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Speaker 1: Hmm a poache production.

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Speaker 2: For the record, I'm done trying to make you uncomfortable

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Speaker 2: for the record. You ain't trying to grow downy stuff

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Speaker 2: for your for the record, laugh on me going all

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Speaker 2: the way for the record. Ain't trying to link, No,

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Speaker 2: trying to waste for.

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Speaker 3: The record, for the record, for the for the record,

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Speaker 3: for the red for the record, for the record.

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Speaker 4: For the record.

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Speaker 2: I'm done trying to make you uncomfortable.

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Speaker 5: Welcome back to Season sixteen Off the Clink, Real Stories

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Speaker 5: of Redemption, to big shoutout to put Shape, Sideway Surf

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Speaker 5: and Clink Cleaning high pressure and softwa services. If you

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Speaker 5: need anything high pressure, washed or soft washed, make sure

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Speaker 5: you reach out to Clink Cleaning. You will find them

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Speaker 5: on all social media platforms. Tell them that the Clink

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Speaker 5: sent you. Today's guest is a wonderful woman who's doing

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Speaker 5: amazing things and has a wonderful, dark, deep story that

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Speaker 5: will inspire.

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Speaker 4: Chrysola Desnya. Welcome to the.

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Speaker 6: Clink, Thanks Brent, thanks for having me on.

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Speaker 7: Now I'm gonna I'm gonna, I'm gonna share this because

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Speaker 7: ptably are gonna go why they laugh? So your your

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Speaker 7: your beautiful name, your beautiful grecor name is it's a name.

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Speaker 5: I really really pride myself on trying to always make

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Speaker 5: sure I know who I'm talking to and I intro

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Speaker 5: you any guests without making a mistake. I don't know

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Speaker 5: how many times I tripped up introduce you said it so.

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Speaker 6: Well the first fear shines.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, oh did I not say it right?

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Speaker 1: The last time, well, pretty close.

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Speaker 4: It's Crsula Chrysula.

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Speaker 6: There you go. Perfect, that's it.

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Speaker 4: I'm unbelievable.

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Speaker 5: Hey, listen, thank you for your time, and look, welcome

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Speaker 5: to the clink. It's a fantastic story of yours that

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Speaker 5: I know a little bit of. I know there's some

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Speaker 5: very deep traumatic parts of that journey that really had

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Speaker 5: a downward spiral in your life for around about twenty years,

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Speaker 5: I believe, and I personally have seen the photos on

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Speaker 5: your socials and wow, looking at you now, you just

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Speaker 5: couldn't say that's the same person. So all I want

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Speaker 5: to say is you look amazing. Congratulations. Recovery must be

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Speaker 5: just unbelievable. And I know what you're putting in as

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Speaker 5: I do follow your journey through your social media parts,

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Speaker 5: and wow, what a fantastic journey.

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Speaker 4: You're on.

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Speaker 1: Thank you. Yeah, it's weird. It feels like it feels

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Speaker 1: like this is my chapter two since I've been clean

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Speaker 1: in my recovery, Like my chapter one, I thought that'd

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Speaker 1: be me forever.

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Speaker 6: I just thought that was me, a krim An addict forever.

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Speaker 6: That was all I knew.

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Speaker 1: But then come to find this, just to get into

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Speaker 1: my recovery and to discover this new version of myself

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Speaker 1: and be on this chapter two.

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Speaker 4: It's like I.

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Speaker 1: Feel like this was a life I was born to live,

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Speaker 1: but I didn't discover it until I was thirty three.

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Speaker 4: Well it's never too late, yea.

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Speaker 5: My life choice has changed around that same stage. You know,

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Speaker 5: it's something that I don't look when it's meant to.

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Speaker 4: Be, it'll be.

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Speaker 5: And you know, I don't think that where really in

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Speaker 5: a position where we can look back and go say, oh, look,

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Speaker 5: I wish I should have could have would have known,

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Speaker 5: because we wouldn't be sitting here having this conversation right there,

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Speaker 5: and you wouldn't be on that beautiful, righteous path, that healthy,

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Speaker 5: amazing journey where you're inspiring so many people through your

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Speaker 5: actions daily and have the experience and knowledge that you

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Speaker 5: now have to be able to give back and help

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Speaker 5: many others. So, you know, a credit to you and

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Speaker 5: to anybody out there that's listening today that's in recovery

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Speaker 5: or that you know, easy in addiction looking.

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Speaker 4: For a way out.

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Speaker 5: I hope that this story today truly inspires you and

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Speaker 5: it's a it's a pretty amazing journey, you know, it's

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Speaker 5: I'm always, I guess not blown away because it's something

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Speaker 5: that we all have the choice to do, and we

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Speaker 5: all know the consequences when we do either pick up

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Speaker 5: the pipe, the needle, the straw, whatever we want to do,

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Speaker 5: the bong. There are consequences for anything that we do

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Speaker 5: in life, and drugs have massive consequences.

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Speaker 4: Let's go back to some earlier years.

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Speaker 5: Let's give our listeners a little bit of insight into

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Speaker 5: your background and how life was for you growing up,

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Speaker 5: maybe as a young person into your teens, and where

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Speaker 5: it all began.

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Speaker 6: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So I grew up as an only child in a

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Speaker 1: rural country town in Perth. My mum was a racehorse

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Speaker 1: trainer and she had her own property and business, but

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Speaker 1: she did it all by herself, so she really had

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Speaker 1: Oh sorry, I go back. My dad was there up

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Speaker 1: until I was about maybe seven or eight, and then

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Speaker 1: he left and left us there. I felt kind of

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Speaker 1: left me on my own to fend for myself with

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Speaker 1: my mum because at that time we didn't have a

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Speaker 1: good relationship.

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Speaker 6: She was pretty harsh.

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Speaker 1: She was pretty hard, but I guess as I grew

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Speaker 1: up and reflected back, that was all she knew how.

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Speaker 6: To be, how to survive. There was a lot of

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Speaker 6: I would.

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Speaker 1: Have said abuse, and when I was that age, I

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Speaker 1: would have said there was a lot of abuse, But

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Speaker 1: then looking back at it, I think it's just kind

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Speaker 1: of discipline before discipline and the nine you know in

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Speaker 1: the eighties, sorry, in the nineties.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, the old time.

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Speaker 6: Now it would be abuse back, Yeah, the specially under

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Speaker 6: the ears. Yeah.

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Speaker 5: You can't raise your kids these days without being told

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Speaker 5: that it's inappropriate.

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Speaker 6: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: No, But I thought I was pretty hardly done by,

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Speaker 1: and I guess I had felt that as well, because

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Speaker 1: there wasn't much love there.

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Speaker 6: There wasn't ever any you know, you're doing great.

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Speaker 4: Job, or like.

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Speaker 1: Taking me to looking at my homework with me, or

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Speaker 1: I don't know, taking me to swimming or whatever. You know,

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Speaker 1: just things that other parents got did with their children

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Speaker 1: that I saw my friends got from their parents.

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Speaker 6: I was left of fend for myself a lot.

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Speaker 1: Because my mum was gone before I woke four am

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Speaker 1: and she didn't come back until like seven or eight

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Speaker 1: pm in the evening.

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Speaker 6: So I was just by myself a lot and fending.

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Speaker 4: From how old were you at this age?

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Speaker 1: This was from when I was a child up until

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Speaker 1: you know, when I was a baby up until then.

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Speaker 6: My dad was there until I was about seven or eight.

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Speaker 1: And then he left and then it was just me

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Speaker 1: and I was there until I was just high school age,

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Speaker 1: so about.

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Speaker 6: Twelve eleven or twelve. Yeah, so from maybe seven and

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Speaker 6: eight to eleven twelve, I was just kind of fending

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Speaker 6: for myself a lot. So I was by myself a

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Speaker 6: lot as well, sisters just me.

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Speaker 1: So it was a pretty isolated, lonely life because we're

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Speaker 1: out on a farm on a property, rural. I didn't

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Speaker 1: have any friends around close to me, or brothers and sisters.

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Speaker 1: It was just me with the horses. You know, I

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Speaker 1: had horses, So that was a that was a luxury.

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Speaker 1: That was that was nice and I guess I found

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Speaker 1: my love for animals growing up.

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Speaker 6: On that farm.

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Speaker 1: But as well as the isolation that my mum always

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Speaker 1: had people coming and going because she had stable hands

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Speaker 1: that would live there, that would live in the house

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Speaker 1: in a spare room that we had there.

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Speaker 6: One of those stable hands sexually abused me when I

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Speaker 6: was sorry. I was.

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Speaker 1: Nine, maybe nine or ten. I kind of blocked it out, and.

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Speaker 6: It resurfaced a few years later.

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Speaker 1: I completely blocked it out, and when it resurfaced, I

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Speaker 1: told my mum, and I remember where we were at

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Speaker 1: the time. I remember very little about those years, like

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Speaker 1: it's just a blur, but I remember this specifically time,

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Speaker 1: telling her. We're driving down the street in her truck

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Speaker 1: and I told her what had happened, and she exploded.

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Speaker 1: She was like, a.

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Speaker 6: Fucking bassard, I'll fucking kill him. I'll shoot him.

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Speaker 1: Burroh.

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Speaker 6: And that was it, you know that that was all.

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Speaker 1: There was an outburst and she's like, I'll fucking find

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Speaker 1: him and I'll kill him. But then that was it.

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Speaker 1: It never got brought up again, never got talked about,

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Speaker 1: never got you know, maybe you should get some help

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Speaker 1: or anything.

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Speaker 6: It was just that was it.

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Speaker 8: But you know, looking back to it, do you think

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Speaker 8: that basically, and as a survivor, I totally relate to

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Speaker 8: what you're talking about.

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Speaker 4: There and the day I told my father that I had.

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Speaker 5: Been raped and sexually abused for a long time, and

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Speaker 5: it just was like I got a backhand for it.

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Speaker 5: Do you think that Mum was maybe in denial because

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Speaker 5: of the fact that you know it was just you

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Speaker 5: and her, and that the reality of it is you're

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Speaker 5: a very vulnerable young young person, young woman, with no

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Speaker 5: male presence, no one there to protect. Do you think

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Speaker 5: that she may have just sort of taken all that

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Speaker 5: in in that way and felt, I've got to shut

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Speaker 5: this out myself, for it was just more deaf eve.

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Speaker 1: I don't know.

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Speaker 6: Maybe she felt like she had failed me by not

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Speaker 6: being there.

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Speaker 4: I don't know.

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Speaker 1: She certainly didn't express it that way, but I can

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Speaker 1: only guess that perhaps she felt I wasn't there for

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Speaker 1: my daughter, but then didn't know how to deal with

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Speaker 1: it because she'd never been given given tools to deal

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Speaker 1: with emotional hardships like that herself. She was brought up

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Speaker 1: in the age of something hard, how something bad happens,

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Speaker 1: you get over it, you get on with it, you

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Speaker 1: push on, you live another day, you work through it.

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Speaker 6: You know, hard enough, tough enough, So that was kind.

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Speaker 1: Of what she pushed forward and perhaps she felt some

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Speaker 1: guilt there, but then I'm guessing she just didn't really

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Speaker 1: know how to deal with that, so that's why she

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Speaker 1: never brought it up again.

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Speaker 4: I think there's a father and as a father of

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Speaker 4: a daughter.

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Speaker 5: If my daughter was to come to me in any way,

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Speaker 5: shape or form and be suggestive that she'd been interfered with,

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Speaker 5: I don't think for a second that I wouldn't listen

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Speaker 5: and act immediately.

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Speaker 4: How did you feel? How did you feel?

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Speaker 5: If you don't mind me asking, And I mean, obviously

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Speaker 5: I can tell the obvious, but for our listeners, how

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Speaker 5: did you take that that no one was there to listen,

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Speaker 5: to help, to protect, to even do anything about it

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Speaker 5: for you?

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Speaker 1: Look, I think that's probably when I started to just

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Speaker 1: get hardened to the world and think, fuck everybody, Fuck

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Speaker 1: the world, nobody loves me, nobody's there for me, and

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Speaker 1: I kind of developed this attitude of I'm just going

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Speaker 1: to do whatever the fuck I want. I'm going to

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Speaker 1: take what I want. I'm going to do what I want.

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Speaker 1: Nobody has been there to protect me or care for me,

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Speaker 1: so I don't care anymore. And I guess that's probably

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Speaker 1: where that started, and it just developed and developed and just.

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Speaker 6: Got worse and worse as I got older. But that's

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Speaker 6: probably where it started.

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Speaker 5: I think for a lot of people out there, and

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Speaker 5: we do have a lot of listeners that are survivors,

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Speaker 5: and look, I often say to everybody that we have

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Speaker 5: on as a guest or our listeners that please, guys,

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Speaker 5: do take care and anything that may be triggering through

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Speaker 5: our talk today, if you're not coping with that, then

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Speaker 5: please reach out and do talk to somebody. Feel free

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Speaker 5: to DM me or anybody that you may know that

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Speaker 5: you trust enough to chat with.

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Speaker 4: But you know, I I find it, how do I

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Speaker 4: put it?

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Speaker 5: Fucking sickening for starters, And secondly, it builds even now

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Speaker 5: hearing your story. We don't know each other personally, but

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Speaker 5: I see you, and I feel you know our conversation,

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Speaker 5: and I know a little bit about your background story,

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Speaker 5: and I think now you know these traumatic times are

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Speaker 5: so triggering and have such an impact on the.

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Speaker 4: Next phases of our lives.

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Speaker 5: You know, people don't get why people fall into addictions,

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Speaker 5: why people become suicidal, while people just totally become imploded

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Speaker 5: and anti everybody, anti world, anti love, anti fucking care.

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Speaker 4: It is a big fuck you to everyone.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, these these actions from these perpetrators destroy lives. It's

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Speaker 5: as simple as that. It doesn't matter if it was

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Speaker 5: just a once off incident or whether it was a

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Speaker 5: reoccurring incident. We lose people, and.

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Speaker 4: People like ourselves that are survivors that are still here

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Speaker 4: to help and tell the story.

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Speaker 5: And I know you're giving so much back to others

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Speaker 5: out there in support, and you know through your your

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Speaker 5: healthier choices in life that.

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Speaker 4: It's it's a blessing that we talk so.

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Speaker 5: Much about it today and bring it to the surface,

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Speaker 5: because you're right, years ago it was just like shond Off.

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Speaker 5: It was like like you said, harden up or in

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Speaker 5: my case, a backhand, and I don't ever fucking say

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Speaker 5: that again.

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Speaker 4: You know, things like that. Imagine that today it just

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Speaker 4: it just wouldn't. It wouldn't happen. And as much as

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Speaker 4: I feel in my heart that we're reducing the rate

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Speaker 4: of sexual abuse victims because we're speaking out so much,

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Speaker 4: people are so much more onto it and aware of it.

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Speaker 5: As opposed to everything was always swept under the carpet. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 5: you know, it's it is a terrible, terrible thing. And

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Speaker 5: from did this person or or why don't we give

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Speaker 5: him the credit of person. Did this perpetrate to this scum?

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Speaker 5: Did it continue or once it was spoken of, he

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Speaker 5: was gone, disappeared or I mean, how was it for

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Speaker 5: you living around knowing that this was had happened to you,

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Speaker 5: and did you have to confront that person daily?

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Speaker 4: No?

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Speaker 1: Look, they were afloat in float out, like she had

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Speaker 1: a lot of people that just came for a few

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Speaker 1: weeks and then they were off again. And to be honest,

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Speaker 1: I can't remember much else around that time of except

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Speaker 1: for the event when it happened.

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Speaker 6: To my memory, it was only.

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Speaker 1: One time, and I don't even know what happened to

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Speaker 1: him after then because I've blocked it all out.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, so no, I don't. I just don't remember much

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Speaker 6: around that time.

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Speaker 1: But I certainly don't have any memories of being awkward

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Speaker 1: in the house with him still being there. So maybe

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Speaker 1: it was just, you know, he was just there for

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Speaker 1: a brief time and then out again. But I was

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Speaker 1: definitely changed after that. You know, I was already resentful

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Speaker 1: of my mum and of the life that I had

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Speaker 1: because I felt so alone and unloved and nobody was

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Speaker 1: there or cared for me. But I guess that was

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Speaker 1: just kind of the loading of the gun, the you know,

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Speaker 1: the icing on the cake that kind of pushed me.

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Speaker 4: So we're talking about a twelve year old.

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Speaker 6: No, I was younger then, I was maybe nine.

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Speaker 4: What continued after this?

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Speaker 1: So I stayed in New York until I was high

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Speaker 1: school age, and then my mum and dad thought that

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Speaker 1: I should come down to a perth school, city school

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Speaker 1: to get a better education. But moving me from the

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Speaker 1: country to the city, it was just like a whole

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Speaker 1: playground of a whole playground.

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Speaker 4: To run wild, and whole playground of fuck you.

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Speaker 6: Yeah yeah, because you're where I grew up.

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Speaker 1: It was one street, very small. I had begun shoplifting

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Speaker 1: there because.

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Speaker 6: I found this it was only one shot there really

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Speaker 6: to shoplift from. And I'd found.

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Speaker 1: I liked the feeling of giving somebody something and then

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Speaker 1: being so grateful for it.

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Speaker 6: And I've realized now, I think it's just because I

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Speaker 6: got no.

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Speaker 1: Affirmations or no love or anything growing up. So when

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Speaker 1: i'd give someone a gift, they'd be like, oh, thank you,

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Speaker 1: thank you, and I'd feel like I'd done something right.

