WEBVTT - Kylie Minogue Just Made Us Believe In The Comeback

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<v Speaker 1>You're listening to I'm on the MEA podcast three two one.

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<v Speaker 2>Are we nailed there?

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<v Speaker 3>Guys, we're back in the room.

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<v Speaker 1>Hello, and welcome to Unleashed, the podcast for gen X

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<v Speaker 1>women who need a laugh. If you have peeled the

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<v Speaker 1>stickers off a Rubik's cube to complete it, if you've

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<v Speaker 1>owned a pair of fingerless Lacey gloves or covered in

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<v Speaker 1>your sisters, and if you have worn out your VHS

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<v Speaker 1>copy of Beaches, Yes, you're in the right place, ladies.

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<v Speaker 2>Yes, welcome.

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<v Speaker 1>Now, who is on the sofa this week?

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<v Speaker 3>I'm Ginnie Meersberg. I'm a GP.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm Brunard Pep Andrea. I'm a film and TV producer.

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<v Speaker 4>Her role I love you? Won't you tell me your name?

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<v Speaker 4>Grace Lamb, fashion stylist.

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<v Speaker 1>I am Kath Mahoney comedian. Well, I have to fess

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<v Speaker 1>up immediately. Is Perry brain? You know the talking I've

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<v Speaker 1>forgotten it. So we are without a talking pick. So

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<v Speaker 1>we're just gonna have to do what normal people do

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<v Speaker 1>exactly exactly. Anyone want to start me me?

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<v Speaker 4>Here we go, Grace, So dr Jeanie in the bottle.

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<v Speaker 4>As you remember a few episodes ago, I spoke about

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<v Speaker 4>how I got knits on the tram, and you said

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<v Speaker 4>it was ridiculous. I just want to prove my point

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<v Speaker 4>and do some public services. So I know you didn't

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<v Speaker 4>believe me, and I took matters to my own hands.

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<v Speaker 4>So here we go. So today I'm here as Grace Slams,

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<v Speaker 4>the official gemophobe of and lesions. I'm gonna hang out

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<v Speaker 4>flyers to protect everyone's hair because there's knits on the tram.

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<v Speaker 4>Let's go my flyers is lamb on tram. No, thank you, ma'am.

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<v Speaker 4>Knit on board, commute at own risk. Don't catch knits.

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<v Speaker 4>Excuse me, guys, my name is great. I've recently caught

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<v Speaker 4>knits like headline on the tram. I want to protect

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<v Speaker 4>both of your hair. Would you like the shower cap

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<v Speaker 4>before you get on a tram cable? It's free, it's right,

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<v Speaker 4>it's right. Excuse me, you're going to give you some flyers.

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<v Speaker 3>Thank you so much.

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<v Speaker 4>Rejected.

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<v Speaker 1>I just want to protect people.

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<v Speaker 5>I don't catch it.

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<v Speaker 4>I'm gonna get your sanitizers as well. Don't touch up anything. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 4>it's a breeding ground for knits. Protect the public. That's

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<v Speaker 4>my publicam on a tram. No thank you, man, no,

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<v Speaker 4>thank you, dam that head lies roum your comere people.

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<v Speaker 4>Did you know you can get knits on the tram?

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<v Speaker 4>Oh my god, that's what happened to me recently. Oh god,

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<v Speaker 4>I get the tramp every day, so you should wear

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<v Speaker 4>a shower cap.

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<v Speaker 5>Please.

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<v Speaker 3>Actually caught crabs from some random girl.

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<v Speaker 4>The stars are online. That's why we're meeting today. Make

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<v Speaker 4>sure you put that on. Let's put on together.

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<v Speaker 2>Do you havents Neil No, I'm not crazy.

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<v Speaker 4>I'm just cautious about headlines and knit you well.

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<v Speaker 1>Thank me later.

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<v Speaker 4>This message is approved. But gracelam the official dramaphone from Alish.

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<v Speaker 1>My lamb on a track.

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<v Speaker 4>Favor people, come on on the tram?

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<v Speaker 2>Is your new name?

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<v Speaker 3>Transport know that you've been disseminating these public health messages for.

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<v Speaker 4>Free or they didn't stop me, so I think we're fine.

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<v Speaker 4>I'm going to give you one each of my flyer.

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<v Speaker 4>Can you please read it out. It's a very very

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<v Speaker 4>important message.

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<v Speaker 1>Dr Jinny. Maybe you should take it.

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<v Speaker 3>I'm not endorsing this message, but the Lamb on tram no,

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<v Speaker 3>thank you, ma'am. Knits on board commute at own risk.

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<v Speaker 3>And there's a little picture of a knit with a

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<v Speaker 3>line through it and a QR cod What are we

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<v Speaker 3>what are we scanning this QR code too?

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<v Speaker 4>So that people I gave the flyer to they can

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<v Speaker 4>listen to our episode.

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<v Speaker 1>Rilla marketing.

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<v Speaker 4>But in that and I think I did pretty well today.

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<v Speaker 4>I have no shame and that got so many directions.

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<v Speaker 4>Thank god, I've got the skin.

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<v Speaker 3>So if anybody gets on public transport and sees half

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<v Speaker 3>the commuters wearing a shower cap, you know what happened.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm not sure it's going.

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<v Speaker 4>To catch on, Grace, I'm starting this trend.

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<v Speaker 1>I feel like this is your actress moment for inner

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<v Speaker 1>pay it is.

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<v Speaker 3>It's definitely not your doctor moment.

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<v Speaker 2>Put it that way. It may not lead to an

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<v Speaker 2>Oscar nomination, but good luck. Speaking of actresses, can we

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<v Speaker 2>talk about I know a lot of people are talking

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<v Speaker 2>about this right now, the Kylie docco.

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<v Speaker 4>Yes, Yes, I love her.

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<v Speaker 2>I know I loved it so much and so for me,

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<v Speaker 2>obviously we all grew up with her right where the

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<v Speaker 2>definitely the right age. But not only did we're up

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<v Speaker 2>with Kylie. I feel like I was really around the

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<v Speaker 2>scene in a lot of the kind of big moments

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<v Speaker 2>that they were talking about, and I love this doco

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<v Speaker 2>so much, although I did feel like I could have

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<v Speaker 2>done with another couple of episodes because her life is

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<v Speaker 2>really interesting, she had so many stages. But it just

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<v Speaker 2>brought up so many memories from In fact, crazily, I

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<v Speaker 2>was at an event for Michael Hutchins' memorial and I

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<v Speaker 2>knew him a little bit, and it just really struck

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<v Speaker 2>me and made me have these kind of deep memories

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<v Speaker 2>of how incredibly charismatic was if you ever met Michael Hutchins.

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<v Speaker 2>I didn't know him very well, but we've all had

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<v Speaker 2>this experience. And this is what I really thought about

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<v Speaker 2>when I was watching the Kylie docco and she was

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<v Speaker 2>talking about the effect that relationship had on her, and

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<v Speaker 2>I remember when I was younger, there were those guys

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<v Speaker 2>that when they smiled at you, you felt like, whether

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<v Speaker 2>you were dating or not, you felt like you were

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<v Speaker 2>the only person in the world, and their charisma was

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<v Speaker 2>so kind of magnetic, and Michael definitely had that. I

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<v Speaker 2>remember that very vividly. You know what I.

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<v Speaker 3>Loved about I loved everything about that documentary because I

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<v Speaker 3>feel like it just traced the arc of my life,

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<v Speaker 3>not that I ever was at an after party or

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<v Speaker 3>being cool. I was just in the background with people

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<v Speaker 3>on my wall. But when Kylie spoke about Michael, the

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<v Speaker 3>thing that really struck me was her grace and her

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<v Speaker 3>generosity and her vulnerability in saying he broke my heart

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<v Speaker 3>and yet she still wished him so well and wanted

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<v Speaker 3>to beard his memorial and still held him in such

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<v Speaker 3>high regard. And I thought you were always like goals

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<v Speaker 3>for me, but oh my goodness, she went up in

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<v Speaker 3>my estimation even further.

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<v Speaker 4>Because it can be really.

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<v Speaker 3>Tempting to trash your X. It can be really tempting

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<v Speaker 3>to say it was all their fault and I didn't

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<v Speaker 3>even want him anyway, which like that's what normal people do, right,

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<v Speaker 3>But she just was like up there flying the flag

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<v Speaker 3>for what is the best of an ex behavior. Like

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<v Speaker 3>I was so impressed and so blown away, and I

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<v Speaker 3>thought everybody who's ever had their heartbroken needs to watch her,

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<v Speaker 3>because she nailed it.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that bit flowed me. The bit where she talks

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<v Speaker 1>about comparing every single relationship she's ever had and they

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<v Speaker 1>were like twenty twenty one when they were together to Michael,

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<v Speaker 1>that flawed me.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 6>Michael was touring all over the world, so came really

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<v Speaker 6>hard for us to see each other.

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<v Speaker 7>Are you still in love with ky?

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<v Speaker 8>Jeff? That's nice too, private.

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<v Speaker 4>Least very good friends and always he was.

