1 00:00:05,720 --> 00:00:08,640 Speaker 1: From the Australian. Here's what's on the front. I'm Claire Harvey. 2 00:00:08,680 --> 00:00:16,200 Speaker 1: It's Friday, May two, twenty twenty five. Its election. Even 3 00:00:16,280 --> 00:00:19,960 Speaker 1: the Australian is reporting today. Labor has courted Beijing backed 4 00:00:20,040 --> 00:00:24,360 Speaker 1: property developers and senior figures in the Chinese Communist Party's 5 00:00:24,560 --> 00:00:29,240 Speaker 1: foreign influence arm. Anthony Albanezi has refused to rule out 6 00:00:29,280 --> 00:00:33,440 Speaker 1: new taxes, and the coalition released the costings of its policies, 7 00:00:33,800 --> 00:00:38,240 Speaker 1: showing a deeper projected budget deficit in its first two years, 8 00:00:38,720 --> 00:00:45,839 Speaker 1: but a reduced budget deficit within four years. Aaron Patterson 9 00:00:45,880 --> 00:00:50,040 Speaker 1: conducted taste tests where she hid mushroom powder in muffins 10 00:00:50,280 --> 00:00:53,000 Speaker 1: and fed them to her children. That was part of 11 00:00:53,040 --> 00:00:56,080 Speaker 1: the evidence in an emotional day of testimony by Crown 12 00:00:56,120 --> 00:01:01,640 Speaker 1: witness Simon Patterson. Aaron's husband leaded not guilty to three 13 00:01:01,680 --> 00:01:04,880 Speaker 1: counts of murder and one of attempted murder for feeding 14 00:01:05,000 --> 00:01:09,680 Speaker 1: death cap mushrooms to Simon's parents, aunt, and uncle, something 15 00:01:09,920 --> 00:01:14,679 Speaker 1: she says was a terrible accident. Today, Simon Patterson describes 16 00:01:14,800 --> 00:01:18,640 Speaker 1: the breakdown of her marriage and Erin's attempts to get 17 00:01:18,760 --> 00:01:33,640 Speaker 1: him to come to the fatal lunch the day before 18 00:01:33,720 --> 00:01:37,399 Speaker 1: a lunch that would kill his parents and his auntie. 19 00:01:37,440 --> 00:01:41,720 Speaker 1: Simon Patterson sent a text to his wife Erin Aaron 20 00:01:41,760 --> 00:01:45,360 Speaker 1: Patterson had invited her husband, from whom she was separated 21 00:01:45,480 --> 00:01:49,560 Speaker 1: after a rocky marriage, along with his parents Don and Gail, 22 00:01:49,920 --> 00:01:54,000 Speaker 1: and aunt and uncle Heather and Ian. Aaron Patterson told 23 00:01:54,080 --> 00:01:57,720 Speaker 1: Simon Patterson that she had serious health news to share 24 00:01:58,280 --> 00:02:01,880 Speaker 1: and wanted to talk Frank without the presence of their 25 00:02:01,920 --> 00:02:07,080 Speaker 1: two children. But Simon Patterson, who had declined an earlier 26 00:02:07,160 --> 00:02:11,160 Speaker 1: invitation to lunch, decided he didn't want to go. In 27 00:02:11,240 --> 00:02:15,120 Speaker 1: the early evening of July twenty eight, twenty twenty three, 28 00:02:15,440 --> 00:02:18,320 Speaker 1: he sent Aaron Patterson this message. 29 00:02:19,200 --> 00:02:21,960 Speaker 2: Sorry, I feel too uncomfortable about coming to the lunch 30 00:02:21,960 --> 00:02:24,720 Speaker 2: with your mum, Dad, Heather and I and tomorrow, but 31 00:02:24,720 --> 00:02:27,280 Speaker 2: I'm happy to talk about your health and implications of 32 00:02:27,280 --> 00:02:29,920 Speaker 2: that at another time. If you'd like to discuss on 33 00:02:29,960 --> 00:02:31,280 Speaker 2: the phone, just let me know. 34 00:02:32,600 --> 00:02:35,000 Speaker 1: Five minutes later, Aaron Patterson. 