Speaker 1: You're listening to a MoMA Mia podcast.
Speaker 2: Mamma Mea acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters
Speaker 2: that this podcast is recorded on Hello and welcome to
Speaker 2: Mamma Mia out Loud. It's what women are actually talking about.
Speaker 2: On Monday, the sixteenth of September, I'm Holly Wainwright, I'm
Speaker 2: MEA Friedman.
Speaker 3: And I'm Jesse Stevens.
Speaker 2: And on the show today, unpicking the conspiracies from the
Speaker 2: dog whistles on Planet Trump as he apparently survives another
Speaker 2: attempt on his life. Also unpacking the Perfect Couple and
Speaker 2: why Nicole Kidman is very much in her rich lady
Speaker 2: who lives by the sea era and do you want
Speaker 2: your partner to know where you are in your cycle?
Speaker 2: The endless inventions to handle our hormones and whether they're
Speaker 2: always helpful. But first, me a Freedman.
Speaker 1: In case you missed it, Prince Harry celebrated his fortieth
Speaker 1: birthday over the weekend, which will make you feel very old.
Speaker 1: If you remember Kim being taken out of the hospital
Speaker 1: in the arms of his mother, she had says Diana
Speaker 1: in a little blankie.
Speaker 2: Thought of that, but of course I'm under that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, the big question in the lead up, of course,
Speaker 1: was would King Charles and Prince William acknowledge it? Because
Speaker 1: they haven't since twenty twenty one. I shouldn't laugh. I
Speaker 1: think the word to use is estranged. But this year
Speaker 1: they did acknowledge it.
Speaker 2: You can't ignore the big ones, so you can ignore
Speaker 2: thirty eight who cares whatever, but you can't ignore them.
Speaker 1: Well, they sort of acknowledge it. So the Royal Family
Speaker 1: official social media platform, which is like Buckingham Palace and
Speaker 1: Charles and Camilla's people, they posted a photo to the
Speaker 1: grid of a smiling Harry and the caption read wishing
Speaker 1: the Duke of Sussex a very happy fortieth birthday today.
Speaker 1: Exclamation mark emoji of a cake.
Speaker 4: Oh, I love it.
Speaker 3: I think the exclamation mark is very encouraging. I think
Speaker 3: it seems very authentic.
Speaker 1: The shade came a little bit later in the day
Speaker 1: when William and Kate they have their own account called
Speaker 1: the Princeton Princess of Wales, and they reposted the grid
Speaker 1: from King Charles's page, but to their stories, and we
Speaker 1: know if it goes on the stories. That's the first
Speaker 1: piece of shade. The second piece of shade is that
Speaker 1: they paraphrased the caption out of their own and said,
Speaker 1: wishing a happy fortieth birthday to the Duke of Sussex.
Speaker 1: No exclamation mark, no kke emoji, no very happy happy.
Speaker 2: They took the emoji off to post it to the story.
Speaker 1: Well, they did their own caption, but it's almost like
Speaker 1: it is your birthday today.
Speaker 3: And I heard reports that Charles is planning on giving
Speaker 3: Harry little birthday phone call, and so is Kate. Allegend
Speaker 3: this is Red and the tabloids.
Speaker 1: Jesse after the things that he said about her in
Speaker 1: Wah his memoir, There's no way.
Speaker 3: She would exclusively told the post. So Kate is going
Speaker 3: to phone to wish him well on his birthday, but
Speaker 3: William will not be mad.
Speaker 1: I know what I think that is when you ring
Speaker 1: someone and you just hope that it goes straight to
Speaker 1: voicemail and you're like, please pick up, please don't pick up,
Speaker 1: please don't pick up.
Speaker 2: A happy birthday, Sorry to have missed you.
Speaker 3: And have you also heard that he's getting a cheek
Speaker 3: a little inheritance.
Speaker 2: How much money is he getting for his birthday?
Speaker 3: Look reports very but I'm going with sixteen mil from
Speaker 3: the Queen mother. She had a thing where when you
Speaker 3: turn forty you get a pot of money. He's getting
Speaker 3: another pot of money, another pot of money. So I
Speaker 3: love little birthday present for Harry.
Speaker 2: That is shade right if you just post it to
Speaker 2: the stories, oh, because.
Speaker 3: It's going to disappear. And also okay, it's me as
Speaker 3: birthday right. Holly shares a happy birthday to mayor to
Speaker 3: the grid, to the grid, I just reshare Holly's happy birthday.
Speaker 2: Which isn't mine to share with the sad caption. With
Speaker 2: a sad caption, you can share with it.
Speaker 1: I can ever do.
Speaker 4: I hate you.
Speaker 2: Yeah, thank you for that translation.
Speaker 5: Donald Trump says he's safe and well after reports of
Speaker 5: gunshots described to have been fired in his vicinity.
Speaker 2: There has been another assassination attempt on Donald Trump's life,
Speaker 2: at least that's certainly how it seems as we're recording
Speaker 2: this at Monday lunchtime. Here is what's being reported by
Speaker 2: reputable sources. Trump was playing golf. I don't want to
Speaker 2: be mean. I don't want to start with negativity.
Speaker 1: Busy, no, no, no. He likes to play golf. It's
Speaker 1: what he does, clearly a lot, barely. Apparently he's very
Speaker 1: good at it.
Speaker 2: I'm not running for president, and I would find it
Speaker 2: hard to find time for how long does golf take?
Speaker 1: A golf is for board people.
Speaker 2: Anyway, let's put the shade aside, because this is quite serious.
Speaker 2: He was playing golf in Florida at Palm Beach and
Speaker 2: apparently a rifle poked through the fence of the golf course,
Speaker 2: and it's not clear if they got any shots off,
Speaker 2: but the Secret Service shot back. At least four shots
Speaker 2: were fired, and the gunman ran away but then later
Speaker 2: got caught. It turns out his preliminary identification is he's
Speaker 2: a guy called Ryan Ruth and that he has been
Speaker 2: very vocal on social media criticizing Trump, and he's very
Speaker 2: pro Ukraine. So he's said in captions that he did
Speaker 2: vote for Trump in twenty sixteen but has been deeply
Speaker 2: disillusioned by him and he I mean, you don't want
Speaker 2: to diagnose from social media captions, but the man appears
Speaker 2: to be rather unwell.
Speaker 1: He's fifty eight, and his sons come out and said
Speaker 1: that he hopes that media reports are overblown. All he
Speaker 1: can say is that his father is a hard working
Speaker 1: and loving father. I think he's also from Hawaii.
