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Speaker 1: I'll get a you bloody champions, it's harps. Welcome to

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Speaker 1: another installment the You Project. You know what for the

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Speaker 1: seven eight hundredth and sometime the other day was episode

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Speaker 1: seven eight hundred and it passed. It came and went,

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Speaker 1: and I didn't even acknowledge it, so I should be

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Speaker 1: mad at me. But anyway, Fuck, it was seventeen hundred

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Speaker 1: and something episodes. We're still here? Did you know that?

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Speaker 1: The I think it's the average podcast. The average podcast

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Speaker 1: only lasts something like, I don't know, not many three.

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Speaker 1: It might be seven, it might be three, but it's

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Speaker 1: less than ten. So how the fuck we got to

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Speaker 1: seven eeen hundred and something that we've been around six

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Speaker 1: years and people are actually still listening. That's either a

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Speaker 1: testament to what we're doing or an indictment on you listeners.

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Speaker 1: I'm not sure either way. Fucking he fuck we're still here.

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Speaker 1: I tell you someone who has listened to a few

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Speaker 1: episodes and been to a few workshops of mine and

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Speaker 1: hails from the Sunshine State and has an interesting story

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Speaker 1: and has finally agreed to chat with me on the

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Speaker 1: aforementioned program as Nicole Ladell, who I call Nick. Hi, Nick,

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Speaker 1: hey sore, you go, Oh fuck, I'm so good. I'm

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Speaker 1: so good. It's Sunday, it's five point thirty nine. The

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Speaker 1: birds are singing, the bees are buzzing. It's been a

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Speaker 1: good day. It's to be honest, it's been a day

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Speaker 1: and a weekend with a few challenges, but we won't

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Speaker 1: go there. Nothing too terrible. But now you were down

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Speaker 1: in Melbourne yesterday you like I said, Sunshine State, and

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Speaker 1: we caught up momentarily and had a coffee in a chat.

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Speaker 1: And I didn't tell you this yesterday because I didn't

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Speaker 1: know when we might do it, and I like telling

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Speaker 1: I like springing it on people so they can't plan.

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Speaker 1: But I thought, as you were telling me your story

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Speaker 1: that you would be good to have a chat with

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Speaker 1: and before we dive in. So the reason that I

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Speaker 1: want to talk about this everyone is because my demographic

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Speaker 1: is about seventy percent female. Not sure why, so dudes

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Speaker 1: come on lifting you do who are listening that thank you,

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Speaker 1: But if you get a few of your dude mates,

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Speaker 1: that'd be great. But seventy percent female and a lot

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Speaker 1: of women somewhere in the ballpark of thirty five to sixty.

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Speaker 1: And we know, as I said to you before we

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Speaker 1: started recording. We know that, you know, people listen to

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Speaker 1: this show because they want to learn something, or they

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Speaker 1: want to be a bit inspired, or they want to

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Speaker 1: grow or evolve or improve their situation or their mindset

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Speaker 1: or their physiology, psychology, sociology results in some way. And

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Speaker 1: I'm very impressed with you because when I met you

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Speaker 1: at one of my workshops, how long ago do you

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Speaker 1: reckon our Paths cross? When I'm going.

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Speaker 2: To say, it was around two thousand and eight.

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Speaker 1: Right, So that is that is sixteen years ago. So

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Speaker 1: you would have been thirty five years old. And you

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Speaker 1: don't mind me saying that you're fifty one, because that's

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Speaker 1: going to come up. So you were thirty five, and

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Speaker 1: what was life like? What was happening when you were

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Speaker 1: thirty five, because you've had an interesting journey since, But

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Speaker 1: what tell us what thirty five looked like for you?

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Speaker 1: Thirty five looked like a.

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Speaker 2: I had.

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Speaker 3: I had lost a lot of weight at that point,

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Speaker 3: so I had followed that online program that we're talking

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Speaker 3: met yesterday and came across you during that.

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Speaker 2: And I was married and my.

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Speaker 3: Children were quite young, and I had started doing triathon.

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Speaker 3: I don't know if you remember that. But I used

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Speaker 3: to do triathon.

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Speaker 2: And yeah, I was married, but it was falling apart.

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Speaker 1: I'll put it that way, Okay, okay, And so here

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Speaker 1: we are sixteen years later, and it's fair to say

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Speaker 1: that there's been a lot of peaks and troughs and

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Speaker 1: not unlike the host of the You Project, You're gain weight,

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Speaker 1: you lost weight, you got in shape, you got out

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Speaker 1: of shape. You're fucking in the zone, out of the zone, flying, dying, flying,

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Speaker 1: dying up down right. That's it's a typical kind of

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Speaker 1: experience for many people, not all people, but a lot

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Speaker 1: of people. So I just asked you before we went live,

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Speaker 1: and you've lost thirty five k's I saw you yesterday.

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Speaker 1: You look great. You're fifty one, you fit, you're healthy,

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Speaker 1: you look as good as I've ever seen you. Look.

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Speaker 1: How long have you been in the shape that you're

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Speaker 1: currently in.

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Speaker 3: I would say so, I've been on a bit of

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Speaker 3: a journey for the last two years. So I've lost

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Speaker 3: thirty five in the last two years. So I've probably

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Speaker 3: been maintained my current weight for about six months, but

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Speaker 3: have been solidly consistently training and eating healthy for over

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Speaker 3: two years.

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Speaker 1: Great and why do you think it's different this time?

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Speaker 1: And why do you think you won't go back? Like

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Speaker 1: why do you think? I'm sure you think that and

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Speaker 1: I know it, Yeah, you know it. Okay, great, Why

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Speaker 1: do you know you're never going to go back?

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Speaker 3: I honestly because I've It's not just my body that

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Speaker 3: I've worked on.

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Speaker 2: So you know, I've done the training, I've lost the weight.

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Speaker 2: But in the last.

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Speaker 3: Ten or you know, six to ten years, there's been

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Speaker 3: a lot of stuff that's happened where I've really excavated

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Speaker 3: a lot of my own internal stuff.

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Speaker 2: And you know, kind of looked at.

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Speaker 3: Patterns of behavior and how I.

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Speaker 2: Got to where I was and all that sort of thing.

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Speaker 2: And so now my kids are all adults, so I'm

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Speaker 2: not so parenting.

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Speaker 1: It's me.

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Speaker 3: It's like I am the priority. And yeah, I love training,

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Speaker 3: like I love living like this. This is this is

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Speaker 3: where I'm happy. So I'm just not choosing to go

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Speaker 3: back to where I wasn't happy.

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Speaker 1: So you said you had to excavate some internal stuff.

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Speaker 1: I like that, the internal excavation, right, Wow, what stuff?

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Speaker 1: Like what did you need to change or what did

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Speaker 1: you need to own up to or what did you

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Speaker 1: need to realize deal with what was that.

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Speaker 2: Just how I show up in the world, and like.

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Speaker 3: The I had to take responsibility for some of the

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Speaker 3: situations that I've been in. Yeah, I'm kind of just

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Speaker 3: understand and the role that I've played in some of

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Speaker 3: the things that have happened in my life that have

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Speaker 3: you know, caused trauma and drama.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, I just it was really just.

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Speaker 3: Taking responsibility and learning how to set boundaries, I think

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Speaker 3: was the big one.

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Speaker 2: We're talking yesterday. I think a little bit about being discerning.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, like tell me the relationship between I know

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Speaker 1: I'm interrupting, but it's relevant soon. So we're not you

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Speaker 1: when I asked you about excavating internal stuff, I was

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Speaker 1: talking about in relation to getting in shape. Then you

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Speaker 1: started talking about trauma. Yeah, so talk to me about

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Speaker 1: getting in shape physically and navigating food and exercise and

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Speaker 1: weight loss. And by the way, when we talk about

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Speaker 1: weight loss, we're not talking about, you know, from an

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Speaker 1: esthetic point of view or an ego point of view.

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Speaker 1: We're talking about health, wellness function. But then you so

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Speaker 1: talk to me a little bit about the correlation you scientists,

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Speaker 1: between the emotional stuff, the trauma stuff, the body stuff

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Speaker 1: and the changing your life forever stuff.

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Speaker 3: Well I think so I don't know without giving you

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Speaker 3: my entire life story, which I could do but we

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Speaker 3: don't really have time for.

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Speaker 2: And I think a lot of women can relate to this.

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Speaker 2: So our bodies are very.

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Speaker 3: Connected to our emotions. I truly believe that, and to

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Speaker 3: trauma as well. So when I went through some stuff,

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Speaker 3: you know, about ten years ago, I started really looking

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Speaker 3: into sematics, so I read you know, The Body Keeps

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Speaker 3: the Score and all of those trauma informed sort of books,

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Speaker 3: and I just I think just having the awareness of

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Speaker 3: I used to use weight to keep the world out,

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Speaker 3: so if I was overweight and big and not attractive,

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Speaker 3: I didn't draw attention to myself and therefore no one

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Speaker 3: could hurt me.

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Speaker 1: So I've heard that quite a bit. And so for you,

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Speaker 1: was that a subconscious manifestation Like obviously didn't think, all right,

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Speaker 1: what I'm going to do is I'm going to put

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Speaker 1: on thirty k's I'm going to be So that's a

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Speaker 1: subconscious protection, protective mechanism.

