Speaker 1: You're listening to a Mom with mea podcast.
Speaker 2: Welcome to Parenting out Loud. This is the podcast where
Speaker 2: we don't actually tell you how to parent. We figure
Speaker 2: that there's probably enough places that do that. We instead
Speaker 2: talk about parenting in the culture. We read all the
Speaker 2: parenting news and the trends and the advice and the
Speaker 2: things that happen on the internet so that you don't
Speaker 2: have to and then we bring it to you on
Speaker 2: a platter and try and make sense of it. So
Speaker 2: Welcome parents, Welcome friends, Welcome parents and friends. Committee to
Speaker 2: Parenting out Loud.
Speaker 3: I'm Monice Bowley, I'm Claire Stevens filling in for Emelia Lester.
Speaker 1: And I'm Stacy Hicks. Hi Claire.
Speaker 3: Hey, guys, nice to have you. Claire, I'm so excited
Speaker 3: to be here. I love just banging down the door
Speaker 3: and getting out loud. It's so fun.
Speaker 1: Is this because you're pregnant so you just want to
Speaker 1: be here to use us for any of your questions.
Speaker 3: And I'm like, guys, like, when I'm doing out Loud,
Speaker 3: I'm like, if I'm honest, all I'm really thinking about
Speaker 3: is my toddler, Like twenty fours, which is an interesting
Speaker 3: to everyone.
Speaker 2: It is to us, come and nest with us. We're
Speaker 2: very welcome here. How many weeks pragante are you?
Speaker 3: I'm twenty four weeks, which it's not far enough along
Speaker 3: for my liking, but it is over halfway. But I
Speaker 3: remember from last time, between twenty and thirty weeks is
Speaker 3: a it's a long road. It goes on forever, and
Speaker 3: then after thirty weeks you're a little bit. Things are
Speaker 3: so dire that time speeds up a little bit.
Speaker 2: Yeah, oh well, welcome, so good to have you all right?
Speaker 2: Coming up on today's show, what are you bringing us?
Speaker 1: Claire?
Speaker 3: Has anyone ever called your kid bad? The reframe we
Speaker 3: need is here.
Speaker 1: And the sibling effect trend is the trend that I
Speaker 1: would like to go away forever. Please, I will tell
Speaker 1: you why.
Speaker 2: And an eleven year old just a pretty hard life
Speaker 2: lesson from a celebrity. I want to talk about how
Speaker 2: do you prepare kids for when life and people suck?
Speaker 2: But first, the biggest video in my feed this week
Speaker 2: was a basketball coach screaming in her player's face. Have
Speaker 2: you guys seen this?
Speaker 3: I've seen, yes, I've seen some of it. I haven't
Speaker 3: seen all of the context around it, so I need
Speaker 3: you to explain.
Speaker 1: Yes, it is everywhere, right, Like I watched this on
Speaker 1: a loop. When you send this to me, I know
Speaker 1: I couldn't stop.
Speaker 2: It had thirty million views. I think twenty nine million
Speaker 2: on mine. It was at a college basketball game in America.
Speaker 2: So Maryland college basketball coach Brenda Freeze mid game. This
Speaker 2: is an NCAA game, college basketball game, lots of pressure.
Speaker 2: She gets her star player, Aluchi Okanawa, and she serves
Speaker 2: up what looks like this massive spray, like she's right
Speaker 2: in her face, she's locking eyes with her and she
Speaker 2: is just screaming. And what she says is so I
Speaker 2: was like, right, I need someone to lip read this
Speaker 2: for me. What is this? Because it looks really intense
Speaker 2: and aggressive. What she says is, I need you to
Speaker 2: lock in stop being distracted. I believe in you, but
Speaker 2: you've got to want this moment.
Speaker 1: This isn't my story or right.
Speaker 3: Right an American accent.
Speaker 2: I just gave myself goosebumps. So people saw this and
Speaker 2: immediately split into two camps, which one was I would
Speaker 2: run through a brick wall after this for this coach.
Speaker 2: The other camp was, you cannot speak to people like that,
Speaker 2: but I wanted to talk about it with you both
Speaker 2: today because I loved it for two reasons. Number one
Speaker 2: is that in a world where you're told always to
Speaker 2: parent in a gentle way, in a very encouraging way,
Speaker 2: in a loving way, to see a moment where someone
Speaker 2: is being pushed hard like this, I was like, holy shit.
Speaker 2: I think that's why I went back and watched it
Speaker 2: again and again, because it's not something we see that much.
Speaker 2: And the second reason I loved it was for what
Speaker 2: the player said afterwards. So in the presser, Okanawa said, this.
Speaker 4: Coach understands I'm a competitor at heart, and I love
Speaker 4: to be coach, and that's what she does with me
Speaker 4: every single day. And really what that was was a
Speaker 4: regroup moment for myself and her telling me she believed
Speaker 4: in me, because sometimes that's really all you need to hear.
Speaker 2: I'm so obsessed with this. I think the reason I'm
Speaker 2: so obsessed is because I feel like the dominant narrative
Speaker 2: with kids these days. And look, Akanawa is twenty two.
Speaker 2: She's not a kid, but she's Gen Z and every
Speaker 2: criticism of Gen Z's and Gen Alpha's and every generation
Speaker 2: after millennials is that they're soft, they can't take feedback,
Speaker 2: they're fragile, they've been overparented, and this is just not that.
Speaker 2: And I just loved what the coach did and I
Speaker 2: loved what she did, and I love it all.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it was really I found it confronting when I
Speaker 1: watched it for the first time. I was like, I
Speaker 1: would want to kill that woman if she was speaking
Speaker 1: to my kid that way. Like, but and you know,
Speaker 1: famously I'm terrible at sport. I could not be yelled
Speaker 1: at like that and then get out there and do
Speaker 1: a great performance. I would just want to be told
Speaker 1: I'm wonderful and that everything I'm doing is great. But
Speaker 1: I think that's the distinction is she's not getting yelled at.
Speaker 1: It's motivational, and it's like sometimes it does need to
Speaker 1: be a bit more aggressive, Like we're so used to
Speaker 1: speaking to everyone in a gentle, calm voice and sometimes
Speaker 1: just a bit of like up in your grill motivational
Speaker 1: words would actually do the trick.
Speaker 3: I love that it's two women, like because I feel
Speaker 3: like you do see this, Like even from watching some
Speaker 3: of the F one stuff, you kind of sometimes you
Speaker 3: can see men really get into this with each other,
Speaker 3: and that there's no you know that, it's not you know,
Speaker 3: anybody attacking each other. It's about really seizing the moment
Speaker 3: and this is the one opportunity and so you've got.
