1 00:00:05,921 --> 00:00:07,801 Speaker 1: Apogee Production. 2 00:00:10,841 --> 00:00:14,001 Speaker 2: Jawn jessper Jensen. He was a granddad and a loving 3 00:00:14,081 --> 00:00:16,961 Speaker 2: father to his two daughters. His wife had died, and 4 00:00:17,001 --> 00:00:20,480 Speaker 2: although he had some medical conditions and had suffered depression 5 00:00:21,121 --> 00:00:23,961 Speaker 2: a few days before he disappeared, he was said to 6 00:00:23,961 --> 00:00:27,401 Speaker 2: be in good spirits and chirpy. Head back to the 7 00:00:27,441 --> 00:00:34,681 Speaker 2: previous three episodes to hear how the story's unfolded. On Tuesday, 8 00:00:34,721 --> 00:00:38,681 Speaker 2: the twenty seventh of June twenty seventeen, police make a 9 00:00:38,721 --> 00:00:42,201 Speaker 2: public appeal for information around Jawn's disappearance. 10 00:00:42,961 --> 00:00:49,001 Speaker 3: Any informations from the great appreciating Yeah, it's a beautiful granddad. 11 00:00:50,561 --> 00:00:54,161 Speaker 4: One now, they say it's completely unlike the widower to 12 00:00:54,241 --> 00:00:56,681 Speaker 4: go out for so long without making contact. 13 00:00:58,001 --> 00:01:01,481 Speaker 2: That night, his empty car is found an hour and 14 00:01:01,561 --> 00:01:05,481 Speaker 2: seventeen minutes away in a sleepy fishing town called Anselm. 15 00:01:06,641 --> 00:01:09,840 Speaker 2: Police are able to pull CCTV records of the highways 16 00:01:09,881 --> 00:01:12,881 Speaker 2: on the trip and spot a car that looks like Jawn's, 17 00:01:14,241 --> 00:01:18,041 Speaker 2: but the images are grainy and it's impossible to see 18 00:01:18,280 --> 00:01:21,361 Speaker 2: who's driving the car and if there are any passengers. 19 00:01:24,840 --> 00:01:30,361 Speaker 2: There is one thing that's crystal clear. It's the car 20 00:01:30,401 --> 00:01:35,201 Speaker 2: that's found outside the Lanslam Beach Hotel is Jawns and 21 00:01:35,241 --> 00:01:41,681 Speaker 2: he's not in it. Joe Burr is the investigating officer 22 00:01:41,840 --> 00:01:45,521 Speaker 2: in charge of the case in wa. Joe was instrumental 23 00:01:45,521 --> 00:01:48,121 Speaker 2: in writing the brief for the coroner, and he told 24 00:01:48,161 --> 00:01:51,121 Speaker 2: me about the forensics that were done once Jawn's car 25 00:01:51,201 --> 00:01:52,361 Speaker 2: had been found. 26 00:01:53,841 --> 00:01:57,641 Speaker 5: Yeah, that's correct, so we the steering will and the 27 00:01:57,881 --> 00:02:06,281 Speaker 5: headrest of the vehicle were actually forensically analyzed. Obbs were 28 00:02:06,321 --> 00:02:10,481 Speaker 5: sent off for analysis and it did come back that 29 00:02:10,561 --> 00:02:13,881 Speaker 5: mister Jensen's DNA was located on the steering wheel of 30 00:02:13,881 --> 00:02:20,601 Speaker 5: the vehicle. It's not something that we do in every 31 00:02:20,881 --> 00:02:23,041 Speaker 5: mis in person case. It comes down to those initial 32 00:02:23,081 --> 00:02:27,361 Speaker 5: investigative critical decisions that are made at that point. I 33 00:02:27,401 --> 00:02:31,761 Speaker 5: guess they're looking at every possible avenue that this investigation 34 00:02:31,841 --> 00:02:33,761 Speaker 5: could go down. So I think it was a good 35 00:02:33,761 --> 00:02:37,281 Speaker 5: decision to take those swabs because you know, it wasn't 36 00:02:37,281 --> 00:02:39,041 Speaker 5: known at the time how they were going to come back, 37 00:02:39,601 --> 00:02:43,641 Speaker 5: but and what other supporting evidence could be located further 38 00:02:43,680 --> 00:02:45,881 Speaker 5: down the line that could mean that that DNA swab 39 00:02:46,001 --> 00:02:50,000 Speaker 5: was important. But we did get a mixed profile on 40 00:02:50,161 --> 00:02:55,401 Speaker 5: the steering wheel, but that's not unusual in itself because Obviously, 41 00:02:55,441 --> 00:02:57,881 Speaker 5: with most vehicles, you have a number of people driving 42 00:02:58,201 --> 00:03:00,961 Speaker 5: the car and your hands are a good source on 43 00:03:01,001 --> 00:03:05,680 Speaker 5: the steering wheel of leaving DNA in that location. There 44 00:03:05,841 --> 00:03:09,201 Speaker 5: was DNA located on the steering wheel that we didn't get. 45 00:03:09,081 --> 00:03:09,601 Speaker 4: A match on. 46 00:03:09,721 --> 00:03:12,641 Speaker 5: But you know, black could come back to anyone. You 47 00:03:12,680 --> 00:03:16,801 Speaker 5: could be looking at mechanics, service centers, family members, neighbors, 48 00:03:16,841 --> 00:03:20,641 Speaker 5: anybody that's been in that vehicle. So the location of 49 00:03:21,201 --> 00:03:24,601 Speaker 5: mixed profile there isn't in itself something that we need 50 00:03:24,601 --> 00:03:25,881 Speaker 5: to be suspicious about. 51 00:03:26,721 --> 00:03:30,241 Speaker 2: So a mixed profile essentially means someone else's DNA in 52 00:03:30,281 --> 00:03:33,441 Speaker 2: the car. Both the two daughters of Jehorn Jensen's DNA 53 00:03:33,641 --> 00:03:38,281 Speaker 2: were also taken and they were excluded from the two 54 00:03:38,361 --> 00:03:40,041 Speaker 2: other matches in the car. Is that right? 55 00:03:40,481 --> 00:03:44,401 Speaker 5: So their DNA wasn't wasn't a match there. Quite often 56 00:03:44,441 --> 00:03:49,001 Speaker 5: we take nets of kin DNA not only for that 57 00:03:49,121 --> 00:03:52,601 Speaker 5: forensic purpose, but also for the possible future identification of 58 00:03:52,641 --> 00:03:58,441 Speaker 5: any any located human remains. So we would usually take 59 00:03:58,641 --> 00:04:01,641 Speaker 5: the nets of kin DNA, and that's an action that 60 00:04:01,681 --> 00:04:05,441 Speaker 5: should be taken in most long term miss in persons. 61 00:04:05,561 --> 00:04:09,481 Speaker 5: Up it was there was no match per se with 62 00:04:09,521 --> 00:04:11,561 Speaker 5: the DNA that was located on that steering wheel with 63 00:04:11,561 --> 00:04:12,241 Speaker 5: the daughters. 64 00:04:13,841 --> 00:04:16,801 Speaker 2: Both daughters had said that they had driven the car before, 65 00:04:18,321 --> 00:04:22,320 Speaker 2: but they also said that partners had also driven John's car, 66 00:04:22,801 --> 00:04:27,161 Speaker 2: and mister Jensen's neighbors had also driven his car at 67 00:04:27,201 --> 00:04:30,401 Speaker 2: some point. So it's feasible that they could be from 68 00:04:30,440 --> 00:04:31,640 Speaker 2: a myriad of different people. 