Speaker 1: The public has had a long held fascination with detectives.
Speaker 1: Detective sy a side of life the average person is
Speaker 1: never exposed to. I spent thirty four years as a cop.
Speaker 1: For twenty five of those years I was catching killers.
Speaker 1: That's what I did for a living. I was a
Speaker 1: homicide detective. I'm no longer just interviewing bad guys. Instead,
Speaker 1: I'm taking the public into the world in which I operated.
Speaker 1: The guests I talk to each week have amazing stories
Speaker 1: from all sides of the law. The interviews are raw
Speaker 1: and honest, just like the people I talk to. Some
Speaker 1: of the content and language might be confronting. That's because
Speaker 1: no one who comes into contact with crime is left unchanged.
Speaker 1: Join me now as I take you into this world.
Speaker 1: Peter Lyndon James, welcome back to part two of my
Speaker 1: Catch Killers.
Speaker 2: Thank you as you'd be back well.
Speaker 1: I got to say in part one, hearing your story
Speaker 1: in the way you articulate it in so much detail,
Speaker 1: you've virtually took me on the journey you've been through,
Speaker 1: and it's pretty heavy what you've been through. For those
Speaker 1: that didn't hear Part one, Peter told us about his life,
Speaker 1: there was a lot of pain and problems in his childhood,
Speaker 1: his parents separated, he ended up in the detention centers
Speaker 1: from the age of nine. Basically, and the whole thing,
Speaker 1: all the theme I picked up, Peter. The whole time
Speaker 1: you just wanted to be loved by your mum or
Speaker 1: your dad, and you felt like you'd have been abandoned,
Speaker 1: and that put your life on a path that led
Speaker 1: to drugs, crime and everything else in between. We finished
Speaker 1: off part one and you were talking about this was
Speaker 1: the moment that, after all this time, twenty six years,
Speaker 1: have been a slave to your addictions and hating yourself,
Speaker 1: hating the world, you had an epiphany. I would say.
Speaker 1: You described meeting three random people on one particular afternoon
Speaker 1: and all three of them steering you towards God and
Speaker 1: a better life. For whatever reason, that seemed to resonate
Speaker 1: with you got you at the right time. Do you
Speaker 1: want to take it from there, Peter.
Speaker 2: Yeah, mate. So basically, after that encounter with three people,
Speaker 2: end up getting home and I and I said to
Speaker 2: the missions, I can't do this anymore, and I just
Speaker 2: grabbed my wife or grabbed my kids, chumped in the
Speaker 2: car and we drove around. I ended up booking our hotel,
Speaker 2: and I just wanted to get away from my house
Speaker 2: and all that crap. And I went to sleep and
Speaker 2: I woke up three o'clock in the morning and I
Speaker 2: had a dream, I mean my dream, and I heard
Speaker 2: God tell me its Peter, I've got a plan and
Speaker 2: a purpose for your life. And I remember just the
Speaker 2: same feeling I felt when I was sixteen in Riverbank.
Speaker 2: His presidence was all over me. I wake my messas up.
Speaker 2: So I just had a dream from God. You like, whatever,
Speaker 2: that's nice, rolls over, goes back to sleep. But anyway,
Speaker 2: when we wake up in the morning, it was a
Speaker 2: Sunday morning. It was actually September the eleventh. But I
Speaker 2: said to Missus, I said, we've got to go to church.
Speaker 2: She goes what I said, We've got to go to church.
Speaker 2: I ain't never been no church. Well I got church.
Speaker 2: I had got dressed up, She got dressed ug other kids,
Speaker 2: and we drive around looking for a church. And I
Speaker 2: spent there the all day looking for church. And every
Speaker 2: time I put it in a church, I heard this voice,
Speaker 2: not that one. I went to Freeman, I went Armadah,
Speaker 2: went to Golds and there's all these different churches and
Speaker 2: I didn't know which one was which. And then Morley,
Speaker 2: I'll come up and cried Mere Street and Morley and
Speaker 2: I a quarter to five, and I heard a voice
Speaker 2: in my head saying that one. So I went up
Speaker 2: walking into this church. Part me car up, walked out
Speaker 2: the front doors, and the kids went that way, and
Speaker 2: we went this way and because I've got this king's
Speaker 2: kid's church thinking, and I walked in the second I
Speaker 2: walked in, Mate, I was shaking, crying, and his preacher
Speaker 2: was preaching. He says, how dear that I'm circumcised Philistine
Speaker 2: to fire the armies a living God. And I was like, mate,
Speaker 2: And then he gave this older carps and for those
Speaker 2: who want your life to change and come out, and
Speaker 2: I made. I was up the front and a half
Speaker 2: a second flat. My wife come with him because she
Speaker 2: didn't want to be left in the seat. When I
Speaker 2: asked Christ in my heart, and I'm telling him from
Speaker 2: that day forward, I changed. I heard his big voice again.
Speaker 2: It says, Peter, I want you to give up everything
Speaker 2: you own and follow me. And oh my god, I
Speaker 2: was a mess. I was on bail for handguns powder
Speaker 2: part and I nod old drive out a lot all
Speaker 2: this stuff. I literally went out to Ginger and Carrying Park,
Speaker 2: about an hour and a half out of Perth. I
Speaker 2: moved in the carrivan park. I gave away everything that
Speaker 2: I owned, all all the stuff I WoT with drug
Speaker 2: buddy and cars and bikes, and I got out of
Speaker 2: the house and I detoxed myself over probably two months,
Speaker 2: and i'd go in down to Perth to go to court,
Speaker 2: that i'd go back home again and I just slept
Speaker 2: and I wrote my first part of my life down
Speaker 2: in dot Point. And anyway, fast forward ay and I
Speaker 2: having to go back to jail. I got four months
Speaker 2: in prison, went to jail. I spent a couple months
Speaker 2: in Casah Casuna, then went to Carnett And then when
Speaker 2: I was in jail, I felt led to go to
Speaker 2: Bible College. I went to sixteen different schools myself. I
Speaker 2: don't even made grade six. I can't even read running
Speaker 2: writing mate, but I felt I had to go to
Speaker 2: this Bible college. So one particular one stood out. I
Speaker 2: went to start a Bible College, and yeah, I ended
Speaker 2: up doing three years Bible College, done for a ministry
Speaker 2: diploma in theology and advanced to Plombing in theology. I
Speaker 2: started a business. When I started a Bible college, I
Speaker 2: started doing normal stuff. And three years of Bible College
Speaker 2: finished in two thousand and five, and then I've become
Speaker 2: a full time volunteer up at a Kasha prison as
Speaker 2: a volunteer chaplain. I remember the first time I walked
Speaker 2: in a Kaisha prison when I'd seen all these fellows
Speaker 2: I grew up with, and I say, Lindon James, what
Speaker 2: are you doing here? Brother? And I got the keys,
Speaker 2: you know. But I spent five months, five years in there,
Speaker 2: three days a week, going around trying to disciple people
Speaker 2: and help them change their life, like they changed mind.
