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Speaker 1: Imagine if you will getting picked on at school because

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Speaker 1: you didn't look like or didn't sound like all the

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Speaker 1: other kind bossie kids. Then imagine that you discover you're

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Speaker 1: very good at something that those Aussie kids really value,

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Speaker 1: and you get so good at it you set multiple

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Speaker 1: world records. You win more World Championship, Commonwealth and Olympic

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Speaker 1: gold medals than you can put in a pool room.

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Speaker 1: You're a towering human. You've got hands like house bricks.

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Speaker 1: You have a smile that can light any room you're in,

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Speaker 1: which is good because your shoulders are so broad. Everyone

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Speaker 1: you speak to is permanently in shadow. You walk through

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Speaker 1: the world as a powerful physical specimen, the living embodiment

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Speaker 1: of Australian masculinity. And then your body turns on itself.

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Speaker 1: A rare autoimmune disease with no cure, starts to shred

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Speaker 1: your nervous system, Your muscle start to atrophy, your increasingly

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Speaker 1: impeded mobility, and your basic physical ability begins to vanish

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Speaker 1: more and more every day. How do you feel right now?

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Speaker 1: Would you be enjoying this part of your life today?

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Speaker 1: My guest is Michael Klym, and I've just asked you

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Speaker 1: to imagine exactly what he's gone through. You're about to

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Speaker 1: hear me ask him how he feels after everything that

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Speaker 1: he's going through, and how he got to telling me

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Speaker 1: His answer, which is actually enjoying this part of his life.

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Speaker 1: How he got to that answer is nothing short of inspirational,

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Speaker 1: and we'll get right to it.

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Speaker 2: I'll be back after the break.

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Speaker 1: Today. Thanks for listening to the show. This is better

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Speaker 1: than yesterday, helping you make today better than yesterday. Since

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Speaker 1: twenty thirteen, I'm watching Ginsburg. I'm a podcaster, I'm a

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Speaker 1: best selling author, I'm a documentary maker, I host TV.

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Speaker 1: I'm a post surgery deadlift pr rechiever today, so I'm

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Speaker 1: very happy about I'm a solar panel quote requester. Still

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Speaker 1: wedding on the other one to get back to me,

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Speaker 1: and I'm very glad you're here. Thanks for being a

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Speaker 1: part of the show. Before we get to Michael Clem,

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Speaker 1: thank you so much for your questions. Please do keep

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Speaker 1: them coming in. I very much enjoy doing those episodes

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Speaker 1: with Audrey, my wife. It's quite fun. She's very funny.

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Speaker 1: There's a link in the show notes. It'll take you

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Speaker 1: to the newsletter. Just you'll see a button that says,

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Speaker 1: send a message, just pop your questions there and hopefully

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Speaker 1: you'll be a part of the show. So Michael Clym

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Speaker 1: is easily one of the most physically recognizable athletes in

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Speaker 1: our country. He's got this unmistakable atuesque physeeke. You could

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Speaker 1: spot it from across a footy field like long way

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Speaker 1: dead ballline to dead ball line, and even though you're

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Speaker 1: one hundred meters away, you'd see him. You'd recognize him instantly,

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Speaker 1: and then you'd think, hang on, is Michael Clem walking

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Speaker 1: with a cane? Michael Clem is everything that this show

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Speaker 1: is about. He's a man who went faced with immense adversity,

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Speaker 1: found his way to acceptance and got into action. There

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Speaker 1: were a lot of bumps in the road, that's for sure,

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Speaker 1: but it's important to hear that no success is linear.

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Speaker 1: Never Michael Clym is a joyful, joyful man despite the

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Speaker 1: immense physical challenges that he currently faces. He's just a

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Speaker 1: delight to be in the presence of He's got a

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Speaker 1: new book out right now. It's called clim and it's

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Speaker 1: more than a sporting memoir. It's a truly courageous look

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Speaker 1: into what it costs to be the best and what

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Speaker 1: it takes to meet the kind of challenges that you

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Speaker 1: and I would never in a worse night mess want

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Speaker 1: to dream about facing in or out of the poor.

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Speaker 1: He's a magnificent man. I know you're going to enjoy

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Speaker 1: this wonderful time with the great, great Michael klem. When

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Speaker 1: you were at the top of like training, what was

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Speaker 1: your breasting heart rate? To remember, it was.

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Speaker 3: In the forties.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, And I remember like there was a problem and

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Speaker 4: I'd go to hospital because like the alarm would sound

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Speaker 4: and all the nurses would start running in and I'd

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Speaker 4: be like, no, no, that's it's kind of normal.

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Speaker 1: I'm just astoundingly good at turning oxygen.

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Speaker 4: Surprisingly that I just did that the DNA test with

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Speaker 4: all the new sort of performance traits, and the only

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Speaker 4: thing my recovery heart rate was way above normal. But

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Speaker 4: my athletic ability, what's the way below average? Yeah, so

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Speaker 4: like a lot of traits would below average. So it's

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Speaker 4: more environmental than anything.

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Speaker 1: I'd love to get into all that. Look, we have

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Speaker 1: a bit in common. I was very happy to hear

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Speaker 1: you pop up in a conversation with my friend Rich.

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Speaker 1: I've known him for a very, very long time. Yet

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Speaker 1: we also have something in common in that well, I

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Speaker 1: didn't actually get here from there, but we both grew

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Speaker 1: up with families who came to Australia from Eastern Europe

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Speaker 1: and both had to kind of go, well, I've got

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Speaker 1: a weird name compared everybody else, and my lunch box

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Speaker 1: looks very different and.

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Speaker 3: I look very different. Yeah, I would stand.

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Speaker 1: Out a lot, lunch cheek bos of somewhat. I remember

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Speaker 1: actually in high school, my history teacher, he took one

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Speaker 1: look at me and goes, what's your last name? Irish Ginsburg. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I can tell that's racist. I'm not actually Jewish, but

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Speaker 1: I think you'd say that to Conrad Limb over there,

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Speaker 1: but saying Conrad's not real anyway. You how old were

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Speaker 1: you when you got here?

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Speaker 3: I was eleven.

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Speaker 1: Man, all right, So like heaps of heaps of like

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Speaker 1: pre early childhood memories and all that early per day.

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Speaker 4: And I lived in five different countries before even coming

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Speaker 4: to Australia, so it's spent five years. In four and

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Speaker 4: a half years in India. I learned to swim there.

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Speaker 4: My dad was working for the Polish consulate, so we

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Speaker 4: were traveling around and I went from India, back to Poland, Germany,

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Speaker 4: Canada and then eventually Australia.

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Speaker 1: What part of Poland?

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Speaker 3: Did you grow up in?

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Speaker 4: Dina, which is right in the north on the Baltic

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Speaker 4: Sea actually next to Dansk, where the where the Second

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Speaker 4: World War start at the first bomb land It's ah.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so right, because my mum's from Lithuania, which is.

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Speaker 3: Like, yeah, it's staying from just around just.

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Speaker 1: Around the corner. Did you come to Sydney, No, we

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Speaker 1: went to Melbourne. Melbourne, Yeah, a little a little more immigranty.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, biz, coming from Toronto in Canada like you Land,

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Speaker 4: I mean Toronto out, but not like Melbourne. Like I

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Speaker 4: thought the end of Sinkilla Road was like the end

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Speaker 4: of the city, but that was just a That's when

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Speaker 4: suburbia started and it just it was like just so

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Speaker 4: much space. Wow, flabberg acid, But how much space there was?

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Speaker 1: What was different about I mean, your dad was a diplomat,

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Speaker 1: So what was different about your dad to the way

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Speaker 1: that you saw I mean, you don't know your dad's

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Speaker 1: different until you see him. In contrast, Yeah, what was

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Speaker 1: it different about your dad to other days?

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Speaker 4: I think the fact that he had seen so much

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Speaker 4: and traveled so much he always wanted. I don't know,

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Speaker 4: he felt that it was more for us elsewhere. And

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Speaker 4: I mean good and bad timing. In eighty nine when

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Speaker 4: we arrived in Australia, Wall fell dout, you know. So

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Speaker 4: he was a kind of a pioneer and trying to

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Speaker 4: give us the best future. I don't think he's ever

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Speaker 4: had regrets about not going back and letting us grow

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Speaker 4: up in Poland. But I think the fact that he

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Speaker 4: was he was always an alternative thinker. He was import exports,

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Speaker 4: so he's an entrepreneurial, you know, not always doing things

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Speaker 4: by the book, and so he was you know, I

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Speaker 4: think he was getting a lot of scrutiny from the

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Speaker 4: government while we lived in Poland as well, because he

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Speaker 4: was so resourceful and was able to get these new

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Speaker 4: gigs overseas, and you know, so and he always had

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Speaker 4: this kind of and I guess maybe that's how I

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Speaker 4: got my entrepreneur or kind of from that. He liked

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Speaker 4: to sort of always negotiate hard and you know, opportunist

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Speaker 4: when he had to be.

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Speaker 1: And it's got to be kind of interesting to be

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Speaker 1: that guy. Because I only left from what my father

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Speaker 1: taught me. I went back to Prague with him thirty

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Speaker 1: years of the month that he escaped. He was twenty

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Speaker 1: four when he left, sixty eight when the Russians came

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Speaker 1: in and talking with his friends and you know, he

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Speaker 1: would he found a whole lot of mates to go

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Speaker 1: and be able to speak with him, and he hadn't

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Speaker 1: seen thirty years, right, and just they were you know,

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Speaker 1: educated people. They had a bit of get up and

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Speaker 1: go about it. And just how the party treated the

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Speaker 1: Communist Party just was like no fucking way, and like

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Speaker 1: that took one particular. I remember he was the editor

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Speaker 1: of this big medical journal. They made him the typesetterup. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you go down the basement, our buddy, you're there for

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Speaker 1: the next citing. That's fucking what he did.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, you can, I mean, obviously that's what communism is about.

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Speaker 3: You can't stand out.

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Speaker 4: I have vague memories of growing up there where you know,

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Speaker 4: gray Commission flats and you know, food tickets and lining

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Speaker 4: up for the basics of like bread and milk and

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Speaker 4: in flour and things that we really take for granted.

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Speaker 3: And I remember Mum coming home from the shops one.

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Speaker 4: Day with bruis of ReBs because people were you know,

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Speaker 4: like it's pretty dire, like if you forget that, you know,

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Speaker 4: like we were Upper Arms when there was a toilet

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Speaker 4: paper shortage during COVID and Mom was like, this is

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Speaker 4: like home, this is like what I was growing up in.

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Speaker 3: Wow, we didn't have toilet paper for a couple of weeks.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, but people were very quick to say whoever made

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Speaker 1: they was like, you're a dictator. No, they're just a

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Speaker 1: supply chain issue. There's a very big difference between this

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Speaker 1: and what a communist is. People kind of use these

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Speaker 1: words not quite really understanding what it means. You know,

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Speaker 1: do you remember the way sport played a role in

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Speaker 1: communism is because that was a big thing and you

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Speaker 1: see in China now is this is how we can

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Speaker 1: show those guys.

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Speaker 4: Probably not that much in Poland because it was you know,

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Speaker 4: we were obviously that Poland wasn't lucrative, we didn't have

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Speaker 4: an infrastructure and the facilities, but it was for me

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Speaker 4: it was a way too, you know, already at that

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Speaker 4: age to kind of get away from a lot of

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Speaker 4: the things that are happening outside of say sport and

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Speaker 4: even at school and I kind of always had this

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Speaker 4: affinity with swimming, especially tennis was the other sport in

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Speaker 4: our family, and that was also another opportunity that my

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Speaker 4: dad was trying to make sure that we explored as

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Speaker 4: much as we could. And my sister showed a lot

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Speaker 4: of prowess and in her tennis and she was a

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Speaker 4: national champion when she arrived under sixteen and went pro

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Speaker 4: and all that. So what dad wanted to provide for us,

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Speaker 4: we ended up achieving, which was a great way to

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Speaker 4: say thanks in a way, because they did sacrifice a lot.

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Speaker 4: They left the family, friends and yeah, so it was

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Speaker 4: great to achieve the things for them as well.

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Speaker 1: So you learned to swim in India. When did you

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Speaker 1: realize that, I, you know, I love this, but oh

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Speaker 1: I love it more than everybody else. At what point

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Speaker 1: did you kind of realize that you were kind of

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Speaker 1: really really into it, way more into it.

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Speaker 4: Probably not until, I mean definitely when I arrived here

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Speaker 4: in Australia and you know there's I mean, swimming in

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Speaker 4: Canada was very popular sport.

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Speaker 3: Also in Germany.

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Speaker 4: I remember actually my first Olympic experience was watching Dunkan

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Speaker 4: Armstrong and gold and eighty eight and I was living

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Speaker 4: in Hamburg and watching that race in German commentary where

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Speaker 4: the German was the favorite to win that race and

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Speaker 4: West Germany at that point it was West Germany. Little

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Speaker 4: did I know that I'll be training with Duncan Armstrong,

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Speaker 4: you know, ten years later, but coming to Australia. And

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Speaker 4: then the first year, I wasn't that, you know, I

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Speaker 4: wasn't a standout. The second year neither. And probably two

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Speaker 4: or three years later, you know, I had this. I

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Speaker 4: had a better drive than other kids. I was more

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Speaker 4: dedicated and I was probably one of those annoying kids

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Speaker 4: that kept on pushing the older guys and pushing the

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Speaker 4: envelope a little bit. And I started winning national titles

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Speaker 4: for my age group around thirteen fourteen, right, so that

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Speaker 4: was kind of the breakthrough for me.

