Speaker 1: We'd like to acknowledge that traditional custodians of the land
Speaker 1: on which this podcast was produced, the Galliger people of
Speaker 1: the Orination. We pay our respects to Elder's past and present.
Speaker 1: This episode contains discussions of sexual assault. If this raises
Speaker 1: any issues for you, support is available through the links
Speaker 1: and phone numbers in the show notes.
Speaker 2: Today we're in Somalia. It's two thousand and eight, and
Speaker 2: after the country's brutal long time dictator was overthrown seventeen
Speaker 2: years ago, a bloody civil war has raged on, with
Speaker 2: so many groups vying for control, the emergence of extremist
Speaker 2: groups like Auschebab, and a surge in piracy. It's a
Speaker 2: very dangerous place to be, but for photojournalist Nigel Brennan
Speaker 2: is exactly where he feels he needs to be. He's
Speaker 2: here to show the world the unfolding humanitarian crisis. The
Speaker 2: plan is to stay for seven days, but on the
Speaker 2: fourth day plan changes dramatically. Nigel and his colleague and
Speaker 2: Mandolinhaut are dragged out of their vehicle at gunpoint by
Speaker 2: masked men who plan to keep them hostage. There are
Speaker 2: only two ways out of this. Either a three million
Speaker 2: dollar ransom from a government whose policy is not to
Speaker 2: pay or escape from a lockdown house guarded by masked
Speaker 2: men clutching AK forty seven's in the middle of one
Speaker 2: of the world's most dangerous countries. I'm Att Middleton. This
Speaker 2: is head Game Today, the ultimate lesson in resilience, strength
Speaker 2: and survival. Nigel Brennan, great to have you on my podcast.
Speaker 2: Thanks for coming. Now, you're a photo journalist. What do
Speaker 2: you do on a day.
Speaker 3: To day A fado journalist obviously someone that works in
Speaker 3: the media. I sort of started out in regional newspapers
Speaker 3: and then went into freelance. So I guess as a
Speaker 3: freelance phato let's trying to cover stories that I thought
Speaker 3: were important and wanted to, I guess share with the
Speaker 3: wider world of what was going on in particularly in
Speaker 3: countries overseas.
Speaker 2: You turned this hobby into a career and then you
Speaker 2: find yourself being called to go to Somalia. Take me
Speaker 2: back to that day when someone, when whoever, your boss,
Speaker 2: whoever it was, said to you, right, you're going too smiley.
Speaker 2: How did you feel, what was the job role? And
Speaker 2: did you take it straight away?
Speaker 3: So I got a phone call from Amanda who at
Speaker 3: that stage was working for Presstvay in Iran. So she said, look,
Speaker 3: I'm thinking about doing a trip into Kenya, Ethiopia and Somalia.
Speaker 3: Would you be interested in coming along? And for me
Speaker 3: it was I guess that that first thing for me
Speaker 3: was like new Obviously Kenya and Ethiopia fell yourself. Somali
Speaker 3: was a different kettle of fish. But I also had
Speaker 3: that thing of like I'd wanted to go into war
Speaker 3: zone or a conflict area, like a country that was
Speaker 3: dangerous and photograph and tell stories. And I guess when
Speaker 3: Aman sort of put that to me, it was just like, well,
Speaker 3: am I going to do this?
Speaker 4: Or am I just going to be a dramer?
Speaker 2: And I thought, well, you feel like you had to
Speaker 2: earn your stripes.
Speaker 3: I've been trying to get into Afghanistan, and I think
Speaker 3: as a freelancer was incredibly difficult to try and get
Speaker 3: em bettered and those sorts of things.
Speaker 2: And then probably it's probably safer to go into Afghanistan,
Speaker 2: absolutely with the top cover that you'd have, yes, then
Speaker 2: it would be to Somalia. Well I can tell you
Speaker 2: that because I've been to both. But I mean hindsight,
Speaker 2: hindsight is a great thing, but probably probably a lot
Speaker 2: better going into Afghanistan because going into Somalia sort of
Speaker 2: just as a freelancer, Oh, it takes some balls.
Speaker 4: It does take some balls.
Speaker 3: Look, I think in hindsight as well, you know, looking back,
Speaker 3: and it was like probably a little bit grain, a
Speaker 3: little bit naive, because I think at that stage Somali
Speaker 3: was the third most dangerous country in the world. As
Speaker 3: you said, like Afghanistan, you had US forces and UK
Speaker 3: forces and you basically had people there that could help.
Speaker 3: In Somalia it was there was no like you had
Speaker 3: eight organizations, but there was absolutely no white or Western
Speaker 3: personnel there. So it was an incredible risk to take,
Speaker 3: you know. And the plan was a seven day sort
Speaker 3: of jaunt in and out because we knew after seven
Speaker 3: days it would be too risky.
Speaker 2: Seven days in total without the three countries, or seven
Speaker 2: days only for.
