1 00:00:05,921 --> 00:00:07,281 Speaker 1: Appogie Production. 2 00:00:15,321 --> 00:00:19,881 Speaker 2: Welcome back to episode eight of The Missing Matter, Jonie. 3 00:00:20,441 --> 00:00:24,921 Speaker 2: This is a big one because we go to Luxembourg. Yes, yes, 4 00:00:25,441 --> 00:00:27,761 Speaker 2: the place that neither of us had ever heard of, 5 00:00:27,841 --> 00:00:34,120 Speaker 2: I would assume until we started looking into this. So Luxembourg, well, 6 00:00:34,161 --> 00:00:39,361 Speaker 2: it's been a country of interest to me, obviously since 7 00:00:39,441 --> 00:00:43,281 Speaker 2: my mum's disappearance. Prior to that, I didn't really know 8 00:00:43,361 --> 00:00:45,961 Speaker 2: much about it. But this was my second trip there, 9 00:00:46,040 --> 00:00:48,241 Speaker 2: so I did know my way around a little bit. 10 00:00:48,281 --> 00:00:50,961 Speaker 2: It's not a very big city, so my memory of 11 00:00:51,040 --> 00:00:54,961 Speaker 2: it was quite good. However, that doesn't take away from 12 00:00:54,961 --> 00:00:57,401 Speaker 2: the fact that you still can get lost. 13 00:00:57,721 --> 00:01:12,241 Speaker 1: You can no English. 14 00:01:12,521 --> 00:01:19,041 Speaker 2: But we're heading to Luxembourg on Themburg leaving Brussels, which. 15 00:01:18,801 --> 00:01:22,121 Speaker 1: Is rainy, rainy, rainy. It's been very difficult to navigate. 16 00:01:24,081 --> 00:01:29,801 Speaker 2: We had a really good meeting today, so yeah, anyway, 17 00:01:30,081 --> 00:01:37,161 Speaker 2: we're heading We're heading away by bye Brussels. It was Tuesday, 18 00:01:37,200 --> 00:01:40,961 Speaker 2: the fifteenth of October, and we had left Brussels mid 19 00:01:41,000 --> 00:01:44,440 Speaker 2: afternoon for our four and a half hour train ride 20 00:01:44,560 --> 00:01:47,921 Speaker 2: to Luxembourg. The lady at the hotel had given me 21 00:01:47,961 --> 00:01:50,321 Speaker 2: instructions on how to catch the bus from the train 22 00:01:50,401 --> 00:01:53,801 Speaker 2: station to the hotel. We were staying down in the 23 00:01:53,921 --> 00:01:59,281 Speaker 2: spectacular old quarters of the Fortifications area, which is regarded 24 00:01:59,361 --> 00:02:04,441 Speaker 2: as a UNESCO World Heritage Site. The area is sunken 25 00:02:04,521 --> 00:02:09,361 Speaker 2: below the city and recognize for its exceptional military architecture 26 00:02:09,401 --> 00:02:14,601 Speaker 2: and strategic importance in European history. It was completely stunning. 27 00:02:14,680 --> 00:02:17,841 Speaker 2: I remember standing up there with Brian Seymour when we 28 00:02:17,881 --> 00:02:20,961 Speaker 2: went back in May twenty nineteen, looking down into there, 29 00:02:21,001 --> 00:02:23,081 Speaker 2: and we did do some footage down in there, and 30 00:02:23,161 --> 00:02:26,361 Speaker 2: the area is just beautiful. I just completely could see 31 00:02:26,361 --> 00:02:29,121 Speaker 2: how my mum would fall in love with the stories 32 00:02:29,201 --> 00:02:34,681 Speaker 2: and the history behind what Luxembourg is. However, it was 33 00:02:34,721 --> 00:02:38,240 Speaker 2: peak hour traffic. We got off the train, We've got 34 00:02:38,240 --> 00:02:41,401 Speaker 2: all our luggage, we get on the bus. We're sitting 35 00:02:41,481 --> 00:02:44,921 Speaker 2: in literally standstill traffic, weren't we And We've been on 36 00:02:44,960 --> 00:02:47,161 Speaker 2: the bus for about an hour, and I started to 37 00:02:47,161 --> 00:02:51,601 Speaker 2: get concerned because I thought we were going the wrong way. Yeah, 38 00:02:51,641 --> 00:02:54,961 Speaker 2: we could see different little suburbs counting down, remember on 39 00:02:55,041 --> 00:02:58,400 Speaker 2: the sign on the going time direction, and We're like, 40 00:02:58,881 --> 00:03:02,081 Speaker 2: just seems like we're going out into the suburbs and 41 00:03:02,401 --> 00:03:05,041 Speaker 2: I'm saying that far away from Luxembourg City. 42 00:03:05,121 --> 00:03:07,001 Speaker 1: It's we were in the. 43 00:03:06,921 --> 00:03:09,601 Speaker 2: Heart of the city, so I had very little battery 44 00:03:09,921 --> 00:03:12,321 Speaker 2: left on my phone once again, and I tried to 45 00:03:12,361 --> 00:03:15,721 Speaker 2: call the boutique little hotel reception because I knew she 46 00:03:15,800 --> 00:03:17,761 Speaker 2: was closing at six pm and we needed to let 47 00:03:17,800 --> 00:03:19,441 Speaker 2: her know we weren't going to make it there before 48 00:03:19,441 --> 00:03:22,081 Speaker 2: she left, so we had to organize for her to 49 00:03:22,201 --> 00:03:26,681 Speaker 2: leave the key for us somewhere. She apologized to me, saying, 50 00:03:26,680 --> 00:03:28,481 Speaker 2: oh my gosh, I'm so sorry. I've given you the 51 00:03:28,561 --> 00:03:33,521 Speaker 2: wrong directions. So the buses that a standstill, but she 52 00:03:33,601 --> 00:03:35,641 Speaker 2: had told us to go on that bus and head 53 00:03:35,721 --> 00:03:38,321 Speaker 2: that way. She apologized, and we pressed the button to 54 00:03:38,401 --> 00:03:40,241 Speaker 2: let the bus drive, and know we wanted to jump off, 55 00:03:40,281 --> 00:03:44,201 Speaker 2: and we're literally with all of our suitcases jump off 56 00:03:44,241 --> 00:03:47,361 Speaker 2: the bus. We run across the road in all the 57 00:03:47,401 --> 00:03:50,161 Speaker 2: traffic and we were waving down the bus that's coming 58 00:03:50,161 --> 00:03:51,881 Speaker 2: saying please stop, please stop, we want to get on 59 00:03:51,921 --> 00:03:55,321 Speaker 2: the bus. After a massive day traveling, we finally made it. 60 00:03:55,881 --> 00:03:59,121 Speaker 2: Then the next challenge we faced was finding the key 61 00:04:00,001 --> 00:04:03,881 Speaker 2: and then getting our luggage up the staircase. Yes, that 62 00:04:04,041 --> 00:04:08,321 Speaker 2: staircase was a physical challenge, I must say. 63 00:04:08,761 --> 00:04:09,321 Speaker 1: I remember I. 64 00:04:09,281 --> 00:04:13,241 Speaker 2: Had my case turned sideways lifting it up onto each 65 00:04:13,321 --> 00:04:16,561 Speaker 2: step because I could not walk with my bag next 66 00:04:16,601 --> 00:04:18,721 Speaker 2: to me, so it was a case of either a 67 00:04:18,761 --> 00:04:20,481 Speaker 2: hold in front of me or drag it behind me, 68 00:04:20,521 --> 00:04:22,521 Speaker 2: which was kind of impossible because I think it weighed 69 00:04:23,121 --> 00:04:27,320 Speaker 2: twenty five kilos or thirty kilos something ridiculous. And I 70 00:04:27,361 --> 00:04:30,441 Speaker 2: think you captured that, which traditioned me. You were doing 71 00:04:31,041 --> 00:04:33,520 Speaker 2: very out of breath because we were up on the 72 00:04:33,561 --> 00:04:35,201 Speaker 2: top floor as well, what are. 73 00:04:35,081 --> 00:04:46,801 Speaker 1: You actually doing right now? Stick stepping around? There we go. 74 00:04:48,001 --> 00:04:49,121 Speaker 1: This a good challenge. 75 00:04:54,801 --> 00:04:58,481 Speaker 2: God. I felt so privileged to even be staying in 76 00:04:58,561 --> 00:05:02,241 Speaker 2: such a place, just you know, the surroundings and where 77 00:05:02,241 --> 00:05:04,520 Speaker 2: we were at and that sort of thing. So it 78 00:05:04,641 --> 00:05:07,320 Speaker 2: was just be back in time. It's actually I would 79 00:05:07,401 --> 00:05:11,880 Speaker 2: encourage anybody to go and actually witness Luxembourg. It is amazing, 80 00:05:11,921 --> 00:05:14,921 Speaker 2: and I again felt very privileged to be back there 81 00:05:14,961 --> 00:05:17,841 Speaker 2: doing another search, just digging a bit deeper with a 82 00:05:17,841 --> 00:05:20,841 Speaker 2: bit more information that we have, because what people have 83 00:05:20,921 --> 00:05:24,080 Speaker 2: to remember too when they're listening to these episodes that 84 00:05:24,081 --> 00:05:27,801 Speaker 2: we're talking about. When I went with Channel seven, we 85 00:05:27,801 --> 00:05:31,001 Speaker 2: didn't know about reck Blum. We were looking for Fernand Ramkel. 