1
00:00:00,200 --> 00:00:02,880
Speaker 1: I'm my Boris and this is straight talk. Well, it's

2
00:00:02,880 --> 00:00:07,200
Speaker 1: my great pleasure to have the one only Harry Triggerbof.

3
00:00:08,119 --> 00:00:10,720
Speaker 1: Happy to be here, Thanks very much for coming in, Harry.

4
00:00:10,920 --> 00:00:14,319
Speaker 2: So my father, the Chinese merchants got mad at him

5
00:00:14,840 --> 00:00:17,840
Speaker 2: that he made so well and they didn't and they

6
00:00:18,680 --> 00:00:23,800
Speaker 2: made false declarations and they put him in jail, and

7
00:00:23,960 --> 00:00:26,920
Speaker 2: so he got a visa to come here. And that's

8
00:00:26,920 --> 00:00:31,200
Speaker 2: how I started here. I could only succeed because I

9
00:00:31,280 --> 00:00:34,880
Speaker 2: worked very hard, and the people that I had worked

10
00:00:35,000 --> 00:00:40,120
Speaker 2: very hard. I was lucky that I found all those people.

11
00:00:40,960 --> 00:00:44,360
Speaker 1: You're still working. I'm still working at ninety one years

12
00:00:44,400 --> 00:00:47,640
Speaker 1: of age. What is it that drives Harry Triggerboff to

13
00:00:47,760 --> 00:00:51,120
Speaker 1: keep doing this even though he's a multi billionaire? Why

14
00:00:51,200 --> 00:00:52,120
Speaker 1: do you keep doing it?

15
00:00:52,600 --> 00:00:56,640
Speaker 2: I looked upon the business as a family, So how

16
00:00:56,680 --> 00:00:57,840
Speaker 2: can you leave your family?

17
00:00:58,600 --> 00:01:02,160
Speaker 1: How can we solve housing crisis in Australia? And if

18
00:01:02,200 --> 00:01:05,800
Speaker 1: you wouldn't mind reflecting for a moment on immigration, what

19
00:01:05,840 --> 00:01:10,360
Speaker 1: would you say about those two issues. Well, it's my

20
00:01:10,400 --> 00:01:14,480
Speaker 1: great pleasure to have the one and only Harry Triggerboff.

21
00:01:15,240 --> 00:01:16,720
Speaker 2: Oh, happy to be here.

22
00:01:17,000 --> 00:01:20,560
Speaker 1: Thanks very much for coming in, Harry. Harry, I'm amazed

23
00:01:20,600 --> 00:01:23,000
Speaker 1: I saw you walk up the stairs to come in here.

24
00:01:25,600 --> 00:01:29,559
Speaker 1: Your your the way you walk, the strength that you

25
00:01:29,560 --> 00:01:31,880
Speaker 1: put up, you put your one foot half the other

26
00:01:32,000 --> 00:01:33,960
Speaker 1: very well, most people at your age. And you know

27
00:01:34,000 --> 00:01:35,600
Speaker 1: you're ninety one this year.

28
00:01:35,880 --> 00:01:38,319
Speaker 2: I think it was ninety one this year.

29
00:01:38,520 --> 00:01:42,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's amazing. How do you say? So fit? What

30
00:01:42,440 --> 00:01:42,959
Speaker 1: is the deal?

31
00:01:43,720 --> 00:01:51,000
Speaker 2: Two reasons to right? A very good doctors. That helps, right,

32
00:01:51,080 --> 00:01:56,880
Speaker 2: very good doctors. And the second is I have four

33
00:01:56,920 --> 00:02:03,160
Speaker 2: people with whom I do exercise professionals, right, because otherwise

34
00:02:03,200 --> 00:02:09,440
Speaker 2: I wouldn't do anything. It's very interesting. So about fifteen ten,

35
00:02:09,560 --> 00:02:13,200
Speaker 2: fifteen years ago, my daughters thought I should get a

36
00:02:13,360 --> 00:02:18,160
Speaker 2: lift in the house. But these professionals, they like the

37
00:02:18,200 --> 00:02:21,600
Speaker 2: steps and I go up and down three times, well

38
00:02:22,000 --> 00:02:27,840
Speaker 2: two three. So I do quite a lot of exercise

39
00:02:27,919 --> 00:02:29,360
Speaker 2: with them. That's all I do.

40
00:02:29,680 --> 00:02:31,720
Speaker 1: So do they get you? Well, that's can I just

41
00:02:31,760 --> 00:02:33,480
Speaker 1: talk about it for a second, because I'm actually quite

42
00:02:33,480 --> 00:02:35,680
Speaker 1: curious about that. Do they do you get you? Ever?

43
00:02:35,800 --> 00:02:37,640
Speaker 1: To hold the light weights and do any weight?

44
00:02:38,040 --> 00:02:41,280
Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah? Yeah, so you do some yeah.

45
00:02:40,760 --> 00:02:44,680
Speaker 1: Some, you know a little bit of exercise with weights.

46
00:02:45,120 --> 00:02:46,560
Speaker 1: I know you. I don't know if you still do it,

47
00:02:46,560 --> 00:02:48,280
Speaker 1: but I know used to walk down on the promenade

48
00:02:48,280 --> 00:02:50,480
Speaker 1: a BONDI a lot. Yeah, do you still do that?

49
00:02:51,720 --> 00:02:57,639
Speaker 1: We walk now in Double Bay, very's very flat, nice

50
00:02:57,639 --> 00:02:58,000
Speaker 1: and flat.

51
00:02:58,280 --> 00:03:03,240
Speaker 2: Yeah. So so we go from Intigo right round and

52
00:03:03,320 --> 00:03:03,800
Speaker 2: come back.

53
00:03:04,000 --> 00:03:06,440
Speaker 1: Have you been doing this content? Have you been doing

54
00:03:06,440 --> 00:03:08,639
Speaker 1: this all your life? Exercise?

55
00:03:09,680 --> 00:03:10,840
Speaker 2: This sort of exercise?

56
00:03:10,919 --> 00:03:11,919
Speaker 1: Yeah, all your life?

57
00:03:12,120 --> 00:03:12,600
Speaker 2: Yeah?

58
00:03:12,639 --> 00:03:16,079
Speaker 1: And what about food? Are you careful food?

59
00:03:16,440 --> 00:03:21,880
Speaker 2: I don't eat much because I think that's better not

60
00:03:21,880 --> 00:03:30,200
Speaker 2: to eat too much. So I it's very simple foods,

61
00:03:30,360 --> 00:03:36,520
Speaker 2: very simple food. And I'm okay. Like you know, I

62
00:03:36,560 --> 00:03:38,200
Speaker 2: don't have any pains or anything.

63
00:03:38,560 --> 00:03:41,480
Speaker 1: Wow, you don't have pain when you wake up? For example?

64
00:03:41,520 --> 00:03:42,320
Speaker 2: I have no pains.

65
00:03:43,760 --> 00:03:47,080
Speaker 1: There's something wrong with me that I'm much younger than you,

66
00:03:47,520 --> 00:03:50,160
Speaker 1: and I get pain when I wake up. So a

67
00:03:50,160 --> 00:03:52,400
Speaker 1: better how to start thinking about simplifying my meals? Do

68
00:03:52,400 --> 00:03:53,680
Speaker 1: you mean when you say you don't eat much, you

69
00:03:53,720 --> 00:03:54,960
Speaker 1: mean you eat three meals a day?

70
00:03:55,040 --> 00:04:01,760
Speaker 2: Or if I ate three meals a day, I eat breakfast,

71
00:04:02,200 --> 00:04:07,800
Speaker 2: a bigger lunch, and very small dinner, hardly anything. And

72
00:04:07,960 --> 00:04:12,280
Speaker 2: I never had much dinner anyway in life. In my life.

73
00:04:12,320 --> 00:04:18,080
Speaker 2: I never My wife never cooked dinner once. Wow, that's

74
00:04:18,360 --> 00:04:20,400
Speaker 2: her second wife they didn't.

75
00:04:20,160 --> 00:04:22,480
Speaker 1: Cook and and uh, and I should say that I'm

76
00:04:23,320 --> 00:04:25,880
Speaker 1: I'm sad to say here that your wife passed not

77
00:04:25,960 --> 00:04:28,840
Speaker 1: too long ago. And thank you for coming in on.

78
00:04:28,880 --> 00:04:33,520
Speaker 2: A big shock. Yeah, she had you see, she had dementia,

79
00:04:34,120 --> 00:04:37,839
Speaker 2: but she was very strong and she added a few years.

80
00:04:38,400 --> 00:04:41,880
Speaker 2: But she was quite good, you know, she forgot a

81
00:04:41,920 --> 00:04:45,240
Speaker 2: bit but that you could take her out and she

82
00:04:45,320 --> 00:04:48,880
Speaker 2: could listen to people and talk of it. But then

83
00:04:48,920 --> 00:04:53,679
Speaker 2: she got this cancer. And that cancer is terrible cancer.

84
00:04:54,640 --> 00:04:59,840
Speaker 2: It starts growing very slowly, but then it goes very fast.

85
00:05:00,360 --> 00:05:03,520
Speaker 2: And that's what happened to her, and she had no chance.

86
00:05:04,200 --> 00:05:07,640
Speaker 2: So really she had dementia, but she never suffered much

87
00:05:07,680 --> 00:05:11,839
Speaker 2: from that and was very quick after we found the cancer.

88
00:05:11,880 --> 00:05:13,799
Speaker 2: Within two months she was gone.

89
00:05:13,800 --> 00:05:15,440
Speaker 1: Well what's it like to live with somebody with them?

90
00:05:15,600 --> 00:05:22,040
Speaker 2: And she was singing Elvis Presley two days before she died. Really,

91
00:05:23,200 --> 00:05:25,640
Speaker 2: she liked Elvis Presley. She sang his songs.

92
00:05:25,880 --> 00:05:28,440
Speaker 1: I don't blame her like elvisterman, he's one of my favorites.

93
00:05:28,640 --> 00:05:30,800
Speaker 1: But what's it like, Harry, live with somebody with dementia?

94
00:05:30,920 --> 00:05:34,799
Speaker 1: And how do you what are the what are the issues?

95
00:05:34,839 --> 00:05:38,080
Speaker 1: I mean, do you feel sad that she doesn't remember something.

96
00:05:39,480 --> 00:05:45,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, she was very upset when she found out. And

97
00:05:45,760 --> 00:05:51,039
Speaker 2: then after a few years they told her not to

98
00:05:51,120 --> 00:05:56,800
Speaker 2: drive anymore. She was a very good driver, but she

99
00:05:56,960 --> 00:06:01,320
Speaker 2: was very cautious then and they told, now, you drive

100
00:06:01,760 --> 00:06:06,120
Speaker 2: too slowly, so they stopped her. Anyway, she lost That's

101
00:06:06,120 --> 00:06:07,400
Speaker 2: one thing she missed very much.

102
00:06:07,480 --> 00:06:11,200
Speaker 1: She lost her independence. Yeah, so clearly you've got you've

103
00:06:11,200 --> 00:06:13,560
Speaker 1: got an accent of small accent, still an accent though,

104
00:06:14,839 --> 00:06:16,600
Speaker 1: where's that accent come from? Where were you born?

105
00:06:16,920 --> 00:06:22,280
Speaker 2: Where was that born? I was born in a place

106
00:06:22,360 --> 00:06:29,280
Speaker 2: called Darien, now before I was Dyrn, but but they

107
00:06:29,320 --> 00:06:31,039
Speaker 2: took me away when I was one year old, so

108
00:06:31,080 --> 00:06:32,240
Speaker 2: I don't remember it all.

109
00:06:32,400 --> 00:06:34,159
Speaker 1: Where is that? Which country is that in?

110
00:06:35,400 --> 00:06:43,760
Speaker 2: That's China and support all these afterwards I lived in

111
00:06:43,800 --> 00:06:49,800
Speaker 2: Tanjin and but all these places are very much connected

112
00:06:49,839 --> 00:06:55,480
Speaker 2: with Australia because that's where they import the iron ore.

113
00:06:56,400 --> 00:06:58,560
Speaker 1: The Russia in port or from Australia there.

114
00:06:59,720 --> 00:07:03,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, from Australia they get And when I was there,

115
00:07:04,560 --> 00:07:07,520
Speaker 2: I don't know, it was not that important. But because

116
00:07:07,560 --> 00:07:11,520
Speaker 2: they didn't have industry, what was important then is that

117
00:07:11,560 --> 00:07:16,920
Speaker 2: they used to import wheat from Australia, and I used

118
00:07:16,960 --> 00:07:20,840
Speaker 2: to go to the port and watch them take bags

119
00:07:20,880 --> 00:07:25,840
Speaker 2: of wheat on the shoulder onto a horse with a cart.

120
00:07:26,960 --> 00:07:32,120
Speaker 2: And that's I used to enjoy watching. One of the

121
00:07:32,160 --> 00:07:32,920
Speaker 2: things I liked.

122
00:07:33,400 --> 00:07:36,160
Speaker 1: Now, you're not Chinese. No, you're born in China, but

123
00:07:36,200 --> 00:07:36,880
Speaker 1: you're not Chinese.

124
00:07:36,960 --> 00:07:37,640
Speaker 2: I'm definitely not.

125
00:07:37,960 --> 00:07:39,440
Speaker 1: Where were your parents from then?

126
00:07:39,920 --> 00:07:40,320
Speaker 2: Russia?

127
00:07:40,560 --> 00:07:42,960
Speaker 1: Russia? How did they end up in China?

128
00:07:45,680 --> 00:07:52,920
Speaker 2: So there was the First World War and my father

129
00:07:53,040 --> 00:07:58,760
Speaker 2: didn't feel like going to fight in the Russian army,

130
00:07:58,920 --> 00:08:04,320
Speaker 2: so he put in his hair. Then they wouldn't take

131
00:08:04,400 --> 00:08:10,160
Speaker 2: him because he would spread it in the barracks. Now,

132
00:08:10,400 --> 00:08:18,080
Speaker 2: his two uncles they fought in the Russo Japanese War

133
00:08:18,600 --> 00:08:25,760
Speaker 2: nineteen oh five, and they brought him to China. On

134
00:08:25,800 --> 00:08:29,560
Speaker 2: the way, he met my mother in Siberia and he

135
00:08:29,600 --> 00:08:33,680
Speaker 2: married her. He was originally he was from Ukraine, but

136
00:08:33,960 --> 00:08:36,640
Speaker 2: that time they called it Russia. If you asked him

137
00:08:36,640 --> 00:08:38,719
Speaker 2: where you were born, he would say Russia. He wouldn't know.

138
00:08:39,400 --> 00:08:42,280
Speaker 2: He didn't know a word of Ukrainian, none of us.

139
00:08:42,320 --> 00:08:46,360
Speaker 2: I don't know a word of Ukraine. But met my

140
00:08:47,240 --> 00:08:52,760
Speaker 2: mother and he brought her to China. Right now, his

141
00:08:52,800 --> 00:08:58,439
Speaker 2: story is very, very interesting. He didn't know a word

142
00:08:58,440 --> 00:09:02,160
Speaker 2: of Chinese or a word of English. He knew Russian,

143
00:09:03,400 --> 00:09:08,959
Speaker 2: and you know this is the old Jewish, right. But

144
00:09:09,720 --> 00:09:13,320
Speaker 2: he had to make a living. So he ran all

145
00:09:13,360 --> 00:09:19,600
Speaker 2: over China looking where he should settle, and he decided Tangin.

146
00:09:20,480 --> 00:09:26,800
Speaker 2: Came to Tangent. Yeah, he had the little shop. He

147
00:09:26,920 --> 00:09:31,560
Speaker 2: managed to pay rent, but not much more. And then

148
00:09:31,800 --> 00:09:34,400
Speaker 2: the war broke out with the Japs.

149
00:09:34,559 --> 00:09:40,840
Speaker 1: The sign of Japanese War the China the second Second

150
00:09:40,840 --> 00:09:41,600
Speaker 1: World War, right.

151
00:09:41,520 --> 00:09:45,640
Speaker 2: Second World War. Yeah, the Chinese fought them right now.

152
00:09:48,760 --> 00:09:57,000
Speaker 2: So the Japanese took all the British who controlled commerce,

153
00:09:58,160 --> 00:10:03,840
Speaker 2: put them all into camps, and there was nobody left

154
00:10:04,160 --> 00:10:09,480
Speaker 2: to deal with the Japanese. So my father and I

155
00:10:09,520 --> 00:10:13,560
Speaker 2: remember this already because now we're talking nineteen forty one

156
00:10:14,320 --> 00:10:16,800
Speaker 2: forty two, so I was already eight nine years old.

157
00:10:17,559 --> 00:10:23,080
Speaker 2: I remember how he got all the little Jewish bankers.

158
00:10:23,960 --> 00:10:27,400
Speaker 2: I mean, you know, you wouldn't think of them as bankers,

159
00:10:27,400 --> 00:10:31,080
Speaker 2: but they were little bankers, and he collected many from them,

160
00:10:31,160 --> 00:10:34,520
Speaker 2: and he went to the Jets and he told the Japanese,

161
00:10:35,280 --> 00:10:39,520
Speaker 2: now you brought the goods here to China, because China

162
00:10:39,559 --> 00:10:46,880
Speaker 2: had no manufacturing and now the purchasers you put them

163
00:10:47,880 --> 00:10:52,120
Speaker 2: into camps, so you can't sell. Now, I will buy

164
00:10:52,120 --> 00:10:56,400
Speaker 2: it from you. So they laughed at him. He said, old, laugh,

165
00:10:57,840 --> 00:11:01,720
Speaker 2: give me ten percent of what you brought, and I

166
00:11:01,800 --> 00:11:05,000
Speaker 2: will borrow it from my people and pay you money cash.

167
00:11:05,840 --> 00:11:13,079
Speaker 2: He did that, and after that he made millions because

168
00:11:14,559 --> 00:11:17,480
Speaker 2: he was the only buyer they had, and they were

169
00:11:17,520 --> 00:11:20,199
Speaker 2: sending the goods to him, and he was selling and

170
00:11:20,320 --> 00:11:26,320
Speaker 2: he did everything, all kinds of things, bought this, all that, everything,

171
00:11:26,679 --> 00:11:33,960
Speaker 2: built that everything. After the war, the Americans had nothing

172
00:11:34,040 --> 00:11:37,360
Speaker 2: from China. So he came to them and he said, look,

173
00:11:38,360 --> 00:11:41,280
Speaker 2: because you collected lots of things that he used to

174
00:11:41,559 --> 00:11:44,440
Speaker 2: go to Macy's, you know, the big Macy's, big store,

175
00:11:44,720 --> 00:11:47,160
Speaker 2: and told them, look, I'll sell you the goods nobody

176
00:11:47,160 --> 00:11:50,360
Speaker 2: else has. So the first shipment was probably worth ten

177
00:11:50,440 --> 00:11:54,119
Speaker 2: times more than the next one. And so he continued.