Speaker 2: So if you've heard about this, and Trump is fine,
Speaker 2: though he was not hit or injured in this encounter,
Speaker 2: and it's been roundly condemned of course, that there is
Speaker 2: no place for this kind of violence in politics, from
Speaker 2: everyone from Harris to Biden and so on. If you've
Speaker 2: heard that story, you've probably also heard though some of
Speaker 2: the skepticism around it. Now we're not endorsing any of that,
Speaker 2: but some of the kind of points that are being
Speaker 2: shared are, is Donald Trump going to get someone to
Speaker 2: pretend to shoot him every time his ratings go down?
Speaker 2: And so on and so on. It's getting harder and
Speaker 2: harder to pick the conspiracies from the truths. So it's
Speaker 2: hardly surprising that the first reaction to this and almost
Speaker 2: any event, actually is did that actually happen? Is it
Speaker 2: actually real? Trump's team are especially good at this.
Speaker 1: I wanted to.
Speaker 2: Talk a little bit about the Eating Dogs and Cats
Speaker 2: debarcle of the past week as an example. The world
Speaker 2: has been laughing at that since the debate last Wednesday.
Speaker 2: We spoke about it obviously on the show on Wednesday
Speaker 2: and on a special subscribers episode on Thursday.
Speaker 1: And on the weekend, I shared this song to the
Speaker 1: group chat thinking that it was funny. Have a listen to.
Speaker 2: This in Springfield, they're eating the dogs, they're eating the cats.
Speaker 6: They're eating the pets.
Speaker 1: Of the people that live there.
Speaker 7: They're eating the dogs.
Speaker 1: That's a remix by DJ the Kidner's I'm sorry it
Speaker 1: was quite catchy, but I do appreciate it's also quite serious.
Speaker 2: Everybody's been laughing about that and making cool remixes of
Speaker 2: it and using it broadly as an example of how
Speaker 2: Donald Trump lost his mind and had some sort of
Speaker 2: brain explosion in the debate. But actually that's not what
Speaker 2: has happened, and there isn't that much to laugh about,
Speaker 2: because what this eating dogs and cats thing that Trump
Speaker 2: exploded with during the debate has actually done is send
Speaker 2: the world's media to a small city in Midwestern America
Speaker 2: that has recently had a large injection of Haitian immigrants. Now,
Speaker 2: the real story about Springfield, Ohio could definitely be seen
Speaker 2: as a good one. The town was really languishing, you know,
Speaker 2: It's manufacturing had moved on, like the story in lots
Speaker 2: of small towns across America and Australia. Indeed, and after
Speaker 2: COVID and lots of incentives from the city authorities for
Speaker 2: businesses to come and set up businesses, their factories, manufacturing
Speaker 2: and so on. There was a labor shortage, so people
Speaker 2: were encouraged to move there, take the jobs, and reinvigorate
Speaker 2: the city. It's estimated that somewhere between twelve thousand and
Speaker 2: twenty thousand Haitian immigrants from other parts of the US
Speaker 2: and who have relatively recently arrived from Haiti because there's
Speaker 2: a lot of unread in Haiti, have moved to Springfield
Speaker 2: to take these jobs. Right now, any smallish town that
Speaker 2: has a sudden population shift like this is going to
Speaker 2: face issues. And indeed Springfield has infrastructure issues like around healthcare, housing, schools,
Speaker 2: and roads. It is not necessarily caught up yet right
Speaker 2: with this population injection, and there are some legitimate issues,
Speaker 2: none of which have anything to do, of course, with
Speaker 2: anybody eating cats or dogs. But what Trump and JD.
Speaker 2: Vance's literal dog whistle did while all of us lefties
Speaker 2: were laughing, or all of us in our anti Trump
Speaker 2: bubble were laughing, was exactly what it set out to do,
Speaker 2: which was to highlight a place that has a few
Speaker 2: legitimate issues with population growth and hand amc to resentment
Speaker 2: and fear, this kind of hum of do you want
Speaker 2: your town to be overrun with strangers, foreigners, people who
Speaker 2: are different to you? And no one was talking about
Speaker 2: Springfield before Tuesday, and now this deeply racist undertone has
Speaker 2: been legit.
Speaker 1: I hadn't thought about it like that, And it's.
Speaker 2: What Trump wants. I want us to consider every time
Speaker 2: we're like laughing about him and thinking like that guy's crazy,
Speaker 2: what an idiot?
Speaker 8: What?
Speaker 2: His team and him probably are smarter than we give
Speaker 2: them credit for, because that ridiculous comment in the debate
Speaker 2: has played right into their hands using a conspiracy theory
Speaker 2: like that. Jesse, do you think we need to better
Speaker 2: understand conspiracy theories?
Speaker 3: Yes? I mean it's hard, right because it's like, well,
Speaker 3: how are you meant to react? Like to take it seriously?
Speaker 3: Almost feels more offensive to immigrants, like and it was
Speaker 3: fact checked at the time, and that is.
Speaker 2: No evidence of anybody eating any dogs or cats.
Speaker 3: Yeah, but what we need to do, I think is
Speaker 3: follow up with the real world consequences. Because the mayor
Speaker 3: of Springfield confirmed to reporters that elementary schools have been
Speaker 3: evacuated because of threats directly to the community. If you
Speaker 3: were someone an immigrant from Haiti and you were living
Speaker 3: in Springfield right now, how genuinely scary would it be.
Speaker 2: Like her to cancel community events?
Speaker 3: I guess the question is also like who's the butt
Speaker 3: of the joke here? Because to a lot of immigrants,
Speaker 3: I think you would feel like the butt of the joke.
Speaker 3: And jd Vance said as much he was speaking.
Speaker 1: He's got to stop talking about cats. Yeah, what's wrong
Speaker 1: with that man?
Speaker 3: He's obsessed.
Speaker 1: He's obsessed with who's got cats, who doesn't have children?
Speaker 1: What they're doing with it?
Speaker 7: What?
Speaker 2: Just sure?
Speaker 3: She's he was speaking, and he said that he is
Speaker 3: willing to create stories, and he was pressed on it,
Speaker 3: and he said, basically, the Republican Party at this point
Speaker 3: is willing to create stories so that the media actually
Speaker 3: pays attention to the suffering of the American people.
Speaker 2: And that's exactly what has just he.
Speaker 3: Knew this wasn't true. Trump knew this wasn't true. It
Speaker 3: didn't matter if it was true, because it told a
Speaker 3: story they wanted to tell about unrest caused by immigrants.
Speaker 3: The damage has been done. No amount of fact checking
Speaker 3: or whatever is going to make any difference. And the
Speaker 3: other thing that they've done is the earpiece. Did you
Speaker 3: guys see this over the weekend? I saw I was,
Speaker 3: you know, just on social media and you can get
Speaker 3: pulled into it really quickly.
