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Speaker 1: You're listening to a MoMA Mia podcast.

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Speaker 2: Mama Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters

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Speaker 2: that this podcast is recorded on Hey, out louders, it's moms.

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Speaker 2: I have something really special dropping into your feed today.

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Speaker 2: It's called Parenting out Loud. It's everything you love about

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Speaker 2: out loud culture, explainers, trends, hot takes, sometimes cold takes,

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Speaker 2: little bit of shit talking about the biggest job in

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Speaker 2: the world, parenting, not being Donald Trump. FYI, you'll find

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Speaker 2: this first episode here in your out loud feed. But

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Speaker 2: some time with us, but for now, settle in and

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Speaker 2: enjoy this first taste of a brand new season of

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Speaker 2: Parenting Out Loud. Hello, we are here. You asked for

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Speaker 2: this out louders, so here we are for real life IRL,

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Speaker 2: so welcome, Welcome fan. This is Parenting out Loud. This

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Speaker 2: is the podcast for parents who don't always listen to

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Speaker 2: parenting podcasts. We're just doing things a little bit differently,

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Speaker 2: So we read everything in parenting culture and trends so

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Speaker 2: you don't have to. So if you're thinking about it,

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Speaker 2: we're going to talk about it. I'm Monique Bowli. You

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Speaker 2: might remember me from very early days of Muma mea

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Speaker 2: out Loud. I went and I had some kids and

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Speaker 2: now I'm back slaving it up on the podcast again.

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Speaker 1: Welcome back one, Thank you. I'm Amelia Laster.

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Speaker 3: I am a magazine editor, which is funny because a

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Speaker 3: young person recently asked me what a magazine was and

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Speaker 3: I just wept silently.

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Speaker 1: And I'm Stacy Higgs. I'm their deputy editor of Mum

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Speaker 1: and Maya. I also should mention I do have a

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Speaker 1: child as well, a glorious little four year old.

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Speaker 2: So here I am on today's show.

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Speaker 3: There is a new reason why young people are saying

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Speaker 3: no to being parents.

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Speaker 1: And a famous man said some beautiful words about being

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Speaker 1: a dad and the internet frocked it, but not all

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Speaker 1: of us did.

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Speaker 2: Plus how often do you text other parents? From mid

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Speaker 2: play date photos to post birthday party photos? Are parents

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Speaker 2: just texting each other way too much?

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Speaker 3: And if you have a third kid, if you want

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Speaker 3: a third kid, if you look at other people with

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Speaker 3: a third kid and think, oh boy, we found the

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Speaker 3: most perfect metaphor for the third child on the internet

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Speaker 3: this week.

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Speaker 1: Once you hear it, you won't be able to unhear it.

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Speaker 2: But first, people lost their minds over a very different

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Speaker 2: kind of sports highlight. It wasn't sort of a game

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Speaker 2: winning kick or like a big moment. It was a

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Speaker 2: teenage boy crying. Archie Wilson, who's nineteen, fresh out of

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Speaker 2: Melbourne and chasing his dream playing college football in Nebraska,

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Speaker 2: a long way from home, and he was talking at

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Speaker 2: a press conference and he completely broke down when he

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Speaker 2: started talking about missing his mum and his dad and

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Speaker 2: his two little brothers.

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Speaker 4: Yeah. I got two little brothers and a moment dad. Yeah,

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Speaker 4: that's the tough part about being here. I love them

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Speaker 4: a lot. And I missed them, but it's a I mean,

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Speaker 4: they know this is what's best for me, and it's

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Speaker 4: let's I can still talk to them plenty of the phone,

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Speaker 4: and they're coming here to see the first first few games,

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Speaker 4: so I'm looking forward to that. Thanks, Thanks guys, Minor.

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Speaker 2: Oh my god, I could not have loved this anymore.

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Speaker 2: Initial reactions, I absolutely loved it, Like this is the

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Speaker 2: gold standard. This is where you want your kids to

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Speaker 2: get to, where they're this.

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Speaker 1: Polite and courteous and kind to the journalists afterwards, It's

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Speaker 1: just gorgeous.

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Speaker 2: The emotional range Amelia, like from the softboy energy of

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Speaker 2: like missing his family and then just snapping into complete

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Speaker 2: manners mode.

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Speaker 1: It was so lovely.

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Speaker 3: It also really made me reflect on my own experience.

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Speaker 3: I left Australia for the US when I was eighteen

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Speaker 3: to pursue my football dreams, and when I got over there,

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Speaker 3: that's true, not the college football part. I never thought

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Speaker 3: about how hard that was for my parents, and now

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Speaker 3: I look back on it and it must be like

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Speaker 3: losing a limb. So I see Archie and I see

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Speaker 3: the obvious bond that he has with his parents, and

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Speaker 3: I just can't help but pour one out for Archie's

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Speaker 3: parents here and thinking about the sacrifices that they've made

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Speaker 3: for him to pursue his dream.

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Speaker 1: It's really beautiful.

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Speaker 2: But also in the way that they've parented him that

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Speaker 2: he feels like, okay, enough about showing his emotions like this,

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Speaker 2: because that was largely the retrick around this On the internet,

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Speaker 2: the major themes were Wow, like, his parents have done

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Speaker 2: such a good job, look at this fine young man.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, they were the real heroes, weren't they, Like they

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Speaker 1: must be so toughed. Can you imagine them sitting back

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Speaker 1: being like, yes, yes, we did. I don't know if they.

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Speaker 2: Might be sitting back going oh, like feeling guilty, tearing

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Speaker 2: at the heart strings.

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Speaker 3: Maybe I think that there's no way that you can't

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Speaker 3: watch that and know that Archie is loved and that

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Speaker 3: he loves his parents. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: The other big thing people were saying on the internet,

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Speaker 2: which was super encouraging, was we have to protect this

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Speaker 2: guy at all costs, like real men cry. This vulnerability

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Speaker 2: is strength and people responded in droves to this tender

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Speaker 2: teen moment, especially in a culture of football, and seems

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Speaker 2: very sort of marcho. It took about ten seconds for

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Speaker 2: this to go far or It now has around ten

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Speaker 2: million views, and there's all manner of people commenting, like

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Speaker 2: Chris Hemsworth fifty eight million followers, thank you very much.

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Speaker 2: Like even the official Bluey account hopped onto this and said,

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Speaker 2: you do he great mate?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, he's become like a national hero now, hasn't he.

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Speaker 1: Like all of the champion Aussies are shouting him out.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. I even saw a comment from Jenna Lyons, she's

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Speaker 2: sort of the general fashion icon, real housewife of New York,

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Speaker 2: and she was in the comments loving it too.

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Speaker 3: I love Jennal lions. Looks amazing And it's interesting because

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Speaker 3: she's been sort of pushing us to think about what

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Speaker 3: it is to be a boy or a man for

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Speaker 3: some time now. Back when she was the creative director

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Speaker 3: at j Crue, when that was the fashion label that

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Speaker 3: Michelle Obama wore, it was like the hottest label in America.

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Speaker 3: There was a J Crew catalog that came out and

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Speaker 3: it showed Jenna painting the nails of her son, of

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Speaker 3: her young son, and there was all this predictable and

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Speaker 3: ridiculous outrage. How can she be painting her son's nails?

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Speaker 3: And her answer was just because it looks nice and

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Speaker 3: because he wants to.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, say's law there with her. I guess yeah, Like

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Speaker 2: this clip has transcended sport, fashion, kids TV.

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Speaker 1: It's just it's everywhere, in case you missed it. We

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Speaker 1: all need to calm the fuck down about protein. Oh good, okay,

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Speaker 1: you have fourth permission. That's a message that was in

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Speaker 1: a great article in The Cut this week about how

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Speaker 1: the high protein craze has now taken over our toddlers. No,

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Speaker 1: the cottage cheese has come for our toplus. Now I'm

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Speaker 1: very happy that this message has come through. As someone

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Speaker 1: who spent one hundred and fifty dollars once on a

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Speaker 1: baby lad weaning guide, we've all done that.

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Speaker 3: Sorry, what was the format of this guide? It wasn't

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Speaker 3: even a real book. It was like a PDF form.

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Speaker 3: But I got got it and then I downloaded it.

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Speaker 2: So I did the same thing. You get tired, you

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Speaker 2: get desperate.

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Speaker 1: Sleep deprivation does crazy shitah.

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Speaker 2: And these brands come they know you're tired, Yeah, come in,

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Speaker 2: They're like, I will solve your problems. You will pay

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Speaker 2: any amount of money.

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Speaker 1: I downloaded it to my phone and then I didn't

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Speaker 1: know how to access the downloads and I never actually

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Speaker 1: used it, so this is good for me. This is

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Speaker 1: the messaging is basically just to care less. So in

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Speaker 1: the article, Rika Schwegenhausen spoke to a recipe developer and

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Speaker 1: a dietitian and they both said that when they post

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Speaker 1: recipes that are marketed as high protein, even for babies,

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Speaker 1: that it goes off. Everyone engages with it, everyone downloads it,

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Speaker 1: wants to cook it. When there's fiber, nothing crickets. No

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Speaker 1: one cares about fiber anymore.

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Speaker 2: Fiber has a massive pr problem, Like how can we

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Speaker 2: help them? Are big lentil and been just sitting around

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Speaker 2: the conference table being like, guys, everyone's about protein or

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Speaker 2: protein things. They're so good. What about us? How are

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Speaker 2: we going to get our message out there?

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Speaker 1: But here's the problem with fiber.

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Speaker 3: I was told by my GP to start putting silium

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Speaker 3: husk on my porridge in the mornings, and so I

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Speaker 3: bought the cilium husk and it comes to this big

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Speaker 3: packet and it literally says on its scromptious silium husk,

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Speaker 3: and I'm like, don't know if it's seal it. Yes,

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Speaker 3: it tastes like sawdust and it makes you pooplic I

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Speaker 3: feel like the universe is telling me this week to

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Speaker 3: just not worry about what I'm feeding my kids, because

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Speaker 3: I did read a quote from Jennifer Ghana this week,

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Speaker 3: and look, anyone who's negotiating co parenting with Ben Affleck

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Speaker 3: already deserves a medal in my book. And she said,

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Speaker 3: kids don't care, families don't care, No one cares.

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Speaker 1: Just make it. Just make the food.

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Speaker 3: And I want that on one of those you know,

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Speaker 3: those neon signs that in the two thousands were in

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Speaker 3: like really rich people's homes and they always like had

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Speaker 3: them in the kitchen. I need one of those neon

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Speaker 3: signs in my.

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Speaker 1: Flat that says, stop putting, just don't just make us

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Speaker 1: make it.

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Speaker 3: There's a book that multiple friends of mine have all

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Speaker 3: of a sudden been swearing by, and I'm curious whether

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Speaker 3: you've heard about it. It's called Adult Children of Emotionally

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Speaker 3: Immature Parents.