35 00:02:34,560 --> 00:02:40,360 Speaker 3: Replied, that's really disappointing. I've spent many hours this week 36 00:02:40,400 --> 00:02:43,720 Speaker 3: preparing lunch for tomorrow, which has been exhausting in light 37 00:02:43,760 --> 00:02:46,760 Speaker 3: of the issues I'm facing, and spent a small fortune 38 00:02:46,760 --> 00:02:49,840 Speaker 3: on beef. I Phillips to make beef Wellington's because I 39 00:02:49,880 --> 00:02:52,440 Speaker 3: wanted it to be a special meal, because I may 40 00:02:52,480 --> 00:02:54,480 Speaker 3: not be able to host a lunch like this again 41 00:02:54,520 --> 00:02:58,040 Speaker 3: for some time. It's important to me that you're all 42 00:02:58,040 --> 00:03:01,160 Speaker 3: there tomorrow and that I can have the conversations that 43 00:03:01,240 --> 00:03:04,200 Speaker 3: I need to have. I hope you'll change your mind. 44 00:03:04,720 --> 00:03:07,840 Speaker 3: Your parents and Heather and Ian are coming at twelve thirty. 45 00:03:08,400 --> 00:03:09,600 Speaker 3: I hope to see there. 46 00:03:13,120 --> 00:03:15,840 Speaker 1: That exchange was read to the jury in Aaron Patterson's 47 00:03:15,880 --> 00:03:19,800 Speaker 1: Supreme Court of Victoria trial, where Simon Patterson sat in 48 00:03:19,840 --> 00:03:23,200 Speaker 1: the witness box across the courtroom from his wife in 49 00:03:23,240 --> 00:03:26,840 Speaker 1: the dock. Aaron Patterson has pleaded not guilty to three 50 00:03:26,960 --> 00:03:30,320 Speaker 1: counts of murder for killing Don and Gail Patterson and 51 00:03:30,440 --> 00:03:34,520 Speaker 1: Gail's sister, Heather Wilkinson. She's also pleaded not guilty to 52 00:03:34,639 --> 00:03:38,320 Speaker 1: one count of attempted murder relating to Simon's uncle Ian, 53 00:03:38,600 --> 00:03:43,360 Speaker 1: who became seriously ill after the lunch but survived. The 54 00:03:43,400 --> 00:03:46,320 Speaker 1: Crown alleges she invited the family to her home with 55 00:03:46,680 --> 00:03:50,520 Speaker 1: murderous intent and served them a meal she knew contained 56 00:03:50,720 --> 00:03:55,000 Speaker 1: deadly deathcap mushrooms. Aaron Patterson's lawyer has told the jury. 57 00:03:55,200 --> 00:03:58,520 Speaker 1: She didn't intend to kill anyone and it was a 58 00:03:58,560 --> 00:04:04,840 Speaker 1: tragedy and a terrible accident. We've used voice actors to 59 00:04:04,920 --> 00:04:08,160 Speaker 1: bring you the words spoken in the Supreme Court of Victoria. 60 00:04:08,760 --> 00:04:09,600 Speaker 1: Simon Patterson. 61 00:04:11,120 --> 00:04:14,440 Speaker 2: Erin's very intelligent. I guess some of the things that 62 00:04:14,480 --> 00:04:17,120 Speaker 2: attracted me to her in the first place was definitely 63 00:04:17,160 --> 00:04:21,200 Speaker 2: her intelligence. She's quite witty and can be quite funny. 64 00:04:23,880 --> 00:04:26,719 Speaker 1: That was how Simon Patterson began his evidence on day 65 00:04:26,720 --> 00:04:29,279 Speaker 1: two of the trial, telling the jury what made him 66 00:04:29,279 --> 00:04:31,799 Speaker 1: fall in love with Erin when they met while both 67 00:04:31,920 --> 00:04:35,560 Speaker 1: working at the local council. She was a qualified accountant 68 00:04:35,600 --> 00:04:38,800 Speaker 1: and air traffic controller, but she was an animal lover 69 00:04:39,200 --> 00:04:43,800 Speaker 1: working as an RSPCA representative at the council. He was 70 00:04:43,839 --> 00:04:49,200 Speaker 1: a civil engineer. Simon Patterson described a turbulent marriage where 71 00:04:49,320 --> 00:04:52,760 Speaker 1: Erin would frequently leave him, including when they were driving 72 00:04:52,760 --> 00:04:55,920 Speaker 1: around Australia in a four wheel drive with their baby son. 73 00:04:57,400 --> 00:04:59,640 Speaker 2: We'd sort of done the northern part of Australia right 74 00:04:59,720 --> 00:05:01,840 Speaker 2: up to the top of Cape York Peninsula and then 75 00:05:01,880 --> 00:05:05,440 Speaker 2: got back down to Townsville and Aaron decided or chose 76 00:05:05,440 --> 00:05:08,480 Speaker 2: to fly just herself back to Perth, and so yeah, 77 00:05:08,640 --> 00:05:11,200 Speaker 2: I packed everything up and the baby and I drove 78 00:05:11,240 --> 00:05:13,679 Speaker 2: across Australia through the Middle straight back to Perth. 