Speaker 1: They just what they tried to say is that, Okay,
Speaker 1: what you've got to understand about Trump is I'm going
Speaker 1: to challenge you on one thing, Holly, which is he
Speaker 1: knew what he was doing. Trump never has a strategy, right,
Speaker 1: He's pure id He's just pure. If you think of
Speaker 1: him as a toddler. Toddlers don't have strategies, They just
Speaker 1: react in real time. This was a strategy to the moment.
Speaker 1: I think.
Speaker 2: Strategy.
Speaker 1: But what I was going to say is that the
Speaker 1: people around him, this is why he's so dangerous as
Speaker 1: a leader. And what Kamala Harris was trying to point out,
Speaker 1: he's so easy to manipulate. So I'm not saying that
Speaker 1: his people around him didn't know what to feed him.
Speaker 1: But when there's a fact that he can't handle because
Speaker 1: it doesn't align with his view of himself as a
Speaker 1: tough man, a winner, or powerful almighty, he just makes
Speaker 1: up something else because that's what he has to believe.
Speaker 1: Because it was roundly agreed even by Fox News that
Speaker 1: he lost the debate, and he can't really get away
Speaker 1: from those headlines, just like when he lost the election.
Speaker 1: He has to find a way to make that not true,
Speaker 1: and it is questioning the moderators, and he has since
Speaker 1: said that they should be criminally investigated, the moderators of
Speaker 1: the debate. He's now saying that Kamala Harris had ear
Speaker 1: pieces in her earrings and was being coached in real
Speaker 1: time about what to say and fed the questions in
Speaker 1: advance by the corrupt abe his news.
Speaker 3: But the thing is he didn't start that rumor right
Speaker 3: like it started on X oh yeah by someone else,
Speaker 3: and then of course he does jump onto.
Speaker 1: It, grab anything to soothe himself, and his supporters love
Speaker 1: that because that's a much more interesting story than Kamala
Speaker 1: Harris is just an accomplished smart woman who whipped his ass.
Speaker 3: And the more you ever explain, the guiltier you sound.
Speaker 3: There's every article and fact check out that's gone. She's
Speaker 3: worn these earrings once a month for years.
Speaker 1: And as soon as she then releases a statement ye
Speaker 1: denying that it's like the sharing the tailor for Trump
Speaker 1: deep fakes. As soon as you have to deny it.
Speaker 1: You're dragged into the gutter and dragged into his news cycle,
Speaker 1: and that's what he loves.
Speaker 2: It's interesting, though, because you know the cats and dogs.
Speaker 2: Trump's team are sharing all these very stylized AI cat
Speaker 2: memes of him and JD. Vance on planes fuls of cats,
Speaker 2: and it's very clever. It's very clever. It's got smart
Speaker 2: people around terrifyingly dark because it's playing into it a
Speaker 2: deliberately racist trope one hundred percent. It's putting actual, real
Speaker 2: life humans in danger in Springfield and other places, and
Speaker 2: it's giving everybody lots of fodder to extend this ridiculous conversation.
Speaker 2: I don't know. I wish there was a way to
Speaker 2: avoid being pulled into his version of that.
Speaker 1: But he loves that for two reasons. Firstly, what he
Speaker 1: understands better than anyone who's how to dominate the news cycle,
Speaker 1: That's what I mean exactly. And also it's who's around him,
Speaker 1: So he tends to surround himself by people who know
Speaker 1: how to play him. And he loves conspiracies because you
Speaker 1: can always invent a conspiracy to explain why something you
Speaker 1: don't like isn't true. And so what's alarming, and we're
Speaker 1: going to talk about it more later in the week
Speaker 1: with Emelia Lester. There's a woman called Laura Luma who
Speaker 1: is spending a lot of time with him now and
Speaker 1: traveled to the debate with him. She's a very troubling person,
Speaker 1: and even the most extreme MAGA people have disenfranchised her
Speaker 1: and said she's too extreme for them. She went with
Speaker 1: him to the nine to eleven memorial last week. She
Speaker 1: has publicly said on many occasions that she believes nine
Speaker 1: to eleven was an inside job and that it was
Speaker 1: the American government. Like talk about a conspiracy. So she
Speaker 1: peddles these conspiracy theories, and Trump will just regard agitate
Speaker 1: what he's been told. And that's why he's so easy
Speaker 1: to play any leader that pisss in his pocket, whether
Speaker 1: it's Kim Jong U R. Putin, they know how to
Speaker 1: play him. It doesn't mean that he's colluding with them.
Speaker 1: They're just smarter than him.
Speaker 2: I just worry that we're all being played by him,
Speaker 2: that the left leaning media is being played by him.
Speaker 2: I don't when I say we, I don't mean we
Speaker 2: the left leaning media, but like when we're laughing about
Speaker 2: the dogs and cats and going, this man's out of
Speaker 2: his mind and that we are being played by him
Speaker 2: like a violin. And I think that that's why it'll
Speaker 2: be interesting now to see if there's any legs to
Speaker 2: this idea of like maybe this assassination attempt was overblown,
Speaker 2: maybe it wasn't real. Maybe he just wants a new cycle.
Speaker 2: But that Trump's enemies also stop buying it.
Speaker 1: But that's the left conspiracy. Yeah, yeah, but you even
Speaker 1: saw in the debate he was trying to say, this
Speaker 1: is the Democrats organized to try and have me killed.
Speaker 1: I mean he's been saying that quite a lot. Jadie
Speaker 1: Vance came out straight after that first assassination attempt and
Speaker 1: said that, and many people say that's why he was chosen.
Speaker 1: Apart from being best mates with John Jr. Trump really
Speaker 1: liked that. He loves a conspiracy theory because he knows
Speaker 1: that it plays well with his base, who love a story.
Speaker 3: And to go back to that first assassination attempt, because
Speaker 3: the news cycle moved so quickly that we never kind
Speaker 3: of properly get to prosecute what happened. I remember us
Speaker 3: having a conversation and talking about the contempt in political
Speaker 3: discourse and was this a reflection of where we're at
Speaker 3: at a culture and political divisiveness. Looking back, what actually
Speaker 3: happened there. The way that history will interpret what happened
Speaker 3: was that this gunman and two people died on that day,
Speaker 3: and that was really sad. But what happened on that
Speaker 3: day was he wanted a spectacle. I don't think that
Speaker 3: that man was politically motivated to kill Trump. I think
Speaker 3: he would have killed.
Speaker 1: Popide in the locations of both candidates exactly.