69 00:04:32,440 --> 00:04:35,320 Speaker 5: Anything that touches anything else, you know, you could even 70 00:04:35,761 --> 00:04:37,921 Speaker 5: somebody's DNA could be on that steerweel that hasn't even 71 00:04:38,001 --> 00:04:40,200 Speaker 5: driven the car. If someone was to shake hands with 72 00:04:40,281 --> 00:04:44,361 Speaker 5: somebody and then step into their car. You know, the 73 00:04:44,440 --> 00:04:49,921 Speaker 5: DNA is a wonderful tool, but it's not always on 74 00:04:49,961 --> 00:04:52,481 Speaker 5: its own something that can be used to solve a case. 75 00:04:53,481 --> 00:04:58,481 Speaker 2: Bell told us that she employed a forensic scientists herself. 76 00:04:58,880 --> 00:05:00,761 Speaker 2: He was critical of the fact that the police didn't 77 00:05:00,801 --> 00:05:06,001 Speaker 2: retain mister Jensen's car for more thorough forensic examination, which 78 00:05:06,001 --> 00:05:09,801 Speaker 2: he said was should have been tested the vehicle driver 79 00:05:09,921 --> 00:05:12,521 Speaker 2: side footwell and its boots. Did you have a view 80 00:05:12,561 --> 00:05:13,401 Speaker 2: on that at the time. 81 00:05:14,921 --> 00:05:18,681 Speaker 5: I actually think, compared to the vast array of other 82 00:05:18,721 --> 00:05:21,521 Speaker 5: miss in person cases that I deal with, they actually 83 00:05:21,521 --> 00:05:25,521 Speaker 5: went above and beyond what would usually be done at 84 00:05:25,521 --> 00:05:29,361 Speaker 5: the initial scene of a missing person vehicle, because what 85 00:05:31,241 --> 00:05:34,161 Speaker 5: the forensic officer was I guess looking at at that 86 00:05:34,281 --> 00:05:39,401 Speaker 5: time is purely from a position of that there could 87 00:05:39,440 --> 00:05:44,281 Speaker 5: be some criminality involved in this. But the initial assessment 88 00:05:44,481 --> 00:05:48,001 Speaker 5: of the investigation that continues to this day is that 89 00:05:48,121 --> 00:05:53,121 Speaker 5: no evidence of any criminality has been located. So if 90 00:05:53,161 --> 00:05:55,641 Speaker 5: you were looking at it as a crime scene, then yes, 91 00:05:55,921 --> 00:05:57,561 Speaker 5: if you were looking at it it's solely a miss 92 00:05:57,561 --> 00:06:01,361 Speaker 5: in person case, where you have no supporting evidence that 93 00:06:01,440 --> 00:06:04,640 Speaker 5: somebody else has driven that vehicle, then I wouldn't necessarily 94 00:06:04,721 --> 00:06:09,001 Speaker 5: concur with that opinion because they have had the foresight 95 00:06:09,201 --> 00:06:11,961 Speaker 5: to swab the steering wheels, to swab their head wreck. 96 00:06:13,880 --> 00:06:16,001 Speaker 5: We can always look back on these things with hindsight, 97 00:06:16,081 --> 00:06:21,320 Speaker 5: and obviously certain things have been raised that it would 98 00:06:21,401 --> 00:06:25,080 Speaker 5: be it would be prudent now to look back and 99 00:06:25,361 --> 00:06:30,441 Speaker 5: be able to swab the football, for example, But the 100 00:06:30,961 --> 00:06:33,601 Speaker 5: critical decision at the time was that that was not necessary, 101 00:06:33,641 --> 00:06:37,161 Speaker 5: and I haven't seen any corroborating evidence that says that 102 00:06:37,201 --> 00:06:39,481 Speaker 5: would show anything different for what we currently have. 103 00:06:40,241 --> 00:06:43,361 Speaker 2: Bell also confirmed to me that it is very likely 104 00:06:43,440 --> 00:06:46,520 Speaker 2: her DNA would have been in the car and in 105 00:06:46,561 --> 00:06:49,921 Speaker 2: the house, and that a sister had stayed over a 106 00:06:50,001 --> 00:06:52,841 Speaker 2: dad's many times to keep an eye on him. 107 00:06:53,440 --> 00:06:55,960 Speaker 6: Look, there was a mattress. It was set up in 108 00:06:57,081 --> 00:06:58,880 Speaker 6: opposite to where that foot spar. 109 00:06:59,121 --> 00:07:04,281 Speaker 4: Was sort of set up, but it was, you know, 110 00:07:04,361 --> 00:07:06,921 Speaker 4: a bit of a weird spot. But yes, my sister, 111 00:07:06,921 --> 00:07:09,001 Speaker 4: I'll be honest, she did say that she would go 112 00:07:09,041 --> 00:07:11,801 Speaker 4: over there and keep an eye on him and when 113 00:07:11,841 --> 00:07:14,201 Speaker 4: he was going through rough times and stuff like that. 114 00:07:14,401 --> 00:07:18,641 Speaker 4: So yeah, she said she was obviously sleeping there. But 115 00:07:19,601 --> 00:07:22,321 Speaker 4: strange enough, the DNA sampen wasn't strong enough because both 116 00:07:22,361 --> 00:07:26,441 Speaker 4: of us, due to my forensic investigator expert, you know, luckily, 117 00:07:26,481 --> 00:07:29,321 Speaker 4: we pushed for them to take our DNA because I said, well, 118 00:07:29,361 --> 00:07:31,921 Speaker 4: surely we should be doing that, especially if down the track, 119 00:07:31,961 --> 00:07:33,761 Speaker 4: if we do find him, you know, you want to 120 00:07:33,761 --> 00:07:36,921 Speaker 4: have that DNA on file, right, So we were trying 121 00:07:36,961 --> 00:07:39,321 Speaker 4: to exclude everyone. So yeah, we both had our DNA, 122 00:07:39,441 --> 00:07:43,881 Speaker 4: and but yeah, strange enough, they couldn't They couldn't include 123 00:07:44,041 --> 00:07:47,601 Speaker 4: or exclude her as being the other DNA that was found. 124 00:07:47,401 --> 00:07:49,841 Speaker 2: On that bad Police also state in the Kindness report 125 00:07:49,961 --> 00:07:53,041 Speaker 2: there was no evidence of a cleanup in an attempt 126 00:07:53,041 --> 00:07:55,641 Speaker 2: to conceal or deceive evidence. 127 00:07:56,681 --> 00:07:57,121 Speaker 6: Correct. 128 00:07:58,361 --> 00:08:05,881 Speaker 4: Look, there was comments from one particular officer at the 129 00:08:06,001 --> 00:08:08,681 Speaker 4: time where he sort of had eluded that he did 130 00:08:09,081 --> 00:08:11,321 Speaker 4: part of his initials, you know, said he didn't look 131 00:08:11,361 --> 00:08:12,401 Speaker 4: like there was a. 132 00:08:12,361 --> 00:08:14,121 Speaker 6: Cleanup or some sort of cleanup. 