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Speaker 1: Ever heard of it? Yeah?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, People love this book, and it's not just anecdotal.

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Speaker 3: There was a New York Times article in December of

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Speaker 3: last year about how this book that published ten years

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Speaker 3: ago has been surging in popularity. It's sold one point

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Speaker 3: two million copies, its biggest year of sales was last year.

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Speaker 1: So something's up.

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Speaker 3: A lot of people think that they are the adult

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Speaker 3: children of emotionally immature parents. Look, it's bio clinical psychologist.

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Speaker 3: The cover copy says it's about parents who have difficulty

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Speaker 3: regulating their ow emotions, which immediately made me feel really

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Speaker 3: worried that my children are going to read that book

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Speaker 3: when they grow up, because doesn't everyone have difficulty regulating

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Speaker 3: their emotions. But the reason it's spiked, the publisher says,

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Speaker 3: is TikTok. There's a whole wave of content around this

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Speaker 3: idea of family estrangement. On TikTok, call it traumatok. There

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Speaker 3: are hashtags like inner child, healing, childhood wounds, and some

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Speaker 3: signs that you've experienced childhood trauma at the hands of

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Speaker 3: your parents. According to these videos, let me run you

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Speaker 3: through them. You're a people pleaser. You jiggle your legs,

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Speaker 3: people call you an old soul. You procrastinate, you have

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Speaker 3: a hard time asking for help. This is the human

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Speaker 3: condition human This is and maybe having too much coffee

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Speaker 3: the leg jiggling. It is a real thing that in

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Speaker 3: the last couple of years, family estrangement has seem to

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Speaker 3: really rise in prominence and popularity.

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Speaker 2: Okay, so we're seeing more of it in social media.

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Speaker 2: Does the data back it up?

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Speaker 1: Yes.

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Speaker 3: There's a psychologist who's quoted in a New Yorker article

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Speaker 3: on this topic who puts the rate of parental estrangement

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Speaker 3: in the US at about thirty percent, and he says

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Speaker 3: that it's probably much higher than that because that's just

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Speaker 3: people who are answering a survey and being prepared to

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Speaker 3: share that information. And he says that that's much higher

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Speaker 3: than it used to be. And the question is why,

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Speaker 3: And the question is does this have anything to do

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Speaker 3: with our extremely low fertility rates? Let me explain. Michelle Lebowitz,

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Speaker 3: who is a New York Times writer, has a theory.

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Speaker 3: She says that millennials are not having children, and the

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Speaker 3: reason why is that they think it seems too hard.

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Speaker 3: They think that parenting is too hard. They have all

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Speaker 3: these ideas about how their own parents screwed them up,

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Speaker 3: and they don't want to make those same mistakes, so

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Speaker 3: they're opting out of it entirely. And I think that

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Speaker 3: has the ring of truth to it. I saw a

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Speaker 3: reddit throughout the other day that said, in a generation's time,

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Speaker 3: what are going to be the complaints about our parenting,

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Speaker 3: and some of the answers were gentle parenting that just

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Speaker 3: makes you into a parental doormat, like giving in too much,

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Speaker 3: basically being overprotective, not letting children walk home from school,

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Speaker 3: making them stay at home until they're old enough to

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Speaker 3: vote practically, and not being allowed to go out at night.

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Speaker 3: Or bulldoze of parents. That was another really popular answer,

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Speaker 3: bulldoze of parents who bulldoze every obstacle out of their way.

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Speaker 1: I'm really curious if you think.

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Speaker 3: That this idea that the over therapization that is a

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Speaker 3: word I just made up, the over therapization of our

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Speaker 3: culture is in part leading to this reluctance to have kids.

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Speaker 2: Interesting theory. It's not the only thing. I mean, there's

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Speaker 2: cost of living, there's work life balance, there's access to childcare,

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Speaker 2: there's all of these other factors, mainly crushing cost of

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Speaker 2: living and housing and job insecurity. But what an interesting

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Speaker 2: theory that takes it beyond that into actually therapy culture.

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Speaker 2: I think therapy culture has has a lot to answer for.

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Speaker 2: It has been great in so many ways. Opening up

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Speaker 2: discussions about mental health is always going to be a

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Speaker 2: good thing, but it's not without its downsides. And I

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Speaker 2: want to talk about I just want to put on

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Speaker 2: the table the idea about friction in relationships for a minute.

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Speaker 2: So I follow this culture than analyst, I guess, And

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Speaker 2: he was talking recently about how life is very frictionless

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Speaker 2: for us now that tech companies have made all these

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Speaker 2: apps so that we don't have to experience much discomfort anymore,

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Speaker 2: so that when we do experience it, it feels very jarring

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Speaker 2: to us, and we're not resilient enough to handle it.

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Speaker 2: So there is this stress response I guess, where people

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Speaker 2: will just flee in an uncomfortable situation. Now, that is to say,

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Speaker 2: estrangement is obviously important for so many, like there would

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Speaker 2: be abuse and toxic relationships, and that's fine, But what

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Speaker 2: you're talking about now merely is like this middle ground

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Speaker 2: where people just feel uncomfortable about a relationship and so

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Speaker 2: we'll estrange themselves from their parents. And I think we're

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Speaker 2: very quick to remove friction now from our lives or

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Speaker 2: not be able to sit with it. So is therapy

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Speaker 2: culture making all of our relationships feel impossible to maintain

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Speaker 2: because I think also when you.

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Speaker 1: Because it's holding us to impossible standards.

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Speaker 2: Completely and it's leading into friendships. So once upon a time,

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Speaker 2: you might have had a friend that was a bit

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Speaker 2: flaky and you'd roll your eyes and you'd be like, oh,

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Speaker 2: come on, get it together. But now you say, no,

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Speaker 2: these are my boundaries and you're toxic and I'm cutting

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Speaker 2: you out of my life. And like in work culture too,

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Speaker 2: I was a manager before I sat behind this microphone,

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Speaker 2: and there's certainly as a manager now you have to

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Speaker 2: have such a responsibility to be emotionally literate. Like there's

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Speaker 2: lots of healing and affirming and trauma proofing that you

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Speaker 2: have to do in the workplace. So is therapy culture.

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Speaker 2: As you said, Amelia, I'm making our relationships hard to maintain.

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Speaker 3: And also just making it feel like parenting is an

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Speaker 3: impossible task, like making people feel like, well, I could

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Speaker 3: never have children because I can never be the perfect

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Speaker 3: parent that i'd want to be.

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Speaker 1: But I think that's just the volume of information there

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Speaker 1: is now. Like I know, when I had my daughter

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Speaker 1: and was struggling in the newborn days, I had this

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Speaker 1: conversation with my mum where she was like, well, it's

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Speaker 1: just that you've got too many answers. Now, you've got

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Speaker 1: too many options. She was like, when I did it.

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Speaker 1: I just had to figure it out. And that was

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Speaker 1: kind of just her kind way of being like, can

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Speaker 1: you stop reading about wake windows and just put your

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Speaker 1: baby to sleep when they seem tired? Like you are

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Speaker 1: making this so hard for yourself. And I think I

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Speaker 1: had never even really thought about how I was parented

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Speaker 1: until I became a parent and started getting all these

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Speaker 1: TikTok videos that you speak of, Like I get them

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Speaker 1: come up in my algorithm all the time, saying are

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Speaker 1: you a chronic people pleaser who can sense the you know,

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Speaker 1: the atmosphere change when people's moods change in the room.

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Speaker 1: And I was like, yeah, I can, But I don't

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Speaker 1: think that's my parent's fault. I think that's just my

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Speaker 1: personality type. Like I think I'm just conscious of wanting

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Speaker 1: everyone to be having a nice time. That's not something

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Speaker 1: that they necessarily did wrong.

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Speaker 2: Stacy, have you had therapy before?

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Speaker 1: I only did after having my daughter, so very short

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Speaker 1: amount of sessions after having.

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Speaker 2: Do you remember like what one of the first questions

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Speaker 2: I asked you was.

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Speaker 1: It was about my parents. It was all about the

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Speaker 1: dynamic of my parents and almost withholding from me, Ah,

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Speaker 1: I've sussed this and we're going to get to why

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Speaker 1: you're struggling with this now.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I hear that. Like one of the first questions

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Speaker 2: you'll get asked in therapy if you can afford it

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Speaker 2: to go and have it, is tell me about your childhood,

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Speaker 2: tell me about how you were parented. And so I

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Speaker 2: don't think this is new. We are not the first

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Speaker 2: generation to agonize about having kids or to blame parents

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Speaker 2: for any psychological wobble like I think our parents were. Also,

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Speaker 2: they probably didn't have the language of the words around it,

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Speaker 2: but parents have them too.

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Speaker 3: So fertility rates are at an all time low. So

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Speaker 3: millennials are on track to be the generation with the

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Speaker 3: least children in recorded history. And one point that's made

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Speaker 3: in this article is that when you have children, you

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Speaker 3: suddenly forgive your parents for all their perceived shortcomings. So

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Speaker 3: you're like, oh, this is really hard. Yeah, that's true,

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Speaker 3: and I'm just struggling to do. I find myself saying

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Speaker 3: to my children a line that I heard to write

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Speaker 3: my childhood, which is I'm doing the very best I can,

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Speaker 3: and why don't you appreciate the work I'm doing for you?

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Speaker 3: And all of these lines are coming out of me

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Speaker 3: because now I see that they're in fact true. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: I'm doing the best I can. Why can't you appreciate

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Speaker 3: all the work I'm doing for you? When you have children,

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Speaker 3: you realize that that's true. But if you don't have children,

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Speaker 3: you don't realize that's true. And I wonder if there's

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Speaker 3: a chicken and egg element here, is that what's contributing

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Speaker 3: to these really high rates of family estrangement too, because

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Speaker 3: people are not having that experience of, oh wait, my

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Speaker 3: parents are just human, just like everyone else. Another reason

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Speaker 3: I think that therapy could be contributing to more people

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Speaker 3: choosing to be child free is that there is so

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Speaker 3: much more language now around our partners and the bad

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Speaker 3: behaviors they might have. So you might be able to

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Speaker 3: now recognize when someone is a narcissist, or when someone

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Speaker 3: is gaslighting you, or when someone's just a bit of

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Speaker 3: a douche, and you might choose not to procreate with

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Speaker 3: them for that reason.

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Speaker 2: I don't think you necessarily need to have had a child, though,

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Speaker 2: to come to that understanding. So I've had seven years

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Speaker 2: of therapy. I've spent fortune on it, or save you

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Speaker 2: the time and the money, and part therapy one of

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Speaker 2: the best things that my therapist ever said to me

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Speaker 2: was what if they were just doing the best they

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Speaker 2: could with the tools they had, And maybe that's the

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Speaker 2: antidote to this therapy culture perfectionism. What if everyone is

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Speaker 2: just doing the best they can.

