Speaker 1: We acknowledged the traditional custodians of the land we're recording
Speaker 1: on today. My entire world literally.
Speaker 2: Just imploded in those first months, just thinking what the
Speaker 2: fuck have I done? There was no newborn bubble. It
Speaker 2: was a This has been the biggest mistake of my life.
Speaker 2: I can't believe I've done this.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we are back. Did you miss us?
Speaker 2: This is your favorite podcast back in your ears Every Wednesday, Eat, Sleep, Shit, Repeat,
Speaker 2: a wildly unhinched podcast about the madness that is motherhood
Speaker 2: and everything in between.
Speaker 1: I'm Kelly McCarran. What a stunning introduction. I'm Kiri Cels
Speaker 1: and it is bloody glorious to be bad. We really
Speaker 1: appreciated all of the lovely messages from our shitters who
Speaker 1: were like, how am I supposed to cope without you?
Speaker 1: And we weren't really coping without you either, So we
Speaker 1: made it swift and short, and we are back better
Speaker 1: than ever with a much tighter show.
Speaker 2: Unlike Maya Nus, which is really upsetting me at the moment.
Speaker 2: He used to resemble a nice, tight bitch and now
Speaker 2: it looks like a.
Speaker 1: Deflated burger bun. I didn't approve that, yew.
Speaker 2: Also, you have confirmed that it does now look like
Speaker 2: that it does. Later on in the episode, we will
Speaker 2: get into the meaty topic of the week, what to
Speaker 2: do when your baby won't stop crying. But first now,
Speaker 2: in our last episode, we did ask the shitter is
Speaker 2: about what they thought about us doing our weekly peek
Speaker 2: and Pit, and the response was overwhelmingly positive.
Speaker 1: It was unanimous. Please do not stop.
Speaker 2: Everyone was saying, I love it. They make me feel
Speaker 2: more normal. I love hearing about your lives. Those were
Speaker 2: the general responses. So we shall keep it in, of course,
Speaker 2: but we thought it might be.
Speaker 1: Good to actually take turns in it so that we
Speaker 1: cut down on our waffling, because boy, ome boy, can
Speaker 1: we waffle. It's very easy for us to sit down
Speaker 1: and record hours and hours of content, and somehow it
Speaker 1: needs to get cut down, and we must must think
Speaker 1: of our lovely editor, Maddie, who does the most, because
Speaker 1: she really does. So Key, you kick off this new format,
Speaker 1: give us your peek and Pit of the week, and
Speaker 1: in honor of this new season, please make sure that
Speaker 1: the peak is very good and the pit very great.
Speaker 1: Oh it's groom, Let me tell you I had a
Speaker 1: menty bee over the weekend. No A full blown menty bee.
Speaker 1: I have been so tired lately, like exhausted, and I
Speaker 1: just kind of put it down to I haven't been
Speaker 1: really exercising consistently. I'm a mom, so I just kind
Speaker 1: of thought, oh, broken sleep sometimes just generally mental load
Speaker 1: all of that stuff, right, and I just thought, oh,
Speaker 1: get it together, key, like just everyone else seems to
Speaker 1: be getting it together. So I actually did go to
Speaker 1: the doctor and just get some blood work done to
Speaker 1: make sure everything was a okay. And I found out
Speaker 1: that I have an underactive thyroid. That is why I've
Speaker 1: been so exhausted. So I think as soon as I
Speaker 1: got that news, it almost made it worse because I
Speaker 1: was like, Oh, instead of treading water, I kind of
Speaker 1: just let myself drown. I was just like, oh, I'm
Speaker 1: going to fall into a heat because I have a
Speaker 1: medical condition that's making me feel this way. Yes, that's
Speaker 1: making me feel like I am got weights on my
Speaker 1: ankles and it's so hard to move and cope with anything.
Speaker 1: But it is a medical condition that is pretty easy
Speaker 1: to fix it. Yes, it is medication. So I'm going
Speaker 1: to have some blood work done in a few weeks
Speaker 1: just to kind of see where it's at again there
Speaker 1: and then all discuss going on medication and that should
Speaker 1: help it, which should be great.
Speaker 2: It's so interesting because you haven't gained weight, and most
Speaker 2: people with an underactive thyroid, the way that they figure
Speaker 2: it out is because they've gained a lot of weight
Speaker 2: in a short period of time.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I think it's probably because I am gluten and
Speaker 1: torran and a pescotarian, my diet tends to be on
Speaker 1: the healthier side quote unquote healthy. That makes sense. But
Speaker 1: what happened is that this meant to be coincided with
Speaker 1: Rue having her two year sleep regression. And of course,
Speaker 1: of course it did because I'm meet, I'm meet, and
Speaker 1: I just have the words luck in the world. And
Speaker 1: you know, Charlie was really great. He was like, babe,
Speaker 1: just take the weeknd off, I'll sort everything like you
Speaker 1: just do you you catch up on rest, blah blah
Speaker 1: blah blah. But it's really hard when your kid is
Speaker 1: screaming and it screams I have never heard before, or
Speaker 1: like the proper toddler screams proper toddlers, and you tarlet
Speaker 1: you shut all the windows because you're like, don't want
Speaker 1: the nervous to her I am going to call the police.
Speaker 1: I think I'm doing something real bad to my daughter,
Speaker 1: and it's always Mum that she's screaming. So it's just
Speaker 1: really hard to obviously switch off. But on the flip
Speaker 1: side of that, my patience with her was non existent.