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<v Speaker 6>The first in so many ways.

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<v Speaker 5>Yeah, and.

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<v Speaker 8>One of those first was heartbreak.

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<v Speaker 6>Here's a rock star, which doesn't just mean that he

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<v Speaker 6>needs to have many women in his life, but he

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<v Speaker 6>needed to go where he needed to go. But I

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<v Speaker 6>know from people in his circle that he talked with

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<v Speaker 6>me and thought of me.

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<v Speaker 3>We were good together.

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<v Speaker 6>Should have would have cut it whatever, you know, you

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<v Speaker 6>go on and live your life. But it was definitely

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<v Speaker 6>an amazing point in time. I've probably been looking for

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<v Speaker 6>something like that ever since. I haven't got it.

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<v Speaker 3>Oh wow, Because let's be honest, a lot of us

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<v Speaker 3>have had heartbreak. But it's a pretty dick move to

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<v Speaker 3>kind of, you know, break up with somebody telling Jeff

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<v Speaker 3>McMullin on sixty minutes that you're good friends like that.

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<v Speaker 3>I could have forgiven her if she'd harbored a whole

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<v Speaker 3>heap of resentment towards him for the rest of her life.

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<v Speaker 1>But she did it.

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<v Speaker 3>You know, she owned the fact that he broke her heart,

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<v Speaker 3>that she loved him and he didn't love her in

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<v Speaker 3>the same way. Even though he did clearly love her,

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<v Speaker 3>and you know, I think the media wanted to portray

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<v Speaker 3>that he was punching below his weight and that's clearly

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<v Speaker 3>not true.

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<v Speaker 1>But I loved her.

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<v Speaker 3>Honesty and I think in that environment, like it's hard

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<v Speaker 3>to be honest in that world where you're protecting your

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<v Speaker 3>persona so much.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, but what's amazing I think for me why I

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<v Speaker 2>love the documentary so much is, yes, the kind of

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<v Speaker 2>the way she talked about him, but I think she's able,

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<v Speaker 2>You're able to look back as an older person also

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<v Speaker 2>and understand that was a moment, right, Not when you're

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<v Speaker 2>in the middle of heartbreak, it's much harder, but just

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<v Speaker 2>the amount of time she reinvented herself, you know, in

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<v Speaker 2>the same way that so many kind of great icons have.

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<v Speaker 2>And that's no easy feat when you have been slammed

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<v Speaker 2>and slammed and kind of put down. And so I

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<v Speaker 2>think that was the big takeaway from me was, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>continuing to not let people define her and even the

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<v Speaker 2>crazy I mean, even to kind of do what she

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<v Speaker 2>did when she I loved chearing Nick Cave talking about her,

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<v Speaker 2>but even to do that music video with him, there

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<v Speaker 2>was such a brave thing in the moment, Yes, to

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<v Speaker 2>kind of you know, kind of throw her image in

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<v Speaker 2>some ways away and kind of surprise people. So yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>that was the big takeaway from me, which like just

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<v Speaker 2>watching artists do that and reinvent themselves for me is

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<v Speaker 2>just like the greatest reminder just you know, don't let

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<v Speaker 2>anyone else define you.

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<v Speaker 1>Grace and joy That's what I got from it. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>that she's just still so joyful.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, but like a lot of heartbreak along the way.

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<v Speaker 2>I think, just like she owns ages. Yeah, and it's

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<v Speaker 2>good that a lot of people have done these documentaries

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<v Speaker 2>because I think it makes more people comfortable to be

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<v Speaker 2>able to kind of be more vulnerable. And look, I'm

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<v Speaker 2>sure there's a lot she's still you know, holding back

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<v Speaker 2>because you know, you can't give the world everything. I

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<v Speaker 2>think there's another's many episodes more, you know. I do

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<v Speaker 2>think it's the one thing that I'm always reminded of

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<v Speaker 2>when I watch these things is how hard the world

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<v Speaker 2>comes at women who are successful much more than they

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<v Speaker 2>do come successful.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>So that was that was interesting, But yeah, I could

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<v Speaker 2>have I could have watched more and more.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, talking about losing the potential love of your life,

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<v Speaker 1>you might remember a few weeks ago, I had a

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<v Speaker 1>really great date. Yeah, the guy I was lovely. We

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<v Speaker 1>really clicked. Then there was a fight amongst us all

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<v Speaker 1>about whether I should text him or not, and Sally Hepworth,

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<v Speaker 1>who isn't with us, and.

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<v Speaker 4>She's not clarifying just in case people, if you're listening,

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<v Speaker 4>you're very much alive.

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<v Speaker 1>She takes it this morning. So Sally and producer Moe's

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<v Speaker 1>really went in hard. When I joined a group chat

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<v Speaker 1>to say I've been on a date, I was desperate

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<v Speaker 1>to message him. You know, what should I do? And

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<v Speaker 1>they were very sort of divided on you know, either

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<v Speaker 1>being a deer and being elusive or being the labrador

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<v Speaker 1>puppy that I am and sort of being all over

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<v Speaker 1>his leg and being excited. From then, we had agreed

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<v Speaker 1>to go on a second date. We were going to

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<v Speaker 1>go to the Archibald, which I thought was a lovely date. Anyway,

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<v Speaker 1>two days later he had to work that date, but

0:11:43.434 --> 0:11:46.274
<v Speaker 1>he immediately said how about Sunday? So I was like, okay,

0:11:46.274 --> 0:11:49.514
<v Speaker 1>this is good. Yeah, And here's something I am going

0:11:49.594 --> 0:11:52.634
<v Speaker 1>to have to confess to you guys. I have been

0:11:52.714 --> 0:11:55.554
<v Speaker 1>running all of our chats through AI.

0:11:55.874 --> 0:11:57.394
<v Speaker 2>Oh god, okay.

0:11:58.234 --> 0:12:03.194
<v Speaker 1>Well, so anyway, my chat bot of choice is clawed. Okay,

0:12:03.354 --> 0:12:11.714
<v Speaker 1>so I put all of our conversation into claudatory so

0:12:11.834 --> 0:12:16.114
<v Speaker 1>much like please continue because Holly Wayne Wright I shared something.

0:12:16.154 --> 0:12:18.714
<v Speaker 1>I shared it with Grace and Holly, something he'd said

0:12:18.754 --> 0:12:20.674
<v Speaker 1>about me in the chat, which I thought was lovely.

0:12:20.754 --> 0:12:23.394
<v Speaker 1>Holly immediately said do you think chat wrote that? So

0:12:23.554 --> 0:12:25.514
<v Speaker 1>when I'm talking to Claude and like, do you think

0:12:25.634 --> 0:12:27.754
<v Speaker 1>chat wrote that? And he was like, well no, because

0:12:27.754 --> 0:12:31.834
<v Speaker 1>it's grammatically incorrect in places, and also you had sent

0:12:31.874 --> 0:12:33.834
<v Speaker 1>a message and less than a minute later he had

0:12:33.874 --> 0:12:35.994
<v Speaker 1>replied with that. So he said, you know, so Claude,

0:12:35.994 --> 0:12:37.874
<v Speaker 1>who I think is a chap, we're saying that. So

0:12:37.914 --> 0:12:40.074
<v Speaker 1>I was like, okay, Claude did suggest. I was like,

0:12:40.114 --> 0:12:41.834
<v Speaker 1>do you think I'm more keen than him? And Claude

0:12:41.874 --> 0:12:44.914
<v Speaker 1>was like, look, I think it's fairly equal, but maybe

0:12:44.994 --> 0:12:45.634
<v Speaker 1>just pull back.

0:12:45.674 --> 0:12:48.114
<v Speaker 4>So I was like, yeah, we're got Claude, I've got okay.

0:12:48.114 --> 0:12:50.754
<v Speaker 4>Can we just say yeah, for those lovely listeners who

0:12:50.754 --> 0:12:52.154
<v Speaker 4>don't know what Claude is not a person?

0:12:54.434 --> 0:12:55.594
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, chatbot?

0:12:55.754 --> 0:12:56.474
<v Speaker 1>Like's not chatbot?

0:12:56.514 --> 0:12:56.914
<v Speaker 2>What is it?

0:12:56.914 --> 0:13:00.754
<v Speaker 3>Well, because it's AI, it's actually taken a lot of

0:13:00.874 --> 0:13:04.474
<v Speaker 3>data to actually build Claude like. It's not I love Claude.

0:13:04.634 --> 0:13:06.834
<v Speaker 3>It's not something you can build for one thousand dollars

0:13:06.874 --> 0:13:07.234
<v Speaker 3>and put on.

0:13:08.434 --> 0:13:10.874
<v Speaker 2>It is its own chat. I think it's a chap.

