1
00:00:11,445 --> 00:00:16,205
Speaker 1: You're listening to a Muma Mia podcast. Mamma Mia acknowledges

2
00:00:16,285 --> 00:00:19,125
Speaker 1: the traditional owners of the land and waters that this

3
00:00:19,165 --> 00:00:20,645
Speaker 1: podcast is recorded on.

4
00:00:26,725 --> 00:00:29,485
Speaker 2: Welcome to Parenting Out Loud. This is the podcast for

5
00:00:29,565 --> 00:00:34,084
Speaker 2: parents who don't always listen to parenting podcasts. It's the culture,

6
00:00:34,205 --> 00:00:37,925
Speaker 2: it's the trends, it's a zeitgeist, it's Marbo, it's the vibe.

7
00:00:38,045 --> 00:00:39,084
Speaker 2: I'm Monique Bolli.

8
00:00:39,045 --> 00:00:41,485
Speaker 3: I'm Amelia Lastra and I love that castle shut up.

9
00:00:41,925 --> 00:00:43,485
Speaker 1: And I am Stacy Higgs.

10
00:00:43,725 --> 00:00:46,765
Speaker 2: First up, thank you for all the years. On last

11
00:00:46,765 --> 00:00:50,005
Speaker 2: week's show, so many of you dming us people loving

12
00:00:50,085 --> 00:00:53,485
Speaker 2: it sick and heaps of non parents just here for it.

13
00:00:53,525 --> 00:00:55,885
Speaker 2: So we love that. And Ladies number two on the

14
00:00:55,885 --> 00:00:56,605
Speaker 2: Apple charts.

15
00:00:56,645 --> 00:00:57,925
Speaker 3: Who I love that?

16
00:00:57,925 --> 00:00:58,885
Speaker 1: That seems huge?

17
00:00:59,085 --> 00:01:00,205
Speaker 3: Are we stars now?

18
00:01:00,285 --> 00:01:01,005
Speaker 1: I think we are.

19
00:01:01,605 --> 00:01:05,524
Speaker 2: We've made it fine Diary of a CEO, which feels

20
00:01:05,565 --> 00:01:09,445
Speaker 2: so validating because in twenty twenty five, parenting culture has

21
00:01:09,565 --> 00:01:11,445
Speaker 2: become like an startup, right.

22
00:01:11,444 --> 00:01:15,325
Speaker 3: Yes, and both cultures lack sleep. I feel that's true.

23
00:01:15,485 --> 00:01:17,804
Speaker 1: Yeah, you're giving your all and not getting a lot time.

24
00:01:18,005 --> 00:01:22,484
Speaker 2: Yeah, both cultures relentless. Coming up on today's show, K

25
00:01:22,684 --> 00:01:25,645
Speaker 2: Pop Demon Hunters, you might have heard it rippling through

26
00:01:25,684 --> 00:01:28,804
Speaker 2: the culture. We're going to talk about why it's so huge.

27
00:01:29,045 --> 00:01:32,405
Speaker 4: Men parent or tracking apps are booming, but do children

28
00:01:32,444 --> 00:01:33,525
Speaker 4: have a right to privacy?

29
00:01:33,684 --> 00:01:35,804
Speaker 3: I really want to get into this thauny debate with you.

30
00:01:36,084 --> 00:01:37,925
Speaker 1: And a man has made a case for why we

31
00:01:37,964 --> 00:01:40,925
Speaker 1: should be having kids younger, and he actually might convince

32
00:01:40,964 --> 00:01:43,924
Speaker 1: you it's a good idea. Maybe maybe we'll see.

33
00:01:44,005 --> 00:01:46,844
Speaker 2: But first, did you guys see Anne Hathaway gentle parent

34
00:01:46,925 --> 00:01:49,125
Speaker 2: the paparazzi? I feel like this. I saw this video

35
00:01:49,125 --> 00:01:52,044
Speaker 2: on Instagram a few times. It's been viewed over sixty

36
00:01:52,085 --> 00:01:54,285
Speaker 2: million times. She was on the set of The Devil

37
00:01:54,285 --> 00:01:56,245
Speaker 2: Wears prior to Too, which has had a lot of

38
00:01:56,285 --> 00:01:59,445
Speaker 2: paparazzi interest, Like there's things being leaked from set, there's

39
00:01:59,485 --> 00:02:02,525
Speaker 2: lots of images coming out. But on this particular day,

40
00:02:02,605 --> 00:02:06,764
Speaker 2: the paparazzi pack were bickering and she walked over. She

41
00:02:06,805 --> 00:02:09,925
Speaker 2: had this big smile and just completely diffuse the situation.

42
00:02:10,445 --> 00:02:12,365
Speaker 1: You're going to have to give us like a reenactment,

43
00:02:12,445 --> 00:02:15,725
Speaker 1: mons like what was she doing? Calm zen Master.

44
00:02:16,165 --> 00:02:18,365
Speaker 2: We can't play this on the show because Muma Mia

45
00:02:18,445 --> 00:02:21,365
Speaker 2: does not endorse paparazzi shots or videos, so I'm going

46
00:02:21,405 --> 00:02:24,285
Speaker 2: to explain to you instead. She walks over to the pack.

47
00:02:24,445 --> 00:02:27,325
Speaker 2: She has an open palm. She has a very calm

48
00:02:27,405 --> 00:02:31,205
Speaker 2: and present stance, and she says, you guys have got

49
00:02:31,245 --> 00:02:35,325
Speaker 2: to relax. There are children on set today. Does everybody

50
00:02:35,365 --> 00:02:39,245
Speaker 2: know there are children on set? So everyone's going to relax.

51
00:02:39,565 --> 00:02:42,245
Speaker 2: We're going to have a very nice day because we

52
00:02:42,365 --> 00:02:47,845
Speaker 2: have children. It was very calm, very demure, very Okay,

53
00:02:48,045 --> 00:02:51,485
Speaker 2: everyone's having some feelings right now, but this is the boundary.

54
00:02:51,765 --> 00:02:54,725
Speaker 2: And it was so fantastic. I tried it on my

55
00:02:54,765 --> 00:02:58,045
Speaker 2: own kids as well today like it worked. It worked

56
00:02:58,085 --> 00:03:00,485
Speaker 2: on my four year old. It also worked on the paparazzi.

57
00:03:00,485 --> 00:03:02,965
Speaker 2: They all sort of diffused and said, oh, yes, thank you, ma'am.

58
00:03:03,325 --> 00:03:04,005
Speaker 3: I feel like.

59
00:03:03,925 --> 00:03:06,645
Speaker 4: Anne Hathaway was born to gentle parents. First of all,

60
00:03:06,685 --> 00:03:09,805
Speaker 4: she has an amazing voice. Second of all, I remember

61
00:03:09,845 --> 00:03:12,044
Speaker 4: reading an interview with her when her kids were a

62
00:03:12,045 --> 00:03:15,725
Speaker 4: little younger, and she said that she had stopped drinking

63
00:03:16,005 --> 00:03:19,285
Speaker 4: because she found that she was more present with them

64
00:03:19,565 --> 00:03:22,085
Speaker 4: during the week, in particular when she sort of just

65
00:03:22,205 --> 00:03:25,325
Speaker 4: ruled out drinking. So every time I have a glass

66
00:03:25,325 --> 00:03:27,645
Speaker 4: of wine on a weeknight, I think of Anne Hathaway

67
00:03:27,685 --> 00:03:31,405
Speaker 4: and how she is present and I am not okay

68
00:03:31,445 --> 00:03:33,805
Speaker 4: and another mum doing it right this week, I need

69
00:03:33,845 --> 00:03:36,165
Speaker 4: to talk about Queen Mary. So she's just given us

70
00:03:36,165 --> 00:03:38,485
Speaker 4: all the masterclass in how to react when your kids

71
00:03:38,525 --> 00:03:42,925
Speaker 4: do stupid shit. So our very own Tazzyborn, Queen of Denmark.

72
00:03:43,285 --> 00:03:44,925
Speaker 4: She was at this public engagement and.

73
00:03:44,885 --> 00:03:47,685
Speaker 1: A reporter asked her what she thought of her daughter

74
00:03:47,765 --> 00:03:49,685
Speaker 1: Isabella's outfit when she attended.

75
00:03:50,645 --> 00:03:51,525
Speaker 3: Have you seen this?

76
00:03:51,685 --> 00:03:54,365
Speaker 2: Remember this? The princess wore a T shirt that had

77
00:03:54,405 --> 00:03:55,205
Speaker 2: something rude on it.

78
00:03:55,325 --> 00:03:59,325
Speaker 1: Right, Yes, it was quite rude. So it loosely translates

79
00:03:59,365 --> 00:04:02,565
Speaker 1: to f tim yesterday with an arrow pointing to the

80
00:04:02,645 --> 00:04:04,645
Speaker 1: right kind of light those shirts from the nineties that

81
00:04:04,685 --> 00:04:07,685
Speaker 1: said I'm with stupid and then pointed to the right

82
00:04:07,725 --> 00:04:08,085
Speaker 1: of view.

83
00:04:08,125 --> 00:04:10,605
Speaker 4: I would be so worried wearing that T shirt that

84
00:04:10,845 --> 00:04:12,525
Speaker 4: like on the bus yeah.

85
00:04:12,445 --> 00:04:15,165
Speaker 1: Or that someone inappropriate walks up like your brother or

86
00:04:15,205 --> 00:04:18,684
Speaker 1: your dad walks up next to you. Very risky shirt.

87
00:04:18,725 --> 00:04:21,445
Speaker 1: But for context, it's lyrics from the band that she

88
00:04:21,565 --> 00:04:24,924
Speaker 1: was watching at the festival, and so this reporter asked,

89
00:04:24,925 --> 00:04:29,245
Speaker 1: what did you think of this? And Queen Mary gave

90
00:04:29,445 --> 00:04:33,044
Speaker 1: the most perfect response in Danish, So I have studied

91
00:04:33,045 --> 00:04:36,845
Speaker 1: this clip with forensic levels of investigation. The smile on

92
00:04:36,885 --> 00:04:39,925
Speaker 1: her face doesn't crack, it doesn't break even for a second.

93
00:04:39,925 --> 00:04:43,284
Speaker 1: She just does a slight raise of the eyebrows, very demure,

94
00:04:43,685 --> 00:04:47,525
Speaker 1: and just says. MY first thought was are you completely confused?

95
00:04:47,605 --> 00:04:48,005
Speaker 1: Ha ha ha.

96
00:04:48,645 --> 00:04:49,685
Speaker 3: But let's just put.

97
00:04:49,485 --> 00:04:54,845
Speaker 1: It this way, some decisions are better than others. Isn't

98
00:04:56,365 --> 00:04:59,245
Speaker 1: a great response, Like I feel like this was the

99
00:04:59,285 --> 00:05:02,325
Speaker 1: perfect way of saying I don't agree with it, but

100
00:05:02,365 --> 00:05:04,005
Speaker 1: she can do what she wants and I'm not going

101
00:05:04,005 --> 00:05:05,925
Speaker 1: to put her down in front of you. I loved it.

102
00:05:06,005 --> 00:05:10,325
Speaker 2: What do you think imagine being a royal and how

103
00:05:10,405 --> 00:05:12,765
Speaker 2: having the balls to wear a T shirt that's got

104
00:05:12,765 --> 00:05:15,565
Speaker 2: the F word on it? Like are you okay? Isabella?

105
00:05:15,685 --> 00:05:19,405
Speaker 2: Like do you put any weight behind birth order impact

106
00:05:19,445 --> 00:05:23,005
Speaker 2: on personality? So if you think about Isabella Princess Isabella

107
00:05:23,045 --> 00:05:27,485
Speaker 2: Henriette to Ingrid Muggaree, she's the middle child. Her older

108
00:05:27,525 --> 00:05:30,125
Speaker 2: brother is first in line to the throne, so he's

109
00:05:30,165 --> 00:05:33,845
Speaker 2: going to be king, and her younger siblings are twins, right,

110
00:05:33,925 --> 00:05:37,245
Speaker 2: so it's attention on him, attention on them. Is this

111
00:05:37,605 --> 00:05:43,725
Speaker 2: just like the middle child going attention.

112
00:05:42,565 --> 00:05:45,285
Speaker 1: To me, and she's Prince Harry in the birth order

113
00:05:45,365 --> 00:05:47,685
Speaker 1: when you think about it, like she's the second in

114
00:05:47,725 --> 00:05:50,885
Speaker 1: line to the throne. She's the Prince Harry equivalent of Denmark.

115
00:05:51,205 --> 00:05:53,605
Speaker 1: So I feel like she can be a bit more

116
00:05:53,805 --> 00:05:57,284
Speaker 1: cheeky with her behavior. And she is eighteen, she's an adult.

117
00:05:57,445 --> 00:06:00,285
Speaker 2: She also has form in the area of breaking protocol.

118
00:06:00,365 --> 00:06:03,365
Speaker 2: So you might remember she had an official portrait where

119
00:06:03,405 --> 00:06:06,405
Speaker 2: she was wearing this orange gown and this teal sash,

120
00:06:06,405 --> 00:06:09,005
Speaker 2: she had the tiara, the turquoise earrings and she was

121
00:06:09,045 --> 00:06:09,805
Speaker 2: holding her phone.

122
00:06:10,485 --> 00:06:11,164
Speaker 1: Oh wow.

123
00:06:11,245 --> 00:06:13,405
Speaker 2: She was kind of the first royal to do so,

124
00:06:13,845 --> 00:06:18,205
Speaker 2: and it was apparently Mary Our Mary's idea like this

125
00:06:18,445 --> 00:06:22,125
Speaker 2: intentionally modern touch to like symbolize a modern princess and

126
00:06:22,245 --> 00:06:24,725
Speaker 2: kind of a nod to her generation. But what's interesting

127
00:06:24,805 --> 00:06:27,964
Speaker 2: is the Danes mostly love it. Like this TV presenter

128
00:06:28,045 --> 00:06:31,125
Speaker 2: Jim Linfield I saw this on Facebook. He said, I

129
00:06:31,205 --> 00:06:34,925
Speaker 2: love that our royal youngsters also have personality and courage

130
00:06:34,965 --> 00:06:37,845
Speaker 2: and they don't follow the neat, pleated flow. The time

131
00:06:37,925 --> 00:06:40,525
Speaker 2: of the ladies in the hat is over. Princess Isabella

132
00:06:40,645 --> 00:06:42,565
Speaker 2: is in. People are getting around it.