79 00:05:14,880 --> 00:05:18,680 Speaker 1: When they arrived in Perth, Patterson, who Simon said had 80 00:05:18,680 --> 00:05:22,400 Speaker 1: inherited two million dollars from her late grandmother, had organized 81 00:05:22,440 --> 00:05:25,000 Speaker 1: a rental house for herself and the baby. 82 00:05:26,240 --> 00:05:28,960 Speaker 2: I organized to stay in an on site van at 83 00:05:28,960 --> 00:05:32,119 Speaker 2: a caravan park nearby. I don't know how many months, 84 00:05:32,160 --> 00:05:35,359 Speaker 2: a few months. What I understood from Aaron was that 85 00:05:35,400 --> 00:05:37,120 Speaker 2: she was struggling inside herself. 86 00:05:38,160 --> 00:05:40,720 Speaker 1: They got back together and moved to Victoria. 87 00:05:41,920 --> 00:05:44,280 Speaker 2: Aeron decided to buy herself a separate house and move 88 00:05:44,279 --> 00:05:44,680 Speaker 2: into it. 89 00:05:45,680 --> 00:05:52,320 Speaker 1: They separated again. Crown Prosecutor Nanette Rogers sc her words 90 00:05:52,360 --> 00:05:53,599 Speaker 1: are read by a voice actor. 91 00:05:55,120 --> 00:05:58,160 Speaker 4: How would you describe the relationship? Was it a bit strained? 92 00:05:58,920 --> 00:06:01,800 Speaker 2: Yeah, it was strained. There was tension in it. I'd 93 00:06:01,880 --> 00:06:05,040 Speaker 2: organized a family counselor in Lee and Gatha. I was 94 00:06:05,080 --> 00:06:07,120 Speaker 2: always keen to have a good relationship, have a good 95 00:06:07,120 --> 00:06:09,200 Speaker 2: marriage and a good strong family to bring up the 96 00:06:09,279 --> 00:06:11,599 Speaker 2: kids in. I think it's good to be friends with 97 00:06:11,640 --> 00:06:13,880 Speaker 2: the person you're married to, and plus I like to 98 00:06:13,880 --> 00:06:17,719 Speaker 2: have good relationships with anyone, especially my wife. But also 99 00:06:17,800 --> 00:06:24,680 Speaker 2: partly because it was, so it's really important to me that. Sorry, 100 00:06:24,680 --> 00:06:25,560 Speaker 2: can I have some tissues? 101 00:06:25,600 --> 00:06:25,880 Speaker 4: Please? 102 00:06:27,279 --> 00:06:30,400 Speaker 2: Do you want to break I don't, That's fine. I'm 103 00:06:30,400 --> 00:06:32,599 Speaker 2: just struggling to answer the question, but I'll get there. 104 00:06:33,800 --> 00:06:37,080 Speaker 1: Simon Patterson said they'd retained a friendly relationship where they 105 00:06:37,120 --> 00:06:40,799 Speaker 1: shared custody of their two children and shared family holidays together, 106 00:06:40,960 --> 00:06:44,680 Speaker 1: both in Australia and overseas, but one day in late 107 00:06:44,720 --> 00:06:48,040 Speaker 1: twenty twenty two, about seven months before the fatal lunch, 108 00:06:48,400 --> 00:06:51,000 Speaker 1: after he dropped off one of the children at her home, 109 00:06:51,520 --> 00:06:55,400 Speaker 1: Simon recalled Aaron Patterson, saying she wanted a serious conversation. 