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Speaker 1: And that that carried on for years and years and

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Speaker 1: then I when I came down to the city, I

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Speaker 1: started to steal, not only for other people but for myself,

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Speaker 1: and I would became addicted to stealing shoplifting, and I

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Speaker 1: would just shoplift for the hell of it.

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Speaker 6: Sometimes.

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Speaker 1: I went to a school down here, and I kind

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Speaker 1: of it was a I got put in a private

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Speaker 1: school for a little bit, and I kind of gravitated

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Speaker 1: towards the other girls that were out cast there, I guess,

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Speaker 1: and we you know, smoked a little dope and stuff.

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Speaker 1: And I eventually got kicked out of that or asked

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Speaker 1: to leave from that school, and I went to an

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Speaker 1: alternative school or public school.

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Speaker 6: So and I gravitated then again towards other people that were.

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Speaker 1: Hurt and wanting to just like fuck the world and

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Speaker 1: just run right and just funck sit up, you know,

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Speaker 1: just take out the torment that they'd had in their life.

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Speaker 1: And I started hanging out with people that were stealing

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Speaker 1: cars and smoking dope and breaking into houses.

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Speaker 6: And I got into that.

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Speaker 1: And then one day I was driving a stolen car

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Speaker 1: and I got in a police chase and got tea

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Speaker 1: barred from the side and I had to get cut

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Speaker 1: out with the jaws. Life I had broken ribs and

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Speaker 1: a scratched up head, a good glass in my head,

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Speaker 1: and some broken broken fracture pelvis and they had me

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Speaker 1: on pethodine and morphine in the hospital for about a

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Speaker 1: week straight, and then as soon as they got me

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Speaker 1: on crutches, they kicked me out with no painkillers. And like,

350
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Speaker 1: I was in agony, not only physically, but I was

351
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Speaker 1: just yeah, I was in absolutely agony. I was like,

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Speaker 1: I have to I have to find something to take

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Speaker 1: this pain away. And I knew some people and I

354
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Speaker 1: was just like, you know, can you help me? And anyway,

355
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Speaker 1: I got given heroin for the first time, and that

356
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Speaker 1: first time I smoked it, and I remember thinking, there

357
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Speaker 1: goes all my physical pain, but there goes all the

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Speaker 1: voices in my head, all the noise in my head.

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Speaker 6: It's quiet.

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Speaker 5: Now.

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00:18:52,761 --> 00:18:56,240
Speaker 1: I feel like this is how I want to feel forever.

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Speaker 1: Like all the internal dialogue had gone, all the you're

363
00:19:00,041 --> 00:19:02,440
Speaker 1: not good enough, you're shit, you'll never be anything, that

364
00:19:02,561 --> 00:19:03,041
Speaker 1: was all gone.

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Speaker 6: It was just silent there, and I.

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Speaker 1: Remember thinking, this is this is what I want to

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Speaker 1: this is how I want to feel forever.

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Speaker 5: And it's it's very interesting you say that. Yeah, I

369
00:19:17,201 --> 00:19:20,601
Speaker 5: growing up that was obviously the drug of choice.

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00:19:20,360 --> 00:19:20,961
Speaker 4: In that era.

371
00:19:21,961 --> 00:19:25,001
Speaker 5: The gear was very, very big, and you know, through

372
00:19:25,041 --> 00:19:28,640
Speaker 5: the nineties, I had a lot of friends that chase

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Speaker 5: the dragon and ended up basically using and a lot

374
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Speaker 5: that passed. And you know, I've seen them to the

375
00:19:36,080 --> 00:19:37,721
Speaker 5: point where they've turned blue in front of me and

376
00:19:37,761 --> 00:19:40,080
Speaker 5: I've had to try and get them to a hospital.

377
00:19:40,160 --> 00:19:43,481
Speaker 5: And it's you know, the one thing they always said

378
00:19:43,640 --> 00:19:45,521
Speaker 5: was very similar to what you just said, You just

379
00:19:46,080 --> 00:19:49,440
Speaker 5: takes you to this beautiful, dreamy place that it just

380
00:19:49,801 --> 00:19:53,801
Speaker 5: takes away everything that is shit, all bad, all pain,

381
00:19:54,120 --> 00:19:59,400
Speaker 5: and you know, it's it's it's something that I don't

382
00:19:59,600 --> 00:20:02,321
Speaker 5: think or don't want people to go out and try

383
00:20:02,360 --> 00:20:05,321
Speaker 5: and chase and find, but it's such a common thing

384
00:20:05,400 --> 00:20:08,600
Speaker 5: that people that have used the gear do saying you

385
00:20:08,681 --> 00:20:11,801
Speaker 5: can just start to appreciate why it has such a

386
00:20:11,840 --> 00:20:15,200
Speaker 5: hold on you take away the physical addiction once it

387
00:20:15,241 --> 00:20:19,360
Speaker 5: becomes the aches and the pains and the body shutdowns

388
00:20:19,360 --> 00:20:20,121
Speaker 5: and everything like that.

389
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Speaker 4: But that first initial hit is.

390
00:20:22,961 --> 00:20:26,080
Speaker 5: One I could never work out because, like I said,

391
00:20:26,080 --> 00:20:28,561
Speaker 5: I'd seen the mates over the years and some of

392
00:20:28,600 --> 00:20:32,281
Speaker 5: them literally would be head between the league's power spewing

393
00:20:32,481 --> 00:20:34,561
Speaker 5: and others have just beyond the nod in this bliss.

394
00:20:34,600 --> 00:20:35,840
Speaker 4: Can you talk us through?

395
00:20:36,080 --> 00:20:38,080
Speaker 5: And I'd love for you to be able to explain

396
00:20:38,160 --> 00:20:41,480
Speaker 5: to people that don't know and don't understand why it

397
00:20:41,561 --> 00:20:44,520
Speaker 5: has such a stronghold on people, and what it is

398
00:20:44,561 --> 00:20:48,120
Speaker 5: about the gear that once you start injecting there's no

399
00:20:48,241 --> 00:20:48,840
Speaker 5: coming back.

400
00:20:50,721 --> 00:20:53,600
Speaker 1: Well, like I said, that first initial hit, and I

401
00:20:53,681 --> 00:20:56,961
Speaker 1: suppose most people have heard this, that the first high

402
00:20:57,041 --> 00:20:58,721
Speaker 1: is always the best and you never get a high

403
00:20:58,801 --> 00:21:02,120
Speaker 1: like that ever again, but you always chase it. You

404
00:21:02,961 --> 00:21:05,600
Speaker 1: even I guess even when people go into the knowing

405
00:21:05,681 --> 00:21:08,241
Speaker 1: this knowledge, do you still always chase it because you're

406
00:21:08,281 --> 00:21:12,640
Speaker 1: hoping to get that total oblivion, that total bliss, that

407
00:21:12,840 --> 00:21:18,281
Speaker 1: feeling of just you know that nothing can beat smoking

408
00:21:18,321 --> 00:21:21,321
Speaker 1: It is fine, I guess, But you know, I was

409
00:21:21,360 --> 00:21:25,080
Speaker 1: told by other people that injecting it straight into the vein,

410
00:21:25,160 --> 00:21:27,201
Speaker 1: you feel it a lot quicker and a lot stronger,

411
00:21:28,160 --> 00:21:32,201
Speaker 1: and it lasts for a bit longer, and it's cheaper,

412
00:21:32,360 --> 00:21:37,681
Speaker 1: it's more economical to inject it. So that's what I did.

413
00:21:37,840 --> 00:21:40,041
Speaker 1: And then once I'd done that, I was just no

414
00:21:40,201 --> 00:21:43,680
Speaker 1: turning back, absolutely no turning back. I was always trying

415
00:21:43,681 --> 00:21:46,680
Speaker 1: to get I guess, as cliche as it sounds, that

416
00:21:46,761 --> 00:21:51,080
Speaker 1: first high again, you know, just to get obliterated again.

417
00:21:51,880 --> 00:21:54,720
Speaker 1: He just became he just chased your tail, you know,

418
00:21:54,840 --> 00:21:56,161
Speaker 1: always trying to get that high again.

419
00:21:57,281 --> 00:21:59,160
Speaker 4: How much gear were you using daily?

420
00:21:59,441 --> 00:22:01,440
Speaker 1: So when I started, it was maybe just a packet

421
00:22:01,481 --> 00:22:04,761
Speaker 1: a day, and a packet is like a point of

422
00:22:04,801 --> 00:22:08,721
Speaker 1: gear fifty to one hundred bucks back then. And then

423
00:22:08,761 --> 00:22:11,321
Speaker 1: my tolerance became more and I'd have to start using

424
00:22:11,360 --> 00:22:15,200
Speaker 1: quarter weights or half weights. And then I realized I

425
00:22:15,241 --> 00:22:18,081
Speaker 1: couldn't really afford that. How I would afford it was stealing.

426
00:22:18,120 --> 00:22:20,321
Speaker 1: I'd steal from shops and I'd sell that or swap

427
00:22:20,360 --> 00:22:24,761
Speaker 1: that with dealers. And I found I wasn't able to

428
00:22:24,761 --> 00:22:27,321
Speaker 1: steal enough to support my habits. So I started buying

429
00:22:27,400 --> 00:22:32,080
Speaker 1: larger amounts and then selling smaller packets to other addicts

430
00:22:32,080 --> 00:22:34,641
Speaker 1: that I knew, And I did that for a few

431
00:22:34,721 --> 00:22:37,440
Speaker 1: years whilst I was still a teenager and I was

432
00:22:37,441 --> 00:22:42,441
Speaker 1: living at my grandmother's house, and I, you know, buy

433
00:22:42,640 --> 00:22:46,001
Speaker 1: a big enough amount for me, which was probably just

434
00:22:46,041 --> 00:22:48,321
Speaker 1: a couple of full weights, which you know is pretty

435
00:22:48,321 --> 00:22:51,080
Speaker 1: small stuff. But at that time I could just have

436
00:22:51,201 --> 00:22:55,001
Speaker 1: my own, have my own each day, and then sell

437
00:22:55,041 --> 00:22:57,720
Speaker 1: the rest, and I was a small time dealer, you know,

438
00:22:57,840 --> 00:23:02,080
Speaker 1: but that was all I needed at that time. But

439
00:23:03,281 --> 00:23:06,120
Speaker 1: as well with that life came hanging out with other criminals,

440
00:23:06,360 --> 00:23:11,160
Speaker 1: so I wasn't just dealing and using. I was also

441
00:23:11,160 --> 00:23:13,160
Speaker 1: getting into trouble with other people because I still had

442
00:23:13,201 --> 00:23:17,241
Speaker 1: to like fuck the world attitude. There was a lot

443
00:23:17,281 --> 00:23:23,600
Speaker 1: of breaking into houses and cars, and like, being where

444
00:23:23,640 --> 00:23:26,521
Speaker 1: I am now in society, I kind of cringe a

445
00:23:26,561 --> 00:23:30,761
Speaker 1: little inside saying that because I fucking hate little cars.

446
00:23:31,001 --> 00:23:32,920
Speaker 1: That breaking the cars or breaking the houses, you know

447
00:23:32,961 --> 00:23:35,360
Speaker 1: what I mean, and steal people's hard earned shit, like

448
00:23:35,441 --> 00:23:39,000
Speaker 1: I work hard for my stuff. But back then I

449
00:23:39,001 --> 00:23:42,561
Speaker 1: didn't care. I had no respect for myself and I

450
00:23:42,561 --> 00:23:45,920
Speaker 1: had no respect for anybody else. So I didn't care.

451
00:23:48,360 --> 00:23:49,761
Speaker 1: And obviously do you.

452
00:23:49,640 --> 00:23:53,521
Speaker 5: Find though that did you find though with that fact

453
00:23:53,561 --> 00:23:57,200
Speaker 5: of not caring or obviously a major part of it,

454
00:23:57,281 --> 00:24:02,480
Speaker 5: but also too you had to have that hit because

455
00:24:02,521 --> 00:24:05,761
Speaker 5: the sickness that would come. They're really is no option,

456
00:24:05,921 --> 00:24:08,961
Speaker 5: but you need to get on every day for breakfast, lunch,

457
00:24:09,041 --> 00:24:11,961
Speaker 5: and dinner sort of thing. You know, it becomes food

458
00:24:12,001 --> 00:24:13,640
Speaker 5: for the body, and if you don't have it, you

459
00:24:13,640 --> 00:24:19,480
Speaker 5: don't function and you know you can speak firsthand of

460
00:24:19,481 --> 00:24:21,840
Speaker 5: what that's like, because it's something that I can only

461
00:24:21,880 --> 00:24:24,281
Speaker 5: say that I've seen that you've gived it.

462
00:24:25,080 --> 00:24:26,960
Speaker 1: Look, I can't even remember the first time I went

463
00:24:27,001 --> 00:24:30,521
Speaker 1: through withdrawal, but I do know that it was a rude,

464
00:24:30,521 --> 00:24:33,001
Speaker 1: fucking shock. Like every time I went through withdrawal was

465
00:24:33,120 --> 00:24:38,200
Speaker 1: just horrible, Like the worst experience of my life. And

466
00:24:38,281 --> 00:24:45,321
Speaker 1: I mean it, it was different. It was worse and

467
00:24:45,441 --> 00:24:47,720
Speaker 1: during some years than it was on other years because

468
00:24:48,721 --> 00:24:50,801
Speaker 1: some periods of my addiction I had a way, way,

469
00:24:50,840 --> 00:24:53,600
Speaker 1: way higher tolerance. I was using a lot more drugs,

470
00:24:53,600 --> 00:24:56,360
Speaker 1: so then coming off that was just like ten xt

471
00:24:56,481 --> 00:24:59,160
Speaker 1: on what it was coming off, you know, using one

472
00:24:59,241 --> 00:25:00,880
Speaker 1: hundred bucks or one hundred and fifty bucks worth of

473
00:25:00,921 --> 00:25:06,080
Speaker 1: drugs a day, and it was just horrend and yeah,

474
00:25:06,120 --> 00:25:08,041
Speaker 1: something I never wanted to go through, So I was

475
00:25:08,080 --> 00:25:10,801
Speaker 1: always chasing together. It was like a full time job,

476
00:25:11,241 --> 00:25:13,761
Speaker 1: having to get on every day and having to make

477
00:25:13,761 --> 00:25:15,321
Speaker 1: sure that I had something for the next shot.

478
00:25:15,681 --> 00:25:18,321
Speaker 5: Yeah, that's exactly what it becomes, and that's why it

479
00:25:18,441 --> 00:25:22,640
Speaker 5: is such a lifestyle like we you know today. And

480
00:25:22,681 --> 00:25:25,281
Speaker 5: I've had many a guess on that have been in

481
00:25:25,281 --> 00:25:29,600
Speaker 5: addiction and functioning every day, Like some some some guests

482
00:25:29,640 --> 00:25:33,080
Speaker 5: that I've had on have held down professional jobs, but

483
00:25:33,201 --> 00:25:37,120
Speaker 5: yet you know they're always to ice, they eat a sleep,

484
00:25:37,521 --> 00:25:38,361
Speaker 5: they do and I.

485
00:25:38,360 --> 00:25:42,041
Speaker 9: Just go, how Yeah, that always blows my mind, Like

486
00:25:43,041 --> 00:25:45,080
Speaker 9: I don't definitely don't think I'd be capable of holding

487
00:25:45,120 --> 00:25:48,721
Speaker 9: down a functioning and having a normal member of society.

488
00:25:48,801 --> 00:25:52,041
Speaker 1: But having that addiction on the side, it's just all

489
00:25:52,120 --> 00:25:52,880
Speaker 1: consuming for me.

490
00:25:53,481 --> 00:25:56,561
Speaker 4: It's crazy, isn't it, because the power that it has over.

491
00:25:56,400 --> 00:26:00,801
Speaker 5: You mentally even to be able to, you know, function

492
00:26:01,041 --> 00:26:04,761
Speaker 5: and I guess speak to people because it does change

493
00:26:04,761 --> 00:26:06,120
Speaker 5: your life whole personality.

494
00:26:06,481 --> 00:26:08,600
Speaker 4: Where were you living at that stage? Was it more

495
00:26:08,640 --> 00:26:09,481
Speaker 4: living on the streets?

496
00:26:09,481 --> 00:26:11,440
Speaker 5: I know you said with your grandmother, But did there

497
00:26:11,481 --> 00:26:13,921
Speaker 5: come a time where Nan had sort of gone, hey,

498
00:26:14,120 --> 00:26:15,241
Speaker 5: something's not right here.

499
00:26:15,921 --> 00:26:18,440
Speaker 4: You know you either stop or move out. Was there

500
00:26:18,441 --> 00:26:20,481
Speaker 4: any of that sort of talk or was she supportive

501
00:26:20,521 --> 00:26:23,920
Speaker 4: in that respective knowing that you really were hitting rock bottom?

502
00:26:23,921 --> 00:26:25,041
Speaker 4: I mean, how was that for Nan?

503
00:26:25,281 --> 00:26:28,720
Speaker 1: Look as ashamed as it makes me say this, this

504
00:26:28,801 --> 00:26:32,360
Speaker 1: is probably one of the biggest things I feel shame

505
00:26:32,481 --> 00:26:35,561
Speaker 1: and guilt around is the way I treated my manner

506
00:26:35,840 --> 00:26:40,680
Speaker 1: and the things that she saw. She's gone now. She

507
00:26:40,801 --> 00:26:43,360
Speaker 1: passed just after I got clean. But she was my

508
00:26:43,441 --> 00:26:47,481
Speaker 1: biggest and only supporter. I won't say only, but so.