Speaker 1: And the reason why it made it a really bad
Speaker 1: pit is because I found myself starting to question if
Speaker 1: I was like my mum basically, and that's what made
Speaker 1: me really upset. Because my mom had zero patient, she
Speaker 1: had the shortest temper, she was very scary to be around,
Speaker 1: and that's always kind of stayed with me. But that's
Speaker 1: what really got me down because I just like, oh
Speaker 1: my god, like I don't have any patience with her
Speaker 1: because I'm just fighting to try and keep it together
Speaker 1: and I just don't like that quality. And so I
Speaker 1: don't know. I mean, things have been better since Sam, Like,
Speaker 1: you know, I've had my rest, I've kind of caught
Speaker 1: up a little bit on things, and I'm trying to
Speaker 1: embrace the really testing moments, you know, and just work
Speaker 1: with her in those moments instead of pushing against But
Speaker 1: it's really difficult when you're fighting a really learned behavior,
Speaker 1: and I struggle with that a lot, so it really
Speaker 1: got me down. I didn't like who I was in
Speaker 1: that moment, and I felt like embarrassed, and I kept
Speaker 1: asking Charlie like, do you think I'm a bad mom?
Speaker 1: Do you think I'm a bad mom? And He's like, no,
Speaker 1: I just think you're in a bad spot and you
Speaker 1: don't have any confidence right now and your abilities. Like
Speaker 1: you're allowed to have bad days, that's okay, but I
Speaker 1: don't know. I feel like I seem to be having
Speaker 1: a lot of bad days lately, and that makes me sad.
Speaker 2: I also want to acknowledge to anyone listening, but mainly
Speaker 2: to you, that being impatient it isn't just a learned
Speaker 2: behavior that you think that you've learned from your mom.
Speaker 2: It is a very normal human reaction. Yeah, every single
Speaker 2: person feels impatient at times. My grandma used to always
Speaker 2: say patience is a virtue. Patience is a virtue. So
Speaker 2: I know that when you're feeling like that, nothing can
Speaker 2: really make you feel better or like you are a
Speaker 2: good mum. But I do want you to know that
Speaker 2: feeling impatient and I mean, listen, I'm not the barometer
Speaker 2: of health or mental clarity, but I know for sure
Speaker 2: that that is such a normal response to have. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and they test us like no one else, and they
Speaker 2: know they know what they're doing. You hate it when
Speaker 2: people go, oh, they don't know what Yes, they bloody
Speaker 2: do not all the time. And I'm not saying that
Speaker 2: they still can't help it. Yeah, but they know what
Speaker 2: they're doing and they know where to push.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Charlie. On that weekend, he goes, he had her
Speaker 1: all day and I went out and had lunch with
Speaker 1: a girlfriend and came back and everything, and as soon
Speaker 1: as I got through the door, she was just crazy again.
Speaker 1: He was like, she was finally. She was fine when
Speaker 1: you weren't here, and it's when you're here that she
Speaker 1: this bad behavior comes. And I'm like, but I'm the
Speaker 1: main person who looks That's why why can't she just
Speaker 1: be nice to me? Because she trusts you, yeah so much.
Speaker 2: You are her primary caregiver. You do spend the most
Speaker 2: amount of time with her, so she.
Speaker 1: Feels safe to let her freak flame.
Speaker 2: Whenever people say that to me, I'm like, great, thanks,
Speaker 2: But it's so true. That is where they feel the
Speaker 2: most comfortable to really just unleash every single thought, emotion,
Speaker 2: feeling that they have sometimes when Lenny walks through the door,
Speaker 2: He's been fine all date daycare. Luke picks him up, Fine, fine,
Speaker 2: fine in the car, babbling away, walks through the door.
Speaker 2: I can hear him going, where'smummy, where's mummy? And he
Speaker 2: sees me and then he just loses it. He literally
Speaker 2: drops to the floor and just starts screaming. He lets
Speaker 2: out every single ioda of frustration he's had old.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And for me, I'm like, shut up, Yeah, you
Speaker 1: just got here. I'm excited to see you, and now
Speaker 1: that excitement has gone, Like.
Speaker 2: I was so excited to see you, and now I'm like,
Speaker 2: can you go back to daycare right now?
Speaker 1: Why did they get lovely? Lenny? And I get feelings? Lenny,
Speaker 1: that's a lot.
Speaker 2: But yeah, it's so normal. And you are nothing like
Speaker 2: your mother.
Speaker 1: I know you haven't fucked off overseas. You're already beating her.
Speaker 1: I know we're going overseas, but we're taking her. So
Speaker 1: where are you going? We're going to Europe for our honeymoon. Okay,
Speaker 1: is this the peak? Are we moving into the peak? No,
Speaker 1: we haven't even planned it yet. We haven't brought our tickets.
Speaker 1: We've just decided good friend getting married, so we thought
Speaker 1: we'd just do it. It was always a plan, but
Speaker 1: we're meant to do it with that Ruber. Now we're
Speaker 1: going to take her my peak. It's a little bit
Speaker 1: of wholesome. So I have everyone Thursdays and Fridays and
Speaker 1: every Thursday. We've done this a lot, but the consistency
Speaker 1: hasn't been there. So for the last month, every Thursday
Speaker 1: we have been going to rhyme Time at our local
Speaker 1: library and it's this little quaint library, really small. It's
Speaker 1: got a little cafe attached to it, a little grass area.
Speaker 1: We get there in the morning for the class and
Speaker 1: it's kind of coincided with the girls being the age
Speaker 1: that they really enjoy it. So they're starting to sing along,
Speaker 1: clap along, and you go with Beck, go with Beck
Speaker 1: and Goldie and also going out of front Talia, who's
Speaker 1: the biggest shitter in the world. Tarlia shout out tas
Speaker 1: she's got two little girls. Yeah, I know.
