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Speaker 1: You're listening to a Muma Mia podcast. Mumma Mea acknowledges

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Speaker 1: the traditional owners of land and waters that this podcast

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Speaker 1: is recorded on.

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Speaker 2: Hey, I'm Taylor Strano. This is Mamma MIA's twice daily

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Speaker 2: news podcast, The Quickie. With recent teacher strikes and classrooms

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Speaker 2: under pressure, more parents are making a radical choice for

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Speaker 2: their kids homeschooling. Let's look at the upsides and challengers

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Speaker 2: when parents bring the classroom home. Before we get there,

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Speaker 2: here's Clare Murphy with the latest from the QUICKI newsroom

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Speaker 2: for Monday, August eighteen.

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Speaker 1: Thanks Taylor. US envoys Steve Whitkoff has offered some of

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Speaker 1: the first details of what was discussed at the weekend

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Speaker 1: summit in Alaska between US President Donald Trump and Russian

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Speaker 1: President Vladimir Putin. Witkoff said we were able to win

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Speaker 1: the following concession that the United States could offer Article

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Speaker 1: five like protection, which is one of the real reasons

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Speaker 1: why Ukraine wants to be in NATO. Witkoff said it

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Speaker 1: was the first time he'd heard Putin agree to that.

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Speaker 1: He added that Russia said that it would make a

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Speaker 1: legislative commitment not to go after any additional territory in Ukraine.

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Speaker 1: There have been reports that Putin offered a written promise

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Speaker 1: not to attack Ukraine or any other European country again

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Speaker 1: in return for them being given the don Bas region,

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Speaker 1: but academics have worn that Putin has made the same

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Speaker 1: promise in the past and broken it. The New York

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Speaker 1: Times reported that Trump has told European leaders that he

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Speaker 1: now supports the plan to end the Ukraine War by

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Speaker 1: handing the territory to Russia and is now pushing Ukrainian

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Speaker 1: leader Vladimir Zelenski to accept the deal. Witkov said, I

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Speaker 1: think everybody agreed that we had made progress, maybe not

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Speaker 1: enough for a peace deal, but we are on the

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Speaker 1: path for the first time. He added the fundamental issue,

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Speaker 1: which is some sort of land swap, which is obviously

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Speaker 1: ultimately in the control of the Ukrainians, that could not

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Speaker 1: have been discussed at this meeting with Putin. Witkof defended

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Speaker 1: Trump's decision to abandon his push for Russia to agree

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Speaker 1: to an immediate ceasefire. The president had pivoted towards a

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Speaker 1: peace deal to end the three and a half year

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Speaker 1: war because so much progress was made. US Secretary of

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Speaker 1: State Marco Rubio insisted there would be additional consequences, as

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Speaker 1: Trump warned before the meeting with Putin if they failed

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Speaker 1: to reach a ceasefire, but Rubio noted there was not

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Speaker 1: going to be any sort of deal on a truce

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Speaker 1: reached when Ukraine was not at the talks, saying they

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Speaker 1: want to avoid those consequences with an even better one,

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Speaker 1: the end of hostilities. Zelenski and European leaders are scheduled

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Speaker 1: to meet with Trump at the White House today, where

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Speaker 1: Zelenski has to handle a White House that has been

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Speaker 1: hostile to him in the past. Trump earlier this year

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Speaker 1: called him a dictator, and he and Vice President j.

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Speaker 1: D Vance famously ejected Zelenski from a meeting after they

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Speaker 1: repeatedly asked why he'd not thank them for their help.

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Speaker 1: Zelenski needs the US assistance to have any hope of

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Speaker 1: defeating the Russians plan to take over parts of Ukraine,

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Speaker 1: but also has to contend with Trump and Putin making

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Speaker 1: plans without his input. Putin was welcomed onto US soil,

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Speaker 1: the Trump administration rolling out the red carpet for the

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Speaker 1: Russian leader, holding a press conference after the catch up,

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Speaker 1: where Putin gave Trump an option for the location of

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Speaker 1: their next meeting.

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Speaker 3: We're going to start really five six, seven thousand, thousands

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Speaker 3: of people a week from being killed, and President Putin

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Speaker 3: wants to see that as much as I do. So again,

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Speaker 3: mister President, I'd like to thank you very much, and

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Speaker 3: we'll speak to you very soon and probably see you

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Speaker 3: again very soon.

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Speaker 2: Thank you very much, Vladimir.

