WEBVTT - Central Coast massacre: Ted Bassingthwaighte Pt.2 0:00:01.920 --> 0:00:04.920 The public has had a long held fascination with detectives. 0:00:05.400 --> 0:00:08.080 Detective see a side of life the average persons never 0:00:08.160 --> 0:00:11.120 exposed her. I spent thirty four years as a cop. 0:00:11.600 --> 0:00:14.040 For twenty five of those years I was catching killers. 0:00:14.440 --> 0:00:16.240 That's what I did for a living. I was a 0:00:16.239 --> 0:00:20.560 homicide detective. I'm no longer just interviewing bad guys. Instead, 0:00:20.600 --> 0:00:23.160 I'm taking the public into the world in which I operated. 0:00:23.840 --> 0:00:26.439 The guests I talk to each week have amazing stories 0:00:26.440 --> 0:00:28.800 from all sides of the law. The interviews are raw 0:00:28.840 --> 0:00:31.479 and honest, just like the people I talk to. Some 0:00:31.600 --> 0:00:34.640 of the content and language might be confronting. That's because 0:00:34.680 --> 0:00:37.680 no one who comes into contact with crime is left unchanged. 0:00:38.159 --> 0:00:40.400 Join me now as I take you into this world. 0:00:45.680 --> 0:00:47.960 Welcome back to part two of my chat with retired 0:00:48.000 --> 0:00:52.040 detective Ted Bathmwaite. In part one, Ted talked us through 0:00:52.159 --> 0:00:54.480 in details the events that led to the murder of 0:00:54.600 --> 0:00:57.680 six people on one night in October nineteen ninety two 0:00:57.680 --> 0:00:58.560 on the Central Coast. 0:01:00.120 --> 0:01:02.720 Welcome back, Welcome back to you, Gary, Thank you. 0:01:02.720 --> 0:01:06.560 Okay, well, in part one, you gave us a very 0:01:06.600 --> 0:01:09.920 detailed description of the lead up and the build up 0:01:09.959 --> 0:01:14.000 to this. Neither of murder and brutality at the level 0:01:14.000 --> 0:01:16.600 that we rarely get to see. And we just touched 0:01:16.600 --> 0:01:20.640 on it briefly. So many red flags, and we have 0:01:20.720 --> 0:01:23.880 the benefit of hindsight, and you would having research for 0:01:23.920 --> 0:01:27.319 the book, but more importantly working on the investigation, you 0:01:27.360 --> 0:01:31.760 would have you would have seen it. This appears to 0:01:31.800 --> 0:01:34.880 be just so many, so many times where if people 0:01:34.880 --> 0:01:36.800 put the hand up, brought it to the attention that 0:01:36.840 --> 0:01:42.199 the police, maybe, just maybe this horror of an evening 0:01:42.200 --> 0:01:45.120 wouldn't have occurred. What's your take on that. 0:01:45.520 --> 0:01:49.440 Well, it's always been a vexed question for me. The 0:01:49.520 --> 0:01:54.320 question is why why didn't anybody speak up? And I 0:01:54.360 --> 0:01:58.680 can only reflect on the context of those individuals lives 0:01:58.720 --> 0:02:01.720 at the time, the one that were given the red 0:02:01.720 --> 0:02:03.600 flag or had an opportunity to do a red flag. 0:02:04.280 --> 0:02:09.840 I think that the deep effect of his coercive control 0:02:09.960 --> 0:02:15.280 over people may have been something that was that they 0:02:15.480 --> 0:02:18.280 that those women in particular, couldn't overcome if I was 0:02:18.320 --> 0:02:20.959 to speak up. They may have thought He's going to 0:02:21.040 --> 0:02:24.360 come for me. And he's always been a bullshit artist. 