133
00:06:42,725 --> 00:06:45,845
Speaker 4: They're such a modern, cool royal family. I feel like

134
00:06:45,845 --> 00:06:48,885
Speaker 4: they're rode bikes everywhere. It's so different to the British

135
00:06:48,965 --> 00:06:50,645
Speaker 4: royal family totally.

136
00:06:50,725 --> 00:06:52,925
Speaker 1: And I think you can actually buy this shirt online,

137
00:06:52,965 --> 00:06:54,405
Speaker 1: so we can drop a link in the show notes

138
00:06:54,405 --> 00:06:57,165
Speaker 1: if anyone wants a T shirt that says ftim yesterday,

139
00:06:57,445 --> 00:06:58,284
Speaker 1: it's available.

140
00:06:59,045 --> 00:07:01,445
Speaker 2: Oh to be eighteen to not have the front to

141
00:07:01,485 --> 00:07:08,045
Speaker 2: low fully developed. I love it. It feels like the

142
00:07:08,085 --> 00:07:12,765
Speaker 2: whole world is talking about kay Pop Demon Hunters. It's

143
00:07:12,845 --> 00:07:14,765
Speaker 2: not a great name, is it. Let's just get that

144
00:07:14,805 --> 00:07:16,765
Speaker 2: out of the way. It feels like a placeholder name.

145
00:07:16,805 --> 00:07:19,045
Speaker 2: It feels like they were thinking this is just the

146
00:07:19,085 --> 00:07:22,165
Speaker 2: working title, and they were like, you know what, let's just.

147
00:07:22,045 --> 00:07:22,805
Speaker 3: Call it this.

148
00:07:22,805 --> 00:07:23,725
Speaker 2: This is just what it is.

149
00:07:24,005 --> 00:07:25,645
Speaker 3: I kept seeing it on Netflix.

150
00:07:25,765 --> 00:07:28,005
Speaker 4: I think it came out in June, and I kept

151
00:07:28,005 --> 00:07:30,445
Speaker 4: seeing it pushed on me. I was like, this sounds ridiculous.

152
00:07:30,485 --> 00:07:32,885
Speaker 4: I'm not gonna watch it. But then one day my

153
00:07:33,005 --> 00:07:35,725
Speaker 4: children had been possessed by K Pop Demon Hunters. They

154
00:07:35,765 --> 00:07:37,925
Speaker 4: chose to watch it by themselves, and now it's all

155
00:07:37,965 --> 00:07:38,525
Speaker 4: we listen to.

156
00:07:38,925 --> 00:07:43,525
Speaker 2: Yeah. So this little animated movie has completely captured the

157
00:07:43,525 --> 00:07:46,285
Speaker 2: attention of kids the world over and adults too. It's

158
00:07:46,365 --> 00:07:50,685
Speaker 2: now Netflix's most watched movie ever, Wow, two hundred and

159
00:07:50,685 --> 00:07:54,125
Speaker 2: thirty six million views, and the soundtracks made history too.

160
00:07:54,325 --> 00:07:58,245
Speaker 2: It's the first movie soundtrack to have four simultaneous top

161
00:07:58,285 --> 00:08:01,245
Speaker 2: ten hits on the Billboard Top one hundred and Golden

162
00:08:01,365 --> 00:08:04,805
Speaker 2: has hit number one. So if you're thinking I have

163
00:08:04,965 --> 00:08:07,365
Speaker 2: seen this, I haven't clicked on it. It looks horrid

164
00:08:07,405 --> 00:08:11,165
Speaker 2: on Netflix. It's a terrible placeholder name. But should I

165
00:08:11,205 --> 00:08:13,205
Speaker 2: be worried if my kids are obsessed with this? The

166
00:08:13,325 --> 00:08:17,765
Speaker 2: answer is, don't worry. This is excellent, and I want

167
00:08:17,805 --> 00:08:21,205
Speaker 2: to talk about why. Top line. It follows a fictional

168
00:08:21,365 --> 00:08:24,125
Speaker 2: K pop girl group now k pop stands for Korean pop,

169
00:08:24,525 --> 00:08:27,805
Speaker 2: and they're also Demon Hunters. It's written and directed by

170
00:08:27,845 --> 00:08:32,365
Speaker 2: Maggie Kang. It's about these three girls where demons lurk everywhere,

171
00:08:32,405 --> 00:08:35,684
Speaker 2: but their music protects the world from the demons of

172
00:08:35,765 --> 00:08:39,365
Speaker 2: Korean folklore. So in a sentence, it's basically girl pop

173
00:08:39,405 --> 00:08:45,205
Speaker 2: group save the world. This movie goes so hard and

174
00:08:45,285 --> 00:08:48,005
Speaker 2: it is so good. Like in the first eight minutes

175
00:08:48,125 --> 00:08:51,965
Speaker 2: I thought, what is this? I cannot look away and

176
00:08:52,005 --> 00:08:53,804
Speaker 2: it's not what I thought it would be at all,

177
00:08:53,845 --> 00:08:56,045
Speaker 2: and I'm obsessed with it. Have you guys seen it

178
00:08:56,365 --> 00:08:56,845
Speaker 2: so good.

179
00:08:57,325 --> 00:09:00,005
Speaker 1: I hadn't, and you two convinced me to watch this,

180
00:09:00,165 --> 00:09:02,245
Speaker 1: and now the songs are on repeat in my head

181
00:09:02,285 --> 00:09:04,445
Speaker 1: like I can't get it out. It's the catchiest ear.

182
00:09:04,485 --> 00:09:04,645
Speaker 4: Whem.

183
00:09:04,645 --> 00:09:06,845
Speaker 1: I'm happy it's there. It's not even annoying me that

184
00:09:06,885 --> 00:09:08,804
Speaker 1: these songs are in my head. It's absolutely brilliant.

185
00:09:09,125 --> 00:09:12,965
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's fun, it's funny, it's really tightly written, it's

186
00:09:13,085 --> 00:09:17,125
Speaker 2: beautiful to watch. The music is just all bangers. But

187
00:09:17,245 --> 00:09:19,085
Speaker 2: beyond that, I want to talk about the messages in it,

188
00:09:19,085 --> 00:09:21,765
Speaker 2: because I think it's really solid, and I think Disney

189
00:09:21,805 --> 00:09:27,005
Speaker 2: would be looking at this and thinking, shit, our brain

190
00:09:27,405 --> 00:09:30,645
Speaker 2: is over. They would be sitting around the bardroom head

191
00:09:30,645 --> 00:09:34,925
Speaker 2: in hands I reckon. So firstly, it's very girl power,

192
00:09:35,165 --> 00:09:37,885
Speaker 2: so the girls are at the center of this instead

193
00:09:37,925 --> 00:09:42,605
Speaker 2: of being passive and pretty pop idols, they're warriors and

194
00:09:42,645 --> 00:09:46,165
Speaker 2: it's their voices that are the weapons. So that's doing

195
00:09:46,245 --> 00:09:50,444
Speaker 2: two interesting things. Firstly, it centers art and music as

196
00:09:50,485 --> 00:09:52,685
Speaker 2: the thing that will save us, like music's going to

197
00:09:52,725 --> 00:09:55,365
Speaker 2: save us, which I think is a really good message

198
00:09:55,405 --> 00:09:58,325
Speaker 2: right now for the world. And secondly, it's flipping the

199
00:09:58,405 --> 00:10:01,325
Speaker 2: script on female pop stars, like this thing that's often

200
00:10:01,365 --> 00:10:06,205
Speaker 2: commodified their voices actually is what gives this group power.

201
00:10:06,645 --> 00:10:10,325
Speaker 2: It's really heavily about friendship. So these three girls are

202
00:10:10,565 --> 00:10:14,285
Speaker 2: all each other's anchors. There's no male savior rushing in,

203
00:10:14,725 --> 00:10:20,005
Speaker 2: and it's got all these amazing girlhood coded moments like goofy, messy,

204
00:10:20,365 --> 00:10:23,965
Speaker 2: really silly energy and Maggie Kang, the director, said in

205
00:10:24,085 --> 00:10:27,845
Speaker 2: Glamour that she grew up watching Disney princesses and thought

206
00:10:28,445 --> 00:10:31,444
Speaker 2: that's not me. I'm goofy and I'm awkward and I'm

207
00:10:31,485 --> 00:10:34,485
Speaker 2: gross sometimes, and she wanted to put that version of

208
00:10:34,525 --> 00:10:36,845
Speaker 2: girlhood on screen. Did you guys notice that?

209
00:10:37,205 --> 00:10:40,085
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a big thing that stuck out to me, Like,

210
00:10:40,365 --> 00:10:42,285
Speaker 1: I know, you kind of sold this to me as

211
00:10:42,325 --> 00:10:43,965
Speaker 1: this is a great show to watch with your kids.

212
00:10:44,045 --> 00:10:46,005
Speaker 1: But my overriding thought when I was watching it is

213
00:10:46,285 --> 00:10:49,005
Speaker 1: this isn't for the kids. This is for the women

214
00:10:49,085 --> 00:10:53,085
Speaker 1: who love girl groups and want to relive that fandom

215
00:10:53,125 --> 00:10:55,205
Speaker 1: and girlhood. And it just happens to be done in

216
00:10:55,205 --> 00:10:57,365
Speaker 1: a format that your kids will be But we.

217
00:10:57,565 --> 00:11:00,485
Speaker 4: Did you think it was inappropriate for kids, or more

218
00:11:00,645 --> 00:11:02,645
Speaker 4: just that kids wouldn't get as much out of it.

219
00:11:02,845 --> 00:11:04,845
Speaker 1: I just feel like kids wouldn't get as much out

220
00:11:04,845 --> 00:11:07,285
Speaker 1: of it. I mean, the demons, depending on your kids age,

221
00:11:07,485 --> 00:11:10,005
Speaker 1: probably might freak them out a little bit. But I think, like,

222
00:11:10,445 --> 00:11:13,765
Speaker 1: you know, it's no scarier than in Lion King him

223
00:11:13,805 --> 00:11:16,885
Speaker 1: falling off the rock or the Scary step Mother Entangled. Like,

224
00:11:17,085 --> 00:11:19,805
Speaker 1: there's always dark themes in kids shows, so I could

225
00:11:19,845 --> 00:11:22,405
Speaker 1: definitely overlook that. I definitely though, felt like it was

226
00:11:22,485 --> 00:11:25,165
Speaker 1: more for us. I felt like it was very much

227
00:11:25,205 --> 00:11:27,725
Speaker 1: a movie for us. Here's what I loved about it.

228
00:11:27,925 --> 00:11:31,605
Speaker 4: When I was growing up, I was not even aware

229
00:11:32,125 --> 00:11:37,805
Speaker 4: of South Korea. I consumed almost exclusively American content, with

230
00:11:37,845 --> 00:11:39,684
Speaker 4: a little bit of British and a tiny bit of

231
00:11:39,725 --> 00:11:43,805
Speaker 4: Australian content sprinkled in. I just think it's so brilliant

232
00:11:43,885 --> 00:11:48,565
Speaker 4: that the first big cultural touchstone for Generation Alpha is

233
00:11:48,765 --> 00:11:50,725
Speaker 4: a non Western.

234
00:11:50,685 --> 00:11:52,845
Speaker 1: Creation, which is this movie.

235
00:11:53,205 --> 00:11:56,325
Speaker 4: And there's Korean language in the songs, as I discovered

236
00:11:56,325 --> 00:11:58,765
Speaker 4: because my kids wanted to write out the lyrics to them,

237
00:11:58,805 --> 00:12:01,605
Speaker 4: and then we realized there's a bunch of Korean lyrics

238
00:12:01,605 --> 00:12:05,125
Speaker 4: in them. There are Korean locations, there's nods to Korean myths.

239
00:12:05,165 --> 00:12:07,165
Speaker 4: Of course, the very plot is sort of premised on

240
00:12:07,205 --> 00:12:10,845
Speaker 4: the idea of Korean demons and folklore. It's part of

241
00:12:10,885 --> 00:12:13,965
Speaker 4: this wave of Korean culture which is not as how you,

242
00:12:14,045 --> 00:12:16,684
Speaker 4: which has sort of taken over the world in recent years.

243
00:12:16,725 --> 00:12:20,324
Speaker 4: But I love that this is the first big moment

244
00:12:20,405 --> 00:12:24,005
Speaker 4: for this generation and it's not Western. I found it

245
00:12:24,005 --> 00:12:27,245
Speaker 4: really interesting to learn that even though the characters speak English,

246
00:12:27,365 --> 00:12:32,205
Speaker 4: their mouth movements actually match or reflect Korean pronunciation. So

247
00:12:32,325 --> 00:12:35,525
Speaker 4: little details like that the producer and the filmmakers really

248
00:12:35,525 --> 00:12:38,365
Speaker 4: wanted to get across an authentic picture of Korean culture

249
00:12:38,405 --> 00:12:42,804
Speaker 4: today and the ultimate message of reclaiming your identity and

250
00:12:43,325 --> 00:12:46,885
Speaker 4: being true to yourself. It feels almost subversive right now

251
00:12:46,925 --> 00:12:49,965
Speaker 4: in a political environment both in Australia and the US

252
00:12:50,005 --> 00:12:54,885
Speaker 4: and in other Western countries where that whole idea of immigration, pluralism,

253
00:12:55,245 --> 00:12:58,885
Speaker 4: multiculturalism is under attack from some sectors.