Speaker 1: To do it.
Speaker 3: And I love seeing two women do that and the
Speaker 3: fact that it's not it's not anger, it's not I'm this.
Speaker 3: I'm a very sensitive person, and I know that there
Speaker 3: are certain points in my life where I would not
Speaker 3: have been able to take that, yeah, corner in the corner.
Speaker 3: But then I think about it and I think, if
Speaker 3: somebody would have believe in me that much, that means
Speaker 3: a lot, and that is often a sign post of
Speaker 3: your potential, and that's really exciting.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I think Maggie Dent always talks about lighthouse figures right
Speaker 2: where you have in your life, you have your parents,
Speaker 2: and then you also need a range of lighthouse figures
Speaker 2: around you that can kind of believe in you. And
Speaker 2: that was just such a great example of that.
Speaker 3: In case you missed it, actress Viola Davis, who you'd
Speaker 3: probably know from her roles in The Help and How
Speaker 3: to Get Away with Murder and Doubt and a million
Speaker 3: other things, was recently again on Amy Pola's podcast Good Hang,
Speaker 3: and there's a viral clip from the show where Viola
Speaker 3: Davis says she loves a bad kid.
Speaker 5: I love a bad kid, like a two year old
Speaker 5: bad kid, someone who comes, you know. I had a
Speaker 5: little bad kid at my wedded who stuck his whole
Speaker 5: finger in my cake.
Speaker 1: Oh.
Speaker 5: I thought it was the best thing in the world.
Speaker 5: So I love a bad kid. Listen, the world is
Speaker 5: going to get at you. It's going to kick your ass,
Speaker 5: just leave you in the dumpster. So it's really great
Speaker 5: when you go out in the world and you have
Speaker 5: the hootspu. Yes you have that self possession right, Yes,
Speaker 5: that's what I want with my kid.
Speaker 3: I was completely obsessed with this take because I think
Speaker 3: it points to a few things one Viola Davis like,
Speaker 3: I think she didn't even realize how powerful what she
Speaker 3: was saying was, because it was really about tolerance and
Speaker 3: the importance of our attitude towards kids in public, Like
Speaker 3: kids are going to do inconvenient things, and we should
Speaker 3: be a whole lot more tolerant and understanding. I often
Speaker 3: think that when kids are acting up or there's often
Speaker 3: there's discussions about, you know, how empathetic or how patient
Speaker 3: you should be with somebody else's kids. It's not even
Speaker 3: about whether you have kids, whether there are kids in
Speaker 3: your life. It's that we were all kids once, and
Speaker 3: we were all that kid and the fact that the
Speaker 3: world isn't built for kids makes us less patient and
Speaker 3: less accepting and more willing to jump down their throats
Speaker 3: when they do something like that. So if I had
Speaker 3: in my head walking around that there are people like
Speaker 3: Viola Davis who says, I love that that kid has
Speaker 3: just funny vibes, then it would make me feel a
Speaker 3: lot more safe as a parent. The other thing I
Speaker 3: took away from it is that the kid who does
Speaker 3: that is not a bad kid, especially at two, like
Speaker 3: in Viola Davis's example, you look at a kid like
Speaker 3: that and you go, it's not that you're bad. And
Speaker 3: this is what clinical psychologist doctor Becky said when she
Speaker 3: stitched that on TikTok. She said, there are no bad kids.
Speaker 3: You can have a good kid who's impulsive and a
Speaker 3: good kid who needs boundaries. And I absolutely love that reframing.
Speaker 3: And it's just I look at my two year old
Speaker 3: and I think you don't have the cognitive ability to
Speaker 3: be bad, even if you wanted to everything you do
Speaker 3: is because you have no skills.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, if he doesn't want to stick their
Speaker 1: finger in a cake, you know, it is an intrusive thought.
Speaker 1: It's just that kids let that win. And I loved
Speaker 1: that this was rebranded as you know, we just need
Speaker 1: to see that as entertaining, not as misbehavior. It's the
Speaker 1: same as kind of when they swear you can either
Speaker 1: be aghast at this or you can just go it's
Speaker 1: pretty funny, especially when it's not your own kid.
Speaker 3: And it's very true that it's self fulfilling, like I
Speaker 3: can see if you looked at your kid doing I
Speaker 3: was out in public yesterday, and if anybody saw me
Speaker 3: out in public, they would have thought she's got a
Speaker 3: bad kid. Because Matilda, in her defense, she is sick.
Speaker 3: She's going through a lot, and she was just running
Speaker 3: through Woolworths, refusing to get in her pram and like
Speaker 3: screaming absolute tantrum and grabbing things off the shelves. It
Speaker 3: was just a nightmare. But in my head, and even
Speaker 3: in that situation, I don't really react to it because
Speaker 3: as a parent, you've got so much empathy for what
Speaker 3: your kid is going through and that she generally is
Speaker 3: incredibly well behaved, and it was just one of those days.
Speaker 3: But I do like the thought. And sometimes it can
Speaker 3: just be like a little smile from somebody that you
Speaker 3: pass or Matilda was then crying in her pram and
Speaker 3: a man in front of us just kept kind of
Speaker 3: pulling funny faces, and I thought, God, that just makes
Speaker 3: you feel so much better as a parent that people
Speaker 3: respect that your kid is worthy of dignity and respec
Speaker 3: It's just that they're going through some things today.
Speaker 2: So I don't disagree, Like I agree with everything you're saying.
Speaker 2: Adults probably need to be more tolerant. This is often
Speaker 2: like developmentally appropriate for their age. But what if the
Speaker 2: person sticking their hand in the cake is a five
Speaker 2: year old or a seven year old? Does that change it? Like,
Speaker 2: I think we have a lot of tolerance for toddlers
Speaker 2: because they're still learning their way through the world, they're
Speaker 2: having a lot of big feelings, But what if it's
Speaker 2: an older kid, Like, where do you draw the line?
Speaker 3: I know, And the tricky thing is you don't know
Speaker 3: where they're at developmentally behavior wise, what kind of challenges
Speaker 3: they might be having. You can't tell all of that
Speaker 3: from the outside, but at the same time, yeah, it
Speaker 3: would be disingenuous to pretend that we're not sometimes very
Speaker 3: frustrated by kids in public, and that if a kid
Speaker 3: comes up to my kid in the playground and hits
Speaker 3: her because he wants to use the and he's seven,
Speaker 3: I'm like, well that was that? Yeah, yeah, but I yeah,
Speaker 3: I agree, Like it's a it's kind of a vague
Speaker 3: line of where you draw that based on what you
Speaker 3: can see from the outside.