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Speaker 3: Yes, very much so, because I you know, I've been

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Speaker 3: I've been obese, I've been thin, I've been an athlete,

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Speaker 3: I've been all of those things, and the world interacts

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Speaker 3: with us differently.

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Speaker 2: You know, I don't care how much people say it

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Speaker 2: doesn't matter. It does matter. The world interacts with us.

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Speaker 3: Differently depending on how we look. And so I felt

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Speaker 3: very vulnerable in the world. So being overweighted, I became

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Speaker 3: invisible and I think I subconsciously deliberately did that.

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Speaker 1: And so.

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Speaker 3: Ah, and then you know, the shame that comes around

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Speaker 3: that as well, because health, looking after yourself and health

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Speaker 3: is also one of my values. It's quite a lot

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Speaker 3: living in alignment with my value. So the shame and

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Speaker 3: the guilt comes on top of that. And but then

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Speaker 3: so part of what I had to learn was being

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Speaker 3: discerning and setting boundaries and having self compassion and all

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Speaker 3: of those things that come along with dealing with trauma.

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Speaker 2: And so once I realized that I can.

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Speaker 3: Actually set boundaries, then I can then I'm now I'm

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Speaker 3: comfortable being in the world, not you know, not being

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Speaker 3: one hundred kilos. I don't need to be one hundred

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Speaker 3: kilos to keep people away.

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Speaker 1: It's kind of a two edged sword that, you know,

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Speaker 1: being bigger and heavier, and now I'm invisible, and I

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Speaker 1: don't get the same kind of attension that I didn't want.

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Speaker 1: And I'm less vulnerable now no one's looking at me,

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Speaker 1: and but it is a two edged sword because but

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Speaker 1: also I don't really want to look like this or

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Speaker 1: feel like this, or carry around all of this weight

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Speaker 1: or put my health at risk or yeah, yeah, what

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Speaker 1: what I mean? So for you, what was? Maybe we'll

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Speaker 1: talk about as much or as little as you want.

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Speaker 1: Have you either way? Have you ever this your first podcast?

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Speaker 1: Every you've done it right, I've done a couple. You're

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Speaker 1: doing very well. Listen to me, giving you a score

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Speaker 1: five stars. We'll talk about any potential trauma stuff maybe

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Speaker 1: if you want, but like on a kind of an

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Speaker 1: emotional level in terms of because I've said this, like

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Speaker 1: my first book literally was about the psychology and the

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Speaker 1: emotion of changing a body, right, And that was really

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Speaker 1: before I was too clued up. But I realized early

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Speaker 1: days when I was working with people that you know,

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Speaker 1: changing your body and keeping it changed is not really

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Speaker 1: that much about your body. Like your body is the

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Speaker 1: byproduct of sorting out the ship. You need to sort

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Speaker 1: out the emotional and psychological and ritualistic and habitual underlying

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Speaker 1: shit that just happens to create a body that looks

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Speaker 1: and functions like X and y. You know. And so

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Speaker 1: because your body isn't making decisions, your body is just

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Speaker 1: bearing the brunt of your decisions, be they good or

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Speaker 1: bad decisions. So what was the emotional stuff that you

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Speaker 1: needed to address?

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Speaker 2: Self compassion?

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Speaker 1: So can I what does that mean for you? For me?

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Speaker 3: I have lived most of my life being my biggest critic,

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Speaker 3: So I you know, I would I would be concerned

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Speaker 3: about other people judging me, but no one was judging

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Speaker 3: me more than I was judging myself. Yes, and so

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Speaker 3: I you know, and for choices that I'd made and

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Speaker 3: situations that I ended up in that caused me harm,

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Speaker 3: I blamed myself.

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Speaker 2: And so self compassion.

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Speaker 3: Was big on the on the list of things that

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Speaker 3: I had to learn to do, like to be able

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Speaker 3: to say that even good people make mistakes or you know,

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Speaker 3: no one is all good or all bad. And yeah,

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Speaker 3: so just kind of understanding me as if I was

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Speaker 3: dealing with myself as a friend, Like how would I

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Speaker 3: talk to my friend if my friend was going through

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Speaker 3: the stuff that I was going through. So that allowed

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Speaker 3: me to be softer with myself. Lots off there, but

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Speaker 3: also understanding that my body actually belongs to me, not

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Speaker 3: the world and not a partner or not any man

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Speaker 3: down the street, or you know, like my body one

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Speaker 3: hundred percent belongs to me. Now I actually really believe

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Speaker 3: that now for the first time, at fifty one, that

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Speaker 3: it's mine to do with what I want to do.

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Speaker 1: You know. Tell me just like like on an intellectual level,

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Speaker 1: you always knew that. Like if I said to you

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Speaker 1: when you were thirty five, Nick, do you know that

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Speaker 1: your body is you'd go, yeah, of course, But tell

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Speaker 1: me about the divergence between intellectually understanding something but at

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Speaker 1: the same time not feeling it, Like what you say,

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Speaker 1: now you know your body's yours. What was the status before?

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Speaker 3: Well, the status before was the whole people pleasing thing,

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Speaker 3: you know that, which I.

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Speaker 2: Know you've talked about a lot.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and the belief I think it comes down to

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Speaker 3: those world views and those real internal call beliefs. So

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Speaker 3: when I talk about excavating, it's like really getting through

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Speaker 3: what are those core beliefs that are driving the behaviors.

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Speaker 3: So I grew up, like a lot of women, and

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Speaker 3: especially my age, believing that our role was to please

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Speaker 3: others or to you know, I was talking to you

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Speaker 3: yesterday about going to UNI and my dad when I

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Speaker 3: left school, and my dad said, no, you'll get married

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Speaker 3: and your husband will look after you. Don't need to

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Speaker 3: go to university. Girls don't go to university. So I

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Speaker 3: was the conditioning that my whole role or reason for

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Speaker 3: even existing was to just please other people or two

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Speaker 3: you know what I mean.

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Speaker 1: So just so you wanted to go to UNI. And

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Speaker 1: dad went, no, you won't go to UNI. You'll marry

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Speaker 1: a bloke and he'll look after you.

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Speaker 3: Yep, that was his exact words to me, was you don't.

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Speaker 3: Girls don't go to university.

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Speaker 2: Because I had I had I was. I wanted to

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Speaker 2: do either psychology or drama.

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Speaker 3: I had applied for both, and I had an audition

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Speaker 3: for the drama program. I can't remember what it was

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Speaker 3: now or even what UNI it was. And my dad said, no, wow, no,

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Speaker 3: girls don't go to university. I'll get you a job

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Speaker 3: in a bank, which he did. He got me a

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Speaker 3: job because.

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Speaker 2: He knew the bank manager.

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Speaker 3: I'll get you a job in a bank and then

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Speaker 3: you'll get married and your husband will look after you.

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Speaker 2: And that's I mean.

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Speaker 3: I went around about it a different way, but that's

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Speaker 3: essentially what happened.

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Speaker 1: I didn't. Yeah, okay, so we'll jump around a little bit.

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Speaker 1: But one of the reasons I wanted I wanted to

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Speaker 1: chat to you was because at the astonishingly old age

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Speaker 1: of forty three, you went back or you didn't go

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Speaker 1: back to UNI. So did you do year twelve?

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Speaker 3: I did you twelve and I had done I think

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Speaker 3: it was maybe two years or a year before I

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Speaker 3: went to UNI. I did finish a diploma, so but

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Speaker 3: that was that was it. I did year twelve. I

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Speaker 3: think I finished Year twelve in I can't even tell

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Speaker 3: you what year it was.

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Speaker 1: So you finished year twelve at eighteen, and then you

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Speaker 1: started university at forty three, yes, so that's quarter of

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Speaker 1: a century. So all right, So one of I mean, firstly,

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Speaker 1: I don't think I definitely don't think everyone needs to

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Speaker 1: go to university. I think for some people university is

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Speaker 1: and not because they're not smart enough, just because I

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Speaker 1: don't think it suits them. Right. And in fact, if

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Speaker 1: you I'm glad I didn't go to university at eighteen

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Speaker 1: nine and twenty because for me at that stage it

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Speaker 1: wouldn't have suited me. I wouldn't have been very good

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Speaker 1: at it. I may not have even gone, but when

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Speaker 1: I did, when I did go to university for the

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Speaker 1: first time, which was when I was thirty six, I

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Speaker 1: was mentally, emotionally and practically in the right place. But

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Speaker 1: tell me about like I love the fact that, like

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Speaker 1: I said to you at the start, so many of

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Speaker 1: our listeners are you know, it's like you're almost the demographic.

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Speaker 1: You know, it's really broad. Of course, we have teenagers

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Speaker 1: who listen, and people in their seventies who listen, and

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Speaker 1: men and women and people from all around the world.

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Speaker 1: But I'm always encouraging people to learn and to be

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Speaker 1: curious and to you know, whether or not that's formal

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Speaker 1: learning education, formal education or informal or experiential or you

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Speaker 1: know whatever. But so, what precipitated the decision to go

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Speaker 1: back to UNI? What was it like? How did you go?

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Speaker 1: Were you great at it? Were you fucking terrified? What

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Speaker 1: was it like?

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Speaker 2: Well, the decision was made on a whim. I was.

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Speaker 3: It wasn't long. I remember you came up and we

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Speaker 3: caught up for coffee. You come up for something and

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Speaker 3: you caught up for coffee.

