Speaker 1: Hey guys, just a little bit of a heads up
Speaker 1: for this episode, we talk and discuss things like self harm,
Speaker 1: mental health, and eating disorders. If you are at all
Speaker 1: triggered by this conversation, just head to our show notes
Speaker 1: for any resources that you may need, or take a
Speaker 1: breather from this episode and skip to the next one.
Speaker 2: You can reach out to Lifeline Australia on thirteen eleven
Speaker 2: fourteen if you'd like to talk to someone, and for
Speaker 2: mob to mob conversations head to one to three yarn.
Speaker 1: All right, your mob, you can welcome to First things first,
Speaker 1: I'm Brook Blot and my pronouns as she and huh.
Speaker 2: I'm Maddie Mills. My pronouns are he and him. And
Speaker 2: before we get started, we'd like to acknowledge the custodians
Speaker 2: of the land on which we record. And for me,
Speaker 2: that's the gadigle people of the urination.
Speaker 1: For me, it's the undery people of the cooler nation.
Speaker 2: Let's get into it. I thought that you were about
Speaker 2: to say, for me, it's the gay people.
Speaker 1: It is pride man Paks. Yeah, it's me. It's the
Speaker 1: gay community, of the gay community, being gay, gay gay gay, Hay.
Speaker 2: I have downloaded an app that you were using. Want
Speaker 2: to tell you that I'm I don't let downloaded the
Speaker 2: sober app.
Speaker 1: Yes, I am sober, which I wish it was like
Speaker 1: rather than sober, being like I am accountable rather than
Speaker 1: something like, you know, because it's not always sober from something,
Speaker 1: you know, like yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2: It feels like such a I don't know, it feels
Speaker 2: like it's a hard harsh term to use for the
Speaker 2: like yeah, I don't know, for the.
Speaker 1: Because instead of sober for something, wouldn't you want to
Speaker 1: feel like you're just more, you know, practicing accountability rather
Speaker 1: than soberism. Soberism actually a word.
Speaker 2: No, I don't think so, but I made it up
Speaker 2: now it is. But the reason I bring it up
Speaker 2: is because do you remember when we were at the
Speaker 2: start of the year and we were talking about some
Speaker 2: things that we wanted to maybe be a little bit
Speaker 2: more accountable for. Yeah, and well, so I think we
Speaker 2: wanted to have, you know, some breaks from certain aspects
Speaker 2: of our life, and I think yours was you wanted
Speaker 2: to go celibate.
Speaker 1: You know. Over the years that we've done the podcast,
Speaker 1: I think one of the trends that I was noticing
Speaker 1: is you know my relationship aspect not being able to
Speaker 1: develop deeper connections or more sustainable relationships. You know, it
Speaker 1: would be like, oh, I'm dating this guy and it
Speaker 1: goes good like four six weeks and you know, we
Speaker 1: have like two episodes in there, and then it's like
Speaker 1: the next month is oh, nah, that's done, like see
Speaker 1: all move on. And that was a reoccurring pattern. And
Speaker 1: you know, if you are an avid listener and you
Speaker 1: have known my journey, you would know and you would
Speaker 1: notice this pattern with me. And you know, people always say, oh,
Speaker 1: like I have a time, But it's a pattern. And
Speaker 1: if you're not aware of it and you're not being
Speaker 1: self aware, you just keep repeating it. And I just
Speaker 1: kept repeating this relationship pattern of developing these quick fast
Speaker 1: connections and then it disintegrating or it being and not
Speaker 1: what I want because I'm not vetting enough, I'm not
Speaker 1: developing or like unpacking enough in that first part of
Speaker 1: the relationship. I'm sort of just rushing into it. And
Speaker 1: I think, yeah, so I wanted to eliminate some of
Speaker 1: the factors that do happen in that verse rush and
Speaker 1: that's you know, a sexual connection. I feel like I
Speaker 1: value that a lot. In the first instance, that has
Speaker 1: to be chemistry, has to be intense, and it's like, well,
Speaker 1: if you remove that, what else is there? And I
Speaker 1: think that's kind of what I'm unpacking, is removing that aspect,
Speaker 1: so not rushing in and going for it, maybe just
Speaker 1: taking it slow. But I have not been dating. I
Speaker 1: have sort of stopped dating. Uh fuck nos, next month
Speaker 1: will be different. But I am trying to keep accountable
Speaker 1: and that's why I download that app of like no dating,
Speaker 1: you know, meaning like no casual sex or no you know,
Speaker 1: having sex with someone practicing celibacy, Like I don't like
Speaker 1: the word celibacy, but it's just the word that you know,
Speaker 1: we use in the Australian dictionary.
Speaker 2: But yes, okay, do you think that does for your life?
Speaker 2: Like what improves when you find yourself being accountable to that?
