1
00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:02,920
Speaker 1: Gooday, Hello, thank you for joining us on Healthy Ish

2
00:00:03,400 --> 00:00:05,600
Speaker 1: Dally Podcasts from Body and Soul. I am your host

3
00:00:05,640 --> 00:00:08,360
Speaker 1: of Felicity Harley. How much time do you spend outdoors?

4
00:00:08,960 --> 00:00:12,360
Speaker 1: Perhaps you go a day and you barely walk outside,

5
00:00:12,400 --> 00:00:15,200
Speaker 1: and then you spend an hour or so the next day,

6
00:00:15,240 --> 00:00:18,400
Speaker 1: and how much time should we really be spending outdoors

7
00:00:18,440 --> 00:00:21,800
Speaker 1: each week? Well, today we have the answer. I am

8
00:00:21,920 --> 00:00:25,440
Speaker 1: joined by lifestyle medicine physician doctor Jenny Brocketts. She's written

9
00:00:25,480 --> 00:00:27,680
Speaker 1: a new book, she's the best selling author by the way.

10
00:00:27,880 --> 00:00:31,120
Speaker 1: This new one is called The Natural Advantage, and she's

11
00:00:31,120 --> 00:00:33,760
Speaker 1: here today to remind us why spending time outdoors is

12
00:00:33,880 --> 00:00:37,440
Speaker 1: wondrous for well being and what is the minimum amount

13
00:00:37,560 --> 00:00:40,080
Speaker 1: required each week. Make sure you're listening to Jenny on

14
00:00:40,159 --> 00:00:43,040
Speaker 1: Extra Healthy Ish, where she discusses how to create your

15
00:00:43,080 --> 00:00:46,760
Speaker 1: own personal nature prescription. You can grab that one wherever

16
00:00:46,760 --> 00:01:03,200
Speaker 1: you get your podcasts. Jenny, Welcome to you Healthy, Thank

17
00:01:03,200 --> 00:01:04,200
Speaker 1: you for joining us today.

18
00:01:04,520 --> 00:01:06,319
Speaker 2: My absolute pleasure, Felicity just.

19
00:01:06,360 --> 00:01:08,560
Speaker 1: Joining us off the back of a walk, no doubt,

20
00:01:08,680 --> 00:01:10,039
Speaker 1: that seems very fitting.

21
00:01:10,440 --> 00:01:13,880
Speaker 2: Is you can't keep me out of the outdoors.

22
00:01:15,080 --> 00:01:18,160
Speaker 1: It's just even the word even you're saying the word

23
00:01:18,280 --> 00:01:20,320
Speaker 1: just fills me, you know, fills me with joy. I

24
00:01:20,400 --> 00:01:22,640
Speaker 1: need to we need to get outside. But tell us

25
00:01:22,720 --> 00:01:26,600
Speaker 1: why you're spending time in nature. Nature beneficial for us.

26
00:01:28,080 --> 00:01:30,520
Speaker 2: Well, there's been a lot of research looking into this,

27
00:01:31,200 --> 00:01:34,360
Speaker 2: and I think lots of people recognize that we feel

28
00:01:34,400 --> 00:01:38,360
Speaker 2: better when we go outside, but the research says it's

29
00:01:38,400 --> 00:01:40,680
Speaker 2: actually good for us on so many different levels. It's

30
00:01:40,680 --> 00:01:44,560
Speaker 2: good for our mental wellbeing. It helps us to recover

31
00:01:45,319 --> 00:01:48,120
Speaker 2: if we've been unwell, you know, if people are suffering

32
00:01:48,120 --> 00:01:51,200
Speaker 2: from anxiety or depression, or just feeling a bit overwhelmed

33
00:01:51,200 --> 00:01:55,240
Speaker 2: by life in general. But it's also super important for

34
00:01:55,480 --> 00:02:00,360
Speaker 2: maintaining mental wellbeing, so it keeps you buoyant, to you

35
00:02:01,000 --> 00:02:04,280
Speaker 2: able to manage all the stresses of life more effectively.

