v Speaker 3>Prosecutions at the time, who was a man named Stephen Polaris.

0:46:29.982 --> 0:46:33.702
<v Speaker 3>It was his role as the DPP in South Australia

0:46:33.782 --> 0:46:35.982
<v Speaker 3>to look at evidence that police have gathered and make

0:46:36.062 --> 0:46:38.542
<v Speaker 3>decisions on whether or not there was enough to put

0:46:38.582 --> 0:46:41.102
<v Speaker 3>a person before the court. This was his speciality. This

0:46:41.142 --> 0:46:44.902
<v Speaker 3>is what he did every day. So that evidence was

0:46:44.902 --> 0:46:48.542
<v Speaker 3>presented to him, and he tells me after examining that evidence,

0:46:48.622 --> 0:46:51.382
<v Speaker 3>he came to the conclusion that there was not only

0:46:51.662 --> 0:46:55.662
<v Speaker 3>enough evidence to charge Jeffrey Hall, there was enough evidence

0:46:55.902 --> 0:46:59.542
<v Speaker 3>to put him on trial for murder. This was a

0:46:59.582 --> 0:47:01.662
<v Speaker 3>determination he made in two thousand and eight. And I

0:47:01.702 --> 0:47:05.182
<v Speaker 3>do want to caveat that with the fact that perhaps

0:47:05.222 --> 0:47:07.862
<v Speaker 3>evidence has been gathered since then that might change his mind,

0:47:07.862 --> 0:47:11.622
<v Speaker 3>but certainly that was his determination in two thousand and eight.

0:47:12.822 --> 0:47:16.262
<v Speaker 1>You have Brunei not wanting to do that. You have

0:47:16.302 --> 0:47:20.302
<v Speaker 1>Australia wanting to do that. How do you go about

0:47:20.422 --> 0:47:24.582
<v Speaker 1>making that happen because we don't have jurisdiction there, and so.

0:47:24.622 --> 0:47:26.782
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, this was the first brick Wall I guess that

0:47:26.862 --> 0:47:30.142
<v Speaker 3>those investigators faced here in South Australia. So there was

0:47:30.182 --> 0:47:32.782
<v Speaker 3>Detective Brenton Rownie, but there was also another one that

0:47:32.942 --> 0:47:35.902
<v Speaker 3>came in, Detective John schneiem Milch. They worked together for

0:47:35.942 --> 0:47:41.182
<v Speaker 3>a point and they decided, okay, Brunei Police isn't going

0:47:41.182 --> 0:47:45.302
<v Speaker 3>to investigate the DPP here thinks there's enough evidence. Our

0:47:45.342 --> 0:47:48.462
<v Speaker 3>next step, we're going to talk to Jeff Hall. Jeff

0:47:48.502 --> 0:47:51.622
<v Speaker 3>Hall was working in Tokyo as an executive by this point.

0:47:52.342 --> 0:47:55.782
<v Speaker 3>They put an alert on his passport so that whenever

0:47:55.822 --> 0:48:00.062
<v Speaker 3>he enters the country they would know about it. Jeff

0:48:00.062 --> 0:48:04.262
<v Speaker 3>Hall eventually comes back to Australia and he's staying at

0:48:04.302 --> 0:48:08.702
<v Speaker 3>a hotel in the CBD and detective Rownie and schnee

0:48:08.742 --> 0:48:14.582
<v Speaker 3>Milch go to his front door at the hotel room. Jeff,

0:48:15.302 --> 0:48:19.662
<v Speaker 3>to their surprise, agrees to talk to them and they

0:48:20.142 --> 0:48:25.062
<v Speaker 3>interview him at length. Jeff sticks to that original story.

0:48:26.422 --> 0:48:29.022
<v Speaker 3>I've got varying accounts from those two detectives. One of

0:48:29.062 --> 0:48:32.862
<v Speaker 3>them believes that he thought that at one stage Jeff

0:48:32.862 --> 0:48:35.262
<v Speaker 3>Hall was going to confess to the murder. The other

0:48:35.302 --> 0:48:38.902
<v Speaker 3>detective certainly didn't agree with that at all, but both

0:48:38.982 --> 0:48:41.702
<v Speaker 3>of them do agree that Jeff Hall was extremely upset.

0:48:41.982 --> 0:48:45.662
<v Speaker 3>He was obviously extremely shocked to suddenly have detectives arriving

0:48:45.662 --> 0:48:47.942
<v Speaker 3>at his door all of these years later, but they

0:48:48.542 --> 0:48:52.622
<v Speaker 3>did interview him. He agreed to the interview. Jeff's story

0:48:52.662 --> 0:48:58.022
<v Speaker 3>didn't change, and then the detectives went to the Bradshaw's home,

0:48:58.782 --> 0:49:02.222
<v Speaker 3>sat them down and said, we think we've done all

0:49:02.262 --> 0:49:06.862
<v Speaker 3>we can here. Now we don't have any jurisdiction and

0:49:06.902 --> 0:49:08.702
<v Speaker 3>we're going to have to leave it at that. And

0:49:08.862 --> 0:49:13.822
<v Speaker 3>Craig Bradshaw, Anthea's eldest brother, who very frustrated by this point,

0:49:13.862 --> 0:49:16.262
<v Speaker 3>says that he went outside. He had a punching bag

0:49:16.542 --> 0:49:18.702
<v Speaker 3>and he punched the punching bag and he broke his

0:49:18.742 --> 0:49:23.702
<v Speaker 3>wrist because he felt like it was just another as