Speaker 3: And so it wasn't anything against a Republican candidate. It
Speaker 3: wasn't anything against Trump. It was about spectacle. It was
Speaker 3: the same as we see in the US all the
Speaker 3: time of people going and school shooting, for example. It's
Speaker 3: got a lot to do with gun laws. This obviously
Speaker 3: we don't know so much about anymore, but the way
Speaker 3: that it was put into this very neat narrative. And
Speaker 3: whether you think Trump's smart or an idiot or manipulated,
Speaker 3: he tells a story, and he tells a good story
Speaker 3: that does resonate with a lot of people and makes
Speaker 3: them feel things. So the cats and dogs, and we
Speaker 3: talked a little bit about this posted debate, but that
Speaker 3: is a story about savages it's about the external savage
Speaker 3: coming into a Western civilization and destroying the vulnerable things
Speaker 3: they love.
Speaker 1: But Jesse, it's also in the same realm as the
Speaker 1: Democrats executing babies. They're executing the babies after they're born.
Speaker 1: It's this idea that these evil people, you're right, are
Speaker 1: threatening our way of life. When the moderators during the
Speaker 1: debate were fact checking him, I mean we were laughing
Speaker 1: because it's like it's satire. It's not something out of
Speaker 1: Saturday Night. I've mister Trump, We've checked, and no, it
Speaker 1: is not legal in anything.
Speaker 3: You know why the facts a cutter baby didn't even
Speaker 3: work because what he was speaking to was something that
Speaker 3: some Americans.
Speaker 1: Feel, and just yeah, it plays for him.
Speaker 3: If you feel like someone's taken your job, or you
Speaker 3: feel like your suburb looks different to how it looked
Speaker 3: twenty years ago, then you actually don't give a shit
Speaker 3: whether a real cat or a real dog was killed
Speaker 3: or eaten. You're just like, yeah, that man knows how
Speaker 3: I feel, which is even more kind of sinister.
Speaker 8: Scary. I heard someone walking around, You're right. I was
Speaker 8: just I was just thirsty, thirsty. Don't you have a
Speaker 8: graph by your bed? I I forgot. Are you sure
Speaker 8: there wasn't something else you were looking for? Because I
Speaker 8: hate you to be sneaking around. I mean, if you
Speaker 8: want something, just ask.
Speaker 1: Like many of you. The weekend binge watching Nicole Kidman's
Speaker 1: latest series, The Perfect Couple on Netflix, and what everybody's
Speaker 1: talking about is how similar it is to so many
Speaker 1: other Nicole Kidman TV series from the past few years,
Speaker 1: because she seems to keep playing a rich, cold, murder adjacent,
Speaker 1: ambitious mother who looks like she's thirty two while wearing
Speaker 1: a series of quality wigs and living beside large bodies
Speaker 1: of water. You may remember that vibe from Big Little Eyes,
Speaker 1: Nine Perfect Strangers, The Undoing, a Family Affair, and now
Speaker 1: The Perfect Couple, and I should say a Family Affair
Speaker 1: didn't have a murder in it, but her character was
Speaker 1: oddly spookily similar to the one she plays in The
Speaker 1: Perfect Couple. They were both hugely successful authors grappling with
Speaker 1: issues around sex and love and what it means to
Speaker 1: parent your adult children and all the rest of those
Speaker 1: shows like The Perfect Couple do hinge around a murder
Speaker 1: that's revealed in the first episode. It's definitely giving white
Speaker 1: lotus and lots of people have remarked on the similarity
Speaker 1: between White lotus The Perfect Couple. We'll be doing a
Speaker 1: full subscriber review of the whole series with all our
Speaker 1: thoughts in the next few days, but today we want
Speaker 1: to unpack this idea of Nicole's era and the idea
Speaker 1: that it's a pretty interesting career decision to choose so
Speaker 1: many roles that are the same whole What do you
Speaker 1: think is going on with that? Is it a deliberate
Speaker 1: strategy or she just likes playing those women? I don't know.
Speaker 2: I mean, one of the things I think about the
Speaker 2: fact that all these sort of TV ones have come
Speaker 2: out at the same time, because she also has a
Speaker 2: movie coming out, which is supposed to be very Venice
Speaker 2: Film Festival, very arty, very award bab Baby Girl, Baby Girl.
Speaker 2: Is Is it some kind of hangover from the strike,
Speaker 2: because it's like, all of a sudden, just all these vehicles,
Speaker 2: no one's working harder than Nicole. Kidman, it feels like
Speaker 2: at the moment, doesn't it.
Speaker 8: Well.
Speaker 1: They did say that this series, The Perfect Couple was
Speaker 1: meant to be filmed over six weeks, which is still
Speaker 1: a pretty short shoot given it with six episodes. But
Speaker 1: they had to condense it because of the writer's strike
Speaker 1: to just three weeks. It was filmed in three weeks,
Speaker 1: three ways wow, six hours of TV.
Speaker 2: One of the things that I was thinking when I
Speaker 2: was watching it is that, you know how people have
Speaker 2: always said, what are the roles for women over a
Speaker 2: certain age in Hollywood? There are now more roles for
Speaker 2: women over a certain age in Hollywood, but they are
Speaker 2: very specific ones.
Speaker 1: How would you describe the thing that.
Speaker 2: Kidman can't do anymore is she can't do ordinary person.
Speaker 2: So if you think about, say, Kate Winslett playing Mayor
Speaker 2: of Eastown, I can't remember what the character's actual name was,
Speaker 2: Mayor the detective. It was detective. It was a few
Speaker 2: years ago now, but it was an absolute and everybody
Speaker 2: was like, she's so brave because she looks so normal
Speaker 2: and so unlike a movie star and all that because
Speaker 2: she was playing a small town cop who was deep
Speaker 2: in grief and didn't have time to get her roots done.
Speaker 2: Nicole Kidman can't play those roles anymore because of the
Speaker 2: esthetic choices she's made about her face, which are entirely
Speaker 2: her business, mean that she is now perfectly positioned to
Speaker 2: play a certain type of rich, older woman who would
Speaker 2: have also made those choices.
Speaker 1: But you say that she didn't look that different back
Speaker 1: in the day when she was in the hours, and
Speaker 1: that's ironically, or maybe not ironically, what she married Mioska
Speaker 1: for you think, I mean she wore a prosthetic nose
Speaker 1: for that and as sort of a gray wig where
Speaker 1: she played Virginia Wolf. You're right, she does look different now.
Speaker 1: But what's interesting is when we've been involved with Strive,
Speaker 1: you do think about, oh, this character and is it
Speaker 1: too similar to other characters that they've played, and should
Speaker 1: we cast this person because I mean, obviously not the
Speaker 1: main character, but some of the characters have they played
Speaker 1: something similar in something else that's coming out around that time.
Speaker 3: When you are Nicole Kidman, you're the boss, I think
Speaker 3: you get to decide what projects you do.
Speaker 1: And she's produced a lot of that.