0:02:24.360 --> 0:02:27.639 He's always talking shit. I don't really believe him, and 0:02:27.760 --> 0:02:31.960 most of them in the book kind of expressed that, 0:02:32.000 --> 0:02:35.000 oh yeah, that's just that's just Malcolm, that's that's just Baker, 0:02:35.040 --> 0:02:38.560 that's just the way he is. Only on one occasion 0:02:38.560 --> 0:02:40.839 with one of the people that he offered a red 0:02:40.840 --> 0:02:44.640 flag to really had a genuine fear that he would 0:02:44.639 --> 0:02:48.000 carry it out. But again, why they didn't speak up 0:02:49.320 --> 0:02:51.680 could be because of their fear of him. The coercive 0:02:51.720 --> 0:02:53.640 control that he had over them, could have been in 0:02:53.680 --> 0:02:56.519 the context of where they were in time, time and 0:02:56.560 --> 0:03:01.320 place in Western Sydney and their attitude towards snitching or 0:03:01.360 --> 0:03:04.800 their attitudes towards the police. It's hard to fathom. It's 0:03:04.800 --> 0:03:07.120 hard to fathim. There's no obvious evidence to the reason 0:03:07.120 --> 0:03:09.280 why no one went straight down to the police station 0:03:09.840 --> 0:03:12.760 and complained. But then again, what are you going to 0:03:12.800 --> 0:03:16.840 complain about. Here's this cranky man who he knows, a 0:03:16.919 --> 0:03:19.120 pain in the ass, cranky man come around having a 0:03:19.120 --> 0:03:21.079 big winge on my shoulder. What offense has he fit? 0:03:21.200 --> 0:03:23.440 Has he committed? You know, he might have a gun 0:03:23.480 --> 0:03:25.480 in the back of his car, but he may or 0:03:25.560 --> 0:03:27.160 may not have the gun that he used on the 0:03:27.200 --> 0:03:28.760 neither murders wasn't in his car, it was at his 0:03:28.760 --> 0:03:29.760 house hid and't at his house. 0:03:29.919 --> 0:03:31.960 Yeah, I suppose when you break it down like that, 0:03:32.000 --> 0:03:34.760 and it potentially could be in isolation, so it's just 0:03:34.800 --> 0:03:38.160 someone voicing an opinion. He's always talking shit like that, Yeah, 0:03:38.320 --> 0:03:39.560 never never carried it out. 0:03:39.600 --> 0:03:41.600 But he's a coward, you know, and they would have 0:03:41.600 --> 0:03:43.600 seen all those people would have seen him as a 0:03:43.640 --> 0:03:47.280 cowardly The cowards have the courage to do. But eventually he. 0:03:47.240 --> 0:03:49.880 Did a tough talk, but that never backs it up 0:03:50.000 --> 0:03:53.880 type thing. But I suppose, and this is why. Yeah, 0:03:54.000 --> 0:03:57.160 in today's society, we're so aware of these things, and 0:03:57.400 --> 0:04:00.760 I don't think it would wash these days. The pub 0:04:00.840 --> 0:04:03.800 tests for the day, people go okay, well you need 0:04:03.840 --> 0:04:06.920 to speak up. But yeah, it's judging people on what 0:04:06.960 --> 0:04:08.440 they could a long time ago. 0:04:08.520 --> 0:04:11.240 Yeah, and don't. I don't hold any judgment to those people. 0:04:11.440 --> 0:04:14.440 I just like to think about into context of where 0:04:14.480 --> 0:04:17.039 it was in their lives at the time and their 0:04:17.080 --> 0:04:21.440 relationships to him, and the broader societal context as well. 0:04:22.040 --> 0:04:24.679 It's not like it is now. It's hopefully much safer 0:04:24.680 --> 0:04:25.440 for women now. 0:04:25.760 --> 0:04:28.960 Yeah, Okay, let's bring it up up to the night. 0:04:29.080 --> 0:04:32.000 So what we left off in part one that he'd 0:04:32.040 --> 0:04:35.280 gone round to Kerry Anne's place, stalking up and down, 0:04:35.320 --> 0:04:37.279 patrolling up and down the street during the course of 0:04:37.279 --> 0:04:40.880 the day. He'd been rejected by Kerry Anne's mother a 0:04:41.000 --> 0:04:43.960 couple of days before when he said he wanted to 0:04:43.960 --> 0:04:46.479 see Kerry Anne and then he's crept up to the 0:04:46.520 --> 0:04:49.760 house and heard carry Anne talking to a mile in 0:04:49.839 --> 0:04:52.760 the bedroom. Yes, on that basis, he's gone back to 0:04:52.880 --> 0:04:55.479 his house. And how far away is his house. 0:04:55.520 --> 0:04:56.800 It's only a five or ten minute drive. 0:04:56.920 --> 0:04:59.320 Okay, that's very close. So gone back to it, driven 0:04:59.360 --> 0:05:02.800 back to his house. Access to firearm that the police didn't. 0:05:02.520 --> 0:05:04.760 Seize Bentley twelve gage shotgun. 0:05:04.800 --> 0:05:09.200 So twelve twelve gauge shotgun. Just people don't understand firearms. 