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Speaker 1: This podcast is recorded on gaddigal Land Always was, always

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Speaker 1: will be Aboriginal Land.

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Speaker 2: Hey chicks, I'm sal and this is Two Broke Chicks,

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Speaker 2: the show that shares life lessons and tips to help

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Speaker 2: make you rich in life.

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Speaker 1: And today we are joined by.

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Speaker 2: Zoe Foster Blake, author, entrepreneur and founder of Go to Skincare.

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Speaker 2: Today we're talking about how to actually practice being present,

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Speaker 2: business mistakes that led to big life lessons, and why

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Speaker 2: telling ourselves.

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Speaker 1: Things will calm down soon is the biggest lie ever.

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Speaker 1: Welcome to the show. I'm thrilled to be here. Thank you, ladies.

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Speaker 3: We were so excited. We were saying before that we

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Speaker 3: were really cool about it, and I do believe the

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Speaker 3: words I'm obsessed with you came out of one of

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Speaker 3: our mouths, not me maybe, but yeah, so we played

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Speaker 3: it really cool guys.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, we're so excited.

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Speaker 2: But before we jump into the questions, we always start

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Speaker 2: off with our life lesson of the week, So would

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Speaker 2: you like to kick us off?

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Speaker 1: My gosh, and my gosh, my.

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Speaker 4: Gosh, You've got me at the tail end of a

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Speaker 4: week in a health retreat and so I'm being bundled

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Speaker 4: up and sent out into the big noisy world.

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Speaker 1: So my answers will probably a bit woo woo.

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Speaker 4: But I've spent a week in nature with my mother

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Speaker 4: and sister, and you just don't do that as you

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Speaker 4: get older. There's always children and work and partners and

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Speaker 4: so on. So just to lock into the feminine energy,

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Speaker 4: shall we say, in my family was very special for

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Speaker 4: a week, and I regret not doing it more often.

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Speaker 1: Oh that's amazing.

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Speaker 3: I think I need to I need to take that

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Speaker 3: life lesson and apply it to myself, because my life

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Speaker 3: lesson of the week was sometimes the crashout is necessary

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Speaker 3: and because one we're in a ludial phase, which fuck

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Speaker 3: that bitch.

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Speaker 1: Dude, I'm in the first day of my period.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, so you're like, you're getting out of it.

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Speaker 1: Tomorrow, I'll be like, have a release.

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Speaker 3: I'm like, And yesterday was just one of those days,

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Speaker 3: like every message you get not something's not right with it.

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Speaker 3: You've got to fix something, you gotta do something. And

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Speaker 3: then the last straw was like me filming a video

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Speaker 3: and then posted it and it was blurry and the like,

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Speaker 3: the reaction did not correlate equally with.

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Speaker 1: The with the crime.

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Speaker 3: I threw my phone I started crying and I was like,

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Speaker 3: nothing goes right. I'm texting sal who's literally like so

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Speaker 3: busy being like fucking hate, like full blown tantrum. And

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Speaker 3: then I felt better, like and sometimes, like I know,

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Speaker 3: we will have those moments been like, oh, you know,

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Speaker 3: like works not everything and this isn't that, and I

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Speaker 3: think that's so valid, But sometimes you just need to

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Speaker 3: have a screaming fit and a good cry and like

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Speaker 3: hate everything within your vicinity.

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Speaker 1: For maybe like twenty minutes.

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Speaker 3: And then I came back.

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Speaker 1: And I was like, Okay, who's that? Yeah, day oh

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Speaker 1: it's crazy.

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Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, And sometimes as a crashout is necessary. But

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Speaker 3: then the thing that brought me back, which is so

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Speaker 3: lame but kind of what I'm like, I need to

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Speaker 3: just resenter a little bit on what you're saying as well, Zoe,

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Speaker 3: was it was like a sound from the movie Eternal

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Speaker 3: Sun trying of a spotless.

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Speaker 1: Mind, mm hmm. And then I looked around.

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Speaker 3: And my cat like came and cuddled me, and I

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Speaker 3: was like, would I rather have that comment or my

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Speaker 3: cat be really like healthy and be cuddling me, and like,

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Speaker 3: would I rather have that really annoying thing that happened

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Speaker 3: with an email or not have like the amazing friends

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Speaker 3: I have around me, and every time I picked the

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Speaker 3: thing that pissed me off, like I would rather have

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Speaker 3: the main comment and still have you know what I've got,

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Speaker 3: rather than lose that and not have that.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, focus on the positive, yeah, which I.

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Speaker 3: Know, like potentially borderline toxic positivity that I'm not like

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Speaker 3: trying to like say that.

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Speaker 1: No, it's fine. I'm not so happy. I love when

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Speaker 1: people are mean to me online. Yeah, like yay, thank you.

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Speaker 2: That's why it's important to have the crash out and

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Speaker 2: not be like it's fine, Like, yeah, just having a

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Speaker 2: bad day, Like sometimes you do need to be like,

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Speaker 2: but like if I could change it and lose you know,

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Speaker 2: these things that I have, I actually wouldn't.

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Speaker 3: So I'm like that kind of was like, all right,

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Speaker 3: it's not that bad then, is it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Like it can't be can't be that bad if.

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Speaker 3: I still am like, but look at all this amazing

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Speaker 3: things that I have. Enough gratitude, bitch.

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Speaker 1: But like I love it.

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Speaker 3: Yeah that I was just like I'd still rather not

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Speaker 3: have it, but that'd be idea. But yeah, so if

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Speaker 3: you're having a crash out, crash out, maybe get a cat.

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Speaker 1: I love you. Okay.

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Speaker 2: My life lesson is shifting gears here hit me, and

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Speaker 2: it's that I learned this on the way here today

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Speaker 2: this morning. The first lesson is that there is going

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Speaker 2: to be a biopic about the band Kiss.

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Speaker 1: I didn't realize that was happening. I love Kiss.

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Speaker 2: I did not know this was happening. But there's also

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Speaker 2: so many that I feel like I'm losing track. But

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Speaker 2: the thing that I learned this morning is that who

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Speaker 2: do you think is playing Paul Stanley, the front man

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Speaker 2: of Kiss.

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Speaker 3: I'm going to be so real with you. They all

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Speaker 3: are the same man to me, the one with the star.

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Speaker 1: Okay, I don't even notice that the one with the star,

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Speaker 1: he's the lead singer.

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Speaker 3: I'm going to just chuck one out because there's, like,

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Speaker 3: you know, the seven flavors of the Internet's Boyfriend.

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Speaker 1: I'm going to throw out Jacob Lordie. Okay, yeah, they

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Speaker 1: do everything. It's Nick Jonas.

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Speaker 5: What Nick Jonas is playing Paul Stanley from Kiss? And

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Speaker 5: he will be singing I am so introdused, Okay, okay,

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Speaker 5: brand yes, very interesting.

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Speaker 3: Not sure if I see the vision.

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Speaker 1: But I'm hoping. I like to be proven wrong. Yeah, interesting,

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Speaker 1: no one else has been cast. It's Kevin Jonas and.

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Speaker 3: Brothers.

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Speaker 2: And then the fourth one, the cat who's the one

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Speaker 2: that everybody forgets about, will be their little brother.

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Speaker 1: Surely, yes, gotta be that. Okay, I'm into it, So

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Speaker 1: stay two.

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Speaker 2: Now we've got our really equally philosophical life lessons out

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Speaker 2: of the way, let's jump into the questions.

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Speaker 3: Okay. In our first segment, we're going to talk calm,

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Speaker 3: career and chaos. We kind of alluded to the quote

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Speaker 3: and also the name of your book things will calm

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Speaker 3: down soon, And it feels like both a hopeful mantra

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Speaker 3: and a bit of a wink, because like, does it.

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Speaker 1: Ever really calm down?

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Speaker 3: You know? And with everything you know?

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Speaker 1: That's it?

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Speaker 3: Actually, thanks so much for listening to the episode, guys,

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Speaker 3: But no, like.

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Speaker 6: With everything you've built, I mean, books, beauty brands, babies,

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Speaker 6: how do you find calm when chaos feels like constant

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Speaker 6: companion through like every decade?

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Speaker 4: Great question, and I don't have a perfect answer, and

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Speaker 4: it definitely evolves. But the first thing I do if

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Speaker 4: I have a moment like you were having where something's

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Speaker 4: happening online is usually a big trigger because it's public

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Speaker 4: facing and I worry about you know, I'm responsible for

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Speaker 4: a brand and a company and things like that. Is

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Speaker 4: to not have a phone with me, put that away

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Speaker 4: and get into nature. That's usually my first protocol. And

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Speaker 4: a walk can fix most things, and a sleep can

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Speaker 4: fix a lot of things, and some food often helps.

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Speaker 1: Like that we're all.

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Speaker 4: Hierarchy of yeah, one hundred percent, and having a good

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Speaker 4: talk to someone event I think we call them because

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Speaker 4: I don't want feedback. That would be my husband's role.

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Speaker 4: But I think it's important to step away and get

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Speaker 4: some perspective because as you mentioned before, it's never that

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Speaker 4: bad and you can definitely fully find yourself in an

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Speaker 4: echo chamber where you believe those things are real. And

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Speaker 4: then I'll walk into the kitchen and see my children,

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Speaker 4: all my cats, my husband, real life things I can touch,

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Speaker 4: you know. It's have a banana, get your feet in

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Speaker 4: the grass, that sort of thing, which is a joke,

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Speaker 4: but I think it's actually really important. And I think

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Speaker 4: being in green environment is really helpful for me. And

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Speaker 4: also I would say sleep is I can handle most

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Speaker 4: things if I've slept. Mostly if I haven't slept, everything

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Speaker 4: is hard and I'm a lot more vulnerable to really

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Speaker 4: irrational responses, and so I've learned to just like I'm

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Speaker 4: not perfect like you are, Like it definitely wig out

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Speaker 4: at things, but I just.

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Speaker 1: Kick that shit locked down and get into nature and

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Speaker 1: it's never as bad later on.

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Speaker 3: I like that because as well, it's like it's not

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Speaker 3: you don't just find one fix and go ook done. Now,

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Speaker 3: I'm never going to crash out. Things are going to

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Speaker 3: be calm forever. Now. It's like finding the process and

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Speaker 3: the tools to maybe be like this will happen again.

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Speaker 1: This is but it's not this.

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Speaker 3: Like looming dark cloud of being like, Okay, there's so

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Speaker 3: many bad things in the future that I'm going to

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Speaker 3: have to deal with. Maybe it's like looking at those

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Speaker 3: things and being like they're gonna happen, but I know

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Speaker 3: how to deal with it.

