WEBVTT - Erin Patterson’s liposuction testimony

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<v Speaker 1>From The Australian. Here's what's on the front. I'm Claire Harvey.

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<v Speaker 1>It's Friday, June thirteen, twenty twenty five. Wife killer and

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<v Speaker 1>child sex offender Christopher Michael Dawson has lost his bid

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<v Speaker 1>to have the High Court of Australia reopen his case. Dawson,

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<v Speaker 1>whose murder of wife Lynette Simms was the subject of

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<v Speaker 1>The Australian's podcast The Teacher's Pet, failed to convince the

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<v Speaker 1>justices of Australia's highest court he'd been the victim of

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<v Speaker 1>a miscarriage of justice. You can read that story right

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<v Speaker 1>now at the Australian dot com au. And if you

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<v Speaker 1>haven't listened to The Teacher's Pet or our companion podcast,

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<v Speaker 1>The Teacher's Trial, find them now wherever you're listening. Accused

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<v Speaker 1>mushroom murderer Aaron Patterson insists she did have an appointment

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<v Speaker 1>for liposuction and that's why she needed to invite four

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<v Speaker 1>elderly relatives to her house for a lunch without her

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<v Speaker 1>children being present. Today, the final moments of Aaron Patterson's

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<v Speaker 1>time in the witness box giving evidence in her defense

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<v Speaker 1>on charges of murdering three people and attempting to murder

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<v Speaker 1>a fourth We've used voice actors throughout this episode to

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<v Speaker 1>bring you the words spoken in court. On Thursday, June twelve,

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<v Speaker 1>Colin Mandy sc representing Aaron Patterson, got his chance to

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<v Speaker 1>re examine his client after several days of cross examination

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<v Speaker 1>by prosecutor Nanett Rodgers. Re examination is where a witness

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<v Speaker 1>can be asked to clarify points that have arisen in

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<v Speaker 1>cross examination. It's a chance to have the last word,

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<v Speaker 1>and in this matter, Aaron Patterson was the defense's one

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<v Speaker 1>and only witness. That means evidence in the case has concluded.

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<v Speaker 1>Now the trial will move on to closing submissions by

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<v Speaker 1>both Crown and defense, then summing up by the judge

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<v Speaker 1>before the jury is sent out to consider its verdict.

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<v Speaker 1>Is Aaron Patterson guilty beyond reasonable doubt of three counts

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<v Speaker 1>of murder and one of attempted murder of having deliberately

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<v Speaker 1>poisoned her three elderly relatives with deathcap mushrooms? Or was it,

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<v Speaker 1>as Mandy said in his defense, opening a tragedy and

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<v Speaker 1>a terrible accident at the fatal lunch on July twenty nine,

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<v Speaker 1>twenty twenty three, after serving her lunch guests beef Wellington,

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<v Speaker 1>Aaron Patterson told them she was likely to eat surgery

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<v Speaker 1>in the future. The Crown says Patterson invented a diagnosis

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<v Speaker 1>of ovarian cancer in order to justify inviting her husband,

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<v Speaker 1>his parents, and his aunt and uncle to lunch at

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<v Speaker 1>her home while excluding her children. Patterson, who's pleading not

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<v Speaker 1>guilty to three counts of murder, says she did no

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<v Speaker 1>such thing. She says that she did tell the lunch

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<v Speaker 1>guests she was concerned about cancer, something she says she'd

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<v Speaker 1>been genuinely worried about in the past. But she says

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<v Speaker 1>the real reason she was going to need surgery was

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<v Speaker 1>that she had decided to do something about her weight

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<v Speaker 1>and long term eating battles. That's something was gastric bypass surgery.

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<v Speaker 1>That's what Patterson told the jury during her evidence in

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<v Speaker 1>examination in chief. Here's what she told the jury on

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<v Speaker 1>June fourth, under questioning from her barrister, Colin Mandy sc

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<v Speaker 1>Aaron Patterson, who had separated from the Patterson's son Simon,

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<v Speaker 1>described exchanging messages with Gail Patterson about a lump on

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<v Speaker 1>her arm shortly before the fatal lunch. Here's what Aaron

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<v Speaker 1>Patterson's message said.

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<v Speaker 2>I had a needle biopsy taken out of the lump,

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<v Speaker 2>and I'm returning for an MRI next week and will

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<v Speaker 2>know more after the results of those two things.

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<v Speaker 3>In court, Mandy asked, had you been to an appointment?

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<v Speaker 1>No?

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<v Speaker 3>Had you had a needle biopsy taken off the lump?

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<v Speaker 4>No?

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<v Speaker 3>Were you returning for an MRI the next week?

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<v Speaker 1>No?