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Speaker 1: You don't get to national titles without at thirteen fourteen,

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Speaker 1: you don't get there without being like, I know, fuck you,

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Speaker 1: I'll go on stair at a black line for twelve

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Speaker 1: hours this week, yep, I'm in.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: I think being a migrant kid, everywhere I went, I

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Speaker 4: learned to be alone and I was comfortable with that

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Speaker 4: and you know, going and buses and going to training

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Speaker 4: at five am, and you know, traveling by myself and

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Speaker 4: not necessar relying on my parents to I mean, they

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Speaker 4: facilitated everything, but it was ultimately up to me. I

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Speaker 4: almost had this kind of mission to do things. And

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Speaker 4: I see the same kind of with my son. He's

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Speaker 4: now boarding at Wesley College in Melbourne and he kind

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Speaker 4: of enjoys doing things by himself, getting on the train,

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Speaker 4: by himself, traveling.

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Speaker 3: And it was almost a bit of a challenge at

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Speaker 3: that age to do it.

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Speaker 1: Base you feel kind of grown up, you feel kind

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Speaker 1: of there. I haven't had a chance. Well, I've spoken

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Speaker 1: of houstimmers in my time, but no one who's done

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Speaker 1: what you've done. When I first got diagnosed with obsessic

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Speaker 1: convulsive disorder, I just kind of deflated like a bouncy

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Speaker 1: castle after the cake's gone right. And my doctor he's

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Speaker 1: just up the road here, he says, how many kind

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Speaker 1: of wallabies and Olympians have had sitting in that chair, Like,

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Speaker 1: do you really think someone could stare at a black

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Speaker 1: line for you know, three hours a day, twice a day,

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Speaker 1: so that thing maybe in Tokyo in twelve years could happen.

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Speaker 1: Of course, you have to have a bit of that

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Speaker 1: when you got amongst the kind of more elite stuff,

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Speaker 1: when you started winning the statee stuff when I don't know,

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Speaker 1: was there a lot of jump in ease on the bus,

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Speaker 1: like people kind of hard to kind of focus. I

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Speaker 1: like racehorses.

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Speaker 3: When you'll get together, it's a really interesting room.

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Speaker 4: And it's kind of the dynamics in that room where,

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Speaker 4: especially in Australia, it's such a small nation and you

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Speaker 4: compete against each other and you're try and then you try,

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Speaker 4: and you know, then you represent the country together. So

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Speaker 4: it's very incestuous in that sense. But I think it's

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Speaker 4: it's a small percentage of people to get to that

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Speaker 4: level in the first place. So and every single person's

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Speaker 4: got different increases in what is it or traits, let's say,

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Speaker 4: all their habits. I was, you know, my kids say

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Speaker 4: I've got OCD for sure, and like, you know, even

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Speaker 4: the way and when I was racing or competing, it

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Speaker 4: was elevated.

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Speaker 3: I'd pack my bag three times.

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Speaker 4: I'd make sure i'd have spare goggles, you know, nearly

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Speaker 4: in every pocket. I'd triple quad triple check my straps

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Speaker 4: on my goggles and my zippers, and I'd pack extra

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Speaker 4: spare spare suits just in case, you know. And I

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Speaker 4: think ultimately sometimes I was mind doing, you know, because

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Speaker 4: I if things didn't go the way I wanted, or

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Speaker 4: if I couldn't find a comfortable place where I could

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Speaker 4: put my bag and I had enough space to do

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Speaker 4: my certain stretches or whatever, I find my coach and

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Speaker 4: it would rattle me. And it wasn't until I was

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Speaker 4: comfortable in I guess in my own sort of ability

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Speaker 4: and in my mindset that it didn't rattle me as much.

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Speaker 4: But my first Olympic Games, just the wheels fell over

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Speaker 4: because I just couldn't, you know, it didn't go the

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Speaker 4: way I planned and I just wouldn't handle it.

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Speaker 1: What changed for you was it ability? To you mentioned

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Speaker 1: a confidence in your own ability, But I can only

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Speaker 1: imagine that if you're say this literally just come from

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Speaker 1: a cardiologistic sprinting on a treadmill, try to be at

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Speaker 1: my peak? What changed for you when you're trying to

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Speaker 1: go to get ready to be at the most explosive

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Speaker 1: your body can possibly be that you've ever done more

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Speaker 1: so than in training with the lift of the crowd

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Speaker 1: and all that. But in between heats, just like the

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Speaker 1: lower I can get between heats, the better the next

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Speaker 1: one's going to be. Like, did you work on that

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Speaker 1: as well.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, so I think all my best races, and especially

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Speaker 4: that one and the relay in Sydney when I let

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Speaker 4: off in the world record is all that preparation's done.

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Speaker 4: You know, everything is in place, and the only thing

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Speaker 4: you can do is just almost like with a racehorse,

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Speaker 4: you just got to open the gates and let it run,

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Speaker 4: you know. And I think the more you overthink and

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Speaker 4: the more you try and follow a cert and cues

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Speaker 4: and you don't really even need to you know, like

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Speaker 4: it's and you don't even need to overemphasize effort. The

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Speaker 4: effort's going to be that you're in the race. In

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Speaker 4: the Olympic Games, seventeen thousand people there, you know, there's

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Speaker 4: the comment saying is that you've run.

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Speaker 3: The race before it's even run.

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Speaker 4: So I did one hundred and fifty races in one

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Speaker 4: calendar year, which was no one had ever really done

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Speaker 4: up to this up to that point.

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Speaker 3: So by the time I got up on the blocks.

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Speaker 4: Of ninety eight and ninety nine, for me, that process

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Speaker 4: became automatic. So I had maybe three or four cues

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Speaker 4: in the race, and I didn't have to think about

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Speaker 4: anything else. I didn't have to think about you know

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Speaker 4: my breathing pattern or my stroke. So approaching the wall,

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Speaker 4: everything was just you know, clicking, So I think the

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Speaker 4: better we can get out of our mind so to speak.

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Speaker 4: And yeah, just it was. It just comes down to

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Speaker 4: intuition and you know what to do because you're probably

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Speaker 4: swimming you know, thirty forty fifty k's a week.

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Speaker 3: So yeah, that was the key.

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Speaker 1: All the kind of stuff I need to think about,

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Speaker 1: which way my little thing has got to be as

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Speaker 1: it passes my hip. All that kind of stuff you

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Speaker 1: can't that's already in there and I can't adjust it

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Speaker 1: and nothing's going to change it. The thing I can

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Speaker 1: control and be aware of is regulating how much MP

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Speaker 1: IM going to Yeah, safely.

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Speaker 4: It's a sense of control too, because you're controlling a

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Speaker 4: movement with this fatigue setting in and you know your

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Speaker 4: body's going you know it's going to happen. You know

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Speaker 4: its Sometimes people get a shock if it happens sooner,

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Speaker 4: or if it doesn't happen if it happens later. So

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Speaker 4: it's more. My coach would always talk about staying in

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Speaker 4: control right up to you know, when you're touch the wall,

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Speaker 4: and you can even see in races when they're close finishes.

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Speaker 4: The people that lose control in those last few strokes

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Speaker 4: or start gasping for air or it's all about control.

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Speaker 1: I can't imagine. I mean, yeah, you're one of the

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Speaker 1: guys that you held a record for four years, so

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Speaker 1: you know what it is to win. But there's us

352
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Speaker 1: had one hundred and fifty races in a year. There

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Speaker 1: would have been a lot of them. You didn't win.

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Speaker 1: What's it like? You see how close they are, Like

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Speaker 1: there's length of it half a fingernail. You'll lose that

356
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Speaker 1: by What does that do to you?

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Speaker 3: Well?

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Speaker 4: You know that was the for me. I had that,

359
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Speaker 4: especially in Sydney. I had a roller coaster ride.

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Speaker 3: I won. I had won two.

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Speaker 4: Gold medals by day four, you know I was and

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Speaker 4: two order records.

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Speaker 1: Are you even sleep? How do you even relax and

364
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Speaker 1: get your tree?

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Speaker 3: So I was rooming with him.

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Speaker 4: So we had five gold medals by day four of

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Speaker 4: the Olympic Games and five five five fluffy kangaroos as well.

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Speaker 4: Actually thought he had a silver on top of that too,

369
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Speaker 4: But if for me? And then day six came and

370
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Speaker 4: I had one hundred fly and you know I lost

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Speaker 4: by less than point one of a second. So if

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Speaker 4: you get a credit, grab a stop watch and try

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Speaker 4: and stop it as fast as you can. Most people

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Speaker 4: get point point eight point oh seven, you know, so

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Speaker 4: it's faster than your body can react. And you know,

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Speaker 4: as you said, I had the word record for a

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Speaker 4: few years leading into that event, when unbeaten for quite

378
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Speaker 4: a few years, and to lose that specific grace in

379
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Speaker 4: front of your home crowd, yeah it was. It was

380
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Speaker 4: a tough one. And I've got a few mates, and

381
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Speaker 4: Daniel Kowalski, who we talk about the ones that got

382
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Speaker 4: away because they're not necessarily the ones we win, because

383
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Speaker 4: they're the ones that we kind of they're the hardest

384
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Speaker 4: ones to swallow. And you know Daniel's experience in ninety

385
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Speaker 4: six with Karen coming out of the blocks in lane eight,

386
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Speaker 4: and you know Daniel being the favorite too in that one,

387
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Speaker 4: there was a tough one for him as well.

388
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Speaker 3: So sometimes initially I thought, well, would my life look

389
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Speaker 3: like it would.

390
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Speaker 4: Be any different? And ultimately I don't think so, and

391
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Speaker 4: I know it wouldn't be. But it's almost that it's

392
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Speaker 4: I don't know if it's self gratitude or if it's

393
00:20:36,440 --> 00:20:39,159
Speaker 4: like the ego that wants you to say, you know,

394
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Speaker 4: I wanted to be individual gold medalists in my home country,

395
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Speaker 4: but you know, I'm so grateful to have been part

396
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Speaker 4: of them. Probably one of the most famous relays of

397
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Speaker 4: all time in Australia, and I still get to talk

398
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Speaker 4: about it every four years or even not even not

399
00:20:54,920 --> 00:20:59,320
Speaker 4: more often. But it's an interesting question because that's you

400
00:20:59,520 --> 00:21:02,480
Speaker 4: train for that, to be Olympic champion, and that didn't

401
00:21:02,520 --> 00:21:03,119
Speaker 4: happen for me.

402
00:21:03,480 --> 00:21:06,320
Speaker 1: What do you think you've learned about what it is

403
00:21:06,400 --> 00:21:10,000
Speaker 1: to to not get the thing you trained for, not

404
00:21:10,000 --> 00:21:12,240
Speaker 1: to get the thing, But what can when it happens,

405
00:21:12,359 --> 00:21:13,480
Speaker 1: What can you do with that?

406
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Speaker 4: The hardest thing is knowing that your best would have

407
00:21:17,480 --> 00:21:20,560
Speaker 4: been good enough. And you know, last who beat me,

408
00:21:20,880 --> 00:21:23,800
Speaker 4: you know, didn't beat my word record. It was a

409
00:21:23,800 --> 00:21:26,560
Speaker 4: little bit off. So that was the hardest thing, and

410
00:21:26,800 --> 00:21:29,080
Speaker 4: that's where resilience comes from, you know. And I think

411
00:21:29,119 --> 00:21:33,680
Speaker 4: my whole sporting career was built on pushing my envelope

412
00:21:33,680 --> 00:21:36,199
Speaker 4: because I wasn't the biggest, I wasn't the you know,

413
00:21:36,280 --> 00:21:39,320
Speaker 4: even the DNA results show that I wasn't the most

414
00:21:39,320 --> 00:21:42,680
Speaker 4: physically gifted or mentally gifted either in terms of sports.

415
00:21:42,720 --> 00:21:46,280
Speaker 4: So for me, I had to find resources on how

416
00:21:46,320 --> 00:21:49,919
Speaker 4: to swim fastest, so technology, using the suits, swimming in

417
00:21:49,960 --> 00:21:52,720
Speaker 4: a different way, so I, you know, swim with straight arms,

418
00:21:53,240 --> 00:21:55,320
Speaker 4: you know, I preferred to some underwater that on top

419
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Speaker 4: of the water. And I think in train differently for

420
00:21:58,760 --> 00:22:02,119
Speaker 4: example doing those races and traveling the world. So it

421
00:22:02,240 --> 00:22:05,120
Speaker 4: was an example that I still had something to learn.

422
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Speaker 4: And unfortunately, you know, my career was sort of due

423
00:22:08,080 --> 00:22:11,080
Speaker 4: by a lot of injuries after that. But mentally, I

424
00:22:11,119 --> 00:22:13,160
Speaker 4: knew that there was still other things that I could

425
00:22:13,320 --> 00:22:16,679
Speaker 4: you know, tweak and learn from that race, which I

426
00:22:16,800 --> 00:22:20,439
Speaker 4: never got to execute. But that's how I would, you know,

427
00:22:20,560 --> 00:22:23,480
Speaker 4: even in life after sport, I was when I was

428
00:22:23,520 --> 00:22:26,320
Speaker 4: doing sales and knocking on the door of you know,

429
00:22:26,920 --> 00:22:30,400
Speaker 4: the hundreds of retailers and distributors. I took that same

430
00:22:30,440 --> 00:22:32,359
Speaker 4: approach out in the poor I had to continue to

431
00:22:32,400 --> 00:22:36,760
Speaker 4: evolve and innovate and not take no for an answer.