Speaker 2: There are also social norms, right, Like, you can't you
Speaker 2: can't have kids that just do whatever they want for
Speaker 2: the rest of their life, because what are they going
Speaker 2: to be like when they're in the workplace? What are
Speaker 2: they going to be like in social situations? Like I
Speaker 2: think the principle of the idea is really great, but
Speaker 2: in practice, I think there's a line of like, well, actually,
Speaker 2: that's just bad manners.
Speaker 1: But maybe this isn't about not stopping the behavior. You
Speaker 1: absolutely should stop the behavior, but it's kind of about
Speaker 1: embracing it for what it is at the time, which
Speaker 1: is like, yeah, he shouldn't have stuck his finger in
Speaker 1: the cake, but it's kind of funny that he did,
Speaker 1: and we can just kind of laugh about that, especially
Speaker 1: when it's not your own kid doing it, it is
Speaker 1: even funnier.
Speaker 3: And maybe also being sensitive to those situations that aren't
Speaker 3: kid friendly to begin with, Like, yeah, you think about
Speaker 3: a wedding, and this is why I'm all for child
Speaker 3: free weddings, because what's a kid gonna do at a wedding?
Speaker 3: They're gonna stick a finger in the cave. Like kids
Speaker 3: behave a lot better in situations that are actually designed
Speaker 3: for them, as opposed to like sit down at this
Speaker 3: fancy restaurant and don't disturb anyone. Well, they're going to
Speaker 3: do something stupid because they're a child.
Speaker 2: I need to relax my noose. By the sounds of it,
Speaker 2: I'm like the stern mother.
Speaker 3: You're so right.
Speaker 2: You might have seen a prickly little celebrity story around
Speaker 2: the chaps this week, and I want to talk about it.
Speaker 2: I know they talked about it on Mamma Mia out
Speaker 2: Loud this earlier this week, but we're sitting at the
Speaker 2: parents table here and I think there's more to unpack.
Speaker 2: It was when an eleven year old encountered a celebrity,
Speaker 2: and that celeb was Chapel Roan. Is that right?
Speaker 1: High saying i did it right. Has been calling her Chappelle,
Speaker 1: bro Chapelle, every different variation, but you nailed it on,
Speaker 1: thank you.
Speaker 2: So she's huge right now to everyone except for me,
Speaker 2: very adored. She's staying in a hotel right This eleven
Speaker 2: year old spots her at breakfast, and yet's excited, because
Speaker 2: what do you do when you're eleven and you see
Speaker 2: a celebrity, You do get excited. But the eleven year old.
Speaker 1: Even when you're not eleven. I'm sorry. If I saw
Speaker 1: Taylor Swift and I was at breakfast, I would absolutely do.
Speaker 3: A little drive par nosy. I can't help you.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah. There was no approach, there was no
Speaker 2: autograph or selfie moment. It's this was very much just
Speaker 2: admire from a distance, walk past the table. Yep, it's her.
Speaker 2: How exciting. Let's get back to our breakfast.
Speaker 1: Now.
Speaker 2: What happens next is that security steps in and essentially
Speaker 2: tells this kid off and threatens them and allegedly harasses them.
Speaker 2: Now it happens that the eleven year old is the
Speaker 2: step daughter of a very famous soccer player. It's also
Speaker 2: the daughter of Judelaw, a very famous celebrity. Her step
Speaker 2: father Georginiao has four point nine million Instagram followers. He
Speaker 2: is not happy at this point. He's eleven year old
Speaker 2: stepdaughter has been harassed security guard, and so he wrote
Speaker 2: on his Instagram this takedown of Chappelle, Chapel and Chapel
Speaker 2: saying without your fans, you would be nothing and to
Speaker 2: the fans, she does not deserve your attention. FYI. For
Speaker 2: the record, Chapel said she didn't do it and she
Speaker 2: doesn't hate kids. I think the reason this has gone
Speaker 2: wild is because it's eleven year old girl at the
Speaker 2: center of it, right, And at eleven years old, you're
Speaker 2: still in that place where adults smile at you and
Speaker 2: the world's pretty soft towards you, and you haven't kind
Speaker 2: of had that gut punch slap in the face. People
Speaker 2: can be a bit shit moment yet, so a moment
Speaker 2: like this is kind of a huge parenting deal for
Speaker 2: a number of reasons. But I wanted to talk about
Speaker 2: it today because I think we spend a lot of
Speaker 2: years teaching our kids to be friendly and open and
Speaker 2: polite and make eye contact and engage and don't be rude,
Speaker 2: don't stick your hand in a cake, and then they
Speaker 2: do all of that, and then they have this moment,
Speaker 2: this moment is going to come in their life where
Speaker 2: people are dicks to them, Like the world is really harsh.
Speaker 2: So when something like this happens to your kid, do
Speaker 2: you step in and protect them or do you tell
Speaker 2: them the truth like, yeah, the world's really hard.
Speaker 1: Like what do you do?
Speaker 2: How do you prepare them?
Speaker 3: I had not because I had followed this story really closely,
Speaker 3: and I had not for a second thought about the
Speaker 3: parenting perspective. I thought about, what if you were Chapel
Speaker 3: Roone and a rogue security guard does something and you're
Speaker 3: accountable for it. I did think about putting somebody on
Speaker 3: blast to four point nine million followers and the ethics
Speaker 3: of that. But as soon as you brought this up Mon's,
Speaker 3: I was like, Oh, that is such a toxic thing
Speaker 3: to teach a kid that if somebody doesn't pander to you,
Speaker 3: that if you're embarrassed. Maybe the security guard came over
Speaker 3: and the eleven year old felt embarrassed, the whole family
Speaker 3: felt embarrassed that you are then entitled to publicly shame
Speaker 3: and humiliate another person. That is such a dangerous thing
Speaker 3: to teach a kid, and the fame thing is really
Speaker 3: like seeing somebody out in public and feeling like you
Speaker 3: should be able to go up to them and engage
Speaker 3: with them. I think phones have really done that that. Yeah,
Speaker 3: an eleven year old would think, but that's Chapel Roone
Speaker 3: and she's in my phone and where friends and I
Speaker 3: listen to. I listened to all her music. I think
Speaker 3: it's really important to explain to a kid, no, that's
Speaker 3: actually a human being who's having her breakfast and we
Speaker 3: don't know what her experience is like, we don't know
Speaker 3: what her day is like. And generally, if somebody behaves
Speaker 3: badly towards you, it's probably a really good idea as
Speaker 3: a parent to try and express what that person's worldview
Speaker 3: could be that, oh, well, we actually know that Chapel
Speaker 3: Rome really struggles with people coming up to her, and
Speaker 3: she really struggles with fame, and she has some struggles
Speaker 3: with her mental health, and she's talked about that and
Speaker 3: blah blah blah, Like, yes, I know that's a very
Speaker 3: kind of evolved thing to do, but it would probably
Speaker 3: be the ideal.