178
00:11:54,160 --> 00:12:00,680
Speaker 2: So everything was going very well. But the Chinese, his merchants,

179
00:12:00,679 --> 00:12:03,280
Speaker 2: got mad at him that he made so well and

180
00:12:03,360 --> 00:12:10,280
Speaker 2: they didn't, and they made false declarations and they put

181
00:12:10,360 --> 00:12:13,080
Speaker 2: him in jail. He was in jail for one year.

182
00:12:13,679 --> 00:12:17,520
Speaker 2: That was very, very unfortunate because that was the year

183
00:12:17,600 --> 00:12:21,600
Speaker 2: when he could have sold things, and he was unfortunately

184
00:12:21,640 --> 00:12:24,640
Speaker 2: in jail. I was a child and my brother was

185
00:12:24,679 --> 00:12:29,640
Speaker 2: a bigger but still child, and so he got a

186
00:12:29,720 --> 00:12:34,840
Speaker 2: visa to come here. I was on the visa together

187
00:12:34,920 --> 00:12:41,080
Speaker 2: with the parents. So I come to Darwin. I still

188
00:12:41,120 --> 00:12:48,199
Speaker 2: remember the face of the young Australian official death and

189
00:12:48,320 --> 00:12:52,560
Speaker 2: he looked at me. He never saw that visa for

190
00:12:52,640 --> 00:12:56,640
Speaker 2: three and only one here and as a child. So anyway,

191
00:12:56,840 --> 00:13:01,040
Speaker 2: he looked at me, look and led me through up

192
00:13:01,120 --> 00:13:06,840
Speaker 2: to him right now. So we came here. My brother

193
00:13:07,000 --> 00:13:08,880
Speaker 2: was with me. He was bigger, he was twenty, he

194
00:13:08,960 --> 00:13:12,360
Speaker 2: was twenty one. I was fourteen. And that's how I

195
00:13:12,400 --> 00:13:15,440
Speaker 2: started here. I went to school in Down in Down,

196
00:13:15,600 --> 00:13:18,960
Speaker 2: sorry in Down No no, no, no oh.

197
00:13:18,960 --> 00:13:21,079
Speaker 1: I went to Sydney, and you came to Sydney from Dowell.

198
00:13:21,120 --> 00:13:24,640
Speaker 2: I came to Sydney, came to Sydney my brother and

199
00:13:24,679 --> 00:13:28,360
Speaker 2: I asked where is their hotel? So they show us

200
00:13:28,360 --> 00:13:32,520
Speaker 2: a pub. They say, you see pub on top, that's hotel.

201
00:13:34,400 --> 00:13:36,200
Speaker 1: Where can you and where did you stay when you

202
00:13:36,200 --> 00:13:39,120
Speaker 1: were in Sydney? Where where did you live when you

203
00:13:39,160 --> 00:13:39,840
Speaker 1: first stayed?

204
00:13:39,960 --> 00:13:43,920
Speaker 2: I stayed with the Jewish butcher. So I had very

205
00:13:43,920 --> 00:13:48,880
Speaker 2: good food, excellent food, and I stayed for three years

206
00:13:48,880 --> 00:13:49,280
Speaker 2: here years.

207
00:13:50,360 --> 00:13:51,959
Speaker 1: I reckon. I ask a question like I'd like to

208
00:13:51,960 --> 00:13:57,240
Speaker 1: ask this question living China and the life you had

209
00:13:57,240 --> 00:14:03,880
Speaker 1: in China. What was the most obvious difference from there,

210
00:14:04,559 --> 00:14:08,640
Speaker 1: that life and then living in Sydney when you got here,

211
00:14:08,679 --> 00:14:10,880
Speaker 1: what did you notice? That is the big differences?

212
00:14:11,400 --> 00:14:15,760
Speaker 2: So sins In didn't have a beach like we have

213
00:14:16,040 --> 00:14:25,040
Speaker 2: Bonda Beach. So I looked at all those brown bodies there.

214
00:14:25,920 --> 00:14:28,960
Speaker 2: They're not Chinese, no Chinese at all. At that time

215
00:14:28,960 --> 00:14:32,840
Speaker 2: there were no Chinese. I looked at them very different.

216
00:14:33,080 --> 00:14:41,320
Speaker 2: Right now. When I went to school here, they told

217
00:14:41,360 --> 00:14:45,520
Speaker 2: me if I could play football, and I looked at

218
00:14:45,560 --> 00:14:47,760
Speaker 2: the big fellows and I was small. I mean now

219
00:14:47,760 --> 00:14:51,520
Speaker 2: I'm smaller still because I'm growing down, but I was

220
00:14:51,960 --> 00:14:55,560
Speaker 2: still small. I said, no, I can't do it. So

221
00:14:55,600 --> 00:15:00,600
Speaker 2: they wouldn't wouldn't accept me. But father gave money to

222
00:15:00,680 --> 00:15:03,240
Speaker 2: my brother, so we had some money. He went to

223
00:15:05,200 --> 00:15:08,880
Speaker 2: back on New South Wales, then West and he said, look,

224
00:15:10,360 --> 00:15:13,920
Speaker 2: help my brother to get into Scott's and they took

225
00:15:13,920 --> 00:15:14,560
Speaker 2: me after.

226
00:15:14,360 --> 00:15:16,600
Speaker 1: That Scott's College in bevy Hill.

227
00:15:17,080 --> 00:15:20,720
Speaker 2: Wow, that's what I went. I told them, Look, I

228
00:15:20,760 --> 00:15:24,240
Speaker 2: can write nice history yes, there's not. We were football.

229
00:15:24,320 --> 00:15:27,840
Speaker 2: We want but after they heard of money, I was

230
00:15:27,880 --> 00:15:31,640
Speaker 2: accepted money. He said, maybe you want to be border

231
00:15:32,000 --> 00:15:34,560
Speaker 2: I said no, no, no. They didn't like dripping.

232
00:15:34,960 --> 00:15:37,840
Speaker 1: No, you should explain dripping. A lot of people don't

233
00:15:37,840 --> 00:15:40,720
Speaker 1: know what dripping is, so you should explain what dripping

234
00:15:40,760 --> 00:15:42,080
Speaker 1: is because a lot of people don't even know what

235
00:15:42,240 --> 00:15:43,600
Speaker 1: dripping is. Dripping.

236
00:15:43,640 --> 00:15:44,680
Speaker 2: They don't know what dripping is.

237
00:15:44,720 --> 00:15:46,600
Speaker 1: A lot of people don't know what. I'm looking at

238
00:15:46,600 --> 00:15:49,000
Speaker 1: the young producer, he does not know what dripping is.

239
00:15:49,200 --> 00:15:50,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, I know, I know.

240
00:15:51,120 --> 00:15:52,520
Speaker 1: Explain explain what dripping is.

241
00:15:53,800 --> 00:15:55,400
Speaker 2: I just know it smelled badly.

242
00:15:55,640 --> 00:16:00,480
Speaker 1: It's bad because everything got cooked in dripping. Dripping were

243
00:16:00,480 --> 00:16:05,400
Speaker 1: the drippings off the fat that came off lamb or

244
00:16:05,600 --> 00:16:09,320
Speaker 1: cows and instead of butter. We used to do cooking

245
00:16:09,320 --> 00:16:11,240
Speaker 1: and dripping, and sometimes if you didn't have a lot

246
00:16:11,240 --> 00:16:13,720
Speaker 1: of money in your family, you put the bread into

247
00:16:13,760 --> 00:16:17,040
Speaker 1: the dripping some salt to fool you up. So it's

248
00:16:17,080 --> 00:16:19,640
Speaker 1: just fat and bread and salt, and that's what we

249
00:16:19,720 --> 00:16:22,840
Speaker 1: went through for a long period of time. I remember, well,

250
00:16:23,080 --> 00:16:25,120
Speaker 1: we had it in our house and I hated it

251
00:16:25,120 --> 00:16:27,440
Speaker 1: because I all, like you did, the smell was so

252
00:16:27,480 --> 00:16:32,640
Speaker 1: strong in boarding schools. They would have been doing it

253
00:16:32,680 --> 00:16:36,560
Speaker 1: for shore for sure, especially in those days. Did all

254
00:16:36,600 --> 00:16:39,320
Speaker 1: of a sudden did you realize you mentioned that when

255
00:16:39,360 --> 00:16:42,320
Speaker 1: you applied to go to Scott's and they thought about

256
00:16:42,400 --> 00:16:45,360
Speaker 1: you playing football, which in the Scott's colleges rugby union.

257
00:16:45,760 --> 00:16:48,320
Speaker 1: But when they realized that you didn't want to play football,

258
00:16:48,280 --> 00:16:50,960
Speaker 1: but they noticed that you had access to money, or

259
00:16:50,960 --> 00:16:53,680
Speaker 1: at least your father had some money. Did that teach

260
00:16:53,720 --> 00:16:56,920
Speaker 1: you a lesson about money? Did it tell you something

261
00:16:56,920 --> 00:16:59,680
Speaker 1: about money? How place like Sydney operates?

262
00:17:00,480 --> 00:17:05,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, so I was lucky that father had some

263
00:17:05,960 --> 00:17:10,800
Speaker 2: money and gave it to them but paid my fees. Anyway.

264
00:17:10,840 --> 00:17:14,040
Speaker 2: It was very good and the butcher was very good,

265
00:17:14,520 --> 00:17:17,040
Speaker 2: so I was very I was very I was very

266
00:17:17,040 --> 00:17:20,960
Speaker 2: happy here. Now many people said when they came here

267
00:17:21,920 --> 00:17:26,760
Speaker 2: they were not happy with the with the boys. Well,

268
00:17:26,800 --> 00:17:31,600
Speaker 2: I was very happy because I found boys who were

269
00:17:31,640 --> 00:17:35,320
Speaker 2: similar to me, and we were very big friends, you see.

270
00:17:36,119 --> 00:17:40,160
Speaker 2: But unfortunately the others come here, they don't know how

271
00:17:40,200 --> 00:17:42,240
Speaker 2: to mix with the right people. You have to mix

272
00:17:42,280 --> 00:17:44,160
Speaker 2: with the ones who want to be your friends. It's

273
00:17:44,240 --> 00:17:44,560
Speaker 2: very good.

274
00:17:44,720 --> 00:17:47,680
Speaker 1: Did you learn English? Could you speak English before?

275
00:17:48,000 --> 00:17:52,680
Speaker 2: Like now? We studied in English also Russian, I know

276
00:17:53,080 --> 00:17:58,520
Speaker 2: very well, because towards the end there were very few

277
00:17:58,520 --> 00:18:05,040
Speaker 2: people's people left in tins Inn or went whatever they could,

278
00:18:06,200 --> 00:18:10,120
Speaker 2: So I studied Russian well as well. So the ones

279
00:18:10,119 --> 00:18:12,720
Speaker 2: who came from tins Inn where I come from, we

280
00:18:12,800 --> 00:18:14,600
Speaker 2: know Russian and English.

281
00:18:14,920 --> 00:18:20,520
Speaker 1: Perfect A recon because I remember he was an old

282
00:18:20,520 --> 00:18:23,800
Speaker 1: client of mine many Medieasia. But Renee Riken, Yeah, he

283
00:18:23,920 --> 00:18:26,560
Speaker 1: was also born in China, in Harbin. I think it

284
00:18:26,600 --> 00:18:30,280
Speaker 1: was Harbin. Why we grew up in Shanghai, Shanghai. Why

285
00:18:30,320 --> 00:18:33,240
Speaker 1: did a lot of Russians end up in China? What

286
00:18:33,560 --> 00:18:36,040
Speaker 1: were they running away from? I know the story in

287
00:18:36,080 --> 00:18:37,560
Speaker 1: your case it was your dad didn't want to be

288
00:18:37,840 --> 00:18:41,000
Speaker 1: go to the war. But was it everybody the same same?

289
00:18:41,080 --> 00:18:44,719
Speaker 2: Reson? No, No, there was civil war in Russia for

290
00:18:44,800 --> 00:18:48,440
Speaker 2: many years between the Tsarists and the Communists.

291
00:18:48,520 --> 00:18:48,680
Speaker 1: Yeah.

292
00:18:48,720 --> 00:18:52,959
Speaker 2: Yeah, these books people were caught in the middle and

293
00:18:53,119 --> 00:18:56,840
Speaker 2: in China they lived like kings over there, and it

294
00:18:56,960 --> 00:19:00,320
Speaker 2: was very funny because they had no money, was so

295
00:19:00,640 --> 00:19:05,199
Speaker 2: dir cheap. They all lived very well. Rifkin and all

296
00:19:05,240 --> 00:19:05,720
Speaker 2: these people.

297
00:19:05,800 --> 00:19:08,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's just funny because a lot of people won't

298
00:19:08,680 --> 00:19:12,119
Speaker 1: know this or won't remember this. But if you're given

299
00:19:12,320 --> 00:19:15,240
Speaker 1: where your dad was, if we go back to early

300
00:19:16,480 --> 00:19:19,960
Speaker 1: twentieth century, like nineteen whatever, it is, fifteen to sixteen.

301
00:19:20,040 --> 00:19:23,439
Speaker 1: So there was in Russia was the Bolshevik Revolution ineteen nineteen,

302
00:19:23,800 --> 00:19:26,800
Speaker 1: that's why they old run away everybody's and the first

303
00:19:26,920 --> 00:19:30,639
Speaker 1: Menshevik revolution, then the Bolshevik Revolution where they got the

304
00:19:30,680 --> 00:19:33,760
Speaker 1: czar and the family. These are the days of russ

305
00:19:33,760 --> 00:19:35,600
Speaker 1: Booten and all those sort of great stories.

306
00:19:36,320 --> 00:19:39,920
Speaker 2: So what you're saying is they need the visa, no problems,

307
00:19:39,960 --> 00:19:43,680
Speaker 2: like really, no visa. My father sat in the boat

308
00:19:43,960 --> 00:19:46,719
Speaker 2: a more river and he was in Harbin. That's it.

309
00:19:46,920 --> 00:19:47,320
Speaker 1: That's it.

310
00:19:48,440 --> 00:19:52,159
Speaker 2: And then that's the Chinese never recognized him as Chinese,

311
00:19:52,640 --> 00:19:55,760
Speaker 2: never gave him anything and never took anything. That's time.

312
00:19:56,760 --> 00:20:00,680
Speaker 1: And how big was the Jewish community in those parts

313
00:20:00,680 --> 00:20:05,280
Speaker 1: of Russia like for example and sends in where you were, Yeah, yeah,

314
00:20:05,680 --> 00:20:07,600
Speaker 1: how is it? Was it a big community?

315
00:20:07,800 --> 00:20:13,680
Speaker 2: No? No, not big, not big. But it was a

316
00:20:13,920 --> 00:20:17,280
Speaker 2: very good community. You see, like we had a Jewish

317
00:20:17,320 --> 00:20:23,760
Speaker 2: school and building for the aged people. Very very good,

318
00:20:24,720 --> 00:20:29,600
Speaker 2: very strong connections. That's why when I came, I was

319
00:20:29,720 --> 00:20:32,800
Speaker 2: very active in the Jewish schools because I went to

320
00:20:32,880 --> 00:20:35,600
Speaker 2: Jewish school, so I thought that was very important.

321
00:20:35,960 --> 00:20:38,520
Speaker 1: That's in China. In China, when you came here, you

322
00:20:38,600 --> 00:20:42,040
Speaker 1: went to a Christian school which is Scotch was Jewish school.

323
00:20:42,600 --> 00:20:44,760
Speaker 1: Really no Jewish girl at the time, not at that time,

324
00:20:45,000 --> 00:20:48,119
Speaker 1: because obviously there is now wait that I started, you started?

325
00:20:48,280 --> 00:20:49,640
Speaker 1: Which ones? You started in Sydney.

326
00:20:50,000 --> 00:20:54,240
Speaker 2: There was a small one in in Bellby Hill, small one.

327
00:20:54,119 --> 00:20:58,119
Speaker 1: Which which year? Which which period? Now we're talking about. Oh,

328
00:20:58,160 --> 00:20:59,840
Speaker 1: I came here late forties.

329
00:20:59,880 --> 00:21:02,919
Speaker 2: I came here in nineteen sixty sixty, right, because I

330
00:21:03,000 --> 00:21:05,199
Speaker 2: came as a child. Then I went to Israel. Then

331
00:21:05,240 --> 00:21:08,320
Speaker 2: I came back, So nineteen sixty I came back. Yeah.

332
00:21:08,520 --> 00:21:13,520
Speaker 2: I started to build soon after, and then a lot

333
00:21:13,560 --> 00:21:16,720
Speaker 2: of Hungarians came here and they were very good Jews too,

334
00:21:17,359 --> 00:21:22,760
Speaker 2: so together we built a lot. Yeah. Mariah, the one

335
00:21:22,800 --> 00:21:25,640
Speaker 2: that I'm talking about is Mariah, very big school now, yeah,

336
00:21:25,680 --> 00:21:30,280
Speaker 2: down Waverly there Masada in the North Shore. Yeah. Yeah.

337
00:21:30,320 --> 00:21:33,840
Speaker 1: So you you actually were one of the original, let's

338
00:21:33,880 --> 00:21:38,879
Speaker 1: call philanthropists behind the putting together Moriah College, which is

339
00:21:38,920 --> 00:21:41,440
Speaker 1: a great Jewish school in the suburbs at the back

340
00:21:41,440 --> 00:21:44,680
Speaker 1: of the Taia Park there. So if you went back

341
00:21:44,680 --> 00:21:49,000
Speaker 1: to Israel from Australia. Yeah, when I finished school, when

342
00:21:49,040 --> 00:21:50,000
Speaker 1: you finish school, Yeah.