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Speaker 2: And I was a little bit of a mess at

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Speaker 2: the time, because I was coming out.

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Speaker 3: Of an emotionally psychologically abusive relationship. Yeah, so it'd already

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Speaker 3: I'd already been divorced for about five years at the time,

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Speaker 3: and I was I was a bit lost.

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Speaker 2: So not long after that.

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Speaker 3: I had a kind of it's that proverbial rock bottom,

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Speaker 3: I think where I had. I kind of came to

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Speaker 3: the conclusion that I was never going to depend on

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Speaker 3: a man again financially.

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Speaker 2: I needed to take care of myself. Was being financial

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Speaker 2: for me.

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Speaker 3: Being financially dependent on somebody, which is what I was

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Speaker 3: raised to be, wasn't safe for me.

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Speaker 2: So I needed to create my own life.

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Speaker 3: And then a friend of mine had finished her social

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Speaker 3: work degree and I jokingly sort of said, I'd love

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Speaker 3: to I wish I had it gone to UNI or something,

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Speaker 3: and she sort of said, well why don't you.

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Speaker 2: I said, I'm too old now, and how would I

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Speaker 2: How can I.

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Speaker 3: Put food on the table and go to use it

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Speaker 3: is not possible, And plus the degree I want to

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Speaker 3: do is a six year degree, and you know all

345
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Speaker 3: of these reasons. And then another friend of mine, I've

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Speaker 3: mentioned it to another friend of mine and she said,

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Speaker 3: you should just do it, And I said, well, I

348
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Speaker 3: couldn't even afford the I think it was at the

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Speaker 3: time sixty nine dollars queue TAC fee to apply and

350
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Speaker 3: the semester was starting in a week or two weeks.

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Speaker 1: To tell people what q TAC is, Oh, que tech.

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Speaker 3: Is the Queensland Tertiary. I can't remember what it stands for,

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Speaker 3: but it's it's the application center. So you you have

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Speaker 3: to apply through them and tell them what university and

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Speaker 3: program you want to do, so they're the ones that decide,

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Speaker 3: and so you.

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Speaker 2: Have to pay a fee to apply.

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Speaker 3: And she this friend of mine just gave me her

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Speaker 3: credit card number and said do it now.

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Speaker 2: So I just jumped online and did it.

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Speaker 1: So at the time, you couldn't even afford that fee.

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Speaker 3: No, No, at the time, I had friends were buying

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Speaker 3: me groceries.

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Speaker 2: That's that's where I was at. It was I could.

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Speaker 2: I was barely paying the rent and I had.

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Speaker 3: I was shopping at the food co op some days

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Speaker 3: this without sounding over dramatic, but some days I didn't send.

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Speaker 2: The kids to school because I didn't have any lunch

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Speaker 2: for them. So it was bad. It was pretty bad.

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Speaker 1: It was pretty bad.

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Speaker 3: So it was really just a it was kind of

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Speaker 3: like I have to do something, Like I had to

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Speaker 3: do something to change the trajectory of my life.

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Speaker 1: And I didn't.

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Speaker 2: I didn't know beyond each day what the next week

376
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Speaker 2: was going to look like.

377
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Speaker 3: So I just decided to go to university and suck

378
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Speaker 3: it and see just show up every day and see where,

379
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Speaker 3: like just one foot in front of the other.

380
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Speaker 2: One semester one thirteen.

381
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Speaker 3: You know, semesters are a thirteen week block, and it

382
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Speaker 3: was like, just get through each thirteen week block and

383
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Speaker 3: you're moving closer to something. And I started getting so

384
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Speaker 3: I got that. I got a job at the university

385
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Speaker 3: pretty much straight away.

386
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Speaker 1: Hang On, hang on, hang on, hang on. You didn't

387
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Speaker 1: tell us about your applied you got accepted.

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Speaker 2: I got accepted.

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Speaker 1: Well, tell us about one. What the fuck did you

390
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Speaker 1: study or what did you apply for? Tell us about

391
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Speaker 1: getting accepted. How did you feel when you go, fucking hell,

392
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Speaker 1: I'm a university student.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, so I did a psychology degree, which is what

394
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Speaker 3: I'd always wanted to do. And yeah, I got the

395
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Speaker 3: email to say I got in, and it was, you know,

396
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Speaker 3: a holy shit sort of moment. I went to O week.

397
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Speaker 3: I was telling you this yesterday, I went to open day,

398
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Speaker 3: and I was lost. I had never stepped foot on

399
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Speaker 3: a university campus before.

400
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Speaker 2: To me, university was.

401
00:23:41,600 --> 00:23:44,240
Speaker 3: Always something that other people did like it was never

402
00:23:45,480 --> 00:23:47,720
Speaker 3: I was told that it was never for me, so

403
00:23:47,880 --> 00:23:48,800
Speaker 3: I believed it was.

404
00:23:48,760 --> 00:23:51,399
Speaker 2: Never for me. I was not one of those people.

405
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Speaker 1: Right.

406
00:23:52,720 --> 00:23:57,080
Speaker 3: So I'm on campus, I'm walking around. I didn't know

407
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Speaker 3: a single soul. I obviously looked lost, and somebody said,

408
00:24:02,960 --> 00:24:05,000
Speaker 3: you know, do you need some help? Can I help

409
00:24:05,040 --> 00:24:06,680
Speaker 3: you find your way? And I said, I'm looking for

410
00:24:07,119 --> 00:24:10,480
Speaker 3: this building? And they said to me, are you undergrad

411
00:24:10,560 --> 00:24:13,399
Speaker 3: or postgrad? And I just looked and I went, I

412
00:24:13,400 --> 00:24:16,359
Speaker 3: don't I don't even know what that means. I don't

413
00:24:16,440 --> 00:24:20,359
Speaker 3: know what and she went undergrad. If you don't know

414
00:24:20,400 --> 00:24:23,720
Speaker 3: the difference, then you're undergrad. I went, okay, And of course,

415
00:24:23,760 --> 00:24:26,639
Speaker 3: now I know undergrad is like, you know, primary school

416
00:24:26,680 --> 00:24:27,560
Speaker 3: versus high school.

417
00:24:28,160 --> 00:24:31,000
Speaker 1: Could you just explain to our listeners who are basically

418
00:24:31,560 --> 00:24:35,359
Speaker 1: a version of what you like, what is maybe just

419
00:24:35,400 --> 00:24:38,600
Speaker 1: go through undergrad? You know, honors and butt like, what

420
00:24:38,720 --> 00:24:41,960
Speaker 1: is the hierarchy? What does it mean? Just so for

421
00:24:42,080 --> 00:24:45,040
Speaker 1: people who have got their l plates on with this language.

422
00:24:45,480 --> 00:24:50,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, so an undergraduate degree is your first degree right,

423
00:24:51,200 --> 00:24:55,760
Speaker 3: it's the it's the primary school, I guess you could say.

424
00:24:57,119 --> 00:25:01,199
Speaker 3: So undergrad is usually the first three to four years,

425
00:25:02,040 --> 00:25:07,920
Speaker 3: and then once you finish your once you finish your undergrad,

426
00:25:08,080 --> 00:25:08,880
Speaker 3: then you go to.

427
00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:12,280
Speaker 2: Oh you could do honors.

428
00:25:11,920 --> 00:25:15,639
Speaker 3: So for the psyche, it's like three years undergrad psyche

429
00:25:16,040 --> 00:25:19,080
Speaker 3: and then a fourth year of it's called an honor's year.

430
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Speaker 2: So that's a level up.

431
00:25:22,680 --> 00:25:25,639
Speaker 3: And then you can go to master's level, so a

432
00:25:25,720 --> 00:25:30,560
Speaker 3: master's degree and then a PhD or you know, a

433
00:25:30,600 --> 00:25:37,040
Speaker 3: PhD is the highest level of education, so undergrad is

434
00:25:37,080 --> 00:25:37,560
Speaker 3: the beginning.

435
00:25:37,760 --> 00:25:41,240
Speaker 2: pH d is, Yeah, but not everywhere. You don't have to.

436
00:25:41,200 --> 00:25:44,680
Speaker 1: Do the whole and so some people might do for example,

437
00:25:45,200 --> 00:25:47,840
Speaker 1: like an undergrad degree. Generally they're called a bachelor's degree

438
00:25:47,840 --> 00:25:52,080
Speaker 1: as well, you know, so a bachelor Bachelor of accounting

439
00:25:52,680 --> 00:25:55,359
Speaker 1: or like me, my first degree was a Bachelor of

440
00:25:55,400 --> 00:25:59,000
Speaker 1: Exercise Science, or you could do a Bachelor of fucking

441
00:25:59,600 --> 00:26:02,159
Speaker 1: you know and pitten plaster scene. I don't know, but

442
00:26:02,800 --> 00:26:07,080
Speaker 1: it's yeah, it can be a start and finish in itself,

443
00:26:07,280 --> 00:26:10,320
Speaker 1: or yeah, you can build on it. Yeah, so you

444
00:26:10,359 --> 00:26:12,280
Speaker 1: did your degree, then what do you do after that?

445
00:26:12,680 --> 00:26:13,680
Speaker 1: After your undergrad?

446
00:26:14,960 --> 00:26:19,560
Speaker 3: So then I did the Psychology Honors, which is a

447
00:26:19,560 --> 00:26:24,680
Speaker 3: twelvemonth degree. It's coursework as well as a research project.