Speaker 3: Every time, I'm like, she's the biggest shitter or she
Speaker 3: just loves to be a shitter. And it's just so
Speaker 3: beautiful because it's an enclosed area that you sit in
Speaker 3: afterwards with the gate and the kids can kind of
Speaker 3: run somewhat wild, and you can sit together and have
Speaker 3: like your tea a cake.
Speaker 1: They've got little gluten free cakes that I get every time.
Speaker 1: We can have a conversation, like actually get through a conversation.
Speaker 2: Trapped, not trapped, but they are in close and close
Speaker 2: is the word I was looking for.
Speaker 1: You have to join to go to run time, So
Speaker 1: I've started getting picture books for her each week so
Speaker 1: that she can read them, you know, for the two weeks,
Speaker 1: and then we take them back. So I don't know.
Speaker 1: I think it's a mixture of just like the regularity
Speaker 1: of it, because we did have swimming, but my swim
Speaker 1: school closed down, so then Thursdays we're kind of just
Speaker 1: like this fucking free for all. I know that those
Speaker 1: places are heated, but too it is cold anyway, so
Speaker 1: this has been great to feel that and they get
Speaker 1: really tired afterwards we go for like a walk around
Speaker 1: the park that's there. But I also just love the
Speaker 1: connection to community and it's like feeling like you're all together.
Speaker 1: We see the same faces each week and they're starting
Speaker 1: to get to know the kids, and I don't know,
Speaker 1: it just feels really wholesome and It's a lovely thing
Speaker 1: to be able to do each week that is free.
Speaker 1: That is so cute, and it also such a good recommendation. Yeah,
Speaker 1: get amongst it, go to your local library. Join it's
Speaker 1: so good. The people that put it on are so passionate,
Speaker 1: like the librarians, and also the volunteers are so passionate
Speaker 1: about it. They love kids. It's just a really nice
Speaker 1: pocket of like humanity that you can dip into. I
Speaker 1: would be so good as a rhyme time teacher, So
Speaker 1: would I. Beck actually took a video of me last
Speaker 1: week because oh, because you can dance as well. Oh no.
Speaker 1: We were just in the park and the kids were
Speaker 1: fucking wanting to jump on this like the top of
Speaker 1: a drain, and I was just like, why are they
Speaker 1: knowing this? Beck's super pregnant, Tars has got a baby
Speaker 1: strap to her, so I'm like, all right, girls, get information.
Speaker 1: Ring a rosie, She's like kindergarten teacher comes through and
Speaker 1: I'm like, I'm aware, But Monday, neither of us have
Speaker 1: the patient of us have we'd be like that ring
Speaker 1: around a rosy shut. But I have patients with other
Speaker 1: people's kids. I don't You don't know I shouted other
Speaker 1: people's kids the time. Sounds like we've gone off on
Speaker 1: a little bit of a tangent. Guys.
Speaker 2: I recently asked a girlfriend who's got a new baby
Speaker 2: how she was going, and she responded that she was great,
Speaker 2: and she said she shared some cute picks. It was
Speaker 2: in a group chat and started talking about other stuff,
Speaker 2: and then I separately messaged her to say something like, Hey,
Speaker 2: I'm not trying to be annoying. I'm just checking in, Like,
Speaker 2: you know, I'm right here if you need anything, you
Speaker 2: don't need to pretend that everything's fine, like something along
Speaker 2: those lines. And she was like, oh my god, love
Speaker 2: you so much, but I'm totally fine. I'll let you
Speaker 2: know if anything changes.
Speaker 1: And I guess as well. In my mind, I'm like,
Speaker 1: how could you be fine? Yeah?
Speaker 2: How could you be coping with a newborn as a
Speaker 2: new mum and just be fine?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 2: So obviously, then when she confirmed that she was fine,
Speaker 2: I was like, oh, okay, that's really good, But also
Speaker 2: just highlighted to me how alone I feel in my
Speaker 2: experience as a new mom with a newborn. So I
Speaker 2: wanted to do an episode for anyone out there who
Speaker 2: has a baby who doesn't stop crying, because maybe then
Speaker 2: you will feel less alone and know that it's not
Speaker 2: just you. You aren't doing anything wrong, your baby isn't broken.
Speaker 2: You unfortunately, have just been dealt with the shit.
Speaker 1: Stick when it comes to the baby bubble, as smug
Speaker 1: people with nice babies refer to that fourth trimester.
Speaker 2: Oh my goodness. Honestly, when people would say to me like, oh,
Speaker 2: isn't the baby bubble so precious? Oh, soak up every
Speaker 2: minute of that baby bubble, I wanted to smack people
Speaker 2: that said things like that because it makes me very
Speaker 2: anxious when I hear newbornes cry and other people will
Speaker 2: be like, oh my god, you're so good at babies
Speaker 2: because I immediately grab them. But it's actually because I
Speaker 2: get so anxious that I need that baby to stop crying. Yeah,
Speaker 2: even when it's not my baby. So there was no bubble.
Speaker 2: The only bubble was the snot bubble that was coming
Speaker 2: out of my nose as I cried for the seventeenth
Speaker 2: time that day, thinking what the fuck have I done?
Speaker 1: This is the biggest mistake of my life. Yeah, well,
Speaker 1: it was really traumatic and I am still asking you
Speaker 1: why you've decided to quit therapy. Well I haven't. I've
Speaker 1: just got to find a new therapist. Okay, good good,
Speaker 1: I'm glad, I'm glad. All right.
Speaker 2: Let's first discuss, though, what my baby won't stop crying
Speaker 2: actually looks like. Because, of course, babies cry.