Speaker 4: Smiling, seven days only for Somalia's.
Speaker 2: Still quite long. Yeah, after twenty four to forty eight hours,
Speaker 2: people start sniffing.
Speaker 3: Around absolutely, And look, I guess as well, as a journalist,
Speaker 3: you know, you work out who your fix is going
Speaker 3: to be in country. And we had someone recommended who
Speaker 3: was also working with National geographic journals that were in
Speaker 3: the country at the same time, and we hired security.
Speaker 3: We had an interpret to those sorts of things. Again,
Speaker 3: probably not enough security, but as I said, as freelancers,
Speaker 3: you know, that's all we could afford was a certain
Speaker 3: amount of security. And there's also that ethical thing I
Speaker 3: think for journalists too, like driving around in cars and
Speaker 3: more torn eras, do you want to have weapons in
Speaker 3: your vehicle? Like you know, you're meant to be neutral
Speaker 3: and having a gun in your car is well, hang on,
Speaker 3: you're not really neutral anymore, you're taking aside.
Speaker 2: So so you start off where you start off in Kenya.
Speaker 3: Start off in Kenya. So in n Airabi organized visas
Speaker 3: to get into Sonario. So I actually have to forge document.
Speaker 3: So my brother's best mate had a I guess it
Speaker 3: was a publication in Brisbane magazine. So I basically ripped
Speaker 3: his logo off and made a letter up and signed
Speaker 3: it under Carl's name and gave that to the Somalian
Speaker 3: embassy and got the visa and then went flew from
Speaker 3: Nairobi into Moga Disher. I'm one of the dodgiest planes
Speaker 3: I've ever been, Like, I'm surprised it actually took off
Speaker 3: and landed. Oh yeah, I like seats sort of going
Speaker 3: back and forwards, and the chickens and goats and it's
Speaker 3: just like what is this. I think people might have
Speaker 3: even been smoking on the plane, which you know, I
Speaker 3: can remember sitting on the plane and there was an
Speaker 3: Italian aid worker who was going through to Somali land
Speaker 3: and he said, what are you two doing here? And
Speaker 3: we're like, we're going to Mogadisha and he's like serious,
Speaker 3: and so yeah, we're journalists and he's like okay. He said,
Speaker 3: you know, your head's worth a million dollars that's not
Speaker 3: attached to your body. And I think that's probably the
Speaker 3: you know, I knew Mogadishu was going to be dangerous,
Speaker 3: and I knew there was potential for kidnap, but I
Speaker 3: never thought that I would end up being kidnapped in
Speaker 3: a country. But I guess that's probably where, you know,
Speaker 3: things start to pucker up a little bit and it's
Speaker 3: just like, okay, this is you know, we're flying into
Speaker 3: sort of I guess, alien territory. And it wasn't until
Speaker 3: we started descend into Mogadishu and you're looking out the
Speaker 3: window and you can see basically just whatever a decade's
Speaker 3: worth of internal conflict and you know, buildings that were
Speaker 3: just decimated, and Mogadishu, which they said was the Paris
Speaker 3: of Africa, you know, getting to eventually landing at Mogadishu
Speaker 3: Airport and getting off the plane and getting into the
Speaker 3: carousel and just saying it was complete pandemonium and mayhem,
Speaker 3: and you know there's security there that are beating people
Speaker 3: with sticks to get them away from the luggage carousel.
Speaker 2: And a bit of a reality check.
Speaker 4: Oh it was.
Speaker 3: It was like I felt like a complete alien. It
Speaker 3: was just like I should not be.
Speaker 2: Here this this Oh as soon as you landed, you
Speaker 2: thought it wasn't.
Speaker 4: I just I felt completely out.
Speaker 2: Of my comfort zone. What are you hoping to capture?
Speaker 2: You know, why did you go there in the first place?
Speaker 2: What was there? What was the task or what was
Speaker 2: the mission?
Speaker 3: I think for Amanda and I, the task was like
Speaker 3: the humanitarian crisis that was going on. There was a
Speaker 3: famine that was about to hit the country again, and
Speaker 3: for us, we wanted to try and capture some of
Speaker 3: the the fighting between al Chabob and the African Union Forces.
Speaker 3: So I guess again, as a green, young journalist. It
Speaker 3: was like, you know, I want to get out to
Speaker 3: the front lines and capture some of what's going on
Speaker 3: to because by that stage, you know, Somali was sort
Speaker 3: of a country that was forgotten about, I guess after
Speaker 3: black Hawk Down and those sorts of things which everyone's
Speaker 3: aware of, it really sort of fell out of the
Speaker 3: media cycle, and particularly for us. One of the interesting
Speaker 3: stories was how food aid is brought into the country.