448
00:26:24,720 --> 00:26:26,400
Speaker 2: So you have to do a research project.

449
00:26:27,040 --> 00:26:30,400
Speaker 1: And what was your research project on? It was.

450
00:26:32,240 --> 00:26:36,800
Speaker 3: Perceived impacts of stress on train driver performance.

451
00:26:37,800 --> 00:26:46,560
Speaker 1: Wow, hang on, let me perceived effects of stress.

452
00:26:43,880 --> 00:26:49,199
Speaker 2: On train drive train driver performance? Yeah, so how do

453
00:26:50,040 --> 00:26:51,760
Speaker 2: other systems?

454
00:26:51,920 --> 00:26:56,239
Speaker 3: Are the stakeholders in the rail industry as well as

455
00:26:56,280 --> 00:27:00,720
Speaker 3: train drivers, so how do they perceive acute dress would

456
00:27:00,800 --> 00:27:05,960
Speaker 3: impact a performance? And then we compared those perceptions across

457
00:27:06,480 --> 00:27:11,000
Speaker 3: all the different jobs and stakeholders across the rail system

458
00:27:11,080 --> 00:27:13,280
Speaker 3: just to see whether or not the other people and

459
00:27:13,359 --> 00:27:17,200
Speaker 3: the other people working in rail understood the same. It's

460
00:27:17,280 --> 00:27:20,520
Speaker 3: the experiences of train drivers because they're the ones making

461
00:27:20,520 --> 00:27:21,399
Speaker 3: all the decisions.

462
00:27:21,480 --> 00:27:23,240
Speaker 2: So that was basically what it was about.

463
00:27:23,680 --> 00:27:27,080
Speaker 1: Can I just backtrack a tiny bit? That's that's interesting.

464
00:27:27,480 --> 00:27:31,080
Speaker 1: I just want I just want to know what the

465
00:27:31,119 --> 00:27:36,199
Speaker 1: first semester of day, one week, one semester one of

466
00:27:36,400 --> 00:27:38,840
Speaker 1: university life. For the girl who didn't know what an

467
00:27:38,920 --> 00:27:41,399
Speaker 1: undergrad degree was, it was.

468
00:27:41,920 --> 00:27:44,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, I knew.

469
00:27:44,400 --> 00:27:47,320
Speaker 3: I went and sat in my first lecture theater. I

470
00:27:47,359 --> 00:27:52,119
Speaker 3: can still feel the feeling and I'd never been in

471
00:27:52,160 --> 00:27:55,160
Speaker 3: a university lecture theater before and they're big, like they

472
00:27:55,240 --> 00:28:00,000
Speaker 3: seek three four hundred people, right, and in fact Monash.

473
00:27:59,119 --> 00:28:00,720
Speaker 2: Is probably he's bigger than ours.

474
00:28:00,800 --> 00:28:05,320
Speaker 3: But sat there with one hundreds of students and the

475
00:28:05,440 --> 00:28:11,200
Speaker 3: lecturer comes in and I'm just like, wow, I'm here.

476
00:28:11,240 --> 00:28:14,320
Speaker 3: This is where I like this is. I knew that

477
00:28:14,320 --> 00:28:18,040
Speaker 3: that's where I needed to be. It was this deep

478
00:28:18,640 --> 00:28:21,919
Speaker 3: innate knowing that that was the right place for me.

479
00:28:22,640 --> 00:28:25,760
Speaker 3: I had no idea, and you know, I struggled the

480
00:28:25,800 --> 00:28:32,320
Speaker 3: first semester. I white knuckled it. I didn't understand, you know,

481
00:28:32,440 --> 00:28:35,320
Speaker 3: I took about mean and medium and mode and all

482
00:28:35,359 --> 00:28:38,520
Speaker 3: that sort of stuff. There was basic knowledge that I

483
00:28:38,560 --> 00:28:42,520
Speaker 3: didn't have that there was assumed knowledge that I didn't have.

484
00:28:42,640 --> 00:28:45,120
Speaker 3: So I struggled in the first semester of just trying

485
00:28:45,120 --> 00:28:51,360
Speaker 3: to even understand the basic stuff. So there were times

486
00:28:51,360 --> 00:28:54,320
Speaker 3: where I thought I don't belong here, Like there were

487
00:28:54,440 --> 00:28:59,560
Speaker 3: times where I thought I can't do this, and then I.

488
00:28:59,440 --> 00:29:02,200
Speaker 2: Was just like, well, just suck it and see just

489
00:29:02,640 --> 00:29:03,280
Speaker 2: see how you go.

490
00:29:03,320 --> 00:29:06,000
Speaker 3: And then you know, you get your first assignment back

491
00:29:06,040 --> 00:29:07,880
Speaker 3: and you get good marks, or someone.

492
00:29:07,600 --> 00:29:10,000
Speaker 2: Says you write really well, or you know, just the

493
00:29:10,040 --> 00:29:12,240
Speaker 2: little things along the way that just keep you going.

494
00:29:13,240 --> 00:29:17,160
Speaker 1: So it's like and it's like for me, going to

495
00:29:17,280 --> 00:29:20,320
Speaker 1: UNI was like going to a new country where you

496
00:29:20,400 --> 00:29:23,240
Speaker 1: know that everyone speaks English, but they also speak another

497
00:29:23,360 --> 00:29:26,720
Speaker 1: language that you don't have. I'm like, oh and now,

498
00:29:27,320 --> 00:29:31,040
Speaker 1: as you well know, now, although you you were better

499
00:29:31,080 --> 00:29:35,560
Speaker 1: prepared for me because Nicole's now doing her PhD. But

500
00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:39,280
Speaker 1: you know, that's a whole another level of language and

501
00:29:39,360 --> 00:29:43,560
Speaker 1: culture and understanding and and the way that that that

502
00:29:44,520 --> 00:29:48,400
Speaker 1: you know that that level of academia is yeah, that's

503
00:29:48,480 --> 00:29:52,080
Speaker 1: like going to Russia. Well that's like kind somewhere definitely

504
00:29:52,080 --> 00:29:55,880
Speaker 1: where they don't speak Craig. Like where I'm at, nobody

505
00:29:55,920 --> 00:29:59,719
Speaker 1: speaks Greg which neither should they. But it's it's a

506
00:29:59,760 --> 00:30:00,760
Speaker 1: new world, isn't it.

507
00:30:01,240 --> 00:30:02,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, completely different world.

508
00:30:03,040 --> 00:30:08,760
Speaker 3: And I did everything I could to to make sure

509
00:30:08,800 --> 00:30:11,120
Speaker 3: that I had the best chance.

510
00:30:11,040 --> 00:30:11,800
Speaker 2: To do well.

511
00:30:11,880 --> 00:30:16,160
Speaker 3: So I sought out all of the academic skills workshops.

512
00:30:16,200 --> 00:30:20,640
Speaker 3: I went to every everything I could go to to

513
00:30:20,760 --> 00:30:22,000
Speaker 3: help me build skills.

514
00:30:23,480 --> 00:30:23,960
Speaker 2: I went to.

515
00:30:24,040 --> 00:30:27,920
Speaker 3: I engaged in everything possible within the university, and that

516
00:30:28,040 --> 00:30:30,600
Speaker 3: was you know, later on down the track when I

517
00:30:30,760 --> 00:30:35,080
Speaker 3: started working with new students and stuff, it was like

518
00:30:36,080 --> 00:30:39,600
Speaker 3: that was my That was my key piece of advice,

519
00:30:39,720 --> 00:30:45,840
Speaker 3: is just engaging everything possible to support yourself through the process.

520
00:30:45,920 --> 00:30:48,040
Speaker 3: Because I hadn't I really had no idea.

521
00:30:50,080 --> 00:30:52,040
Speaker 1: So I want to know about the dough. I want

522
00:30:52,040 --> 00:30:54,880
Speaker 1: to know about the dough, ray me, because before you started,

523
00:30:55,320 --> 00:30:59,160
Speaker 1: you had no money and you're worry about how do

524
00:30:59,240 --> 00:31:02,960
Speaker 1: I put fucking food on the table. Now you still

525
00:31:03,000 --> 00:31:05,080
Speaker 1: don't have a job, and now you're a student on

526
00:31:05,160 --> 00:31:08,520
Speaker 1: top of that, so like, how did you How did

527
00:31:08,560 --> 00:31:11,960
Speaker 1: your children not starve to death and die of neglect.

528
00:31:13,520 --> 00:31:17,840
Speaker 3: I applied for scholarships and worked really hard, so I

529
00:31:17,920 --> 00:31:21,320
Speaker 3: didn't go one semester where I Apart from the first semester,

530
00:31:22,080 --> 00:31:22,840
Speaker 3: every single.

531
00:31:22,680 --> 00:31:25,160
Speaker 2: Semester after that I was awarded some.

532
00:31:26,600 --> 00:31:29,400
Speaker 3: Kind of scholarship, even if it was just one thousand dollars,

533
00:31:29,480 --> 00:31:33,440
Speaker 3: So anywhere from one thousand dollars to five thousand dollars.

534
00:31:33,440 --> 00:31:38,920
Speaker 3: Scholarships were available for students. Some of them were merit based,

535
00:31:39,000 --> 00:31:45,240
Speaker 3: some of them were bursary based, you know, demographic based,

536
00:31:47,280 --> 00:31:48,120
Speaker 3: so that helped.

