WEBVTT - The Jackie O Story We All Got Wrong 0:00:10.287 --> 0:00:13.047 You're listening to Amma Mia podcast. 0:00:13.727 --> 0:00:16.767 Mama Mer acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters 0:00:16.807 --> 0:00:23.207 that this podcast is recorded on Hello and welcome to 0:00:23.247 --> 0:00:25.847 Mamma Mia out Loud. It's what women are actually talking about. 0:00:25.927 --> 0:00:29.007 On Monday, the twenty eighth of October. I'm Holly Wayne right, 0:00:29.047 --> 0:00:31.687 I'm still basking and having given the best ever recommendation 0:00:31.807 --> 0:00:34.207 ever on Mama My Outloud on Friday, do you very 0:00:34.207 --> 0:00:37.047 popular know how many out louders are now obsessed with Rivals? 0:00:37.447 --> 0:00:38.967 Watch Rivals? Me Friedman? 0:00:38.967 --> 0:00:39.567 Have you started? 0:00:39.647 --> 0:00:42.287 Hello, I'm mea Friedman. I wasn't on the show on Friday. 0:00:42.327 --> 0:00:44.087 I didn't listen to the show on Friday, but on 0:00:44.127 --> 0:00:47.367 the weekend I started watching Rivals and I love it. 0:00:47.527 --> 0:00:50.607 Oh my goodness. Okay, I am Jesse Stevens. I haven't 0:00:50.647 --> 0:00:53.087 started watching Rivals yet because I've got a lot of 0:00:53.087 --> 0:00:54.167 other shows to get through. 0:00:53.967 --> 0:00:55.887 But it's don't stop. 0:00:56.847 --> 0:01:00.087 On today's show, one of the most successful women in 0:01:00.127 --> 0:01:03.567 Australian media has surprised everyone by talking about her drug 0:01:03.607 --> 0:01:06.407 and alcohol addiction and it reminds us of something we 0:01:06.487 --> 0:01:10.287 repeatedly choose to forget. Also probably seen the clip of 0:01:10.327 --> 0:01:13.567 Irish movie star Sirsha Ronan sitting on a chat show couch, 0:01:13.647 --> 0:01:16.607 shutting everyone up with a truth bomb about women and violence. 0:01:16.687 --> 0:01:20.647 But what wasn't said? And screw getting a mentor don't 0:01:20.727 --> 0:01:23.487 dream big and really really don't trust your gut. It's 0:01:23.527 --> 0:01:26.887 the best career advice that's exactly the opposite of everything 0:01:27.087 --> 0:01:27.927 you've been told. 0:01:28.247 --> 0:01:31.767 But first, in case you missed it, Americans are really 0:01:31.847 --> 0:01:36.007 keen to dress up as Raygun for Halloween. Google Trends 0:01:36.007 --> 0:01:39.687 has tracked the most popular Halloween costumes, and as it stands, 0:01:39.887 --> 0:01:44.127 Raygun is coming in at number two, just under Shrunken 0:01:44.167 --> 0:01:46.927 Head Bob from Beetlejuice. Never heard of Shrunken Head Bob. 0:01:47.007 --> 0:01:50.327 I'm picturing what a Raygun costume might be and I'm 0:01:50.367 --> 0:01:51.567 coming up completely blank. 0:01:51.687 --> 0:01:53.207 It's an Australia track. 0:01:53.007 --> 0:01:54.727 Suit, you know, Walmart is selling it. 0:01:54.807 --> 0:01:57.727 Yeah, Maggie, Australia green and gold tracksuit. 0:01:58.047 --> 0:02:00.967 Yeah, so they are selling a Raygun costume and it's 0:02:00.967 --> 0:02:03.847 actually really good. And I kept thinking, I really hope 0:02:03.847 --> 0:02:06.487 that Australia has trademarked some of this because I think 0:02:06.487 --> 0:02:08.607 it could fix our cost of living crisis if we 0:02:08.647 --> 0:02:11.727 get all this money from the US. Because every single American, 0:02:11.767 --> 0:02:13.847 all three hundred million of them, are dressing as Raygun. 0:02:14.047 --> 0:02:16.607 We could do with that in our public person Anyway. 0:02:16.927 --> 0:02:18.807 I get a bit confused this time of year because 0:02:18.927 --> 0:02:22.447 I thought that Halloween was about being scary, and perhaps 0:02:22.527 --> 0:02:25.407 Raygun fits into that genre, but also in the top ten. 0:02:25.527 --> 0:02:27.167 Well, that's not very nice. 0:02:27.927 --> 0:02:30.087 I think that a lot of people were quite confronted 0:02:30.127 --> 0:02:33.127 by her doubts. I'm a big fan of Raygun, but like, 0:02:33.167 --> 0:02:34.887 I think it fits in the Halloween category. 