254
00:12:59,485 --> 00:13:02,085
Speaker 1: And Mum and mea is entertainment writer Chelsea Hoy. She

255
00:13:02,605 --> 00:13:04,725
Speaker 1: loved this movie. She was a very early adopter of

256
00:13:04,765 --> 00:13:06,845
Speaker 1: this movie and he's a big fan of the k

257
00:13:07,005 --> 00:13:10,005
Speaker 1: pop craze and said that it does feel very true

258
00:13:10,005 --> 00:13:12,845
Speaker 1: to that genre while bringing in this whole other group

259
00:13:12,845 --> 00:13:15,165
Speaker 1: of people now that get to enjoy that. And she

260
00:13:15,285 --> 00:13:17,165
Speaker 1: wrote for the site we can link the story in

261
00:13:17,405 --> 00:13:19,765
Speaker 1: our show notes. But bringing it back to what you

262
00:13:19,805 --> 00:13:22,804
Speaker 1: said about female friendship Monds, she said that that was

263
00:13:22,845 --> 00:13:25,405
Speaker 1: what felt like the best part of this film was

264
00:13:25,405 --> 00:13:28,444
Speaker 1: that it perfectly captures friendship in all its chaotic glory.

265
00:13:28,685 --> 00:13:32,605
Speaker 1: She said, the silliness, the unhinged chaos, it's so girlhood coded.

266
00:13:33,045 --> 00:13:37,684
Speaker 1: This is exactly how close friends should interact. It's messy, supportive, ridiculous,

267
00:13:37,965 --> 00:13:40,725
Speaker 1: and fiercely loyal all at the same time. Each girl

268
00:13:40,725 --> 00:13:44,005
Speaker 1: has her own struggles, dreams, growth, arc and the film

269
00:13:44,045 --> 00:13:46,725
Speaker 1: takes time to develop them all properly, and that the

270
00:13:46,805 --> 00:13:50,285
Speaker 1: banter feels natural and lived in, so their conflicts feel real,

271
00:13:50,605 --> 00:13:52,645
Speaker 1: but their bond feels very unbreakable. And I think that's

272
00:13:52,645 --> 00:13:54,725
Speaker 1: an excellent message for our girls to be growing up.

273
00:13:54,685 --> 00:13:55,765
Speaker 3: With well and our boys.

274
00:13:55,845 --> 00:13:58,804
Speaker 4: I love the fact that ye for boys and girls,

275
00:13:58,925 --> 00:14:01,285
Speaker 4: this is a vital window when they are young to

276
00:14:01,365 --> 00:14:03,885
Speaker 4: kind of shape their perceptions of the world and what

277
00:14:03,965 --> 00:14:07,645
Speaker 4: relationships are. And I've noticed that when boys watch that

278
00:14:07,805 --> 00:14:13,084
Speaker 4: movie too, it's not centering asexual romance, it's centering friendship.

279
00:14:13,165 --> 00:14:15,725
Speaker 4: And that's just as powerful a message for boys to

280
00:14:15,765 --> 00:14:16,885
Speaker 4: receive as for girls.

281
00:14:16,965 --> 00:14:20,565
Speaker 2: Yeah. Absolutely, it's very emotionally intelligent, Like I was comparing

282
00:14:20,565 --> 00:14:23,125
Speaker 2: it to what we grew up with when we were kids,

283
00:14:23,165 --> 00:14:27,085
Speaker 2: and it's sort of we had the Goonies, the Sandlot Kids,

284
00:14:28,045 --> 00:14:31,045
Speaker 2: Lion King, I guess was really big beating the Beast,

285
00:14:31,085 --> 00:14:33,205
Speaker 2: which is super problematic.

286
00:14:32,845 --> 00:14:35,845
Speaker 4: A lad and super problematic, a lot of like mediation

287
00:14:36,005 --> 00:14:36,605
Speaker 4: of other.

288
00:14:36,405 --> 00:14:42,005
Speaker 2: Cultures and all centered on men. Here's the small problem

289
00:14:42,485 --> 00:14:45,285
Speaker 2: with it is that the men actually don't come off

290
00:14:45,445 --> 00:14:48,205
Speaker 2: very well in this movie. So Mark Lee wrote in

291
00:14:48,405 --> 00:14:53,125
Speaker 2: Northwest Asian Weekly that once again Asian men get thrown

292
00:14:53,245 --> 00:14:56,685
Speaker 2: under the bus, and he was arguing that at first glance,

293
00:14:57,085 --> 00:15:00,045
Speaker 2: this looks like a win for Asian representation, Like the

294
00:15:00,085 --> 00:15:03,565
Speaker 2: women are very stylish and confident and heroic, but the

295
00:15:03,645 --> 00:15:07,525
Speaker 2: men in this film are either villains or they're passive

296
00:15:07,965 --> 00:15:11,165
Speaker 2: like the Sarja boys. They don't speak. None of them

297
00:15:11,205 --> 00:15:14,445
Speaker 2: have really a speaking role, so they're completely silenced, or

298
00:15:14,485 --> 00:15:18,205
Speaker 2: they're just playing useless like their manager that the girls have.

299
00:15:18,325 --> 00:15:21,605
Speaker 2: The other main male character is basically like a buffoon.

300
00:15:22,245 --> 00:15:25,925
Speaker 2: So it does leave the guys with almost nothing. But

301
00:15:26,165 --> 00:15:29,165
Speaker 2: I was thinking about childhood movies we had it. I

302
00:15:29,205 --> 00:15:31,805
Speaker 2: was arguing with my sister about this. She was saying,

303
00:15:31,845 --> 00:15:33,605
Speaker 2: don't worry about the man, like they've had their time

304
00:15:33,605 --> 00:15:35,765
Speaker 2: in the sun. If you think about the childhood movies

305
00:15:35,765 --> 00:15:39,405
Speaker 2: we had, it was Goonies, All boys, Sandlot Kids, All boys,

306
00:15:39,525 --> 00:15:41,885
Speaker 2: Lion King, a big boy dies and a little boy

307
00:15:41,925 --> 00:15:44,965
Speaker 2: takes over, you know, and a weird evil boy uncle,

308
00:15:45,325 --> 00:15:47,885
Speaker 2: Beauty and the Beast. Like the smart girl marries her

309
00:15:48,005 --> 00:15:51,645
Speaker 2: captor to save her dad. So it's nice to see

310
00:15:52,045 --> 00:15:56,645
Speaker 2: this tide turning in kids pop culture towards more female centric,

311
00:15:57,005 --> 00:15:57,845
Speaker 2: smart movies.

312
00:15:58,085 --> 00:16:01,285
Speaker 4: I can see that critique though, because in cell culture

313
00:16:01,925 --> 00:16:05,445
Speaker 4: is really a big thing in Korea too, and this

314
00:16:05,565 --> 00:16:10,085
Speaker 4: idea of young men feeling left behind as young women

315
00:16:10,205 --> 00:16:13,605
Speaker 4: are empowered and are hitting educational goals and career goals

316
00:16:14,045 --> 00:16:16,005
Speaker 4: in a way that they're kind of lapping men is

317
00:16:16,165 --> 00:16:18,405
Speaker 4: just as big an issue there as it is in

318
00:16:18,485 --> 00:16:21,285
Speaker 4: Western cultures. So I think that's an important perspective to

319
00:16:21,325 --> 00:16:23,765
Speaker 4: bring in. I guess the other thing that I think

320
00:16:23,925 --> 00:16:26,805
Speaker 4: kids are really connecting with here, which we haven't yet

321
00:16:26,845 --> 00:16:29,805
Speaker 4: touched on, is the way that it blurs the lines

322
00:16:29,845 --> 00:16:33,245
Speaker 4: between the digital and virtual world and real world in

323
00:16:33,245 --> 00:16:36,885
Speaker 4: a way that feels so on point and so relevant

324
00:16:37,205 --> 00:16:40,485
Speaker 4: for Generation Alpha. They are more than digital natives. Their

325
00:16:40,525 --> 00:16:44,045
Speaker 4: world is shaped by the Internet and by online culture,

326
00:16:44,565 --> 00:16:47,845
Speaker 4: and this movie just blurs those boundaries in such a

327
00:16:47,925 --> 00:16:50,725
Speaker 4: sort of neat and clever way. Think about the way

328
00:16:50,805 --> 00:16:53,605
Speaker 4: on the end credits, this isn't a spoiler. You see

329
00:16:53,645 --> 00:16:55,765
Speaker 4: the women who are actually doing the singing in the

330
00:16:55,765 --> 00:16:59,765
Speaker 4: studio recording the songs, so you get reminded that this

331
00:16:59,925 --> 00:17:02,045
Speaker 4: is the real world. There is also the virtual world

332
00:17:02,045 --> 00:17:03,765
Speaker 4: that you've been watching in the movie, and the two

333
00:17:03,805 --> 00:17:05,764
Speaker 4: of them, it's really hard to tell where one ends

334
00:17:05,764 --> 00:17:08,564
Speaker 4: and the other begins. One interesting cultural reason for that

335
00:17:08,725 --> 00:17:11,525
Speaker 4: is that South Korea got internet in a widespread way

336
00:17:11,565 --> 00:17:13,084
Speaker 4: a lot earlier than the rest of the world. They

337
00:17:13,085 --> 00:17:15,605
Speaker 4: found out that broadband was delivered their back in twenty

338
00:17:15,605 --> 00:17:18,565
Speaker 4: ten to basically all houses, and so I think that's

339
00:17:18,685 --> 00:17:21,085
Speaker 4: part of the reason why they're able to sort of

340
00:17:21,125 --> 00:17:25,125
Speaker 4: tap into a digital native culture in such a convincing way.

341
00:17:25,205 --> 00:17:26,805
Speaker 3: For young kids, yeah.

342
00:17:26,525 --> 00:17:29,085
Speaker 2: It's quite TikTok coded as well, so in the way

343
00:17:29,125 --> 00:17:31,445
Speaker 2: that Stacy said before that this is a movie for

344
00:17:31,925 --> 00:17:34,565
Speaker 2: really for adults, it does that beautiful thing where it

345
00:17:34,605 --> 00:17:38,365
Speaker 2: toes the line between youth culture and adult themes. So

346
00:17:38,445 --> 00:17:41,085
Speaker 2: in the first few minutes we meet the girls, they're

347
00:17:41,085 --> 00:17:44,405
Speaker 2: on their private jet and they're having this big feast

348
00:17:44,484 --> 00:17:47,725
Speaker 2: of food, and that feels TikTok coded to me, because

349
00:17:47,725 --> 00:17:50,405
Speaker 2: there is this subculture on TikTok of I think it's

350
00:17:50,405 --> 00:17:54,484
Speaker 2: called muckbang, where people buy Korean food and then film

351
00:17:54,484 --> 00:17:56,885
Speaker 2: themselves eating it, And so I think there's all these

352
00:17:56,965 --> 00:18:01,165
Speaker 2: like digital moments throughout the show that kids would connect

353
00:18:01,205 --> 00:18:03,125
Speaker 2: with in a way that people who don't live their

354
00:18:03,125 --> 00:18:05,804
Speaker 2: life on TikTok probably wouldn't. But the other thing that

355
00:18:05,925 --> 00:18:10,165
Speaker 2: really stood out to me was how inclusive this show was.

356
00:18:10,365 --> 00:18:14,245
Speaker 2: So the fans of this girl group, they're not just silly,

357
00:18:14,405 --> 00:18:19,085
Speaker 2: screaming teenage girls. It's everyone. You see all ages, all

358
00:18:19,125 --> 00:18:23,244
Speaker 2: body types, all genders. You see blokey men crying, you

359
00:18:23,285 --> 00:18:26,845
Speaker 2: see elderly women with their little fan clubs. Zoe, one

360
00:18:26,885 --> 00:18:29,804
Speaker 2: of the characters, talks about the colors in her head

361
00:18:29,885 --> 00:18:32,685
Speaker 2: and taking off her mask, which some people have said

362
00:18:32,765 --> 00:18:35,885
Speaker 2: is coded as she's neurodivergent, and a lot of fans

363
00:18:35,925 --> 00:18:38,925
Speaker 2: have read roomy. The main character is queer. Even the

364
00:18:39,045 --> 00:18:42,725
Speaker 2: rival boy band has pink hair and sort of effeminate

365
00:18:42,805 --> 00:18:45,484
Speaker 2: looking soft men. So the whole world of it is

366
00:18:45,605 --> 00:18:47,525
Speaker 2: very fluid and very inclusive.

367
00:18:47,845 --> 00:18:50,445
Speaker 4: That's a great point, and it makes me reflect on

368
00:18:50,484 --> 00:18:51,804
Speaker 4: the fact that, you know, there are all sorts of

369
00:18:51,845 --> 00:18:55,685
Speaker 4: downsides to not having a monoculture anymore, like the fact

370
00:18:55,725 --> 00:18:58,605
Speaker 4: that everyone's listening to their own music, everyone's watching their

371
00:18:58,645 --> 00:19:02,965
Speaker 4: own TikTok algorithm. But every now and then something hits

372
00:19:03,005 --> 00:19:05,805
Speaker 4: that the whole world enjoys, and that brings us back

373
00:19:05,845 --> 00:19:09,205
Speaker 4: to the monoculture that we used to have. And I've

374
00:19:09,245 --> 00:19:12,325
Speaker 4: found that I'm reconnect with friends who I've sort of

375
00:19:12,325 --> 00:19:15,085
Speaker 4: fallen out of touch with because our kids are sharing

376
00:19:15,205 --> 00:19:18,685
Speaker 4: videos of themselves dancing to Golden and it's just so

377
00:19:18,805 --> 00:19:21,085
Speaker 4: nice for the whole world at this kind of moment

378
00:19:21,205 --> 00:19:23,244
Speaker 4: to be able to enjoy the same thing at the

379
00:19:23,285 --> 00:19:24,365
Speaker 4: same time. Yeah.

380
00:19:24,405 --> 00:19:28,645
Speaker 1: Yeah, My only criticism when Monzie mentioned about the inclusiveness,

381
00:19:28,685 --> 00:19:31,244
Speaker 1: I think that was great from the fan perspective. But

382
00:19:31,565 --> 00:19:34,085
Speaker 1: my only thing that bugged me was that the three

383
00:19:34,365 --> 00:19:39,405
Speaker 1: main girl band members are all incredibly thin and attractive,

384
00:19:39,405 --> 00:19:42,365
Speaker 1: and when they're showing other body types in the movie,

385
00:19:42,405 --> 00:19:44,284
Speaker 1: but they're not showing them on them, that was the

386
00:19:44,325 --> 00:19:46,645
Speaker 1: only thing where I went, Oh, when they're talking about

387
00:19:46,685 --> 00:19:49,885
Speaker 1: consuming ten thousand calories before they go on stage. I

388
00:19:49,925 --> 00:19:52,284
Speaker 1: wish that that hadn't been part of it because you

389
00:19:52,365 --> 00:19:53,965
Speaker 1: kind of don't want that to be the focus.