343
00:21:50,000 --> 00:21:56,119
Speaker 2: Because my father couldn't get permission to come here. Why

344
00:21:57,440 --> 00:22:06,920
Speaker 2: because they accused him of working with the jebs. Now,

345
00:22:07,560 --> 00:22:09,439
Speaker 2: so he said, of course I would jeps if he

346
00:22:09,480 --> 00:22:12,960
Speaker 2: comes to my shop, I sell them. But it's it

347
00:22:13,000 --> 00:22:15,560
Speaker 2: wasn't fair. It was all wrong. And in the end

348
00:22:15,640 --> 00:22:22,280
Speaker 2: he was acquitted, but the Canberra got some ideas that

349
00:22:22,320 --> 00:22:27,400
Speaker 2: he was He really was nothing, but it affected him.

350
00:22:27,400 --> 00:22:29,800
Speaker 2: That's the big problem what happened. So once he came

351
00:22:29,840 --> 00:22:32,439
Speaker 2: to Israel, he was no longer the same as he

352
00:22:32,600 --> 00:22:36,320
Speaker 2: was in China. After jile, after jail, he said, why

353
00:22:36,359 --> 00:22:38,800
Speaker 2: did they do it to me? I never did anything wrong?

354
00:22:39,640 --> 00:22:41,600
Speaker 2: And I used to tell them father, you didn't do

355
00:22:41,640 --> 00:22:44,399
Speaker 2: anything wrong. So it made them even more mad. So

356
00:22:45,480 --> 00:22:48,360
Speaker 2: don't worry whether you did wrong, didn't do wrong. Who

357
00:22:48,440 --> 00:22:49,720
Speaker 2: cares anyways?

358
00:22:49,880 --> 00:22:51,320
Speaker 1: Do you think that? But do you think Harry? He

359
00:22:51,400 --> 00:22:54,879
Speaker 1: was so like maybe what is strong word? But traumatized

360
00:22:55,320 --> 00:22:58,080
Speaker 1: from being in jail, he.

361
00:22:58,080 --> 00:23:01,720
Speaker 2: Couldn't forget that he did nothing wrong. Of course he

362
00:23:01,800 --> 00:23:04,840
Speaker 2: did nothing wrong, and they couldn't care less if it

363
00:23:04,880 --> 00:23:07,080
Speaker 2: did wrong. But right they put money now.

364
00:23:07,080 --> 00:23:10,159
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, and and and it was the reason you

365
00:23:10,240 --> 00:23:12,879
Speaker 1: went to Israel and he went he went back to Israel.

366
00:23:13,240 --> 00:23:16,199
Speaker 1: Is the reason for that is because you wanted to.

367
00:23:17,040 --> 00:23:21,600
Speaker 2: Well, he came to hisself from China and he made

368
00:23:21,600 --> 00:23:26,399
Speaker 2: the textile manufacturing, right. That was always his dream. He

369
00:23:26,480 --> 00:23:32,000
Speaker 2: wanted to make textiles. He sent me to England to

370
00:23:32,240 --> 00:23:36,280
Speaker 2: Leeds and I'm a textile engineer. Oh really, yeah, I'm

371
00:23:36,320 --> 00:23:41,400
Speaker 2: texting now. You know. They taught me music and I

372
00:23:41,440 --> 00:23:47,400
Speaker 2: can't hear properly. My eyes are superb, my ears are hopeless.

373
00:23:47,640 --> 00:23:51,320
Speaker 2: But I learned music. Had three teachers were the teachers

374
00:23:51,320 --> 00:23:58,200
Speaker 2: were all bad. There were no good teachers for the piano. Piano. Yeah,

375
00:23:58,359 --> 00:24:04,439
Speaker 2: that had three pianos. So so he opened that factory

376
00:24:04,920 --> 00:24:08,879
Speaker 2: in Israel or in Israel. At that time, business in

377
00:24:08,960 --> 00:24:13,760
Speaker 2: Israel was hopeless. They were very left wing, very socialists.

378
00:24:14,040 --> 00:24:17,320
Speaker 2: There was nobody with money. Anyways, it didn't matter. He

379
00:24:17,480 --> 00:24:20,720
Speaker 2: was probably the richest man in Israel with very little

380
00:24:20,800 --> 00:24:25,320
Speaker 2: left to China. Because you see, when you have real estate,

381
00:24:25,600 --> 00:24:28,480
Speaker 2: that's the worst thing you can have if you leave

382
00:24:28,560 --> 00:24:31,920
Speaker 2: the if you have to go, because you can't take

383
00:24:31,960 --> 00:24:34,600
Speaker 2: it with you. Yeah, gold is the best, diamonds is good.

384
00:24:34,640 --> 00:24:38,200
Speaker 2: You put in the pocket. But real estate is the worst.

385
00:24:38,520 --> 00:24:41,800
Speaker 2: It stays there, that's for sure. Anyway, the Chinese, they

386
00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:45,560
Speaker 2: they welcome me and they show me that we look

387
00:24:45,600 --> 00:24:48,480
Speaker 2: at the buildings he built and left and oh they're

388
00:24:48,600 --> 00:24:54,040
Speaker 2: very excited. The house where we lived is now heritage

389
00:24:54,480 --> 00:24:58,520
Speaker 2: and they opened it for public to come and they

390
00:24:58,600 --> 00:25:01,840
Speaker 2: charged them feasts. See wow. Yeah, so it was one

391
00:25:01,840 --> 00:25:06,119
Speaker 2: of the best buildings Hong Kong Share High Bank boss

392
00:25:06,200 --> 00:25:08,080
Speaker 2: used to live there then be bought very good.

393
00:25:09,040 --> 00:25:11,040
Speaker 1: So when they when he went to Israel, And you're

394
00:25:11,040 --> 00:25:14,199
Speaker 1: being a textile engineer, is that something you studied in

395
00:25:14,240 --> 00:25:19,200
Speaker 1: London or where you studied, you studied, you study textile engineering.

396
00:25:19,640 --> 00:25:21,680
Speaker 1: And that's to be a rag trader, to be in

397
00:25:21,680 --> 00:25:23,040
Speaker 1: the right that's to be in the right trade.

398
00:25:23,119 --> 00:25:24,200
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah.

399
00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:26,080
Speaker 1: And what what was your dad making? What was your

400
00:25:26,160 --> 00:25:31,520
Speaker 1: dad making? What type of clothing but suits or fabric.

401
00:25:31,119 --> 00:25:33,360
Speaker 2: Or what fabric? Fabric? Fabric? Yeah?

402
00:25:34,280 --> 00:25:37,119
Speaker 1: And and and did he want you to be in

403
00:25:37,160 --> 00:25:38,760
Speaker 1: the same business? That was his dream?

404
00:25:38,880 --> 00:25:42,520
Speaker 2: Yeah. So then Australia writes me a letter and says

405
00:25:42,600 --> 00:25:43,080
Speaker 2: come home.

406
00:25:43,400 --> 00:25:46,880
Speaker 1: Who in Australia wrote the letter? Canber the government?

407
00:25:47,760 --> 00:25:50,560
Speaker 2: Why? But they wanted to be back at first they

408
00:25:50,560 --> 00:25:54,040
Speaker 2: didn't let Then I said, but you know, I'm already

409
00:25:54,880 --> 00:25:59,080
Speaker 2: finishing here in England. You can't come back then if

410
00:25:59,119 --> 00:26:01,680
Speaker 2: you don't want. So I said, what do I do?

411
00:26:02,119 --> 00:26:05,480
Speaker 2: He said, you go to the Home Office. So I

412
00:26:05,520 --> 00:26:08,399
Speaker 2: go to the Home Office and I show them the letter.

413
00:26:08,840 --> 00:26:11,440
Speaker 2: Oh they say you can stay here, Harry, very good,

414
00:26:11,520 --> 00:26:14,840
Speaker 2: thank you. So I finished my studies. Everything is right.

415
00:26:15,840 --> 00:26:18,680
Speaker 2: Then the Home Office comes to me and they say, Harry,

416
00:26:18,840 --> 00:26:22,200
Speaker 2: but what do you want to do now? I want

417
00:26:22,280 --> 00:26:26,159
Speaker 2: to think about it. They said, think. Oh, so I

418
00:26:26,280 --> 00:26:27,119
Speaker 2: go back to it.

419
00:26:28,640 --> 00:26:30,920
Speaker 1: And when then, why then did you what did you

420
00:26:31,080 --> 00:26:33,320
Speaker 1: when did you decide to come back to Australia. If

421
00:26:33,359 --> 00:26:34,560
Speaker 1: you're back now, you're back in Israel.

422
00:26:35,520 --> 00:26:39,440
Speaker 2: So then my father brought also my brother to Israel.

423
00:26:40,280 --> 00:26:44,160
Speaker 2: And my brother didn't fit Israel. He lived a few

424
00:26:44,240 --> 00:26:48,600
Speaker 2: years and couldn't talk the language. Actually he talked Hebrew

425
00:26:48,680 --> 00:26:52,240
Speaker 2: better when he came back here. I don't know something

426
00:26:52,240 --> 00:26:52,800
Speaker 2: in his mind.

427
00:26:52,960 --> 00:26:55,800
Speaker 1: He couldn't speak Hebrew properly. He couldn't speak Hebrew.

428
00:26:55,840 --> 00:27:00,080
Speaker 2: Probably he couldn't speak you. He didn't fit there. So

429
00:27:00,560 --> 00:27:04,040
Speaker 2: I started arguing with him and with my father, and

430
00:27:04,119 --> 00:27:07,080
Speaker 2: this and that, and my mother was a very quiet woman.

431
00:27:07,520 --> 00:27:12,040
Speaker 2: She said, look, this atmosphere is not good. I sent

432
00:27:12,160 --> 00:27:17,119
Speaker 2: you when you were boy to Australia. You go back right,

433
00:27:17,240 --> 00:27:20,520
Speaker 2: So my mother tells me, so you go back right?

434
00:27:20,600 --> 00:27:26,560
Speaker 2: Very good. So anyway, after a bit of problems, they

435
00:27:26,600 --> 00:27:31,359
Speaker 2: accepted me back. I come back. I tell them I'm Australian.

436
00:27:31,520 --> 00:27:34,479
Speaker 2: They see, how are you Australian? I said, because I

437
00:27:34,520 --> 00:27:37,760
Speaker 2: lived here for over three years and I was a junior.

438
00:27:38,119 --> 00:27:42,679
Speaker 2: That's the law. Oh well we have no records of

439
00:27:42,720 --> 00:27:45,479
Speaker 2: you being here. Oh you don't. Well I don't know

440
00:27:45,840 --> 00:27:49,280
Speaker 2: I was here. So they are bureaucrats, you see. They

441
00:27:49,280 --> 00:27:52,560
Speaker 2: make the law. They say, Harry, you go to your

442
00:27:52,600 --> 00:27:55,680
Speaker 2: head master. If he says you went to school, then

443
00:27:55,680 --> 00:27:59,120
Speaker 2: you're Australian. You're right. So first I couldn't get in

444
00:27:59,280 --> 00:28:01,560
Speaker 2: afterwards with it. In a month I became Australian. To

445
00:28:01,600 --> 00:28:02,400
Speaker 2: see where you go.

446
00:28:03,600 --> 00:28:06,320
Speaker 1: And then so you're now back in Australia. You're a

447
00:28:06,320 --> 00:28:09,960
Speaker 1: textile engineer. How old are you now?

448
00:28:10,200 --> 00:28:14,240
Speaker 2: Am I? Then? I was then maybe twenty seven.

449
00:28:14,240 --> 00:28:16,880
Speaker 1: Twenty seven years of age and any assets.

450
00:28:17,000 --> 00:28:22,920
Speaker 2: Nothing he gave me, I think, and I'm very happy

451
00:28:22,960 --> 00:28:25,639
Speaker 2: it happened. He gave a bit of money to my

452
00:28:25,720 --> 00:28:30,320
Speaker 2: brother for sure. Well, but he gave me enough to

453
00:28:30,359 --> 00:28:36,160
Speaker 2: buy a cottage, saying willub I had that, but instead

454
00:28:36,200 --> 00:28:42,360
Speaker 2: of buying a house, I invested. So I had a

455
00:28:42,400 --> 00:28:46,000
Speaker 2: milk crown and I had a.

456
00:28:45,600 --> 00:28:50,920
Speaker 1: You're a milkman. You're the milkman, got a guy to

457
00:28:51,000 --> 00:28:52,320
Speaker 1: do it. But you bought the run.

458
00:28:52,480 --> 00:28:55,760
Speaker 2: I bought the runner, and I became a partner in

459
00:28:55,840 --> 00:29:01,320
Speaker 2: a taxi and I bought four flat in dullar Chill

460
00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:09,840
Speaker 2: with big mortgages. And I invested very well, made probably

461
00:29:10,360 --> 00:29:15,400
Speaker 2: twenty percent return. That was very good. On the other hand,

462
00:29:15,440 --> 00:29:18,720
Speaker 2: there was no capital gaining those days. Yes straight ye

463
00:29:19,200 --> 00:29:22,880
Speaker 2: you bought sold after five years still the same. But

464
00:29:23,320 --> 00:29:26,920
Speaker 2: it was very good investment. And I got the job

465
00:29:27,800 --> 00:29:33,160
Speaker 2: in textiles. I get a job in textiles, and I

466
00:29:33,200 --> 00:29:39,120
Speaker 2: tell them textiles is no good. Our machines are old,

467
00:29:40,680 --> 00:29:47,680
Speaker 2: our market is small, and in Asia the wages are low.

468
00:29:48,680 --> 00:29:54,880
Speaker 2: So I told them textiles rubbish. So with that attitude,

469
00:29:54,880 --> 00:29:56,640
Speaker 2: they were quite happy to see the back of.

470
00:29:57,360 --> 00:30:01,160
Speaker 1: Who you're not working with, someone like Josephrender or some who.

471
00:30:00,680 --> 00:30:05,560
Speaker 2: You Joseph Brenda and I we were big friends. But

472
00:30:06,640 --> 00:30:09,840
Speaker 2: because he studied in Geelong and we were about the

473
00:30:09,880 --> 00:30:11,840
Speaker 2: same age. You know, we would have been together if

474
00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:12,680
Speaker 2: we were here.

475
00:30:12,760 --> 00:30:16,080
Speaker 1: If Joseph was still here his past last year.

476
00:30:16,440 --> 00:30:20,160
Speaker 2: In the end, I bought his block of land where

477
00:30:20,160 --> 00:30:23,080
Speaker 2: he had this factory and all that. Yeah, because I

478
00:30:23,080 --> 00:30:25,360
Speaker 2: could fight the council. So I thought I was couldn't

479
00:30:25,360 --> 00:30:31,320
Speaker 2: buy right, But so I said it's rubbish and I

480
00:30:31,360 --> 00:30:37,760
Speaker 2: went away. And then either friend Tommy, and Tommy tells me, Harry,

481
00:30:37,960 --> 00:30:44,360
Speaker 2: we should build flats. He was from Israel but originally Hungry,

482
00:30:44,640 --> 00:30:49,920
Speaker 2: a big friend of mine. So we were very lucky

483
00:30:50,560 --> 00:30:56,080
Speaker 2: that the chief lending officer of A and Z was

484
00:30:57,840 --> 00:31:02,320
Speaker 2: in bondi junction. They were him. So he looked at

485
00:31:02,320 --> 00:31:04,400
Speaker 2: me and he said, Harry, if you reach the roof,

486
00:31:04,440 --> 00:31:06,320
Speaker 2: I'll give you money. If you don't reach the roof,

487
00:31:07,080 --> 00:31:12,400
Speaker 2: it can go. So Davidson is next, with Rex Davidson.

488
00:31:14,360 --> 00:31:18,360
Speaker 2: Nobody remembers him, but he was all powerful in that bank,

489
00:31:18,680 --> 00:31:20,959
Speaker 2: and in the end they paid him off because they

490
00:31:20,960 --> 00:31:23,680
Speaker 2: couldn't control them. But I was lucky, so he gave

491
00:31:23,680 --> 00:31:25,480
Speaker 2: me a bit of money, you see. So it was

492
00:31:25,600 --> 00:31:28,120
Speaker 2: very good. And so I got a bit of money

493
00:31:28,120 --> 00:31:36,000
Speaker 2: and I built and at that time many people sold

494
00:31:36,560 --> 00:31:41,480
Speaker 2: their textile businesses here in this country, and they came

495
00:31:41,520 --> 00:31:44,240
Speaker 2: to me and they would buy from me four flats,

496
00:31:44,560 --> 00:31:48,320
Speaker 2: six flats, And so I sold little blocks of flats

497
00:31:48,560 --> 00:31:51,200
Speaker 2: and I always sold them as soon as I finished them.

498
00:31:51,440 --> 00:31:54,479
Speaker 2: So I finished them, I put tenants in them, and

499
00:31:54,520 --> 00:32:02,360
Speaker 2: I had the buyer. Then they really were no builders

500
00:32:02,400 --> 00:32:06,360
Speaker 2: for flats. They had builders that could build huge flats,

501
00:32:06,400 --> 00:32:09,880
Speaker 2: big ones that that's you know lang least that's not

502
00:32:13,000 --> 00:32:18,280
Speaker 2: small ones were very little. So what I did I

503
00:32:18,320 --> 00:32:23,680
Speaker 2: saw that the subcontractors had commercial brains because they survived.

504
00:32:24,960 --> 00:32:28,320
Speaker 2: So I took every subcontractor and I said, now you

505
00:32:28,360 --> 00:32:30,840
Speaker 2: will be a builder and you'll build that block, that

506
00:32:30,960 --> 00:32:33,280
Speaker 2: block for flats, and you'll be a builder and you'll

507
00:32:33,280 --> 00:32:38,680
Speaker 2: build it. And I realized that the workers had to

508
00:32:38,840 --> 00:32:44,120
Speaker 2: have permanent employment. The problem was that because all of

509
00:32:44,200 --> 00:32:47,080
Speaker 2: us were building these little blocks of flats, they would

510
00:32:47,080 --> 00:32:49,240
Speaker 2: build a little block and then they would lose the job.

511
00:32:50,000 --> 00:32:53,960
Speaker 2: And I made sure that my people always had work.

512
00:32:54,480 --> 00:32:57,360
Speaker 1: You so you could continue work all the time, and

513
00:32:57,400 --> 00:32:58,280
Speaker 1: I always stay with you.