0:02:35.207 --> 0:02:37.447 Do you I was just about to say, do you 0:02:37.487 --> 0:02:41.047 think you'd be flattered or freaked out if you were Raygun? 0:02:41.207 --> 0:02:43.407 I think she'd find this fun. She found the memes 0:02:43.487 --> 0:02:47.927 and stuff fun. She didn't find the cancel uo everyone 0:02:47.967 --> 0:02:48.247 in an. 0:02:48.127 --> 0:02:51.167 Apology as fun, not the death threats less fun. 0:02:51.007 --> 0:02:55.247 Less fun. But among some of the other top training costumes, 0:02:56.167 --> 0:02:59.127 Sabrina Carpenter is a big one, and also Moodang, the. 0:02:59.167 --> 0:02:59.767 Viral hip hop. 0:02:59.847 --> 0:03:02.207 Oh yeah, how do you dress up as Mudang? I 0:03:02.367 --> 0:03:02.687 like that? 0:03:02.847 --> 0:03:03.567 I like that a lot. 0:03:03.727 --> 0:03:04.247 Untsipig. 0:03:04.407 --> 0:03:05.767 Yeah, Maya, what are you gonna dress up? 0:03:05.767 --> 0:03:06.287 As well? 0:03:06.287 --> 0:03:08.287 We've got an all hands meeting at Mamma Maya, and 0:03:08.327 --> 0:03:11.127 apparently we've got dress ups in here. Oh and our 0:03:11.367 --> 0:03:15.447 CEO's coming as a vampire as per your instruction. 0:03:15.127 --> 0:03:16.127 Yes, scary. 0:03:16.367 --> 0:03:17.447 I don't usually. 0:03:17.167 --> 0:03:19.367 Dress up, like when I used to take my kids out, 0:03:19.807 --> 0:03:21.847 did I dress up? I don't think I did, and 0:03:21.887 --> 0:03:24.167 I think I've given away all our old Halloween stuff 0:03:24.327 --> 0:03:25.847 because my kids have grown out of it. 0:03:26.047 --> 0:03:27.767 To your point, Jesse, about whether it's scary or not, 0:03:27.807 --> 0:03:30.247 obviously I don't like Halloween because I don't like dressing up. 0:03:30.247 --> 0:03:33.967 That's on the record. However, Halloween is scary when you're 0:03:34.007 --> 0:03:36.847 a child because as our relationship in Australia with Halloween 0:03:36.847 --> 0:03:39.807 has matured and become more American, if you're not a 0:03:39.847 --> 0:03:42.447 little kid, it's now just dress up as whoever you want, 0:03:42.487 --> 0:03:44.127 which is why it's always interesting what the. 0:03:44.047 --> 0:03:46.327 Cultural and Sabrina kat is exactly. 0:03:46.407 --> 0:03:47.927 And so you know, a few years ago there was 0:03:47.927 --> 0:03:49.767 lots of Donald Trump, but I think this year everybody's 0:03:49.807 --> 0:03:51.847 decided that's too close to the. 0:03:51.807 --> 0:03:54.207 Bad MAYA fun fact. Holley and I were at a 0:03:54.247 --> 0:03:57.527 writer's festival over the weekend and we met a group 0:03:57.567 --> 0:03:59.487 of out louders who said they had a dress up 0:03:59.527 --> 0:04:01.927 party recently and the theme was what do you want 0:04:01.927 --> 0:04:03.567 to be when you grow up and they went as 0:04:03.687 --> 0:04:06.967 us and they had headphones, they had a microphone. One 0:04:07.007 --> 0:04:09.687 woman dresses in sparkles. Around that time you said you 0:04:09.727 --> 0:04:12.487 won't wearing sparkles anymore, which ruined her costume. But I 0:04:12.527 --> 0:04:14.487 assured her that you have changed your mind and your 0:04:14.487 --> 0:04:15.287 back to sparkles. 0:04:15.287 --> 0:04:17.607 That's phenomenal. Is there photographic evidence of this? 0:04:17.727 --> 0:04:19.967 Well, I saw it, but I didn't get sent it. 0:04:20.087 --> 0:04:21.527 So I would like to do a call out for 0:04:21.567 --> 0:04:23.527 that out louder. Can you please put it in the 0:04:23.567 --> 0:04:26.567 Facebook group or send it to us? We desperately need 0:04:26.567 --> 0:04:27.247 to see that image. 