390
00:19:54,245 --> 00:19:56,205
Speaker 2: Yeah, like I can't argue with that. I think that's

391
00:19:56,245 --> 00:19:58,645
Speaker 2: a really valid point though. I was listening to a

392
00:19:58,645 --> 00:20:02,804
Speaker 2: podcast with Jayha Kim. She studies K pop, and she

393
00:20:03,045 --> 00:20:07,925
Speaker 2: was talking about how K pop is this extremely manufactured

394
00:20:08,085 --> 00:20:11,205
Speaker 2: and controlled machine, and how women n in K pop

395
00:20:11,765 --> 00:20:14,685
Speaker 2: have to diet like they're really controlled. They have to

396
00:20:14,765 --> 00:20:17,004
Speaker 2: look a certain way. So I guess in some sense

397
00:20:17,045 --> 00:20:20,484
Speaker 2: it's true to the K pop culture. But yeah, I

398
00:20:20,565 --> 00:20:23,885
Speaker 2: do agree skinny, hot girls save.

399
00:20:23,765 --> 00:20:26,405
Speaker 1: In the world. And it's even at the point, as

400
00:20:26,445 --> 00:20:29,805
Speaker 1: you say about the dancers from the show, Novak Djokovic

401
00:20:29,845 --> 00:20:32,645
Speaker 1: even when you want to match. Last week did a

402
00:20:32,685 --> 00:20:35,085
Speaker 1: little dance from one of the songs.

403
00:20:34,725 --> 00:20:37,044
Speaker 3: And I said, most lovable thing he's ever done in it.

404
00:20:37,125 --> 00:20:38,165
Speaker 1: I know, that's what I thought.

405
00:20:38,165 --> 00:20:39,725
Speaker 3: I was like, do I like him now?

406
00:20:40,085 --> 00:20:42,685
Speaker 1: He did one of the dancers in tribute to his daughter.

407
00:20:42,765 --> 00:20:44,605
Speaker 1: He said, she's been teaching me how to do these

408
00:20:44,725 --> 00:20:47,805
Speaker 1: dances from K pop demon Hunters. So it's at that level,

409
00:20:47,845 --> 00:20:50,125
Speaker 1: like it's just permeated the culture in such a massive way,

410
00:20:50,165 --> 00:20:51,965
Speaker 1: which is great to see everyone can enjoy it.

411
00:20:52,205 --> 00:20:55,084
Speaker 2: The demons are funny. They're not scary. If you're thinking, arna, oh,

412
00:20:55,125 --> 00:20:58,004
Speaker 2: my kid's watching demons, they're quite funny. They poke fun

413
00:20:58,045 --> 00:21:00,125
Speaker 2: at themselves like. It's a ten out of ten for me.

414
00:21:00,325 --> 00:21:00,845
Speaker 2: I loved it.

415
00:21:02,285 --> 00:21:05,764
Speaker 4: There are a lot of questions that parents these days

416
00:21:06,005 --> 00:21:09,925
Speaker 4: are having to ask themselves and answer that previous generations

417
00:21:09,925 --> 00:21:13,365
Speaker 4: of parents did not have to deal with. One of

418
00:21:13,405 --> 00:21:18,005
Speaker 4: those questions, a really, really tricky one to answer, is

419
00:21:18,325 --> 00:21:21,125
Speaker 4: whether or not to use a tracking app on your kids. Now,

420
00:21:21,365 --> 00:21:24,405
Speaker 4: Mon's and Stacy, you're probably not yet at the stage

421
00:21:24,484 --> 00:21:27,645
Speaker 4: where you're thinking about that. I am sort of approaching

422
00:21:27,685 --> 00:21:30,125
Speaker 4: that stage, and to be honest, I just don't know

423
00:21:30,205 --> 00:21:31,165
Speaker 4: what I'm going to do.

424
00:21:32,005 --> 00:21:33,565
Speaker 3: But lots and lots of.

425
00:21:33,525 --> 00:21:36,965
Speaker 4: Parents have asked this question and decided yes, they do

426
00:21:37,045 --> 00:21:39,564
Speaker 4: want to know where their children are, and there are

427
00:21:39,605 --> 00:21:43,244
Speaker 4: lots of reasons why they do that. For instance, experts

428
00:21:43,285 --> 00:21:46,685
Speaker 4: say that for parents of children with autism, a tracking

429
00:21:46,685 --> 00:21:50,484
Speaker 4: app can be really helpful, particularly when wandering off is common.

430
00:21:51,085 --> 00:21:53,085
Speaker 4: There are lots of reasons why they do it, but

431
00:21:53,685 --> 00:21:57,125
Speaker 4: we don't yet really understand what the effects of using

432
00:21:57,165 --> 00:22:01,005
Speaker 4: these tracking apps will be on the children who are constantly.

433
00:22:00,565 --> 00:22:01,445
Speaker 3: Surveyed by them.

434
00:22:02,005 --> 00:22:05,445
Speaker 4: So we have some clues that are emerging. I should

435
00:22:05,484 --> 00:22:08,885
Speaker 4: say they've become really ubiquitous. One of the most popular apps,

436
00:22:08,925 --> 00:22:11,165
Speaker 4: Life three sixty, is now on four fourteen percent of

437
00:22:11,165 --> 00:22:12,284
Speaker 4: all phones in the US.

438
00:22:12,765 --> 00:22:15,565
Speaker 2: What really, Yeah, it's crazy right.

439
00:22:15,645 --> 00:22:18,925
Speaker 4: And in Australia one in five parents attracting their children,

440
00:22:18,965 --> 00:22:21,565
Speaker 4: whether it's through an air tag or Lie three sixty

441
00:22:21,725 --> 00:22:25,325
Speaker 4: or another app. We've got some stats coming out about

442
00:22:25,325 --> 00:22:28,484
Speaker 4: what it's doing to kids to feel constantly surveyed. A

443
00:22:28,565 --> 00:22:32,925
Speaker 4: recent survey that Australia's e Safety Commissioner did looked at

444
00:22:33,085 --> 00:22:37,285
Speaker 4: the effects on young people's attitudes to relationships and specifically

445
00:22:37,365 --> 00:22:40,445
Speaker 4: intimate relationships, and they discovered that a full twenty percent

446
00:22:40,484 --> 00:22:44,205
Speaker 4: of eighteen to twenty four year olds think that it's

447
00:22:44,325 --> 00:22:47,885
Speaker 4: reasonable to track the location of their intimate partners. That's

448
00:22:47,965 --> 00:22:50,205
Speaker 4: higher than any other age group. And remember this is

449
00:22:50,245 --> 00:22:53,645
Speaker 4: the age group that came of age being trapped by

450
00:22:53,645 --> 00:22:56,925
Speaker 4: their parents. It's alarming. I think I'm going to put

451
00:22:56,925 --> 00:22:58,965
Speaker 4: my cards on the table here. I haven't decided yet

452
00:22:59,005 --> 00:23:02,005
Speaker 4: what to do about the tracking apps. There are unforeseen

453
00:23:02,085 --> 00:23:06,284
Speaker 4: consequences of children going up knowing that their parents know

454
00:23:06,445 --> 00:23:09,764
Speaker 4: exactly where they are at all times, and it's a

455
00:23:09,805 --> 00:23:13,285
Speaker 4: real grey area, and it raises lots of uncomfortable questions.

456
00:23:13,805 --> 00:23:17,165
Speaker 4: Do children are they entitled to privacy? Do we need

457
00:23:17,205 --> 00:23:19,605
Speaker 4: to get their consent to use these apps? What does

458
00:23:19,645 --> 00:23:22,285
Speaker 4: it mean to link surveillance and love in this way?

459
00:23:22,565 --> 00:23:25,085
Speaker 4: Is this just the price of safety these days? You know,

460
00:23:25,205 --> 00:23:27,725
Speaker 4: as I was thinking about this, I came across a

461
00:23:27,765 --> 00:23:31,284
Speaker 4: great quote from Tina Fey about photoshop. She said, and

462
00:23:31,285 --> 00:23:32,805
Speaker 4: I want to get it right because she's so clever.

463
00:23:32,965 --> 00:23:36,165
Speaker 4: It is an appalling and tragic reflection on the moral

464
00:23:36,245 --> 00:23:39,245
Speaker 4: decay of our society, unless I need it, in which case,

465
00:23:39,245 --> 00:23:40,085
Speaker 4: everybody be cool.

466
00:23:40,725 --> 00:23:41,804
Speaker 3: I suspect that's.

467
00:23:41,685 --> 00:23:43,885
Speaker 4: Where I'm going to land on the whole tracking apps thing,

468
00:23:43,965 --> 00:23:47,564
Speaker 4: But I also wanted to intellectualize it and overthink it first.

469
00:23:47,765 --> 00:23:49,885
Speaker 3: So Stacy, what do you think? Do you think you'll

470
00:23:49,965 --> 00:23:50,925
Speaker 3: use a tracking app?

471
00:23:51,125 --> 00:23:53,805
Speaker 1: Yeah? Of course, I bloody will, Like I didn't even

472
00:23:53,805 --> 00:23:56,564
Speaker 1: think this was a question. Everybody's doing that now. I

473
00:23:56,685 --> 00:23:59,885
Speaker 1: have friends who track their kids, track their husbands, track

474
00:23:59,965 --> 00:24:03,524
Speaker 1: their son's girlfriend. Like. It's all very normal now. And

475
00:24:03,565 --> 00:24:06,085
Speaker 1: our kids are growing up in that generation where they're

476
00:24:06,125 --> 00:24:08,965
Speaker 1: tracking their friends even on Snapchat. They're used to sharing

477
00:24:09,005 --> 00:24:10,845
Speaker 1: that they're not used to the level of obviously that

478
00:24:10,885 --> 00:24:12,685
Speaker 1: we had. So I very much feel that this is

479
00:24:12,725 --> 00:24:15,045
Speaker 1: going to be the norm going forward. I must admit

480
00:24:15,085 --> 00:24:17,325
Speaker 1: it's something that I think, well, yeah, that probably would

481
00:24:17,325 --> 00:24:21,125
Speaker 1: make me feel better knowing where she is. But I

482
00:24:21,205 --> 00:24:24,004
Speaker 1: kind of wanted to interrogate, like, what's our fear, Like

483
00:24:24,085 --> 00:24:27,445
Speaker 1: what's our fear around not knowing their every move? And

484
00:24:27,525 --> 00:24:29,085
Speaker 1: I guess the one that's at the top of the

485
00:24:29,085 --> 00:24:31,725
Speaker 1: list I think you'd probably both agree is that they'll

486
00:24:31,725 --> 00:24:34,405
Speaker 1: get taken, Like that's the thing you're worried about, is

487
00:24:34,405 --> 00:24:37,004
Speaker 1: that they'll get taken or they're a missing person and

488
00:24:37,045 --> 00:24:38,925
Speaker 1: you don't know where they are. And so I looked

489
00:24:38,925 --> 00:24:42,484
Speaker 1: into that and the stats of that, and it's so

490
00:24:42,925 --> 00:24:46,885
Speaker 1: minuscule compared to our population. Like Dennis Moriarty wrote this

491
00:24:46,965 --> 00:24:50,284
Speaker 1: piece where he quoted the National Missing Person's Coordination Center,

492
00:24:50,605 --> 00:24:53,125
Speaker 1: and they track the number of missing child cases throughout

493
00:24:53,165 --> 00:24:55,845
Speaker 1: the decades. So when we're looking back at the seventies,

494
00:24:55,845 --> 00:24:59,085
Speaker 1: it was eighteen, in the eighties, it was eleven children

495
00:24:59,525 --> 00:25:02,484
Speaker 1: nineties fifteen, and then it drops way down four in

496
00:25:02,484 --> 00:25:04,805
Speaker 1: the two thousands and five in the twenty ten.

497
00:25:05,005 --> 00:25:07,405
Speaker 4: Do they know why there's been such a drop. I

498
00:25:07,405 --> 00:25:09,565
Speaker 4: mean those are small numbers to begin with, small.

499
00:25:09,445 --> 00:25:11,764
Speaker 1: Numbers when you consider like the growth of people that

500
00:25:11,805 --> 00:25:14,285
Speaker 1: we've had in the country as well. Not to say

501
00:25:14,285 --> 00:25:17,044
Speaker 1: that we ever want that to be happening to any child,

502
00:25:17,325 --> 00:25:20,445
Speaker 1: But the world is by and large a safer place

503
00:25:20,645 --> 00:25:22,925
Speaker 1: now than it was then. But I wonder whether it's

504
00:25:22,965 --> 00:25:25,485
Speaker 1: a chicken and egg. It's a bit safer now because

505
00:25:25,525 --> 00:25:27,765
Speaker 1: we have the technology to be able to know where

506
00:25:27,805 --> 00:25:30,485
Speaker 1: everyone is. What do you think mons.

507
00:25:31,565 --> 00:25:38,085
Speaker 2: Safety doesn't sell product, Stacy, Yeah, you said the magic

508
00:25:38,165 --> 00:25:43,525
Speaker 2: word just before fear. And these companies they don't care

509
00:25:43,885 --> 00:25:48,685
Speaker 2: about your kids. They care about their shareholders. Life three

510
00:25:48,845 --> 00:25:52,925
Speaker 2: sixty is a tech company and they have built a

511
00:25:52,965 --> 00:25:59,685
Speaker 2: product on anxious millennial parents, on catastrophizing situations and marketing

512
00:25:59,725 --> 00:26:03,565
Speaker 2: with fear. Have you seen the ad for this product?

513
00:26:03,645 --> 00:26:09,085
Speaker 2: Cop this? You are my whole wide world, my joy,

514
00:26:09,245 --> 00:26:14,645
Speaker 2: my baby girl. You'll never know how much I love you.