509
00:26:47,441 --> 00:26:49,840
Speaker 5: She got to see you healthy, but she got to

510
00:26:49,880 --> 00:26:54,361
Speaker 5: see you just beat the cycle, just how good God

511
00:26:54,521 --> 00:26:55,041
Speaker 5: gave it up.

512
00:26:55,080 --> 00:26:58,561
Speaker 1: She left. Some people say that maybe she was hanging

513
00:26:58,600 --> 00:27:01,001
Speaker 1: on until I got clean, because she always knew that

514
00:27:01,041 --> 00:27:03,041
Speaker 1: I get clean. She always had faith when all the

515
00:27:03,041 --> 00:27:05,721
Speaker 1: rest of the family said, leave her up on her,

516
00:27:06,281 --> 00:27:09,041
Speaker 1: just stop stop wasting your time, your money, your energy,

517
00:27:09,360 --> 00:27:12,561
Speaker 1: leave her, let her go. Everyone said that to her.

518
00:27:12,561 --> 00:27:15,840
Speaker 1: In the end, she never gave up. Never She saw

519
00:27:15,921 --> 00:27:19,321
Speaker 1: something in me that nobody else ever saw. She knew

520
00:27:19,360 --> 00:27:20,481
Speaker 1: that I would be.

521
00:27:22,281 --> 00:27:22,561
Speaker 4: Fuck.

522
00:27:23,281 --> 00:27:25,321
Speaker 1: She knew that I would that I had good things.

523
00:27:25,840 --> 00:27:26,960
Speaker 4: You're right, take a moment.

524
00:27:27,441 --> 00:27:29,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, I've never that's never come up before.

525
00:27:30,400 --> 00:27:31,881
Speaker 4: You had a lot of love for I can see

526
00:27:31,880 --> 00:27:32,400
Speaker 4: in your eyes.

527
00:27:32,441 --> 00:27:34,280
Speaker 5: I can see the way that you speak, you know,

528
00:27:34,360 --> 00:27:37,600
Speaker 5: and even when you're talking, you're looking up as if

529
00:27:37,721 --> 00:27:39,401
Speaker 5: you know she's looking down on you now.

530
00:27:39,481 --> 00:27:42,401
Speaker 4: And it's something can you if I can say this

531
00:27:42,600 --> 00:27:44,961
Speaker 4: and I'm only just picking up.

532
00:27:44,840 --> 00:27:47,201
Speaker 5: A little bit about your personality now, and it's something

533
00:27:47,281 --> 00:27:51,561
Speaker 5: that I sort of have and you I'm sure living

534
00:27:51,561 --> 00:27:53,561
Speaker 5: the life you have lived. Body language is a big

535
00:27:53,600 --> 00:27:57,080
Speaker 5: thing when you look at people, and you know, I'm

536
00:27:57,281 --> 00:27:58,120
Speaker 5: really big on it.

537
00:27:59,201 --> 00:28:02,241
Speaker 4: You obviously carry a lot of your end strength.

538
00:28:03,640 --> 00:28:06,041
Speaker 5: When I sort of see what I see in you

539
00:28:06,321 --> 00:28:10,081
Speaker 5: and what I do know and your daily goings on

540
00:28:10,160 --> 00:28:12,801
Speaker 5: and things like that. To be where you were, to

541
00:28:12,921 --> 00:28:16,120
Speaker 5: have you know, fought so hard to be where you

542
00:28:16,160 --> 00:28:19,801
Speaker 5: are today. That strength has to come from somewhere, because

543
00:28:20,880 --> 00:28:25,960
Speaker 5: anybody in addiction, especially with heroin, it is so hard

544
00:28:26,201 --> 00:28:28,441
Speaker 5: and it is ugly. I mean, I've had mates where

545
00:28:28,441 --> 00:28:32,721
Speaker 5: I won't say kidnapped, but held them in hotel rooms,

546
00:28:32,761 --> 00:28:34,521
Speaker 5: you know, flown them to places so they.

547
00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:35,360
Speaker 4: Couldn't be near the gear.

548
00:28:35,400 --> 00:28:37,921
Speaker 5: And I've watched them just get to the point where

549
00:28:38,281 --> 00:28:41,881
Speaker 5: they literally will find gear, doesn't matter where they are.

550
00:28:42,001 --> 00:28:44,361
Speaker 5: They could hunt it, smell it, whatever, you know, and

551
00:28:44,401 --> 00:28:47,521
Speaker 5: they just couldn't beat it. And some of them are

552
00:28:47,561 --> 00:28:50,361
Speaker 5: no longer with us. They couldn't deal with the battle

553
00:28:50,361 --> 00:28:54,440
Speaker 5: any longer. The strength that you show and how you

554
00:28:54,521 --> 00:28:56,801
Speaker 5: live your life today is a credit to you, and

555
00:28:57,321 --> 00:29:00,881
Speaker 5: I'm taking that. NaN's definitely obviously in your corner.

556
00:29:01,481 --> 00:29:06,720
Speaker 1: Yeah, definitely. There were some times there when I was

557
00:29:06,721 --> 00:29:11,801
Speaker 1: living with her one in particular that I remember where

558
00:29:11,801 --> 00:29:17,081
Speaker 1: she found me odeed, almost dead, and it was a

559
00:29:17,121 --> 00:29:20,240
Speaker 1: time where she was in the house and then she

560
00:29:20,321 --> 00:29:22,281
Speaker 1: came in my room and she said she's going out

561
00:29:22,321 --> 00:29:25,561
Speaker 1: to run errands or whatever. She see me later, I said, okay, bye,

562
00:29:25,881 --> 00:29:27,761
Speaker 1: knew the coast was clear, so I had my shot.

563
00:29:28,041 --> 00:29:33,121
Speaker 1: I had my shot and I odeed. She forgot something,

564
00:29:33,921 --> 00:29:36,081
Speaker 1: you know, And this is not the first time this

565
00:29:36,161 --> 00:29:38,841
Speaker 1: happened in my had This happened multiple times during my

566
00:29:39,001 --> 00:29:41,281
Speaker 1: using where I shouldn't have been found. I was dead.

567
00:29:41,801 --> 00:29:44,241
Speaker 1: I had taken an overdose and there was nobody there.

568
00:29:44,281 --> 00:29:48,361
Speaker 1: I just should have died, you know. But she forgot

569
00:29:48,401 --> 00:29:50,881
Speaker 1: something and she came back in and she found me odeed,

570
00:29:50,921 --> 00:29:53,881
Speaker 1: and she had to call the ambulance. And you know,

571
00:29:53,961 --> 00:29:56,241
Speaker 1: that was one of many many times when I odeed.

572
00:29:56,321 --> 00:29:59,601
Speaker 1: And that one sticks with me though, because you know,

573
00:29:59,801 --> 00:30:02,761
Speaker 1: she had to see me there. She saw me dead

574
00:30:02,801 --> 00:30:07,641
Speaker 1: and blue, and you know that must have been a

575
00:30:07,961 --> 00:30:13,921
Speaker 1: terrifying experience for her. But yeah, I lived on and

576
00:30:13,961 --> 00:30:18,521
Speaker 1: off with her for many years and then I was

577
00:30:19,161 --> 00:30:22,520
Speaker 1: most likely kicked out by probably not her, but you know,

578
00:30:22,841 --> 00:30:24,841
Speaker 1: maybe some of the other family was just like, no,

579
00:30:24,921 --> 00:30:28,520
Speaker 1: you've got to go and I'd live with partners at

580
00:30:28,521 --> 00:30:32,001
Speaker 1: the time, or friends, or there was a guy that

581
00:30:32,601 --> 00:30:34,601
Speaker 1: I used to deal drugs with. We were partners in

582
00:30:34,641 --> 00:30:39,081
Speaker 1: that way, not in the other way. We lived together

583
00:30:39,121 --> 00:30:43,081
Speaker 1: for a time, we had a house. So many things happened,

584
00:30:43,081 --> 00:30:46,081
Speaker 1: and I don't have a correct chronicological order for them

585
00:30:46,161 --> 00:30:48,641
Speaker 1: in my brain. I know that they happened, but I

586
00:30:48,681 --> 00:30:51,921
Speaker 1: can't put one before the other on a timeline. But

587
00:30:51,961 --> 00:30:53,761
Speaker 1: there was a time there where I got like a

588
00:30:53,801 --> 00:30:55,361
Speaker 1: homes West house. I don't know if you guys have

589
00:30:55,401 --> 00:30:57,921
Speaker 1: homes West over there. It's like a government funded house.

590
00:30:58,321 --> 00:31:01,721
Speaker 1: And I would have been just early in my twenties probably,

591
00:31:02,881 --> 00:31:05,841
Speaker 1: and you know, playing cheap as chips rent. And there

592
00:31:05,881 --> 00:31:10,401
Speaker 1: was a time in fact in that house where one

593
00:31:10,401 --> 00:31:14,081
Speaker 1: of my brothers that I knew from that life he's

594
00:31:14,161 --> 00:31:20,361
Speaker 1: no longer with us either. I wanted to kill myself. So,

595
00:31:20,521 --> 00:31:23,721
Speaker 1: you know, so many times over that period I wanted

596
00:31:23,721 --> 00:31:25,841
Speaker 1: to die. I was depressed, and I just it was

597
00:31:25,881 --> 00:31:27,441
Speaker 1: this was a time where I thought, fuck it, something

598
00:31:27,481 --> 00:31:29,000
Speaker 1: had happened. I was just like, no, I don't want

599
00:31:29,001 --> 00:31:30,481
Speaker 1: to live anymore. So I went and bought a court

600
00:31:30,521 --> 00:31:33,481
Speaker 1: of heroin, locked myself in my house, I'd had to

601
00:31:33,481 --> 00:31:35,281
Speaker 1: smash the window to get in there. Something had happened.

602
00:31:35,281 --> 00:31:37,480
Speaker 1: I lost my key, so I'd smashed the window, got in,

603
00:31:37,601 --> 00:31:40,440
Speaker 1: locked my hat, locked myself in, taken an overdose, like

604
00:31:40,521 --> 00:31:45,321
Speaker 1: that's it. Nobody knows I'm here. And this person who

605
00:31:45,361 --> 00:31:47,401
Speaker 1: was very close to at the time, he came walking

606
00:31:47,441 --> 00:31:50,561
Speaker 1: down the street and he saw that my window was

607
00:31:50,601 --> 00:31:52,401
Speaker 1: smashed and he was like, what's going on here, got

608
00:31:52,441 --> 00:31:56,240
Speaker 1: himself inside, found me blue dead again. This time it

609
00:31:56,321 --> 00:31:59,200
Speaker 1: was so bad that I had lost some of my

610
00:31:59,241 --> 00:32:02,001
Speaker 1: short term memory. So I was unconscious for so long

611
00:32:02,041 --> 00:32:03,921
Speaker 1: with no heir to my oxygen to my brain that

612
00:32:04,321 --> 00:32:06,801
Speaker 1: I just lost short term memory. And I was put

613
00:32:06,801 --> 00:32:10,121
Speaker 1: in a like a lock toward hospital because they knew

614
00:32:10,161 --> 00:32:12,881
Speaker 1: that I had tried to kill myself. And I would

615
00:32:12,921 --> 00:32:15,161
Speaker 1: ask everyone who would visit me the same questions over

616
00:32:15,201 --> 00:32:17,281
Speaker 1: and over. Where am I, where am I clothed? What

617
00:32:17,361 --> 00:32:20,240
Speaker 1: am I doing here? You know? And people were like

618
00:32:20,281 --> 00:32:22,121
Speaker 1: exasperated with me, and I didn't know why. I'm like,

619
00:32:22,121 --> 00:32:23,641
Speaker 1: why the fuck are you're getting upset at me? I'm

620
00:32:23,641 --> 00:32:25,921
Speaker 1: just asking a question. But little did I know at

621
00:32:25,921 --> 00:32:30,321
Speaker 1: that time, I've been asking that over and over and over. Yeah,

622
00:32:30,361 --> 00:32:33,721
Speaker 1: and that person who saved my life then is sadly

623
00:32:33,761 --> 00:32:36,041
Speaker 1: not with us anymore either. He later took his own

624
00:32:36,081 --> 00:32:41,281
Speaker 1: life in prison, which happened to so many people I

625
00:32:41,321 --> 00:32:47,401
Speaker 1: grew up with no longer with us. Sometimes I wonder why,

626
00:32:47,921 --> 00:32:50,401
Speaker 1: how did I make it out and none of these

627
00:32:50,401 --> 00:32:54,561
Speaker 1: other people did, But you know, that's that's what happens

628
00:32:54,561 --> 00:32:58,521
Speaker 1: in that life. Unfortunately, they're either still in jail or

629
00:32:58,521 --> 00:33:01,601
Speaker 1: they're no longer with us. And the very few have

630
00:33:01,761 --> 00:33:03,881
Speaker 1: made it out, but they are are very few. You know,

631
00:33:04,281 --> 00:33:06,041
Speaker 1: I know a handful of people that have made it out,

632
00:33:06,081 --> 00:33:07,720
Speaker 1: and I'm in contact with them because they see my

633
00:33:07,721 --> 00:33:11,921
Speaker 1: stuff on social media and we message now, and you know,

634
00:33:11,961 --> 00:33:15,921
Speaker 1: it's really nice to speak to people or you know,

635
00:33:15,961 --> 00:33:17,881
Speaker 1: even if it's only over a message of like that

636
00:33:18,001 --> 00:33:22,041
Speaker 1: I was in the trenches with, we were absolutely like gone,

637
00:33:22,321 --> 00:33:25,720
Speaker 1: and they now have turned their life around also. But

638
00:33:25,801 --> 00:33:28,081
Speaker 1: it's very very few people we probably know.

639
00:33:28,641 --> 00:33:32,241
Speaker 5: We have a mutual friend who I have the absolute

640
00:33:32,961 --> 00:33:36,960
Speaker 5: utmost respectful. She's an absolute soldier, and to be honest,

641
00:33:36,961 --> 00:33:40,161
Speaker 5: she actually introduced us tonight.

642
00:33:40,641 --> 00:33:44,000
Speaker 4: You know, yes, you are going over for dinner and

643
00:33:44,041 --> 00:33:49,441
Speaker 4: I'm like, what do you have? I already had that conversation. Yeah,

644
00:33:49,481 --> 00:33:50,480
Speaker 4: and big shout out to.

645
00:33:50,521 --> 00:33:53,280
Speaker 5: Holly, we do love you, and you know what an

646
00:33:53,321 --> 00:33:58,041
Speaker 5: amazing journey she's been on. I guess my question here is,

647
00:33:58,641 --> 00:34:01,161
Speaker 5: was there a time where you guys did you know

648
00:34:01,241 --> 00:34:03,841
Speaker 5: each other back then or where did you guys sort

649
00:34:03,881 --> 00:34:06,921
Speaker 5: of come into player prison using around that same time?

650
00:34:07,281 --> 00:34:09,521
Speaker 4: All right? So you did when she come back from.

651
00:34:09,321 --> 00:34:13,201
Speaker 1: Thailand, Yeah, you know, and I didn't know her out on

652
00:34:13,241 --> 00:34:15,201
Speaker 1: the streets, and I only knew her from in prison.

653
00:34:15,841 --> 00:34:20,641
Speaker 1: So I was in Bandy up at the time, serving

654
00:34:20,641 --> 00:34:23,641
Speaker 1: a sentence and she was in there also. We went

655
00:34:23,841 --> 00:34:26,361
Speaker 1: great close friends in there. She had a really tight

656
00:34:26,361 --> 00:34:29,961
Speaker 1: circle and she really kept to herself, but you know,

657
00:34:29,961 --> 00:34:31,561
Speaker 1: we chatted every now and then, and I knew who

658
00:34:31,601 --> 00:34:36,601
Speaker 1: she was. It was only really since I got out

659
00:34:36,641 --> 00:34:38,801
Speaker 1: and got clean and then discovered that she's out and

660
00:34:38,841 --> 00:34:41,121
Speaker 1: she's clean and she's doing all this stuff, writing a book,

661
00:34:41,161 --> 00:34:43,401
Speaker 1: sharing her story, because we all kind of knew about

662
00:34:43,401 --> 00:34:46,121
Speaker 1: her story back then, but not how I know about

663
00:34:46,121 --> 00:34:47,841
Speaker 1: it now after reading the book and talking to her

664
00:34:47,881 --> 00:34:52,401
Speaker 1: and having like good chats with her. But yeah, she's

665
00:34:52,521 --> 00:34:58,041
Speaker 1: she's an incredible person and an incredible inspiration. She's been

666
00:34:58,081 --> 00:34:58,961
Speaker 1: through some shit.

667
00:34:59,081 --> 00:35:02,801
Speaker 5: I think personally you're both You're both amazing and we've

668
00:35:02,841 --> 00:35:05,001
Speaker 5: only just touched on a little bit of your story.

669
00:35:05,121 --> 00:35:08,641
Speaker 5: And you know, like for anybody out there that doubts

670
00:35:08,721 --> 00:35:12,681
Speaker 5: that they can't get through it, you truly can. And

671
00:35:12,721 --> 00:35:16,121
Speaker 5: it is not easy by any means. It's fucking hard,

672
00:35:16,761 --> 00:35:18,521
Speaker 5: but the reward at the end, and you.

673
00:35:18,481 --> 00:35:21,001
Speaker 4: Know, like, I feel very proud to who.

674
00:35:22,401 --> 00:35:25,081
Speaker 5: Of you have been guests here and us sitting down,

675
00:35:25,161 --> 00:35:26,921
Speaker 5: I mean, Holley and I've built a friendship now that

676
00:35:26,921 --> 00:35:31,121
Speaker 5: it will be forever, and I absolutely, as I said,

677
00:35:31,161 --> 00:35:32,281
Speaker 5: I have the utmost respect for her.