432
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Speaker 1: But knowing that you can handle not getting what you

433
00:22:40,359 --> 00:22:42,280
Speaker 1: wanted so badly, does that give you something you can

434
00:22:42,280 --> 00:22:42,800
Speaker 1: carry with you?

435
00:22:43,359 --> 00:22:46,160
Speaker 4: I think so, I think, you know, initially I thought

436
00:22:46,200 --> 00:22:49,399
Speaker 4: i'd you know, we always get compared, and now like

437
00:22:49,880 --> 00:22:52,520
Speaker 4: there's always people, there's all these swimming stats.

438
00:22:53,160 --> 00:22:56,560
Speaker 1: I'm comparing my shoulders with yours right now, and especially

439
00:22:57,440 --> 00:22:59,240
Speaker 1: here in a cane, I'm like at them, motherfucking hell.

440
00:22:59,240 --> 00:23:03,840
Speaker 4: Man, I've lifted away in years, but that's the genetics.

441
00:23:04,480 --> 00:23:06,439
Speaker 3: But then if for the squads, you'd have me covered.

442
00:23:06,520 --> 00:23:11,800
Speaker 4: So but look, I think initially I thought it'd probably

443
00:23:11,840 --> 00:23:14,080
Speaker 4: make me weaker, but now looking back at where I

444
00:23:14,119 --> 00:23:17,440
Speaker 4: am and how I am able to influence others through

445
00:23:17,440 --> 00:23:20,960
Speaker 4: my recent journey, it's actually, if anything, it's made me

446
00:23:21,040 --> 00:23:24,639
Speaker 4: tougher because if if everyone gets everything there after, I

447
00:23:24,640 --> 00:23:27,480
Speaker 4: don't think there's I don't know anyone that doesn't have

448
00:23:27,520 --> 00:23:30,119
Speaker 4: a challenge in their life or it's you know, I

449
00:23:30,119 --> 00:23:33,640
Speaker 4: mean when no one's so blessed, and even the most

450
00:23:33,640 --> 00:23:36,840
Speaker 4: successful athletes in the world, I guarantee you they still

451
00:23:36,880 --> 00:23:39,960
Speaker 4: want more. I mean, I know Kaylee McEwan well and

452
00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:44,200
Speaker 4: the shoes the best and it's gone double double, but.

453
00:23:44,240 --> 00:23:45,760
Speaker 3: She's still hungry for more.

454
00:23:45,920 --> 00:23:49,720
Speaker 4: So you know, I think, yeah, it's hard to meet

455
00:23:50,160 --> 00:23:53,000
Speaker 4: someone's appetite that's that driven.

456
00:23:53,119 --> 00:23:57,160
Speaker 1: What's how you get to be double level because everyone

457
00:23:57,200 --> 00:23:59,320
Speaker 1: else has gone you know what, I think, I'm finey, Yeah,

458
00:23:59,359 --> 00:24:02,639
Speaker 1: I'm good and as socially as you get older and

459
00:24:02,680 --> 00:24:06,200
Speaker 1: your body starts going dude, well come on, it hurts, yeah,

460
00:24:06,320 --> 00:24:06,920
Speaker 1: like it still.

461
00:24:07,440 --> 00:24:09,160
Speaker 3: And that was the story of my comeback.

462
00:24:09,280 --> 00:24:14,479
Speaker 4: You know, I physically, my body definitely wasn't responding it.

463
00:24:14,520 --> 00:24:16,439
Speaker 3: But mentally I was like, I want to do this.

464
00:24:16,640 --> 00:24:19,119
Speaker 4: I still want to go around the block again and

465
00:24:19,280 --> 00:24:22,720
Speaker 4: be part of this amazing group of people and be

466
00:24:22,800 --> 00:24:25,440
Speaker 4: part of this team that you know, we had such

467
00:24:25,440 --> 00:24:29,040
Speaker 4: a great era. But it's when that physical and mental

468
00:24:29,119 --> 00:24:31,360
Speaker 4: don't match, it's a it's a tough one and that's

469
00:24:31,400 --> 00:24:32,040
Speaker 4: when you start.

470
00:24:32,480 --> 00:24:32,840
Speaker 3: I did.

471
00:24:32,880 --> 00:24:36,119
Speaker 4: Anyway, I started resenting a lot, you know, the sport.

472
00:24:36,280 --> 00:24:40,040
Speaker 4: I started being grumpy. I started really being angry with

473
00:24:40,080 --> 00:24:43,960
Speaker 4: myself that, you know, why is it, why can't I

474
00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:45,320
Speaker 4: line up these two things?

475
00:24:45,359 --> 00:24:48,080
Speaker 3: And why can't I swim again the way I did before?

476
00:24:48,720 --> 00:24:52,480
Speaker 4: What changed for you, Well, there was this age there

477
00:24:52,560 --> 00:24:55,200
Speaker 4: was definitely you know, like assuming in your early thirties

478
00:24:55,320 --> 00:24:58,840
Speaker 4: is much different to swimming when you got one sole

479
00:24:58,960 --> 00:25:03,040
Speaker 4: focus is is just swimming. And the second time around,

480
00:25:03,040 --> 00:25:05,720
Speaker 4: I had a family, I was running a business. You know,

481
00:25:06,320 --> 00:25:08,720
Speaker 4: I ended up going actually to the same level as

482
00:25:08,760 --> 00:25:11,600
Speaker 4: I do when I retired. I didn't take into account

483
00:25:11,600 --> 00:25:13,960
Speaker 4: that the rest of the world was also going to progress,

484
00:25:14,080 --> 00:25:17,679
Speaker 4: and we had you know, likes of James Magnuson, Cameron McAvoy.

485
00:25:17,760 --> 00:25:19,920
Speaker 4: They all came on the same aim and make am

486
00:25:19,920 --> 00:25:23,280
Speaker 4: and Sullivan. Sorry, so I didn't evolve as much as

487
00:25:23,320 --> 00:25:26,160
Speaker 4: they did so, but it also proved that you can,

488
00:25:26,480 --> 00:25:29,880
Speaker 4: you can manage, and it's probably healthier to have other

489
00:25:29,920 --> 00:25:31,720
Speaker 4: things in your life, you know, Like when I was

490
00:25:31,760 --> 00:25:35,520
Speaker 4: a pro, it was literally everyone was working for me

491
00:25:35,640 --> 00:25:38,640
Speaker 4: almost you know, you have all these resources feeding into

492
00:25:39,760 --> 00:25:42,879
Speaker 4: it's a very selfish existence. And by that the second

493
00:25:42,880 --> 00:25:45,800
Speaker 4: time around, you know, the pressure wasn't there. I wasn't

494
00:25:46,359 --> 00:25:48,080
Speaker 4: I was kind of okay. I could come home and

495
00:25:48,119 --> 00:25:50,080
Speaker 4: the kids didn't care. They were toddlers. They didn't care

496
00:25:50,119 --> 00:25:52,000
Speaker 4: if I won or lost, even though there were saying

497
00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:55,600
Speaker 4: go in, daddy. But it was it was a it

498
00:25:55,640 --> 00:25:58,600
Speaker 4: put a kind of a normal spin on things. Rather

499
00:25:58,680 --> 00:26:00,920
Speaker 4: than for me, it was that I used to beat

500
00:26:01,000 --> 00:26:03,119
Speaker 4: myself up a lot if I didn't get the result

501
00:26:03,200 --> 00:26:03,600
Speaker 4: I wanted.

502
00:26:03,840 --> 00:26:07,359
Speaker 1: Resentment is is tough. I face, certainly face it in

503
00:26:07,400 --> 00:26:10,560
Speaker 1: my career. I faced right now. You know, I'm fifty,

504
00:26:10,640 --> 00:26:13,240
Speaker 1: I'm you know, trying to figure out what the fuck

505
00:26:13,280 --> 00:26:16,359
Speaker 1: to do. Is my industry changes very rapidly, you know,

506
00:26:16,400 --> 00:26:19,480
Speaker 1: And I turn around and I see he's not magnism,

507
00:26:19,560 --> 00:26:21,639
Speaker 1: but I see some you know those kids love what

508
00:26:21,680 --> 00:26:24,080
Speaker 1: are they twenty two? They grunt for like an hour?

509
00:26:24,640 --> 00:26:29,199
Speaker 1: Four hundred thousand people follow them? Fucking how Like what happened?

510
00:26:29,760 --> 00:26:30,560
Speaker 3: What do I have to say?

511
00:26:30,680 --> 00:26:33,119
Speaker 1: What I do? And you know, I was sort of

512
00:26:33,119 --> 00:26:34,479
Speaker 1: my wife about this last night. It is like, I

513
00:26:34,520 --> 00:26:37,840
Speaker 1: just don't even there's resentment there, and I know it's

514
00:26:37,880 --> 00:26:39,880
Speaker 1: really bad for me to have because it doesn't it's

515
00:26:39,920 --> 00:26:42,280
Speaker 1: not productive whatsoever, and it's going to end everything if

516
00:26:42,320 --> 00:26:44,879
Speaker 1: I careful, because exactly what happens to you, Yeah, you

517
00:26:44,920 --> 00:26:46,879
Speaker 1: get cranky, you start to be a bit of a

518
00:26:46,880 --> 00:26:49,359
Speaker 1: punish and then nobody wants to be around and you're like,

519
00:26:49,400 --> 00:26:50,800
Speaker 1: see I told you that I want and then you

520
00:26:50,960 --> 00:26:51,920
Speaker 1: kind of make it true.

521
00:26:52,440 --> 00:26:56,399
Speaker 4: I mean, for me, in terms of my personality really changing,

522
00:26:56,680 --> 00:27:01,280
Speaker 4: was when you know, when I got diagnosed and I

523
00:27:01,320 --> 00:27:06,320
Speaker 4: was really kind of playing I played that victim card

524
00:27:06,400 --> 00:27:06,840
Speaker 4: so well.

525
00:27:06,920 --> 00:27:09,280
Speaker 3: I was angry with the world. Why was I dealt

526
00:27:09,280 --> 00:27:09,800
Speaker 3: this card?

527
00:27:10,400 --> 00:27:13,800
Speaker 4: I was resentful with everyone around me, you know, the

528
00:27:15,560 --> 00:27:17,680
Speaker 4: I felt that it was I was hard done by

529
00:27:18,240 --> 00:27:21,560
Speaker 4: and so that was kind of the emotions that I had,

530
00:27:21,960 --> 00:27:24,600
Speaker 4: you know, when I first retired towards the sport, I

531
00:27:24,680 --> 00:27:29,120
Speaker 4: had those emotions towards everyone else and towards me as well,

532
00:27:29,200 --> 00:27:31,879
Speaker 4: like did I do something wrong to deserve this? And

533
00:27:31,920 --> 00:27:33,960
Speaker 4: it was that what kind of got me into a

534
00:27:34,000 --> 00:27:36,760
Speaker 4: pretty pretty dark place after a couple of years.

535
00:27:37,000 --> 00:27:44,480
Speaker 1: So we're talking about the chronic inflammatory diet demielinatingly europathy.

536
00:27:44,600 --> 00:27:46,679
Speaker 1: I should know this because I heard about it. My

537
00:27:46,720 --> 00:27:50,399
Speaker 1: father was a rheumatologist, so he was all about autoimmune disease, right,

538
00:27:50,440 --> 00:27:53,080
Speaker 1: but autoimmunes, yeah, I mean I grew up with a

539
00:27:53,080 --> 00:27:54,080
Speaker 1: guy that treated this stuff.

540
00:27:54,160 --> 00:27:54,320
Speaker 3: Right.

541
00:27:54,560 --> 00:27:58,359
Speaker 1: Auto immune stuff is so so I don't want to

542
00:27:58,400 --> 00:28:01,800
Speaker 1: say cruel, but it kind of is because it's just

543
00:28:01,840 --> 00:28:04,920
Speaker 1: a gene that turns on and that's it, and nobody

544
00:28:05,240 --> 00:28:07,960
Speaker 1: often they're not caused by anything, but it happens, and

545
00:28:08,000 --> 00:28:12,520
Speaker 1: then fucking that's it. What happens now. And most of it, well,

546
00:28:12,560 --> 00:28:16,720
Speaker 1: my dad's work was most of it was managing quality

547
00:28:16,760 --> 00:28:19,520
Speaker 1: of life because it couldn't take it away, make it

548
00:28:20,040 --> 00:28:24,160
Speaker 1: and quality of life involved as well. Well. These meds

549
00:28:24,200 --> 00:28:26,600
Speaker 1: will make it better, and these mens will also turn

550
00:28:26,680 --> 00:28:31,080
Speaker 1: your stomach into a piece of toilet paper. So we're

551
00:28:31,080 --> 00:28:32,439
Speaker 1: going to need to have these meds or you're going

552
00:28:32,480 --> 00:28:35,120
Speaker 1: to have to think about how you manage this, you know,

553
00:28:35,200 --> 00:28:38,680
Speaker 1: and as someone who you know, you're in the tiniest

554
00:28:38,680 --> 00:28:41,720
Speaker 1: percentile of what humans can do with their bodies. To know,

555
00:28:43,280 --> 00:28:44,800
Speaker 1: you know, I know what it feels like to be strong.