110 00:06:57,000 --> 00:06:59,240 Speaker 2: She said that she discovered that my tax returned for 111 00:06:59,279 --> 00:07:02,039 Speaker 2: the previous final actual year had for the first time 112 00:07:02,160 --> 00:07:05,400 Speaker 2: noted that we were separated before that. We hadn't got 113 00:07:05,400 --> 00:07:07,800 Speaker 2: the government involved in the fact we were separated at 114 00:07:07,839 --> 00:07:10,680 Speaker 2: all before then, and so she said that mattered, I 115 00:07:10,720 --> 00:07:13,680 Speaker 2: think for the family tax benefit something of that nature, 116 00:07:14,520 --> 00:07:17,080 Speaker 2: and she would be obliged to claim child sport of me, 117 00:07:17,400 --> 00:07:20,680 Speaker 2: which had never happened before, and so was yeah, she 118 00:07:20,800 --> 00:07:24,080 Speaker 2: pointed that out, and that was she was upset about it. 119 00:07:25,400 --> 00:07:29,120 Speaker 1: Simon Patterson said he hadn't intended to describe himself as separated, 120 00:07:29,480 --> 00:07:32,960 Speaker 1: but it was probably a miscommunication between him and his accountant. 121 00:07:33,520 --> 00:07:36,000 Speaker 1: He said. He offered to amend the tax return. 122 00:07:37,240 --> 00:07:39,880 Speaker 2: Aaron rejected that as a possibility and said she wasn't 123 00:07:39,880 --> 00:07:42,800 Speaker 2: happy with that. I think it was resolved by us 124 00:07:42,840 --> 00:07:44,560 Speaker 2: agreeing she would apply for child. 125 00:07:44,280 --> 00:07:48,320 Speaker 1: Support, But that, said Simon Patterson, was the end of 126 00:07:48,360 --> 00:07:53,280 Speaker 1: their friendly relationship. The chatty banter on messages ceased. He said. 127 00:07:53,280 --> 00:07:56,360 Speaker 1: He then began declining requests to pay school fees and 128 00:07:56,440 --> 00:07:59,480 Speaker 1: medical bills, telling eron that should be covered by the 129 00:07:59,560 --> 00:08:01,240 Speaker 1: child's caught payments. 130 00:08:02,040 --> 00:08:03,560 Speaker 4: Was she happy or unhappy? 131 00:08:04,120 --> 00:08:07,080 Speaker 2: Pretty sure she was very upset about that. I was 132 00:08:07,120 --> 00:08:08,800 Speaker 2: sure she was very upset about. 133 00:08:08,600 --> 00:08:13,200 Speaker 1: That, Simon Patterson said. After this, Aaron Patterson involved his parents, 134 00:08:13,280 --> 00:08:16,120 Speaker 1: Don and Gail Patterson in the discussion about the school 135 00:08:16,120 --> 00:08:19,440 Speaker 1: fees via a group chat on the messaging app Signal. 136 00:08:20,360 --> 00:08:22,200 Speaker 2: I think it was pretty clear she was asking for 137 00:08:22,240 --> 00:08:26,560 Speaker 2: them to be involved, That's my opinion, They responded, encouraging 138 00:08:26,640 --> 00:08:28,320 Speaker 2: us to resolve it between each other. 139 00:08:29,360 --> 00:08:33,800 Speaker 1: Asked about Aaron Patterson's relationship with his parents, Simon Patterson said. 140 00:08:34,240 --> 00:08:37,200 Speaker 2: She got on particularly well with dad. They shared a 141 00:08:37,240 --> 00:08:39,000 Speaker 2: love of knowledge in the world, and I think she 142 00:08:39,240 --> 00:08:42,720 Speaker 2: liked his gentle nature. Mum and Dad were really active 143 00:08:42,720 --> 00:08:45,560 Speaker 2: in maintaining a good relationship with Aaron. I think it 144 00:08:45,600 --> 00:08:46,120 Speaker 2: was mutual. 145 00:08:49,720 --> 00:08:53,160 Speaker 1: The morning after the lunch Sunday, July thirty, Simon Patterson 146 00:08:53,200 --> 00:08:55,040 Speaker 1: got a call from his father Dawn. 147 00:08:55,920 --> 00:08:57,760 Speaker 2: He told me that he and Mum had been vomiting 148 00:08:57,800 --> 00:09:00,559 Speaker 2: in a diary since I think he was first light 149 00:09:00,600 --> 00:09:02,920 Speaker 2: and then Mum started perhaps an hour later, and that 150 00:09:03,000 --> 00:09:06,640 Speaker 2: had been continuing throughout the night fairly frequently, and so 151 00:09:06,760 --> 00:09:08,360 Speaker 2: they'd called emergency services. 