Speaker 1: But I guess the other option is so in that
Speaker 1: circumstance where their daughter's kind of getting this heavy life
Speaker 1: lesson of like something didn't go your way and someone
Speaker 1: was a jerk to you. Yes, you can say, oh,
Speaker 1: but we rise above that and we you know, we're kind.
Speaker 1: We never do that. But the other angle, and I
Speaker 1: guess something that we do have to teach our kids
Speaker 1: at some point is that like, if something happens to you,
Speaker 1: do not have to take it lying down all the time.
Speaker 1: And yes, you know, we're not in a position where
Speaker 1: we'd be blasting it to five million people. I don't
Speaker 1: agree with doing that, but it's definitely a potential thing.
Speaker 1: And it was interesting that both parents did this, So
Speaker 1: the stepfather did this and her mother also kind of
Speaker 1: went on a lengthy doubled down, Yeah, doubled down and
Speaker 1: was like, no, we did this for a reason. We
Speaker 1: stand by what we did, and it's kind of teaching
Speaker 1: your child that, yeah, like we're teaching you to be kind,
Speaker 1: but there might be circumstances that call for you to
Speaker 1: stand up for yourself. And is this not that or
Speaker 1: is this an example of kind of snowplow parenting where
Speaker 1: you're just like, well, you will get your way no
Speaker 1: matter what, and I will help you get that. It's
Speaker 1: a really interesting like fight between the two.
Speaker 3: Because I reckon, this is snowplow parenting. Yeah, I think
Speaker 3: there is. We had a bit of a similar situation.
Speaker 3: I was at the chie you saw Chapel Roade, Oh yeah, yeah,
Speaker 3: exactly the same. We were at the children's hospital with
Speaker 3: Matilda and a lot of other sick kids and one
Speaker 3: of the Wiggles was there. I won't I'd say which
Speaker 3: one in case it gives away the kind of area
Speaker 3: he lives in or whatever. But one of the Wiggles
Speaker 3: was there and I loved him.
Speaker 2: Was that the purple one? Tell me the hot purple?
Speaker 2: It was one that all the mom's are fer. Was
Speaker 2: it the tree of Life?
Speaker 3: And it wasn't, but it was a very recognizable wiggle.
Speaker 3: And my first thought when I saw him was that
Speaker 3: poor poor man, he is here with his sick child
Speaker 3: and every kid in this waiting.
Speaker 2: He wasn't dressed as the wiggle. No, he was in
Speaker 2: nine City.
Speaker 3: No, he was being himself. He was being a dad
Speaker 3: gives off, yes off judy wigs and so he is
Speaker 3: there with his sick kid, and I thought, oh, imagine,
Speaker 3: you've been told there was like a seven hour wait.
Speaker 3: It was just the worst time to be in the
Speaker 3: children's hospital, and I thought, oh god, imagine you're sitting
Speaker 3: there being like, oh god, my kid's screaming and everybody's sick,
Speaker 3: and every kid in that room is looking at him
Speaker 3: being like can I get a picture? Like and I
Speaker 3: just thought, I was like, that's a really important lesson
Speaker 3: to say to your kid. I know that he's on
Speaker 3: our television and we love him unconditionally and we talk
Speaker 3: about him most days, but he is in his own
Speaker 3: situation and you need to shut the hell up.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know that I'd recognize a Wiggle without
Speaker 2: the clothes off really say how deep? How deep are you?
Speaker 1: And Wiggles?
Speaker 2: Oh man, you would know that.
Speaker 3: We go through the names of the Wiggles every evening.
Speaker 3: We like, we are obsessed. Even people who slightly look
Speaker 3: like Wiggles. My daughter loses it. So no, we're very familiar.
Speaker 1: This was probably a very good example of getting a
Speaker 1: no and not getting what you want, which is probably
Speaker 1: what this eleven year old might have needed as well.
Speaker 2: Hang on, hang on. She didn't approach Chapel, she didn't
Speaker 2: ask for the autographer selfie, she didn't interrupt her. In fact,
Speaker 2: Chapel says, I ever even remember seeing this girl, and
Speaker 2: I certainly didn't interact with her. This is like I
Speaker 2: think we're getting we're getting away from the central point,
Speaker 2: which is like there is always this rugpool moment for
Speaker 2: kids in life when it's like you're not the center
Speaker 2: of the universe.
Speaker 3: Anything for everyone.
Speaker 2: Remember that moment as a kid, I remember the moment,
Speaker 2: do you.
Speaker 3: I think it came bloody early because I was a
Speaker 3: twin so I was never I never had the world.
Speaker 3: According to me, everything was compromised, and I think my
Speaker 3: parents were pretty were pretty good at that. But and
Speaker 3: I think maybe that's why I'm a little bit brutal
Speaker 3: on this, and I'm a little bit critical of the
Speaker 3: way those parents responded.
Speaker 1: What was yours? Mon's what did that for you?
Speaker 2: I had a teacher say to me, you're never gonna
Speaker 2: amount to anything, and you're never going to Yeah, you're
Speaker 2: never gonna a mount to anything, and you're never gonna
Speaker 2: play basketball for anyone or be anything. And yeah, my
Speaker 2: parents greatly upset me at the time. And my parents
Speaker 2: are really pragmatic about it. I remember them being like, well, yeah,
Speaker 2: so what are you going to do about it? Like
Speaker 2: not going to the school and knocking on the door
Speaker 2: and saying, how dare you not writing a letter to
Speaker 2: the principles. They put it back on me, Well, yeah,
Speaker 2: life's hard. People say shit, so what are you going
Speaker 2: to do? And like, I used that little tidbit. I
Speaker 2: used that moment for like ten years to motivate me.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that's a really interesting framing that it's like,
Speaker 3: we don't it's almost like not about them, like this
Speaker 3: this is the world. The world can be cruel and
Speaker 3: unfair and people won't see you for your beautiful light
Speaker 3: in every single moment. But I do reckon if you've
Speaker 3: got the kind of parent who is willing to publicly
Speaker 3: humiliate somebody who didn't, you know, meet your expectations. Because
Speaker 3: although you're right, Mom's like it was about the security guard,
Speaker 3: it's not a bit like chapel Rone wasn't directly involved.