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Speaker 4: Also, I am also kind of okay with things not

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Speaker 4: being calm. It's how I function best, and that might

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Speaker 4: be unhealthy or toxic. But I like being productive. I

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Speaker 4: like having a lot of things going on. I like

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Speaker 4: my brain being busy. I think I take it too

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Speaker 4: far sometimes, but I think compartmentalization is really important as well.

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Speaker 4: So make time for your work, make time for your family,

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Speaker 4: make time for novel writing for me, for your health

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Speaker 4: and all of those things, and commit, you know, and

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Speaker 4: also to take back the agency and go. Things are

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Speaker 4: not calm and I like it. And if you can

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Speaker 4: put a positive feeling around it and it's not toxic positivity,

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Speaker 4: it's not going everything's fine always, it's going, Shit's gonna

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Speaker 4: get real. What are my coping mechanisms? How am I

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Speaker 4: going to be able to do better next time? Because

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Speaker 4: you know, being like again, the irrational responses. I'm not

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Speaker 4: proud myself. I try not to judge myself too harshly,

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Speaker 4: and I just need a snack.

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Speaker 2: Or relatable And I think that's a good way to

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Speaker 2: look at it too, because chaos isn't always a bad thing.

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Speaker 2: Having a super busy scrive isn't always a bad thing.

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Speaker 2: And something that we're constantly told is that we need

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Speaker 2: to be present. But that can be really bad when

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Speaker 2: you are somebody who is really productive and career oriented

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Speaker 2: and you're always looking towards the next thing, the next deadline.

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Speaker 2: How do you actually practice being present rather than just

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Speaker 2: acknowledging I need to be present.

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Speaker 4: It's a great question because I think intellectually academically, socially,

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Speaker 4: we are aware of that threat of being present all

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Speaker 4: the time. It's like protein, I'm always getting.

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Speaker 1: Yelled at about god so, and I have.

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Speaker 4: This thing where if I get told to be something,

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Speaker 4: I want to rebel and reject and not do that

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Speaker 4: and avoidance.

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Speaker 1: No thanks.

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Speaker 4: So I am bad at being present. I will own

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Speaker 4: up to that, and I'm working on it. But I've

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Speaker 4: come to realize that I'm aiming for a bit more

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Speaker 4: of a macro presence rather than like a daily or

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Speaker 4: even minute presence. So my goal for this year is

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Speaker 4: to be a lot more present with my children and

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Speaker 4: my family, because last year it was all business, and

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Speaker 4: the year before that was all book.

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Speaker 1: So that's my focus.

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Speaker 4: And I sort of manipulated a little bit by because

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Speaker 4: if my child and they think a lot of parents

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Speaker 4: will agree if they say, you know, if they want

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Speaker 4: to sit on the rug and do a tedious block

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Speaker 4: building or dull activity, I freely struggle and I start

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Speaker 4: cleaning the bedroom, or I you know, I do a

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Speaker 4: silly character and try to get out of it and

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Speaker 4: it's awful.

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Speaker 1: So I realized I'm good.

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Speaker 4: At active presence with my children, not seated face to

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Speaker 4: face presence. So I'm like, let's get outside and do something.

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Speaker 4: So it's like parallel presence where we're both in an

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Speaker 4: activity together because I can't sit still. So I forgive

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Speaker 4: myself on that front and I go, we're still going

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Speaker 4: to have a beautiful time together.

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Speaker 1: I just can't sit on a rug and play trucks.

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Speaker 4: Yea, yeah, And I'm not going to beat myself off

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Speaker 4: over I'm just going to find another avenue to connect

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Speaker 4: with my child. Yeah, and being present all day is

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Speaker 4: I don't have.

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Speaker 1: I can't do it.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, it's an impossible task, but yeah, I know it's important.

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Speaker 4: And I do do things like meditate, and I think

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Speaker 4: that gives me little spurts of it to get them through.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: It's also like, how do you accept the fact that

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Speaker 3: you're just better at some things than others.

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Speaker 4: I think going back to what you're saying, then finding

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Speaker 4: your rhythm and what you're good at, and that's a

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Speaker 4: dangerous path as well to only go I'm good at this,

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Speaker 4: therefore that's all I do, and we should try and

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Speaker 4: push ourselves in the other direction because that's where we

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Speaker 4: need to grow.

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Speaker 3: Sorrow.

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Speaker 1: Damn, it's out.

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Speaker 4: I need to learn it as well, but I realized, like,

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Speaker 4: for example, in holidays, some people's idea would be like

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Speaker 4: I want to line the beach with the book or

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Speaker 4: next to the pool.

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Speaker 1: That's my hell. Please know.

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Speaker 4: I've realized that I need a costume, a routine, and

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Speaker 4: to be in natured. So for our family, it's like

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Speaker 4: bike holidays, or we did Safari, or even on a

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Speaker 4: health retreat. You have a uniform, you have to get

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Speaker 4: up at a certain time, there's a meal time, there's

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Speaker 4: something to do. So that's strung sure allows me to

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Speaker 4: be free, allows me to give up and go a

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Speaker 4: bit limp and just go Okay, someone else is in control.

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Speaker 1: I have to think about anything, but I'm still being

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Speaker 1: active and present.

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Speaker 4: It allows me to be more present because the shit

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Speaker 4: that I normally have to take care.

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Speaker 1: Of is not there. Yeah, that's a new one for me.

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Speaker 2: I like that though, because I think a lot of

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Speaker 2: people feel guilty if they can't just sit by a

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Speaker 2: pool and read a book, and they're like, what's wrong

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Speaker 2: with me?

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Speaker 1: Like why can't I just relax? I can't find it

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Speaker 1: really hard.

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Speaker 4: Its small doses, in small doses, but so I think

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Speaker 4: our attention spend's shot.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, and you alluded to this before, but your

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Speaker 2: life straddles a lot of different areas, like.

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Speaker 1: You've got your business, books, your.

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Speaker 2: Family, of course, how do you maintain balance on like

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Speaker 2: a random Tuesday, Like what do you do to stay

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Speaker 2: grounded when you are so busy?

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Speaker 4: I think also I have given up on the idea

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Speaker 4: of balance, or rather I now see balances like if

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Speaker 4: you think of a plank on a ball, that's always

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Speaker 4: like this. It's unwavering, it's not steady and locked. Even

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Speaker 4: if you try and balance on one foot, there's going

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Speaker 4: to be some work to stabilize.

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Speaker 1: So I'm really.

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Speaker 4: Okay with this going up and down all the time,

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Speaker 4: and I'm not going to expend all this energy trying

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Speaker 4: to find this perfect work life balance because I'm a

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Speaker 4: bit more everything everywhere, all at once. That's my That's

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Speaker 4: how I roll, and that's how I am, and I'm

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Speaker 4: okay with that. What I do think make that work

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Speaker 4: is the Again. The sleep hygiene is so critical because

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Speaker 4: I think we all know the effects on your brain

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Speaker 4: and your body and your mood if you don't get

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Speaker 4: good sleep. Never a phone in my bedroom, like this

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Speaker 4: is the shit we do in our house, and we're

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Speaker 4: training our children. We're role modeling that and staying off

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Speaker 4: things that are bad.

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Speaker 1: For me like social media.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, but you kind of mentioned before that you have

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Speaker 3: like a uniform for your day, right, I'd love to

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Speaker 3: know what are those things that are like your non

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Speaker 3: negotiables for your Tuesday for you to have the goal

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Speaker 3: of a good day.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: I like it, and I think that going in with

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Speaker 4: a good intention is really important as well. Mum's always

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Speaker 4: telling me that, you know, the first thing you do,

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Speaker 4: put your feet on the ground when you get out

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Speaker 4: of bed and just thank yourself you're here, you made it,

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Speaker 4: you're doing great, thank you for being here and showing up,

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Speaker 4: and then get into it. I think one of the

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Speaker 4: key things for me is taking the noise out of decisions.

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Speaker 4: So I have finally found my perfect breakfast, which seems

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Speaker 4: like a silly thing, but it's taken me years and

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Speaker 4: now I'm repeat, repeat, repeat, and then lunch can become

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Speaker 4: breakfast so then I can have my eggs and fun stuff. Yeah,

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Speaker 4: my god, I've got a hack that's just it's just

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Speaker 4: changed my world. In terms of eggs, I cook them

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Speaker 4: in thick cream instead of butter. I saw it on

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Speaker 4: Instagram or something, but instead of using butter to like

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Speaker 4: fry slash poach your eggs, use like a poor of

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Speaker 4: thickened cream. It's amazing, my gosh, rusty sourdo with avocado,

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Speaker 4: and then put the everything bagel.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, everything bagel, spices, spices. We're with you, Yeah, do it,

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Speaker 1: it's now, can we go? That's hungry?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, shifting gears ever so slightly.

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Speaker 1: But you once said a Karen.

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Speaker 2: Is just a Cindy that needs love, which is fucking iconic.

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Speaker 1: But can you elaborate what did you mean by that?

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Speaker 2: And how can we apply more compassion, especially when the

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Speaker 2: world does feel judgmental and reactive.

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Speaker 1: And a little too online.

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Speaker 4: We've all had moments we're not proud of, and often

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Speaker 4: you know, it's hormonal, I think, or you haven't slept,

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Speaker 4: or you're just having a ship day and we're yeah,

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Speaker 4: it's I think the first step is to not judge

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Speaker 4: people in those moments. Some people are just having a

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Speaker 4: shitty day and some people are monsters, but that's okay.

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Speaker 1: We've got to give.

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Speaker 4: Them the benefit of the day out. I think particularly

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Speaker 4: this kind of this was raised in the context of

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Speaker 4: customer service with go To and how I feel customer

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Speaker 4: service is a very very important tenant for us. It's

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Speaker 4: as important as product or marketing, because if someone has

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Speaker 4: bothered to invest with you and try your products and

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Speaker 4: then they've felt like it hasn't delivered, and they've then

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Speaker 4: taken more time to email you feedback, which ultimately all

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Speaker 4: feedback we welcome because it has really changed the direction

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Speaker 4: of our brand in a lot of ways.

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Speaker 1: A lot of times.

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Speaker 4: Then they are first of all oda response, but their

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Speaker 4: old consideration. And I think a lot of people just

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Speaker 4: want to be heard and seen, and we don't know

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Speaker 4: where they're coming from, what they're coming on the back of.

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Speaker 4: You know, there could be unemployed, have a sick mother,

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Speaker 4: have a sick child. Like you just don't know someone's situation.

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Speaker 4: We all know that. And I think the minute you

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Speaker 4: show someone kindness in that moment and the compassion you

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Speaker 4: were referring to, they feel seen and heard, which is

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Speaker 4: all we ever want.

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Speaker 1: And they are pretty locked after that because you took.