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Speaker 4: Next time in Moscow.

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Speaker 3: Oh that's an interesting one.

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Speaker 2: I'll get a little hitt on that one.

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Speaker 1: It's Vietnam Veterans Day today, marking fifty years since the

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Speaker 1: end of the Vietnam War, and still more than two

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Speaker 1: thousand ausies who fought in the conflict are waiting for

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Speaker 1: recognition of their service. In order to be recognized with

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Speaker 1: a Vietnam Campaign Medal, those who fought had to have

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Speaker 1: served at least one hundred and eighty one days, but

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Speaker 1: for those who were conscripted into service to fight in

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Speaker 1: a deeply unpopular war who were sent home due to

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Speaker 1: being wounded in battle, some after serving more than one

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Speaker 1: hundred days but not the required one hundred and eighty one.

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Speaker 2: Have been refused the medal.

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Speaker 1: While the stigma surrounding those who fought in the conflict,

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Speaker 1: which raged between nineteen sixty two and nineteen seventy five

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Speaker 1: has slowly worn off. Many Vietnam vets reports still feeling

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Speaker 1: less than compared to others who've been recognized with the medal.

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Speaker 1: The end of the Vietnam War, Australia's longest military engagement

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Speaker 1: of the twentieth century, will be commemorated today the anniversary

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Speaker 1: of the Battle of Long Tan. Services will be conducted

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Speaker 1: across Australia. Some three thousand Australians were wounded during the conflict,

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Speaker 1: and five hundred and twenty four died during or as

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Speaker 1: a result of their service in Vietnam. Terence Stamp, who

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Speaker 1: played the iconic Bernadette in Priscilla, Queen of the Desert,

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Speaker 1: has died aged eighty seven. Stamp made his name as

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Speaker 1: an actor in nineteen sixties London and went on to

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Speaker 1: play the arch villain General Zod in the Hollywood hits

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Speaker 1: Superman and Superman two. Famous for his good looks and

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Speaker 1: impeccable dress sense, Stamp had a string of high profile

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Speaker 1: romances in his time, including with fellow actor Julie Christie

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Speaker 1: and model Gene Shrimpton. After failing to land the role

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Speaker 1: of James Bond, to succeed Sean Connery. He appeared in

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Speaker 1: Italian films and worked with Frederico Fellini in the late

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Speaker 1: nineteen sixties. Stamp's family released a statement saying he passed

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Speaker 1: away Sunday morning, and that he leaves behind an extraordinary

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Speaker 1: body of work, both as an actor and as a

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Speaker 1: writer that will continue to touch and inspire people for

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Speaker 1: years to come.

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Speaker 2: Thanks Claire. Next the unexpected boom of homeschooling. Earlier this month,

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Speaker 2: nearly six hundred thousand kids stayed home from school, not

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Speaker 2: because of COVID or a severe weather event, but because

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Speaker 2: their teachers walked off the job. For the first time

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Speaker 2: since two thousand and nine, Queensland teachers went on strike

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Speaker 2: calling for better pay and conditions. It's the latest sign

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Speaker 2: of a school system under pressure, and it's not just

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Speaker 2: teachers who are feeling it. More and more parents are

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Speaker 2: deciding that the mainstream classroom just isn't working for their kids,

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Speaker 2: so they're turning to homeschooling in big numbers. In New

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Speaker 2: South Wales, registrations have jumped from just over threeenty twenty

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Speaker 2: fourteen to more than twelve thousand today. Queensland has seen

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Speaker 2: a similar surge. More than doubling in the last four years.

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Speaker 2: What used to be mainly for a small group of families,

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Speaker 2: homeschooling is now drawing kids from all walks of life,

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Speaker 2: including gifted students, children with disabilities, and those struggling socially.

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Speaker 2: Parents say it's about flexibility, individual support and letting their

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Speaker 2: child learn at their own pace, but it's not easy.

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Speaker 2: Many also talk about the challenge and self doubt that

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Speaker 2: comes from being both teacher and parent. So why is

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Speaker 2: this shift happening now and what does it mean for

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Speaker 2: Australia's education system. News and Weekend editor Rafael and Chicarelli

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Speaker 2: has been investigating the homeschool boom. RAFFAELA, what are some

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Speaker 2: of the reasons people are choosing to homeschool their kids.