86 00:05:31,761 --> 00:05:34,601 Speaker 2: So it was a Wednesday, and the next day we 87 00:05:34,641 --> 00:05:38,121 Speaker 2: had a big day planned. We decided that we were 88 00:05:38,161 --> 00:05:40,801 Speaker 2: going to first stop was to head out on the 89 00:05:40,841 --> 00:05:45,121 Speaker 2: bus to a place called it Zinc, which is a 90 00:05:45,121 --> 00:05:51,200 Speaker 2: little town in the commune of s ber and Esparage 91 00:05:51,681 --> 00:05:55,401 Speaker 2: in southern Luxembourg, with a population of only two four 92 00:05:55,481 --> 00:05:58,681 Speaker 2: hundred and fourteen people. So you can literally walk the 93 00:05:58,841 --> 00:06:03,440 Speaker 2: entire area in under an hour. It's cold, it's raining again. 94 00:06:04,081 --> 00:06:06,401 Speaker 2: We're rugged up with our puffa jackets. You can hear 95 00:06:06,481 --> 00:06:10,361 Speaker 2: a swagon along with a constantly and everything that we're 96 00:06:10,401 --> 00:06:11,321 Speaker 2: trying to capture. 97 00:06:25,041 --> 00:06:25,641 Speaker 3: I think. 98 00:06:27,201 --> 00:06:29,880 Speaker 1: I really hope she's home. I really hope she wants 99 00:06:29,921 --> 00:06:33,960 Speaker 1: to talk to us. I didn't send her an email 100 00:06:34,320 --> 00:06:35,001 Speaker 1: that would have to go. 101 00:06:36,521 --> 00:06:39,081 Speaker 2: We're not sure if she checks the email or not, 102 00:06:39,121 --> 00:06:41,801 Speaker 2: because it's her old work email and she obviously hasn't 103 00:06:41,801 --> 00:06:45,640 Speaker 2: worked for a very long time, so we do know 104 00:06:45,721 --> 00:06:48,361 Speaker 2: she was using that email, but probably didn't check her 105 00:06:48,440 --> 00:06:51,161 Speaker 2: very regularly, so she might not. 106 00:06:52,681 --> 00:06:57,601 Speaker 1: Have seen it. I want to see if I could 107 00:06:57,641 --> 00:07:04,441 Speaker 1: find some flowers or something to bring. It doesn't look 108 00:07:04,521 --> 00:07:21,521 Speaker 1: too many shops for the next three plums. How did 109 00:07:21,561 --> 00:07:35,801 Speaker 1: you know that? Because it's awesome. Okay, so we will 110 00:07:39,081 --> 00:07:44,361 Speaker 1: training in lud to day. Good luck, we la, so 111 00:07:44,561 --> 00:07:51,161 Speaker 1: we will let you go up through the Liberation every year. Yeah, 112 00:07:51,961 --> 00:07:55,201 Speaker 1: and then we go left down. 113 00:07:55,321 --> 00:07:58,801 Speaker 4: Ruby Commerce, and then the Finance, and then we go 114 00:07:59,161 --> 00:08:00,481 Speaker 4: right at Ruby's. 115 00:08:00,521 --> 00:08:06,081 Speaker 1: Funny kind, I remember how. 116 00:08:05,961 --> 00:08:13,721 Speaker 2: You did that. So we arrive and we jump off 117 00:08:14,041 --> 00:08:17,081 Speaker 2: the bus and we decided to go straight around to Manique's. 118 00:08:17,361 --> 00:08:19,441 Speaker 2: We were really hoping that she'd be home and we 119 00:08:19,521 --> 00:08:22,761 Speaker 2: could just gently knock on the door. I had emailed 120 00:08:22,881 --> 00:08:25,961 Speaker 2: her like a month prior, just to let her know 121 00:08:26,081 --> 00:08:28,321 Speaker 2: that we were coming. I hadn't heard from her. But 122 00:08:28,961 --> 00:08:31,441 Speaker 2: at the same time, the email was an old email 123 00:08:31,481 --> 00:08:34,401 Speaker 2: address we didn't even know she received. It, didn't have 124 00:08:34,561 --> 00:08:35,721 Speaker 2: contact details for her. 125 00:08:38,601 --> 00:08:39,881 Speaker 1: Such a weird feeling. 126 00:08:41,161 --> 00:08:45,721 Speaker 2: Here we are should so hello Ago, So I can't. 127 00:08:45,761 --> 00:08:49,961 Speaker 2: I'm just not a breasting for this one time one 128 00:08:50,041 --> 00:08:52,761 Speaker 2: in my head right this second. Yeah, it's not sure 129 00:08:52,761 --> 00:08:54,881 Speaker 2: if you are. But what did he live in that 130 00:08:55,001 --> 00:08:58,801 Speaker 2: house around the corner nineteen eighty one? Unlikely that any 131 00:08:58,881 --> 00:09:01,201 Speaker 2: of the neighbors, but maybe if shed. 132 00:09:01,081 --> 00:09:01,641 Speaker 1: Not one member. 133 00:09:02,121 --> 00:09:05,921 Speaker 2: Yes, I've looked and tracked all the names around him, 134 00:09:06,961 --> 00:09:09,921 Speaker 2: and unfortunately none of them are alive. The ones that 135 00:09:10,401 --> 00:09:15,321 Speaker 2: were contacted cannot recall and the parents cannot recall either. 136 00:09:15,561 --> 00:09:17,801 Speaker 2: There was a lot of young families. This was a 137 00:09:17,841 --> 00:09:22,401 Speaker 2: brand new subdivision when they moved in, so it was 138 00:09:22,441 --> 00:09:24,001 Speaker 2: getting sort of built around them. 139 00:09:25,801 --> 00:09:26,441 Speaker 1: Is that hard of that? 140 00:09:26,681 --> 00:09:31,881 Speaker 2: Yeah, that's it, Okay, So she's been here all this time, Sally. 141 00:09:32,161 --> 00:09:35,241 Speaker 2: He said that she lived from when he wrote the 142 00:09:35,321 --> 00:09:36,521 Speaker 2: letter in the eighties. 143 00:09:36,561 --> 00:09:37,441 Speaker 1: That's what I was, Manie. 144 00:09:38,401 --> 00:09:41,041 Speaker 2: So we hoped to rock up with some flowers. I 145 00:09:41,121 --> 00:09:44,201 Speaker 2: was desperately trying to find somewhere to buy something for her, 146 00:09:44,241 --> 00:09:46,001 Speaker 2: even a cake or something, and there was just nothing. 147 00:09:46,081 --> 00:09:50,321 Speaker 2: There was no shops anywhere to be found. And what's interesting, 148 00:09:50,401 --> 00:09:53,201 Speaker 2: and you're here. When we were sort of recording ourselves, 149 00:09:53,761 --> 00:09:55,681 Speaker 2: it sounds like I've gone up and I'm like, we're 150 00:09:55,721 --> 00:09:57,841 Speaker 2: at the wrong place. So we went to the wrong house. 151 00:09:58,401 --> 00:10:01,281 Speaker 2: And when we've gone back since, we've had a look 152 00:10:01,361 --> 00:10:04,521 Speaker 2: at Google Earth and we've looked at the photo of 153 00:10:05,121 --> 00:10:08,561 Speaker 2: us standing with Channel seven at that front door. And 154 00:10:08,681 --> 00:10:10,361 Speaker 2: at the time I went with Channel seven, it was 155 00:10:10,441 --> 00:10:13,881 Speaker 2: just a black wall and there was nothing next to it. 156 00:10:14,241 --> 00:10:17,081 Speaker 2: But looking at it, it actually was something being built 157 00:10:17,281 --> 00:10:20,281 Speaker 2: next to it. And in today's world, there's actually another 158 00:10:20,401 --> 00:10:23,281 Speaker 2: house that's been built which is identical to the one 159 00:10:23,441 --> 00:10:26,681 Speaker 2: that Manique Cornelius lives in, and it has exactly the 160 00:10:26,721 --> 00:10:29,481 Speaker 2: same pathway up to the door. So for me, I'm like, no, no, 161 00:10:29,641 --> 00:10:31,521 Speaker 2: we were at the end, there was nothing next to us, 162 00:10:31,601 --> 00:10:34,041 Speaker 2: and I was really playing with my head a little bit, 163 00:10:34,641 --> 00:10:36,921 Speaker 2: and you were even like, yeah, I remember, I remember. 164 00:10:37,041 --> 00:10:39,041 Speaker 2: But we've gone back and had a look and we've 165 00:10:39,161 --> 00:10:41,361 Speaker 2: worked out that there was a new place being built 166 00:10:41,441 --> 00:10:41,881 Speaker 2: next door. 167 00:10:42,241 --> 00:10:44,641 Speaker 1: So we went up to the front. 168 00:10:44,441 --> 00:10:48,041 Speaker 2: Door and we've standing there and we look at the 169 00:10:48,681 --> 00:10:54,121 Speaker 2: door bell and it says Cornelius and then above it 170 00:10:54,601 --> 00:10:58,521 Speaker 2: is the name Blum. I swear to girl, we must 171 00:10:58,521 --> 00:11:00,921 Speaker 2: have knocked on the wrong door when we came with Brian, 172 00:11:01,041 --> 00:11:03,841 Speaker 2: because we went up to that apricoc colored house and walked. 