36
00:02:04,560 --> 00:02:07,320
Speaker 2: We're more resilient if we go outside more regularly, so

37
00:02:07,400 --> 00:02:11,400
Speaker 2: that's one benefit. The other benefit, which I think gets overlooked,

38
00:02:11,600 --> 00:02:14,720
Speaker 2: is that when you spend more time outside, you're often

39
00:02:14,760 --> 00:02:18,600
Speaker 2: more physically active, which actually gives you the physical benefit

40
00:02:18,919 --> 00:02:21,880
Speaker 2: of you're going to be a little bit more physically fit,

41
00:02:22,120 --> 00:02:25,680
Speaker 2: perhaps especially if you go walking or hiking or cycling

42
00:02:25,800 --> 00:02:29,160
Speaker 2: or running or any of those sort of things. And

43
00:02:29,200 --> 00:02:34,640
Speaker 2: the third benefit is the cognitive benefit when you go outside.

44
00:02:34,680 --> 00:02:36,480
Speaker 2: And I don't know if you ever do this felicity.

45
00:02:36,520 --> 00:02:39,200
Speaker 2: I do it quite often. If I'm stuck on something

46
00:02:40,200 --> 00:02:42,760
Speaker 2: and I'm chewing it over, chewing it over, cheering it over,

47
00:02:42,800 --> 00:02:46,600
Speaker 2: and I just can't find the solution, going outside for

48
00:02:46,800 --> 00:02:51,920
Speaker 2: walk will often lead to that insight. Aha, I know

49
00:02:52,000 --> 00:02:55,600
Speaker 2: what the answer is now. So it really does clear

50
00:02:55,639 --> 00:03:00,560
Speaker 2: our head, allows us to resolve issues and challenges more easily.

51
00:03:00,919 --> 00:03:04,079
Speaker 2: Plus it boosts our level of cognition. We're actually more

52
00:03:04,120 --> 00:03:08,560
Speaker 2: open to new ideas, we're more creative, we learn more effectively.

53
00:03:09,320 --> 00:03:12,480
Speaker 2: What's not to love about being outside?

54
00:03:12,720 --> 00:03:14,440
Speaker 1: How does it do this? Why does it do this?

55
00:03:14,480 --> 00:03:17,079
Speaker 1: Is it evolution? Is it the fact that we spent

56
00:03:17,200 --> 00:03:19,839
Speaker 1: millions and millions of years outside and then we came

57
00:03:19,880 --> 00:03:25,040
Speaker 1: inside and we're on screens and I've got too freaking busy.

58
00:03:25,880 --> 00:03:29,480
Speaker 2: I think essentially that probably is the answer. I mean,

59
00:03:29,600 --> 00:03:33,800
Speaker 2: that's what's being proposed. We evolved in nature, and up

60
00:03:33,880 --> 00:03:36,840
Speaker 2: until the last couple of hundred years, we spent a

61
00:03:36,840 --> 00:03:41,640
Speaker 2: lot of time outside, and now we've all moved towards

62
00:03:41,920 --> 00:03:45,440
Speaker 2: city life, which is not necessarily a bad thing. I mean,

63
00:03:45,480 --> 00:03:49,320
Speaker 2: city life can be absolutely great, but as a consequence,

64
00:03:49,920 --> 00:03:54,120
Speaker 2: because of all the stresses that you've mentioned and the

65
00:03:54,120 --> 00:03:58,880
Speaker 2: frantic pace of life, we've lost sight of the fact

66
00:03:58,960 --> 00:04:01,720
Speaker 2: that we do better when we go outside a bit more.