0:05:09.400 --> 0:05:13.240 A shotgun spreads a lot of shots that come out, 0:05:13.279 --> 0:05:16.400 depending on the size of the shells put in there. 0:05:16.920 --> 0:05:18.800 But they do a hell of a lot of damage 0:05:18.839 --> 0:05:20.600 when fired of the person close range. 0:05:20.720 --> 0:05:23.800 Yeah, close range damage that they're designed to kill it 0:05:23.839 --> 0:05:25.120 close range. They're not hunting them. 0:05:25.200 --> 0:05:28.600 Yeah, and it's not just one projectile. Its sprays spray's yeah. 0:05:28.839 --> 0:05:31.800 From memory, the cartridges that he used, there was somewhere 0:05:31.839 --> 0:05:36.719 between sixteen and twenty six shot in each cartridge. 0:05:36.800 --> 0:05:39.799 Okay, so that will spread fairly wide of the close 0:05:39.920 --> 0:05:42.240 close range and signal well, punch a very big hole, 0:05:43.040 --> 0:05:48.200 significant significant damage. He also cut off the stock of 0:05:48.240 --> 0:05:53.039 the firearm. What was that about. He doesn't really explain 0:05:53.080 --> 0:05:55.640 that in the subsequent interviews after his arrest. 0:05:55.440 --> 0:05:58.599 But it would just be for ease, easy to hide, 0:05:58.600 --> 0:06:01.080 it's easy to carry, it's less cumbersome. 0:06:01.240 --> 0:06:05.120 Well, that's that was the old bank robbers tool and trade. 0:06:05.400 --> 0:06:07.880 Cut off the butt of the shotgun so they could 0:06:08.080 --> 0:06:08.919 conceal it. 0:06:09.080 --> 0:06:11.599 Just make it a smaller, smaller weapon. Very in mind. 0:06:11.600 --> 0:06:14.479 It was a pump action shot it's a pump action shotgun. 0:06:14.520 --> 0:06:16.400 So you had two hands on the on the on 0:06:16.440 --> 0:06:18.160 the slide, had one hand on the slide and one 0:06:18.200 --> 0:06:21.280 head on the trigger. The stock was irrelevant. Really, Yeah, 0:06:21.560 --> 0:06:23.480 he never pellowed to his shoulder to ad because it 0:06:23.520 --> 0:06:24.120 was all from the. 0:06:24.040 --> 0:06:28.320 Pips still operate. How many how many cartridges did he take? 0:06:28.320 --> 0:06:30.960 He had a full full had seven up the spout 0:06:30.960 --> 0:06:33.560 as we say, yeah, which is the foot in the firearm. 0:06:33.760 --> 0:06:37.080 And you had a bandolier of twenty plus. 0:06:37.279 --> 0:06:41.080 Okay, so he went there well armed, well armed. Okay, 0:06:41.200 --> 0:06:45.120 Now I just want you and I apologize to people 0:06:45.160 --> 0:06:46.880 listening to it that what we're going to talk about 0:06:46.960 --> 0:06:49.680 is fairly brutal, but this is the nature of what 0:06:49.839 --> 0:06:53.880 happens when a gunman goes on the rampage. So let's 0:06:53.880 --> 0:06:57.120 take it through in the chronology of what happened in 0:06:57.120 --> 0:07:01.000 that night. And this is based on your knowledge from 0:07:01.000 --> 0:07:04.240 the investigation, your research in the book, and stuff that 0:07:04.279 --> 0:07:05.440 he told police. 0:07:05.200 --> 0:07:08.719 Suff he tool police, and subsequent conversations I had with 0:07:08.839 --> 0:07:10.200 three of the victims of the matter. 0:07:10.280 --> 0:07:12.600 Okay, if you just take us through it. 0:07:12.720 --> 0:07:16.160 Okay. So on the night, for whatever reason walking up 0:07:16.200 --> 0:07:20.000 the stairs that has flicked the switch were the previous 0:07:20.040 --> 0:07:22.160 twelve months and all the conversations he's had with people, 0:07:22.240 --> 0:07:23.560 I'm going to do this, I'm going to do that. 0:07:24.320 --> 0:07:26.880 She's a bit, you know, she's ruined my life and whatever. 