Speaker 3: And she's produced a lot. What we don't see a
Speaker 3: lot of is women or people who can work as
Speaker 3: much as Nicole Kidman wanting to work as much as
Speaker 3: Nicole Kidman, like she.
Speaker 1: Must love work.
Speaker 3: I was looking at her IMDb profile and she has
Speaker 3: ninety seven credits to her name, and I kept going
Speaker 3: back going. No, but there's been a recent explosion of
Speaker 3: Nicole Kidman. No, there hasn't. That woman has consistently worked
Speaker 3: for what twenty five thirty year is something like interesting.
Speaker 2: Yeah, she clearly does.
Speaker 8: Love that.
Speaker 2: Because I'm fascinated by ambition. What happens to ambition as
Speaker 2: you get older, too, because you know, a more traditional
Speaker 2: trajectory is you go so hard to establish yourself and
Speaker 2: then you get really picky. I'm now at a point
Speaker 2: not me Nicole Kidman. I'm being Nicole Kidman in the enpoyment.
Speaker 2: I can entirely pick and choose. I don't have to
Speaker 2: do any job to pay the mortgage. I don't have
Speaker 2: to do any job to keep myself in the spotlight.
Speaker 2: Because she's Nicole Kidman, the drive in her to love
Speaker 2: what she does is clearly not slowed down at all.
Speaker 2: She could be on her ranch in Nashville, or at
Speaker 2: her farm in the Southern Highlands here, or kicking back
Speaker 2: on a beach in Hawaii for nine months of the
Speaker 2: year and do one project. But she does not want to,
Speaker 2: And I find that really interesting.
Speaker 3: In twenty nineteen, she was ranked as the fourth highest
Speaker 3: paid actress in the world, with an annual income of
Speaker 3: thirty four million dollars, so she is very, very rich.
Speaker 3: So in the last ten years she's done thirty projects,
Speaker 3: and you think like you've got your big little lies,
Speaker 3: you've got your nine perfect strangers. And that's actually on
Speaker 3: part with two other women of her era. You've got
Speaker 3: Kate Winslet, she's done about thirty, and you've got Kate Blanchett,
Speaker 3: who's also done about thirty. The difference with Nicole Kidman
Speaker 3: is there's this brilliant article written on Slate with the
Speaker 3: headline Nicole Kidman's Beach reads Cinematic Universe, and they say
Speaker 3: it's like the Marvel Universe, where like all the characters
Speaker 3: could possibly be related slash the same characters.
Speaker 1: They literally wear the same clothes. She wears the same wigs.
Speaker 1: She always is sort of like looking wistfully out to see.
Speaker 3: There's a lot of huffing. There's a lot of sighing,
Speaker 3: which is a a state pawn exactly. They say, it's
Speaker 3: kind of like the depressed wine Mum, but like that
Speaker 3: artifice coming undone. So it's like the opening of this
Speaker 3: Slate article is so good. It's like watching the Perfect Couple.
Speaker 3: You kind of go. Wait, didn't we already watch this
Speaker 3: in a scenic coastal location. No, that was big lit lies.
Speaker 3: She's playing a wealthy New Yorker who's adulterous husband may
Speaker 3: or may not have committed murder. Wait, No, that's the
Speaker 3: undoing and it just goes through and there's like six
Speaker 3: that you go, these are all the same thing. And
Speaker 3: one theory is that maybe she's not trying to prove
Speaker 3: herself anymore because she's always gone through eras in her
Speaker 3: career where she's played like complicated mothers or like her
Speaker 3: divorce film was More and Rouge, and they kind of
Speaker 3: go through and see it. But if Nicole Kidman just
Speaker 3: wants to work and she gets a druckload of money
Speaker 3: to go and be a depressed wine mum in Nantucket
Speaker 3: for three weeks, fuck take it. Like there's this theory
Speaker 3: in Hollywood that it's like one for them, one for me,
Speaker 3: Like is she just doing that paying the bills and
Speaker 3: then going and doing some passion project like maybe the
Speaker 3: one she won the baby Girl?
Speaker 2: Yeah, maybe she loves it, because one thing you could
Speaker 2: argue is that another thing that all those things have
Speaker 2: in common is that massive hits, big, little lies, the
Speaker 2: undoing this like everybody's talking about the perfect couple. I've
Speaker 2: started watching it against my will because me have told
Speaker 2: me I should. Yeah, and im in exactly nowhere there
Speaker 2: as good as Big Little Eyes. I'm sorry.
Speaker 1: People should stop.
Speaker 2: Comparing it to that. There's nowhere near that good. But
Speaker 2: it's really good. It's really fun. And so she obviously
Speaker 2: knows what women want to watch, right, yeah, because we're
Speaker 2: all watching it.
Speaker 1: So I think that's a really interesting idea that it's
Speaker 1: not a flaw, it's a feature. So it's not oh whoops,
Speaker 1: the characters are all similar, it's she knows that this
Speaker 1: is what people want to see her be in the
Speaker 1: same way that you know, Tom Cruise just only does
Speaker 1: films where he's jumping out of planes, Like he only
Speaker 1: plays one character. Remember when he did Born of the
Speaker 1: Fourth of July and he did Magnolia, and he was
Speaker 1: making some interesting choices sort of twenty years ago, and
Speaker 1: then it's almost like he decided, no, I'm going to
Speaker 1: give the people what they want, which is me being
Speaker 1: a stunt guy and jumping out of planes. And it's
Speaker 1: almost like she's kind of done the same thing. Whereas
Speaker 1: you look at Kate Winslet and Kate Blanchette, for example,
Speaker 1: And I probably couldn't tell you those thirty projects that
Speaker 1: they've each done because they've been so varied and they
Speaker 1: haven't been as commercially successful as Nichole's.
Speaker 2: Kitmun does do some risky things. I think Baby Girl
Speaker 2: is meant to be risky, and she went through a
Speaker 2: real art house phase. She really did, but it's almost
Speaker 2: like she's left it behind.
Speaker 1: She's meant to be amazing in Baby Girl, but when
Speaker 1: you say risky, she's not putting on a prosthetic nose
Speaker 1: and not plucking her eyebrows, and.
Speaker 2: More to being risky than what you look like.
Speaker 7: Right?
Speaker 2: Is it risky material? Controversial? Material? Difficult?
Speaker 1: I would argue, is it risky for a woman of
Speaker 1: her age to look her age? Because of course, one
Speaker 1: of the things that's kind of disconcerting in this is
Speaker 1: that she's meant to be the matriarch with three adult children,
Speaker 1: which would put her in her fifties, which is and
Speaker 1: yet she looks younger, a lot younger than the young women.
Speaker 1: I disagree.