Speaker 2: But I've seen Casha prison go from four hundred to
Speaker 2: seven hundred prisoners I wrent over over a period a
Speaker 2: few years. Today it's two thousand and two hundred plus prisoners.
Speaker 2: But everything that happened to meet like a child. They
Speaker 2: were going in our, in our, in our, in our.
Speaker 2: In twenty ten, I finished the prison and then I
Speaker 2: become a full time volunteer, so I had no income.
Speaker 2: I thought now that I've done twenty six years in
Speaker 2: prisons institutions, I've done three years of Bible College, I've
Speaker 2: done five years as a prison chaplain. I wanted to
Speaker 2: try and see how I can put all that to
Speaker 2: use and help people change your life in a way
Speaker 2: that I could do it, because everything I've seen is
Speaker 2: not working. Everyone is on a different page, the Sites accouncilors,
Speaker 2: the Department of Justice, the government. So I thought, OK,
Speaker 2: I'll buy a house. I spent two and a half
Speaker 2: years from two thousand and ten to twenty twelve, floating
Speaker 2: around all the different rehabs, taking people to rehabs and
Speaker 2: seeing rehabs take them from an illegal drug to a
Speaker 2: legal drug that would take him off the speed, to
Speaker 2: the antidepressants, and dishing out value like lollies.
Speaker 1: So Peter, at that time in your life, like you
Speaker 1: talk the prison and then your studies and then as
Speaker 1: a prison chaplain, and then you wanted to make a difference,
Speaker 1: and you're going to we finished off or we talked
Speaker 1: a little bit about how to take the prison out
Speaker 1: of the prisoners. Were you seeing the addictions? Like where
Speaker 1: you're steering towards? Is that what you wanted to do?
Speaker 1: You wanted to help people with addictions so you could
Speaker 1: break that cycle.
Speaker 2: No, I wanted to do I was trying to work
Speaker 2: out what the root cause of it is. I mean,
Speaker 2: why they are like they are. But the addiction is
Speaker 2: just the mask that helps them to copeing to live life.
Speaker 2: And so it is the addiction. And so I floated
Speaker 2: down all these different rehabs. I'd volunteer on the streets
Speaker 2: and yeah, I just seen a massive need. I'd take
Speaker 2: them to these rehabs. And like I said, that just
Speaker 2: take them from a legal drug to a legal drug.
Speaker 2: They think that Sarah Paks, the metazepine, the value, the
Speaker 2: xanax and all this stuff would help them, but it
Speaker 2: doesn't help them their addicts. I mean, they want the
Speaker 2: kick and the chemical.
Speaker 1: Do you think taking them from the legal drugs putting
Speaker 1: illegal drugs, put them on the legal drugs is just
Speaker 1: masking the problem and setting them up to.
Speaker 2: We're taking heroin addicts off a heroin and we put
Speaker 2: them a methodone on the box own and we're chaining
Speaker 2: them to a chemist and they're going to go to
Speaker 2: the chemists every day for the seven dollar dose where
Speaker 2: we reduce the crime rate. But we're just legally dishing
Speaker 2: out heroin, right, call it the box, call it methadone.
Speaker 2: Where we're legally dishing that out their teeth, the riding
Speaker 2: their bones, that calcium that live at their organs. I mean,
Speaker 2: there's not one person. I've got one hundred and sixty
Speaker 2: people in Shulam that lived me from one to three years,
Speaker 2: and not one person is on any medication at all
Speaker 2: in any way, shape or form. I've got to take them.
Speaker 2: I've got to take the medication of to deal with
Speaker 2: the root cause of the issue.
Speaker 1: Okay, so that's that's the approach. Okay, Shallam house. When
Speaker 1: did that concept come in that you're going to When
Speaker 1: did the name come in? When did it you decide
Speaker 1: to set up?
Speaker 2: So twenty twelve, I just spent two and a half
Speaker 2: years doing all this voluntary stuff and I drove past
Speaker 2: bandyat Woman's prison. There was a house for sale, and
Speaker 2: I own my own house. I lived around the corner.
Speaker 2: My wife was running a guarding business, and I went
Speaker 2: to look at this house and I thought, well, maybe
Speaker 2: I could just buy my own house and put fellas
Speaker 2: in that and just do it my way and have
Speaker 2: a crack at it. And so I bought this house
Speaker 2: and I started with a few fellas and I just
Speaker 2: started discipling them. But it wasn't until I bought the
Speaker 2: house and put the fellows in the house that I
Speaker 2: realized that I started to have rules and no phone,
Speaker 2: no TV, no blend of work, and by better just evolved. So, yeah,
Speaker 2: I bought a house.
Speaker 1: What you're doing there, Peter, and just so people can understand,
Speaker 1: and you lived it, but just breaking it down, You've
Speaker 1: got yourself out of the prison. You've you've broken the cycle,
Speaker 1: you've cleared the addiction, you've studied, you've worked in the
Speaker 1: worked in the prison, you've seen the house, you bought it,
Speaker 1: and you want to help people break break these addictions,
Speaker 1: so you bring them in. And then it was you
Speaker 1: were virtually using your experience from your studies and life experience,
Speaker 1: going Okay, that's not working. We're going to get them
Speaker 1: to get rid of their phones. We've got to do this.
Speaker 1: We're going to Is that is that? Is that how
Speaker 1: it evolved?
Speaker 2: Yeah, but that's how evolved. So I ended up developing
Speaker 2: a five stage program over the course of probably six
Speaker 2: seven years. But as I developed the stages, you know,
Speaker 2: I mean it's like stage one, two, three, four, five,
Speaker 2: the numbers grew. I went from four to seven, seven
Speaker 2: to nine, then nine to sixteen, and they and the
Speaker 2: systems and structures you need. When you get sixteen and
Speaker 2: then you go to thirty, you've got to change. And
Speaker 2: so the more you get, the more you got to implement.
Speaker 2: So now stage now it's thirteendars late. I've got one
Speaker 2: hundred and sixty.
Speaker 1: How did you get those people in the first place?
Speaker 1: How did those people come to you?
Speaker 2: I was like the pied pipe. I don't advertise. I've
Speaker 2: never advertised. I just started discipling people. I call it discipling,
Speaker 2: and they just kept coming. I've never they just kept coming.
Speaker 1: Discipling in a religious sense or discipling it just in
Speaker 1: the practice in a living life.
Speaker 2: So originally I called it. Someone says to me, right,
Speaker 2: it says, what are you going to call it? And
Speaker 2: I probably shot myself with this football calling it shalom.
