1 00:00:04,880 --> 00:00:07,880 Speaker 1: From the Australian. Here's what's on the front. I'm Claire Harvey. 2 00:00:07,960 --> 00:00:15,280 Speaker 1: It's Thursday, December four, twenty twenty five. The superstar of 3 00:00:15,360 --> 00:00:19,680 Speaker 1: Japanese pop a Yumi Hamasaki, is the latest victim of 4 00:00:19,720 --> 00:00:25,000 Speaker 1: a geopolitical dispute that's flaring big time. It's China versus Japan, 5 00:00:25,480 --> 00:00:28,640 Speaker 1: and it's all about China's number one issue, the future 6 00:00:28,760 --> 00:00:33,559 Speaker 1: of Taiwan. Now Australia is under pressure to choose a side. 7 00:00:34,120 --> 00:00:36,600 Speaker 1: That's today's story. 8 00:00:41,960 --> 00:00:43,680 Speaker 2: Bye bye, bye, bye bye. 9 00:00:51,560 --> 00:00:55,200 Speaker 1: This is a Yumi Hamasaki, a forty seven year old superstar. 10 00:00:55,520 --> 00:00:59,480 Speaker 1: She's Japan's best selling singer. Her nickname is the Empress 11 00:00:59,560 --> 00:01:04,800 Speaker 1: of Hamasaki, who's Kylie Minogue level famous throughout the region. 12 00:01:05,240 --> 00:01:08,080 Speaker 1: Was gearing up for a big show in Shanghai when 13 00:01:08,160 --> 00:01:20,720 Speaker 1: suddenly Chinese authorities said fans weren't allowed to attend, so. 14 00:01:20,800 --> 00:01:24,240 Speaker 3: She's due to play, and then the day before her 15 00:01:24,280 --> 00:01:27,400 Speaker 3: fourteen thousand fans who sold out at the whole venue 16 00:01:27,480 --> 00:01:30,960 Speaker 3: before they turned up, the concert was abruptly canceled, or 17 00:01:31,000 --> 00:01:33,319 Speaker 3: at least canceled to the public. 18 00:01:34,040 --> 00:01:37,040 Speaker 1: Will Glasgow is The Australian's North Asia correspondent. 19 00:01:37,560 --> 00:01:42,319 Speaker 3: Now that Chinese officials have claimed force majeur. They don't 20 00:01:42,480 --> 00:01:45,720 Speaker 3: explicitly say what has happened, but of course the reason 21 00:01:45,880 --> 00:01:49,480 Speaker 3: Chinese officials, trying to make a point, have canceled this 22 00:01:49,680 --> 00:01:53,559 Speaker 3: because they think it's inappropriate for a Japanese pop star 23 00:01:54,080 --> 00:01:58,840 Speaker 3: to be entertaining Chinese audiences during this moment of unhappiness. 24 00:02:00,080 --> 00:02:04,760 Speaker 2: Recently, the concert of Japanese pop star Ayumi Hamasaki in 25 00:02:04,880 --> 00:02:09,480 Speaker 2: Shanghai was unexpectedly canceled. As a result, she performed the 26 00:02:09,680 --> 00:02:12,040 Speaker 2: entire show in front of an empty audience. 27 00:02:13,800 --> 00:02:17,440 Speaker 4: The fans basically just went to continue to support Aymihamazaki, 28 00:02:17,600 --> 00:02:23,320 Speaker 4: who have decided to continue the performance in the empty stadium. 29 00:02:23,919 --> 00:02:28,600 Speaker 1: The Chinese Communist Party is absolutely furious with Japan's new 30 00:02:28,639 --> 00:02:30,799 Speaker 1: Prime minister, Sanai Takaichi. 31 00:02:31,840 --> 00:02:36,200 Speaker 4: Japanese Prime Minister Sanai Takeichi has drawn criticism from China 32 00:02:36,240 --> 00:02:40,080 Speaker 4: this week after suggesting Japan could respond with force to 33 00:02:40,160 --> 00:02:42,639 Speaker 4: a hypothetical Chinese attack on Taiwan. 34 00:02:43,639 --> 00:02:48,040 Speaker 1: That's the CCP's red line. It already regards Japan with 35 00:02:48,080 --> 00:02:52,160 Speaker 1: suspicion and hostility and takes every opportunity to mention that 36 00:02:52,320 --> 00:02:55,160 Speaker 1: time Japan teamed up with Adolf Hitler and tried to 37 00:02:55,200 --> 00:02:58,640 Speaker 1: take over the world since World War Two. Japan's not 38 00:02:58,800 --> 00:03:04,239 Speaker 1: engaged in any armed conflicts, but Takaichi's very deliberate use 39 00:03:04,280 --> 00:03:09,440 Speaker 1: of words indicated if China attacks Taiwan, Japan's back in 40 00:03:09,480 --> 00:03:13,040 Speaker 1: the game, it would be justified in taking military action 41 00:03:13,320 --> 00:03:17,480 Speaker 1: as an act of self defense. In response, the Chinese 42 00:03:17,520 --> 00:03:22,000 Speaker 1: Communist Party is taking revenge by using its complete control 43 00:03:22,160 --> 00:03:27,600 Speaker 1: of Chinese society and the economy severely curtailing Chinese citizens' 44 00:03:27,680 --> 00:03:31,680 Speaker 1: access to Japanese exports, including pop music. 