515
00:26:15,045 --> 00:26:18,844
Speaker 1: When you're gone. I just thinks of you dying.

516
00:26:20,285 --> 00:26:20,525
Speaker 3: Mom.

517
00:26:20,725 --> 00:26:23,205
Speaker 2: What every time you leave my safe when you drive

518
00:26:23,245 --> 00:26:25,524
Speaker 2: a schoolish stay out at night? This is where I

519
00:26:25,765 --> 00:26:28,845
Speaker 2: got to the million ways ins I my brain and

520
00:26:28,885 --> 00:26:31,205
Speaker 2: what you could die at any given time.

521
00:26:32,725 --> 00:26:33,645
Speaker 3: That's to range.

522
00:26:33,845 --> 00:26:35,325
Speaker 1: That does make me very anxious.

523
00:26:35,965 --> 00:26:37,925
Speaker 2: When you go to marketing school, you know what they say,

524
00:26:38,125 --> 00:26:42,365
Speaker 2: They say like marketing one oh one. Fear based marketing

525
00:26:42,725 --> 00:26:45,845
Speaker 2: works because it hits the oldest part of our brain,

526
00:26:46,005 --> 00:26:50,005
Speaker 2: like the survival instinct. And for parents, the stakes are

527
00:26:50,045 --> 00:26:53,685
Speaker 2: really high because you're talking about your children. So I

528
00:26:53,765 --> 00:26:56,445
Speaker 2: just think we need to take a zoom back and go,

529
00:26:56,845 --> 00:27:00,205
Speaker 2: are they just exploiting a fear that we have that

530
00:27:00,325 --> 00:27:03,845
Speaker 2: doesn't exist, Stacy, because as you say, the data shows

531
00:27:03,925 --> 00:27:07,365
Speaker 2: that we actually are living quite in safe times, particularly

532
00:27:07,405 --> 00:27:11,484
Speaker 2: in Australia. Yeah, notwithstanding your point about autism and about

533
00:27:11,525 --> 00:27:14,965
Speaker 2: some parents really needing this for certain reasons. But what

534
00:27:15,085 --> 00:27:19,445
Speaker 2: I think is really interesting is what the experts are

535
00:27:19,445 --> 00:27:23,045
Speaker 2: saying about this. I've been reading The Anxious Generation by

536
00:27:23,325 --> 00:27:26,004
Speaker 2: Jonathan hit He wrote this best selling book. Lots of

537
00:27:26,045 --> 00:27:29,205
Speaker 2: people are talking about it, and he calls this phenomenon

538
00:27:29,725 --> 00:27:33,405
Speaker 2: safety ism, and he says the research around this is

539
00:27:33,484 --> 00:27:39,285
Speaker 2: really consistent, like hovering, tracking doesn't reduce anxiety. It actually

540
00:27:39,285 --> 00:27:42,564
Speaker 2: makes kids and parents more anxious, and you see it

541
00:27:42,605 --> 00:27:46,165
Speaker 2: in the data everywhere. So Deacon University found that Australian

542
00:27:46,165 --> 00:27:49,485
Speaker 2: parents are the most risk averse in the world. Four

543
00:27:49,565 --> 00:27:52,524
Speaker 2: out of five won't let their kids do risky things.

544
00:27:53,125 --> 00:27:55,725
Speaker 2: There was this University of Michigan study that found that

545
00:27:55,885 --> 00:27:58,725
Speaker 2: half of parents won't even let their tween walk to

546
00:27:58,765 --> 00:28:01,845
Speaker 2: a friend's house or go to another aisle in the supermarket,

547
00:28:02,125 --> 00:28:04,165
Speaker 2: like parents will not let their kids go to Aisle

548
00:28:04,205 --> 00:28:06,764
Speaker 2: three to collect a can of beans. And what this

549
00:28:06,965 --> 00:28:10,965
Speaker 2: is doing is making kids depressed and anxious more than

550
00:28:11,005 --> 00:28:14,165
Speaker 2: ever and parents too. And so the experts are saying

551
00:28:14,484 --> 00:28:19,005
Speaker 2: the solution to this anxious generation is not tracking them

552
00:28:19,125 --> 00:28:21,645
Speaker 2: or texting them. You have to let them go into

553
00:28:21,725 --> 00:28:24,405
Speaker 2: the big wide world. And when we stop children taking

554
00:28:24,445 --> 00:28:27,685
Speaker 2: any risks, we actually block them with this safetyism. We

555
00:28:27,765 --> 00:28:31,965
Speaker 2: block them from overcoming anxiety, managing risk, learning to be

556
00:28:32,045 --> 00:28:35,284
Speaker 2: self governing like, all of which are essential skills to

557
00:28:35,365 --> 00:28:36,244
Speaker 2: becoming an adult.

558
00:28:36,365 --> 00:28:39,445
Speaker 4: The other thing that Hite says is that we have

559
00:28:39,565 --> 00:28:42,165
Speaker 4: set up a division between the real world and the

560
00:28:42,205 --> 00:28:44,725
Speaker 4: online world that says that the real world is more

561
00:28:44,805 --> 00:28:48,045
Speaker 4: dangerous than the online world, and kids get a lesson

562
00:28:48,085 --> 00:28:51,205
Speaker 4: from this. He says that they can retreat into their phones,

563
00:28:51,245 --> 00:28:54,165
Speaker 4: where they're not monitored and where they can roam freely,

564
00:28:54,565 --> 00:28:57,845
Speaker 4: and that world is actually more dangerous than the real

565
00:28:57,885 --> 00:29:00,485
Speaker 4: world that we're monitoring them in. So I know it

566
00:29:00,485 --> 00:29:02,765
Speaker 4: starts to feel overwhelming them because when you say, thinking

567
00:29:02,765 --> 00:29:05,365
Speaker 4: about the supermarket aisle, I don't know if I have

568
00:29:05,645 --> 00:29:08,485
Speaker 4: necessarily consciously let my kids go into a different isle

569
00:29:08,525 --> 00:29:12,005
Speaker 4: in the supermarket. One way to get around that is

570
00:29:12,045 --> 00:29:15,565
Speaker 4: that Jonathan Hite has this organization called let Grow that

571
00:29:15,645 --> 00:29:18,525
Speaker 4: I know you've come across Tummons and that website. The

572
00:29:18,605 --> 00:29:21,925
Speaker 4: let Grow website has a ton of useful information and

573
00:29:22,085 --> 00:29:25,965
Speaker 4: practical tips on how you can start letting go of

574
00:29:26,005 --> 00:29:29,125
Speaker 4: your kids and let them into the world. And they

575
00:29:29,125 --> 00:29:31,485
Speaker 4: even have this little card you can print out there

576
00:29:31,845 --> 00:29:34,604
Speaker 4: that your child can carry that says, I am not

577
00:29:34,645 --> 00:29:37,605
Speaker 4: a neglected child. I am a child whose parents want

578
00:29:37,605 --> 00:29:39,525
Speaker 4: me to be able to walk around in the world.

579
00:29:39,845 --> 00:29:42,005
Speaker 4: Here is their number if you have any questions. And

580
00:29:42,045 --> 00:29:43,365
Speaker 4: I think that's a brilliant idea.

581
00:29:43,485 --> 00:29:46,005
Speaker 1: That's so interesting. Maybe it is a case of that

582
00:29:46,045 --> 00:29:48,325
Speaker 1: we're worrying about the wrong thing. Like it's like when

583
00:29:48,325 --> 00:29:50,285
Speaker 1: people are worried about getting on a plane and the

584
00:29:50,285 --> 00:29:52,565
Speaker 1: plane crashing, but then they'll jump in their car every

585
00:29:52,605 --> 00:29:54,844
Speaker 1: day after a couple of glasses of wine and not

586
00:29:54,845 --> 00:29:58,125
Speaker 1: think twice about it, Like really, we're thinking that the

587
00:29:58,205 --> 00:30:00,925
Speaker 1: danger is when they're out and about without us. But

588
00:30:01,045 --> 00:30:03,325
Speaker 1: a lot of the danger is the phone. Like we're

589
00:30:03,365 --> 00:30:05,805
Speaker 1: seeing time and time again study showing that phones are

590
00:30:05,805 --> 00:30:08,085
Speaker 1: the damaging thing to their mental health and they're overall

591
00:30:08,085 --> 00:30:11,245
Speaker 1: well being, like to their resilience. Yeah, we're saying, here,

592
00:30:11,405 --> 00:30:14,005
Speaker 1: have the phone, never leave it alone. You must take

593
00:30:14,005 --> 00:30:15,925
Speaker 1: this with you so that I don't lose you. It's

594
00:30:16,005 --> 00:30:19,485
Speaker 1: kind of like misdirected fear. I think I saw.

595
00:30:19,445 --> 00:30:23,365
Speaker 2: An article that said that in twenty twenty three, stalking

596
00:30:23,485 --> 00:30:28,445
Speaker 2: victims filed a class action lawsuit against this company Life

597
00:30:28,485 --> 00:30:32,125
Speaker 2: three sixty and against tile and against Amazon for essentially

598
00:30:32,205 --> 00:30:37,765
Speaker 2: promoting stalking, specifically multiple privacy law violations. And there was

599
00:30:37,805 --> 00:30:39,925
Speaker 2: this article in the Washington Post as well that said

600
00:30:40,285 --> 00:30:43,965
Speaker 2: that parents are using this location sharing feature to track

601
00:30:44,045 --> 00:30:48,525
Speaker 2: their teenage and adult children in ways that resemble emotional abuse.

602
00:30:48,845 --> 00:30:51,725
Speaker 2: So you talked about that before, Amelia, Like, is it

603
00:30:51,765 --> 00:30:53,685
Speaker 2: a thin end of the wedge? Are we teaching our

604
00:30:53,765 --> 00:30:57,125
Speaker 2: kids that surveillance is normal and surveillance is love? And

605
00:30:57,165 --> 00:30:57,965
Speaker 2: what does that say?

606
00:30:58,365 --> 00:31:00,645
Speaker 4: And I think we're teaching each other that too. The

607
00:31:00,685 --> 00:31:03,765
Speaker 4: New South Wales Crime Commission has actually highlighted the use

608
00:31:03,805 --> 00:31:07,445
Speaker 4: of these apps in both domestic violence and organized crime settings.

609
00:31:07,925 --> 00:31:11,325
Speaker 4: In a lot of intimate partner violence situations, these apps

610
00:31:11,325 --> 00:31:14,525
Speaker 4: are used to control, and I wonder if we're just

611
00:31:14,605 --> 00:31:18,405
Speaker 4: becoming used to having people on demand and having information

612
00:31:18,445 --> 00:31:21,565
Speaker 4: about people on demand in a way that isn't just

613
00:31:21,605 --> 00:31:24,405
Speaker 4: done reasonable for kids, but it's also bleeding into our

614
00:31:24,445 --> 00:31:25,565
Speaker 4: other relationships.

615
00:31:25,725 --> 00:31:28,205
Speaker 1: And it's like the app doesn't guarantee the safety. It's

616
00:31:28,205 --> 00:31:30,084
Speaker 1: telling you where they are, but it's not telling you

617
00:31:30,125 --> 00:31:33,365
Speaker 1: the circumstances of that location and how safe they'd be

618
00:31:33,405 --> 00:31:35,325
Speaker 1: when they're there, Like you might be seeing them at

619
00:31:35,365 --> 00:31:37,565
Speaker 1: their friend's house, there could be a party going on,

620
00:31:37,605 --> 00:31:40,165
Speaker 1: all sorts of strangers there. So it's not like a

621
00:31:40,205 --> 00:31:43,325
Speaker 1: fail safe. It doesn't account for everything that could go wrong.

622
00:31:43,445 --> 00:31:46,885
Speaker 2: So true, Stacy. Also, kids are savvy. They're going to

623
00:31:47,285 --> 00:31:49,445
Speaker 2: find a workaround for this anyway. They're going to put

624
00:31:49,485 --> 00:31:51,765
Speaker 2: their phone under their pillow at home and then have

625
00:31:51,765 --> 00:31:54,165
Speaker 2: a burn a phone that they're using at a party.

626
00:31:54,325 --> 00:31:58,525
Speaker 1: That's exactly right. I found this awesome article Juliet Weisfogel

627
00:31:58,645 --> 00:32:02,885
Speaker 1: wrote for She Knows, a teens guide to temporarily Regaining Freedom,

628
00:32:03,325 --> 00:32:05,965
Speaker 1: where she's written all about the hacks that she used

629
00:32:05,965 --> 00:32:08,365
Speaker 1: when her mum put the tracking apps on her phone

630
00:32:08,405 --> 00:32:11,005
Speaker 1: when she was a fourteen year old and got sneaking

631
00:32:11,005 --> 00:32:13,685
Speaker 1: out the window. On the ways that she got around it,

632
00:32:13,725 --> 00:32:16,085
Speaker 1: so there were different things she did, like turning off

633
00:32:16,165 --> 00:32:19,445
Speaker 1: the Bluetooth at home and the Wi Fi so that

634
00:32:19,525 --> 00:32:21,765
Speaker 1: the app would know that that was her last location,

635
00:32:21,885 --> 00:32:24,165
Speaker 1: and then sneaking out the window to a party. But

636
00:32:24,205 --> 00:32:26,205
Speaker 1: I thought the best one that she gave his advice,

637
00:32:26,245 --> 00:32:29,645
Speaker 1: which is so funny, really crazy idea to get around it.

638
00:32:29,725 --> 00:32:32,565
Speaker 1: She suggested leave your phone at home and go to

639
00:32:32,605 --> 00:32:35,285
Speaker 1: the party. But I thought the best part was that

640
00:32:35,325 --> 00:32:38,245
Speaker 1: she said they still took their laptops because they needed

641
00:32:38,245 --> 00:32:41,245
Speaker 1: a way to communicate and to uber home afterwards. So

642
00:32:41,445 --> 00:32:43,285
Speaker 1: they've got a bit of technology on them anyway, they

643
00:32:43,325 --> 00:32:44,085
Speaker 1: can't escape it.