Speaker 3: So you know, food aid from America and Australia and
Speaker 3: Canada is handed over to a third party who basically
Speaker 3: has to pay for that food aid, Like he has
Speaker 3: to hand over money for it, and he doesn't get
Speaker 3: paid until he delivers it to the destination where it's
Speaker 3: got to go to. And it's like that's a lot
Speaker 3: of risk for one person, and then you've got als
Speaker 3: chabob that raiding those sorts of things. So we wanted
Speaker 3: to sort of see how, you know, food aid from
Speaker 3: western countries is actually dispersed and does it actually get
Speaker 3: to where it is and how corrupt is that that
Speaker 3: whole sort of experience for for the middleman.
Speaker 2: Really, like that was the mission to capture to capture
Speaker 2: the year.
Speaker 3: Yeah, the day we left the day we were actually kidnapped,
Speaker 3: we were heading out of Mogadishu. So, you know, everyone
Speaker 3: said in Mogadishu had was relatively safe. I think it
Speaker 3: was like eight square blocks around Villa Somalia, which is
Speaker 3: where the president palaces and was controlled by African Union forces.
Speaker 3: They said outside of that, it's sort of militia run areas.
Speaker 3: But the day we were kidnapped, we were traveling to Afkgoya,
Speaker 3: which is I think forty k's outside of Mogadishu, and
Speaker 3: there were five internally displaced camps there, so I think
Speaker 3: there was about seven hundred thousand people that had been
Speaker 3: displaced from Mogadisha because of the fighting, living in those
Speaker 3: five camps.
Speaker 2: So you land, do your security travel with you or
Speaker 2: did they meet you at the airport with a fixer?
Speaker 2: You by yourself and you've got to meet the security
Speaker 2: team and the fixer or you traveling with them.
Speaker 3: No, So we meet the security team once we land
Speaker 3: in Mogadishu. So we meet Abdi who it becomes our subfixer.
Speaker 3: I guess, so he speaks English. We also meet a
Speaker 3: driver and our security detail. First impressions, Abdi was like
Speaker 3: really nice, great English, felt sort of quite secure. I
Speaker 3: guess that, knowing that we had security as well. Again,
Speaker 3: I think you know the reality check of As we're
Speaker 3: leaving the airport with our bags, there's quite a high
Speaker 3: ranking officer from the African Union forces that are in
Speaker 3: country and he's like, what are you guys doing here?
Speaker 3: Explained to him, you know that we're journalists. And then
Speaker 3: we're here for seven days and he gives us a number.
Speaker 3: It says, if you get in trouble, give us a call.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you leave the airport, how many days are you
Speaker 2: in country until you're obviously you get that knock on
Speaker 2: the door and your whole world turns upside down.
Speaker 3: So we spend the first three days basically connecting with
Speaker 3: I guess people, trying to get access to hospitals.
Speaker 2: And that's what's about, isn't It's just getting access, talking
Speaker 2: with fixers, trying to get interviews with people, and outside
Speaker 2: of your control, right, because you've got to rely on
Speaker 2: other people to get you into these locations, right.
Speaker 3: Yeah, So we're completely reliant on a juice who's the
Speaker 3: main fixer. We explained to him, what, you know, what
Speaker 3: we want to do on the stories that we want
Speaker 3: to cover, and you know obviously saying to him, we
Speaker 3: want to get out to the front line and sort
Speaker 3: of see the fighting between al Shabab and the African
Speaker 3: Union forces. He's not a chance, not going to happen.
Speaker 3: Where like, we want to go to Bakara Market, which
Speaker 3: is a really famous market in Somalia, and they have
Speaker 3: a part of that market is a gun market.
Speaker 4: Again, he said, that's not going to happen.
Speaker 2: And knocking you back.
Speaker 3: So that's really frustrating. So we end up, like we
Speaker 3: get to a couple of feeding stations where you know
Speaker 3: there's thousands of people obviously waiting for food aid that
Speaker 3: sort of stuff. I think one of those locations, I
Speaker 3: think about half an hour after we leave, there's a
Speaker 3: mortar attack. So then we then go to one of
Speaker 3: the main hospitals in Mogadish, which you know, by the
Speaker 3: standards of western countries is it looks just how can
Speaker 3: I explain this, uh, pretty.
Speaker 4: Shabby.
Speaker 3: Yeah, like you know, very limited resources, doctors run off
Speaker 3: their feet, you know, lots of flies around, lots of infection,
Speaker 3: those sorts of things.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and lack of doors, lack of windows.
Speaker 3: Yeah, absolutely, and you know you're in a hospital where
Speaker 3: there's fighting around and those sorts of things as well.
Speaker 3: So yeah, we get we managed to get three days,
Speaker 3: get out with African Union forces I think on the
Speaker 3: third day, which was interesting as well to spend a
Speaker 3: bit of time with them, and you know, I think
Speaker 3: they're probably just as terrified as we are.