537
00:31:48,560 --> 00:31:49,560
Speaker 2: That helped a lot.

538
00:31:50,520 --> 00:31:54,480
Speaker 3: After the first six months, I started applying for jobs

539
00:31:54,480 --> 00:31:57,120
Speaker 3: at the university and I got a job, a casual

540
00:31:57,160 --> 00:32:02,360
Speaker 3: position in students Central and then I became a student ambassador.

541
00:32:02,400 --> 00:32:05,800
Speaker 3: So I just I just ended up with a few

542
00:32:05,840 --> 00:32:10,959
Speaker 3: different casual jobs around the university, which subsidized because our

543
00:32:11,040 --> 00:32:18,360
Speaker 3: study doesn't really pay a lot. And so when I

544
00:32:18,400 --> 00:32:23,040
Speaker 3: finished my honors, I was working. I had started working

545
00:32:23,080 --> 00:32:25,800
Speaker 3: for a research center who I did my honors with.

546
00:32:27,000 --> 00:32:29,400
Speaker 3: And then when I finished my honors, I took some

547
00:32:29,520 --> 00:32:32,920
Speaker 3: time off to take care of myself and do all

548
00:32:32,960 --> 00:32:35,200
Speaker 3: the things, and then I worked full time at the

549
00:32:35,240 --> 00:32:40,440
Speaker 3: research center for eighty months, and then before I started

550
00:32:40,480 --> 00:32:44,400
Speaker 3: doing the PhD. So yeah, it's over time. I just

551
00:32:44,800 --> 00:32:46,960
Speaker 3: you know, it's just having faith at what you're doing.

552
00:32:47,040 --> 00:32:51,200
Speaker 3: I think when you're in alignment with your values, and

553
00:32:51,240 --> 00:32:52,920
Speaker 3: I know you talk about this a lot, but I

554
00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:55,960
Speaker 3: truly believe it. When you're in alignment with your values,

555
00:32:56,400 --> 00:32:57,320
Speaker 3: it's almost like.

556
00:32:58,760 --> 00:33:00,080
Speaker 2: I had no idea.

557
00:32:59,880 --> 00:33:02,120
Speaker 3: What was coming next, but I had faith that I

558
00:33:02,200 --> 00:33:04,440
Speaker 3: was doing the right thing because it felt good and

559
00:33:04,480 --> 00:33:07,480
Speaker 3: it was in alignment with what I wanted in life.

560
00:33:07,560 --> 00:33:10,600
Speaker 2: And it was almost like the red carpet.

561
00:33:10,240 --> 00:33:12,040
Speaker 3: Just kept rolling out in front of me, and I

562
00:33:12,120 --> 00:33:15,320
Speaker 3: just kept taking a step. I had no idea where

563
00:33:15,320 --> 00:33:20,840
Speaker 3: it was going, but it was moving me forward. So yeah,

564
00:33:21,040 --> 00:33:21,920
Speaker 3: and so now you know.

565
00:33:21,840 --> 00:33:25,080
Speaker 1: What, do you know what this reminds me. I've had

566
00:33:25,080 --> 00:33:28,440
Speaker 1: this conversation with Melissa and a few others. I don't

567
00:33:28,480 --> 00:33:31,280
Speaker 1: know if I've ever mentioned it in seventeen hundred and

568
00:33:31,360 --> 00:33:38,560
Speaker 1: two episodes, but it's like, I always think, what about if,

569
00:33:39,400 --> 00:33:43,560
Speaker 1: like that really fucking person who's awesome at that thing,

570
00:33:43,720 --> 00:33:47,480
Speaker 1: Like let's say Serena Williams had never picked up a

571
00:33:47,520 --> 00:33:50,960
Speaker 1: tennis racket. Yeah, Let's say she grew up in a

572
00:33:50,960 --> 00:33:55,080
Speaker 1: different place and her dad wasn't interested in tennis. Let's

573
00:33:55,080 --> 00:33:57,360
Speaker 1: say her dad drove trucks or a dad was a

574
00:33:57,400 --> 00:34:01,440
Speaker 1: lawyer or whatever, and she went to school and but

575
00:34:01,520 --> 00:34:05,000
Speaker 1: that same woman or that same girl at that stage,

576
00:34:05,040 --> 00:34:08,880
Speaker 1: with the same potential and the same genetics in a

577
00:34:08,920 --> 00:34:14,720
Speaker 1: different context, with different interactions and resources, And I feel

578
00:34:14,760 --> 00:34:18,719
Speaker 1: like it's like somebody handed you your tennis racket at

579
00:34:18,760 --> 00:34:19,799
Speaker 1: forty three.

580
00:34:20,239 --> 00:34:22,919
Speaker 3: Yeah, it was very much like that. And I think,

581
00:34:24,320 --> 00:34:27,040
Speaker 3: you know, I was very fortunate when I started working

582
00:34:27,120 --> 00:34:31,640
Speaker 3: at the research center. My boss there is just a

583
00:34:31,680 --> 00:34:36,440
Speaker 3: phenomenal woman who and it's you know, it's academia can

584
00:34:36,480 --> 00:34:41,839
Speaker 3: be very difficult where it's a lot of academics, bless them,

585
00:34:42,280 --> 00:34:44,319
Speaker 3: have the point of view that they did it tough

586
00:34:44,360 --> 00:34:45,720
Speaker 3: and they'refore sociod.

587
00:34:45,360 --> 00:34:50,400
Speaker 2: You right, and it's ed it.

588
00:34:51,280 --> 00:34:54,920
Speaker 3: You know, it's not that it's rare, but when you

589
00:34:55,000 --> 00:34:58,280
Speaker 3: get when you come across an academic who is willing

590
00:34:58,320 --> 00:35:00,359
Speaker 3: to take you under their wing and mentor are you,

591
00:35:01,280 --> 00:35:06,279
Speaker 3: it's a gift, like it really is. And I've been

592
00:35:06,320 --> 00:35:09,680
Speaker 3: really fortunate in the center that I work for. It's

593
00:35:09,800 --> 00:35:15,360
Speaker 3: they're very supportive of helping you develop skills and grow

594
00:35:15,400 --> 00:35:18,759
Speaker 3: into the space. So it was almost like they saw

595
00:35:18,880 --> 00:35:23,040
Speaker 3: my potential and then showed it to me. Yeah, because

596
00:35:23,080 --> 00:35:27,200
Speaker 3: I had no idea that what I had no idea

597
00:35:27,239 --> 00:35:30,560
Speaker 3: what I was capable of until they put some things

598
00:35:30,560 --> 00:35:32,839
Speaker 3: in front of me and I went, oh, I can

599
00:35:32,920 --> 00:35:37,480
Speaker 3: do this. Yeah, so I was yes, literally was handed.

600
00:35:38,880 --> 00:35:41,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, it is. It is funny that you think about

601
00:35:42,840 --> 00:35:47,480
Speaker 1: what what dormant potential do people have, Like what do

602
00:35:47,560 --> 00:35:51,640
Speaker 1: we like imagine I think about that for myself, even

603
00:35:51,800 --> 00:35:53,560
Speaker 1: like I don't know, like who would I be if

604
00:35:53,600 --> 00:35:55,919
Speaker 1: I had you know, let's say I was the same

605
00:35:56,000 --> 00:35:58,520
Speaker 1: genetically the same, and I have the same brain and

606
00:35:58,560 --> 00:36:00,759
Speaker 1: the same body and the same genetic potential and the

607
00:36:00,800 --> 00:36:07,279
Speaker 1: same innate potential, creative, intellectual, academic, whatever, sporting, whatever. But

608
00:36:07,440 --> 00:36:09,880
Speaker 1: I was just raised in a different place with different

609
00:36:09,920 --> 00:36:13,560
Speaker 1: interactions and experiences, and I wonder what I would have

610
00:36:13,600 --> 00:36:16,400
Speaker 1: done and who I would have become. Or imagine if

611
00:36:17,480 --> 00:36:21,520
Speaker 1: you know, like imagine if you know somebody not you know,

612
00:36:22,080 --> 00:36:24,520
Speaker 1: clearly I never would have been well probably not. But

613
00:36:24,640 --> 00:36:26,400
Speaker 1: somebody had to give me a tennis racket when I

614
00:36:26,440 --> 00:36:29,040
Speaker 1: was six and they went off, you go, and here's

615
00:36:29,040 --> 00:36:32,080
Speaker 1: a coach, and here's a you don't know, you know,

616
00:36:32,280 --> 00:36:34,759
Speaker 1: or if somebody you know, if my mum and dad

617
00:36:34,800 --> 00:36:39,080
Speaker 1: were academics, I would have probably been groomed to be

618
00:36:39,160 --> 00:36:41,719
Speaker 1: an academic. Or if you were raised in a you know,

619
00:36:41,760 --> 00:36:45,080
Speaker 1: you were living on the beach and bloody Queensland, I

620
00:36:45,280 --> 00:36:47,399
Speaker 1: might have grown up with a surfboard under my arm

621
00:36:47,719 --> 00:36:52,080
Speaker 1: or you know, or not saying I have any athletic

622
00:36:52,120 --> 00:36:55,200
Speaker 1: potential anyone, but you know, it's like you just don't know,

623
00:36:55,360 --> 00:36:59,799
Speaker 1: and so much like you think about how much of