Speaker 3: The implication and the kind of narrative has gone towards
Speaker 3: her from both the parents who were clearly very much
Speaker 3: like why don't you engage with your fans? You're nothing
Speaker 3: without your fans, And if oh, I think that's it seems.
Speaker 2: Really yeah, it does feel really pointed, doesn't it, And
Speaker 2: like I understand the feeling of wanting to defend your
Speaker 2: child and and wanting to fight back and wanting to
Speaker 2: stand up for what you believe in. I guess it's that,
Speaker 2: but just on a astronomical level. Given four point nine
Speaker 2: million follows.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that's a totally different situation, and that
Speaker 3: you've you're clearly willing to hurt somebody to assert your
Speaker 3: child's importance. I think that's a really bad lesson.
Speaker 2: Yeah, hurt people, hurt people. That's what I say in
Speaker 2: my kids all the time.
Speaker 3: Oh beautiful, beautiful parenting.
Speaker 1: How likely is it that your friend bails tonight? That's
Speaker 1: the headline I saw from the New Yorker this week
Speaker 1: that stopped me in my tracks. It was this awesome
Speaker 1: piece by Ellen Harold, and she used very serious science,
Speaker 1: and by science I mean her vibes and her vibes
Speaker 1: alone to calculate how likely it is that your hang
Speaker 1: will happen, judged off what people say. So it's basically
Speaker 1: decoding texts and giving them a percentage. So she had
Speaker 1: some like I'm ninety nine percent sure I can make
Speaker 1: it tonight. Really means you're fifty percent sure, or I
Speaker 1: could be convinced means they are in track pants and
Speaker 1: therefore cannot be convinced it is not changing. I'm definitely
Speaker 1: going out tonight. Is for some reason an eighty three
Speaker 1: percent chance?
Speaker 3: Yeah, no, no, you can reneg on.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, definitely. So basically, what I wanted to do
Speaker 1: is a parent's edition of this and give you some
Speaker 1: of mine, and you can tell me what you think
Speaker 1: the percentage is that this person is actually going.
Speaker 2: Okay, all right, these actual texts that people have sent you, and.
Speaker 1: No, just my vibe, very serious science mom, this is
Speaker 1: my vibes of what the answer to this is. Okay,
Speaker 1: So if someone said you, baby Billy was up coughing
Speaker 1: last night, but I should be totally fine to come, what's.
Speaker 2: The coming of the percentage? Yeah, are less eighteen percent?
Speaker 1: Okay, I went twelve percent. You've already taken your bra off.
Speaker 1: Billy is not that sick, and you have two episodes
Speaker 1: of maths to catch up on. And this is what
Speaker 1: children are good for. The ultimate excuse when you don't
Speaker 1: want to go.
Speaker 3: It's the word fine shop fine, nothing is fine.
Speaker 1: No, no, no, okay, here's another one. It's been such
Speaker 1: a crazy week. Excited to see you tomorrow though.
Speaker 2: No, she's not.
Speaker 1: No, she's not.
Speaker 2: It's been a crazy week. She's again getting in her
Speaker 2: Traxi pants.
Speaker 3: Yeah, no, crazy week is not a good sign. No,
Speaker 3: but looking forward to seeing you tomorrow now, it's though,
Speaker 3: it's though.
Speaker 2: Yeah, oh twenty five, twenty five.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm saying about twenty five as well.
Speaker 1: I said forty percent.
Speaker 5: Okay.
Speaker 1: It will all depend on whether you get your period
Speaker 1: or your husband so much as breeds loudly in your
Speaker 1: general vicinity, which will send you into a rage cleaning meltdown,
Speaker 1: and then you won't be able.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you're like one obstacle away.
Speaker 1: From from not going, so it may happen.
Speaker 2: That's fair. It's the term crazy week. Like sometimes when
Speaker 2: you've had a crazy week, you do need to blow
Speaker 2: off steam. Yeah, exactly, little Margie.
Speaker 1: It could go either way. Yes, okay, here's my last one.
Speaker 1: I've organized mum to take Billy for the night, so
Speaker 1: excited for some cocktails.
Speaker 3: Nine nine point.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I said, I said. Not even a catastrophic weather
Speaker 1: event don't stop you.
Speaker 3: It does not matter if your child is out of
Speaker 3: your care. Yes, I could be so unwell exactly, I
Speaker 3: could have learned some devastating news. But I am processing
Speaker 3: that over drink.
Speaker 1: With my friend. Yes, and this is probably the only
Speaker 1: night you both have in the last three months that
Speaker 1: you could make this work. So it is happening.
Speaker 2: It does not fu Yeah, I'm fake tanning for that coming.
Speaker 2: I'm fake tanning.
Speaker 1: I'm putting.
Speaker 2: I'm using makeup that night.
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly, the fancy stuff, not just the stuff at
Speaker 1: the bottom and the draw. Okay, So there is a
Speaker 1: new trend that's everywhere this week, and it's really riled
Speaker 1: me up. I thought I was above getting angry at
Speaker 1: strangers on the internet. I really did. I thought it
Speaker 1: was more evolved than that. But apparently I'm not.
Speaker 3: None of us though.
Speaker 1: No, Well, it got me good this week. So this
Speaker 1: is called the sibling effect, and it's where parents make
Speaker 1: videos of their kids before the sibling comes along. So
Speaker 1: it might be like a little girl sitting on a
Speaker 1: bench having an ice cream or like playing quietly with
Speaker 1: her toys, and it's set to a lot of them
Speaker 1: are set to that song American Pie by Don McLain,
Speaker 1: you know where he's like the day the music dad,
Speaker 1: and then it gets very upbeat and happy. So that's
Speaker 1: the before is like sad, lonely child, sad quiet music.
Speaker 1: And the after is the child with their siblings. So
Speaker 1: cute of course, siblings cuddling siblings on a seesaw. It's
Speaker 1: very sweet on first glance, and it often is accompanied
Speaker 1: by a caption that says, now they'll never have to
Speaker 1: walk life alone. And I can see why if you
Speaker 1: have kids, if you have multiple kids, you want to
Speaker 1: share this footage. This is the gold standard. This is
Speaker 1: what you hope for siblings, that they'll get along like
Speaker 1: that and have that relationship. But it starts to get
Speaker 1: particularly hurtful for one group of parents, of which I
Speaker 1: belong to. So I'm going to be the spokesperson today. Yes, please,
Speaker 1: I'm going to get on my high horse, because for
Speaker 1: families with one child, whether that is through choice or
Speaker 1: whether that is through circumstance, this is sending a very
Speaker 1: clear message that your child will always be stuck in
Speaker 1: the before that there's this other better version of their
Speaker 1: life just here, just out of grasp. But either you're
Speaker 1: choosing not to give it to them, or you don't
Speaker 1: have the ability or circumstances to be able to give
Speaker 1: it to them. I don't know if I'm being unreasonable
Speaker 1: with this. You can both tell me to get a grip,
Speaker 1: but it's just settled in me this week, and I
Speaker 1: really needed to talk to you, both of them.