Speaker 2: But back in nineteen ninety nine, I was, like I said,
Speaker 2: I was doing sixteen days no sleep, looping out. But
Speaker 2: I remember I was walking down Savannahs on the coast
Speaker 2: and I walked into the caravan park and his old
Speaker 2: dude there and he had this word shalom on the
Speaker 2: on the caravan and he made me a cup of
Speaker 2: coffee and we had a chat, but I always maybe the
Speaker 2: name of Shaalob. And two in two thousand and twelve,
Speaker 2: two thy thirteen, someone says, what are you going to
Speaker 2: call it? You've got to give it a name. I
Speaker 2: had the name Shalam, So I googled. I managed to
Speaker 2: do it. You googled what does what does shalom mean?
Speaker 2: It's the fullness of everything that we as human beings
Speaker 2: should a spider be. And so I called the place
Speaker 2: Shalom discipleship house, and discipleship and means mentoring. It's coming alongside,
Speaker 2: and so coming alongside, I had to teach about it.
Speaker 2: You take away their coping mechanism, the drugs and the substances.
Speaker 2: They've got to learn how to communicate, express how they feel,
Speaker 2: deal with life problems, finances, car, employment, whole heap of stuff.
Speaker 2: It's not just a matter of taking away that their
Speaker 2: brains haven't matured properly. My brain didn't mature properly, and
Speaker 2: so I just discipled people.
Speaker 1: Okay, So it's a complicated situation, isn't And we're speaking
Speaker 1: to people that would not have any experience that what
Speaker 1: goes on in these rehab centers, Like do they just
Speaker 1: get locked in the room, and yeah, the perception is
Speaker 1: go cold turkey. But there's a lot too, a lot
Speaker 1: to be considered. Can you tell us one story just
Speaker 1: it can be a combination of people that come through
Speaker 1: your program. Just talk us through the stages that someone
Speaker 1: goes through when they're trying to break this addiction in
Speaker 1: Shallam House.
Speaker 2: Okay, so we don't actually have one program for everybody.
Speaker 2: Everybody has their own program, individual program. And so the
Speaker 2: first stage one and we put four stars next to
Speaker 2: their name and they're paired up with another resident and
Speaker 2: that we pair them up because they could be detoxing
Speaker 2: off of alcohol or drugs or substantus. And so wherever
Speaker 2: they go they're paired up to stop and picking up
Speaker 2: cigarette butts, et cetera. But over that four weeks we
Speaker 2: have lots of different departments. Our mentoring department will do
Speaker 2: it with their family history is the mum, dad, brothers
Speaker 2: and sisters, uncles and narnis. They might have four kids
Speaker 2: to the first wife, two kids to the second wife,
Speaker 2: and that shows us where all the damage has been caused.
Speaker 1: So you're breaking down a person's life and going literally, okay,
Speaker 1: well look at what you got going on here? Is
Speaker 1: a bigger thing than just the addiction. You've got all
Speaker 1: these issues in your life, and that's the type of
Speaker 1: stuff you're looking at.
Speaker 2: Yeah, the whole family. We've got to identify mum and dad.
Speaker 2: They've split up when they were a kid, step mom,
Speaker 2: and everywhere they've done damage because we need to repair
Speaker 2: all that structure, not just the person. When we take
Speaker 2: the person in, we also take on all the family.
Speaker 2: So over that first four weeks, my counseling department, along
Speaker 2: with my psych we'll map that out. And then I
Speaker 2: have a finances team and everyone graduates SHALLYM one hundred
Speaker 2: percent debt free will manage what their finances are. It
Speaker 2: could be a car, they're paying off a mortgage, they
Speaker 2: have loans. We want to freezle them, so we want
Speaker 2: to see what their financial history is.
Speaker 1: Can I just slay you down just on that. So
Speaker 1: I'm seeing that you're looking at. It's not just the addiction,
Speaker 1: it's their life, like the home. You might clean someone
Speaker 1: up from heroin, but then they go out and they
Speaker 1: are one hundred thousand dollars to the bank or whatever,
Speaker 1: and they're just going to collapse again.
Speaker 2: So that's great.
Speaker 1: It's a holistic approach to helping these people.
Speaker 2: That's correact. So you've got the family, then you've got
Speaker 2: the financial situation, and then you've got the general could
Speaker 2: be a car on the side of the road, it
Speaker 2: could be a house that needs cleaned up, something that
Speaker 2: needs to be fixed, and put the rest so they
Speaker 2: can focus on the rest of the rehab and also
Speaker 2: direction what do you want to do with your life?
Speaker 2: So over the first three months we find out what
Speaker 2: do they want to do with their life, We find
Speaker 2: out what their financial history is, what of the general
Speaker 2: stuff is, and all the family where's all the mess
Speaker 2: because generally when they come to us, no one wants
Speaker 2: anything to do with them. They're all homeless, and so
Speaker 2: over the course of the program, when they get the
Speaker 2: Stage two part of the program, which is generally after
Speaker 2: three months, every resident is eligible for two days a
Speaker 2: week paid work with an employer on the same pages
Speaker 2: of the rehab. And so we have hundreds of employers
Speaker 2: that we interview and we ask the employer to take
Speaker 2: an active part in the residence employment. In other words,
Speaker 2: don't stick them with somebody else who's using drugs and substances,
Speaker 2: don't put them with somebody else where they're doing. We
Speaker 2: want you to put them someone who's going to speak
Speaker 2: life into them. And we can tell when we give
Speaker 2: our residents and we set them about two days a
Speaker 2: week paid work, we can tell if they're putting into
Speaker 2: practice what they've learned by our feedback from the employer.
Speaker 2: And we can also tell if the workplace is having
Speaker 2: a positive negative effect on the resident by their attitude
Speaker 2: back in the house.
Speaker 1: So the thing you're looking for there, per they're just
Speaker 1: a gain. So I understand that two days a week.
Speaker 1: After three months they get two days a week, you
Speaker 1: can find them paid work. You've got employers that have said, okay,
Speaker 1: we'll take people. It might be a builder, it might
Speaker 1: be a builder or whatever. But you look out that
Speaker 1: you don't get a black that's just come off years
Speaker 1: of drug abuse teamed up with someone working in the
Speaker 1: building site that likes a smoker at lunchtime.
Speaker 2: We don't have all that. We're pretty strict.
Speaker 1: We make sure filter it through.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so we've got everybody on the same page.
Speaker 1: Okay.
Speaker 2: So and right from the beginning when they come in
Speaker 2: the program, and we have an extremely strong focus on
Speaker 2: reintegration and resocialization, and so our program basically is no
Speaker 2: different than you living your life. It's literally it's no different.