152 00:09:09,559 --> 00:09:12,760 Speaker 1: Dom Patterson told his son Ian and Heather Wilkinson had 153 00:09:12,880 --> 00:09:17,040 Speaker 1: similar symptoms. Simon Patterson said he said he then drove 154 00:09:17,160 --> 00:09:18,240 Speaker 1: to the Wilkinson's home. 155 00:09:19,120 --> 00:09:20,120 Speaker 2: Ian answered the door. 156 00:09:21,040 --> 00:09:22,240 Speaker 4: How did he appear. 157 00:09:23,400 --> 00:09:27,840 Speaker 2: Sick? He looked gray, I suppose, and stooped, Yeah, he 158 00:09:27,880 --> 00:09:28,480 Speaker 2: was struggling. 159 00:09:28,920 --> 00:09:29,200 Speaker 1: I think. 160 00:09:29,200 --> 00:09:31,640 Speaker 2: I said, how are you? He said, not good. 161 00:09:32,640 --> 00:09:35,200 Speaker 1: Simon Patterson said he entered the house and found Heather 162 00:09:35,240 --> 00:09:39,559 Speaker 1: Wilkinson hunched over a container he described as a spew bucket. 163 00:09:40,880 --> 00:09:43,400 Speaker 2: We didn't have much conversation, but she puzzled and she 164 00:09:43,480 --> 00:09:46,000 Speaker 2: said I noticed Aaron served to sell for food on 165 00:09:46,040 --> 00:09:49,200 Speaker 2: a colored plate which was different to the rest he 166 00:09:49,280 --> 00:09:50,319 Speaker 2: took them to hospital. 167 00:09:51,360 --> 00:09:52,679 Speaker 4: Did Heather say something to. 168 00:09:52,640 --> 00:09:56,520 Speaker 2: You, Yeah, she did. She mentioned the color plate again, 169 00:09:56,720 --> 00:09:59,600 Speaker 2: so she asked me, is Aaron short of crockery? Is 170 00:09:59,600 --> 00:10:02,080 Speaker 2: that why she would have this different kind of colored plate. 171 00:10:03,200 --> 00:10:05,320 Speaker 4: Did you reply to Heather's observation. 172 00:10:05,679 --> 00:10:08,160 Speaker 2: I said, yes, Aaron doesn't have that many plates, and 173 00:10:08,200 --> 00:10:09,240 Speaker 2: that may be the reason. 174 00:10:10,600 --> 00:10:13,520 Speaker 1: When he first saw his parents in hospital, Simon Patterson 175 00:10:13,559 --> 00:10:16,720 Speaker 1: observed his father seemed very ill. 176 00:10:17,040 --> 00:10:20,840 Speaker 2: Dad was substantially worse than mum. He was really struggling. 177 00:10:20,920 --> 00:10:25,120 Speaker 2: He was lying on the side, hunched, noticeably discolored face. 178 00:10:26,040 --> 00:10:28,480 Speaker 2: Speaking was an effort and taking the energy to speak 179 00:10:28,559 --> 00:10:31,800 Speaker 2: was an effort, and his voice was strained. He wasn't 180 00:10:31,880 --> 00:10:33,880 Speaker 2: right inside. 181 00:10:34,400 --> 00:10:36,920 Speaker 1: Simon told the jury Don Patterson told him that at 182 00:10:36,920 --> 00:10:40,000 Speaker 1: the lunch Aaron Patterson had told him she had cancer. 183 00:10:40,840 --> 00:10:44,040 Speaker 2: He said, they'd found cancer, I think ovarian cancer in erin, 184 00:10:44,640 --> 00:10:47,000 Speaker 2: so she was expecting to have I think chemo and 185 00:10:47,040 --> 00:10:50,480 Speaker 2: potentially surgery. Mum said that she talked about the question 186 00:10:50,520 --> 00:10:52,560 Speaker 2: of how to break the news to the kids, and 187 00:10:52,600 --> 00:10:55,320 Speaker 2: that she believed we should talk about that with the 188 00:10:55,400 --> 00:10:56,120 Speaker 2: kids together. 