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Speaker 3: Pretty much everyone is doing the best they can. Apart

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Speaker 3: from the person who didn't let me in when I

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Speaker 3: was trying to turn this morning.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, they should have done better.

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Speaker 2: I've got one to file under men talking about their feelings.

381
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Speaker 2: People love it because this week I saw an absolute scorcher.

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00:18:34,141 --> 00:18:36,461
Speaker 2: There was this viral clip on Instagram of the actor

383
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Speaker 2: Bob Odenkirk.

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Speaker 1: I love him.

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Speaker 2: You know who he is?

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Speaker 1: I don't know.

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Speaker 3: He was in Breaking Bad and the greatest TV show

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Speaker 3: of all time?

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Speaker 1: Better Call Saul.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Also like a tough guy, like a rich, cool guy,

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Speaker 1: but very cool.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, comedian, writer, actor, And he was talking about being

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Speaker 2: a dad.

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Speaker 5: Who are you jealous of anybody who's still got little

396
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Speaker 5: kids at home growing up? Yeah, there's no question I

397
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Speaker 5: knew what I was doing when I had kids growing up. Yeah,

398
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Speaker 5: I was being a doubt. I mean that was my job,

399
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Speaker 5: and I didn't have to ask myself what am I

400
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Speaker 5: doing here? What am I doing. How can I be

401
00:19:12,581 --> 00:19:15,942
Speaker 5: a part of this world? How can I be meaningful today?

402
00:19:16,061 --> 00:19:17,981
Speaker 5: I didn't have to ask that question because of an

403
00:19:18,022 --> 00:19:20,502
Speaker 5: answer is pick up everything between here and.

404
00:19:20,462 --> 00:19:21,101
Speaker 2: The door.

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Speaker 5: And make sure they get to school and have a

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Speaker 5: laugh with them. Yeah, you know, life was I understood

407
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Speaker 5: my purpose.

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Speaker 1: That's the answer.

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Speaker 2: Oh so profound, Amelia. You and I had really different

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Speaker 2: reactions to this. We had quite a robust discussion. Tell

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Speaker 2: me what I'm not seeing?

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Speaker 3: Okay, Well, first of all, I do want to reiterate

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Speaker 3: that I love Bob Odenkirch.

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Speaker 1: I mean his voice. He's just got the best voice

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Speaker 1: that said.

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Speaker 3: I did not love this. It made me feel rotten.

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Speaker 3: Let me paint you a picture. Got home from a

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Speaker 3: very long day, had left my flat early in the

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Speaker 3: morning for work. I got back after having dinner with

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Speaker 3: a friend, and I watched this and I thought, oh,

421
00:20:01,702 --> 00:20:05,502
Speaker 3: I'm doing everything wrong. I didn't even see my children today,

422
00:20:05,502 --> 00:20:08,861
Speaker 3: these precious moments when they are little, and I'm not

423
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Speaker 3: spending enough time with them, and I should just be

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Speaker 3: soaking up every bath time and I should never go

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Speaker 3: out to dinner with my friends again because this time

426
00:20:16,061 --> 00:20:17,861
Speaker 3: is so precious and rare and I'm going to look

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Speaker 3: back and miss these days. And then the spiral of

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Speaker 3: guilt continued and I couldn't sleep that night. This is

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Speaker 3: a whole genre of guilt content for parents. We're constantly

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Speaker 3: being told how irreplaceable and special these days are, and

431
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Speaker 3: yet we also know, because we're living them, how hard

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Speaker 3: it is to truly be in the moment with the

433
00:20:34,861 --> 00:20:37,821
Speaker 3: children when they are pushing your buttons, when they're refusing

434
00:20:37,821 --> 00:20:39,782
Speaker 3: to get in the bath, when they're refusing to sleep.

435
00:20:40,381 --> 00:20:43,381
Speaker 1: And this is a whole trend now though, Amelia of

436
00:20:43,381 --> 00:20:45,702
Speaker 1: parents pushing back on this because oh good.

437
00:20:45,861 --> 00:20:46,061
Speaker 3: Yeah.

438
00:20:46,101 --> 00:20:49,262
Speaker 1: There is this song by Trace Adkins called You're going

439
00:20:49,341 --> 00:20:51,022
Speaker 1: to Miss this? Have you heard I'll sing a line

440
00:20:51,061 --> 00:20:52,542
Speaker 1: to you country?

441
00:20:52,901 --> 00:20:53,622
Speaker 2: Do you want me to sing?

442
00:20:53,942 --> 00:20:54,142
Speaker 3: Yeah?

443
00:20:54,422 --> 00:20:56,781
Speaker 1: Actually you've got skills. Can you add a little bit

444
00:20:56,782 --> 00:20:59,822
Speaker 1: of auto tune for me as well? But he basically

445
00:20:59,861 --> 00:21:02,742
Speaker 1: goes like, you're going to make us this, You're gonna

446
00:21:02,861 --> 00:21:06,022
Speaker 1: want this bag and it's all about how you are

447
00:21:06,061 --> 00:21:12,061
Speaker 1: so talented twang? Am I a country? Suff This song

448
00:21:12,101 --> 00:21:14,302
Speaker 1: is basically all about how you're gonna want those days back,

449
00:21:14,341 --> 00:21:15,901
Speaker 1: like you're going to miss this thing that you're in.

450
00:21:16,262 --> 00:21:18,981
Speaker 1: But now parents have taken it and are using it

451
00:21:19,022 --> 00:21:24,302
Speaker 1: and overlaying it over their children. Absolutely, So they're using

452
00:21:24,341 --> 00:21:27,022
Speaker 1: it as they're like forcing their child into their car

453
00:21:27,061 --> 00:21:29,101
Speaker 1: seat and they won't get in, or when they're like

454
00:21:29,422 --> 00:21:31,902
Speaker 1: carrying a bike over one shoulder and their child over

455
00:21:31,942 --> 00:21:34,461
Speaker 1: another shoulder back to the car. So they're kind of

456
00:21:34,462 --> 00:21:37,222
Speaker 1: saying like, that's so nice of you to say once

457
00:21:37,262 --> 00:21:39,182
Speaker 1: you're out of that season of your life, but when

458
00:21:39,222 --> 00:21:41,061
Speaker 1: you're in it, this is what it looks like, and

459
00:21:41,222 --> 00:21:42,661
Speaker 1: I'm not going to miss it. I'm not going to

460
00:21:42,702 --> 00:21:43,901
Speaker 1: miss this exact part.

461
00:21:44,222 --> 00:21:46,981
Speaker 2: Okay, So why did you like it? Well, it's so

462
00:21:47,022 --> 00:21:48,982
Speaker 2: interesting what you said about your reaction to it. It's

463
00:21:48,982 --> 00:21:50,782
Speaker 2: like when you go to a psychiatrist and they held

464
00:21:50,861 --> 00:21:53,342
Speaker 2: up the ink pictures and you say, I see this,

465
00:21:57,341 --> 00:21:59,101
Speaker 2: that's not at all what I saw. Yeah, I'll tell

466
00:21:59,101 --> 00:22:01,782
Speaker 2: you what I saw. I actually thought, because I do

467
00:22:01,821 --> 00:22:04,661
Speaker 2: love Bob Odenkirk as well, but I watched this and

468
00:22:04,702 --> 00:22:10,302
Speaker 2: I thought the bar is so low culturally for men

469
00:22:10,462 --> 00:22:13,461
Speaker 2: in the parenting space, like are we so starved of

470
00:22:13,581 --> 00:22:17,662
Speaker 2: good men and good dads that when Bob Odenkirk says

471
00:22:17,702 --> 00:22:21,341
Speaker 2: something that millions of mothers know or say every day,

472
00:22:21,861 --> 00:22:24,101
Speaker 2: that the Internet faints with sort of how profound and

473
00:22:24,141 --> 00:22:27,101
Speaker 2: beautiful it is, and nothing against Bob od Kirk, nothing

474
00:22:27,141 --> 00:22:30,181
Speaker 2: against great fathers. It's so important we see them. I

475
00:22:30,222 --> 00:22:33,221
Speaker 2: feel like if a mum said this firstly, it's not

476
00:22:33,262 --> 00:22:35,262
Speaker 2: going to go viral and it's just going to be

477
00:22:35,302 --> 00:22:39,261
Speaker 2: filed under like a obvious like scroll past. I just wonder.

478
00:22:39,942 --> 00:22:41,702
Speaker 2: I don't know men with feelings on the Internet. People

479
00:22:41,702 --> 00:22:43,302
Speaker 2: seem to really froth it in a way that I

480
00:22:43,341 --> 00:22:46,061
Speaker 2: think maybe we are starved of this kind of content.

481
00:22:46,141 --> 00:22:49,101
Speaker 3: But I think we've got to check ourselves on that reaction.

482
00:22:49,381 --> 00:22:53,302
Speaker 3: Because the other night, during these precious moments with my

483
00:22:53,621 --> 00:22:57,302
Speaker 3: very young children, I completely wasted my evening by listening

484
00:22:57,302 --> 00:23:00,621
Speaker 3: to a podcast interview with US Vice President jd Vance.

485
00:23:01,141 --> 00:23:03,302
Speaker 3: Now why did I do this, I don't know. But

486
00:23:03,581 --> 00:23:06,742
Speaker 3: he was being interviewed by an interviewer who was interested

487
00:23:06,782 --> 00:23:09,741
Speaker 3: in how he's balancing being vice president with being the

488
00:23:09,742 --> 00:23:10,621
Speaker 3: father to three ChEls.

489
00:23:10,661 --> 00:23:10,781
Speaker 1: Oh.

490
00:23:10,942 --> 00:23:13,302
Speaker 2: Someone actually asked him that that's great.

491
00:23:13,101 --> 00:23:17,061
Speaker 3: Okay, but she's a conservative podcast influencer. And I found

492
00:23:17,101 --> 00:23:21,782
Speaker 3: that my instinctive reaction was annoyance. Why because I had

493
00:23:21,782 --> 00:23:23,941
Speaker 3: to unpack it. He was talking about how he and

494
00:23:23,982 --> 00:23:26,862
Speaker 3: his wife usha Vance liked to take the kids on

495
00:23:26,901 --> 00:23:30,222
Speaker 3: his overseas trips in his capacity as vice president, and

496
00:23:30,222 --> 00:23:33,302
Speaker 3: how it's sometimes difficult when they're stepping off the presidential

497
00:23:33,341 --> 00:23:35,942
Speaker 3: plane to get the kids to not have a tantrum

498
00:23:36,022 --> 00:23:37,861
Speaker 3: when the world's cameras are on them and when they're

499
00:23:37,861 --> 00:23:41,461
Speaker 3: about to meet you know, Emmanuel Macron in France. I

500
00:23:41,542 --> 00:23:43,901
Speaker 3: just like saying his name, to be honest, But I

501
00:23:43,982 --> 00:23:46,182
Speaker 3: really had to figure out why I was annoyed. First

502
00:23:46,182 --> 00:23:47,981
Speaker 3: of all, I think I was annoyed because I find

503
00:23:48,222 --> 00:23:50,581
Speaker 3: jd Vance himself personally annoying.