624
00:37:00,040 --> 00:37:03,480
Speaker 1: who you were at forty three, not that that was

625
00:37:03,520 --> 00:37:06,960
Speaker 1: good or bad, but was essentially just a by product

626
00:37:07,120 --> 00:37:12,359
Speaker 1: of life happening. It's not like you consciously, it's not

627
00:37:12,440 --> 00:37:15,279
Speaker 1: like you said, you know, when I'm forty three, this

628
00:37:15,360 --> 00:37:18,480
Speaker 1: is where I want to be. No, you woke up

629
00:37:18,520 --> 00:37:20,919
Speaker 1: one day and yes, you'd made choices along the way,

630
00:37:20,960 --> 00:37:23,600
Speaker 1: good and bad, and you know, but it's like, in

631
00:37:23,640 --> 00:37:27,719
Speaker 1: many ways me included. You know, you get to a

632
00:37:27,760 --> 00:37:30,680
Speaker 1: point where you're like, okay, so I'm thirty or I'm forty,

633
00:37:30,760 --> 00:37:35,399
Speaker 1: or I'm fifty or and you know, I'm kind of

634
00:37:36,160 --> 00:37:39,560
Speaker 1: to blame or not or you know, some of how

635
00:37:39,600 --> 00:37:42,120
Speaker 1: I got here was about my choices and behaviors, but

636
00:37:42,239 --> 00:37:45,279
Speaker 1: some of it it's just a byproduct of shit that

637
00:37:45,400 --> 00:37:49,160
Speaker 1: happened to me around me and here I am. And

638
00:37:49,160 --> 00:37:52,320
Speaker 1: then you think, like, even at sixty one, I think

639
00:37:52,800 --> 00:37:56,320
Speaker 1: I still think what can I do? What can I learn?

640
00:37:56,560 --> 00:37:59,400
Speaker 1: What can I get better at? How do I how

641
00:37:59,440 --> 00:38:01,840
Speaker 1: do I Like yesterday I did a forty five minute

642
00:38:01,840 --> 00:38:04,560
Speaker 1: stretching session. Right now, I know this sounds ridiculous, but

643
00:38:05,400 --> 00:38:07,719
Speaker 1: so one of my goals in the next year or

644
00:38:07,760 --> 00:38:09,640
Speaker 1: two is to be able to do the splits, because

645
00:38:09,640 --> 00:38:12,319
Speaker 1: who the fuck you know at sixty one, who's got

646
00:38:12,360 --> 00:38:14,920
Speaker 1: ship flexibility? And I go, I reckon, I can do that.

647
00:38:15,000 --> 00:38:17,880
Speaker 1: I probably can't, but I reckon I can, you know. So,

648
00:38:18,280 --> 00:38:23,160
Speaker 1: like I'm so fascinated just with and not just for

649
00:38:23,200 --> 00:38:27,520
Speaker 1: the sake of doing something. But but you know, leaning

650
00:38:27,560 --> 00:38:32,200
Speaker 1: into that curiosity around well, you know, like you, well,

651
00:38:32,280 --> 00:38:35,040
Speaker 1: now you're doing a PhD and you're a you're a

652
00:38:35,120 --> 00:38:38,120
Speaker 1: legit academic, and you're a researcher and you were a

653
00:38:38,160 --> 00:38:41,000
Speaker 1: research assistant or I think you still do some of that. Brothers,

654
00:38:42,120 --> 00:38:46,200
Speaker 1: It's like, oh, so if you had a mate, you know,

655
00:38:46,320 --> 00:38:49,240
Speaker 1: on that day, if that lady didn't say, I reckon,

656
00:38:49,280 --> 00:38:51,279
Speaker 1: you should do it, and I'm going to pay for

657
00:38:51,320 --> 00:38:55,319
Speaker 1: that whatever it is, and Mama, maybe we wouldn't be

658
00:38:55,360 --> 00:38:57,440
Speaker 1: having this chat.

659
00:38:58,320 --> 00:39:01,040
Speaker 3: No, I'm and in fact, I dread to think where

660
00:39:01,920 --> 00:39:06,200
Speaker 3: I would have ended up really like and I and

661
00:39:06,239 --> 00:39:10,520
Speaker 3: I do think about that sometimes. You know, my kids

662
00:39:10,520 --> 00:39:12,200
Speaker 3: probably would have ended up having to go and live

663
00:39:12,239 --> 00:39:14,080
Speaker 3: with their dad, and I would have ended up living

664
00:39:14,080 --> 00:39:15,960
Speaker 3: with my dad, had rent you know, living in his

665
00:39:16,080 --> 00:39:16,680
Speaker 3: spare room.

666
00:39:16,800 --> 00:39:18,439
Speaker 2: And I just.

667
00:39:19,840 --> 00:39:26,200
Speaker 4: Yeah, the timing was it was it felt just in time. Yeah,

668
00:39:26,280 --> 00:39:31,319
Speaker 4: you know, I realized my potential or just not even

669
00:39:31,360 --> 00:39:32,960
Speaker 4: that I just went for it.

670
00:39:34,440 --> 00:39:36,480
Speaker 2: Just in time. That's how I feel.

671
00:39:36,880 --> 00:39:40,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, we spoke yesterday, you and I about

672
00:39:42,239 --> 00:39:47,520
Speaker 1: both kind of being accidental academics, and you know, I

673
00:39:47,560 --> 00:39:49,080
Speaker 1: don't know if I told you this bit, but no,

674
00:39:49,160 --> 00:39:50,960
Speaker 1: I don't think I did. But I told you the

675
00:39:50,960 --> 00:39:53,520
Speaker 1: second bit about my PhD. But my under the story

676
00:39:53,560 --> 00:39:56,920
Speaker 1: around my undergrad is so I used to have a

677
00:39:56,960 --> 00:40:00,000
Speaker 1: trainer who worked for me, who was had a double

678
00:40:00,080 --> 00:40:04,800
Speaker 1: degree in still has a double degree in physiotherapy and

679
00:40:04,880 --> 00:40:10,360
Speaker 1: occupational therapy. Really smart, and you know, we talk about stuff.

680
00:40:10,480 --> 00:40:14,680
Speaker 1: I would consult with her around certain things with clients

681
00:40:14,719 --> 00:40:17,239
Speaker 1: because you know, not only was she a training but

682
00:40:17,320 --> 00:40:19,640
Speaker 1: also in OT and a physio, which is very handy

683
00:40:19,640 --> 00:40:24,600
Speaker 1: on stuff. And she was always saying, you know, you

684
00:40:24,640 --> 00:40:27,200
Speaker 1: should do a degree, you should do excise science. And

685
00:40:27,239 --> 00:40:29,400
Speaker 1: I'm like, ah, you know, I'm not that guy. And

686
00:40:29,440 --> 00:40:33,279
Speaker 1: I'm you know, like, but it was really I was interested,

687
00:40:33,360 --> 00:40:37,000
Speaker 1: but absolutely thought I was too stupid. I lacked confidence.

688
00:40:37,040 --> 00:40:39,560
Speaker 1: I lacked I didn't know. I was like you if

689
00:40:39,600 --> 00:40:42,120
Speaker 1: you had have said, I didn't know what an undergrad

690
00:40:42,160 --> 00:40:44,800
Speaker 1: degree or postgrad degree, I didn't know. I didn't understand

691
00:40:44,800 --> 00:40:50,680
Speaker 1: the language. I was like, So anyway, I didn't apply

692
00:40:50,800 --> 00:40:56,840
Speaker 1: for UNI. She applied for me. She applied for me,

693
00:40:57,840 --> 00:41:02,400
Speaker 1: and then I got place at UNI the first time.

694
00:41:03,040 --> 00:41:06,000
Speaker 1: Like by the time she'd applied, she told me and

695
00:41:06,040 --> 00:41:10,719
Speaker 1: I went, and then and then I was involved from them,

696
00:41:10,760 --> 00:41:13,600
Speaker 1: but the initial application, all the stuff, like she just

697
00:41:13,640 --> 00:41:18,040
Speaker 1: sent it in as though she was me, Yeah, I

698
00:41:18,040 --> 00:41:22,239
Speaker 1: hope I don't take the degree back now, but no,

699
00:41:22,400 --> 00:41:25,719
Speaker 1: I did the work. Yeah, but there's no way, like

700
00:41:25,960 --> 00:41:28,560
Speaker 1: I would not have made that decision because I was

701
00:41:28,600 --> 00:41:33,160
Speaker 1: too scared. I lacked confidence. I was probably had too

702
00:41:33,280 --> 00:41:37,880
Speaker 1: much ironically insecurity and ego, you know where you're like

703
00:41:38,520 --> 00:41:41,239
Speaker 1: insecure because what if I look stupid? Ego, what if

704
00:41:41,239 --> 00:41:43,640
Speaker 1: I look stupid? What if I go and I can't

705
00:41:43,680 --> 00:41:46,839
Speaker 1: do it? Because I already had a profile, and you know,

706
00:41:47,040 --> 00:41:49,640
Speaker 1: I was kind of well known and I owned three gyms,

707
00:41:49,640 --> 00:41:52,120
Speaker 1: and I was writing for the Herald's son and you know,

708
00:41:52,320 --> 00:41:55,400
Speaker 1: in the tiny fish bowl of my life, I was