Speaker 2: And to be fair, knowing the African forces, they're not
Speaker 2: the most capable or the best trains trained, and of
Speaker 2: everything that they the lack of resources that they have
Speaker 2: as well the lack of training. Yes, so there you're
Speaker 2: on the back foot already.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so yeah, we managed to get three days of
Speaker 3: shooting in and you know, I guess trying to create
Speaker 3: some stories and aligning some stuff up for the next
Speaker 3: four days. And then obviously day four we'd organized with
Speaker 3: a juice to travel outside of Mogadishu to Afgoya, to
Speaker 3: the smallest IDP camp we wanted to go and visit.
Speaker 3: So there was something like five US fifty to sixty
Speaker 3: thousand people in that camp. To give you, I guess
Speaker 3: an overview, there's no running water, there's no electricity. We'd
Speaker 3: heard that during the night Al Shabob were doing raids
Speaker 3: into these camps and basically raping women there was a
Speaker 3: small I guess hospital in this smaller camp with a
Speaker 3: woman that was running it. We wanted to go and
Speaker 3: basically photograph her and see what she was doing. So
Speaker 3: we'd organized this with a juice the day before he
Speaker 3: said because we were leaving, mogad Isshu said, you're going
Speaker 3: to need extra security detail because you are now going
Speaker 3: into a complete militia run area. So we'd organized extra
Speaker 3: security detail for that day and we'd planned to leave
Speaker 3: after the National Geographic guys that were staying in the
Speaker 3: hotel with So there were four journalists and you know,
Speaker 3: we're split into teams. They were heading past half guys,
Speaker 3: so we were leaving after.
Speaker 4: Them in the morning.
Speaker 3: So, yeah, wake up on the morning of the fourth
Speaker 3: day feeling fairly nervous.
Speaker 2: And security's bumped up. You're feeling nervous. You're just going
Speaker 2: outside of mood issue. You know, there's a you know,
Speaker 2: you feel been pre warned.
Speaker 3: Well and there's more risk in doing that, and I'm
Speaker 3: feeling quite well. It wasn't anxious, so I sort of
Speaker 3: it was like my.
Speaker 2: Intuition was feeling I was trying to tell me something
Speaker 2: went out that airport. I get exactly what you mean,
Speaker 2: there's something that you go.
Speaker 3: So we're in the hotel waiting for everyone to get ready,
Speaker 3: you know, the drivers and security and that sort of stuff,
Speaker 3: and I'm like, oh, I think I'm going to have
Speaker 3: diarrhea and running to the toilet.
Speaker 4: Nothing's coming out.
Speaker 3: And for me that was like intuition saying something shit's
Speaker 3: about to happen to you. So we jump in the car.
Speaker 3: The NATO team have left, so we were always meant
Speaker 3: to be this can car behind them. We jump in
Speaker 3: our vehicle, we take off. We get to basically the
Speaker 3: outskirts of Mogadishu where the Mogadishu University is. You've got
Speaker 3: African Union troops that are stationed there. You can see
Speaker 3: all the sandbags and guys behind machine guns and those
Speaker 3: sorts of things. The car stops and a security detail
Speaker 3: that are in the vehicle. Basically we're told pretty much
Speaker 3: at that point that they have to leave us and
Speaker 3: we now have to travel five kilometers without security detail
Speaker 3: until we pick up our next security detail.
Speaker 2: Did that not raise alarm bell?
Speaker 4: Absolutely do.
Speaker 2: So there's there's an inside job going on right there
Speaker 2: or something along those way. Yes, because you get your
Speaker 2: security detail. The idea is that.
Speaker 4: They stay with you.
Speaker 2: On the boots on the ground.
Speaker 3: Well, it was explained to us that because they were
Speaker 3: seen as government forces, they can't travel into a militia
Speaker 3: run area, so that they would basically be stationed there.
Speaker 3: They would wait until we've come back from the day
Speaker 3: and we'd pick them up. So again, like you know,
Speaker 3: having done hostile environment training, we say, if the plan changes,
Speaker 3: you basically need to stop what you're doing, think about
Speaker 3: the consequences, think about the risks, and if it's too risky,
Speaker 3: you go home and have a cup of tea.
Speaker 2: Yeah, red flags basically yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 3: So Amanda and I had a really quick conversation. We
Speaker 3: were like, you know, we've come all this way, we
Speaker 3: really want to get this story. And we made the
Speaker 3: decision that we'd punched through.
Speaker 2: And is that because you've been getting excuse my friend
Speaker 2: shit stories before and you're like, this is the first
Speaker 2: meeting one we're going to get. This is the first
Speaker 2: one that we're going to Yeah, I think really sink
Speaker 2: our teeth into.
Speaker 3: For the first three days, it was this sort of
Speaker 3: fed stuff that they were sort of I think, look,
Speaker 3: I think.
Speaker 2: Almost just pleasing you with little little things, you know.
Speaker 3: To keep us busy while while a juice was working
Speaker 3: with the nat JA guys getting the stuff that we
Speaker 3: were sort of hoping or wanting to get as well.