67
00:04:01,920 --> 00:04:05,320
Speaker 2: And I think the statistic that really blew my mind

68
00:04:05,560 --> 00:04:08,320
Speaker 2: was one that came out from the States saying that

69
00:04:08,880 --> 00:04:12,640
Speaker 2: majority of Americans spend ninety three percent of their time

70
00:04:12,800 --> 00:04:17,360
Speaker 2: indoors eve every single day. And I'm thinking, crikey. If

71
00:04:17,400 --> 00:04:19,600
Speaker 2: it's true for the Americans, is it true for us?

72
00:04:19,640 --> 00:04:23,680
Speaker 2: And it actually is. We've become indoor dwellers, if you like,

73
00:04:24,360 --> 00:04:26,520
Speaker 2: because if you think about it, we live in a house.

74
00:04:26,720 --> 00:04:29,680
Speaker 2: We might work from home, we might go to an office,

75
00:04:30,000 --> 00:04:32,720
Speaker 2: but we sit in the car, we sit on public transport.

76
00:04:33,839 --> 00:04:37,720
Speaker 2: We don't actually go out and walk places very much

77
00:04:37,880 --> 00:04:43,239
Speaker 2: anymore for whatever reasons. And that's what's causing what's called

78
00:04:43,400 --> 00:04:44,560
Speaker 2: the nature deficit.

79
00:04:45,600 --> 00:04:46,800
Speaker 1: I think you've read about this in the book, but

80
00:04:46,839 --> 00:04:50,240
Speaker 1: it was interesting because the pandemic almost made us all

81
00:04:50,320 --> 00:04:52,520
Speaker 1: realize this. You know, we can talk about the science,

82
00:04:52,560 --> 00:04:54,960
Speaker 1: but when we all were forced to go for the

83
00:04:55,040 --> 00:04:57,880
Speaker 1: walks once a day within the five ks, well, not

84
00:04:57,960 --> 00:05:00,720
Speaker 1: in Perth, but the rest of us to earlier.

85
00:05:01,400 --> 00:05:03,880
Speaker 2: Yes, less so in Perth. We were just constrained to

86
00:05:03,920 --> 00:05:06,040
Speaker 2: stay in West Australia. Wouldn't got allowed to get anywhere else.

87
00:05:06,080 --> 00:05:10,160
Speaker 1: Yes, yes, we probably truly realized we didn't need the

88
00:05:10,200 --> 00:05:12,359
Speaker 1: science to tell us how good nature was for mind,

89
00:05:12,400 --> 00:05:13,080
Speaker 1: body and soul.

90
00:05:14,080 --> 00:05:17,240
Speaker 2: We were desperate to get out. And I think that's

91
00:05:17,440 --> 00:05:21,200
Speaker 2: that was the realization that we hate feeling constrained and

92
00:05:21,279 --> 00:05:23,840
Speaker 2: not able to move outside when we want to. And

93
00:05:23,880 --> 00:05:27,000
Speaker 2: people suddenly got the idea of, oh, let's take the

94
00:05:27,040 --> 00:05:28,800
Speaker 2: whole family out for a walk, let's get a dog,

95
00:05:29,120 --> 00:05:33,800
Speaker 2: let's do something outside. And I was really hoping that

96
00:05:34,040 --> 00:05:38,720
Speaker 2: after the pandemic that we would maintain that healthy attitude.

97
00:05:39,000 --> 00:05:41,320
Speaker 2: But of course we went back to our usual way

98
00:05:41,360 --> 00:05:45,320
Speaker 2: of doing things, and so we didn't always maintain that

99
00:05:45,320 --> 00:05:48,680
Speaker 2: that happened, even though we recognized how much of a

100
00:05:48,680 --> 00:05:49,840
Speaker 2: difference it made at the time.

101
00:05:50,120 --> 00:05:52,919
Speaker 1: Now, I was almost horrified to read this and equally

102
00:05:53,080 --> 00:05:54,919
Speaker 1: horrified to ask you the question. But there is a

103
00:05:54,960 --> 00:05:59,120
Speaker 1: current minimum recommendation for time you should spend outside, Yes,

104
00:05:59,160 --> 00:05:59,520
Speaker 1: there is.