709
00:41:55,440 --> 00:42:00,799
Speaker 1: someone in my mind and my mum's mind. But then

710
00:42:00,840 --> 00:42:03,120
Speaker 1: you go, well, fuck, what if I go to university

711
00:42:03,120 --> 00:42:04,840
Speaker 1: and I'm too dumb and I have to drop like

712
00:42:04,920 --> 00:42:08,399
Speaker 1: all the shit. And then and then, as I said

713
00:42:08,400 --> 00:42:11,840
Speaker 1: to you yesterday, for my you know, the post grad stuff,

714
00:42:11,840 --> 00:42:15,719
Speaker 1: for I literally got asked to talk at Monash at

715
00:42:15,760 --> 00:42:19,719
Speaker 1: the Neuroscience neuropsych Lab which is called Brain Park. I

716
00:42:19,760 --> 00:42:22,160
Speaker 1: went and did a talk and spoke to the students

717
00:42:22,200 --> 00:42:24,000
Speaker 1: and the faculty about my work and what I do

718
00:42:24,080 --> 00:42:27,000
Speaker 1: and how I do it, which was hilarious because, as

719
00:42:27,080 --> 00:42:30,319
Speaker 1: I said to you, I was the wildly the most

720
00:42:30,400 --> 00:42:33,239
Speaker 1: least qualified person in the room talking to all the

721
00:42:33,320 --> 00:42:37,040
Speaker 1: people with PhDs. And then after that, I had a

722
00:42:37,040 --> 00:42:39,440
Speaker 1: coffee with one of the dudes who said, have you

723
00:42:39,520 --> 00:42:42,759
Speaker 1: thought about doing a PhD? And I laughed, I'm like,

724
00:42:42,920 --> 00:42:46,560
Speaker 1: have you met me? Do I seem like an academic?

725
00:42:47,400 --> 00:42:50,399
Speaker 1: And it just went from there and it wasn't I mean,

726
00:42:50,440 --> 00:42:54,000
Speaker 1: he wasn't urging, but he was like, oh, you could,

727
00:42:54,160 --> 00:42:57,399
Speaker 1: and you know, like you the shit that you do,

728
00:42:57,440 --> 00:42:59,759
Speaker 1: you could do something in the psyche space. And I'm like,

729
00:43:00,560 --> 00:43:03,920
Speaker 1: it never dawned on me. But if he had not

730
00:43:04,080 --> 00:43:07,040
Speaker 1: said I think you could do it, I think you

731
00:43:07,160 --> 00:43:09,279
Speaker 1: might go okay at it, and I think you might

732
00:43:09,560 --> 00:43:12,680
Speaker 1: like it, because on no level did I think that

733
00:43:12,760 --> 00:43:17,319
Speaker 1: I was worthy, qualified, smart enough any of that stuff. Yeah. Yeah,

734
00:43:17,360 --> 00:43:21,800
Speaker 1: So it isn't it funny how like this kind of happens, right?

735
00:43:23,000 --> 00:43:23,280
Speaker 2: Yeah?

736
00:43:23,320 --> 00:43:26,400
Speaker 3: And I remember when I finished the third year of

737
00:43:26,560 --> 00:43:30,719
Speaker 3: psych it was like, I don't think I don't have

738
00:43:30,840 --> 00:43:34,440
Speaker 3: what it takes to do honest. That was what I

739
00:43:34,480 --> 00:43:36,520
Speaker 3: was telling people, I'm like, I don't think I'll apply

740
00:43:36,640 --> 00:43:38,800
Speaker 3: for honest, I don't think I have what it takes

741
00:43:38,840 --> 00:43:43,600
Speaker 3: to do honors. And luckily, again it was you know,

742
00:43:43,640 --> 00:43:46,759
Speaker 3: the people around me that said, yeah you can, you

743
00:43:46,880 --> 00:43:47,439
Speaker 3: so can.

744
00:43:48,239 --> 00:43:49,239
Speaker 2: What else you going to do?

745
00:43:49,600 --> 00:43:51,600
Speaker 3: Like, what can you do with you know, there's not

746
00:43:53,400 --> 00:43:56,080
Speaker 3: there is options for three year psych degree, but you

747
00:43:56,120 --> 00:43:58,920
Speaker 3: can't become a psychologist with the three year degree.

748
00:43:58,960 --> 00:44:01,680
Speaker 2: You can't. There's not a lot you can do without

749
00:44:01,760 --> 00:44:07,560
Speaker 2: going a little bit further with the side. And I

750
00:44:07,600 --> 00:44:10,439
Speaker 2: was working at the center and my boss was like, yeah, well,

751
00:44:10,640 --> 00:44:12,000
Speaker 2: you know, we'll do you.

752
00:44:12,040 --> 00:44:16,400
Speaker 3: So my bosses at the research Center were my psych

753
00:44:17,280 --> 00:44:22,040
Speaker 3: honors supervisors and they are now my PhD supervisors. So

754
00:44:22,120 --> 00:44:26,440
Speaker 3: they have carried me through my whole journey of academia.

755
00:44:26,640 --> 00:44:31,560
Speaker 3: So I've been very very fortunate, but also taking up

756
00:44:31,560 --> 00:44:36,200
Speaker 3: the opportunities when they present themselves, like seeing them and

757
00:44:36,239 --> 00:44:40,120
Speaker 3: I have a thing, you know, encouragement is just borrowed courage.

758
00:44:40,360 --> 00:44:44,040
Speaker 3: So if someone encourages me to do something, it's they're

759
00:44:44,080 --> 00:44:47,120
Speaker 3: just lending me some courage and I'll take that and

760
00:44:47,200 --> 00:44:50,560
Speaker 3: I'll you know, you just keep moving forward until you

761
00:44:50,840 --> 00:44:52,280
Speaker 3: get your own momentum.

762
00:44:53,239 --> 00:44:54,239
Speaker 2: That's what it's been like.

763
00:44:54,920 --> 00:44:58,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, and how do you I mean it's hard because

764
00:44:59,840 --> 00:45:03,600
Speaker 1: you you know, your your view of the world, like

765
00:45:03,680 --> 00:45:05,719
Speaker 1: my view of the world is subjective, and the way

766
00:45:06,080 --> 00:45:09,520
Speaker 1: you see you as subjective. But how do you think

767
00:45:09,680 --> 00:45:12,719
Speaker 1: so fifty one year old you versus forty three year

768
00:45:12,760 --> 00:45:15,920
Speaker 1: old you, how do you see the world differently? How

769
00:45:16,000 --> 00:45:19,680
Speaker 1: do you see you differently? Has your how is your

770
00:45:20,600 --> 00:45:24,280
Speaker 1: you know, your cognitive emotional paradigm shifted.

771
00:45:26,000 --> 00:45:30,640
Speaker 3: I have a lot more respect for myself, you know,

772
00:45:30,840 --> 00:45:36,600
Speaker 3: and my capabilities, and my voice doesn't shake so much

773
00:45:36,640 --> 00:45:39,440
Speaker 3: when I talk to people who I think are smarter

774
00:45:39,560 --> 00:45:39,759
Speaker 3: than me.

775
00:45:40,000 --> 00:45:40,160
Speaker 1: You know.

776
00:45:40,239 --> 00:45:43,040
Speaker 2: It's that kind of I kind of feel like I've

777
00:45:43,080 --> 00:45:43,560
Speaker 2: earned my.

778
00:45:43,600 --> 00:45:46,080
Speaker 3: Place in the world, not because I've done a degree,

779
00:45:46,640 --> 00:45:48,520
Speaker 3: but because I did what.

780
00:45:48,560 --> 00:45:50,680
Speaker 2: I didn't think I could do and I did it well.

781
00:45:50,760 --> 00:45:53,359
Speaker 3: So it was that It's more the climbing of the

782
00:45:53,440 --> 00:45:58,480
Speaker 3: mountain that has given me the confidence, not the certificate.

783
00:45:58,680 --> 00:46:04,640
Speaker 3: It was it was doing it in spite of And

784
00:46:04,960 --> 00:46:07,040
Speaker 3: I've earned my place in the world not because I

785
00:46:07,080 --> 00:46:10,000
Speaker 3: have an education, but because I did the hard stuff

786
00:46:10,920 --> 00:46:14,839
Speaker 3: and came out at the other end, and I now

787
00:46:15,480 --> 00:46:18,600
Speaker 3: don't let people push me around anymore. Like I just

788
00:46:19,280 --> 00:46:22,480
Speaker 3: I'm like, no, that doesn't work for me because I

789
00:46:22,480 --> 00:46:27,760
Speaker 3: I have a more solid sense of self now after

790
00:46:28,239 --> 00:46:31,840
Speaker 3: doing that, because it was hard and it was you know,

791
00:46:32,160 --> 00:46:36,239
Speaker 3: and I was so parenting the whole way through and

792
00:46:36,280 --> 00:46:38,760
Speaker 3: that was hard, and no one can take that away

793
00:46:38,760 --> 00:46:39,880
Speaker 3: from me that I did that.

794
00:46:40,600 --> 00:46:45,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, isn't it funny how many people, you know, once

795
00:46:45,120 --> 00:46:47,200
Speaker 1: they do something hard, whether or not it's you know,

796
00:46:47,360 --> 00:46:50,680
Speaker 1: overcome cancer or build a business or brand or do

797
00:46:50,800 --> 00:46:56,919
Speaker 1: a course or whatever. You know, even raise kids, which

798
00:46:56,960 --> 00:46:59,800
Speaker 1: is maybe the hardest fucking job, you would know that.