Speaker 1: The thing with me is I'm so accountable to a
Speaker 1: lot of things, Like I keep myself accountable, like accountable
Speaker 1: for a certain way I live my life and the
Speaker 1: way that I work. But when I'm not being accountable
Speaker 1: to myself in relationships, I neglect my feelings and I
Speaker 1: neglect some aspects of my life. I kind of get
Speaker 1: distracted by the rush of like love and intensity and
Speaker 1: the excitement of you know that. But yeah, I guess
Speaker 1: I'm not really being accountable to where I'm at in
Speaker 1: my life, which is just I'm so busy. I don't
Speaker 1: really think that I can sustain a healthy, functional relationship
Speaker 1: right now. I don't have the time, and so I
Speaker 1: have to realize that and I have to break that
Speaker 1: pattern of thinking that I do. And yeah, I mean
Speaker 1: there's a lot of other things that I'm keeping accountable
Speaker 1: for which I probably haven't really shared, which have been
Speaker 1: also patterns that I've noticed about my life. So the
Speaker 1: other things that I've given up A coffee, So.
Speaker 2: How do you how does that work? Because I would
Speaker 2: be I think I'd be a shell of myself if
Speaker 2: I didn't have a morning coffee.
Speaker 1: Yeah, sometimes i am, but I've replaced it with Marcher,
Speaker 1: which is a tea which still has caffeine in it,
Speaker 1: but it's slow releasing and it's not you know. And
Speaker 1: it's when I look at the coffee aspect, for me,
Speaker 1: it was an example of success, which is so unusual,
Speaker 1: like to think, right, It's like every morning I take
Speaker 1: my dog for a walk and I get that coffee
Speaker 1: and every day. Every day I get that coffee, I'm like, oh,
Speaker 1: like I'm living the dream, you know, And I'm reminded, like, oh,
Speaker 1: I can buy my I can buy a coffee every day,
Speaker 1: and I have a coffee machine, a perfectly good coffee machine,
Speaker 1: which I do love the ritual of making a coffee.
Speaker 1: So I swapped that out and I was like, I
Speaker 1: will make a march at home. I'll do the ritual
Speaker 1: which is giving me that same feeling of having that coffee,
Speaker 1: that success, and then I take my dog for a
Speaker 1: walk with my marcher and that has been replaced, and
Speaker 1: that's made me feel much better. It also reduces my anxiety.
Speaker 1: It reduces how stimulated I am, because we do know
Speaker 1: that coffee is a stimulant. And at first it was hard,
Speaker 1: but I've reduced, like you know, I've limited and gradually
Speaker 1: I'll have a not not now, but I'll go back
Speaker 1: to having a coffee maybe like once every month or so,
Speaker 1: because I enjoy it and I want to feel the effect.
Speaker 1: But yeah, I'm I've also I haven't I want to
Speaker 1: ask you a question, but I mean I have also
Speaker 1: stopped drinking, which I'm I'm assuming you know, we'll probably
Speaker 1: talk to your experience with drinking. But my experience with
Speaker 1: alcohol hasn't always been a negative thing. Sorry it has
Speaker 1: been in other people's experiences, but my own, I've just
Speaker 1: not drank because I just don't really like the taste
Speaker 1: of alcohol. But as I've gotten older, it's become more
Speaker 1: of a social thing than really like a thing that
Speaker 1: I like doing. And I've noticed that I don't like
Speaker 1: the effect the next day. Yeah, it's all well into
Speaker 1: you know, fine to be out and having a good time,
Speaker 1: and I'm all about that creating memories with friends, but
Speaker 1: it's the next morning that I suffer that I just
Speaker 1: don't enjoy. So giving that up has yeah, been another
Speaker 1: I guess breaking in the pattern. The hangovers and I think,
Speaker 1: like you know.
Speaker 2: Because are the worst, especially as you get older. It's
Speaker 2: like they just aren't the same anymore. Like I find
Speaker 2: that as well, like you're borrowing time from tomorrow that
Speaker 2: you just shouldn't.
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. And I think I'm I always just silly.
Speaker 1: I always just silly things like I'm not into like
Speaker 1: risk taking or you know, I don't drink so much
Speaker 1: that I'm risk adverse per se, but I will like
Speaker 1: I don't know, I will fall over or I will
Speaker 1: think it's funny to text next, and I think those
Speaker 1: things are just for me in my eyes the way
Speaker 1: that I see them. Not anyone would think that, but
Speaker 1: I just think, oh, I'm better than that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I The thing with the accountability app that
Speaker 2: I'm focusing on is actually alcohol. I think that there's
Speaker 2: been so many years where alcohol has been a vice
Speaker 2: for me to forget about things or to numb myself
Speaker 2: or you know. I started drinking when I was fifteen
Speaker 2: years old. And yeah, you know, I went to a
Speaker 2: boarding school where you know, on the weekends you'd go
Speaker 2: out and you would, you know, go we would go
Speaker 2: to my friend's house and they would steal their parents'
Speaker 2: alcohol and we would start drinking. You know, it's around fifteen,
Speaker 2: sixteen years old, I started drinking. And I feel like
Speaker 2: I continuously drank from that age until you know, this year,
Speaker 2: and it as I got older. Unlike you, I actually,
Speaker 2: you know, the floodgates open for me when I get
Speaker 2: drunk and when it comes to risk taking behavior, and
Speaker 2: I feel like it has been an issue for me
Speaker 2: and it's something that I don't like to sort of
Speaker 2: hop on about or share that often because I feel
Speaker 2: there's a shame that comes with it. But I would,
Speaker 2: you know, I.