Speaker 3: So it's just like, you guys just can have the
Speaker 3: scraps off the table. We'll just keep you busy, you know.
Speaker 2: So the decision wasn't you were like, let's just go
Speaker 2: for it.
Speaker 4: We're here now, let's go made a decision.
Speaker 3: There's five of us in the car, we leave our
Speaker 3: security detail and we basically punched down the road. I'm
Speaker 3: mucking around with my camera, basically looking at the images
Speaker 3: I've taken from the day before, deleting images slowly, like
Speaker 3: so had all the shots from while I was with
Speaker 3: the African Union Forces. I can remember hearing Amanda and Abdi,
Speaker 3: who was our interpreter, sort of speaking by the stage.
Speaker 3: We created quite a good bond with Abdi. He was
Speaker 3: good fun, liked to laugh and they were sort of
Speaker 3: singing and mucking around. And I can remember looking up
Speaker 3: over the driver's shoulder and seeing a car flashing as
Speaker 3: lights because we said they told us that we'd obviously
Speaker 3: intercept another security detail, and I just presumed that that
Speaker 3: was the car that was our security detail didn't really
Speaker 3: take much notice, went back to my camera, and then
Speaker 3: as we got to that car, we stopped, and then
Speaker 3: I sort of looked up and looked over my right
Speaker 3: shoulder and just saw a guy fully mask faced with
Speaker 3: an AK forty seven literally sort of inches away from
Speaker 3: the glass. And then the next thing that you know, aw,
Speaker 3: four doors are ripped open. I'm dragged out of the
Speaker 3: vehicle driver, the second the guy who's in the in
Speaker 3: the front seat with the driver, and then Abdin Amanda
Speaker 3: who in the back were all brought around to my
Speaker 3: side of the car, pushed face down into the dirt
Speaker 3: AK forty seven at the back of the head. Very quickly,
Speaker 3: all five of us are bundled into the back seat
Speaker 3: of this land cruiser. I've got this really big hostage
Speaker 3: taker who's now sitting beside us. So there's six of
Speaker 3: us in the back seat. I've got Amanda on my lap.
Speaker 3: Two guys jump in the front, one's got a pistol
Speaker 3: pointing back, and then two young guys again mask face
Speaker 3: at the back who are pointing AK forty seven's at
Speaker 3: the back of our heads.
Speaker 2: Did you have time to realize what was going on
Speaker 2: or before you knew it. He was in the back
Speaker 2: of the land Cruiser.
Speaker 3: Look, I saw him, and then I looked around and
Speaker 3: I saw more guys with guns, and it was like,
Speaker 3: I think the whole mast face was just like this,
Speaker 3: this ain't good. So basically they surrounded the car, doors
Speaker 3: all open. Everyone's ripped out, thrown on the ground, yeah,
Speaker 3: very quickly, thrown back into the vehicle. And then literally
Speaker 3: someone jumps in the driver suit and we take you. Yeah,
Speaker 3: and instead of driving down the road, they just go
Speaker 3: across country.
Speaker 2: So they take you straight off grid.
Speaker 3: Like I felt like we're doing one hundred and fifty.
Speaker 3: We're probably only doing eighty. But it was rough, Like
Speaker 3: I can remember sort of putting my hands up on
Speaker 3: the roof to brace because I've got a manda on
Speaker 3: me and we're just cross country, you know, driving cross
Speaker 3: scrub bush that sort of stuff.
Speaker 2: And at this point, is there any sort of signals
Speaker 2: that you're trying to give to the others or any
Speaker 2: sort of or you just like your head is everywhere.
Speaker 2: You don't know what the hell is going on.
Speaker 3: Like for me, I sort of describe it like your
Speaker 3: brain goes to cotton more, like you can't even think
Speaker 3: it's just that.
Speaker 2: Goes some mush, doesn't it.
Speaker 4: It does. It's like it's not panic, it's just I think,
Speaker 4: pure sh you.
Speaker 2: Just realizing what's going on. You know it. You can't
Speaker 2: your brain can't compute what the hell is going on.
Speaker 2: It is like it takes so long before you actually realize, Wow,
Speaker 2: I'm in a whole world of pain right now. Yeah,
Speaker 2: things are going down here rapidly.
Speaker 3: They basically demand everyone's mobile phones. I don't give them
Speaker 3: mine because it's it's in the back of my Jane,
Speaker 3: so I can't actually get to it. And again, like
Speaker 3: trying to work out timeframes is really difficult because the
Speaker 3: concept of time just goes, you know, to shit.
Speaker 2: Compleat self preservation right now on.
Speaker 3: So there's obviously the car in front of us that
Speaker 3: we'd stopped for, who's now sort of the lead car.
Speaker 4: We're behind that.
Speaker 3: After a few minutes we pull up, Amanda's ripped out
Speaker 3: out of the car and she's put into the front car.