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Speaker 4: It's really a mix, but there are no one size

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Speaker 4: fits or reason for any parent. So it could be

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Speaker 4: that a child is neurodivergent, has diverse learning needs and

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Speaker 4: that could be at either end of the spectrum, so

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Speaker 4: they've got learning difficulties or they're profoundly gifted. Another reason

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Speaker 4: that was commonly cited by one of the teachers that

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Speaker 4: we spoke to was difficult social dynamics may prompt a

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Speaker 4: parent to take the child out of school. Now, this

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Speaker 4: doesn't necessarily mean bullying. It could be friendship fallout, a

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Speaker 4: child that's struggling to make friends and is struggling with

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Speaker 4: that personally. Is a huge mix of reasons why parents

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Speaker 4: are turning towards this as an alternative mentoram education.

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Speaker 2: When you put it out to the community, I know

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Speaker 2: you had a whole bunch of responses, people sharing their

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Speaker 2: own experience. Was there a lot of curiosity though around

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Speaker 2: it too. I feel like with homeschooling, it's one of

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Speaker 2: those things that unless you're in it and you're doing it,

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Speaker 2: you probably actually don't know much about it.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, So within an hour of putting out the call out,

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Speaker 4: I was overwhelmed with common and really from people on

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Speaker 4: all sides of the fence. So we had teachers weighing in,

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Speaker 4: we had parents who had homeschooled their children weighing in,

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Speaker 4: and that really kind of tapped into how important this

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Speaker 4: conversation is. There was no common threads from that other

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Speaker 4: than the fact that this is a movement that is growing.

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Speaker 4: A lot of parents were saying that they decided to

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Speaker 4: trial it because they had children that had learning needs

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Speaker 4: that were quite being catered for. And then we had

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Speaker 4: some teachers give their experience and their opinion on homeschooling

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Speaker 4: as a movement.

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Speaker 2: I want to talk a little bit more on that

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Speaker 2: because you did speak to quite a few individuals who

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Speaker 2: shared their side of the coin. Let's start with the

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Speaker 2: homeschool of parents that you were in contact with. What

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Speaker 2: did they say about their experience with this idea.

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Speaker 4: I interviewed one parent who had no other choice to homeschool.

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Speaker 4: She had tried all avenues in traditional mainstream education. She

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Speaker 4: had no other choice and that's when she and her

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Speaker 4: family had to make the hard choice to move from

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Speaker 4: Queensland to South Australia to aid them with their homeschooling journey.

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Speaker 4: Another parent I spoke to was attracted to the homeschool

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Speaker 4: in concept when her child was a very young age.

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Speaker 4: She started looking into things when her daughter was two

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Speaker 4: because her daughter was struggling with separation anxiety at the time.

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Speaker 4: Through the course of educating her child, she realized the

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Speaker 4: child was profoundly gifted and she had an intelligence in

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Speaker 4: the ninety nine point nine percentile or something like that.

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Speaker 4: So she very quickly had the idea reinforced that her

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Speaker 4: child wouldn't actually be catered for in the mainstream school

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Speaker 4: setting because she wasn't being given the avenues to pursue

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Speaker 4: her interests in hyper focus on the subjects that she

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Speaker 4: was displaying an interest in.

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Speaker 2: So we know that things like homeschooling are not one

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Speaker 2: size fits al, and we've heard from a couple of

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Speaker 2: lived experience on different sides of that spectrum. But what

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Speaker 2: about from teachers. We saw earlier this month that there

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Speaker 2: was a strike, A bunch of teachers walked off the

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Speaker 2: job in order to get recognized for better pay and

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Speaker 2: conditions in schools. What do they have to say when

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Speaker 2: it comes to the home school debate.

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Speaker 4: I spoke to two teachers who did prefer to remain anonymous,

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Speaker 4: and they said that there is an avenue for homeschooling

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Speaker 4: is an option, but it has to be done correctly.

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Speaker 4: So one of the teachers said that it can't be

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Speaker 4: trialed as a stop gap. It needs to be really

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Speaker 4: committed to as a long term solution, and you need

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Speaker 4: to tap into the homeschooling community around you to try

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Speaker 4: and make it a sustainable, long term alternative. The other

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Speaker 4: teacher I spoke to believed that their homeschooling does suit

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Speaker 4: some families, but she urged parents to really look into

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Speaker 4: all other options within the mainstream school setting before making

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Speaker 4: that choice, to try and find out if there is

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Speaker 4: a recourse within that traditional structure. Classrooms offer things like

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Speaker 4: boundaries and regiments and routine and structure that is very

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Speaker 4: valuable to a child's learning.