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Speaker 4: The time to personally a human being doing it, saying hey,

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Speaker 4: thank you so much, we're really sorry. Can we fix

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Speaker 4: this for you? How can we solve it as soon

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Speaker 4: as possible? And thank you for telling us because this

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Speaker 4: might happen to somebody else. And so I think that

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Speaker 4: role modeling and teaching people that if you're going to

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Speaker 4: yell and someone treats you with kindness, maybe they'll think

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Speaker 4: about that the next time, yeah, instead of like just

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Speaker 4: going in attack mode on people.

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Speaker 3: Do you think like self trust comes into it, that

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Speaker 3: that helps maybe dealing with feedback and also just like life,

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Speaker 3: that big old thing like self trust obviously plays a

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Speaker 3: massive part of dealing with, you know, all these big, scary,

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Speaker 3: looming things that we have to deal with when we're

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Speaker 3: growing up. And I would love to know what self

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Speaker 3: trust looks to you now versus when you're in your twenties.

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Speaker 4: So different, and I think, I'm not sure how old

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Speaker 4: you ladies are, but there's not a lot of me

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Speaker 4: that wants to be my twenty year old self again.

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Speaker 4: I'm so unsure. I was insecure, really trying to find

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Speaker 4: my way in the world. I'd moved from the country

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Speaker 4: at seventeen to the city with no friends, no money,

402
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Speaker 4: a lot of things, and it was my formative year

403
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Speaker 4: before I went to UNI where I learned so much.

404
00:19:10,240 --> 00:19:15,600
Speaker 4: But my twenties, what I will say is that that

405
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Speaker 4: self trust was certainly developing. What I had back then though,

406
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Speaker 4: was and I thank that person because she took risks

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Speaker 4: and she had energy, and I was like working full

408
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Speaker 4: time writing books, blogging, like I just went for it

409
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Speaker 4: and everything she did back then because she had nothing

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Speaker 4: to lose, she had no responsibility, she didn't have a

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Speaker 4: company or a family or a mortgage any of those things.

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Speaker 4: She could just go for it, and so love her

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Speaker 4: very grateful. Now it looks different because instead of I

414
00:19:44,560 --> 00:19:48,760
Speaker 4: don't really have that same energy or appetite, I am

415
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Speaker 4: more using my experience and the wisdom that I've gleaned

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Speaker 4: from other people and my own life experience and what

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Speaker 4: I've done to trust my decisions going forward. So I'm

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Speaker 4: still okay with risk, lot more measured now, and I

419
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Speaker 4: think that's a sign of growth and evolution. You know,

420
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Speaker 4: I'm not going to take those same risks that I

421
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Speaker 4: did back then because I was footloose.

422
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Speaker 1: And fancy free and who cares. I didn't give a fuck.

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Speaker 4: But now I'm like, oh god, you know, I've got

424
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Speaker 4: to really think things through and be a bit more

425
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Speaker 4: commercially minded or you know, time, just think about my time,

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Speaker 4: if I want to do that or that take me

427
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Speaker 4: away from.

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Speaker 1: My family and love them both. They're just just different. Yeah.

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Speaker 3: And I think as well, you've probably like learned from

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Speaker 3: a lot of the risks that you took, so that

431
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Speaker 3: now when you're risk assessing, you'd be like, Okay, so

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Speaker 3: when we did this when we were twenty, that didn't

433
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Speaker 3: quite work out, So now we're going to do this

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Speaker 3: instead that I'm like, Yeah, that makes sense.

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Speaker 2: Informed decision making, Yeah, yeah, which I think is an

436
00:20:43,119 --> 00:20:44,439
Speaker 2: important important thing to.

437
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Speaker 3: Learn from our twenties or really any age.

438
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Speaker 2: And you also wrote Breakup Boss, a bible for navigating heartbreak.

439
00:20:51,600 --> 00:20:52,800
Speaker 1: I read this during a breakup.

440
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Speaker 3: By the way, it literally my friend dropped it over

441
00:20:55,480 --> 00:20:58,879
Speaker 3: and was like, hope this help. And then when a

442
00:20:58,960 --> 00:21:02,919
Speaker 3: friend went through a break Yes, it's like the Sisterhood

443
00:21:02,960 --> 00:21:05,320
Speaker 3: of the Traveling Pants of breakup book.

444
00:21:05,760 --> 00:21:06,480
Speaker 1: I hear this a lot.

445
00:21:06,600 --> 00:21:09,080
Speaker 3: I don't know where it is now. I don't probably

446
00:21:10,040 --> 00:21:11,639
Speaker 3: out there. I wish we all like signed it.

447
00:21:11,840 --> 00:21:15,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, I wish I should have. If we

448
00:21:15,080 --> 00:21:16,880
Speaker 1: ever reprinted, I'm going to put that in the front.

449
00:21:16,960 --> 00:21:20,520
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, being like past this to someone else, and yeah,

450
00:21:20,520 --> 00:21:22,240
Speaker 3: everyone has to sign it, and you can see all

451
00:21:22,280 --> 00:21:25,280
Speaker 3: the wonderful people that have been like, Yeah, the.

452
00:21:25,240 --> 00:21:27,720
Speaker 1: Book is full of gems of wisdom.

453
00:21:27,920 --> 00:21:30,520
Speaker 2: So what is one thing that you wish more women

454
00:21:30,680 --> 00:21:34,720
Speaker 2: understood about breakups, whether it's romantic or friendship or even

455
00:21:35,080 --> 00:21:36,240
Speaker 2: with their identity.

456
00:21:36,480 --> 00:21:37,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, good one.

457
00:21:38,119 --> 00:21:40,720
Speaker 4: I think it comes down to what you can control.

458
00:21:40,960 --> 00:21:46,240
Speaker 4: And one of the real hope key lessons or little

459
00:21:46,560 --> 00:21:50,080
Speaker 4: thoughts through that book is that you can't control somebody else.

460
00:21:50,240 --> 00:21:53,920
Speaker 4: And I think when we're trying to academically understand a breakup,

461
00:21:54,040 --> 00:21:56,560
Speaker 4: like the practicality of why this person chose not to

462
00:21:56,600 --> 00:21:58,600
Speaker 4: be with me, or why you chose not to be

463
00:21:58,640 --> 00:22:02,119
Speaker 4: with them, but you're still heartbroken, you really put a

464
00:22:02,160 --> 00:22:04,200
Speaker 4: lot of energy into trying to figure out this other

465
00:22:04,240 --> 00:22:08,080
Speaker 4: person's motives or why, just the why and the how.

466
00:22:08,520 --> 00:22:09,560
Speaker 1: And that will do your head in.

467
00:22:09,880 --> 00:22:10,080
Speaker 2: Yeah.

468
00:22:10,480 --> 00:22:12,439
Speaker 4: And I think you know as you get older, this

469
00:22:12,560 --> 00:22:15,199
Speaker 4: idea of control the controllable, it applies to everything you

470
00:22:15,240 --> 00:22:18,480
Speaker 4: do in life, and it does give you this underlying

471
00:22:18,880 --> 00:22:21,359
Speaker 4: calm and zen because when you understand that you can't

472
00:22:21,359 --> 00:22:27,240
Speaker 4: control other people's lives, decisions, things that you cannot understand

473
00:22:27,240 --> 00:22:30,040
Speaker 4: and can't hope to comprehend, there is a piece in

474
00:22:30,119 --> 00:22:34,000
Speaker 4: detachment and just going I no longer attached to your

475
00:22:34,320 --> 00:22:36,399
Speaker 4: needs and projections and this shit's about me.

476
00:22:36,640 --> 00:22:37,440
Speaker 1: Wrap it up.

477
00:22:37,920 --> 00:22:41,119
Speaker 4: Put yourself in cotton, will no texting. Put yourself in

478
00:22:41,160 --> 00:22:44,000
Speaker 4: like an emotional lockdown, and just like go through a

479
00:22:44,080 --> 00:22:47,040
Speaker 4: bootcamp to try and restore yourself and love yourself and

480
00:22:47,080 --> 00:22:51,119
Speaker 4: look after yourself. And that's the most powerful bit of

481
00:22:51,119 --> 00:22:54,720
Speaker 4: a breakup is the regeneration of what's going on whilst

482
00:22:54,720 --> 00:22:58,040
Speaker 4: you're still grieving, of course, and that's where girlfriends and

483
00:22:58,200 --> 00:23:02,280
Speaker 4: friends are just the best, absolute gold. And let me

484
00:23:02,280 --> 00:23:04,240
Speaker 4: tell you, ladies, as you get older, those friends are

485
00:23:04,320 --> 00:23:07,480
Speaker 4: just the best, the best female friendships. You know, partners

486
00:23:07,480 --> 00:23:11,560
Speaker 4: will come and go, life happens, but the girlfriends the best.

487
00:23:11,560 --> 00:23:13,639
Speaker 4: And when you're building up legacy friendships like I have

488
00:23:13,680 --> 00:23:15,199
Speaker 4: a friend that I met when I was eleven and

489
00:23:15,200 --> 00:23:17,560
Speaker 4: we're still in each other's lives. But mostly you'll lock in,

490
00:23:17,640 --> 00:23:19,520
Speaker 4: I think, especially if you're a country girl who's moved

491
00:23:19,520 --> 00:23:23,040
Speaker 4: to the city. Those like you know, late teens, early

492
00:23:23,080 --> 00:23:25,080
Speaker 4: twenties and a lot of my magazine friends are just

493
00:23:25,480 --> 00:23:26,600
Speaker 4: they know you so well.

494
00:23:27,200 --> 00:23:31,680
Speaker 3: It's very every steak literally say you actually can't stop

495
00:23:31,720 --> 00:23:33,600
Speaker 3: being friends because they know it to much.

496
00:23:34,240 --> 00:23:35,960
Speaker 1: I'd have to kill you and I love that as well.

497
00:23:36,000 --> 00:23:36,560
Speaker 1: With friends.

498
00:23:36,600 --> 00:23:38,280
Speaker 3: We wrote a book called Finding Your People, and in

499
00:23:38,359 --> 00:23:41,679
Speaker 3: it it was yeah and it was thank you, and

500
00:23:41,720 --> 00:23:46,200
Speaker 3: it was like, where does like the line between friendly

501
00:23:46,240 --> 00:23:49,600
Speaker 3: feedback and justification? Where is that of like your friends

502
00:23:49,640 --> 00:23:54,119
Speaker 3: being like, yeah, look not great, but I'm I'm still

503
00:23:54,160 --> 00:23:54,800
Speaker 3: here for you.