678
00:35:32,321 --> 00:35:33,721
Speaker 4: She's an absolute champion.

679
00:35:33,761 --> 00:35:36,361
Speaker 5: She's my little go to if I'm down and out

680
00:35:36,361 --> 00:35:38,521
Speaker 5: and I need to just have a blowout and have it,

681
00:35:38,561 --> 00:35:43,121
Speaker 5: you know, and over, She's there, you know, and that

682
00:35:43,241 --> 00:35:47,201
Speaker 5: to me is just amazing. And obviously you know, you

683
00:35:47,281 --> 00:35:52,201
Speaker 5: have that support network within each other, which which must

684
00:35:52,281 --> 00:35:56,161
Speaker 5: be fantastic as well. You wouldn't have had anything like

685
00:35:56,241 --> 00:35:59,361
Speaker 5: that back when you were in your peak of addiction,

686
00:35:59,441 --> 00:36:00,121
Speaker 5: would you.

687
00:36:00,121 --> 00:36:03,841
Speaker 1: Well, no, because everyone you knew was out for whatever

688
00:36:03,841 --> 00:36:06,480
Speaker 1: they could get out of you, or everyone I knew

689
00:36:06,521 --> 00:36:10,001
Speaker 1: was an addict or a criminal, and they only at

690
00:36:10,041 --> 00:36:12,881
Speaker 1: the end of it cared about their own needs, which

691
00:36:13,641 --> 00:36:15,961
Speaker 1: the same for me, that's all I cared about also,

692
00:36:16,961 --> 00:36:20,921
Speaker 1: So no, I didn't really have any solid support like that.

693
00:36:23,121 --> 00:36:25,401
Speaker 1: There was a counselor though that I remember she stands

694
00:36:25,401 --> 00:36:27,881
Speaker 1: out now to me who was really supportive for a

695
00:36:27,961 --> 00:36:30,201
Speaker 1: number of years and helped me when I had my daughter.

696
00:36:31,401 --> 00:36:33,321
Speaker 1: But you know, here, here and there there were those

697
00:36:33,321 --> 00:36:37,681
Speaker 1: people obviously not in addiction with me, but usually counselors

698
00:36:37,761 --> 00:36:40,121
Speaker 1: or somewhere along someone along the way that I've that

699
00:36:40,361 --> 00:36:42,361
Speaker 1: which was trying to help me and saw something in

700
00:36:42,401 --> 00:36:46,121
Speaker 1: me that I didn't. Saw this in me obviously that

701
00:36:46,201 --> 00:36:47,361
Speaker 1: I couldn't at that time.

702
00:36:47,681 --> 00:36:51,361
Speaker 5: I think it's it's interesting too because when you see

703
00:36:52,041 --> 00:36:56,721
Speaker 5: people in addiction and most we'll all hub around like

704
00:36:56,841 --> 00:36:57,561
Speaker 5: minded people.

705
00:36:57,601 --> 00:36:59,481
Speaker 4: I guess if you will, which.

706
00:36:59,321 --> 00:37:03,841
Speaker 5: Then you know you're all there, you're all using, you're

707
00:37:03,881 --> 00:37:08,281
Speaker 5: all doing crime. It just becomes that's the way I thought.

708
00:37:08,321 --> 00:37:10,041
Speaker 5: That is your hub, that is your circle.

709
00:37:10,161 --> 00:37:10,721
Speaker 1: That's all you know.

710
00:37:10,801 --> 00:37:13,721
Speaker 4: The reality of it all is it is.

711
00:37:13,761 --> 00:37:15,241
Speaker 5: But at the end of the day, I mean, you

712
00:37:15,321 --> 00:37:18,161
Speaker 5: might have one or two mates there that it'll help

713
00:37:18,201 --> 00:37:20,121
Speaker 5: you out if you do od or you know, you

714
00:37:20,921 --> 00:37:22,561
Speaker 5: need a little bit of a hand now and again,

715
00:37:22,601 --> 00:37:26,761
Speaker 5: but most of the time it is such a dark

716
00:37:26,881 --> 00:37:29,001
Speaker 5: and lonely walk.

717
00:37:28,801 --> 00:37:29,121
Speaker 4: Isn't it.

718
00:37:29,681 --> 00:37:32,681
Speaker 1: Absolutely. You know, at the time, you thought you had friends,

719
00:37:33,321 --> 00:37:35,441
Speaker 1: you know, you had a boyfriend, or you had friends,

720
00:37:35,441 --> 00:37:37,401
Speaker 1: and you were like they were everything to you. You know,

721
00:37:37,561 --> 00:37:39,641
Speaker 1: you'd use with them, you'd steal with them, you'd get

722
00:37:39,641 --> 00:37:45,201
Speaker 1: on with them. Oftentimes they'd cross you and they and

723
00:37:45,241 --> 00:37:47,121
Speaker 1: then you write them off and then you'd find someone else.

724
00:37:47,681 --> 00:37:50,921
Speaker 1: I found this with myself. I was very like I

725
00:37:51,041 --> 00:37:54,001
Speaker 1: latched onto people and they became my whole world. And

726
00:37:54,001 --> 00:37:57,281
Speaker 1: then I became very close with them, maybe months, maybe

727
00:37:57,321 --> 00:37:59,481
Speaker 1: for maybe years, and then something would happen and we'd

728
00:37:59,721 --> 00:38:01,961
Speaker 1: drift apart. One of us would do something over, do

729
00:38:02,441 --> 00:38:04,561
Speaker 1: one of the others over. And but yeah, I had

730
00:38:04,601 --> 00:38:06,241
Speaker 1: a lot of people that I thought were my friends

731
00:38:06,281 --> 00:38:08,201
Speaker 1: and I thought were so close and that you know,

732
00:38:08,441 --> 00:38:10,361
Speaker 1: I thought they would do anything for me, and I

733
00:38:10,361 --> 00:38:13,401
Speaker 1: would do anything for them. But really.

734
00:38:15,921 --> 00:38:18,401
Speaker 4: There's no trust. There is no trust.

735
00:38:18,281 --> 00:38:22,041
Speaker 5: In that way, and it's just nah, you know who's

736
00:38:22,041 --> 00:38:23,961
Speaker 5: sitting there having a shot with you that they're telling

737
00:38:24,001 --> 00:38:25,440
Speaker 5: you you're the best person in the world.

738
00:38:25,441 --> 00:38:27,441
Speaker 4: Where for Couey's with five eightes, I've got.

739
00:38:27,321 --> 00:38:28,761
Speaker 1: To you all of that.

740
00:38:28,881 --> 00:38:32,001
Speaker 4: Yeah, tomorrow they're rob they're robbing you tomorrow.

741
00:38:32,041 --> 00:38:35,721
Speaker 5: I used to see I used to see blokes that

742
00:38:35,801 --> 00:38:39,801
Speaker 5: I knew, and this is this is quite sad because

743
00:38:39,921 --> 00:38:42,921
Speaker 5: they're you know, growing up on the streets and a

744
00:38:42,961 --> 00:38:45,001
Speaker 5: lot of young women like yourself that were you know,

745
00:38:45,681 --> 00:38:49,721
Speaker 5: basically just fucked the world. They would be out there

746
00:38:49,761 --> 00:38:53,761
Speaker 5: and next minute, you know, they start seeing a bloke

747
00:38:53,801 --> 00:38:56,361
Speaker 5: who was using. Now this young girl at sixteen or

748
00:38:56,401 --> 00:38:59,321
Speaker 5: seventeen wasn't using. He might have been eighteen nineteen, And

749
00:38:59,361 --> 00:39:03,681
Speaker 5: I remember it. Within weeks, you know, she'd she'd fallen

750
00:39:03,721 --> 00:39:06,001
Speaker 5: head over heels for him. Next minutes, she's smoke in

751
00:39:06,041 --> 00:39:09,001
Speaker 5: the gain, next minute they're giving each other shots. And

752
00:39:09,721 --> 00:39:11,841
Speaker 5: in the end he had her working in a brothel

753
00:39:11,881 --> 00:39:13,841
Speaker 5: to support their habit.

754
00:39:14,001 --> 00:39:16,961
Speaker 4: Like that gives me goosebumps.

755
00:39:16,401 --> 00:39:20,481
Speaker 1: Because I've seen that story so many times. Yeah, something

756
00:39:20,481 --> 00:39:21,481
Speaker 1: similar to that.

757
00:39:21,481 --> 00:39:22,161
Speaker 4: That was my point.

758
00:39:22,241 --> 00:39:26,361
Speaker 5: It becomes and I don't think people really truly understand

759
00:39:26,401 --> 00:39:31,401
Speaker 5: the depths of how how selfish and how bad it

760
00:39:31,441 --> 00:39:34,841
Speaker 5: can become in addiction, especially with heroin.

761
00:39:35,201 --> 00:39:39,641
Speaker 1: Yeah. Absolutely, I got spent many years, like as a juvenile,

762
00:39:39,721 --> 00:39:44,401
Speaker 1: I was in and out of detention, centers, and I

763
00:39:44,401 --> 00:39:47,681
Speaker 1: think going into the detention centers. My first experience in

764
00:39:47,681 --> 00:39:50,481
Speaker 1: a remand center here as a child, as as a

765
00:39:50,521 --> 00:39:55,841
Speaker 1: teenager was being one of three women amongst ninety odd men,

766
00:39:56,241 --> 00:39:58,761
Speaker 1: because there were very little female It was a mixed,

767
00:39:58,921 --> 00:40:03,520
Speaker 1: mixed remand center and you're not three women.

768
00:40:03,641 --> 00:40:06,281
Speaker 5: Don't have it like a little yard, little yard or something,

769
00:40:06,401 --> 00:40:08,721
Speaker 5: just like a segro yard for you women, and then

770
00:40:08,881 --> 00:40:11,121
Speaker 5: or was it you were visible to everyone.

771
00:40:11,801 --> 00:40:15,681
Speaker 1: We mixed, so females had their own units. We slept

772
00:40:15,681 --> 00:40:18,361
Speaker 1: and were housed in a separate unit or wing, sorry,

773
00:40:18,401 --> 00:40:20,401
Speaker 1: not a unit, just a wing. It was a super

774
00:40:20,401 --> 00:40:23,081
Speaker 1: old building. It got demolished soon after I was there,

775
00:40:24,361 --> 00:40:27,961
Speaker 1: really really old. And the men were housed in their wings,

776
00:40:28,201 --> 00:40:32,921
Speaker 1: but for recreate, for dinners, breakfast, recreation work, we were

777
00:40:32,961 --> 00:40:36,161
Speaker 1: all out in the same yard. And that was where

778
00:40:36,201 --> 00:40:40,041
Speaker 1: I became. My defense is my walls were because the

779
00:40:40,121 --> 00:40:42,841
Speaker 1: whole time you were outside of your cell, you were fighting.

780
00:40:43,281 --> 00:40:46,361
Speaker 1: You were fighting with the other boys who were like

781
00:40:46,961 --> 00:40:51,361
Speaker 1: sexual innuendos, like the whole day, all day did not stop.

782
00:40:52,401 --> 00:40:54,201
Speaker 1: And then you were fighting with the girls because maybe

783
00:40:54,201 --> 00:40:56,601
Speaker 1: the girls had cousins in there that were talking shit

784
00:40:56,721 --> 00:40:59,201
Speaker 1: and it was just like the entire day while you

785
00:40:59,241 --> 00:41:01,401
Speaker 1: were out of your cell, it was just fight, fight, fight, fight, fight.

786
00:41:02,561 --> 00:41:04,481
Speaker 1: I had my first prison fight in there with a

787
00:41:04,521 --> 00:41:07,281
Speaker 1: girl who I don't know it was jealous or whatever,

788
00:41:07,401 --> 00:41:10,321
Speaker 1: and attacked me in front of the screws though, so

789
00:41:10,361 --> 00:41:11,961
Speaker 1: we had a small fight, you know, in front of

790
00:41:12,001 --> 00:41:16,801
Speaker 1: the screws. That was my first prison fight. And yeah,

791
00:41:16,841 --> 00:41:17,881
Speaker 1: that place really.

792
00:41:18,001 --> 00:41:22,441
Speaker 5: Never ever, never ever heard and that that's blown me

793
00:41:22,481 --> 00:41:27,321
Speaker 5: away because myself, I've seen a lot of jail nearly

794
00:41:27,361 --> 00:41:31,761
Speaker 5: fourteen years, and obviously all my guests that I've had,

795
00:41:31,761 --> 00:41:35,601
Speaker 5: you know, his guests that have gone back to the system,

796
00:41:35,641 --> 00:41:38,241
Speaker 5: well before I was even a sperm in my dad's bullsack,

797
00:41:38,321 --> 00:41:41,921
Speaker 5: you know what I mean, They've been around and I've

798
00:41:42,041 --> 00:41:46,201
Speaker 5: never once heard of a mixed I just I couldn't

799
00:41:46,241 --> 00:41:46,721
Speaker 5: fathom it.

800
00:41:46,801 --> 00:41:48,761
Speaker 4: Like I'm just rating to what you're saying.

801
00:41:48,801 --> 00:41:51,001
Speaker 5: And mate, I know how they used to treat the

802
00:41:51,041 --> 00:41:53,401
Speaker 5: trainees at Long Bay, you know, like they walk the

803
00:41:53,521 --> 00:41:57,201
Speaker 5: circle and you know the lifers and the long terms

804
00:41:57,241 --> 00:42:00,001
Speaker 5: and oh that was bad enough to have an actual female,

805
00:42:00,121 --> 00:42:03,001
Speaker 5: a woman present amongst so many men.

806
00:42:04,041 --> 00:42:08,440
Speaker 1: Well boy, that scary boys, But well.

807
00:42:09,001 --> 00:42:10,801
Speaker 4: They've got dicks and balls and all they're going to

808
00:42:10,841 --> 00:42:14,561
Speaker 4: do is want of the revenues, mental boys. It's all

809
00:42:14,601 --> 00:42:15,161
Speaker 4: the same.

810
00:42:15,001 --> 00:42:20,121
Speaker 5: When it but that that really really just blows my

811
00:42:20,201 --> 00:42:26,241
Speaker 5: mind because I think to myself, how could anybody allow

812
00:42:26,321 --> 00:42:28,841
Speaker 5: that to happen? One and duty of care like they

813
00:42:28,881 --> 00:42:32,401
Speaker 5: protect all these dogs and pedophiles and shit that they don't.

814
00:42:32,561 --> 00:42:33,121
Speaker 4: That's wrong.

815
00:42:33,761 --> 00:42:37,761
Speaker 1: Yeah, so they still have a they changed that Rainview

816
00:42:37,841 --> 00:42:41,721
Speaker 1: remand they knocked that down. Sorry, not Raineview. Long More.

817
00:42:42,401 --> 00:42:44,361
Speaker 1: Rainew was the remand long More was we you go

818
00:42:44,401 --> 00:42:46,561
Speaker 1: when you were sentenced. So they knocked long More down,

819
00:42:47,401 --> 00:42:49,841
Speaker 1: I don't know, nineteen ninety seven or ninety eight, and

820
00:42:49,881 --> 00:42:51,921
Speaker 1: then we all got transferred to Banksha Hill. So that's

821
00:42:51,921 --> 00:42:55,041
Speaker 1: the new detention center. But even there the detention center,

822
00:42:55,081 --> 00:42:57,881
Speaker 1: the girls have their own wing or their own unit,

823
00:42:57,961 --> 00:43:01,201
Speaker 1: but they all mix with the boys. I just thought

824
00:43:01,241 --> 00:43:04,361
Speaker 1: that was how it was in juvenile detention. Is that

825
00:43:04,401 --> 00:43:06,441
Speaker 1: not how it is over there? And juvenile attention.

826
00:43:08,001 --> 00:43:10,681
Speaker 5: No way, like we would see in like I remember

827
00:43:10,761 --> 00:43:17,121
Speaker 5: Yasmar and not not minda. Yasma was probably in that

828
00:43:17,281 --> 00:43:21,881
Speaker 5: era the only sort of co and you would see

829
00:43:21,921 --> 00:43:25,161
Speaker 5: different times passing or you know, coming through the center,

830
00:43:25,601 --> 00:43:27,520
Speaker 5: you would know that there's females there and you would

831
00:43:27,521 --> 00:43:36,281
Speaker 5: see them, but to actually be mixing as such, boys

832
00:43:36,361 --> 00:43:38,161
Speaker 5: dream to have a chick hanging around, you know what

833
00:43:38,161 --> 00:43:42,601
Speaker 5: I mean, Like it would have been good times, you know.

834
00:43:42,721 --> 00:43:46,041
Speaker 1: And all they do is like throw out sexual innuendo

835
00:43:46,281 --> 00:43:49,001
Speaker 1: all day long. Yeah, and you'd just be like telling

836
00:43:49,041 --> 00:43:52,041
Speaker 1: them to fuck off all day long and it will

837
00:43:52,081 --> 00:43:54,641
Speaker 1: just go back and forth. So that really kind of

838
00:43:54,641 --> 00:43:57,241
Speaker 1: hardened me there. That just got my defenses up, and

839
00:43:57,281 --> 00:44:02,281
Speaker 1: that was just yeah, I became a very closed off, defensive,

840
00:44:02,321 --> 00:44:03,161
Speaker 1: protective person.

841
00:44:03,201 --> 00:44:08,641
Speaker 5: Then how was then that next stage of you progressing

842
00:44:08,681 --> 00:44:12,841
Speaker 5: obviously becoming a young young woman an adult and then

843
00:44:12,921 --> 00:44:19,480
Speaker 5: hitting the mainstream system. How was it in and out

844
00:44:19,521 --> 00:44:20,201
Speaker 5: do you find that?