Speaker 2: You get up in the morning, you cook, you clean,
Speaker 2: you have your breakfast, you do your dishes, you go
Speaker 2: to work. You work from Monday to Friday, nine to five,
Speaker 2: and when you come home, you clean your house, you
Speaker 2: do your dishes, and you go to bed. And that's
Speaker 2: our program. We work. We don't sit people in a
Speaker 2: class and filling the floor this head knowledge. We're ninety
Speaker 2: percent of it's just doney paper. You're not going to work.
Speaker 2: We actually live life together.
Speaker 1: And you call it reintegration and resocialization.
Speaker 2: Basically, without reintegration and resocialization, rehabilitation doesn't work.
Speaker 1: Okay, breat break that down again. Let's just process that
Speaker 1: without without.
Speaker 2: Reintegration and resocialization and rehabilitation doesn't work.
Speaker 1: Okay.
Speaker 2: I mean, because you're taking away a person's coping mechanism,
Speaker 2: you've got to teach them how to cope using different tools.
Speaker 2: You've got to teach them how to hang around geeks
Speaker 2: and normal people doing normal stuff. You've got to condition
Speaker 2: them to work Monday to Friday, nine to five, and
Speaker 2: you've got a condition to do normal activities on Saturdays,
Speaker 2: like go and kick a ball or play hockey or sports,
Speaker 2: or even during the week we go soccer. So we've
Speaker 2: got to do normal stuff. Saturdays Sundays we go to church.
Speaker 2: Now we don't go to one particular church. We go
Speaker 2: to all these different churches. And the reason we go
Speaker 2: to all these different churches is because we have one
Speaker 2: hundred and sixty people, and that shouldn't be one church
Speaker 2: fits all. I'm not going to push religion down people's throats.
Speaker 2: I don't care if they come in an atheist and
Speaker 2: leave atheists, or come in a Muslim and leave a Muslim.
Speaker 2: There's no relationships at Shalam. But the church side of it,
Speaker 2: we could go one. We could go to Pentecostal church,
Speaker 2: or you had this other one where they're just up
Speaker 2: on band. They've got this big band going off and
Speaker 2: his guitar and they're sitting on the half around. I think, man,
Speaker 2: don't your face gets out or the following. He could
Speaker 2: be one could be Catholic, Anglican, Pentecostal, Protestant. But it's
Speaker 2: not just about the face side of it. What they
Speaker 2: teach is love and honesty and all that. But it's
Speaker 2: not just to me. It's rent it's having conversations with
Speaker 2: normal people. So when we rock up at a bus
Speaker 2: with one hundred people and go to these churches, everyone's
Speaker 2: got to split up and they're going to find a geek,
Speaker 2: and they're going to have so much conversation with a geek.
Speaker 2: And when they start having conversations with the geeks, they
Speaker 2: find that the geeks are just as screwed up as
Speaker 2: what they are, or they've changed their life, I mean.
Speaker 2: And that's why we do lots of voluntary We do
Speaker 2: run for a reason, fun runs. We make sure that
Speaker 2: all of our residents come from the back of the pack.
Speaker 2: We don't want to rent the waste, We want to
Speaker 2: come behind those and supporting them. We do a lot
Speaker 2: of community car parking and volunteer stuff. So it's all reintegration,
Speaker 2: re socialization around normal people doing normal stuff, living a
Speaker 2: normal life.
Speaker 1: And are you you're following that philosophy and that template
Speaker 1: to get them in? Is that what you had to
Speaker 1: realize about yourself? You lost that ability And I know
Speaker 1: when we talked in part one, you said you could
Speaker 1: land anywhere, but you fell back into your kind because
Speaker 1: you didn't feel comfortable talking to the geeks as you
Speaker 1: call them.
Speaker 2: Yeah. When I started Bible College and there's one particular fellow.
Speaker 2: And when I started Bible College, I remember walking in
Speaker 2: there and this fellow went to come up and give
Speaker 2: me a cuddle, pull back, cracking one. It's like, but
Speaker 2: as a Christian thing, I want to cuddle in there.
Speaker 2: I all this stuff. And I spent three years sitting
Speaker 2: at the back of the class. And when I couldn't
Speaker 2: feel like them, I spent four years walking in that
Speaker 2: church and I had to volunteer and doing the search
Speaker 2: service on the weekend, and I just kept saying, man,
Speaker 2: I can't be like them. I can't be like them.
Speaker 2: I don't want to be like them. And we about
Speaker 2: three years later. It's like gun on chechs when you
Speaker 2: want to go my kids working in garing to kids shirts.
Speaker 2: Amanda was volunteering, and it was one day when I
Speaker 2: just said I can't be like them, I don't want
Speaker 2: to be like them. I heard a voice again. I says,
Speaker 2: I didn't ask you to be them. Oh thank God.
Speaker 2: So what you say is what you get, and it's
Speaker 2: just like but it was. It was. It was reintegration
Speaker 2: and resocialization, doing normal stuff, volunteering your time, and not
Speaker 2: expecting anything in return, and making a difference in other
Speaker 2: people's lives, not being so selfish about what you can
Speaker 2: get for your own.
Speaker 1: I get it. But the way I'm looking at the
Speaker 1: way you're describing it's a very holistic, holistic approach that
Speaker 1: you're hitting all the different points. What's the average time
Speaker 1: people go into your program before they come out come
Speaker 1: out in a state where they're fit to be back
Speaker 1: in society.
Speaker 2: They're actually back in society for the day they come in,
Speaker 2: or from four weeks up they come in. So if
Speaker 2: you pitch when a person comes in and there's a skill,
Speaker 2: there's one, two, three, four five. When they first come in,
Speaker 2: I take one hundred percent control of their life. I
Speaker 2: work out what their family structure is, I work out
Speaker 2: what their finances are, I work out what the general
Speaker 2: and alsay what they want to do with their life.
Speaker 2: When they get after the four weeks, i've got that plan.
Speaker 2: I give them back control nineteen percent. No longer are
Speaker 2: they being shadowed. And when they get to stage two,
Speaker 2: I give them back another twenty percent. In stage three,
Speaker 2: another twenty percent.
Speaker 1: What do they get for stage two?
Speaker 2: Stage two you get two days a week paid work.
Speaker 2: You get a home leave every three months, and you
Speaker 2: start getting put into leadership positions and stuff. Stage three
Speaker 2: you get to have a phone and you get your
Speaker 2: car back. You can come and go off the property.
Speaker 2: You're out extended hours. That's nomal truck a lot of
Speaker 2: it's got more trust and you're in a leadership position.