0:13:13.514 --> 0:13:16.874
<v Speaker 1>Dating anyway, So Claude, you know, has confirmed that the

0:13:16.994 --> 0:13:19.394
<v Speaker 1>Welsh guy is into me, and claud would know, and

0:13:19.434 --> 0:13:22.674
<v Speaker 1>Claude would know. Claud's got all of our WhatsApp chats. Okay,

0:13:22.874 --> 0:13:28.194
<v Speaker 1>my god. Then we ended up having a FaceTime chat no, no,

0:13:28.314 --> 0:13:31.074
<v Speaker 1>this is me and this s Welsh guy, which I

0:13:31.154 --> 0:13:34.714
<v Speaker 1>thought was a normal WhatsApp call and I'm fully faked

0:13:34.754 --> 0:13:37.594
<v Speaker 1>hand in my dressing gown was no underwear, literally looking orange,

0:13:37.634 --> 0:13:39.754
<v Speaker 1>and because I didn't have my glasses on, I answered

0:13:39.754 --> 0:13:42.474
<v Speaker 1>his WhatsApp phone call but it was a video. So

0:13:42.554 --> 0:13:45.034
<v Speaker 1>then I've got to chat for half an hour looking

0:13:45.074 --> 0:13:48.594
<v Speaker 1>like an umplump but with low breasts hanging. Luckily he

0:13:48.634 --> 0:13:50.554
<v Speaker 1>was on the sofa, he wears glasses. I'm not sure

0:13:50.554 --> 0:13:52.434
<v Speaker 1>what he did and didn't see. Anyway, what I'm trying

0:13:52.474 --> 0:13:54.554
<v Speaker 1>to say is I'm trying to build our love story

0:13:54.954 --> 0:13:56.514
<v Speaker 1>for you, so you can see. Now at this point

0:13:56.754 --> 0:13:58.914
<v Speaker 1>you see a bit. He didn't see my bits, but

0:13:58.954 --> 0:14:00.714
<v Speaker 1>I did have to fess up. You know, I had

0:14:00.714 --> 0:14:02.874
<v Speaker 1>to keep moving the camera up because I was very

0:14:02.874 --> 0:14:05.434
<v Speaker 1>orange and braless. Anyway, we'd had lovely two and a

0:14:05.434 --> 0:14:07.634
<v Speaker 1>half hours together. We now had the half an hour

0:14:07.714 --> 0:14:12.474
<v Speaker 1>on the FaceTime and then the Friday, Claude suggested no

0:14:12.554 --> 0:14:15.274
<v Speaker 1>contact because we'd had the nice chat the night before.

0:14:15.274 --> 0:14:18.754
<v Speaker 1>So I was like, good plan, Claude. Saturday morning, he

0:14:18.874 --> 0:14:21.234
<v Speaker 1>reaches out with a photo of his Welsh mug, saying,

0:14:21.274 --> 0:14:23.274
<v Speaker 1>all thinking of you cuse I grew up in Wales

0:14:23.274 --> 0:14:24.794
<v Speaker 1>and chat chat chat. This is what I'm doing with

0:14:24.794 --> 0:14:27.074
<v Speaker 1>my son today, and what time shall I pick you

0:14:27.154 --> 0:14:29.794
<v Speaker 1>up tomorrow? And you know, ten or ten thirty and

0:14:29.794 --> 0:14:31.954
<v Speaker 1>we're having a laugh about you know, is he coming

0:14:31.994 --> 0:14:33.914
<v Speaker 1>in his horse and car or a motorbike. He's like,

0:14:33.954 --> 0:14:37.514
<v Speaker 1>you know, talking about just good normal fun banter. So

0:14:37.674 --> 0:14:39.874
<v Speaker 1>ten o'clock is the you know, the time he's going.

0:14:39.954 --> 0:14:41.634
<v Speaker 1>He's now I've got my dress, Kath.

0:14:41.794 --> 0:14:44.794
<v Speaker 2>I feel like I'm watching a thriller. This is like

0:14:44.874 --> 0:14:46.634
<v Speaker 2>literally a bit of thriller than I would ever make.

0:14:46.834 --> 0:14:50.554
<v Speaker 1>Yes, he's going straight into my book anyway, So I've

0:14:50.554 --> 0:14:52.594
<v Speaker 1>got my outfit planned because you've got to be cash.

0:14:52.674 --> 0:14:54.794
<v Speaker 1>We're gonna have a coffee and a walk. So I'm like,

0:14:54.874 --> 0:14:56.594
<v Speaker 1>you know, I want to look nice but also a

0:14:56.634 --> 0:14:59.514
<v Speaker 1>bit cash but not fully like cra So I'm all planned.

0:14:59.874 --> 0:15:02.874
<v Speaker 1>I wake up at seven am to a text from

0:15:02.954 --> 0:15:08.274
<v Speaker 1>him at six thirty seven am, Hi, Cath, sorry, had

0:15:08.274 --> 0:15:11.194
<v Speaker 1>an impromptu night out with the lads. Just getting in.

0:15:11.674 --> 0:15:15.994
<v Speaker 1>I'll have to cancel six thirty seven, just getting in.

0:15:16.194 --> 0:15:21.354
<v Speaker 1>He's fifty two, some big big red flags there, so

0:15:21.474 --> 0:15:23.354
<v Speaker 1>I have to you know, and you know someone can

0:15:23.354 --> 0:15:25.314
<v Speaker 1>see what you've said on WhatsApp, so I just thought

0:15:25.634 --> 0:15:27.234
<v Speaker 1>I just wrote, okay, thanks for that.

0:15:28.594 --> 0:15:28.994
<v Speaker 4>Anyway.

0:15:29.314 --> 0:15:30.754
<v Speaker 1>I then sort of spend the rest of the day

0:15:30.754 --> 0:15:33.234
<v Speaker 1>wondering how long his hangover or big night out will last,

0:15:33.274 --> 0:15:35.674
<v Speaker 1>and when I'll hear from him with an apology or

0:15:35.994 --> 0:15:40.794
<v Speaker 1>let's let's reschedule with you know, plan b nothing, what

0:15:40.994 --> 0:15:45.594
<v Speaker 1>you're feeling, very sad. Nothing on the Sunday. So by

0:15:45.634 --> 0:15:46.354
<v Speaker 1>Monday night.

0:15:46.394 --> 0:15:47.074
<v Speaker 3>Big hangover.

0:15:47.394 --> 0:15:51.474
<v Speaker 1>It's a big hangover. By Monday night, I'm sat with Claude.

0:15:51.554 --> 0:15:55.074
<v Speaker 1>I've put it all in. I've put it all in

0:15:55.434 --> 0:15:58.234
<v Speaker 1>and he said, I said, you know that was my response,

0:15:58.234 --> 0:16:00.874
<v Speaker 1>and he said, that's a very dignified response. Well done.

0:16:01.154 --> 0:16:04.434
<v Speaker 1>But how are you feeling, because that's a cancelation the

0:16:04.514 --> 0:16:08.154
<v Speaker 1>morning of after a week of really lovely bill. That stings.

0:16:08.594 --> 0:16:10.594
<v Speaker 1>I was like, it did, and then he said, but

0:16:10.674 --> 0:16:13.194
<v Speaker 1>the cancelation coming home at six thirty seven on a

0:16:13.234 --> 0:16:15.314
<v Speaker 1>Sunday morning after a big night out, canceling on the

0:16:15.394 --> 0:16:19.114
<v Speaker 1>date date, that's that needs a moment of reflection, he said. Anyway,

0:16:19.394 --> 0:16:22.874
<v Speaker 1>but also the second date. He didn't suggest rescheduling in

0:16:22.914 --> 0:16:26.474
<v Speaker 1>the message that bit matters, and I was like, no,

0:16:26.594 --> 0:16:29.834
<v Speaker 1>he's right anyway. The next day I still haven't heard

0:16:29.834 --> 0:16:32.234
<v Speaker 1>from him, and now I just wanted to be really cross.

0:16:32.234 --> 0:16:33.914
<v Speaker 1>I want to be a disappointed mum. I want to

0:16:33.914 --> 0:16:37.634
<v Speaker 1>be teacher. I want to tell him off. I took

0:16:37.634 --> 0:16:41.834
<v Speaker 1>it to Claude and Claude said, do not contact him, Yes, Claude,

0:16:41.914 --> 0:16:44.594
<v Speaker 1>do not call him, do not text him, do not WhatsApp,

0:16:44.754 --> 0:16:47.554
<v Speaker 1>do not on do anything on Instagram. Nothing. And here

0:16:47.634 --> 0:16:49.994
<v Speaker 1>is the simple truth. And this is why it's worth

0:16:49.994 --> 0:16:53.434
<v Speaker 1>paying claud every month. He wrote, he knows where you are,

0:16:53.834 --> 0:16:57.394
<v Speaker 1>he has your number. If he wanted to apologize and reschedule,

0:16:57.474 --> 0:16:59.794
<v Speaker 1>he would have done it by now. A message from

0:16:59.834 --> 0:17:02.874
<v Speaker 1>you won't create something that isn't there it will just

0:17:02.954 --> 0:17:06.073
<v Speaker 1>cost you your dignity and give him power he hasn't earned.

0:17:06.834 --> 0:17:08.674
<v Speaker 1>This is why Mike dropped Claude.

0:17:08.754 --> 0:17:11.714
<v Speaker 4>This is why people are marrying Ai bot No, but

0:17:11.794 --> 0:17:12.313
<v Speaker 4>we could have.