504
00:23:50,901 --> 00:23:53,341
Speaker 1: But then I had to stop and think, it's actually.

505
00:23:53,061 --> 00:23:55,262
Speaker 3: Kind of great that this person who I may not

506
00:23:55,381 --> 00:23:58,421
Speaker 3: agree with politically, who was on the other side of

507
00:23:58,422 --> 00:24:03,302
Speaker 3: offense politically, is trying to talk about integrating children not

508
00:24:03,422 --> 00:24:07,222
Speaker 3: just into his professional life but into public life, into

509
00:24:07,381 --> 00:24:09,941
Speaker 3: going on a state trip and saying, I'm bringing my

510
00:24:09,982 --> 00:24:14,022
Speaker 3: children along because these children shouldn't just be my partner's responsibility.

511
00:24:14,061 --> 00:24:16,661
Speaker 3: But I want you to explain why I was annoyed why.

512
00:24:16,702 --> 00:24:18,701
Speaker 2: It might just be that you're confusing the political with

513
00:24:18,742 --> 00:24:20,142
Speaker 2: the emotional maybe, or it.

514
00:24:20,101 --> 00:24:22,782
Speaker 3: Could be that we automatically think that men who talk

515
00:24:22,821 --> 00:24:24,461
Speaker 3: about parenting are show voting.

516
00:24:24,742 --> 00:24:27,262
Speaker 2: If I was a PR agent, if I was managing

517
00:24:27,341 --> 00:24:29,702
Speaker 2: some celebrities, I would be saying to them, say, I'm

518
00:24:29,861 --> 00:24:32,581
Speaker 2: managing Ryan Reynolds. You know he's got a bit of ick.

519
00:24:32,782 --> 00:24:34,941
Speaker 2: There's a bit of a stink about him. I'd say, Ryan,

520
00:24:35,381 --> 00:24:38,502
Speaker 2: go on a podcast and talk about get emotional about

521
00:24:38,502 --> 00:24:41,701
Speaker 2: being a father. Show some vulnerability, because there's nothing the

522
00:24:41,782 --> 00:24:44,101
Speaker 2: internet loves more than that. Right now, there's nothing the

523
00:24:44,141 --> 00:24:46,861
Speaker 2: culture loves more than a dad talking about their feelings.

524
00:24:47,101 --> 00:24:49,621
Speaker 3: Another example is I work with a lot of men

525
00:24:49,742 --> 00:24:52,221
Speaker 3: in my day job, and whenever one of them is

526
00:24:52,302 --> 00:24:54,422
Speaker 3: like I have to go to my kids school parade,

527
00:24:54,982 --> 00:24:57,742
Speaker 3: I feel annoyed. What is going on with me? That's

528
00:24:57,821 --> 00:25:00,422
Speaker 3: great that he's taking the time. I think it's because

529
00:25:00,821 --> 00:25:02,782
Speaker 3: it just feels performative in a way.

530
00:25:02,901 --> 00:25:04,702
Speaker 2: You're feeling defensive about it.

531
00:25:04,742 --> 00:25:07,141
Speaker 1: Maybe I do feel the same though. Listening to that

532
00:25:07,222 --> 00:25:10,101
Speaker 1: clip from Bob oden Kirk as well, I was like, oh,

533
00:25:10,182 --> 00:25:11,942
Speaker 1: that's easy. You just picked up the things and drop

534
00:25:12,022 --> 00:25:15,542
Speaker 1: them off and then you left. You didn't you didn't

535
00:25:15,581 --> 00:25:17,702
Speaker 1: think about the permission sleep if you book the day

536
00:25:18,502 --> 00:25:21,782
Speaker 1: school holidays. Bob Odenkirk, did you just pick up the toys. Yeah,

537
00:25:21,782 --> 00:25:23,181
Speaker 1: I did think, Well, I would quite like to be

538
00:25:23,222 --> 00:25:25,141
Speaker 1: a dad when my kid's a little too, which is

539
00:25:25,262 --> 00:25:28,462
Speaker 1: very unfair because I don't know his circumstances. He's obviously

540
00:25:28,542 --> 00:25:29,341
Speaker 1: very involved.

541
00:25:29,422 --> 00:25:31,821
Speaker 2: So I'm okay with the showboating. I think there has

542
00:25:31,821 --> 00:25:33,861
Speaker 2: to be a period where they do show boat, where

543
00:25:33,901 --> 00:25:37,182
Speaker 2: it is seen as aspirational and fantastic to do, and

544
00:25:37,222 --> 00:25:39,381
Speaker 2: that you get a lot of points from women for

545
00:25:39,462 --> 00:25:42,742
Speaker 2: doing it, Like I roll, because that's the only way

546
00:25:42,782 --> 00:25:43,621
Speaker 2: the needles right.

547
00:25:44,022 --> 00:25:45,902
Speaker 1: But we've got to give them the points. You're right.

548
00:25:46,061 --> 00:25:49,581
Speaker 2: It's like when my husband makes a terrible dinner. Oh

549
00:25:49,661 --> 00:25:52,581
Speaker 2: the praise, I am doing it so full of it.

550
00:25:52,702 --> 00:25:54,861
Speaker 2: I am like, this is the best thing I've ever

551
00:25:54,901 --> 00:25:57,141
Speaker 2: eaten because guess what, I didn't have to cook it.

552
00:25:57,222 --> 00:25:58,461
Speaker 2: And then, just like a bit.

553
00:25:58,341 --> 00:26:02,262
Speaker 3: Of okay generation, the next time someone on slack, a

554
00:26:02,302 --> 00:26:04,222
Speaker 3: man on slack tells me that he can't do something

555
00:26:04,222 --> 00:26:06,381
Speaker 3: because he's going to his kid's school parade, I'm going

556
00:26:06,462 --> 00:26:10,342
Speaker 3: to give the party hat emoji and the five emotions.

557
00:26:10,381 --> 00:26:12,981
Speaker 2: Ameily, I do think you should, because I also think that.

558
00:26:13,141 --> 00:26:17,061
Speaker 1: Culturally aggressive thumbs.

559
00:26:17,141 --> 00:26:19,341
Speaker 2: Ulturally, we do need to kind of move the needle

560
00:26:19,422 --> 00:26:21,661
Speaker 2: on this stuff dads that need to start to.

561
00:26:21,742 --> 00:26:23,022
Speaker 1: Lift point taken.

562
00:26:24,061 --> 00:26:26,421
Speaker 3: So I moved back to Australia last year after many

563
00:26:26,502 --> 00:26:29,742
Speaker 3: years overseas, and I realized a few months in that

564
00:26:29,901 --> 00:26:32,741
Speaker 3: I was committing a big parenting faux pa.

565
00:26:32,901 --> 00:26:33,782
Speaker 1: Do you want to guess what it was?

566
00:26:34,022 --> 00:26:36,421
Speaker 2: Yeah, you flirted with another dat I fashion him.

567
00:26:36,542 --> 00:26:39,262
Speaker 3: No, just my kid was in kindergarten. So I was

568
00:26:39,262 --> 00:26:41,581
Speaker 3: getting invite to a lot of parties because in kindergarten,

569
00:26:41,702 --> 00:26:45,502
Speaker 3: I think the sort of conventional wisdom is that, if possible,

570
00:26:45,581 --> 00:26:47,781
Speaker 3: invite the whole class to the party. So there were

571
00:26:47,821 --> 00:26:50,421
Speaker 3: a lot of parties. That he was at a public school,

572
00:26:50,462 --> 00:26:52,101
Speaker 3: so it was a huge class and so you know,

573
00:26:52,502 --> 00:26:57,701
Speaker 3: every weekend, another party. And what happened was that I

574
00:26:57,861 --> 00:27:01,581
Speaker 3: noticed after the parties, parents were writing to the class

575
00:27:01,661 --> 00:27:06,941
Speaker 3: WhatsApp with these effusive notes of gratitude and praise for

576
00:27:07,022 --> 00:27:09,942
Speaker 3: the party. This is with everyone in there so much.

577
00:27:10,101 --> 00:27:12,381
Speaker 3: It was just so great of you to invite little

578
00:27:12,381 --> 00:27:17,421
Speaker 3: Billy to this party. I particularly liked the cakes frosting,

579
00:27:17,782 --> 00:27:22,382
Speaker 3: or I particularly liked the dejected spider Man party entertaining

580
00:27:22,462 --> 00:27:24,141
Speaker 3: you hired. You know, there was just it was like

581
00:27:24,222 --> 00:27:26,661
Speaker 3: these really thoughtful notes, the kind that I would normally

582
00:27:26,702 --> 00:27:28,742
Speaker 3: write to my aunt when I was ten years old

583
00:27:28,782 --> 00:27:31,101
Speaker 3: after she sent me ten dollars in the mail, but

584
00:27:31,222 --> 00:27:32,581
Speaker 3: they were writing them to the class.

585
00:27:32,621 --> 00:27:35,581
Speaker 1: What'sapp I asked a friend. Well, actually, I complained to

586
00:27:35,621 --> 00:27:35,942
Speaker 1: a friend.

587
00:27:35,982 --> 00:27:38,181
Speaker 3: I was like, this is so annoying. After every party,

588
00:27:38,222 --> 00:27:39,742
Speaker 3: I get these notes. And she looked at me and

589
00:27:39,782 --> 00:27:42,101
Speaker 3: she said, Amelia, are you not writing a thank you

590
00:27:42,222 --> 00:27:44,421
Speaker 3: note for attending a party? And I said no, I'm not.

591
00:27:44,782 --> 00:27:45,821
Speaker 3: Why am I thanking them?

592
00:27:46,341 --> 00:27:48,502
Speaker 1: She said, in Australia you have to write a thank

593
00:27:48,542 --> 00:27:50,101
Speaker 1: you note for attending the kids party.

594
00:27:50,462 --> 00:27:53,141
Speaker 3: And then another thing I noticed is that when I

595
00:27:53,341 --> 00:27:56,181
Speaker 3: hosted a party, I have to write a thank you

596
00:27:56,341 --> 00:27:58,701
Speaker 3: note for attending the party to the parents.

597
00:27:58,782 --> 00:28:00,502
Speaker 1: And it's just getting out of control.

598
00:28:01,182 --> 00:28:03,422
Speaker 3: So when I saw an article in New York magazine

599
00:28:03,462 --> 00:28:07,061
Speaker 3: called Fellow Parents, May I please text less? It really

600
00:28:07,341 --> 00:28:08,422
Speaker 3: made me feel seen.