Speaker 1: I knew that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I know that they could cry a lot. But
Speaker 2: Lenny was on an intense mix of prescription drugs for
Speaker 2: the first week of his life, so he really only
Speaker 2: fussed when he was hungry. Yeah, and then maybe the
Speaker 2: first two weeks were okay in terms of crying. He
Speaker 2: wouldn't really let us put him down. But on reflection,
Speaker 2: then that's perfectly normal as well, because he'd only recently
Speaker 2: been horribly exited from his lovely cozy what this is?
Speaker 2: I remember he would get like a little bit gassy
Speaker 2: here and there, and I did see an insta post
Speaker 2: about colic, but I scoffed at the three through three rule.
Speaker 1: Do you know what the three three rule is?
Speaker 2: So they defined colic as crying for more more than
Speaker 2: three hours per day, for more than three days per week,
Speaker 2: and for longer than three weeks in an infant who
Speaker 2: is otherwise well fed and healthy. And I remember seeing
Speaker 2: that and I'm like, oh my god, as if babies
Speaker 2: can scream for more than three hours a day, I
Speaker 2: just thought that is ludicrous. You'd go mad if your
Speaker 2: baby was screaming for three hours a day.
Speaker 1: Well yeah, and.
Speaker 2: Lol, I bet my future self, who dealt with fourteen
Speaker 2: hours on average per day of unrelenting screams, would gladly
Speaker 2: take those three hours.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, if we only knew what was in stall.
Speaker 1: I do get really sad every time you talk about
Speaker 1: this because I just didn't realize how about it was.
Speaker 2: Well, I don't think that I talked about it that much,
Speaker 2: or I think I probably made jokes because that's my
Speaker 2: way of coping with things.
Speaker 1: But yeah, it's a very isolating place to be, and
Speaker 1: I think that's what is so triggering for you. When
Speaker 1: people have newborns and they say that they're doing well,
Speaker 1: how come I'm the only one that's been through this
Speaker 1: experience within our social group. Yeah, that's what I really
Speaker 1: struggle with.
Speaker 2: It's not that I want anyone that I love or
Speaker 2: anyone to have my experience. It's just that I want
Speaker 2: to feel less alone, I totally in my own experience,
Speaker 2: or better yet, I wish that that wasn't my experience. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: I wish that I did have a different time. Yeah,
Speaker 2: newborn baby, bubble whatever, Yeah, I get them call it so. Keith, obviously,
Speaker 2: you had through a couple of months three months after
Speaker 2: I had land. So what do you remember about my
Speaker 2: experience while you were still pregnant.
Speaker 1: I remember that you would share on little bits here
Speaker 1: and there on socials, but I don't think you ever
Speaker 1: really opened up until much later about how bad it was.
Speaker 1: The hours that he cried was the thing that shocked
Speaker 1: me the most because I was like, it sounds made up.
Speaker 1: Well yeah, I mean it sounds made up, maybe yeah,
Speaker 1: but it sounds completely unmanageable to me. I loved the
Speaker 1: newborn phase and was nothing like that, and I found
Speaker 1: it it was still hard, and you know, to have
Speaker 1: it been so hard that you hate it that there's
Speaker 1: no respite from it, I just think sounds horrible. And
Speaker 1: when I'm thinking about my mother's group, we all had
Speaker 1: a stage where the kids were like going through colic
Speaker 1: and we got that, like you know, the babies do
Speaker 1: not most, but a lot of babies do. Because it's
Speaker 1: so annoying how under formed babies exit the womb, their
Speaker 1: digestive system hasn't not believe this.
Speaker 2: Meanwhile, animals come out and they're like, go on, run away.
Speaker 2: Ours come out and they're like, we don't know how
Speaker 2: to shit yet.
Speaker 1: Could have done with a few more months, to be
Speaker 1: honest exactly, And we all got that like little concoction
Speaker 1: from the weird like pharmacy thing. It actually did work,
Speaker 1: to be fair. But then I thought about the two
Speaker 1: run ins I had with two of the mother's grew
Speaker 1: girls who only came really to the first one and
Speaker 1: never came back, and we had like selfishly assumed that
Speaker 1: it was because they hated us and we sucked. But
Speaker 1: I remember specifically the first one being like, oh my god,
Speaker 1: I'm so sorry I haven't been back to see girls.
Speaker 1: And this is maybe at the six month mark. She
Speaker 1: was like, I've just been so sick with mastitis, like
Speaker 1: I've had it so many times, I've been in hospital,
Speaker 1: i haven't been able to get out of bed, blah
Speaker 1: blah blah. And then the other one I saw after
Speaker 1: three months and she was like, my baby just didn't sleep,
Speaker 1: didn't stop crying. I had to sleep train my baby
Speaker 1: at three months old, and you're not meant to do
Speaker 1: sleep training till six months. So we're not saying that
Speaker 1: that's the thing to do, but that is what she
Speaker 1: took because she needed to. And I kind of thought
Speaker 1: about it, like the people that drop off from the
Speaker 1: mother's group of the people that are really struggling, the
Speaker 1: people that can continue to come each week are just
Speaker 1: having a somewhat you know, text experience. So I think
Speaker 1: that's probably why I didn't have anyone super close to
Speaker 1: me other than you who experienced it at the same
Speaker 1: time that I was going through that first stage. When
Speaker 1: did things start to take a turn? Cut Like, how
Speaker 1: old was Lend when things got particularly bad.
Speaker 2: It was either two or three weeks old. I don't
Speaker 2: remember which one exactly, but I remember the night that
Speaker 2: he woke up from the newborn. And a lot of
Speaker 2: babies do this where people get lulled into a false
Speaker 2: sense of security for the first couple of weeks, they're
Speaker 2: still asleep, yeah yeah, and then they wake up and
Speaker 2: this is when the proper pterodactyl began.