845
00:44:21,441 --> 00:44:25,761
Speaker 1: Well? Like I said that first, my first experience of

846
00:44:25,801 --> 00:44:29,881
Speaker 1: long More Detention Center just kind of set me in

847
00:44:30,001 --> 00:44:32,921
Speaker 1: that Like if I thought I hated people and I

848
00:44:32,961 --> 00:44:35,721
Speaker 1: hated the world, I really fucking hated everyone then and

849
00:44:35,761 --> 00:44:39,641
Speaker 1: I was just so so defensive and I came out

850
00:44:39,641 --> 00:44:43,121
Speaker 1: of their worse and when I went in, uh, and

851
00:44:43,161 --> 00:44:45,001
Speaker 1: I just wanted to get into more trouble and I

852
00:44:45,041 --> 00:44:49,241
Speaker 1: did h and I went I spent those years as

853
00:44:49,241 --> 00:44:52,481
Speaker 1: a teenager going in and out of long More and

854
00:44:52,481 --> 00:44:54,841
Speaker 1: then Raineview which is the Remark, and then the new

855
00:44:54,881 --> 00:44:57,241
Speaker 1: banksher Hill which was a new detention center, in and out,

856
00:44:57,281 --> 00:45:02,441
Speaker 1: in and out until I hit obviously adulthood, and then

857
00:45:02,441 --> 00:45:04,641
Speaker 1: I managed to stay out of prison for a couple

858
00:45:04,721 --> 00:45:06,881
Speaker 1: of years. I think I was scared of going into

859
00:45:08,321 --> 00:45:13,241
Speaker 1: the bandy out prison adults, but at some point I

860
00:45:13,281 --> 00:45:16,121
Speaker 1: obviously got caught for something and went in there a

861
00:45:16,161 --> 00:45:18,161
Speaker 1: couple of times on remand. And then I think I

862
00:45:18,281 --> 00:45:22,961
Speaker 1: was twenty four, I'd had my daughter, I'd just had

863
00:45:22,961 --> 00:45:26,401
Speaker 1: my daughter, and then I was twenty maybe I was

864
00:45:26,401 --> 00:45:28,681
Speaker 1: twenty six actually that I got sentenced to my first

865
00:45:28,681 --> 00:45:31,281
Speaker 1: big sentence, which was two years, which for me was

866
00:45:31,601 --> 00:45:36,601
Speaker 1: a big sentence back then. Yep, And I did. I

867
00:45:36,641 --> 00:45:39,361
Speaker 1: did the whole time because I got caught smoking dope

868
00:45:39,401 --> 00:45:42,561
Speaker 1: inside and getting in trouble inside. So instead of doing

869
00:45:42,561 --> 00:45:44,081
Speaker 1: one year and getting out on parole, I did the

870
00:45:44,081 --> 00:45:49,521
Speaker 1: whole two years. And that was another fight of itself.

871
00:45:49,641 --> 00:45:51,601
Speaker 1: You know, you were always you had to be on

872
00:45:51,641 --> 00:45:53,281
Speaker 1: guard every time you're out of your cell, you know,

873
00:45:53,321 --> 00:45:56,681
Speaker 1: from someone trying to stand over you, fight, you take

874
00:45:56,721 --> 00:46:01,921
Speaker 1: what you had. It was just always a fight. You know.

875
00:46:02,921 --> 00:46:03,841
Speaker 4: I love your honesty.

876
00:46:03,881 --> 00:46:07,721
Speaker 5: I always say to people exactly that everybody is vulnerable

877
00:46:07,761 --> 00:46:11,201
Speaker 5: the moment that that door is cracked, and even sometimes

878
00:46:11,201 --> 00:46:14,841
Speaker 5: when it's shut, you just don't know, and it is,

879
00:46:15,521 --> 00:46:20,121
Speaker 5: you know, like it's how do I put it? You know,

880
00:46:20,161 --> 00:46:23,161
Speaker 5: you're living on the edge literally. You know, there's people

881
00:46:23,161 --> 00:46:24,681
Speaker 5: in there to get around and you would have seen

882
00:46:24,681 --> 00:46:27,241
Speaker 5: that they you know, just become accustomed to it. They've

883
00:46:27,241 --> 00:46:29,520
Speaker 5: got their gangs, their clicks, and you know they're doing

884
00:46:29,561 --> 00:46:33,081
Speaker 5: this and that. But those that choose to stay away

885
00:46:33,081 --> 00:46:37,361
Speaker 5: from the politics and the gang within the jail system,

886
00:46:37,561 --> 00:46:40,761
Speaker 5: you're always going to be picked off. And there's always

887
00:46:40,761 --> 00:46:43,121
Speaker 5: someone out there that thinks that you're an easy prey

888
00:46:43,801 --> 00:46:47,121
Speaker 5: and to most people, they are because you know, what

889
00:46:47,121 --> 00:46:48,481
Speaker 5: are you going to do unless you arm up and

890
00:46:48,521 --> 00:46:51,481
Speaker 5: go on with it? And really, you know should have

891
00:46:51,561 --> 00:46:54,601
Speaker 5: go right on with it, and you're going to struggle

892
00:46:54,681 --> 00:46:59,041
Speaker 5: to correct correct and you're going to really struggle to

893
00:46:59,081 --> 00:47:01,121
Speaker 5: get through another day.

894
00:47:01,401 --> 00:47:01,961
Speaker 4: It's just.

895
00:47:03,401 --> 00:47:05,321
Speaker 5: And when you're doing years like you did, you know,

896
00:47:05,521 --> 00:47:07,241
Speaker 5: that's that's a hard way to leave.

897
00:47:07,841 --> 00:47:12,201
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I had to fight back one day.

898
00:47:13,041 --> 00:47:18,961
Speaker 1: I remember it was was this would sound so ridiculous

899
00:47:19,001 --> 00:47:20,721
Speaker 1: to anybody that hasn't been in jail. But I'm sure

900
00:47:20,761 --> 00:47:22,361
Speaker 1: you know exactly what I mean. It was a lu

901
00:47:22,521 --> 00:47:24,081
Speaker 1: It was a dinner line and someone tried to push

902
00:47:24,121 --> 00:47:26,121
Speaker 1: in front of me in the dinner line, and I

903
00:47:26,201 --> 00:47:28,401
Speaker 1: knew if i'd let it happened, that they just all

904
00:47:28,441 --> 00:47:29,881
Speaker 1: walk all over me, because it was like a test,

905
00:47:29,961 --> 00:47:31,881
Speaker 1: you know, it was like how fun can they push you?

906
00:47:32,401 --> 00:47:34,001
Speaker 1: And make sure they can push you that far? I

907
00:47:34,041 --> 00:47:35,681
Speaker 1: can stand in front of her lunch light. Oh, I

908
00:47:35,721 --> 00:47:39,361
Speaker 1: can take her gratuity, so I could take her you know,

909
00:47:39,441 --> 00:47:44,081
Speaker 1: commissaries off her chocolates and chips. I can take whatever

910
00:47:44,121 --> 00:47:48,281
Speaker 1: off her. So I was just like nap. Now, when

911
00:47:48,281 --> 00:47:51,041
Speaker 1: we threw down, we fought. She had a butter knife

912
00:47:51,041 --> 00:47:54,841
Speaker 1: and she tried to stab me with it, and yeah,

913
00:47:54,881 --> 00:47:57,121
Speaker 1: but that was it. We got put in solitary and

914
00:47:58,081 --> 00:48:04,281
Speaker 1: that kind of set the way for me not being

915
00:48:04,281 --> 00:48:06,081
Speaker 1: stood over again. I'm not I'm not gonna say I didn't

916
00:48:06,081 --> 00:48:09,401
Speaker 1: try it. They didn't try it, but like when they

917
00:48:09,441 --> 00:48:11,801
Speaker 1: realized that you're too much trouble to try and stand over,

918
00:48:11,961 --> 00:48:14,481
Speaker 1: most people will leave you alone in there unless you're

919
00:48:14,481 --> 00:48:18,601
Speaker 1: a real shit. Can't you do something you and then

920
00:48:19,081 --> 00:48:22,481
Speaker 1: you know you'll also get yours. But yeah, I just

921
00:48:23,681 --> 00:48:25,641
Speaker 1: try to kind of keep my head down and just

922
00:48:26,041 --> 00:48:29,841
Speaker 1: do my time, and that's what I did for that

923
00:48:29,841 --> 00:48:34,481
Speaker 1: two years. I eventually went to a medium security prison,

924
00:48:35,001 --> 00:48:37,321
Speaker 1: which was a lot easier, a lot nicer.

925
00:48:39,561 --> 00:48:43,440
Speaker 5: Did you find that it was a battle coming back

926
00:48:43,481 --> 00:48:45,521
Speaker 5: out each time? And I want to ask you, because

927
00:48:45,521 --> 00:48:47,601
Speaker 5: obviously you know you're being very open and thank you

928
00:48:47,601 --> 00:48:51,601
Speaker 5: if you're honesty. Were you using inside or was it

929
00:48:51,881 --> 00:48:55,001
Speaker 5: okay I'm in jail, I don't use anymore. I'm off

930
00:48:55,041 --> 00:48:56,801
Speaker 5: the gears sort of thing. And then as soon as

931
00:48:56,801 --> 00:48:58,121
Speaker 5: you get out, you go and have a shot.

932
00:48:58,961 --> 00:49:01,561
Speaker 1: Fuck. If I could have, I would have. But really,

933
00:49:01,601 --> 00:49:03,961
Speaker 1: the only way to use in there with like needles

934
00:49:04,041 --> 00:49:05,921
Speaker 1: was use a dirt. You need all that have been

935
00:49:05,921 --> 00:49:10,241
Speaker 1: passed around like that's ten thick, correct twenty women, And

936
00:49:10,281 --> 00:49:12,361
Speaker 1: there was absolutely no fucking way I was going to

937
00:49:12,401 --> 00:49:14,841
Speaker 1: do that. I smoked pot a couple of times, which

938
00:49:14,881 --> 00:49:18,081
Speaker 1: was why I got some dirty piss tests and got

939
00:49:18,201 --> 00:49:22,401
Speaker 1: knocked back, got my sorry, got my parole knock back.

940
00:49:24,081 --> 00:49:27,161
Speaker 1: But yeah, not needles in there, No way, no way.

941
00:49:27,881 --> 00:49:29,641
Speaker 5: I've got to give you credit for that one, because

942
00:49:29,641 --> 00:49:31,361
Speaker 5: I've sat there and I've seen, you know, in the

943
00:49:31,361 --> 00:49:34,481
Speaker 5: toilet block, seven eight blokes sitting squat and dere mixing

944
00:49:34,561 --> 00:49:37,561
Speaker 5: up pube and they're all sitting there trying to use.

945
00:49:37,521 --> 00:49:39,081
Speaker 4: This tiny little thing.

946
00:49:39,281 --> 00:49:39,561
Speaker 1: Yeah.

947
00:49:39,641 --> 00:49:40,961
Speaker 4: Yeah, And I don't even think.

948
00:49:40,801 --> 00:49:46,440
Speaker 5: People can understand what lengths they go to to one.

949
00:49:46,921 --> 00:49:49,321
Speaker 4: To hide hide it. Firstly.

950
00:49:50,281 --> 00:49:55,641
Speaker 5: Secondly, let's talk about hygiene. There's some terrible hygiene around that. Yeah.

951
00:49:55,721 --> 00:49:58,001
Speaker 1: Yeah, then you've got that you can hide.

952
00:49:57,761 --> 00:50:00,721
Speaker 5: It, No, there's not. And then you've got you know,

953
00:50:00,801 --> 00:50:04,161
Speaker 5: the fact that they're all and it's blunt like I've

954
00:50:04,201 --> 00:50:07,481
Speaker 5: watched them sharp on the ground, you know what I mean, like,

955
00:50:07,561 --> 00:50:10,041
Speaker 5: and then sit there and try and stab it into

956
00:50:10,081 --> 00:50:10,480
Speaker 5: the vein.

957
00:50:11,521 --> 00:50:12,881
Speaker 4: It is just atrocious.

958
00:50:12,961 --> 00:50:16,801
Speaker 5: And look back when you and I were doing time,

959
00:50:16,841 --> 00:50:19,681
Speaker 5: which is you know, obviously a long time before now,

960
00:50:20,401 --> 00:50:22,121
Speaker 5: it was a lot more common. I think that the

961
00:50:22,161 --> 00:50:25,641
Speaker 5: system's definitely become a lot more awake to those sorts

962
00:50:25,641 --> 00:50:27,601
Speaker 5: of things, and you know, with the amount of cameras

963
00:50:27,641 --> 00:50:30,520
Speaker 5: and newer jails and the way that things are done.

964
00:50:31,801 --> 00:50:34,961
Speaker 5: Not saying that there's not drugs in there, but I

965
00:50:35,001 --> 00:50:37,641
Speaker 5: think that the way that they're used is a little

966
00:50:37,641 --> 00:50:42,721
Speaker 5: bit different. Yeah, but that's got to have been some

967
00:50:42,761 --> 00:50:45,881
Speaker 5: sort of credit to you in respect of having morals,

968
00:50:46,041 --> 00:50:48,601
Speaker 5: I guess, and being able to say to yourself, no

969
00:50:48,641 --> 00:50:50,441
Speaker 5: fucking way, like I'm not gonna end up with hair

970
00:50:50,521 --> 00:50:53,841
Speaker 5: parades or you know, I just refuse to do that.

971
00:50:54,801 --> 00:50:59,401
Speaker 4: If you are able to do that, there, that's strength.

972
00:51:00,681 --> 00:51:03,001
Speaker 4: What do you think was the reason?

973
00:51:03,681 --> 00:51:06,041
Speaker 5: And I've got a fair idea, But I'd like to

974
00:51:06,081 --> 00:51:09,721
Speaker 5: hear why would you come back out and put yourself

975
00:51:09,761 --> 00:51:11,561
Speaker 5: through that whole.

976
00:51:11,281 --> 00:51:15,441
Speaker 4: Thing again with the addiction hanging out.

977
00:51:16,201 --> 00:51:21,480
Speaker 5: Like it is such a just crazy crazy walk like.

978
00:51:21,441 --> 00:51:25,521
Speaker 1: It's yeah, you know, I would say now in hindsight,

979
00:51:25,601 --> 00:51:27,960
Speaker 1: looking back at it, because I didn't have anything else

980
00:51:27,961 --> 00:51:30,841
Speaker 1: in my life. I didn't know that there was anything

981
00:51:30,841 --> 00:51:33,361
Speaker 1: else that could make you feel good when you're out.

982
00:51:33,881 --> 00:51:35,801
Speaker 1: Like one of the biggest things, one of the things

983
00:51:35,801 --> 00:51:38,361
Speaker 1: that I the biggest messages that I try and get

984
00:51:38,401 --> 00:51:40,881
Speaker 1: across now to people that are still in jail, still using,

985
00:51:40,921 --> 00:51:44,121
Speaker 1: still an addiction, is that there's so much fucking life

986
00:51:44,241 --> 00:51:46,601
Speaker 1: out of addiction and crime. Like when I was in it,

987
00:51:46,681 --> 00:51:50,121
Speaker 1: I didn't think. I didn't know how straight people could

988
00:51:50,121 --> 00:51:52,161
Speaker 1: be happy, how they could have fun, how they could

989
00:51:52,241 --> 00:51:55,361
Speaker 1: enjoy their life. I just it. I had no idea.

990
00:51:56,361 --> 00:51:59,121
Speaker 1: And even though I would get clean in jail. Obviously

991
00:51:59,201 --> 00:52:01,440
Speaker 1: I wasn't using for you know, a number of couple

992
00:52:01,481 --> 00:52:03,721
Speaker 1: of years. When I get out, I didn't know what

993
00:52:03,761 --> 00:52:05,281
Speaker 1: to do with myself. The only way I know how

994
00:52:05,281 --> 00:52:08,401
Speaker 1: to have fun, or to enjoy myself, or to you know,

995
00:52:08,601 --> 00:52:10,761
Speaker 1: escape those thoughts in my head was to use again

996
00:52:10,841 --> 00:52:12,881
Speaker 1: I was, and to hang out with them only those

997
00:52:12,921 --> 00:52:16,121
Speaker 1: people that I knew. I didn't have any other good

998
00:52:16,121 --> 00:52:18,881
Speaker 1: connections or friends that I knew were doing things that

999
00:52:18,921 --> 00:52:20,641
Speaker 1: were good in their life and that were they were

1000
00:52:20,641 --> 00:52:22,960
Speaker 1: happy with how their lives were going. I just I didn't.

1001
00:52:23,001 --> 00:52:27,001
Speaker 1: I didn't, I wasn't exposed to any of that. So

1002
00:52:27,201 --> 00:52:28,921
Speaker 1: I just went back to doing the only thing I

1003
00:52:28,961 --> 00:52:30,721
Speaker 1: knew how to correct.

1004
00:52:30,721 --> 00:52:34,521
Speaker 5: And it's scary because breaking that cycle takes a lot

1005
00:52:34,521 --> 00:52:36,761
Speaker 5: of strength. And I keep referring back to the strength

1006
00:52:36,801 --> 00:52:40,721
Speaker 5: that you've you have, because I don't think you know

1007
00:52:40,921 --> 00:52:43,761
Speaker 5: you We can sit here and talk about it, but

1008
00:52:43,841 --> 00:52:47,681
Speaker 5: to actually explain to somebody what it truly takes to fight.