644
00:32:44,205 --> 00:32:46,885
Speaker 4: And that said I'm getting a bit of deja vu here,

645
00:32:46,925 --> 00:32:48,725
Speaker 4: which is before I had kids, I said I'd never

646
00:32:48,805 --> 00:32:51,925
Speaker 4: let them watch TV. I reserve the right to use

647
00:32:51,965 --> 00:32:54,565
Speaker 4: tracking apps the minute I feel I need to. Yeah,

648
00:32:55,245 --> 00:32:58,885
Speaker 4: some sad news cross my feed this week. Every reject

649
00:32:58,925 --> 00:33:02,325
Speaker 4: shop in Australia is about to disappear for good. No

650
00:33:04,205 --> 00:33:07,565
Speaker 4: I love the Reject Shop, and I also love the

651
00:33:07,605 --> 00:33:10,125
Speaker 4: top comment on this news from a Reddit post about

652
00:33:10,125 --> 00:33:12,805
Speaker 4: the ree Shop. No longer will I be able to

653
00:33:12,845 --> 00:33:15,205
Speaker 4: tell my sister that's where my mum and dad bought her.

654
00:33:16,245 --> 00:33:18,165
Speaker 1: That was a classic. I pulled that one a couple

655
00:33:18,205 --> 00:33:18,965
Speaker 1: of times too.

656
00:33:20,205 --> 00:33:23,365
Speaker 4: Look, it's probably a deep psychological problem I have.

657
00:33:23,445 --> 00:33:25,685
Speaker 3: But the Reject Shop really.

658
00:33:25,245 --> 00:33:28,485
Speaker 4: Brings out my latent hoarding instincts. I go in there

659
00:33:28,485 --> 00:33:32,045
Speaker 4: with my little basket, and because everything is so aggressively

660
00:33:32,125 --> 00:33:35,565
Speaker 4: and reasonably priced, I just want it all, and it

661
00:33:35,685 --> 00:33:38,365
Speaker 4: makes me feel like it can be a different kind

662
00:33:38,405 --> 00:33:40,645
Speaker 4: of parent. This is the kind of parent who has

663
00:33:40,645 --> 00:33:43,845
Speaker 4: a craft draw as opposed to just piles of nonsense,

664
00:33:44,445 --> 00:33:47,605
Speaker 4: the kind who sharpens her kid's pencils every evening while

665
00:33:47,605 --> 00:33:49,925
Speaker 4: thinking about the masterpieces that they're going to create the

666
00:33:49,965 --> 00:33:52,165
Speaker 4: next day that she's not going to throw out when

667
00:33:52,205 --> 00:33:54,845
Speaker 4: no one's looking back, instead curate in a perfect scrap

668
00:33:54,845 --> 00:33:57,925
Speaker 4: book that she also got at the reject Shop, And

669
00:33:57,965 --> 00:34:01,325
Speaker 4: the kind of parent who creates seasonal tablescapes. I really

670
00:34:01,365 --> 00:34:03,685
Speaker 4: want to be one of those parents who celebrates the

671
00:34:03,725 --> 00:34:05,685
Speaker 4: coming of spring with some pastels.

672
00:34:06,205 --> 00:34:08,805
Speaker 2: Yeah, I get that feeling in Ikia, this is too okay,

673
00:34:08,844 --> 00:34:11,525
Speaker 2: that's yours. That's my reject shop.

674
00:34:12,165 --> 00:34:15,205
Speaker 4: Look, that's why I really want to pour out a

675
00:34:15,245 --> 00:34:18,765
Speaker 4: bottle of aggressively centered off brand bubble bath for the

676
00:34:18,844 --> 00:34:19,604
Speaker 4: reject Shop.

677
00:34:21,524 --> 00:34:22,964
Speaker 3: You know exactly what you're talking.

678
00:34:23,205 --> 00:34:25,004
Speaker 1: I can smell the smell as you said.

679
00:34:25,004 --> 00:34:27,605
Speaker 2: It's blue, right, it's blue blue.

680
00:34:27,884 --> 00:34:31,844
Speaker 4: And you're like, is this going to make my children's skin.

681
00:34:31,805 --> 00:34:32,884
Speaker 3: Break out in a rash?

682
00:34:33,084 --> 00:34:35,644
Speaker 4: Maybe, but they're gonna have fun doing it and it's

683
00:34:35,685 --> 00:34:37,204
Speaker 4: going to be a thing.

684
00:34:38,285 --> 00:34:40,325
Speaker 3: Reject Shop. Thank you for the good times.

685
00:34:40,364 --> 00:34:43,684
Speaker 4: Remember when Tony Abbott, I'm wittingly posed in front of

686
00:34:43,725 --> 00:34:47,205
Speaker 4: its signage on a campaign stop in Canberra before the election,

687
00:34:47,325 --> 00:34:50,884
Speaker 4: he laves or that wonderful Thank you for making school

688
00:34:50,884 --> 00:34:54,205
Speaker 4: holidays bearable. Thank you for the competitively priced water colors,

689
00:34:54,364 --> 00:34:58,564
Speaker 4: thank you for the Okay, I've just been told by

690
00:34:58,564 --> 00:35:02,564
Speaker 4: their producers that in fact, it's just being renamed, and

691
00:35:02,604 --> 00:35:05,524
Speaker 4: they're telling me that it's going to be okay. It's

692
00:35:05,524 --> 00:35:09,205
Speaker 4: going to be called something called Dolorama, which is apparently

693
00:35:09,205 --> 00:35:12,604
Speaker 4: a Canadian chain that just doesn't.

694
00:35:12,285 --> 00:35:14,485
Speaker 3: Have the same ring.

695
00:35:15,685 --> 00:35:18,964
Speaker 4: And I am going to suspend judgment on this and

696
00:35:19,044 --> 00:35:20,924
Speaker 4: wait to go and see it. But in the meantime,

697
00:35:21,004 --> 00:35:22,964
Speaker 4: thank you for the good chimes. Thank you for the

698
00:35:23,404 --> 00:35:26,924
Speaker 4: hairspray I have that has the name It's giving Glam.

699
00:35:28,084 --> 00:35:32,325
Speaker 2: They sell Impulse Body Spray. There, guys, stop up now. Oh.

700
00:35:34,245 --> 00:35:36,685
Speaker 1: I read a sub set this week called once Again

701
00:35:36,765 --> 00:35:39,044
Speaker 1: I Wish I had kids younger that I have been

702
00:35:39,084 --> 00:35:41,124
Speaker 1: busting to talk to you too about because I know

703
00:35:41,165 --> 00:35:44,084
Speaker 1: you'll have a lot of feelings. Jim Dalrymple, who was

704
00:35:44,205 --> 00:35:46,564
Speaker 1: thirty six when he had his first child, said he

705
00:35:46,604 --> 00:35:48,884
Speaker 1: started thinking about the pros and cons of having kids

706
00:35:48,964 --> 00:35:52,325
Speaker 1: younger when the CEO of an AI company, Brad Weiss,

707
00:35:52,645 --> 00:35:57,605
Speaker 1: tweeted having kids before thirty is how you stay generationally poor,

708
00:35:57,805 --> 00:36:01,444
Speaker 1: and it caused quite the debate. So why is later

709
00:36:01,484 --> 00:36:03,604
Speaker 1: Clara Frad that what he meant is that having kids

710
00:36:03,645 --> 00:36:05,924
Speaker 1: young eats up your cash flow and your time, which

711
00:36:05,964 --> 00:36:09,284
Speaker 1: makes having kids sound like dodgy investment properties and fair

712
00:36:09,484 --> 00:36:13,564
Speaker 1: kind of does. But Dalrymple argues that the opposite might

713
00:36:13,564 --> 00:36:15,764
Speaker 1: be true when you consider what you could gain laiter

714
00:36:15,884 --> 00:36:18,924
Speaker 1: down the track by having kids early. So he says

715
00:36:18,924 --> 00:36:21,685
Speaker 1: in his piece, if I become a grandparent at sixty

716
00:36:21,685 --> 00:36:24,164
Speaker 1: two rather than seventy two, I might be able to

717
00:36:24,165 --> 00:36:26,884
Speaker 1: provide ten years of full time care for my grandkids.

718
00:36:27,245 --> 00:36:29,564
Speaker 1: This could be worth hundreds of thousands of dollars to

719
00:36:29,604 --> 00:36:34,285
Speaker 1: my descendants. That's not generational poverty, it's generational wealth. Suddenly,

720
00:36:34,325 --> 00:36:38,164
Speaker 1: having kids young is a financial advantage. And his whole

721
00:36:38,205 --> 00:36:41,245
Speaker 1: point is by having kids sooner, we can give ourselves

722
00:36:41,285 --> 00:36:43,805
Speaker 1: a more active, involved village, which is something a lot

723
00:36:43,844 --> 00:36:46,524
Speaker 1: of us millennials say that we don't really have, is

724
00:36:46,564 --> 00:36:49,924
Speaker 1: an involved village. He makes the point that millennials complain

725
00:36:50,245 --> 00:36:52,524
Speaker 1: that they don't have a village, but then go out

726
00:36:52,564 --> 00:36:55,284
Speaker 1: and make choices that will actively ensure our children also

727
00:36:55,364 --> 00:36:58,245
Speaker 1: don't have a village. This is very simplistic, like he

728
00:36:58,285 --> 00:37:01,045
Speaker 1: acknowledges that not everyone is going to have a village

729
00:37:01,084 --> 00:37:04,205
Speaker 1: just by compressing the time span between generations. Some people

730
00:37:04,444 --> 00:37:06,245
Speaker 1: won't have a village, whether they have a baby at

731
00:37:06,325 --> 00:37:08,684
Speaker 1: twenty two or they have one at forty two. But

732
00:37:08,765 --> 00:37:12,004
Speaker 1: the point is that we could rethink the way families

733
00:37:12,004 --> 00:37:15,205
Speaker 1: are helping each other. So Mon's do you wish you

734
00:37:15,285 --> 00:37:17,164
Speaker 1: got cracking sooner? Now that you heard this.

735
00:37:17,285 --> 00:37:23,164
Speaker 2: Argument, Jim, Jim, Jim, I see your argument. I accept

736
00:37:23,205 --> 00:37:27,205
Speaker 2: your argument. What I don't accept is the thing that

737
00:37:27,245 --> 00:37:30,805
Speaker 2: he's missed entirely, which is the reason so many of

738
00:37:30,884 --> 00:37:34,685
Speaker 2: us don't have babies until like our thirties and older.

739
00:37:35,125 --> 00:37:38,044
Speaker 2: It's not just because we're making a choice about that.

740
00:37:38,364 --> 00:37:41,525
Speaker 2: There are all these systemic reasons, like there are huge

741
00:37:41,685 --> 00:37:45,285
Speaker 2: socio economic and social drivers that are related to this.

742
00:37:46,044 --> 00:37:50,404
Speaker 2: And here's my receipts. In Australia, the average age of

743
00:37:50,484 --> 00:37:54,044
Speaker 2: first time mums is twenty nine point nine years, so

744
00:37:54,325 --> 00:37:58,084
Speaker 2: almost thirty. In the nineteen seventies, which is where Jim

745
00:37:58,125 --> 00:38:03,285
Speaker 2: wants to live, it was twenty three. Demographers and social

746
00:38:03,325 --> 00:38:06,565
Speaker 2: researchers have looked at this, They're like, why are people

747
00:38:06,604 --> 00:38:10,724
Speaker 2: having babies older? Here's why women are spending more years

748
00:38:10,765 --> 00:38:15,125
Speaker 2: in higher education, They're establishing careers. There are enormous economic

749
00:38:15,165 --> 00:38:19,484
Speaker 2: pressures on us right now. There's insecure work, there's better contraception,

750
00:38:19,685 --> 00:38:23,524
Speaker 2: which means more control over timing. Meeting someone is a

751
00:38:23,564 --> 00:38:27,564
Speaker 2: shit show. People are marrying their partners much later, So

752
00:38:27,604 --> 00:38:30,364
Speaker 2: the average age at marriage in Australia is now thirty

753
00:38:30,364 --> 00:38:33,164
Speaker 2: two for women thirty four for men. That's ten years

754
00:38:33,245 --> 00:38:35,964
Speaker 2: later than in the nineteen seventy so that pushes berths

755
00:38:36,004 --> 00:38:39,964
Speaker 2: further out. Also, FYI it takes ten years now to

756
00:38:40,004 --> 00:38:42,524
Speaker 2: say for a house deposits. So I just think, yeah,

757
00:38:42,564 --> 00:38:46,125
Speaker 2: cool story, Jim. I see that, but the data doesn't

758
00:38:46,205 --> 00:38:49,085
Speaker 2: quite match up. And I think that that's the piece

759
00:38:49,125 --> 00:38:51,725
Speaker 2: that was missing for me here is it's not a

760
00:38:51,805 --> 00:38:54,924
Speaker 2: personal choice to have kids later. There's all these other

761
00:38:55,004 --> 00:38:58,524
Speaker 2: things happening around us. This is not just in Australia.

762
00:38:58,645 --> 00:39:01,725
Speaker 2: This is globally. If you zoom out, this is happening

763
00:39:01,765 --> 00:39:04,844
Speaker 2: across the EU. It's happening in Italy, Greece and Ireland,

764
00:39:05,084 --> 00:39:09,284
Speaker 2: it's happening in Asia. Maternal age is rising everywhere. There

765
00:39:09,285 --> 00:39:12,564
Speaker 2: are very few that are bucking the trend. Here it's

766
00:39:12,564 --> 00:39:15,605
Speaker 2: sort of rural India and some parts of northern Europe,

767
00:39:15,844 --> 00:39:19,805
Speaker 2: but mostly the average age of parents is rising because

768
00:39:19,844 --> 00:39:23,844
Speaker 2: we are being structurally funneled into it from all the

769
00:39:23,964 --> 00:39:25,004
Speaker 2: precious Jim.

770
00:39:26,484 --> 00:39:29,884
Speaker 1: I didn't like the article either at first. I did

771
00:39:30,165 --> 00:39:30,524
Speaker 1: at first.