Speaker 2: Stage four. And so every stage you go from two
Speaker 2: days a week, Stage two, three days a week, Stage three,
Speaker 2: four days week, Stage four, five weeks, Stage five, and
Speaker 2: then you move off site after you stage five to
Speaker 2: graduate and give you the idea of the finances side right,
Speaker 2: and when we back out a person's life and we
Speaker 2: actually create a MyGov number for every resident, and over
Speaker 2: the three month stage up to the stage three we
Speaker 2: consolidate taxation, superneration, child support, medicare, We put it all
Speaker 2: into the MyGov number. We also consolidate all this superneration
Speaker 2: from all these different accounts into one account. We get
Speaker 2: everyone's taxation all up to date, so SUUP has done,
Speaker 2: taxation has done, is medicare done. And by the time
Speaker 2: we get the stage three the program, we hand them
Speaker 2: back the MyGov number and we've literally fixed up the
Speaker 2: whole financial history everybody, everybody it comes through Shalom, they graduate,
Speaker 2: they all are one hundred percent debt free. We get
Speaker 2: every resident off of centill It within four months. Centrall
Speaker 2: it was set up by a government for people in
Speaker 2: short term needs of crisis, not for people to live
Speaker 2: off a bloodshof. But we literally get everybody off essentially
Speaker 2: within four months and all they ever pay is round
Speaker 2: the bucks.
Speaker 1: A thousand questions. I've got the finance to run something
Speaker 1: like this, whether it's the finance has come for you.
Speaker 1: I know there's a lot of volunteer work and that,
Speaker 1: but there's costs associated with what you're talking about here.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so people probably would believe the scale of Shalom.
Speaker 2: So we've got two centers or two and a half centers,
Speaker 2: one in Cavalry, one in Perth, and the Perth is
Speaker 2: split up over probably six and seven different properties, so
Speaker 2: one hundred and sixty residents. Men's program, a women's program,
Speaker 2: and also a families program. So when girls get six
Speaker 2: months into the program, the children come in and join them,
Speaker 2: and most residents are with us on an average between
Speaker 2: one year and three years.
Speaker 1: Okay, long time, in a long time.
Speaker 2: You can't again because you've got you've got to do
Speaker 2: the rehabilitation to integration. And the good thing about Shalim
Speaker 2: is I look back at my life and if all
Speaker 2: of those people who had the skills and knowledge to
Speaker 2: help me change my life work together, my life would
Speaker 2: have changed. And well, I've done at Shalom. I'm a
Speaker 2: facilitator of other people's gifts. I have my own child psychologists, psychologists, counselors, psychiatrists,
Speaker 2: and I just facilitate. And the only people I'm missing
Speaker 2: to get on board now is the Justice Department, the
Speaker 2: Corrective Services Department and the prison's department. If I can
Speaker 2: get them three on side, I've got the circle and
Speaker 2: I can make a massive differences, not just within the
Speaker 2: prison system and of course system.
Speaker 1: Those three government departments shown interest or is there any negotiations?
Speaker 2: Yeah, Well, a couple of weeks back, I had the
Speaker 2: Police Commisioner and also the Corrective Services Minister, and I've
Speaker 2: told them what I need on board, and so they
Speaker 2: said they're putting together where I'm going to come in
Speaker 2: and do a presentations, but they're going to get the
Speaker 2: Chief Justice. See, we get the Chief Justice and I'll
Speaker 2: just do another presentation to three of them. Hopefully we
Speaker 2: can start with a trial. Every department of Slum has
Speaker 2: policies procedures, standard operating procedures where registered Drug and Alcohol
Speaker 2: Agency in Australia, New Zealand and we've been ordered for years.
Speaker 2: We've got extremely high level governance. It's the work site
Speaker 2: for sal whole of Shalom, the officers as well as
Speaker 2: the work truck. So we have departments in the offices.
Speaker 2: Resident Care has four style ID services which gets everyone
Speaker 2: one hundred per points. I have eight IDA it gets
Speaker 2: two staff because most people don't come with an ID.
Speaker 2: The MIGUV department, so we're our own in house sentlling agency,
Speaker 2: so we look after all in centling on site. We
Speaker 2: don't have to go down to the sendling. And we
Speaker 2: also have the medical department which is as registers nurse.
Speaker 2: We have four people there and Finances department which gets
Speaker 2: everyone debt free. We have a program manager which oversees
Speaker 2: all that office and an office manager which sees oversees
Speaker 2: a program manager which oversees those offices. Then we have
Speaker 2: a separate department called Shalom Works. We have seventy vehicles, trucks, bobcats,
Speaker 2: so we have a mechanics business. We have a steal
Speaker 2: fabrication business, Hardscape, soft gates, fencing, painting, tiling, bob gating, limestone,
Speaker 2: and we also have an education department, so we do
Speaker 2: a lot of online training for mental health. We have
Speaker 2: teachers that help people go from year nine to year ten.
Speaker 2: We do a lot of online training with aveling helps
Speaker 2: from getting work at the heights and skilled tickets. We
Speaker 2: have a labor hire company we have and we use
Speaker 2: all these all these businesses. We don't make money. We
Speaker 2: make people.
Speaker 1: That's philosophy and.
Speaker 2: That's something we're not interested in money. And one of
Speaker 2: the challenges that I had being self employed, how do
Speaker 2: you integrate how do you integrate the quality of how
Speaker 2: do you integrate business and quality of workmanship while using
Speaker 2: people who come from a drug effective background, who have
Speaker 2: no skills. So all my trucks are paid staff member
Speaker 2: on it, and then every day we put four or
Speaker 2: five residents to each truck leader, so we could send
Speaker 2: out five, six, seven trucks and doing all different types
Speaker 2: of tasks. But it's not about making money. It's about
Speaker 2: teaching people. They teach him how to tile and paint,
Speaker 2: and so we asked the fellows that do a directions
Speaker 2: chat after two months, what do you want to do
Speaker 2: with your life? Do you want to be a baller
Speaker 2: maker Tyler Paynter Carvener and for those or you want
Speaker 2: to be an office admin. And so if you walked
Speaker 2: into my office now in that resident care my whole organization,
Speaker 2: I'm not joking Now almost are residents in the program
Speaker 2: or were residents in the program. The whole of the whole,
Speaker 2: of the whole of the organization is used to teach
Speaker 2: and equip and train the residents to find out what
Speaker 2: they want to do with the live and when they've
Speaker 2: found that, we empower them and get them jobs in
Speaker 2: the direction they want to go.
Speaker 1: So you've got one hundred and fifty hundred and sixty
Speaker 1: people in the program at the moment, that's correct. And
Speaker 1: how many people have in the program? How many people
Speaker 1: have you got supporting that program working?
Speaker 2: What do you mean both roughly supporting?
Speaker 1: You're in the program, but you've got psychologists there.