189 00:10:57,480 --> 00:10:59,439 Speaker 4: And did your father agree with that strategy? 190 00:11:00,160 --> 00:11:02,400 Speaker 2: They were both really strong on us working our marriage 191 00:11:02,400 --> 00:11:04,120 Speaker 2: out together, and everything out together. 192 00:11:05,320 --> 00:11:07,880 Speaker 1: The previous night, Aaron Patterson had told her husband she 193 00:11:07,920 --> 00:11:11,400 Speaker 1: had diarrhea symptoms. The jury heard she. 194 00:11:11,400 --> 00:11:13,520 Speaker 2: Wanted to go to hospital, or thought she should go 195 00:11:13,520 --> 00:11:16,160 Speaker 2: to hospital perhaps, but again she was worried that if 196 00:11:16,160 --> 00:11:19,400 Speaker 2: she drove herself theare she was worried she might poo 197 00:11:19,480 --> 00:11:20,280 Speaker 2: her pants driving. 198 00:11:21,280 --> 00:11:22,680 Speaker 4: So did she ask you something? 199 00:11:23,520 --> 00:11:25,520 Speaker 2: She asked me to come and take her to the hospital. 200 00:11:29,880 --> 00:11:32,600 Speaker 1: When he saw his wife later at the local medical center, 201 00:11:32,720 --> 00:11:35,360 Speaker 1: Simon Patterson said she didn't seem to be rushing to 202 00:11:35,400 --> 00:11:39,240 Speaker 1: the toilet frequently. He brought their children to hospital and 203 00:11:39,320 --> 00:11:42,000 Speaker 1: they spent time in the same room as Aaron Patterson. 204 00:11:42,720 --> 00:11:45,560 Speaker 1: Simon Patterson said during their time at the hospital, the 205 00:11:45,640 --> 00:11:50,400 Speaker 1: family discussed the fact the daughter didn't like mushrooms. Simon 206 00:11:50,440 --> 00:11:53,680 Speaker 1: Patterson said Aaron Patterson told him and the children that 207 00:11:53,880 --> 00:11:58,320 Speaker 1: she'd been dehydrating mushrooms and pulverizing them, then putting the 208 00:11:58,400 --> 00:12:00,560 Speaker 1: powder in muffins for the children. 209 00:12:01,840 --> 00:12:04,040 Speaker 2: She said she did a blind taste test with our 210 00:12:04,120 --> 00:12:07,480 Speaker 2: daughter by adding powdered dehydrated mushroom to food, and they 211 00:12:07,520 --> 00:12:10,480 Speaker 2: all found it interesting that our daughter did like the muffins. 212 00:12:10,480 --> 00:12:11,840 Speaker 5: With mushrooms. 213 00:12:18,960 --> 00:12:40,800 Speaker 1: Coming up. Aaron Patterson's lawyer cross examines her husband. Aaron 214 00:12:40,840 --> 00:12:45,720 Speaker 1: Patterson's lawyer, Colin Mandy sc Cross examined Simon Patterson. He 215 00:12:45,800 --> 00:12:49,559 Speaker 1: asked Simon Patterson to agree their relationship had been cordial 216 00:12:49,920 --> 00:12:52,800 Speaker 1: over the years, and Patterson agreed. The couple and their 217 00:12:52,880 --> 00:12:56,479 Speaker 1: children had taken many holidays together even after separation. 218 00:12:57,840 --> 00:13:00,720 Speaker 5: Would you agree with this proposition that Erin was very 219 00:13:00,720 --> 00:13:04,040 Speaker 5: generous with that money she received from her grand Yes, 220 00:13:04,720 --> 00:13:06,319 Speaker 5: especially to you and your siblings. 221 00:13:07,160 --> 00:13:10,960 Speaker 1: Yes, he agreed. They used some of her inheritance to 222 00:13:10,960 --> 00:13:13,520 Speaker 1: make loans of up to three hundred thousand dollars to 223 00:13:13,640 --> 00:13:15,000 Speaker 1: two of Simon's siblings. 224 00:13:15,760 --> 00:13:19,199 Speaker 5: And you'd agree with this proposition that, consistent with all 225 00:13:19,240 --> 00:13:22,040 Speaker 5: of that, money has never really been a significant factor, 226 00:13:22,360 --> 00:13:24,920 Speaker 5: motivating factor in Aeron's life decisions. 