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Speaker 2: And a lot of other self skills too, I imagine,

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Speaker 2: like how to coexist with other people that you maybe

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Speaker 2: don't necessarily get along with, and some real socializing that

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Speaker 2: you may not get if you are homeschooling. Although I

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Speaker 2: do point to your article which will link in our

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Speaker 2: show notes, there were some really great examples of how

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Speaker 2: people are navigating the concept of socialization when you're homeschooling

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Speaker 2: a child.

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Speaker 4: One of the things that did strike me from the

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Speaker 4: preliminary chats I had with parents in the comments that

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Speaker 4: this initial call out did get was just how vilified

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Speaker 4: homeschooled children can be when it comes to things like socialization.

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Speaker 4: It is a very common misnomer that homeschooled children won't

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Speaker 4: have access to the same social settings that other children

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Speaker 4: do have, when this is not necessarily the case. This

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Speaker 4: community is growing, according to the recent statistics that it

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Speaker 4: unprecedented rate. So there is social structure. Their parents just

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Speaker 4: have to tap into it and lean into it and

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Speaker 4: become part of this community.

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Speaker 2: Raphaela, Is there a conversation to be had about addressing

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Speaker 2: the issues that face both the teachers and the parents

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Speaker 2: who've chosen to homeschool their kids because the system currently

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Speaker 2: isn't working for them, right, Like, teachers are telling us

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Speaker 2: that they're struggling to maintain large class sizes, the varied

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Speaker 2: abilities in the classroom, ndous system that maybe doesn't cater

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Speaker 2: to all of the kids under their care. That's what

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Speaker 2: they've been campaigning for and that's what we've been hearing

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Speaker 2: lots in the news about recently. And then on the

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Speaker 2: other side, we have parents who are echoing that sentiment

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Speaker 2: that the traditional classroom model maybe doesn't work for their

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Speaker 2: child for whatever reason that might be. Has the government

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Speaker 2: said anything to this effect, Has there been any sort

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Speaker 2: of way in from them, what's their stance?

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Speaker 4: So we did bridge out to the Department of Education

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Speaker 4: to try and understand whether they are tracking this increase

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Speaker 4: that we're hearing from at the state level, and they

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Speaker 4: confirm that they do not hold national data on the

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Speaker 4: number of homeschooled students, but that they remain committed to

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Speaker 4: ensuring that every Australian child enjoys the benefits of education,

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Speaker 4: regardless of background, through evidence based and measurable improvements. One

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Speaker 4: of the things we have learned through the course of

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Speaker 4: this investigation is that the education system is currently rolling

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Speaker 4: out this explicit learning model of tea which is really

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Speaker 4: catered to the eighty percent of students learning needs. And

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Speaker 4: this does mean that twenty percent of students, whether they're

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Speaker 4: at the learning difficulties end of things or the profoundly

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Speaker 4: gifted end of things, aren't quite hated for in this

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Speaker 4: mainstream setting, but with larger classroom sizes and the teacher shortage,

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Speaker 4: this is the model that hits that bell curve.

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Speaker 2: So I wonder then if going forward or maybe sometime

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Speaker 2: in the future, they would be appetite from the government

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Speaker 2: to more closely check those statistics, and then maybe that

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Speaker 2: in itself could inform how education is set up in

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Speaker 2: the country.

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Speaker 4: I think if this is a trend that does continue

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Speaker 4: on the rates that it is currently occurring with that

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Speaker 4: it would be beneficial to track from a national level

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Speaker 4: what the number of homeschool students are doing.

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Speaker 2: Thanks for taking some time to feed your mind with

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Speaker 2: us today. Hey, before your head off, I've got a

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Speaker 2: favor to ask. We're cooking out something new here at

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Speaker 2: us make sure that we absolutely nail it it' Let

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Speaker 2: me take about twenty minutes and as a thank you,

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Speaker 2: you'll score a three month Mumma Mea subscription plus a

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Speaker 2: ten dollars gift card. And if you're thinking tailor mate,

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Speaker 2: I'm already a subscriber. Don't worry about it. You can

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Speaker 2: give that on to a friend. It's almost time to

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Speaker 2: start thinking about Christmas presents. Just tab the link in

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Speaker 2: the show notes to take the survey, and a big

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Speaker 2: thanks in advance from us. The quickie is produced by

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Speaker 2: me Taylor Strano and Claire Murphy, with audio production by

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Speaker 2: Lou Hill.