0:17:12.394 --> 0:17:15.554
<v Speaker 2>I mean, with all due respect to Claude, I could

0:17:15.594 --> 0:17:16.674
<v Speaker 2>have said those exact words.

0:17:16.754 --> 0:17:18.234
<v Speaker 1>I know. But you also don't want to be the

0:17:18.274 --> 0:17:21.234
<v Speaker 1>needy friend that goes out. Do you think this text

0:17:21.314 --> 0:17:23.434
<v Speaker 1>meant that or that? So it's kind of it was

0:17:23.514 --> 0:17:23.954
<v Speaker 1>come over.

0:17:23.914 --> 0:17:26.634
<v Speaker 2>Tex, But I feel happy for you. I'll tell you why, okay,

0:17:26.634 --> 0:17:29.074
<v Speaker 2>because I'm going to put a positive spin on this, Okay,

0:17:29.114 --> 0:17:34.434
<v Speaker 2>which it is positive. Forget about romantic relationships. In any relationships,

0:17:34.874 --> 0:17:37.914
<v Speaker 2>people tell you who they are very early. Always people

0:17:37.954 --> 0:17:40.874
<v Speaker 2>cannot hide who they really are. That's my theory. And

0:17:40.954 --> 0:17:43.714
<v Speaker 2>he told you who he was early, so he didn't.

0:17:44.034 --> 0:17:45.474
<v Speaker 2>You should think of it as a gift that he

0:17:45.514 --> 0:17:49.874
<v Speaker 2>did not waste any more of your precious, beautiful, amazing time.

0:17:50.754 --> 0:17:52.674
<v Speaker 2>And I think he's done you a massive favor. And

0:17:52.834 --> 0:17:55.234
<v Speaker 2>I would never think about him again, I would never

0:17:55.274 --> 0:17:57.074
<v Speaker 2>text him again. I would not give him one more

0:17:57.114 --> 0:18:00.594
<v Speaker 2>second of your valuable time because he told you exactly

0:18:00.634 --> 0:18:03.034
<v Speaker 2>who he was in the second that he sent that text.

0:18:03.034 --> 0:18:06.954
<v Speaker 4>At six thirty seven, but I want to be with something.

0:18:07.274 --> 0:18:09.154
<v Speaker 4>Party's still at fifty.

0:18:08.834 --> 0:18:12.594
<v Speaker 3>Two, fifty two, grow the f up for God's date

0:18:13.034 --> 0:18:15.234
<v Speaker 3>for ten thirty the next morning? On what planet are

0:18:15.274 --> 0:18:17.074
<v Speaker 3>you coming home at six thirty? I mean, know what play?

0:18:17.114 --> 0:18:18.914
<v Speaker 3>Are you doing that? Anyway? But like you've got a

0:18:18.994 --> 0:18:20.474
<v Speaker 3>date the next day? Why are you coming home at

0:18:20.514 --> 0:18:22.874
<v Speaker 3>six thirty? I do want to ask you a question, though,

0:18:23.194 --> 0:18:25.553
<v Speaker 3>I'd say, in a week's time, he texts you and

0:18:25.634 --> 0:18:27.154
<v Speaker 3>turns on the charm, what are we doing then?

0:18:27.514 --> 0:18:28.234
<v Speaker 4>No?

0:18:28.234 --> 0:18:32.154
<v Speaker 1>No, we're ghosting a yeah, yeah, no, Because but I

0:18:32.154 --> 0:18:34.354
<v Speaker 1>would like to say for anyone who is out there

0:18:34.554 --> 0:18:37.834
<v Speaker 1>single and dating at our time of life, it's hard

0:18:37.874 --> 0:18:41.073
<v Speaker 1>because you're being vulnerable, you're putting yourself out there and

0:18:41.154 --> 0:18:43.834
<v Speaker 1>you open your heart up, and you know, I did.

0:18:43.874 --> 0:18:45.994
<v Speaker 1>I felt like I got dumped at high school all

0:18:46.074 --> 0:18:47.794
<v Speaker 1>over again, Like it.

0:18:47.914 --> 0:18:51.394
<v Speaker 2>Sucks, it sucks, it's so interesting, and I look again.

0:18:51.554 --> 0:18:55.273
<v Speaker 2>I was single for many, many, many, many many, and

0:18:55.434 --> 0:18:57.994
<v Speaker 2>let me repeat many years I was. I was in

0:18:58.114 --> 0:19:00.274
<v Speaker 2>very short relationships for the most part. Before I met

0:19:00.314 --> 0:19:03.914
<v Speaker 2>my husband, I was single, and I remember that feeling vividly.

0:19:04.394 --> 0:19:05.234
<v Speaker 1>I don't know why.

0:19:05.274 --> 0:19:07.434
<v Speaker 2>I've heard a lot lately, maybe there's a lot in

0:19:07.474 --> 0:19:09.714
<v Speaker 2>the media. But I was listening to do you know

0:19:09.754 --> 0:19:12.194
<v Speaker 2>who de Salmon is? Okay, So I was listening to

0:19:12.194 --> 0:19:15.434
<v Speaker 2>her No Filter, and she's a radio host. I think

0:19:15.514 --> 0:19:17.194
<v Speaker 2>I didn't really know who she was, and I was

0:19:17.274 --> 0:19:20.553
<v Speaker 2>listening to her be interviewed on No Filter. And what

0:19:20.674 --> 0:19:24.474
<v Speaker 2>I loved about the conversation she had with Kate. She

0:19:24.674 --> 0:19:27.594
<v Speaker 2>talks about romantic relationships not being the be all and

0:19:27.754 --> 0:19:30.274
<v Speaker 2>end all, but that her life is full of familiar

0:19:30.274 --> 0:19:35.874
<v Speaker 2>relationships of friend relationships and how meaningful they fill her cup,

0:19:36.274 --> 0:19:39.194
<v Speaker 2>and that she is in a beautiful romantic relationship and.

0:19:39.114 --> 0:19:39.674
<v Speaker 1>She loves that.

0:19:39.754 --> 0:19:41.714
<v Speaker 2>But she said, very honestly, if that went away, my

0:19:41.794 --> 0:19:44.634
<v Speaker 2>life would not fall apart. And I just thought it

0:19:44.714 --> 0:19:48.474
<v Speaker 2>was such an interesting perspective from someone relatively young and

0:19:48.594 --> 0:19:50.634
<v Speaker 2>kind of out there and in a relationship, and it

0:19:50.674 --> 0:19:53.274
<v Speaker 2>made me think about my own life. And I love

0:19:53.314 --> 0:19:55.274
<v Speaker 2>my husband, don't get me wrong. I mean I hope

0:19:55.274 --> 0:19:57.674
<v Speaker 2>to be married for a long time, but I have

0:19:57.794 --> 0:20:02.834
<v Speaker 2>a very full, loving life outside of that. And I'm

0:20:02.834 --> 0:20:06.354
<v Speaker 2>not saying stop looking, but I'm just saying, like, it

0:20:06.434 --> 0:20:08.553
<v Speaker 2>is incredible like you have that. I know you do

0:20:08.634 --> 0:20:12.114
<v Speaker 2>because you talk about your amazing friendships. You talk about

0:20:12.114 --> 0:20:14.674
<v Speaker 2>your relationship with your family, and you have more you

0:20:14.674 --> 0:20:17.754
<v Speaker 2>have almost more love than anyone I know. So just

0:20:17.794 --> 0:20:20.154
<v Speaker 2>I want to remind you of that because it's just

0:20:20.154 --> 0:20:22.074
<v Speaker 2>something I've been thinking a lot about that's in the media.

0:20:22.194 --> 0:20:22.394
<v Speaker 6>Yeah.

0:20:22.474 --> 0:20:24.394
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, And I mean two things off the back of that.

0:20:25.194 --> 0:20:27.314
<v Speaker 1>I think with a Kylie Docco when she talked about

0:20:27.314 --> 0:20:29.634
<v Speaker 1>Michael being the love of her life but still having

0:20:29.634 --> 0:20:31.313
<v Speaker 1>a full life, I had that moment where I was like,

0:20:31.674 --> 0:20:34.554
<v Speaker 1>maybe I've had all of the relationship love I meant

0:20:34.554 --> 0:20:38.074
<v Speaker 1>to have, you know, in this lifetime. And then I did.

0:20:38.114 --> 0:20:40.154
<v Speaker 1>I looked around. I was like, yeah, I have so

0:20:40.274 --> 0:20:43.354
<v Speaker 1>much love in my life. And Sally Hepworth she sort

0:20:43.394 --> 0:20:45.434
<v Speaker 1>of checked in when she knew the date to you

0:20:45.434 --> 0:20:47.954
<v Speaker 1>know what had happened, and it was great talk to

0:20:47.954 --> 0:20:50.394
<v Speaker 1>her and you know, be vulnerable, and she just said

0:20:50.794 --> 0:20:52.553
<v Speaker 1>I think this. I think the piece here for you

0:20:52.714 --> 0:20:55.834
<v Speaker 1>is self love. Yes, you know, is to just is

0:20:55.874 --> 0:20:58.314
<v Speaker 1>to just do exactly what you said, fill your own cup.