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<v Speaker 3>Were those lies?

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<v Speaker 5>Yes?

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<v Speaker 3>And why did you tell those lies?

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<v Speaker 2>So some weeks prior, I had been having an issue

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<v Speaker 2>with my elbow with pain, and I thought there was

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<v Speaker 2>a lump there, and I'd told Gail and Don about

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<v Speaker 2>that when I saw them or spoke to them, and

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<v Speaker 2>they'd trained quite a lot of care about that, which

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<v Speaker 2>felt really nice. The issue started to resolve, and I

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<v Speaker 2>felt like a bit embarrassed that I'd made such a

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<v Speaker 2>big deal about it, and I didn't want their care

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<v Speaker 2>of me to stop, so I just kept it going.

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<v Speaker 2>I shouldn't have done it.

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<v Speaker 1>Patison sent another message suggesting they talk about it at

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<v Speaker 1>the lunch.

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<v Speaker 2>I'd come to the conclusion that I wanted to do

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<v Speaker 2>something for once and for all about my weight and

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<v Speaker 2>my poor eating habits. So I was planning to have

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<v Speaker 2>gastric bypass surgery and so I remember thinking I didn't

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<v Speaker 2>want to tell anybody what I was going to have done.

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<v Speaker 2>I was really embarrassed about it. So I thought perhaps

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<v Speaker 2>letting them believe I had some serious issue that needed

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<v Speaker 2>treatment might mean they'd be able to help me with

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<v Speaker 2>the logistics around the kids, and I wouldn't have to

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<v Speaker 2>tell them the real reason.

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<v Speaker 1>During cross examination, prosecutor Nannett Rodgers was asking Patterson about

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<v Speaker 1>conversations she'd had with her husband Simon about wanting to

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<v Speaker 1>discuss medical issues at the lunch. Patterson was asked about

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<v Speaker 1>a message she'd sent on the day before the lunch

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<v Speaker 1>twenty eight July, to Simon when he said he wouldn't

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<v Speaker 1>be able to attend.

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<v Speaker 5>Sorry, I feel too uncomfortable about coming to the lunch

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<v Speaker 5>with you, Mum, Dad, Heather and I and tomorrow, but

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<v Speaker 5>I'm happy to talk about your health and implications of

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<v Speaker 5>that another time.

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<v Speaker 4>If you'd like to discuss on my phone.

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<v Speaker 2>Just let me know. That's really disappointing. I've spent many

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<v Speaker 2>hours this week preparing lunch for tomorrow, which has been

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<v Speaker 2>exhausting in light of the issues I'm facing, and spent

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<v Speaker 2>a small fortune on beef. I Phillip to make beef

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<v Speaker 2>Wellington's because I wanted it to be a special meal,

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<v Speaker 2>as I may not be able to host a lunch

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<v Speaker 2>like this again for some time. It's important me that

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<v Speaker 2>you're all there tomorrow and that I have the conversations

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<v Speaker 2>I need to have. I hope you'll change your mind.

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<v Speaker 2>Your parents in Heather and Ian are coming at twelve thirty.

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<v Speaker 2>I hope to see you there.

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<v Speaker 1>Here's what Nanette Rodgers asked on Friday, June sixth I.

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<v Speaker 5>Suggest that on the sixteenth of July twenty twenty three

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<v Speaker 5>that you lied to Simon saying that you had some

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<v Speaker 5>medical issues to discuss. Correct or incorrect?

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<v Speaker 2>No, that wasn't a lie.

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<v Speaker 5>You wrote quote it's important to me that you're all

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<v Speaker 5>there tomorrow and that I can have the conversations that

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<v Speaker 5>I need to have.

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<v Speaker 2>I did write that.

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<v Speaker 5>Is that a reference to the medical issues that you

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<v Speaker 5>were confronting.

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<v Speaker 2>It's a reference to medical things, yes, But.

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<v Speaker 5>You weren't confronting any medical issues, were you correct?

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<v Speaker 4>Ah?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, No, I think I was.

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<v Speaker 5>Yeah, And what were they?

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<v Speaker 2>I was going to have surgery soon?

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<v Speaker 5>What surgery?

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<v Speaker 2>The gastric bypass surgery?

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<v Speaker 5>And had that appointment been booked in I.

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<v Speaker 2>Had an appointment for early September, Yes, with who, the

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<v Speaker 2>Enriched Clinic in Melbourne.

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<v Speaker 5>And what was the date of the appointment.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't remember the exact date. I don't think it was.

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<v Speaker 2>The appointment was not the surgery itself, but like a

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<v Speaker 2>pre surgery appointment, if that makes sense.