556
00:28:44,840 --> 00:28:46,800
Speaker 1: I know what it feels like to I can run

557
00:28:46,880 --> 00:28:49,400
Speaker 1: fucking thirty k's if I want back when I was running.

558
00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:51,040
Speaker 1: I know what it feels like to pull a deadlift.

559
00:28:51,080 --> 00:28:54,160
Speaker 1: I know what I feel strong. I feel powerful to

560
00:28:54,280 --> 00:28:58,400
Speaker 1: have that be told like, that's probably not going to

561
00:28:58,400 --> 00:28:59,840
Speaker 1: be there all the time. You know, it's going to

562
00:28:59,880 --> 00:29:00,520
Speaker 1: be one day.

563
00:29:00,520 --> 00:29:04,520
Speaker 3: Get yeah, yeah, I would have been so yeah.

564
00:29:04,680 --> 00:29:11,000
Speaker 4: The hard thing was seeing actually experiencing it, and seeing

565
00:29:11,040 --> 00:29:14,000
Speaker 4: it kind of disappearing in front of my own eyes

566
00:29:14,080 --> 00:29:16,960
Speaker 4: right in the not only in the mirror, but if

567
00:29:16,960 --> 00:29:20,680
Speaker 4: I'd be sitting down or walking, my calves were just

568
00:29:20,680 --> 00:29:24,960
Speaker 4: just just fading away, and I could I would notice

569
00:29:24,960 --> 00:29:27,960
Speaker 4: in photos visibly that my you know, like from the

570
00:29:28,080 --> 00:29:30,400
Speaker 4: knees down, I don't really have any calves left. It's

571
00:29:30,600 --> 00:29:32,080
Speaker 4: a little bit on my left side.

572
00:29:32,160 --> 00:29:34,240
Speaker 3: So I was.

573
00:29:34,520 --> 00:29:37,680
Speaker 4: Rehabbing a bad ankle on the on the left side,

574
00:29:37,680 --> 00:29:39,800
Speaker 4: and I quit one day, just couldn't do a car

575
00:29:39,880 --> 00:29:42,720
Speaker 4: phraise on the right side. And that was kind of

576
00:29:42,760 --> 00:29:45,800
Speaker 4: the start of it. And so it was just being

577
00:29:45,880 --> 00:29:48,480
Speaker 4: stripped away of this kind of slowly. The things that

578
00:29:48,520 --> 00:29:51,960
Speaker 4: I was runnowned through my physique and my ability to

579
00:29:52,080 --> 00:29:53,680
Speaker 4: even post them my career.

580
00:29:53,720 --> 00:29:56,400
Speaker 3: I want to do it adventurous, Sure, I'll do it right,

581
00:29:56,560 --> 00:29:57,200
Speaker 3: three hours.

582
00:29:57,880 --> 00:30:00,320
Speaker 4: Right, I'd run a few marathons and do I could

583
00:30:00,360 --> 00:30:03,479
Speaker 4: do anything. And then I couldn't get up one flighter

584
00:30:03,520 --> 00:30:06,680
Speaker 4: stairs after six months, and then I couldn't get to

585
00:30:06,720 --> 00:30:08,720
Speaker 4: the water cooler and I'd fall over.

586
00:30:08,920 --> 00:30:14,920
Speaker 3: And so because it came so quickly, I wasn't equipped for.

587
00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:17,680
Speaker 4: It, I wasn't ready for it. I was drowning. I

588
00:30:17,720 --> 00:30:20,520
Speaker 4: was drowning my emotions with the wrong stuff, you know.

589
00:30:20,600 --> 00:30:24,160
Speaker 4: I secluded myself from the rest of the world, used

590
00:30:24,280 --> 00:30:27,600
Speaker 4: COVID as an excuse, and I kind of just fell

591
00:30:27,600 --> 00:30:31,800
Speaker 4: into you know, used all the pattern that wouldn't set

592
00:30:31,840 --> 00:30:35,800
Speaker 4: me up for longevity in this condition. So, yeah, they

593
00:30:35,840 --> 00:30:39,200
Speaker 4: had to come a time where actually wasn't up to

594
00:30:39,360 --> 00:30:43,360
Speaker 4: the people in my life, my partner who was amazing, Michelle,

595
00:30:43,400 --> 00:30:47,400
Speaker 4: and my parents and my sister to be that support network.

596
00:30:47,440 --> 00:30:49,560
Speaker 4: It was up to me to get out of that.

597
00:30:49,840 --> 00:30:53,360
Speaker 4: And ultimately, you know that the moment I dropped that

598
00:30:53,440 --> 00:30:58,560
Speaker 4: ego and I realized that, you know, people respect me

599
00:30:58,720 --> 00:31:03,120
Speaker 4: or people like me for my personality or whatever. They

600
00:31:03,120 --> 00:31:06,960
Speaker 4: don't like me because I've got big lads or it

601
00:31:07,040 --> 00:31:10,600
Speaker 4: was like it was almost that shallow and that vain,

602
00:31:10,680 --> 00:31:11,440
Speaker 4: that mentality.

603
00:31:11,520 --> 00:31:12,720
Speaker 3: It was just bizarre.

604
00:31:12,960 --> 00:31:15,880
Speaker 1: But it's understandable Michael, considering you know, if I think

605
00:31:15,920 --> 00:31:18,760
Speaker 1: if I recall like some of the you know, some

606
00:31:18,800 --> 00:31:22,240
Speaker 1: of the marketing stuff you were involved in around the time, Fuck,

607
00:31:22,320 --> 00:31:24,720
Speaker 1: I would have got my rig out every second of

608
00:31:24,760 --> 00:31:28,560
Speaker 1: the day if I looked like that, like take all

609
00:31:28,600 --> 00:31:31,360
Speaker 1: the photos you want, you know, you know, I would

610
00:31:31,400 --> 00:31:34,479
Speaker 1: do that all. And it's understandable that if you've got

611
00:31:34,520 --> 00:31:36,760
Speaker 1: that much focus on you and that many people want

612
00:31:36,800 --> 00:31:38,360
Speaker 1: to throw money at you a whole of things like

613
00:31:38,720 --> 00:31:42,720
Speaker 1: oh yeah, it's because of this and having that association.

614
00:31:42,800 --> 00:31:44,720
Speaker 1: It makes sense, you know, and it's not you. I'm

615
00:31:44,760 --> 00:31:48,320
Speaker 1: not a bad person for feeling that. Yeah, you know,

616
00:31:49,280 --> 00:31:50,640
Speaker 1: you have it, Like I said, you don't have an

617
00:31:50,680 --> 00:31:52,200
Speaker 1: awareness that it won't always be there.

618
00:31:52,280 --> 00:31:55,080
Speaker 4: Yeah, And I had to because I think I over

619
00:31:55,720 --> 00:31:59,560
Speaker 4: those couple of first years of disorder, I sort of

620
00:32:00,720 --> 00:32:04,840
Speaker 4: my as you said, my awareness was terrible, even in

621
00:32:04,840 --> 00:32:09,280
Speaker 4: my relationship with my partner, even as a parent, and workwise,

622
00:32:09,360 --> 00:32:13,640
Speaker 4: my productivity was shocking. And so the moment I just

623
00:32:13,760 --> 00:32:17,640
Speaker 4: shifted in terms of more action where I started going

624
00:32:17,680 --> 00:32:20,440
Speaker 4: back into the tools that I knew from sport, from

625
00:32:20,560 --> 00:32:24,720
Speaker 4: routine to exercise to mindfulness to all the things that

626
00:32:24,760 --> 00:32:28,200
Speaker 4: I really enjoyed in and actually doing the work in

627
00:32:28,280 --> 00:32:31,920
Speaker 4: terms of counseling and you know, diving deeper and addressing

628
00:32:31,920 --> 00:32:35,160
Speaker 4: the issues that if it's ego, of if it's kind

629
00:32:35,200 --> 00:32:38,920
Speaker 4: of my self worth and my identity. Once I bridged

630
00:32:38,960 --> 00:32:42,800
Speaker 4: all those gaps, I was kind of like almost like

631
00:32:42,880 --> 00:32:47,080
Speaker 4: I was released. It was bizarre and saying my neural

632
00:32:47,160 --> 00:32:50,640
Speaker 4: studies that I'm doing every six months maybe improved, you

633
00:32:50,680 --> 00:32:54,640
Speaker 4: know a few degrees here and there, but my output

634
00:32:54,640 --> 00:32:57,800
Speaker 4: in terms of a person and my outlook on life,

635
00:32:57,880 --> 00:32:59,200
Speaker 4: it's bizarre.

636
00:32:59,680 --> 00:33:02,440
Speaker 3: You know, I'd say one hundred and eighty degrees increases.

637
00:33:02,480 --> 00:33:06,680
Speaker 4: So it's so physical disability for me has not been

638
00:33:07,080 --> 00:33:10,240
Speaker 4: the restricting part. It was more just you know, how

639
00:33:10,520 --> 00:33:14,560
Speaker 4: mentally I viewed myself and then how mentally I restricted

640
00:33:14,600 --> 00:33:16,520
Speaker 4: myself about what I could do.

641
00:33:17,040 --> 00:33:21,200
Speaker 1: I had to get air replacement, all right, Not all

642
00:33:21,280 --> 00:33:25,160
Speaker 1: surgery is low risk, not no surgery is no risk.

643
00:33:25,760 --> 00:33:28,360
Speaker 1: And there was a complication. So I ended up with

644
00:33:29,640 --> 00:33:34,880
Speaker 1: eighteen months of like unbelievable chronic intense pain, which took

645
00:33:34,880 --> 00:33:37,560
Speaker 1: two more surgeries to sort out. What kind of pressure

646
00:33:37,720 --> 00:33:40,240
Speaker 1: is being in that headspace? Put on the relationship?

647
00:33:40,800 --> 00:33:43,680
Speaker 4: Well, I think finding I mean, I'm so lucky that

648
00:33:43,720 --> 00:33:48,200
Speaker 4: I found Michelle. You know, she's a amazing human. I

649
00:33:48,280 --> 00:33:51,560
Speaker 4: met her in twenty nineteen, just at the beginning of

650
00:33:51,640 --> 00:33:54,680
Speaker 4: all these kind of symptoms, and so the fact that

651
00:33:54,760 --> 00:33:58,680
Speaker 4: she stayed with me, I'd say to her that she got.

652
00:33:58,520 --> 00:34:02,320
Speaker 3: The dud version of Mike Clear without without the rig.

653
00:34:02,440 --> 00:34:06,840
Speaker 4: But you know, I think she it was hard because

654
00:34:06,920 --> 00:34:10,719
Speaker 4: everything would trigger me, and she was the person that

655
00:34:10,880 --> 00:34:13,680
Speaker 4: was there twenty four to seven, so she would, you

656
00:34:13,719 --> 00:34:16,600
Speaker 4: know a lot of the time be the recipient of

657
00:34:17,400 --> 00:34:21,279
Speaker 4: bad behavior, and you know, when she was protecting me

658
00:34:22,000 --> 00:34:24,080
Speaker 4: from the kids and when I was in a bad mood,

659
00:34:24,160 --> 00:34:27,360
Speaker 4: so they would be okay. And you know, she suffered

660
00:34:27,440 --> 00:34:30,400
Speaker 4: cares fatigue and it's something very common and you know,

661
00:34:31,000 --> 00:34:34,000
Speaker 4: I've really come lives and bounds in terms of my

662
00:34:34,160 --> 00:34:36,720
Speaker 4: progression in the last two years. But you know, it's

663
00:34:37,320 --> 00:34:40,000
Speaker 4: very common that, you know, sometimes the care is gift

664
00:34:40,080 --> 00:34:43,080
Speaker 4: so much that sometimes I get left behind because I,

665
00:34:43,120 --> 00:34:45,160
Speaker 4: you know, I had my counselor, I had the great

666
00:34:45,200 --> 00:34:48,440
Speaker 4: support network that I built, and I had new projects

667
00:34:48,480 --> 00:34:51,880
Speaker 4: that I've instigated, and had places to go and people

668
00:34:51,880 --> 00:34:55,080
Speaker 4: to talk to. And sometimes when you know, like in

669
00:34:55,160 --> 00:35:00,359
Speaker 4: Michelle's case, she literally stopped her life prioritized my you know,

670
00:35:01,040 --> 00:35:03,920
Speaker 4: my well being for everything that she did move to

671
00:35:04,000 --> 00:35:08,520
Speaker 4: BALI forgot about her career, and so she also had

672
00:35:08,560 --> 00:35:12,040
Speaker 4: to rebuild and you know, put pieces back together. So

673
00:35:12,040 --> 00:35:15,759
Speaker 4: it was a it takes a special person to endure that.

674
00:35:17,080 --> 00:35:21,360
Speaker 4: And we you know, I'm lucky that I'm still with Michelle.

675
00:35:21,400 --> 00:35:26,520
Speaker 4: Favey's on COVID c IDP. You know, she also came

676
00:35:26,560 --> 00:35:29,920
Speaker 4: into a dynamic with you know, I've got three kids.

677
00:35:30,440 --> 00:35:33,920
Speaker 4: She became an instant stepmother living in a foreign country,

678
00:35:34,040 --> 00:35:36,000
Speaker 4: so she's super human.