0:49:23.702 --> 0:49:27.262
<v Speaker 3>I say, brickwall that they had faced. And so when

0:49:27.302 --> 0:49:30.302
<v Speaker 3>he had eventually calmed down, he said to these detectives, Okay,

0:49:30.382 --> 0:49:33.182
<v Speaker 3>well where can we go from here? And they said, well,

0:49:33.942 --> 0:49:36.422
<v Speaker 3>we don't think your chances are very good, but you

0:49:36.462 --> 0:49:40.262
<v Speaker 3>could go to Federal Parliament and you could change a

0:49:40.342 --> 0:49:45.142
<v Speaker 3>law so that police in Australia can investigate this crime,

0:49:45.222 --> 0:49:46.782
<v Speaker 3>because at the end of the day, the victim was

0:49:46.822 --> 0:49:50.342
<v Speaker 3>Australian and there was legislation in place already that came

0:49:50.342 --> 0:49:52.982
<v Speaker 3>in in two thousand and two after the Bali bombings

0:49:53.782 --> 0:49:58.142
<v Speaker 3>that allowed Australian police to investigate overseas murders. The problem

0:49:58.182 --> 0:50:01.782
<v Speaker 3>with that though, was that it wasn't backdated, so the

0:50:01.942 --> 0:50:06.342
<v Speaker 3>legislation only began in two Anything before that, including Anthea's

0:50:06.382 --> 0:50:10.382
<v Speaker 3>murder in nineteen ninety four, wasn't subject to this legislation,

0:50:10.582 --> 0:50:14.022
<v Speaker 3>and so what the Bradshaws would need to do is

0:50:14.142 --> 0:50:18.622
<v Speaker 3>changed that legislation so that it was retrospective. And that's

0:50:18.662 --> 0:50:21.462
<v Speaker 3>where a whole new fight began for the Bradshaws. They

0:50:21.502 --> 0:50:25.342
<v Speaker 3>went to journalists at the time and one of them

0:50:25.382 --> 0:50:28.342
<v Speaker 3>was probably me, but also a reporter with a local

0:50:28.382 --> 0:50:30.982
<v Speaker 3>paper who wrote a feature article about this. It gave

0:50:31.022 --> 0:50:34.102
<v Speaker 3>the case a bit more prominence. And then I'm sure

0:50:34.102 --> 0:50:37.622
<v Speaker 3>you'll know Nick Xenophon, a very prominent independent senator at

0:50:37.622 --> 0:50:41.062
<v Speaker 3>the time, became aware of the case and he went

0:50:41.102 --> 0:50:43.822
<v Speaker 3>and met with the Bradshaws and he said Okay, well,

0:50:44.302 --> 0:50:48.222
<v Speaker 3>let's see if we can change this legislation. It was

0:50:48.262 --> 0:50:50.582
<v Speaker 3>going to be difficult though for Nick on his own

0:50:50.622 --> 0:50:53.142
<v Speaker 3>because he was an independent wasn't aligned to either of

0:50:53.182 --> 0:50:56.382
<v Speaker 3>the major parties here in Australia. But perhaps another stroke

0:50:56.422 --> 0:51:00.102
<v Speaker 3>of luck was that the local member for the Bradshaws

0:51:00.262 --> 0:51:04.582
<v Speaker 3>was Christopher Pine, a prominent cabinet minister at the time,

0:51:04.662 --> 0:51:08.022
<v Speaker 3>and so Nick and Chris and the family get together

0:51:09.382 --> 0:51:12.622
<v Speaker 3>and they try to work out, okay, how do we

0:51:12.662 --> 0:51:16.262
<v Speaker 3>go about this. Christopher Pine approached the Attorney General at

0:51:16.302 --> 0:51:19.022
<v Speaker 3>the time, who was George Brandis, and they decided that

0:51:19.102 --> 0:51:23.382
<v Speaker 3>if they introduced a private member's bill through Nick Xenophon,

0:51:23.542 --> 0:51:27.182
<v Speaker 3>that perhaps this could get past the Senate and the

0:51:27.182 --> 0:51:31.982
<v Speaker 3>House of Representatives. And it didn't happen easily, but eventually

0:51:32.422 --> 0:51:34.662
<v Speaker 3>that did happen and the law was changed, and the

0:51:34.662 --> 0:51:39.342
<v Speaker 3>Bradshaws went to Canberra. They fronted the cameras and this

0:51:39.542 --> 0:51:43.902
<v Speaker 3>was an historic day and they changed federal law and

0:51:44.222 --> 0:51:47.462
<v Speaker 3>it became known as Antia's Law or the Bradshaw Bill,

0:51:48.262 --> 0:51:50.982
<v Speaker 3>and that would not just help them, but potentially help

0:51:51.582 --> 0:51:55.422
<v Speaker 3>many other Australian families as well. That could be seen

0:51:55.462 --> 0:51:58.342
<v Speaker 3>as a victory For the Bradshaws, they certainly didn't see

0:51:58.342 --> 0:52:00.462
<v Speaker 3>it that way and they said as much. This was

0:52:00.662 --> 0:52:04.142
<v Speaker 3>just Martin Bradshaw that his father said. They were never

0:52:04.222 --> 0:52:07.142
<v Speaker 3>going to be any winners in this. It's just about

0:52:07.302 --> 0:52:10.262
<v Speaker 3>pursuing justice. But this allowed them to take that next

0:52:10.302 --> 0:52:10.782
<v Speaker 3>time step.