Speaker 1: Have to what are you most shame about?
Speaker 2: I think the lack of control? You know, when you
Speaker 2: talk about when I talk about, you know, what alcohol
Speaker 2: does for me. I think that it doesn't make you know,
Speaker 2: it doesn't make me happy. It makes me less aware and.
Speaker 1: And so you feel less in control, which makes you feel.
Speaker 2: I just feel like when I drink, I become a
Speaker 2: different person. And that person that I become, I'm not
Speaker 2: it's a happy, go lucky person, but it also is
Speaker 2: a person who partakes in things that just aren't good
Speaker 2: for me. And I've continuously done that for years, and
Speaker 2: it's something that you know, it's quite taboo to talk
Speaker 2: about because people don't want to talk about, you know,
Speaker 2: you know, the risk taking behaviors. But for me, I
Speaker 2: need to be really open and accountable to myself that
Speaker 2: I would never do some of the things that I
Speaker 2: do when I'm drunk if I wasn't drinking alcohol. It
Speaker 2: would be the last thing on my mind, it would,
Speaker 2: you know, those things that they just don't come into
Speaker 2: my world unless I'm intoxicated. So I feel like over
Speaker 2: the years. I've seen that pattern, and I've seen that,
Speaker 2: you know, I do these things when I'm intoxicated or
Speaker 2: when I've had a few drinks that are just outside
Speaker 2: of you know, the world that I want to live in,
Speaker 2: and so I've stopped drinking. You know, I've had since
Speaker 2: the start of the year, there's been a bit of
Speaker 2: a roller coaster ride with sobriety. You know, I have gone,
Speaker 2: you know, for stints and then I've you know, had
Speaker 2: my breakout moment where I've gone and had a drink
Speaker 2: and you know, use the term relapsed but steal. That
Speaker 2: feels quite harsh for my circumstances. But it's about being
Speaker 2: honest about it.
Speaker 1: Exactly, and I think you can use any word, but
Speaker 1: you know, yeah, that's also fun.
Speaker 2: And so the app has helped a lot because and
Speaker 2: this isn't a sponsored episode of anyone who's like, oh,
Speaker 2: you know, I am sober. He is not sponsoring us,
Speaker 2: but they.
Speaker 1: Should keeping us accountable.
Speaker 2: And keeping us accounting.
Speaker 1: I think it's the I don't know, it's just having
Speaker 1: something like tangible to see and to you and.
Speaker 2: Seeing those days, you know, every day you get on
Speaker 2: this app and it gives you a notification and you say, yes,
Speaker 2: I haven't done this today, and it's about, you know,
Speaker 2: seeing those days pile up. It's actually inspiring and motivating.
Speaker 2: So for me, I'm loving clicking. You know, I haven't
Speaker 2: drank today, and I'm not someone who has ever had
Speaker 2: alcohol at home. So if you think about an alcoholic,
Speaker 2: you might, you know, see them as someone who has
Speaker 2: a lot of our cool at home. I've never been
Speaker 2: anyone who drinks who drink at home, so it's always
Speaker 2: going out and drinking.
Speaker 1: Well on the opposite that I have so much alcohol
Speaker 1: at home, like in terms of like cocktail mixes and
Speaker 1: stuff when my friends ring it over, but I've not
Speaker 1: touched any of it. Like I only have a drink
Speaker 1: when I go out and yeah, yeah, like I don't drink.
Speaker 1: I never have a drink at home.
Speaker 2: So we either I never have a drink of home.
Speaker 2: Many friends who go home and have a glass of
Speaker 2: wine or something after work, That's never been my experience.
Speaker 2: My experience is going getting shit faced with friends in
Speaker 2: a club and staying out until the sun rises. Like
Speaker 2: I am an all or nothing type of person, and
Speaker 2: so if I'm not, you know, if I can't be
Speaker 2: measured and in control of that part of my life.
Speaker 2: I'm not going to do it anymore. And it comes
Speaker 2: down to like what I want to sacrifice for the
Speaker 2: things I want to achieve, And this, for me, feels
Speaker 2: like a small sacrifice that is hard work for me.
Speaker 2: I like going out, I like having fun. I like
Speaker 2: drinking and feeling, you know, that sense of euphoria on
Speaker 2: a dance floor and feeling like, you know, tomorrow might
Speaker 2: not come, so just suck it up tonight, you know, like, yeah,
Speaker 2: I love that feeling. So it's actually it's a challenge.
Speaker 2: It's a challenge for me to not partake in that world.