Speaker 1: Ohterdacy. Yeah.
Speaker 2: So it was a Friday night. We had had dinner
Speaker 2: and then it just begun out of nowhere, and it
Speaker 2: was the proper pterodactyls screaming, and it went on for hours,
Speaker 2: hours and hours, and nothing would work. And Luke and
Speaker 2: I were just taking it in turns, yeah, because like,
Speaker 2: how do you deal with this infant that you don't
Speaker 2: even know you've just met them screaming at you. So
Speaker 2: we would just passing back and forth every half an hour,
Speaker 2: forty minutes, try whatever we could within that time, and
Speaker 2: then passing back. And the thing is is that you're
Speaker 2: actually not supposed to try too many things, because then
Speaker 2: that can confuse the more, and upset the more, and
Speaker 2: over stimulate the more. But you're also trying every single
Speaker 2: thing under the sun in terms of colic positions. You
Speaker 2: feed them, you burp them, you're changing their n appy,
Speaker 2: you do everything, you take them outside. And from that
Speaker 2: night my life for the next few months, my life
Speaker 2: consisted of doing absolutely everything in my power to stop
Speaker 2: my baby crying. And I have never failed so miserably
Speaker 2: at anything in my life. And I've been fired from jobs.
Speaker 1: You can't get fired from this one, though, but you can't,
Speaker 1: even though when you're doing that bad of a job,
Speaker 1: you really should. But you weren't doing a bad job.
Speaker 1: He has just been a tricky baby.
Speaker 2: Yes, and we will get to that, because I think
Speaker 2: that's so important to acknowledge to anyone that's in that
Speaker 2: at the moment.
Speaker 1: But I didn't know that not the time.
Speaker 2: No, he screamed all day every day unless we were
Speaker 2: walking outdoors. He liked the fresh air, and so a
Speaker 2: couple of weeks postpartum, I was so slim. Yeah, and
Speaker 2: I remember people being like, oh my god, what's your
Speaker 2: secret to losing the baby?
Speaker 1: Wait?
Speaker 2: And I'm like, Oh, just have a baby that never
Speaker 2: stops crying. This is like why you should never comment
Speaker 2: on someone's body unless well, no, you just shouldn't comment.
Speaker 2: But I was like, oh, just have a baby that
Speaker 2: cries all the time. So you have to walk for
Speaker 2: hours and hours and hours a day. Yeah, because that's
Speaker 2: the only time that they're not crying. And then people
Speaker 2: would be like, oh, get the rocket and different things
Speaker 2: for the prem at home. No, No, it had to
Speaker 2: be outdoors. He also knew the difference between pushing and
Speaker 2: a rocker. It had to be outdoors, the fresh air
Speaker 2: and just hours. It didn't always work, but it often did.
Speaker 2: Sometimes we'd go to the shops because that also worked,
Speaker 2: and that here comes the sun plus the mister Rath
Speaker 2: would just be playing on repeat. So when I hear
Speaker 2: that song, I literally just goo. Yeah. I just think
Speaker 2: about hours of walking around listening to those bloody things.
Speaker 2: He wouldn't ever sleep for long, though, and then he'd
Speaker 2: be back away screaming.
Speaker 1: And this was all day, all night. He did feed fine,
Speaker 1: didn't care if.
Speaker 2: It was from the bottle of boob, and he generally
Speaker 2: passed wind solos are good.
Speaker 1: Things, like yeah. Like, So it wasn't that he was yeah.
Speaker 2: It wasn't that he wasn't getting enough food or wasn't
Speaker 2: whooing or something like that.
Speaker 1: But my entire world literally just imploded.
Speaker 2: And as I've talked about, I think it was in
Speaker 2: the mental health episode. I just spent those first months
Speaker 2: just thinking what the fuck have I done? There was
Speaker 2: no newborn bubble. It was a this has been the
Speaker 2: biggest mistake of my life. I can't believe I've done this.
Speaker 1: Yeah, which is a horrible thing to admit, but that's
Speaker 1: how I felt, because this small person just screamed at
Speaker 1: me all the time, and nothing I did ever worked,
Speaker 1: and no one seemed to understand just how bad it was,
Speaker 1: just how defeating it was, just how isolating it was,
Speaker 1: and I was just so frustrated and exhausted. I know
Speaker 1: some people have really difficult babies, but then they sleep
Speaker 1: at night, which is still so hard, don't get me wrong,
Speaker 1: still so hard. I remember Rue went through a stage
Speaker 1: where she wouldn't sleep all during the day. Yeah, be like, oh,
Speaker 1: but she's sleeping at night, so it's okay, Okay, it's manageable.
Speaker 2: He didn't sleep at night, so I dreaded the sun
Speaker 2: going down because it was kind of like, okay, round two,
Speaker 2: my second shift is going to start. But there's no
Speaker 2: one around anymore. You can't go outside and walk your
Speaker 2: baby around for hours. I've never felt so lonely.
Speaker 1: And there really is no lonelier place than a mum
Speaker 1: at three am, when you're baby screaming, you haven't slept
Speaker 1: for days, you don't know when you'll sleep again.
Speaker 2: And as a first time mum, I remember people would
Speaker 2: say it ends, it gets better. I promise you it
Speaker 2: gets better. I always found that very frustrating because when
Speaker 2: if you're a first time mum, you have no idea
Speaker 2: what to expect, you have no idea what the future holds.
Speaker 2: As a second time mom, if I had another baby,
Speaker 2: even if it was the same experience. I know that rationally,
Speaker 2: I could be like, hell, it ends, it's okay, this
Speaker 2: isn't forever. Yeah, it ends, and also do other things differently.