0:52:11.662 --> 0:52:14.782
<v Speaker 1>We still don't have anyone behind bars for this murder,

0:52:15.862 --> 0:52:20.102
<v Speaker 1>so that law might have gone through, but what's actually

0:52:20.142 --> 0:52:22.702
<v Speaker 1>happened since that law came through? Where are we at

0:52:22.742 --> 0:52:23.782
<v Speaker 1>in this investigation?

0:52:25.222 --> 0:52:28.502
<v Speaker 3>And so the Bradshaws thought at this point that the

0:52:28.542 --> 0:52:32.782
<v Speaker 3>South Australian Police would then investigate and have jurisdiction. That

0:52:32.902 --> 0:52:37.702
<v Speaker 3>didn't happen. The Australian Federal Police were given the job

0:52:37.982 --> 0:52:42.022
<v Speaker 3>of investigating it, presumably because they used to dealing with

0:52:42.422 --> 0:52:48.502
<v Speaker 3>overseas governments, overseas police forces, and they might have access

0:52:48.582 --> 0:52:51.662
<v Speaker 3>to more intel than the South Australian Police would have,

0:52:52.342 --> 0:52:56.262
<v Speaker 3>so in a way it made sense. Two investigators were

0:52:56.262 --> 0:53:00.222
<v Speaker 3>given the task of not conducting an investigation. They used

0:53:00.262 --> 0:53:03.862
<v Speaker 3>the word evaluation to evaluate the evidence to then make

0:53:03.902 --> 0:53:07.822
<v Speaker 3>a decision whether it was even worth investigating. Those two

0:53:07.862 --> 0:53:12.982
<v Speaker 3>investigators spent around eighteen months looking at the evidence, conducting

0:53:13.022 --> 0:53:19.182
<v Speaker 3>their own investigations, re examining forensic exhibits, They visited Brunei,

0:53:19.502 --> 0:53:25.702
<v Speaker 3>they spoke to witnesses. However, they then summoned the Bradshaws,

0:53:25.742 --> 0:53:29.942
<v Speaker 3>or called the Bradshaws to their AFP offices in Adelaide,

0:53:30.622 --> 0:53:34.502
<v Speaker 3>sat them down and told them quite bluntly that they

0:53:34.542 --> 0:53:37.942
<v Speaker 3>would not be conducting a full investigation into the matter.

0:53:38.902 --> 0:53:43.382
<v Speaker 1>That must have been heartbreaking after all of that, after

0:53:43.462 --> 0:53:48.302
<v Speaker 1>everything that they had been through, it ripped their hearts out.

0:53:48.662 --> 0:53:54.102
<v Speaker 3>Paul Bradshaw, I'm told, reacted very angrily. Anthea's younger brother

0:53:55.462 --> 0:53:59.702
<v Speaker 3>just wanted to leave, dropped some f bombs, told them

0:53:59.982 --> 0:54:05.342
<v Speaker 3>what he thought of them, and eventually left the building.

0:54:06.742 --> 0:54:09.502
<v Speaker 3>I'm told by some sources he may have done a

0:54:09.542 --> 0:54:12.182
<v Speaker 3>small burnout in the car park and then drove off.

0:54:13.302 --> 0:54:16.302
<v Speaker 3>And it was the same feeling for Craig and Roz

0:54:16.422 --> 0:54:19.942
<v Speaker 3>and Martin. It was a shock. They thought that there

0:54:19.942 --> 0:54:22.382
<v Speaker 3>would at least be an investigation. And that's the point

0:54:22.422 --> 0:54:25.902
<v Speaker 3>I want to make here, is that this wasn't about going, Okay,

0:54:25.982 --> 0:54:29.942
<v Speaker 3>let's go and arrest Jeff Hall. It was about let's

0:54:29.982 --> 0:54:34.382
<v Speaker 3>investigate who killed Anthea. There are other theories, but someone

0:54:34.502 --> 0:54:37.182
<v Speaker 3>killed Anthea. So Let's find out who it was. Let's

0:54:37.262 --> 0:54:40.982
<v Speaker 3>not just allow a South Australian woman to be murdered

0:54:41.022 --> 0:54:44.582
<v Speaker 3>overseas and do nothing about it. That was their frustration,

0:54:46.182 --> 0:54:49.062
<v Speaker 3>and it was a shock for me too. I've been

0:54:49.062 --> 0:54:51.222
<v Speaker 3>following this case. I tried to ring the Brawdshaws. They

0:54:51.222 --> 0:54:55.022
<v Speaker 3>weren't answering their phones. They dropped off the grid for

0:54:55.542 --> 0:54:58.022
<v Speaker 3>a few days, maybe a few weeks. And I'm only

0:54:58.062 --> 0:55:02.422
<v Speaker 3>being told now the reason that was was that Martin

0:55:03.062 --> 0:55:08.782
<v Speaker 3>Antea's father started to spiral. His health started to suffer

0:55:09.542 --> 0:55:12.102
<v Speaker 3>and he had a stroke a couple of weeks after

0:55:13.222 --> 0:55:17.022
<v Speaker 3>being told this news. He survived that stroke. Craig was

0:55:17.062 --> 0:55:19.422
<v Speaker 3>there and managed to get into a hospital, but sadly,

0:55:20.102 --> 0:55:22.942
<v Speaker 3>he had a few more strokes and he continued to

0:55:22.982 --> 0:55:25.782
<v Speaker 3>go downhill, and a few years ago he passed away

0:55:26.022 --> 0:55:28.142
<v Speaker 3>without knowing what had happened to his daughter.