Speaker 3: I have also been triggered by the same trend for
Speaker 3: different reasons. Okay, so I like that it's triggering for
Speaker 3: both of us together. The reason it was triggering for
Speaker 3: me because obviously started coming up and I was like, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 3: But then I noticed there were a lot the further
Speaker 3: I got into this rabbit hole, there were a lot
Speaker 3: that were about sisters, and it was about like, there's
Speaker 3: no relationship like a sister. And then I got in
Speaker 3: my head thinking, oh, I'm not giving Matilda a sister.
Speaker 3: I'm giving her a brother, and it's not really in
Speaker 3: my control. If I ever give her a sister, it's
Speaker 3: not really in my control. If I give this boy
Speaker 3: a brother, that's not in anyone's control. And I started thinking.
Speaker 3: Then I started thinking, I'm like, well, I love my
Speaker 3: sister and she's a really important part of my life,
Speaker 3: and I'm not what if Matilda doesn't have that, and
Speaker 3: have I deprived her of That really really got me
Speaker 3: into this cycle of shame over something that even if
Speaker 3: I wanted to I can't control. And it did make
Speaker 3: me think also about how that trend set such high
Speaker 3: expectations for what the bond is going to be like
Speaker 3: between the kids when a second or third or whatever arrives,
Speaker 3: and what the family dynamic is going to be like.
Speaker 3: The other thing that a lot of those videos have
Speaker 3: is the moment that the kids meet. But also Mon's
Speaker 3: I wonder if you had this like that is a
Speaker 3: huge trend as well, like the moment that you bring
Speaker 3: your toddler into all your other child into the hospital
Speaker 3: to meet the newborn. And so many of my friends
Speaker 3: have said that was toxic for me because one, who
Speaker 3: it may not look like that. You may have a
Speaker 3: premie baby and they may be in NICU and you
Speaker 3: may not want a toddler around them. Two, a lot
Speaker 3: of toddlers, they're not going to get it. They're gonna scream,
Speaker 3: they're gonna like wait till you're home.
Speaker 1: Even older kids like they might not care. It's the
Speaker 1: meeting a blob at that point, and so it may
Speaker 1: not be that magical moment. And I think that's what
Speaker 1: this is. It's romanticizing of a sibling in every way,
Speaker 1: in any way it comes it's saying that this is
Speaker 1: going to be such a magical thing, and why aren't
Speaker 1: you giving that to your child?
Speaker 2: I think I want to say, first up off the bat,
Speaker 2: I'm really sorry you had to see that, Stacy, and
Speaker 2: I'm sorry that it elected such an emotional reaction in you.
Speaker 2: And as it would as it would right like this
Speaker 2: sits at This is kind of on the surface for you, right,
Speaker 2: it's front of mine for you. You've talked about it
Speaker 2: on this podcast before. And it sucks that you have
Speaker 2: to scroll through your feed, which is probably a source
Speaker 2: of entertainment delight most of the time, and then see
Speaker 2: this kind of stuff. And I want to say thank
Speaker 2: you for bringing this topic to the show, because it
Speaker 2: would have been one of those things that I just
Speaker 2: scrolled past and not thought about. But hearing that perspective
Speaker 2: of someone that has one is really important, and it's
Speaker 2: not something that we hear that often. I don't understand.
Speaker 2: I'm not a marketing person, Like, what would compel a
Speaker 2: mother or a family or a father to make this
Speaker 2: kind of content? I don't know, you're both content makers.
Speaker 2: Why are they doing this? What are they trying to say?
Speaker 1: I think it's because you know, so much of what
Speaker 1: we see on the internet. We're smart enough to know
Speaker 1: this now, is that a lot of it is to
Speaker 1: elicit a reaction. They don't necessarily care if it's a
Speaker 1: positive or negative one. And if you look at these videos,
Speaker 1: the comments are very much split in half. You've got
Speaker 1: people saying and completely agree, it's a bomb like no other,
Speaker 1: and then you've got other people saying, I think I'd
Speaker 1: rather my child have a happy parent who's not stretched
Speaker 1: beyond their means than give them a sibling, purely out
Speaker 1: of service to them. But it very much feels like
Speaker 1: by doing that and creating this content that's kind of
Speaker 1: meant to get these big reactions. It's almost forced parents
Speaker 1: into trying to advocate for their choice, like and trying
Speaker 1: to make their choice the better choice and showing and
Speaker 1: showing that. But I think one of the reasons it
Speaker 1: does it does hit a nerve. And the thing that
Speaker 1: kind of bothered me most about it is because the
Speaker 1: biggest question you do ask when you've got one child
Speaker 1: is do I owe my child a sibling? Like it
Speaker 1: is something that I'm surprised plays on your mind even
Speaker 1: when you're quite set in that decision, even when you're
Speaker 1: one hundred percent set in that decision. And for people.
Speaker 2: Because you're getting pressure, you're getting pressure from more side stages.
Speaker 2: It's not like an internal thing. It's the message is
Speaker 2: that you're being sent constantly, is asking you when are
Speaker 2: you having another one? It's people asking you do you
Speaker 2: have a brother or sister? Like, it's all of those
Speaker 2: things yeah, but are just like subconsciously ticking away all
Speaker 2: the time.
Speaker 1: Yeah. And for people in that position, it's like a
Speaker 1: constant loop of why am I not strong enough to
Speaker 1: do that? Or why won't my body do that? Or
Speaker 1: why don't I feel the urge to do that again?
Speaker 1: So it's kind of a lot of these feelings of
Speaker 1: guilt that you have lay it on, and then when
Speaker 1: you see this picture perfect version of what that could be,
Speaker 1: it does make you feel bad, like it really does.
Speaker 1: And I don't know what the answer to that is
Speaker 1: in terms of, you know, this isn't to shit on
Speaker 1: people that have multiple kids like that is a wonderful
Speaker 1: choice for so many families, But it's like, how can
Speaker 1: we all coexist in this space where whatever choice you
Speaker 1: made is fine and we don't have to call it
Speaker 1: an effect.