Speaker 2: I think that it's perfect casting. The character she's playing
Speaker 2: would look like that. That's true, and so as to my
Speaker 2: point before, she doesn't look like a small town cop
Speaker 2: with no money, but she looks exactly like a very successful,
Speaker 2: you know, waspy author with a munchin on Nantucket. That
Speaker 2: is what she would look like. So I think that,
Speaker 2: as I say, the choices she's made allow her to
Speaker 2: play a very certain kind of older woman who does
Speaker 2: look like that.
Speaker 1: So isn't the same as you know, how when an
Speaker 1: author has a bestseller, all of their book covers look
Speaker 1: a bit the same, like Lisa Jule for example, Oh
Speaker 1: you've got to look and vibe for your novels. And
Speaker 1: is that because it's like, oh, I like Nicole Kidman,
Speaker 1: and it's like more of the same. It's if you
Speaker 1: liked Big Little Lies, if you like Nine Perfect Strangers,
Speaker 1: if you like the undoing.
Speaker 3: This just feels like also we're seeing the boom of
Speaker 3: female fiction, which is very new. And the thing about
Speaker 3: contemporary women's fiction is that it also isn't about twenty
Speaker 3: year olds anymore like Big Little Lies. Was a real
Speaker 3: kind of shift in that, and Leanne Moriarty is almost
Speaker 3: synonymous with Nicole Kidman at this point. They obviously did
Speaker 3: Nine Perfect Strangers, and now they're doing what Alice forgot,
Speaker 3: I think is the next one. And I think she's
Speaker 3: attached herself to the those sorts of projects, and so
Speaker 3: she's done the damsel in distress or like the Witch.
Speaker 3: She's done romance. She's done a bunch of stuff. This
Speaker 3: is a current cliche, and this is what the slight
Speaker 3: article said that she's leaning into only to invert it.
Speaker 3: Sometimes I'm not fully seeing the inversion of the cliche.
Speaker 3: To be honest, there's a few two dimensional I really
Speaker 3: struggled with that in A Family Affair where I went
Speaker 3: what's difficult is when you know what Nicole Kidman is
Speaker 3: capable of. She's one of the best actresses alive.
Speaker 1: There were some real glimpses of it in this. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I found even.
Speaker 2: In the first episode. I think she's great in it.
Speaker 3: I'm not understanding the accent.
Speaker 4: This is.
Speaker 1: This is something that's happened with a British accent.
Speaker 2: I don't English accent.
Speaker 3: In the last two shows she's done, she has a
Speaker 3: completely different accent to the rest of her family, which
Speaker 3: isn't offul well.
Speaker 1: No, she's Australian in the last one in a Family Affair,
Speaker 1: and she's a brit in this one.
Speaker 3: Why isn't she just doing an American accent?
Speaker 2: It's distracting.
Speaker 1: I think great in the perfect contest nd a normal accent.
Speaker 1: Now that as we will be talking about this, stay
Speaker 1: tuned for an upcoming subscriber episode. You can watch this
Speaker 1: on Netflix Really good, easily bingeable, six hours, go hard.
Speaker 3: One, unlimited out loud access. We drop episodes every Tuesday
Speaker 3: and Thursday exclusively from Mum and MEA subscribers follow the
Speaker 3: link in the show notes to get us in your
Speaker 3: ears five days a week, and a huge thank you
Speaker 3: to all our current subscribers. Period tracking, cycle sinking, femtech
Speaker 3: and meno washing. Has capitalism finally weaseled its way into
Speaker 3: my ovaries. There's a few things going on here, and
Speaker 3: I want to start with an experience I had last week.
Speaker 3: My husband was out with a bunch of friends and
Speaker 3: I got a message from him saying, my friend has
Speaker 3: the flow app on his phone that tracks his girlfriend's cycle.
Speaker 3: Maybe we should do this, and I promptly replied, fuck off.
Speaker 3: To be clear, this isn't It's not about baby make
Speaker 3: It's about working out. When I am pre menstrul do
Speaker 3: I get perms?
Speaker 1: Absolutely?
Speaker 3: Is that information I would like to share with my partner. No,
Speaker 3: I like to keep them Onney's toast.
Speaker 1: Why I would like everybody if I still had a cycle,
Speaker 1: I would like everybody to know what it was.
Speaker 3: Now it's to mining. Oh my goodness, it's so onto mining.
Speaker 3: And this isn't just about period tracking. It has some
Speaker 3: incredible benefits. It can anticipate symptoms, it compiles health data,
Speaker 3: and it can potentially assist with the diagnosis of things
Speaker 3: like PCOS or endo. This about an industry because everywhere
Speaker 3: I look, I am being sold something like cycle sinking
Speaker 3: exercise regimes. Have you guys seen this? Yeah, no, okay,
Speaker 3: big in my world. It's probably because you're perry, so
Speaker 3: they're just like, she's a right off, I'm met her now, Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 3: So your algorithms, No, you don't need it, but it's
Speaker 3: where your exercise regime is based on where you are
Speaker 3: in your cycle, so you know, when you're on new period,
Speaker 3: you shouldn't do this, but you should do more of
Speaker 3: this or whatever. Yeah, there's fertility courses, there are new
Speaker 3: gadgets to assist with period pain. There's moon caups and
Speaker 3: period undies. There's a new industry that a lot of
Speaker 3: experts are now riding about and it's being referred to
Speaker 3: as the absolute gold rush of menopause. So in the UK,
Speaker 3: for example, Tesco has announced it's trialing menopause friendly aisles
Speaker 3: in stores and it's got skincare and vitamins and special
Speaker 3: pads for ladies.
Speaker 2: They've worked out that the older ladies have the money.
Speaker 3: Yeah exactly.
Speaker 1: There also be no people in that aisle, so true,
Speaker 1: people are bloody annoying.
Speaker 3: I want to know, are we all being taken for
Speaker 3: a ride or should we be excited that whole new
Speaker 3: industries are being funded to cater to our needs?
Speaker 1: Both okay, both yes and yes. And there are a
Speaker 1: lot of people who are launching whole brands for menopause
Speaker 1: and women like Naomi Watts has got a brand called
Speaker 1: Stripes that does everything from lubricant for vaginal dryness to
Speaker 1: shampoo and yeah fake so I can run.
Speaker 3: I mean, that's genuinely something that is a symptom of
Speaker 3: that period of your life. So that's solving a problem
Speaker 3: that exists, right.
Speaker 1: But what I think so lovely about it? And I
Speaker 1: take your point, but like capitalism is always sold to women.
Speaker 1: Thanks for including us and not ignoring us, because I
Speaker 1: much prefer being sold to as a woman of my
Speaker 1: age then products being sold to me by twenty year
Speaker 1: olds who are advertising anti wrinkle creams, Like, thanks at
Speaker 1: least for acknowledging that I exist. And there are certain
Speaker 1: things that are specific about being this age.