0:07:27.200 --> 0:07:30.880 For whatever reason, when he heard the conversation with Chris 0:07:30.920 --> 0:07:35.040 gall in the bedroom at seventy five Barnhill Drive, caused 0:07:35.080 --> 0:07:37.640 him to go back to the house straight away, saw 0:07:37.680 --> 0:07:40.280 the butt off, load the gun, get the bandoleer, and 0:07:41.200 --> 0:07:42.840 he didn't go straight back to the house because it 0:07:42.880 --> 0:07:47.240 was daylight saving, so he's spent time going around the town. 0:07:47.480 --> 0:07:50.800 While he's going around Terry Gull waiting for darkness. He 0:07:50.840 --> 0:07:54.560 actually runs into young Tom Gennan, who had been at 0:07:54.560 --> 0:07:55.880 the house prior. 0:07:55.600 --> 0:08:00.120 To Baker, Kerrie Anne's younger brother, Kerrians. 0:07:59.800 --> 0:08:03.720 Young brother, and he'd had a conversation with him. So 0:08:03.760 --> 0:08:07.120 at this point he's down in Terrigle at dusk with 0:08:07.200 --> 0:08:11.200 a loaded firearm which had been modified. Talking to Tom Gannett. 0:08:11.480 --> 0:08:14.360 I'm convinced if he'd had the opportunity then and there, 0:08:14.680 --> 0:08:16.200 but it would have been in public, he would have 0:08:16.240 --> 0:08:19.520 shot young Tom Gannett. Tom Gannon's got away from him. Whatever. 0:08:19.640 --> 0:08:22.560 Baker's then waited for it to get dark. He's come. 0:08:22.760 --> 0:08:25.760 He's slunk up the hill at Grosvenor Revenue, parked out 0:08:25.760 --> 0:08:29.760 of sight and came across come across the Barnhill Road. 0:08:30.280 --> 0:08:34.880 He walked up the stairs stairway, two level stairs, stood 0:08:34.880 --> 0:08:38.520 at the door of seventy seven Barnhill Drive, Barnhill Road. Terrible. 0:08:39.000 --> 0:08:41.120 The front door was closed and he could see at 0:08:41.160 --> 0:08:43.640 the at the the as a timber door and had 0:08:43.640 --> 0:08:46.080 a piece of that opaque glass in the door, like 0:08:47.000 --> 0:08:51.199 a square of opaque glass. He could see shadow figures inside, 0:08:51.240 --> 0:08:55.040 he could hear the TV. And then he just kicked 0:08:55.040 --> 0:08:58.600 the door. He just kicked the door open, charged into 0:08:58.640 --> 0:09:03.120 the house. Lis Agannon was on his left, sitting at 0:09:03.200 --> 0:09:06.120 a couch having something to eat. This is a Lisa 0:09:06.120 --> 0:09:10.080 eight months pregnant. Lisa again and Carrie's sister saw Tom Gannon, 0:09:10.160 --> 0:09:13.280 the senior, at the back of the kitchen. They've He's 0:09:13.320 --> 0:09:16.400 moved forward towards Tom. Tom's moved out of the kitchen, 0:09:17.040 --> 0:09:19.880 had the firearm on his hip. Tom's had a conversation 0:09:20.000 --> 0:09:22.880 with him, Get out, get out, what are you doing here? Bang? 0:09:22.960 --> 0:09:25.200 He shot Tom and the first shot hit Tom in 0:09:25.240 --> 0:09:29.680 the shoulder and the chest. Tom spun around, semi conscious 0:09:29.679 --> 0:09:32.400 and fell on the floor. He's turned immediately to his 0:09:32.520 --> 0:09:36.720 left and virtually on top of Lisa. Gannon fired one 0:09:36.800 --> 0:09:38.360 round into the top of her head. 0:09:38.200 --> 0:09:38.280 And. 0:09:40.800 --> 0:09:42.640 It was with such force that blew the top of 0:09:42.679 --> 0:09:46.440 her head off, killing her instantly. At this point, Carrie 0:09:47.320 --> 0:09:51.520 and Chris Gaure her friend or a boyfriend at the time, 0:09:51.920 --> 0:09:54.560 heard the shots. Carriann's opened and they were in the 0:09:54.559 --> 0:09:57.839 bedroom two rooms down the hallway to the left. Carrie 0:09:57.840 --> 0:10:00.760 Anne's opened the door and she saw Matt or as 0:10:00.760 --> 0:10:03.760 she called him, Mac. Saw Max. It's Mac. It's Max's Mac. 0:10:05.320 --> 0:10:08.600 She closed the door and locked it. He heard her. 0:10:09.679 --> 0:10:13.280 Baker's walked down the corridor, stood at the door, fired 0:10:13.320 --> 0:10:16.920 around into the door of Carrie Anne's bedroom. The door 0:10:17.080 --> 0:10:20.080 swung open. The first person he's seen is Kerrien's boyfriend, 0:10:20.160 --> 0:10:22.600 Chris Gall, standing at the end of the bed. Fired 0:10:22.640 --> 0:10:24.880 a shot at Chris. That shot, has said, Chris into 0:10:24.920 --> 0:10:29.160 the right side of the face, removing basically his right 0:10:29.240 --> 0:10:33.880 cheek and knocking him unconscious. He fell to the floor. 