0:04:27.247 --> 0:04:29.767 They're wonderful out louders from Adelaide. So if that's you, 0:04:29.967 --> 0:04:32.567 because maybe more out louder than I don't know. 0:04:32.647 --> 0:04:35.727 My fallback for fancy dress and this works for Halloween 0:04:35.807 --> 0:04:38.247 or book week. If it's you, or if it's a child, 0:04:38.767 --> 0:04:41.287 just get a pen and draw a Harry pottersca on. 0:04:41.247 --> 0:04:43.087 A forhad done off you go. 0:04:52.127 --> 0:04:54.687 I'll be checking in to the Betty Ford Center in 0:04:55.047 --> 0:04:59.207 ranch Home, Miarage. I'll be spending twenty eight days there, 0:05:00.047 --> 0:05:04.007 voluntarily enrolled in a twelve step program there to treat 0:05:04.007 --> 0:05:07.247 the substance dependence and drug addiction. I've been able to 0:05:07.327 --> 0:05:11.687 keep secret for three long four years. Are you okay? 0:05:12.487 --> 0:05:13.247 I am okay? 0:05:13.327 --> 0:05:16.567 Yeah, that is one of the most successful people in 0:05:16.607 --> 0:05:20.967 Australian media. Jackie O reading an excerpt from her memoir 0:05:21.167 --> 0:05:23.487 on The Kyle and JACKIEO Show on Friday, which is 0:05:23.967 --> 0:05:26.767 a radio show in Sydney and also in Melbourne, and 0:05:26.847 --> 0:05:29.287 it's one of the biggest radio shows that's ever existed 0:05:29.287 --> 0:05:29.927 in Australia. 0:05:30.007 --> 0:05:30.207 Right. 0:05:31.207 --> 0:05:34.527 It was very interesting that Jackie O decided to share 0:05:34.567 --> 0:05:37.887 that as part of her memoir promotion because for the 0:05:37.927 --> 0:05:41.207 past year or so a lot has been written about her, 0:05:41.607 --> 0:05:44.087 some of it by me. I wrote a piece about 0:05:44.127 --> 0:05:46.807 Jackie's comeback and what it all meant in the context 0:05:46.887 --> 0:05:49.567 of weight loss and body image back in June last year, 0:05:49.647 --> 0:05:52.847 because it seemed like suddenly the second chair on the 0:05:52.887 --> 0:05:54.927 Kyle and JACKIEO Show, one of the most listened to 0:05:54.967 --> 0:05:59.287 people in the country was everywhere. After being almost invisible 0:05:59.287 --> 0:06:02.327 there for a while, post divorced the narrative when she 0:06:02.487 --> 0:06:05.047 was back, and she was back on magazine covers at 0:06:05.047 --> 0:06:07.087 the kind of social events that get you in the paper. 0:06:07.407 --> 0:06:09.847 She was launching a business with her best friend. She 0:06:09.927 --> 0:06:12.647 signed a new deal with Sandaland's worth a reported two 0:06:12.767 --> 0:06:16.087 hundred million dollars. The narrative was that she'd been sad 0:06:16.087 --> 0:06:19.487 about her relationship breakdown and deep in pandemic work and 0:06:19.527 --> 0:06:22.047 motherhood funk, and now she was on a health kick, 0:06:22.167 --> 0:06:25.687 feeling great and was back out there. Pieces like mine 0:06:25.727 --> 0:06:28.407 talked about how women feel that they can re emerge 0:06:28.407 --> 0:06:31.847 from social hibernation when their confidence is back, and yes, 0:06:31.887 --> 0:06:34.167 when their body looks the way everybody wants it to 0:06:34.927 --> 0:06:38.247 turns out. I, like everyone else who was talking about this, 0:06:38.727 --> 0:06:42.407 knew nothing, because, as you just heard this past week, 0:06:42.527 --> 0:06:45.567 Jackie O read from her book called The Whole Truth 0:06:45.967 --> 0:06:48.447 about the fact that actually she had been in a 0:06:48.487 --> 0:06:53.767 pit of addiction to painkillers, to sleeping pills, taboos for years, 0:06:54.047 --> 0:06:56.247 and that the re emergence that we all witnessed in 0:06:56.287 --> 0:06:59.847 twenty twenty three was actually about her becoming sober. She'd 0:06:59.887 --> 0:07:02.127 spent time at the Betty Ford Clinic in America, as 0:07:02.127 --> 0:07:04.847 she said in that clip, entered a twelve step program, 0:07:05.007 --> 0:07:07.807 detoxed from her drug addiction and was learning how to 0:07:07.847 --> 0:07:10.767 live a life without that toxic secret. What we were 0:07:10.847 --> 0:07:15.447 actually