105
00:05:59,560 --> 00:06:02,520
Speaker 2: What is it? It's one hundred and twenty minutes.

106
00:06:02,880 --> 00:06:04,880
Speaker 1: Oh goodness, a week, a week.

107
00:06:04,839 --> 00:06:06,240
Speaker 2: Week a week?

108
00:06:06,360 --> 00:06:06,680
Speaker 1: Wow?

109
00:06:06,720 --> 00:06:10,640
Speaker 2: So nothing, it's nothing. No, it actually breaks down to

110
00:06:10,720 --> 00:06:13,800
Speaker 2: seventeen minutes and a few seconds a day. So the

111
00:06:13,880 --> 00:06:17,160
Speaker 2: question is do you have seventeen minutes and a few

112
00:06:17,200 --> 00:06:20,120
Speaker 2: seconds to spend outside? And I would suggest you do,

113
00:06:20,640 --> 00:06:23,599
Speaker 2: but we sometimes need to make that conscious choice to

114
00:06:23,760 --> 00:06:26,520
Speaker 2: get outside, to open the door, open the window, do whatever,

115
00:06:26,920 --> 00:06:28,640
Speaker 2: escape and step outside.

116
00:06:29,320 --> 00:06:31,440
Speaker 1: It's a great formula or a rule in your book

117
00:06:31,480 --> 00:06:34,960
Speaker 1: that you that I particularly liked, and it's from doctor

118
00:06:35,040 --> 00:06:38,200
Speaker 1: Rachel Hotman, twenty five to three rule. Can you tell

119
00:06:38,279 --> 00:06:38,919
Speaker 1: us more about this?

120
00:06:40,120 --> 00:06:42,440
Speaker 2: I like the rule too because it's simple and I

121
00:06:42,440 --> 00:06:47,560
Speaker 2: can remember it. So it's twenty minutes, five hours and

122
00:06:47,680 --> 00:06:51,080
Speaker 2: three days. So her suggestion is that we should all

123
00:06:51,120 --> 00:06:55,239
Speaker 2: be getting outside for twenty minutes three times a week,

124
00:06:56,240 --> 00:07:02,920
Speaker 2: regardless that we spend five hours once a month doing

125
00:07:03,000 --> 00:07:05,960
Speaker 2: something a bit more extensive, like go for a long

126
00:07:06,040 --> 00:07:08,159
Speaker 2: walk or a drive to a national park or something

127
00:07:08,240 --> 00:07:11,720
Speaker 2: like that, and then once a year go off grid

128
00:07:12,000 --> 00:07:15,480
Speaker 2: for three days. Now, the three days is actually important,

129
00:07:15,520 --> 00:07:17,080
Speaker 2: and I don't know if you've ever done this, but

130
00:07:17,160 --> 00:07:20,720
Speaker 2: if you go off grid, there's no phones, no laptops. Oh,

131
00:07:20,760 --> 00:07:26,000
Speaker 2: it's wonderful. It can take you three days for your

132
00:07:26,040 --> 00:07:31,160
Speaker 2: brain to really unwind from all the busyness. Of life

133
00:07:31,480 --> 00:07:35,640
Speaker 2: because we've got our phones with us all the time

134
00:07:35,680 --> 00:07:38,680
Speaker 2: twenty four to seven and we don't go anywhere without them,

135
00:07:39,040 --> 00:07:41,400
Speaker 2: and so it's actually been shown that it takes about

136
00:07:41,440 --> 00:07:44,760
Speaker 2: three days to stop looking for the phone and wanting

137
00:07:44,800 --> 00:07:47,160
Speaker 2: to connect. Isn't it interesting?

138
00:07:47,280 --> 00:07:52,360
Speaker 1: Gosh? That is interesting and also horrifying. How do we

139
00:07:52,400 --> 00:07:55,880
Speaker 1: work out our own nature prescription? And perhaps you can

140
00:07:55,880 --> 00:07:57,920
Speaker 1: talk about yours, and how do we actually go about

141
00:07:57,920 --> 00:08:00,040
Speaker 1: doing it.