772
00:39:30,604 --> 00:39:33,285
Speaker 4: I read it and look, it's like everything you disagree

773
00:39:33,285 --> 00:39:36,084
Speaker 4: with politically often there's a kernel of truth in it.

774
00:39:36,205 --> 00:39:38,325
Speaker 4: And that's why on first read I was kind of

775
00:39:38,325 --> 00:39:39,725
Speaker 4: seduced by his thesis.

776
00:39:39,884 --> 00:39:41,525
Speaker 3: Yes, I thought, it's true.

777
00:39:41,805 --> 00:39:45,484
Speaker 4: You know, when you have children older, your parents are older,

778
00:39:46,044 --> 00:39:51,044
Speaker 4: they are less interchanging nappies because they are enjoying their retirement.

779
00:39:51,765 --> 00:39:54,325
Speaker 4: And you're older, so it's harder to wake up in

780
00:39:54,364 --> 00:39:54,805
Speaker 4: the morning.

781
00:39:55,084 --> 00:39:59,044
Speaker 3: None of this can be disputed. Getting older in general

782
00:39:59,524 --> 00:40:02,565
Speaker 3: is not great and your energy levels do drop.

783
00:40:03,084 --> 00:40:05,685
Speaker 1: But then I started to think about what Jim was saying,

784
00:40:06,604 --> 00:40:09,164
Speaker 1: and I realized that he was missing an elephant in

785
00:40:09,205 --> 00:40:13,164
Speaker 1: the room, and that elephant is women. He says, no,

786
00:40:13,245 --> 00:40:16,964
Speaker 1: it's fine to have children young, because it turns out

787
00:40:17,044 --> 00:40:20,605
Speaker 1: that men who have children young actually make more money

788
00:40:21,044 --> 00:40:24,084
Speaker 1: than men who have children later. And then I thought

789
00:40:24,125 --> 00:40:28,844
Speaker 1: to myself, yeah, but women who have children younger make

790
00:40:29,004 --> 00:40:32,364
Speaker 1: less money than women who have children later. And you

791
00:40:32,444 --> 00:40:36,325
Speaker 1: know why that is. It's because the motherhood penalty is real.

792
00:40:36,805 --> 00:40:40,844
Speaker 1: The Australian Breer Statistics shows that women reduce their paid

793
00:40:40,884 --> 00:40:43,844
Speaker 1: work hours by about thirty five percent across the first

794
00:40:43,884 --> 00:40:46,684
Speaker 1: five years after the arrival of children. Australia has one

795
00:40:46,685 --> 00:40:49,645
Speaker 1: of the highest rates of part time work by women

796
00:40:49,805 --> 00:40:50,724
Speaker 1: in the OECD.

797
00:40:51,325 --> 00:40:52,445
Speaker 3: In some ways, that's great.

798
00:40:52,484 --> 00:40:54,884
Speaker 4: It means we get a lot more flexibility when our

799
00:40:54,964 --> 00:40:56,924
Speaker 4: children are young to give them the time that we

800
00:40:56,964 --> 00:40:59,404
Speaker 4: want to give them. In other ways, it means we're

801
00:40:59,444 --> 00:41:02,645
Speaker 4: missing out on income for retirement and for financial security

802
00:41:02,685 --> 00:41:05,644
Speaker 4: and stability because we're looking after children and we're taking

803
00:41:05,645 --> 00:41:09,404
Speaker 4: ourselves out of full time work. So the motherhood penalty

804
00:41:09,444 --> 00:41:12,004
Speaker 4: for women is real, and it's even more real when

805
00:41:12,044 --> 00:41:15,524
Speaker 4: you have kids younger. The other problem with it is

806
00:41:15,564 --> 00:41:19,004
Speaker 4: that when we talk about the village, let's be real,

807
00:41:19,084 --> 00:41:20,484
Speaker 4: we're talking about grandmothers, right.

808
00:41:20,765 --> 00:41:23,285
Speaker 1: That is so true. That's what the village is.

809
00:41:23,404 --> 00:41:27,084
Speaker 4: The village is just a series of grandmothers making crow

810
00:41:27,165 --> 00:41:29,444
Speaker 4: shaped blankets and doing the stuff.

811
00:41:29,924 --> 00:41:32,684
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's the unpaid labor that women get loved with.

812
00:41:32,725 --> 00:41:34,285
Speaker 3: Again, good point, Amilia.

813
00:41:34,524 --> 00:41:37,444
Speaker 4: And the thing about grandmothers is they're not paid for

814
00:41:37,484 --> 00:41:41,444
Speaker 4: what they do. The village is unpaid labor and that's wonderful.

815
00:41:41,484 --> 00:41:44,325
Speaker 4: Grandmothers want to do it, they love their grandkids. But

816
00:41:45,044 --> 00:41:47,765
Speaker 4: we can't get away from the fact that we're basically

817
00:41:47,844 --> 00:41:51,245
Speaker 4: saying that we want more unpaid labor by women. And

818
00:41:51,364 --> 00:41:54,884
Speaker 4: one way Australians are actually pushing to strengthen that village

819
00:41:54,964 --> 00:41:58,524
Speaker 4: is they're pushing to include grandparents in the government childcare subsidy.

820
00:41:58,884 --> 00:42:01,805
Speaker 4: Parents around the nation are actually putting together a petition

821
00:42:01,884 --> 00:42:05,684
Speaker 4: for the Prime Minister to say why shouldn't grandparents get

822
00:42:05,685 --> 00:42:08,964
Speaker 4: the same kinds of financial reimbursement as other types of care,

823
00:42:09,325 --> 00:42:12,485
Speaker 4: and I think that's a real solid step forward rather

824
00:42:12,564 --> 00:42:15,285
Speaker 4: than saying that women should take themselves out of the

825
00:42:15,285 --> 00:42:17,404
Speaker 4: workplace earlier to have children.

826
00:42:17,564 --> 00:42:20,124
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it's also in an ideal world that would

827
00:42:20,125 --> 00:42:23,325
Speaker 1: be lovely if you had your children earlier your parents

828
00:42:23,364 --> 00:42:26,084
Speaker 1: are around to help you, But you can't bet on

829
00:42:26,125 --> 00:42:29,044
Speaker 1: the fact that once you get there, your parents will

830
00:42:29,084 --> 00:42:31,924
Speaker 1: be around to help you. Like that's assuming that nothing

831
00:42:31,964 --> 00:42:35,045
Speaker 1: will go wrong for them physically or health wise.

832
00:42:35,004 --> 00:42:38,044
Speaker 2: And assuming they're alive exactly, they have a relationship with

833
00:42:38,084 --> 00:42:39,164
Speaker 2: you as well, that's it.

834
00:42:39,245 --> 00:42:41,524
Speaker 1: That's not guaranteed that they're even going to be there.

835
00:42:41,524 --> 00:42:43,805
Speaker 1: And as you say, they're not paid workers. They can

836
00:42:43,884 --> 00:42:45,644
Speaker 1: change their mind at any time and say I'm not

837
00:42:45,685 --> 00:42:47,884
Speaker 1: helping you with this. Your kids are brat, you're on

838
00:42:47,924 --> 00:42:51,285
Speaker 1: your own, so you're not guaranteeing yourself a village. Obviously,

839
00:42:51,325 --> 00:42:53,765
Speaker 1: in an ideal world that would be lovely, But why

840
00:42:53,805 --> 00:42:56,524
Speaker 1: would I risk it and risk my earning capacity to

841
00:42:56,564 --> 00:42:58,044
Speaker 1: have a child earlier? On what if?

842
00:42:58,444 --> 00:43:02,844
Speaker 4: Sorry, Jim, I love that more men are writing about parenting,

843
00:43:03,044 --> 00:43:06,604
Speaker 4: And yes, I think Jim's got a terrific newsletter, which

844
00:43:06,685 --> 00:43:08,564
Speaker 4: I have subscribed to because I do want to hear

845
00:43:08,604 --> 00:43:11,164
Speaker 4: more perspectives from men, and it's really refreshing to have

846
00:43:11,245 --> 00:43:14,844
Speaker 4: a man talk frankly about his regrets in fatherhood. But

847
00:43:15,364 --> 00:43:17,924
Speaker 4: turns out he really is pushing an gender. He also

848
00:43:18,165 --> 00:43:20,644
Speaker 4: writes for a conservative think tank in the US that's

849
00:43:20,685 --> 00:43:25,644
Speaker 4: dedicated to strengthening marriage hint heterosexual marriage and families.

850
00:43:26,004 --> 00:43:28,524
Speaker 1: And I think blessed Jim, Like, even if we subscribe

851
00:43:28,564 --> 00:43:30,965
Speaker 1: to this idea that we should be having them younger,

852
00:43:31,245 --> 00:43:34,164
Speaker 1: I think we can all probably admit whether we it's

853
00:43:34,245 --> 00:43:36,244
Speaker 1: not a great trait. But when you hear of someone

854
00:43:36,245 --> 00:43:38,884
Speaker 1: who's had a baby at twenty two, twenty three, your

855
00:43:38,924 --> 00:43:42,004
Speaker 1: first question is, one was that on purpose? Did they

856
00:43:42,044 --> 00:43:45,285
Speaker 1: mean to do that? And two? How are they going

857
00:43:45,364 --> 00:43:47,044
Speaker 1: to do this now? Who's going to help them look

858
00:43:47,084 --> 00:43:48,804
Speaker 1: after that baby? How are they going to move ahead

859
00:43:48,805 --> 00:43:51,405
Speaker 1: in their career? Like I get secondhand stress for women

860
00:43:51,404 --> 00:43:53,804
Speaker 1: that have them younger because I think about how hard

861
00:43:53,805 --> 00:43:56,165
Speaker 1: it would be to parent at that age.

862
00:43:56,325 --> 00:43:57,164
Speaker 3: It will help out.

863
00:43:57,524 --> 00:43:59,004
Speaker 1: Yeah, good Stacy, what.

864
00:43:59,125 --> 00:44:00,844
Speaker 2: They've got all the energy in the world. That's the

865
00:44:00,884 --> 00:44:02,084
Speaker 2: best age to be a parent.

866
00:44:02,165 --> 00:44:03,884
Speaker 1: That's what you say that's true, but it is a

867
00:44:03,924 --> 00:44:06,725
Speaker 1: young person's game. And that is the thing. Like, really,

868
00:44:06,765 --> 00:44:08,924
Speaker 1: when you look at all of the studies around when

869
00:44:09,044 --> 00:44:11,164
Speaker 1: is actually best for us to conceal even when would

870
00:44:11,245 --> 00:44:13,964
Speaker 1: equate to the lowest risk pregnancy, it is in our

871
00:44:14,004 --> 00:44:16,364
Speaker 1: mid twenties to late twenties, Like that is when we

872
00:44:16,364 --> 00:44:19,084
Speaker 1: should be having them, but we're just too busy getting

873
00:44:19,125 --> 00:44:20,685
Speaker 1: our shit in order to do.

874
00:44:20,564 --> 00:44:23,964
Speaker 2: It all right. To wrap up today's show, we're going

875
00:44:24,004 --> 00:44:25,924
Speaker 2: to share the things that we're loving, sick, things that

876
00:44:25,924 --> 00:44:27,725
Speaker 2: we might text to our friends or put in the

877
00:44:27,805 --> 00:44:30,205
Speaker 2: mums group chat. Amelia.

878
00:44:30,364 --> 00:44:34,044
Speaker 4: So, I have discovered a book series that I want

879
00:44:34,044 --> 00:44:37,444
Speaker 4: to read just as much, if not more than my children.

880
00:44:37,725 --> 00:44:40,844
Speaker 4: And it's called Percy Jackson and the Olympians. This is

881
00:44:40,844 --> 00:44:44,924
Speaker 4: a series that inspires absolute devotion and adoration and people.

882
00:44:44,964 --> 00:44:46,684
Speaker 4: And I guess I've been living under a rock because

883
00:44:46,685 --> 00:44:48,964
Speaker 4: I only recently discovered it. The book started coming out

884
00:44:49,004 --> 00:44:50,964
Speaker 4: in two thousand and five that by an author called

885
00:44:51,044 --> 00:44:51,805
Speaker 4: Rick Reordan.

886
00:44:52,325 --> 00:44:53,205
Speaker 3: I pick one up at the.

887
00:44:53,165 --> 00:44:55,564
Speaker 4: Bookshop and I took it to the counter and the

888
00:44:55,604 --> 00:44:59,284
Speaker 4: young woman behind the counter literally gasped and said, this

889
00:44:59,364 --> 00:45:01,764
Speaker 4: is the book that got me into reading. And now

890
00:45:01,805 --> 00:45:03,844
Speaker 4: she works at a bookshop, so she's very into reading.

891
00:45:04,484 --> 00:45:06,245
Speaker 4: And I took it home and started reading it to

892
00:45:06,364 --> 00:45:10,164
Speaker 4: my children, and look, they think it's fine. I'm obsessed.

893
00:45:10,964 --> 00:45:13,884
Speaker 4: I'm now like, can we start doing bedtime reading at

894
00:45:13,924 --> 00:45:16,124
Speaker 4: six point thirty when bedtime is eight, just so we

895
00:45:16,165 --> 00:45:18,964
Speaker 4: can read more of the books. There are fantasy series.

896
00:45:18,964 --> 00:45:21,005
Speaker 4: They are about a twelve year old kid who travels

897
00:45:21,044 --> 00:45:25,004
Speaker 4: across America to recover Zusa's lightning Bolt. They're based on

898
00:45:25,044 --> 00:45:30,004
Speaker 4: Greek mythology. They're so exciting, they're so gripping, and they're

899
00:45:30,044 --> 00:45:32,805
Speaker 4: a page turner for kids and adults alike.

900
00:45:33,125 --> 00:45:35,205
Speaker 2: That's great. I love that. Did you start with a

901
00:45:35,245 --> 00:45:37,044
Speaker 2: particular one? Is it a series that you have to

902
00:45:37,044 --> 00:45:38,364
Speaker 2: start at zero? Yeah?

903
00:45:38,444 --> 00:45:40,724
Speaker 4: Start at zero. The first book's called The Lightning Thief.