504
00:23:54,960 --> 00:23:58,680
Speaker 4: As you get older, you don't want the fluff anymore. Yeah,

505
00:23:58,760 --> 00:24:01,520
Speaker 4: just like fucking tell me st And my best friend

506
00:24:01,640 --> 00:24:03,919
Speaker 4: will be the only one who actually calls me on

507
00:24:03,960 --> 00:24:06,600
Speaker 4: my shit. Yeah, and not even my husband will. And

508
00:24:06,640 --> 00:24:09,200
Speaker 4: so I rely on those girls, that handful of women

509
00:24:09,320 --> 00:24:13,560
Speaker 4: to keep me grounded and be a bit mean because

510
00:24:13,560 --> 00:24:16,440
Speaker 4: I need that shit. And otherwise I just go unfettered

511
00:24:16,480 --> 00:24:18,360
Speaker 4: and think I'm amazing and fabulous and I'm not sure

512
00:24:18,400 --> 00:24:20,840
Speaker 4: people's feelings and not this, that and the other, but

513
00:24:21,400 --> 00:24:24,000
Speaker 4: those friends that I love you enough to be honest,

514
00:24:24,560 --> 00:24:27,040
Speaker 4: I'm writing my new book is about female friendship, five

515
00:24:27,080 --> 00:24:32,080
Speaker 4: girls and that mid life like forty five forty sort

516
00:24:32,080 --> 00:24:32,919
Speaker 4: of stuff that goes on.

517
00:24:32,960 --> 00:24:34,360
Speaker 1: You've got a lot of shit at play.

518
00:24:34,400 --> 00:24:36,760
Speaker 4: Then you've got children, You've got parents who are sick

519
00:24:36,800 --> 00:24:39,480
Speaker 4: and unwell. You've got partners that you might be drifting

520
00:24:39,480 --> 00:24:42,960
Speaker 4: away from. You've got you know, financial pressures, health pressures,

521
00:24:43,200 --> 00:24:45,280
Speaker 4: Everything fucking implodes.

522
00:24:45,160 --> 00:24:46,439
Speaker 1: And it's a lot.

523
00:24:46,560 --> 00:24:51,000
Speaker 4: And that's when the friends really come through because everything

524
00:24:51,040 --> 00:24:52,160
Speaker 4: else feels a bit unstable.

525
00:24:52,240 --> 00:24:55,399
Speaker 1: We want to chat to about career as well.

526
00:24:55,560 --> 00:24:59,320
Speaker 2: And you did mention previously that your start in editorial

527
00:24:59,400 --> 00:25:02,200
Speaker 2: and writing as a journalist and your start in beauty

528
00:25:02,200 --> 00:25:06,359
Speaker 2: did come from being an editor who deeply understands products

529
00:25:06,359 --> 00:25:11,199
Speaker 2: and people and not necessarily coming from a business background.

530
00:25:11,680 --> 00:25:14,320
Speaker 2: So what's one life lesson you learned starting go to

531
00:25:14,560 --> 00:25:17,080
Speaker 2: that no article or spreadsheet.

532
00:25:16,560 --> 00:25:17,240
Speaker 1: Could have taught you.

533
00:25:17,560 --> 00:25:21,760
Speaker 4: Oh, just one, so so, so, so so many. And

534
00:25:21,920 --> 00:25:25,600
Speaker 4: I don't want to ever dismay or tell anyone not

535
00:25:25,640 --> 00:25:28,600
Speaker 4: to start a business because you don't have a business background,

536
00:25:28,680 --> 00:25:32,080
Speaker 4: because if you understand people and you understand product or

537
00:25:32,119 --> 00:25:34,000
Speaker 4: you've seen a gap, you are a business person.

538
00:25:34,280 --> 00:25:36,679
Speaker 1: That's it. That's the shit that's actually worth money.

539
00:25:37,280 --> 00:25:38,919
Speaker 4: A lot of people that they have money and have

540
00:25:39,000 --> 00:25:41,359
Speaker 4: done business and commerce and MBAs, but they don't have

541
00:25:41,400 --> 00:25:44,280
Speaker 4: the ideas and they don't have the community. And that

542
00:25:44,320 --> 00:25:46,800
Speaker 4: shit takes time and it takes integrity and people have

543
00:25:46,840 --> 00:25:49,680
Speaker 4: to trust you, and that's the real goal. So don't

544
00:25:49,720 --> 00:25:52,639
Speaker 4: doubt yourself. You've got this also you will learn as

545
00:25:52,680 --> 00:25:56,040
Speaker 4: you go. Like with everything, we're not expected to come

546
00:25:56,040 --> 00:25:58,960
Speaker 4: in fully fledged. I know exactly how to run it

547
00:25:59,440 --> 00:26:02,800
Speaker 4: and honestly hire good people who know their shit because

548
00:26:02,840 --> 00:26:05,320
Speaker 4: thinking it's there's a lot of hubrew's involved in going

549
00:26:05,320 --> 00:26:06,560
Speaker 4: I know how to run a company.

550
00:26:07,040 --> 00:26:08,439
Speaker 1: No you don't. I didn't.

551
00:26:08,560 --> 00:26:11,119
Speaker 4: So I had a general manager, a marketing like one

552
00:26:11,160 --> 00:26:13,600
Speaker 4: of our directors became the managing director and he handled

553
00:26:13,600 --> 00:26:17,280
Speaker 4: things like inventory and logistics and fulfillment. No no, no,

554
00:26:17,480 --> 00:26:20,480
Speaker 4: not me. Not good at it, don't care And that's

555
00:26:20,480 --> 00:26:23,320
Speaker 4: okay because he couldn't do what I do. So everybody

556
00:26:23,359 --> 00:26:25,640
Speaker 4: knowing their skill sets, you sort of have your superpowers

557
00:26:25,640 --> 00:26:28,040
Speaker 4: and you come together and make a fully formed company.

558
00:26:28,119 --> 00:26:29,680
Speaker 4: And I've talked to a lot of young founders and

559
00:26:29,720 --> 00:26:32,000
Speaker 4: they're like, I think we need to hire someone junior

560
00:26:32,040 --> 00:26:33,520
Speaker 4: to just help with like socials and stuff.

561
00:26:33,520 --> 00:26:35,000
Speaker 1: I'm like, I would.

562
00:26:34,760 --> 00:26:38,159
Speaker 4: Really recommend not doing that, because that is your first

563
00:26:38,160 --> 00:26:41,720
Speaker 4: line of contact with your with your customer and your community.

564
00:26:42,040 --> 00:26:44,399
Speaker 4: And leaving it to someone who doesn't understand the brand

565
00:26:44,640 --> 00:26:46,880
Speaker 4: and you know, that's a really important role.

566
00:26:47,119 --> 00:26:49,320
Speaker 1: That is the dialogue between you and the people.

567
00:26:49,720 --> 00:26:52,439
Speaker 4: Please don't give it to someone who is untrained and

568
00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:54,800
Speaker 4: doesn't understand the brand and the ethos and the way

569
00:26:54,840 --> 00:26:58,640
Speaker 4: to do the brand. Also, I think hire big, spend

570
00:26:58,720 --> 00:27:01,680
Speaker 4: up on like a key senior staff men, because that

571
00:27:01,720 --> 00:27:03,600
Speaker 4: person's going to take you to the next level much

572
00:27:03,640 --> 00:27:06,280
Speaker 4: faster than hiring someone under you who can do the

573
00:27:06,320 --> 00:27:10,080
Speaker 4: scrappy stuff. Take someone in who's gonna work alongside you,

574
00:27:10,119 --> 00:27:13,080
Speaker 4: and it will really grow your business because it's an

575
00:27:13,080 --> 00:27:14,800
Speaker 4: investment that will really really pay off.

576
00:27:14,960 --> 00:27:17,080
Speaker 3: I like that. I don't think I've ever heard that

577
00:27:17,359 --> 00:27:21,160
Speaker 3: advice before, but it makes complete and utter of sense

578
00:27:21,200 --> 00:27:24,840
Speaker 3: because you often get told just make the first hire

579
00:27:24,960 --> 00:27:26,720
Speaker 3: and like they can do all the stuff and free

580
00:27:26,800 --> 00:27:27,720
Speaker 3: up your time.

581
00:27:27,560 --> 00:27:28,520
Speaker 1: So they have to delegate.

582
00:27:28,880 --> 00:27:31,760
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah, but that makes total sense to me

583
00:27:31,760 --> 00:27:34,119
Speaker 3: as well, because half the time as well, like you

584
00:27:34,160 --> 00:27:36,119
Speaker 3: just said, you don't know what you're doing, so you

585
00:27:36,119 --> 00:27:37,480
Speaker 3: need someone else to be like, do you.

586
00:27:37,440 --> 00:27:40,840
Speaker 1: Know you got this? Well, they're not gonna are they

587
00:27:41,080 --> 00:27:43,399
Speaker 1: just fresh out of UNI good. I mean, we do.

588
00:27:43,400 --> 00:27:46,480
Speaker 4: Need absolute business who are able to do all kinds

589
00:27:46,520 --> 00:27:48,840
Speaker 4: of things. But I think hiring someone senior at your

590
00:27:49,080 --> 00:27:51,960
Speaker 4: level of someone you respect and can help you in

591
00:27:52,000 --> 00:27:54,119
Speaker 4: areas that you are not good at or skilled at

592
00:27:54,440 --> 00:27:55,520
Speaker 4: will really help.

593
00:27:55,880 --> 00:27:59,000
Speaker 3: I can imagine that there have been a lot of

594
00:27:59,359 --> 00:28:04,840
Speaker 3: life lessons we rebrand oops moments life lessons.

595
00:28:04,520 --> 00:28:06,080
Speaker 1: Because hindsight it's a beautiful thing.

596
00:28:06,480 --> 00:28:09,400
Speaker 3: But I'd love to know what's like the expensive mistake

597
00:28:09,560 --> 00:28:12,800
Speaker 3: or like And by expensive, I mean it could be money,

598
00:28:12,920 --> 00:28:16,480
Speaker 3: or it could be like, yeah, time that you made

599
00:28:17,040 --> 00:28:20,919
Speaker 3: that you're like, so glad you learned in your career.

600
00:28:21,080 --> 00:28:23,560
Speaker 4: I learned it late, and I put this is part

601
00:28:23,560 --> 00:28:25,240
Speaker 4: of the reason I wrote Things Will Come Down Soon,

602
00:28:25,280 --> 00:28:28,320
Speaker 4: because I had just come out of a big deal

603
00:28:28,359 --> 00:28:30,440
Speaker 4: where I sold half of my company and then ended

604
00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:33,919
Speaker 4: up buying half back. But that whole process was so

605
00:28:34,160 --> 00:28:36,199
Speaker 4: eye opening, and I just needed to get all of

606
00:28:36,240 --> 00:28:38,400
Speaker 4: that business advice and wisdom that i'd learned and paid

607
00:28:38,400 --> 00:28:40,719
Speaker 4: a lot of money for into a book so that

608
00:28:40,800 --> 00:28:43,320
Speaker 4: people would learn it but enjoy it instead of it

609
00:28:43,360 --> 00:28:45,400
Speaker 4: being another dry business book, because we don't need another

610
00:28:45,400 --> 00:28:45,840
Speaker 4: one of those.