Speaker 2: But I know that in the long run it's going
Speaker 2: to be something that is really helpful for what I
Speaker 2: want to achieve. And it's a small sacrifice in the
Speaker 2: grand scheme of things. But also it comes down to
Speaker 2: the cycle. You know, when I go home and I
Speaker 2: see my nieces and nephews and I think about the
Speaker 2: life that I had when I was a kid, I
Speaker 2: want to break the cycle. And if there's one thing
Speaker 2: that I can do in my life that is going
Speaker 2: to be like the ultimate trayer, it'll be to you know,
Speaker 2: to not drink, because that does stop a lot of
Speaker 2: that vicious cycle that you know, both of us saws.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it's it's very inspiring.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't think I want to bring a kid
Speaker 2: into the world if I haven't dealt with Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I want to get like a little bit a
Speaker 1: personal I feel like this like bit of weight on
Speaker 1: my chest right now. But I'm just going to you
Speaker 1: know this this as I guess. So why we started
Speaker 1: the podcast is to share our experiences, and this episode
Speaker 1: particularly is I didn't think it'd like really upset me,
Speaker 1: but and I think having these conversations just really help
Speaker 1: understand like where I'm at. Yea. So one of the
Speaker 1: things that I have on my app is you know, alcohol, celidocy,
Speaker 1: like sex. I'm like not addicted to sex, but like
Speaker 1: you know, I'm practicing more having more meaningful relationships. So
Speaker 1: that means like you know, removing that and with the
Speaker 1: one of the other things that I have a lot
Speaker 1: of shame around which I'm like dealing with and I'm
Speaker 1: in therapy for is self harm. And I've been eighteen
Speaker 1: days from that and I don't like it's not a
Speaker 1: matter of cutting myself or or you know, I like
Speaker 1: think a lot of people think self harm is hurting yourself.
Speaker 1: It is still hurting yourself, but I have a different
Speaker 1: way of dealing with it. So and I have a
Speaker 1: lot of shame around it, but I'm just gonna like
Speaker 1: talk about it because I think this is really important
Speaker 1: to understand. Is you know, accountability is one thing, but
Speaker 1: hurting and being vulnerable is another thing too. And so
Speaker 1: my way of self harm has been for a very
Speaker 1: long time. And I didn't actually realize it, but was
Speaker 1: punishing myself and starving myself. And I haven't felt like,
Speaker 1: you know, I was just accepting that it was a
Speaker 1: thing that I learned when I was younger. And you know,
Speaker 1: I talk about food a lot in Big Love and
Speaker 1: the deprivation of that and not having that. And I
Speaker 1: didn't realize that I had a real problem until therapy,
Speaker 1: until unpacking that. And you know, I often if I
Speaker 1: feel like I haven't deserved this is so upsetting, by
Speaker 1: the way.
Speaker 2: Take your time, it's fine.
Speaker 1: I just have so much shame around it because I
Speaker 1: was on the opposite side. When you know, people will
Speaker 1: girls or everyone talks about eating disorders, I'm like, oh, well,
Speaker 1: you have a privilege like to have food when you
Speaker 1: were younger, Like, why would you have an eating disorder? Yeah,
Speaker 1: where mine has inherently been developed and I didn't know
Speaker 1: that it was like a Now it's now developed into
Speaker 1: more of a coping mechanism, but now even more of
Speaker 1: a punishment. I know that's so complex and I'm still
Speaker 1: learning time pack it, but yeah, sometimes I will just
Speaker 1: not eat and sounds that sounds so stupid. But for
Speaker 1: a long time I could really hide it because I
Speaker 1: spent a lot of time by myself. I live by myself.
Speaker 1: I could hide it from friends. And the more sad
Speaker 1: I get, the more I isolate myself, and the more
Speaker 1: that I can hide it. And I think in relationships
Speaker 1: it was really kind of hard. But I would often
Speaker 1: just blame that I felt sick and say that I
Speaker 1: felt sick so I wouldn't eat. And so, yeah, I
Speaker 1: mean I'm in recovery, I guess in terms of you know,
Speaker 1: like the whole word of like relapsing and recovery. Like
Speaker 1: that's so scary that tho were those words scare me
Speaker 1: because I think I'm an addict of some sort, but
Speaker 1: I'm not. I'm actually just in pain and I'm just
Speaker 1: hurting and I'm suffering this in silence, and I just
Speaker 1: want people to know that it's not easy and it's
Speaker 1: something that I didn't think that I had and having
Speaker 1: to come to terms with that, feeling like there's something
Speaker 1: wrong with me. It's it's not Oh, I'm not I'm
Speaker 1: not okay right now, I'm feeling a lot of shame
Speaker 1: around it. Yeah, but I know that I'm going to
Speaker 1: get better for it, and I'm keeping myself accountable in
Speaker 1: a way that is going to help me and become
Speaker 1: better and to stop punishing myself.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and you know what, being able to share this
Speaker 2: and be so open.
Speaker 1: Like shaking right now, Like I'm just I've never really
Speaker 1: even said that out loud, because.