799
00:46:59,120 --> 00:47:00,879
Speaker 2: It's not like.

800
00:47:01,080 --> 00:47:04,680
Speaker 1: I mean, but it's it's like so many people say

801
00:47:04,719 --> 00:47:07,000
Speaker 1: a version of it's not about the summit. It's not

802
00:47:07,080 --> 00:47:09,080
Speaker 1: about the top of the mountain. It's about the climb,

803
00:47:09,120 --> 00:47:12,000
Speaker 1: and it's about you know, while getting a degree and

804
00:47:12,040 --> 00:47:16,680
Speaker 1: an honors degree and eventually a PhD degree, which fucking congratulations,

805
00:47:16,719 --> 00:47:20,160
Speaker 1: by the way, it's amazing, and all of that is great,

806
00:47:20,440 --> 00:47:27,000
Speaker 1: but like I see a profound change in you, like

807
00:47:27,200 --> 00:47:33,160
Speaker 1: profound the way that you talk. You're this is this

808
00:47:33,239 --> 00:47:36,319
Speaker 1: is this is going to sound silly, right, Not that

809
00:47:36,360 --> 00:47:39,440
Speaker 1: you ever seem dumb. You're always intelligent, but it's like

810
00:47:39,560 --> 00:47:42,759
Speaker 1: you seem smarter, but you're not smarter. You're just more confident,

811
00:47:43,520 --> 00:47:47,279
Speaker 1: but confident in a good way. Not not arrogant, not

812
00:47:48,600 --> 00:47:50,160
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. And I love that, And

813
00:47:50,200 --> 00:47:52,319
Speaker 1: I love the fact that you've grown and learned and

814
00:47:52,360 --> 00:47:56,160
Speaker 1: evolved and you've done some you know, like some stuff

815
00:47:56,239 --> 00:47:59,799
Speaker 1: that is been really challenging and we don't have time

816
00:47:59,840 --> 00:48:02,960
Speaker 1: to day, but you also went through a lot of

817
00:48:03,000 --> 00:48:06,799
Speaker 1: trauma and abuse that maybe we'll come back and talk

818
00:48:06,840 --> 00:48:11,840
Speaker 1: about one day. And you're not you know, you're not

819
00:48:11,880 --> 00:48:14,920
Speaker 1: bitter and twisted and hateful and hurtful, and like you're

820
00:48:14,960 --> 00:48:18,839
Speaker 1: philosophical and you've learned and grown and you know, you're

821
00:48:18,920 --> 00:48:21,520
Speaker 1: kind and you're aware and you're empathetic, but you won't

822
00:48:21,560 --> 00:48:24,480
Speaker 1: put up with bullshit, which is good. Like you're a

823
00:48:24,520 --> 00:48:28,600
Speaker 1: little bit terrifying and a little bit gorgeous like my mum.

824
00:48:29,320 --> 00:48:32,920
Speaker 1: Like my mum's gorgeous, but don't fuck with her. You know,

825
00:48:33,160 --> 00:48:37,360
Speaker 1: she's five foot nothing of absolute fucking terror, you know,

826
00:48:38,560 --> 00:48:42,960
Speaker 1: Like I love that. Well, so we've got to wine,

827
00:48:43,560 --> 00:48:47,399
Speaker 1: but no pleasure. It's true, you know, it's like who

828
00:48:47,480 --> 00:48:49,480
Speaker 1: you become is the key, you know, I think with

829
00:48:49,600 --> 00:48:54,560
Speaker 1: all this, you think about people acquiring and doing and

830
00:48:54,600 --> 00:48:58,840
Speaker 1: box sticking. Nothing wrong with any of that, but like, Okay,

831
00:48:58,880 --> 00:49:01,360
Speaker 1: you've got this, you've earned that, you own that, you've

832
00:49:01,400 --> 00:49:04,600
Speaker 1: got this title, you've got that body, you've got that car,

833
00:49:04,680 --> 00:49:08,759
Speaker 1: you've got whatever. This many followers cool. But in the

834
00:49:08,800 --> 00:49:10,719
Speaker 1: middle of all of those things that you've done and

835
00:49:10,800 --> 00:49:13,759
Speaker 1: achieved in boxes, you like coop you become and how

836
00:49:13,800 --> 00:49:15,920
Speaker 1: are you? Are you happy? Are you in field? Are

837
00:49:15,960 --> 00:49:20,920
Speaker 1: you content? Do you sleep great? Are you you know?

838
00:49:21,040 --> 00:49:26,080
Speaker 1: Are you mentally, emotionally, physically healthy? And you know, there

839
00:49:26,160 --> 00:49:28,920
Speaker 1: are so many people that have done so much stuff

840
00:49:29,040 --> 00:49:32,560
Speaker 1: which is good, and they've collected and owned and whatever,

841
00:49:32,920 --> 00:49:37,800
Speaker 1: accumulated so much stuff, and in the middle of their stuff,

842
00:49:38,520 --> 00:49:43,080
Speaker 1: they're fucking broken, you know, they're unhappy all feel and

843
00:49:43,160 --> 00:49:47,040
Speaker 1: it's like, nothing wrong with building and accumulating, but we

844
00:49:47,160 --> 00:49:49,840
Speaker 1: need to work on us as we do the building

845
00:49:49,880 --> 00:49:51,080
Speaker 1: and accumulating, right.

846
00:49:52,320 --> 00:49:54,120
Speaker 3: Well, yeah, and I think too because I say to

847
00:49:54,160 --> 00:49:57,640
Speaker 3: my kids all the time, like I couldn't really I don't.

848
00:49:57,440 --> 00:50:00,239
Speaker 2: Really care what my kids do with their lives.

849
00:50:00,200 --> 00:50:05,480
Speaker 3: As long as they're as long as they're not shit humans, like,

850
00:50:05,520 --> 00:50:08,080
Speaker 3: as long as they care about other people and that

851
00:50:08,160 --> 00:50:11,600
Speaker 3: they're available for other people and that they're you know,

852
00:50:11,800 --> 00:50:12,360
Speaker 3: as long.

853
00:50:12,760 --> 00:50:15,879
Speaker 2: I want them to be well taken care of.

854
00:50:15,840 --> 00:50:17,600
Speaker 3: And make sure they've got food on the table and

855
00:50:17,680 --> 00:50:19,239
Speaker 3: the roof over their heads and all of that and

856
00:50:19,320 --> 00:50:22,680
Speaker 3: successful in that way. But and I say to them

857
00:50:22,719 --> 00:50:28,279
Speaker 3: all the time, your happiness through life is directly correlated

858
00:50:28,360 --> 00:50:31,839
Speaker 3: with how well you relate to other people and your

859
00:50:31,880 --> 00:50:35,439
Speaker 3: relationship with other people. And if you cannot get that right,

860
00:50:36,840 --> 00:50:39,360
Speaker 3: then it doesn't matter what you own, it doesn't matter.

861
00:50:39,719 --> 00:50:44,640
Speaker 3: If you can't have healthy relationships, friendships, interactions.

862
00:50:44,040 --> 00:50:48,279
Speaker 2: With other human beings, then what's the point. What's the

863
00:50:48,320 --> 00:50:53,399
Speaker 2: point being here? So, yeah, that was That's a big

864
00:50:53,400 --> 00:50:53,920
Speaker 2: thing for me.

865
00:50:54,640 --> 00:50:59,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, Hey, you're quite good at this. If people want,

866
00:51:00,080 --> 00:51:03,440
Speaker 1: are you okay for people to follow you on Insta

867
00:51:03,680 --> 00:51:08,600
Speaker 1: or wherever? Or send you an email if somebody I don't.

868
00:51:08,360 --> 00:51:11,200
Speaker 3: Really have a presence, I don't really I mean apart

869
00:51:11,239 --> 00:51:13,719
Speaker 3: from just my personal accounts.

870
00:51:13,760 --> 00:51:19,680
Speaker 1: But so if somebody wanted to message you where, would

871
00:51:19,840 --> 00:51:23,880
Speaker 1: like on Facebook or Insta or should send us an

872
00:51:23,920 --> 00:51:25,279
Speaker 1: email and we'll forward it to you.

873
00:51:26,600 --> 00:51:33,880
Speaker 2: But uh, yeah, on Insta, I'm Nick Underscore.

874
00:51:33,480 --> 00:51:38,600
Speaker 1: Liddell, so and I see underscore L I double D

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00:51:38,800 --> 00:51:42,640
Speaker 1: E double L L yea, that can. Yeah.

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00:51:42,680 --> 00:51:46,480
Speaker 3: And because I'm just knickknack on Facebook, so that's not really.

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Speaker 2: That probably Facebook.

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00:51:50,000 --> 00:51:54,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, Hey, I know you've done a couple, but

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00:51:54,239 --> 00:51:56,200
Speaker 1: this is your debut with us. That was great, that

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00:51:56,320 --> 00:52:01,799
Speaker 1: was so interesting, and I'm super proud of you and

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Speaker 1: keep being amazing. And thanks for taking this call on

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Speaker 1: very short notice.

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Speaker 2: Thanks, thanks for inviting me. It's an honor.

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Speaker 1: Thanks Nick, You're great. To see you next time. Yeah,