679
00:35:36,440 --> 00:35:39,279
Speaker 1: Step Parenting is a whole other That was my first

680
00:35:39,440 --> 00:35:42,000
Speaker 1: My first experience of parenting was stepparenting. She was ten

681
00:35:42,760 --> 00:35:46,920
Speaker 1: when I met Audrey, and it's a whole Keller fish Man,

682
00:35:47,320 --> 00:35:48,160
Speaker 1: it's a whole.

683
00:35:48,120 --> 00:35:51,360
Speaker 3: Thing how do you how do you find me? And stepdad.

684
00:35:52,880 --> 00:36:01,400
Speaker 1: An enormous, enormous responsibility and an incredible gift not and

685
00:36:01,440 --> 00:36:04,040
Speaker 1: I say it often, is that I'd seen my mates

686
00:36:04,200 --> 00:36:08,759
Speaker 1: change when they had kids, and you know, she was,

687
00:36:09,239 --> 00:36:11,879
Speaker 1: you know, my girlfriend's kid. We're around the living room.

688
00:36:11,920 --> 00:36:14,160
Speaker 1: It was fun. And then one day I worked up

689
00:36:14,280 --> 00:36:15,879
Speaker 1: was like, I would push you out of the way

690
00:36:15,880 --> 00:36:17,399
Speaker 1: of a train if it meant that I would die,

691
00:36:17,520 --> 00:36:19,200
Speaker 1: But if you stayed alive, I would And every dollar

692
00:36:19,239 --> 00:36:21,160
Speaker 1: I own is now to make all your dreams country.

693
00:36:21,800 --> 00:36:26,400
Speaker 1: I was like, well, I'm a fucking self sended, egotistical asshole.

694
00:36:26,680 --> 00:36:27,440
Speaker 3: How did that happen?

695
00:36:27,960 --> 00:36:30,040
Speaker 1: And it was just that was it? That was it,

696
00:36:30,280 --> 00:36:32,360
Speaker 1: And then I was done. I moved back from America

697
00:36:32,440 --> 00:36:35,919
Speaker 1: and I was nothing else. It didn't matter. And I

698
00:36:35,960 --> 00:36:39,440
Speaker 1: was very happy to know that that, even without not

699
00:36:39,480 --> 00:36:42,400
Speaker 1: a biological child like could happen, like it's still you know,

700
00:36:43,120 --> 00:36:44,840
Speaker 1: I'm still you know who you And why can't I

701
00:36:44,880 --> 00:36:46,359
Speaker 1: sleep in the bed every night with Mum, Like it's

702
00:36:46,520 --> 00:36:49,040
Speaker 1: you know you was still there, which is tricky, But.

703
00:36:49,000 --> 00:36:51,640
Speaker 4: How are you how are you going with like, let's say,

704
00:36:51,640 --> 00:36:55,000
Speaker 4: putting those boundaries in terms of you know, because I know,

705
00:36:55,560 --> 00:36:59,239
Speaker 4: it's that dynamic. It's hard for you know, three three

706
00:36:59,320 --> 00:37:01,520
Speaker 4: kids one you know, well.

707
00:37:01,360 --> 00:37:03,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, I spoke to a lot of I had an

708
00:37:03,560 --> 00:37:05,960
Speaker 1: interesting focus group because I was working on Bachelor at

709
00:37:06,000 --> 00:37:08,960
Speaker 1: the time, and it kind of got out that I had,

710
00:37:09,080 --> 00:37:12,160
Speaker 1: you know, a step d order and early on one

711
00:37:12,160 --> 00:37:15,040
Speaker 1: of the ladies was like, early on, there's like twenty

712
00:37:15,080 --> 00:37:17,040
Speaker 1: of them, and they said, you got a step daughter,

713
00:37:17,120 --> 00:37:19,560
Speaker 1: don't you. I said yeah, And one of them went

714
00:37:20,239 --> 00:37:22,560
Speaker 1: stick with it, and like three or four of the

715
00:37:22,600 --> 00:37:26,240
Speaker 1: other ones not that it went yeah, yeah, mid twenties

716
00:37:26,360 --> 00:37:28,200
Speaker 1: or so, just hold on, hold on, I was like,

717
00:37:28,280 --> 00:37:30,359
Speaker 1: And that really helped me. And I was another made

718
00:37:30,360 --> 00:37:32,520
Speaker 1: of my told me something was really, really, really good

719
00:37:33,560 --> 00:37:35,520
Speaker 1: because his stepdad showed up when he was about the

720
00:37:35,520 --> 00:37:38,319
Speaker 1: same agent and he said, I was so little. I

721
00:37:38,360 --> 00:37:42,839
Speaker 1: didn't understand that if I liked him. In my mind,

722
00:37:42,880 --> 00:37:44,799
Speaker 1: if I liked him, man, I didn't like my own dad,

723
00:37:45,280 --> 00:37:48,880
Speaker 1: so I couldn't like him. And when Benny told me that,

724
00:37:48,880 --> 00:37:51,879
Speaker 1: I was like, ah, right, But those like it's still

725
00:37:51,920 --> 00:37:54,560
Speaker 1: you know, it's still hard because you never you've never

726
00:37:54,640 --> 00:37:57,839
Speaker 1: loved someone so much that doesn't sometimes doesn't want anything

727
00:37:57,840 --> 00:38:00,879
Speaker 1: to do with you, which is hard.

728
00:38:01,080 --> 00:38:02,879
Speaker 3: Yeah, and that's fine.

729
00:38:02,760 --> 00:38:04,239
Speaker 1: Because they're a teenager and they're trying to become an

730
00:38:04,239 --> 00:38:05,400
Speaker 1: adult and that's part of it.

731
00:38:05,400 --> 00:38:08,400
Speaker 4: And it's not even like it's because you're a step that.

732
00:38:09,760 --> 00:38:12,480
Speaker 4: It's where they are in their life, and it's you know,

733
00:38:12,560 --> 00:38:16,080
Speaker 4: obviously you know, I've had three kids, and it's I

734
00:38:16,120 --> 00:38:20,120
Speaker 4: get you. I've been you trained to sort of acknowledge

735
00:38:20,160 --> 00:38:22,279
Speaker 4: what is what I need to take care of, what

736
00:38:22,320 --> 00:38:24,200
Speaker 4: I sort of let through to the keeper, what sort

737
00:38:24,200 --> 00:38:28,399
Speaker 4: of triggers me, what what needs disciplining. But I think

738
00:38:28,560 --> 00:38:30,520
Speaker 4: you know, if you if you're knew into the game,

739
00:38:30,640 --> 00:38:35,200
Speaker 4: is going you take everything to heart and it's yeah,

740
00:38:35,239 --> 00:38:38,520
Speaker 4: and it's sometimes Michelle goes, it doesn't bother you. Are

741
00:38:38,520 --> 00:38:40,080
Speaker 4: you not going to do anything about that? I'm like,

742
00:38:40,640 --> 00:38:43,120
Speaker 4: I just picked the battles and sometimes it's you know,

743
00:38:43,200 --> 00:38:45,520
Speaker 4: and then she would sit with things that you know,

744
00:38:45,640 --> 00:38:49,239
Speaker 4: make them stew and potentially get worse and so that.

745
00:38:49,920 --> 00:38:52,759
Speaker 4: But we've we've found a really good balance where you know,

746
00:38:52,800 --> 00:38:55,960
Speaker 4: I can be the authoritarian and now as we speak,

747
00:38:56,440 --> 00:39:00,160
Speaker 4: they're at Bonda junctions in a great old times. So

748
00:39:00,680 --> 00:39:05,200
Speaker 4: it actually is the best feeling seeing my kids having

749
00:39:05,239 --> 00:39:07,000
Speaker 4: the best time with my partner.

750
00:39:07,080 --> 00:39:07,680
Speaker 3: It's the best.

751
00:39:07,760 --> 00:39:10,440
Speaker 1: That's really really well. I mean, we had we got

752
00:39:10,440 --> 00:39:12,640
Speaker 1: really lucky. We had we had help. There was a

753
00:39:12,719 --> 00:39:16,120
Speaker 1: children's hospital near where we live and there was someone

754
00:39:16,160 --> 00:39:17,640
Speaker 1: there and they had a you know.

755
00:39:17,640 --> 00:39:20,240
Speaker 5: This is for people who are blended families and exactly

756
00:39:20,239 --> 00:39:22,960
Speaker 5: what we were great teaching guys like me had to

757
00:39:23,200 --> 00:39:26,400
Speaker 5: because I had, you know, one month of parenting experience

758
00:39:26,440 --> 00:39:28,360
Speaker 5: and by this point when I moved in, she's eleven.

759
00:39:29,520 --> 00:39:31,880
Speaker 1: I just do not want to fuck this up as much, like,

760
00:39:32,239 --> 00:39:32,840
Speaker 1: because it's.

761
00:39:32,800 --> 00:39:34,000
Speaker 3: Really interesting time.

762
00:39:34,239 --> 00:39:36,120
Speaker 1: Well it is. It is such an important time in

763
00:39:36,120 --> 00:39:40,680
Speaker 1: their life. That's my buddy Steve told me, Yeah, they're

764
00:39:40,719 --> 00:39:42,840
Speaker 1: going to ignore you, but your job is to be

765
00:39:42,920 --> 00:39:44,000
Speaker 1: there for them to ignore.

766
00:39:44,160 --> 00:39:45,799
Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, that's and.

767
00:39:45,800 --> 00:39:47,120
Speaker 1: The way I kind of put it is though, when

768
00:39:47,120 --> 00:39:49,799
Speaker 1: they're really little and they're in bed and they're between you,

769
00:39:50,080 --> 00:39:53,400
Speaker 1: it's quite cute. But then they get bigger. She was like,

770
00:39:53,400 --> 00:39:57,200
Speaker 1: they're fucking kicking you in the spleen. They're not. They're

771
00:39:57,239 --> 00:39:59,719
Speaker 1: just checking to making sure you're there. That's what they're

772
00:39:59,719 --> 00:40:02,399
Speaker 1: doing with the feet, and it's kind of that, you know,

773
00:40:02,600 --> 00:40:05,640
Speaker 1: I'm just I'm going to do this thing to see

774
00:40:05,640 --> 00:40:07,960
Speaker 1: if you're at the edges to help me.

775
00:40:08,560 --> 00:40:13,480
Speaker 4: And it's hard, and I've you know, this CIDP has

776
00:40:13,600 --> 00:40:18,440
Speaker 4: been the best thing for me to reconnect the family.

777
00:40:20,320 --> 00:40:22,680
Speaker 4: I've gone through a divorce and now you know, I've

778
00:40:22,680 --> 00:40:27,120
Speaker 4: got an amazing partner and but if you know, unfortunately

779
00:40:27,160 --> 00:40:31,160
Speaker 4: it did take this condition for us to get so tight.

780
00:40:31,280 --> 00:40:31,520
Speaker 3: But it.

781
00:40:33,320 --> 00:40:36,520
Speaker 4: I put all eggs in one basket for the kids

782
00:40:36,520 --> 00:40:39,640
Speaker 4: and you're trying to you know, provide for them and

783
00:40:39,719 --> 00:40:42,840
Speaker 4: putting you know, I've learned to prioritize much better. I

784
00:40:42,960 --> 00:40:44,799
Speaker 4: used to go to the opening of everything, you know,

785
00:40:44,880 --> 00:40:47,880
Speaker 4: I try and be seen make the most of my profile.

786
00:40:48,360 --> 00:40:50,839
Speaker 4: Now it's obviously the book is coming out, but it's

787
00:40:51,400 --> 00:40:54,000
Speaker 4: I'm much better at saying no and and putting the

788
00:40:54,120 --> 00:40:54,680
Speaker 4: kids first.

789
00:40:54,680 --> 00:40:57,160
Speaker 3: So it's yeah, just.

790
00:40:57,120 --> 00:40:59,600
Speaker 1: A moment away to say that if this podcast is

791
00:40:59,640 --> 00:41:02,319
Speaker 1: bringing you value for finding this conversation great, if it's

792
00:41:02,360 --> 00:41:04,480
Speaker 1: worth your time, please do consider showing it with someone.

793
00:41:04,600 --> 00:41:07,520
Speaker 1: This is my job and people come and go from

794
00:41:07,520 --> 00:41:10,360
Speaker 1: the subscription list all the time. So if there's somebody

795
00:41:10,440 --> 00:41:12,840
Speaker 1: in your life that you think could benefit from listening

796
00:41:12,840 --> 00:41:15,160
Speaker 1: to this, or something you want to share with somebody,

797
00:41:15,520 --> 00:41:17,879
Speaker 1: just you know, either pitch share in your podcast app

798
00:41:17,960 --> 00:41:20,000
Speaker 1: or for them the newsletter. There's an article about this

799
00:41:20,040 --> 00:41:21,960
Speaker 1: episode in the show notes just for them that it's

800
00:41:21,960 --> 00:41:23,799
Speaker 1: an email that'd be great if you could do that

801
00:41:24,040 --> 00:41:26,040
Speaker 1: really helps us, like financially, it doesn't cost you anything.

802
00:41:26,040 --> 00:41:26,800
Speaker 1: It makes us money.

803
00:41:26,800 --> 00:41:27,279
Speaker 3: So thank you.

804
00:41:27,800 --> 00:41:37,600
Speaker 1: I'll be back after the break. You really struck me

805
00:41:37,640 --> 00:41:39,480
Speaker 1: even when I saw you, you know, walk in here.