0:10:34.160 --> 0:10:37.800 The Baker when he back at his house earlier on, 0:10:37.840 --> 0:10:41.600 when he was planning to do all this these murders here, 0:10:41.880 --> 0:10:44.960 he had decided that he would not shoot Kerrien, that 0:10:45.000 --> 0:10:46.959 he wanted to kidnap her and take her away, which 0:10:47.040 --> 0:10:49.600 is interesting in the context of what he's always done. 0:10:49.600 --> 0:10:53.480 He wanted to get carry In away from the family 0:10:53.600 --> 0:10:55.599 or any of the obstacles that he had, and it 0:10:55.720 --> 0:10:58.360 had taken with him a piece of nylon rope which 0:10:58.360 --> 0:11:00.560 he had around his waist or over his shoulder. So 0:11:00.600 --> 0:11:02.800 he grabbed Carrie Anne at the bedroom with Chris Gaul 0:11:02.880 --> 0:11:05.400 semi conscious on the floor, and he could hear Chris 0:11:05.440 --> 0:11:08.480 Gore can hear the conversation that He's Baker's having with 0:11:08.520 --> 0:11:10.719 carry Anne, dragged her, got her in her headlock and 0:11:10.760 --> 0:11:14.360 dragged her down the corridor to the lounge room, where 0:11:14.400 --> 0:11:17.320 She's all of a sudden seen her murdered sister Lisa 0:11:17.559 --> 0:11:22.000 on the on the couch, screamed, wrestled, and Baker's scratched 0:11:22.000 --> 0:11:24.080 her neck and tried to choke her. She's got away 0:11:24.120 --> 0:11:29.720 and run back into the bedroom, which is quite bizarre 0:11:29.760 --> 0:11:31.959 in a sense because before she gets to the bedroom 0:11:31.960 --> 0:11:34.440 there was a laundry which had a back door, which 0:11:34.440 --> 0:11:36.840 she could have run down in accord into the backyard 0:11:36.840 --> 0:11:38.560 to escape, but she obviously didn't think of it at 0:11:38.559 --> 0:11:41.760 the time. Baker's followed her back to the bedroom and 0:11:41.960 --> 0:11:44.800 carry Anne stood up to him. He said, I've had enough, 0:11:45.200 --> 0:11:47.079 had enough. If you're going to kill me, just kill me, 0:11:47.480 --> 0:11:49.959 and she turned around and at that point from a 0:11:49.960 --> 0:11:51.640 meet her and a halfway he shot her in the back. 0:11:52.640 --> 0:11:57.040 Carrie has fallen face up and died instantly on the spot. 0:11:57.080 --> 0:11:59.120 That while this was going on in the bedroom with 0:11:59.559 --> 0:12:02.000 carry and Baker, Tom Baker had managed to get up 0:12:02.600 --> 0:12:05.640 remain conscious of father, the father, the eldest Tom sr. 0:12:05.840 --> 0:12:09.320 And he struggled down the front stairs and collapsed unconscious 0:12:09.440 --> 0:12:13.120 on the middle of Barnhill road. As Baker was leaving, 0:12:13.280 --> 0:12:16.280 Baker saw Tom Tom on the road, walked up the 0:12:16.320 --> 0:12:18.720 Tom and at point blank, Raine shot him in the 0:12:18.760 --> 0:12:20.240 back of the head, killing him. 0:12:20.800 --> 0:12:21.880 It's brutal, isn't it. 0:12:21.880 --> 0:12:22.800 It's absolutely brutal. 0:12:23.120 --> 0:12:27.480 What just on this breakdown? A couple of things there. 0:12:28.559 --> 0:12:31.280 How long did this rampage in this house last fall? 0:12:31.320 --> 0:12:34.600 What are we talking? Is the way you've described it's 0:12:34.640 --> 0:12:35.440 virtually in real. 0:12:35.760 --> 0:12:38.160 No more than five minutes. The witness the witness accounts 0:12:38.160 --> 0:12:39.880 have said. It has happened very quickly. 0:12:40.360 --> 0:12:43.520 And the chaos and the sound of a shotgun going 0:12:43.559 --> 0:12:44.920 off and the screens. 0:12:44.600 --> 0:12:49.280 Yes, one, two, three, four, five times five times. 