611
00:28:45,920 --> 00:28:46,440
Speaker 1: There's plenty.

612
00:28:46,480 --> 00:28:48,880
Speaker 4: They're great, good But I've always thought, and this was

613
00:28:48,880 --> 00:28:51,360
Speaker 4: my whole principle with beauty, if you're having fun and

614
00:28:51,400 --> 00:28:54,280
Speaker 4: you're entertained, you don't even really notice you're learning. Like

615
00:28:54,360 --> 00:28:55,960
Speaker 4: that was how I wanted to write about beauty.

616
00:28:56,000 --> 00:28:57,360
Speaker 1: In the beginning and relationships.

617
00:28:57,440 --> 00:28:59,680
Speaker 4: That was the main reason I wrote the book. But

618
00:29:00,240 --> 00:29:02,880
Speaker 4: in the book, I do touch on a lot of

619
00:29:03,360 --> 00:29:06,200
Speaker 4: protecting your equity and not giving away too much of

620
00:29:06,240 --> 00:29:10,040
Speaker 4: your business at the start and treating that equity like gold.

621
00:29:10,120 --> 00:29:12,080
Speaker 4: And I definitely learned that too late in the piece.

622
00:29:12,800 --> 00:29:15,280
Speaker 4: And I tell every founder, like, if you don't have

623
00:29:15,360 --> 00:29:18,360
Speaker 4: to take in investors, if it's only for financial reasons,

624
00:29:18,400 --> 00:29:21,400
Speaker 4: please bootstrap it yourself, because one day your company could

625
00:29:21,400 --> 00:29:23,560
Speaker 4: be worth a hundred million dollars and that five percent

626
00:29:23,720 --> 00:29:26,400
Speaker 4: is worth a lot of money. Yeah, so hold it tight,

627
00:29:26,640 --> 00:29:29,720
Speaker 4: only release it when you absolutely have to. And if

628
00:29:29,760 --> 00:29:31,480
Speaker 4: you do do it, make sure the equity are giving

629
00:29:31,480 --> 00:29:35,360
Speaker 4: away is really getting good use out of that investment,

630
00:29:35,480 --> 00:29:38,920
Speaker 4: so they have connections, infrastructure, whatever you're trying to do.

631
00:29:39,000 --> 00:29:40,600
Speaker 4: For us, it was we were trying to go big

632
00:29:40,600 --> 00:29:43,720
Speaker 4: overseas and have the boots on the ground that the

633
00:29:44,320 --> 00:29:46,800
Speaker 4: people over there who could help us do that. So

634
00:29:46,840 --> 00:29:48,760
Speaker 4: it was very calculated in that sense.

635
00:29:48,840 --> 00:29:50,120
Speaker 1: But if you're just.

636
00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:52,760
Speaker 4: Doing it because you think you need some more money

637
00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:54,560
Speaker 4: because you want to do a bigger run or something,

638
00:29:56,440 --> 00:29:59,479
Speaker 4: take a loan, ask your parents. I think there might

639
00:29:59,520 --> 00:30:01,440
Speaker 4: be other ways do it. And then when you've scaled

640
00:30:01,440 --> 00:30:03,680
Speaker 4: and you're at a profitable state and the company is

641
00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:06,080
Speaker 4: worth a lot more, you'll be very grateful. Not to

642
00:30:06,080 --> 00:30:08,240
Speaker 4: say never take investment, but just to be really, really

643
00:30:08,280 --> 00:30:08,920
Speaker 4: considered with it.

644
00:30:09,000 --> 00:30:10,000
Speaker 1: No, I think that's good.

645
00:30:09,960 --> 00:30:12,520
Speaker 4: Because you've got the ideas, you've got the community, you've

646
00:30:12,520 --> 00:30:15,120
Speaker 4: got what the people with money want. They don't have that,

647
00:30:15,960 --> 00:30:18,560
Speaker 4: So to treat it like gold because it is very special.

648
00:30:18,560 --> 00:30:20,480
Speaker 4: And that's how I got through millions of meetings with

649
00:30:20,720 --> 00:30:23,560
Speaker 4: fifteen guys in blue suits like just trying to make

650
00:30:23,600 --> 00:30:25,640
Speaker 4: my business to get it for a cheaper price, and

651
00:30:25,680 --> 00:30:27,680
Speaker 4: I'm just like, guys.

652
00:30:28,000 --> 00:30:30,280
Speaker 1: We're not in distress. This business is fucking incredible and

653
00:30:30,280 --> 00:30:32,800
Speaker 1: you're lucky to be sitting here. So don't come at

654
00:30:32,840 --> 00:30:34,240
Speaker 1: with that. I love like this.

655
00:30:34,360 --> 00:30:36,360
Speaker 4: I will protect this brand at aucust. And that's why

656
00:30:36,440 --> 00:30:39,000
Speaker 4: you buy it back because you're like, no, no, yeah,

657
00:30:39,080 --> 00:30:41,400
Speaker 4: you don't get a hands on this, see the vision?

658
00:30:41,640 --> 00:30:42,400
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah yeah.

659
00:30:42,400 --> 00:30:45,480
Speaker 2: And it comes back to trusting yourself, yes, because I

660
00:30:45,480 --> 00:30:48,840
Speaker 2: think a lot of people go to that avenue or

661
00:30:49,560 --> 00:30:53,200
Speaker 2: seek help in those ways because they don't believe that

662
00:30:53,240 --> 00:30:55,120
Speaker 2: they can do it yeah themselves.

663
00:30:55,240 --> 00:30:57,640
Speaker 1: And yeah, like you said, that doesn't apply all the time.

664
00:30:57,800 --> 00:31:00,280
Speaker 2: Sometimes it is a very considered thing and it makes sense.

665
00:31:00,320 --> 00:31:02,640
Speaker 2: But I do think that in the beginning, a lot

666
00:31:02,640 --> 00:31:04,560
Speaker 2: of people like I can't do this on my own,

667
00:31:04,640 --> 00:31:06,840
Speaker 2: like I need the help of somebody else. But maybe

668
00:31:06,840 --> 00:31:08,520
Speaker 2: you just need to take it a little bit more

669
00:31:08,560 --> 00:31:09,480
Speaker 2: slow and.

670
00:31:09,400 --> 00:31:10,440
Speaker 1: You can do it yourself.

671
00:31:10,600 --> 00:31:14,920
Speaker 3: The transparency behind running a business is it's becoming more

672
00:31:14,960 --> 00:31:17,800
Speaker 3: and more transparent, like people and founders and business women

673
00:31:17,800 --> 00:31:20,840
Speaker 3: are opening up a lot more, but it's still from

674
00:31:20,840 --> 00:31:23,920
Speaker 3: the outside, it's still very high glam and you know,

675
00:31:24,160 --> 00:31:26,920
Speaker 3: the business bitch. Yeah, we still have this like especially

676
00:31:26,920 --> 00:31:29,080
Speaker 3: even with like journalism, we all still are going back

677
00:31:29,120 --> 00:31:31,280
Speaker 3: to like how to lose a guy in ten days

678
00:31:31,320 --> 00:31:33,440
Speaker 3: and never wears proud of being like that looks so fun,

679
00:31:34,560 --> 00:31:38,160
Speaker 3: which you would know because of your journalism background. But

680
00:31:38,280 --> 00:31:42,800
Speaker 3: it's obviously a lot more intense in the bts and

681
00:31:42,920 --> 00:31:45,880
Speaker 3: behind the scenes that I'm like, how do you embrace

682
00:31:46,120 --> 00:31:49,600
Speaker 3: I know you said that you thrive in chaos. How

683
00:31:49,640 --> 00:31:54,000
Speaker 3: do you embrace calm when everything feels like chaos?

684
00:31:54,560 --> 00:31:58,280
Speaker 1: Great question, I think I get. I get very anxious.

685
00:31:58,440 --> 00:32:02,560
Speaker 4: I get well, I was very very anxious, but then

686
00:32:03,120 --> 00:32:05,920
Speaker 4: I got on hit and my god, I'm a different person.

687
00:32:06,080 --> 00:32:07,840
Speaker 1: So I now, you guys are too young for that.

688
00:32:08,040 --> 00:32:12,760
Speaker 4: But the perimenopausal shit is real, and I'm so grateful

689
00:32:12,800 --> 00:32:16,200
Speaker 4: there's dialogue around it and education now, because I didn't

690
00:32:16,240 --> 00:32:18,240
Speaker 4: know what it was till a couple years ago. And

691
00:32:18,280 --> 00:32:19,880
Speaker 4: I think at the time, when I was doing my

692
00:32:19,920 --> 00:32:22,120
Speaker 4: deal and I was writing a book and I had

693
00:32:22,200 --> 00:32:26,000
Speaker 4: young children, I was not good. I was so anxious,

694
00:32:26,040 --> 00:32:30,160
Speaker 4: I wasn't sleeping, it wasn't much fun. And now I

695
00:32:30,160 --> 00:32:32,400
Speaker 4: feel like a very different person. So I think getting

696
00:32:32,400 --> 00:32:37,160
Speaker 4: my hormones right, wow, massive massive change. And my anxiety

697
00:32:37,200 --> 00:32:40,960
Speaker 4: still pops up, but that's probably more rooted in perfectionism

698
00:32:41,720 --> 00:32:45,160
Speaker 4: and wanting to do the best job possible rather than

699
00:32:45,200 --> 00:32:47,840
Speaker 4: the responsibility I feel as a founder and someone that

700
00:32:48,200 --> 00:32:51,480
Speaker 4: is responsible for a whole team and at customer base

701
00:32:53,280 --> 00:32:55,800
Speaker 4: as well as my family. So I think that has

702
00:32:55,840 --> 00:32:57,720
Speaker 4: been a huge one. And I think a lot of

703
00:32:57,760 --> 00:33:01,280
Speaker 4: women in their forties gas lighting themselves, going, oh, it's

704
00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:03,520
Speaker 4: just a busy time, or you know, I'm not sleeping

705
00:33:03,560 --> 00:33:06,520
Speaker 4: because X, or you know things will come down Soon's

706
00:33:07,480 --> 00:33:10,120
Speaker 4: that's the refrain that we tell ourselves again and again.