0:55:28.702 --> 0:55:30.462
<v Speaker 1>Is that why you've come in? Is that why you're

0:55:30.462 --> 0:55:34.062
<v Speaker 1>reinvestigating this to try and help this family in this

0:55:34.222 --> 0:55:35.462
<v Speaker 1>next stage of their fight.

0:55:36.342 --> 0:55:38.582
<v Speaker 3>Yes, because they don't know where else to go. The

0:55:38.622 --> 0:55:41.382
<v Speaker 3>Bradshaw family at the moment, we need to reflect. Now

0:55:41.422 --> 0:55:44.342
<v Speaker 3>we've had a Brunei police investigation that didn't go anywhere.

0:55:44.542 --> 0:55:49.502
<v Speaker 3>South Australian Police were enthusiastic about helping them, but ultimately

0:55:50.142 --> 0:55:53.102
<v Speaker 3>didn't have the primary jurisdiction and it was given to

0:55:53.222 --> 0:55:56.822
<v Speaker 3>the AFP, which investigated. And I need to be very clear,

0:55:57.782 --> 0:56:03.022
<v Speaker 3>they called that investigation an evaluation and then they said

0:56:03.102 --> 0:56:05.662
<v Speaker 3>explicitly to the family that they would not conduct a

0:56:05.702 --> 0:56:09.782
<v Speaker 3>full investigation into the matter. And I found that very

0:56:09.902 --> 0:56:13.622
<v Speaker 3>unusual for several reasons. And I'm not saying that they

0:56:13.662 --> 0:56:16.502
<v Speaker 3>didn't do a thorough job. And I'm sure that they

0:56:16.742 --> 0:56:19.702
<v Speaker 3>are aware of evidence that I'm not aware of, and

0:56:19.742 --> 0:56:22.462
<v Speaker 3>perhaps the other police forces aren't aware of, and the

0:56:22.462 --> 0:56:28.102
<v Speaker 3>former South Australian DEPP isn't aware of. But did they

0:56:28.182 --> 0:56:31.862
<v Speaker 3>do everything they could? And should they be saying that

0:56:31.942 --> 0:56:34.622
<v Speaker 3>they're not going to conduct a full investigation. I think

0:56:34.622 --> 0:56:37.702
<v Speaker 3>that's a horrible thing to tell a family. I really do.

0:56:38.582 --> 0:56:44.182
<v Speaker 3>And for example, if there's a cold case in South

0:56:44.222 --> 0:56:51.022
<v Speaker 3>Australia the South Australian Police, it'll always be something that

0:56:51.022 --> 0:56:53.542
<v Speaker 3>they never give up on and they will hold press

0:56:53.542 --> 0:56:57.302
<v Speaker 3>conferences or they'll keep pushing it out there and calling

0:56:57.342 --> 0:57:03.062
<v Speaker 3>for information. Now, I'm not aware of a single police

0:57:03.102 --> 0:57:08.022
<v Speaker 3>officer in the world having ever done a press conference

0:57:08.222 --> 0:57:12.622
<v Speaker 3>about Anthea's murder. Not one nearly thirty years not one

0:57:13.342 --> 0:57:16.702
<v Speaker 3>might have happened in Brunei. Perhaps I'm not sure. Certainly

0:57:16.702 --> 0:57:18.622
<v Speaker 3>not in Australia. And that's what I guess what we

0:57:18.662 --> 0:57:22.502
<v Speaker 3>can focus on now, because clearly it's now Australia's job

0:57:22.542 --> 0:57:25.022
<v Speaker 3>to do this, because Brunei is not going to I

0:57:25.062 --> 0:57:29.182
<v Speaker 3>would have thought that at some point you front the

0:57:29.222 --> 0:57:34.262
<v Speaker 3>cameras and you say it's not acceptable that an innocent

0:57:34.702 --> 0:57:37.902
<v Speaker 3>South Australian school teacher was killed in the prime of

0:57:37.942 --> 0:57:40.902
<v Speaker 3>her life in a foreign country. We want to do

0:57:40.942 --> 0:57:44.702
<v Speaker 3>something about it. Who knows something? If you know, call

0:57:44.782 --> 0:57:48.222
<v Speaker 3>this number, put out a reward, like you do with

0:57:48.302 --> 0:57:52.782
<v Speaker 3>every other unsolved murder in Australia that hasn't happened. Either.

0:57:52.822 --> 0:57:56.742
<v Speaker 3>There's no reward. The AFP might say, I will look,

0:57:56.942 --> 0:58:00.222
<v Speaker 3>this happened overseas. Why would we call for witnesses here

0:58:00.222 --> 0:58:04.422
<v Speaker 3>in Australia. Well, a lot of the witnesses now live

0:58:04.422 --> 0:58:06.862
<v Speaker 3>in Australia. Well, the key one, nor Angela, who I

0:58:06.902 --> 0:58:09.502
<v Speaker 3>spoke to, who was the last to see anthrough her

0:58:09.582 --> 0:58:11.302
<v Speaker 3>live will, says she was the last to see anthrow

0:58:11.302 --> 0:58:14.302
<v Speaker 3>your lives. She lives in Perth. I've spoken to another

0:58:14.342 --> 0:58:17.222
<v Speaker 3>witness who had dinner with Anthea and Jeff the night before.