seeing was her coming back to life. I read 0:07:15.487 --> 0:07:18.767 everything I could about this on the weekend because Jackie 0:07:18.807 --> 0:07:22.367 fascinates me. She always does. I think she's consistently underrated 0:07:22.367 --> 0:07:24.687 as the reason that that show is a success, but 0:07:24.847 --> 0:07:27.607 also because it's yet another reminder that the stories we 0:07:27.647 --> 0:07:30.527 tell ourselves about what's going on in public people's lives, 0:07:30.967 --> 0:07:34.407 even the story they're telling us, is rarely accurate. And 0:07:34.447 --> 0:07:36.687 when we latch onto it as a story to tell 0:07:36.687 --> 0:07:40.047 ourselves and compare ourselves against, we're never doing that with 0:07:40.087 --> 0:07:42.847 the full picture in sight, so it's never a good idea. 0:07:43.487 --> 0:07:43.727 Mia. 0:07:43.807 --> 0:07:46.887 You interviewed Jackie last year, were you surprised by this? 0:07:47.367 --> 0:07:49.967 To be honest, MY first reaction was that I was bummed, 0:07:50.127 --> 0:07:51.927 but I didn't get the screen. Of course, that she 0:07:51.967 --> 0:07:56.447 didn't tell me, but I completely understand that she wanted 0:07:56.647 --> 0:07:59.367 to do it in her own time and in her 0:07:59.407 --> 0:08:04.967 own words, and I really respect that. I was really 0:08:05.007 --> 0:08:08.647 surprised because I think you, being a little bit generous, 0:08:08.687 --> 0:08:11.647 I would say whole in terms of the main conversation 0:08:12.007 --> 0:08:14.127 that's been around jack for the last year, which has 0:08:14.167 --> 0:08:15.167 been around her weight, but. 0:08:15.287 --> 0:08:17.927 Not only about her weight. It's been about this hole 0:08:18.087 --> 0:08:20.607 she's back thing. Right, That's what I very much have 0:08:20.687 --> 0:08:22.767 been reading, and that's the subtape. 0:08:22.767 --> 0:08:26.927 I think her weight has been an avatar for that, 0:08:27.287 --> 0:08:29.367 you know, in terms of the media's portrayal of her. 0:08:29.967 --> 0:08:34.247 Every single article on the Daily Mail, which you know, 0:08:34.407 --> 0:08:37.687 writes about her incessantly as they can. She's in the 0:08:37.727 --> 0:08:40.527 public eye, but it is all focused on her weight. 0:08:40.567 --> 0:08:44.367 It's all shows off her new pins, shows off her 0:08:44.407 --> 0:08:48.927 new body, shows off her svelt frame. There was this 0:08:49.247 --> 0:08:53.247 cultural obsession that Jackie looked very different to the way 0:08:53.327 --> 0:08:56.367 Jackie's looked for the last ten years. And I think 0:08:56.407 --> 0:08:59.047 that by talking about is it the divorce? What is it? 0:08:59.127 --> 0:08:59.687 That sort of. 0:08:59.647 --> 0:09:03.047 Gave people permission to have the conversation and ask her 0:09:03.087 --> 0:09:05.847 the questions, often directly, and she denied it. Every time 0:09:05.887 --> 0:09:08.367 that she was on a zempic she said, no, no, 0:09:08.407 --> 0:09:11.647 I'm not, I'm not not. You have to believe someone, 0:09:11.887 --> 0:09:14.087 while at the same time you have to respect that 0:09:14.167 --> 0:09:17.527 someone's health information is completely their own to share and 0:09:17.567 --> 0:09:19.247 decide whether they want to make a public or not. 0:09:20.167 --> 0:09:23.327 So I think what this has done is, as you say, 0:09:23.727 --> 0:09:26.087 the story we thought we were seeing, which was one 0:09:26.127 --> 0:09:28.567 about weight loss, and she even has said in the 0:09:28.607 --> 0:09:32.407 book all her team were running bets on what they 0:09:32.447 --> 0:09:35.607 thought it was did she have gastric bypass surgery? Did 0:09:35.607 --> 0:09:38.527 she leave to have cosmetic surgery? Was she on a 0:09:38.647 --> 0:09:41.767 reality show? Why did she have this absence that she 0:09:41.887 --> 0:09:44.087 had told everybody was because she was suffering from long 0:09:44.087 --> 0:09:47.647 COVID and needed time off. Even Kyle in an industry 0:09:47.647 --> 0:09:50.967 that can't keep secrets very well, I guess I was 0:09:51.007 --> 0:09:55.967 incredibly impressed and also just impressed that she's done this 0:09:56.047 --> 0:09:58.207 on her terms. In terms of telling her story. 