133 00:08:14,161 --> 00:08:15,881 Speaker 4: But at that point I think he was thinking maybe 134 00:08:15,881 --> 00:08:17,841 Speaker 4: he's tried to clean it up just to get to 135 00:08:17,881 --> 00:08:20,481 Speaker 4: the hospital, I'm assuming, But no, it. 136 00:08:20,521 --> 00:08:21,481 Speaker 6: Was very much. 137 00:08:24,281 --> 00:08:27,441 Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, the scene was unusual, and I guess 138 00:08:27,441 --> 00:08:29,321 Speaker 4: they were sort of a soy. No, No, it didn't 139 00:08:29,361 --> 00:08:31,601 Speaker 4: didn't look like a cleanup, but it was odd that 140 00:08:31,641 --> 00:08:34,841 Speaker 4: there was no blood at all found from this one 141 00:08:34,881 --> 00:08:37,881 Speaker 4: particular area. You know, if he's walked out of the house, 142 00:08:38,361 --> 00:08:40,281 Speaker 4: there would have been blood either through the lounge on 143 00:08:40,281 --> 00:08:43,081 Speaker 4: the carpet, or through the tiles, or in the football 144 00:08:43,161 --> 00:08:49,441 Speaker 4: of the car, especially after driving an hour seventeen. You know, 145 00:08:49,561 --> 00:08:52,401 Speaker 4: if he's adrenaline, if he's adrenaline's pumping, wouldn't wouldn't that 146 00:08:52,921 --> 00:08:54,801 Speaker 4: be you know, you. 147 00:08:55,041 --> 00:08:57,441 Speaker 6: Would think you would find blood elsewhere. 148 00:08:58,921 --> 00:08:59,881 Speaker 2: There was no blood in the. 149 00:08:59,801 --> 00:09:02,721 Speaker 3: Car, and there was no blood in the car, And 150 00:09:02,761 --> 00:09:05,521 Speaker 3: he actually was on blood thinning medication at the so 151 00:09:05,641 --> 00:09:07,721 Speaker 3: his ability to be able to stop the bleeding would 152 00:09:07,721 --> 00:09:10,921 Speaker 3: have been very limited. So we would expect that to 153 00:09:10,921 --> 00:09:14,001 Speaker 3: be blood in the car. 154 00:09:14,961 --> 00:09:18,161 Speaker 2: It's important to state that we're not accusing anyone of 155 00:09:18,201 --> 00:09:22,001 Speaker 2: any wrongdoing in this podcast. We're simply stating some points 156 00:09:22,041 --> 00:09:26,521 Speaker 2: of view that don't necessarily agree with each other. Police 157 00:09:26,521 --> 00:09:29,481 Speaker 2: are very clear that there doesn't seem to be any 158 00:09:29,521 --> 00:09:33,641 Speaker 2: criminality involved in the case of the missing man John Jensen, 159 00:09:35,561 --> 00:09:38,441 Speaker 2: Darren and Bell don't agree on this point. 160 00:09:39,201 --> 00:09:43,201 Speaker 4: I think he was murdered. No, I, one hand, on 161 00:09:43,201 --> 00:09:45,041 Speaker 4: my heart believe he was murdered. 162 00:09:45,441 --> 00:09:49,041 Speaker 2: If something untoward did happen to Jasper, there would have 163 00:09:49,081 --> 00:09:52,561 Speaker 2: had to been a motive, something that stood out and 164 00:09:52,681 --> 00:09:56,961 Speaker 2: possibly could lead to police investigating a different path, or 165 00:09:57,001 --> 00:10:01,561 Speaker 2: more sinister path. I asked Joe Burr about John's bank 166 00:10:01,641 --> 00:10:04,241 Speaker 2: records and his financial situation. 167 00:10:05,361 --> 00:10:09,321 Speaker 5: The issue when you're looking back at somebody's financial records 168 00:10:09,361 --> 00:10:14,001 Speaker 5: is you never you're never prudent to the transactions or 169 00:10:14,041 --> 00:10:19,121 Speaker 5: the conversations or the agreements that people have with family, 170 00:10:19,281 --> 00:10:22,681 Speaker 5: with people they know, so it's always difficult to look 171 00:10:22,721 --> 00:10:27,081 Speaker 5: back and think that certain things do look amiss. There 172 00:10:27,921 --> 00:10:33,601 Speaker 5: there was transactions like normal transactions, like anybody's accounts, but 173 00:10:34,161 --> 00:10:39,161 Speaker 5: there was there was obviously agreements in place with people 174 00:10:39,721 --> 00:10:42,281 Speaker 5: and it's not up to me, you know, I can't 175 00:10:42,281 --> 00:10:47,281 Speaker 5: talk about somebody else's financial situation. But there wasn't anything 176 00:10:47,481 --> 00:10:52,241 Speaker 5: necessarily that meant to us that there was any link 177 00:10:52,321 --> 00:10:56,201 Speaker 5: to his finances to the disappearance of mister Jensen. 178 00:10:56,841 --> 00:10:58,721 Speaker 2: What we can see from the kind of support that 179 00:10:58,801 --> 00:11:00,961 Speaker 2: he's had a few bank accounts. One was with IG 180 00:11:01,161 --> 00:11:04,321 Speaker 2: and was dormant since twenty fourteen. Then he had an 181 00:11:04,361 --> 00:11:07,441 Speaker 2: every day account with NAB and the last time that 182 00:11:07,601 --> 00:11:11,721 Speaker 2: was touched before his disappearance was the nineteenth of June, 183 00:11:11,721 --> 00:11:14,681 Speaker 2: which was six days before his disappearance, and the son 184 00:11:14,761 --> 00:11:20,921 Speaker 2: was three hundred dollars. Bell had mentioned in our chat 185 00:11:21,321 --> 00:11:24,641 Speaker 2: that a dad was very a creature of habit. He 186 00:11:24,681 --> 00:11:27,561 Speaker 2: would have the same dinner every night, he would do 187 00:11:27,601 --> 00:11:29,601 Speaker 2: the same things very often. He would sit in the 188 00:11:29,601 --> 00:11:32,601 Speaker 2: front room watch tally, and he would often visit the 189 00:11:32,601 --> 00:11:36,241 Speaker 2: bank on the same day. And from her perspective, she 190 00:11:36,361 --> 00:11:40,201 Speaker 2: said that his visits to the bank over the last 191 00:11:40,241 --> 00:11:42,881 Speaker 2: sort of three to four months became a little more 192 00:11:42,921 --> 00:11:46,401 Speaker 2: sporadic and random, if you like, with different amounts. Did 193 00:11:46,401 --> 00:11:51,041 Speaker 2: police investigate anything prior to his disappearance and the transactions 194 00:11:51,041 --> 00:11:53,201 Speaker 2: across his bank accounts. 195 00:11:52,961 --> 00:11:58,321 Speaker 5: Yeah, we did look at it. We usually next to 196 00:11:58,401 --> 00:12:02,041 Speaker 5: see what the run is. If a missing personal investigation 197 00:12:02,121 --> 00:12:05,241 Speaker 5: goes long term, we will try and create some kind 198 00:12:05,241 --> 00:12:08,761 Speaker 5: of victimology, some kind of gauge of that person's life 199 00:12:08,841 --> 00:12:13,841 Speaker 5: and their usual activities. I can't disagree with Belle obviously. 