Speaker 2: I feel really proud of you for sharing this, Like
Speaker 2: I know that it's really something that's really deep for
Speaker 2: your you and your life, you know. Yeah, I want
Speaker 2: you to know that you know you are loved and
Speaker 2: that this, you know, obviously is something that you have
Speaker 2: been going through alone. But being able to share this
Speaker 2: obviously is you know, going to help so many people.
Speaker 1: I just felt like so stupid because like I'm like
Speaker 1: I look healthy and like I look like I'm well,
Speaker 1: and I'm you know, I preached like taking care of
Speaker 1: yourself and like self love and all these things, and
Speaker 1: I didn't actually realize that I was actually like punishing myself,
Speaker 1: Like I just thought it was just something I inherited
Speaker 1: when I was younger, like, oh, that.
Speaker 2: Was just because of your life when you were young, you.
Speaker 1: St do it. And then I just realized that it's
Speaker 1: a self it's a it's a it's self harm, like
Speaker 1: I'm doing it to hurt myself, to make my I
Speaker 1: don't feel better for it, and I feel worse if anything,
Speaker 1: like who doesn't want to not eat? Like But because
Speaker 1: I looked all well on the outside, I was like, oh, well,
Speaker 1: like no one's gonna notice, like who cares.
Speaker 2: I just.
Speaker 1: I just realized, yeah, it's not yeah, And I guess
Speaker 1: that's also why I downloaded this app, was to, I guess,
Speaker 1: keep myself accountable. And the days that you know, that
Speaker 1: app goes up and the numbers go up, it means
Speaker 1: that I've eaten for every single day, for eighteen days,
Speaker 1: every single day, I've had a meal or I've had
Speaker 1: food or I've had something, and I'm not hiding it
Speaker 1: from myself or from anyone like people see me eat,
Speaker 1: I'm not you know, I'm not ashamed to show people
Speaker 1: that I'm eating, and I'm like, yeah, I eat, But
Speaker 1: it's the days when I'm by myself that I'm like, oh,
Speaker 1: well I ate so much yesterday, Like I won't eat today.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Do you feel like, you know, you speak, you
Speaker 2: write so much about your childhood and feeling that sense
Speaker 2: of hunger when you're a kid, that that trauma is
Speaker 2: what's driving this.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it's something. There's so there's such a
Speaker 1: complex part of my journey with this, and it comes
Speaker 1: in different sort of ways. Is that one there was
Speaker 1: no food in the fridge or cupboard that we could eat,
Speaker 1: and it was a bit of a survival mentality of
Speaker 1: you know, and sometimes I wouldn't eat so that my
Speaker 1: siblings could eat, so that you know, was inherited kind
Speaker 1: of thing over the years. And then when I got
Speaker 1: to living with my dad and my stepmom, and you know,
Speaker 1: I was very nourished, and you know, I had a
Speaker 1: lot of health problems, and I was also iron deficient,
Speaker 1: so I have to eat meat and I don't really
Speaker 1: enjoy red meat, but I eat it just to get
Speaker 1: iron in. It just always felt like such a slog
Speaker 1: and I in a way. And then my parents, my
Speaker 1: stepmom and my dad, you know, they were also very
Speaker 1: sort of lowsos economic and my stepmom would also make
Speaker 1: me feel bad for her having to buy red meat
Speaker 1: in order for me to eat. And so I was like, well,
Speaker 1: then I don't worry about like I'm fine, like I'll
Speaker 1: just eat whatever everyone else is eating. And I was
Speaker 1: meant to mate. I was made to feel bad for that,
Speaker 1: and then I would. I also felt a lot of
Speaker 1: shame around my lunches. My lunches were always like, you know,
Speaker 1: a very stale vegimite sandwich, and all my friends were
Speaker 1: having these like really gourmet like ham and cheese and
Speaker 1: like ntella, and I felt kind of shameful around my lunches.
Speaker 1: So then I would go hide in school with teachers
Speaker 1: and not eat during the whole day, and then go
Speaker 1: to follow the dream and then eat there. So as
Speaker 1: you can imagine this cycle of like with food and
Speaker 1: you know, having all these other things that I'm dealing
Speaker 1: with as well, Like I didn't realize it was like
Speaker 1: such a problem until I actually like isolated that particular
Speaker 1: issue and looked at it from like a bird's eye
Speaker 1: view and was like, oh, like this is probably why,
Speaker 1: and it just made so much sense to why. I
Speaker 1: kind of con punish myself for it all the time
Speaker 1: because I felt a lot of shame around it, and
Speaker 1: then you know, I felt like I did never never
Speaker 1: wanted to play into this like I have an eating
Speaker 1: disorder or I'm in recovery for an eating disorder disorder
Speaker 1: or anything like, but I definitely have like inherently like
Speaker 1: disordered eating, which is an eating disorder, like and so
Speaker 1: coming to terms with that and then being like, well, no,
Speaker 1: like I have money, I can buy food, so therefore
Speaker 1: I have a privilege so I can eat, you know,
Speaker 1: like yeah, I mean I'm not a binge eater per se.