0:58:17.342 --> 0:58:20.382
<v Speaker 3>She lives in Borough, South Australia. A lot of these

0:58:20.422 --> 0:58:27.062
<v Speaker 3>expats are in Australia and anti families in Australia. Antea's

0:58:27.182 --> 0:58:30.542
<v Speaker 3>friends are in Australia. It's important to know about Jeff

0:58:30.582 --> 0:58:34.502
<v Speaker 3>and Anthea's relationship before they went overseas. You need to

0:58:34.502 --> 0:58:36.662
<v Speaker 3>build a full picture, and so I think there is

0:58:36.742 --> 0:58:39.942
<v Speaker 3>good reason to do a press conference or a recorded

0:58:40.022 --> 0:58:43.782
<v Speaker 3>interview here in Australia and I have reached out to

0:58:43.822 --> 0:58:48.342
<v Speaker 3>the AFP with a full list of questions. It took

0:58:48.382 --> 0:58:50.342
<v Speaker 3>me a long time to get an answer as to

0:58:50.382 --> 0:58:53.702
<v Speaker 3>whether they would speak with me, and six weeks after

0:58:54.022 --> 0:58:57.382
<v Speaker 3>that first inquiry I got an email saying that they

0:58:57.422 --> 0:59:02.902
<v Speaker 3>would politely decline. And what's particularly frustrating about that is

0:59:02.942 --> 0:59:08.582
<v Speaker 3>that podcasts they extend beyond borders, don't they Like people

0:59:08.622 --> 0:59:12.662
<v Speaker 3>in BRUNEI might listen to the podcast, the American expats

0:59:12.742 --> 0:59:15.302
<v Speaker 3>might hear it in the US. There are witnesses in

0:59:15.302 --> 0:59:18.142
<v Speaker 3>the UK, and there is a very good chance that

0:59:18.222 --> 0:59:21.502
<v Speaker 3>once the podcast starts getting shared around, it will get

0:59:21.542 --> 0:59:25.062
<v Speaker 3>to the right people. I was extremely disappointed that they

0:59:25.062 --> 0:59:28.382
<v Speaker 3>didn't want to talk. They did provide me with an

0:59:28.382 --> 0:59:32.182
<v Speaker 3>extensive written statement, and I should acknowledge that they certainly

0:59:32.222 --> 0:59:35.302
<v Speaker 3>say that they did everything that they could, that they

0:59:35.342 --> 0:59:40.782
<v Speaker 3>feel like they turned over every stone, that they interviewed

0:59:40.822 --> 0:59:43.822
<v Speaker 3>all of the right people, They re examined the forensic evidence.

0:59:44.382 --> 0:59:49.102
<v Speaker 3>They also say that they uncovered new evidence, including some

0:59:49.302 --> 0:59:53.302
<v Speaker 3>injuries we weren't aware of to anthea, which is well

0:59:53.302 --> 0:59:55.102
<v Speaker 3>and good, but I would have some follow up questions

0:59:55.102 --> 0:59:57.582
<v Speaker 3>for that, and I'd like to know a little bit more.

0:59:57.662 --> 1:00:00.742
<v Speaker 3>And if there is some stuff that they know that

1:00:01.062 --> 1:00:05.382
<v Speaker 3>we don't the public doesn't know, that doesn't sit very

1:00:05.422 --> 1:00:08.062
<v Speaker 3>comfortably with me either, because that would mean that Martin

1:00:08.102 --> 1:00:13.822
<v Speaker 3>Bradshaw passed away without knowing the full story. And they

1:00:13.862 --> 1:00:16.262
<v Speaker 3>probably do say that they need to keep some things

1:00:16.302 --> 1:00:20.622
<v Speaker 3>up their sleeve because it might compromise the investigation if

1:00:20.662 --> 1:00:23.262
<v Speaker 3>they release that information. But my response to that would

1:00:23.262 --> 1:00:24.342
<v Speaker 3>be what investigation.

1:00:24.622 --> 1:00:26.462
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, they've said they're not doing one.

1:00:26.982 --> 1:00:29.742
<v Speaker 3>It's been thirty years. Maybe it's time to take some

1:00:29.902 --> 1:00:34.182
<v Speaker 3>risks in releasing some information and getting the public talking again.

1:00:34.462 --> 1:00:37.982
<v Speaker 3>I don't think it's okay to sit there inter state

1:00:38.862 --> 1:00:41.222
<v Speaker 3>and say, oh, look, there are things that you guys

1:00:41.262 --> 1:00:45.862
<v Speaker 3>don't know in this case. We're all is. Even if

1:00:45.902 --> 1:00:48.262
<v Speaker 3>there's only a few new things that we can be told,

1:00:48.542 --> 1:00:51.382
<v Speaker 3>it might be enough to get those witnesses talking again

1:00:51.782 --> 1:00:54.542
<v Speaker 3>and to get the case back on track. So that

1:00:54.622 --> 1:00:55.502
<v Speaker 3>has been frustrating.

1:00:56.422 --> 1:00:58.622
<v Speaker 1>I just want to touch on this briefly, but as

1:00:58.662 --> 1:01:02.262
<v Speaker 1>part of your investigation, you've been trying to build that timeline,

1:01:02.262 --> 1:01:06.742
<v Speaker 1>that relationship inside Jeff and Anthea's world by talking to

1:01:06.782 --> 1:01:11.102
<v Speaker 1>friends and stuff like that. Has anything in that timeline

1:01:11.182 --> 1:01:14.702
<v Speaker 1>surprised you? Because one thing we haven't mentioned is that

1:01:15.822 --> 1:01:18.502
<v Speaker 1>Jeff is actually a gay man. He came out in

1:01:18.542 --> 1:01:21.782
<v Speaker 1>the early two thousands around that time has been gay.

1:01:22.982 --> 1:01:25.342
<v Speaker 1>Is that something that's worth talking about.