0:20:58.474 --> 0:21:10.914
<v Speaker 8>Yeah.

0:21:11.234 --> 0:21:13.514
<v Speaker 3>Okay, guys, I've got something that I need to talk about.

0:21:14.514 --> 0:21:15.394
<v Speaker 2>Okay.

0:21:15.474 --> 0:21:16.994
<v Speaker 3>So I have a lot of kids.

0:21:17.394 --> 0:21:18.154
<v Speaker 2>How many kids?

0:21:18.274 --> 0:21:21.354
<v Speaker 3>So there's three and three? So three that came from

0:21:21.354 --> 0:21:23.114
<v Speaker 3>my employance, and three that I got for a week,

0:21:24.474 --> 0:21:27.674
<v Speaker 3>no Alis, but what has happened, So I've got too.

0:21:28.074 --> 0:21:31.834
<v Speaker 3>My two eldest did UNI exchange in America and have

0:21:31.994 --> 0:21:34.434
<v Speaker 3>ended up living there, right, so they both have met

0:21:34.474 --> 0:21:38.314
<v Speaker 3>American girls, married American girls. I now have American grandchildren.

0:21:39.314 --> 0:21:44.114
<v Speaker 3>And I never left home or did anything, and I

0:21:44.194 --> 0:21:47.314
<v Speaker 3>was I've never lived anywhere else other than Sydney, really,

0:21:47.674 --> 0:21:49.674
<v Speaker 3>and so I was kind of really excited for them

0:21:49.754 --> 0:21:53.273
<v Speaker 3>to go and spread their wings, you know, move out,

0:21:53.754 --> 0:21:57.514
<v Speaker 3>you know, have amazing opportunities overseas, and I've always been

0:21:57.554 --> 0:21:59.274
<v Speaker 3>so happy for them that they've been able to spread

0:21:59.314 --> 0:22:02.313
<v Speaker 3>their wings, something I never got to do. But we

0:22:02.434 --> 0:22:05.273
<v Speaker 3>tend to FaceTime in the mornings, my mornings, and I

0:22:05.354 --> 0:22:07.034
<v Speaker 3>often get the girls in the bar or the girl

0:22:07.234 --> 0:22:10.553
<v Speaker 3>feeding dinner. And one day it just like hit me.

0:22:11.474 --> 0:22:16.074
<v Speaker 3>My kids are now American, my granddaughters are American. I'm

0:22:16.114 --> 0:22:18.234
<v Speaker 3>never going to live in the same country as them

0:22:18.274 --> 0:22:21.594
<v Speaker 3>for the rest of my life, and any future grandchildren

0:22:21.634 --> 0:22:24.114
<v Speaker 3>I have from my two sons are going to be

0:22:24.154 --> 0:22:29.553
<v Speaker 3>American grandchildren. And I want to be really positive and

0:22:29.594 --> 0:22:32.754
<v Speaker 3>optimistic and really happy for them, and I am, but

0:22:32.754 --> 0:22:34.834
<v Speaker 3>it's hard on me, right, It's really hard that I

0:22:34.874 --> 0:22:37.474
<v Speaker 3>can't cuddle them whenever I want. I can't hug them

0:22:37.474 --> 0:22:39.674
<v Speaker 3>whenever I want, I can't call them whenever I want,

0:22:39.674 --> 0:22:42.834
<v Speaker 3>because you know, the timing is all wrong. And so.

0:22:44.314 --> 0:22:45.514
<v Speaker 1>You guys have all.

0:22:45.394 --> 0:22:48.954
<v Speaker 3>Your all parents, you have all lived overseas and had

0:22:48.994 --> 0:22:51.714
<v Speaker 3>to leave your parents, and you've all got kids coming

0:22:51.714 --> 0:22:53.834
<v Speaker 3>into this age group where they're going to start thinking

0:22:53.834 --> 0:22:55.234
<v Speaker 3>about maybe.

0:22:55.074 --> 0:22:57.434
<v Speaker 1>UNI overseas, careers overseas.

0:22:57.914 --> 0:22:59.914
<v Speaker 3>And I wanted to know, have you ever thought about

0:22:59.954 --> 0:23:03.234
<v Speaker 3>how you would handle your kids coming to you and going,

0:23:03.594 --> 0:23:05.553
<v Speaker 3>Mam I moving to London or Mum I moving to

0:23:05.594 --> 0:23:06.674
<v Speaker 3>New York? How would you deal with that?

0:23:07.154 --> 0:23:07.834
<v Speaker 2>How do you feel?

0:23:08.554 --> 0:23:09.114
<v Speaker 5>I feel?

0:23:09.954 --> 0:23:12.114
<v Speaker 3>I guess what I want to say is that I'm

0:23:12.234 --> 0:23:15.634
<v Speaker 3>full of love and excitement and admiration and I just say, fly,

0:23:15.754 --> 0:23:20.234
<v Speaker 3>little birds, be free, And that's fantasy me. But in

0:23:20.274 --> 0:23:23.954
<v Speaker 3>my darker moments, I feel sorry for myself because I

0:23:23.994 --> 0:23:28.033
<v Speaker 3>am missing these extraordinary moments. And I don't think we

0:23:28.114 --> 0:23:30.394
<v Speaker 3>think too much about being grandparents when we're younger, but

0:23:30.434 --> 0:23:32.034
<v Speaker 3>you just assume you're going to be able to cuddle

0:23:32.074 --> 0:23:33.954
<v Speaker 3>your grandchildren all the time, and they're going to be

0:23:33.954 --> 0:23:34.954
<v Speaker 3>there on demand and they're not.

0:23:36.394 --> 0:23:37.954
<v Speaker 1>So I've got four girls that are.

0:23:37.834 --> 0:23:40.594
<v Speaker 3>Just gonna have to like I'm like, come oniktok, let's move,

0:23:40.674 --> 0:23:43.074
<v Speaker 3>let's move this situation. I need some grandchildren in Australia.

0:23:43.114 --> 0:23:47.194
<v Speaker 3>But I do want to know whether I'm being reasonable

0:23:47.234 --> 0:23:49.394
<v Speaker 3>and kind of bounce it off the tribe and just

0:23:49.474 --> 0:23:51.434
<v Speaker 3>kind of get your sense sense check this.

0:23:51.754 --> 0:23:54.994
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, well, I mean I'm close to it. You know,

0:23:55.114 --> 0:23:59.434
<v Speaker 1>loose seventeen and a half. He plays plays rugby. You

0:23:59.474 --> 0:24:02.114
<v Speaker 1>know he could Yeah, he could play in the country

0:24:02.154 --> 0:24:06.034
<v Speaker 1>or could play overseas. I don't know. I thought, because

0:24:06.074 --> 0:24:08.914
<v Speaker 1>Andrew and I, that's my husband, separated when lou was

0:24:08.954 --> 0:24:12.914
<v Speaker 1>only five. I've spent the last eleven years losing him

0:24:12.994 --> 0:24:15.554
<v Speaker 1>every half of the week, and so I thought, you know,

0:24:15.634 --> 0:24:18.994
<v Speaker 1>I kind of got over my grief and my sadness

0:24:20.194 --> 0:24:24.474
<v Speaker 1>and feeling lost early on, and I thought, hey, empty nesting,

0:24:24.674 --> 0:24:27.754
<v Speaker 1>I won't feel that, smug bitch. And it's so weird

0:24:27.794 --> 0:24:31.194
<v Speaker 1>now that he's about to get to that age. It's

0:24:31.234 --> 0:24:36.194
<v Speaker 1>a whole new sense of grief that's coming across and loneliness,

0:24:36.234 --> 0:24:38.834
<v Speaker 1>maybe because he's at that age where you get nothing

0:24:39.194 --> 0:24:42.154
<v Speaker 1>from a teenage boy. So they are there eating all

0:24:42.154 --> 0:24:44.194
<v Speaker 1>of the food or needing the lift, but there's no

0:24:44.994 --> 0:24:46.954
<v Speaker 1>you get the moments when they want to chat, you know,

0:24:47.074 --> 0:24:49.434
<v Speaker 1>so I feel I don't know. And then on the

0:24:49.434 --> 0:24:52.833
<v Speaker 1>flip side, I left, you know, my home when I

0:24:52.914 --> 0:24:55.194
<v Speaker 1>was in my twenties two and have been the other

0:24:55.234 --> 0:24:57.513
<v Speaker 1>side of the world for longer than I lived in

0:24:57.514 --> 0:25:01.354
<v Speaker 1>the UK, and I miss my sister and her kids.

0:25:01.434 --> 0:25:04.594
<v Speaker 1>You know, suddenly I get to see them every Christmas,

0:25:04.634 --> 0:25:08.033
<v Speaker 1>you know, if I'm lucky, and that it's hard. So

0:25:08.114 --> 0:25:10.914
<v Speaker 1>I think when you as soon as you have more

0:25:10.914 --> 0:25:14.154
<v Speaker 1>than one home or bets are off, aren't they you

0:25:14.234 --> 0:25:17.154
<v Speaker 1>do sort of feel there's joy, and there's there's one.

