Speaker 1: Listeners are advised that this podcast series Bromwin contains course
Speaker 1: language and adult themes. This podcast series is brought to
Speaker 1: you by me Headley Thomas and The Australian. Some parts
Speaker 1: of this infuriating case about the sudden disappearance of Bromwin
Speaker 1: Winfield one unremarkable night in May nineteen ninety.
Speaker 2: Three are stranger than fiction.
Speaker 1: My longtime friend Matthew Condon, a widely published author, journalist
Speaker 1: for The Australian and podcaster, was dagged when I first
Speaker 1: shared with him a lengthy email written by someone in
Speaker 1: Lenox Head will call the person who wrote to me, Alex.
Speaker 2: Matt read it and got back to me quickly.
Speaker 3: He said, WHOA, this is entering suburban Gothic territory.
Speaker 1: Matt knows more about popular culture, books, movies, TV series
Speaker 1: and music than most of his colleagues. I thought I
Speaker 1: knew what he meant, but to be sure, I went
Speaker 1: to Wikipedia for a crash guide to suburban Gothic. The
Speaker 1: online encyclopedia says that suburban Gothic is dealing with concerns
Speaker 1: about hidden Gothic worlds behind the suburban facade. The TV
Speaker 1: series Twin Peaks, as well as acclaimed productions from Buffy
Speaker 1: the Vampire Slayer to Desperate Housewives to American Horror Story
Speaker 1: and Stepford Wives are cited as compelling examples. In the
Speaker 1: first two seasons of Bromwin, A suburban facade in Sandstone Crescent,
Speaker 1: Lennox Head has been laid bare. But now we are
Speaker 1: traveling a few kilometers east, closer to Boulder Beach and
Speaker 1: Skinner's Head and the fortress like home built by John
Speaker 1: Winfield more than twenty years ago with funds from the
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety nine sale of the house in which a
Speaker 1: young mother, Bromwyn Joy Winfield was last seen on the
Speaker 1: night of May sixteenth, nineteen ninety three. Bromwin never returned
Speaker 1: to see her children or to seek a single dollar
Speaker 1: from the sale proceeds of that house, even though she
Speaker 1: was entitled to as much as half the equity.
Speaker 2: John took it all. Now we are hovering over another address.
Speaker 1: A third property. It is a stone's throw from John's
Speaker 1: newer home. The house we are outside belonged to a
Speaker 1: woman called Beverly Brooker. She lived alone. It has an
Speaker 1: ocean lookout. But here's the unusual thing. Beverly's old house
Speaker 1: now belongs to John Winfield. This is the story of Beverly,
Speaker 1: the story of Bev's life and her assets worth several
Speaker 1: million dollars, the story of Bev's death, and how almost
Speaker 1: all those assets quietly fell into John's hands. Shortly before
Speaker 1: this podcast investigation started, Alex began the first of several
Speaker 1: lengthy pieces of correspondence to me like this.
Speaker 4: Please find attached some info I'd like to share regarding
Speaker 4: your investigation and podcast into the disappearance of Bronwyn Winfield.
Speaker 4: I only became aware of this case and John's identity
Speaker 4: in recent years, and was somewhat taken aback.
Speaker 1: The words that you are hearing were written by someone
Speaker 1: who had just a little to do with Bev Brooker.
Speaker 1: While Bev lived in what was for some years her
Speaker 1: ocean face home in Skemmer's Head.
Speaker 4: She seemed quite a lonely person, almost afraid of people.
Speaker 4: My initial thoughts were that she had some kind of
Speaker 4: social phobia or anxiety disorder, or had experienced some kind
Speaker 4: of trauma throughout her life. As a result, I felt
Speaker 4: a bit sorry for her, but I was curious to
Speaker 4: know more about her.
Speaker 1: I'm protecting the identity of the person who has been
Speaker 1: talking and writing to me about Bev. A female actor's
Speaker 1: voice is helping achieve this.
Speaker 4: I do currently feel compelled to write to you as
Speaker 4: I think the case needs to be solved, and perhaps
Speaker 4: some of this following information may be of assistance.
Speaker 1: Because of the sensitivity, I'm not going to confirm or
Speaker 1: deny whether the individual is male or female. This source
Speaker 1: is going to be known from here on as Alex,
Speaker 1: and that's deliberate too. It's a gender neutral name. Alex
Speaker 1: wanted to write and talk about the woman who once
Speaker 1: lived near John, Bevbrooker.
Speaker 4: She was quite reserved, quietly spoken, somewhat expressionless, and her
Speaker 4: speech was slow and deliberate, like she had to put
Speaker 4: thought into each word or sentence before she said it.
Speaker 4: She only ever shared a bit of small talk, never
Speaker 4: really expanding on conversations. However, she was always pleasant. John
Speaker 4: Winfield lives a few hundred meters away. His house is
Speaker 4: quite distinct. There are always tools of his trade or
Speaker 4: piles of gravel or bricks lying around, and he's often
Speaker 4: out the front tinkering with things. John was spending a
Speaker 4: fair bit of time doing work both inside and out
Speaker 4: on Beverly's house. It's a double story red brick house
Speaker 4: set back from the street, so there's no real backyard.
Speaker 4: Most of the gardens are at the front. Beverly was
Speaker 4: the only owner occupy higher of the house, a single
Speaker 4: lady living.
Speaker 2: On her own.
Speaker 4: She was extremely reclusive and somewhat eccentric. I never noticed
Speaker 4: her having visitors other than John Winfield or mowing contractors.
Speaker 4: The house from day to day was extremely well kept,
Speaker 4: but looked unused or somewhat devoid of human occupation. The
Speaker 4: blinds and curtains were always closed, and you would never
Speaker 4: know whether anyone was moving about inside the house, or
Speaker 4: whether the TV was on, or see the lights being
Speaker 4: switched on or off, or if anyone was at home
Speaker 4: at all. She very rarely attended any neighborhood gatherings or parties.
Speaker 4: I never saw her go off to community based activities
Speaker 4: like exercise classes, or even take a walk or a
Speaker 4: swim at the beach, which was only minutes away. Her
Speaker 4: cars had personalized plates with BEEV and numbers. After of
Speaker 4: more recent years, she had a bright red Honda Jazz
Speaker 4: and a bright red sporty looking Hatchback. Her bright and
Speaker 4: distinct vehicles were very much in contrast to her introverted
Speaker 4: character and personality. Another distinctive feature about Bev is that
Speaker 4: she wore the same style outfit every day nineties era
Speaker 4: long dark tights, long knee high or ankle height dress, boots,
Speaker 4: a tight t shirt or knitted jumper pulled over her
Speaker 4: tights with a wide belt pulled tight around her waist.
Speaker 4: From a distance, you might have thought she was much younger.
Speaker 4: She had a mass of long, frizzy blonde, fair hair,
Speaker 4: fair skin, and blue eyes quite distinct. Regardless of whether
Speaker 4: she was going to work or tending to the gardens.