1:01:26.102 --> 1:01:28.862
<v Speaker 3>Yes, I think it's worth talking about. Obviously, we need

1:01:28.902 --> 1:01:32.782
<v Speaker 3>to be very careful. I don't think that we can

1:01:32.902 --> 1:01:37.382
<v Speaker 3>say it's important to the investigation necessarily. And the Bradshaws

1:01:37.382 --> 1:01:39.702
<v Speaker 3>make the point as well that just because Jeff has

1:01:39.742 --> 1:01:42.542
<v Speaker 3>come out as gay, it doesn't make him a murderer.

1:01:42.542 --> 1:01:46.222
<v Speaker 3>And I hope that's an obvious thing to say. However,

1:01:47.462 --> 1:01:53.902
<v Speaker 3>given that ninety six days after Anthea's wedding, she was killed,

1:01:54.062 --> 1:01:57.742
<v Speaker 3>and given that Jeff Hall has been named as a

1:01:57.782 --> 1:02:02.062
<v Speaker 3>suspect in a coroner's in quest and also in an

1:02:02.062 --> 1:02:06.342
<v Speaker 3>Adelaide court since then. Given those things, it's important to

1:02:06.342 --> 1:02:10.822
<v Speaker 3>go back over their relationship because that helps build a picture.

1:02:11.742 --> 1:02:15.142
<v Speaker 3>So I want to talk about a few things there. Firstly,

1:02:15.782 --> 1:02:19.742
<v Speaker 3>the Bradshaws say that they never saw many signs of

1:02:20.062 --> 1:02:23.822
<v Speaker 3>tension between the couple, only an argument here and there.

1:02:24.662 --> 1:02:29.182
<v Speaker 3>I've spoken to friends of Anthea who say that they

1:02:29.222 --> 1:02:33.102
<v Speaker 3>did like Jeff, but they've also painted a bit of

1:02:33.142 --> 1:02:36.262
<v Speaker 3>a different picture about what was happening behind closed doors.

1:02:36.862 --> 1:02:40.382
<v Speaker 3>There was one letter in particular that Anthea had sent

1:02:40.462 --> 1:02:44.422
<v Speaker 3>to one of her friends that spoke about them having

1:02:44.502 --> 1:02:48.622
<v Speaker 3>some doozy of arguments, is how she described them, arguments

1:02:48.702 --> 1:02:54.382
<v Speaker 3>that involved furniture throwing and minor injuries. Now, I want

1:02:54.462 --> 1:02:57.062
<v Speaker 3>to make it clear that that doesn't make Jeff a

1:02:57.142 --> 1:03:00.862
<v Speaker 3>murderer either, and that lots of couples would have arguments,

1:03:00.862 --> 1:03:07.462
<v Speaker 3>and lots of couples probably have quite volatile arguments. Again,

1:03:07.542 --> 1:03:10.662
<v Speaker 3>I think it's important to paint the picture though about

1:03:10.662 --> 1:03:14.622
<v Speaker 3>their relationship, given that he is a suspect in the murder.

1:03:15.222 --> 1:03:17.822
<v Speaker 3>There were other friends as well that also recall there

1:03:17.862 --> 1:03:22.302
<v Speaker 3>being arguing. And there are some friends as well that

1:03:22.422 --> 1:03:25.502
<v Speaker 3>say that there was some strange behavior, erratic behavior from

1:03:25.582 --> 1:03:30.662
<v Speaker 3>Jeff after Anthea died, after the funeral, and I guess

1:03:30.662 --> 1:03:33.422
<v Speaker 3>that could be explained. He would have been grieving at

1:03:33.422 --> 1:03:36.102
<v Speaker 3>the time, but I think important to put that on

1:03:36.142 --> 1:03:40.222
<v Speaker 3>the record. So there were those things from Antie's friends. Essentially,

1:03:40.342 --> 1:03:45.582
<v Speaker 3>it was not a perfect relationship. Also, when you mentioned

1:03:45.702 --> 1:03:49.622
<v Speaker 3>Jeff coming out as gay, that happened around ten years

1:03:50.102 --> 1:03:52.862
<v Speaker 3>after the murder, that was a real shock for the

1:03:52.902 --> 1:03:55.782
<v Speaker 3>Bradshaw family because they were still close with Jeff, particularly

1:03:55.782 --> 1:03:59.222
<v Speaker 3>the brothers. They were still mates, but Jeff didn't tell them.

1:03:59.422 --> 1:04:02.422
<v Speaker 3>One of the brothers, Paul, was at a social event.

1:04:02.462 --> 1:04:04.182
<v Speaker 3>It was a cricket party, he says, and he was

1:04:04.222 --> 1:04:07.182
<v Speaker 3>talking to a mutual friend of Jeff's and Paul said,

1:04:07.702 --> 1:04:11.342
<v Speaker 3>how is Jeff? And this friend said, well, you know,

1:04:11.382 --> 1:04:14.782
<v Speaker 3>I was a bit shocked about him coming out with

1:04:15.662 --> 1:04:19.622
<v Speaker 3>this young fellow. And Paul said, what do you mean

1:04:19.702 --> 1:04:22.222
<v Speaker 3>coming out of what? And would soon put two and

1:04:22.262 --> 1:04:25.142
<v Speaker 3>two together and that was how he found out that

1:04:25.222 --> 1:04:28.902
<v Speaker 3>Jeff was gay. And so Paul says, why didn't Jeff

1:04:28.942 --> 1:04:31.062
<v Speaker 3>tell me that? Why didn't he come to meet with it,

1:04:31.622 --> 1:04:35.942
<v Speaker 3>and at no point did these brothers think, oh, okay,

1:04:35.982 --> 1:04:38.622
<v Speaker 3>that's it. That means that he killed Anthea. Far from it.