904
00:45:40,765 --> 00:45:42,724
Speaker 4: But there's so many in the series. So the good

905
00:45:42,765 --> 00:45:45,524
Speaker 4: news is you have a lot of great reading ahead

906
00:45:45,564 --> 00:45:45,725
Speaker 4: of you.

907
00:45:46,004 --> 00:45:50,644
Speaker 2: I've been reading Rolldal to my kids, whoa role like whoa?

908
00:45:50,805 --> 00:45:54,565
Speaker 2: The world has changed. I was reading The Magic finger

909
00:45:54,725 --> 00:45:57,164
Speaker 2: to the Middle of Night. Do you remember this one?

910
00:45:57,484 --> 00:46:01,404
Speaker 2: The kids have guns in it.

911
00:46:00,084 --> 00:46:02,045
Speaker 3: Is the Gunner Magic Fingers.

912
00:46:02,325 --> 00:46:07,004
Speaker 2: Yeah. Wow, it's just like wow. Another time Rodal did

913
00:46:07,044 --> 00:46:10,524
Speaker 2: not give a shit about like being careful around language,

914
00:46:10,645 --> 00:46:14,605
Speaker 2: or he's just yeah, it's really cool to read Stacy. Stacy,

915
00:46:14,645 --> 00:46:15,604
Speaker 2: what are you recommending?

916
00:46:16,125 --> 00:46:18,605
Speaker 1: So despite us onthing doing this show for a few weeks,

917
00:46:18,645 --> 00:46:21,604
Speaker 1: I felt like I had run out of recommendations yesterday,

918
00:46:22,165 --> 00:46:24,604
Speaker 1: and I of course made that my husband's problem. I

919
00:46:24,685 --> 00:46:27,484
Speaker 1: was like, do a lap of the house, look around

920
00:46:28,205 --> 00:46:30,524
Speaker 1: at our daughter's stuff and see if there's anything that

921
00:46:30,564 --> 00:46:32,765
Speaker 1: I should be recommending. And as I've got him on

922
00:46:32,805 --> 00:46:35,444
Speaker 1: that wild Goose chase, I found the thing that I

923
00:46:35,484 --> 00:46:39,165
Speaker 1: wanted to recommend. So it only cost me twelve dollars

924
00:46:39,205 --> 00:46:40,884
Speaker 1: and I bought it five years ago and I still

925
00:46:40,964 --> 00:46:42,924
Speaker 1: use it every single day and they still have them.

926
00:46:42,964 --> 00:46:47,524
Speaker 1: I've checked. It's a nappy caddy from Kmart, so I'm

927
00:46:47,564 --> 00:46:50,444
Speaker 1: well out of the nappy stage. But they're just a

928
00:46:50,524 --> 00:46:53,005
Speaker 1: cute little box, chic looking little box with a handle

929
00:46:53,044 --> 00:46:55,805
Speaker 1: on the top, and I use it now as like

930
00:46:56,165 --> 00:46:58,645
Speaker 1: the shit bits box. So you know when you find

931
00:46:58,765 --> 00:47:00,164
Speaker 1: like a piece of a toy and you have no

932
00:47:00,245 --> 00:47:02,765
Speaker 1: idea where the rest of that toy is and you

933
00:47:02,884 --> 00:47:04,764
Speaker 1: put it in that pile next to your fruit bowl,

934
00:47:05,084 --> 00:47:08,245
Speaker 1: like where Pemish and Andy talk about this podcast.

935
00:47:07,844 --> 00:47:09,404
Speaker 3: Why do you know about my house?

936
00:47:10,404 --> 00:47:14,004
Speaker 1: Because we all have identical houses, and you just end

937
00:47:14,084 --> 00:47:15,924
Speaker 1: up with all this crap that you don't know where

938
00:47:15,924 --> 00:47:19,085
Speaker 1: it's meant to go. And all my daughter's like hair stuff.

939
00:47:19,245 --> 00:47:22,085
Speaker 1: You know, you're the curl cream and the tangling brush

940
00:47:22,084 --> 00:47:25,204
Speaker 1: and all those bits. I use that nappy caddy still

941
00:47:25,285 --> 00:47:27,484
Speaker 1: for all of those bits, And now I've got a

942
00:47:27,524 --> 00:47:30,684
Speaker 1: second one to stop the fruit bowl pile from piling up.

943
00:47:30,725 --> 00:47:32,204
Speaker 1: So I just pulled all the little bits in there

944
00:47:32,205 --> 00:47:34,605
Speaker 1: and figure it out later. That's later mess problem.

945
00:47:34,765 --> 00:47:37,884
Speaker 2: Are you literally recommending a bin like a bin?

946
00:47:38,604 --> 00:47:42,164
Speaker 1: No? They are things that you can't throw out, yes.

947
00:47:41,884 --> 00:47:43,844
Speaker 4: Because you know that the kid's going to be like,

948
00:47:43,924 --> 00:47:47,084
Speaker 4: where is the one small bit of a toy that

949
00:47:47,364 --> 00:47:48,444
Speaker 4: I desperately need?

950
00:47:48,685 --> 00:47:52,765
Speaker 1: Yes, exactly, you need them at some point maybe, but

951
00:47:52,924 --> 00:47:55,444
Speaker 1: you can't throw them out. So that's where this stuff goes.

952
00:47:55,645 --> 00:47:58,484
Speaker 2: Doesn't it stink though, from all the nappy odor that

953
00:47:58,645 --> 00:47:59,765
Speaker 2: seeped into the plastic.

954
00:48:00,325 --> 00:48:02,765
Speaker 1: No, I don't know about your nappy. No, I'm not

955
00:48:02,765 --> 00:48:05,964
Speaker 1: taling about a nappy bin, mons. I'm talking about a

956
00:48:06,004 --> 00:48:08,684
Speaker 1: little square box with a little handle on top. The

957
00:48:08,725 --> 00:48:11,724
Speaker 1: dirty nappies never went anywhere here. It was the one

958
00:48:11,765 --> 00:48:16,364
Speaker 1: that you keep like the wives, the clean nappies, gotcha,

959
00:48:16,444 --> 00:48:20,484
Speaker 1: the moisturizer. Okay, all right, Oh my god, no, that

960
00:48:20,645 --> 00:48:23,364
Speaker 1: bin is long gone. That bin has gone to the

961
00:48:23,404 --> 00:48:25,884
Speaker 1: tip that was foul, never to be returned to my house.

962
00:48:25,964 --> 00:48:27,884
Speaker 2: My god, I thought you were just throwing everything in

963
00:48:27,924 --> 00:48:30,924
Speaker 2: the stinking like oh yeah, here for that.

964
00:48:32,044 --> 00:48:35,285
Speaker 1: Anyway, they're like ten to twenty bucks at kmar and

965
00:48:35,325 --> 00:48:36,244
Speaker 1: we'll put a link to one.

966
00:48:36,125 --> 00:48:39,444
Speaker 2: Of lid on It Stacy, so you can cover the

967
00:48:39,484 --> 00:48:40,085
Speaker 2: ship bits.

968
00:48:40,484 --> 00:48:42,605
Speaker 1: No, the bits are free and loose, but it's fine.

969
00:48:42,765 --> 00:48:46,484
Speaker 1: Got confused shit bits? You're imaging little bits of shit

970
00:48:46,604 --> 00:48:49,084
Speaker 1: in there. Yeah, I'm so sorry. That's on mem On's.

971
00:48:49,125 --> 00:48:51,645
Speaker 3: That's what's your.

972
00:48:51,524 --> 00:48:55,444
Speaker 2: Reco I've got this this hidden Netflix gem that I

973
00:48:55,444 --> 00:48:57,724
Speaker 2: can't stop watching right now, neither can my kids. It's

974
00:48:57,725 --> 00:49:01,884
Speaker 2: not K Pop Demon Hunters. It's Toddler's Running Errands. It's

975
00:49:01,884 --> 00:49:06,364
Speaker 2: a show called Old Enough. It's a Japanese show where

976
00:49:06,524 --> 00:49:10,765
Speaker 2: they send two three and four year olds into the

977
00:49:10,765 --> 00:49:13,124
Speaker 2: world to run errands completely on their own, and then

978
00:49:13,165 --> 00:49:14,924
Speaker 2: they film them with hidden cameras.

979
00:49:15,004 --> 00:49:16,045
Speaker 1: Have they got tracking apps?

980
00:49:16,084 --> 00:49:18,565
Speaker 2: I must know there are no tracking apps.

981
00:49:19,044 --> 00:49:19,484
Speaker 1: Literally.

982
00:49:19,645 --> 00:49:21,884
Speaker 2: I watched one last night where a woman said to

983
00:49:21,884 --> 00:49:24,525
Speaker 2: her three year old, take my pants to the store

984
00:49:24,524 --> 00:49:28,604
Speaker 2: and get them mended. And I cannot stop watching it.

985
00:49:28,604 --> 00:49:32,645
Speaker 2: It's equal parts adorable and terrifying. Like you will laugh,

986
00:49:33,285 --> 00:49:37,404
Speaker 2: you will gasp, you'll cheer for these toddlers, like these preschoolers.

987
00:49:37,884 --> 00:49:40,164
Speaker 2: And my kids love it too, even though they can't

988
00:49:40,245 --> 00:49:43,844
Speaker 2: quite understand it because it's in Japanese, so they're subtitles,

989
00:49:43,844 --> 00:49:46,164
Speaker 2: but they can't completely read them all. It's going to

990
00:49:46,245 --> 00:49:48,565
Speaker 2: make you want to send your kids out for errands

991
00:49:48,645 --> 00:49:51,725
Speaker 2: too without a tracker, which is, you know, sometimes a

992
00:49:51,725 --> 00:49:52,044
Speaker 2: good thing.

993
00:49:52,325 --> 00:49:56,244
Speaker 3: How successful are they fulfilling the errands? Did she get

994
00:49:56,245 --> 00:49:56,884
Speaker 3: the pants hand?

995
00:49:57,325 --> 00:50:00,724
Speaker 2: Yes, they do the most amazing things, some of these kids,

996
00:50:00,884 --> 00:50:02,964
Speaker 2: and they show you during the show. They say they

997
00:50:03,004 --> 00:50:05,364
Speaker 2: have to walk three hundred meters, they need to cross

998
00:50:05,404 --> 00:50:08,404
Speaker 2: two roads, so they set it up. And yes, these

999
00:50:08,484 --> 00:50:12,204
Speaker 2: kids are so capable at such young age. It's amazing

1000
00:50:12,245 --> 00:50:15,004
Speaker 2: to watch. And now since we've watched it, my kids

1001
00:50:15,044 --> 00:50:16,964
Speaker 2: keep saying, Mum, send me on an errand I want

1002
00:50:16,964 --> 00:50:18,125
Speaker 2: to go to the shops by myself.

1003
00:50:18,205 --> 00:50:21,004
Speaker 1: So this is definitely watching this great wreck.

1004
00:50:21,444 --> 00:50:22,685
Speaker 2: You know what, We'll put a link to all of

1005
00:50:22,725 --> 00:50:25,045
Speaker 2: our reps in the show notes in case your brain

1006
00:50:25,084 --> 00:50:27,364
Speaker 2: is a sieve. That is all we have time for

1007
00:50:27,444 --> 00:50:30,285
Speaker 2: this week on Parenting out Loud. Now, last week I

1008
00:50:30,325 --> 00:50:32,804
Speaker 2: told you something I was not supposed to tell you all.

1009
00:50:32,924 --> 00:50:35,244
Speaker 2: I said, Hey, we're in the Mama Mea out Loud

1010
00:50:35,285 --> 00:50:38,004
Speaker 2: feed for just a few weeks. So if you like

1011
00:50:38,165 --> 00:50:41,125
Speaker 2: this show, come and follow it, because if you don't,

1012
00:50:42,125 --> 00:50:46,644
Speaker 2: it might not survive. That's actually a reality. I've got

1013
00:50:46,645 --> 00:50:49,565
Speaker 2: a fun fact for you both. There are ten times

1014
00:50:49,604 --> 00:50:51,844
Speaker 2: the amount of people listening to this in the Mama

1015
00:50:51,924 --> 00:50:54,444
Speaker 2: Mea out Loud feed compared to the Parenting out Loud feed.

1016
00:50:54,844 --> 00:50:57,044
Speaker 2: One in ten people went and followed and the rest

1017
00:50:57,084 --> 00:50:59,684
Speaker 2: were like nah nah. So I want to say huge

1018
00:50:59,765 --> 00:51:02,484
Speaker 2: thank you to the people who did. You are elite,

1019
00:51:02,765 --> 00:51:04,964
Speaker 2: you're in the one percent. You are the early adopters.

1020
00:51:05,245 --> 00:51:08,004
Speaker 2: Thank you, and for the rest of you. If you

1021
00:51:08,044 --> 00:51:10,245
Speaker 2: do like this show, come on over to the Parenting

1022
00:51:10,245 --> 00:51:12,524
Speaker 2: out Loud feed and if not, you know what will

1023
00:51:12,524 --> 00:51:14,005
Speaker 2: be out of your hair in a couple of weeks.

1024
00:51:14,524 --> 00:51:17,564
Speaker 2: The best way to help us is to just do that.

1025
00:51:17,685 --> 00:51:20,245
Speaker 2: So search for Parenting out Loud in your podcast app,

1026
00:51:20,524 --> 00:51:24,364
Speaker 2: find the show it's a purple logo, and hit follow

1027
00:51:24,484 --> 00:51:27,445
Speaker 2: and then maybe, just maybe we will get to number

1028
00:51:27,484 --> 00:51:30,724
Speaker 2: one ahead of Dari of A CEO. A huge thank

1029
00:51:30,765 --> 00:51:33,964
Speaker 2: you to our team, the group ep Is, Ruth Devine, produces,

1030
00:51:34,044 --> 00:51:38,285
Speaker 2: Leah Porgus and Sashatanic and researcher Tessa Kodovich. Have a

1031
00:51:38,285 --> 00:51:40,404
Speaker 2: great week. We'll talk to you next Saturday morning.

1032
00:51:40,685 --> 00:51:43,805
Speaker 1: See you then Bye,