173 00:11:03,881 --> 00:11:06,441 Speaker 1: There's footage of me doing it. Yeah, I know there is. 174 00:11:06,921 --> 00:11:09,361 Speaker 2: We've gone to the wrong house, and you know what else, 175 00:11:10,601 --> 00:11:14,241 Speaker 2: we would have noticed the Blum and Cornelius on the door. 176 00:11:14,481 --> 00:11:18,161 Speaker 2: So just for those of you who weren't here and 177 00:11:18,281 --> 00:11:26,201 Speaker 2: couldn't see on her bell a little plark that is 178 00:11:27,681 --> 00:11:31,881 Speaker 2: actually engraved, so it's not just handwritten, but saying Blum 179 00:11:32,521 --> 00:11:35,881 Speaker 2: at the top and Cornelius at the bottom. So I've 180 00:11:35,921 --> 00:11:39,601 Speaker 2: taken a photo of it. What the hell is that about? 181 00:11:40,761 --> 00:11:47,201 Speaker 2: What the hell is that about? That is bizarre, but 182 00:11:47,321 --> 00:11:53,641 Speaker 2: you I'm going to look for that footage. Definitely colored door. 183 00:11:53,681 --> 00:11:54,281 Speaker 1: I remember it. 184 00:11:54,561 --> 00:11:57,641 Speaker 2: I'm pretty certain I remember just walking up like a platform, 185 00:11:59,161 --> 00:12:01,801 Speaker 2: which I mean that where I went death then was 186 00:12:01,841 --> 00:12:04,761 Speaker 2: a platform of sorts as well. So I might be wrong, 187 00:12:04,841 --> 00:12:07,241 Speaker 2: but my memory was that it was I walked up 188 00:12:07,321 --> 00:12:09,521 Speaker 2: and then a long kind of like a because I 189 00:12:09,561 --> 00:12:12,041 Speaker 2: remember standing there looking back at Paul because he was 190 00:12:13,081 --> 00:12:16,041 Speaker 2: she was using the camera from the car, and I 191 00:12:16,161 --> 00:12:17,841 Speaker 2: was looking back towards him. 192 00:12:17,881 --> 00:12:19,041 Speaker 1: And Brian and I went up to the. 193 00:12:19,081 --> 00:12:22,601 Speaker 2: Door together and we would have like I would have 194 00:12:22,721 --> 00:12:25,841 Speaker 2: remembered if we'd seen a bell with Blum on it. 195 00:12:26,481 --> 00:12:29,681 Speaker 1: Yep, what is that about? I'm going to ask her 196 00:12:29,681 --> 00:12:30,001 Speaker 1: about that. 197 00:12:31,401 --> 00:12:34,761 Speaker 2: So has Tom been to her house and Alison's been 198 00:12:34,761 --> 00:12:36,561 Speaker 2: to her house and no one's brought that up? 199 00:12:37,121 --> 00:12:37,801 Speaker 5: I can't lean on. 200 00:12:37,961 --> 00:12:43,761 Speaker 1: Maybe so above it is the name Blum B l 201 00:12:44,001 --> 00:12:44,481 Speaker 1: U M. 202 00:12:45,921 --> 00:12:50,441 Speaker 2: It has residue all over it of sticky tape, which 203 00:12:50,641 --> 00:12:54,521 Speaker 2: would indicate to me personally that it's been covered with something. 204 00:12:54,921 --> 00:12:58,321 Speaker 2: And then above it, on the actual wall, it's written 205 00:12:58,481 --> 00:13:02,441 Speaker 2: Cornelius in handwriting with arrows pointing down to it, So 206 00:13:02,561 --> 00:13:04,361 Speaker 2: that kind of was a bit of a bombshell moment 207 00:13:04,441 --> 00:13:06,601 Speaker 2: for you and I. We were like, what the hell 208 00:13:07,281 --> 00:13:11,201 Speaker 2: does that mean? Why is there Blum and Cornelius on 209 00:13:11,361 --> 00:13:13,801 Speaker 2: the same face plate. It's on the same piece of metal. 210 00:13:14,361 --> 00:13:17,881 Speaker 2: There's not two separate pieces of metal. And they're engraved, yes, 211 00:13:18,241 --> 00:13:20,281 Speaker 2: so they must have been engraved at the same time. 212 00:13:21,041 --> 00:13:25,881 Speaker 2: And us knowing Rick Blum with the same spelling. That 213 00:13:26,721 --> 00:13:29,481 Speaker 2: was quite mind blowing for me. I was like, I'm 214 00:13:29,561 --> 00:13:32,161 Speaker 2: so confused, as so what this means and what is. 215 00:13:32,201 --> 00:13:34,241 Speaker 1: Going on here? And how do we work that out? 216 00:13:34,281 --> 00:13:37,681 Speaker 2: Because Rick Bloom didn't change his name too, Rick Bloom 217 00:13:38,321 --> 00:13:42,721 Speaker 2: until twenty Fifteen's interesting. And then I was going, oh, well, 218 00:13:42,761 --> 00:13:44,841 Speaker 2: how did we not notice this when we were here 219 00:13:44,961 --> 00:13:48,241 Speaker 2: in twenty nineteen. Well, Sally, that was because in twenty nineteen. 220 00:13:48,721 --> 00:13:50,961 Speaker 2: And this is something I have to struggle with as 221 00:13:51,041 --> 00:13:54,321 Speaker 2: I'm going through the story as well, because I'm constantly 222 00:13:54,441 --> 00:13:56,881 Speaker 2: going I know that now I've got to pull myself 223 00:13:56,961 --> 00:13:59,001 Speaker 2: back to what did I know in twenty nineteen as 224 00:13:59,041 --> 00:14:01,121 Speaker 2: opposed to what do I know now in twenty twenty five. 225 00:14:01,681 --> 00:14:03,601 Speaker 2: That's actually a very hard thing to do, especially when 226 00:14:03,641 --> 00:14:06,881 Speaker 2: you're constantly talking about it people and trying to rehash 227 00:14:07,081 --> 00:14:09,241 Speaker 2: the story, it can get a little bit messy in 228 00:14:09,281 --> 00:14:13,681 Speaker 2: your head. But anyway, we were there. We were just 229 00:14:14,321 --> 00:14:19,761 Speaker 2: our minds were blown there for a moment. So after that, 230 00:14:19,921 --> 00:14:23,201 Speaker 2: I guess our mind's a kind of spinning cell around. 231 00:14:23,641 --> 00:14:25,121 Speaker 1: Okay, what does this actually mean? 232 00:14:25,241 --> 00:14:28,081 Speaker 2: And of course I'm sort of thinking to myself, well, 233 00:14:28,161 --> 00:14:31,321 Speaker 2: how can we actually find this information and find out 234 00:14:31,681 --> 00:14:35,681 Speaker 2: who that individual was that was residing in that second apartment. 235 00:14:36,681 --> 00:14:40,601 Speaker 2: So we then walk off. We sort of think, I'm 236 00:14:40,681 --> 00:14:43,081 Speaker 2: not quite sure if Nick's home. We haven't seen any 237 00:14:43,201 --> 00:14:46,241 Speaker 2: rattling of the curtains or movement or anything like that, 238 00:14:47,281 --> 00:14:49,841 Speaker 2: so we walk off when we think to ourselves, okay, 239 00:14:50,561 --> 00:14:55,041 Speaker 2: let's look to see we'll actually physically walk between Menique's 240 00:14:55,081 --> 00:14:59,721 Speaker 2: house and Rick Bloom's house in its dish So obviously 241 00:14:59,841 --> 00:15:01,761 Speaker 2: it's not the apartment that we were at, or was 242 00:15:01,801 --> 00:15:04,481 Speaker 2: at another address, so we thought we'd go ahead and 243 00:15:04,601 --> 00:15:07,081 Speaker 2: do that. Well, I think something you and I had 244 00:15:07,281 --> 00:15:10,721 Speaker 2: talked about this before we went, and how the fact 245 00:15:10,761 --> 00:15:13,361 Speaker 2: that you had been able to establish that Rick Blum 246 00:15:13,561 --> 00:15:19,001 Speaker 2: lived with Diane and his kids at one point and 247 00:15:19,281 --> 00:15:23,721 Speaker 2: Manique Cornelius was in walking distance and we wanted to 248 00:15:23,801 --> 00:15:27,921 Speaker 2: sort of capture that and see what that was like. 249 00:15:28,281 --> 00:15:31,161 Speaker 2: So we went off on a trip and we said, 250 00:15:31,241 --> 00:15:34,241 Speaker 2: let's walk around to where we know that house to 251 00:15:34,321 --> 00:15:38,961 Speaker 2: be yes to me, it's actually quite astonishing in a 252 00:15:39,041 --> 00:15:43,681 Speaker 2: way that Monique was living obviously in a different place, 253 00:15:44,441 --> 00:15:49,281 Speaker 2: and she was literally two blocks away from Frederick Dehadavari 254 00:15:49,401 --> 00:15:52,281 Speaker 2: or Rick Bloom's apartment which was on the corner their 255 00:15:52,281 --> 00:15:53,401 Speaker 2: opposite the soccer field. 