200 00:12:14,041 --> 00:12:16,761 Speaker 5: You know I was never fortunate enough to meet missus Jason, 201 00:12:16,761 --> 00:12:20,481 Speaker 5: and I'm sure she knows that that's very well, so 202 00:12:20,521 --> 00:12:24,481 Speaker 5: I wouldn't disagree with her assessment of that. But it's 203 00:12:24,721 --> 00:12:30,041 Speaker 5: impossible from an investigator's point of view to actually determined 204 00:12:30,081 --> 00:12:34,241 Speaker 5: that any change of activity is due to anything untoward. 205 00:12:34,641 --> 00:12:39,841 Speaker 5: You know, we certain people are people have habit, like 206 00:12:39,881 --> 00:12:44,921 Speaker 5: you say, but our lives change, and certain conversations happen, 207 00:12:45,041 --> 00:12:47,481 Speaker 5: and certain routes you go down different routes to what 208 00:12:47,521 --> 00:12:50,841 Speaker 5: you might have done before. So you know, there's no 209 00:12:50,921 --> 00:12:53,881 Speaker 5: evidence there. There's no evidence that I've seen that suggests 210 00:12:53,881 --> 00:12:57,841 Speaker 5: that any kind of visit to ATM anything untoward has 211 00:12:57,881 --> 00:13:00,481 Speaker 5: happened that has then led to his disappearance. 212 00:13:02,481 --> 00:13:06,361 Speaker 2: Now, Bell, I guess doesn't share the same view. She 213 00:13:06,441 --> 00:13:10,361 Speaker 2: has a more sinister view of what has occurred, and 214 00:13:10,401 --> 00:13:14,441 Speaker 2: I know she shared that with you numerous times. Is 215 00:13:14,481 --> 00:13:19,001 Speaker 2: there any evidence from a police perspective and from the 216 00:13:19,081 --> 00:13:22,801 Speaker 2: corner's report that is in line with Bells thinking that 217 00:13:23,641 --> 00:13:25,601 Speaker 2: something more sinister happened to her father. 218 00:13:28,921 --> 00:13:31,721 Speaker 5: Well, my heart goes out to Bell and Darren and 219 00:13:31,761 --> 00:13:36,361 Speaker 5: the rest of the family. Going through this kind of 220 00:13:36,561 --> 00:13:41,281 Speaker 5: situation is everybody's worst nightmare, there's no and it's hard 221 00:13:41,401 --> 00:13:44,361 Speaker 5: as an investigator of miss person cases because you can't 222 00:13:44,441 --> 00:13:49,201 Speaker 5: give people the resolution that they need. And until you 223 00:13:49,201 --> 00:13:52,121 Speaker 5: can give them a resolution, until you reached that conclusion, 224 00:13:52,841 --> 00:13:59,201 Speaker 5: anything that happens is not necessarily one hundred percent accurate. 225 00:13:59,241 --> 00:14:02,361 Speaker 5: And the issue you have as a family member is 226 00:14:02,401 --> 00:14:06,441 Speaker 5: you never actually know. So I will I always applaud 227 00:14:07,481 --> 00:14:12,601 Speaker 5: Belinda and Darren for keeping up the intensity of the 228 00:14:12,641 --> 00:14:15,801 Speaker 5: investigation and for you know, looking out for their father 229 00:14:15,961 --> 00:14:20,241 Speaker 5: and wanting to find the truth. But in reality, I 230 00:14:20,281 --> 00:14:23,841 Speaker 5: think when I look at all of the information, all 231 00:14:23,841 --> 00:14:28,921 Speaker 5: of the evidence that I concur with the currenter that well, 232 00:14:28,921 --> 00:14:31,881 Speaker 5: the current is given an open verdict, but that is 233 00:14:31,881 --> 00:14:34,481 Speaker 5: to be expected because we don't actually know. We don't 234 00:14:34,521 --> 00:14:37,721 Speaker 5: have cast iron evidence of what happened on that day, 235 00:14:38,161 --> 00:14:41,961 Speaker 5: but we also don't have any evidence, in my opinion, 236 00:14:42,161 --> 00:14:46,481 Speaker 5: to suggest that any any criminal activity has taken place 237 00:14:46,521 --> 00:14:50,761 Speaker 5: and any criminal activity has led to missus Jensen's disappearance. 238 00:14:53,121 --> 00:14:56,281 Speaker 5: When you're looking at a missing personal investigation, you look 239 00:14:56,281 --> 00:15:00,281 Speaker 5: at the criminality aspects, you look at the misadventure aspect, 240 00:15:00,321 --> 00:15:05,041 Speaker 5: and you look at the possible self harm aspects. And I, personally, 241 00:15:05,441 --> 00:15:07,121 Speaker 5: based on now I've been dinning with this case for 242 00:15:07,121 --> 00:15:09,841 Speaker 5: a long time, I can't say that self harmer's taking place. 243 00:15:09,881 --> 00:15:11,881 Speaker 5: I don't know that self palmer's taking place, and I 244 00:15:11,881 --> 00:15:15,881 Speaker 5: would hate to offend the family in any way by 245 00:15:15,961 --> 00:15:19,841 Speaker 5: indicating that somebody that we don't know as investigators have 246 00:15:19,961 --> 00:15:23,681 Speaker 5: the intense self harm. We don't know that happens. People 247 00:15:23,681 --> 00:15:26,361 Speaker 5: get disorientated, that could have happened. We don't know that 248 00:15:26,361 --> 00:15:31,761 Speaker 5: that happened. But obviously the element you know, we we're 249 00:15:31,881 --> 00:15:35,041 Speaker 5: missing Persentine. We're part of the homicide squad because I 250 00:15:35,161 --> 00:15:39,041 Speaker 5: have to be in a location where if we determine 251 00:15:39,121 --> 00:15:44,161 Speaker 5: any criminality, we work with homicide squad detectives to reach 252 00:15:44,561 --> 00:15:49,521 Speaker 5: the resolution and to find somebody responsible for the criminality. 253 00:15:49,601 --> 00:15:53,081 Speaker 5: And the reality is as hard as we have looked 254 00:15:53,081 --> 00:15:57,761 Speaker 5: and we have investigated this, there's no evidence I believe 255 00:15:57,961 --> 00:16:00,801 Speaker 5: that there has been any of that criminal activity has 256 00:16:00,841 --> 00:16:03,121 Speaker 5: taken part in this disappearance. 