142
00:08:00,560 --> 00:08:02,840
Speaker 2: I think it's important to work out what your own is.

143
00:08:03,040 --> 00:08:05,200
Speaker 2: I mean, it's great to have a rule like Rachel's

144
00:08:05,280 --> 00:08:08,520
Speaker 2: rule of twenty five and three, but I think it's

145
00:08:08,520 --> 00:08:12,080
Speaker 2: better to have a daily habit, something that you put

146
00:08:12,120 --> 00:08:14,440
Speaker 2: in place that just becomes part of what you do

147
00:08:14,520 --> 00:08:17,000
Speaker 2: naturally without having to really think about it, like brushing

148
00:08:17,000 --> 00:08:19,800
Speaker 2: your teeth. So for me, I know I'm going to

149
00:08:19,840 --> 00:08:22,560
Speaker 2: have a good day when I've been outside, especially in

150
00:08:22,600 --> 00:08:26,240
Speaker 2: the early morning. There's nothing I love more than stepping

151
00:08:26,240 --> 00:08:29,120
Speaker 2: outside when my first cup of tea. I'm English, so

152
00:08:29,160 --> 00:08:31,480
Speaker 2: I always drink tea first.

153
00:08:31,040 --> 00:08:33,800
Speaker 1: Yes, yes, not coffee like the rest of us.

154
00:08:34,160 --> 00:08:38,199
Speaker 2: It comes later. But I just love stepping outside and

155
00:08:38,320 --> 00:08:42,440
Speaker 2: just looking up, looking at the clouds, just noticing what's

156
00:08:42,480 --> 00:08:47,400
Speaker 2: around me and just engaging. The Japanese have this beautiful

157
00:08:47,440 --> 00:08:50,959
Speaker 2: word called com or ab. I don't know if I've

158
00:08:50,960 --> 00:08:53,040
Speaker 2: said that right. The Japanese listening was saying, oh, she

159
00:08:53,200 --> 00:08:56,959
Speaker 2: can't say that would but it means scattered light through trees.

160
00:08:57,520 --> 00:08:59,600
Speaker 1: Oh, And I think, what a beautiful word that.

161
00:09:00,320 --> 00:09:02,280
Speaker 2: I think it's we need a word like that, don't we.

162
00:09:02,880 --> 00:09:06,560
Speaker 2: And to me, it's all about com rab. I just

163
00:09:06,679 --> 00:09:09,600
Speaker 2: love seeing that dappled light as it comes through and

164
00:09:09,640 --> 00:09:13,800
Speaker 2: the shadows being cast. It immediately makes me feel calm.

165
00:09:14,040 --> 00:09:17,760
Speaker 2: So it's great for me to lower stress, get me

166
00:09:17,800 --> 00:09:21,600
Speaker 2: ready for the day, go outside, especially in the early morning,

167
00:09:21,600 --> 00:09:24,520
Speaker 2: because that early morning light resets your circadian rhythm and

168
00:09:24,520 --> 00:09:26,959
Speaker 2: all this sort of stuff, so you're bright eyed and

169
00:09:27,080 --> 00:09:30,360
Speaker 2: bushy taid, ready for the day ahead. And then so

170
00:09:30,400 --> 00:09:33,199
Speaker 2: I aim to do something every day. It's either walking

171
00:09:33,480 --> 00:09:35,920
Speaker 2: or I jump in our back pool, which I tell

172
00:09:35,960 --> 00:09:38,520
Speaker 2: my husband, do not turn the heating on. I want

173
00:09:38,520 --> 00:09:38,920
Speaker 2: it cold.

174
00:09:38,960 --> 00:09:39,880
Speaker 1: Do you want the cold plate?