514
00:32:58,360 --> 00:33:01,640
Speaker 2: Even sometimes maybe not so good the block, but that'sn't matter,

515
00:33:01,840 --> 00:33:07,200
Speaker 2: it's okay. That became very useful when we had fights

516
00:33:07,360 --> 00:33:11,120
Speaker 2: with unions, because they stuck by me. Because they knew

517
00:33:11,160 --> 00:33:13,200
Speaker 2: that if they were immediate to get jobs, if they

518
00:33:13,240 --> 00:33:17,600
Speaker 2: were with them, who knows. And so unions were very

519
00:33:17,640 --> 00:33:19,880
Speaker 2: rough in those days, much rougher than now now. They

520
00:33:20,040 --> 00:33:23,960
Speaker 2: gentlemen in comparison. Yeah, yeah, and they were very rough.

521
00:33:24,280 --> 00:33:27,560
Speaker 2: But my people stuck by me. We had no problems.

522
00:33:27,960 --> 00:33:31,840
Speaker 1: Did you mostually get foreigners like people from other countries

523
00:33:32,640 --> 00:33:35,640
Speaker 1: to be your subcontractors or to do the buildings for

524
00:33:35,720 --> 00:33:37,680
Speaker 1: you or you or were you getting audise?

525
00:33:39,320 --> 00:33:42,920
Speaker 2: They were all kind. They were Italians and Greeks.

526
00:33:43,240 --> 00:33:47,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, foreigners, the people who who just want to just

527
00:33:47,680 --> 00:33:49,840
Speaker 1: want to make some money for their family and have

528
00:33:49,920 --> 00:33:51,200
Speaker 1: a good security.

529
00:33:52,000 --> 00:33:57,680
Speaker 2: My main man was a Scotsman. Scots, they're clever with money. Yeah.

530
00:33:57,800 --> 00:34:01,720
Speaker 2: He worked with me, and son works with me, worked

531
00:34:01,760 --> 00:34:05,040
Speaker 2: with me, and his grandson is with me. He's retired,

532
00:34:05,360 --> 00:34:06,120
Speaker 2: but there's.

533
00:34:06,560 --> 00:34:07,160
Speaker 1: Still with you.

534
00:34:07,640 --> 00:34:08,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, very good.

535
00:34:09,000 --> 00:34:11,880
Speaker 1: So what years are we talking about now? When you

536
00:34:12,000 --> 00:34:14,360
Speaker 1: were doing this which in the seventies.

537
00:34:13,960 --> 00:34:15,879
Speaker 2: I started in nineteen sixty.

538
00:34:17,640 --> 00:34:21,400
Speaker 1: Never stopped so because I remember, and I mentioned this earlier,

539
00:34:21,440 --> 00:34:25,600
Speaker 1: but in nineteen seventy seven I was twenty twenty one

540
00:34:25,680 --> 00:34:31,440
Speaker 1: years old, maybe twenty two, and I was married my

541
00:34:31,520 --> 00:34:34,560
Speaker 1: first wife, and you met my son from my first

542
00:34:34,560 --> 00:34:39,480
Speaker 1: wife earlier, and we had just had a baby, and

543
00:34:40,960 --> 00:34:42,719
Speaker 1: I was very young to be married. But it doesn't matter.

544
00:34:42,800 --> 00:34:47,560
Speaker 1: And I needed to buy an apartment house, apartment, and

545
00:34:47,640 --> 00:34:50,759
Speaker 1: you had a block of apartments for sale, just built

546
00:34:50,840 --> 00:34:55,960
Speaker 1: brand new in Port Akin, rood, Sylvania, and I remember

547
00:34:56,320 --> 00:34:59,440
Speaker 1: what it was attractive to me. Was it three levels,

548
00:34:59,480 --> 00:35:03,480
Speaker 1: walk up, no lifts, car parking underneath. I could buy

549
00:35:03,480 --> 00:35:05,440
Speaker 1: an apartment. I think the apartment I bought was like

550
00:35:05,560 --> 00:35:08,920
Speaker 1: forty maybe forty seven thousand dollars or something like that.

551
00:35:09,840 --> 00:35:12,720
Speaker 1: But you lent the money to me, not you, Meriton

552
00:35:13,120 --> 00:35:16,200
Speaker 1: lend me the money, this company called Meriton. You lent

553
00:35:16,280 --> 00:35:18,640
Speaker 1: me ninety percent because I couldn't borrow the money from

554
00:35:18,640 --> 00:35:22,319
Speaker 1: the bank. When did you start to decide that I'm

555
00:35:22,360 --> 00:35:24,920
Speaker 1: going to lend money to people to buy the buildings

556
00:35:24,960 --> 00:35:28,040
Speaker 1: that I built. Where'd you get that idea from? Right?

557
00:35:29,280 --> 00:35:38,239
Speaker 2: So, when I started to build, I thought that my

558
00:35:38,360 --> 00:35:43,200
Speaker 2: big problem would be to get money to do the

559
00:35:43,239 --> 00:35:48,839
Speaker 2: building to build. This was in my mind, but I

560
00:35:48,960 --> 00:35:54,080
Speaker 2: soon found out that the big problem were the councils.

561
00:35:54,440 --> 00:35:56,920
Speaker 2: And there's still the big problem. It didn't change worse

562
00:35:57,000 --> 00:36:05,320
Speaker 2: now bigger, more of course, much worse, but so going

563
00:36:05,440 --> 00:36:08,400
Speaker 2: public was a waste of time. I went public, but

564
00:36:08,560 --> 00:36:11,200
Speaker 2: it was a waste of time because they could get

565
00:36:11,239 --> 00:36:14,280
Speaker 2: me money. But I I could sell very well easily,

566
00:36:15,160 --> 00:36:19,480
Speaker 2: no problem. So I saw the problem was that the

567
00:36:19,560 --> 00:36:24,400
Speaker 2: people had no money. They all wanted my flats, no problem,

568
00:36:24,760 --> 00:36:30,120
Speaker 2: but they didn't have money. Especially I started to build

569
00:36:30,120 --> 00:36:33,560
Speaker 2: a little bit in surface Paradise. There was worse than here,

570
00:36:33,800 --> 00:36:37,600
Speaker 2: much worse, especially those days, you know, so we had

571
00:36:37,640 --> 00:36:40,880
Speaker 2: no Chinese here. Later on they came, so that was

572
00:36:40,920 --> 00:36:46,000
Speaker 2: easy then. Yeah, so I decided to give them money.

573
00:36:46,560 --> 00:36:49,760
Speaker 2: So I used to borrow money because I didn't have much,

574
00:36:50,280 --> 00:36:52,800
Speaker 2: and give it to them, give it to the buyer,

575
00:36:53,080 --> 00:36:55,680
Speaker 2: to the buyer, but not for a long time, a year,

576
00:36:55,719 --> 00:37:02,160
Speaker 2: two years, and till today. I have very few bad debts.

577
00:37:02,440 --> 00:37:04,800
Speaker 2: But I only gave it on my blocks. Of that

578
00:37:05,360 --> 00:37:08,600
Speaker 2: because those ones I built and I knew them, because

579
00:37:08,680 --> 00:37:11,319
Speaker 2: you know, we also have problems afterwards with how good

580
00:37:11,320 --> 00:37:16,399
Speaker 2: the block is as well, and so it worked very well,

581
00:37:16,680 --> 00:37:21,799
Speaker 2: works till today. Now, especially now now I have to

582
00:37:21,800 --> 00:37:26,360
Speaker 2: give fifty percent. I give money to people because Chinese

583
00:37:27,600 --> 00:37:32,040
Speaker 2: have stopped being big buyers. They are now selling, and

584
00:37:32,080 --> 00:37:34,520
Speaker 2: they're selling because of things in China nothing to do

585
00:37:34,640 --> 00:37:38,759
Speaker 2: with us. Yeah, so that's you need even money more.

586
00:37:40,040 --> 00:37:44,840
Speaker 2: But because the councils don't approve anything fast, I have

587
00:37:44,920 --> 00:37:47,439
Speaker 2: a lot of money because I would love to build more,

588
00:37:47,920 --> 00:37:49,440
Speaker 2: but I can't get approval.

589
00:37:50,000 --> 00:37:53,240
Speaker 1: So when did you really start to kick off hard?

590
00:37:53,239 --> 00:37:53,439
Speaker 2: Though?

591
00:37:53,480 --> 00:37:56,319
Speaker 1: You know which period in your life was it, maybe

592
00:37:56,360 --> 00:37:58,520
Speaker 1: the seventies or eighties, did you really start to say,

593
00:37:58,520 --> 00:38:00,359
Speaker 1: hang on a minute, I can do it. A lot

594
00:38:00,360 --> 00:38:02,160
Speaker 1: of these that can have more than one or two

595
00:38:02,200 --> 00:38:06,040
Speaker 1: sides at the time, maybe for example Bonna Junction, when

596
00:38:06,080 --> 00:38:08,600
Speaker 1: you did the merit and apartments in Bonna Junction, When

597
00:38:08,640 --> 00:38:11,439
Speaker 1: did you start realizing I got something big here?

598
00:38:11,680 --> 00:38:16,920
Speaker 2: Yeah? In seventy three, not only me, you see, the

599
00:38:17,000 --> 00:38:21,240
Speaker 2: Americans came, City bank came, and city banks said different

600
00:38:21,520 --> 00:38:25,080
Speaker 2: because our banks never had money, same as now they

601
00:38:25,120 --> 00:38:31,400
Speaker 2: have no money. And city banks said, we have money

602
00:38:31,680 --> 00:38:35,319
Speaker 2: and you can build, so we should go together. And

603
00:38:35,360 --> 00:38:39,319
Speaker 2: so that's when Ellen Bond and I and others suddenly grew.

604
00:38:39,520 --> 00:38:44,280
Speaker 2: Nobody heard of us before. Very good. But then what happened?

605
00:38:47,600 --> 00:38:50,480
Speaker 2: I mean I didn't even hire a lawyer. I just

606
00:38:50,520 --> 00:38:54,839
Speaker 2: signed it, got the mortgage, got the money they put

607
00:38:54,880 --> 00:38:58,680
Speaker 2: in a close there that said that I have to

608
00:38:58,760 --> 00:39:02,440
Speaker 2: repay on demand. If they needed money, I had to

609
00:39:02,520 --> 00:39:06,600
Speaker 2: repay and demand. It doesn't matter how good my property was.

610
00:39:06,719 --> 00:39:10,040
Speaker 2: They had to pay on demand. So I went to

611
00:39:10,080 --> 00:39:12,759
Speaker 2: them and I said, yesterday I was a film star.

612
00:39:13,120 --> 00:39:16,919
Speaker 2: Today i'm broke. You say you need the money. Yeah,

613
00:39:17,000 --> 00:39:20,120
Speaker 2: they said, we need the money. You signed it, all right.

614
00:39:21,760 --> 00:39:25,840
Speaker 2: So of course I had money that was not in

615
00:39:26,480 --> 00:39:31,439
Speaker 2: mortgage to them, so I started building more. Now, I say,

616
00:39:31,480 --> 00:39:35,960
Speaker 2: you're so clever, you go finish them. Harry is not fair.

617
00:39:36,560 --> 00:39:43,080
Speaker 2: Now then I said, look, you give me the money

618
00:39:43,120 --> 00:39:47,040
Speaker 2: to finish, and I will pay you every day as

619
00:39:47,040 --> 00:39:50,120
Speaker 2: I sell. Every day I sell, I give you the money. Oh.

620
00:39:50,480 --> 00:39:53,719
Speaker 2: They say, we'll give you seven percent. I said no, no, no,

621
00:39:54,040 --> 00:39:57,799
Speaker 2: you give me nothing. You just pay. I'll just give

622
00:39:57,840 --> 00:40:00,200
Speaker 2: you the money that I pay, and that's in up.

623
00:40:02,800 --> 00:40:06,200
Speaker 2: They tried to get some of my money from A

624
00:40:06,320 --> 00:40:08,239
Speaker 2: and Z, and A and Z threw them out. They said,

625
00:40:08,280 --> 00:40:12,279
Speaker 2: nothing to do with you. It's so I finished with

626
00:40:14,440 --> 00:40:17,799
Speaker 2: with the City Bank as best friends. They gave me

627
00:40:17,880 --> 00:40:20,080
Speaker 2: two million dollars at that time. It's a lot of

628
00:40:20,080 --> 00:40:25,360
Speaker 2: money because they thought that I was definitely broke. But

629
00:40:25,520 --> 00:40:28,880
Speaker 2: I paid them every day I paid a SOB you

630
00:40:28,960 --> 00:40:38,080
Speaker 2: know that's and then after that I was lucky that

631
00:40:38,120 --> 00:40:41,560
Speaker 2: I took them to court and everything, and they now

632
00:40:42,880 --> 00:40:49,440
Speaker 2: don't allow to write pay on demand. That's now finished.

633
00:40:49,520 --> 00:40:52,640
Speaker 2: I fixed that because I said, you can't do that

634
00:40:52,680 --> 00:40:56,000
Speaker 2: with that's rubbish. You're in trouble. So I mean, I'm

635
00:40:56,400 --> 00:40:59,200
Speaker 2: zero point one percent of you. You're in trouble. What

636
00:40:59,239 --> 00:40:59,799
Speaker 2: can I do?

637
00:41:00,680 --> 00:41:03,359
Speaker 1: What's interesting about that, though, was your strategy or your

638
00:41:03,400 --> 00:41:07,239
Speaker 1: tactic was to put them in a position that they

639
00:41:07,280 --> 00:41:09,839
Speaker 1: can't complete the job because you're the builder. They're not

640
00:41:10,719 --> 00:41:14,399
Speaker 1: and the only way out of trouble for them is

641
00:41:14,440 --> 00:41:17,480
Speaker 1: to be patient, to let you sell, and to sell

642
00:41:17,520 --> 00:41:20,279
Speaker 1: you have to finish first. So that was quite clever

643
00:41:20,360 --> 00:41:22,920
Speaker 1: because you think they're much bigger than you, But you

644
00:41:23,080 --> 00:41:26,279
Speaker 1: also they've got nothing without you. I mean, they're not

645
00:41:26,280 --> 00:41:28,760
Speaker 1: going to point administrator who's going to try and find

646
00:41:28,800 --> 00:41:33,360
Speaker 1: builders and carpenters and brick layers and plasters and stuff

647
00:41:33,400 --> 00:41:39,120
Speaker 1: like that. I want to talk to you about your trades, Meriton.

648
00:41:39,920 --> 00:41:42,680
Speaker 1: Merit probably is. I dare say this would be the case.

649
00:41:43,200 --> 00:41:48,040
Speaker 1: You are more than likely the largest apartment builder in

650
00:41:48,080 --> 00:41:51,200
Speaker 1: Australia over the last twenty thirty years. Would that be right?

651
00:41:52,000 --> 00:41:52,480
Speaker 2: Easily?

652
00:41:53,360 --> 00:41:57,680
Speaker 1: Easily and part of your you said right at the

653
00:41:57,760 --> 00:41:59,960
Speaker 1: very beginning that one of the things you did was

654
00:42:00,040 --> 00:42:03,000
Speaker 1: make sure that your trades, your trades people who were

655
00:42:03,440 --> 00:42:06,839
Speaker 1: all different types of nationalities, were always certain that they

656
00:42:06,840 --> 00:42:10,759
Speaker 1: were going to get work no matter what happens today,

657
00:42:11,480 --> 00:42:14,640
Speaker 1: is Merriton still that same model? Is that the same model?

658
00:42:16,200 --> 00:42:17,839
Speaker 1: Would it be fair to say that you have with

659
00:42:17,920 --> 00:42:24,719
Speaker 1: you businesses bricklayers, painters, plasters, companies who probably been with

660
00:42:24,760 --> 00:42:25,640
Speaker 1: me thirty forty.

661
00:42:25,440 --> 00:42:31,799
Speaker 2: Years, different generations their family. Yeah, family, yeah, but we

662
00:42:31,920 --> 00:42:35,440
Speaker 2: have to remember one thing. We have a problem, not we,

663
00:42:35,640 --> 00:42:38,799
Speaker 2: the whole world has a problem. These guys who were

664
00:42:38,840 --> 00:42:43,839
Speaker 2: so terrific with me, their children were not necessarily so good,

665
00:42:44,840 --> 00:42:48,120
Speaker 2: and they always, like my father, they wanted them to

666
00:42:48,280 --> 00:42:54,280
Speaker 2: stay in the business. Some succeeded. The girls succeeded actually

667
00:42:54,640 --> 00:42:55,600
Speaker 2: better than boys.

668
00:42:55,840 --> 00:42:56,160
Speaker 1: Really.

669
00:42:56,360 --> 00:43:02,279
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well they can't play bricks, but they But we

670
00:43:02,360 --> 00:43:06,800
Speaker 2: have a problem with that, and that is not only

671
00:43:06,880 --> 00:43:11,560
Speaker 2: with Australians or New Australians, but the Chinese have the

672
00:43:11,600 --> 00:43:16,000
Speaker 2: same problem. They're kids that grow up here are not

673
00:43:16,080 --> 00:43:17,640
Speaker 2: necessarily like the fathers.

674
00:43:17,920 --> 00:43:19,879
Speaker 1: Well, why do you think that is? Well, when you say,

675
00:43:19,960 --> 00:43:22,600
Speaker 1: is it because it's not spoiled, but they just lead

676
00:43:22,640 --> 00:43:23,239
Speaker 1: a different life.

677
00:43:23,520 --> 00:43:28,000
Speaker 2: They're just they're different here. So we have to value

678
00:43:28,120 --> 00:43:33,359
Speaker 2: very much these migrants that come here because they are

679
00:43:33,400 --> 00:43:36,840
Speaker 2: still the same as well with me. It's their children

680
00:43:37,320 --> 00:43:40,919
Speaker 2: already that are born here. They're not the.

681
00:43:40,880 --> 00:43:44,000
Speaker 1: Same, maybe not as hungry, not as hungry here. And

682
00:43:44,600 --> 00:43:48,240
Speaker 1: is it because in hungry? Is it because they don't

683
00:43:48,239 --> 00:43:50,160
Speaker 1: have the same ambition?

684
00:43:50,360 --> 00:43:50,800
Speaker 2: Maybe?

685
00:43:51,080 --> 00:43:51,960
Speaker 1: What do you think it is?

686
00:43:53,040 --> 00:43:56,560
Speaker 2: Well, they are different. You see that the ones who

687
00:43:56,600 --> 00:43:58,520
Speaker 2: came in with me, they are the same as I am.