Speaker 3: But it is. It is that idea of like when
Speaker 3: you turn something into a trend and yet put romantic
Speaker 3: music behind it, all of that you are suggesting that
Speaker 3: that thing that you have done is the ideal and
Speaker 3: other people who don't do it are lacking. And it
Speaker 3: goes for so many aspects of parenting. And I think
Speaker 3: every parent who has ever been on the internet has
Speaker 3: felt shame and as though they're doing something wrong, and
Speaker 3: that I used to get it. I remember when I
Speaker 3: got it, very cutely, was when I was struggling with
Speaker 3: breastfeeding and everything was like these mums like crying while
Speaker 3: they were breastfeeding and just saying how it's the most
Speaker 3: magical experience and the tragedy of the last time, the
Speaker 3: last feed and all of that, and I would just
Speaker 3: be thinking, oh my god, Like I like, I know,
Speaker 3: I know it's important, I know the science, I know
Speaker 3: all of that. I am really struggling with something that
Speaker 3: I cannot control, and I am just being bombarded with
Speaker 3: the emotion of it. Like there's one thing to know,
Speaker 3: to know facts about what's good for your child whatever,
Speaker 3: but there's another thing. The emotional guilt is bloody horrific.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I think the question was that you asked Claire earlier,
Speaker 2: who is this for? And that is such an interesting
Speaker 2: question to ask, because I think if we if you
Speaker 2: reached out to one of these influences that made one
Speaker 2: of these sibling effect videos and said like, what are
Speaker 2: you doing? Do you realize like this is hurting people?
Speaker 2: Their intention would never be to do that. You know,
Speaker 2: it might be Devil's Advocate that who this is for
Speaker 2: is for the parents to go to try and legitimize
Speaker 2: their decision, to capture the memories, to be able to
Speaker 2: look back on it and remember how little their kids were,
Speaker 2: to make themselves feel better, and to make them feel
Speaker 2: like they're in control of something which is kind of
Speaker 2: out of our control. Like parenting, you lose a lot
Speaker 2: of control in it. So maybe I don't know, just
Speaker 2: like Devil's Advocate that this isn't supposed to be making
Speaker 2: other people feel bad, it's an effect of it. But
Speaker 2: maybe it's just actually about controlling something in a landscape
Speaker 2: that feels really out of control. This part of the
Speaker 2: shows where we reckon amend things that we actually love sick.
Speaker 2: We might have seen something on Instagram that we in
Speaker 2: fact brings us joy and delight, or we might have
Speaker 2: bought something, or used something or done something. So recommendations
Speaker 2: Claire Pragante, Pregante News. What's from the Pregante Dispatches. What
Speaker 2: are you obsessed with this week?
Speaker 3: Okay? So I have followed this midwife on TikTok forever,
Speaker 3: since the very early days of TikTok. Her name is
Speaker 3: Jen Hamilton. She is a labor and delivery nurse in
Speaker 3: the US. She also used to be an er nurse,
Speaker 3: so there's an ed nurse, so she has some amazing
Speaker 3: stories about that as well. But she's now written a
Speaker 3: book called Birth Vibes, which kind of sums up like
Speaker 3: just what her energy is generally, which is very She
Speaker 3: has an amazing way of explaining labor, birth postpartum in
Speaker 3: a warm, empathetic way while still getting across all the
Speaker 3: media information while acknowledging the nuances of all of it
Speaker 3: that the medical system sometimes isn't perfect for what a
Speaker 3: mum wants, and so she is just my go to
Speaker 3: at the moment. Every video she posts, I absolutely love it.
Speaker 3: She did one the other day that was about the
Speaker 3: tension between if you are about to deliver your baby
Speaker 3: and you are saying I don't want x Y and
Speaker 3: Z or I do want X Y and Z. And
Speaker 3: she's very very good at telling people how to advocate
Speaker 3: for themselves and what is your choice and what isn't well,
Speaker 3: not that anything isn't your choice, but basically how to
Speaker 3: word things, what questions to ask, all of that, how
Speaker 3: to be prepared. But she also explained that from the
Speaker 3: perspective of a midwife or an obstetrician, they have a
Speaker 3: duty of care where they can't do anything to you
Speaker 3: that they don't think is correct. So she describes in
Speaker 3: standoffs sometimes where a mother is advocating for something that
Speaker 3: the doctor physically will not do, and she's like, I
Speaker 3: don't have an answer to it, but I'm telling you
Speaker 3: that these situations arise not because anyone's evil, not because
Speaker 3: anyone is trying to get in the way of your rights,
Speaker 3: but just because that is the conflict in medicine. So
Speaker 3: she has so many birth stories, she has so many
Speaker 3: just great examples of the way birth can go, and
Speaker 3: just every question you have ever had about C section induction,
Speaker 3: how all of it can go. She is so so
Speaker 3: so clever and she I watch her and I'm like,
Speaker 3: that is the midwife you want in the room, who
Speaker 3: will look you in the eye and say this is
Speaker 3: all up to you, like, we are going at your pace.
Speaker 3: I am not going to do anything to you that
Speaker 3: you do not consent to, and we care about you
Speaker 3: as much as we care about your baby. She's also
Speaker 3: got great stories about some of the things that men
Speaker 3: do in the delivery room, which I faint no like,
Speaker 3: like men who bring in like video games and men
Speaker 3: who just say the wrong thing, and and it's like, no,
Speaker 3: the midwives are not here for you, so.
Speaker 2: We are pro we are pro dad on this show.
Speaker 2: Are the stories? Are there stories of good duds showing
Speaker 2: up in the delivery rooms?
Speaker 3: So many, so many, and overwhelmingly she's very, very positive,
Speaker 3: But every now and then there are those stories just
Speaker 3: in the context of how much you are as a midwife.
Speaker 3: You are there for that woman and you are directing
Speaker 3: all your questions to her and not and not the partner.
Speaker 3: So I just say go and have a binge on
Speaker 3: her videos. They are endlessly entertained.
Speaker 1: I actually love a birth story like I will never
Speaker 1: get s birth stories. I think they're the best, like
Speaker 1: and it's probably for you. It probably feels like exposure
Speaker 1: therapy too. If I just hear all the different variables.
Speaker 1: Then whichever one it is, I've got like an anecdotal
Speaker 1: story about where.
Speaker 3: Yeah, she's very open about smells. The fact that you
Speaker 3: you will pooh, yeah, and that's okay, and your midwife
Speaker 3: loves that for you. If you if you are pooing,
Speaker 3: your midwife is like you are pushing, pushing so well,
Speaker 3: So it's very reassuring.