1:04:39.102 --> 1:04:42.262
<v Speaker 3>In fact, Craig says that when he found out this news,

1:04:43.062 --> 1:04:46.102
<v Speaker 3>he essentially said, look, so what doesn't make him a murderer.

1:04:46.142 --> 1:04:49.262
<v Speaker 3>And he even reached out to Jeff. He called him

1:04:49.742 --> 1:04:52.662
<v Speaker 3>and said, I've just built a new house at Morson Lakes.

1:04:52.662 --> 1:04:54.742
<v Speaker 3>Would you like to come and see it? And Jeff said, no,

1:04:54.822 --> 1:04:57.942
<v Speaker 3>I can't, I'm too busy with water Polo and basically

1:04:58.062 --> 1:05:01.662
<v Speaker 3>hung up. And that was the last interaction that Jeff

1:05:01.662 --> 1:05:04.622
<v Speaker 3>and Craig had ever had, and the Bradshaws haven't spoken

1:05:04.662 --> 1:05:07.942
<v Speaker 3>to him for many years. And so why is his

1:05:08.022 --> 1:05:11.622
<v Speaker 3>sexuality relevant? It's potentially not reallyan Why am I mentioning

1:05:11.622 --> 1:05:14.862
<v Speaker 3>it in the podcast? Well we need to know did

1:05:14.902 --> 1:05:17.262
<v Speaker 3>Jeff know he was gay when he married Anthea? And

1:05:17.302 --> 1:05:19.982
<v Speaker 3>if he did, why did he marry Anthea? And it

1:05:20.022 --> 1:05:22.582
<v Speaker 3>speaks to the dynamics of the relationship. I think it's

1:05:22.582 --> 1:05:24.102
<v Speaker 3>an important thing to mention.

1:05:25.142 --> 1:05:26.982
<v Speaker 1>Will You're right in calling it a mystery because there

1:05:26.982 --> 1:05:29.702
<v Speaker 1>are still so many unanswered questions in this case, it's

1:05:29.702 --> 1:05:31.942
<v Speaker 1>definitely not one we should be just closing a book

1:05:31.942 --> 1:05:35.382
<v Speaker 1>on what's Jeff's response been to all of this and

1:05:35.422 --> 1:05:37.622
<v Speaker 1>to the various investigations that have been going on.

1:05:38.502 --> 1:05:40.902
<v Speaker 3>It's really important to put on the record that Jeff

1:05:40.942 --> 1:05:45.862
<v Speaker 3>has always denied any involvement in Anthea's murder. The Brunei

1:05:45.902 --> 1:05:50.982
<v Speaker 3>police investigation did not find enough evidence to charge him.

1:05:51.382 --> 1:05:54.662
<v Speaker 3>South Australian police have obviously never charged him, and an

1:05:54.742 --> 1:05:58.942
<v Speaker 3>AFP investigation did not find enough evidence to charge him,

1:05:59.422 --> 1:06:02.062
<v Speaker 3>so in the eyes of the law, he is an

1:06:02.062 --> 1:06:05.862
<v Speaker 3>innocent man. I've reached out to him for comment so

1:06:06.022 --> 1:06:08.742
<v Speaker 3>far I haven't got a response at this stage. I

1:06:08.782 --> 1:06:12.302
<v Speaker 3>know that a user with sixty minutes reached out to

1:06:12.382 --> 1:06:15.342
<v Speaker 3>Jeff for comment a few years ago. He was polite

1:06:15.382 --> 1:06:18.582
<v Speaker 3>on the phone and certainly indicated that he would like

1:06:18.662 --> 1:06:23.062
<v Speaker 3>to help, but ultimately declined the request for an interview.

1:06:23.662 --> 1:06:27.182
<v Speaker 3>And more recently, the AFP has told me that they

1:06:27.262 --> 1:06:31.342
<v Speaker 3>reached out to Jeff for an interview for their investigation

1:06:31.742 --> 1:06:35.542
<v Speaker 3>and he declined, which is his right to do. So

1:06:35.582 --> 1:06:37.942
<v Speaker 3>that's where we're at at the moment, and I do

1:06:37.982 --> 1:06:42.022
<v Speaker 3>want to maintain that whilst Jeff has been named as

1:06:42.062 --> 1:06:46.102
<v Speaker 3>a suspect, there have also been other theories including a

1:06:46.142 --> 1:06:52.102
<v Speaker 3>stranger seen outside of the apartment complex, including the fact

1:06:52.142 --> 1:06:55.862
<v Speaker 3>that there were a lot of people around the apartment

1:06:55.982 --> 1:06:57.462
<v Speaker 3>complexes at that time.

1:06:58.222 --> 1:07:01.022
<v Speaker 1>Lastly, I just wanted to ask you what you think

1:07:01.102 --> 1:07:04.342
<v Speaker 1>this case can teach us about grief, because I think

1:07:04.382 --> 1:07:08.622
<v Speaker 1>listening to the Bradshaws, they say time heals wounds, their

1:07:08.622 --> 1:07:12.862
<v Speaker 1>wounds don't feel in any way, shape or form. Thirty

1:07:12.942 --> 1:07:15.982
<v Speaker 1>years later, their grief is so palpable you can hear

1:07:16.022 --> 1:07:20.262
<v Speaker 1>it in their voices. How deeply has this affected the

1:07:20.302 --> 1:07:22.822
<v Speaker 1>trajectory of their lives, and do you think that justice

1:07:22.942 --> 1:07:26.942
<v Speaker 1>will help them to finally be able to handle that grief.