Speaker 3: How about a tea? Do you need a special tea?
Speaker 1: Well, no, I don't need a special tea, but if
Speaker 1: someone finds that tea nice. What's the most important thing
Speaker 1: for women is information, not products, to be honest, and
Speaker 1: that's where we sit and that's why we had the
Speaker 1: Very Pery Summit and why we'll be doing more around
Speaker 1: that next year because women need information. Do they need
Speaker 1: to buy products? I would argue that they need to
Speaker 1: know whether or not they should use HIT and whether
Speaker 1: or not there are certain things that they might just
Speaker 1: think are just them. They might just think that their
Speaker 1: vaginal dryness or their skin dryness, or their ezatia is
Speaker 1: just them, or their weight game or their forgetfulness. They
Speaker 1: might not understand what it is. And by telling them, hey,
Speaker 1: all these random seeming symptoms they're all connected. They're all
Speaker 1: because you're lacking estrogen and your body's going through reverth puberty.
Speaker 1: It's like, Oh, it's very normalizing now. Whether you choose
Speaker 1: to buy products to treat those things or not is
Speaker 1: then up to you. But the most important thing is
Speaker 1: the information. I agree with me or on this.
Speaker 2: But I want to go back to the variot tracking
Speaker 2: app and though whether or not your partners should.
Speaker 1: Have oh to your worst nightmare whole that's terrible.
Speaker 2: I can't believe that's terrible.
Speaker 1: Can you guys explain to me why it's terrible?
Speaker 2: This is what I would think. I don't know. I
Speaker 2: can't speak for Jess. She'll speak for herself. The problem
Speaker 2: with your partner and the people around you, and your
Speaker 2: colleagues and whoever. Knowing that, oh, she's pmassing as it means, Oh,
Speaker 2: I get to disregard everything you say a day.
Speaker 1: But that's it's not.
Speaker 2: True that your hormones are so in charge of your
Speaker 2: life that there's no truth to any of the things.
Speaker 1: So's there's a lot of truth exactly.
Speaker 2: It's like if I lose my ship because you keep
Speaker 2: putting your cup on the edge of the dishwasher instead
Speaker 2: of putting it in the dishwasher, and I'm more likely
Speaker 2: to lose my ship the day before my period about that.
Speaker 1: So why wouldn't you want it doesn't mean somebody to
Speaker 1: know that, because he'll go, oh, she's just pay messing
Speaker 1: and not think, oh, I should put my cup in
Speaker 1: the dishwater. See, you've clearly got awful partners, because what
Speaker 1: I would like to believe is that my partner would go, Okay,
Speaker 1: that's not the time to bring this up or do that.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna treat her with some special t LC because.
Speaker 3: Sensitive little flowers are so so we then we just
Speaker 3: tiptoe around the crazy home.
Speaker 1: Before period. Frankly appreciated if everybody really took a little
Speaker 1: bit of better care of me before I have.
Speaker 2: This is the problem with this is if there is
Speaker 2: a tension in this that we've discussed before about that idea.
Speaker 2: You know, it used to be where women can't be
Speaker 2: in powerful positions because they're too emotional X amount of
Speaker 2: days of the year. You couldn't trust the decisions that
Speaker 2: they'd make, You couldn't trust the calls they'd make. Shouldn't
Speaker 2: let them hire anyone, fire anyone, make any important calls
Speaker 2: about things. Of course, there's a lot of truth and
Speaker 2: science to hormones, and it's great that we're all learning
Speaker 2: more about it. But this is what worries me about
Speaker 2: us leaning so heavily into the hormonal story of our life.
Speaker 2: It can so easily be weaponized against us. And you're right,
Speaker 2: Mia that lovely, well meaning people won't do that. But
Speaker 2: the world isn't full of lovely, well meaning people. And
Speaker 2: also even if they are, those tropes are so ingrained
Speaker 2: in our culture. This idea of like, oh, she must
Speaker 2: be p messing if she's angry about something, rather than
Speaker 2: maybe she's got a really valid reason to be angry
Speaker 2: about something. We don't want to hand more of that
Speaker 2: to people.
Speaker 1: Well, the sort of Handmaid's tale side of this is
Speaker 1: in America, since rovers Way was overturned, a lot of
Speaker 1: people have been saying, you should take those apps off
Speaker 1: your phones because they can be co opted potentially by
Speaker 1: legislation to track your periods. I mean, that's what Project
Speaker 1: twenty twenty five, which is this blueprint for what conservatives
Speaker 1: want to do if Trump wins the election. It includes
Speaker 1: women's cycles being tracked. When this sounds like something out
Speaker 1: of a horror film, it's very dystopian, but this idea
Speaker 1: of we do want to track women so yes, it
Speaker 1: can be used for nefarious purposes, and we must remember that.
Speaker 1: But one of the things I always used to find
Speaker 1: hardest about my PMS, and also about Perry, which is
Speaker 1: very similar in mood swings of it, was that I
Speaker 1: would never realize that's what was going on. I would
Speaker 1: just think that everyone was awful. My relationship was awful,
Speaker 1: I was awful, life was awful. And sometimes I like
Speaker 1: a third party to just give me a little reality
Speaker 1: check and just say, hey, could be because a bit.
Speaker 3: I think though, Just firstly on the privacy thing, I
Speaker 3: think that's an important point because the idea too is
Speaker 3: that if it is illegal for you to have an abortion,
Speaker 3: then that could lead to criminal proceedings.
Speaker 1: And use contraception.
Speaker 3: And as part of criminal proceedings, you can get data
Speaker 3: off someone's phone and your abortion or your pregnancy would
Speaker 3: be logged in your phone. So that's a problem. The
Speaker 3: other problem is sharing that data with advertisers so that
Speaker 3: they know, oh, at this point of a cycle, she
Speaker 3: might be more likely to buy this kind of thing
Speaker 3: and being manipulated, which I hate all that shit.
Speaker 1: Read the fine print before you download those apps.
Speaker 3: Yeah, But the other thing is if I'm in my
Speaker 3: local supermarket, and there is menopause aisles right for like,
Speaker 3: you know, you need your special pad, and you need
Speaker 3: your specialty and your skin care and your vitamins. And
Speaker 3: then I walk into work and I'm working with women
Speaker 3: who are of menopausal age. Is it not reshaping how
Speaker 3: we see women? Like we've wanted to divorce women a
Speaker 3: little bit from their hormones, and at a moment where
Speaker 3: women are becoming their reproductive capacities again in a very
Speaker 3: very dangerous way.
Speaker 1: I just worry that these.