Speaker 1: Love it.
Speaker 2: Five poos here, five poos. Yeah, they call me five
Speaker 2: pooh bowlie. They kept I think because one delivery. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I think your wives are bloody amazing.
Speaker 1: Oh, I really bond.
Speaker 3: The bond you have with your midwives by the end
Speaker 3: of it, Oh, it's something else, really.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like that moment in a nightclub in the
Speaker 2: bathroom when you're friends the little girls like that time's
Speaker 2: a thousand. Yeah, it's so good.
Speaker 3: Because they've seen your age.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and the pain. But the aforementioned stacy. Yeah, one
Speaker 1: from one suspicious fluid to another. Yes, I have been
Speaker 1: putting snail secretion on my face and loving it. And look,
Speaker 1: I'm about two years later to this trend, so you
Speaker 1: too might be like, Yes, people have been doing this
Speaker 1: for a long time. I know they speak about it
Speaker 1: on New Beauty. They've been speaking about it on New
Speaker 1: Beauty for years.
Speaker 3: I've never done it, so I need Okay.
Speaker 1: So it's the.
Speaker 2: Does it smell like snail?
Speaker 1: No, it kind of does it sort of like anything.
Speaker 2: You know when snails have that the it like it's
Speaker 2: a fluorescent trail. Your face get fluorescent, well.
Speaker 1: Not fluorescent, but that is kind of the effect it has.
Speaker 1: So it's the cost RX snail Muken Power Essence twenty
Speaker 1: one bucks on Amazon. I saw it cheaper and they
Speaker 1: sell it in Kmart now, which I didn't realize. So
Speaker 1: that's also fun, so very affordable. But it's essentially like
Speaker 1: a serum, like you're putting it on as a syrus.
Speaker 3: Is it hydrating? Is that idea? Okay?
Speaker 1: So it gives you a face like a plump baby's thigh,
Speaker 1: you know, just that like us delicious feeling. So I
Speaker 1: put it on before and it just is like, yeah,
Speaker 1: it like sucks it all up and feels like your
Speaker 1: skin is nice and juicy.
Speaker 3: Oh I need that, okay.
Speaker 1: Yeah, So I just you know, Amelia Love is a
Speaker 1: K beauty thing, and everyone tells you how good K
Speaker 1: beauty is, and it is so cheap in comparison to
Speaker 1: these like ninety dollars serums. So yeah, I just love it,
Speaker 1: So try that. What's yours months.
Speaker 2: I'm always like hyper aware of how smug I sound
Speaker 2: in these recommendations, and I listen back to this show
Speaker 2: and I want to slap myself in the face. I'm like,
Speaker 2: shut up, you think you're so good as a mum,
Speaker 2: and so pre warning, this is another one of those
Speaker 2: recommendations where you're gonna hate me for it. But also
Speaker 2: some people might be like, Okay, I'll give it a go.
Speaker 2: I'm a bit psycho about screen time for my kids,
Speaker 2: Like I'm always like, this is rotting your brains, and
Speaker 2: yet I am also like, luody, dad da, here's my
Speaker 2: fourteen hours on my iPhone. So I bought a phone
Speaker 2: lock box. It's a wooden container. I got it off Amazon.
Speaker 2: It's got a timer on it. It's a safe for
Speaker 2: your phone. You have to put your phone in and
Speaker 2: set the tim out, and once it's a lot, you
Speaker 2: cannot get your phone out.
Speaker 1: So you can't get it out no matter what, like
Speaker 1: unless break.
Speaker 2: Okay, if you're desperate, you have to log in to
Speaker 2: the internet and it gives you some it sends a
Speaker 2: code to your email, like if you're that desperate, but
Speaker 2: they haven't been yet.
Speaker 3: They know humans so well that they know you're too
Speaker 3: lazy to do that, and that really shows you the extent,
Speaker 3: like you'd know you had a real problem with addiction
Speaker 3: if you did that. Yeah, so I've also got one
Speaker 3: of those safe and yeah, no, it changes your life.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, it's because I am addicted to my phone.
Speaker 2: It was it's getting gross. One of the kids was like, yeah,
Speaker 2: he's on your phone. I was like, right, okay, if
Speaker 2: they're noticing it, I better. I have no willpower. I
Speaker 2: need something else that will do it for me. So
Speaker 2: it's been hard, but I'm doing it all week nights
Speaker 2: and then on Saturday night, that's my night off my
Speaker 2: lock box. I have my sacred ritual where I get
Speaker 2: into bed with like the Audi choker chocolate like it
Speaker 2: is so good if you need and then I get
Speaker 2: my phone out like a greedy little pig, and I
Speaker 2: just like I inhale like a hundred memes and I
Speaker 2: laughed my head off and I send them to all
Speaker 2: my friends and then I know that's my hit for
Speaker 2: the week.
Speaker 1: And then I just put it back in the box.
Speaker 1: How long is it in this box? Yeah? Every evening?
Speaker 1: Like are you putting it in there? And it's out
Speaker 1: for the night until the next day.
Speaker 2: Yes, that's right.
Speaker 1: I oh, no, I know I couldn't.
Speaker 2: I'm going like seven thirty pm until five am.
Speaker 3: Oh I know better than me.
Speaker 2: Have I gone too hard?
Speaker 3: No?
Speaker 1: That sounds that sounds correct. I use my job here
Speaker 1: as an excuse not to do that because things often
Speaker 1: happen late at night as I'm sitting there about an
Speaker 1: hour into TikTok scrolls for this job. I'm doing it
Speaker 1: for you, I know.
Speaker 3: But it's a trap. But it's a trap of the time.
Speaker 3: It's it's yeah, that's right.
Speaker 2: Look, I'm not better than you. I'm just trying something. Okay,
Speaker 2: it's not going well.
Speaker 1: Give it another way, idea. I need to try it.
Speaker 1: I need to do it. Okay.
Speaker 2: Hey, that's it for the week in parenting culture. Thanks
Speaker 2: for joining us, Thanks for clicking on this on a
Speaker 2: Saturday morning. Great to have you with us, Claire, thanks
Speaker 2: for jumping in familiar.
Speaker 3: Thanks for having me guys, Thank.
Speaker 2: You all right, and a huge thanks to our team
Speaker 2: that puts this show together. Have a great week. We'll
Speaker 2: be back next Saturday morning. Bye bye, Mamma Mere acknowledges
Speaker 2: the traditional owners of the land on which we have
Speaker 2: recorded this podcast.