Speaker 3: So then I guess, you know, my fear sort of
Speaker 3: goes up several notches because it's like they've just taken
Speaker 3: my friend and who's female, and they've separated us, which
Speaker 3: is not like I have no control of what's going
Speaker 3: on with her.
Speaker 2: So you're all completely separated from each other.
Speaker 3: And at this stage, like so there's the five of
Speaker 3: us that were in the car roil in the backseat.
Speaker 3: A man is the only one that's taken out of
Speaker 3: the vehicle and put in the lead vehicle. So we're
Speaker 3: trying to talk and the guy is saying stop talking,
Speaker 3: like they're not actually saying. They just again, we drive
Speaker 3: through bush and we're sort of coming into little villages
Speaker 3: on dirt roads, and then after the bush and then
Speaker 3: into a village, and so they're really trying.
Speaker 4: To disorientate you, absolutely disorientatus.
Speaker 3: We pull up again and then I'm pulled out of
Speaker 3: the vehicle and I'm put into the lead vehicle with Amanda.
Speaker 3: And that's the first time I meet one of the
Speaker 3: head guys called Ahmed, who speaks absolutely fluent English, introduces himself,
Speaker 3: says everything's okay, no need to worry. The commanders basically
Speaker 3: want to meet you and see who you are and
Speaker 3: understand what you're doing in the country.
Speaker 2: Did you believe him?
Speaker 4: Maybe I wanted to believe him.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because you do. You want to you want to
Speaker 2: humanize yourself. Don't you want to there's that hope. That's
Speaker 2: when this starts to get.
Speaker 3: The first person who didn't have a mask on either,
Speaker 3: so it was sort of like I could see his face,
Speaker 3: which which was also like terrifying in a way. It's like,
Speaker 3: because I don't want to see your face because now
Speaker 3: I can identify you, and I think they're the sorts
Speaker 3: of thoughts that are just flatting through your head. It's
Speaker 3: just like, what are they doing with this? And he said, look,
Speaker 3: we're going to take you to a compound. Commanders of
Speaker 3: our group are going to they want to meet with you,
Speaker 3: want to understand who you are while you're in the country.
Speaker 2: Is anyone hysterical? How was? Amanda was like none of us,
Speaker 2: all of you were just playing well, staying quiet all
Speaker 2: through that journey and just until.
Speaker 3: So I think Amanda and I are in the back seat,
Speaker 3: we're sort of holding hands, but not hysterical at all.
Speaker 3: I think, trying to be calm and just look. I
Speaker 3: think also that that initial stage of shock is you
Speaker 3: just yeah, you just go.
Speaker 2: You go with it, your schedule going to die, yeah,
Speaker 2: kick off or you yeah, there's that whole thing. You
Speaker 2: don't upset the people that have just you know, now
Speaker 2: in control of your life. Basically. Yeah, they decide what
Speaker 2: happens to you do, They decide where you go, They
Speaker 2: decide whether you live or die. Yep, it's yeah, that
Speaker 2: shock is it's almost submissive, I would say, you.
Speaker 4: Know it is in a way. Yeah, I think just.
Speaker 3: Playing the game with him. And we're then taken to
Speaker 3: a compound and it was in a small little village,
Speaker 3: you know, with a massive sort of ten twelve high
Speaker 3: foot war with metal gates. We drive into there, I'm
Speaker 3: taken out of the car, frog marched into. There's a
Speaker 3: I guess a low building with three rooms in it.
Speaker 3: I'm frog marched into the end room. Amanda asked to
Speaker 3: go to the toilet straight away. So she obviously has
Speaker 3: her card from the her camera that has photographs with
Speaker 3: the African Union forces on it, so she's trying to
Speaker 3: delete that in the toilet. They obviously think she's trying
Speaker 3: to hide something.
Speaker 2: Why did they catch her doing it?
Speaker 3: No, they didn't catch her doing it, but when she
Speaker 3: was brought back to the room, within minutes, they come
Speaker 3: in and they take her to the room next door.
Speaker 3: I can hear her scream as they put well, she
Speaker 3: tells me after she comes back, but they put their
Speaker 3: hands down her, her boobs and then her hands indoor
Speaker 3: pants to say, she's.
Speaker 2: Being sexually assaulted at this stage, Wow, and what's happening
Speaker 2: to you?
Speaker 3: You can hear her screaming, So yeah, pretty terrified. Terrified
Speaker 3: because it's like, we'll hang on in the car. You
Speaker 3: said everything was okay, this is completely different.
Speaker 2: Did you feel a sense of handover because that handover
Speaker 2: can that that can that's a method to really disrupt
Speaker 2: the individual.