707
00:33:10,960 --> 00:33:13,440
Speaker 1: But it doesn't need to be that hard.

708
00:33:14,560 --> 00:33:17,520
Speaker 4: You know, and there could be like quite an obvious

709
00:33:17,560 --> 00:33:21,520
Speaker 4: health problem that needs looking into and that will help

710
00:33:21,520 --> 00:33:21,800
Speaker 4: a lot.

711
00:33:21,960 --> 00:33:23,800
Speaker 3: I think that's great advice when we need to stop

712
00:33:23,800 --> 00:33:24,880
Speaker 3: gas lighting themselves.

713
00:33:25,040 --> 00:33:26,600
Speaker 4: Oh god, I did, and I was like, oh, you know,

714
00:33:27,480 --> 00:33:29,520
Speaker 4: just because this or you know, if I just do this,

715
00:33:29,600 --> 00:33:32,200
Speaker 4: then maybe I'm not exiting writer or no alcohol that

716
00:33:32,240 --> 00:33:35,479
Speaker 4: will fix everything, you know, whatever it was, you know

717
00:33:35,600 --> 00:33:36,520
Speaker 4: that would be the fix.

718
00:33:36,640 --> 00:33:39,320
Speaker 1: But surprise, it was my homemones. Yeah.

719
00:33:39,720 --> 00:33:41,360
Speaker 4: If you think about what changes to your body when

720
00:33:41,360 --> 00:33:43,479
Speaker 4: you go through puberty or when you have a baby,

721
00:33:43,880 --> 00:33:46,120
Speaker 4: big shit happens. So of course when you're on the

722
00:33:46,160 --> 00:33:48,560
Speaker 4: tail end of all of that, big shit's going to happen.

723
00:33:49,360 --> 00:33:51,560
Speaker 1: I think it's amazing that we wouldn't suspect that as

724
00:33:51,640 --> 00:33:55,400
Speaker 1: like the number one. Yeah, yeah, that's so interesting.

725
00:33:55,440 --> 00:33:58,840
Speaker 2: And you spoke about perfectionism just now, and you did

726
00:33:58,880 --> 00:34:01,880
Speaker 2: say in a recent interview there's this very dangerous idea

727
00:34:02,000 --> 00:34:02,600
Speaker 2: of perfection.

728
00:34:03,160 --> 00:34:04,640
Speaker 1: Of course, there have been failures.

729
00:34:05,040 --> 00:34:08,400
Speaker 2: What role do you think failures should play in our lives?

730
00:34:08,480 --> 00:34:10,600
Speaker 1: And how do you reframe it when it does happen?

731
00:34:11,200 --> 00:34:11,800
Speaker 1: Just a lesson?

732
00:34:12,160 --> 00:34:15,040
Speaker 4: Yeah, every failure is a lesson, and we're having failures

733
00:34:15,040 --> 00:34:17,960
Speaker 4: from the day we're born. And whether that's falling over

734
00:34:17,960 --> 00:34:21,960
Speaker 4: when we're learning to walk, or making a brand that

735
00:34:22,560 --> 00:34:24,239
Speaker 4: seemed like fun at the time but didn't have a

736
00:34:24,239 --> 00:34:28,160
Speaker 4: commercial sensibility around it, whatever it might be, it's a lesson.

737
00:34:28,200 --> 00:34:30,560
Speaker 4: And I feel like I've had a few runs on

738
00:34:30,600 --> 00:34:33,640
Speaker 4: the board, so I have the privileged success, and that

739
00:34:34,320 --> 00:34:37,360
Speaker 4: lends me to feel a bit comfortable and complacent, and

740
00:34:37,400 --> 00:34:40,279
Speaker 4: I hate that. So I want to be challenged. And

741
00:34:40,320 --> 00:34:44,200
Speaker 4: I think people who lead an increasingly frictionless life because

742
00:34:44,280 --> 00:34:49,400
Speaker 4: they have more success, more money, bigger team, the strivers

743
00:34:49,400 --> 00:34:52,240
Speaker 4: will seek challenges and they will seek hard things.

744
00:34:53,520 --> 00:34:55,200
Speaker 1: Whether that's healthy or not. I just think that's the

745
00:34:55,280 --> 00:34:58,920
Speaker 1: human condition. So I like lessons because otherwise how am

746
00:34:58,920 --> 00:35:01,040
Speaker 1: I going to grow? That's why I go no further,

747
00:35:01,080 --> 00:35:01,839
Speaker 1: et cetera, et cetera.

748
00:35:01,960 --> 00:35:04,239
Speaker 4: So having hard things in my life, like trying to

749
00:35:04,239 --> 00:35:07,120
Speaker 4: write a novel or running a business, Yeah, that shit

750
00:35:07,200 --> 00:35:07,879
Speaker 4: makes me spin.

751
00:35:07,960 --> 00:35:08,360
Speaker 1: I love it.

752
00:35:08,480 --> 00:35:08,680
Speaker 3: Yeah.

753
00:35:09,000 --> 00:35:10,680
Speaker 1: I don't know if you do this though, but then

754
00:35:10,719 --> 00:35:11,560
Speaker 1: if you have a bad day and.

755
00:35:11,560 --> 00:35:14,160
Speaker 3: Then you're like fucking hate this shit, being like why

756
00:35:14,160 --> 00:35:15,640
Speaker 3: am I doing this, and then you're like, nah, I'm

757
00:35:15,640 --> 00:35:16,480
Speaker 3: doing it because I love it.

758
00:35:16,520 --> 00:35:19,160
Speaker 1: I do Yeah, yeah, I mean you have.

759
00:35:19,560 --> 00:35:21,600
Speaker 3: That's why you have to do something you love, because

760
00:35:21,600 --> 00:35:23,800
Speaker 3: when you do have those moments that's a failure or

761
00:35:23,880 --> 00:35:25,759
Speaker 3: it's a hard day or whatever. You have to be like,

762
00:35:26,320 --> 00:35:28,439
Speaker 3: You're still going to get up tomorrow and do it. Yeah,

763
00:35:28,560 --> 00:35:31,080
Speaker 3: it'll whinge about it, Yeah, but I'm still going to

764
00:35:31,160 --> 00:35:35,160
Speaker 3: do it. Let's talk about your beauty wisdom, because you've

765
00:35:35,200 --> 00:35:39,960
Speaker 3: seen many skincare a trend come and go, and as

766
00:35:39,960 --> 00:35:44,600
Speaker 3: someone who has been on both sides as editor and entrepreneur,

767
00:35:45,480 --> 00:35:49,680
Speaker 3: what is the skincare truth you wish every woman would

768
00:35:49,719 --> 00:35:50,400
Speaker 3: stop ignoring?

769
00:35:50,800 --> 00:35:51,160
Speaker 1: You know it?

770
00:35:51,960 --> 00:35:52,040
Speaker 3: Is?

771
00:35:52,080 --> 00:35:55,880
Speaker 1: It gonna be scar Listen.

772
00:35:56,040 --> 00:36:01,279
Speaker 4: I I'm genuinely astonished where this is all heading with

773
00:36:01,320 --> 00:36:04,040
Speaker 4: the girls in their twenties and the guys, because I

774
00:36:04,080 --> 00:36:06,719
Speaker 4: felt like we were really getting somewhere and it has

775
00:36:06,880 --> 00:36:10,160
Speaker 4: completely gone backwards and we're into tan lines again and

776
00:36:10,200 --> 00:36:12,080
Speaker 4: there are tanning products in my feet and I'm like,

777
00:36:12,120 --> 00:36:15,160
Speaker 4: how have we got here? Meanwhile, people like me who

778
00:36:15,200 --> 00:36:18,600
Speaker 4: are manufacturing and spending tens and thousands of dollars on

779
00:36:18,680 --> 00:36:21,920
Speaker 4: each product to get it safe and properly ready for

780
00:36:21,960 --> 00:36:25,680
Speaker 4: the market and so cosmetically elegant that people will actually

781
00:36:25,719 --> 00:36:26,000
Speaker 4: wear it.

782
00:36:26,000 --> 00:36:26,839
Speaker 1: And not think about it.

783
00:36:26,960 --> 00:36:28,799
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's a big thing for all of us, is

784
00:36:28,800 --> 00:36:30,960
Speaker 4: making modern sunscreens that people will wear, because then they

785
00:36:30,960 --> 00:36:32,160
Speaker 4: can't complain about the texture.

786
00:36:32,400 --> 00:36:35,320
Speaker 1: No, no, we fix that. You have no excuse. Yeah,

787
00:36:35,440 --> 00:36:35,919
Speaker 1: is that two.

788
00:36:35,880 --> 00:36:38,560
Speaker 4: In three Australians will develop skin cancer at some point.

789
00:36:38,760 --> 00:36:41,080
Speaker 4: It's a real statistic And I just don't know how

790
00:36:41,080 --> 00:36:43,320
Speaker 4: that message is not getting threat. It's like everyone' vaping again.

791
00:36:43,960 --> 00:36:46,080
Speaker 4: Maybe it's a nihilistic tendency. They don't think the world's

792
00:36:46,080 --> 00:36:47,279
Speaker 4: going to be around in twenty years.

793
00:36:47,320 --> 00:36:51,520
Speaker 1: But I'm really I'm shocked at the cavalier attitude towards cancer. Yeah.

794
00:36:51,719 --> 00:36:54,719
Speaker 4: So I feel like, but you know, vanity coming into it.

795
00:36:54,920 --> 00:36:57,680
Speaker 4: I decided at like sixteen or seventeen that I was

796
00:36:57,680 --> 00:37:00,200
Speaker 4: going to stop tanning because quite I didn't want to

797
00:37:00,200 --> 00:37:03,560
Speaker 4: look fifty when I was forty. Now I'm forty four.

798
00:37:03,840 --> 00:37:05,640
Speaker 4: I'm proud of my skin. I stay out at the

799
00:37:05,640 --> 00:37:09,000
Speaker 4: sun and you can get all the lasers and procedures that.

800
00:37:08,920 --> 00:37:11,680
Speaker 1: You want, but you cannot it will show.

801
00:37:12,040 --> 00:37:13,480
Speaker 4: Yeah, And that's why I say you face stops at

802
00:37:13,520 --> 00:37:15,480
Speaker 4: you boobs, because even if you have a stunting face

803
00:37:15,480 --> 00:37:17,239
Speaker 4: because you've bothered to put on screen on. Guess what

804
00:37:17,280 --> 00:37:20,719
Speaker 4: we're always showing this. We're showing this, We're showing our knees.