0:25:17.314 --> 0:25:20.074
<v Speaker 1>You know, there's connectivity around the world, but there is

0:25:20.114 --> 0:25:23.554
<v Speaker 1>also you're always missing something. I think when you've when

0:25:23.554 --> 0:25:25.554
<v Speaker 1>that happens, or your kids move somewhere else.

0:25:25.794 --> 0:25:28.634
<v Speaker 2>I think about it all the time because number one,

0:25:28.674 --> 0:25:31.313
<v Speaker 2>I have twins, so I think about it in the

0:25:31.354 --> 0:25:33.273
<v Speaker 2>context of they're going to leave at the same time.

0:25:33.754 --> 0:25:36.834
<v Speaker 2>So I'm just going it's gonna be like my heart

0:25:36.954 --> 0:25:40.474
<v Speaker 2>being ripped open because they're both gonna abandon me at

0:25:40.514 --> 0:25:44.354
<v Speaker 2>the same time. And even though they're only thirteen now.

0:25:44.554 --> 0:25:47.874
<v Speaker 2>My perspective on living overseas is very different because I

0:25:47.994 --> 0:25:51.554
<v Speaker 2>essentially did what your sons did, right. And I make

0:25:51.674 --> 0:25:54.834
<v Speaker 2>jokes that you never know what's coming because I've made

0:25:54.914 --> 0:25:58.194
<v Speaker 2>my way back to Australia. I went Sydney, London, London,

0:25:58.194 --> 0:26:00.954
<v Speaker 2>New York, New York, La, LA, back to Sydney, so

0:26:00.994 --> 0:26:03.513
<v Speaker 2>you never know where you're gonna live. But my daughter,

0:26:03.714 --> 0:26:06.874
<v Speaker 2>who is so American, literally says to me all the time,

0:26:07.514 --> 0:26:09.434
<v Speaker 2>I just need you to know, like I'm obviously not

0:26:09.434 --> 0:26:12.274
<v Speaker 2>going to go to college in Australia. I'm thinking New York,

0:26:12.354 --> 0:26:16.754
<v Speaker 2>London or Paris, but like, just know, prepare yourself and

0:26:16.834 --> 0:26:18.793
<v Speaker 2>my son. I don't know what's going to happen. But

0:26:19.514 --> 0:26:22.474
<v Speaker 2>my perspective is and I think you're really lucky because

0:26:22.514 --> 0:26:24.714
<v Speaker 2>you do travel. You have this amazing business, so it

0:26:24.754 --> 0:26:27.674
<v Speaker 2>takes you to America all the time. So I think

0:26:27.834 --> 0:26:30.553
<v Speaker 2>if I was you, I would reframe it because what

0:26:30.634 --> 0:26:32.674
<v Speaker 2>I think about and I make jokes and I'm going

0:26:32.714 --> 0:26:35.274
<v Speaker 2>to go live wherever my daughter is. She's like, yeah,

0:26:35.314 --> 0:26:36.914
<v Speaker 2>you're not doing that. I was like, I might be

0:26:36.954 --> 0:26:40.154
<v Speaker 2>filming there, you don't know. But my perspective is thinking

0:26:40.194 --> 0:26:42.954
<v Speaker 2>about it as an adventure for ourselves in the future,

0:26:43.594 --> 0:26:46.234
<v Speaker 2>you know what I mean, Like in some ways it

0:26:46.354 --> 0:26:48.874
<v Speaker 2>liberates you. Right, we film all over the world, so

0:26:49.474 --> 0:26:51.394
<v Speaker 2>my perspective is like I'm going to have a base

0:26:51.434 --> 0:26:54.394
<v Speaker 2>in Sydney and then just basically go wherever they are.

0:26:54.794 --> 0:26:56.634
<v Speaker 1>When they leave home, which.

0:26:56.514 --> 0:27:00.554
<v Speaker 2>Might be considered stalking. No, No, I think about it

0:27:00.594 --> 0:27:02.234
<v Speaker 2>all the time. I think it's a really real thing

0:27:02.434 --> 0:27:04.634
<v Speaker 2>for a lot of our listeners. I imagine it's.

0:27:04.514 --> 0:27:06.994
<v Speaker 4>A really big thing for people. I mean, I loved

0:27:07.234 --> 0:27:10.914
<v Speaker 4>home my son. My son's age like twelve thirteen to

0:27:11.114 --> 0:27:14.114
<v Speaker 4>UK boarding school, so I didn't know that grace.

0:27:14.234 --> 0:27:14.394
<v Speaker 8>Yeah.

0:27:14.434 --> 0:27:17.513
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, so we left quite young. And so that's why

0:27:17.514 --> 0:27:22.114
<v Speaker 4>I'm very independent and I don't do guilt trips my parents.

0:27:22.154 --> 0:27:24.593
<v Speaker 4>I don't do any of that, maybe because I was

0:27:24.874 --> 0:27:29.074
<v Speaker 4>trained that way and my son is everything to me.

0:27:30.074 --> 0:27:33.194
<v Speaker 4>And of course I think about when he leaves, I'm

0:27:33.234 --> 0:27:36.874
<v Speaker 4>gonna be like basket case one hundred percent because I

0:27:36.994 --> 0:27:41.874
<v Speaker 4>worried about him so much and it's not gonna be pretty,

0:27:42.074 --> 0:27:44.754
<v Speaker 4>and I feel sorry for my husband, Jason. But at

0:27:44.754 --> 0:27:47.874
<v Speaker 4>the same time, because I've lived in so many cities

0:27:47.914 --> 0:27:49.594
<v Speaker 4>and worked in so many cities, like from New York,

0:27:49.794 --> 0:27:51.954
<v Speaker 4>I mean I left to go to Paris on my own,

0:27:51.994 --> 0:27:54.954
<v Speaker 4>I couldn't speak French and I lived in Paris for

0:27:55.034 --> 0:27:57.834
<v Speaker 4>nine months and didn't know anybody. And when I moved

0:27:57.874 --> 0:28:03.074
<v Speaker 4>to per for Shanghai or you know, Beijing, didn't know anyone.

0:28:03.354 --> 0:28:07.954
<v Speaker 4>So that is not something that I think I'm scared of.

0:28:08.954 --> 0:28:12.554
<v Speaker 4>At the same time, I've only got one son, so

0:28:12.634 --> 0:28:15.754
<v Speaker 4>he is my everything, but not to put pressure on

0:28:15.834 --> 0:28:19.073
<v Speaker 4>him as well. I think sometimes when we paint a

0:28:19.114 --> 0:28:22.914
<v Speaker 4>picture of how family should be, it doesn't always work

0:28:22.994 --> 0:28:26.994
<v Speaker 4>out that way. It doesn't always paint as hunky dory.

0:28:27.354 --> 0:28:29.394
<v Speaker 4>So this is some reality that a lot of people

0:28:29.474 --> 0:28:32.634
<v Speaker 4>don't think about. And even if you live in the

0:28:32.674 --> 0:28:35.194
<v Speaker 4>same country, it doesn't mean that it's going to be harmony. True.

0:28:35.434 --> 0:28:37.874
<v Speaker 2>That's so true. And I think the world's getting smaller

0:28:38.154 --> 0:28:42.874
<v Speaker 2>and my mom's probably listening. I see her less now

0:28:42.914 --> 0:28:44.794
<v Speaker 2>that she lives in Melbourne and I'm an hour away

0:28:44.794 --> 0:28:47.194
<v Speaker 2>than when I lived in Los Angeles. She would come

0:28:47.234 --> 0:28:49.514
<v Speaker 2>for like eight weeks at a time. She would say this,

0:28:49.674 --> 0:28:52.274
<v Speaker 2>and she's right, and it's not good and going I

0:28:52.314 --> 0:28:55.274
<v Speaker 2>need to change that. But it's so funny. When you're close,

0:28:55.394 --> 0:28:57.754
<v Speaker 2>sometimes you don't see each other as much because you're

0:28:57.794 --> 0:29:00.594
<v Speaker 2>just in your life. But yeah, I just think you

0:29:00.754 --> 0:29:02.674
<v Speaker 2>make of it what you will. That will be direct

0:29:02.674 --> 0:29:06.474
<v Speaker 2>flights and everyone, yeah, everyone talking about our children.

0:29:07.354 --> 0:29:11.474
<v Speaker 4>My son has become my teacher, so you know how

0:29:11.554 --> 0:29:14.114
<v Speaker 4>we're parents were always thinking that we're teaching our kids,

0:29:14.314 --> 0:29:18.194
<v Speaker 4>but actually I realized that after having my child, he

0:29:18.554 --> 0:29:23.754
<v Speaker 4>is my ultimate master, seaful teacher, coach everything because he

0:29:23.994 --> 0:29:26.634
<v Speaker 4>is a great mix of me and Jason, my husband.