Speaker 4: In the yard, winter or summer, Bev always had the
Speaker 4: same style outfit on. I never saw her wearing a
Speaker 4: summer dress or beach attire, or sandals or thongs or
Speaker 4: work wear in the garden.
Speaker 1: Alex said that Bev's garden was a bit special. It's
Speaker 1: immaculate straight lines of hedging, the lack of weeds, array
Speaker 1: of shrubs and flowers, and the neat and tidy layout.
Speaker 4: In the afternoons and on weekends, Bev spent many hours
Speaker 4: caring for the garden, still wearing that same outfit. She
Speaker 4: did reveal that she had cancer and that the prognosis
Speaker 4: was not great. Around this same time, Bev was doing
Speaker 4: extensive renovations to the insides of her home, and John's
Speaker 4: increasing presence at the premises became apparent. I'm not sure
Speaker 4: for exactly how long Bev and John had been friends,
Speaker 4: but he seemed to come and go regularly in more
Speaker 4: recent years and be able to let himself into the house.
Speaker 4: It seemed to me that John was Bev's only friend,
Speaker 4: and they were obviously very close at the time she
Speaker 4: was unwell.
Speaker 2: Alex observed something else.
Speaker 4: When I looked at the Bromwin Winfield case online. One
Speaker 4: thing that immediately struck me like a lightning bolt was
Speaker 4: the uncanny similarity of appearance between the photo of Bromwyn
Speaker 4: to the likeness of Beverly, albeit that Bev was some
Speaker 4: thirty five to forty years older. To this day, it
Speaker 4: has had me wondering whether there was any connection between
Speaker 4: Beverly and Bromwyn. Some people have said that John and
Speaker 4: Bev were involved in a clandestine relationship for quite some time,
Speaker 4: and John was visiting Bev secretly over many many years.
Speaker 4: Regardless of all the rumormonger ing and hearsay, I feel
Speaker 4: in my bones that something is just not sitting quite
Speaker 4: right with regard to John Winfield's interest and involvement in
Speaker 4: Beverly's life.
Speaker 1: Alex posed a series of questions, some of which we
Speaker 1: believe can be answered in this and upcoming episodes.
Speaker 4: One Why would such a reclusive, socially withdrawn single woman
Speaker 4: end up involved with the only man in town who
Speaker 4: is a known murder suspect?
Speaker 5: Two?
Speaker 4: Was BEV involved with John around the time of Bromwin's disappearance?
Speaker 4: Did Beverly and Bromwyn know each other? Four? Was BEV reclusive,
Speaker 4: private and withdrawn because she simply knew what happened to Bromwin.
Speaker 4: Five Is John Winfield an innocent man but a marked
Speaker 4: man living with innuendo and rumor for most of his life,
Speaker 4: hence keeping subsequent relationships very private.
Speaker 1: Alex concluded that first letter to me with these words,
Speaker 1: it would.
Speaker 4: Bug me indefinitely if I did not share these thoughts
Speaker 4: with someone who has a genuine intent to find the
Speaker 4: truth behind this whole sad story.
Speaker 1: After some back and forth by phone and email, Matthew
Speaker 1: Condon drove the short distance from his home in northern New.
Speaker 2: South Wales to meet Alex.
Speaker 1: We decided that a face to face meeting would be best,
Speaker 1: and at that time I was tied up in production
Speaker 1: for Bromwin episodes. Matt and Alex spoke somewhere quiet, Neil
Speaker 1: Lennox head. The conversation was recorded with Alex's consent. You'll
Speaker 1: hear Matt's side of it, his real voice, but a
Speaker 1: voice actor has done Alex's side.
Speaker 3: So we're looking at Beverly Brooker.
Speaker 4: When I look at the photo of Bromwin, I thought,
Speaker 4: oh my god, almost a replica of Bromwyn. She was
Speaker 4: a nice looking lady for her age. She had a
Speaker 4: very good figure and she showed it off. But you
Speaker 4: only ever saw her just tending the garden, and there
Speaker 4: were some days where she'd just ignore you.
Speaker 3: No sign of visitors apart from John Winfield.
Speaker 4: The cancer Cancil Carr was coming around to pick her up,
Speaker 4: obviously to take her in for treatment, and that was
Speaker 4: quite unusual because no one used to go apart from John.
Speaker 1: Bev Brooker had miso thelioma, a form of asbestosis. It
Speaker 1: was possibly a legacy of her job for the New
Speaker 1: South Wales government, working five decades in offices which, like
Speaker 1: many back in those days, were built from materials comprising asbestos, miso.
Speaker 2: Thelioma is a terminal illness.
Speaker 3: There were changes happening to the house.
Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah, we couldn't understand why is she doing all this?
Speaker 3: He's clearly unwell.
Speaker 4: Very unwell, and he's coming and going and they're doing
Speaker 4: kitchens and bathrooms.
Speaker 2: Beverly Brooker died in September twenty twenty two. She was
Speaker 2: seventy one.
Speaker 4: I never found out anything whether she had a funeral.
Speaker 3: Do you remember Windfield or did you notice anyone coming
Speaker 3: and going from the house after her death?
Speaker 4: Oh, he still comes and goes all the time.
Speaker 3: Is it as simple as he is maintaining the property.
Speaker 4: No, he's still improving it. The house has been sitting
Speaker 4: there for two years empty.
Speaker 3: Could he be maintaining the house? She left it to
Speaker 3: a brother or she left it to a relative and
Speaker 3: he's just a mister handyman.
Speaker 1: Alex reckoned that was plausible, but had to acknowledge it
Speaker 1: was one of the unknowns. Others have also been speculating
Speaker 1: during brief catch ups in the shops and down at
Speaker 1: the beach. The story of Bev and John has run
Speaker 1: around like wildfire, dozens of interactions between people and the
Speaker 1: exchanges of information in a relatively small community. Matt was
Speaker 1: still curious about the relationship between Beverly and John.
Speaker 3: We don't know whether there were an item speak.
Speaker 4: I guess intimacy is in different forms. If he was
Speaker 4: the one who carried her out when she was blind
Speaker 4: and then she had a stroke and couldn't.
Speaker 3: Walk the last journey out of that house, correct, Yes,
Speaker 3: and took it to Saint Vincent's. Whichever way you want
Speaker 3: to define intimacy, it's about as intimate an act as
Speaker 3: you can get, isn't it to carry someone to their death?
Speaker 4: Yeah, and you're just the builder.
Speaker 3: And you're just the builder and the handyman. That also
Speaker 3: suggests she had no immediate family. This is an interesting question.
Speaker 3: Did Beverly and bronwin know each other?
Speaker 4: Yeah, well, I don't know.
Speaker 3: And would she have known anything about the missing Bronwin.
Speaker 4: Well, that's the thing I reckon she did. I reckon
Speaker 4: He's told her that I'm John Winfield and people don't
Speaker 4: like me because of this, and it's not true and
Speaker 4: I didn't do it sort of thing. And he's treated
Speaker 4: her well and done work for her.