256 00:15:53,561 --> 00:15:56,121 Speaker 1: So we walked it, didn't we so there was it 257 00:15:56,281 --> 00:15:59,081 Speaker 1: was literally what was it like a two minute walk? 258 00:15:59,641 --> 00:16:02,441 Speaker 2: So why is that important? Do we think during kondos 259 00:16:03,121 --> 00:16:08,041 Speaker 2: well of the day if you live you is that 260 00:16:08,201 --> 00:16:10,201 Speaker 2: if you have someone who is willing to. 261 00:16:12,161 --> 00:16:16,561 Speaker 4: Carry out an affair extra manitial affair that close to 262 00:16:17,081 --> 00:16:19,841 Speaker 4: your family's home with a pregnant wife and. 263 00:16:19,921 --> 00:16:20,881 Speaker 1: A newborn baby. 264 00:16:21,841 --> 00:16:24,361 Speaker 4: Especially I think in an area like this on a 265 00:16:24,441 --> 00:16:31,401 Speaker 4: plateau surrounded by forests, farmlands, etc. And I just wonder 266 00:16:31,521 --> 00:16:34,641 Speaker 4: if people would have even noticed someone bobbing in and 267 00:16:34,761 --> 00:16:38,961 Speaker 4: out of each home. It's just quite an interesting kind 268 00:16:39,001 --> 00:16:43,801 Speaker 4: of situation, I think, because we just wonder whether if 269 00:16:43,921 --> 00:16:47,321 Speaker 4: there was a willingness you actually do so you know 270 00:16:47,601 --> 00:16:51,361 Speaker 4: Marion's case could also be a learning from Marrying's space. 271 00:16:52,561 --> 00:16:55,521 Speaker 2: Well, just not to make assumptions, right, just to sit 272 00:16:55,601 --> 00:16:58,521 Speaker 2: there and say, if all my mum's money was coming 273 00:16:58,561 --> 00:17:01,481 Speaker 2: out of a bank account in Byron Bay, it seems 274 00:17:01,481 --> 00:17:02,281 Speaker 2: a little bit too. 275 00:17:02,241 --> 00:17:05,361 Speaker 1: Close for comfort. You know, I've said it a billion times. 276 00:17:05,401 --> 00:17:07,080 Speaker 2: It's not like the money was coming out of a 277 00:17:07,121 --> 00:17:11,000 Speaker 2: bank account in Western Australia. Every single point of interest 278 00:17:11,160 --> 00:17:16,080 Speaker 2: is around that neck of the woods, Armadale, Grafton, Byron. 279 00:17:17,961 --> 00:17:21,160 Speaker 4: It's not unthinkable, but there would be There would be 280 00:17:21,360 --> 00:17:25,681 Speaker 4: an okayness with having somebody very close to your family home. 281 00:17:25,721 --> 00:17:28,400 Speaker 1: I mean, Jennet Oldenberg was only a short drive away, 282 00:17:28,921 --> 00:17:33,120 Speaker 1: so yeah, not a problem. Where was my mum not 283 00:17:33,321 --> 00:17:33,801 Speaker 1: a problem? 284 00:17:34,600 --> 00:17:36,680 Speaker 2: Yeah? I'm glad we cleared that up because I actually 285 00:17:37,001 --> 00:17:38,801 Speaker 2: I was confused by that, because I did think this 286 00:17:38,961 --> 00:17:40,640 Speaker 2: is where they were living close. 287 00:17:40,441 --> 00:17:42,521 Speaker 1: To each other. But then the love ness thing threw 288 00:17:42,600 --> 00:17:45,880 Speaker 1: me a little bit. Well, maybe we'll walk back. 289 00:17:45,801 --> 00:17:48,681 Speaker 2: To Moniques and see if she's there. I'm really doubtful 290 00:17:48,761 --> 00:17:51,240 Speaker 2: that she's going to be there. We could always come 291 00:17:51,321 --> 00:17:53,961 Speaker 2: back again tomorrow if we wanted to. 292 00:17:54,201 --> 00:17:56,481 Speaker 1: It's not that much of a ride here and back again. 293 00:17:56,640 --> 00:17:58,281 Speaker 1: I didn't find it too difficult. 294 00:17:59,160 --> 00:18:01,240 Speaker 2: I think it's wild to think and we're not going 295 00:18:01,321 --> 00:18:04,360 Speaker 2: to make any accusations about anything, but people can sort 296 00:18:04,400 --> 00:18:07,561 Speaker 2: of put them their own ideas into how that might 297 00:18:07,640 --> 00:18:11,961 Speaker 2: play out in a normal circumstance where you might choose 298 00:18:12,041 --> 00:18:16,160 Speaker 2: to have a relationship with another person that's within walking 299 00:18:16,241 --> 00:18:19,801 Speaker 2: distance in a population that is not very big. I mean, 300 00:18:19,840 --> 00:18:22,281 Speaker 2: we could hear the kids playing in the playground and 301 00:18:22,400 --> 00:18:26,561 Speaker 2: it was just quiet, and it was not bustling and 302 00:18:26,681 --> 00:18:29,361 Speaker 2: bouncing and where you could get lost. It was like, oh, 303 00:18:29,761 --> 00:18:32,360 Speaker 2: that person walked down the road and kicked a stone 304 00:18:32,561 --> 00:18:35,521 Speaker 2: and it hit a mailbox, like some that would be 305 00:18:35,640 --> 00:18:38,360 Speaker 2: something that would be captured because it's so quiet. 306 00:18:38,481 --> 00:18:40,681 Speaker 1: It's actually a lot more built up now to sale. 307 00:18:40,801 --> 00:18:44,081 Speaker 2: So like in nineteen eighty it was a very very 308 00:18:44,321 --> 00:18:47,880 Speaker 2: brand new suburb too, so a lot of the stuff 309 00:18:47,961 --> 00:18:50,401 Speaker 2: that we saw when we were there wouldn't have even 310 00:18:50,521 --> 00:18:53,361 Speaker 2: been there, Like there was still houses being built there 311 00:18:54,201 --> 00:18:57,001 Speaker 2: from the ground up in the mid eighties. So it 312 00:18:57,160 --> 00:19:01,801 Speaker 2: was a very new, very quiet, very family oriented, kind 313 00:19:01,880 --> 00:19:07,721 Speaker 2: of small, little outlying address. And I probably would say too, 314 00:19:07,921 --> 00:19:10,360 Speaker 2: like Johnny and I just recently did a bit of 315 00:19:10,441 --> 00:19:14,561 Speaker 2: a drive around northern New South Wales, and what stood 316 00:19:14,561 --> 00:19:19,281 Speaker 2: out to me was the locations of some of the 317 00:19:19,840 --> 00:19:24,921 Speaker 2: choices that Rick Blum made as far as his housing goes, 318 00:19:24,961 --> 00:19:27,961 Speaker 2: and that covers all the way from Tasmania to Northern 319 00:19:28,001 --> 00:19:32,001 Speaker 2: New South Wales, Queens the UK to Queens like you. 320 00:19:32,281 --> 00:19:34,280 Speaker 2: If you look at all of the addresses, they are 321 00:19:35,041 --> 00:19:38,401 Speaker 2: just in the middle of absolutely nowhere, And it kind 322 00:19:38,441 --> 00:19:41,001 Speaker 2: of made me scratch my head to think, why would 323 00:19:41,041 --> 00:19:43,920 Speaker 2: you move there? Like, what would be the purpose of 324 00:19:44,801 --> 00:19:50,921 Speaker 2: moving to such a strange, remote, quiet location. I keep 325 00:19:51,041 --> 00:19:53,081 Speaker 2: saying someone somewhere or something. 326 00:19:54,001 --> 00:19:57,440 Speaker 6: That is where we are now. Yep, that is Rick's 327 00:19:57,481 --> 00:20:00,481 Speaker 6: house and that is Menique's house back in nineteen eighty two. 328 00:20:01,441 --> 00:20:04,400 Speaker 6: So maybe go to Rix and then walk to Manique 329 00:20:04,481 --> 00:20:07,840 Speaker 6: because our us will be up around Linette's if we 330 00:20:07,961 --> 00:20:09,521 Speaker 6: can't get on, but we'll come back down. 331 00:20:09,640 --> 00:20:10,241 Speaker 1: It doesn't matter. 332 00:20:11,201 --> 00:20:13,161 Speaker 2: So I think we got here and go up there 333 00:20:13,360 --> 00:20:15,600 Speaker 2: and come back, and we'll come back and see if 334 00:20:15,640 --> 00:20:18,001 Speaker 2: she's back here again. It's too far to come to 335 00:20:18,120 --> 00:20:21,321 Speaker 2: not check again. Would give it an hour or so. 336 00:20:21,561 --> 00:20:24,761 Speaker 2: She might be out getting groceries or something. He was 337 00:20:24,880 --> 00:20:25,920 Speaker 2: in radio, if he was of. 338 00:20:26,001 --> 00:20:30,080 Speaker 1: The journalist radio he lived across the road. Yeah, I 339 00:20:30,120 --> 00:20:30,721 Speaker 1: wouldn't do that. 340 00:20:30,840 --> 00:20:32,761 Speaker 2: Now they're going to be fair looking at us. I 341 00:20:32,801 --> 00:20:35,961 Speaker 2: don't really want to upset anybody. Yeah, I'm going to move, 342 00:20:36,481 --> 00:20:44,160 Speaker 2: but I'll just get the napping out and everything. So 343 00:20:44,681 --> 00:20:48,321 Speaker 2: we've walked back and forth, We've done loops of its 344 00:20:48,360 --> 00:20:52,041 Speaker 2: itch to try and get a feel for the area. 345 00:20:52,400 --> 00:20:54,481 Speaker 2: We decide we go back to Monique and knock on 346 00:20:54,521 --> 00:20:57,121 Speaker 2: the door for a second time to see if she's 347 00:20:57,201 --> 00:21:00,521 Speaker 2: come home. Maybe she's gone out for the morning, Maybe 348 00:21:00,600 --> 00:21:01,840 Speaker 2: she'll be there when we get back. 349 00:21:04,080 --> 00:21:07,441 Speaker 1: The houses there were up quite high. 350 00:21:08,561 --> 00:21:11,881 Speaker 2: You can see the wind turnbines in in the distance there. 