0:12:49.960 --> 0:12:52.720 And so Tom's trying to escape from the house or 0:12:53.040 --> 0:12:53.600 it's help Aul. 0:12:53.800 --> 0:12:56.280 It's unclear what Tom's what Tom was trying to do, 0:12:56.360 --> 0:12:58.440 but he only made it to the middle of the road. 0:12:59.640 --> 0:13:02.679 Tom's relationship Tom soon his relationship with Baker was was 0:13:02.800 --> 0:13:06.080 that were mates, did various jobs together. They probably did 0:13:06.120 --> 0:13:10.360 some criminal activity together, but he that had a falling 0:13:10.400 --> 0:13:13.200 out over some work that Tom had done some time ago. 0:13:13.679 --> 0:13:16.120 But Tom was part of the family group that were 0:13:16.160 --> 0:13:18.160 all encouraging carry to get away from. 0:13:18.080 --> 0:13:21.280 From and so Tom's on the road and he just 0:13:21.320 --> 0:13:22.439 come up and shot him in the. 0:13:22.440 --> 0:13:24.040 Yeah, he was still alive. And then he shot him 0:13:24.040 --> 0:13:24.200 in the. 0:13:24.200 --> 0:13:26.240 Back of the fellow that was in the bedroom with 0:13:26.280 --> 0:13:29.760 Kerry Anne. Now Chris got what did he pass out 0:13:30.000 --> 0:13:31.079 from the injuries. 0:13:31.280 --> 0:13:34.120 He was semi conscious from the injuries, and he could 0:13:34.160 --> 0:13:37.400 hear the conversation. He heard the conversation between carry Anne 0:13:37.520 --> 0:13:39.240 and Baker as he dragged her out of the room 0:13:39.280 --> 0:13:42.680 and dragged her down the hall. And then he heard 0:13:42.720 --> 0:13:45.760 the conversation with carry Anne said just kill me. He 0:13:45.800 --> 0:13:47.959 was unable to move. He was kind of virtually trapped 0:13:48.000 --> 0:13:51.520 under the edge of the fold out bed, a large 0:13:51.559 --> 0:13:53.959 portion of his face missing, bleeding profusely. 0:13:55.400 --> 0:13:57.360 And do you think Baker just thought he was dead. 0:13:57.640 --> 0:14:00.920 I think Baker thought he was dead. But Baker, Baker 0:14:01.200 --> 0:14:05.200 assassinated the people that this this crime scene is all 0:14:05.200 --> 0:14:07.319 about revenge, all about. 0:14:07.160 --> 0:14:09.200 All family memb all family members. 0:14:09.360 --> 0:14:11.960 This kid, Chris Gore wasn't he wasn't fair, so he 0:14:12.000 --> 0:14:14.240 didn't he'd never met him, He didn't even know. Chris 0:14:14.280 --> 0:14:17.160 Gaul is Sylvia Gall one of the ladies from the 0:14:17.200 --> 0:14:21.480 Vocar nursing home. It's her son, Okay, because Sylvia Gall 0:14:21.560 --> 0:14:23.800 invited Kerry Anne to go and stay with her for 0:14:23.840 --> 0:14:25.600 a couple of nights after Baker bashed her in. 0:14:25.600 --> 0:14:27.320 The flat and formed the friendship. 0:14:27.600 --> 0:14:29.200 Formed the friendship from that. So it was her son, 0:14:29.240 --> 0:14:30.160 that's where she met him. 0:14:30.280 --> 0:14:34.080 What how chilling here in carry Anne like, if you're 0:14:34.080 --> 0:14:36.120 going to kill me, just kill me her words? Isn't 0:14:36.160 --> 0:14:39.240 that that just so sad that her wife has come 0:14:39.280 --> 0:14:40.360 to that, this lunatic. 0:14:40.440 --> 0:14:43.480 That she had no option, She had no choice. She 0:14:43.640 --> 0:14:46.800 was twenty four years old, she hadn't she was a 0:14:46.800 --> 0:14:49.360 whole life ahead of her and this man would not stop, 0:14:49.520 --> 0:14:51.840 would not stop, and she was trapped in this bedroom, 0:14:52.400 --> 0:14:56.120 probably thought Chris Gore was dead. What to do and 0:14:56.160 --> 0:14:58.040 then she just called his bluff and lost. 0:14:59.200 --> 0:15:02.400 Just makes me sad even thinking about it. And her 0:15:02.440 --> 0:15:05.960 sister that was eight months pregnant. Yes, the baby didn't survive, 0:15:06.040 --> 0:15:06.600 I'd take it. No. 0:15:08.680 --> 0:15:11.200 Another really sad part of it. Lisa was engaged to 0:15:11.240 --> 0:15:14.160 a serving police officer at the time, Paul Martin, who 0:15:14.160 --> 0:15:16.400 worked in Sydney, and Paul had been at