227 00:13:25,440 --> 00:13:27,679 Speaker 2: Yeah, I think both of us I don't think money was. 228 00:13:28,080 --> 00:13:30,800 Speaker 2: Money's not been the most important motivation to either Erin 229 00:13:30,880 --> 00:13:32,040 Speaker 2: or me in our decisions. 230 00:13:33,320 --> 00:13:36,160 Speaker 1: Mandy asked about Aaron Patterson's religious faith. 231 00:13:37,080 --> 00:13:38,800 Speaker 2: When I met Erin, she was an atheist. 232 00:13:39,880 --> 00:13:41,880 Speaker 1: Mandy brought up a day when the couple attended the 233 00:13:41,920 --> 00:13:46,400 Speaker 1: current Borough Baptist Church. Mandy asked if Ian Wilkinson, one 234 00:13:46,400 --> 00:13:48,960 Speaker 1: of the guests at the lunch, was the pastor delivering 235 00:13:48,960 --> 00:13:52,000 Speaker 1: the sermon that day, Patterson said he couldn't recall. 236 00:13:53,000 --> 00:13:55,720 Speaker 5: Do you recall that Aaron was moved by the sermon? 237 00:13:56,760 --> 00:13:59,400 Speaker 2: I think I know what you're referring to. Yeah, Aaron 238 00:13:59,559 --> 00:14:02,160 Speaker 2: was moved during the service. I think it was I 239 00:14:02,160 --> 00:14:05,559 Speaker 2: think during the communion. She quickly walked, stepped up and left, 240 00:14:05,840 --> 00:14:07,720 Speaker 2: left the church building and went outside. 241 00:14:08,320 --> 00:14:09,280 Speaker 5: And was she upset? 242 00:14:10,240 --> 00:14:11,920 Speaker 2: She looked upset. Yeah. 243 00:14:12,120 --> 00:14:14,800 Speaker 5: Was there discussion with her afterwards about why that was 244 00:14:15,440 --> 00:14:17,640 Speaker 5: and was it because she was moved by the sermon? 245 00:14:18,160 --> 00:14:20,720 Speaker 2: Oh, she was moved my memory of it, she was 246 00:14:20,760 --> 00:14:23,640 Speaker 2: actually moved by what was happening during the communion part 247 00:14:23,680 --> 00:14:25,960 Speaker 2: of the service, not the sermon, but. 248 00:14:26,000 --> 00:14:29,280 Speaker 5: By a religious or spiritual aspect of what was happening. 249 00:14:28,880 --> 00:14:29,440 Speaker 3: On that day. 250 00:14:30,280 --> 00:14:37,640 Speaker 1: Yes, the pair owned multiple properties, and Simon Patterson said 251 00:14:37,840 --> 00:14:41,040 Speaker 1: he was puzzled about why Aaron Patterson added his name 252 00:14:41,360 --> 00:14:43,680 Speaker 1: to the title on some of those properties. 253 00:14:44,840 --> 00:14:46,880 Speaker 2: It made me wonder about whether she was using me 254 00:14:46,920 --> 00:14:50,080 Speaker 2: for my expertise and contacts to build her house, or 255 00:14:50,080 --> 00:14:53,200 Speaker 2: whether she genuinely thought this was, you know, a move 256 00:14:53,280 --> 00:14:55,200 Speaker 2: towards living together as a family again. 257 00:14:56,720 --> 00:15:00,400 Speaker 1: Colin Mandy asked Simon Patterson to agree that Erin's self 258 00:15:00,440 --> 00:15:04,040 Speaker 1: image wasn't great after she'd gained a lot of weight. 259 00:15:05,240 --> 00:15:07,720 Speaker 5: Do you accept she wasn't happy with the way she looked. 260 00:15:08,520 --> 00:15:11,720 Speaker 2: Aaron is not particularly happy with how she is, including 261 00:15:11,760 --> 00:15:25,280 Speaker 2: probably most aspects. I don't think she has high self esteem. 262 00:15:25,320 --> 00:15:29,160 Speaker 1: The trial continues. Our reporters John Ferguson and Ellie Dudley 263 00:15:29,200 --> 00:15:31,760 Speaker 1: are in court and you can read their reporting all 264 00:15:31,840 --> 00:15:34,480 Speaker 1: day at the Australian dot com dot au.