175
00:09:41,280 --> 00:09:44,440
Speaker 2: I like the cold plunge. Or I just take the

176
00:09:44,440 --> 00:09:47,560
Speaker 2: dogs out. Just something. And so some people tell me

177
00:09:47,559 --> 00:09:49,920
Speaker 2: they go for a meditation, but that's what I do.

178
00:09:52,360 --> 00:09:55,360
Speaker 2: Then every week I go for a long walk with

179
00:09:55,480 --> 00:09:59,160
Speaker 2: some friends. So we've got beautiful national parks around us,

180
00:09:59,200 --> 00:10:01,600
Speaker 2: so we choose a different place to go and explore.

181
00:10:02,160 --> 00:10:04,600
Speaker 2: At the moment, we've got beautiful spring flowers out, so

182
00:10:05,320 --> 00:10:08,240
Speaker 2: we're out in beautiful spaces. We're looking at what's around.

183
00:10:08,280 --> 00:10:10,560
Speaker 2: We're noticing the flora and the fauna and having a

184
00:10:10,559 --> 00:10:12,800
Speaker 2: great time and having a bit of a chat as

185
00:10:12,800 --> 00:10:15,560
Speaker 2: we go around. So that's what I do. I also

186
00:10:15,600 --> 00:10:18,880
Speaker 2: love kayaking once a week, that's my other go to.

187
00:10:19,440 --> 00:10:23,199
Speaker 2: So my five hours is actually something I sort of

188
00:10:23,240 --> 00:10:27,240
Speaker 2: semi morph into my weekly thing. And then once a

189
00:10:27,360 --> 00:10:30,880
Speaker 2: quarter I try to encourage my husband to come away

190
00:10:30,920 --> 00:10:32,720
Speaker 2: with me, so we just go away for a long weekend.

191
00:10:33,400 --> 00:10:38,199
Speaker 2: And the other thing is we do love to go remote.

192
00:10:38,440 --> 00:10:41,480
Speaker 2: We go remote camping, far away from the madding crowd.

193
00:10:41,840 --> 00:10:44,439
Speaker 2: We pack up the car, we just take all our food,

194
00:10:44,559 --> 00:10:47,400
Speaker 2: all our water, everything we need and we go off

195
00:10:47,440 --> 00:10:51,920
Speaker 2: the grid literally into the great outdoors, the great sandy desert,

196
00:10:51,920 --> 00:10:55,400
Speaker 2: wherever it is, and we just love it. We absolutely

197
00:10:55,440 --> 00:10:56,000
Speaker 2: adore it.

198
00:10:56,120 --> 00:10:58,840
Speaker 1: A great reset. Jinny, thank you for coming Unhealthy my

199
00:10:58,920 --> 00:11:02,760
Speaker 1: absolute pleasure. Thank you, thank you. Well. If you are

200
00:11:02,760 --> 00:11:06,119
Speaker 1: not listening to this episode outside, I encourage you. I implore

201
00:11:06,080 --> 00:11:10,360
Speaker 1: you to get outside today and get that nature prescription. AH.

202
00:11:10,600 --> 00:11:12,760
Speaker 1: Just makes you feel better, doesn't it. And hey, we've

203
00:11:12,760 --> 00:11:15,679
Speaker 1: just heard about all the science. Jenny's new book is

204
00:11:15,720 --> 00:11:18,319
Speaker 1: called The Natural Advantage. It is out now. If you

205
00:11:18,360 --> 00:11:20,480
Speaker 1: did enjoy this chat, jump on at rate and review it,

206
00:11:20,600 --> 00:11:23,480
Speaker 1: or you can subscribe to this podcast. Of course, anything else,

207
00:11:23,480 --> 00:11:25,280
Speaker 1: head to body andsoul dot com dot you follow us

208
00:11:25,280 --> 00:11:27,320
Speaker 1: on socials rob Our print edition which is out in

209
00:11:27,320 --> 00:11:33,280
Speaker 1: your local Sunday paper, and until tomorrow, stay healthysh