806
00:41:40,080 --> 00:41:43,399
Speaker 1: You strike me as someone like there's a levity about you.

807
00:41:43,440 --> 00:41:48,120
Speaker 1: There's a lightness about you, which you know with someone

808
00:41:48,160 --> 00:41:49,640
Speaker 1: dealing with what you're dealing with and all the things

809
00:41:49,719 --> 00:41:52,640
Speaker 1: you're describing, it's evidence of the work that you've done

810
00:41:52,920 --> 00:41:55,879
Speaker 1: to get here. Well, I can only imagine that you're

811
00:41:55,880 --> 00:41:59,640
Speaker 1: there because acceptance has had to be some of the

812
00:41:59,680 --> 00:42:01,600
Speaker 1: work had to do. What would you what would you

813
00:42:01,640 --> 00:42:02,560
Speaker 1: say about acceptance?

814
00:42:04,280 --> 00:42:06,880
Speaker 4: It was it was a topic that you know, my

815
00:42:06,960 --> 00:42:11,239
Speaker 4: counselor brought up because I I was very top level

816
00:42:11,520 --> 00:42:14,560
Speaker 4: when I was you know, seeing her for many sessions

817
00:42:14,840 --> 00:42:17,719
Speaker 4: and one day she just had stopped giving speeches to me,

818
00:42:18,320 --> 00:42:21,799
Speaker 4: like just giving a speech after speech, and you know

819
00:42:21,960 --> 00:42:27,439
Speaker 4: like and it's kind of almost yeah, so and yeah,

820
00:42:27,480 --> 00:42:32,879
Speaker 4: we started talking about the acceptance more actually grief. It

821
00:42:32,920 --> 00:42:36,200
Speaker 4: was it was just a form of grief, and that

822
00:42:36,400 --> 00:42:42,000
Speaker 4: was the way I was expressing myself, acting out, you know,

823
00:42:42,800 --> 00:42:47,719
Speaker 4: being deceitful, lying, you know, certain things, and it was

824
00:42:47,760 --> 00:42:51,080
Speaker 4: all grief and you know, not wanting to address these

825
00:42:51,120 --> 00:42:55,560
Speaker 4: emotions and actually going going public with my condition and

826
00:42:55,760 --> 00:43:00,520
Speaker 4: seeing how how much love and support and there was

827
00:43:01,000 --> 00:43:05,080
Speaker 4: this influx of just other sufferers wanting help and wanting

828
00:43:05,120 --> 00:43:07,520
Speaker 4: to share their story. But at that time I was

829
00:43:07,560 --> 00:43:11,400
Speaker 4: already prepared for that. But it was more that my

830
00:43:11,520 --> 00:43:15,919
Speaker 4: inner circle just became so big and then everyone out

831
00:43:15,920 --> 00:43:19,880
Speaker 4: there just were in praise for me to having the

832
00:43:19,960 --> 00:43:23,000
Speaker 4: guts to actually talk about it, and that just gave

833
00:43:23,040 --> 00:43:27,040
Speaker 4: me so much more sort of, I guess, empowerment to

834
00:43:27,680 --> 00:43:31,279
Speaker 4: push on. So yeah, I think that, yeah, it was

835
00:43:31,320 --> 00:43:35,800
Speaker 4: more grief than acceptance. I still don't. I'm still pushing

836
00:43:35,800 --> 00:43:38,000
Speaker 4: the envelope in terms of physically what I can do.

837
00:43:38,040 --> 00:43:40,400
Speaker 4: I just went skiing for the first time on the weekend,

838
00:43:40,520 --> 00:43:43,440
Speaker 4: and you know, I hadn't skied in years, and like,

839
00:43:43,560 --> 00:43:46,120
Speaker 4: my left side was really good, my right was dodgy,

840
00:43:46,239 --> 00:43:48,239
Speaker 4: so I had to sort of, you know, figure out

841
00:43:48,280 --> 00:43:50,600
Speaker 4: a way to ski where I can favor my left leg.

842
00:43:51,239 --> 00:43:53,279
Speaker 4: But like so I'm still you know, I think that's

843
00:43:53,320 --> 00:43:56,200
Speaker 4: where I always mentally, I always try and push the

844
00:43:56,280 --> 00:44:00,279
Speaker 4: envelope and find, you know, even new treatment methods. And

845
00:44:00,360 --> 00:44:04,160
Speaker 4: I'm doing trying hyperbaric chamber at the moment, a sixty

846
00:44:04,239 --> 00:44:06,600
Speaker 4: session course to see if that's goodness, you know, have

847
00:44:06,640 --> 00:44:09,880
Speaker 4: any different results or so.

848
00:44:10,120 --> 00:44:12,160
Speaker 3: I think that part of me won't change. But I

849
00:44:12,160 --> 00:44:15,680
Speaker 3: think in terms of I've accepted that there is a

850
00:44:15,719 --> 00:44:17,479
Speaker 3: new norm. Maybe. Yeah.

851
00:44:17,960 --> 00:44:20,000
Speaker 1: I almost ask my dad how he talks to people

852
00:44:20,360 --> 00:44:23,560
Speaker 1: about this stuff, you know, and he said, well, I'll

853
00:44:23,600 --> 00:44:26,279
Speaker 1: make him a cup of tea, because it would come

854
00:44:26,280 --> 00:44:28,640
Speaker 1: out sometimes I do reception from on the weekends. He

855
00:44:28,640 --> 00:44:30,879
Speaker 1: would come out sometimes make up of time a weekend

856
00:44:31,640 --> 00:44:33,279
Speaker 1: and walk back in with a cup of tea. Say,

857
00:44:34,000 --> 00:44:37,200
Speaker 1: these things happen, that nobody's fault. The sooner you get

858
00:44:37,239 --> 00:44:40,479
Speaker 1: on with aton, you accept that it's happening, as sooner

859
00:44:40,480 --> 00:44:42,759
Speaker 1: that we can get on, you know, finding a way

860
00:44:42,760 --> 00:44:43,840
Speaker 1: for you to live the life and the way you

861
00:44:43,840 --> 00:44:46,400
Speaker 1: want to live it the best way you possibly can.

862
00:44:46,880 --> 00:44:50,080
Speaker 1: And that's the only way forward. Like it took me

863
00:44:50,120 --> 00:44:52,440
Speaker 1: a really long time to heat his advice, and like

864
00:44:52,440 --> 00:44:54,160
Speaker 1: all good doctors, he didn't heed his own advice.

865
00:44:54,480 --> 00:44:59,160
Speaker 4: But your dad's one of a few because the experiences

866
00:44:59,160 --> 00:45:02,239
Speaker 4: that I've had doctors didn't prepare me.

867
00:45:02,239 --> 00:45:04,320
Speaker 3: For what was happening.

868
00:45:04,800 --> 00:45:08,759
Speaker 4: I mean, the closest I got was I think, you know,

869
00:45:08,840 --> 00:45:11,200
Speaker 4: my doctor said, this is going to be the greatest

870
00:45:11,280 --> 00:45:13,960
Speaker 4: challenge of your life and you have to be ready

871
00:45:13,960 --> 00:45:17,000
Speaker 4: for it. And I'm like, well, I'm not because I

872
00:45:17,040 --> 00:45:20,160
Speaker 4: don't even know what the challenge is. There was another

873
00:45:20,200 --> 00:45:23,040
Speaker 4: motivation for me to start the foundation and then give

874
00:45:23,600 --> 00:45:27,719
Speaker 4: give you patients a little bit of guidance because it's

875
00:45:27,760 --> 00:45:31,919
Speaker 4: everything is self exploratory and you become doctor.

876
00:45:31,600 --> 00:45:33,799
Speaker 3: Google and you know your own can be good and

877
00:45:33,920 --> 00:45:38,640
Speaker 3: a exactly yeah. But so yeah, I think the you

878
00:45:38,680 --> 00:45:42,000
Speaker 3: know that bedside matter that is.

879
00:45:41,960 --> 00:45:44,720
Speaker 1: Amazing kind of old They're both both my parents were doctors.

880
00:45:44,760 --> 00:45:47,000
Speaker 1: It's kind of old school that kind of thing. It's

881
00:45:47,680 --> 00:45:49,200
Speaker 1: the patient needs to be enrolled in their own be

882
00:45:49,680 --> 00:45:51,520
Speaker 1: getting better. As you mentioned, it was only once you

883
00:45:51,640 --> 00:45:55,640
Speaker 1: decided that things started to change. What did you notice

884
00:45:55,680 --> 00:45:58,360
Speaker 1: about the things that you could do when you started

885
00:45:58,400 --> 00:46:01,279
Speaker 1: putting those things together. You know this day where I

886
00:46:01,280 --> 00:46:02,680
Speaker 1: did do this, and then there's two days where I

887
00:46:02,680 --> 00:46:04,040
Speaker 1: did do this, and there's three days where I did

888
00:46:04,040 --> 00:46:06,239
Speaker 1: do this. Once you started having a bit of agency.

889
00:46:06,640 --> 00:46:08,439
Speaker 1: How did that make you feel well?

890
00:46:08,440 --> 00:46:12,160
Speaker 4: It's it all coincided with a few things. I gave

891
00:46:12,239 --> 00:46:15,399
Speaker 4: up the grog initially because I was drinking too much.

892
00:46:15,640 --> 00:46:21,560
Speaker 4: I was drinking unhealthily unhealthy amounts to forget my emotions

893
00:46:21,600 --> 00:46:24,160
Speaker 4: and not wanting to deal with the new situations.

894
00:46:24,200 --> 00:46:25,320
Speaker 1: It's kin to the right place.

895
00:46:28,040 --> 00:46:28,560
Speaker 3: A half years.

896
00:46:30,200 --> 00:46:32,759
Speaker 4: The only thing that happened is the only thing that

897
00:46:32,800 --> 00:46:35,760
Speaker 4: happens is the only thing that happens is the dosage

898
00:46:35,760 --> 00:46:38,160
Speaker 4: that you need to get the same effect gets to

899
00:46:38,160 --> 00:46:39,320
Speaker 4: the point where it's going to kill you.

900
00:46:40,160 --> 00:46:45,520
Speaker 1: The problems, don't They just get worse, And exactly eventually.

901
00:46:45,239 --> 00:46:48,520
Speaker 4: That was the first thing that you know, obviously collectively

902
00:46:48,640 --> 00:46:51,640
Speaker 4: we decided I will give give that away. I became

903
00:46:51,760 --> 00:46:56,160
Speaker 4: more diligent with with routine and exercise, and there was

904
00:46:56,960 --> 00:47:01,360
Speaker 4: It's amazing how this momentum built so much like it's

905
00:47:01,960 --> 00:47:04,279
Speaker 4: you know, as soon as my head became clearer, I

906
00:47:04,280 --> 00:47:06,759
Speaker 4: could I became more productive and then I could do

907
00:47:07,120 --> 00:47:09,040
Speaker 4: you know, I could talk to people more often. I

908
00:47:09,080 --> 00:47:11,560
Speaker 4: was you know, I could hold this kind of There's

909
00:47:11,640 --> 00:47:15,400
Speaker 4: no way I could hold this conversation. I wasn't my partner,

910
00:47:15,480 --> 00:47:18,720
Speaker 4: Michelle said, you know, she's seen me talk in public

911
00:47:18,800 --> 00:47:22,319
Speaker 4: quite often, and I was doing interviews and prior to me,

912
00:47:22,760 --> 00:47:25,399
Speaker 4: that's even giving up drinking or being in this kind

913
00:47:25,440 --> 00:47:26,400
Speaker 4: of depressive state.

914
00:47:26,520 --> 00:47:32,160
Speaker 3: She said, you couldn't string a sentence together. And it was, Yeah,

915
00:47:32,239 --> 00:47:33,480
Speaker 3: Now it's.

916
00:47:33,360 --> 00:47:36,040
Speaker 4: Bizarre that I not that I always get off on it,

917
00:47:36,120 --> 00:47:39,760
Speaker 4: but I really get into conversations. I can be present

918
00:47:39,800 --> 00:47:43,279
Speaker 4: with you for however long. And I remember talking to

919
00:47:43,360 --> 00:47:46,319
Speaker 4: people but actually not being there, not being present, you know,

920
00:47:46,520 --> 00:47:47,120
Speaker 4: And that was.

921
00:47:48,000 --> 00:47:50,040
Speaker 3: And yeah, so these things just snowball.

922
00:47:50,120 --> 00:47:52,160
Speaker 4: And now I got a little bit of being the

923
00:47:52,200 --> 00:47:54,439
Speaker 4: ambassador for life Blood gave me a little bit more

924
00:47:54,560 --> 00:47:57,560
Speaker 4: sort of responsibility. And then I started the sim school

925
00:47:57,600 --> 00:48:01,360
Speaker 4: with with with Michelle and and Bali, and you know,

926
00:48:01,400 --> 00:48:05,080
Speaker 4: the responsibilities grew. And this is a figure of speech.

927
00:48:05,120 --> 00:48:06,799
Speaker 4: But I was walking and then I was running and

928
00:48:06,840 --> 00:48:09,480
Speaker 4: I was sprinting in life and now it's kind of

929
00:48:09,520 --> 00:48:10,240
Speaker 4: it's all happening.