601
00:28:08,821 --> 00:28:09,341
Speaker 1: First of all, I.

602
00:28:09,302 --> 00:28:12,061
Speaker 3: Want to interrupt and say did you know this? Instinctively

603
00:28:12,101 --> 00:28:13,502
Speaker 3: about the parties and the thank.

604
00:28:13,341 --> 00:28:16,182
Speaker 2: You I'm hearing you say this, and I'm like, yeah,

605
00:28:16,222 --> 00:28:17,581
Speaker 2: that's just manners, Amelia.

606
00:28:18,022 --> 00:28:20,502
Speaker 3: See, I just was like, I don't want to impinge

607
00:28:20,542 --> 00:28:23,702
Speaker 3: on people's inboxes. I don't want to write unnecessary messages.

608
00:28:23,782 --> 00:28:25,661
Speaker 1: Well, I didn't realize that this was all happening in

609
00:28:25,742 --> 00:28:28,581
Speaker 1: like a group forum, So surely there's some eagle eyed

610
00:28:29,101 --> 00:28:32,662
Speaker 1: person in there making sure that everyone actually the party.

611
00:28:32,702 --> 00:28:34,661
Speaker 1: If I had to dride up this year, party about

612
00:28:35,141 --> 00:28:36,582
Speaker 1: up funny, maybe that's why.

613
00:28:37,061 --> 00:28:40,382
Speaker 3: So. Catherine Gesu Morton, who writes a great parenting column

614
00:28:40,422 --> 00:28:43,142
Speaker 3: for New York which I highly recommend, writes about the

615
00:28:43,222 --> 00:28:46,582
Speaker 3: experience of dropping her kids off for playdates and how

616
00:28:46,782 --> 00:28:50,062
Speaker 3: it's assumed that you have to show your concern and

617
00:28:50,182 --> 00:28:53,702
Speaker 3: your diligence as a parent by checking in constantly while

618
00:28:53,742 --> 00:28:56,262
Speaker 3: the kid is on the playdate, and also the parent

619
00:28:56,342 --> 00:28:58,422
Speaker 3: during the hosting of the playdate has to be constantly

620
00:28:58,502 --> 00:29:00,582
Speaker 3: checking in, Oh, is it okay if I give little

621
00:29:00,622 --> 00:29:03,142
Speaker 3: Billy some biscuits? Or is it okay if he has

622
00:29:03,182 --> 00:29:05,782
Speaker 3: a fruit juice? This is constant back and forth of communication.

623
00:29:06,422 --> 00:29:08,782
Speaker 3: She says that she used to live in Mexico, which

624
00:29:08,902 --> 00:29:11,342
Speaker 3: flex I would love to live in Mexico, and when

625
00:29:11,502 --> 00:29:13,782
Speaker 3: she would drop off her kid at a playdate, she

626
00:29:13,862 --> 00:29:15,782
Speaker 3: would say to the parent, as she has been trained

627
00:29:15,822 --> 00:29:18,262
Speaker 3: to do, oh, when should I pick my kid up?

628
00:29:18,382 --> 00:29:20,222
Speaker 3: And the parent would look vaguely annoyed and say I

629
00:29:20,262 --> 00:29:24,502
Speaker 3: don't know, like before bedtime, go away. Essentially just leave

630
00:29:24,582 --> 00:29:27,702
Speaker 3: us alone, trust me to do this, And so from

631
00:29:27,742 --> 00:29:30,181
Speaker 3: her Mexico experience, she resolved to become more of a

632
00:29:30,262 --> 00:29:33,142
Speaker 3: minimalist text She says that in fact, every time you

633
00:29:33,262 --> 00:29:36,302
Speaker 3: text a fellow parent, you are asking them to use

634
00:29:36,342 --> 00:29:38,662
Speaker 3: their time and energy on both reading the message, thinking

635
00:29:38,702 --> 00:29:40,661
Speaker 3: about the message, and then responding to the message. And

636
00:29:40,822 --> 00:29:42,822
Speaker 3: she suggests that we all need to take a pact

637
00:29:43,302 --> 00:29:46,181
Speaker 3: to text less Mon's are you going to be joining

638
00:29:46,222 --> 00:29:47,142
Speaker 3: Catherine in this pledge?

639
00:29:47,262 --> 00:29:50,421
Speaker 2: I hear that. I think it's about age and stage.

640
00:29:50,862 --> 00:29:53,502
Speaker 2: So first of all, I would say, what's wrong with

641
00:29:53,622 --> 00:29:56,782
Speaker 2: a bit of over communication? I think we are saturated

642
00:29:56,822 --> 00:29:59,181
Speaker 2: with over communication from schools and childcares and all that.

643
00:29:59,302 --> 00:30:02,102
Speaker 2: So the standard has been set, like in the vacuum

644
00:30:02,182 --> 00:30:05,222
Speaker 2: that we are in, in the culture that we are in,

645
00:30:05,582 --> 00:30:08,342
Speaker 2: is all about over communicating. But I do think it

646
00:30:08,542 --> 00:30:12,421
Speaker 2: definitely reaps up. I also think it's about the agent stage.

647
00:30:12,462 --> 00:30:14,421
Speaker 2: So if you're a new parent, if you've joined a

648
00:30:14,502 --> 00:30:18,062
Speaker 2: new school, it's the first playdate. Then it is about

649
00:30:18,182 --> 00:30:22,542
Speaker 2: building the trust and it's code for I'm a conscientious parent.

650
00:30:22,661 --> 00:30:24,982
Speaker 2: It's like trust me, And it's this weird thing of

651
00:30:25,062 --> 00:30:26,622
Speaker 2: like the more you check in, the more sort of

652
00:30:26,661 --> 00:30:30,502
Speaker 2: conscientious and caring you become. And so texting has become

653
00:30:30,622 --> 00:30:33,982
Speaker 2: kind of this false way of performing virtue, I guess,

654
00:30:34,062 --> 00:30:35,942
Speaker 2: and I'm guilty of it. Like I text a lot

655
00:30:35,982 --> 00:30:37,822
Speaker 2: because i want to fast track the trust so that

656
00:30:37,942 --> 00:30:40,062
Speaker 2: I can get to the point where I'm the Mexican

657
00:30:40,182 --> 00:30:42,502
Speaker 2: parent saying just drop them and come back when you

658
00:30:42,582 --> 00:30:44,902
Speaker 2: feel like it. But I do think it's a sliding scale.

659
00:30:44,982 --> 00:30:47,701
Speaker 2: It starts with everyone very keen on the texting, and

660
00:30:47,782 --> 00:30:50,582
Speaker 2: then I'm hoping by middle school it'll just die right off.

661
00:30:50,902 --> 00:30:53,742
Speaker 1: See, maybe I'm guilty of being one of these overtexters.

662
00:30:53,822 --> 00:30:56,222
Speaker 1: I'm not at the kindergarten school parties yet, so I

663
00:30:56,302 --> 00:30:58,941
Speaker 1: can see that that would be an absolute punished I

664
00:30:59,062 --> 00:31:02,102
Speaker 1: have to reply to all of those. But my daughter

665
00:31:02,222 --> 00:31:05,982
Speaker 1: being four now, she recently went to a gorgeous friend's

666
00:31:06,022 --> 00:31:08,262
Speaker 1: house to look after my daughter while I worked, and

667
00:31:08,942 --> 00:31:11,262
Speaker 1: she was tech me a lot. She was texting me,

668
00:31:11,702 --> 00:31:14,342
Speaker 1: they're having an ice cream together, they're on the swing together,

669
00:31:14,542 --> 00:31:17,462
Speaker 1: they're doing this, And I probably wouldn't have thought to

670
00:31:17,542 --> 00:31:19,261
Speaker 1: do the same for her if it was the other

671
00:31:19,302 --> 00:31:21,142
Speaker 1: way around. But when she did it, I bloody loved

672
00:31:21,182 --> 00:31:23,742
Speaker 1: it because it actually took the guilt for me out

673
00:31:23,782 --> 00:31:26,022
Speaker 1: of the fact that I wasn't there. I was like, Yep, great,

674
00:31:26,062 --> 00:31:28,022
Speaker 1: she's cool. Yep, great, she's still cool.

675
00:31:28,102 --> 00:31:30,782
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a lot of we're all anxious, Amelia, but

676
00:31:30,942 --> 00:31:33,422
Speaker 2: we're an anxious generation. We need the constant checking.

677
00:31:33,462 --> 00:31:35,462
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, I think it's gotten out of control. Like

678
00:31:35,542 --> 00:31:39,542
Speaker 3: when my kids started school here, I had to download

679
00:31:40,102 --> 00:31:45,221
Speaker 3: four apps, four different ways of communicating with the school

680
00:31:45,462 --> 00:31:47,462
Speaker 3: and ways that they could communicate with me.

681
00:31:48,262 --> 00:31:49,421
Speaker 1: That's too many apps.

682
00:31:49,702 --> 00:31:53,542
Speaker 3: We know too much, I think, particularly with school. I

683
00:31:53,702 --> 00:31:56,222
Speaker 3: don't really think that it's my business what my kids

684
00:31:56,262 --> 00:31:59,302
Speaker 3: are getting up to at school. I just don't think

685
00:31:59,382 --> 00:32:02,502
Speaker 3: it's my concern. I feel the opposite. I froth those

686
00:32:02,542 --> 00:32:05,382
Speaker 3: weekly updates. When my daughter went to a daycare, we

687
00:32:05,462 --> 00:32:07,782
Speaker 3: never got any, and I was just desperate for a crumber.

688
00:32:07,782 --> 00:32:09,142
Speaker 3: I was like, just send me one picture of her

689
00:32:09,142 --> 00:32:11,221
Speaker 3: doing a little finger painting and I'll be so happy

690
00:32:11,661 --> 00:32:13,862
Speaker 3: that she had a good day. And now at her

691
00:32:14,062 --> 00:32:16,701
Speaker 3: prep school we get like this week, we learn about this,

692
00:32:17,142 --> 00:32:20,942
Speaker 3: the letter of the week is this, and I try.

693
00:32:21,942 --> 00:32:22,902
Speaker 2: Oh I love it.

694
00:32:23,102 --> 00:32:26,222
Speaker 3: Do you have your phones on no notifications, because you

695
00:32:26,422 --> 00:32:30,182
Speaker 3: cannot deny that every time your phone pings, your QUOTASOL

696
00:32:30,262 --> 00:32:33,342
Speaker 3: levels spike and you feel a little pang of anxiety

697
00:32:33,382 --> 00:32:36,302
Speaker 3: and stress. Don't you want to minimize that? I guess so,

698
00:32:36,542 --> 00:32:38,461
Speaker 3: at least for me, it's only once a week when

699
00:32:38,542 --> 00:32:40,862
Speaker 3: that's happening. But I guess if you were getting those constantly,

700
00:32:40,942 --> 00:32:42,542
Speaker 3: that would be stressed. I just think it's about the

701
00:32:42,582 --> 00:32:45,342
Speaker 3: class WhatsApp groups mons, Have you muted your class?