1009
00:52:47,521 --> 00:52:51,561
Speaker 4: That demon, that everyday battle of I just have a tickle,

1010
00:52:51,681 --> 00:52:52,201
Speaker 4: you know what I mean?

1011
00:52:56,841 --> 00:52:59,961
Speaker 5: As for a few hours it just yeah, just kick back,

1012
00:53:00,001 --> 00:53:01,601
Speaker 5: you know, I just get stone and just just I'll

1013
00:53:01,641 --> 00:53:02,561
Speaker 5: be right I have a shot.

1014
00:53:02,761 --> 00:53:05,841
Speaker 4: Now I'm going to be all sweets. Just a tickle,

1015
00:53:06,481 --> 00:53:08,601
Speaker 4: it does, and then it becomes a scratch.

1016
00:53:08,601 --> 00:53:12,161
Speaker 5: The next minute that's an open wound and you're fight.

1017
00:53:12,881 --> 00:53:16,441
Speaker 5: Everybody loves a tickle, you know, people don't mind a scratched,

1018
00:53:16,441 --> 00:53:17,481
Speaker 5: but once that cuts off, I.

1019
00:53:17,441 --> 00:53:19,481
Speaker 1: Haven't heard that. I haven't heard that word in years.

1020
00:53:19,961 --> 00:53:22,241
Speaker 4: Oh look at you know, And it was the old eye.

1021
00:53:22,321 --> 00:53:25,161
Speaker 4: It's just remissions, you know, the old kick back. You know,

1022
00:53:25,201 --> 00:53:26,841
Speaker 4: it's just my downtime, you know.

1023
00:53:27,161 --> 00:53:32,241
Speaker 5: Yeah, right, But it is such a powerful, powerful thing.

1024
00:53:32,321 --> 00:53:35,761
Speaker 5: And you know, to have that strength to be able

1025
00:53:35,841 --> 00:53:39,321
Speaker 5: to walk away from everyone and everything, because you would

1026
00:53:39,321 --> 00:53:42,641
Speaker 5: have had to completely disconnect from everything and anyone you knew.

1027
00:53:43,641 --> 00:53:47,001
Speaker 1: Yeah I did, but it wasn't. I'm not gonna. I

1028
00:53:47,041 --> 00:53:49,321
Speaker 1: can't give myself a credit and go. I was that strong.

1029
00:53:49,481 --> 00:53:51,801
Speaker 1: I was just able to walk away. It didn't happen

1030
00:53:51,841 --> 00:53:54,601
Speaker 1: quite like that. Like I made a leap, and I

1031
00:53:54,681 --> 00:53:57,921
Speaker 1: made the leap to go to rehab. And I made

1032
00:53:57,921 --> 00:54:01,321
Speaker 1: that leap, and I wasn't strong. I was just I

1033
00:54:01,361 --> 00:54:04,081
Speaker 1: was desperate, frent. I was absolutely at my wits end

1034
00:54:04,121 --> 00:54:07,121
Speaker 1: of desperation. I did not want to live anymore. I wanted.

1035
00:54:07,201 --> 00:54:10,161
Speaker 1: I would have killed myself. I would I I over

1036
00:54:10,161 --> 00:54:13,441
Speaker 1: the years, I'd try attempt at suicide so many times,

1037
00:54:14,281 --> 00:54:18,041
Speaker 1: like properly attempted, and like I said, for the there,

1038
00:54:18,081 --> 00:54:20,081
Speaker 1: but for the grace of God or whatever I was found,

1039
00:54:21,481 --> 00:54:24,281
Speaker 1: I would have killed myself. But I have a daughter,

1040
00:54:24,601 --> 00:54:27,921
Speaker 1: and at that time, she was seven, I think, or

1041
00:54:27,961 --> 00:54:31,001
Speaker 1: eight around that, and I didn't want to leave her

1042
00:54:31,041 --> 00:54:33,681
Speaker 1: with the stigma of a mother that had killed herself.

1043
00:54:33,801 --> 00:54:35,641
Speaker 1: So I took the leap and I went to rehab.

1044
00:54:35,841 --> 00:54:39,121
Speaker 1: And I definitely wasn't strong at that point, but I

1045
00:54:39,561 --> 00:54:42,761
Speaker 1: was there for a day and then another day and

1046
00:54:42,801 --> 00:54:45,921
Speaker 1: another day, and I wanted to leave so many fucking times.

1047
00:54:45,961 --> 00:54:48,121
Speaker 1: And it was so much harder than jail because I

1048
00:54:48,161 --> 00:54:50,681
Speaker 1: could get up and leave whenever I wanted, like I

1049
00:54:50,721 --> 00:54:53,401
Speaker 1: had the choice. It was my choice. I had to

1050
00:54:53,801 --> 00:54:55,401
Speaker 1: I had to stay. It was on me. Nobody was

1051
00:54:55,441 --> 00:54:58,721
Speaker 1: locking me in. And I just made that choice every day.

1052
00:54:58,761 --> 00:55:00,521
Speaker 1: Sometimes I had to make it an hour at a time,

1053
00:55:00,561 --> 00:55:02,801
Speaker 1: sometimes a minute, tell myself, I'm staying another minute, I'm

1054
00:55:02,801 --> 00:55:04,761
Speaker 1: staying another hour. And that's how I got through my

1055
00:55:04,801 --> 00:55:07,761
Speaker 1: fet few weeks, a few months. It wasn't strength. I

1056
00:55:07,881 --> 00:55:11,881
Speaker 1: was not strong back then. But then I got some

1057
00:55:12,001 --> 00:55:15,521
Speaker 1: weeks of being clean under my belt, and I started

1058
00:55:15,641 --> 00:55:18,361
Speaker 1: doing a beach walk, which they made everyone do every morning,

1059
00:55:18,361 --> 00:55:20,521
Speaker 1: a walk on the beach, and I started to feel

1060
00:55:20,521 --> 00:55:23,041
Speaker 1: how good it felt, those endorphins from walking and then

1061
00:55:23,161 --> 00:55:25,401
Speaker 1: running a bit. And they had a little room with

1062
00:55:25,441 --> 00:55:27,401
Speaker 1: some weights and a machine in there. Not much, but

1063
00:55:27,401 --> 00:55:29,201
Speaker 1: I started lifting and fucking around with that, and I

1064
00:55:29,241 --> 00:55:31,761
Speaker 1: was like, I like how this feels. I like how

1065
00:55:31,761 --> 00:55:34,241
Speaker 1: it feels to lift something, lift something hard, and then

1066
00:55:34,321 --> 00:55:37,361
Speaker 1: feel good afterwards. And then from there it kind of

1067
00:55:37,401 --> 00:55:39,401
Speaker 1: ignited my passion to I want to go and learn

1068
00:55:39,441 --> 00:55:43,361
Speaker 1: how to do this properly, and so I built up

1069
00:55:43,401 --> 00:55:46,241
Speaker 1: four months there and then from there I went straight

1070
00:55:46,241 --> 00:55:48,201
Speaker 1: to TAFE. I came out of rehabit. I went to

1071
00:55:48,241 --> 00:55:50,561
Speaker 1: TAFE and I studied my thirt three and fourign fitness,

1072
00:55:51,241 --> 00:55:53,281
Speaker 1: and then I went on to work from there. But

1073
00:55:53,321 --> 00:55:59,561
Speaker 1: I definitely wasn't It wasn't strength that allowed me to

1074
00:55:59,601 --> 00:56:01,921
Speaker 1: walk away from everyone. It was just like desperation. And

1075
00:56:01,921 --> 00:56:04,481
Speaker 1: once I got there, I was like, oh, okay, hang on,

1076
00:56:04,641 --> 00:56:06,801
Speaker 1: this feel good. I found that maybe I can be

1077
00:56:06,881 --> 00:56:09,801
Speaker 1: clean and actually not feel horrendous about myself. There's a

1078
00:56:09,841 --> 00:56:11,281
Speaker 1: lot of other healing and stuff that went on in

1079
00:56:11,321 --> 00:56:14,641
Speaker 1: rehab and counseling and working on myself, working on my

1080
00:56:14,681 --> 00:56:20,641
Speaker 1: inner child, working out that I had been selfish and

1081
00:56:21,961 --> 00:56:24,561
Speaker 1: selfish my entire life. I was only ever thinking about myself.

1082
00:56:24,601 --> 00:56:27,121
Speaker 1: I lived in my victimhood. I lived in a victim mentality.

1083
00:56:27,161 --> 00:56:29,921
Speaker 1: I thought everything was done to me. And it was

1084
00:56:29,921 --> 00:56:32,041
Speaker 1: only when I started working on that and realizing no,

1085
00:56:32,201 --> 00:56:35,601
Speaker 1: I'm not a victim. I made these choices. I made

1086
00:56:35,641 --> 00:56:38,001
Speaker 1: every single fucking one of those choices that led me here.

1087
00:56:38,561 --> 00:56:41,361
Speaker 1: And it was only when I accepted that, coupled with

1088
00:56:41,441 --> 00:56:44,721
Speaker 1: the fact of like, okay, being clean doesn't feel so horrible. Yes,

1089
00:56:44,761 --> 00:56:48,161
Speaker 1: it's emotionally painful sometimes realizing the shit, the trauma I've

1090
00:56:48,201 --> 00:56:50,281
Speaker 1: caused others, the hurt that I've caused others, and what

1091
00:56:50,281 --> 00:56:54,961
Speaker 1: I've done to myself for twenty fucking years. But then

1092
00:56:55,041 --> 00:56:57,401
Speaker 1: I started to feel okay, I like this how I

1093
00:56:57,441 --> 00:56:59,361
Speaker 1: feel from exercise. And I went on and I learned

1094
00:56:59,401 --> 00:57:01,601
Speaker 1: about that, and I went to TAFE and I and

1095
00:57:01,641 --> 00:57:04,361
Speaker 1: then pretty much the rest is history. Like I became

1096
00:57:04,401 --> 00:57:07,721
Speaker 1: a qualified I started working and health and fitness, so

1097
00:57:07,801 --> 00:57:11,281
Speaker 1: rehab got me clean, health and fitness without a fucking

1098
00:57:11,321 --> 00:57:15,881
Speaker 1: doubt has kept me clean, Like training, nutrition, lifestyle, combining

1099
00:57:15,881 --> 00:57:19,961
Speaker 1: all those things together and I'm putting them together like

1100
00:57:20,041 --> 00:57:23,321
Speaker 1: that has kept me clean because there's no like everything

1101
00:57:23,361 --> 00:57:27,921
Speaker 1: I've built, I've built so much strength and resilience, and like,

1102
00:57:28,081 --> 00:57:30,721
Speaker 1: I'm the healthiest person I've ever been. I'm the health Sorry,

1103
00:57:30,721 --> 00:57:33,841
Speaker 1: I'm the healthiest I've ever been. All that comes from

1104
00:57:33,841 --> 00:57:36,481
Speaker 1: what I've put into it, from the strength, training and

1105
00:57:36,601 --> 00:57:40,681
Speaker 1: nutrition and that lifestyle. So that has kept me clean.

1106
00:57:41,161 --> 00:57:44,961
Speaker 4: And what a fantastic job you're doing, you know.

1107
00:57:45,121 --> 00:57:48,201
Speaker 5: Like once again, I'll refer back to some pictures on

1108
00:57:48,241 --> 00:57:50,481
Speaker 5: your page, and please, for the listeners, can you tell

1109
00:57:51,121 --> 00:57:53,801
Speaker 5: exactly what your page is on Instagram so they can

1110
00:57:53,841 --> 00:57:55,241
Speaker 5: go over and have a look and they'll be able

1111
00:57:55,281 --> 00:57:57,121
Speaker 5: to see exactly what it is that I'm talking to.

1112
00:57:57,281 --> 00:58:00,601
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, so Chrysula Underscore Ivana. That is my personal page.

1113
00:58:00,641 --> 00:58:03,201
Speaker 1: I also have a business page for Strong Bodies by Prisula.

1114
00:58:03,961 --> 00:58:05,601
Speaker 1: I'm a personal trainer now, I have been for the

1115
00:58:05,641 --> 00:58:08,481
Speaker 1: last eight years. I'm an online nutrition coach as well,

1116
00:58:09,001 --> 00:58:12,961
Speaker 1: and I share openly on my page about my addiction.

1117
00:58:13,081 --> 00:58:15,001
Speaker 1: I share my before and after pictures, I share my

1118
00:58:15,001 --> 00:58:19,561
Speaker 1: prison pictures of which I obtained many of when I

1119
00:58:19,601 --> 00:58:21,321
Speaker 1: got out and I got clean, and I was like,

1120
00:58:21,801 --> 00:58:24,961
Speaker 1: I want to And I started training and becoming healthier

1121
00:58:25,001 --> 00:58:28,401
Speaker 1: and changing how I looked with my appearents through exercise nutrition.

1122
00:58:28,801 --> 00:58:30,001
Speaker 1: I was like, fuck, I want to get hold of

1123
00:58:30,001 --> 00:58:33,641
Speaker 1: some of these pictures. And I contacted the prisons department,

1124
00:58:33,761 --> 00:58:37,641
Speaker 1: some department, freedom of information department or something, and I

1125
00:58:37,761 --> 00:58:42,481
Speaker 1: got several of my prison pictures, back of my sorry

1126
00:58:42,481 --> 00:58:45,641
Speaker 1: police arrest arrest pictures, and some of my prison entry pictures.

1127
00:58:46,441 --> 00:58:50,121
Speaker 1: Fuck they are They're a site. You know, they are

1128
00:58:50,121 --> 00:58:52,601
Speaker 1: pretty shocking. And there's one in particular where it was

1129
00:58:52,641 --> 00:58:56,441
Speaker 1: my last prison entry and like you can see the desperation,

1130
00:58:56,841 --> 00:59:00,441
Speaker 1: the pain in my face. It's written like from my head,

1131
00:59:00,721 --> 00:59:03,721
Speaker 1: it's written all over me. So I share a lot

1132
00:59:03,721 --> 00:59:06,081
Speaker 1: of those before and afters every year when I celebrate

1133
00:59:06,081 --> 00:59:09,521
Speaker 1: another year clean, and next August, in like roughly four weeks,

1134
00:59:09,761 --> 00:59:14,041
Speaker 1: I'll be nine years clean. And I never thought I

1135
00:59:14,041 --> 00:59:16,561
Speaker 1: would get to that. Like when I was one year clean,

1136
00:59:17,241 --> 00:59:18,841
Speaker 1: fuck how can? I? And I saw people that were

1137
00:59:18,841 --> 00:59:21,041
Speaker 1: ten years clean because I was in the NA Fellowship.

1138
00:59:21,601 --> 00:59:23,881
Speaker 1: I just thought, how can you be ten year? How?

1139
00:59:24,241 --> 00:59:26,961
Speaker 1: And now here I am like But the biggest thing

1140
00:59:26,961 --> 00:59:28,321
Speaker 1: that I try and get across because I go back

1141
00:59:28,321 --> 00:59:31,561
Speaker 1: and I speak to people in the rehabs every how

1142
00:59:31,561 --> 00:59:33,841
Speaker 1: and then, and I like, the biggest thing I try

1143
00:59:33,841 --> 00:59:36,681
Speaker 1: and feel people is time's going to pass. Whether you're

1144
00:59:37,281 --> 00:59:40,521
Speaker 1: in jail, in addiction, off your head, whether you're clean,

1145
00:59:40,801 --> 00:59:44,121
Speaker 1: loving life, living it to the fullest, experiencing and creating

1146
00:59:44,201 --> 00:59:46,201
Speaker 1: memories with the people and the friends and the family

1147
00:59:46,241 --> 00:59:50,241
Speaker 1: around you, Time's going to go so fucking quickly. So

1148
00:59:50,441 --> 00:59:52,521
Speaker 1: which one would I rather do? Fuck? I would rather

1149
00:59:52,561 --> 00:59:56,641
Speaker 1: be making creating memories that are long lasting and loving

1150
00:59:56,681 --> 00:59:59,521
Speaker 1: and like the ones that I want to remember than

1151
01:00:00,201 --> 01:00:01,241
Speaker 1: you know the other.

1152
01:00:01,561 --> 01:00:05,521
Speaker 5: And you now obviously moving forward, have you being able

1153
01:00:05,561 --> 01:00:08,881
Speaker 5: to create a lovely relationship with your daughter now?

1154
01:00:09,201 --> 01:00:12,681
Speaker 1: And she lives with me now again. She came back

1155
01:00:12,681 --> 01:00:17,281
Speaker 1: to me when she was about sixteen, and like I said,

1156
01:00:17,361 --> 01:00:20,841
Speaker 1: she'd been through a lot of trauma with those people

1157
01:00:21,001 --> 01:00:23,681
Speaker 1: that I thought were looking after her. I mean, I

1158
01:00:23,721 --> 01:00:26,521
Speaker 1: knew her dad wasn't a ever really a good egg.

1159
01:00:26,721 --> 01:00:32,001
Speaker 1: But I was lied to by those people saying that

1160
01:00:32,681 --> 01:00:34,561
Speaker 1: she didn't want to see me, she was happy where

1161
01:00:34,641 --> 01:00:37,521
Speaker 1: she was. She wanted me to stop contacting them. I

1162
01:00:37,681 --> 01:00:42,001
Speaker 1: was disrupting her life by continuing to contact her. She

1163
01:00:42,081 --> 01:00:45,841
Speaker 1: even I even received a few letters from my daughter

1164
01:00:45,921 --> 01:00:48,601
Speaker 1: in her hand which telling me these things, which she

1165
01:00:48,681 --> 01:00:52,441
Speaker 1: later on told me she was forced to write. So

1166
01:00:52,481 --> 01:00:54,561
Speaker 1: I went through years of after I was clean, trying

1167
01:00:54,561 --> 01:00:57,121
Speaker 1: to get her back. She would come and visit me

1168
01:00:57,161 --> 01:00:59,641
Speaker 1: once a fortnight, and it was great when we're together.