Speaker 3: I mean, the odds too obsessively reclusive human beings hooking
Speaker 3: up in the same street. They're pretty long odds right?
Speaker 3: Did he in fact make her more reclusive? Speculated to
Speaker 3: Headley on the Weekend about this house. Throughout his three marriages,
Speaker 3: the big issue was the property settlement and if he
Speaker 3: was adamant to Bronwin, there was no way she was
Speaker 3: getting the house. And here's a second property within walking
Speaker 3: distance of his own.
Speaker 4: He's a nice lady. I'll help her out.
Speaker 1: Reading and hearing in the podcast about Bromwin's disappearance troubled
Speaker 1: Alex greatly.
Speaker 2: The more Alex learned about it.
Speaker 1: From the podcast, the more curious Alex became about Bromin's fate.
Speaker 4: Look at the Dowson case. They were standing over the police.
Speaker 4: Of course he didn't do it.
Speaker 3: He's a footballer, Yeah, big stars.
Speaker 1: John's presence at Beverly's house in Skinner's Head before she
Speaker 1: began came ill was obvious. It was a talking point
Speaker 1: among residents, they're visitors and some of the tradees who
Speaker 1: worked at the house. The talk didn't lessen after Beverly died.
Speaker 1: It grew and it escalated again when the Bromin.
Speaker 2: Podcast series started. Unlike some of the gossip.
Speaker 1: And the occasionally unkind things which were said by some
Speaker 1: about the two somewhat eccentric people in their early seventies.
Speaker 2: John's physical work.
Speaker 1: On the property Beverly owned was real and tangible.
Speaker 4: I don't know whether she paid him. She's alone as
Speaker 4: time goes on, figures it out in his head. I
Speaker 4: think I might be onto something here. She has no friends.
Speaker 4: When I wrote all this, I thought, they're not going
Speaker 4: to believe what I'm saying. They're going to think it's
Speaker 4: all hogwash. It's like a soapie, but it's.
Speaker 3: Real, bloody hell. What's going on there.
Speaker 4: That's what makes me think he now owns it, or
Speaker 4: is in line to own it. It'll be interesting to
Speaker 4: see what that will said.
Speaker 3: I can't help but think of this fastidious man, knowing
Speaker 3: in the back of his head that a few doors
Speaker 3: up this project, there's immaculate project he's keeping, and maybe
Speaker 3: to wake up and have a serf and think today
Speaker 3: I'll go and make sure that everything's perfect. And still
Speaker 3: it's empty.
Speaker 4: It's empty. If he was really desperate for money, you'd
Speaker 4: probably rent it.
Speaker 3: Why keep it?
Speaker 2: Why not sell it?
Speaker 4: He doesn't want anyone in there messing it up.
Speaker 3: But it's like this bizarre Museum artifact.
Speaker 1: Matt Leaves to print out of Alex's first letter, the
Speaker 1: one in which Alex questioned what John's motives were.
Speaker 2: Was he the.
Speaker 1: Ultimate good samaritan looking after another introvert because he cared
Speaker 1: deeply for Bev, so much that he was there for
Speaker 1: her during her darkest months, weeks and days as the
Speaker 1: end neared, a selfless volunteer, a shoulder to cry on,
Speaker 1: a pillar of support. Or was John always playing a
Speaker 1: long game with a watchful eye on the spoils the
Speaker 1: beachside house, the savings in Bev's bank accounts, new cars,
Speaker 1: and other items of monetary value. Are those two contrasting
Speaker 1: agendas mutually exclusive.
Speaker 3: It's simply not normal that a suburb continues to function
Speaker 3: day in, day out, twenty four to seven people come,
Speaker 3: keep people of kids, families, dogs, all of this, and
Speaker 3: sitting there, Christine is an empty.
Speaker 4: House managed by a murder suspect. She did have some
Speaker 4: relatives or brothers. I think.
Speaker 2: I'm going to ask him all about his sister. What
Speaker 2: was going on there?
Speaker 5: Okay, sounds good?
Speaker 2: Hello, Hello, Jeff, it is hello Redley.
Speaker 1: I've joined my colleague and friend, Madison Walsh to the
Speaker 1: call Hello, Hello, Madison.
Speaker 2: Maddie's in Sydney. She knows a little bit about this,
Speaker 2: and I just thought it'd be great if she's on
Speaker 2: the call too.
Speaker 1: Maddie and I knew a little about it, becurse. Apart
Speaker 1: from the letter sent by Alex, there have also been
Speaker 1: emails and messages tipping me off about Bev, her estate,
Speaker 1: and John. These nuggets of information from listeners who are
Speaker 1: residents of Lennox Head and the nearby town of Balina
Speaker 1: are a testament to the power of podcasting and the
Speaker 1: listeners who want to help.
Speaker 2: Jeff, Can you tell me a bit about your sister?
Speaker 5: Right? Okay?
Speaker 1: So my sister dev Beverly Brooker had two brothers, Jeff
Speaker 1: and Paul Outerbridge.
Speaker 5: From sixty not far from retirement.
Speaker 2: Paul is almost there.
Speaker 1: When I first got in touch with Jeff, he had
Speaker 1: heard about the Bromwin podcast, but he was having trouble listening.
Speaker 5: I don't even know how to text. Technology has left
Speaker 5: me behind, mate.
Speaker 1: But Jeff had already formed strong views about John Winfield.
Speaker 1: Jeff had two sisters, Bev Van Margaret, and both are deceased.
Speaker 1: Jeff's partner has died. Jeff's brother, Paul, lives in Ballina
Speaker 1: with his wife Sarah.
Speaker 5: He's the youngest of the four of us and he's
Speaker 5: just turned sixty.
Speaker 1: Along with Jeff, they have fond memories of Bev, but
Speaker 1: not of John. I sat in my car in Brisbane
Speaker 1: one evening and Maddie at her family home as Jeff
Speaker 1: talked about Bev and the unusual turn of events before
Speaker 1: and immediately after Bev died.
Speaker 5: She worked her who working life at the one job
Speaker 5: from the time she left school, which was the Roads
Speaker 5: and Maritime Authority, and Bed worked in the office at
Speaker 5: the depot in Ballina in the secretary or section, and
Speaker 5: she was deadly involved with all her work colleagues. She
Speaker 5: had a lot of good close friends go to her
Speaker 5: work and she worked away up the ladder and she
Speaker 5: was doing quite well. She had been married, and I
Speaker 5: remained very good friends with her ex husband, and he
Speaker 5: was a nice guy and they didn't have any children together.
Speaker 5: But obviously things didn't work out and they went their
Speaker 5: separate ways, which was fine. When she separated from her
Speaker 5: husband and her home was sold, she moved down to
Speaker 5: Ballina to be closer to work, and eventually ended up
Speaker 5: buying her house over at Skinner's Head and kept in
Speaker 5: contact with myself and my brother and my mother, and
Speaker 5: we were all very close. She had a beautiful garden
Speaker 5: at her house. She loved working in the garden.