702
00:32:45,382 --> 00:32:48,062
Speaker 2: What's I am the rogue parent that does not check

703
00:32:48,142 --> 00:32:48,742
Speaker 2: the messages?

704
00:32:48,942 --> 00:32:51,622
Speaker 3: So I, oh, you're that parent and you're the one

705
00:32:51,661 --> 00:32:53,982
Speaker 3: who comes in after like a month and it's like, sorry,

706
00:32:54,022 --> 00:32:54,902
Speaker 3: when's book week?

707
00:32:55,062 --> 00:32:55,181
Speaker 1: Yes?

708
00:32:55,302 --> 00:32:57,661
Speaker 2: Completely, I'm the one that took my kid at a

709
00:32:57,702 --> 00:33:00,062
Speaker 2: school in their school uniform on casual day because I

710
00:33:00,142 --> 00:33:02,661
Speaker 2: don't check the apps. It was an easy fix and

711
00:33:02,742 --> 00:33:05,941
Speaker 2: it was a teachable moment. I think, what if you

712
00:33:06,182 --> 00:33:09,941
Speaker 2: don't text Amelia? What if you are the rogue parent?

713
00:33:10,382 --> 00:33:14,062
Speaker 2: Is that kind of code for she's careless and that's

714
00:33:14,102 --> 00:33:15,662
Speaker 2: why no one comes to play our house?

715
00:33:15,822 --> 00:33:16,022
Speaker 3: Yeah?

716
00:33:16,262 --> 00:33:16,542
Speaker 1: Maybe?

717
00:33:16,702 --> 00:33:19,262
Speaker 3: I mean. Catherine says that part of this pledge to

718
00:33:19,342 --> 00:33:22,421
Speaker 3: text less, what you have to be aware of is

719
00:33:22,502 --> 00:33:24,982
Speaker 3: that people will be mad at you. People will be

720
00:33:25,142 --> 00:33:28,421
Speaker 3: angry at you. There's going to be some social blowback

721
00:33:28,542 --> 00:33:31,542
Speaker 3: from texting less. That's absolutely true.

722
00:33:32,542 --> 00:33:34,302
Speaker 2: I tried something new the other day when I was

723
00:33:34,342 --> 00:33:37,302
Speaker 2: texting another mum where I gave options. I treated it

724
00:33:37,462 --> 00:33:39,862
Speaker 2: like I was going to text my boss. And if

725
00:33:39,902 --> 00:33:41,701
Speaker 2: you're in a workplace and you know how to manage up,

726
00:33:41,862 --> 00:33:43,862
Speaker 2: you sort of like offer a problem and then offer

727
00:33:43,902 --> 00:33:46,261
Speaker 2: the solution and then give the recommendation in the one thing.

728
00:33:46,382 --> 00:33:49,662
Speaker 2: So I said, Hi, Sally, we'd love to have Ari

729
00:33:49,942 --> 00:33:53,222
Speaker 2: over for a playdate two till four. You can a

730
00:33:53,702 --> 00:33:55,502
Speaker 2: kiss and drop and we'll see you in a few hours.

731
00:33:55,902 --> 00:33:59,262
Speaker 2: B get regular text updates and photos on all their activities,

732
00:33:59,422 --> 00:34:01,062
Speaker 2: or see stay and have a cup of tea and

733
00:34:01,142 --> 00:34:04,102
Speaker 2: hang out too. Now what this? And then short and

734
00:34:04,182 --> 00:34:07,102
Speaker 2: then I said, I'm the parent that always chooses a

735
00:34:07,542 --> 00:34:10,701
Speaker 2: loll but whatever you feel me comfortable with. So it

736
00:34:10,822 --> 00:34:14,062
Speaker 2: stops the back and forth. It sets the intention. It's

737
00:34:14,102 --> 00:34:16,902
Speaker 2: like if you choose what you want, choose your own adventure,

738
00:34:17,302 --> 00:34:20,221
Speaker 2: and then everyone's happy. And what parent, and merely what

739
00:34:20,422 --> 00:34:22,902
Speaker 2: parent is going to say, yeah, I want text updates

740
00:34:22,902 --> 00:34:23,341
Speaker 2: every hour?

741
00:34:23,462 --> 00:34:25,181
Speaker 4: Then not that?

742
00:34:25,382 --> 00:34:26,942
Speaker 1: And you know what would have taken it to the

743
00:34:27,022 --> 00:34:29,342
Speaker 1: next level. Did you do it like a poll in

744
00:34:29,462 --> 00:34:33,821
Speaker 1: what's that button? That would have been next level?

745
00:34:33,982 --> 00:34:36,062
Speaker 2: I just went ABC because I also am aware that,

746
00:34:36,181 --> 00:34:39,302
Speaker 2: like the mental load with texting back and forth is crippling.

747
00:34:39,382 --> 00:34:42,022
Speaker 1: And so what she picked she picked A kiss and JOP. Yeah,

748
00:34:42,022 --> 00:34:43,701
Speaker 1: I love it. Who wouldn't. But do you know why

749
00:34:43,822 --> 00:34:46,142
Speaker 1: she did pick A and why I would pick A

750
00:34:46,261 --> 00:34:49,102
Speaker 1: in that circumstance when really I love getting all the updates?

751
00:34:49,342 --> 00:34:51,861
Speaker 1: Is that you set up that you're that person. That's

752
00:34:51,902 --> 00:34:54,062
Speaker 1: the genius of it that you said, I'm a mom

753
00:34:54,102 --> 00:34:57,742
Speaker 1: who does a loll like I'm chill, so I'm expecting

754
00:34:57,781 --> 00:35:01,062
Speaker 1: you to be chill and not asking. We're sort of

755
00:35:01,261 --> 00:35:03,542
Speaker 1: like sending some parameters breadcrumb.

756
00:35:03,622 --> 00:35:05,582
Speaker 2: But look, she could have chosen B or C and

757
00:35:05,622 --> 00:35:06,582
Speaker 2: I would have been happy.

758
00:35:06,342 --> 00:35:09,982
Speaker 1: With that, genuinely okay with B, which was provide constant updates.

759
00:35:10,062 --> 00:35:12,261
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's fine. If a parent wants that from me

760
00:35:12,422 --> 00:35:14,542
Speaker 2: and needs that to feel safe and build the trust

761
00:35:14,781 --> 00:35:17,301
Speaker 2: with me with her child, then that's absolutely fine. It

762
00:35:17,422 --> 00:35:18,661
Speaker 2: just puts the burden back on her.

763
00:35:20,221 --> 00:35:22,781
Speaker 1: So we published a story on the site about how

764
00:35:22,862 --> 00:35:25,622
Speaker 1: having kids is basically like ordering food at a restaurant

765
00:35:25,741 --> 00:35:28,382
Speaker 1: and it's so brilliant that I need everyone to hear it.

766
00:35:28,942 --> 00:35:32,781
Speaker 1: So the article by Francesca Hornack was titled why a

767
00:35:32,862 --> 00:35:36,582
Speaker 1: third kid is like ordering dessert, and she basically runs

768
00:35:36,622 --> 00:35:39,582
Speaker 1: through this metaphorical restaurant of childbearing. So I'll give you

769
00:35:39,701 --> 00:35:42,942
Speaker 1: some of them. So with starters, she's like, you know

770
00:35:43,062 --> 00:35:47,262
Speaker 1: the drill, everyone gets there, we're all really excited. You're drinking,

771
00:35:47,422 --> 00:35:50,022
Speaker 1: and everyone starts ordering the first round of entrees, which

772
00:35:50,102 --> 00:35:52,942
Speaker 1: is the first round of babies. And she's like, everyone's

773
00:35:52,982 --> 00:35:55,181
Speaker 1: really excited when they come because you're ravenous, Like you're

774
00:35:55,221 --> 00:35:57,982
Speaker 1: all so excited by this, and you secretly start comparing,

775
00:35:58,062 --> 00:36:00,902
Speaker 1: like who got the best starter. Then everyone's having a

776
00:36:00,942 --> 00:36:01,341
Speaker 1: great time.

777
00:36:01,422 --> 00:36:03,421
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like it's a vibe. The first entrees is a vibe.

778
00:36:03,462 --> 00:36:06,262
Speaker 2: You're in the restaurant, you're feeling it, like, here it comes,

779
00:36:06,382 --> 00:36:07,022
Speaker 2: we are ready.

780
00:36:07,102 --> 00:36:09,142
Speaker 1: You're really excited for you ever got the barada, because

781
00:36:09,142 --> 00:36:13,342
Speaker 1: that's obvious the superior entrey, like very exciting stuff. Mains

782
00:36:13,422 --> 00:36:17,502
Speaker 1: is your second kid. That makes sense. Following this pork chop, Yeah, yeah,

783
00:36:17,661 --> 00:36:20,781
Speaker 1: pork chop. You know, everyone's less excited in your food

784
00:36:20,942 --> 00:36:22,942
Speaker 1: because they've got their own food to worry about.

785
00:36:23,221 --> 00:36:25,382
Speaker 2: But great, you're not so hungry anymore.

786
00:36:25,502 --> 00:36:27,502
Speaker 1: Yeah, but you're all settled in, you know the score,

787
00:36:27,781 --> 00:36:31,462
Speaker 1: so it's a little bit easier. You're enjoying yourselves. The

788
00:36:31,582 --> 00:36:33,821
Speaker 1: best one she has is when they come around and say,

789
00:36:33,982 --> 00:36:35,902
Speaker 1: would you like the dessert menu? And I'm going to

790
00:36:35,942 --> 00:36:37,902
Speaker 1: read you what she wrote here because it's so brilliant,

791
00:36:38,661 --> 00:36:41,862
Speaker 1: she says. Nearly everyone at the table says no, thanks immediately,

792
00:36:42,102 --> 00:36:44,661
Speaker 1: without pausing or even looking at each other. But you're

793
00:36:44,661 --> 00:36:48,261
Speaker 1: a little surprised. Pudding would be delicious, and you don't

794
00:36:48,302 --> 00:36:51,462
Speaker 1: feel quite finished or balanced. It's all been a bit savory.

795
00:36:51,862 --> 00:36:53,661
Speaker 1: This is when you try for a third after having

796
00:36:53,701 --> 00:36:56,261
Speaker 1: two kids of the same sex. The thing is, you

797
00:36:56,382 --> 00:36:59,262
Speaker 1: aren't sure you should actually be having a hole pudding.