0:29:27.394 --> 0:29:33.314
<v Speaker 4>And something happened recently that I regretted because I was

0:29:33.354 --> 0:29:37.554
<v Speaker 4>having a very overwhelming day and I spoke to my mom.

0:29:37.954 --> 0:29:40.794
<v Speaker 4>She said something very inconsiderate, so I was already fired up,

0:29:41.514 --> 0:29:43.594
<v Speaker 4>so the whole day was kind of ruined. Then I

0:29:43.634 --> 0:29:47.554
<v Speaker 4>said to my husband, Jason, sometimes I wish I'm single,

0:29:48.314 --> 0:29:50.954
<v Speaker 4>meaning and I did say to my husband, I said,

0:29:50.914 --> 0:29:56.154
<v Speaker 4>it doesn't mean that I regret marrying you, not having children,

0:29:56.194 --> 0:29:59.874
<v Speaker 4>not having my child something. You might not be aware

0:29:59.954 --> 0:30:02.434
<v Speaker 4>that I'm a very direct person. Oh no, I know

0:30:02.554 --> 0:30:04.114
<v Speaker 4>you didn't know that. I'm just telling you now.

0:30:04.354 --> 0:30:05.794
<v Speaker 2>I called you a grace bam bam.

0:30:05.994 --> 0:30:10.554
<v Speaker 4>Yeah exactly. So sometimes my directness doesn't quite agree with

0:30:10.914 --> 0:30:13.514
<v Speaker 4>majority of people because they've got like fucking baby.

0:30:13.274 --> 0:30:16.434
<v Speaker 1>Ears or and or feeling well yeah.

0:30:16.674 --> 0:30:19.714
<v Speaker 4>That is why I train my son quite hard in

0:30:19.754 --> 0:30:21.954
<v Speaker 4>that sense, because I don't want him to be too

0:30:22.034 --> 0:30:24.434
<v Speaker 4>sensitive when people say things that are not even related

0:30:24.474 --> 0:30:29.114
<v Speaker 4>attacking him. So he is really good in studying how

0:30:29.154 --> 0:30:31.594
<v Speaker 4>I speak to him, and it doesn't face him, you know.

0:30:32.554 --> 0:30:34.994
<v Speaker 4>But when I said that, I didn't know that he heard.

0:30:35.594 --> 0:30:36.514
<v Speaker 4>And then he told me.

0:30:36.514 --> 0:30:42.074
<v Speaker 2>After, oh he heard you, yes, okay, so then.

0:30:41.954 --> 0:30:44.874
<v Speaker 4>I was I felt so bad because he's my only

0:30:44.914 --> 0:30:47.634
<v Speaker 4>son and I loved him so much. When he told

0:30:47.634 --> 0:30:52.034
<v Speaker 4>me that he heard me, I started crying. Oh, and then.

0:30:53.434 --> 0:30:55.674
<v Speaker 2>No, no, I'm.

0:30:55.514 --> 0:30:57.634
<v Speaker 4>Not going to cry because I've got really thick eyeliner.

0:30:58.474 --> 0:31:00.914
<v Speaker 4>We've got tissues. Yes, I'm not going to ruin my makeup.

0:31:01.954 --> 0:31:05.954
<v Speaker 4>But because he's so important to me, and I felt bad,

0:31:07.234 --> 0:31:09.234
<v Speaker 4>and I had to explain to him that when I

0:31:09.274 --> 0:31:12.074
<v Speaker 4>was single, I didn't have to worry about anyone. I

0:31:12.074 --> 0:31:15.954
<v Speaker 4>didn't worry about me, and it was so liberating because

0:31:16.154 --> 0:31:18.234
<v Speaker 4>now when you have a family, it's so much pressure.

0:31:18.354 --> 0:31:20.914
<v Speaker 4>And it's because I care so much. I wish I'm

0:31:20.954 --> 0:31:24.514
<v Speaker 4>one of those moms that are so carefree and don't

0:31:24.514 --> 0:31:27.314
<v Speaker 4>care about anything and just let their children do whatever. Right,

0:31:27.594 --> 0:31:29.954
<v Speaker 4>I'm just not like that. And I want him to

0:31:29.954 --> 0:31:33.634
<v Speaker 4>protect himself in every way, and that's why it gets

0:31:33.714 --> 0:31:39.074
<v Speaker 4>to me when things are overwhelming. And then it hung

0:31:39.114 --> 0:31:42.514
<v Speaker 4>over my head for so many hours. But I don't

0:31:42.594 --> 0:31:44.794
<v Speaker 4>let things faster, like when I'm mad at Jason or

0:31:44.874 --> 0:31:46.794
<v Speaker 4>him or whatever. So it's only twenty four hours. That's

0:31:46.794 --> 0:31:49.914
<v Speaker 4>my rule. The next day, I said to my son,

0:31:50.314 --> 0:31:54.874
<v Speaker 4>will you please forgive me? Guess what he said? He said, Mama,

0:31:54.954 --> 0:31:55.834
<v Speaker 4>that was ages ago.

0:31:55.914 --> 0:31:56.714
<v Speaker 2>What are you talking about?

0:31:56.754 --> 0:31:57.474
<v Speaker 1>I know you love me?

0:31:57.874 --> 0:32:00.034
<v Speaker 4>And I was I couldn't believe he said that because

0:32:00.034 --> 0:32:03.314
<v Speaker 4>he's only twelve, and I thought, wow, I think he'll

0:32:03.354 --> 0:32:03.754
<v Speaker 4>be all right.

0:32:03.874 --> 0:32:06.274
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you know, I mean, and we've all done that.

0:32:06.394 --> 0:32:08.354
<v Speaker 2>I make a lot of jokes with my kids, like

0:32:08.714 --> 0:32:11.514
<v Speaker 2>for this is probably gonna sound bad. I only ever

0:32:11.554 --> 0:32:14.634
<v Speaker 2>wanted boys because I was really scared of having teenage

0:32:14.714 --> 0:32:17.274
<v Speaker 2>daughters because I'd seen so many of my friends have girls,

0:32:17.274 --> 0:32:19.354
<v Speaker 2>and I was just scared. I just didn't think i'd

0:32:19.394 --> 0:32:22.474
<v Speaker 2>be good at it. And so when my kids little,

0:32:22.954 --> 0:32:26.834
<v Speaker 2>i'd always say, oh, yeah, I just wanted boys. My daughter,

0:32:27.274 --> 0:32:29.994
<v Speaker 2>my daughter at one point was like, really, like, can

0:32:30.034 --> 0:32:33.274
<v Speaker 2>you please stop saying that? And the most important thing,

0:32:33.354 --> 0:32:34.874
<v Speaker 2>I actually think you can teach your kids is to

0:32:34.914 --> 0:32:36.754
<v Speaker 2>have a sense of humor, yeah, and to kind of

0:32:36.834 --> 0:32:39.554
<v Speaker 2>understand who you are and to kind of have that dynamic.

0:32:39.594 --> 0:32:42.034
<v Speaker 2>And you and Jason clearly have that dynamic in the family.

0:32:42.514 --> 0:32:44.794
<v Speaker 2>And then I think it not only it makes them resilient,

0:32:45.154 --> 0:32:46.834
<v Speaker 2>but I do want to pick up on something you said.

0:32:47.154 --> 0:32:49.074
<v Speaker 2>My husband always says this to us. We do cause

0:32:49.074 --> 0:32:50.914
<v Speaker 2>a lot of our own suffering in terms of the

0:32:50.954 --> 0:32:54.074
<v Speaker 2>amount of worry, and I think we all need to

0:32:54.274 --> 0:32:57.154
<v Speaker 2>remember that, Like we can teach them I told you

0:32:57.154 --> 0:32:58.594
<v Speaker 2>what someone said to me once. You can teach your

0:32:58.674 --> 0:33:01.794
<v Speaker 2>kids to be upstanders or bystanders. You can teach them

0:33:01.834 --> 0:33:04.714
<v Speaker 2>to be caretakers or takers, right, like you can teach

0:33:04.714 --> 0:33:10.754
<v Speaker 2>them make basic good mind stuff. Right. But apart from that,

0:33:11.274 --> 0:33:13.914
<v Speaker 2>in some ways, you know, the world is they have

0:33:13.954 --> 0:33:17.154
<v Speaker 2>to be in the world on their own. So I

0:33:17.314 --> 0:33:19.554
<v Speaker 2>do think what we all need to remind ourselves of

0:33:19.914 --> 0:33:22.914
<v Speaker 2>is to let go a little bit. And I know

0:33:23.034 --> 0:33:25.754
<v Speaker 2>it's so hard, but that's the same as what we

0:33:25.794 --> 0:33:29.354
<v Speaker 2>were talking, so different what we were saying to kath Right,

0:33:29.514 --> 0:33:33.314
<v Speaker 2>you just gotta not hold on so tight sometimes because

0:33:33.314 --> 0:33:36.674
<v Speaker 2>I think ultimately that will make you feel happier.

0:33:36.994 --> 0:33:50.034
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, all right.