688
00:43:58,600 --> 00:44:01,560
Speaker 2: They think the same. But these new ones some that,

689
00:44:01,880 --> 00:44:06,880
Speaker 2: some not. So it's a it's a worldwide problem, not only.

690
00:44:07,000 --> 00:44:08,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, I would mind examining that because I mean I

691
00:44:08,880 --> 00:44:11,560
Speaker 1: got four kids too, and I often think myself a

692
00:44:11,560 --> 00:44:18,239
Speaker 1: similar top issue. Do you think it's because they think

693
00:44:18,280 --> 00:44:20,720
Speaker 1: to themselves, I look at my father or your children,

694
00:44:20,760 --> 00:44:23,600
Speaker 1: look at you or their children, your trades people look

695
00:44:23,600 --> 00:44:25,919
Speaker 1: at their father and mother and they say, I don't

696
00:44:25,920 --> 00:44:27,800
Speaker 1: want to have to work that hard for my life

697
00:44:27,840 --> 00:44:31,160
Speaker 1: like my parents did. Do you think that is because I.

698
00:44:31,120 --> 00:44:33,480
Speaker 2: Don't care, majority don't want it?

699
00:44:34,760 --> 00:44:37,640
Speaker 1: And do you think it's also because they think that

700
00:44:37,760 --> 00:44:40,239
Speaker 1: maybe their father or their mother missed out on a

701
00:44:40,239 --> 00:44:44,160
Speaker 1: lot of things in their life, and they because you're

702
00:44:44,200 --> 00:44:44,800
Speaker 1: still working.

703
00:44:45,200 --> 00:44:46,600
Speaker 2: I'm still working.

704
00:44:46,520 --> 00:44:49,200
Speaker 1: At ninety one years of age. I know you are

705
00:44:49,239 --> 00:44:52,240
Speaker 1: still looking at sites and you're still putting up new sites?

706
00:44:52,840 --> 00:44:55,120
Speaker 1: Are you? And you're as energetic and as active and

707
00:44:55,120 --> 00:44:59,600
Speaker 1: as probably enthusiastic about continuing. You don't need to. You

708
00:44:59,600 --> 00:45:01,400
Speaker 1: don't need to do it from a financial point of view,

709
00:45:01,480 --> 00:45:03,399
Speaker 1: that you can stop tomorrow, it doesn't matter, won't change

710
00:45:03,400 --> 00:45:07,480
Speaker 1: your life. Why do you keep doing it? What is

711
00:45:07,520 --> 00:45:10,560
Speaker 1: it that drives Harry triggered off to keep doing this

712
00:45:10,680 --> 00:45:14,520
Speaker 1: even though he's a multi billionaire and it doesn't need

713
00:45:14,680 --> 00:45:18,280
Speaker 1: banks anymore, doesn't really need anything. You've got nothing to prove. Why?

714
00:45:18,680 --> 00:45:24,640
Speaker 2: Well, I think that I looked upon the business as

715
00:45:24,680 --> 00:45:28,680
Speaker 2: a family. They were like my family, the people in

716
00:45:28,719 --> 00:45:32,960
Speaker 2: the business. So how can you leave your family? That's

717
00:45:33,040 --> 00:45:33,640
Speaker 2: the thing?

718
00:45:48,040 --> 00:45:48,759
Speaker 1: Can I actually this?

719
00:45:48,800 --> 00:45:49,080
Speaker 2: Harry?

720
00:45:49,239 --> 00:45:53,800
Speaker 1: I mean, you've been married twice, You've had two marriages.

721
00:45:56,040 --> 00:45:58,640
Speaker 1: Do you think that that type of attitude that you're

722
00:45:58,680 --> 00:46:03,000
Speaker 1: talking about, that the business is my family, that's what

723
00:46:03,120 --> 00:46:07,280
Speaker 1: I love the most. Does that cannot create a problem

724
00:46:07,320 --> 00:46:08,439
Speaker 1: in your relationship?

725
00:46:10,160 --> 00:46:16,440
Speaker 2: Yeah? Of course, you see my first wife. I married

726
00:46:16,440 --> 00:46:21,880
Speaker 2: her in Israel. She was in the army, so she

727
00:46:22,040 --> 00:46:25,960
Speaker 2: didn't know what the world was about. She comes here.

728
00:46:29,320 --> 00:46:41,080
Speaker 2: I'm a young fellow. The women I already had women

729
00:46:41,160 --> 00:46:48,040
Speaker 2: do to were very important in my business, so I

730
00:46:48,160 --> 00:46:54,279
Speaker 2: used to go out with them. But I always came

731
00:46:54,320 --> 00:46:58,400
Speaker 2: home and had dinner, little dinner that I had a

732
00:46:58,400 --> 00:47:04,279
Speaker 2: little dinner. Not one day did a miss. She was

733
00:47:04,320 --> 00:47:09,640
Speaker 2: not confident. I think. I think she was a very

734
00:47:09,719 --> 00:47:13,840
Speaker 2: nice woman. And she found the boyfriend she had before me,

735
00:47:15,480 --> 00:47:20,600
Speaker 2: and that boyfriend married sick wife and they were sick

736
00:47:20,680 --> 00:47:23,400
Speaker 2: and they had nothing on this and that's what she found.

737
00:47:23,719 --> 00:47:31,000
Speaker 2: She wanted to go back to. She felt better in Well,

738
00:47:32,520 --> 00:47:38,040
Speaker 2: thank god she stayed here. She didn't go ahead with

739
00:47:38,080 --> 00:47:42,920
Speaker 2: the boyfriend. And the daughters are very good to her

740
00:47:43,880 --> 00:47:47,040
Speaker 2: and she has she lives in a very good apartment

741
00:47:47,120 --> 00:47:52,160
Speaker 2: in Bondi Beach there, so she's looked after. She she

742
00:47:52,200 --> 00:47:55,359
Speaker 2: never wanted to marry again, and that was it. And

743
00:47:55,680 --> 00:47:58,680
Speaker 2: for seven years I was between the wives and.

744
00:47:58,600 --> 00:48:02,680
Speaker 1: They single single. So seven years your single guy.

745
00:48:02,760 --> 00:48:07,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, and then I married the second one, but she

746
00:48:07,239 --> 00:48:12,000
Speaker 2: unfortunately just died just two months ago. So that's what happened.

747
00:48:12,160 --> 00:48:15,120
Speaker 1: But do you think that when because some people will

748
00:48:15,120 --> 00:48:18,200
Speaker 1: look at you know, look at where you're, where you

749
00:48:18,280 --> 00:48:20,760
Speaker 1: are in your life, I mean, and younger people especially,

750
00:48:20,840 --> 00:48:24,240
Speaker 1: they say, wow, I'd love to be a billionaire. And

751
00:48:24,239 --> 00:48:27,400
Speaker 1: and then obviously there is a lot of ingredients involved

752
00:48:27,400 --> 00:48:33,120
Speaker 1: in becoming successful, one of which is sacrifice, and people

753
00:48:33,160 --> 00:48:38,200
Speaker 1: around you have to sometimes participate in that sacrifice, like

754
00:48:38,360 --> 00:48:41,120
Speaker 1: you know, like I personally know exactly how it works.

755
00:48:41,440 --> 00:48:43,480
Speaker 1: And sometimes when we're young, when I was young, and

756
00:48:43,520 --> 00:48:45,919
Speaker 1: I guess when you were younger, we don't realize we're

757
00:48:46,000 --> 00:48:49,360
Speaker 1: asking other people to make sacrifices as well.

758
00:48:49,680 --> 00:48:50,239
Speaker 2: That's right.

759
00:48:50,320 --> 00:48:53,520
Speaker 1: What would you say to these young people about sacrifice

760
00:48:53,680 --> 00:48:55,560
Speaker 1: and an effort?

761
00:48:57,040 --> 00:49:03,840
Speaker 2: Well, right, I could only succeed because I worked very hard.

762
00:49:04,120 --> 00:49:05,920
Speaker 1: And what does that mean? Seven days awake.

763
00:49:07,719 --> 00:49:11,320
Speaker 2: All the time. And the people that I had worked

764
00:49:11,400 --> 00:49:20,560
Speaker 2: very hard two and the ordinary workers, we all worked hard.

765
00:49:21,680 --> 00:49:25,080
Speaker 2: We had one aim in life. I mean, unions came

766
00:49:25,160 --> 00:49:31,080
Speaker 2: and they never dented all nothing to and they were

767
00:49:31,120 --> 00:49:35,000
Speaker 2: a big problem. I mean, the councils to get things through,

768
00:49:35,040 --> 00:49:38,360
Speaker 2: like with your house you see here. I get them through.

769
00:49:39,239 --> 00:49:42,240
Speaker 2: But that's a lot of effort and the right people

770
00:49:42,280 --> 00:49:48,440
Speaker 2: to do it. And I was lucky that I found

771
00:49:48,560 --> 00:49:53,200
Speaker 2: all those people. They all fit together.

772
00:49:53,440 --> 00:49:56,400
Speaker 1: In one part of the jigsaw. There's always a different

773
00:49:56,400 --> 00:49:59,120
Speaker 1: part of the jigsaw, because I've often wondered, how does

774
00:49:59,200 --> 00:50:05,760
Speaker 1: Meriton managed to get approvals for sometimes really difficult sites

775
00:50:07,640 --> 00:50:10,160
Speaker 1: ahead of everybody else. And then, for example Bonda Junction.

776
00:50:10,360 --> 00:50:12,560
Speaker 1: Bonda Junction now got lots of high rise going up,

777
00:50:12,960 --> 00:50:15,160
Speaker 1: but you were like the first big high rise there.

778
00:50:15,320 --> 00:50:18,080
Speaker 1: I mean, I can see there's one or two other

779
00:50:18,120 --> 00:50:19,120
Speaker 1: ones now coming away.

780
00:50:19,239 --> 00:50:22,719
Speaker 2: I give you example Bonda Junction you talk about, right,

781
00:50:25,200 --> 00:50:30,759
Speaker 2: So I wanted to build there, and I built on

782
00:50:30,840 --> 00:50:34,920
Speaker 2: top of the railway and on top of the buses,

783
00:50:35,400 --> 00:50:37,279
Speaker 2: and then I came. So you can imagine it's a

784
00:50:37,320 --> 00:50:38,040
Speaker 2: problem site.

785
00:50:38,160 --> 00:50:38,399
Speaker 1: Yeah.

786
00:50:39,680 --> 00:50:41,600
Speaker 2: The guy was sold it to me A nice fellow

787
00:50:41,680 --> 00:50:47,160
Speaker 2: is architect. He started explaining to me the problems he

788
00:50:47,320 --> 00:50:52,480
Speaker 2: was He felt that he had to warn me. I said,

789
00:50:52,880 --> 00:50:56,160
Speaker 2: don't worry. If I thought there were problems, I wouldn't

790
00:50:56,200 --> 00:51:01,319
Speaker 2: touch it. We had them. It was just before the

791
00:51:01,400 --> 00:51:06,120
Speaker 2: Olympic Games. I went to the Minister of the Olympic

792
00:51:06,160 --> 00:51:10,200
Speaker 2: Games and I told him, listen, you got a problem

793
00:51:10,719 --> 00:51:14,880
Speaker 2: that you need to finish that blog before the Olympic Games.

794
00:51:15,400 --> 00:51:18,040
Speaker 2: He said, I have a problem. You're right, I said,

795
00:51:18,160 --> 00:51:21,279
Speaker 2: so approve it. So he went and he tempted on

796
00:51:21,320 --> 00:51:24,960
Speaker 2: that built. I found him. I found him a reason

797
00:51:25,880 --> 00:51:28,880
Speaker 2: to go because he had powers over all the councils,

798
00:51:28,920 --> 00:51:31,799
Speaker 2: over everything. He had to get everything ready for the

799
00:51:31,840 --> 00:51:32,560
Speaker 2: Olympic Games.

800
00:51:32,560 --> 00:51:35,759
Speaker 1: He need accommodation for Olympic Games. But Harry, do you.

801
00:51:35,680 --> 00:51:37,840
Speaker 2: Think as an example, right.

802
00:51:37,760 --> 00:51:43,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, But do you think that's because is that because One,

803
00:51:43,680 --> 00:51:47,239
Speaker 1: it's logical, makes sense. I get that. Two he went

804
00:51:47,280 --> 00:51:49,960
Speaker 1: to the right person who has the power to override

805
00:51:50,040 --> 00:51:53,680
Speaker 1: counsels or make the decision instead of counsel. But how

806
00:51:53,760 --> 00:52:00,719
Speaker 1: much of that is because of Harry Triggerbov's forcefulness? Like, Harry,

807
00:52:01,400 --> 00:52:05,240
Speaker 1: you've never been shy. You're not shy. You often say

808
00:52:05,400 --> 00:52:07,880
Speaker 1: in the media what you think, even though not maybe

809
00:52:07,920 --> 00:52:12,200
Speaker 1: not popular or somebody won't like it. You've always, as

810
00:52:12,200 --> 00:52:15,640
Speaker 1: far as I remember, you've always been this way. How

811
00:52:15,680 --> 00:52:20,879
Speaker 1: much of that Harry Triggerbov's forceful nature, By the way,

812
00:52:20,920 --> 00:52:23,320
Speaker 1: have you always been this person? And how much of

813
00:52:23,360 --> 00:52:26,719
Speaker 1: that is important in terms of convincing somebody to make

814
00:52:26,760 --> 00:52:29,120
Speaker 1: this decision? Because if Harry Triggerbov walks in and says

815
00:52:29,200 --> 00:52:34,560
Speaker 1: to the Prime Minister, look, Anthony ALBERANIZI we need you

816
00:52:34,680 --> 00:52:37,440
Speaker 1: to do this because we don't have enough housing. They

817
00:52:37,440 --> 00:52:39,759
Speaker 1: will listen to you if if if you say, I'm

818
00:52:39,800 --> 00:52:42,520
Speaker 1: coming to see you, Harry Triggerbop is coming in, so

819
00:52:42,520 --> 00:52:45,200
Speaker 1: we better listen. Okay, how much is that? How important

820
00:52:45,239 --> 00:52:45,640
Speaker 1: is that part?

821
00:52:46,400 --> 00:52:55,919
Speaker 2: Very important? Now? You see, sometimes the council has land

822
00:52:56,680 --> 00:53:01,400
Speaker 2: and he wants to sell. Very often he sells it

823
00:53:01,480 --> 00:53:05,200
Speaker 2: to me because he's sure that our building. But the

824
00:53:05,239 --> 00:53:07,520
Speaker 2: other ones he doesn't know how good they are, but better,

825
00:53:07,640 --> 00:53:13,400
Speaker 2: so he prefers me to them, which is one sort

826
00:53:13,400 --> 00:53:14,320
Speaker 2: of thing that happened.

827
00:53:14,440 --> 00:53:18,640
Speaker 1: So you are you build a reputation as someone who

828
00:53:18,800 --> 00:53:21,920
Speaker 1: gets something completed, so that's important.

829
00:53:22,719 --> 00:53:31,600
Speaker 2: Also, I always watched which council has good bureaucrats, because

830
00:53:31,680 --> 00:53:35,759
Speaker 2: if you have the wrong bureaucrats, they'll sink you. The

831
00:53:35,840 --> 00:53:38,719
Speaker 2: problem with that is they don't flast, so you have

832
00:53:38,760 --> 00:53:39,560
Speaker 2: to be fast.

833
00:53:40,000 --> 00:53:42,040
Speaker 1: The good ones last yea, yeah, why.

834
00:53:42,000 --> 00:53:45,520
Speaker 2: No, nobody lasts that. They change them. And it's not

835
00:53:45,560 --> 00:53:47,399
Speaker 2: because they're good or bad. That's the way it goes.

836
00:53:47,480 --> 00:53:50,919
Speaker 2: They change them. So you have to pick the good

837
00:53:51,080 --> 00:53:53,480
Speaker 2: the good counsoles, and you have to move fast.

838
00:53:53,520 --> 00:53:55,560
Speaker 1: How do you know who's good. But how do you

839
00:53:55,600 --> 00:53:57,319
Speaker 1: know how do you work that out? How do you

840
00:53:57,520 --> 00:53:59,359
Speaker 1: mean do you gadget lunch or you.

841
00:53:59,320 --> 00:54:02,279
Speaker 2: Know, give them a chance. I tell them to prove it.

842
00:54:02,719 --> 00:54:09,000
Speaker 2: I was. I built in Right Council for thirty five years.

843
00:54:09,080 --> 00:54:13,840
Speaker 2: Every day, every day I built because they were good counsel.

844
00:54:13,600 --> 00:54:15,080
Speaker 1: And you got to know everybody.

845
00:54:15,239 --> 00:54:21,360
Speaker 2: They know who's so like I go to surface because

846
00:54:21,560 --> 00:54:22,320
Speaker 2: easy counsel.

847
00:54:22,560 --> 00:54:25,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was gonna ask about surface. What's the difference

848
00:54:25,000 --> 00:54:28,120
Speaker 1: between Gold Coast to Service Paradise and say, let's say

849
00:54:28,120 --> 00:54:31,680
Speaker 1: Sydney in terms of councils and everything else for that.

850
00:54:31,680 --> 00:54:40,400
Speaker 2: Matter, people there want development. People in Sydney, the older

851
00:54:40,440 --> 00:54:42,920
Speaker 2: ones don't want to developed. You mean the residents, the

852
00:54:43,000 --> 00:54:47,359
Speaker 2: residents whoever lives there. Yeah, because they're doing okay here

853
00:54:47,960 --> 00:54:53,279
Speaker 2: the way it is, so why change? And surfers they

854
00:54:53,320 --> 00:54:56,879
Speaker 2: think they should be bigger. You see, they have all

855
00:54:56,920 --> 00:55:02,160
Speaker 2: these dreams of becoming big. So it's much easier. They

856
00:55:02,200 --> 00:55:06,120
Speaker 2: have the same dream as I have. But here we

857
00:55:06,200 --> 00:55:08,960
Speaker 2: have more and more old people and they're the real

858
00:55:09,040 --> 00:55:12,080
Speaker 2: problem because they are happy. That's it.

859
00:55:12,760 --> 00:55:15,920
Speaker 1: They don't want to change. Is that in aus in

860
00:55:16,040 --> 00:55:17,480
Speaker 1: Cyny they don't want anyone to change.

861
00:55:17,480 --> 00:55:19,920
Speaker 2: Their little Yeah, they're happy that way they are.