Speaker 2: But he just screamed all the time. I didn't know
Speaker 2: that this would end. I had no reference point, so
Speaker 2: that wasn't helpful unless someone was like, you know, it
Speaker 2: gets better at three months or whatever. I remember everyone
Speaker 2: said just get through the.
Speaker 1: First six weeks.
Speaker 2: Then other people would be like, get through the first
Speaker 2: twelve weeks, and then it became four months and then
Speaker 2: six months, and I.
Speaker 1: Was like, but when.
Speaker 2: So I just remember being in that dark pit and
Speaker 2: I wanted to leave so bad, Like that was when
Speaker 2: I was in the very dark place. But honestly, this
Speaker 2: sounds so unhinged. It made me very much, so I
Speaker 2: understand how people can get into such bad headspaces.
Speaker 1: I was like, I can't leave him. He's horrible. No
Speaker 1: one else will take him. I remember saying this, yeah.
Speaker 2: Because I was like, I birthed him, I have to
Speaker 2: look after him. No one else will look after this child.
Speaker 2: He's awful. Yeah, he screams all the time.
Speaker 1: Well, it's a sleep deprivation that really gets you, right,
Speaker 1: because you just don't have any time to actually rationalize
Speaker 1: things well, yeah, and have a clear head. Yeah. I
Speaker 1: cannot believe with the amount of sleep deprivation that some
Speaker 1: new mums have, that they're allowed to take care of
Speaker 1: a baby. Do you know what I mean? Like, they
Speaker 1: shouldn't be allowed to drive, let alone take care of
Speaker 1: a baby. Back, let alone work, let alone work, because
Speaker 1: you threw that one into the little mixtue choos. Yep,
Speaker 1: mine was going for a bloody record.
Speaker 2: All of my memories from that time are blurry, and
Speaker 2: all of the flashbacks make me very scared to even
Speaker 2: consider doing it again. People say, oh, we just laid
Speaker 2: in bed for a while and looked at each other
Speaker 2: and he cooed at me or she cooed at me
Speaker 2: or whatever, and I'm like, I didn't have that. He
Speaker 2: was always screaming, yeah, or sleeping, but even in sleep
Speaker 2: he had a scowl on his face because he was miserable.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I wanted to take you through a list of
Speaker 1: all of the things that I tried over those okays, Yeah,
Speaker 1: to no success obviously, Yes, Okay, I'm still screamed, got it.
Speaker 1: I had a midwife.
Speaker 2: She was kind of like a mental health midwife but
Speaker 2: also there to support the baby, and she would come
Speaker 2: once a fortnight and she was so lovely.
Speaker 1: I really liked her, But.
Speaker 2: I think that sometimes when you're getting these house visits
Speaker 2: from people, they're there for an hour and they don't
Speaker 2: really get it. Like she sort of was trying to
Speaker 2: teach me about sleep cycles and how as he's coming
Speaker 2: out of the deep sleep you really need to and
Speaker 2: she was showing me these things to try to tide
Speaker 2: him over into the next sleep cycle so he didn't
Speaker 2: startle himself awake and then scream. But I was like,
Speaker 2: wasn't actually helpful even though she was trying so hard.
Speaker 2: But I was like, the problem is not that I
Speaker 2: don't know what a sleep cycle is. I mean, of
Speaker 2: course I didn't. I appreciated the help, but.
Speaker 1: He wasn't even getting to that point.
Speaker 2: No, no, So I was on every single forum. I
Speaker 2: followed every single baby sooth on TikTok. The amount of
Speaker 2: videos that I have saved of like try this technique
Speaker 2: to get your baby to stop screaming in thirty seconds,
Speaker 2: I can probably get ninety percent of babies to stop screaming. Yeah,
Speaker 2: you're so good, Like I have got the touch because
Speaker 2: I have so many tricks up my sleeve from all
Speaker 2: of this research that I did. Yeah, couldn't get my
Speaker 2: own baby to stop screaming though I tried the Wilby's
Speaker 2: collic form.
Speaker 1: Now that's what I was talking about before. That will
Speaker 1: be stuff. When I was like that concoction that you
Speaker 1: get from the pharmacists that you know that like weird chemists.
Speaker 1: You've got to go to a compntoun chemist. That's what
Speaker 1: I meant, the weird one. Yeah, not your regular one.
Speaker 1: Some people find it's so good but it works, and
Speaker 1: Charlie and I were just like some fucking magic, like what.
Speaker 2: Is Oh, who knows what's in it? It didn't work
Speaker 2: for me, but of course yeah, but I still kept
Speaker 2: buying it.
Speaker 1: And it's so expensive.
Speaker 2: It's like thirty bucks a week plus shipping just for
Speaker 2: this stupid little bottle.
Speaker 1: But if it works, you don't care. Yeah.
Speaker 2: A really good piece of advice that someone gave me
Speaker 2: was throw money at the problem because now it's not
Speaker 2: the time to worry about money.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you're surviving, you're trying.
Speaker 2: Is so good, so it's not like going to debt
Speaker 2: or anything. But it's like if you've got money to
Speaker 2: spend on something, throw the money at the problem.
Speaker 1: I tried the doctor golly winding method. I've never heard
Speaker 1: of this.
Speaker 2: Okay, well let me tell you I can burp a
Speaker 2: child unlike no one else. I did so many other
Speaker 2: short courses and courses in sleep reflux colic. We had
Speaker 2: the Happy Baby Song, Half the Magic Dragon, and here
Speaker 2: Comes the Sun Gray repeat.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Those are good songs.
Speaker 2: There's science behind them that they work on a baby's
Speaker 2: but very painful to.