1:07:27.742 --> 1:07:30.982
<v Speaker 3>Firstly, it's absolutely ruined their lives. They haven't been the same.

1:07:31.062 --> 1:07:34.542
<v Speaker 3>Their lives have been turned upside down, mental health problems,

1:07:35.022 --> 1:07:39.702
<v Speaker 3>suicidal thoughts, alcohol problems. They've gone from being a happy

1:07:39.822 --> 1:07:45.982
<v Speaker 3>suburban family to being completely ruined. And I don't think

1:07:46.022 --> 1:07:48.902
<v Speaker 3>we can even begin to imagine what it would be like.

1:07:49.302 --> 1:07:51.982
<v Speaker 3>I've got a sister. If she was one moment, I'm

1:07:52.062 --> 1:07:54.822
<v Speaker 3>m seeing her wedding, the next moment, I'm getting a

1:07:54.862 --> 1:07:59.742
<v Speaker 3>phone call to say that she'd been murdered. Unthinkable. There's that,

1:08:00.942 --> 1:08:03.902
<v Speaker 3>and that's the worst part, right that's the worst part.

1:08:03.942 --> 1:08:07.702
<v Speaker 3>They've lost their sister, they've lost their daughter. But I

1:08:07.742 --> 1:08:13.542
<v Speaker 3>think what has really destroyed them is this ongoing fight

1:08:13.662 --> 1:08:17.262
<v Speaker 3>for justice and the frustration of that and that anger

1:08:18.102 --> 1:08:20.982
<v Speaker 3>that that would bring. And that's what I think really

1:08:21.182 --> 1:08:24.742
<v Speaker 3>comes out when you speak to them. They want whoever

1:08:25.062 --> 1:08:28.662
<v Speaker 3>was responsible to suffer in the way that they have suffered.

1:08:29.822 --> 1:08:33.822
<v Speaker 3>And I've spoken to the former victim's Rights commissioner here

1:08:33.822 --> 1:08:36.262
<v Speaker 3>in South Australia who had some strong things to say

1:08:36.302 --> 1:08:39.342
<v Speaker 3>on this, and he said that families don't ever move

1:08:39.382 --> 1:08:43.142
<v Speaker 3>on from these things. You know, time doesn't really heal wounds.

1:08:43.182 --> 1:08:46.342
<v Speaker 3>People just learn how to live with what's happened to them.

1:08:46.662 --> 1:08:51.502
<v Speaker 3>And he's made the point of saying that these families

1:08:51.502 --> 1:08:55.222
<v Speaker 3>shouldn't be expected to move on afterwards and just to

1:08:55.382 --> 1:08:59.342
<v Speaker 3>drop the investigation and think this isn't getting anywhere, Let's

1:08:59.342 --> 1:09:02.262
<v Speaker 3>go on with our lives. Well, I think it's offensive

1:09:02.302 --> 1:09:04.782
<v Speaker 3>when people say that to them, because it's not for

1:09:04.862 --> 1:09:09.582
<v Speaker 3>other people to decide that. And when I made inquiries

1:09:10.182 --> 1:09:14.982
<v Speaker 3>with witnesses and investigators, some of them said they've got

1:09:14.982 --> 1:09:18.382
<v Speaker 3>to get on with their lives. Anthea wouldn't have wanted this. Well,

1:09:18.462 --> 1:09:23.382
<v Speaker 3>I even question that because Anthea obviously knew who killed her.

1:09:24.142 --> 1:09:25.582
<v Speaker 3>There are people that have said to me anthey will

1:09:25.622 --> 1:09:28.022
<v Speaker 3>be saying go and get them. It's not good enough

1:09:28.022 --> 1:09:30.302
<v Speaker 3>to say that the family should be expected to move

1:09:30.342 --> 1:09:33.622
<v Speaker 3>on because they're never going to have any kind of

1:09:33.702 --> 1:09:37.262
<v Speaker 3>peace until the case is solved. And that's for them

1:09:37.302 --> 1:09:42.862
<v Speaker 3>to decide. And so if there are reasons why things

1:09:42.942 --> 1:09:46.262
<v Speaker 3>can't be investigated further, I mean there are people I

1:09:46.422 --> 1:09:50.262
<v Speaker 3>approached for interview for the podcast who said no, and

1:09:50.502 --> 1:09:53.862
<v Speaker 3>that's completely fine. People have their reasons for that. I

1:09:53.902 --> 1:09:56.982
<v Speaker 3>just don't want one of those reasons to be that

1:09:57.102 --> 1:10:00.022
<v Speaker 3>the family should just move on and that it's best

1:10:00.062 --> 1:10:02.702
<v Speaker 3>for the family, because it's not for us to decide

1:10:02.862 --> 1:10:04.022
<v Speaker 3>what's best for the family.

1:10:09.142 --> 1:10:11.502
<v Speaker 1>Thanks to Ben for assisting us to tell this story.

1:10:11.982 --> 1:10:15.302
<v Speaker 1>True Crime Conversations is a Mumma mea podcast hosted and

1:10:15.342 --> 1:10:19.022
<v Speaker 1>produced by me Jemma Bass, with audio design by Scott Stronik.

1:10:19.542 --> 1:10:23.582
<v Speaker 1>Our executive producer is lif Proud. Thanks so much for listening.

1:10:23.902 --> 1:10:26.902
<v Speaker 1>I'll be back next week with another True Crime Conversation.

1:10:40.342 --> 1:10:42.582
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