Speaker 2: Where did you and Bev grow up?
Speaker 5: Well, we all grew up in Balner, born and raised
Speaker 5: in Barner. Had a shop in Barner, a general store.
Speaker 5: He also worked at the local council. Yeah, we spent
Speaker 5: most of our time here in Barner.
Speaker 2: Did you know John Winfield?
Speaker 5: Never knew him, never knew anything about him, didn't know
Speaker 5: anything about the story. His name was never brought up
Speaker 5: in conversation at any of our gatherings, our family gatherings. Nothing.
Speaker 5: It was just a bolt out of the blue.
Speaker 2: And what was that bolt out of the blue?
Speaker 1: Can you put your finger on the first time you
Speaker 1: heard of John Winfield in connection with your sister Bev?
Speaker 5: Okay, So that would have been the day that I
Speaker 5: went to the solicitors to sign some paperwork for Bev
Speaker 5: in regards to injury and guardian and power of attorney,
Speaker 5: those sort of PaperWorks.
Speaker 2: It was early May twenty twenty two.
Speaker 5: And the solicitor brought up his name and said to me,
Speaker 5: this is John, this is his name and he is
Speaker 5: Bev's partner, which was a shock, total shock.
Speaker 2: And why was that a total shop?
Speaker 5: Because they've never mentioned anything about anybody in her life.
Speaker 5: He was never at any of our functions.
Speaker 2: Would Bev usually have shared information like that.
Speaker 5: Might not have shared it with myself and my brother,
Speaker 5: but I'm sure she would have brought up the conversation
Speaker 5: with my partner at some stage, and or my brother's partner.
Speaker 5: He would have mentioned something to them, or even my mother.
Speaker 5: None of those knew anything about him.
Speaker 1: The Ballona solicitor who told Jeff about the status of
Speaker 1: John Winfield in Bev's life was acting for Bev. I
Speaker 1: asked Jeff Outerbridge whether, apart from being an enduring guardian,
Speaker 1: he had any active legal role as Bev's brother in
Speaker 1: helping manage Bev's affairs at that time.
Speaker 5: No. I think she knew things were starting to get
Speaker 5: a bit desperate and she needed to have some people
Speaker 5: that could take care of her affairs. I had the
Speaker 5: doctor's report on you, and it says that she had
Speaker 5: metastatic me so barly omer. It started out as a
Speaker 5: lung cancer and then it spread to her brain. I
Speaker 5: knew she was ill because when she was at my
Speaker 5: partner's funeral, I could tell she was very very ill.
Speaker 5: She organized with the solicitor to get all that paperwork
Speaker 5: up to date and sign off on so if anything happens,
Speaker 5: people could make decisions for her. But of course the
Speaker 5: main person that was going to be making any decisions
Speaker 5: was going to be John Enduring.
Speaker 6: Guardianship is only any good up until the point of the.
Speaker 5: Person passes away. Since the person passes away, that is
Speaker 5: all then null and void. I can't touch anything to
Speaker 5: do with my sister's estate on sch it passes away.
Speaker 5: Only the executor of the will can then handle the situation,
Speaker 5: and he was that as well.
Speaker 2: Jeff is talking about John Winfield in during.
Speaker 1: Guardian and executor of Beverly Brooker's will. It was at
Speaker 1: that point in the solicitor's offices that Jeff first appreciated what.
Speaker 2: John was doing. I'll clarify the timing.
Speaker 1: In early May twenty twenty two, Bev's brother, Jeff Outerbridge,
Speaker 1: went to see Bev's solicitor. Bev's health was very poor.
Speaker 1: Bev died in September twenty twenty two. Something else happened
Speaker 1: in that year and.
Speaker 5: The will was changed in March twenty third of March
Speaker 5: twenty twenty two.
Speaker 1: Beverly's will in March twenty twenty two was changed how.
Speaker 5: From the previous beneficiary.
Speaker 2: The previous will was unremarkable.
Speaker 5: I've got that will here with me as well, and
Speaker 5: it was dated the seventh of June twenty eleven. It
Speaker 5: was with a different solicitor. Of course. The state in
Speaker 5: total was left to the one person, which was my
Speaker 5: cousin and Bev's cousin, and she was the sole beneficiary
Speaker 5: of Bev's a Stoke.
Speaker 1: In twenty eleven. Bev's will then provided that her cousin
Speaker 1: in Victoria would inherit all of Bev's estate.
Speaker 2: Was there a.
Speaker 1: Special connection between your cousin, Bev's cousin and Bev.
Speaker 5: She was very close to my sister. They are about
Speaker 5: the same sort of age group. They used to stay
Speaker 5: in close contact.
Speaker 7: My cousin would bring Bev on birthdays and Keith Bev
Speaker 7: up to date on my auntie, who was very ill.
Speaker 7: Cousins used to come up from Sydney every year and
Speaker 7: holiday him with us, and we're all very close.
Speaker 1: What was your view of your cousin inheriting your sister's estate.
Speaker 5: Well, it didn't worry me, really, she was a close
Speaker 5: cousin and that was fine. If that's what my sister
Speaker 5: wanted to do, that was okay by me.
Speaker 2: She was family for eleven years.
Speaker 1: This provision in the will held until Bev's health was
Speaker 1: really dire. In early twenty twenty two, and six months
Speaker 1: before she died, Bev's will was altered in a most
Speaker 1: profound and divisive way.
Speaker 2: You can probably guess where this is going.
Speaker 5: But this other guy, he's a total blowing We never
Speaker 5: met him and didn't know anything about him, and that
Speaker 5: was a real surprise and shot I think that he
Speaker 5: would inherit everything that my sister owned to Firshley.
Speaker 1: Did this listener tell you at that meeting that is
Speaker 1: what would happen?
Speaker 5: No, he just said John's name was on the paperwork
Speaker 5: and he was Thev's partner.
Speaker 1: When did you realize for the first time that John
Speaker 1: would actually inherit your sister's estate.
Speaker 5: After my sister's general and it was probably a week later,
Speaker 5: I went back down to the same solicitors and I
Speaker 5: just said, look, I'm here to collect a copy of
Speaker 5: my sister's will so I can see what's happening with
Speaker 5: their estate, and that was when I was refused any
Speaker 5: copy of any will. So I was told that because
Speaker 5: my name was not mentioned in the will, I was
Speaker 5: not allowed to have a copy. That listener was very
Speaker 5: uncoperative and even wouldn't let me have copies of my
Speaker 5: sister's will.
Speaker 2: Jeff explained that when the solicitor refused to give him copies,
Speaker 2: Jeff went to see another solicitor who.