Speaker 1: Listen to over and over again. They're social. One came
Speaker 1: on the other day and I was like, oh, yet
Speaker 1: it off, Get it off. He had a chiropractor and
Speaker 1: a kinesiologist. Gorse Burb from the non woo Woo Kelly,
Speaker 1: Non woo Woo Kelly.
Speaker 2: When you are a parent struggling, you will try anything.
Speaker 2: You will woo woo, you will woo woo, you will
Speaker 2: woo woo the fuck out of your anti woo woop.
Speaker 2: So I would take him to his chiropractic kinesiologist. And
Speaker 2: I'm not kidding when I tell you that there are
Speaker 2: crystals waving involved crystals, crystals to stop your baby screaming, Kelly,
Speaker 2: using crystals to stop her baby from screaming.
Speaker 1: It's like something that would never.
Speaker 2: Ever happen, and me like looking over my baby being realigned. Also,
Speaker 2: just anyone that's playing along at home. Can I say
Speaker 2: a chipractor on a baby? It's not cracking, cracking God, No,
Speaker 2: It's actually very gentle and very effective. For some people.
Speaker 2: It can really help because babies can get you know,
Speaker 2: stuck or misaligned as they are exiting the womb or
Speaker 2: in whatever fashion they come. I have heard stories about chiropractice.
Speaker 1: Doing God's work for newborns.
Speaker 2: Right while I was still breastfeeding, I cut out night
Speaker 2: shade fruits.
Speaker 1: What is a night shade food? Yeah? What is it?
Speaker 1: As a vegetarian, it's like all of my favorite no
Speaker 1: saw what is like eggplant would be a night shade?
Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure.
Speaker 2: Egg plant, sweet potato, potato, corn like capsicum.
Speaker 1: Yeah, there's not much left as the what am I
Speaker 1: supposed to be? If I can't eat Mexican? Because I
Speaker 1: also had to cut out dairy, like all of these
Speaker 1: things that I cut out.
Speaker 2: He had an occupational therapist. She diagnosed him with reflux
Speaker 2: and a tongue tie. So we did zoom calls where
Speaker 2: she would take me through different exercises. So we do
Speaker 2: like all these different exercises with the baby Tatrot's help
Speaker 2: and sane, oh insane, plus working full time, remember, and
Speaker 2: not sleeping, Kelly, I had four different types of baby carriers. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and then the GP prescribed just the standard reflux medication.
Speaker 1: I'm not going to say any drug name, but.
Speaker 2: It's the one that you get if your child has reflux.
Speaker 2: They start off on a pretty conservative dose and they
Speaker 2: go up. Still wasn't doing anything, and at that point
Speaker 2: I took him to a pediatrician who diagnosed him with
Speaker 2: the worst god he'd seen in his career and severe
Speaker 2: cow's milk and protein allergy. So what's good gastrod disease.
Speaker 2: It's like the worst form of reflex you can get.
Speaker 1: Oh my god.
Speaker 2: So it's like then he ended up on what Charlie
Speaker 2: or Luke would be on in terms of medication, the
Speaker 2: dosage that's how I was free three times a day
Speaker 2: and prescription formula which actually works out so much cheaper.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Oh, such a win rue positive and it doesn't have
Speaker 2: all of the mean messaging on it either.
Speaker 1: No.
Speaker 2: No, after that, he still wasn't a great sleeper, but
Speaker 2: he screamed less and started hitting more of his milestees.
Speaker 2: So if you're listening to this and you have tears
Speaker 2: running down your cheeks because you feel like you're alone
Speaker 2: in this experience and you're not enjoying the newborn bubble
Speaker 2: that everyone tells you to enjoy, and you're questioning what
Speaker 2: the fuck you've done, I promise you that you're not alone.
Speaker 2: People talk about things a lot more than they used to,
Speaker 2: but I still don't hear people talking about baby that
Speaker 2: never stop crying. And I think it's because we feel
Speaker 2: inherent shame. Yeah, because it must be us. It must
Speaker 2: be I'm just a terrible parent. I don't know what
Speaker 2: I'm doing. Who let me have a baby? It's obviously me.
Speaker 2: I'm a horrible mother. Google it all that comes up.
Speaker 2: There's nothing about mums. It's all about oh try these things.
Speaker 2: Oh no, never thought to fucking rock my baby and
Speaker 2: shush at the same time.
Speaker 1: Google. Thanks Google. So the two things that I will
Speaker 1: say is that push and advocate for your baby. You
Speaker 1: will get fobbed off because all babies cry. But trust me,
Speaker 1: not all babies cry all the time. There's a huge
Speaker 1: difference that isn't normal. And the problem is as well,
Speaker 1: babies like to gaslight because they're distracted when they're at
Speaker 1: the GP or the doctors. They often don't behave the
Speaker 1: way that they do it a little angel hush for.
Speaker 2: Your baby, because your baby can't advocate for themselves. And
Speaker 2: it will end. And I know I said that. I
Speaker 2: hated when people said that to me, But it does,
Speaker 2: and you will get to a place where you're like,
Speaker 2: oh my god, you still have a lot of like
Speaker 2: trauma around it or PTSD, I don't know what the
Speaker 2: right word is, but it doesn't.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it gets better. Do you have thoughts, Oh, I
Speaker 1: feel like I could have been a better friend in
Speaker 1: that moment for you. I feel like I didn't talk
Speaker 1: about it because I was so embarrassed, I know, And
Speaker 1: to be fair, like I was the last of my
Speaker 1: girlfriends I've said this before to have kids or one
Speaker 1: of the last, and they all started having kids in
Speaker 1: our late twenties, and it wasn't until I had my
Speaker 1: baby that they really opened up to me about how
Speaker 1: much they struggled, some of them in that newborn phase
Speaker 1: with really difficult babies. And so it is a fact
Speaker 1: of like being in like an echo chamber of bad
Speaker 1: thoughts and convincing yourself that you are not doing a
Speaker 1: good job, you must be something wrong with you, because
Speaker 1: so much of the newborn phase is the mother or
Speaker 1: the primary care who is in that and it's often
Speaker 1: just alone with the baby. So it's shame. But also
Speaker 1: you just don't even have a minute to really, I think,
Speaker 1: realize what's actually happening and how bad it is. Maybe
Speaker 1: like it feels bad, you know it's bad, but not enough.