805
00:37:20,680 --> 00:37:23,400
Speaker 1: And places you release suspects. So please look up to

806
00:37:23,400 --> 00:37:26,239
Speaker 1: your skin because yes, it's young and tanned and bouncy now,

807
00:37:26,360 --> 00:37:29,600
Speaker 1: but you will age hopefully if you're lucky. Yeah, you

808
00:37:29,760 --> 00:37:30,600
Speaker 1: look direct that.

809
00:37:30,760 --> 00:37:33,000
Speaker 4: And also if you're using high strength acids, like if

810
00:37:33,000 --> 00:37:35,640
Speaker 4: you're in there using your red and only nail and

811
00:37:35,640 --> 00:37:36,080
Speaker 4: you are not.

812
00:37:36,080 --> 00:37:39,040
Speaker 1: Protecting, you're doing so much damage. And you did mention

813
00:37:39,160 --> 00:37:39,800
Speaker 1: tan lines.

814
00:37:39,840 --> 00:37:42,600
Speaker 2: But are there any other beauty trends or products that

815
00:37:42,680 --> 00:37:43,920
Speaker 2: make you roll your eyes?

816
00:37:44,719 --> 00:37:48,560
Speaker 1: I am pretty chill about that. I think like everyone

817
00:37:49,360 --> 00:37:52,400
Speaker 1: have fun. That's the ethos of go To is like

818
00:37:52,400 --> 00:37:54,919
Speaker 1: beauty shouldn't be so serious. You're getting so up tired

819
00:37:54,920 --> 00:37:57,000
Speaker 1: about this. It's lotions and potions. Have fun.

820
00:37:57,160 --> 00:37:59,720
Speaker 4: You're just making yourself have a nice time and ideally

821
00:37:59,719 --> 00:38:02,160
Speaker 4: getting healthier skin or the complexion you want.

822
00:38:02,560 --> 00:38:05,920
Speaker 1: So I don't judge you on. I'm very prone to influence.

823
00:38:05,640 --> 00:38:08,359
Speaker 4: So I buy a lot of shit that I don't

824
00:38:08,440 --> 00:38:12,319
Speaker 4: use much role as led you name it, I've done it,

825
00:38:12,360 --> 00:38:14,839
Speaker 4: I've bought it. And what it always comes back to,

826
00:38:15,040 --> 00:38:17,040
Speaker 4: and this is where our focus is, of course, is

827
00:38:17,440 --> 00:38:23,680
Speaker 4: the gold standard, very proven ingredients like vitamin C, sbf AHA,

828
00:38:24,000 --> 00:38:27,840
Speaker 4: vitamin A, and they will consistently get you better results.

829
00:38:27,840 --> 00:38:30,800
Speaker 4: So if you just did a decent daily skincare routine

830
00:38:30,840 --> 00:38:33,719
Speaker 4: and got the occasional procedure, you get your injections, get

831
00:38:33,760 --> 00:38:35,360
Speaker 4: whatever you want. But if you're just doing that on

832
00:38:35,400 --> 00:38:37,080
Speaker 4: the day, that you will see a big, big difference.

833
00:38:37,160 --> 00:38:39,680
Speaker 1: I love that. I love it being like you have free.

834
00:38:39,440 --> 00:38:43,919
Speaker 4: Will if you want to do twelve steps, two twelve steps,

835
00:38:44,200 --> 00:38:46,200
Speaker 4: but if you want to do two, we've got you.

836
00:38:46,200 --> 00:38:46,440
Speaker 3: You know.

837
00:38:46,640 --> 00:38:48,600
Speaker 1: That's what got this point is like, it shouldn't be

838
00:38:48,640 --> 00:38:49,000
Speaker 1: that hard.

839
00:38:49,160 --> 00:38:51,200
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm going to ask you a really hard question.

840
00:38:51,880 --> 00:38:56,760
Speaker 3: What's like obviously, parents when they have their product babies,

841
00:38:56,800 --> 00:38:57,719
Speaker 3: it's like, no.

842
00:38:57,600 --> 00:38:59,719
Speaker 1: You can't chruse the hybrid. Oh I can't.

843
00:39:00,440 --> 00:39:04,160
Speaker 3: Well, I want to know what products you think would

844
00:39:04,200 --> 00:39:06,320
Speaker 3: be illegal to discontinue from.

845
00:39:06,160 --> 00:39:07,120
Speaker 1: Go to AH.

846
00:39:07,360 --> 00:39:10,520
Speaker 4: It's I think face Heero because it's just got, you know,

847
00:39:10,719 --> 00:39:13,560
Speaker 4: hundreds of thousands of five star reviews.

848
00:39:13,560 --> 00:39:16,160
Speaker 1: Everyone loves it. It becomes like it's our gateway product.

849
00:39:16,239 --> 00:39:18,040
Speaker 4: People use it and then they find the whole brand

850
00:39:18,080 --> 00:39:20,160
Speaker 4: because it's so easy to put into your routine.

851
00:39:21,160 --> 00:39:22,040
Speaker 1: I use it mornay and night.

852
00:39:22,080 --> 00:39:24,480
Speaker 4: I use it on rashes, I use it on my children,

853
00:39:24,560 --> 00:39:26,000
Speaker 4: I use it every my husband use.

854
00:39:25,960 --> 00:39:29,279
Speaker 1: It in his bid. It's just especially in which it's a.

855
00:39:29,239 --> 00:39:31,120
Speaker 4: Beautiful booster and it just gives you the glowe. And

856
00:39:31,160 --> 00:39:33,239
Speaker 4: then now we've made a clarifying version.

857
00:39:33,040 --> 00:39:35,799
Speaker 1: So people who are like oil no, if they have

858
00:39:35,800 --> 00:39:39,600
Speaker 1: an oil or digested skin or breakouts, then we made

859
00:39:39,719 --> 00:39:41,680
Speaker 1: a dry earl that really sorts it out.

860
00:39:41,680 --> 00:39:43,759
Speaker 4: And our clinicals are amazing, so I feel like we've

861
00:39:43,800 --> 00:39:48,080
Speaker 4: got oils covered that if you're older, I would say

862
00:39:48,160 --> 00:39:52,360
Speaker 4: very amazing. Retin now retinol is what most people default to,

863
00:39:52,440 --> 00:39:54,680
Speaker 4: but retin now retten how to hide is sort of

864
00:39:54,680 --> 00:39:56,799
Speaker 4: a new ingredient, and that's what we use because it's

865
00:39:56,800 --> 00:39:59,360
Speaker 4: a lot more tolerable, but it's a lot more strong,

866
00:40:00,920 --> 00:40:03,440
Speaker 4: so you can get the results without the irritation.

867
00:40:03,640 --> 00:40:07,080
Speaker 3: What's like the most underrated product from go to that

868
00:40:07,440 --> 00:40:09,399
Speaker 3: more people need, that needs to be like a could

869
00:40:09,440 --> 00:40:10,400
Speaker 3: set the removalist.

870
00:40:10,440 --> 00:40:11,319
Speaker 1: It's the clay mask.

871
00:40:11,640 --> 00:40:14,359
Speaker 4: It is so good. A lot of people like our

872
00:40:14,480 --> 00:40:17,480
Speaker 4: sheet mask transformazing. They sell maybe one every minute.

873
00:40:17,960 --> 00:40:22,719
Speaker 1: Yeah it's me, thank you, just me every minute.

874
00:40:22,800 --> 00:40:30,200
Speaker 3: I like walk back into Meca and I'm like another.

875
00:40:29,239 --> 00:40:31,960
Speaker 4: Yeah, I use one this morning, but their their magic

876
00:40:32,120 --> 00:40:35,319
Speaker 4: pre event, pre makeup or if the next morning. But

877
00:40:35,840 --> 00:40:38,279
Speaker 4: the removal list is a clay mask, but it's very

878
00:40:38,480 --> 00:40:41,160
Speaker 4: hydrating and brightening, and it is a secret weapon. So

879
00:40:41,320 --> 00:40:43,839
Speaker 4: if you want to have good skin, that's not just

880
00:40:44,120 --> 00:40:47,840
Speaker 4: a serum based good skin. So trans amazing is amazing.

881
00:40:47,760 --> 00:40:50,759
Speaker 1: But it's sort of surface, but you are it.

882
00:40:50,920 --> 00:40:54,160
Speaker 4: Just trusts me. It smells like bubble gum. It's fun

883
00:40:54,200 --> 00:40:55,920
Speaker 4: to use. Use it once a week and you'll see big,

884
00:40:55,960 --> 00:40:58,319
Speaker 4: big results, specially if you're having some coggestion. You can

885
00:40:58,360 --> 00:40:59,799
Speaker 4: just spot use it on your shirt or something. But

886
00:40:59,880 --> 00:41:01,680
Speaker 4: I love it, and that's my secret room. So sometimes

887
00:41:01,680 --> 00:41:03,000
Speaker 4: I'm just sitting at my desk and I start to

888
00:41:03,000 --> 00:41:05,880
Speaker 4: feel old and bored and wrinkley, and I'll go and

889
00:41:05,920 --> 00:41:09,040
Speaker 4: do the removal list and slather myself in oils and

890
00:41:09,080 --> 00:41:10,480
Speaker 4: creams and I feel a million.

891
00:41:11,760 --> 00:41:13,719
Speaker 1: But what's next? What can we look forward to?

892
00:41:15,120 --> 00:41:18,400
Speaker 4: So so so much coming out for Go too. Wearing

893
00:41:18,400 --> 00:41:20,359
Speaker 4: some of the new stuff today, I'm very exciting because

894
00:41:20,360 --> 00:41:23,440
Speaker 4: it's that final testing where we're it's pretty much perfect.

895
00:41:23,440 --> 00:41:27,200
Speaker 4: It's just like a tweak of fragrance, so a lot

896
00:41:27,239 --> 00:41:32,000
Speaker 4: to come in different categories. Yeah, yeah, so we're excited.

897
00:41:32,000 --> 00:41:33,879
Speaker 4: We're very good at skincare, but we want to play

898
00:41:33,880 --> 00:41:34,520
Speaker 4: in other areas.

899
00:41:34,600 --> 00:41:41,400
Speaker 3: Oh my god, you just let that sit, okay, marine,

900
00:41:42,080 --> 00:41:44,040
Speaker 3: but we're going to look after you and you'll love it.

901
00:41:44,120 --> 00:41:47,920
Speaker 1: Oh my god, I'm yeah. Yeah, And I do have

902
00:41:47,920 --> 00:41:48,680
Speaker 1: one final question.

903
00:41:48,719 --> 00:41:51,680
Speaker 3: This is incredibly selfish of me to ask, but every year,

904
00:41:51,719 --> 00:41:56,160
Speaker 3: your husband bakes a cake. Yeah, yeah, to put it mildly,

905
00:41:57,040 --> 00:42:00,560
Speaker 3: and this has been a tradition for a many a years. Yeah,

906
00:42:01,120 --> 00:42:04,960
Speaker 3: do you have a favorite cake that has.