Speaker 2: Two things could be I agree, I sympathize with this
Speaker 2: because I agree with me that I think it's great
Speaker 2: that we are much more aware now of menopause and
Speaker 2: all the things that come along with it. But we
Speaker 2: did an episode of mid about rage, and in it
Speaker 2: we were discussing myself and just interparsons how there is
Speaker 2: an element of midlife rage which is directly related to
Speaker 2: a plunge in estrogen right there, That's true. But there
Speaker 2: is also an element of midlife rage that's about just
Speaker 2: having had enough of spending years and years putting yourself
Speaker 2: at the end of a list, putting up with a
Speaker 2: whole lot of crap, caretaking all the time living in
Speaker 2: a world where you're often told to shush and smile
Speaker 2: and be nice. That when women get to that place
Speaker 2: sometimes where things boil over and they go the cliches
Speaker 2: about older women, no folks left to give all that stuff,
Speaker 2: there's an element of truth in that that is really important.
Speaker 2: And I think, while it's imp I want to understand
Speaker 2: the science, it shouldn't all be dismissed as science. It's
Speaker 2: the same I used to feel the same way when
Speaker 2: I was pregnant. There was a sort of strain of
Speaker 2: being easily dismissed when you're pregnant. Baby brain. Now there
Speaker 2: is some scientific truth to that, right, But also pregnant
Speaker 2: women can do amazing things. They can run countries, as
Speaker 2: just Cindra ar Durn showed us. They can certainly run businesses,
Speaker 2: They can do all kinds of incredible things. They don't
Speaker 2: become lobotomized idiots because their hormones are doing things. So
Speaker 2: I agree it's a fine line to walk. It's like,
Speaker 2: we want to be understood, we want to be empowered.
Speaker 2: And when I was really struggling with Perry symptoms in particular,
Speaker 2: I tried every tea, every cream, every supplement, to try
Speaker 2: and help me with some things, and some of them
Speaker 2: really did and some of them really didn't, and you
Speaker 2: know that was that, and I was glad they were there.
Speaker 2: And a lot of those are businesses started by women
Speaker 2: who can see a gap. But it's not everything. It's
Speaker 2: exactly where you started mere, which is like, yes, and yes,
Speaker 2: it's great that the science is improved. It's great we've
Speaker 2: got more awareness, but also let's not dismiss women as
Speaker 2: just walking balls of hormones.
Speaker 3: And it's also at the moment it's a bit the
Speaker 3: wild West because the science and the investment in the femtech.
Speaker 3: Like I look at the incredible explosion of devices to
Speaker 3: help with period pain and I'm like, that's amazing. I mean,
Speaker 3: I've been spending money on medication ever since i got
Speaker 3: my first period, and now that you would have people
Speaker 3: are using tens machines or they're using these heat packs
Speaker 3: and they're trialing them. I'm like fantastic, Or like invest
Speaker 3: in endometriosis when they test for it and they're able
Speaker 3: to find it. But what I worry about is then
Speaker 3: all of this stuff popping up online that's unregulated, that
Speaker 3: a products that don't work or courses that don't work
Speaker 3: because you've got a I guess people who are desperate
Speaker 3: who have been ignored by medical science for most of
Speaker 3: his way, which.
Speaker 1: Brings us back to l and why it's important to
Speaker 1: have responsible information from responsible sources. And that's why with
Speaker 1: the very Peri summit that we did and that we'll
Speaker 1: be doing it again next year, it wasn't us just
Speaker 1: saying and getting an influencer. We brought the leading experts
Speaker 1: from around the world to give information and what we
Speaker 1: decided to do with that information is then up to them.
Speaker 1: But you're presenting reputable information and no one's trying to
Speaker 1: sell you something out loud.
Speaker 3: As I want to know if you would feel comfortable
Speaker 3: with partner, friends, even colleagues perhaps tracking your period. We
Speaker 3: asked the women in the Mummeya office how they feel
Speaker 3: about it. Most of them have tracking apps on their
Speaker 3: phone and here is what they said.
Speaker 5: I used the period tracker app called Glow, and I
Speaker 5: absolutely think it'd be great if my partner had access
Speaker 5: to this so then he could prepare for how I'm
Speaker 5: feeling throughout the month. Apparently every month is like the
Speaker 5: four seasons, so like winter being PMS, so it'd be
Speaker 5: great if he knew about this and could be extra
Speaker 5: nice and buy me things.
Speaker 6: Look, I use a period tracking app, but I just
Speaker 6: don't see the need for my partner to be up
Speaker 6: all in my business in that regard. If I need something,
Speaker 6: or I need support, or I need to communicate to him,
Speaker 6: I'll just tetle him myself.
Speaker 7: I would actually love if my partner had access to
Speaker 7: my flow app, because I don't think you'd use it
Speaker 7: against me. I feel like he would just you know,
Speaker 7: make me food or be nicer to me when he
Speaker 7: needs to be.
Speaker 9: I don't currently use a period tracker app. I don't
Speaker 9: think my partner needs to see it personally. If he
Speaker 9: needs to know, we can have a conversation about it.
Speaker 1: But I can't really think of a reason why he
Speaker 1: would need to know.
Speaker 10: I use both flow and Natural Cycles, and I let
Speaker 10: my partner or ex partner have access to it so
Speaker 10: you can track my period in my fertility because I
Speaker 10: feel like it shouldn't just be on me. It's like
Speaker 10: a partnership. So yeah, I let him track so he
Speaker 10: kne when I was my period was coming in, when
Speaker 10: I was gonna be fertile.
Speaker 4: Look from a fertility perspective. I totally get it. You're
Speaker 4: both looking out for that window and you know you
Speaker 4: want to jump on it. But any other time, no,
Speaker 4: thank you. That's my business. I don't need you inside
Speaker 4: my uterus as a man for any reason, whether you
Speaker 4: are government trying to make legislation or my husband. That
Speaker 4: is literally just my business. And you can reach out
Speaker 4: and say I noticed you're feeling a little bit emotional
Speaker 4: this week.
Speaker 1: You okay?
Speaker 4: Can I help you? You don't need an app to
Speaker 4: track that and inform you when I have PMS. No,
Speaker 4: thank you, sir.
Speaker 2: That's all we've got time for this Monday. A massive
Speaker 2: thank you to all of you out louders for listening
Speaker 2: to today's show, and of course to our wonderful team
Speaker 2: for putting this show together. We will be back in
Speaker 2: your ears tomorrow with a rundown of what happened at
Speaker 2: the Emmys today. Bye bye bye.
Speaker 1: Shout out to any Mum and Maya subscribers listening. If
Speaker 1: you love the show and want to support us as well,
Speaker 1: subscribing to MoMA Mia is the very best way to
Speaker 1: do so. There is a link in the episode description