930
00:48:11,560 --> 00:48:14,279
Speaker 1: Hearing the giggle come out of you. Yeah, because I

931
00:48:14,280 --> 00:48:16,440
Speaker 1: want to. I know what it's like to have forgotten

932
00:48:16,480 --> 00:48:19,480
Speaker 1: the last time you had a giggle, you know, Yeah,

933
00:48:20,040 --> 00:48:22,000
Speaker 1: I remember point it was like it was years. I

934
00:48:22,040 --> 00:48:24,600
Speaker 1: don't remember what it felt like to chuckle. I know

935
00:48:24,680 --> 00:48:26,600
Speaker 1: I can do it. I've done it before, but there's

936
00:48:26,719 --> 00:48:29,319
Speaker 1: nothing that's happened in the last how many weeks, months

937
00:48:29,360 --> 00:48:32,960
Speaker 1: or whatever that's made me feel like doing it spontaneously.

938
00:48:33,440 --> 00:48:36,160
Speaker 1: So that's a huge I can understand. I really appreciate

939
00:48:36,239 --> 00:48:38,520
Speaker 1: how much work it's taken. What would you say to

940
00:48:38,560 --> 00:48:42,080
Speaker 1: people who might be on the other side, or you

941
00:48:42,080 --> 00:48:44,239
Speaker 1: were describing before, when everyone's kind of looking at you, going,

942
00:48:44,960 --> 00:48:47,680
Speaker 1: we've done everything, it's going to have to be you,

943
00:48:47,800 --> 00:48:49,160
Speaker 1: what would you say to people who might be in

944
00:48:49,160 --> 00:48:52,000
Speaker 1: that space, or someone who loves someone who's in that space.

945
00:48:54,080 --> 00:48:57,360
Speaker 4: Look, I was fortunate enough that I could gravitate to

946
00:48:57,560 --> 00:48:59,120
Speaker 4: think that.

947
00:49:00,520 --> 00:49:01,560
Speaker 3: I still enjoyed.

948
00:49:01,600 --> 00:49:05,480
Speaker 4: So I gravitated back to exercise a bit more, gravitated

949
00:49:05,520 --> 00:49:10,480
Speaker 4: to a little bit of creative stuff and painting and journeys.

950
00:49:10,040 --> 00:49:11,959
Speaker 3: COVID, So I drew a bit more.

951
00:49:12,080 --> 00:49:17,040
Speaker 4: So I started doing mindfulness things that didn't feel.

952
00:49:16,760 --> 00:49:18,120
Speaker 3: Like mindfulness in a sense.

953
00:49:18,200 --> 00:49:20,839
Speaker 4: So yeah, so I think, and it was step by

954
00:49:20,880 --> 00:49:22,799
Speaker 4: step by There was a few things that I went

955
00:49:22,920 --> 00:49:27,319
Speaker 4: really hammered down, so you know, carniv or diet and

956
00:49:27,520 --> 00:49:30,120
Speaker 4: no grog and you know ice bas There was a

957
00:49:30,120 --> 00:49:32,319
Speaker 4: few things that I went really hard on but then

958
00:49:32,400 --> 00:49:36,600
Speaker 4: other things in terms of self exploration and development that

959
00:49:36,680 --> 00:49:39,360
Speaker 4: kind of took its time, and it was I'd say,

960
00:49:40,360 --> 00:49:42,400
Speaker 4: it's you know, saying.

961
00:49:42,120 --> 00:49:42,959
Speaker 3: One day at a time.

962
00:49:43,920 --> 00:49:47,400
Speaker 4: So it was one day and it's amazing the momentum

963
00:49:47,480 --> 00:49:50,680
Speaker 4: you build from day to day, you know, like you

964
00:49:50,800 --> 00:49:53,480
Speaker 4: make And I don't even look at it as sacrifice

965
00:49:53,480 --> 00:49:56,680
Speaker 4: anymore because it's and it never was a sacrifice. People

966
00:49:56,719 --> 00:49:59,239
Speaker 4: talk to me about sport being a sacrifice.

967
00:49:59,360 --> 00:50:01,120
Speaker 3: It wasn't. It was my choice. I wanted to be

968
00:50:01,560 --> 00:50:02,720
Speaker 3: in that pool at five.

969
00:50:02,560 --> 00:50:07,560
Speaker 4: Am, and unfortunately for me, it's I'd say, I wish

970
00:50:07,840 --> 00:50:11,520
Speaker 4: I adopted this thinking sooner because you know, i'd probably

971
00:50:12,040 --> 00:50:15,960
Speaker 4: even prior to my diagnosis, because I know that I

972
00:50:16,160 --> 00:50:20,880
Speaker 4: prioritize work. I prioritize you know, being on my stupid

973
00:50:20,920 --> 00:50:23,040
Speaker 4: phone instead of being present with my kids in the

974
00:50:23,040 --> 00:50:26,400
Speaker 4: living room. You know, So it doesn't not necessarily about

975
00:50:27,200 --> 00:50:30,319
Speaker 4: you know, the last few years, but it's, yeah, I

976
00:50:30,320 --> 00:50:33,080
Speaker 4: think one thing at a time that you know, even

977
00:50:33,239 --> 00:50:36,279
Speaker 4: just as simple as being present, that was That's kind

978
00:50:36,280 --> 00:50:38,800
Speaker 4: of one of the most rewarding things for me. To

979
00:50:38,920 --> 00:50:43,040
Speaker 4: even having a drive from from Sydney to Threadbaugh with

980
00:50:43,120 --> 00:50:44,520
Speaker 4: the kids without having a fight.

981
00:50:44,640 --> 00:50:46,640
Speaker 3: It was a big win. Man.

982
00:50:46,680 --> 00:50:48,080
Speaker 1: I don't think I've ever done that in the car

983
00:50:48,120 --> 00:50:52,960
Speaker 1: by myself. I was not shouting of myself and doing

984
00:50:52,960 --> 00:50:53,479
Speaker 1: something dumb.

985
00:50:54,239 --> 00:50:54,719
Speaker 3: Wow.

986
00:50:55,520 --> 00:50:57,680
Speaker 1: But I know, look, I know, I know what you're saying.

987
00:50:57,719 --> 00:51:01,480
Speaker 1: It's like, it's the momentum. Is is surprising. I mean,

988
00:51:02,120 --> 00:51:04,520
Speaker 1: you probably didn't think that by the time you were

989
00:51:04,640 --> 00:51:08,080
Speaker 1: automatic in the pool, but that's the result of the momentum.

990
00:51:08,120 --> 00:51:08,520
Speaker 3: But it was.

991
00:51:08,560 --> 00:51:11,080
Speaker 1: It was a result of deliberately choosing every single day

992
00:51:11,120 --> 00:51:13,640
Speaker 1: to do these particular things and your body just going

993
00:51:13,640 --> 00:51:16,200
Speaker 1: okay to the point where you've done it. So mainly,

994
00:51:17,400 --> 00:51:21,359
Speaker 1: as you mentioned, you weren't genetically different more than anybody else.

995
00:51:21,400 --> 00:51:23,400
Speaker 1: You're just the guy that has done it more than

996
00:51:23,400 --> 00:51:25,680
Speaker 1: everybody else to the point where no one could do

997
00:51:25,800 --> 00:51:28,719
Speaker 1: the daylight between you and the next person. And yeah,

998
00:51:29,239 --> 00:51:32,880
Speaker 1: so similarly, it's like, it's funny that you're surprised by

999
00:51:32,920 --> 00:51:34,719
Speaker 1: the momentum on this side when you've already done it.

1000
00:51:34,960 --> 00:51:38,240
Speaker 1: You know it works. But it's interesting how we take convincing,

1001
00:51:38,320 --> 00:51:38,520
Speaker 1: isn't it.

1002
00:51:38,640 --> 00:51:42,959
Speaker 4: Yeah, And it's before it was all about taking, really

1003
00:51:43,160 --> 00:51:46,520
Speaker 4: was taking everything, you know, and now it's all about

1004
00:51:47,080 --> 00:51:50,120
Speaker 4: giving it's it's a different I think that you know

1005
00:51:50,200 --> 00:51:53,400
Speaker 4: from the sim schools is passing on knowledge. You know,

1006
00:51:53,560 --> 00:51:57,600
Speaker 4: let's say with Lifebloods, you know, sharing awareness and spreading

1007
00:51:57,680 --> 00:52:00,920
Speaker 4: a good message, and same with the Foundation. So I

1008
00:52:00,960 --> 00:52:05,600
Speaker 4: think it's less selfless more even obviously you know there's

1009
00:52:05,640 --> 00:52:10,120
Speaker 4: times where I do need time for myself or prioritize myself,

1010
00:52:10,160 --> 00:52:15,560
Speaker 4: but overall it's a it's my mindset is you know,

1011
00:52:15,719 --> 00:52:18,920
Speaker 4: more servers rather than man.

1012
00:52:19,000 --> 00:52:22,359
Speaker 1: Since I once I learned to ask people what can

1013
00:52:22,400 --> 00:52:28,040
Speaker 1: I do for you my career when nuts, yeah, I

1014
00:52:28,080 --> 00:52:30,359
Speaker 1: felt better. It's just I just I always tell people

1015
00:52:30,400 --> 00:52:32,000
Speaker 1: it's like, however I can help you. Don't ever get

1016
00:52:32,000 --> 00:52:35,279
Speaker 1: to hesitate like it's never a problem. It's wild. It's

1017
00:52:35,320 --> 00:52:38,200
Speaker 1: one of those things that we forget is the thing

1018
00:52:38,200 --> 00:52:40,480
Speaker 1: that's going to bring us lasting happiness. We think a

1019
00:52:40,480 --> 00:52:42,200
Speaker 1: big t you is going to bring us lasting happiness.

1020
00:52:42,320 --> 00:52:44,520
Speaker 3: It's not all that. It's good something.

1021
00:52:44,560 --> 00:52:47,120
Speaker 1: It's pretty good sometimes but sometimes not it it's not

1022
00:52:47,200 --> 00:52:51,480
Speaker 1: bad sometimes, but sometimes nothing's on you see the like

1023
00:52:51,600 --> 00:52:54,920
Speaker 1: it's bullshit. It's like I've got every every program ever

1024
00:52:55,000 --> 00:52:57,560
Speaker 1: made in history, and I don't want to be on

1025
00:52:57,560 --> 00:52:57,919
Speaker 1: my couch.

1026
00:52:58,200 --> 00:53:00,719
Speaker 4: I saw the best sketch about mindful this in the

1027
00:53:00,880 --> 00:53:04,960
Speaker 4: in the eighties, rewinding of VHS was mindfulness. Waiting for

1028
00:53:05,000 --> 00:53:10,240
Speaker 4: the bus was mindfulness. Watching condensation on the window was mindfulness.

1029
00:53:10,640 --> 00:53:13,600
Speaker 1: So it's true though, it is. And it's interesting that

1030
00:53:13,880 --> 00:53:15,840
Speaker 1: you mentioned. I laughed earlier when you said being on

1031
00:53:16,040 --> 00:53:17,719
Speaker 1: my stupid phone rather be in the living room with

1032
00:53:17,719 --> 00:53:19,719
Speaker 1: my kids, because like, if that does happen to me,

1033
00:53:21,040 --> 00:53:24,000
Speaker 1: it's interesting you say that because as a community, we've

1034
00:53:24,080 --> 00:53:28,000
Speaker 1: kind of deprived ourselves of the skill of just waiting.

1035
00:53:28,480 --> 00:53:28,680
Speaker 3: Yeah.

1036
00:53:29,680 --> 00:53:33,600
Speaker 1: We never wait, yeah, we never, we rarely wait, and

1037
00:53:34,120 --> 00:53:36,799
Speaker 1: it's really important. We need to have that moment of

1038
00:53:37,000 --> 00:53:41,040
Speaker 1: just sitting to make everything else feel okay. How do

1039
00:53:41,120 --> 00:53:43,319
Speaker 1: you talk to your kids about what's going on with you?

1040
00:53:43,440 --> 00:53:47,320
Speaker 1: And you know what things like the next twenty years

1041
00:53:47,320 --> 00:53:49,600
Speaker 1: look like, you know, by the time what the youngest

1042
00:53:49,680 --> 00:53:55,279
Speaker 1: is what still Yeah, so by the time you're you know,

1043
00:53:55,440 --> 00:53:57,560
Speaker 1: they're kind of leaving UNI and stuff like that, or

1044
00:53:57,560 --> 00:53:59,359
Speaker 1: by the time they're getting married, like what is it?

1045
00:54:00,680 --> 00:54:05,680
Speaker 4: Yeah, you know what I've learned over the last few years.

1046
00:54:05,719 --> 00:54:10,680
Speaker 4: That's I'm trying not to project that far fort yase

1047
00:54:10,800 --> 00:54:14,520
Speaker 4: I don't know what it's going to hold for me,

1048
00:54:14,719 --> 00:54:17,520
Speaker 4: and I mean, I'm hopeful that there will be some

1049
00:54:18,320 --> 00:54:21,240
Speaker 4: you know, great medical developments, and hopefully I'm part of that.

1050
00:54:21,520 --> 00:54:22,160
Speaker 3: And I can.

1051
00:54:22,480 --> 00:54:26,160
Speaker 4: But exposing the kids to the reality of my condition

1052
00:54:26,920 --> 00:54:29,600
Speaker 4: was a tricky part because we didn't know what was

1053
00:54:29,640 --> 00:54:32,239
Speaker 4: going on, and we didn't know where I was. You know,

1054
00:54:32,280 --> 00:54:34,920
Speaker 4: there was thirty percent chance I minded up in the wheelchair,

1055
00:54:35,000 --> 00:54:37,759
Speaker 4: thirty percent chance I could be as I am now

1056
00:54:37,840 --> 00:54:41,200
Speaker 4: pretty sort of stable, or thirty percent chance I could

1057
00:54:41,480 --> 00:54:41,759
Speaker 4: get that.