351 00:21:12,880 --> 00:21:16,001 Speaker 1: This would be the view from Moniques. Yeah, she feels 352 00:21:16,001 --> 00:21:21,321 Speaker 1: like it's going to rain. Probably should have suggested to 353 00:21:21,321 --> 00:21:26,681 Speaker 1: the umbrellas, good umbrellas. We just go back and get 354 00:21:26,721 --> 00:21:27,161 Speaker 1: on the bus. 355 00:21:28,640 --> 00:21:31,481 Speaker 2: We've now gone back to Monique three times over a 356 00:21:31,561 --> 00:21:34,721 Speaker 2: few hours, but she just was not home. We decided 357 00:21:35,001 --> 00:21:39,440 Speaker 2: probably should eat something, so we googled where where was 358 00:21:39,481 --> 00:21:41,481 Speaker 2: the closest place to eat and there was a pub 359 00:21:42,120 --> 00:21:46,321 Speaker 2: of sorts down the bottom of the hill. So we 360 00:21:47,120 --> 00:21:50,041 Speaker 2: made our way down a very steep part of the 361 00:21:50,160 --> 00:21:54,881 Speaker 2: road and went into a pub where they were serving 362 00:21:55,080 --> 00:22:00,721 Speaker 2: fritz and steak. No one spoke any English, so we 363 00:22:00,880 --> 00:22:02,640 Speaker 2: were the only two women in there. There was a 364 00:22:02,721 --> 00:22:05,561 Speaker 2: couple of men and the lady who ran the pub. 365 00:22:05,721 --> 00:22:09,080 Speaker 2: We just sat there, ordered our meal and just hoped 366 00:22:09,120 --> 00:22:11,041 Speaker 2: for the best that it was actually going to come. 367 00:22:11,840 --> 00:22:14,400 Speaker 2: And then the lady actually came over, and I guess 368 00:22:14,521 --> 00:22:18,121 Speaker 2: we just launched into the whole scenario of why we're there. 369 00:22:18,201 --> 00:22:20,681 Speaker 2: I guess she would have been wondering why we were there, 370 00:22:21,120 --> 00:22:25,120 Speaker 2: you know, two ozzie Australian women who didn't speak a 371 00:22:25,201 --> 00:22:27,761 Speaker 2: word of Luxembourgish, French or German. 372 00:22:28,561 --> 00:22:30,041 Speaker 1: So they were really great. Like. 373 00:22:30,241 --> 00:22:33,721 Speaker 2: She then spoke to another man who we found out 374 00:22:33,880 --> 00:22:37,080 Speaker 2: was her husband, wasn't it, And they all seemed quite interested, 375 00:22:37,281 --> 00:22:40,640 Speaker 2: and she actually took a couple of the postcards and. 376 00:22:40,721 --> 00:22:43,600 Speaker 1: Put them up where people would pay and things like that. 377 00:22:44,400 --> 00:22:46,761 Speaker 2: So yeah, so when we ate, and we were in 378 00:22:46,880 --> 00:22:48,440 Speaker 2: a bit of a rash, right because we wanted to 379 00:22:48,481 --> 00:22:51,761 Speaker 2: get back up the hill that your plant of fasciitis 380 00:22:51,921 --> 00:22:54,120 Speaker 2: was playing up, if I remember correctly, and my ankle 381 00:22:54,241 --> 00:22:56,521 Speaker 2: was a little bit dodgy. Yeah, so we walked back 382 00:22:56,600 --> 00:22:59,840 Speaker 2: up the road a bit. There was a gentleman sitting there, 383 00:23:00,041 --> 00:23:03,441 Speaker 2: and you walked over to ask him if he was elderly. 384 00:23:03,600 --> 00:23:05,200 Speaker 2: So you thought, oh, I might go on to to 385 00:23:05,281 --> 00:23:08,520 Speaker 2: him and see if he knows anything. So you went 386 00:23:08,640 --> 00:23:10,321 Speaker 2: up and showed him one of the cards, and I 387 00:23:10,400 --> 00:23:12,400 Speaker 2: think he saluted you or something nice. 388 00:23:13,120 --> 00:23:15,400 Speaker 1: Were just handing out our cards. So there's a. 389 00:23:16,880 --> 00:23:19,561 Speaker 2: Lovely old gentleman here that looks about the right age. 390 00:23:20,001 --> 00:23:22,201 Speaker 2: So Johny's just going to walk over there and ask 391 00:23:22,360 --> 00:23:26,801 Speaker 2: him if he's familiar. But you better hurry though, because 392 00:23:26,801 --> 00:23:32,761 Speaker 2: the boss is going to come. Oh this is intense. 393 00:23:34,561 --> 00:23:40,240 Speaker 2: It's interesting people reading these cards. No, he doesn't know him, 394 00:23:41,441 --> 00:23:44,521 Speaker 2: gives us another salute. It's a bit of a big ask. 395 00:23:44,600 --> 00:23:47,281 Speaker 2: He was only here for for two years, I guess, 396 00:23:47,400 --> 00:23:51,361 Speaker 2: but was in Luxembourg for longer, so you just never never, 397 00:23:51,481 --> 00:23:51,801 Speaker 2: never know. 398 00:23:52,001 --> 00:23:55,801 Speaker 1: That's why we're here. Oh well, good to ask. Anyway. 399 00:23:56,080 --> 00:23:59,360 Speaker 2: It was time for Sally to once again go to 400 00:23:59,441 --> 00:24:02,161 Speaker 2: the ladies, so I said to Johnny, wait here, I'm 401 00:24:02,201 --> 00:24:04,840 Speaker 2: going to run down quickly back to the pub and 402 00:24:05,201 --> 00:24:08,441 Speaker 2: the bathroom, because there was literally nothing anywhere wherever we'd 403 00:24:08,521 --> 00:24:11,801 Speaker 2: been this day. And when I walked in there, the 404 00:24:11,921 --> 00:24:14,840 Speaker 2: lady had already popped the postcards that we'd left with 405 00:24:14,921 --> 00:24:17,160 Speaker 2: her up on the wall of the pub, so I 406 00:24:17,281 --> 00:24:20,321 Speaker 2: was very grateful there was that language barrier, but it's 407 00:24:20,360 --> 00:24:23,241 Speaker 2: so interesting when you actually try your best. So we 408 00:24:23,321 --> 00:24:26,241 Speaker 2: were trying our best to communicate with her in their language, 409 00:24:26,241 --> 00:24:27,960 Speaker 2: and she was trying to do the same for us, 410 00:24:28,041 --> 00:24:30,160 Speaker 2: And it was just nice to have that support and 411 00:24:30,241 --> 00:24:33,001 Speaker 2: people having the shock value of knowing that, you know, 412 00:24:33,321 --> 00:24:36,721 Speaker 2: we were there looking for potentially a missing person or 413 00:24:36,801 --> 00:24:40,120 Speaker 2: connectors to a missing person. You know, it's nice to 414 00:24:40,160 --> 00:24:43,041 Speaker 2: see people actually just wanting to help and wanting to 415 00:24:43,201 --> 00:24:46,721 Speaker 2: hear what we were there for and what we were doing. 416 00:24:47,120 --> 00:24:50,321 Speaker 2: So the buses in light five minutes, all right, So 417 00:24:50,400 --> 00:24:54,041 Speaker 2: we've just tried ringing Monique again. I literally just down 418 00:24:54,120 --> 00:24:57,360 Speaker 2: the bottom from where she is, but to get down 419 00:24:57,441 --> 00:25:00,481 Speaker 2: here was like a goat track, and then we just 420 00:25:00,561 --> 00:25:03,321 Speaker 2: don't want to. My ankle's actually feeling pretty good. I 421 00:25:03,360 --> 00:25:06,201 Speaker 2: think the wall the walking has actually helped it. Surprisingly. Yeah, 422 00:25:06,201 --> 00:25:08,600 Speaker 2: I reckon my heel too, but I don't I wouldn't trust. 423 00:25:08,400 --> 00:25:10,401 Speaker 1: It on that kind of road. It's pretty hard. 424 00:25:10,801 --> 00:25:14,561 Speaker 2: Anyway, We're going to go back up the top, which 425 00:25:14,600 --> 00:25:16,280 Speaker 2: is a little frustrating because we're gonna have to get 426 00:25:16,281 --> 00:25:20,041 Speaker 2: off the bus, walk around, knock on the door, and 427 00:25:20,160 --> 00:25:22,041 Speaker 2: if she's not there again, they'll have to wait for 428 00:25:22,120 --> 00:25:23,041 Speaker 2: the bus, which. 429 00:25:22,840 --> 00:25:24,600 Speaker 1: Could take another What are the buses' journey? 430 00:25:24,640 --> 00:25:26,761 Speaker 2: Are they half an hour in between every twenty and 431 00:25:27,120 --> 00:25:29,920 Speaker 2: every twenty that's not too bad. Well, we had an 432 00:25:30,001 --> 00:25:34,160 Speaker 2: hour last night, and this is weird. Everyone will think 433 00:25:34,201 --> 00:25:37,321 Speaker 2: I'm weird now. But Owen always said that if when 434 00:25:37,360 --> 00:25:40,160 Speaker 2: he comes back after life, oh did. I used to 435 00:25:40,201 --> 00:25:42,200 Speaker 2: talk about this a lot. I used to sit there 436 00:25:42,241 --> 00:25:44,481 Speaker 2: and say I would come back as a snake. S 437 00:25:45,281 --> 00:25:48,641 Speaker 2: was for Sally, S was for snake, and Owen would 438 00:25:48,721 --> 00:25:51,641 Speaker 2: come back as an owl, which was oh for our 439 00:25:52,561 --> 00:25:54,840 Speaker 2: and I remember being kids and we were talking about 440 00:25:54,880 --> 00:26:00,041 Speaker 2: what animal we would come back in life. When we 441 00:26:00,201 --> 00:26:04,041 Speaker 2: had an hour sitting perch during the inquest A kid, 442 00:26:04,120 --> 00:26:06,400 Speaker 2: you not, it was making a little house in our 443 00:26:06,481 --> 00:26:08,001 Speaker 2: back points on up the top. 444 00:26:08,080 --> 00:26:10,720 Speaker 1: I've got photos of it. He'd be out the front 445 00:26:10,961 --> 00:26:12,561 Speaker 1: at nighttime when. 446 00:26:12,441 --> 00:26:14,440 Speaker 2: We were sitting on the deck, just looking at us. 447 00:26:15,521 --> 00:26:16,960 Speaker 1: It was the most bizarre feeling. 448 00:26:18,360 --> 00:26:21,961 Speaker 2: And then last night we arrived in Luxembourg and there's 449 00:26:21,961 --> 00:26:24,720 Speaker 2: a little happening outside the window. 450 00:26:25,281 --> 00:26:28,001 Speaker 1: But yeah, we will head up there now and we'll 451 00:26:28,041 --> 00:26:29,840 Speaker 1: just see which's home. 452 00:26:31,041 --> 00:26:34,001 Speaker 2: And then I think we're going to head into Luxembourg 453 00:26:34,241 --> 00:26:36,241 Speaker 2: City and we're going to go on and have a 454 00:26:36,281 --> 00:26:39,241 Speaker 2: look at the bank that Monique mentioned that Rick Blum 455 00:26:39,400 --> 00:26:42,321 Speaker 2: told her when they were walking through there that that's 456 00:26:42,360 --> 00:26:44,200 Speaker 2: where he banks and that's where he keeps all of 457 00:26:44,241 --> 00:26:44,680 Speaker 2: his money. 458 00:26:46,001 --> 00:26:49,681 Speaker 1: Luxembourg is a haven for, you know, people who want 459 00:26:49,721 --> 00:26:52,840 Speaker 1: to hide money. It's a bit like Switzerland. 460 00:26:54,441 --> 00:26:54,600 Speaker 2: You know. 461 00:26:54,761 --> 00:26:57,600 Speaker 1: We need to know where my mum's money went, and 462 00:26:58,120 --> 00:27:02,600 Speaker 1: I'm curious as to where that has gone. 463 00:27:03,521 --> 00:27:05,761 Speaker 2: So if we can try and find that information, that 464 00:27:05,801 --> 00:27:08,161 Speaker 2: would be good. And I mean we've got Luxembourg. Who 465 00:27:08,201 --> 00:27:10,961 Speaker 2: comes to us journey, We've got Luxembourg as a point 466 00:27:11,001 --> 00:27:13,680 Speaker 2: of interest because my mum actually you know, said on 467 00:27:13,761 --> 00:27:14,761 Speaker 2: her passenger card that. 468 00:27:14,840 --> 00:27:15,561 Speaker 1: She was leaving. 469 00:27:16,281 --> 00:27:21,241 Speaker 2: Hence, while we're leaving no stone unturned again to ensure. 470 00:27:20,921 --> 00:27:23,321 Speaker 1: That we've cost every tea and dotted every eye. 471 00:27:24,961 --> 00:27:26,881 Speaker 2: So from the pub, we hop back on the bus 472 00:27:26,961 --> 00:27:29,120 Speaker 2: and we go back up to Maniques to try her 473 00:27:29,241 --> 00:27:46,200 Speaker 2: for one last time, just thank you very much. Notice 474 00:27:48,521 --> 00:27:49,120 Speaker 2: a little weird. 475 00:27:52,160 --> 00:27:56,761 Speaker 1: So we're just walking back to Meniques. Now there's no 476 00:27:57,001 --> 00:28:01,281 Speaker 1: cars in the driveway. Yeah, this is not looking not 477 00:28:01,400 --> 00:28:12,001 Speaker 1: looking promising anyway. We all, okay, let's ring the door. 478 00:28:18,041 --> 00:28:24,001 Speaker 1: Just do you want to draw her on the phone, 479 00:28:25,041 --> 00:28:26,920 Speaker 1: because I reckon too much knocking in it is. 480 00:28:27,001 --> 00:28:29,001 Speaker 2: I've got their phone number, so how. 481 00:28:28,921 --> 00:28:33,081 Speaker 1: About we call her, so we'll go a bit further down. 482 00:28:36,360 --> 00:28:39,440 Speaker 2: The bell, said Cornelius on it on the top of 483 00:28:39,561 --> 00:28:41,201 Speaker 2: the actual physical white bell. 484 00:28:41,321 --> 00:28:44,281 Speaker 1: It said, Cornelius. I think maybe we go and do 485 00:28:44,401 --> 00:28:44,841 Speaker 1: our other. 486 00:28:44,841 --> 00:28:48,481 Speaker 2: Task and we call her on the phone and see 487 00:28:48,921 --> 00:28:50,721 Speaker 2: if she's around, because she might just be out. 488 00:28:51,841 --> 00:28:52,960 Speaker 1: You can't see any movement. 489 00:28:53,201 --> 00:28:56,641 Speaker 2: It looks fairly dark in there, so there's all forest 490 00:28:56,721 --> 00:28:59,761 Speaker 2: and farmland, and this is like up high, a little plateau. 491 00:29:01,921 --> 00:29:07,200 Speaker 1: How much would he have loved that? I mean, at 492 00:29:07,281 --> 00:29:10,481 Speaker 1: least we're backing it up with a call, so you 493 00:29:10,561 --> 00:29:12,441 Speaker 1: know what I mean. Good. 494 00:29:18,641 --> 00:29:23,200 Speaker 2: I remember, Oh my god, I remember, I remember us 495 00:29:23,281 --> 00:29:26,281 Speaker 2: being there journey and we weren't sure like we'd been 496 00:29:26,521 --> 00:29:29,001 Speaker 2: We'd sat in the park, we'd gone around to Rick 497 00:29:29,041 --> 00:29:32,121 Speaker 2: Blom's old house, we'd walked around the entire block, we'd 498 00:29:32,161 --> 00:29:34,521 Speaker 2: gone down and got something to eat. We'd now been 499 00:29:34,601 --> 00:29:38,440 Speaker 2: there for four hours trying to talk to Menique, and 500 00:29:38,761 --> 00:29:42,881 Speaker 2: she just wasn't there. And I was honestly thinking to myself, 501 00:29:43,681 --> 00:29:46,641 Speaker 2: all the eyes in the windows as well, So as 502 00:29:46,721 --> 00:29:49,401 Speaker 2: you're walking, I just felt as though if we're walking 503 00:29:49,561 --> 00:29:52,921 Speaker 2: up and down her street constantly, we moved and sat 504 00:29:52,961 --> 00:29:56,681 Speaker 2: in the park, remember, on the park bench, because we're like, ah, 505 00:29:56,881 --> 00:29:59,641 Speaker 2: there's eyes, like there's literally eyes on us. People are 506 00:29:59,641 --> 00:30:01,521 Speaker 2: probably wondering what are we doing. 507 00:30:02,041 --> 00:30:10,041 Speaker 5: I just thought, if you were, yeah, fifty one, so 508 00:30:10,161 --> 00:30:12,481 Speaker 5: six years younger than my mom, so that would make 509 00:30:12,561 --> 00:30:13,441 Speaker 5: them seventy four. 510 00:30:15,481 --> 00:30:20,921 Speaker 1: I domeber what she's doing today, probably loved them. 511 00:30:28,761 --> 00:30:32,561 Speaker 2: So we get back to our hotel and I've rung 512 00:30:32,641 --> 00:30:35,241 Speaker 2: Monique a few times, but I haven't left a voice message. 513 00:30:35,601 --> 00:30:37,321 Speaker 2: But we get back to the hotel and I said 514 00:30:37,321 --> 00:30:40,321 Speaker 2: to Joonie, maybe we had put it, like a card, 515 00:30:40,761 --> 00:30:43,161 Speaker 2: one of Mom's cards into her mailbox, if you remember, 516 00:30:43,641 --> 00:30:45,921 Speaker 2: just to let her know we had been there. But 517 00:30:46,201 --> 00:30:48,041 Speaker 2: I thought now was the time to wring her and 518 00:30:48,161 --> 00:30:51,041 Speaker 2: just leave her a voice message. We rang her and 519 00:30:51,161 --> 00:30:53,200 Speaker 2: left a left a message just to say high that 520 00:30:53,281 --> 00:30:54,960 Speaker 2: we were in the area and if she was around 521 00:30:55,561 --> 00:30:58,801 Speaker 2: tomorrow maybe we could catch up and we'd be happily 522 00:31:00,001 --> 00:31:01,641 Speaker 2: able to come back out to see her. 523 00:31:06,241 --> 00:31:14,441 Speaker 1: Futsightist EMONI spot gonna Hi, Manique. 