Speaker 2: They're talking about our chiatrists as the psychologists and the
Speaker 2: counselors there, they're obviously not residents, but everyone else is
Speaker 2: run by residents who have either been through the program,
Speaker 2: or who are in the program. In my offices, I move.
Speaker 2: I've moved my staff around every six weeks, so everyone
Speaker 2: knows everything.
Speaker 1: To get full understanding, is there any government subsidy that
Speaker 1: comes with your business?
Speaker 2: Oh no, we don't get any government funding. Or we're
Speaker 2: not actually sponsored by anybody. We are a register not
Speaker 2: for profit charity and we're a tax deductible charity. We
Speaker 2: have deja status and all that sort of stuff. But
Speaker 2: I even have a fundrational license where I can do raffles.
Speaker 2: But I've never asked for funding, never asked for a cent.
Speaker 2: I believe. I believe that the residents are where they
Speaker 2: are because of the decisions they made. They're the idiots
Speaker 2: that had fun doing what they did, and may I
Speaker 2: teach them to take responsibility for their actions and to
Speaker 2: pay for the entirety of their rehab. Right. Okay, every
Speaker 2: resident comes through SCHLAM, they leave one hundred percent debt free.
Speaker 2: They leave with a driver's license to the car. They're
Speaker 2: working full time with the employer on the same page
Speaker 2: of the rehab. Ninety percent of the family relationships have
Speaker 2: been restored. I mean, they're productors and members of the society.
Speaker 2: Cost nobody nothing but you can't do that in three months.
Speaker 2: It's like it's a big job.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's got to be a long, long process. How
Speaker 1: many people have you had come through the program since
Speaker 1: it's the inception.
Speaker 2: Yeah, hundreds hundreds. So we've been we've been keeping stats
Speaker 2: and figures. People say, well, what's a success rate? Well,
Speaker 2: I mean, if I could change one life right and
Speaker 2: zero cost to anybody, what is the success rate? And
Speaker 2: what do you define success? Is that? Is that getting
Speaker 2: them drug free? Will we do that? Is it? Is
Speaker 2: it getting them licenses and find well? Do that? Is it?
Speaker 2: Getting an employment educator? We'll do that? I mean, is
Speaker 2: it restored? We do that. We do everything, and we
Speaker 2: don't cost you anything for anything. So you pick what
Speaker 2: you want to define as says, we do all that.
Speaker 2: Some people, some people need the whole program. Some people
Speaker 2: I've seen turn their life around after three months in
Speaker 2: the program.
Speaker 1: Can you give me an example of someone no names,
Speaker 1: but someone that you thought this is going to be
Speaker 1: a tough one, someone that really give us. Give us
Speaker 1: an example.
Speaker 2: Would be a good one for you, And I'll tell
Speaker 2: you his name. His name's Anthony. But when I first started,
Speaker 2: I mean I had a heroin addict who was forty
Speaker 2: years a heroin, and another one who was just like
Speaker 2: molotophic Sue Heroin speed Benzo's alcohol. Then I've got another
Speaker 2: one that drinks hand sanitizer and listerine, and then I
Speaker 2: got another one. They spent his whole life in Jarl
Speaker 2: ever since he was a kid, and his standard none
Speaker 2: was running the houses, baseball bat and people and blades,
Speaker 2: and he can when he's just and his dad used
Speaker 2: to be part of Underworld over wood woop, and when
Speaker 2: he was nine he's seen his dad peing this bloke
Speaker 2: and drop him in a hole. I mean, and his
Speaker 2: whole life is just career. He's a hundred mile an hour.
Speaker 2: He's just like, yeah, it was just a rooster to
Speaker 2: the max. The hardest blake that I ever had, the
Speaker 2: second hardest. But now, I mean he was one of
Speaker 2: my first residents. I mean, he's finished his mature age
Speaker 2: apprenticeship as a plumber, a gasfitter. He's about to get married,
Speaker 2: he's got a kid, I mean, and his life was
Speaker 2: completely changed. But he took seven years, and it was
Speaker 2: with me for like newly seven years. And when he
Speaker 2: come in because he's on all these meth charges. He
Speaker 2: had to go back into jail for two years and
Speaker 2: then come back out again, and then I had to
Speaker 2: do more, but took literally seven years. He didn't give up.
Speaker 2: I've got a couple like that.
Speaker 1: Did you What stopped him? When you say it didn't
Speaker 1: give up? You didn't give up on him. He didn't
Speaker 1: give up on himself. What was it that you saw
Speaker 1: in him? Or you don't give up on anyone?
Speaker 2: What's I don't give up on anybody. Yeah, I can
Speaker 2: say if you walked him my office, I got about
Speaker 2: fifty staff in one office. You walk in an office and
Speaker 2: I just love my staff. I love my and it's
Speaker 2: what you see is what you get. But I just
Speaker 2: love them to be. It's the atmosphere in there. It's
Speaker 2: all run by people who understand what it's like to
Speaker 2: go through a detox. I mean, you've been for it's
Speaker 2: all lived experience. You're not sitting to sitt next to
Speaker 2: some nineteen year old kid. He's got his counselors to
Speaker 2: forget and pointing out your heart to some bullfed or
Speaker 2: some lady who's just full of unforgiveness bitterness, and she's like,
Speaker 2: my god, I think I need to give her counseling.
Speaker 2: Like I said before, I have to interview one hundred
Speaker 2: and twenty people to get one person a counselor, because
Speaker 2: every counselor they're just as screwed up as what my
Speaker 2: residents are, and they all want to be a counselor
Speaker 2: to give out of their own brokenness. Their piece of
Speaker 2: paper means nothing. I'd rather go and grab the unqualified
Speaker 2: and make him qualified, because one hundred percent I want
Speaker 2: to give them relevant. I mean, I'm telling you and
Speaker 2: I was even for six years, I was a mentor
Speaker 2: to a qualified, high profile psyching per and this plate
Speaker 2: was really screwed up, and he's a psych. On a
Speaker 2: flick of a pen, they can lock you up. They
Speaker 2: don't realize these professional, so called professional people, and they
Speaker 2: get offended if I say that.
Speaker 1: Whether I'm sitting on the wings while you're saying that,
Speaker 1: but you know, I'm not objecting, like I'm hearing what
Speaker 1: you say, and I understand exactly what I say what
Speaker 1: you're saying.
Speaker 2: Horrified. I mean, it's like their pride, who cares if
Speaker 2: I'm uneducated, unqualified? Feel I can run a rehab with
Speaker 2: one hundred and sixty people and do what we're doing.
Speaker 2: But it's all the edumacicated ones. They won't even come
Speaker 2: near shel on. They're just like, I'm not trying to proud.
Speaker 2: We're doing my whole life. We're doing well my whole life.