907
00:42:04,760 --> 00:42:08,279
Speaker 1: That's been made? I have a memory that always makes

908
00:42:08,360 --> 00:42:12,600
Speaker 1: us laugh. When he made the Uni donkey.

909
00:42:12,719 --> 00:42:14,000
Speaker 4: It was meant to be a unicorn, but it was

910
00:42:14,040 --> 00:42:16,440
Speaker 4: for my daughter's I think fourth birthday. I was in lockdown.

911
00:42:16,840 --> 00:42:19,880
Speaker 4: We're in a rental and he so he couldn't have

912
00:42:19,880 --> 00:42:21,600
Speaker 4: anyone come and help, which he normally has at least

913
00:42:21,600 --> 00:42:23,959
Speaker 4: one guy to come over and like help him balance.

914
00:42:23,640 --> 00:42:26,959
Speaker 1: Things or yeah that makes sense. Yeah, so he didn't

915
00:42:27,000 --> 00:42:29,319
Speaker 1: have and it was pretty ambition. She didn't have his

916
00:42:29,360 --> 00:42:29,920
Speaker 1: sous chef.

917
00:42:30,000 --> 00:42:30,440
Speaker 3: Is that it?

918
00:42:31,920 --> 00:42:34,440
Speaker 4: And I could still hear banging at five in the morning.

919
00:42:34,520 --> 00:42:37,120
Speaker 4: Normally I it taps like no one sleeps that.

920
00:42:37,200 --> 00:42:37,759
Speaker 1: Night, trust me.

921
00:42:37,800 --> 00:42:40,399
Speaker 4: But by about five I was like, Okay, I need

922
00:42:40,400 --> 00:42:42,600
Speaker 4: to check on this guy because I guess he's repetitive banging.

923
00:42:43,000 --> 00:42:44,600
Speaker 4: And I came down the stairs and he was trying

924
00:42:44,600 --> 00:42:47,719
Speaker 4: to make the cloud of glitter above your.

925
00:42:47,680 --> 00:42:50,160
Speaker 1: Cave sit and he just looked up for me. He

926
00:42:50,200 --> 00:42:54,879
Speaker 1: looked so broken and drunk, quite drunk, and we just

927
00:42:55,360 --> 00:42:59,120
Speaker 1: pissed ourself laughing and like on the floor was honestly,

928
00:42:59,200 --> 00:43:02,000
Speaker 1: he was absolutely delirious and I was like what And

929
00:43:02,040 --> 00:43:06,520
Speaker 1: it was the ugliest thing. The teeth was so wrong

930
00:43:06,600 --> 00:43:09,040
Speaker 1: and big. I mean, she loved it and it was beautiful.

931
00:43:09,040 --> 00:43:11,000
Speaker 4: And it's the thought that counts with us, and the

932
00:43:11,080 --> 00:43:13,880
Speaker 4: care and the time and the tradition. And never know

933
00:43:13,920 --> 00:43:16,160
Speaker 4: how he does it because when I go to bed,

934
00:43:16,200 --> 00:43:17,600
Speaker 4: he doesn't know what he's doing.

935
00:43:18,160 --> 00:43:20,160
Speaker 1: And then in the morning, this perfect.

936
00:43:20,280 --> 00:43:24,279
Speaker 4: Perfection, perfectly to the brief. Yeah, what the kid has

937
00:43:24,320 --> 00:43:25,480
Speaker 4: asked for, it is like he's done it.

938
00:43:25,600 --> 00:43:27,640
Speaker 1: He's never failed. I'm so impressed.

939
00:43:27,760 --> 00:43:30,640
Speaker 4: You know, it's engineering and maths though, That's why I said,

940
00:43:30,640 --> 00:43:31,360
Speaker 4: should I be helping?

941
00:43:32,000 --> 00:43:38,040
Speaker 1: It is not your areas exactly. Everything he's measuring is shopping.

942
00:43:38,200 --> 00:43:39,240
Speaker 1: Is it's awful?

943
00:43:39,480 --> 00:43:46,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, not, it's hard, but it's still yeah, believe him exactly.

944
00:43:47,680 --> 00:43:50,600
Speaker 2: But we do love to wrap up our interviews with

945
00:43:50,640 --> 00:43:53,440
Speaker 2: our guests with the same question, and it's what's your

946
00:43:53,440 --> 00:43:55,719
Speaker 2: biggest life lesson on your journey so far?

947
00:43:56,280 --> 00:43:58,560
Speaker 4: I think it is a cliche, but it is a

948
00:43:58,560 --> 00:44:01,400
Speaker 4: cliche for a reason, which is too trust your instinct.

949
00:44:02,080 --> 00:44:05,759
Speaker 4: And as women, we I think we do inherently and

950
00:44:05,800 --> 00:44:08,760
Speaker 4: we've been taught as like as a safety mechanism to trust,

951
00:44:08,960 --> 00:44:10,719
Speaker 4: you know, is this the right place for me to

952
00:44:10,760 --> 00:44:12,719
Speaker 4: walk at night, or is this the room it's going

953
00:44:12,760 --> 00:44:15,000
Speaker 4: to be safe for me? Or I think we use

954
00:44:15,040 --> 00:44:16,399
Speaker 4: our instinct in a lot of ways that we don't

955
00:44:16,440 --> 00:44:19,520
Speaker 4: even really consider. But I think there's more focuses pulled

956
00:44:19,520 --> 00:44:22,680
Speaker 4: when you are making big financial decisions or business decisions

957
00:44:22,800 --> 00:44:27,600
Speaker 4: or reputational decisions. So it hasn't let me down yet

958
00:44:28,160 --> 00:44:30,560
Speaker 4: and it's been the thing that has guided me this far.

959
00:44:30,760 --> 00:44:33,200
Speaker 4: And I think it's very easy to doubt yourself and

960
00:44:33,960 --> 00:44:35,920
Speaker 4: judge yourself and worry.

961
00:44:36,200 --> 00:44:36,359
Speaker 2: But.

962
00:44:37,840 --> 00:44:39,600
Speaker 1: Don't just trust your gut.

963
00:44:39,200 --> 00:44:42,279
Speaker 4: And there's a wonderful woman, Ellen Langan, and she was

964
00:44:42,320 --> 00:44:45,239
Speaker 4: on a podcast recently saying that don't worry about making

965
00:44:45,280 --> 00:44:46,000
Speaker 4: the right decision.

966
00:44:46,040 --> 00:44:47,799
Speaker 1: Make the decision right. And I love that.

967
00:44:47,760 --> 00:44:50,279
Speaker 4: Because you never know what's going to happen. Say you

968
00:44:50,360 --> 00:44:52,360
Speaker 4: get a job offer in London and you're really torn.

969
00:44:52,480 --> 00:44:53,560
Speaker 1: Do you go? Do you not go?

970
00:44:53,880 --> 00:44:58,400
Speaker 4: Her point is if you go and you believe that

971
00:44:58,440 --> 00:45:01,160
Speaker 4: was the right decision, something could happen and it could

972
00:45:01,160 --> 00:45:02,080
Speaker 4: all fall apart over there.

973
00:45:02,120 --> 00:45:06,560
Speaker 1: You don't know if you stay, same thing could happen there.

974
00:45:06,600 --> 00:45:07,560
Speaker 1: So you actually do it.

975
00:45:07,560 --> 00:45:09,600
Speaker 4: You don't know, you don't know what the universe holds,

976
00:45:09,880 --> 00:45:13,239
Speaker 4: So just choose without too much thought and make that decision, right.

977
00:45:13,440 --> 00:45:17,560
Speaker 1: I feel you just waste my mind. Yeah, no, No,

978
00:45:17,760 --> 00:45:21,520
Speaker 1: it's brilliant sharing a good word. Yeah, I love that.

979
00:45:21,520 --> 00:45:24,120
Speaker 4: That's amazing because we attached so much to the hope

980
00:45:24,120 --> 00:45:26,160
Speaker 4: of making the right decision. And the gut is a

981
00:45:26,160 --> 00:45:28,520
Speaker 4: really important player in that, particularly when it comes to

982
00:45:28,560 --> 00:45:31,200
Speaker 4: selling a business and something very heavy like that.

983
00:45:32,000 --> 00:45:33,920
Speaker 1: And I remember asking other founders, how did you know?

984
00:45:34,000 --> 00:45:35,520
Speaker 1: What did you do? And no one's got.

985
00:45:35,360 --> 00:45:37,920
Speaker 4: The clear answer, And there's no guidebook. That's the other thing,

986
00:45:38,000 --> 00:45:41,320
Speaker 4: Like there's a whole business around founders, like become a success.

987
00:45:42,400 --> 00:45:44,400
Speaker 4: Here's how you become your own boss and become an

988
00:45:44,520 --> 00:45:46,160
Speaker 4: entrepreneur and they build and build and build, and they

989
00:45:46,200 --> 00:45:48,600
Speaker 4: make you go to conferences and panels and stuff. When

990
00:45:48,600 --> 00:45:52,200
Speaker 4: you do it, it's crickets. Who's going to help you

991
00:45:52,200 --> 00:45:54,160
Speaker 4: when you're a success. No one's going to tell you, Oh,

992
00:45:54,160 --> 00:45:55,799
Speaker 4: this is when you should be hiring a CEO. This

993
00:45:55,880 --> 00:45:57,719
Speaker 4: is when you should be outsourcing your warehouse, this is

994
00:45:57,719 --> 00:46:00,000
Speaker 4: when you should be you know, doing same day delivery.

995
00:46:00,000 --> 00:46:01,600
Speaker 1: Read. This is a ship. You have to make up

996
00:46:01,600 --> 00:46:03,279
Speaker 1: as you go and you have to hire smart people

997
00:46:03,320 --> 00:46:06,160
Speaker 1: to help you do that. That's amazing. Thank you so

998
00:46:07,719 --> 00:46:08,320
Speaker 1: so much.

999
00:46:08,440 --> 00:46:10,920
Speaker 2: It has been an absolute pleasure to having your been

1000
00:46:11,360 --> 00:46:14,120
Speaker 2: a dream come true and a bucket list moment for

1001
00:46:14,120 --> 00:46:14,600
Speaker 2: a spise.

1002
00:46:14,640 --> 00:46:16,279
Speaker 3: So thank you to m ik Made for making this

1003
00:46:16,320 --> 00:46:17,640
Speaker 3: episode of Two Proachings Happened.

1004
00:46:17,680 --> 00:46:19,200
Speaker 1: We love being in your ear holes.

1005
00:46:19,560 --> 00:46:25,920
Speaker 3: Goodbye magic Bye