Speaker 5: Killed in the taperwork for me to take down, hand
Speaker 5: it over the counter and say that I am demanding
Speaker 5: copies of my sister wills, present, past, and any other
Speaker 5: paperwork related to my sister. And within five minutes I
Speaker 5: had all that paperwork in my hand. So I had
Speaker 5: to get a solicitor to obtain those copies of those wills.
Speaker 5: And it was then that I realized, after I read
Speaker 5: the will, that that's how it all went.
Speaker 1: Were you keeping your brother informed as well? And your
Speaker 1: sister in law and other members of the family.
Speaker 5: He has kept them up to date and informed, and
Speaker 5: my brother really had a mental breakdown over this. He
Speaker 5: can't really talk very clearly about it at any time
Speaker 5: because he's absolutely devastated and guarded about the whole thing.
Speaker 5: He feels as though this guy has just taken advantage
Speaker 5: of my sister, and maybe it's gone in the wrong direction.
Speaker 5: He would rather the cousin inherit everything that belonged to
Speaker 5: my sister, but not this stranger, this stranger who was
Speaker 5: just doing work on the property, just doing maintenance and rebuilding.
Speaker 2: Can you describe the house that your sister lived in, jet.
Speaker 5: I really knew, two story town house with ocean of
Speaker 5: years looking out over flat rock, beautiful, big verandas up
Speaker 5: the top and down the bottom facing the ocean, big
Speaker 5: double garage around the back where you used to enter
Speaker 5: in from the little cul de stack. It was probably
Speaker 5: three or four bedrooms. It was quite a good size.
Speaker 5: She started renovating work on it over a period of
Speaker 5: a couple of years, and then this guy was doing
Speaker 5: work for her, fixing up branders, balconies, herails, and then
Speaker 5: eventually she started on the inside and the downstairs first
Speaker 5: and bathroom, toilet, laundry downstairs, and then she would live
Speaker 5: downstairs while the upstairs was being renovated. You kitchen, your bathroom, toilet,
Speaker 5: all new flooring, all new kitchen appliances, kitchen cabinets, floating timber, floors,
Speaker 5: all new furniture, and actually, by the time my sister
Speaker 5: passed away and there was still furniture being delivered to
Speaker 5: the house that she didn't even get to benefit for using.
Speaker 2: Who was overseeing all of the renovation work? Who was
Speaker 2: doing it?
Speaker 5: That was John was organizing all the trades and he
Speaker 5: was calling the people in. I think my sister was
Speaker 5: kicking the colors and the stones and the tiles, and
Speaker 5: every week the appliances.
Speaker 1: Do you know whether your sister was funding his employment
Speaker 1: as well as all the materials and furniture costs and
Speaker 1: so on.
Speaker 5: I don't think you'd be doing it for free. And
Speaker 5: she was retired and she was well off with a
Speaker 5: super I'm sure he lived at his house and lived
Speaker 5: at her house, because he told me in the little
Speaker 5: diary that he kept on Bev's health and condition that
Speaker 5: a couple of times he found it when he came
Speaker 5: up to the house of the morning to check and
Speaker 5: make sure that everything was in order, that the tradesmen
Speaker 5: were arriving and that they could come in and do
Speaker 5: their work. That was when he found Bev, on two
Speaker 5: separate occasions, had fallen on the floor and she was
Speaker 5: unconscious and he had to get an ebleance to her.
Speaker 5: That tells me that he was not living there with her.
Speaker 1: Did she say anything to you that struck you as
Speaker 1: unusual during the work.
Speaker 5: By the trades, No, not really, only the fact that
Speaker 5: she was cleaning the house from top to bottom every
Speaker 5: day to keep the house clean and tidy. And I
Speaker 5: couldn't understand why. I said to her, why are you
Speaker 5: doing that, bev, when the trades are going to be
Speaker 5: back again very next day and making another mess. Why
Speaker 5: have you got to kick the house so clean? And
Speaker 5: she just said that that's the way it is, That's
Speaker 5: what she does. She cleans everything from top to bottom.
Speaker 5: I see now that it was a stipulation of Jonathan Wine,
Speaker 5: but that's how he liked to have done. He was
Speaker 5: a bit of a clean freak. She was a need
Speaker 5: and clean and tidy person. But I mean to say,
Speaker 5: it seems strange to me that she'd have to clean
Speaker 5: the house from top to bottom every day after the
Speaker 5: tradees had been in there. That was just crazy to me.
Speaker 1: Every brain cancer will have a different impact on the sufferer.
Speaker 1: But have you questioned whether or not your sister was
Speaker 1: of sound mind from her advanced cancer? To be able
Speaker 1: to legally change her will so dramatically.
Speaker 5: I knew something was wrong for quite a while, and
Speaker 5: I could see her health going downhill, and she was
Speaker 5: making some really strange decisions. I'd even actually accused her
Speaker 5: about COVID. Did she have COVID? Was she getting COVID?
Speaker 5: She had COVID? And she kept on denying everything to me.
Speaker 5: She was very strange. In the last probably twelve months
Speaker 5: of her life, she became more and more reclusive.
Speaker 2: How often do you reckon? You were seeing her.
Speaker 5: Ja every second week, ring her every five days, and
Speaker 5: keep in contact with her on the phone. I'd keep
Speaker 5: her updated all the time on the health of my partner.
Speaker 5: She was close to my partner and they got along
Speaker 5: well together. And of course she'd come down to the
Speaker 5: hospital every second week and visit. But I could see
Speaker 5: strange things happening with her health. And I said to her,
Speaker 5: why are you changing all these things in new townhouse?
Speaker 5: The townhouse was not that old and it was in
Speaker 5: good condition, and why would you want to put in
Speaker 5: all these new applients. Has seemed on a mission to
Speaker 5: spend as much money as she.
Speaker 2: Could on a property that John would inherit exactly yes.
Speaker 5: And also her cars. She had a nice Honda that
Speaker 5: she'd bought brand new. She decided to sell that real
Speaker 5: cheap to a friend that John had organized the sale,
Speaker 5: and she bought a brand new Honder from Lismore and
Speaker 5: she no sooner had that, and she went and bought
Speaker 5: a second one. And I couldn't understand why she would
Speaker 5: buy a second one. She didn't need a second car.
Speaker 5: She had a double garage and she had room to
Speaker 5: park it. But I can't understand why she had two
Speaker 5: brand new Hondas. Obviously John would benefit by them. What
Speaker 5: color are they? They're red in color orangine red.
Speaker 1: Through all of those contacts she were having with your sister,
Speaker 1: calling her every five days and seeing her regularly, how
Speaker 1: many times did she talk about John Winfield?
Speaker 5: Never mentioned, never brought up in conversation.
Speaker 6: My mum was quite early and she had to be
Speaker 6: moved out of her home and put into an age
Speaker 6: care facility at Oulstonville, And we used to go up
Speaker 6: there every week and visit the mum in the age
Speaker 6: care facility until Mom passed away, And the conversation was.