Speaker 2: I just want to done it and it's working. I
Speaker 2: feel like I found a cure for cancer.
Speaker 1: How does it make you feel as an individual? Like looking,
Speaker 1: because we're in part one, we're talking about how low
Speaker 1: your life got and the things that you've done and
Speaker 1: the guilt that you carry. How does that and I
Speaker 1: can see how animated you are. You're clearly enjoying what
Speaker 1: you're doing now and getting something from it. How would
Speaker 1: you describe what you're doing now? Because you're helping people now? Yeah,
Speaker 1: random acts of kindness can really help you grow as
Speaker 1: a person. How are you feeling as a person all
Speaker 1: the people that you're helping?
Speaker 2: You mean, mums are being mums, they're taking him to daycare,
Speaker 2: they're reading story books at nighttime. You mean, dads are
Speaker 2: learning how to be dad's. I mean, lives are changes,
Speaker 2: they're becoming normal people. I got one year one fellow
Speaker 2: essay who works at the mechanics part. I mean he
Speaker 2: probably with his His wife said, sent him a text,
Speaker 2: and she goes, I couldn't sleep last night, but I
Speaker 2: want to say I'm sorry for all the times that
Speaker 2: I've judged you, for all the times that I've never
Speaker 2: let you lead the home, and for all the times
Speaker 2: and she just pulled her out and he's just pulling
Speaker 2: his eyes out. Sorry is a powerful word. We've all
Speaker 2: made mistakes, I mean, yeah, and just seeing truth and
Speaker 2: love and apologies and people owning their stuff. I'm in
Speaker 2: a system that's working. There. The rehab system that I
Speaker 2: volunteered him for two and a half years is not
Speaker 2: working how it should be. I mean, there's a lot
Speaker 2: of people, I mean, and the prison system is definitely
Speaker 2: not working. Don't start me on the prison system. But
Speaker 2: I've worked it out. I've got it.
Speaker 1: Hey, guys, have you ever wondered what goes on behind
Speaker 1: the headlines of a gang war or shooting, then you
Speaker 1: need to listen to crim City. Join crime reporters Mark
Speaker 1: Murray and Josh Hamrahan as they uncover the details of
Speaker 1: crimes unfolding on Sydney streets and share the stories that
Speaker 1: don't make the papers. The latest season of crim City
Speaker 1: is out now listen early and ad free on Crime
Speaker 1: x Plus on Apple Podcasts. Today, I want to read
Speaker 1: this out and get your reaction that Peter's family is
Speaker 1: a drug addict, the thief, the prostitute, the adulterer, the rejected,
Speaker 1: the despise the people society spurn and dismiss. These are
Speaker 1: the people cares for. Is that an accurate description the people?
Speaker 2: Right? If you look back over Shalom's history, when I
Speaker 2: went from when I got up to thirteen people, I
Speaker 2: put in an application to change or change reviews. Now
Speaker 2: I've been going thirteen years. I'm still not legal on
Speaker 2: the right land, but I'm in the Seign Valley. I'm
Speaker 2: on ten acres and I put an applications in to
Speaker 2: get a rehab. No one wants a rehab next door
Speaker 2: to them, and I end up getting caught up in
Speaker 2: the courts for five years. I went three times to
Speaker 2: the State of Minister Tribunal, then the Supreme Court. Back
Speaker 2: to the start. We're not winning, but that five years,
Speaker 2: I end up going to one hundred and forty people.
Speaker 2: I've bought a hundred acre property, tried to put one
Speaker 2: hundred acre property, but the rich people didn't want the
Speaker 2: view spoiled. Now I've had to sell all these other properties.
Speaker 2: I've just bought a property ten acres and I've just
Speaker 2: moved in and I have an asked permission. No one
Speaker 2: wants rehabilitation. They think that I'm going to bring the
Speaker 2: pimp and the drug addict, and they're all scared that
Speaker 2: I'm going to decrease their property values. Yet not once
Speaker 2: in Shalom's history in ten years, I've never had a
Speaker 2: police complaint. I've never had the police out to the property.
Speaker 2: I've never had ambulance out. We've never had any problems
Speaker 2: at all in the history of Slam. No rehab anywhere
Speaker 2: in Australia can say that.
Speaker 1: No, well per the right. From my background in law
Speaker 1: enforcement and just knowing the world, like when you're saying that,
Speaker 1: I'm sitting here thinking it's quite amazing that you've managed
Speaker 1: to get that sort of response.
Speaker 2: The Police Commissioner wrote a letter to the court saying
Speaker 2: we have never never had an issue. I had a
Speaker 2: problem with Slim and it's history and that's because I
Speaker 2: just if you're going to live under my house, We're
Speaker 2: just we've established the culture of what we would like
Speaker 2: as our standard on for the rest of our life.
Speaker 2: I've established the culture of what I my whole life
Speaker 2: ever desired. I want people to feel loved. I want
Speaker 2: them to feel valued. I want them to feel empowered.
Speaker 2: And I want them to be good dads and good
Speaker 2: men and good women. I want us to be the
Speaker 2: best us we can be. It's not about religion. It's
Speaker 2: about being the best year you can be. And as
Speaker 2: you be the best year. But if you want to
Speaker 2: tell people about religion, shuch about to live it. But
Speaker 2: as you start being the best you you can be,
Speaker 2: the difference that you used to make in people's lives
Speaker 2: is completely the opposite. Now people come to us asking
Speaker 2: for advice. I mean, with all these people who come
Speaker 2: from their backgrounds, they've grown more than their families have grown.
Speaker 2: That's what you want. Be part of the solution, not
Speaker 2: part of the problem.
Speaker 1: You've been there, You've seen a lot of people be there.
Speaker 1: What would you say to the people that have hit
Speaker 1: rock bottom with an addiction? Is there hope for them?
Speaker 1: Because I would imagine there'd be people as we speak now,
Speaker 1: or not imagine. We know there's people sitting as we're
Speaker 1: speaking and they're thinking they've got as low as low
Speaker 1: can be with their addiction and their life. What would
Speaker 1: you say to them? What if? What would be your
Speaker 1: message to them?
Speaker 2: And I know that, I know that, I know that
Speaker 2: there's no person on face this planet who can't change.
Speaker 2: But when you hit the bottom, you've got these options.
Speaker 2: You've got your mum, your dad, your brother, your sister,
Speaker 2: Your brain will never, never take the hard option. But
Speaker 2: when all your family members, well, you've got five options.
Speaker 2: Who've got mental health, hospital, hospital, prison, morgue or rehab.
Speaker 2: I know that, I know you can change your life.
Speaker 2: There's no person I've seen through, whether it be heroine, speed, sex, addiction, gambling, addiction, anxiety, depression, PTSD, trauma.