Speaker 3: Well, I think when we got to that compound, obviously
Speaker 3: saying more guys with more guns. It's just like, okay,
Speaker 3: waiting for us. So there's now more people involved. Put
Speaker 3: into that room. Obviously, doors shut again, so you sort
Speaker 3: of now in a room by yourself. Amanda was in
Speaker 3: there for the first period, you know, for the first
Speaker 3: few minutes, and then she was dragged out and then
Speaker 3: she's brought back. She's in tears, explains that she's been
Speaker 3: sexually assaulted.
Speaker 2: They put you back together, Yeah, put us back together.
Speaker 2: And are you talking? Are you trying to come up
Speaker 2: with a plan or you just you're just trying to
Speaker 2: figure out what the hell is going on?
Speaker 3: Trying to figure out what the hell is going on,
Speaker 3: and then I think, you know, after a short period
Speaker 3: of time, it's like, fuck.
Speaker 4: We're been kidnapped.
Speaker 2: Yeah, the penny drops. Why, it's like you've just been
Speaker 2: sexually assaulted. The situation has changed. We've been kidnapped. They
Speaker 2: think we're someone that we're not. Now we have to
Speaker 2: convince them that we're just you know, well just but
Speaker 2: just journalists.
Speaker 3: You know, during that first few hours of being in
Speaker 3: the compound, they come in. They basically want passports and
Speaker 3: want money. Both of us have left our passports at
Speaker 3: the at the hotel because there's no point in going
Speaker 3: out in the field with your passport. I had one
Speaker 3: hundred US dollars on me. I think Amanda had less
Speaker 3: than that, but you know, went through my camera bag,
Speaker 3: they left all of my cameras, didn't touch any of that.
Speaker 3: But they were just looking for documentation. Obviously asked us
Speaker 3: questions of who we were, what we were doing in
Speaker 3: the country, So explain, you know, I'm Nigel Brennan, I'm
Speaker 3: Australian photojournalist here for seven days. Amanda does the same thing.
Speaker 3: She's obviously from Canada. They bring us water, you know,
Speaker 3: do you want anything else? And I'm like, yeah, I
Speaker 3: want to pack of cigarettes.
Speaker 2: Because if they offer as you don't know when that's
Speaker 2: going to be your last meal, your last smoke, your
Speaker 2: last drink. This is the samious thing. So if they're offering,
Speaker 2: always take.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 3: So we're in the room, you know, chain smoking, trying
Speaker 3: to work out what's going on. A group of men
Speaker 3: come in once it's dark and basically I think there
Speaker 3: was four of them, So upmed one of the guys
Speaker 3: that was involved in the kidnapping, whose face I can't see.
Speaker 3: There's an the guy that comes in. He was introduced
Speaker 3: to me as Adam. He also speaks English. Another guy
Speaker 3: that was I think he was at the waiting at
Speaker 3: the compound, Captain Yahyah was how he was introduced.
Speaker 2: Captain Yaya Adam.
Speaker 4: Yeah, of course, yeah. And it's funny.
Speaker 3: As time went on, Amanda and I actually had nicknames
Speaker 3: for all of them so that we could talk about
Speaker 3: them without without them knowing. But they sit down and they,
Speaker 3: you know, obviously, ask us what we're doing, why we're there.
Speaker 3: They accuse us of being spies, and we're like, if
Speaker 3: you you know, you guys have got obviously the Internet
Speaker 3: going to Google. Google my name, Google Anda's name, you'll
Speaker 3: find all of this information. And then they say, basically,
Speaker 3: because you're from Australian Nigel and Amanda, you're from Canada,
Speaker 3: because both of your countries are at war against Islam,
Speaker 3: we're going to hold you for ransom and we're going
Speaker 3: to demand money from your governments.
Speaker 2: Was that a moment that you thought we were going
Speaker 2: to be here for a long time because ransom asking
Speaker 2: they go on for coh they can go on for
Speaker 2: months and go on for years. Well, I guess you
Speaker 2: think yourself, we're in it for the long haul.
Speaker 3: Look to be honest, at that stage, I was probably
Speaker 3: thinking this could last for a couple of months, Like,
Speaker 3: never did I think it was going to last for
Speaker 3: fifteen months. I was having momps, also having like I guess,
Speaker 3: you know, thoughts of Daniel Pearl who was beheaded in Pakistan,
Speaker 3: those sorts of things. So at that stage they didn't
Speaker 3: tell us how much they wanted, but they said we're
Speaker 3: going to ask money. We don't want money from your family.
Speaker 3: We're only interested in money from your governments. And I
Speaker 3: knew that both Australia and Canada as part of the
Speaker 3: Five eyes, which is US, UK, Canada, New Zealand and
Speaker 3: Australia will not pay a ransom for one of their
Speaker 3: citizens because they believe it basically creates an economy for
Speaker 3: that sort of industry, so I explained, And the Australian
Speaker 3: government will not pay you one cent.
Speaker 4: For my life?
Speaker 2: How does that make you feel?
Speaker 3: Knowing that I understand why they make that decision because
Speaker 3: it does create an.
Speaker 4: Economy and money, well it's just money.