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<v Speaker 1>But on Tuesday morning this week, when Patterson was being

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<v Speaker 1>cross examined by Prosecutor Nannett Rodgers, she was presented with

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<v Speaker 1>this statement from the Enriched Clinic.

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<v Speaker 4>The Enriched Clinic does not offer, and never has offered,

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<v Speaker 4>pre surgery assessments relating to gastric bypass surgery. The Enriched

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<v Speaker 4>Clinic only conducts examination relating to the skin and its

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<v Speaker 4>appendages such as hair and nails.

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<v Speaker 5>The Enriched Clinic does not offer gastric bypass surgery or

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<v Speaker 5>gastric sleeve surgery. Agree or disagree, I don't know. The

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<v Speaker 5>Enriched Clinic does not conduct assessments relating to gastric bypass

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<v Speaker 5>surgery or gastric sleeve surgery. Agree or disagree, I don't know.

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<v Speaker 2>But I'm a bit puzzled in what way well that was?

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<v Speaker 2>I had an appointment with them, and that's what my

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<v Speaker 2>memory is that the appointment was for. So that's why

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<v Speaker 2>I'm puzzled.

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<v Speaker 1>Rogers put it to Patterson that the appointment she told

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<v Speaker 1>the jury about had nothing to do with gastric bypass surgery.

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<v Speaker 1>Patterson said, well, it would have been related to weight

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<v Speaker 1>loss surgery. Perhaps it was a different procedure. I was

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<v Speaker 1>doing through them, and I was looking into life per

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<v Speaker 1>suction as well.

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<v Speaker 5>When you gave sworn evidence to this jury last Friday

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<v Speaker 5>that you had a pre surgery appointment for gastric bypass

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<v Speaker 5>surgery booked for early September with the Enriched Clinic in Melbourne,

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<v Speaker 5>that was a lie. Agree or disagree?

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<v Speaker 2>No, it wasn't a lie. That's what my memory was.

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<v Speaker 1>On Thursday June twelve, Colin Mandy asked this in re examination.

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<v Speaker 3>Now, can I just confirm with you your interactions with

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<v Speaker 3>the Enriched Clinic. On the nineteenth of April you made

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<v Speaker 3>a voice call to the Enriched Clinic and then again

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<v Speaker 3>you contacted the Enriched Clinic on the thirty first of

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<v Speaker 3>May twenty twenty three. What did you know then when

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<v Speaker 3>you made those phone calls or contacted the clinic on

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<v Speaker 3>those days about the services that the Enriched Clinic offered I.

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<v Speaker 2>Was under the understanding that they offered treatments concerning weight loss,

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<v Speaker 2>and I believed that to be surgeries like gastric bypass

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<v Speaker 2>and other things like liposuction and anywhere in between.

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<v Speaker 3>Now, the records you saw yesterday confirmed that you had

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<v Speaker 3>an appointment with Enrich on the thirteenth of September twenty

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<v Speaker 3>twenty three, and you described that in your evidence as

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<v Speaker 3>a pre surgery appointment, right, What did you mean by that?

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<v Speaker 1>So?

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<v Speaker 2>What I meant was so I hadn't actually had an

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<v Speaker 2>in person consultation within Rich yet that was going to

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<v Speaker 2>be my first one. And my understanding was that we

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<v Speaker 2>would discuss my needs, what treatments they could offer, what

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<v Speaker 2>would suit me, and schedule that in.

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<v Speaker 3>Did you ever have a consultation with him?

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<v Speaker 2>I never ended up having one, though I canceled that.

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<v Speaker 1>Mandy then tended a statement on the Enriched Clinic's website.

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<v Speaker 4>Enrich Clinic has moved to s the era as of

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<v Speaker 4>January twenty twenty five. As of the thirtieth of June

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<v Speaker 4>twenty twenty four, doctor Rich will not be offering liposuction

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<v Speaker 4>as a treatment option to our patients.

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<v Speaker 3>And what was your understanding about what was being offered

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<v Speaker 3>by Enriched Clinic as at July of twenty twenty three.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, I understood them to be offering liposuction, and I

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<v Speaker 2>also believed they offered the full range of weight loss

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<v Speaker 2>surgery treatments like the bypass and this leeve. I think

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<v Speaker 2>there are two different types of things.

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<v Speaker 3>But why did you cancel the appointment?

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<v Speaker 2>It was a difficult time. Yeah, it was in a

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<v Speaker 2>very difficult time.

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<v Speaker 3>And do you accept now from this material that you

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<v Speaker 3>were mistaken about the fact that Enriched Clinic offered gastric

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<v Speaker 3>bypass surgery?