524 00:31:14,921 --> 00:31:19,481 Speaker 2: It's Sally Laden here, Marion Barta's daughter. I popped out 525 00:31:19,601 --> 00:31:23,481 Speaker 2: yesterday to try and see if you're home. I sent 526 00:31:23,521 --> 00:31:26,561 Speaker 2: you an email a couple of weeks back seeing if 527 00:31:26,601 --> 00:31:27,721 Speaker 2: you would like to catch up. 528 00:31:27,641 --> 00:31:32,401 Speaker 1: While I'm in Luxembourg. My number is plus six y one. 529 00:31:33,921 --> 00:31:37,321 Speaker 2: I am leaving Luxembourg today at one pm, but I 530 00:31:37,401 --> 00:31:39,601 Speaker 2: thought this morning if you were around and you'd like 531 00:31:39,681 --> 00:31:42,161 Speaker 2: to have a coffee and a catch up. I would 532 00:31:42,201 --> 00:31:45,001 Speaker 2: really like to meet you in person say thank you 533 00:31:45,241 --> 00:31:49,841 Speaker 2: for all your help in giving evidence at my mum's case. 534 00:31:50,681 --> 00:31:53,881 Speaker 2: My mum still is missing, so you're an important part 535 00:31:53,961 --> 00:31:57,481 Speaker 2: of the story for me and I'd really love to 536 00:31:57,561 --> 00:31:58,521 Speaker 2: meet you if possible. 537 00:31:59,241 --> 00:32:00,721 Speaker 1: But I hope you have a good day. 538 00:32:02,241 --> 00:32:03,961 Speaker 2: Just One of the other things that I wanted to 539 00:32:04,041 --> 00:32:06,841 Speaker 2: do while we're in live Uxenbourg was going to the 540 00:32:07,161 --> 00:32:10,241 Speaker 2: and I'm going to totally butcher. This again was the 541 00:32:10,361 --> 00:32:14,761 Speaker 2: City Judiciar and that was to look to see whether 542 00:32:14,841 --> 00:32:19,481 Speaker 2: they had any information on the two registered companies of 543 00:32:19,761 --> 00:32:25,081 Speaker 2: mister Bloom in Luxembourg. That was a very bizarre experience 544 00:32:25,161 --> 00:32:28,321 Speaker 2: for me. So Sul was outside talking to someone on 545 00:32:28,401 --> 00:32:30,440 Speaker 2: the phone. So I went in the front door and 546 00:32:30,561 --> 00:32:33,761 Speaker 2: it was pitch black, so there was no lights anywhere. 547 00:32:34,001 --> 00:32:36,521 Speaker 2: I wondered, you know, what was going on here, because 548 00:32:36,521 --> 00:32:39,321 Speaker 2: I expected to be a court building. I went into 549 00:32:39,401 --> 00:32:41,841 Speaker 2: the lift and that was again pitch black. So I 550 00:32:41,961 --> 00:32:44,281 Speaker 2: went up, pressed the button. I got my torch phone 551 00:32:44,321 --> 00:32:47,641 Speaker 2: out and pressed the button of level two, went up 552 00:32:47,641 --> 00:32:50,681 Speaker 2: to level two and it was again just pitch black. 553 00:32:51,361 --> 00:32:54,041 Speaker 2: I found a light switch as I came out of 554 00:32:54,161 --> 00:32:56,681 Speaker 2: the lift, so I managed to turn the lights on 555 00:32:57,521 --> 00:32:59,481 Speaker 2: and then I found the door where I wanted to 556 00:32:59,561 --> 00:33:01,841 Speaker 2: go on it, and I knocked on the door this 557 00:33:02,041 --> 00:33:07,601 Speaker 2: big buzzer buzz really really loud, and then I went 558 00:33:07,721 --> 00:33:11,721 Speaker 2: in and it was literally like this massive hive of activity, 559 00:33:12,521 --> 00:33:17,721 Speaker 2: bright lights, people everywhere, people running their papers from left 560 00:33:17,761 --> 00:33:19,961 Speaker 2: to right to center to ring bowels. 561 00:33:20,601 --> 00:33:22,681 Speaker 1: It was like an absolute hive of activity. 562 00:33:23,441 --> 00:33:26,121 Speaker 2: So it was just quite bizarre, like coming in from 563 00:33:26,201 --> 00:33:29,321 Speaker 2: the dark, silent, and then boom, all of a sudden, 564 00:33:29,401 --> 00:33:33,121 Speaker 2: he had these massive lights. Anyway, it all worked out, okay, 565 00:33:33,321 --> 00:33:35,641 Speaker 2: it wasn't the back entrance. They just explained to me 566 00:33:35,801 --> 00:33:40,121 Speaker 2: that they have really extreme power saving approaches within the 567 00:33:40,241 --> 00:33:44,281 Speaker 2: court precinc themselves and so if there's no one in there, 568 00:33:44,561 --> 00:33:47,801 Speaker 2: then it's black. So I managed to see one of 569 00:33:47,921 --> 00:33:51,041 Speaker 2: the registrars there, so she was more than happy to 570 00:33:51,121 --> 00:33:54,161 Speaker 2: help me. She searched for both of the companies that 571 00:33:54,321 --> 00:33:58,561 Speaker 2: Rick Bloom had registered within Luxembourg or was part of, 572 00:33:58,681 --> 00:34:02,561 Speaker 2: I should say, and she said, too old. I don't 573 00:34:02,601 --> 00:34:06,961 Speaker 2: have any information. I can confirm that both were bankrupt 574 00:34:07,361 --> 00:34:10,361 Speaker 2: and that's why the documents are here from both of 575 00:34:10,441 --> 00:34:14,561 Speaker 2: those companies. There may be stuff in archives, but it's 576 00:34:14,761 --> 00:34:18,041 Speaker 2: likely to be in pay per form and pretty much 577 00:34:18,081 --> 00:34:23,161 Speaker 2: impossible to access. So she said, sorry, I can't help anymore, 578 00:34:23,521 --> 00:34:30,001 Speaker 2: and I left. Well, that doesn't surprise me more doors shut. 579 00:34:30,121 --> 00:34:32,161 Speaker 2: Luxembourg's a bit of a locked city. I've heard that 580 00:34:32,281 --> 00:34:35,961 Speaker 2: many many times, where it's kind of like the Swiss banks, 581 00:34:36,041 --> 00:34:38,201 Speaker 2: you know, just if you want to do anything, you 582 00:34:38,321 --> 00:34:42,401 Speaker 2: go to Luxembourg. So we go back down that was 583 00:34:42,441 --> 00:34:46,121 Speaker 2: actually situated and perched just up the top of the 584 00:34:46,281 --> 00:34:48,841 Speaker 2: Unesco area, and we sort of had to catch a lift, 585 00:34:48,881 --> 00:34:51,121 Speaker 2: didn't we. It was literally outside the courthouse. Took us 586 00:34:51,121 --> 00:34:55,000 Speaker 2: straight down and where our hotel was and we bunk 587 00:34:55,041 --> 00:34:59,521 Speaker 2: it in for the night. The next morning we woke up, 588 00:34:59,601 --> 00:35:02,881 Speaker 2: we went downstairs and had breakfast. It was actually such 589 00:35:02,921 --> 00:35:05,921 Speaker 2: a beautiful little place, wasn't It was a time our hotel, 590 00:35:06,081 --> 00:35:10,601 Speaker 2: but we had a lovely lady who was the manager 591 00:35:10,681 --> 00:35:14,121 Speaker 2: of the hotel, Francois, and she took an interest into 592 00:35:14,201 --> 00:35:18,641 Speaker 2: why we were visiting Luxembourg. Francois did mention that she 593 00:35:18,881 --> 00:35:22,281 Speaker 2: had actually lived near Alan, so the day before she'd 594 00:35:22,361 --> 00:35:24,921 Speaker 2: said that she was going to go and actually have 595 00:35:25,041 --> 00:35:28,121 Speaker 2: a look and try and find the address, so that 596 00:35:28,401 --> 00:35:31,401 Speaker 2: that is what she had done. So she let us 597 00:35:31,481 --> 00:35:36,241 Speaker 2: know the next day that she'd gone there to actually 598 00:35:36,361 --> 00:35:38,481 Speaker 2: check it out, which was awesome of her. 599 00:35:40,241 --> 00:35:48,281 Speaker 1: I assure you that helps you went to along. So 600 00:35:48,401 --> 00:35:50,801 Speaker 1: what happened that dues where we wanted to go. It 601 00:35:50,841 --> 00:35:53,961 Speaker 1: doesn't exist anymore. And this is this house. 