1169
01:00:59,681 --> 01:01:02,321
Speaker 1: It was just like when before i'd gone to rehab.

1170
01:01:03,201 --> 01:01:04,921
Speaker 1: But then when it came close to her being picked

1171
01:01:04,961 --> 01:01:07,201
Speaker 1: up by the stepmother, she would just change. She would

1172
01:01:07,401 --> 01:01:10,081
Speaker 1: shut down, she would go really quiet, and then when

1173
01:01:10,081 --> 01:01:12,161
Speaker 1: she'd get picked up, she wouldn't hardly hug me or

1174
01:01:12,481 --> 01:01:15,361
Speaker 1: look at me. And I found out later also because

1175
01:01:15,361 --> 01:01:17,241
Speaker 1: she'd get a hard time if she was to hug

1176
01:01:17,281 --> 01:01:19,321
Speaker 1: me or shoot too much enthusiasm or show that she'd

1177
01:01:19,401 --> 01:01:22,641
Speaker 1: enjoyed her time with me, then she'd get sort of

1178
01:01:22,681 --> 01:01:28,281
Speaker 1: tormented by the stepmother. And she went through years of

1179
01:01:28,441 --> 01:01:31,401
Speaker 1: her own abuse there, emotional and a bit of physical,

1180
01:01:31,481 --> 01:01:36,961
Speaker 1: and she's told me some sexual as well, of which

1181
01:01:37,001 --> 01:01:45,361
Speaker 1: she's yeah, never been able to bring those people to justice.

1182
01:01:45,801 --> 01:01:50,081
Speaker 1: So it's been it's been tough with her trying to

1183
01:01:50,121 --> 01:01:52,681
Speaker 1: help her heal over the last few years and We've

1184
01:01:52,681 --> 01:01:55,521
Speaker 1: had a lot of ups and downs, but for them, yeah,

1185
01:01:56,241 --> 01:02:00,561
Speaker 1: later part lately it seems to be good. We seem

1186
01:02:00,561 --> 01:02:01,961
Speaker 1: to be in a pretty good place right now.

1187
01:02:02,241 --> 01:02:05,281
Speaker 5: I just want to say that I think it be

1188
01:02:06,161 --> 01:02:09,441
Speaker 5: you know, put all the negativity aside, and we've got

1189
01:02:09,441 --> 01:02:11,441
Speaker 5: to be proud of where we stand today and us

1190
01:02:11,441 --> 01:02:13,761
Speaker 5: being able to sit and have these conversations and you

1191
01:02:13,961 --> 01:02:20,961
Speaker 5: giving back to you know, so many people through your

1192
01:02:20,961 --> 01:02:23,761
Speaker 5: lived experience. And I go on about it all the time,

1193
01:02:23,801 --> 01:02:26,201
Speaker 5: and I'll never ever stop because to me, lived experience

1194
01:02:26,241 --> 01:02:29,601
Speaker 5: is so valuable and this is what the world needs

1195
01:02:29,641 --> 01:02:31,761
Speaker 5: more of as people like us, which we're starting to

1196
01:02:31,761 --> 01:02:37,361
Speaker 5: see a lot more active ex addicts and criminals wanting

1197
01:02:37,401 --> 01:02:41,721
Speaker 5: to and are leaving solid footprints moving forward to be

1198
01:02:41,761 --> 01:02:46,161
Speaker 5: able to then implement positive change and helping young people.

1199
01:02:47,121 --> 01:02:50,241
Speaker 5: I do feel that my wrongs are my children's rights.

1200
01:02:52,001 --> 01:02:54,321
Speaker 5: Having lived the life that I've lived has not left

1201
01:02:54,321 --> 01:02:58,121
Speaker 5: any curiosity to their mind, being open, being able to

1202
01:02:58,361 --> 01:03:01,241
Speaker 5: know that they can come to me so openly and

1203
01:03:01,281 --> 01:03:03,721
Speaker 5: not have to hide anything. We can speak, you know,

1204
01:03:04,521 --> 01:03:07,281
Speaker 5: like when we're father and son or father and daughter.

1205
01:03:07,361 --> 01:03:10,841
Speaker 5: But you know, we're very very comfortable and just having

1206
01:03:11,121 --> 01:03:14,401
Speaker 5: what probably wouldn't be so normally many other people's homes

1207
01:03:14,441 --> 01:03:19,201
Speaker 5: because oh, Shondon, how blessed is your daughter to have

1208
01:03:19,241 --> 01:03:23,761
Speaker 5: you as mum. Like terrible and traumatic what she has experienced,

1209
01:03:23,801 --> 01:03:27,481
Speaker 5: and yes, let's not shy away from it. It's got

1210
01:03:27,481 --> 01:03:29,641
Speaker 5: a lot to do with how the life you chose

1211
01:03:29,681 --> 01:03:32,521
Speaker 5: to live. And obviously her father and that would have

1212
01:03:32,561 --> 01:03:35,401
Speaker 5: had a massive impact on what then took place in

1213
01:03:35,441 --> 01:03:36,521
Speaker 5: her life.

1214
01:03:36,601 --> 01:03:39,601
Speaker 4: But knowing that you understand.

1215
01:03:39,481 --> 01:03:45,201
Speaker 5: You care, you love, you support, you protect, and you've

1216
01:03:45,241 --> 01:03:48,481
Speaker 5: been there, you know that, right, there has got to

1217
01:03:48,481 --> 01:03:51,561
Speaker 5: be some beautiful connection for you both.

1218
01:03:53,401 --> 01:03:56,881
Speaker 1: Yeah, Look, I hope so I hope, like, yeah, we've

1219
01:03:56,921 --> 01:03:59,401
Speaker 1: been through a lot recently and she's been through a lot,

1220
01:03:59,881 --> 01:04:02,161
Speaker 1: but I hope that she you know, she's definitely seen

1221
01:04:03,161 --> 01:04:05,521
Speaker 1: seen enough I think from myself and her father put

1222
01:04:05,521 --> 01:04:07,441
Speaker 1: together that she would never go down that path of

1223
01:04:07,961 --> 01:04:12,881
Speaker 1: hard drugs, of entertaining that idea. And yeah, she's she's

1224
01:04:13,001 --> 01:04:15,961
Speaker 1: experimented and she's shared that with me, you know, softer stuff,

1225
01:04:16,121 --> 01:04:17,721
Speaker 1: but she's she's been able to come to me and

1226
01:04:17,761 --> 01:04:21,041
Speaker 1: share that with me. So I'm glad that there's that. Yeah,

1227
01:04:21,121 --> 01:04:23,961
Speaker 1: I just I just hope now that she can see

1228
01:04:23,961 --> 01:04:26,561
Speaker 1: from what I do, not what I say, But what

1229
01:04:26,601 --> 01:04:30,601
Speaker 1: I do is how like I can really show how

1230
01:04:30,641 --> 01:04:36,041
Speaker 1: to be a good, productive, like honest person in society

1231
01:04:36,081 --> 01:04:39,321
Speaker 1: now by my actions. So that and that's that's all

1232
01:04:39,321 --> 01:04:41,561
Speaker 1: I've got. Sometimes it gets really fucking hard and I

1233
01:04:41,601 --> 01:04:43,521
Speaker 1: don't know where to go with it, but I know

1234
01:04:43,561 --> 01:04:46,521
Speaker 1: that if I keep being this person and living this

1235
01:04:46,641 --> 01:04:49,601
Speaker 1: path and showing by my actions, then I'm that's all

1236
01:04:49,641 --> 01:04:51,881
Speaker 1: I can do. That's, you know, providing a good role

1237
01:04:51,881 --> 01:04:52,441
Speaker 1: model for her.

1238
01:04:52,841 --> 01:04:54,481
Speaker 4: But that's what life's about, isn't it.

1239
01:04:55,521 --> 01:05:02,561
Speaker 5: Leading, you know, showing what positive choices are, what we

1240
01:05:02,641 --> 01:05:05,201
Speaker 5: can do to make a better choice, and how how

1241
01:05:05,241 --> 01:05:08,801
Speaker 5: we choose to live our life through trauma, through pain,

1242
01:05:08,921 --> 01:05:14,881
Speaker 5: through heartache and all those things that you've experienced. You

1243
01:05:14,921 --> 01:05:17,161
Speaker 5: can only be the best you can be. And as

1244
01:05:17,161 --> 01:05:19,881
Speaker 5: I say to my children today, it just be one

1245
01:05:19,881 --> 01:05:22,401
Speaker 5: percent better than yesterday. You can't ask for the world

1246
01:05:22,441 --> 01:05:23,161
Speaker 5: because it ain't.

1247
01:05:23,001 --> 01:05:24,121
Speaker 4: Going to happen, you know.

1248
01:05:24,161 --> 01:05:26,561
Speaker 5: But if you take each step every day and it's

1249
01:05:26,681 --> 01:05:30,521
Speaker 5: just that much better than it was yesterday, you're winning,

1250
01:05:31,161 --> 01:05:34,361
Speaker 5: you know. And if you're doing it together, it's harder

1251
01:05:34,401 --> 01:05:36,761
Speaker 5: to break the team, you know what I mean. No,

1252
01:05:36,881 --> 01:05:39,241
Speaker 5: men's an Ireland is a saying I like to use.

1253
01:05:39,121 --> 01:05:41,161
Speaker 4: Because I truly believe that.

1254
01:05:40,841 --> 01:05:45,201
Speaker 5: That if you're able to build your team, and it

1255
01:05:45,241 --> 01:05:47,281
Speaker 5: may be just you and your daughter, but you're only

1256
01:05:47,321 --> 01:05:50,121
Speaker 5: as strong as your weakest link, and you're strong, so

1257
01:05:50,241 --> 01:05:52,281
Speaker 5: there's no weak link there, do you know what I mean?

1258
01:05:52,361 --> 01:05:54,801
Speaker 5: And to lead and to be able to But at

1259
01:05:54,841 --> 01:05:56,681
Speaker 5: the same time, I get it, your mum, what do

1260
01:05:56,761 --> 01:05:57,001
Speaker 5: you know?

1261
01:05:59,601 --> 01:05:59,881
Speaker 9: You know.

1262
01:06:02,241 --> 01:06:05,041
Speaker 5: We're the biggest fucking asshiles and enemies in the world,

1263
01:06:05,241 --> 01:06:07,121
Speaker 5: because what the fuck would you know?

1264
01:06:10,041 --> 01:06:12,321
Speaker 4: But at the end of the day, when when you know,

1265
01:06:12,441 --> 01:06:14,201
Speaker 4: push comes to shove, I feel.

1266
01:06:13,921 --> 01:06:18,881
Speaker 5: That that our children do definitely look and will feel

1267
01:06:18,881 --> 01:06:19,481
Speaker 5: that blessing.

1268
01:06:20,161 --> 01:06:23,201
Speaker 4: You know, you doing a lot of mentoring. You're in

1269
01:06:23,241 --> 01:06:24,041
Speaker 4: a great space.

1270
01:06:24,241 --> 01:06:27,201
Speaker 5: Let's talk about that and how it is you know,

1271
01:06:27,281 --> 01:06:30,881
Speaker 5: you have eight years you said that you've been involved

1272
01:06:30,881 --> 01:06:32,841
Speaker 5: with your training and your PETEAM and.

1273
01:06:32,801 --> 01:06:35,601
Speaker 4: Stuff, and look, I'm wowed by it.

1274
01:06:36,761 --> 01:06:40,521
Speaker 5: I think that it's fantastic and let's let's tell everyone

1275
01:06:40,561 --> 01:06:43,321
Speaker 5: out there what it is you're actually doing and how

1276
01:06:43,361 --> 01:06:44,281
Speaker 5: it's working for you.

1277
01:06:44,721 --> 01:06:48,041
Speaker 1: Yeah. So, I'm, like I said before, a PT and

1278
01:06:48,121 --> 01:06:51,521
Speaker 1: an online coach, and I've been doing that for last

1279
01:06:52,121 --> 01:06:58,641
Speaker 1: eight years. I my passion is being able to help

1280
01:06:58,681 --> 01:07:00,681
Speaker 1: women and men also. I actually do have a lot

1281
01:07:00,721 --> 01:07:03,641
Speaker 1: of male clients, but I love showing women that they

1282
01:07:03,681 --> 01:07:06,161
Speaker 1: can do more than they think they can do, Like

1283
01:07:06,201 --> 01:07:08,321
Speaker 1: they can do shit that they never thought they could do,

1284
01:07:08,361 --> 01:07:12,401
Speaker 1: they never thought possible. And I love teaching and educating

1285
01:07:12,401 --> 01:07:14,401
Speaker 1: people on how to be strong and how to eat

1286
01:07:14,441 --> 01:07:18,881
Speaker 1: to perform and eat to feel good. And obviously I

1287
01:07:19,841 --> 01:07:22,921
Speaker 1: really love being able to help and share with other

1288
01:07:23,001 --> 01:07:26,161
Speaker 1: addicts or recovering addicts that you know, this is something

1289
01:07:26,201 --> 01:07:28,761
Speaker 1: you can slot into your life that just like so

1290
01:07:28,841 --> 01:07:30,841
Speaker 1: what it's done for me, I like to share that

1291
01:07:30,881 --> 01:07:32,481
Speaker 1: with other people. And I just want to share that

1292
01:07:32,481 --> 01:07:34,721
Speaker 1: with as many people as possible because it's literally saved

1293
01:07:34,761 --> 01:07:37,081
Speaker 1: my life. It's kept me clean. So that's what I

1294
01:07:37,121 --> 01:07:40,601
Speaker 1: get to do every day. I also occasionally go back

1295
01:07:40,601 --> 01:07:43,441
Speaker 1: and talk to the rehabs I said before, and I

1296
01:07:43,441 --> 01:07:45,201
Speaker 1: get to share that story, and I get to look

1297
01:07:45,321 --> 01:07:49,001
Speaker 1: into the faces of people that were me, that were

1298
01:07:49,121 --> 01:07:51,081
Speaker 1: just like me, and I swear when I'm sitting around

1299
01:07:51,121 --> 01:07:52,961
Speaker 1: there in that circle that I used to sit in,

1300
01:07:53,001 --> 01:07:54,841
Speaker 1: because one of the rehabs I go to was one

1301
01:07:54,881 --> 01:07:56,721
Speaker 1: that I was in, and there's a circle that we

1302
01:07:56,761 --> 01:07:58,761
Speaker 1: sit and I was in one of those chairs nine

1303
01:07:58,801 --> 01:08:00,641
Speaker 1: years ago, eight and a half years ago, and like

1304
01:08:00,961 --> 01:08:03,481
Speaker 1: looking back into all those faces, is, how does that feel?

1305
01:08:03,681 --> 01:08:07,201
Speaker 1: Fucking surreal? It is surreal, Like I see the desperation

1306
01:08:07,281 --> 01:08:09,601
Speaker 1: in their faces, and I can feel it because I

1307
01:08:09,641 --> 01:08:12,041
Speaker 1: have that desperation in my face sitting there looking back,

1308
01:08:12,081 --> 01:08:13,681
Speaker 1: and it doesn't feel like it's been nine years that

1309
01:08:13,721 --> 01:08:16,720
Speaker 1: I was sitting there staring back. But I get to

1310
01:08:16,760 --> 01:08:18,720
Speaker 1: show them. I get to show them they're so much

1311
01:08:18,961 --> 01:08:22,481
Speaker 1: more as possible outside of drugs, addiction, out of jail,

1312
01:08:22,601 --> 01:08:25,041
Speaker 1: out of crime, outside of all of that. There's so

1313
01:08:25,161 --> 01:08:28,561
Speaker 1: much that as possible. Like I've traveled, I've been in competitions,

1314
01:08:28,721 --> 01:08:32,041
Speaker 1: I've you know, I've become so fucking strong, not only

1315
01:08:32,041 --> 01:08:35,720
Speaker 1: physically but mentally. I push myself hard in the gym,

1316
01:08:35,841 --> 01:08:38,800
Speaker 1: and I have changed my body with nutrition and with training.

1317
01:08:39,161 --> 01:08:41,601
Speaker 1: I live a life where I'm happy these days. You know,

1318
01:08:41,761 --> 01:08:46,681
Speaker 1: I'm grateful. I'm grateful for nature. I'm grateful for animals.

1319
01:08:47,081 --> 01:08:49,561
Speaker 4: I can see it just your whole persona.

1320
01:08:49,641 --> 01:08:52,041
Speaker 5: You know, like we obviously we had to go deep

1321
01:08:52,561 --> 01:08:56,121
Speaker 5: and you know, talk about your journey, which once again,

1322
01:08:56,281 --> 01:08:59,001
Speaker 5: I'm very grateful, for and thank you for being very

1323
01:08:59,001 --> 01:09:03,161
Speaker 5: open as hard as it parts can be. But the

1324
01:09:03,921 --> 01:09:06,681
Speaker 5: glow on your face so when you're talking now is

1325
01:09:06,801 --> 01:09:09,241
Speaker 5: just so beautiful to see because you can see that

1326
01:09:09,241 --> 01:09:13,441
Speaker 5: there is this excitement of life as I'm living. You know,

1327
01:09:14,281 --> 01:09:18,081
Speaker 5: I'm loving my life. And yeah, okay, you know it's real.