Speaker 5: Never brought up with my mom. My mom knew nothing
Speaker 5: about him. I knew nothing about him, and my brother
Speaker 5: knew nothing about him. Nothing was ever brought up except
Speaker 5: the conversation about this guy who was doing work on
Speaker 5: the house.
Speaker 1: Was there anything in what she said that made you think, oh,
Speaker 1: he might be a bit more involved in her life
Speaker 1: than just a builder.
Speaker 5: Nothing other than the fact that he was doing some
Speaker 5: maintenance work on the house and some renovating work. John
Speaker 5: did tell me on the day that he came here
Speaker 5: to my house, and he had his little diary with
Speaker 5: him that he had met a number of years ago
Speaker 5: when she was out in the garden working in her garden.
Speaker 5: He introduced himself to bed and said that he is
Speaker 5: a builder, does maintenance work, and she must have been
Speaker 5: out with his work, and that's when he eventually did
Speaker 5: more and more, and that he got his foot in
Speaker 5: the door and started renovating the whole interior. But there
Speaker 5: was never any mention of him being in any sort
Speaker 5: of relationship. It was just a handy man that mid
Speaker 5: down the road.
Speaker 1: What is your view of John's conduct and what's happened.
Speaker 5: Well, my opinion is that this guy, he flies under
Speaker 5: the radar. He cannot be trusted. He will not respond
Speaker 5: to any of my phone calls. His very very secret
Speaker 5: is and I really don't trust him. He's a control
Speaker 5: free an absolutely control three. The way he conducted the funeral.
Speaker 2: How was the funeral conducted? What happened?
Speaker 5: Me and my brother asked, can we help arrange things
Speaker 5: with the funeral? And he said, no, there's no need.
Speaker 5: Everything sorted out. He's got it all under control. And
Speaker 5: I said, well, can we help with the flowers? Can
Speaker 5: we do the flower No, no need to touch the flowers.
Speaker 5: He had only seven people at the funeral. No, and
Speaker 5: was allowed to come to the funeral. A couple of
Speaker 5: the people that did attend the funeral he didn't want
Speaker 5: them there. He was very upset about them being there.
Speaker 5: He reckons it was all my sisters requests that it
Speaker 5: was kept private, which is very strange because Beverley wasn't
Speaker 5: like that. She had a lot of close friends and
Speaker 5: work colleagues, and she would have been happy to know
Speaker 5: that they were there at his service. He took control
Speaker 5: of everything. There was a slide show of my sister's life,
Speaker 5: and he did not have one photo of himself in
Speaker 5: that slide shaft.
Speaker 2: Did he deliver a eulogy or anything?
Speaker 5: There no No, he didn't get up and stand up
Speaker 5: and talk.
Speaker 1: Jeff told me that he had reservations about John Winfield
Speaker 1: the first time they met. On that occasion, John kept
Speaker 1: referring to the small diary which he carried.
Speaker 2: He relied on.
Speaker 1: It to cite dates and events, and he read from
Speaker 1: the diary, and he said that they were relevant to
Speaker 1: Bev's condition. The second meeting that Jeff had with John
Speaker 1: was at the private hospital in Lismore called Saint Vincent's,
Speaker 1: and that was when Bev was just days from death.
Speaker 1: The third time was when John came to Jeff's workplace
Speaker 1: in September twenty twenty two to tell him that his
Speaker 1: sister had passed away.
Speaker 5: One, two, three, And then at the funeral. Four times
Speaker 5: I'm meet him four times.
Speaker 2: What about contacts since the funeral?
Speaker 5: No contact? I'll find him a couple of times. He
Speaker 5: won't return my calls of ringing and asking for a
Speaker 5: phone number of my cousin down in Victoria, and he
Speaker 5: hasn't responded to that phone call. I have not heard
Speaker 5: from him since the d of the funeral.
Speaker 1: Is this the cousin who would have been the sole
Speaker 1: beneficiary if the will hadn't been changed.
Speaker 5: Yes, that's the cousin. Yeah. I asked for her phone
Speaker 5: number because be have had it in her phone and
Speaker 5: I kept regular contact.
Speaker 2: But that cousin didn't come to the funeral.
Speaker 5: No, no, because I'd say John didn't even make contact
Speaker 5: with her.
Speaker 2: I think you said there were only seven people there.
Speaker 5: It was John and a young lady that was within him.
Speaker 5: He said that it was his daughter. There was myself,
Speaker 5: There was my brother, my brother's wife, my nephew from
Speaker 5: the Old Coast, Luke, and there was an elderly couple
Speaker 5: from the Olstonville church. Bev used to be a member
Speaker 5: of the Oustonville Church, so that would have been eleven
Speaker 5: or eight people.
Speaker 1: Jeff told me that John was most unhappy that Luke
Speaker 1: turned up at his auntie Bev's funeral.
Speaker 2: The elderly couple from the Austinville Church were not welcomed
Speaker 2: by John either.
Speaker 5: We didn't run it by John to get permission that
Speaker 5: they could attend. They turned up on the day and
Speaker 5: it was a bit of a shock to John because
Speaker 5: he didn't know they were going to be there, so
Speaker 5: he wasn't happy.
Speaker 1: Did you feel that you could have put your foot
Speaker 1: down and said, look, this is our sister, and we'll
Speaker 1: let her friends and other relations know and will farewell
Speaker 1: her and the way well.
Speaker 5: He was telling us that it was Bev's, that it
Speaker 5: was all done on the quiet, so he said, there's
Speaker 5: nothing here to organize. John said, I will make announcements
Speaker 5: to people who need to know what's happened to Bev.
Speaker 2: But any announcements were to be authorized by John and
Speaker 2: come from John, and only after the funeral. John controlled
Speaker 2: the messaging, preventing even a standard funeral notice, which would
Speaker 2: have alerted people to the fact that Bev had died.
Speaker 5: We didn't want to stir up any trouble and didn't
Speaker 5: know what he was like at that stage. Yed that
Speaker 5: we didn't know what we're getting ourselves into. But I thought,
Speaker 5: this is all very strange. I don't think Devine would
Speaker 5: have conducted itself like this.
Speaker 2: What was John's daughter doing at the funeral.
Speaker 5: We were sitting in a row that had a slight
Speaker 5: curve in it and were facing the casket, and my
Speaker 5: brother and system law at the far end, and they
Speaker 5: could see across at what John and the daughter were doing,
Speaker 5: writing down notes on a pad and keeping notes, and
Speaker 5: she would look up and observe us and then go
Speaker 5: back to writing on the notepad. And she was obviously
Speaker 5: observing our reactions and emotions. And I said, that's very strange.
Speaker 5: No one does that sort of thing at a funeral,
Speaker 5: so why would they do that. I've got a few
Speaker 5: notes here that Paul gave me after Bev's funeral. He's
Speaker 5: got written down here. There was no interaction with our
Speaker 5: family at any time from John. My gut feeling and
Speaker 5: what I have seen tells me that he saw a
Speaker 5: moment and stretched it out to an opportunity to gain
Speaker 5: Bev's confidence during her mental sickness, and took every advantage
Speaker 5: he could. There was no pictures of him and Bev
Speaker 5: together in the picture show because there was no relationship.