602 00:35:54,001 --> 00:35:58,161 Speaker 3: In fact, that was an odd hours before. A new 603 00:35:58,321 --> 00:36:03,041 Speaker 3: park has been bat nict two weeks okay, but this 604 00:36:03,361 --> 00:36:06,401 Speaker 3: is the one hundred and third because there is no 605 00:36:06,921 --> 00:36:12,401 Speaker 3: more thirteen. They replaced the all the numbering and numbering, 606 00:36:12,881 --> 00:36:18,361 Speaker 3: but they check, I said, booka maps, but this showed 607 00:36:18,401 --> 00:36:21,321 Speaker 3: me the thirty one also lays. 608 00:36:22,241 --> 00:36:25,161 Speaker 1: On the side said no thirty one said one said 609 00:36:25,201 --> 00:36:25,881 Speaker 1: two d one. 610 00:36:28,161 --> 00:36:31,441 Speaker 2: And so before we left, we pulled all the luggage 611 00:36:31,561 --> 00:36:35,561 Speaker 2: down the stairs and they allowed us to store it 612 00:36:36,321 --> 00:36:37,921 Speaker 2: just because we had one more thing we needed to 613 00:36:38,001 --> 00:36:42,881 Speaker 2: do in Luxembourg before we left. So inside where the 614 00:36:43,001 --> 00:36:46,041 Speaker 2: tea room was or the kitchenette where they would serve 615 00:36:46,161 --> 00:36:50,201 Speaker 2: us breakfast, they actually had a visitor book, and in 616 00:36:50,361 --> 00:36:53,601 Speaker 2: there I actually wrote the missing matter, Marion Matters, and 617 00:36:53,641 --> 00:36:56,241 Speaker 2: I left one of mum's cards inserted on the page 618 00:36:57,001 --> 00:36:59,681 Speaker 2: and just wrote a little note explaining that my mum 619 00:36:59,801 --> 00:37:02,321 Speaker 2: was a missing person and if anyone had any information 620 00:37:02,601 --> 00:37:04,841 Speaker 2: then they were reading this, please reach out and let 621 00:37:04,921 --> 00:37:09,401 Speaker 2: us snow. As our time came to an end in Luxembourg, 622 00:37:09,481 --> 00:37:12,721 Speaker 2: we just have one last job to tick off our list, 623 00:37:12,801 --> 00:37:15,761 Speaker 2: which was the Bank International. So the reason why we're 624 00:37:15,801 --> 00:37:18,521 Speaker 2: going to go into the bank in Luxembourg City was 625 00:37:19,081 --> 00:37:22,361 Speaker 2: because we had heard that Rick Bloom had stated that 626 00:37:23,081 --> 00:37:25,881 Speaker 2: him and Monique were walking in Luxembourg City and he 627 00:37:25,961 --> 00:37:31,041 Speaker 2: actually pointed to the bank and said, look, Monigue, that's 628 00:37:31,081 --> 00:37:33,601 Speaker 2: where I put That's where all my capital is. 629 00:37:34,201 --> 00:37:37,641 Speaker 1: So of course we carry like I've got my big bag. 630 00:37:37,801 --> 00:37:41,401 Speaker 2: It's heavy, I've got my laptop, all the documents, and 631 00:37:41,521 --> 00:37:43,401 Speaker 2: because Johnnie will tell you, I did not want to 632 00:37:43,441 --> 00:37:47,001 Speaker 2: put that bag down anywhere after trying so hard to 633 00:37:47,041 --> 00:37:48,081 Speaker 2: get out all the documents. 634 00:37:48,161 --> 00:37:51,201 Speaker 1: It was super important. I just could not risk it 635 00:37:51,281 --> 00:37:52,241 Speaker 1: being left behind. 636 00:37:52,361 --> 00:37:57,001 Speaker 2: So the bank has moved from where it originally was 637 00:37:58,041 --> 00:37:58,881 Speaker 2: back in the eighties. 638 00:37:59,321 --> 00:38:00,881 Speaker 1: So I got my files with me. 639 00:38:01,001 --> 00:38:04,761 Speaker 2: That's where my bags ody, with mum's probate documents and 640 00:38:05,921 --> 00:38:10,361 Speaker 2: her will and everything and everything in Ramachel to. 641 00:38:11,881 --> 00:38:19,281 Speaker 1: Hopefully allow us access to her file. She's got one of. 642 00:38:19,281 --> 00:38:21,161 Speaker 2: Her there's a bank account with her name on it, 643 00:38:22,481 --> 00:38:25,841 Speaker 2: in the name of Ramachel or Ramachuel, would be kind 644 00:38:25,881 --> 00:38:33,721 Speaker 2: of and what a good to name. All right. We've 645 00:38:33,801 --> 00:38:36,601 Speaker 2: had to walk a fair way into the city from 646 00:38:36,681 --> 00:38:41,641 Speaker 2: where we were, and unbelievably we arrive and the bank 647 00:38:41,761 --> 00:38:44,961 Speaker 2: is shut not just close for the day, but completely 648 00:38:45,081 --> 00:38:48,921 Speaker 2: shut down, with fencing and signs all over it saying 649 00:38:49,161 --> 00:38:57,041 Speaker 2: under restoration, under construction and once again no cigar. Okay, Well, 650 00:38:57,081 --> 00:39:00,721 Speaker 2: in true fashion, it's like I'm having deja vous. That 651 00:39:00,841 --> 00:39:02,841 Speaker 2: was when I came with Brian and nothing was open 652 00:39:02,921 --> 00:39:07,121 Speaker 2: and no one was home to the bank that Joney 653 00:39:07,201 --> 00:39:10,321 Speaker 2: checked this morning and it was a fully functioning, operational 654 00:39:10,441 --> 00:39:16,001 Speaker 2: bank online. We've arrived, it's all barricaded up where there 655 00:39:16,161 --> 00:39:19,361 Speaker 2: is papers all over the windows, stuck with sticky tape 656 00:39:19,561 --> 00:39:23,641 Speaker 2: close close, clothes not open, and we literally, if I 657 00:39:23,681 --> 00:39:29,281 Speaker 2: could look across, we're back to where we were yesterday, 658 00:39:29,401 --> 00:39:32,281 Speaker 2: where number four was, So I literally can see that 659 00:39:32,401 --> 00:39:33,481 Speaker 2: from here where we're standing. 660 00:39:33,561 --> 00:39:39,081 Speaker 1: So that's ironic. We were literally here. Yeah, right, and 661 00:39:39,241 --> 00:39:41,241 Speaker 1: then so this is all shut. 662 00:39:41,041 --> 00:39:43,121 Speaker 2: Down, and then Joney's is what we've been standing here. 663 00:39:43,201 --> 00:39:45,961 Speaker 2: Joney's done a check and it's only ATMs now. 664 00:39:46,161 --> 00:39:48,761 Speaker 1: So my power of. 665 00:39:48,761 --> 00:39:55,161 Speaker 2: Attorney document is it's been quite useless over here. Brought 666 00:39:55,201 --> 00:39:56,561 Speaker 2: all those documents with me and. 667 00:39:58,321 --> 00:39:58,801 Speaker 1: No cigar. 668 00:40:00,681 --> 00:40:05,201 Speaker 2: So all right, so we need to work out what 669 00:40:05,281 --> 00:40:06,961 Speaker 2: you want to do. Now do you want to I 670 00:40:07,041 --> 00:40:08,961 Speaker 2: will walk back down this way. I guess we'll walk. 671 00:40:08,841 --> 00:40:16,721 Speaker 1: Back the way we came, dearing me, hearing me, Yeah, 672 00:40:17,081 --> 00:40:18,161 Speaker 1: did you take a photo? Watch this? 673 00:40:18,321 --> 00:40:22,321 Speaker 2: Doctor though, I might just take a photo. 674 00:40:22,041 --> 00:40:26,681 Speaker 1: As well, so I've got it as well. But that's 675 00:40:26,801 --> 00:40:27,321 Speaker 1: just mental. 676 00:40:30,001 --> 00:40:36,881 Speaker 2: So the Bank of Switzerland, well referred to as Similar Switzerland, is. 677 00:40:38,481 --> 00:40:41,481 Speaker 1: No longer no longer available. 678 00:40:42,201 --> 00:40:46,081 Speaker 2: Anyway, I can't say we didn't come and try because 679 00:40:46,161 --> 00:40:54,441 Speaker 2: we are here, yeah, and it is not here, so. 680 00:40:56,001 --> 00:41:18,480 Speaker 1: Anyway, oh well, hi, going, So we leave Luxembourg. That's 681 00:41:18,521 --> 00:41:19,161 Speaker 1: carry seven. 682 00:41:19,201 --> 00:41:20,561 Speaker 2: We've got to go all the way to the back 683 00:41:23,201 --> 00:41:26,641 Speaker 2: in the next episode of The Missing Matter. So we're 684 00:41:26,721 --> 00:41:30,281 Speaker 2: off to Lille in northern France. So we had a 685 00:41:30,321 --> 00:41:32,801 Speaker 2: few things we wanted to do there. Jonie, we wanted 686 00:41:32,881 --> 00:41:37,121 Speaker 2: to go to archives. I was not feeling well, so 687 00:41:38,121 --> 00:41:40,641 Speaker 2: we swapped rolls and you went and did it on 688 00:41:40,761 --> 00:41:45,721 Speaker 2: your own. And we ventured straight up to the police 689 00:41:45,841 --> 00:41:48,201 Speaker 2: in Law because we wanted to address a few things 690 00:41:48,281 --> 00:41:51,881 Speaker 2: with them and bring some awareness. And I could not 691 00:41:52,121 --> 00:41:55,241 Speaker 2: believe when we arrive what we saw