work that 0:15:16.520 --> 0:15:18.280 day and he's on his way home and he'd heard 0:15:18.280 --> 0:15:20.640 about the shooting at Teregul as he got off the 0:15:20.640 --> 0:15:23.080 train at Gosford and he raced to the crime scene 0:15:23.720 --> 0:15:26.560 and obviously a police were on scene it then and 0:15:27.200 --> 0:15:30.560 they were able to control him and look after him 0:15:30.560 --> 0:15:34.360 in a sense. But it took police quite quite a while, 0:15:34.640 --> 0:15:36.480 had to get the dog squad there because I unsure 0:15:36.480 --> 0:15:39.800 where the shooter was. The only evidence that he wasn't 0:15:39.800 --> 0:15:42.960 in the house was gleaned from Chris Gore, but only 0:15:43.000 --> 0:15:45.440 after Chris Gore was extracted from the house because he 0:15:45.480 --> 0:15:48.680 was a potential killer twenty five minutes later by the 0:15:48.760 --> 0:15:51.400 uniform police and he said, oh, Baker, Baker, and he 0:15:51.840 --> 0:15:54.880 drew He couldn't talk, but he drew Baker's name in 0:15:54.920 --> 0:15:57.200 the sand and the guards of the injuries, yeah, because 0:15:57.200 --> 0:16:00.760 of the injuries. So when Paul Martin's turned up, that 0:16:00.920 --> 0:16:04.040 was an hour later. Prior to that, some forty five 0:16:04.080 --> 0:16:06.560 minutes when the amblaster were on the scene and the 0:16:06.680 --> 0:16:09.120 scene was clear, there's no shooter on scene, and the 0:16:09.200 --> 0:16:11.440 police were very comfortable that it was just going to 0:16:11.440 --> 0:16:15.200 be a crime scene. Ambulece officers went inside and did 0:16:15.200 --> 0:16:17.360 a fetal heartbeat, but there was no fetal heart right. 0:16:17.640 --> 0:16:19.680 You know, the medical evidence say you have three minutes, 0:16:19.760 --> 0:16:22.400 three or four minutes after an injury like that before 0:16:22.560 --> 0:16:24.680 to save the baby, and there was no fetal heartbeat. 0:16:24.760 --> 0:16:30.000 Just another sad aspect of this, Okay, So you've got 0:16:30.040 --> 0:16:32.520 that happened, though, would imagine there'd be calls from the neighbors, 0:16:32.520 --> 0:16:36.120 the police would be alerted what was Baker's movements after that. 0:16:36.280 --> 0:16:39.280 So Baker then straightaway he got into his car and 0:16:39.320 --> 0:16:44.160 he drove straight away to Sherwood Close in Bado Bay, 0:16:44.680 --> 0:16:46.800 which is where his son, David Baker was living with 0:16:47.120 --> 0:16:51.600 a de facto partner, Michelle Cooper and her small child, 0:16:51.640 --> 0:16:54.840 Stevie Lee. And he'd been to this place many times. 0:16:54.840 --> 0:16:58.000 He knew where it was. He'd often been seen stalking 0:16:58.120 --> 0:17:00.280 around the place, often been seen parking down the street, 0:17:00.320 --> 0:17:03.960 stereotax starring at the place, particularly subsequent to when David 0:17:04.200 --> 0:17:08.639 subsequent to David Baker disclosing to Malcolm Baker that he'd 0:17:08.680 --> 0:17:09.440 slept with carry. 0:17:09.800 --> 0:17:12.800 So he's lost for vengeance and that wasn't satisfied with 0:17:13.400 --> 0:17:17.200 the chaosity caused it the first place. And now he's 0:17:17.280 --> 0:17:19.240 gone to see gouty son, the killy son. 0:17:19.280 --> 0:17:21.560 Well, that's the interesting thing about that. This night of 0:17:21.600 --> 0:17:23.480 the murders, he said, Well, I'm going to do one. 0:17:23.640 --> 0:17:26.280 I'm going to get them all, and were reflecting on 0:17:26.320 --> 0:17:30.159 conversations that he'd had with the ex wives in his 0:17:30.200 --> 0:17:32.359 Sydney I'm going to kill them all and whatever. It 0:17:32.480 --> 0:17:36.159 was become a parents in hindsight that if he was 0:17:36.200 --> 0:17:37.720 going to do one, he was going to do them all. 0:17:37.760 --> 0:17:41.400 And on this particular night, unfortunately, they were all home 0:17:41.440 --> 0:17:44.000 and they were all available. So he drove to Sherwood Close. 