862
00:55:20,080 --> 00:55:23,840
Speaker 1: And and and councils, unfortunately are voted in, so councils

863
00:55:23,880 --> 00:55:25,000
Speaker 1: have to listen to everybody.

864
00:55:25,280 --> 00:55:31,360
Speaker 2: Now. So the problem is that the councils are voted in,

865
00:55:32,360 --> 00:55:39,960
Speaker 2: and they when I talk to them, they listen. They

866
00:55:39,960 --> 00:55:43,600
Speaker 2: don't say what they said, Harry, what you said is

867
00:55:43,880 --> 00:55:48,359
Speaker 2: perfectly right. I said, no, but if we approve it,

868
00:55:48,480 --> 00:55:52,400
Speaker 2: we will lose the seat, We lose the votes votes.

869
00:55:52,880 --> 00:55:57,520
Speaker 2: So I say that old women shouldn't have the right

870
00:55:57,560 --> 00:56:01,680
Speaker 2: to approve because they're not doing it for the good

871
00:56:01,719 --> 00:56:05,320
Speaker 2: of the country. They're doing it for the good of themselves.

872
00:56:05,600 --> 00:56:08,040
Speaker 2: So therefore they shouldn't approve. That's what I say.

873
00:56:08,200 --> 00:56:12,560
Speaker 1: So who should approve state government? The bureaucrats, the people

874
00:56:12,640 --> 00:56:16,760
Speaker 1: below their counselor below the aldermen, the non elected person.

875
00:56:16,880 --> 00:56:23,200
Speaker 2: And I say, if the bureaucrats approve more, they should

876
00:56:23,200 --> 00:56:28,400
Speaker 2: be given bonus. You know, I was with tigers, you know,

877
00:56:28,520 --> 00:56:34,239
Speaker 2: the football, and I said, there's one way to win.

878
00:56:35,400 --> 00:56:38,640
Speaker 2: I came to them and I said, no, if you win,

879
00:56:39,760 --> 00:56:42,560
Speaker 2: each one of you gets a thousand pounds. It was

880
00:56:42,600 --> 00:56:47,320
Speaker 2: pounds there. We were the best teams. Comes some Greek

881
00:56:47,360 --> 00:56:50,480
Speaker 2: fellow and he wants to be involved. So I said,

882
00:56:50,760 --> 00:56:54,359
Speaker 2: you've involved. We've been lost every time. But I mean

883
00:56:54,400 --> 00:56:55,640
Speaker 2: that's an extreme case.

884
00:56:56,320 --> 00:56:59,680
Speaker 1: But no, but it makes sense. You incentivize people to

885
00:56:59,760 --> 00:57:02,040
Speaker 1: do things to get the right outcome. Because I actually

886
00:57:02,040 --> 00:57:04,279
Speaker 1: can I just talk about the West Tigers because most

887
00:57:04,320 --> 00:57:06,279
Speaker 1: people don't realize that Merriton was a sponsor to the

888
00:57:06,280 --> 00:57:08,160
Speaker 1: West Tigers for a long time. And you've been involved

889
00:57:08,160 --> 00:57:12,520
Speaker 1: for many, many years. Why why was originally it was

890
00:57:12,520 --> 00:57:14,799
Speaker 1: the Tigers? Why did you before they merged with West?

891
00:57:14,840 --> 00:57:17,840
Speaker 1: But why did you? What was it that got you

892
00:57:17,880 --> 00:57:20,120
Speaker 1: involved in looking after the Tigers or being involved with

893
00:57:20,160 --> 00:57:22,600
Speaker 1: the Tigers? Because you weren't born there, you didn't live there,

894
00:57:22,640 --> 00:57:23,440
Speaker 1: You lived in the East.

895
00:57:24,080 --> 00:57:28,560
Speaker 2: Well, so I told you that I was in right

896
00:57:28,680 --> 00:57:31,440
Speaker 2: for thirty five years. Yeah right, It is very close

897
00:57:31,480 --> 00:57:31,960
Speaker 2: to to.

898
00:57:33,480 --> 00:57:33,880
Speaker 1: Blain.

899
00:57:34,960 --> 00:57:39,680
Speaker 2: So I don't I just like them other though. I

900
00:57:39,760 --> 00:57:42,360
Speaker 2: used to go on the jobs and I listened on

901
00:57:42,360 --> 00:57:44,840
Speaker 2: the radio. At that time there was no television. I

902
00:57:44,880 --> 00:57:47,120
Speaker 2: listened to the radio and I like to listen to

903
00:57:47,200 --> 00:57:49,960
Speaker 2: how they were explaining that they were very good, the

904
00:57:50,000 --> 00:57:54,360
Speaker 2: guys that explained the game. So I got sucked into it.

905
00:57:55,160 --> 00:57:58,280
Speaker 1: And then and because you and I think Dawn Fraser

906
00:57:58,680 --> 00:58:00,000
Speaker 1: maybe involved with the Tigers.

907
00:58:00,120 --> 00:58:01,360
Speaker 2: He was very friendly with me.

908
00:58:01,600 --> 00:58:05,120
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, And because it seems like to me like

909
00:58:05,400 --> 00:58:08,800
Speaker 1: all the big clubs now in New South Wales and

910
00:58:08,880 --> 00:58:11,840
Speaker 1: Queensland and to the Lessex and Victoria, they all have

911
00:58:12,800 --> 00:58:17,040
Speaker 1: some very successful person who sort of sits in relation

912
00:58:17,160 --> 00:58:19,800
Speaker 1: to that club or all the clubs, the more successful

913
00:58:19,800 --> 00:58:23,440
Speaker 1: clubs have. Did you used to go I recall people

914
00:58:23,440 --> 00:58:24,640
Speaker 1: telling them us to go to the games, But you

915
00:58:24,720 --> 00:58:27,080
Speaker 1: used to go to the games, the West Tigers games.

916
00:58:27,600 --> 00:58:29,520
Speaker 1: Well watch it, go and watch the game.

917
00:58:29,920 --> 00:58:33,000
Speaker 2: Yeah. Look, I had no time to run a club.

918
00:58:34,000 --> 00:58:36,960
Speaker 2: Besides that, I don't understand anything, which is even worse

919
00:58:37,480 --> 00:58:42,000
Speaker 2: I could learn, But so I gave the money and

920
00:58:42,040 --> 00:58:46,200
Speaker 2: that's all I did. These people you talk about, they

921
00:58:46,320 --> 00:58:49,120
Speaker 2: understand the game, they love the game, and they devote

922
00:58:49,160 --> 00:58:52,640
Speaker 2: a lot of time. I have no time. That's that's

923
00:58:52,640 --> 00:58:53,440
Speaker 2: what I don't have.

924
00:58:54,280 --> 00:58:57,160
Speaker 1: So Harry, can you just talk to me for I

925
00:58:57,360 --> 00:59:01,000
Speaker 1: just get some advice from you about well maybe advice

926
00:59:01,040 --> 00:59:04,560
Speaker 1: that we can hand over to the government. How can

927
00:59:04,600 --> 00:59:07,880
Speaker 1: we solve the housing crisis in Australia. We have a

928
00:59:07,920 --> 00:59:11,080
Speaker 1: shortage of housing and if you wouldn't mind reflecting for

929
00:59:11,120 --> 00:59:15,240
Speaker 1: a moment on immigration. You know both of us come

930
00:59:15,240 --> 00:59:18,439
Speaker 1: from immigration environments, my family and your family. And I'm

931
00:59:18,440 --> 00:59:22,080
Speaker 1: the first person to say wonderful for immigration. We love

932
00:59:22,120 --> 00:59:24,680
Speaker 1: to give everybody a chance here in Australia. But what

933
00:59:24,680 --> 00:59:28,360
Speaker 1: would you say about those two issues housing supply and immigration.

934
00:59:29,720 --> 00:59:34,920
Speaker 2: See they you get Albany and he says I want

935
00:59:35,040 --> 00:59:40,400
Speaker 2: over a million houses one point two five years. But

936
00:59:41,040 --> 00:59:44,920
Speaker 2: that's where he stops. How is he going to do it? Yeah,

937
00:59:45,000 --> 00:59:49,200
Speaker 2: it's not a method of stamping a plan. That's only

938
00:59:49,240 --> 00:59:53,919
Speaker 2: the first stage. Now you take the buildings that built

939
00:59:54,000 --> 00:59:58,760
Speaker 2: now they take five years, ten years because they're huge

940
00:59:59,400 --> 01:00:05,240
Speaker 2: and there's many stages, so you can't. You have to

941
01:00:05,320 --> 01:00:09,120
Speaker 2: work out how am I going to do it? Because

942
01:00:10,320 --> 01:00:14,520
Speaker 2: there's a lot of people that want to buy, that's

943
01:00:14,560 --> 01:00:17,160
Speaker 2: no problem. They have to buy. There's no w to live,

944
01:00:17,240 --> 01:00:23,600
Speaker 2: so it's very easy. But for instance, I give you

945
01:00:23,600 --> 01:00:37,080
Speaker 2: an example. I went into housing where it was prefabricated houses.

946
01:00:38,320 --> 01:00:44,200
Speaker 2: I did no, it was very good business. But then

947
01:00:44,280 --> 01:00:47,280
Speaker 2: I made more money on units, so I stopped doing it.

948
01:00:47,960 --> 01:00:50,880
Speaker 2: So I said, well, why don't we go now in

949
01:00:51,000 --> 01:00:52,080
Speaker 2: prefabricated house?

950
01:00:55,800 --> 01:00:55,960
Speaker 1: Oh?

951
01:00:56,120 --> 01:01:01,160
Speaker 2: They see the banks don't give money buyer to the buyer.

952
01:01:01,320 --> 01:01:06,200
Speaker 2: So here's now. See it's not only the councils that

953
01:01:06,240 --> 01:01:10,000
Speaker 2: they are at fault. I say, the banks are more

954
01:01:10,080 --> 01:01:15,200
Speaker 2: at fault, apro more at fault. See I made mobile homes.

955
01:01:15,240 --> 01:01:17,800
Speaker 2: That's the way I was looking for now, So the

956
01:01:17,880 --> 01:01:21,040
Speaker 2: mobile homes is what I did. I bought a caravan

957
01:01:21,160 --> 01:01:27,320
Speaker 2: pack and I saw these very dilapidated caravans coming to

958
01:01:27,360 --> 01:01:29,680
Speaker 2: Steve the night. I said, that's not the way to

959
01:01:29,760 --> 01:01:34,560
Speaker 2: do it. I will put mobile homes. And those people

960
01:01:34,640 --> 01:01:37,880
Speaker 2: lived there, like in the flats. They lived for many years.

961
01:01:37,920 --> 01:01:42,240
Speaker 2: They were very happy there. But then I stopped. And

962
01:01:42,360 --> 01:01:45,280
Speaker 2: now they won't give them money. For instance, it will

963
01:01:45,360 --> 01:01:46,320
Speaker 2: help a lot.

964
01:01:46,720 --> 01:01:46,880
Speaker 1: And.

965
01:01:48,600 --> 01:01:56,120
Speaker 2: They they don't look at ways to assist. They have

966
01:01:56,280 --> 01:02:00,160
Speaker 2: their rules. Now. The problem with rules is they were

967
01:02:00,200 --> 01:02:03,560
Speaker 2: made a long time ago. Probably they were clever once

968
01:02:03,640 --> 01:02:09,280
Speaker 2: upon a time. You know, just a year ago. I

969
01:02:09,280 --> 01:02:13,560
Speaker 2: had a heart attack and I come to the doctor

970
01:02:14,520 --> 01:02:20,560
Speaker 2: and he tells me, Harry, we'll try to fix it.

971
01:02:20,920 --> 01:02:23,560
Speaker 2: You might live, you might die. If you live, you

972
01:02:23,680 --> 01:02:27,880
Speaker 2: might be with a wheelchairs. What shall I do? I said,

973
01:02:27,920 --> 01:02:30,480
Speaker 2: you do your best, or don't ask me. Do what

974
01:02:30,560 --> 01:02:35,000
Speaker 2: you can. They fixed it within two hours. What happened.

975
01:02:36,120 --> 01:02:39,919
Speaker 2: I was taking the medicine which was out of date

976
01:02:40,000 --> 01:02:43,920
Speaker 2: for my body. It's the same as are out of

977
01:02:44,040 --> 01:02:49,240
Speaker 2: date for today's requirements. Nothing wrong with the medicine he

978
01:02:49,320 --> 01:02:52,360
Speaker 2: gave me. I lived for a long time with that medicine,

979
01:02:52,440 --> 01:02:55,880
Speaker 2: but then the body changed. What can I do? Real

980
01:02:56,000 --> 01:02:59,400
Speaker 2: estate is the same. They have to face up to

981
01:02:59,480 --> 01:02:59,920
Speaker 2: the new.

982
01:02:59,840 --> 01:03:05,960
Speaker 1: Thing, modern noise. You're saying we should modernize in Australia, modernize.

983
01:03:06,720 --> 01:03:12,720
Speaker 2: Because it changes. You see, it's it's very hard even

984
01:03:12,800 --> 01:03:16,000
Speaker 2: for me to build these big developments because from the

985
01:03:16,080 --> 01:03:20,600
Speaker 2: time I started the time I finished, things change. For instance,

986
01:03:20,640 --> 01:03:27,800
Speaker 2: today it's quite easy to sell bigger apartments because bigger inside,

987
01:03:28,920 --> 01:03:33,760
Speaker 2: because old people own a house. So here's the problem

988
01:03:33,800 --> 01:03:37,120
Speaker 2: of money. Yeah, he sells his house and he buys.

989
01:03:37,160 --> 01:03:40,800
Speaker 2: He doesn't want two bedroom units, he wants four bedroom.

990
01:03:40,520 --> 01:03:42,760
Speaker 1: Units in three bathrooms whatever.

991
01:03:43,720 --> 01:03:50,720
Speaker 2: But that's a change you see with them. If I

992
01:03:50,800 --> 01:03:52,480
Speaker 2: come and I say I have to change this, so

993
01:03:52,600 --> 01:03:56,480
Speaker 2: that that's a huge problem, huge problem. As long as

994
01:03:56,480 --> 01:03:59,720
Speaker 2: they stick to the rules, then they are right. And

995
01:03:59,840 --> 01:04:05,040
Speaker 2: if I stick to reality, that's irrelevant. He says, that's

996
01:04:05,120 --> 01:04:08,240
Speaker 2: his rules. Now, if we want to work that way,

997
01:04:08,280 --> 01:04:12,800
Speaker 2: we will not succeed. I personally think that we as

998
01:04:12,800 --> 01:04:17,040
Speaker 2: a nation are very clever, that we manage such a

999
01:04:17,160 --> 01:04:20,880
Speaker 2: huge continent with so few people. I think we're very

1000
01:04:20,920 --> 01:04:23,960
Speaker 2: clever every time I go to service, because there I

1001
01:04:24,040 --> 01:04:29,240
Speaker 2: go out into the countryside very quickly. I can't imagine it.

1002
01:04:29,320 --> 01:04:32,720
Speaker 2: How we manage so well. It's so huge, so big.

1003
01:04:32,960 --> 01:04:35,760
Speaker 2: To bring electricity, to bring water, to bring roads, to

1004
01:04:35,760 --> 01:04:40,320
Speaker 2: bring alters. Very clever, but we can't. You can't be

1005
01:04:40,440 --> 01:04:43,480
Speaker 2: half clever. You have to be clever, and you have

1006
01:04:43,560 --> 01:04:47,040
Speaker 2: to adjust and be clever and do whatever is necessary

1007
01:04:47,120 --> 01:04:47,640
Speaker 2: at the time.

1008
01:04:47,880 --> 01:04:49,800
Speaker 1: Do you think they should stopped immigration? Do you think

1009
01:04:49,840 --> 01:04:51,680
Speaker 1: we should reduce immigration number?

1010
01:04:52,440 --> 01:04:57,320
Speaker 2: We can't. We need more immigration because if we have

1011
01:04:57,400 --> 01:05:03,080
Speaker 2: no migrants, it's very, very difficult. I can't even imagine

1012
01:05:03,240 --> 01:05:06,720
Speaker 2: how we do it now, So I say that we

1013
01:05:06,800 --> 01:05:12,800
Speaker 2: will collapse, because you see, life is so difficult in

1014
01:05:12,920 --> 01:05:15,760
Speaker 2: so much of the world that everybody would love to

1015
01:05:15,800 --> 01:05:19,400
Speaker 2: come here, not to destroy its You just want to

1016
01:05:19,400 --> 01:05:22,000
Speaker 2: come to live here. It's a good place to live.

1017
01:05:23,560 --> 01:05:27,120
Speaker 2: So if we want to run it, we must bring migrants.

1018
01:05:28,720 --> 01:05:31,439
Speaker 2: But when I talked to them about that, they say,

1019
01:05:31,640 --> 01:05:33,440
Speaker 2: you know, we have problems with vis as. We have

1020
01:05:33,520 --> 01:05:36,640
Speaker 2: probably with this as Yeah, I know now I hope

1021
01:05:36,680 --> 01:05:41,800
Speaker 2: better than you with visas. But we can't find reasons

1022
01:05:41,840 --> 01:05:46,080
Speaker 2: for not fixing it because we must fix it otherwise

1023
01:05:46,480 --> 01:05:51,200
Speaker 2: we will not run it. Now. Chinese are wonderful migrants,

1024
01:05:51,760 --> 01:05:56,080
Speaker 2: but if we bring many of them, they will take over.

1025
01:05:56,600 --> 01:06:01,160
Speaker 2: Forget about fighting. No no fighting, no fighting, because they

1026
01:06:01,160 --> 01:06:04,600
Speaker 2: are all young. Now we have many Australians are old,

1027
01:06:05,520 --> 01:06:08,880
Speaker 2: they will live longer. So there you are as one example.

1028
01:06:09,200 --> 01:06:13,720
Speaker 2: So we have to bring various types. Now. I like

1029
01:06:14,040 --> 01:06:18,400
Speaker 2: East Europeans very much because they know how to work

1030
01:06:20,160 --> 01:06:23,040
Speaker 2: and they're well educated and they will be good. I

1031
01:06:23,080 --> 01:06:26,040
Speaker 2: think South Americans are good too, But we can't just

1032
01:06:26,080 --> 01:06:29,080
Speaker 2: depend on one lot. Of course Chinese are the best.