Speaker 1: Like there is BED which is binge eating disorder. I
Speaker 1: my disordered eating is more of a control thing. And
Speaker 1: obviously the binge eating is a type of control. And
Speaker 1: when you talk about control, and I guess you talk
Speaker 1: about your sobriety, and it's to sort of remain that
Speaker 1: control you're remaining I guess you're keeping that control because
Speaker 1: you know the effects of like you know, if you
Speaker 1: do relapse, per se. I don't like that. But like
Speaker 1: in quotation relapse. Mine is just like the control is
Speaker 1: to it does come from a matter of things. It's
Speaker 1: my weight, it's to punish myself. It's too it's also
Speaker 1: like inherently like a habit of mine, which is not
Speaker 1: a very good habit. And then even when I'm even
Speaker 1: like when I'm more anxious or around, I'm really more
Speaker 1: sad and stressed, I don't eat. So it's just like
Speaker 1: having to come to terms with all of those things.
Speaker 1: And I didn't realize it was like such a problem
Speaker 1: until I really kind of nutted it out and sat
Speaker 1: with my you know, in therapy, and I am so
Speaker 1: grateful for therapy. I'm up to my therapy because you know,
Speaker 1: I have to do more intensive, more intensive therapy with this, yeah,
Speaker 1: every week, and we're sort of unpacking that. And then
Speaker 1: it's about not feeling that shame, but not feeling like
Speaker 1: to continue not trying to control and to punish myself.
Speaker 1: If that mixed sense, Yeah, I don't.
Speaker 2: Yeah, is this like eighteen days for you? Is that
Speaker 2: you know the longest time you've sort of been having
Speaker 2: this happ and seeing that eighteen days, is that the
Speaker 2: longest time you've sort of been able to I suppose
Speaker 2: go without punishing yourself in a long time.
Speaker 1: Yeah, like, yeah, sometimes I would even blame that if
Speaker 1: I didn't eat, I'm like, oh, it's a fast But
Speaker 1: when I look at the how I think about it,
Speaker 1: being able to hide it and to mask it, and.
Speaker 2: I think, justify it to yourself, I suppose.
Speaker 1: Exactly, And that's kind of what an addiction is as well,
Speaker 1: and in some way is kind of validating it and
Speaker 1: being like, oh, like this is what I just do,
Speaker 1: you know, and masking that and yeah, there were so
Speaker 1: many different ways that I've masked this to prove that
Speaker 1: it's okay, and it's actually like no. And then I
Speaker 1: sort of realized when it's more harmful to me is
Speaker 1: when yeah, like I just look like nearly faint, like
Speaker 1: my bloodship my like blood pressure drops and I'm nearly
Speaker 1: literally passing out and I'm just having to still function
Speaker 1: and do a day's work living off you know. When
Speaker 1: That's why I sort of gave up caffeine. I was
Speaker 1: living off caffeine in the morning. That was my first
Speaker 1: drink in the morning, which is so bad for your
Speaker 1: But this is the thing that's so bad for a
Speaker 1: digestive system to have that so like straight away, and
Speaker 1: I know that that's bad, but I don't see like
Speaker 1: not eating bad and I think that's the problem. Well,
Speaker 1: it's not a problem. It's just something that I'm working through.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, like I mean, it's just like to be like, no,
Speaker 2: please don't apologize. I mean, it's beautiful to see like that.
Speaker 2: You you know, you've come to the realization and you're
Speaker 2: doing the work. And it's obviously like a long term thing, right,
Speaker 2: it's a long term commitment for you because it's so
Speaker 2: ingrained in who you are. But it's beautiful to see
Speaker 2: that you're doing the work. And I feel like for
Speaker 2: you to be able to identify the issue, like that's
Speaker 2: a massive thing, like people probably don't get there for
Speaker 2: a very long time.
Speaker 1: You know. I just haven't openly talked about it because
Speaker 1: of that shame and you know, stupidly, like I hide
Speaker 1: it so well.
Speaker 2: Because I'll hide, you know, the things that we don't
Speaker 2: want the world.
Speaker 1: To see exactly. And I think I just I'm ready
Speaker 1: to sort of shed that shame and not have to
Speaker 1: live with it because you know, as we're talking about control,
Speaker 1: I was thinking about the things that I control, and
Speaker 1: I control a lot of things to hide them, and
Speaker 1: I'm just trying to not feel so ashamed about it
Speaker 1: because you carry that weight and you, honestly it weighs
Speaker 1: you down. And you come in here and you talk
Speaker 1: about being proud for Pride Month and then you're like, oh, well, actually, no,
Speaker 1: I'm not proud of this, and you realize how many
Speaker 1: things do weigh you down. And I'm just going to
Speaker 1: be like fucking raw and like honest with it because.
Speaker 2: I'm so happy that you are. You know, because I've
Speaker 2: noticed that lately about myself. The more authentic I can be,
Speaker 2: the more open, the more vulnerable, and show people, you know,
Speaker 2: the good, the bad, the ugly, the struggles that wins,
Speaker 2: the challenges, all of the facets of what makes life
Speaker 2: so interesting. Being able to actually show all of it
Speaker 2: and not pick and choose just to show the shiny
Speaker 2: parts has been so freeing to me. So I hope that,
Speaker 2: like you feel after today, being able to share this
Speaker 2: like that there's a sense of relief for you because
Speaker 2: you deserve that relief. This isn't something that you should
Speaker 2: have to go through by yourself.
Speaker 1: Thank you. I have been isolating myself with this particular
Speaker 1: issue because I didn't want it to feel like I
Speaker 1: was some This is my own like projection of myself,
Speaker 1: which is really negative. But I'm working on that as
Speaker 1: well as to have more positive self talk. And I think,
Speaker 1: you know, I'm realizing that I never felt like I
Speaker 1: was enough in a lot of ways, and so I'm
Speaker 1: just constantly telling myself, like, I am enough, and you know,
Speaker 1: I am emotional, and you just own that and you
Speaker 1: just take that and you just accept that about yourself
Speaker 1: because I think, you know, for a long time, I
Speaker 1: was always there for other people and I was always
Speaker 1: showing up for other people. But right now, in this
Speaker 1: moment and the last you know, a few years, I
Speaker 1: haven't really shown up for myself. And I think that's
Speaker 1: what therapy has taught me, is that in order again
Speaker 1: to love other people and to be there for other people,
Speaker 1: we have to be there for yourself. And I always
Speaker 1: preach that, but I never really felt that. And so
Speaker 1: unpacking all of these, you know, things that I never
Speaker 1: thought I had a problem with is hard. It is raw,
Speaker 1: and it's fucking you're in the trenches and you're in
Speaker 1: the mud pit of it all. But I know that
Speaker 1: it's going to clear out and I'm gonna, you know,
Speaker 1: feel much better for it. And I think everyone just
Speaker 1: kind of pictures that I would have this very fucking
Speaker 1: glamorous life and I'm like, well, no, I still have
Speaker 1: my fucking struggles too, you know, Like yeah, just because
Speaker 1: I fucking wrote a book about it, and I'm like, oh,
Speaker 1: I'm so cathartic, it doesn't mean that I have to
Speaker 1: not deal with any of that stuff still to this day. Like,
Speaker 1: you know, we we hold a lot of shame in
Speaker 1: our communities, and I'm fucking sick of it. Like I'm
Speaker 1: sick of us having to like carry out this this
Speaker 1: carry this weight of all of this stuff. Like when
Speaker 1: do you shed that? Like when you know and you
Speaker 1: you can't just wake up one day and it all
Speaker 1: be gone. You've got to put in the work. You've
Speaker 1: got to keep it, you know, keep yourself accountable, and
Speaker 1: you've got to be raw and honor that as well,
Speaker 1: like take the time to do it, but honor that
Speaker 1: time and honor that journey of doing it, because it's
Speaker 1: fucking messy. Yeah, but you can't just hope that it's
Speaker 1: going to change overnight, like it's really not. And that's
Speaker 1: what I'm learning is that I'm usually one to be like, Okay,
Speaker 1: I'm fixed now, but I'm like, I'm like, no, this
Speaker 1: is so much harder when I tell you it's so
Speaker 1: fucking expensive too. Like the fact that you know, mental
Speaker 1: health is like one of our huges living the things
Speaker 1: that we live with, and we're in such a crisis
Speaker 1: with that. It's just like goes to show like how
Speaker 1: much more people need help with this sort of things,
Speaker 1: and that it's so complex to the individual and we're
Speaker 1: all on a fucking journey, but we're not like seeing
Speaker 1: or feeling heard or having resources to even feel that
Speaker 1: as well, Like, yeah, we lack that in Australia, like
Speaker 1: well in any country to be fair, what the fuck
Speaker 1: is going on with the world? Yeah, And you know
Speaker 1: you don't want to be like, oh, really sad because
Speaker 1: I'm not eating and then just people fucking ying dying
Speaker 1: in Gaza and you're like, oh, like but no, like
Speaker 1: that's what you can't do.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you can't think like that your your problems or
Speaker 2: your problems and perspective, yes, is something, but when it
Speaker 2: comes to your own day to day life and how
Speaker 2: you feel and how you live and the challenges of
Speaker 2: us you don't need to say that they're not a
Speaker 2: challenge because they don't trump someone else's challenge, you know. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I think that we all face our own hurdles and
Speaker 2: challenges and they're unique to us and they're important to us.
Speaker 2: So but yeah, thank you so much for sharing. Like
Speaker 2: I feel people who are listening to this hearing that
Speaker 2: that's going to really help people feel less.
Speaker 1: Alone, I hope. So, I mean, whatever your situation is,
Speaker 1: and whatever your scenario is, like you know, whether it's
Speaker 1: beating you know, or having you know, challenging sobriety and
Speaker 1: or overcoming that or or addiction or just you know,
Speaker 1: being vulnerable with your feelings. Like, I just think it's
Speaker 1: such we don't we don't have that much time on
Speaker 1: this earth as it is. Why why yeah, why spend
Speaker 1: it time carrying this weight or this load every day
Speaker 1: when yeah, I mean I'm still in the trenches right now.
Speaker 1: I'm going to acknowledge like that that's where I am.
Speaker 1: You know. Obviously I can come into work and I
Speaker 1: can put my mask on and do whatever I need
Speaker 1: to do and you know, be happy brook and you know,
Speaker 1: go to school and you know, perform and be active
Speaker 1: and but that's this is the thing that I'm carrying
Speaker 1: shame around at the moment, and you know, I'm working
Speaker 1: through it, but I know that I will get through it.
Speaker 1: And I think that's the thing is that you have
Speaker 1: to be really quite hopeful and just appreciate the journey
Speaker 1: that you're on and be patient with yourself. I might relapse,
Speaker 1: but I know that I can you know, start again
Speaker 1: and I can beat this.
Speaker 2: Yeah. And the thing is we are both up against
Speaker 2: things that are really a part of our lineage personal
Speaker 2: to us. Yeah, I have been you know handed down
Speaker 2: to us. There traumas that you know we face because
Speaker 2: of our you know, really tough childhood, you know, alcoholism
Speaker 2: in my family, both sides. And know that it's a
Speaker 2: really big obstacle for me, and I need to get
Speaker 2: through it and work towards it, you know, one brick
Speaker 2: at a time, but hopefully build that wall up where
Speaker 2: I don't need that anymore and don't look for it.
Speaker 2: But with you, you know, this is obviously an experience
Speaker 2: that you had as a kid that has stuck with
Speaker 2: you and it's it's you know, it's intergenerational. So it's
Speaker 2: like we're working on breaking that cycle. So our kids
Speaker 2: don't have to deal with it exactly. Yeah, and I
Speaker 2: love that. That's takes a champion. So that's how I say, Yes,
Speaker 2: you're a champion and you're going to get through this.
Speaker 1: Thank you. I think the best thing that I've I'm
Speaker 1: trying to like practice is just telling myself that you
Speaker 1: are enough, and I think that about you, like, you know,
Speaker 1: we want to work towards to clear all this shit,
Speaker 1: to inherit, you know, make out hopefully our children are
Speaker 1: brought up in a much healthier, healed way, but also
Speaker 1: to acknowledge that you know, you are enough as you are,
Speaker 1: and you know, if you do have children, like, they're
Speaker 1: going to love your regardless and yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and life is good because of the good and
Speaker 2: the bad.
Speaker 1: Yeah exactly. It really is sh it to appreciate the good.
Speaker 2: Yeah, contrast is everything. And if we didn't have the challenges,
Speaker 2: we wouldn't be resilient and strong people. So, you know what,
Speaker 2: we are strong enough to get through the challenges. That's
Speaker 2: why we've been given them. Exactly. We'll keep on keep
Speaker 2: on tracking along and keep on being accountable to ourselves
Speaker 2: and check.
Speaker 1: Life is goodner, life is sometimes you know what, but
Speaker 1: just like you just flushing in the next yeahs strong, Yes,
Speaker 1: thank you.
Speaker 2: So much, No, thank you, thank you for being so vulnerable.
Speaker 1: I guess just thank you so much for listening and
Speaker 1: being on this journey with our podcast or even just
Speaker 1: us and our journeys together. I think, you know, I
Speaker 1: think the best thing that we show and represent is
Speaker 1: also just a very stable friendship that we can rely
Speaker 1: on one another and hold that space. And I think
Speaker 1: if you are a listener and you do feel that
Speaker 1: and or you haven't got someone that you feel like
Speaker 1: you can go to, just know that you can reach
Speaker 1: out to us as well. And you know there's so
Speaker 1: much you know, there's so many resources and help out
Speaker 1: there as well. So if I've said anything that has
Speaker 1: like triggered or you know, made you feel like a
Speaker 1: certain way, yeah, we can put some resources in the
Speaker 1: show notes for you.
Speaker 2: But yeah, and if you you know, are facing difficulties
Speaker 2: or want to speak to someone, you can reach out
Speaker 2: to Lifeline at thirteen eleven fourteen, or you can chat
Speaker 2: to mob specific you know, workers at one three yarn. Yeah,
Speaker 2: that's a really good hotline that you can call if
Speaker 2: your mob and you'll be chatting to someone who's from
Speaker 2: the community, who you.
Speaker 1: Know, and there's no shame in that. I mean I
Speaker 1: have called them at times in my life.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Did you know that one three Yarn is actually
Speaker 2: a part of Lifeline?
Speaker 1: Yeah? I did.
Speaker 2: Actually I didn't know that, but I was speaking to
Speaker 2: the CEO of Lifeline and they said, yep, there's you know,
Speaker 2: sixty employees who are mob who sort of run the
Speaker 2: one three Yarn section of Lifeline or by themselves. It's
Speaker 2: very self determined the framework. So yeah, super awesome. So yeah,
Speaker 2: I'll always reached out if you need help. You're never alone.
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly, all right, and we'll see you next episode.
Speaker 2: Guys, take care of yourself SMO.