Speaker 5: His daughter, which I saw, was taking notes, leaning forward
Speaker 5: and looking at us all and writing some more notes down.
Speaker 1: You were going to hear from Bev's younger brother, Paul
Speaker 1: Outerbridge in the next episode, and from Paul's wife Sarah
Speaker 1: here they are very briefly. Have you seen John since
Speaker 1: the funeral?
Speaker 2: No? No, why would I?
Speaker 3: I can't say.
Speaker 8: His name, and then I just google it. I just
Speaker 8: put in John Wingfield and I've come from when Wreenfield.
Speaker 8: The likeness blew.
Speaker 5: Me away, and then you got to grossimons. Through the documents.
Speaker 1: Paul and Sarah will shed more light too on what
Speaker 1: they saw at Bev's unusually low key service.
Speaker 2: When did you first learn that he's an alleged killer?
Speaker 5: After the funeral, my sister in law said, do you
Speaker 5: know who this guy is? Have you researched him? Have
Speaker 5: you looked him up on the internet? I said no,
Speaker 5: I don't know. I never heard anything before. And that's
Speaker 5: when she showed me on her laptop the story of
Speaker 5: Jonathan Minfield and I was stunned. I thought, like, how
Speaker 5: can this be true? My sister was a very clever
Speaker 5: lady and very witty, and I said, well, what was
Speaker 5: BEV doing mixed up with this guy? Didn't she know
Speaker 5: who he was and what he was all about? And
Speaker 5: I'm sure Bev would have known the story of Jonathan Winshield.
Speaker 5: And I can't understand why she ended up mixed up
Speaker 5: or had anything to do with it. She didn't live
Speaker 5: under a rock. She was a very intelligent woman up
Speaker 5: until the last little bit of a life when she
Speaker 5: obviously was affected by the cancer. I don't know why
Speaker 5: she put so much trust in this guy and let
Speaker 5: him do what he wanted to do. I don't know
Speaker 5: how she even had him in her house. And then
Speaker 5: after I started doing some research and found out the
Speaker 5: true story, it's just noble from there.
Speaker 1: Did you consider challenging what had happened, challenging the world?
Speaker 5: I did. I went back to the solicitor and I said,
Speaker 5: what can we do? Obviously my sister was not of
Speaker 5: sound mind when she did this. We had a bit
Speaker 5: of a talk about it, and it was going to
Speaker 5: be financially impossible for me to pursue it. So I thought, well,
Speaker 5: I don't like the idea of this guy taking everything
Speaker 5: that my sister had. I don't begrudge my cousin receiving
Speaker 5: the small amount that she is receiving, but I don't
Speaker 5: like the idea of this guy getting the rest.
Speaker 1: And what do you understand the value of your sister's
Speaker 1: estate was.
Speaker 5: It would probably worth a couple of million dollars at
Speaker 5: least the house and the cars and the super anyway,
Speaker 5: and it would total quite a bit of money. My
Speaker 5: cousin is only receiving a small amount of that, and
Speaker 5: Jonathan Winfield is the beneficiary of the rest.
Speaker 1: Jeff picked up a copy of Bev's will. He read
Speaker 1: the provision relating to their cousin.
Speaker 5: I give the son of two hundred thousand dollars and
Speaker 5: can I mention her name?
Speaker 1: Jeff read out the cousin's full name. I'm not repeating
Speaker 1: it here for privacy reasons.
Speaker 5: I give the balance of my estate to Jonathan Winfield.
Speaker 5: That's what the will says here. I appoint Jonathan Winfield
Speaker 5: as executor and trustee. I just can't understand why my
Speaker 5: sister would do that. My brother's desire was to pursue it,
Speaker 5: take it to court and contest the will. And I
Speaker 5: said to my brother, look, I've been down that track.
Speaker 5: It's not doable. I can tell you you're wasting your time.
Speaker 5: And he wouldn't leave me, So he went and got
Speaker 5: his own counsel, and he rang around and were advised
Speaker 5: not to go down that path. Pointe's health have eaually
Speaker 5: got the better of him. Many almost had a breakdown
Speaker 5: over it all, and he gave up.
Speaker 1: It is impossible to know what really goes on in
Speaker 1: family relationships that you are not yourself involved in, why
Speaker 1: conflicts arise, and how siblings manage the fallout are such
Speaker 1: subjective questions. In the Bromwin series, the tensions between family members,
Speaker 1: including Andy Reid, his sister Kim Marshall, and their cousin
Speaker 1: Megan Reid, have been all too obvious at times. Siblings
Speaker 1: squabbles are as predictable as death and taxes. Beverly is
Speaker 1: not around to tell us why Jeff and Paul were
Speaker 1: not in.
Speaker 2: Either of her wills. You sound angry, but measured.
Speaker 5: Angry about the fact that this stranger, by class him
Speaker 5: as a stranger, has walked in and taken everything. My
Speaker 5: brother was affected by the floods here in Belnah, and
Speaker 5: he had flood damage, and he was doing it tough
Speaker 5: at the time. And I said to him at the time,
Speaker 5: I said, look, mate, if your sister is kind enough
Speaker 5: to leave you some money in her estate, you'll be
Speaker 5: able to get yourself back on your feet. He was guarded,
Speaker 5: he couldn't do repairs to his fence, he had no
Speaker 5: car to get to work, and he was actually seeing
Speaker 5: a counselor at the time, and he got worse and
Speaker 5: worse as time went on. About this. He still finds
Speaker 5: it hard to talk about today.
Speaker 2: And what about your sister in law.
Speaker 5: They were close friends. I think she's very disappointed with
Speaker 5: Bev this whole thing with Jonathan instincts.
Speaker 2: Actually, Maddie, you still there. I'm sorry in talking NonStop.
Speaker 9: I just had a question what ultimately led to theav
Speaker 9: passing away?
Speaker 10: The results of the key answer going to her brain.
Speaker 10: She passed away in Saint Vincent's hospital in Isbel and
Speaker 10: that's why I saw her, and she could only just
Speaker 10: see out of her eyes.
Speaker 5: Next day she couldn't see out of her eyes. And
Speaker 5: then on the third day I got noticed to say
Speaker 5: that she passed only that morning. Do you know how
Speaker 5: long FAV was six four before John and to her life?
Speaker 5: I don't know when't exactly. She was diagnosed with the cancer.
Speaker 9: With this little diary that John cat, she said he
Speaker 9: wrote about her condition and all the rest of it
Speaker 9: was that its main purpose.
Speaker 5: No, I thought it was a bit strainingue that he
Speaker 5: had everyone written down. He rang me out of the
Speaker 5: blue and introduced himself to me and said, look, I've
Speaker 5: got some information about your sister. She's in the hospital
Speaker 5: at the moment and she's very seriously or can I
Speaker 5: come around your house and have it talk to you
Speaker 5: about your sister's health. And I said, yeah, this by
Speaker 5: all means come around. I want to know what's going on.