1328
01:09:18,681 --> 01:09:20,601
Speaker 5: You're a mom, You've got your ups and downs with

1329
01:09:20,641 --> 01:09:23,521
Speaker 5: your daughter, You've got business. This ain't perfect some days

1330
01:09:23,521 --> 01:09:27,761
Speaker 5: and some days it's awesome, but you are genuinely just

1331
01:09:27,881 --> 01:09:30,041
Speaker 5: in full on energy mode.

1332
01:09:29,801 --> 01:09:31,361
Speaker 4: Of I am happy.

1333
01:09:31,441 --> 01:09:34,201
Speaker 5: I love my life, and that right there is so

1334
01:09:34,241 --> 01:09:36,401
Speaker 5: awesome and people can have that.

1335
01:09:36,681 --> 01:09:37,161
Speaker 4: It's there.

1336
01:09:37,521 --> 01:09:39,680
Speaker 1: One thing I've also started doing recently, Brent, I want

1337
01:09:39,681 --> 01:09:43,121
Speaker 1: to share is this changed. It's given me an amazing feeling.

1338
01:09:43,121 --> 01:09:44,921
Speaker 1: That is all I can say. I've started volunteering, and

1339
01:09:44,961 --> 01:09:48,201
Speaker 1: I've been volunteering feeding the homeless. This will be my

1340
01:09:48,241 --> 01:09:50,161
Speaker 1: fifth week in a row. So I started. Actually Holly

1341
01:09:50,161 --> 01:09:51,721
Speaker 1: got me onto it. Well. I saw that Holly was

1342
01:09:51,721 --> 01:09:53,561
Speaker 1: doing it with this organization, and I chatted and I

1343
01:09:53,641 --> 01:09:55,521
Speaker 1: got the details and I started. So four weeks in

1344
01:09:55,561 --> 01:09:57,481
Speaker 1: a row, I go every Tuesday night and I help

1345
01:09:57,561 --> 01:10:00,561
Speaker 1: feed homeless people in Perth and the feeling I get

1346
01:10:00,561 --> 01:10:04,521
Speaker 1: of just giving and not being giving with no expectation

1347
01:10:04,601 --> 01:10:07,081
Speaker 1: of return, with not getting anything back, and not being

1348
01:10:07,081 --> 01:10:09,281
Speaker 1: the bath, the mom anything, just helping, just helping and

1349
01:10:09,321 --> 01:10:12,961
Speaker 1: giving is like, I can't explain the feeling that I

1350
01:10:13,001 --> 01:10:15,561
Speaker 1: get from that. The the gradit that.

1351
01:10:15,961 --> 01:10:18,561
Speaker 5: Yes you can, Yes you can, and I'm gonna gonna

1352
01:10:18,601 --> 01:10:20,680
Speaker 5: I'm gonna stop you. You can, and I'll tell you why

1353
01:10:20,721 --> 01:10:23,281
Speaker 5: because you did in the beginning of your story, that

1354
01:10:23,321 --> 01:10:26,761
Speaker 5: little girl that was stealing out there to give to people.

1355
01:10:27,161 --> 01:10:29,881
Speaker 4: And now as a woman, you're out there doing this.

1356
01:10:30,601 --> 01:10:33,641
Speaker 5: There's your answer. It's always been within you. That's who

1357
01:10:33,681 --> 01:10:36,441
Speaker 5: you are, that's what your heart is. It's pure, you know,

1358
01:10:36,841 --> 01:10:40,641
Speaker 5: it's had so much weight and so much sort of

1359
01:10:40,721 --> 01:10:41,721
Speaker 5: darkness around it.

1360
01:10:41,841 --> 01:10:42,881
Speaker 4: Now you've broken it.

1361
01:10:42,841 --> 01:10:46,081
Speaker 5: Away and it's pure and it's clean, and you're doing

1362
01:10:46,121 --> 01:10:48,161
Speaker 5: exactly what you're meant to be doing. And if you

1363
01:10:48,201 --> 01:10:50,841
Speaker 5: look back to that little girl who was stealing to

1364
01:10:50,921 --> 01:10:53,921
Speaker 5: give someone, and you said it yourself, to bring a smile,

1365
01:10:53,961 --> 01:10:55,361
Speaker 5: to make someone happy.

1366
01:10:55,401 --> 01:10:58,121
Speaker 4: Yeah, and you're out there now giving back doing that

1367
01:10:58,201 --> 01:11:02,161
Speaker 4: same mate, that's awesome, Like how good? This is your destiny?

1368
01:11:02,201 --> 01:11:03,081
Speaker 4: This is who you are.

1369
01:11:03,001 --> 01:11:04,801
Speaker 1: Meant to be Yeah, yeah, that's what it feels like.

1370
01:11:05,441 --> 01:11:08,841
Speaker 5: How do you feel today knowing that you asked? I mean,

1371
01:11:08,881 --> 01:11:11,241
Speaker 5: obviously you've realized you're here for a purpose. God's kept

1372
01:11:11,241 --> 01:11:15,201
Speaker 5: you here and you are definitely here to heal and

1373
01:11:15,241 --> 01:11:16,041
Speaker 5: to help others.

1374
01:11:16,081 --> 01:11:18,081
Speaker 4: So yeah, you know, like you said, you should have

1375
01:11:18,121 --> 01:11:18,521
Speaker 4: been dead.

1376
01:11:18,801 --> 01:11:20,881
Speaker 5: How does that feel known looking in the mirror today,

1377
01:11:20,921 --> 01:11:25,680
Speaker 5: realizing and accepting that and understanding that one you're here

1378
01:11:25,721 --> 01:11:26,601
Speaker 5: for a greater purpose.

1379
01:11:27,481 --> 01:11:30,321
Speaker 1: You know. I don't do that often enough because as

1380
01:11:30,321 --> 01:11:32,760
Speaker 1: you get on with day to day living is always

1381
01:11:32,801 --> 01:11:34,481
Speaker 1: something that has to be done within your own business

1382
01:11:34,561 --> 01:11:36,481
Speaker 1: or with your family, and you just you get caught

1383
01:11:36,561 --> 01:11:38,121
Speaker 1: up in life as it is day to day, and

1384
01:11:38,201 --> 01:11:41,601
Speaker 1: I don't often enough take a step back and go, fuck,

1385
01:11:41,841 --> 01:11:44,041
Speaker 1: look where you are, Look where you were, Look what

1386
01:11:44,081 --> 01:11:47,521
Speaker 1: you've done, you know, look what you've done in your life,

1387
01:11:47,521 --> 01:11:49,441
Speaker 1: and look where you are now. I don't do it enough,

1388
01:11:50,401 --> 01:11:51,961
Speaker 1: but I do do a gratitude journey.

1389
01:11:52,041 --> 01:11:54,641
Speaker 4: Well, I'm going to say it to you. Start doing

1390
01:11:54,681 --> 01:11:55,961
Speaker 4: it because you need to.

1391
01:11:56,161 --> 01:11:58,281
Speaker 5: You need to look in that mirror and tell that

1392
01:11:58,361 --> 01:12:02,241
Speaker 5: woman where you are and how far you've come. I mean,

1393
01:12:02,721 --> 01:12:06,121
Speaker 5: fantastic journey to be where you are, Like you would

1394
01:12:06,201 --> 01:12:09,841
Speaker 5: never know if you if you, and I guess there's

1395
01:12:09,881 --> 01:12:12,201
Speaker 5: another thing that how.

1396
01:12:13,561 --> 01:12:15,760
Speaker 4: Your body's adapted to such health.

1397
01:12:16,041 --> 01:12:18,481
Speaker 5: Are you okay, like from all the abuse and stuff

1398
01:12:18,521 --> 01:12:21,201
Speaker 5: like that with the drugs, Internally you're okay?

1399
01:12:21,281 --> 01:12:21,721
Speaker 4: Your body is.

1400
01:12:23,561 --> 01:12:27,161
Speaker 1: Yeah, got all of my own teeth that you can see,

1401
01:12:27,681 --> 01:12:29,761
Speaker 1: they're not all there towards the bat, I'm gone, but

1402
01:12:29,801 --> 01:12:32,561
Speaker 1: I've come out reasonably unscathed. I think for someone that

1403
01:12:32,761 --> 01:12:36,721
Speaker 1: abused heroin and speed and ice and everything else for

1404
01:12:36,961 --> 01:12:40,121
Speaker 1: so many years, I think I've come out reasonably unscathed.

1405
01:12:42,681 --> 01:12:45,761
Speaker 5: Absolutely, And like I say, you would never know if

1406
01:12:45,841 --> 01:12:48,641
Speaker 5: you if you didn't disclose it, you would.

1407
01:12:48,441 --> 01:12:49,441
Speaker 4: Never ever ever know.

1408
01:12:49,721 --> 01:12:53,920
Speaker 5: And that's really really powerful, because man, I think everybody

1409
01:12:53,921 --> 01:12:57,321
Speaker 5: should jump onto your page and just take a moment

1410
01:12:57,401 --> 01:12:59,521
Speaker 5: and have a read of some of your posts in

1411
01:12:59,561 --> 01:13:04,521
Speaker 5: reference to your past and without sounding disrespectful, but how

1412
01:13:05,121 --> 01:13:09,720
Speaker 5: shocking that photo photoes of you in full addiction art,

1413
01:13:09,761 --> 01:13:14,760
Speaker 5: Like it's just yeah, it's wow, yeah, absolutely look amazing.

1414
01:13:15,121 --> 01:13:17,081
Speaker 1: That's why I like a lot of people will see

1415
01:13:17,121 --> 01:13:18,841
Speaker 1: me in the gym and they'll just see me as

1416
01:13:19,121 --> 01:13:23,561
Speaker 1: fit and like really healthy, and maybe people look at

1417
01:13:23,561 --> 01:13:25,841
Speaker 1: me like, oh, that's easy for her or oh that

1418
01:13:26,001 --> 01:13:28,401
Speaker 1: because I make things look easy, because I've repeated them

1419
01:13:28,401 --> 01:13:34,001
Speaker 1: for so many years that now they seem easy. But

1420
01:13:34,081 --> 01:13:36,761
Speaker 1: I like to Okay, it wasn't always easy, you know.

1421
01:13:37,161 --> 01:13:39,241
Speaker 1: It was a heroinautic for twenty years. And then I

1422
01:13:39,281 --> 01:13:41,760
Speaker 1: started at the bottom and I got strong slowly, by slowly,

1423
01:13:41,801 --> 01:13:43,601
Speaker 1: by putting one day and one day and one week

1424
01:13:43,641 --> 01:13:45,481
Speaker 1: in front of each other, and brick by brick by brick,

1425
01:13:45,521 --> 01:13:48,681
Speaker 1: and you know, but if I can do it, anybody

1426
01:13:48,721 --> 01:13:53,161
Speaker 1: can fucking do it. Anybody, do you think though?

1427
01:13:54,241 --> 01:13:56,601
Speaker 4: And obviously I'm going to throw this one out there obvious.

1428
01:13:56,681 --> 01:14:00,161
Speaker 4: Have you substituted one addiction for another? Yeah?

1429
01:14:00,241 --> 01:14:02,681
Speaker 1: I get that. I have had that thrown at me

1430
01:14:02,721 --> 01:14:07,961
Speaker 1: a few times, especially from rehab. Look, I think an addiction? Yeah,

1431
01:14:08,001 --> 01:14:10,201
Speaker 1: perhaps the gym is an addiction. It wouldn't just be

1432
01:14:10,241 --> 01:14:13,361
Speaker 1: the gym. It would be getting enough sleep. It would

1433
01:14:13,401 --> 01:14:15,401
Speaker 1: be lowering my stress, would be putting good things in

1434
01:14:15,441 --> 01:14:18,601
Speaker 1: my body to nourish me and aid in my performance.

1435
01:14:19,161 --> 01:14:21,241
Speaker 1: We'd be getting out and getting morning sunlight. It would

1436
01:14:21,241 --> 01:14:24,481
Speaker 1: be getting you know, getting out in nature every day, walking,

1437
01:14:24,521 --> 01:14:28,561
Speaker 1: getting my steps in movement, all of those things encompassing. Yes,

1438
01:14:28,641 --> 01:14:32,081
Speaker 1: is that an addiction? Yes, Is it an addiction? Is

1439
01:14:32,121 --> 01:14:35,641
Speaker 1: it something an obsession that stops me from living my life,

1440
01:14:35,681 --> 01:14:38,561
Speaker 1: seeing my friend, seeing my family, doing my job. No,

1441
01:14:39,401 --> 01:14:41,521
Speaker 1: so yeah, it may be an addiction, but fuck I

1442
01:14:41,641 --> 01:14:44,800
Speaker 1: take this addiction over the other one any day.

1443
01:14:46,641 --> 01:14:49,201
Speaker 4: Amen. I love it. And look at the strength in

1444
01:14:49,281 --> 01:14:53,481
Speaker 4: what you just said, then fuck that. Yeah.

1445
01:14:53,521 --> 01:14:56,121
Speaker 5: For those out there that are listening, and I do

1446
01:14:56,201 --> 01:14:59,681
Speaker 5: this to all my guests, For that person that was

1447
01:14:59,721 --> 01:15:04,561
Speaker 5: you who's hearing this today, what is some advice or

1448
01:15:04,601 --> 01:15:08,361
Speaker 5: words or a word even that is stuck with you

1449
01:15:08,401 --> 01:15:11,161
Speaker 5: that has helped empower you and allowed you to become

1450
01:15:11,161 --> 01:15:14,601
Speaker 5: the woman that you are today. What would you give

1451
01:15:14,641 --> 01:15:15,401
Speaker 5: to that person?

1452
01:15:15,961 --> 01:15:17,881
Speaker 1: I don't know one thing that just stands out, and

1453
01:15:17,921 --> 01:15:22,601
Speaker 1: it's transcendent from rehab to the NA rooms. But then

1454
01:15:22,641 --> 01:15:25,201
Speaker 1: I've used it in my clean life and in my

1455
01:15:25,241 --> 01:15:27,720
Speaker 1: training life. Is like one day at a time. That's

1456
01:15:27,721 --> 01:15:29,680
Speaker 1: something that they say in NA, you know, one day

1457
01:15:29,681 --> 01:15:31,641
Speaker 1: at a time or one hour at a time. Sometimes

1458
01:15:31,681 --> 01:15:33,481
Speaker 1: I say this to my clients, you know, and they're

1459
01:15:33,481 --> 01:15:36,881
Speaker 1: not going through addiction. They might be trying to string

1460
01:15:36,921 --> 01:15:38,921
Speaker 1: together some good days of healthy eating or some good

1461
01:15:38,961 --> 01:15:41,401
Speaker 1: days of training, you know, just one day at a time.

1462
01:15:41,401 --> 01:15:43,041
Speaker 1: Don't look at the big picture like, fuck, I'm an

1463
01:15:43,041 --> 01:15:45,441
Speaker 1: addict now and I want to get clean. I've got

1464
01:15:45,441 --> 01:15:47,641
Speaker 1: to do all these steps to get there. It seems

1465
01:15:47,681 --> 01:15:50,680
Speaker 1: like a mountain. Just take it. One day at a time,

1466
01:15:50,961 --> 01:15:53,041
Speaker 1: One day at a time of not using, one day

1467
01:15:53,041 --> 01:15:56,401
Speaker 1: at a time of you know, associating yourself or putting

1468
01:15:56,401 --> 01:16:00,201
Speaker 1: yourself in situations where you're surrounded by good, positive people

1469
01:16:00,241 --> 01:16:03,401
Speaker 1: that aren't in that life. One day at a time

1470
01:16:03,401 --> 01:16:07,481
Speaker 1: of not picking up a drink. I think that's that's

1471
01:16:07,481 --> 01:16:09,761
Speaker 1: that's what that's what stands out when you say that.

1472
01:16:09,841 --> 01:16:13,001
Speaker 5: Yeah, Well, all I can say is it's been an

1473
01:16:13,041 --> 01:16:15,841
Speaker 5: absolute honor, and I'm so glad that Holly.

1474
01:16:15,641 --> 01:16:18,401
Speaker 4: Introduced us, and shout out to your whole thank you

1475
01:16:18,481 --> 01:16:19,121
Speaker 4: for this one.

1476
01:16:20,201 --> 01:16:23,041
Speaker 5: Very worthy and look, please keep in contact and if

1477
01:16:23,041 --> 01:16:25,721
Speaker 5: we can support you and your business and anything that

1478
01:16:25,761 --> 01:16:29,481
Speaker 5: you're doing, even down to you know, supporting or helping

1479
01:16:29,841 --> 01:16:32,441
Speaker 5: through whatever choices that you're making to help other people,

1480
01:16:32,841 --> 01:16:35,001
Speaker 5: please reach out to be an honor.

1481
01:16:35,921 --> 01:16:38,081
Speaker 4: Thank you so much for being on the clink today.

1482
01:16:38,641 --> 01:16:39,561
Speaker 1: Thanks Brandon.

1483
01:16:43,641 --> 01:16:46,961
Speaker 2: For the record, don't try and make you uncomfortable. For

1484
01:16:47,161 --> 01:16:49,961
Speaker 2: the record, you ain't trying world and stuff. For your

1485
01:16:50,201 --> 01:16:54,201
Speaker 2: photo record lab on me going hard to work photo record,

1486
01:16:54,321 --> 01:16:57,561
Speaker 2: ain't trying to link, not trying to wish.

1487
01:16:56,841 --> 01:17:03,481
Speaker 3: For the record for the red, for a record for

1488
01:17:03,561 --> 01:17:07,241
Speaker 3: the rate for the reggon, for the reggon,