Speaker 3: But like I guess, does it then put a target
Speaker 3: on certain nationalities? Like I guess over the last decade,
Speaker 3: you've seen the French and the Germans and European nations
Speaker 3: who do pay. And it's not like a kidnapper, you know,
Speaker 3: target specific nationalities. They just grab and if they're fortunate enough, yeah,
Speaker 3: if they're fortunate enough to have someone from Europe, then
Speaker 3: they know that they're going to get money from a government,
Speaker 3: even though those governments will say we don't pay. Whereas
Speaker 3: you know, you look at what happened in Syria with
Speaker 3: ISIS and with the Brits and the Americans that were
Speaker 3: obviously kidnapped, and you know, very sadly majority of them
Speaker 3: all end up dying as propaganda videos for isis.
Speaker 2: So do you think you would be part of that
Speaker 2: city sick? Do you ever think that you were gonna?
Speaker 4: Oh? I think absolutely absolutely.
Speaker 3: At the start, it was like I said, you know,
Speaker 3: thinking about Daniel Pearl, and it's like capturing a Canadian
Speaker 3: and Australian whose forces are in Afghanistan and Iraqan places
Speaker 3: like that. It is like, it doesn't well, it doesn't
Speaker 3: bogue well. And we didn't know who we were dealing
Speaker 3: with at that stage, like they said they were the
Speaker 3: Somali Mujahadeen, So it's like, have they captured two citizens
Speaker 3: from nations that they can make, you know, make examples
Speaker 3: out of. But also I think in the back of
Speaker 3: my head was the reality of I knew my government
Speaker 3: wasn't going to pay for my ransom, that it was
Speaker 3: going to fall on my family.
Speaker 4: So mum and.
Speaker 3: Dad had basically three years earlier sold their family farm
Speaker 3: for quite a substantial amount of money. I think it
Speaker 3: was about six million dollars, and I knew Amanda's family
Speaker 3: had basically no money at all. So the reality was, yes,
Speaker 3: they're telling us they want money from the Australian government
Speaker 3: and the Canadian government. If they don't get that eventually
Speaker 3: they're going to go for the families. So I think
Speaker 3: for me it was that moral dilemma of I was
Speaker 3: going to destroy my mum and dad's retirement fund and I.
Speaker 2: Can retirement full stop their lives.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Absolutely, like my entire family you know, did get caught
Speaker 3: up in this whole I guess experience of my kidnapping.
Speaker 3: And then there was the ethical question that sort of
Speaker 3: hit me as well during those first few months of
Speaker 3: do I want my family to pay a roundsom for me?
Speaker 4: Is that ethically okay?
Speaker 3: Is that money going to be used for means of
Speaker 3: this group buying more arms and innocent people being killed?
Speaker 4: Like great, the white person gets.
Speaker 3: His life back and Black Africans end up dying because
Speaker 3: of you know, potentially a two million dollar ransom payment
Speaker 3: that goes to this group that that they used that
Speaker 3: money to continue their their g haad in scenario.
Speaker 2: Wow, So how long were you in captivity before your
Speaker 2: parents were told? It would have been what days?
Speaker 4: Hours?
Speaker 2: I think hours? Yeah, so straight away from the Australian embassy.
Speaker 3: Well it's interesting too, I think you know, looking back
Speaker 3: at were these guys professional, had they done this before?
Speaker 3: It was probably not because I think in that first
Speaker 3: meeting with the head guys, they said we need the
Speaker 3: number for the Australian government, and I was like, call
Speaker 3: one three, I don't know, and the only number I
Speaker 3: had was Mum and Dad's landline, Like that was the
Speaker 3: only number that I knew off the top of my head.
Speaker 4: So I gave them that.
Speaker 3: Amanda obviously gave them her father's number in Canada, and
Speaker 3: I think it was pretty much within the twenty the
Speaker 3: first twenty four hours. It was a Sunday night, because
Speaker 3: I know my sister was at mum and Dad's having
Speaker 3: dinner with them, which was sort of a family tradition
Speaker 3: on a Sunday night, phone rang, my sister's answered it,
Speaker 3: and Adam, the guy that was part of that initial
Speaker 3: group that entered the you know, the Commander group. He
Speaker 3: ended up being the communicated for the for the kidnapping group.
Speaker 3: Sister picks up the phone and basically says, I have
Speaker 3: your brother Nigel with amandolind out. We're demanding one point
Speaker 3: five million dollars each US so three million dollar ransom demand.
Speaker 3: If you don't pay within the next twenty four hours,
Speaker 3: we'll execute them.
Speaker 2: Wow, and here and I hope you're enjoying Nigel's phenomenal story.
Speaker 2: I don't often do two part interviews, but this story
Speaker 2: is unlike anything I've ever heard before. So join me
Speaker 2: next week for the second half and hear what happened next.
Speaker 2: Thanks for listening to Headgame.