1033
01:06:29,120 --> 01:06:31,960
Speaker 2: They have money and they work and they study, and

1034
01:06:31,960 --> 01:06:35,080
Speaker 2: the young and all this, but we can't depend on

1035
01:06:35,080 --> 01:06:40,280
Speaker 2: one type. And I mean if you talk about Vietnamese

1036
01:06:40,400 --> 01:06:44,360
Speaker 2: or a guy from Taiwan or they are still the

1037
01:06:44,360 --> 01:06:47,600
Speaker 2: same Chinese. There's no different between them. So we have

1038
01:06:47,680 --> 01:06:50,120
Speaker 2: to just make sure that we have all kinds, and

1039
01:06:51,200 --> 01:06:54,680
Speaker 2: they themselves want all kinds. If they love themselves so

1040
01:06:54,800 --> 01:06:57,080
Speaker 2: much to be Chinese, why did they come in the

1041
01:06:57,120 --> 01:06:59,840
Speaker 2: first place. We have a better way of life. That's why.

1042
01:07:00,080 --> 01:07:03,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, So I think what you're saying is that in

1043
01:07:03,560 --> 01:07:06,680
Speaker 1: order to solve this housing problem, housing crisis, it's not

1044
01:07:06,720 --> 01:07:10,560
Speaker 1: about reducing immigration. It's about getting the right mix of immigration.

1045
01:07:11,000 --> 01:07:14,240
Speaker 1: But it's also about making sure that everyone gets in

1046
01:07:14,240 --> 01:07:20,880
Speaker 1: the room somewhere together. Banks, rule makers, regulators. Of course,

1047
01:07:21,720 --> 01:07:25,600
Speaker 1: they've got to get those people in people make decisions

1048
01:07:25,680 --> 01:07:30,840
Speaker 1: about planning and governments, probably some developers as well, to

1049
01:07:30,920 --> 01:07:33,000
Speaker 1: tell them the reality of how this all works.

1050
01:07:33,520 --> 01:07:37,640
Speaker 2: Well, the problem with developers, it's in their nature. They

1051
01:07:37,800 --> 01:07:40,400
Speaker 2: like to build. As a group, they like to build.

1052
01:07:41,760 --> 01:07:48,160
Speaker 2: But where is the money. That's the problem, mainly in money.

1053
01:07:48,640 --> 01:07:53,480
Speaker 2: Now why is money? Because things change in the world now.

1054
01:07:53,680 --> 01:07:59,480
Speaker 2: Who could think that we would have to pre sell

1055
01:08:01,520 --> 01:08:05,400
Speaker 2: He bought the land believing it would be okay. But

1056
01:08:05,520 --> 01:08:08,480
Speaker 2: how can he pre sell a hundred units? He can't.

1057
01:08:08,520 --> 01:08:11,120
Speaker 1: He can't, which is what the bank's usually require to do.

1058
01:08:11,280 --> 01:08:15,200
Speaker 2: Now they require, but we never heard of it before,

1059
01:08:15,600 --> 01:08:20,200
Speaker 2: he says. So that's why cottages are doing better, because

1060
01:08:20,240 --> 01:08:24,679
Speaker 2: cottages he only has one. The guy who builds units

1061
01:08:24,760 --> 01:08:25,160
Speaker 2: must have.

1062
01:08:25,160 --> 01:08:27,680
Speaker 1: One hundred, and he might have the pre Celle fifty.

1063
01:08:28,320 --> 01:08:31,800
Speaker 2: To get production. I don't mean to build a few

1064
01:08:31,920 --> 01:08:36,360
Speaker 2: units in double Bay. Yeah, that will not solve his problem.

1065
01:08:36,520 --> 01:08:39,160
Speaker 2: That will only use the grandmother's money. That he'll do.

1066
01:08:39,600 --> 01:08:45,800
Speaker 2: But that's an like preserve bank. She goes, she's very

1067
01:08:46,200 --> 01:08:49,360
Speaker 2: big stickler for rules, which is I'm sure she's right,

1068
01:08:50,120 --> 01:08:53,400
Speaker 2: but first of all, the rules may not be even correct.

1069
01:08:53,439 --> 01:08:56,960
Speaker 2: Then who knows what they are? Their rules? But you

1070
01:08:57,120 --> 01:08:59,479
Speaker 2: try and shift it, you can't. She says, that's the rules,

1071
01:08:59,520 --> 01:09:00,760
Speaker 2: that's it. What do you want me to do?

1072
01:09:00,960 --> 01:09:03,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, like they're two to three percent inflation. She's saying,

1073
01:09:03,400 --> 01:09:06,479
Speaker 1: unless we have inflation between two and three percent, I

1074
01:09:06,560 --> 01:09:10,080
Speaker 1: have to keep the interest rate up high. It's a rule.

1075
01:09:11,360 --> 01:09:13,479
Speaker 1: And I have wonder's two to three percent right? Or

1076
01:09:13,600 --> 01:09:16,760
Speaker 1: maybe maybe three to four is better? Or why can't

1077
01:09:16,760 --> 01:09:19,320
Speaker 1: we just because if if three to four percent was

1078
01:09:19,360 --> 01:09:22,760
Speaker 1: the inflation rate but your love birthday, then our interest

1079
01:09:22,800 --> 01:09:25,240
Speaker 1: rate will come down of courhich means it makes housing

1080
01:09:25,320 --> 01:09:28,120
Speaker 1: more affordable for everybody because they can now borrow some money.

1081
01:09:29,120 --> 01:09:34,320
Speaker 1: So how do you start this, Harry? Like, who who

1082
01:09:34,400 --> 01:09:37,280
Speaker 1: is it that starts this process of because you know

1083
01:09:37,400 --> 01:09:39,600
Speaker 1: Albanizi gets up and says that, like I'm going to

1084
01:09:40,320 --> 01:09:42,040
Speaker 1: talk to all the state premiers and we're all going

1085
01:09:42,080 --> 01:09:43,559
Speaker 1: to make a decision. We're going to build one point

1086
01:09:43,600 --> 01:09:46,439
Speaker 1: two million houses in the next five years. We're nowhere

1087
01:09:46,479 --> 01:09:48,800
Speaker 1: near it. Nowhere near it because at the end of

1088
01:09:48,840 --> 01:09:51,680
Speaker 1: the day, he doesn't build them, the premier doesn't build them.

1089
01:09:52,080 --> 01:09:54,519
Speaker 1: Someone like you build them, and other people, new people

1090
01:09:54,720 --> 01:09:57,960
Speaker 1: build them different to you. But say, let's say it's

1091
01:09:58,000 --> 01:10:00,200
Speaker 1: anyone else. They have to borrow money from the bank,

1092
01:10:00,600 --> 01:10:02,080
Speaker 1: and they want to borrow money from the bank, and

1093
01:10:02,120 --> 01:10:04,080
Speaker 1: the bank says you do, got to do pre sales.

1094
01:10:04,760 --> 01:10:06,360
Speaker 1: And then the pre sales means you've got to get

1095
01:10:06,400 --> 01:10:08,920
Speaker 1: people to commit, and a lot of people won't commit

1096
01:10:08,960 --> 01:10:11,680
Speaker 1: because they can't get They won't I'm not going to

1097
01:10:11,680 --> 01:10:14,519
Speaker 1: commit to buy something from you before you've even built

1098
01:10:14,560 --> 01:10:16,720
Speaker 1: it if I got to pay you ten percent now

1099
01:10:16,760 --> 01:10:18,840
Speaker 1: and I'm going to pay you the balance into your something.

1100
01:10:19,000 --> 01:10:21,080
Speaker 1: If I can't get a loan approval, if I can't

1101
01:10:21,080 --> 01:10:23,960
Speaker 1: get a pre approval from the bank. So it's a

1102
01:10:23,960 --> 01:10:27,200
Speaker 1: bit of a goes around one big circle. So where

1103
01:10:27,200 --> 01:10:29,800
Speaker 1: does it start, Like who starts this conversation? Is that

1104
01:10:29,840 --> 01:10:32,519
Speaker 1: Matt Common from CBA, the boss of CBO. Who starts

1105
01:10:32,520 --> 01:10:38,240
Speaker 1: this conversation? Which leader, who's the person who should it be?

1106
01:10:39,040 --> 01:10:42,599
Speaker 2: All right, in my opinion, it should be the government

1107
01:10:43,560 --> 01:10:48,960
Speaker 2: because they can change the rules. CBA can change the

1108
01:10:49,000 --> 01:10:53,880
Speaker 2: part of the bank. I don't know if he wants

1109
01:10:53,960 --> 01:10:59,439
Speaker 2: to change, but say he does, he could, he should change.

1110
01:10:59,600 --> 01:11:04,519
Speaker 2: That will help a lot, I said, the government with

1111
01:11:04,880 --> 01:11:09,880
Speaker 2: the way of proving and accepting things. That and then

1112
01:11:10,080 --> 01:11:14,280
Speaker 2: the banks. But it's together, one without the other can't

1113
01:11:14,320 --> 01:11:14,599
Speaker 2: do it.

1114
01:11:14,880 --> 01:11:16,640
Speaker 1: So that tells me, Harry, that we won't have a

1115
01:11:16,680 --> 01:11:20,400
Speaker 1: solution because not everyone's been brought into the room at once.

1116
01:11:21,040 --> 01:11:23,800
Speaker 1: I don't think so. Therefore, that tells me that the

1117
01:11:23,840 --> 01:11:27,439
Speaker 1: actual will of the government doesn't exist. They say things

1118
01:11:27,479 --> 01:11:31,040
Speaker 1: popular sounds good, and you need to say this, mister

1119
01:11:31,080 --> 01:11:33,080
Speaker 1: Prime minister. You need to say this, mister Treasure. That's

1120
01:11:33,120 --> 01:11:37,800
Speaker 1: their advisor. But there's no follow through. You couldn't. If

1121
01:11:37,880 --> 01:11:41,040
Speaker 1: you decide to build a building, you've got to follow through.

1122
01:11:41,840 --> 01:11:47,120
Speaker 1: You've got to have all the team behind you. You know, brickies,

1123
01:11:47,120 --> 01:11:50,000
Speaker 1: everyone's ready. Everyone can be ready. As soon as you

1124
01:11:50,000 --> 01:11:50,800
Speaker 1: say go, they go.

1125
01:11:51,080 --> 01:11:51,519
Speaker 2: That's it.

1126
01:11:51,960 --> 01:11:54,920
Speaker 1: The governments could be the same. Do you ever get

1127
01:11:54,960 --> 01:11:57,040
Speaker 1: asked by this as Albany, is he ever called you?

1128
01:11:57,560 --> 01:12:01,120
Speaker 2: I went once with Rudd yep Rad had a meeting

1129
01:12:01,160 --> 01:12:04,880
Speaker 2: with his advisers and I was there and I look

1130
01:12:04,920 --> 01:12:07,840
Speaker 2: at poor Rad. One guy says this, and the other

1131
01:12:07,880 --> 01:12:11,680
Speaker 2: guy says that, and the other right now, and he

1132
01:12:11,800 --> 01:12:15,759
Speaker 2: since they doesn't know. So he wanted to bring Opera

1133
01:12:16,200 --> 01:12:20,599
Speaker 2: because she would bring American tourists. I said, Rad, listen

1134
01:12:20,680 --> 01:12:26,080
Speaker 2: to this. Go to the airport and see how many

1135
01:12:26,160 --> 01:12:30,160
Speaker 2: American planes you have and how many Asian planes you have.

1136
01:12:30,800 --> 01:12:34,559
Speaker 2: So Opera has no chance. They don't come here. You

1137
01:12:34,680 --> 01:12:37,720
Speaker 2: have to go after people that come, not the ones

1138
01:12:37,760 --> 01:12:38,479
Speaker 2: who thought.

1139
01:12:38,439 --> 01:12:40,759
Speaker 1: Come Chinese and Indians and Japanese.

1140
01:12:40,800 --> 01:12:43,519
Speaker 2: I told him. But I mean, but he has everybody

1141
01:12:43,560 --> 01:12:48,759
Speaker 2: telling him different things, too many advisers and the advice

1142
01:12:48,840 --> 01:12:52,200
Speaker 2: for different reasons to please him, to please themselves. Who

1143
01:12:52,200 --> 01:12:53,799
Speaker 2: knows why they as the advice.

1144
01:12:54,439 --> 01:12:56,800
Speaker 1: So who if you've seen lots of prime ministers in

1145
01:12:56,840 --> 01:12:59,640
Speaker 1: this country, lots, I mean, you get back as far.

1146
01:13:00,000 --> 01:13:01,719
Speaker 2: I had problems with Howard as well.

1147
01:13:01,960 --> 01:13:03,600
Speaker 1: But who is the best prime minister you think we

1148
01:13:03,680 --> 01:13:04,200
Speaker 1: ever had?

1149
01:13:04,320 --> 01:13:07,880
Speaker 2: No? Well, Howard's very good, very good. Yeah, he was

1150
01:13:07,880 --> 01:13:10,839
Speaker 2: a good all rounder. He made the mistake at the answer.

1151
01:13:10,840 --> 01:13:17,719
Speaker 2: It was because he didn't believe that Australians couldn't pay

1152
01:13:18,000 --> 01:13:22,839
Speaker 2: high rates of interest. I told him they can't, look can't.

1153
01:13:23,160 --> 01:13:26,080
Speaker 2: But anyway, he did a terrific job. I think he

1154
01:13:26,200 --> 01:13:29,040
Speaker 2: was very good and he was a good type of

1155
01:13:29,040 --> 01:13:29,840
Speaker 2: a fellow, like.

1156
01:13:29,840 --> 01:13:31,880
Speaker 1: He got on with everybody.

1157
01:13:32,880 --> 01:13:37,600
Speaker 2: I hope that that will get in. He seems to

1158
01:13:37,640 --> 01:13:40,639
Speaker 2: be okay too, but still hasn't got in yet first,

1159
01:13:40,640 --> 01:13:44,799
Speaker 2: but we'll see. But we need somebody that's definitely different

1160
01:13:44,960 --> 01:13:48,679
Speaker 2: from what we have there is now. That's not because

1161
01:13:48,720 --> 01:13:52,360
Speaker 2: they're nice people. Not nice people. They just stick to

1162
01:13:52,400 --> 01:13:56,200
Speaker 2: the rules. And there are no rules written for twenty

1163
01:13:56,280 --> 01:13:58,960
Speaker 2: or fifty years ahead. There's no rules. You have to

1164
01:13:59,000 --> 01:13:59,799
Speaker 2: make them yourself.

1165
01:14:00,280 --> 01:14:03,920
Speaker 1: Harry, you've recently, which is pretty unusual, you've done something

1166
01:14:03,960 --> 01:14:07,000
Speaker 1: pretty crazy. You've had a book written. Is it like

1167
01:14:07,560 --> 01:14:09,200
Speaker 1: a biography of your life?

1168
01:14:10,080 --> 01:14:10,240
Speaker 2: Is it?

1169
01:14:10,560 --> 01:14:11,679
Speaker 1: Is it about your life?

1170
01:14:12,080 --> 01:14:12,280
Speaker 2: Yeah?

1171
01:14:12,439 --> 01:14:15,240
Speaker 1: It's called yeah, your book High Rise, Harry.

1172
01:14:15,360 --> 01:14:19,160
Speaker 2: I just wrote the book. Yep. It's just arrived from China.

1173
01:14:19,840 --> 01:14:22,240
Speaker 1: What do you mean from because you had a print

1174
01:14:22,280 --> 01:14:22,599
Speaker 1: in China.

1175
01:14:23,000 --> 01:14:23,200
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1176
01:14:25,640 --> 01:14:27,920
Speaker 1: And why did why did you decide to do this?

1177
01:14:28,720 --> 01:14:31,280
Speaker 1: Why did you decide to do this? Now? At your age,

1178
01:14:32,120 --> 01:14:34,720
Speaker 1: do you want to set the record or for your grandchildren?

1179
01:14:34,840 --> 01:14:35,400
Speaker 1: What is it.

1180
01:14:37,520 --> 01:14:40,120
Speaker 2: To write the book when I am young. It's too

1181
01:14:40,200 --> 01:14:43,120
Speaker 2: early because it's still a long way to go. At

1182
01:14:43,120 --> 01:14:45,280
Speaker 2: this stage, I'm at the right age, so I can

1183
01:14:45,360 --> 01:14:49,000
Speaker 2: write the book. Because I've done most of it, there's

1184
01:14:49,080 --> 01:14:52,000
Speaker 2: not much left, so it doesn't matter now. The main

1185
01:14:52,080 --> 01:14:54,800
Speaker 2: thing is that I find the people that will continue.

1186
01:14:54,880 --> 01:14:58,160
Speaker 2: That's the main thing. Right. They seem to want, which

1187
01:14:58,200 --> 01:15:04,160
Speaker 2: is very important. So this was the right time. And

1188
01:15:05,840 --> 01:15:13,120
Speaker 2: I thought that some people always ask me, Harry, how

1189
01:15:13,160 --> 01:15:15,840
Speaker 2: did you make it? How can we make it? So

1190
01:15:16,240 --> 01:15:19,000
Speaker 2: I wrote how I did it? So if they can

1191
01:15:19,080 --> 01:15:20,920
Speaker 2: do the same way, well they'll be all right.

1192
01:15:21,760 --> 01:15:25,280
Speaker 1: So the book gets published was being released in December

1193
01:15:25,560 --> 01:15:30,720
Speaker 1: this year. This year it's called high Rise. Harry is

1194
01:15:30,800 --> 01:15:32,720
Speaker 1: like a big thick book. Is it easy to read?

1195
01:15:33,360 --> 01:15:36,160
Speaker 1: Is it easy to read? Or very easy to read?

1196
01:15:36,600 --> 01:15:38,559
Speaker 1: And it's about your life story, how you made it,

1197
01:15:39,439 --> 01:15:43,960
Speaker 1: what sort of things that you did? So what one

1198
01:15:44,080 --> 01:15:48,280
Speaker 1: or two things would you say to some ambitious young

1199
01:15:48,360 --> 01:15:51,960
Speaker 1: man or woman who just wants to make it, Well,

1200
01:15:52,000 --> 01:15:55,840
Speaker 1: you know, what are the characteristics that Harry Triggerbov used

1201
01:15:55,880 --> 01:15:57,959
Speaker 1: to become successful?