257 00:16:12,081 --> 00:16:15,481 Speaker 2: As I've mentioned throughout this podcast, Belle and her big 258 00:16:15,521 --> 00:16:19,441 Speaker 2: sister don't talk anymore. In fact, I don't think it's 259 00:16:19,521 --> 00:16:24,121 Speaker 2: overstating the point to say they dislike each other. It's 260 00:16:24,161 --> 00:16:27,401 Speaker 2: sad because as I look back through photos of these 261 00:16:27,401 --> 00:16:30,681 Speaker 2: two little blonde girls playing with their big mountain of 262 00:16:30,721 --> 00:16:34,081 Speaker 2: a dad sitting on his shoulders at a family holiday 263 00:16:34,561 --> 00:16:37,921 Speaker 2: in nineteen eighty seven in Melbourne, it's not hard to 264 00:16:37,961 --> 00:16:42,801 Speaker 2: imagine how close they once were. We've refrained from mentioning 265 00:16:42,961 --> 00:16:46,001 Speaker 2: her name in this podcast, which will continue to honor 266 00:16:46,641 --> 00:16:52,961 Speaker 2: as Belle mentioned, this is her story. We do have 267 00:16:53,001 --> 00:16:56,841 Speaker 2: a copy of Belle's sister's police statement that was made 268 00:16:56,841 --> 00:17:01,721 Speaker 2: on the thirtieth of June twenty seventeen. It states lots 269 00:17:01,721 --> 00:17:05,521 Speaker 2: of facts, the fact that her dad owned his house 270 00:17:06,161 --> 00:17:10,041 Speaker 2: on Rainbow View in Ocean Reef outright, that he was 271 00:17:10,080 --> 00:17:14,080 Speaker 2: financially supported by his super that her relationship with her 272 00:17:14,160 --> 00:17:17,561 Speaker 2: dad was close and they would see him almost every 273 00:17:17,600 --> 00:17:22,281 Speaker 2: second day and they would speak every day. John's eldest 274 00:17:22,360 --> 00:17:25,120 Speaker 2: daughter also mentioned that she would stay at a dad's 275 00:17:25,160 --> 00:17:27,840 Speaker 2: house when he was feeling low, and that she would 276 00:17:27,880 --> 00:17:30,600 Speaker 2: sleep in a bed made up in the lamb's room. 277 00:17:31,041 --> 00:17:34,720 Speaker 2: Sometimes at those sleepovers she would take his keys and 278 00:17:34,761 --> 00:17:38,720 Speaker 2: his medication and put them next to her overnight. She 279 00:17:38,921 --> 00:17:44,041 Speaker 2: says as a precaution in her words to police, I. 280 00:17:44,120 --> 00:17:46,961 Speaker 1: Don't believe he would have ever done anything to hurt himself. 281 00:17:47,160 --> 00:17:48,401 Speaker 1: He just needed my company. 282 00:17:49,001 --> 00:17:51,400 Speaker 2: In point thirteen of her statement, which was made in 283 00:17:51,521 --> 00:17:55,481 Speaker 2: Lancelain while the searches took place, she mentions that she'd 284 00:17:55,481 --> 00:17:58,920 Speaker 2: taken a dad to her family doctor and he was 285 00:17:58,961 --> 00:18:01,920 Speaker 2: reducing the dose of neuronton, the drug that might have 286 00:18:01,961 --> 00:18:05,761 Speaker 2: added to his depression. We've used an actress to read 287 00:18:05,840 --> 00:18:06,841 Speaker 2: parts of her statement. 288 00:18:07,321 --> 00:18:09,960 Speaker 1: He stopped taking it all together at least three weeks ago. 289 00:18:10,441 --> 00:18:13,160 Speaker 1: Since Dad stopped taking that medication, he had not spoken 290 00:18:13,201 --> 00:18:14,160 Speaker 1: again of suicide. 291 00:18:15,001 --> 00:18:18,120 Speaker 2: This was not the only statement that Belle's sister made. 292 00:18:18,281 --> 00:18:22,400 Speaker 2: On the fourteenth of December twenty seventeen, she made another 293 00:18:22,441 --> 00:18:25,961 Speaker 2: statement to police. It covers some of the same detail, 294 00:18:26,481 --> 00:18:30,041 Speaker 2: However it's much longer and it was made to a 295 00:18:30,080 --> 00:18:34,561 Speaker 2: detective in Perth. She talked of her dad's immense pain 296 00:18:35,160 --> 00:18:35,961 Speaker 2: in that statement. 297 00:18:36,400 --> 00:18:39,201 Speaker 1: I remember when Dad's feet got so painful. At times, 298 00:18:39,241 --> 00:18:42,001 Speaker 1: he would bash his broken wrist to try and take 299 00:18:42,001 --> 00:18:44,440 Speaker 1: away the pain. He told me he would hit it 300 00:18:44,441 --> 00:18:46,641 Speaker 1: because he wanted to take the pain away from his feet. 301 00:18:47,360 --> 00:18:50,080 Speaker 1: Dad became very emotional in the last year and would 302 00:18:50,120 --> 00:18:52,600 Speaker 1: talk about Mam a lot. He would cry at different 303 00:18:52,640 --> 00:18:55,360 Speaker 1: times and would tell me he missed her. He would 304 00:18:55,360 --> 00:18:57,920 Speaker 1: also just cry about his situation and that he couldn't 305 00:18:57,921 --> 00:18:59,201 Speaker 1: do anything because of his feet. 306 00:18:59,921 --> 00:19:03,240 Speaker 2: She also mentions to police that at the time of 307 00:19:03,281 --> 00:19:07,400 Speaker 2: his disappearance he was on around fifteen different types of medication, 308 00:19:08,481 --> 00:19:11,401 Speaker 2: and she details some of his suicidal thoughts. 309 00:19:12,160 --> 00:19:14,761 Speaker 1: In the last at least twelve months. Once a week 310 00:19:14,840 --> 00:19:18,120 Speaker 1: Dad would mention what I believe were suicidal thoughts. He 311 00:19:18,160 --> 00:19:20,361 Speaker 1: would say things like why am I here, I've got 312 00:19:20,400 --> 00:19:23,001 Speaker 1: no life? What's the point? That would be on his 313 00:19:23,080 --> 00:19:25,600 Speaker 1: low days, but I could perkin cheer him back up. 314 00:19:26,080 --> 00:19:28,200 Speaker 1: He would also say things in a joking manner to me. 315 00:19:28,281 --> 00:19:31,561 Speaker 1: On numerous occasions, he would say, Geez, the pain was 316 00:19:31,600 --> 00:19:34,600 Speaker 1: so bad last night that Camery looked good. I could 317 00:19:34,600 --> 00:19:37,960 Speaker 1: have got the hose out. He would also text me 318 00:19:38,041 --> 00:19:40,480 Speaker 1: and write me messages in private message at night on 319 00:19:40,521 --> 00:19:43,361 Speaker 1: that game Words with friends. He would write things at 320 00:19:43,400 --> 00:19:47,001 Speaker 1: sometimes four in the morning, like I can't take this anymore. 321 00:19:47,120 --> 00:19:54,720 Speaker 1: I can't take the pain. The pills aren't working, and 322 00:19:54,761 --> 00:19:59,961 Speaker 1: my feet are on fire. He would also sometimes call 323 00:20:00,001 --> 00:20:02,521 Speaker 1: me on my mobile and would be crying, not being 324 00:20:02,521 --> 00:20:05,641 Speaker 1: able to talk. I would go straight up and stay 325 00:20:05,681 --> 00:20:07,401 Speaker 1: with him on those nights and try and make him 326 00:20:07,400 --> 00:20:10,681 Speaker 1: feel better. When I would stay with him, I would 327 00:20:10,761 --> 00:20:13,721 Speaker 1: hide the keys to his car and medication in bed 328 00:20:13,761 --> 00:20:17,200 Speaker 1: with me so that he didn't do anything silly. Up 329 00:20:17,241 --> 00:20:19,600 Speaker 1: until Dad went missing, I was at his home almost 330 00:20:19,640 --> 00:20:22,521 Speaker 1: every night, wast every night, every night, every night. 