Speaker 2: We take anybody and everybody and they've all changed. Why
Speaker 2: can't you change?
Speaker 1: Okay, it's a powerful, powerful message. What's your proudest achievement
Speaker 1: with shell on something up?
Speaker 2: I'm just proud of all all my staff and all
Speaker 2: record my staff, and my residence, our whole place. If
Speaker 2: you came and if you want to do a video
Speaker 2: check and run into a video tour, but it's all
Speaker 2: run by residents of the program. Some have been there
Speaker 2: three months, six months, twelve months, two years, but they're
Speaker 2: all putting back, and the hard is to help other
Speaker 2: people change their life like their lives have been changed.
Speaker 2: It's coming alongside each other, learning from those ahead of you,
Speaker 2: and also grabbing those behind. My proudest moment out of
Speaker 2: my last twenty years is my kids. I mean, I
Speaker 2: look at my two sons, Peter, who's my oldest son,
Speaker 2: and his wife Elizabeth Elizabeth. I actually didn't know your show,
Speaker 2: but I'm Elizabeth your number one supporter, and she's apparently
Speaker 2: listening to every podcast and she asked me if for
Speaker 2: good mention that.
Speaker 1: But I look at the way over a shout out
Speaker 1: to Elizabeth.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but she's a Peter my son. He's CrossFit, is
Speaker 2: big beard, he's twenty eight. He's the most perfect dad.
Speaker 2: Everything that I ever wanted my kids to be that
Speaker 2: I wasn't. My son's fulfilling it. Peter and his wife
Speaker 2: when they take kids out, everything drops and they spend
Speaker 2: time with their children. He's kind, caring, he's got integrity.
Speaker 2: His other's focus is just Elizabeth, and that's Elizabeth Pete
Speaker 2: and my other son Ryan and Lauren. I mean, they
Speaker 2: both singer as they do a wedding, and he's Peter's
Speaker 2: an extrovert and Ryan's and my children. I'm proud of
Speaker 2: my children. I mean, I'm proud of my children putting
Speaker 2: them back into shlum and releasing me to release my
Speaker 2: wife after thirty years winning anniversary this year. I've been
Speaker 2: with her thirty six years. She's wangan Hill's country girl,
Speaker 2: farmer's daughter, ducks at school years. Well, I mean, she's
Speaker 2: never done nothing wrong and then she met me selling
Speaker 2: drugs at a pub. Mate. I've slept behind her back
Speaker 2: hundreds of times. I've done all this stuff. I'm proud
Speaker 2: of my wife's to support me. I mean, I'm proud
Speaker 2: of all of us to make it what it is.
Speaker 1: Yeah. No, it's a beautiful story and coming from coming
Speaker 1: from where you start. I'll get in the good books
Speaker 1: with the wife because there was something else and I've
Speaker 1: got it written down here that equated from your page.
Speaker 1: I get the privilege to wake up next to my
Speaker 1: wife on a daily basis knowing that she still loves me,
Speaker 1: and that makes my heart flutter. Oh yeah, send that
Speaker 1: message out to her because she's she's put up with
Speaker 1: a lot with your pleas.
Speaker 2: I gaze upon her glory mate, and I tell her
Speaker 2: fifty times a week. She looks hot with a different
Speaker 2: tan legs and all these tan marks on a makes flutter,
Speaker 2: covered in dirt and swinging a chainsaw.
Speaker 1: Well, the good stuff, good stuff. And I've got to say,
Speaker 1: it's nice speaking to someone that's hit the bottom like
Speaker 1: you did, and someone that's got a positive outlook on
Speaker 1: life and willing to get in there and make a difference.
Speaker 1: And it's a tough gig you got yourself involved in
Speaker 1: because you know an addict, do you trust them? You
Speaker 1: don't trust a word that comes out of their mouth
Speaker 1: to start with. So you're literally turning them into people
Speaker 1: again because they lose that, they stop becoming people at
Speaker 1: some stage.
Speaker 2: And I'd like to say something or the professionals, for
Speaker 2: the psychiatrists and the psychologist, the police and everyone who's listening,
Speaker 2: has anything to do with any person like you've just mentioned,
Speaker 2: they can change. I know that I know that they
Speaker 2: can change, and I'd welcome anyone to come out. And
Speaker 2: I'm not trying to say I'm doing it any better,
Speaker 2: but for that person who's caught up in a ball
Speaker 2: right now and just wants their mum and dad, or
Speaker 2: for that person who's laying in jail and his wife
Speaker 2: stuck out the side of the road because the bat
Speaker 2: has locked them up and they can't get them on
Speaker 2: his property. Those people really need help. And when you're
Speaker 2: on the drugs and the substances, you do what you
Speaker 2: don't want to do. But unless us professionals all get
Speaker 2: on the same page and work together as a team,
Speaker 2: we're never going to make an impact. We need a
Speaker 2: couple aside, whatever. But I know if we just come
Speaker 2: together as a team and work together as one, all
Speaker 2: those together as one, we can make a massive difference.
Speaker 2: I'm doing it at a scar like that, and I'm
Speaker 2: not costing anybody anything. Why won't that listen?
Speaker 1: I think that's a very important message. If all those
Speaker 1: different sections are operating independently in silos, it doesn't work.
Speaker 1: So you want everyone to come together, working together and
Speaker 1: try and fix these problems. So I think that's good advice,
Speaker 1: And yeah, hopefully people will be listening. But look, I've
Speaker 1: enjoyed there, enjoyed our chat, and thanks so much for
Speaker 1: making the time. And I just want to say to you,
Speaker 1: good on you for the difference that you're making. There's
Speaker 1: not many people that can say that they've had that
Speaker 1: much influence on people's lives, turning people's lives around. And
Speaker 1: I read that quote out because it's a people's society spurn.
Speaker 1: They're the people that it's just a junkie. You know why,
Speaker 1: We've given him a hundred chances, given her a hundred chances.
Speaker 1: You're there helping the people say good on you.
Speaker 2: Yeah, bless you. I appreciate you, sim and let me
Speaker 2: come on really appreciated cheers.
Speaker 1: Peter is a bundle of energy and he need to
Speaker 1: be a bundle of energy what he's doing with the
Speaker 1: show on House Rehabilitation Center, and it looks like the
Speaker 1: results speak for itself, and it's a tough gig getting
Speaker 1: people away from addiction. What also blows me away about
Speaker 1: Peter is he's upbringing his childhood and what he went through.
Speaker 1: You wonder how anyone would turn out when you've been
Speaker 1: through the childhood like that. And he's just had to
Speaker 1: let the anger go and he's turned his life around.
Speaker 1: And I really found it an enjoyable chat and very
Speaker 1: interesting what he's doing.
Speaker 2: Then at night,