798
00:36:59,422 --> 00:37:01,741
Speaker 1: You're not sure you can fit a whole pudding. But

799
00:37:01,862 --> 00:37:04,422
Speaker 1: you also know deep down that you aren't ready to

800
00:37:04,502 --> 00:37:07,661
Speaker 1: leave the restaurant. This is not throwing out the newborn sleepsuits,

801
00:37:08,102 --> 00:37:10,301
Speaker 1: and you can delay going out into the cold, dark

802
00:37:10,422 --> 00:37:13,502
Speaker 1: night by ordering another course. It's perfect.

803
00:37:13,582 --> 00:37:14,022
Speaker 2: I loved this.

804
00:37:14,261 --> 00:37:18,582
Speaker 1: No, it's yeah, so so many amazing analogies in there.

805
00:37:18,622 --> 00:37:20,301
Speaker 1: We'll put the whole story in the show notes for

806
00:37:20,422 --> 00:37:22,701
Speaker 1: you so you can read the others. But for me

807
00:37:22,862 --> 00:37:26,301
Speaker 1: selfishly with my situation, my favorite was when she says,

808
00:37:26,582 --> 00:37:29,382
Speaker 1: what ordering the salad to come with the mains is like,

809
00:37:29,781 --> 00:37:32,102
Speaker 1: and she said, that's like having an only child. It

810
00:37:32,221 --> 00:37:35,342
Speaker 1: might seem lighter, but the goat's cheese is very demanding,

811
00:37:35,781 --> 00:37:37,302
Speaker 1: so brilliant.

812
00:37:37,502 --> 00:37:39,781
Speaker 2: The trouble with the dessert is what if you don't

813
00:37:39,781 --> 00:37:41,422
Speaker 2: get to choose it. What if it's just like it

814
00:37:41,502 --> 00:37:43,381
Speaker 2: comes out and it might be a lemon merangue pie

815
00:37:43,462 --> 00:37:45,301
Speaker 2: and then you're like, shit, no, I want this.

816
00:37:46,022 --> 00:37:49,142
Speaker 1: I'd love a lemon merangue pie ordering.

817
00:37:49,741 --> 00:37:52,342
Speaker 2: Could we also apply this metaphor to other areas of

818
00:37:52,382 --> 00:37:55,582
Speaker 2: our life, like what other items? Like if it was

819
00:37:55,582 --> 00:37:59,142
Speaker 2: a kitchen appliance. So my first born is probably my

820
00:37:59,302 --> 00:38:04,181
Speaker 2: thermomix because it's like extremely expensive. We poured everything into

821
00:38:04,261 --> 00:38:06,622
Speaker 2: it and then we just don't stop yapping about how

822
00:38:06,661 --> 00:38:09,701
Speaker 2: amazing it is, Like shut up, and then my can

823
00:38:09,781 --> 00:38:12,222
Speaker 2: change more like an anchor toaster, it's just like gets

824
00:38:12,382 --> 00:38:14,382
Speaker 2: the job done. What would a third child be?

825
00:38:14,822 --> 00:38:17,582
Speaker 1: I feel like a third child would be like an

826
00:38:17,661 --> 00:38:20,622
Speaker 1: air fryer that you get gifted by someone else. So

827
00:38:20,741 --> 00:38:23,062
Speaker 1: it kind of was a surprise that got thrown into

828
00:38:23,102 --> 00:38:25,902
Speaker 1: the mix and you don't quite know what to do

829
00:38:26,022 --> 00:38:27,462
Speaker 1: with it, but you can throw everything at it and

830
00:38:27,542 --> 00:38:30,622
Speaker 1: it survives like it doesn't trying to persuade everyone else

831
00:38:30,661 --> 00:38:33,622
Speaker 1: that they needed Yes, yeah, and then you're like, how

832
00:38:33,661 --> 00:38:34,862
Speaker 1: did I live my life without this?

833
00:38:34,982 --> 00:38:35,102
Speaker 3: Air?

834
00:38:35,142 --> 00:38:35,341
Speaker 4: Fright?

835
00:38:35,462 --> 00:38:35,902
Speaker 1: Exactly?

836
00:38:36,862 --> 00:38:37,181
Speaker 3: All right?

837
00:38:37,221 --> 00:38:38,622
Speaker 2: To wrap up today's show, we're going to share the

838
00:38:38,701 --> 00:38:40,862
Speaker 2: things that we're loving sick at the moment. Things we

839
00:38:40,942 --> 00:38:42,741
Speaker 2: might text to our friends or put in the mum's

840
00:38:42,781 --> 00:38:46,102
Speaker 2: group chat, just helpful, helpful stuff. I should say dad's

841
00:38:46,102 --> 00:38:49,062
Speaker 2: group chat as well. Dads probably have group chats, all.

842
00:38:49,022 --> 00:38:53,902
Speaker 1: Right, I don't think, don't they've taken the pledge.

843
00:38:55,462 --> 00:38:57,462
Speaker 2: I've gone back to basics with this one. So this

844
00:38:57,582 --> 00:39:01,862
Speaker 2: is a recipe that is a lunchbox snack that's fast, cheap,

845
00:39:02,221 --> 00:39:03,741
Speaker 2: and you can keep it in the freezer in a

846
00:39:03,822 --> 00:39:08,781
Speaker 2: giant bag. For ingredients, wheatbix balls, Guys, whatever happened to

847
00:39:08,781 --> 00:39:11,702
Speaker 2: wheatbix balls. We're all about the kito and the protein

848
00:39:11,781 --> 00:39:14,622
Speaker 2: and the chea seed and the prunes. No, I'm telling

849
00:39:14,661 --> 00:39:18,862
Speaker 2: you four ingredients. You take eight wheatbicks and then crush

850
00:39:19,062 --> 00:39:21,261
Speaker 2: them up and chuck them in a bowl. You can

851
00:39:21,342 --> 00:39:23,942
Speaker 2: also use the Wheatbix rubble that ends up at the

852
00:39:23,942 --> 00:39:26,461
Speaker 2: bottom of the packet that no one ever uses. Throw

853
00:39:26,582 --> 00:39:28,781
Speaker 2: that into You're going to take a quarter of a

854
00:39:28,862 --> 00:39:32,382
Speaker 2: cup of cocoa and then one cup of desiccated coconut

855
00:39:32,622 --> 00:39:35,382
Speaker 2: and just a can of condensed milky.

856
00:39:35,701 --> 00:39:36,181
Speaker 1: That's it.

857
00:39:36,582 --> 00:39:40,741
Speaker 2: Stir it together, roll it into balls, roll it in coconut,

858
00:39:41,022 --> 00:39:44,142
Speaker 2: store it in a bag in the freezer for wheat

859
00:39:44,261 --> 00:39:46,742
Speaker 2: bis bolts bowls.

860
00:39:47,902 --> 00:39:50,902
Speaker 3: Look, I love that we're giving depression. You're apparenting with

861
00:39:51,022 --> 00:39:52,661
Speaker 3: directs this week. So I'm going to jump in because

862
00:39:52,661 --> 00:39:59,142
Speaker 3: I've got one question. Mine is a recommendation which came

863
00:39:59,181 --> 00:39:59,781
Speaker 3: by my mother.

864
00:40:00,181 --> 00:40:02,182
Speaker 1: My son was sick. He was over at her place.

865
00:40:02,302 --> 00:40:04,022
Speaker 1: He saw a hot water bottle and.

866
00:40:04,142 --> 00:40:06,862
Speaker 3: His mind was blown in a way that I didn't

867
00:40:06,902 --> 00:40:09,502
Speaker 3: think could happen to him outside of watching the Minecraft movie.

868
00:40:09,741 --> 00:40:12,862
Speaker 3: Like he just had this sort of like incredibly touching

869
00:40:13,741 --> 00:40:17,582
Speaker 3: childhood wonderment at the hot water bottle. And so now

870
00:40:17,701 --> 00:40:20,661
Speaker 3: my children think I'm like some kind of literal magician

871
00:40:20,862 --> 00:40:23,502
Speaker 3: because every night I give them this weird contraption and

872
00:40:23,582 --> 00:40:25,342
Speaker 3: they take it to bed and it soothes them and

873
00:40:25,422 --> 00:40:28,382
Speaker 3: it calms them and it eases their growing pains, and

874
00:40:28,502 --> 00:40:28,781
Speaker 3: I need.

875
00:40:28,781 --> 00:40:29,462
Speaker 1: To get one myself.

876
00:40:29,542 --> 00:40:30,421
Speaker 2: They're so good.

877
00:40:30,582 --> 00:40:32,462
Speaker 3: Now you may be asking where do you get one?

878
00:40:32,542 --> 00:40:34,661
Speaker 3: That's what I asked, because I truly hadn't thought about

879
00:40:34,701 --> 00:40:37,342
Speaker 3: them in decades. It turns out they're everywhere, Okay, I

880
00:40:37,502 --> 00:40:41,542
Speaker 3: sware house, They're everywhere, and they're not expensive. And one tip,

881
00:40:41,781 --> 00:40:43,622
Speaker 3: because my son had to tell me this, now, I'm

882
00:40:43,661 --> 00:40:46,462
Speaker 3: aware that people listening will think that I'm extremely silly

883
00:40:46,542 --> 00:40:47,221
Speaker 3: for not knowing this.

884
00:40:47,342 --> 00:40:48,821
Speaker 1: You're not meant to put boiling water in.

885
00:40:49,142 --> 00:40:50,622
Speaker 2: No, they can burst, no can.

886
00:40:51,022 --> 00:40:52,781
Speaker 3: My son told me that you just have to like

887
00:40:53,102 --> 00:40:56,422
Speaker 3: get hot water, not boiling water. But I think it's great.

888
00:40:56,701 --> 00:40:58,781
Speaker 2: Oh that's so good. I think it's the sound they make,

889
00:40:59,022 --> 00:41:01,622
Speaker 2: like the slushy sloshy is so delightful.

890
00:41:01,781 --> 00:41:03,142
Speaker 1: I want I want one.

891
00:41:03,462 --> 00:41:05,301
Speaker 2: Do you put them in a little baggie or is

892
00:41:05,342 --> 00:41:08,741
Speaker 2: it just raw plastic rubber? Yeah?

893
00:41:08,741 --> 00:41:11,342
Speaker 1: And skin probably could get one of those. You know

894
00:41:11,422 --> 00:41:15,822
Speaker 1: how church fates always have those knitted water keep.

895
00:41:15,661 --> 00:41:18,261
Speaker 2: It raw dogging And also because the smell of the

896
00:41:18,422 --> 00:41:22,222
Speaker 2: rubber is so good too. Oh man, what have you got, Stacey?

897
00:41:22,741 --> 00:41:25,861
Speaker 1: So my reco this week does not give depression error.