331 00:20:23,400 --> 00:20:26,961 Speaker 2: Jawn's finances have been a matter of discussion for the sisters. 332 00:20:28,481 --> 00:20:32,441 Speaker 2: Nothing suspicious has been noted by police. In her statement, 333 00:20:32,840 --> 00:20:35,720 Speaker 2: Belle's sister says that on the day she went to 334 00:20:35,761 --> 00:20:39,600 Speaker 2: her dad's house after he was reported missing, she walked 335 00:20:39,640 --> 00:20:41,920 Speaker 2: through the house. I was in complete shock. 336 00:20:42,600 --> 00:20:45,881 Speaker 1: There was blood in Dad's footbath and blood all over 337 00:20:45,921 --> 00:20:48,281 Speaker 1: the floor on the tiles. I was in complete shock. 338 00:20:48,761 --> 00:20:50,921 Speaker 1: I was made aware that the police had been contacted 339 00:20:50,921 --> 00:20:54,120 Speaker 1: the previous night. At some stage, I noticed that Dad's 340 00:20:54,160 --> 00:20:56,840 Speaker 1: medicines were all accounted for because they were on the bench. 341 00:20:57,321 --> 00:20:59,680 Speaker 1: I went into his bedroom and noticed his wallet and 342 00:20:59,721 --> 00:21:02,481 Speaker 1: hearing aids were on a set of drawers. His iPad 343 00:21:02,561 --> 00:21:06,721 Speaker 1: was there in the lounge room near his seat. Dad 344 00:21:06,721 --> 00:21:09,720 Speaker 1: had a Christmas cardboard box underneath a side table in 345 00:21:09,761 --> 00:21:13,801 Speaker 1: the front laund room which contained Dad's cash money. Inside 346 00:21:13,840 --> 00:21:17,041 Speaker 1: the box was four thousand dollars in cash fifty dollar notes, 347 00:21:17,120 --> 00:21:20,481 Speaker 1: which I grabbed whilst Belinda and were present. I took 348 00:21:20,521 --> 00:21:24,160 Speaker 1: the cash money home and paid bills with that money. 349 00:21:25,441 --> 00:21:27,321 Speaker 1: I have all the receipts for the money I spent 350 00:21:27,400 --> 00:21:30,961 Speaker 1: on bills. 351 00:21:33,360 --> 00:21:37,441 Speaker 2: Belle's recollections of a dad's bank accounts, of his financial position, 352 00:21:38,120 --> 00:21:40,721 Speaker 2: and her knowledge of her father and how he used 353 00:21:40,761 --> 00:21:46,200 Speaker 2: money is important. As the police explained, it's impossible to 354 00:21:46,281 --> 00:21:49,600 Speaker 2: know how a families spend their money before something like 355 00:21:49,640 --> 00:21:55,680 Speaker 2: this happens. Financial affairs are normally very private. Bell is 356 00:21:55,721 --> 00:22:00,121 Speaker 2: careful about accusing anyone of anything criminal. When I asked 357 00:22:00,160 --> 00:22:05,521 Speaker 2: her about her dad's bank accounts, that's. 358 00:22:05,360 --> 00:22:07,801 Speaker 6: A tricker one. That's a tricker one. I gotta be 359 00:22:07,921 --> 00:22:11,200 Speaker 6: careful what I will say. And I think it's important 360 00:22:11,241 --> 00:22:13,001 Speaker 6: to say this and I have it right because this 361 00:22:13,080 --> 00:22:14,960 Speaker 6: is my dad. This is my story. 362 00:22:15,001 --> 00:22:19,840 Speaker 4: This is what happened the friday before my dad went missing. 363 00:22:20,360 --> 00:22:21,841 Speaker 6: I popped in on my way home. 364 00:22:21,840 --> 00:22:22,641 Speaker 2: From work. 365 00:22:23,201 --> 00:22:29,240 Speaker 4: He was holding an AHM slip in his hand and 366 00:22:29,321 --> 00:22:34,001 Speaker 4: he said, Bendy, this person is a stole of my money, 367 00:22:35,201 --> 00:22:38,440 Speaker 4: and this particular ATMs. I didn't see how much was 368 00:22:38,441 --> 00:22:40,001 Speaker 4: in his bank account at the time, and I didn't 369 00:22:40,041 --> 00:22:41,520 Speaker 4: realize it's a verity of it. I knew we had 370 00:22:41,721 --> 00:22:46,561 Speaker 4: some financial issues sort of leading up to that period, 371 00:22:46,600 --> 00:22:49,360 Speaker 4: and I didn't realize this verity of the problem at 372 00:22:49,360 --> 00:22:52,240 Speaker 4: that time, but I also thought I'd have time to 373 00:22:52,360 --> 00:22:57,761 Speaker 4: sort it out, so so yeah, some at the time, 374 00:22:57,921 --> 00:22:59,640 Speaker 4: he only had sort of I think it was twelve 375 00:22:59,761 --> 00:23:02,241 Speaker 4: hundred and forty six dollars left in his bank account, 376 00:23:02,921 --> 00:23:05,200 Speaker 4: and I would have thought he would have had thousands, 377 00:23:05,241 --> 00:23:07,440 Speaker 4: like hundreds of thousands, like he used to have a 378 00:23:07,441 --> 00:23:08,080 Speaker 4: savings account. 379 00:23:08,120 --> 00:23:09,241 Speaker 6: We should have had hundreds. 380 00:23:08,961 --> 00:23:11,080 Speaker 4: Of thousands in it, and for him I didn't have 381 00:23:11,160 --> 00:23:13,041 Speaker 4: just over one thousand dollars. Did not make sense. 382 00:23:13,201 --> 00:23:16,321 Speaker 3: Both of his bank accounts were bled of them. 383 00:23:16,761 --> 00:23:17,281 Speaker 6: It was nothing. 384 00:23:17,360 --> 00:23:19,920 Speaker 4: But again I was told because nothing came, nothing was 385 00:23:19,961 --> 00:23:22,120 Speaker 4: taken out after the fact, that that doesn't matter. 386 00:23:23,041 --> 00:23:27,080 Speaker 2: When you say bled dry transferred to someone, given to someone. 387 00:23:28,400 --> 00:23:31,481 Speaker 3: Well, he had sorry, he had a savings account through 388 00:23:31,600 --> 00:23:34,680 Speaker 3: Y and G which had over. I once said, had 389 00:23:34,681 --> 00:23:36,400 Speaker 3: one hundred thousand dollars, but that's what he used to 390 00:23:36,441 --> 00:23:39,521 Speaker 3: pay for his holidays or whatever out of But there 391 00:23:39,561 --> 00:23:43,200 Speaker 3: was a seventy seventy four thousand dollars transfer for a 392 00:23:43,241 --> 00:23:46,161 Speaker 3: holiday apparently that he never went on. So we can't 393 00:23:46,201 --> 00:23:53,041 Speaker 3: explain that. It just says seventy four thousand dollars transfer holiday, 394 00:23:53,160 --> 00:23:56,321 Speaker 3: dash resleep. But Bell booked all these holidays and that 395 00:23:56,441 --> 00:23:59,120 Speaker 3: he didn't go on holidays, not a holiday for seventy 396 00:23:59,120 --> 00:24:00,041 Speaker 3: four thousand dollars. 