Speaker 1: You don't realize how bad it is because you don't
Speaker 1: have a point of reference as well, even if you've
Speaker 1: got other friends or family with babies, you're not with
Speaker 1: them all the time, and people go, yeah, bad baby cries. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but like how many hours a day? You know, it's
Speaker 1: a weird thing to ask, because like it wasn't until
Speaker 1: my mum was helping me feel out of form.
Speaker 2: I was like, oh, would you say about nine hours
Speaker 2: per day? She goes, no, it's higher, it's more like
Speaker 2: fourteen because she was spending a lot of time. And
Speaker 2: I'm like, oh shit.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so if you have a baby that never stops
Speaker 1: coming as well, just if you are worried that you're
Speaker 1: a bad mum and it's something you're doing that is
Speaker 1: the biggest indicator that you're not a bad mum, and
Speaker 1: it's not something that you're doing. And I will say
Speaker 1: because I hate it when people say, oh, it's actually
Speaker 1: a blessing. It'll teach you empathy, it'll teach you this,
Speaker 1: blah blah blah. It's really shit luck that you it is,
Speaker 1: got a baby that was a bad baby. People also
Speaker 1: say that, don't call him a bad baby. Don't do this.
Speaker 1: He was a bad baby. Of course it wasn't his fault.
Speaker 1: I like to say, difficult baby. Do you say spirited baby? Spirited?
Speaker 1: You know what I call a spade of spade bad?
Speaker 1: Well you can say that because it's your baby. I
Speaker 1: can't call him a bad baby. He's not mine. True.
Speaker 1: I don't mind, though, tell you what, he's a hilarious toddler.
Speaker 1: Yeah he really is. He's really funny and his little
Speaker 1: fucking smile. Oh my god.
Speaker 2: Anyway, moving on to recommendations, I have two well ones
Speaker 2: for the new parents or any parent at all.
Speaker 1: Every single parent needs noise canceling headphones. I think I've
Speaker 1: said this before. I will not stop shouting it from
Speaker 1: the rooftops. You need noise canceling headphones. I have the
Speaker 1: Bose bas Boss ones. We can link them in the
Speaker 1: show notes. I absolutely smash them. I lie on them,
Speaker 1: I chuck them everywhere. I wear them in the shower.
Speaker 1: They are Incredible'll not with the water on them, but like,
Speaker 1: if I'm not washing my hair, I like to listen
Speaker 1: to things in the shower. Why don't you just have
Speaker 1: put a speaker on. You are so weird because I
Speaker 1: don't know speak as a waterproof No, I don't that
Speaker 1: sound That is so weird, Kelly, No, that is weird
Speaker 1: because I think that they're waterproof. I just said I
Speaker 1: don't put my head under God, you stress me out
Speaker 1: sometimes with the weirder way.
Speaker 2: Even if they're not on, you can turn them on
Speaker 2: so they dull the noise. Yeah, okay, so the screams
Speaker 2: don't hit as hard. I use them even now. Sometimes
Speaker 2: let me walks through the dof He walks through the
Speaker 2: door and has a meltdown. I literally just go, ah,
Speaker 2: headphones on, noise canceling on.
Speaker 1: So it just dulls it all a little bit. So
Speaker 1: I think he thinks that the headphones are potentially part
Speaker 1: of me and late to the party. But just a
Speaker 1: little bit of a light recommendation as well. Colin from
Speaker 1: Accounts if you need a new show, so good on Binge. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's wonderful. So the unicycle, Yeah yours? How long have
Speaker 1: you been single? A while? I'm late to the party.
Speaker 1: I know it is so funny. Harriet Dyer Patrick Brimmel,
Speaker 1: the two people real life couple. It's loosely based on
Speaker 1: their relationships, say if I didn't know, not completely, like
Speaker 1: just the age gap and things like that, obviously embellished
Speaker 1: to make it really funny and for television. It is
Speaker 1: so funny. I also had a recommendation in there too, Yeah,
Speaker 1: it is kind of coming off what my peak was
Speaker 1: this week. Join your local library. Join the local library,
Speaker 1: take advantage of those free things that they put on,
Speaker 1: take advantage of a safe, quiet space with lots of
Speaker 1: resources to use. Do it. It will be a blessing.
Speaker 2: Oh my god, that is such a good recommendation. Also
Speaker 2: helpful given I'm like spend five hundred dollars on headphones.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for joining us today.
Speaker 2: I hope this podcast has helped if you need it,
Speaker 2: or maybe it just helped you understand someone in your
Speaker 2: life that as a difficult.
Speaker 1: Baby, spirited child, a spirited human. Share the pod on
Speaker 1: your socials. We would love that. Let us know what
Speaker 1: you think and what you want to hear. You can
Speaker 1: tag us at Kyris, at Kelly Underscore mccaren and at
Speaker 1: earssa dot pod. This episode was produced by myself, Kairi Cells,
Speaker 1: and Kelly mccaren, with audio production by Madeline Joanno. See
Speaker 1: you next week. Whoo Why