Speaker 5: Which hospital is she in. So he came around within
Speaker 5: an hour and we sat down and he had this
Speaker 5: diary with him, and he's telling me all the different
Speaker 5: things that have happened. I said, John, look that's not important.
Speaker 5: I said, I wanted to go and see my sister.
Speaker 5: Where is she? And he said no, no, no, you
Speaker 5: can't do that. You can't go there now. I'll make
Speaker 5: arrangements for you to visit her tomorrow. She's in Saint
Speaker 5: Vincent's in Lismore. And I said, my brother's going to
Speaker 5: have to come to her. My brother's going to want
Speaker 5: to see it. And he said, no, your brother's excluded.
Speaker 5: He can't come and visit with your sister. We're doing
Speaker 5: this one person at a time, and he took control
Speaker 5: of the whole situation. But he started off telling me
Speaker 5: her life story in this diary, and I said, John,
Speaker 5: I don't need to know the life story. I just
Speaker 5: want to know what's going on, what's wrong with her,
Speaker 5: and where is she every time she had a fall,
Speaker 5: or every time she was taken to hospital, or every
Speaker 5: time she saw the specialist and every treatment that she had,
Speaker 5: and when the cancer care nurses come to visit the house.
Speaker 5: He had everything written down, the dates and the times
Speaker 5: and everything. It seemed very strange to me that someone
Speaker 5: would keep a diary like that on somebody else's health.
Speaker 5: And he said, I'll meet you up at the hospital tomorrow,
Speaker 5: and he was telling me this is how it's going
Speaker 5: to be, and this is when you can come up
Speaker 5: there and I'll be there to meet you and I'll
Speaker 5: take you in. And he gave me a time, and
Speaker 5: I went up there and saw my sister. Yeah, really
Speaker 5: strange considering it's your sister and my brother could not know.
Speaker 5: You cannot tell your brother, and I had to wait
Speaker 5: until Bevan passed away. And then I went out and
Speaker 5: saw my brother and I break down because I said, mate,
Speaker 5: I'm sorry, but I wasn't allowed to tell you about
Speaker 5: Bev's health and are passing. I had to keep it
Speaker 5: a secret, apparently. And this guy said it was Bev's wish,
Speaker 5: but it was more I think John's wish than anything else.
Speaker 5: My brother was devastated, he was gutted. He didn't get
Speaker 5: to see his sister, he didn't get to say goodbye.
Speaker 9: So when you saw Bev in hospital, was John david
Speaker 9: you the entire time or did he let you have
Speaker 9: alone time with her?
Speaker 5: Oh? No, he was there in the entire time both occasions.
Speaker 3: I went up there.
Speaker 5: On the last night, he slept there in a cot.
Speaker 5: The nurses made up the cot poin beside Ben's bed.
Speaker 2: The following morning, John left the hospital to drive home
Speaker 2: and shower and change into fresh clothes, And that was.
Speaker 5: When burd passed away.
Speaker 1: While he was at home, I asked Jeff whether he
Speaker 1: had regrets about having yielded to John Winfield, a man
Speaker 1: whom nobody in Bev's family knew about until he announced himself.
Speaker 5: I wish I had known more about him at the
Speaker 5: time than I could have included my brother in the visits.
Speaker 5: We could have included ourselves and much more in the
Speaker 5: funeral service. It's just remarkable, And my sister wasn't like that.
Speaker 5: Even when my mom passed away and there was a
Speaker 5: service held for my mum, she brought along all her
Speaker 5: work colleagues with her as back up and helped for
Speaker 5: her at my mum's service. But there was stay. John.
Speaker 1: Well, it's surprising that your sister having worked in Ballina
Speaker 1: in the same office for much of her life, and
Speaker 1: none of her friends or colleagues are able to pay
Speaker 1: their respects.
Speaker 2: They're all excluded.
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, all that was his doing, I'm sure of it.
Speaker 5: The plan was to keep it all very low key,
Speaker 5: hush hush floy, under the radar, and it don't let
Speaker 5: anybody know about him because he had plans. He had
Speaker 5: plans to step in and to take my sister's estate
Speaker 5: and tol Me Headley. Has anyone ever looked into miss
Speaker 5: Guy's finances?
Speaker 2: Well, yes and no.
Speaker 1: He sold that house at Sandstone Crescent about one year
Speaker 1: after the police began a reinvestigation of what had happened
Speaker 1: to Broman. I don't know why he sold in nineteen
Speaker 1: ninety nine, but it has been suggested that one good
Speaker 1: reason for him to sell.
Speaker 2: Then would have been him knowing that.
Speaker 1: The detective Sergeant Glenn Taylor was doing a lot of
Speaker 1: interviewing around the town and in Sydney and piecing together
Speaker 1: John's movements and the timeline and everything.
Speaker 5: He's got all this money coming to him from my sister,
Speaker 5: but has he got money from other women?
Speaker 1: Maddie and I had a separate call immediately after we
Speaker 1: ended the conversation with Jeff Outerbridge, Maddie, your reaction.
Speaker 3: Actually, I'm really angry.
Speaker 9: I'm seething.
Speaker 1: I would have been absolutely still white hot angry if
Speaker 1: it had been my sister and this had happened.
Speaker 9: Me too, especially now that he knows more. Now that
Speaker 9: he knows a lot more about John's past and what's
Speaker 9: happened previously.
Speaker 1: What's with the diary also carried by the woman who
Speaker 1: was introduced to the family as John's daughter, taking notes
Speaker 1: on what people were saying and how they were reacting
Speaker 1: at the funeral.
Speaker 9: It's so fucking strange. Note taking out the funeral is
Speaker 9: the weirdest thing I've ever heard of.
Speaker 1: And John, who was just the maintenance guy and then
Speaker 1: the builder and then called himself a partner, but she
Speaker 1: never spoke of him like it's a two million dollar hole.
Speaker 9: I'm pretty sure the solicitor gives people advice when they're
Speaker 9: change their wills. They will tell you, oh, this is
Speaker 9: not a good idea, or are you sure about this?
Speaker 9: And you have to be kind of with it to
Speaker 9: make decisions that drastic.
Speaker 1: You actually sound more angry over this than you have
Speaker 1: over just about anything.
Speaker 2: We've discussed in this podcast.
Speaker 9: Yeah, because he's had thirty one years to be free
Speaker 9: and yet he still one ups everyone. There is something
Speaker 9: seriously wrong.
Speaker 1: Bronwyn is written and investigated by me Headley Thomas as
Speaker 1: a podcast production for The Australian. If anyone has information
Speaker 1: which may help solve this cold case, please contact me
Speaker 1: confidentially by emailing at the Australian dot com dot au.
Speaker 2: You can read more.
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