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<v Speaker 2>Yes, I was obviously mistaken. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>Colin Mandy also took Erin Patterson to some questions about

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<v Speaker 1>her children, and in answering, Patterson sounded emotional. In cross

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<v Speaker 1>Examinationnnette Rodgers asked Patterson about why she attended Lean and

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<v Speaker 1>Gath the hospital on Monday, July thirty one, two days

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<v Speaker 1>after the lunch, but left against medical advice, telling doctors

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<v Speaker 1>she had to go home and feed her animals and

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<v Speaker 1>attend to things for her children. Rogers asked this.

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<v Speaker 5>You didn't need to go home and pack your daughter's

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<v Speaker 5>ballet bag. Correct?

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<v Speaker 2>Incorrect?

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<v Speaker 5>Your daughter didn't even have bali on Mondays, did she

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<v Speaker 5>she did.

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<v Speaker 2>She had a rehearsal that afternoon and Simon had to

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<v Speaker 2>cancel it.

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<v Speaker 5>Where do you say the rehearsal was.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't remember where it was, but it was a

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<v Speaker 2>rehearsal for an upcoming media concert. So there was some

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<v Speaker 2>special extra lessons they had, and they had one on

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<v Speaker 2>that Monday afternoon evening, and I'd ask Simon to ringle

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<v Speaker 2>Suppelling studio and cancel it, which he told me to do, sorry,

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<v Speaker 2>which he told me he did do.

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<v Speaker 5>Weren't her rehearsals held on weekends.

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<v Speaker 2>Some were, But somewhere on the Monday night afternoon, I

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<v Speaker 2>can't remember what time it was.

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<v Speaker 1>On Thursday June twelve, Mandy took Patterson back to this,

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<v Speaker 1>showing her a text message from Simon sent on the

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<v Speaker 1>day in question, saying he'd left a message on Lisa

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<v Speaker 1>Pellan's studio's phone.

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<v Speaker 3>What did you understand, Simon to be meaning by those messages?

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<v Speaker 2>So Lisa Pellin Studios was the name of my daughter's

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<v Speaker 2>ballet studio. I understood that he was canceling her attendance

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<v Speaker 2>that night, as I'd asked him to do.

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<v Speaker 1>Coming up the final propositions the Crown put to Aaron Patterson.

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<v Speaker 1>In the final moments of a cross examination, Rogers put

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<v Speaker 1>to Patterson these suggestions, leading off with why Patterson handed

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<v Speaker 1>a phone to police that was not her primary device.

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<v Speaker 1>Patterson has repeatedly said she changed devices after the lunch

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<v Speaker 1>because she was concerned about the behavior of her husband, Simon,

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<v Speaker 1>whom she says had accused her of poisoning his parents.

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<v Speaker 1>She is agreed she handed police a phone known as

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<v Speaker 1>Phone B, but not Phone A, her primary device. She

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<v Speaker 1>said she believed police didn't ask for Phone A. She

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<v Speaker 1>also agreed she conducted three factory resets of Phone B,

0:13:30.200 --> 0:13:33.079
<v Speaker 1>including once after it was in a detective's locker at

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<v Speaker 1>one Thaggy police station. Here's how it went in cross examination.

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<v Speaker 5>I suggest to you that all of this conduct, the

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<v Speaker 5>factory resetting of Phone B, handing it to police, and

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<v Speaker 5>telling them your phone number ended in eight three five.

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<v Speaker 5>This was all about hiding the contents of your usual

0:13:50.440 --> 0:13:52.040
<v Speaker 5>mobile phone, Phone.

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<v Speaker 2>A, incorrect.

0:13:53.840 --> 0:13:58.040
<v Speaker 5>I suggest you deliberately concealed Phone A from police. Disagree,

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<v Speaker 5>And you did so because you knew that the data

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<v Speaker 5>on that device would incriminate you agree or disagree?

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<v Speaker 2>Disagree?

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<v Speaker 5>Now you'll be pleased to know I've got three final questions.

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<v Speaker 5>I suggest that you deliberately source Deathcap mushrooms in twenty

0:14:11.400 --> 0:14:16.560
<v Speaker 5>twenty three. Agree or disagree disagree. I suggest you deliberately

0:14:16.559 --> 0:14:19.440
<v Speaker 5>included them in the beef wellingtons you served to Don Patterson,

0:14:19.760 --> 0:14:25.040
<v Speaker 5>Gail Patterson, Ian Wilkinson and Heather Wilkinson Agree or disagree disagree,

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<v Speaker 5>and you did so intending to kill them. Agree or

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<v Speaker 5>disagree disagree? Thank you. I have no further questions.

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<v Speaker 1>The trial continues and you can follow our coverage live

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<v Speaker 1>at the Australian dot com dot au