0:33:50.074 --> 0:33:52.434
<v Speaker 1>Well, speaking of letting go, it's that time in the

0:33:52.474 --> 0:33:55.074
<v Speaker 1>show where we can let go of our problems, ladies,

0:33:55.154 --> 0:33:57.314
<v Speaker 1>and we can tackle other people's problems.

0:33:57.474 --> 0:33:58.554
<v Speaker 5>Yeah.

0:33:58.674 --> 0:34:00.154
<v Speaker 1>This is a part of the show where you send

0:34:00.234 --> 0:34:03.594
<v Speaker 1>us your dilemmas, problems, anything you need to help with.

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<v Speaker 1>We are totally unqualified, but we are very enthusiast.

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<v Speaker 2>I stand up with.

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<v Speaker 1>This week's problem comes from Emma.

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<v Speaker 7>Hi Unleasha's I think I sabotaged my best friend and

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<v Speaker 7>I'm losing sleep over it. Debbie, oh that's not her

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<v Speaker 7>real name, is my best friend. She's now fifty six

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<v Speaker 7>and last year she was made redundant. Her marriage also

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<v Speaker 7>ended right just before that, so she's really not in

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<v Speaker 7>a great headspace or financial position. She applied for a

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<v Speaker 7>senior role at a company in my field and asked

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<v Speaker 7>me to be a reference. I have a close contact

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<v Speaker 7>on the hiring panel who called me. In the back

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<v Speaker 7>of my head, I thought, I'm not sure if she's

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<v Speaker 7>totally qualified for this job, but of course I gave

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<v Speaker 7>her a great reference. I talked her up. I was glowing,

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<v Speaker 7>and then my contact asked me, how does Debbie handle pressure?

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<v Speaker 7>And I paused for about two point five seconds. I

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<v Speaker 7>was thinking, God, what do I say? Because she is

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<v Speaker 7>shit under pressure? So I said to them, yes, she

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<v Speaker 7>has grown a lot in that area, which anyone in

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<v Speaker 7>hiring knows is code for not very good. Debbie didn't

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<v Speaker 7>get the job. She called me devastated. I didn't tell

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<v Speaker 7>her I was a referee or what I said, But

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<v Speaker 7>it's eating me alive. Do I come clean about what happened?

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<v Speaker 7>Or do I just do better next time I'm caught?

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<v Speaker 6>Help?

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<v Speaker 4>No, you do not come clean. No, absolutely not, because

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<v Speaker 4>not only you're going to destroy your friendship and you're

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<v Speaker 4>going to tell your friend who's got so much going

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<v Speaker 4>on that she is shit at working. No, you need

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<v Speaker 4>to say to her you didn't get it, apply for

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<v Speaker 4>a new one, and I'll help you to go through interviews.

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<v Speaker 3>But how do you deal with your own guilt? Because

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<v Speaker 3>now there's this lie that is sitting between you and

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<v Speaker 3>your very best friend in the whole world, and you're

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<v Speaker 3>hiding something from her. Don't you think, like, how do

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<v Speaker 3>you get that out of your head? When you see

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<v Speaker 3>her we sit across the table from her.

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<v Speaker 1>See I think I get the guilt, But then is

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<v Speaker 1>by releasing her guilt?

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<v Speaker 3>You know?

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<v Speaker 1>She's kind of dumping that on Debbie's plate, isn't she

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<v Speaker 1>You know that she might feel better for that millisecond

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<v Speaker 1>before her friendship then blows up and everyone's left feeling

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<v Speaker 1>a bit shitty because.

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<v Speaker 4>At the end of a day, you can't recommend someone

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<v Speaker 4>who's not good at their job because it's going to

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<v Speaker 4>reflect on you. At the same time, she is not

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<v Speaker 4>up for it, period.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I think it's more even more complicated from what

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<v Speaker 2>she was saying. She probably does think she's pretty good

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<v Speaker 2>at the job, but she was asked a very specific

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<v Speaker 2>question about maybe her shortcomings and she had to be honest,

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<v Speaker 2>which there's I feel adamant there is no positive to

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<v Speaker 2>telling Debbie that you did that. I've often been in

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<v Speaker 2>this position because I do work with a lot of

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<v Speaker 2>friends and a different project. Our business is very transient,

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<v Speaker 2>right project to project. I get a lot of calls

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<v Speaker 2>about people. If I ever have something more complex or

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<v Speaker 2>nuance to say, feedback wise, I never put it in writing. Ever,

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<v Speaker 2>I say call me, and you kind of also have

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<v Speaker 2>to trust the other person you're talking to, But then

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<v Speaker 2>you can have a more nuanced conversation say look this,

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<v Speaker 2>here's the this person is great at ab CD, but

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<v Speaker 2>here's maybe some things that are some blind spots or

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<v Speaker 2>from shortcomings, and you kind of have to do that.

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<v Speaker 2>I realize so much on references for people in my business,

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<v Speaker 2>and when I've been steered wrong, which happens and you

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<v Speaker 2>end up with someone who's not as good in the job,

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<v Speaker 2>it's really damaging. So I believe in kind of full transparency.

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<v Speaker 2>So I think she did the right thing regardless of friendship.

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<v Speaker 2>And you know, I think there are other things you

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<v Speaker 2>can do. You can keep a look out, you can

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<v Speaker 2>help her find another path. You know clearly your friend's

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<v Speaker 2>really good at a lot of things as well. So

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<v Speaker 2>I think as a friend, be that support person and

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<v Speaker 2>find another way to help her and also help.

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<v Speaker 4>Her to deal with pressure. I think that's really important.

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<v Speaker 4>That's a life skill.

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<v Speaker 2>Yes, totally great, it's exactly well.

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<v Speaker 3>The question is should she tell her? I mean, I

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<v Speaker 3>think we're on in violent agreement that she did the

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<v Speaker 3>right thing by being very obtuse, but giving a well

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<v Speaker 3>known obtuse answer. The question is should she now tell

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<v Speaker 3>her now? So my question is, when you have somebody

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<v Speaker 3>in that situation, how does she know that her making

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<v Speaker 3>an obtuse comment was the reason that Debbie did not

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<v Speaker 3>keep the job. There might have been eight amazingly qualified people.

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<v Speaker 3>Her reference might have been the good thing, And in fact,

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<v Speaker 3>Debbie did not do well in the interview. So my

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<v Speaker 3>concern about fessing up and saying I'm the reason you

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<v Speaker 3>didn't get the job might be completely false. And now

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<v Speaker 3>you've blown up the relationship for actually false reasons. It

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<v Speaker 3>actually might not have been yours.

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<v Speaker 4>So I think the way to deal with.

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<v Speaker 3>Not telling her is to admit that you don't know

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<v Speaker 3>why Debbie didn't get the job. It might have been

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<v Speaker 3>your obtuse comment. I suspect not. I think I suspect

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<v Speaker 3>there were probably other things, and there.

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<v Speaker 4>Were lots of Really it's a really tough.

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<v Speaker 3>Job environment out there, and so you don't have to

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<v Speaker 3>be guilty about lying to her. Very possibly was not

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<v Speaker 3>a lie. Possibly had nothing to do with you, And

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<v Speaker 3>your role is now to be a really good friend,

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<v Speaker 3>not as you were saying, Kath, to just unload your

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<v Speaker 3>own guilt on your poor unsuspecting friend.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, we all agree.

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<v Speaker 2>No, No, someone did tell me. Fun fact, because someone

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<v Speaker 2>said this recently, I said, what do you do if

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<v Speaker 2>someone's worked for you? And because in America. It's really tricky.

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<v Speaker 2>It's so litigious, so like, and you don't want to

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<v Speaker 2>give them a good reference. But you have to give

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<v Speaker 2>some reference. And so this is apparently what you do.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't know if you guys know this. You say,

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<v Speaker 2>I can confirm that that person worked for me from

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<v Speaker 2>January twenty twenty one to February twenty twenty two. And

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<v Speaker 2>that's basically code for I'm not giving them a good reference.

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<v Speaker 4>Fun fact.

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<v Speaker 2>Fun fact, I'd give you guys a good reference.

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<v Speaker 5>I don't know.

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<v Speaker 1>All right, that is all we have time for sweet ladies,

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<v Speaker 1>but our lovely, lovely listeners. If you have a reference

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<v Speaker 1>for us, please talk up. Yes, go to the Apple

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<v Speaker 1>to not be honest. Good reference. I love the five stars?

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<v Speaker 1>What about you love it six? Then we can do five.

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<v Speaker 1>We'll do five stars and a lovely reference. And if

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<v Speaker 1>you know someone like Debbie who is having a tough time,

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<v Speaker 1>share our episode with her favor give her a loll

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<v Speaker 1>And if you want to d ms at anytime, you

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<v Speaker 1>can go to unleash Dot show on Instagram. We literally

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<v Speaker 1>read everything, don't we read?

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<v Speaker 2>Please love a DM?

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<v Speaker 1>Now what do we like to say? Ladies? See Tuesday

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<v Speaker 1>until next time, stay unfiltered, stay unreasonable, Stay un bye.

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<v Speaker 1>Mamma Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters

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<v Speaker 1>that this podcast is recorded on