1058
00:54:42,120 --> 00:54:44,400
Speaker 3: So but I couldn't give.

1059
00:54:44,280 --> 00:54:47,000
Speaker 4: Them an answer, and in all honesty, I didn't give

1060
00:54:47,040 --> 00:54:49,600
Speaker 4: them enough credit. I didn't think that they would be

1061
00:54:49,640 --> 00:54:53,520
Speaker 4: able to handle the information. But they surprised me with

1062
00:54:53,600 --> 00:54:57,839
Speaker 4: their maturity and their awareness. When when you want them

1063
00:54:57,840 --> 00:55:00,000
Speaker 4: to be aware, they're not. But when you didn't really

1064
00:55:00,080 --> 00:55:03,120
Speaker 4: you want them to were there so so great. The intuition,

1065
00:55:03,280 --> 00:55:07,399
Speaker 4: especially the youngest, her intuition when it comes to an

1066
00:55:07,440 --> 00:55:10,240
Speaker 4: awareness when it comes to my health and my well being,

1067
00:55:10,320 --> 00:55:13,880
Speaker 4: she can read my face like it's it's unbelievable. So

1068
00:55:14,480 --> 00:55:17,600
Speaker 4: I think where they've gone from being, you know, fairly

1069
00:55:17,800 --> 00:55:20,120
Speaker 4: kids can be self centered, as you know, but then

1070
00:55:20,600 --> 00:55:23,480
Speaker 4: now when we're going out in public, they you know,

1071
00:55:23,520 --> 00:55:26,880
Speaker 4: it's led by Michelle, but knowing you know, either to

1072
00:55:27,520 --> 00:55:30,920
Speaker 4: advise me of a step or you know, letting letting

1073
00:55:30,960 --> 00:55:34,920
Speaker 4: me hold onto their neck for balance, or just simple

1074
00:55:35,000 --> 00:55:38,120
Speaker 4: things that now I have to always keep in mind.

1075
00:55:39,160 --> 00:55:40,879
Speaker 3: They are all part of it.

1076
00:55:40,840 --> 00:55:43,840
Speaker 4: Now, you know, there is you know, I probably abuse

1077
00:55:43,920 --> 00:55:45,760
Speaker 4: it a little bit when I need them to fetch

1078
00:55:45,800 --> 00:55:48,120
Speaker 4: me a glass of water occasionally, but you know that's

1079
00:55:48,160 --> 00:55:50,160
Speaker 4: that's part.

1080
00:55:48,840 --> 00:55:54,600
Speaker 1: You're a very you know, you're a recognizable person. Yeah,

1081
00:55:54,800 --> 00:55:58,839
Speaker 1: what's what's it like when people see you when you're

1082
00:55:58,880 --> 00:55:59,400
Speaker 1: out and about.

1083
00:56:00,600 --> 00:56:07,440
Speaker 4: It's amazing because I yeah, people obviously you talk about

1084
00:56:07,560 --> 00:56:10,359
Speaker 4: the you know, the relay and the swimming stuff, but

1085
00:56:10,440 --> 00:56:13,520
Speaker 4: now people are talking to me about, you know, my

1086
00:56:13,800 --> 00:56:17,160
Speaker 4: resilience and what I'm doing, you know in terms of

1087
00:56:17,440 --> 00:56:19,080
Speaker 4: you know, blood donors and.

1088
00:56:19,360 --> 00:56:21,280
Speaker 3: You know, people come up to me on the street.

1089
00:56:21,360 --> 00:56:22,800
Speaker 3: So I donated yesterday.

1090
00:56:22,880 --> 00:56:26,200
Speaker 4: I donated for you yesterday, and it's kind of cool.

1091
00:56:26,280 --> 00:56:29,760
Speaker 4: It's like, you know, obviously, you know, without the swimming,

1092
00:56:29,760 --> 00:56:31,960
Speaker 4: I wouldn't be here. But it's it's great that I

1093
00:56:32,000 --> 00:56:35,959
Speaker 4: can resonate with the public in a different form. So yeah,

1094
00:56:36,520 --> 00:56:39,160
Speaker 4: like I mean, I've managed to keep this balld a

1095
00:56:39,160 --> 00:56:43,400
Speaker 4: head in the limelight for the right reasons and and

1096
00:56:43,640 --> 00:56:46,319
Speaker 4: hopefully I can you know, still make a difference in

1097
00:56:46,360 --> 00:56:47,040
Speaker 4: a different way.

1098
00:56:47,920 --> 00:56:49,960
Speaker 1: What do you think masculinity was when you were at

1099
00:56:50,000 --> 00:56:55,200
Speaker 1: your athletic peak and looking at through the lens you've got, Now,

1100
00:56:55,440 --> 00:56:57,200
Speaker 1: what do you think masculinity is? What does it mean

1101
00:56:57,239 --> 00:56:57,600
Speaker 1: to you now?

1102
00:57:00,680 --> 00:57:01,320
Speaker 3: Good question?

1103
00:57:02,160 --> 00:57:06,600
Speaker 4: Yeah, I think obviously for me, musculinity was was physical,

1104
00:57:06,960 --> 00:57:11,400
Speaker 4: was kind of protection, was kind of was almost authoritarian.

1105
00:57:11,719 --> 00:57:15,080
Speaker 4: It was a little bit of it wasn't so imposing,

1106
00:57:15,120 --> 00:57:19,160
Speaker 4: but you have an aura of this musculinity. And I

1107
00:57:19,200 --> 00:57:22,040
Speaker 4: didn't really let myself be emotional when I was a kid,

1108
00:57:22,880 --> 00:57:26,800
Speaker 4: very similar to my son who gets quiet and withdrawn,

1109
00:57:27,000 --> 00:57:31,480
Speaker 4: and that's how I was introverted. So I just I

1110
00:57:31,480 --> 00:57:33,600
Speaker 4: don't know where it went, but it went in somehow,

1111
00:57:33,680 --> 00:57:37,600
Speaker 4: and I just, you know, I wouldn't communicate much, even

1112
00:57:37,680 --> 00:57:42,600
Speaker 4: with my immediate family, but this macho kind of existence,

1113
00:57:42,680 --> 00:57:46,640
Speaker 4: that was what I thought it was. But now it's

1114
00:57:46,720 --> 00:57:51,320
Speaker 4: really the more I shared my experience, the more I'm

1115
00:57:51,440 --> 00:57:55,080
Speaker 4: vulnerable with what I experienced, the more people give me

1116
00:57:55,720 --> 00:58:00,400
Speaker 4: credit and show me respect for being a male that's

1117
00:58:00,520 --> 00:58:04,800
Speaker 4: able to talk about, you know, not being physically able

1118
00:58:05,040 --> 00:58:08,200
Speaker 4: or not being you know the fact that I, you know,

1119
00:58:08,320 --> 00:58:12,000
Speaker 4: I'm being able to talk about my you know, period

1120
00:58:12,040 --> 00:58:14,479
Speaker 4: where I had depression and a period where I wasn't

1121
00:58:14,480 --> 00:58:18,960
Speaker 4: a great dad or a great partner, and those times existed,

1122
00:58:19,040 --> 00:58:21,720
Speaker 4: and I can put up my hand and you know,

1123
00:58:21,800 --> 00:58:24,080
Speaker 4: accept that that that was the course of my life.

1124
00:58:24,120 --> 00:58:27,960
Speaker 4: And but I'm in a position now where I'm clear

1125
00:58:28,080 --> 00:58:32,240
Speaker 4: enough mentally and physically or not physically, but to address

1126
00:58:32,320 --> 00:58:35,520
Speaker 4: those and I wouldn't necessarily make amends, but to be

1127
00:58:35,640 --> 00:58:39,440
Speaker 4: the best dad, partner, friend that I can be. And

1128
00:58:39,480 --> 00:58:45,920
Speaker 4: that's for me. I think it comes with being transparent

1129
00:58:46,080 --> 00:58:47,560
Speaker 4: and vulnerable.

1130
00:58:47,920 --> 00:58:50,360
Speaker 1: And they certainly, by the sounds of things, no less

1131
00:58:50,400 --> 00:58:55,880
Speaker 1: of a provided, no less of a protector, and certainly

1132
00:58:55,920 --> 00:58:58,760
Speaker 1: no less powerful, would you say, less and more powerful now.

1133
00:58:58,840 --> 00:59:03,920
Speaker 4: Probably more like if even people that were never probably

1134
00:59:03,960 --> 00:59:06,600
Speaker 4: went born when I was swimming talking to me about

1135
00:59:06,600 --> 00:59:10,200
Speaker 4: a topic that is so far removed from the swimming pool.

1136
00:59:11,600 --> 00:59:17,640
Speaker 4: And it's purely, you know, on adversity and overcoming life

1137
00:59:17,760 --> 00:59:21,800
Speaker 4: challenges which we all have, depending all different shapes of form.

1138
00:59:21,920 --> 00:59:24,920
Speaker 4: So even though it's not perfect, but I'm joining this

1139
00:59:25,040 --> 00:59:28,520
Speaker 4: part of my life which I it's so it's kind

1140
00:59:28,560 --> 00:59:31,360
Speaker 4: of like hearing myself say it. It's a little bit

1141
00:59:31,360 --> 00:59:34,600
Speaker 4: weird as well, because I only got diagnosed five years

1142
00:59:34,600 --> 00:59:36,840
Speaker 4: ago and I still can't walk properly. I still got

1143
00:59:36,880 --> 00:59:40,960
Speaker 4: the cane hanging on the chair. But it's almost I'm

1144
00:59:41,080 --> 00:59:45,280
Speaker 4: enjoying seeing what the next ten years brings, and we'll

1145
00:59:45,320 --> 00:59:46,920
Speaker 4: see what we und up.

1146
00:59:49,080 --> 00:59:51,920
Speaker 1: There's not many men that could have said that sentence, man,

1147
00:59:52,120 --> 00:59:56,520
Speaker 1: considering what you're facing, and it's extraordinary. I'm so glad

1148
00:59:56,560 --> 00:59:58,720
Speaker 1: you wrote this book. I'm so glad you came to chat.

1149
00:59:58,880 --> 00:59:59,920
Speaker 1: You've got a lot of to give.

1150
00:59:59,840 --> 01:00:02,880
Speaker 3: But thank you so much. I appreciate it.

1151
01:00:03,120 --> 01:00:07,360
Speaker 1: Thank you so much. And that was Michael Klym. You

1152
01:00:07,440 --> 01:00:10,200
Speaker 1: can support him and all the work he does. I'll

1153
01:00:10,240 --> 01:00:12,040
Speaker 1: put a link in the show notes to the work

1154
01:00:12,040 --> 01:00:14,960
Speaker 1: that he's doing at the moment. Yeah, he's a fascinating man.

1155
01:00:15,360 --> 01:00:18,360
Speaker 1: And if I could face the kind of adversity he's

1156
01:00:18,360 --> 01:00:21,280
Speaker 1: facing with like the smallest amount that you can fit

1157
01:00:21,280 --> 01:00:23,000
Speaker 1: out on my fingernail or what he's got, I'd be

1158
01:00:23,040 --> 01:00:26,240
Speaker 1: a very happy man. That's really something about him. Thanks

1159
01:00:26,240 --> 01:00:28,080
Speaker 1: for being a part of it. Please do get on

1160
01:00:28,120 --> 01:00:29,680
Speaker 1: the newsletter. There's a link in the show notes to that.

1161
01:00:29,720 --> 01:00:31,160
Speaker 1: If you have any questions, you've got any comments, you

1162
01:00:31,200 --> 01:00:33,480
Speaker 1: got any thoughts about the episode. There's a little button

1163
01:00:33,520 --> 01:00:35,560
Speaker 1: at the bottom of every article you just hit send

1164
01:00:35,600 --> 01:00:38,640
Speaker 1: a message and I'll get it, because ping on my

1165
01:00:38,760 --> 01:00:42,200
Speaker 1: laptop it'd be great. I'll be back here on Friday.

1166
01:00:43,000 --> 01:00:44,400
Speaker 1: I didn't make the show by myself. A lot of

1167
01:00:44,400 --> 01:00:47,760
Speaker 1: people that helped me, and here all their names, either

1168
01:00:47,880 --> 01:00:51,000
Speaker 1: read by a AI robot or perhaps somebody else.

1169
01:00:52,240 --> 01:00:55,040
Speaker 6: This episode was brought to you by Andy Maher on

1170
01:00:55,200 --> 01:00:59,680
Speaker 6: Audio post production, Backsided on video post production, Toe Hyder

1171
01:00:59,760 --> 01:01:03,200
Speaker 6: on music. My producer is Bree Steele and my executive

1172
01:01:03,240 --> 01:01:06,920
Speaker 6: function assistant is Monica Chapman. For every episode ever. To

1173
01:01:06,960 --> 01:01:08,840
Speaker 6: get on the mailing list or to get in touch

1174
01:01:08,920 --> 01:01:12,480
Speaker 6: through the contact form, head to Ostriginsburg dot com.

1175
01:01:12,480 --> 01:01:13,440
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening.