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Speaker 1: Apogee Production, life stuff, life, parenting.

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Speaker 2: We're doing life together and we're just going to tell

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Speaker 2: you all about it. I hate the word perimenopause. I

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Speaker 2: can't We're not in menopause. Like, it's making me angry.

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Speaker 1: What Welcome back to another bonus episode of who even

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Speaker 1: are we? Where we are getting our friends to send

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Speaker 1: us worst notes for the topic.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, a little bit of a take on what's really

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Speaker 2: happening on the real world. The biggest issue that I

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Speaker 2: have at the moment is confidence when dating as a

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Speaker 2: single thirty eight year old with one child. I don't

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Speaker 2: even know where to begin. And online dating sucks. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: See, online dating is one of those things. We've got

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Speaker 1: a lot of friends doing it at the moment.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, we never.

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Speaker 1: Did because the online dating wasn't really a thing.

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Speaker 2: Maybe there was, It was different, different websites that have

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Speaker 2: been over time. I never found a boyfriend online.

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Speaker 1: No, But when I watch people doing it now, like

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Speaker 1: I can understand the difficulty of it. You're meeting people

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Speaker 1: based off what they look like. You know, when someone

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Speaker 1: starts talking and you go, oh, whoa.

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Speaker 2: No. The thing for me that stands out the most

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Speaker 2: is online has this presence of not being real for me,

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Speaker 2: like it doesn't feel real. People have this ability of

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Speaker 2: being able to hide behind things, and you know, there's

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Speaker 2: so many other elements that you'll never sort of meet

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Speaker 2: about them, or the traits or the mannerisms or the

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Speaker 2: red flags just don't pop up until you're actually in person.

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Speaker 1: It's such a gamble.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, but some people invest a lot of time into

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Speaker 2: that online part before then they get to the physical part.

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Speaker 2: And when I mean physical, I'm not talking like just

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Speaker 2: straight up Tinder. I'm talking about like even just getting

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Speaker 2: there in person to go on the date. And if

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Speaker 2: you've invested a lot of time and effort into the

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Speaker 2: online presence and you're like you almost like feel one

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Speaker 2: over and then you meet them in person and then

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Speaker 2: it's just like a big yeah, you'd feel deflated every

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Speaker 2: single time.

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Speaker 1: That's what I mean by it's a gamble. Like it's

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Speaker 1: almost a bit like I'm trying to use another reference.

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Speaker 1: But it's like when you do online shopping and Sheene

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Speaker 1: or the brand you don't necessarily know. I know I

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Speaker 1: can buy something with Chic, I know exactly what I'm

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Speaker 1: going to get. It's like online shopping a brand you

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Speaker 1: don't really know what's it going to actually look like? Oh,

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Speaker 1: the size is going to be like that. You know,

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Speaker 1: when you see it on the model in the picture

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Speaker 1: and you go, that looks amazing.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I really like that. That's great.

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Speaker 1: Then it gets to your house and you go, oh, fuck,

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Speaker 1: that's nothing. The materials not what I thought it was

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Speaker 1: going to be. It doesn't fit like it does on

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Speaker 1: the model. I don't understand how you can see a picture,

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Speaker 1: and I've watched friends spend hours on the wiping left right,

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Speaker 1: whatever you're supposed to do. Once you get to a

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Speaker 1: good looking person. Now I've met good looking people in

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Speaker 1: my life. Rage I'm not necessarily attracted to them because they're.

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Speaker 2: Not because their personality shines through more than the other one.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and even the conversation they have, the way they talk,

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Speaker 1: the way they carry themselves, the confidence, all of that

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Speaker 1: I think is such important parts. I think it would

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Speaker 1: be impossible to just go off someone from their photo.

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Speaker 1: They should do videos, Yeah, don't you reckon? They should

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Speaker 1: do a short.

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Speaker 2: Video if it's some of the guys that I've spoken to.

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Speaker 2: One in particular comes to mind, and he is looking

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Speaker 2: for a partner, like he's actively looking for a partner online,

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Speaker 2: but also like if you meet someone at a bar,

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Speaker 2: you meet someone at a bar kind of thing. It

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Speaker 2: was quite interesting because we were chatting and I said,

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Speaker 2: how's everything going, how's online going? And he says to me,

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Speaker 2: this lady sent him a voice note. Well, it started

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Speaker 2: on text and then it went to voice note because

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Speaker 2: she liked voice note. And I'm thinking, like, obviously she

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Speaker 2: feels more comfortable voice noting and he feels more comfortable texting.

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Speaker 2: And then as soon as she voice noted, he was like,

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Speaker 2: ah no, too much, too needy. All of a sudden,

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Speaker 2: because she had the ability to voice note, it was

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Speaker 2: like she emotionally like dumped everything out about herself. And

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Speaker 2: I mean like it was extreme, Like I did listen

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Speaker 2: to the voice note because I was like, it can't

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Speaker 2: be that bad. Surely you're the one making this worse.

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Speaker 1: Because I think voice noting would be good. So if

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Speaker 1: I was thinking the other way around, like would I

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Speaker 1: want a guy to voice note, yeah, because I feel

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Speaker 1: like you can hear exactly what they're like, like.

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Speaker 2: Straight away was looking if you're really in tune with

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Speaker 2: like sort of what you're looking for and all the rest.

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Speaker 2: But if you've got someone just using that as an example.

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Speaker 2: Someone that voice notes who they are and what they

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Speaker 2: like and what they're about, and then like refers to

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Speaker 2: themselves like in third person about something else, like people

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Speaker 2: call me this and you've overshared, and this guy's gone,

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Speaker 2: oh fuck, I think there's a.

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Speaker 1: Bit of a confidence doing voice notes.

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Speaker 2: I said the same thing. I said, I know that

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Speaker 2: you're not feeling comfortable by it. And then I also

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Speaker 2: said to him, so did you return serve in the

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Speaker 2: sense of a voice note, and he goes, no, I

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Speaker 2: just ghosted it. Now this is another thing that like,

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Speaker 2: you know, our friend at thirty eight with one kid,

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Speaker 2: you're trying to raise a child, you know, maintain some

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Speaker 2: form of a lifestyle, maintain who you are all the

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Speaker 2: rest whilst looking for Prince Charming to come along. And

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Speaker 2: then at this at the same time, you've got these

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Speaker 2: people just willing to just ghost you. Like a ghosting

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Speaker 2: part can happen in a relationship, in an online presence,

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Speaker 2: in anything, anyone can ghost each other. Now I actually

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Speaker 2: hate it, Yeah, Like I think it's so rude.

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Speaker 1: So I go, what would you do in that situation? Like,

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Speaker 1: I think, what would I do?

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Speaker 2: Reply and say you're an uther fuck with for ghosting

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Speaker 2: me and it's your loss.

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Speaker 1: No, but no, if I was the person who was ghosting,

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Speaker 1: I probably would not reply either. I mean, what do

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Speaker 1: you say you were too much?

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Speaker 2: I did say to him, Why don't you just reply

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Speaker 2: and say, oh, okay, we're obviously not aligned.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's just sweak because that's honest.

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Speaker 2: That No, I don't see it's confrontational. I see that.

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Speaker 2: That's honest. That's you, a part of you owning who

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Speaker 2: you are and going I'm not attracted to those things

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Speaker 2: that you've just said what you're about, and so then

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Speaker 2: naturally we're not going to align. So then why therefore

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Speaker 2: would I spend any more time investing in something that

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Speaker 2: I already know we're not going to align. Yeah, you

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Speaker 2: have to be identical, Katie. But it's like that part

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Speaker 2: of you that goes like that whole opposites attract. Yes,

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Speaker 2: I agree with it. I do agree that opposite's attract

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Speaker 2: because what happens is you don't have to have all

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Speaker 2: the exact same traits and behaviors and all the rest,

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Speaker 2: because life would be fucking boring, right, But at the

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Speaker 2: same time, if you don't have some common interests that

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Speaker 2: get you there. Then it's like anyway.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that ghosting thing, like on paper, I go, oh,

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Speaker 1: that's not very nice. But I also really get it

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Speaker 1: because I'm like, oh, silence speaks volumes. I'm not coming

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Speaker 1: back to you for a reason. But yeah, you're saying,

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Speaker 1: that's right.

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Speaker 2: I do. I just got that little element of like

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Speaker 2: not being as human the word I'm looking for. I'm saying,

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Speaker 2: like it says more about you than it does about me.

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Speaker 2: It's a bit mean. I think it's mean even friends

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Speaker 2: friends ghosting other friends, Like all of a sudden, you

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Speaker 2: want to be my friend and then you don't want

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Speaker 2: to be my friend anymore. Yeah, that's being like we

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Speaker 2: teach our kids at school not to do that. If

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Speaker 2: you don't want to be friends with someone, say hey,

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Speaker 2: thanks very much, but you know this isn't really working

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Speaker 2: out for me. Why because it's just not aligning with

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Speaker 2: who I am and my morals and my values. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: I think honestly comes through more now going flicking right

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Speaker 2: back to.

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Speaker 1: It, But how do you say so, Like in that

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Speaker 1: situation with the guy and the girl who voice noting,

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Speaker 1: how do you say you too much? And I think

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Speaker 1: you might be a bit.

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Speaker 2: Weird going back to that one because we did. I

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Speaker 2: feel like we workshopped it by the time we'd finished

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Speaker 2: the conversation about it as like we're having a laugh

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Speaker 2: and all the rest I did say to him with

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Speaker 2: that one, I was like, I think you should go

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Speaker 2: back and just say that all sounds fantastic and you

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Speaker 2: sound like a great bird, but you're just not. Probably

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Speaker 2: I think that a word aligned. And using our friend

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Speaker 2: for example, we're thirty eight, we're nearly forty, we're on

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Speaker 2: another path. Right when we're twenty, we're sort of like

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Speaker 2: happy to fuck around, come and go, can't be bothered

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Speaker 2: whatever we want because we don't really know even what

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Speaker 2: we're aligned for or what we stand for. Right, you

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Speaker 2: have that idea of morals and values, but you're sort

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Speaker 2: of playing with them whilst you're going through your twenties,

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Speaker 2: let's flip to forties, like or late thirties, early forties.

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Speaker 2: You really are becoming that person where you're like, actually,

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Speaker 2: you know what I need to align with my morals

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Speaker 2: and my values, and you're a great person, but this

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Speaker 2: is not aligning for me. You're just putting yourself first.

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Speaker 2: So going back to that online bit, I said to him,

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Speaker 2: I said, you should just go back and say thanks

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Speaker 2: for chatting, but I don't think we're going to align.

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Speaker 2: That's as simple as it can be, but it's not

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Speaker 2: leaving anyone in limbo thinking was it me or was

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Speaker 2: it him? Or was it this or was it that?

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Speaker 2: Like you've just cut the connection energetically, there's no connection

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Speaker 2: there anymore. There was something I watched flying home and

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Speaker 2: it was Asha ketty. Oh it's called fake. It's just

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Speaker 2: like a mini series right goes right into this like

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Speaker 2: inner workings of what it's like to be a woman

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Speaker 2: online dating and getting catfished by a con man basically

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Speaker 2: that wants to just take your cash. It was mind blowing.

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Speaker 2: But like I feel for these women that are and

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Speaker 2: men that are online on a day to day basis,

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Speaker 2: not getting catfished for anything else other than a chat

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Speaker 2: or some nudes or some like sexy text or like,

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Speaker 2: it's such a shame that we've got to that place.

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Speaker 1: Right If you were single, right now, how would you

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Speaker 1: go about online? It's interesting. We've got friends who are single,

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Speaker 1: and I notice when there's no guys around, it's very

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Speaker 1: much like what is it called like peacocking? Or like,

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Speaker 1: because you're there to attract the opposite sex, and when

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Speaker 1: there's no one there, it's almost like there's a slight disinterest,

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Speaker 1: and you know, I could be somewhere else. And I

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Speaker 1: remember that feeling because I had that feeling too, when

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Speaker 1: you know, you'd be out in a nightclub or whatever

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Speaker 1: and you'd be like, there's no one here, Let's move

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Speaker 1: on to the next place.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, which I totally get. And I think at

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Speaker 2: that place, like every relationship when it finishes, is it

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Speaker 2: leaves you at some place of like who am I?

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Speaker 2: What am I looking for? And if you're really clear

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Speaker 2: on what you're looking for, I guess if you believe

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Speaker 2: in it, you will attract to the right person. If

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Speaker 2: you're meant to meet someone, you will meet someone. But

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Speaker 2: you've got to put yourself out there willing to So

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Speaker 2: it's all well and good to say that you're standing

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Speaker 2: there and you're peacocking, but if you're not actually open

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Speaker 2: to actually chatting with anyone, how we ever meet anyone.

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Speaker 2: So for me, like going back to your question personally,

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Speaker 2: what would happen if I became single, I would absolutely

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Speaker 2: not be online. I would probably take some time to

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Speaker 2: actually figure out who the fuck I am and what

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Speaker 2: I want, and then I would probably be more in person.

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Speaker 2: Like in my twenties, I loved the hunt and gather

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Speaker 2: kind of vibe of it. If I saw someone and

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Speaker 2: something connected, I was like, I'm going to go and

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Speaker 2: speak to him, and I had that confidence where I

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Speaker 2: was like, I'm just going to go speak to him,

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Speaker 2: and yeah, the awkward moment when the girlfriend comes back

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Speaker 2: and goes here and you're like haha, sorry when you

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Speaker 2: fucking say something, or like vice versa, like yeah, but

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Speaker 2: I was more about that something or someone or your

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Speaker 2: smell or something caught my eye and that was it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, but that needs to be in person, like you know,

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Speaker 1: that person needs to physically be there. You can't get

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Speaker 1: any of that online.

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Speaker 2: I can't. So many of us are opting to sit

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Speaker 2: at home online hoping that it's going to happen window shopping.

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Speaker 2: A couple of the girls went to one of those

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Speaker 2: speed dating the speed dating and I had a giggle

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Speaker 2: and was like, oh yeah, I wasn't free on that night,

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Speaker 2: but I was like, if I'm free, I'll come not

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Speaker 2: to sit and the speed dating, but I'll support you,

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Speaker 2: like I'll sit at the bar and wait for you

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Speaker 2: to finish speed dating. Yeah, I'll observe and watch like

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Speaker 2: this is great content. I'd be like support network for

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Speaker 2: those friends that you know are going through it and

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Speaker 2: all the rest. But yeah, I think they walked away

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Speaker 2: from that going that is absolutely not for me.

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Speaker 1: But is that because they didn't like the process of

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Speaker 1: the speed dating or is that just because there weren't

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Speaker 1: decent guys that they were interested in there?

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Speaker 2: I think it was both. I think there was an

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Speaker 2: element of like the room was full of people that

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Speaker 2: they were not attracted to at all, and then the

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Speaker 2: other part was the speed dating didn't provide enough time

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Speaker 2: to even scratch the surface.

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Speaker 1: See I would say that that if there were a

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Speaker 1: bunch or even one or two great guys in that room,

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Speaker 1: I think it would have been a different experience because yes,

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Speaker 1: you do the speed dating and it's not enough time,

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Speaker 1: but you can also go, okay, I had a real

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Speaker 1: connection with him, and surely there's time afterwards to mingle

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Speaker 1: or something. Isn't there you'd think.

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Speaker 2: I think there was.

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Speaker 1: I think, yes, then that could happen.

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Speaker 2: Then my question is to you, like, I think if

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Speaker 2: you look into it like a little bit further and

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Speaker 2: a little bit deeper. Do you believe that there is

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Speaker 2: someone else out there for you that you're meant to meet? Like,

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Speaker 2: this is where it will go deeper into that next

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Speaker 2: level of going. Like if I sit here and say

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Speaker 2: there's no one out there for me and I'm not

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Speaker 2: going to meet anyone. If you keep going on that

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Speaker 2: same story with that same negative view on it, will

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Speaker 2: it then put out the right connection path to meeting

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Speaker 2: someone that you're meant to meet or will it just

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Speaker 2: keep you on that negative path? Is it more that

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Speaker 2: you're open and you're willing to meet somebody and you're

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Speaker 2: willing to see what is ahead of you if you

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Speaker 2: were to stay open, you know, like it goes down

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Speaker 2: that next home.

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Speaker 1: I think that's the first time I've actually thought about it,

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Speaker 1: to be honest. But I don't think there's one person

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Speaker 1: for each of us. I think there's a whole bunch

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Speaker 1: of people that you could be compatible with. It's just

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Speaker 1: finding them.

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Speaker 2: But it's also a mindset was while I was coming out, Yeah,

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Speaker 2: like that whole mindset.

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Speaker 1: There's somebody else out there, someone else.

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Speaker 2: Kids.

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Speaker 1: I completely understand how kids would complicate things. Can't imagine

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Speaker 1: being with somebody that doesn't love my kids like I

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Speaker 1: love them. Yeah, you know, no one's gonna love your

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Speaker 1: kids the same amount as you love them as their mum.

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Speaker 2: There's that.

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Speaker 1: I understand that. I understand the juggling kids, the one

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Speaker 1: week on, one week off, like the different things that

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Speaker 1: people face. I've got a friend who's got four kids

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Speaker 1: and has met a guy who's got no kids, and

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Speaker 1: it's quite happy to have no kids, and they have

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Speaker 1: a great relationship. From the outside, you'd go, Fuck, that's

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Speaker 1: never gonna work.

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Speaker 2: She's got four kids.

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Speaker 1: How does that work? You know, he's fine with it.

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Speaker 1: She has her own time with the kids, he has

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Speaker 1: his own time without any of them, and then they

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Speaker 1: enjoy time together.

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Speaker 2: So you think it's called a blended family. Now, I

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Speaker 2: think you just sort of make it work for what

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Speaker 2: your situation is.

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Speaker 1: It's a lot more normal than it was. Yeah, although

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Speaker 1: the four kids and then meeting someone who doesn't have

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Speaker 1: kids just an interesting one, isn't it.

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Speaker 2: So Okay?

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Speaker 1: Say you got divorced and you met someone and they

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Speaker 1: had no kids, that would be a difficult conversation around.

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Speaker 1: Imagine if they wanted kids.

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Speaker 2: This happened. Oh no, no, no, where they want kids.

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Speaker 2: That is where you'd have to go. I can't believe

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Speaker 2: we've met each other and you're amazing and I'm amazing,

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Speaker 2: but that does not align. No, you need to go

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Speaker 2: and reproduce with someone else.

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Speaker 1: Have to quickly book in for a hystory.

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Speaker 2: I know. I would just be like, it's absolutely not

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Speaker 2: on my to do list, like we've laughed about it,

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Speaker 2: like you know so many times. But if Sam and

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Speaker 2: I split tomorrow, he would absolutely have more kids. If

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Speaker 2: he met someone else and then they were like, I

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Speaker 2: don't have any kids in your hundred percent, he would

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Speaker 2: me absolutely not. No, I don't want any more kids.

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Speaker 2: Have two. That is enough, very blessed with two healthy

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Speaker 2: babies that are not really babies anymore, they're teens.

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Speaker 1: I do think people find themselves in situations though where

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Speaker 1: they thought they knew what they wanted to do, And

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Speaker 1: when the time comes and you've got someone you.

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Speaker 2: Are madly in love with madly.

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Speaker 1: And they want to have their own baby, Yeah, I

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Speaker 1: can imagine.

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Speaker 2: Or wouldn't it be.

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Speaker 1: Nice for us to have a baby together?

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Speaker 2: Yeah? Circumstantial. My shop has shut efficiently.

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Speaker 1: I'm just staying singleh.

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Speaker 2: I was like, I, yeah, I couldn't anyway. It's not

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Speaker 2: about us, it's about our friend.

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Speaker 1: I don't know if we were any help. Were we

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Speaker 1: I have got no tips at all. Dating with a child,

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Speaker 1: I think, get offline. Yeah, get off line, you get out.

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Speaker 1: You need to meet the actual person. You need to

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Speaker 1: too much of a waste of time. Think of the

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Speaker 1: waste of time, the amount of people you swipe left right,

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Speaker 1: whatever it is too because they're good looking. Then you

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Speaker 1: meet them and they can't fucking talk or you know.

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Speaker 2: I remember, like there was two footballers and I idolized

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Speaker 2: their bodies and what they looked like, and they were

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Speaker 2: so pretty and I thought, oh my gosh, wow, and

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Speaker 2: then they opened their mouth and I was like, oh wow,

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Speaker 2: what is wrong with you? And you go, oh, that

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Speaker 2: just ruined all of that, all of it.

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Speaker 1: That's what I mean. You could be the best looking guy.

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Speaker 2: Yeah on that photo.

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Speaker 1: We need videos, and if you haven't seen someone in

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Speaker 1: the video, don't even bother with it.

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Speaker 2: Honestly, and guys, upgrade your photos. I'm saying, no more

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Speaker 2: selfies in the bathroom with a towel on, Like, honestly,

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Speaker 2: it's so so generic.

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Speaker 1: That's just a sex Surely, surely, that's a photo just

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Speaker 1: for sex. Look, I've got a towel on.

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Speaker 2: You can be underneath this towel.

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Speaker 1: I'm want to whip the towel off.

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Speaker 2: No,