0:17:44.040 --> 0:17:46.480 It was night, it was dark, parked the car around 0:17:46.520 --> 0:17:49.040 the street out of sight because Sherd five Sherwood closes 0:17:49.080 --> 0:17:52.400 a little cul de sac, and he approached the house 0:17:52.400 --> 0:17:55.520 down the left hand side where David's car was. It 0:17:55.600 --> 0:17:58.959 was in darkness. David's dog started barking. David was in 0:17:58.960 --> 0:18:04.680 the house with Michelle Cooper and Stevie Lee, and David's 0:18:04.680 --> 0:18:07.840 dog started barking. At that point, David went outside out 0:18:07.880 --> 0:18:11.000 the back to the back porch to see what was 0:18:11.000 --> 0:18:13.480 making the dog bark. And as David stepped out of 0:18:13.480 --> 0:18:16.919 the back porch looked to his left, the light came on. 0:18:17.080 --> 0:18:19.440 Looked to his left, his father stepped out of the 0:18:19.560 --> 0:18:22.639 darkness and from about three meters fired at him. That 0:18:22.960 --> 0:18:26.119 shot hit him in the chest and knocked him unconscious, 0:18:26.160 --> 0:18:29.040 and he slumped back onto a garden chair in the backyard. 0:18:29.400 --> 0:18:31.560 Baker then walked up to him at point blank range 0:18:31.560 --> 0:18:35.040 and shot him in the head, just the brutale, without 0:18:35.040 --> 0:18:38.520 saying a word, no words for exchange. Michelle Cooper could 0:18:38.560 --> 0:18:41.240 hear the conversation if there was one inside, and she 0:18:42.000 --> 0:18:45.080 heard the shots, she was straight away. She looked out, 0:18:45.200 --> 0:18:49.439 she saw her boyfriend slumped dead in the chair. She 0:18:49.480 --> 0:18:52.120 straight away locked the house and bunkered down. Baker wasn't 0:18:52.160 --> 0:18:54.879 interested in Michelle Cooper. He had no motivation, no reason 0:18:54.920 --> 0:18:58.199 to hurt her. She'd never done anything to stand in 0:18:58.240 --> 0:19:00.439 his way with Kerry Anne. She just happened to be 0:19:00.680 --> 0:19:04.560 in that very short term relationship with David. At that 0:19:04.640 --> 0:19:06.879 point he ran back to his car and he was 0:19:06.920 --> 0:19:09.920 seen reversing his car down the street that he had 0:19:10.000 --> 0:19:12.800 hidden in. The wheel screeched and he drove off. 0:19:16.080 --> 0:19:17.560 Where did he head after that? 0:19:17.680 --> 0:19:20.960 So after that he drove quite some distance from that 0:19:21.080 --> 0:19:26.320 bad Oh Bay to four sixty nine Wyong Road Pacific Highway, 0:19:26.359 --> 0:19:28.680 Wyong North, and that was the house of Ross Smith. 0:19:29.240 --> 0:19:30.760 Heard twenty minutes. 0:19:30.880 --> 0:19:33.760 It's good twenty minutes. Ye, oddly enough, in the book 0:19:33.800 --> 0:19:36.040 you talk about the police response. So all the police 0:19:36.040 --> 0:19:39.800 resources rushed to Terrigle. Police from the Wyon command were 0:19:40.520 --> 0:19:43.639 rushing to Terrigle en route they'd heard about the shooting 0:19:43.760 --> 0:19:45.959 at bad O Bay. They diverted to bad O Bay, 0:19:46.000 --> 0:19:48.720 which was closer. All the police resources were heading south. 0:19:48.760 --> 0:19:51.560 So Gio gradit graphically for people down the stand. You've 0:19:51.560 --> 0:19:57.560 got Terrible south, then Bay northwest, fifteen to twenty minutes northwest, 0:19:57.880 --> 0:19:58.879 and then. 0:19:59.240 --> 0:20:02.120 Wyong's another twenty twenty five minutes northwest. 0:20:02.200 --> 0:20:04.359 So all the police have headed down to what was 0:20:04.400 --> 0:20:07.080 happening at Terrygle, and then when the incidents happened at 0:20:07.080 --> 0:20:09.520 bad Obay, that would have been notified. And then you 0:20:09.600 --> 0:20:12.040 got Baker heading up to wile. 0:20:11.920 --> 0:20:14.240 Well, heading up to Wine and there was no there 0:20:14.320 --> 0:20:17.560