898
00:41:26,062 --> 00:41:29,062
Speaker 1: So I've gone a very different direction this week. Mine

899
00:41:29,181 --> 00:41:30,982
Speaker 1: is to just grab one of your friends and go

900
00:41:31,142 --> 00:41:34,502
Speaker 1: and have a little dance around your handbag, yes, which

901
00:41:34,582 --> 00:41:37,342
Speaker 1: I had not actually done in so long but always

902
00:41:37,422 --> 00:41:38,381
Speaker 1: used to love doing.

903
00:41:38,942 --> 00:41:38,982
Speaker 3: So.

904
00:41:39,342 --> 00:41:41,661
Speaker 1: It's bloody cold. My legs have not seen the light

905
00:41:41,701 --> 00:41:44,622
Speaker 1: of day in months. Like if they were a Duluxe

906
00:41:44,781 --> 00:41:47,982
Speaker 1: paint swatch, it would be called like dry, flaky snowstorm

907
00:41:48,102 --> 00:41:50,181
Speaker 1: or something like that. But I cracked out a can

908
00:41:50,302 --> 00:41:53,821
Speaker 1: of fake tan, fake tanned myself, put some sparkles on.

909
00:41:54,022 --> 00:41:56,582
Speaker 1: I thought of ten different reasons I could get it's

910
00:41:56,902 --> 00:41:58,582
Speaker 1: starting to sound like a lot. I thought, you just

911
00:41:58,622 --> 00:42:00,941
Speaker 1: meant in your living room? You mean yeah. I went

912
00:42:01,142 --> 00:42:03,902
Speaker 1: out in the city, which for me when I'm in

913
00:42:03,942 --> 00:42:06,022
Speaker 1: the Western suburbs, it was even a long way to

914
00:42:06,062 --> 00:42:09,142
Speaker 1: get good. It was actually so good. The one I

915
00:42:09,181 --> 00:42:11,382
Speaker 1: went to was called House of Zim. But they're just

916
00:42:11,462 --> 00:42:16,102
Speaker 1: these women only dance clubs, like is disco club, baby, yeah,

917
00:42:16,382 --> 00:42:19,142
Speaker 1: disco club like Lisa and Sarah are friends of the podcast.

918
00:42:19,221 --> 00:42:21,382
Speaker 1: They have disco club like women go and have the

919
00:42:21,462 --> 00:42:23,622
Speaker 1: best time. And then the one I went to was

920
00:42:23,701 --> 00:42:24,662
Speaker 1: over at ten pm.

921
00:42:24,781 --> 00:42:28,181
Speaker 2: Ye shut seeing these amelia and you see them everywhere

922
00:42:29,181 --> 00:42:30,062
Speaker 2: you put sneakers on.

923
00:42:30,342 --> 00:42:32,701
Speaker 1: Oh good, yeah, you wear flat shoes. I was like,

924
00:42:32,781 --> 00:42:34,382
Speaker 1: what is the music that they play at these? Is

925
00:42:34,422 --> 00:42:38,022
Speaker 1: it like nineties hits? You calling it nineties hits means

926
00:42:38,062 --> 00:42:39,661
Speaker 1: you need to be coming with me to one of these.

927
00:42:40,942 --> 00:42:44,022
Speaker 2: What's the nineties hit like the Spice.

928
00:42:43,741 --> 00:42:46,462
Speaker 1: Girl's Baby, right they were nineties? Yeah, I don't know

929
00:42:46,622 --> 00:42:50,381
Speaker 1: boys two men on the st but yes, it's all

930
00:42:50,462 --> 00:42:52,502
Speaker 1: of that music. Like you can belt out a Celene

931
00:42:52,542 --> 00:42:53,022
Speaker 1: banger at.

932
00:42:52,942 --> 00:42:56,382
Speaker 2: The top bangers and you go hard. The women go

933
00:42:56,622 --> 00:42:58,421
Speaker 2: so hard. Yeah, I saw the next day.

934
00:42:58,822 --> 00:43:00,542
Speaker 1: I was a bit sore in the hips. I'm not

935
00:43:00,622 --> 00:43:03,661
Speaker 1: gonna lie my hips were sore. But it was so good.

936
00:43:03,701 --> 00:43:07,062
Speaker 1: I wore flat shoes. I was so comfy. Great time.

937
00:43:07,661 --> 00:43:10,142
Speaker 1: You know you're seeing like belt out Selene like it's

938
00:43:10,181 --> 00:43:11,461
Speaker 1: the best. I have another question.

939
00:43:11,862 --> 00:43:14,982
Speaker 3: No men, no mess women, no men, No men are

940
00:43:15,022 --> 00:43:18,502
Speaker 3: present and people drinking. Yeah, so you don't have it's

941
00:43:18,542 --> 00:43:20,941
Speaker 3: not one of those like sober coffee dance pot.

942
00:43:21,142 --> 00:43:21,542
Speaker 4: No, no, no.

943
00:43:21,661 --> 00:43:24,342
Speaker 1: There were many margaritas consumed. But I think just in

944
00:43:24,422 --> 00:43:26,342
Speaker 1: a group of women, like everyone was there for the

945
00:43:26,382 --> 00:43:29,502
Speaker 1: same reason. Everyone had gotten a baby or you know,

946
00:43:29,661 --> 00:43:32,022
Speaker 1: found their way to be out. Everyone just chucked their

947
00:43:32,062 --> 00:43:33,981
Speaker 1: bags in a corner like it was great.

948
00:43:34,142 --> 00:43:37,261
Speaker 2: It's so good when you're this age because you you

949
00:43:37,462 --> 00:43:39,741
Speaker 2: maximize your time. Like when you were younger and you

950
00:43:39,781 --> 00:43:42,502
Speaker 2: were going out clubbing, the night would stretch on and

951
00:43:42,622 --> 00:43:42,942
Speaker 2: on and on.

952
00:43:43,181 --> 00:43:44,502
Speaker 1: Yeap, who even knew what.

953
00:43:44,582 --> 00:43:47,622
Speaker 2: You were doing next? But this we are so efficient.

954
00:43:47,741 --> 00:43:49,542
Speaker 2: The women at this age are so efficient. It's like

955
00:43:49,741 --> 00:43:52,861
Speaker 2: get in, get your dance done, go hard, go home

956
00:43:52,902 --> 00:43:54,062
Speaker 2: and get into bed by ten thirty.

957
00:43:54,181 --> 00:43:56,622
Speaker 1: Yeah, it was the best. Woke up, parented my child

958
00:43:56,741 --> 00:43:58,021
Speaker 1: like nothing of homes sold.

959
00:43:58,142 --> 00:44:01,542
Speaker 2: Okay, ah, that's all we have time for on Parenting

960
00:44:01,582 --> 00:44:04,502
Speaker 2: out Loud today. But hey, before you go, a warning.

961
00:44:04,342 --> 00:44:05,502
Speaker 1: Not to YouTube.

962
00:44:06,582 --> 00:44:09,301
Speaker 2: Or if you know this, but this show is a

963
00:44:09,382 --> 00:44:13,261
Speaker 2: time bomb, no pressure. You're listening to this now in

964
00:44:13,382 --> 00:44:15,861
Speaker 2: the Mumma mea out Loud podcast feed, which is great,

965
00:44:15,982 --> 00:44:17,902
Speaker 2: Like we love that for us. We are just like

966
00:44:18,102 --> 00:44:19,741
Speaker 2: suckling on the teeth of Big Mamma.

967
00:44:20,942 --> 00:44:22,062
Speaker 1: But it's not gonna last.

968
00:44:22,181 --> 00:44:25,382
Speaker 2: They're cutting us off after three weeks and if we

969
00:44:25,582 --> 00:44:29,062
Speaker 2: don't survive EMLI, you're gonna have to sell your feet

970
00:44:29,102 --> 00:44:33,221
Speaker 2: picks on only fee. So no hard feelings like that's

971
00:44:33,261 --> 00:44:34,182
Speaker 2: just in commercial reality.

972
00:44:34,502 --> 00:44:37,542
Speaker 1: That's fine, yeah, I mean they do really well, they would.

973
00:44:37,781 --> 00:44:38,382
Speaker 2: What size are you?

974
00:44:38,542 --> 00:44:41,261
Speaker 1: Oh, they're very, very large. Let's not talk about it.

975
00:44:41,382 --> 00:44:44,821
Speaker 2: High arch I love the high h I know too

976
00:44:44,942 --> 00:44:47,622
Speaker 2: much about it. So listen. If you quite liked this

977
00:44:47,781 --> 00:44:51,381
Speaker 2: show and you would listen again, we need to ask

978
00:44:51,502 --> 00:44:53,181
Speaker 2: for your help. We need to ask a favor. I

979
00:44:53,261 --> 00:44:55,421
Speaker 2: know it's more on the mental load. But the best

980
00:44:55,462 --> 00:44:58,261
Speaker 2: way to help us in the next three weeks while

981
00:44:58,302 --> 00:45:01,542
Speaker 2: the time ticks away is to do one thing. It's

982
00:45:01,622 --> 00:45:04,821
Speaker 2: to search for Parenting Out Loud in your podcast app.

983
00:45:05,102 --> 00:45:07,661
Speaker 2: Find the show. It's got a purple logo, and just

984
00:45:07,741 --> 00:45:09,982
Speaker 2: hit follow, so it's like a little plus sign in

985
00:45:10,062 --> 00:45:12,781
Speaker 2: Spotify or Apple or wherever you listen. Now, this is free,

986
00:45:12,982 --> 00:45:15,582
Speaker 2: it's free to do that. But what it means is

987
00:45:15,622 --> 00:45:17,902
Speaker 2: that when we get cut off the teat, when the

988
00:45:18,022 --> 00:45:19,822
Speaker 2: milk stops flowing out.

989
00:45:19,701 --> 00:45:23,542
Speaker 3: Of the nipple of our baby, lead weaning people having

990
00:45:23,582 --> 00:45:24,862
Speaker 3: to pure carrots ourselves.

991
00:45:24,942 --> 00:45:26,062
Speaker 1: Yea, I knew it had come in hand.

992
00:45:26,142 --> 00:45:29,221
Speaker 2: It will be okay, we won't starve. So come on

993
00:45:29,302 --> 00:45:31,422
Speaker 2: over to Parenting Out Mad. We would love to have

994
00:45:31,582 --> 00:45:32,062
Speaker 2: you there.

995
00:45:32,022 --> 00:45:35,781
Speaker 1: And that's so important. Please do Yeah, yeah, I'll leave you.

996
00:45:35,822 --> 00:45:38,861
Speaker 2: With that big ass thanks to our team group ep

997
00:45:39,102 --> 00:45:43,782
Speaker 2: Ruth Divine produces Leoporgus and Sashatanic and research from Tessakotovich.

998
00:45:44,142 --> 00:45:46,582
Speaker 2: Have a great week. We'll talk to you next Saturday morning.

999
00:45:46,701 --> 00:45:47,702
Speaker 1: See then bye,