1202
01:15:59,560 --> 01:16:04,240
Speaker 2: They might go into the right field like I was

1203
01:16:04,280 --> 01:16:09,880
Speaker 2: in textiles, and I pointed out seventy years ago that

1204
01:16:09,960 --> 01:16:15,400
Speaker 2: it's rubbished, so it's no good wasting time there somebody.

1205
01:16:16,680 --> 01:16:20,639
Speaker 2: Then you have to work hard. You have because if

1206
01:16:20,680 --> 01:16:24,000
Speaker 2: you work hard, there's a chance they will work hard.

1207
01:16:24,160 --> 01:16:27,040
Speaker 2: But if you will bludge, they will bludge more, so

1208
01:16:27,280 --> 01:16:35,320
Speaker 2: you won't last. Then I think it's important to collect

1209
01:16:35,560 --> 01:16:42,519
Speaker 2: the people around you who have the same ambition. If

1210
01:16:42,560 --> 01:16:45,479
Speaker 2: they don't want to succeed, you won't succeed. They have

1211
01:16:45,520 --> 01:16:51,280
Speaker 2: to all succeed together. It's a joint effort and they

1212
01:16:51,360 --> 01:16:55,680
Speaker 2: must get on with each other. That's very important. So

1213
01:16:55,880 --> 01:16:58,840
Speaker 2: if you can do all that, then I think you

1214
01:16:58,880 --> 01:17:02,479
Speaker 2: have a chance because there is always demand for something,

1215
01:17:04,120 --> 01:17:06,160
Speaker 2: so you have to find out where is the demand

1216
01:17:06,200 --> 01:17:07,080
Speaker 2: and you go there.

1217
01:17:07,479 --> 01:17:12,160
Speaker 1: So you feature in the book quite a lot about

1218
01:17:12,160 --> 01:17:15,760
Speaker 1: women and how important women in business in your in

1219
01:17:15,840 --> 01:17:19,599
Speaker 1: terms of your success, Like where do you? A lot

1220
01:17:19,600 --> 01:17:22,760
Speaker 1: of people don't, especially us old generation, We tend not

1221
01:17:22,800 --> 01:17:25,400
Speaker 1: to have dealt with women that much because that's just

1222
01:17:25,439 --> 01:17:28,840
Speaker 1: the way society was. But in your case, women have

1223
01:17:28,840 --> 01:17:31,519
Speaker 1: been very important in your success. Yeah, what would you

1224
01:17:31,560 --> 01:17:32,160
Speaker 1: say about that?

1225
01:17:32,560 --> 01:17:33,160
Speaker 2: But women?

1226
01:17:33,320 --> 01:17:34,479
Speaker 1: Yeah in business?

1227
01:17:34,840 --> 01:17:45,160
Speaker 2: In business, yeah right, women at that time didn't have

1228
01:17:46,920 --> 01:17:50,679
Speaker 2: high education as a group. I mean, I'm not talking

1229
01:17:50,680 --> 01:17:54,719
Speaker 2: about academics. They're not they're not with me, do something else.

1230
01:17:57,120 --> 01:18:02,040
Speaker 2: And they are families. So when I had a milker,

1231
01:18:02,000 --> 01:18:05,080
Speaker 2: and I remember we used to deliver five six bottles

1232
01:18:05,080 --> 01:18:07,920
Speaker 2: of milk at night, so they were they had big

1233
01:18:07,960 --> 01:18:12,240
Speaker 2: families and they were responsible to bring up the children.

1234
01:18:13,280 --> 01:18:18,439
Speaker 2: They had this responsibility which was very very important, and

1235
01:18:18,640 --> 01:18:28,400
Speaker 2: I found that they would try their best and stop

1236
01:18:28,439 --> 01:18:34,040
Speaker 2: at nothing to succeed. They wanted to succeed. That's why

1237
01:18:34,080 --> 01:18:37,640
Speaker 2: I liked them. The women today and the men. They

1238
01:18:37,640 --> 01:18:40,000
Speaker 2: were much closer together to what they used to be

1239
01:18:40,439 --> 01:18:46,519
Speaker 2: in those days. They were very very different. But I

1240
01:18:46,560 --> 01:18:52,000
Speaker 2: always admired the women because they had common sense. If

1241
01:18:52,000 --> 01:18:56,439
Speaker 2: you talk to her, I'm talking the ones in the beginning, right,

1242
01:18:57,240 --> 01:19:00,719
Speaker 2: They had common sense. It was very easy to talk.

1243
01:19:02,360 --> 01:19:04,400
Speaker 2: I found very easy for me to talk to them.

1244
01:19:04,920 --> 01:19:11,519
Speaker 2: And I think that they're very important now and I

1245
01:19:11,720 --> 01:19:17,960
Speaker 2: look forward and hope that they will succeed again, because

1246
01:19:18,000 --> 01:19:20,840
Speaker 2: as I say, it's easy to talk to them.

1247
01:19:21,160 --> 01:19:28,160
Speaker 1: I will see Harry, you're ninety one, and God willing,

1248
01:19:28,240 --> 01:19:33,120
Speaker 1: you will live to another twenty years. But maybe in

1249
01:19:33,200 --> 01:19:37,880
Speaker 1: ten years you might want to decide to retire. Who's

1250
01:19:37,920 --> 01:19:40,599
Speaker 1: going to take over your empire.

1251
01:19:41,360 --> 01:19:44,800
Speaker 2: Well, at present, I have two people who are quite good.

1252
01:19:45,000 --> 01:19:48,639
Speaker 1: You're already running a succession Planeah.

1253
01:19:48,000 --> 01:19:54,400
Speaker 2: Of course, yeah. And I want them to come up

1254
01:19:54,439 --> 01:19:58,960
Speaker 2: with ideas and do what they can. Yeah, because in

1255
01:19:59,000 --> 01:20:02,960
Speaker 2: our company, people always came from within. It's not that

1256
01:20:03,040 --> 01:20:05,080
Speaker 2: I went and I picked up somebody there here.

1257
01:20:05,160 --> 01:20:07,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, you're not head hunting. You don't go ahead, no, no, no.

1258
01:20:09,000 --> 01:20:11,600
Speaker 1: You watch them rise through the ranks, and you you

1259
01:20:11,880 --> 01:20:16,559
Speaker 1: you select from your own people. So you have you

1260
01:20:16,680 --> 01:20:20,720
Speaker 1: have succession plans. I have yet, how many years you

1261
01:20:20,880 --> 01:20:23,760
Speaker 1: have you been doing this for now? Succession plans? Or

1262
01:20:24,080 --> 01:20:26,640
Speaker 1: is it just more recently that you've decided.

1263
01:20:26,720 --> 01:20:33,040
Speaker 2: More well, not many years, maybe three four years? But continue?

1264
01:20:33,520 --> 01:20:36,040
Speaker 1: How is it that Harry Drigobov is so confident about

1265
01:20:36,200 --> 01:20:39,559
Speaker 1: his longevity? Like it doesn't it doesn't even seem like

1266
01:20:39,600 --> 01:20:42,280
Speaker 1: something you think about, Like it's it's like you think

1267
01:20:42,320 --> 01:20:45,160
Speaker 1: you live forever? Or do you sometimes think to yourself, no,

1268
01:20:45,400 --> 01:20:49,920
Speaker 1: maybe you know it's years a going by. I got

1269
01:20:49,960 --> 01:20:52,120
Speaker 1: so many Christmas left, so many.

1270
01:20:52,720 --> 01:20:55,680
Speaker 2: When I started, they laughed at me. They said I

1271
01:20:55,680 --> 01:20:58,599
Speaker 2: didn't know building. I said, I don't know building. You're

1272
01:20:58,640 --> 01:21:01,559
Speaker 2: quite right, but pay the bill, that's what I know

1273
01:21:04,200 --> 01:21:17,000
Speaker 2: now I'm very lucky. See the body gets old. You

1274
01:21:17,120 --> 01:21:22,120
Speaker 2: take my ears, they were never good, they're hopeless. Now

1275
01:21:22,960 --> 01:21:26,800
Speaker 2: you take my eyes, always very good, very good now

1276
01:21:26,920 --> 01:21:31,320
Speaker 2: same the eye doctors. They can't believe that they're so good.

1277
01:21:31,840 --> 01:21:37,400
Speaker 2: So getting old doesn't mean that all of you gets old.

1278
01:21:39,320 --> 01:21:43,639
Speaker 2: So just as I could build without knowing how to build,

1279
01:21:44,000 --> 01:21:48,439
Speaker 2: but I got the right people, I believe I can

1280
01:21:48,560 --> 01:21:51,799
Speaker 2: last a few more.

1281
01:21:51,680 --> 01:21:54,519
Speaker 1: Years, hopefully more than a few more years. Harry, I

1282
01:21:54,600 --> 01:21:56,479
Speaker 1: am my mom. I want to interview you again in

1283
01:21:56,479 --> 01:21:58,920
Speaker 1: a couple of years time. And what do you reckon

1284
01:21:58,960 --> 01:22:02,000
Speaker 1: is your I mean a lot of buildings. What is

1285
01:22:02,040 --> 01:22:04,640
Speaker 1: one of the fondest memories of a building that you

1286
01:22:04,720 --> 01:22:08,120
Speaker 1: built that you feel very fond about? You know, maybe

1287
01:22:08,479 --> 01:22:11,439
Speaker 1: is a world Square for example, or what is is

1288
01:22:11,479 --> 01:22:13,320
Speaker 1: the Bondo junction stuff? Or is what you're doing in

1289
01:22:13,320 --> 01:22:16,599
Speaker 1: the Gold Coast? Where do you have the fondest memories of, say,

1290
01:22:16,760 --> 01:22:18,479
Speaker 1: a building that you really love.

1291
01:22:19,439 --> 01:22:24,320
Speaker 2: What I love the most is when I solve problems.

1292
01:22:25,120 --> 01:22:27,760
Speaker 2: That's what I love most. I will tell you how

1293
01:22:27,800 --> 01:22:30,479
Speaker 2: I solved that problem and the problem, and they make

1294
01:22:30,560 --> 01:22:33,720
Speaker 2: me problems all the time, don't worry. So that's what

1295
01:22:33,760 --> 01:22:38,720
Speaker 2: I like the best, not the actual structure. That's the

1296
01:22:38,760 --> 01:22:42,280
Speaker 2: problem with the actual structure is today this is the best.

1297
01:22:42,280 --> 01:22:45,719
Speaker 2: Tomorrow that's better. Yeah, they get better all the time.

1298
01:22:46,240 --> 01:22:49,400
Speaker 2: So that's very nice to see. Yes, but I like

1299
01:22:49,479 --> 01:22:50,160
Speaker 2: to solve.

1300
01:22:49,920 --> 01:22:52,559
Speaker 1: Problems and which is one of the examples you gave

1301
01:22:52,680 --> 01:22:54,840
Speaker 1: is the bondo junction problem building on top of a

1302
01:22:54,880 --> 01:22:58,000
Speaker 1: bus depot on a railway station when probably no one

1303
01:22:58,040 --> 01:23:00,640
Speaker 1: else could, you know, like maybe someone else could, but

1304
01:23:00,640 --> 01:23:02,479
Speaker 1: no one else really wanted to take on the problem.

1305
01:23:02,640 --> 01:23:03,960
Speaker 2: No, they wouldn't think of it.

1306
01:23:04,000 --> 01:23:06,639
Speaker 1: And that's that's where you excel though. You say that

1307
01:23:07,040 --> 01:23:09,160
Speaker 1: when someone else doesn't want to do something somewhere, I

1308
01:23:09,240 --> 01:23:12,200
Speaker 1: will do it and I can solve it. That's what

1309
01:23:12,280 --> 01:23:16,960
Speaker 1: you love the most. So in terms of it, let's

1310
01:23:16,960 --> 01:23:19,839
Speaker 1: talk about investors. Young people want to buy some property

1311
01:23:19,920 --> 01:23:23,000
Speaker 1: for they like to buy an apartment. Okay, where would

1312
01:23:23,040 --> 01:23:25,280
Speaker 1: you say if we young Australians would be the best

1313
01:23:25,320 --> 01:23:27,400
Speaker 1: place to invest in today?

1314
01:23:28,040 --> 01:23:34,200
Speaker 2: I always say in a pharmacy. Pharmacy people get old,

1315
01:23:35,720 --> 01:23:40,040
Speaker 2: the doctors get better, there's more medicine, the government always

1316
01:23:40,080 --> 01:23:41,960
Speaker 2: pays very good.

1317
01:23:42,439 --> 01:23:46,439
Speaker 1: Become pharmacist. Highlight that too. What about property there? Where

1318
01:23:46,439 --> 01:23:48,360
Speaker 1: would you where would they buy real estate? Where would

1319
01:23:48,360 --> 01:23:50,000
Speaker 1: you say, go buy your apartment for good?

1320
01:23:50,280 --> 01:23:54,479
Speaker 2: Page is good, but to build it very complicated, especially

1321
01:23:54,479 --> 01:23:55,960
Speaker 2: today they made this complicated.

1322
01:23:56,400 --> 01:23:59,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, government, well the system very hard.

1323
01:24:00,240 --> 01:24:00,439
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1324
01:24:00,720 --> 01:24:03,559
Speaker 1: But would you say, because I mean we're talking earlier

1325
01:24:03,560 --> 01:24:07,000
Speaker 1: on outside, but gold Coast looks like it's not the

1326
01:24:07,000 --> 01:24:08,479
Speaker 1: same as it used to be. Gold Coast used to

1327
01:24:08,520 --> 01:24:10,200
Speaker 1: go up and go down, and go up and down.

1328
01:24:10,240 --> 01:24:13,559
Speaker 1: There was a bit, lots of variations. Gold Coast seems

1329
01:24:13,600 --> 01:24:16,200
Speaker 1: to be one of your more preferred areas right now.

1330
01:24:16,520 --> 01:24:20,960
Speaker 2: Yes, because I say that my main problem are the councils,

1331
01:24:21,439 --> 01:24:27,080
Speaker 2: and the councils there in Brisbane as well are much

1332
01:24:27,120 --> 01:24:30,599
Speaker 2: easier to work with because with these fellows here, you

1333
01:24:30,600 --> 01:24:34,519
Speaker 2: don't know what they'll do tomorrow. They don't know come

1334
01:24:34,600 --> 01:24:38,639
Speaker 2: up with crazy ideas. They don't seem to think about

1335
01:24:38,680 --> 01:24:42,120
Speaker 2: the consequences. The idea might be all right, but there

1336
01:24:42,160 --> 01:24:43,200
Speaker 2: are consequences.

1337
01:24:44,080 --> 01:24:47,799
Speaker 1: So Harry, last question, and I really appreciate your time today.

1338
01:24:50,360 --> 01:24:53,479
Speaker 1: What do you want to be? And maybe you never

1339
01:24:53,520 --> 01:24:54,880
Speaker 1: thought of this, but what do you want to be

1340
01:24:54,920 --> 01:24:58,360
Speaker 1: remembered for? I mean, what do you want to day?

1341
01:24:58,479 --> 01:25:01,599
Speaker 1: Really worried what I'm remembering you don't care. I never cared.

1342
01:25:02,040 --> 01:25:07,960
Speaker 1: I never cared. I say I was never like welcome, welcome.

1343
01:25:08,000 --> 01:25:11,680
Speaker 1: He said you wanted to thry. Yeah, he wanted to

1344
01:25:11,760 --> 01:25:15,000
Speaker 1: be the prime minister. I never wanted.

1345
01:25:16,120 --> 01:25:18,160
Speaker 2: I just wanted to do my job and that's all

1346
01:25:18,200 --> 01:25:18,880
Speaker 2: I did.

1347
01:25:19,680 --> 01:25:22,960
Speaker 1: And you're happy with If you look back now, do

1348
01:25:22,960 --> 01:25:25,519
Speaker 1: you reckon? You've done a pretty good job.

1349
01:25:25,600 --> 01:25:28,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, very good. Yeah, I'm very happy with what.

1350
01:25:28,800 --> 01:25:31,479
Speaker 1: Yeah, so you're the happiest you've ever been, sort of

1351
01:25:31,880 --> 01:25:32,880
Speaker 1: within reson.

1352
01:25:33,120 --> 01:25:34,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm very happy.

1353
01:25:34,479 --> 01:25:36,360
Speaker 1: You liked a better run one hundred meters flat out,

1354
01:25:36,400 --> 01:25:39,440
Speaker 1: but better, I mean other than that, given your age,

1355
01:25:39,760 --> 01:25:40,320
Speaker 1: you're happy.

1356
01:25:40,640 --> 01:25:41,519
Speaker 2: Yeah, very happy.

1357
01:25:42,040 --> 01:25:44,679
Speaker 1: That's you know, it's a not many people can say that.

1358
01:25:45,360 --> 01:25:46,519
Speaker 1: Not many people can say that.

1359
01:25:46,720 --> 01:25:52,719
Speaker 2: No, because well, as I said when I started to build,

1360
01:25:52,760 --> 01:25:56,599
Speaker 2: I couldn't build when I'm old. I can't do many things,

1361
01:25:56,920 --> 01:25:59,519
Speaker 2: but as long as I can do the important thing

1362
01:26:00,200 --> 01:26:04,200
Speaker 2: about the rest, nobody can do everything. That's that's what

1363
01:26:04,240 --> 01:26:08,080
Speaker 2: we should all remember. You have to pick something where

1364
01:26:08,200 --> 01:26:12,000
Speaker 2: you are good at, which is important. That's your answer

1365
01:26:12,080 --> 01:26:16,200
Speaker 2: to success. Don't try to be good at everything, because

1366
01:26:16,200 --> 01:26:18,559
Speaker 2: nobody can be good at everything. But you have to

1367
01:26:18,600 --> 01:26:22,559
Speaker 2: be good the important thing that you only you will

1368
01:26:22,600 --> 01:26:23,519
Speaker 2: know when you.

1369
01:26:23,520 --> 01:26:25,720
Speaker 1: Work Harry Trick both I want to thank you for

1370
01:26:25,840 --> 01:26:28,360
Speaker 1: sharing your wisdom. I want to thank you for actually

1371
01:26:28,360 --> 01:26:30,559
Speaker 1: sharing your time here to be frank with you and

1372
01:26:30,680 --> 01:26:33,519
Speaker 1: make good luck with the book High Rise Harry, out

1373
01:26:33,560 --> 01:26:37,519
Speaker 1: in the bookstores in December twenty twenty four. Thanks Harry,

1374
01:26:37,840 --> 01:26:41,120
Speaker 1: Thank you,