397 00:24:00,080 --> 00:24:01,441 Speaker 2: Where was that transfer made too? 398 00:24:02,201 --> 00:24:04,801 Speaker 3: It was made to another one of his accounts, and 399 00:24:04,840 --> 00:24:07,240 Speaker 3: then from that account a check was written out in 400 00:24:07,321 --> 00:24:08,080 Speaker 3: someone's name. 401 00:24:09,481 --> 00:24:11,600 Speaker 2: Was your dad wealthy? 402 00:24:11,761 --> 00:24:20,321 Speaker 4: Look, he wasn't wealthy, he was he you know, he. 403 00:24:18,080 --> 00:24:19,400 Speaker 6: He had plenty of money. 404 00:24:19,561 --> 00:24:21,200 Speaker 4: He even said to me at one point, you know, 405 00:24:21,201 --> 00:24:23,321 Speaker 4: because he's very old school, you know, it was always 406 00:24:24,360 --> 00:24:26,880 Speaker 4: pay off your mortgage first. Don't use the ATM all 407 00:24:26,921 --> 00:24:28,080 Speaker 4: the time, you know, back in the day when he 408 00:24:28,160 --> 00:24:30,721 Speaker 4: used to get you know, fees from using ATMs. 409 00:24:30,761 --> 00:24:31,481 Speaker 6: He's always had plentying. 410 00:24:31,521 --> 00:24:33,440 Speaker 4: You always had least three hundred cash in his wallet, 411 00:24:33,880 --> 00:24:37,001 Speaker 4: you know, always he actually kept money at his at 412 00:24:37,001 --> 00:24:40,721 Speaker 4: his property for a rainy day and at one point 413 00:24:40,761 --> 00:24:41,761 Speaker 4: he goes helps you up. 414 00:24:41,721 --> 00:24:43,721 Speaker 7: To like eighty thousand dollars. He had eighty thousand dollars 415 00:24:43,801 --> 00:24:49,001 Speaker 7: kept in his at home and you know he had money. 416 00:24:49,241 --> 00:24:50,960 Speaker 7: He had he could go on all the holidays. I 417 00:24:50,961 --> 00:24:52,720 Speaker 7: mean he worked hard as the labor to you know, 418 00:24:52,761 --> 00:24:54,600 Speaker 7: he had had a mortgage since the eighties because we 419 00:24:54,640 --> 00:24:56,321 Speaker 7: built it. He built his own house with his own 420 00:24:56,521 --> 00:25:00,721 Speaker 7: you know, in Woodvales, so he wasn't in debt. 421 00:25:01,160 --> 00:25:02,881 Speaker 6: He pretty much just had, you know. 422 00:25:02,840 --> 00:25:04,160 Speaker 4: When we were on although it was a bit of 423 00:25:04,201 --> 00:25:07,801 Speaker 4: a tight ask growing up, I looked, admit, but you know, 424 00:25:07,880 --> 00:25:09,481 Speaker 4: if you were on holidays and all that, that's when 425 00:25:09,521 --> 00:25:10,200 Speaker 4: you knew that. 426 00:25:10,840 --> 00:25:12,640 Speaker 6: You know, he saw me sitting there in South Africa. 427 00:25:12,681 --> 00:25:14,200 Speaker 4: I was like, I want that egg that, you know, 428 00:25:14,241 --> 00:25:17,081 Speaker 4: one of those email things that I really wanted money 429 00:25:17,360 --> 00:25:18,880 Speaker 4: and he ended up just buying it for me. You know, 430 00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:21,600 Speaker 4: He's like, don't be silly, you know, and you know, 431 00:25:21,640 --> 00:25:25,321 Speaker 4: things like that. So he didn't spend money previously. He 432 00:25:25,400 --> 00:25:27,961 Speaker 4: was very cautious with his money and so he had 433 00:25:28,041 --> 00:25:31,160 Speaker 4: he should have had a lot more money than what 434 00:25:31,281 --> 00:25:33,680 Speaker 4: he did have when he went Missy. 435 00:25:34,241 --> 00:25:37,241 Speaker 2: Did police investigate the transfers of money. 436 00:25:39,001 --> 00:25:43,281 Speaker 4: Look again, I I reported it first to the first 437 00:25:43,281 --> 00:25:46,441 Speaker 4: officer because obviously, after eight months it was the case 438 00:25:46,521 --> 00:25:50,760 Speaker 4: was handled over to SUTN Joseph. But prior to that, 439 00:25:51,281 --> 00:25:55,400 Speaker 4: the investigator I rang him as soon as basically when 440 00:25:55,441 --> 00:25:57,640 Speaker 4: I got a strange from my sister. There was alarm 441 00:25:57,681 --> 00:25:59,200 Speaker 4: bells and we had an incident, and I was like, 442 00:25:59,241 --> 00:26:02,200 Speaker 4: oh my god, I got to get a bank statement, 443 00:26:02,241 --> 00:26:04,561 Speaker 4: and I just went around to Dad's every day, and 444 00:26:04,721 --> 00:26:06,920 Speaker 4: thank god, I finally got one of his edit his 445 00:26:06,921 --> 00:26:10,080 Speaker 4: final anab statement, And that's when it hit me what 446 00:26:10,241 --> 00:26:13,041 Speaker 4: that Friday conversation was all about, because there was a 447 00:26:13,041 --> 00:26:15,081 Speaker 4: lot of Although you look at it and maybe from 448 00:26:15,120 --> 00:26:17,720 Speaker 4: the police perspective, no, maybe it doesn't look that bad. 449 00:26:17,921 --> 00:26:20,401 Speaker 4: But when you see a fifty dollars ATM transaction when 450 00:26:20,441 --> 00:26:23,080 Speaker 4: this man's not driving, so he's driven, you know, gone 451 00:26:23,120 --> 00:26:25,760 Speaker 4: with Whiford's, and this man's got thousands of dollars at 452 00:26:25,761 --> 00:26:28,681 Speaker 4: his house already and he's not going out or doing anything, 453 00:26:28,880 --> 00:26:31,321 Speaker 4: and you've got transactions for three hundred and then going 454 00:26:31,360 --> 00:26:34,001 Speaker 4: back an hour later and going get another three hundred. 455 00:26:33,721 --> 00:26:36,080 Speaker 6: Out what the you know? 456 00:26:36,160 --> 00:26:39,841 Speaker 4: He he was He was a creature habit. He did 457 00:26:39,840 --> 00:26:43,001 Speaker 4: get at a certain amount at a certain time, and 458 00:26:43,041 --> 00:26:45,880 Speaker 4: you could see these patterns change. I've put every transaction 459 00:26:45,921 --> 00:26:48,880 Speaker 4: into a spreadsheet, extrapolated every bloody report you possibly can, 460 00:26:48,961 --> 00:26:49,400 Speaker 4: and you can. 461 00:26:49,321 --> 00:26:50,121 Speaker 6: See a change. 462 00:26:50,281 --> 00:26:52,880 Speaker 4: You see when he was going, it'd go at a 463 00:26:52,921 --> 00:26:56,000 Speaker 4: certain time, almost to the like two o'clock on a Friday, 464 00:26:56,080 --> 00:26:57,240 Speaker 4: for example, do you know what I mean. 465 00:26:57,281 --> 00:26:58,881 Speaker 6: Then it turned into in the last six. 466 00:26:58,761 --> 00:27:01,961 Speaker 4: Months, there was no consistency and there were a lot 467 00:27:01,961 --> 00:27:04,360 Speaker 4: of transactions, and even in that last since the fall, 468 00:27:04,400 --> 00:27:08,561 Speaker 4: I think had been taken out and I'm like, why 469 00:27:08,880 --> 00:27:10,760 Speaker 4: he had money next to him and at that point 470 00:27:10,921 --> 00:27:13,880 Speaker 4: he wasn't going anywhere, He wasn't playing golf, he wasn't 471 00:27:14,201 --> 00:27:15,600 Speaker 4: what was he spending the money on. 472 00:27:15,801 --> 00:27:17,281 Speaker 2: Did you hand this over to police? 