0:09:58.487 --> 0:10:01.607 Yeah, I'm really glad that she was afforded that privacy 0:10:01.847 --> 0:10:05.887 because that would have been really difficult. They explain how 0:10:06.167 --> 0:10:08.367 the pre recorded message i think went out after she 0:10:08.447 --> 0:10:10.727 left the country so that you know, she wouldn't be followed, 0:10:10.767 --> 0:10:12.927 and she had the hat on and the mask and 0:10:12.967 --> 0:10:15.807 everything so that people wouldn't talk about it before she 0:10:15.847 --> 0:10:16.167 was ready. 0:10:16.167 --> 0:10:16.647 And we know that. 0:10:16.647 --> 0:10:19.807 Happens all the time to celebrities, and that must really 0:10:20.167 --> 0:10:23.087 hinder recovery or just make it more difficult. So I'm 0:10:23.127 --> 0:10:25.807 glad that she was able to just disappear and recover. 0:10:26.367 --> 0:10:28.687 But you're right, Holly, that when someone is on radio 0:10:28.807 --> 0:10:31.127 for four hours every day, five days a week, that's 0:10:31.167 --> 0:10:34.567 twenty hours where they are talking, often about their lives. 0:10:34.647 --> 0:10:37.207 You can feel as though with public figures that you 0:10:37.407 --> 0:10:40.607 know them very, very intimately, and this just reminds us 0:10:40.607 --> 0:10:44.567 that we don't. On the days that she wasn't doing radio, 0:10:44.687 --> 0:10:47.447 she was saying that, you know, she might just sleep. 0:10:48.327 --> 0:10:53.487 There's women who were living with addiction, which tying into 0:10:53.527 --> 0:10:56.447 the post COVID world. I know that COVID has exacerbated 0:10:56.447 --> 0:11:00.727 addiction for a lot of people, alcoholism, substance abuse. But 0:11:00.807 --> 0:11:03.727 also I was thinking about all of those women and 0:11:03.927 --> 0:11:06.487 men who are married and have kids and then they 0:11:06.527 --> 0:11:09.767 split and all of a sudden, and I've heard divorced 0:11:09.767 --> 0:11:13.487 women talk about this, the loud silence of a house 0:11:13.487 --> 0:11:15.367 where the child used to be and how you feel that, 0:11:15.927 --> 0:11:18.407 And she speaks about that as well, which I thought 0:11:18.447 --> 0:11:19.847 was really generous. 0:11:20.047 --> 0:11:23.687 And also, you don't have caring responsibilities for you know, 0:11:23.847 --> 0:11:25.927 maybe half the time or whatever it is when your 0:11:26.007 --> 0:11:27.727 child is with their other. 0:11:27.647 --> 0:11:29.767 Parent, how do you feel that time when you're not 0:11:29.887 --> 0:11:30.887 used to filling that time. 0:11:30.927 --> 0:11:33.207 But it's not just that, it's you can be out 0:11:33.247 --> 0:11:35.447 of it because you don't have to take care of someone. 0:11:35.567 --> 0:11:38.727 So that's why women's addictions are much more likely to 0:11:38.727 --> 0:11:43.847 be addictions like gambling or overeating, because they are addictions. 0:11:44.047 --> 0:11:46.367 You can carry on your caring responsibilities, whether it's for 0:11:46.447 --> 0:11:50.087 children or whoever it's for. But when you are only 0:11:50.087 --> 0:11:53.167 with your children half the time, you can get away 0:11:53.207 --> 0:11:55.287 with it a lot in that time because you have 0:11:55.367 --> 0:11:57.647 no responsibilities. It's like it's all on or off. 0:11:58.007 --> 0:11:58.287 Yeah. 0:11:58.367 --> 0:12:01.647 Yeah, It's also a different narrative about what addiction looks 0:12:01.727 --> 0:12:04.527 like and who suffers from it, right, Because when I 0:12:04.567 --> 0:12:07.007 say about the story that we're always told but we 0:12:07.167 --> 0:12:12.007 happily forget, it's the idea that famous, rich, beautiful, successful, 0:12:12.127 --> 0:12:15.287 thin people, you know whatever, who live in mansions in 0:12:15.367 --> 0:12:19.167 beautiful bits of the city are immune from the kind 0:12:19.207 --> 0:12:22.127 of issues that plague other people. And I'm not suggesting 0:12:22.807 --> 0:12:24.847 that that means there should be a tiny violin for 0:12:24.887 --> 0:12:27.607 all the rich and glorious millionaires. But what I mean 0:12:27.687 --> 0:12:30.847 is it's like, again, we look at people sometimes in 0:12:30.887 --> 0:12:33.407 that public fear, and we compare ourselves to them and 0:12:33.447 --> 0:12:35.807 make ourselves feel bad about it, like why aren't I 0:12:36.087 --> 0:12:38.887 doing so well after my divorce? Or why haven't I 0:12:39.007 --> 0:12:41.767 managed to get on top of my weight issues or 0:12:41.807 --> 0:12:45.607 whatever it is? And the sort of fridge magnet cliche 0:12:45.647 --> 0:12:48.767 of you never know what people are going through. It's 0:12:48.927 --> 0:12:52.407 just really really true because she was looking like one thing, 0:12:53.047 --> 0:12:55.927 and really she was going through this really serious addiction. 0:12:56.247 --> 0:12:58.847 And it challenges the narrative that we have because when 0:12:58.887 --> 0:13:03.607 people talk about addiction in past tense, it often follows 0:13:04.047 --> 0:13:06.967 the pattern of a rock bottom. So the rock bottom 0:13:07.087 --> 0:13:11.687 might be that you were driving your kids around with 0:13:11.807 --> 0:13:15.607 a high blood alcohol level, or you ended up in hospital, 0:13:15.767 --> 0:13:17.407 or you lost your job, or you lost your job, 0:13:17.447 --> 0:13:20.407 something really really significant that you go. And I've heard 0:13:20.447 --> 0:13:22.967 addicks say they're waiting for the rock bottom period because 0:13:22.967 --> 0:13:25.927 they're like, I'm functioning. Why would I get this sorted now? 0:13:25.927 --> 0:13:28.687 I've not had the rock bottom? And in Jackie's story, 0:13:29.407 --> 0:13:33.807 she wasn't found out. She was still somewhat functioning. What 0:13:33.847 --> 0:13:35.967 I love is that her best friend this is I 0:13:35.967 --> 0:13:38.567 think it's also a story of like strong female friendships, 0:13:38.607 --> 0:13:40.687 because it was her best friend, Gemma that said we're 0:13:40.727 --> 0:13:44.087 getting you to rehab. But Jackie, which is the story 0:13:44.127 --> 0:13:47.087 of so many addicts, was like, that feels really over 0:13:47.127 --> 0:13:48.847 the top because. 0:13:48.647 --> 0:13:52.167 She hadn't hit rock bottom. And what we learned from 0:13:52.487 --> 0:13:55.007 the book or that the interview she gave about it, 0:13:55.047 --> 0:13:59.367 is that what prompted her to tell people was not 0:13:59.487 --> 0:14:02.007 in her control. It was that the person who'd been 0:14:02.047 --> 0:14:05.767 supplying her with the prescription medication was no longer able 0:14:05.767 --> 0:14:09.007 to supply her. So she knew, I'm addicted to all 0:14:09.047 --> 0:14:11.767 these substances and they're gonna run out. She had like 0:14:11.887 --> 0:14:14.687 a week or something left. She didn't know how she 0:14:14.727 --> 0:14:17.047 was going to cope, so it was almost forced upon her. 0:14:17.247 --> 0:14:19.567 I thought also it was interesting, you know, you say, 0:14:19.687 --> 0:14:22.047 you think you know these celebrities, but you don't. I mean, 0:14:22.087 --> 0:14:25.087 everybody's got secrets, for sure, but I would say of 0:14:25.247 --> 0:14:29.167 Jackie on the scale of famous people, she is so 0:14:30.047 --> 0:14:32.767 normal and down to earth. And if you just look 0:14:32.767 --> 0:14:34.927 at pictures of her, particularly in the last year, where 0:14:34.927 --> 0:14:38.127 she does look incredibly glamorous, and you don't listen to 0:14:38.127 --> 0:14:40.807 the show and you don't know anything about her story, 0:14:40.967 --> 0:14:44.607 you might dismiss her as an influencer or all for show. 0:14:44.647 --> 0:14:48.807 But she's actually very self deprecating, very down to earth, 0:14:49.487 --> 0:14:53.207 very very hard working, very smart. And that's what I 0:14:53.247 --> 0:14:55.287 was struck most by, you know, in the interview that 0:14:55.327 --> 0:14:57.807 I did with her, and on all the occasions I've 0:14:57.847 --> 0:15:00.327 met her, and I think that what's so good about 0:15:00.367 --> 0:15:03.087 this also is that she was able to we talk 0:15:03.167 --> 0:15:06.327 all the time right from a or speak from a scar, 0:15:06.447 --> 0:15:10.927 not a wound. Recovery is fragile, and when you have 0:15:11.087 --> 0:15:16.527 to be in recovery while also dealing with the world 0:15:16.887 --> 0:15:19.527 talking to you and asking you questions and following you 0:15:19.607 --> 0:15:22.927 and writing about you and speculating about you, I think 0:15:22.967 --> 0:15:25.007 that that adds a whole layer to it that is 0:15:25.087 --> 0:15:27.527 not conducive to sustaining that recovery. 0:15:27.727 --> 0:15:31.167 Or we're still wrestling with what happened during COVID when 0:15:32.127 --> 0:15:35.047 everyone disappeared and when we all went into our homes, 0:15:35.527 --> 0:15:37.967 so alcohol use had been going down, and then something 0:15:38.007 --> 0:15:40.527 happened during COVID that they're still studying, which is that 0:15:41.287 --> 0:15:44.607 at the very least it didn't continue going down like 0:15:44.647 --> 0:15:46.327 people's relationships. 0:15:45.687 --> 0:15:47.847 With Some people drank themselves to death during. 0:15:47.807 --> 0:15:49.647 Yeah, And I think we're still wrestling with that. But 0:15:49.687 --> 0:15:52.127 I think it's also important, just when we're talking about this, 0:15:52.167 --> 0:15:54.167 to acknowledge that there are a lot of people listening 0:15:54.767 --> 0:15:56.727 and a lot of people in Australia who are living 0:15:56.767 --> 0:16:00.047 with addiction issues that don't have the resources to go 0:16:00.207 --> 0:16:04.887 to a really premium rehab facility, to take a month 0:16:04.927 --> 0:16:06.887 off and to take a month exactly. 0:16:06.647 --> 0:16:08.887 Right, that's true. But I've seen her copying a bit 0:16:08.887 --> 0:16:12.047 of credit for that, and that irritates me because of 0:16:12.127 --> 0:16:14.607 course that's true, and there are real issues here. Why 0:16:14.647 --> 0:16:17.647 would you criticize her well saying that, saying oh, it's 0:16:17.687 --> 0:16:19.527 all right for you because you could fly off to 0:16:19.527 --> 0:16:22.047 the Betty Ford Center, right that. I've seen some of that, right. 0:16:22.447 --> 0:16:24.407 And the thing is is it is an important point 0:16:24.447 --> 0:16:26.207 to make, Jesse, because it is really hard for a 0:16:26.247 --> 0:16:28.247 lot of people to access help for addiction and mental 0:16:28.247 --> 0:16:30.887 health issues, and we absolutely know that. But she did 0:16:30.887 --> 0:16:34.167 not have to come clean and inverted commas about this. 0:16:34.647 --> 0:16:37.687 She's got a memoir full of stories that she could 0:16:37.687 --> 0:16:40.607 have told without this, and it's speaking for a lot 0:16:40.607 --> 0:16:42.567 of people who are struggling with this, which I think 0:16:42.647 --> 0:16:45.527 is hashtag brave. And also you know you're going to 0:16:45.607 --> 0:16:48.167 open yourself up to that kind of criticism about privilege, 0:16:48.327 --> 0:16:52.087 So still hashtag brave because ultimately saying me too, I 0:16:52.127 --> 0:16:55.727 struggle with this to a lot of women similar phase 0:16:55.727 --> 0:16:56.967 of life or whatever is. 0:16:56.967 --> 0:17:00.447 A gift after the break the ten words from one 0:17:00.527 --> 0:17:03.447 very famous woman that silenced all the men on a 0:17:03.487 --> 0:17:04.167 talk show. 0:17:03.967 --> 0:17:18.767 Couch all came of it. 0:17:18.927 --> 0:17:22.727 Finally happened. Beyonce came down from whatever planet of sweet 0:17:22.767 --> 0:17:26.007 smelling awesomeness she in habits, walked out on stage and 0:17:26.207 --> 0:17:30.007 endorsed Kamala Harris. While all the Kamala stands among us 0:17:30.007 --> 0:17:33.247 are hoping it's a knockout blow for that guy, we 0:17:33.407 --> 0:17:36.207 kind of doubt it. Beyonce didn't sing, despite what I'm 0:17:36.207 --> 0:17:38.287 sure were eye watering offers for her to have come 0:17:38.287 --> 0:17:41.127 out and belted out freedom. Instead, Here's what she said. 0:17:41.687 --> 0:17:45.087 I'm not here as a celebrity. I'm not here as 0:17:45.087 --> 0:17:51.287 a politician. I'm here as a mother, a mother who 0:17:51.367 --> 0:17:55.287 cares deeply about the world. My children and all of 0:17:55.287 --> 0:17:59.927 our children live a world where we have the freedom 0:17:59.967 --> 0:18:05.927 to control our bodies, a world world we're not divided. 0:18:06.927 --> 0:18:12.407 Our past, our present, our future merge to meet us here. 0:18:12.807 --> 0:18:15.247 It's no accident that that happened in Texas because it 0:18:15.447 --> 0:18:18.207 was the first US state to implement a near total 0:18:18.287 --> 0:18:23.927 abortion man after Roe versus Wade was overturned. That same week, 0:18:24.327 --> 0:18:30.487 Trump was cosplaying working in McDonald's. So it's quite surreal. 0:18:30.767 --> 0:18:33.767 Yeah, although there are so many celebrities for Harris, now 0:18:33.767 --> 0:18:36.007 it feels like every celebrity is for Harris, and I 0:18:36.127 --> 0:18:37.967 just wonder if it really helps. However, I wish I'd 0:18:38.007 --> 0:18:40.047 been at that rally. I would literally faint if I 0:18:40.127 --> 0:18:41.127 was in the presence of Beyonce. 0:18:41.287 --> 0:18:46.127 I'm a massive, massive Beyonce fan and shameless plug. Tomorrow's 0:18:46.167 --> 0:18:48.647 episode of canceled all about Beyonce. We go into the 0:18:48.807 --> 0:18:53.287 Beyonce conspiracy theory? Did he? We had a lot of excellence. Okay, 0:18:54.127 --> 0:18:57.167 you might have seen the headline this week that Sirsha Ronan, 0:18:57.247 --> 0:19:00.647 who you might know from Ladybird or Little Women, managed 0:19:00.647 --> 0:19:03.247 to silence all the men on The Graham Norton Show 0:19:03.367 --> 0:19:07.207 with just ten words. Over the weekend, footage went viral 0:19:07.367 --> 0:19:11.367 of Ronan sitting beside Paul school, Eddie Redmain and Denzel 0:19:11.447 --> 0:19:14.527 Washington and they were talking about the ridiculous ways they 0:19:14.647 --> 0:19:18.167 might protect themselves in a fight. Paul meschyl Is famously 0:19:18.327 --> 0:19:21.447 in the Next Gladiator movie is and out next week, 0:19:21.727 --> 0:19:23.967 and they were talking about how, you know, they were 0:19:24.007 --> 0:19:26.967 doing training on set and someone said, you can use 0:19:27.007 --> 0:19:29.407 sort of anything as a weapon, even a phone can 0:19:29.487 --> 0:19:32.567 be a weapon, and so off that story. This is 0:19:32.567 --> 0:19:33.607 how the conversation went. 0:19:34.127 --> 0:19:35.527 Who's actually going to think about that? 0:19:35.527 --> 0:19:35.687 Though? 0:19:35.727 --> 0:19:41.927 Someone a text me, I'm not going to go phone. 0:19:45.527 --> 0:19:48.527 That's a very good point, like the top girls have 0:19:48.567 --> 0:19:51.647 to think about all the time, Am I right? 0:19:51.727 --> 0:19:52.087 Ladies? 0:19:53.767 --> 0:19:56.967 Quickly, this grab was bundled up by news autlets who 0:19:57.007 --> 0:20:00.047 pointed out the issue with Paul Meschal's joke. She was 0:20:00.087 --> 0:20:03.127 celebrated for and this is a quote gagging men, and 0:20:03.207 --> 0:20:05.847