473 00:27:18,241 --> 00:27:18,401 Speaker 5: Oh? 474 00:27:18,481 --> 00:27:20,321 Speaker 4: Yeah, I read police as soon as I had his, 475 00:27:21,400 --> 00:27:23,120 Speaker 4: and they came out. They came out to my house, 476 00:27:23,321 --> 00:27:26,121 Speaker 4: but I was pretty much told that no money's gone 477 00:27:26,120 --> 00:27:30,561 Speaker 4: out after the fact, you know. So he's basically if 478 00:27:30,561 --> 00:27:32,120 Speaker 4: he whatever he wanted to do with his money is 479 00:27:32,160 --> 00:27:34,160 Speaker 4: his choice and it was his decision. I guess it 480 00:27:34,201 --> 00:27:37,041 Speaker 4: was looked upon that I was had animosity or that 481 00:27:37,120 --> 00:27:39,840 Speaker 4: I was worried that you know someone else was getting 482 00:27:39,840 --> 00:27:41,241 Speaker 4: money and I wasn't, but I wasn't the case. 483 00:27:41,400 --> 00:27:44,880 Speaker 3: I'm fortunately sorry to interopic, but unfortunately when you mentioned money, 484 00:27:45,080 --> 00:27:48,840 Speaker 3: it starts to sound like a civil matter. It sounds like, yeah, money, 485 00:27:48,880 --> 00:27:51,481 Speaker 3: but I'm forced in this situation. We're trying to find 486 00:27:51,481 --> 00:27:53,801 Speaker 3: out what's happened to a man, and this man's money 487 00:27:53,880 --> 00:27:56,321 Speaker 3: had gone missing. They said two things. They said, no 488 00:27:56,441 --> 00:28:01,441 Speaker 3: money has gone since, and that it doesn't mean that 489 00:28:01,681 --> 00:28:04,921 Speaker 3: this person that we're talking about has done it. And 490 00:28:05,080 --> 00:28:07,120 Speaker 3: pretty much the only thing we can see as far 491 00:28:07,160 --> 00:28:10,201 Speaker 3: as the investigation that money goes as one email, which 492 00:28:11,481 --> 00:28:15,000 Speaker 3: was sent to someone we can't say, and that was 493 00:28:15,400 --> 00:28:19,600 Speaker 3: basically saying that there seems to be a lot of 494 00:28:19,640 --> 00:28:24,960 Speaker 3: spending going on, a lot of a lot of money 495 00:28:24,961 --> 00:28:29,481 Speaker 3: going out of accounts. Basically, did your dad sorry, did 496 00:28:30,281 --> 00:28:32,881 Speaker 3: he owe any money? Did just borrow any money? So 497 00:28:33,441 --> 00:28:35,801 Speaker 3: that but that's all we seem to know as far 498 00:28:35,840 --> 00:28:38,481 Speaker 3: as the investigation went. They didn't want to know about 499 00:28:38,481 --> 00:28:40,361 Speaker 3: the money we just got. Told us the civil matter 500 00:28:40,441 --> 00:28:41,361 Speaker 3: doesn't mean anything. 501 00:28:41,481 --> 00:28:46,001 Speaker 2: Did your dad have any gambling issues anything? 502 00:28:45,361 --> 00:28:49,761 Speaker 4: God no, If he enjoyed going to the casino, but 503 00:28:49,801 --> 00:28:51,321 Speaker 4: he was one of these blokes that would just down 504 00:28:51,361 --> 00:28:53,760 Speaker 4: there and watch it. You know, he enjoyed just and 505 00:28:54,001 --> 00:28:56,361 Speaker 4: you know, but he went too hard for his money. 506 00:28:56,921 --> 00:29:00,761 Speaker 4: You know, he wasn't no and he did not owe 507 00:29:00,761 --> 00:29:03,440 Speaker 4: any money. He didn't have a mortgage. 508 00:29:04,001 --> 00:29:08,960 Speaker 2: Yeah, straight out to know in the next episode, and 509 00:29:09,041 --> 00:29:10,481 Speaker 2: did the psyche to study anything? 510 00:29:10,961 --> 00:29:13,001 Speaker 6: He did. Look, I didn't sort of get a reading. 511 00:29:13,001 --> 00:29:14,241 Speaker 4: It was sort of one of those, you know, fairly 512 00:29:14,281 --> 00:29:16,241 Speaker 4: intimate little settings where you know. 513 00:29:16,201 --> 00:29:18,321 Speaker 6: He'll go around reading people. And I kept putting my. 514 00:29:18,321 --> 00:29:20,001 Speaker 4: Hand up right at the very end, and then he 515 00:29:20,041 --> 00:29:22,041 Speaker 4: put me and obviously, you know, sort of started to 516 00:29:22,081 --> 00:29:24,201 Speaker 4: sort of connect down whatever. And then you could see 517 00:29:24,281 --> 00:29:29,081 Speaker 4: him instantly, Yeah, look quite ill, and just went what 518 00:29:29,081 --> 00:29:32,841 Speaker 4: what's happened? What? And then he goes, was your dad murdered? 519 00:29:32,881 --> 00:29:34,881 Speaker 4: And I said, well, it's still under investcabe. You know, 520 00:29:35,001 --> 00:29:37,401 Speaker 4: we haven't found his body. And he goes, I can't 521 00:29:37,521 --> 00:29:38,961 Speaker 4: talk to you about this in front of everyone else. 522 00:29:39,001 --> 00:29:40,681 Speaker 4: You know, I'll talk to you after the seminar. 523 00:29:41,561 --> 00:29:44,761 Speaker 8: He's also showing you people taking people have got in. 524 00:29:44,881 --> 00:29:47,960 Speaker 8: What there was males that have got into the people 525 00:29:48,441 --> 00:29:53,561 Speaker 8: getting or taking or have dune get in. It's like 526 00:29:53,761 --> 00:29:58,241 Speaker 8: there's a group of males that have got He's gone, 527 00:29:58,601 --> 00:30:01,681 Speaker 8: he's deceased, but the way that he passed or the 528 00:30:01,681 --> 00:30:04,361 Speaker 8: way it's like somebody has taken him or got him. 529 00:30:04,361 --> 00:30:05,561 Speaker 8: That's what I mean when with a life. 530 00:30:40,521 --> 00:30:43,321 Speaker 2: Thanks for listening to this episode and supporting this story. 531 00:30:43,961 --> 00:30:46,801 Speaker 2: Independent storytelling that shapes the world is what pod shape 532 00:30:46,881 --> 00:30:50,001 Speaker 2: really cares about. Right now, there's thousands of people listening 533 00:30:50,001 --> 00:30:52,481 Speaker 2: to this show and our other True Crimes, and they're 534 00:30:52,521 --> 00:30:56,201 Speaker 2: completely engaged. More than ten million Australians listen to podcasts 535 00:30:56,241 --> 00:30:59,440 Speaker 2: each week. 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