45 00:03:36,440 --> 00:03:38,960 Speaker 3: I mean, one of the lines the Chinese government has 46 00:03:39,000 --> 00:03:43,320 Speaker 3: maintained throughout this is that the Chinese public so angry 47 00:03:43,400 --> 00:03:47,160 Speaker 3: themselves about what the Japanese Prime minister said that they 48 00:03:47,320 --> 00:03:51,560 Speaker 3: themselves are going to boycott Japanese products. The Chinese Communist 49 00:03:51,600 --> 00:03:54,360 Speaker 3: Party acts as if it's the sort of natural backlash 50 00:03:54,360 --> 00:03:56,520 Speaker 3: amongst the Chinese people. And look, it is the case 51 00:03:56,560 --> 00:03:59,640 Speaker 3: that there are some angry nationalists, some angry Chinese nationalists, 52 00:04:00,040 --> 00:04:02,160 Speaker 3: but it's also the case that there's loads of people 53 00:04:02,200 --> 00:04:05,680 Speaker 3: in China who continue to like the Japanese pop stars 54 00:04:05,720 --> 00:04:09,080 Speaker 3: I liked before, They still like sushi, would like to 55 00:04:09,120 --> 00:04:12,160 Speaker 3: travel to Japan if their government wouldn't block them, So 56 00:04:12,680 --> 00:04:16,480 Speaker 3: that canceled concert is a really striking example of the 57 00:04:16,600 --> 00:04:20,440 Speaker 3: Chinese Communist Party making decisions for its own people to 58 00:04:20,520 --> 00:04:26,159 Speaker 3: boycott things. We saw this in Australia in a massive 59 00:04:26,200 --> 00:04:30,120 Speaker 3: way back in twenty twenty when the Chinese ambassadors said 60 00:04:30,200 --> 00:04:34,120 Speaker 3: it'd interview that was threatening the economic coercion that was 61 00:04:34,160 --> 00:04:36,320 Speaker 3: going to come, and he said maybe the Chinese people 62 00:04:36,560 --> 00:04:40,599 Speaker 3: wouldn't want to buy Australian beef or drink Australian wine. Well, 63 00:04:40,839 --> 00:04:43,120 Speaker 3: the truth was the Chinese people never got to say 64 00:04:43,120 --> 00:04:48,159 Speaker 3: in that the Beijing put a huge political, politically motivated 65 00:04:48,200 --> 00:04:52,240 Speaker 3: tariff on Australian wine into China, so it was just 66 00:04:52,279 --> 00:04:55,480 Speaker 3: priced out of the market. And it's the same kind 67 00:04:55,520 --> 00:04:59,919 Speaker 3: of idea Beijing claiming that it's the public that's boycott 68 00:05:00,120 --> 00:05:15,039 Speaker 3: these products, where it's actually it's the government making these decisions. 69 00:05:15,880 --> 00:05:20,520 Speaker 1: What is Japan's position on China and on Taiwan. 70 00:05:22,080 --> 00:05:26,279 Speaker 3: Japan's got a really complicated and long history with Taiwan, 71 00:05:26,520 --> 00:05:29,760 Speaker 3: and it's very well remembered in China. Taiwan was a 72 00:05:29,839 --> 00:05:33,800 Speaker 3: Japanese colony. It was the model Japanese colonies. So Taiwan 73 00:05:33,880 --> 00:05:38,599 Speaker 3: or Tokyo ruled Taiwan from eighteen ninety five to the 74 00:05:38,640 --> 00:05:41,440 Speaker 3: end of World War Two nineteen forty five, so fifty 75 00:05:41,520 --> 00:05:46,440 Speaker 3: year period, and there was some horrendous colonies Japan had 76 00:05:46,720 --> 00:05:50,960 Speaker 3: around Asia, particularly South Korea or what's now to South Korea, 77 00:05:51,240 --> 00:05:56,440 Speaker 3: was just ravaged by the Japanese treated appallingly, and within 78 00:05:56,640 --> 00:05:59,760 Speaker 3: China itself, particularly in the northeast and what the Japanese 79 00:05:59,800 --> 00:06:04,839 Speaker 3: called Manchuria. So the memory on the mainland of Japan 80 00:06:05,120 --> 00:06:09,960 Speaker 3: and Imperial Japan is of this Nightmaris force, whereas in 81 00:06:10,000 --> 00:06:13,640 Speaker 3: Taiwan it's much more complicated. Taiwan was set up as again, 82 00:06:13,680 --> 00:06:17,120 Speaker 3: as I said, a model colony for Japan, and the 83 00:06:17,240 --> 00:06:19,880 Speaker 3: Japanese wanted to use it to show they were an 84 00:06:19,880 --> 00:06:24,080 Speaker 3: equal of any Western power. They weren't to be colonized. 85 00:06:24,200 --> 00:06:28,160 Speaker 3: They were like the British and German and other European 86 00:06:28,320 --> 00:06:31,800 Speaker 3: colonial powers, and they wanted to show in Taiwan what 87 00:06:31,800 --> 00:06:33,760 Speaker 3: they could do. So they left a big legacy of 88 00:06:34,320 --> 00:06:37,400 Speaker 3: urban infrastructure. They sort of paid the roads, and you know, 89 00:06:37,440 --> 00:06:39,520 Speaker 3: it sounds a bit like the Monty Python sketch. You know, 90 00:06:39,600 --> 00:06:42,440 Speaker 3: they've got the Romans did for them, right, But it's 91 00:06:42,520 --> 00:06:46,080 Speaker 3: actually is remembered in Taiwan that people, you know, literacy 92 00:06:46,160 --> 00:06:50,520 Speaker 3: rates skyrocketed under the Japanese. Sewage systems were installed, roads 93 00:06:50,520 --> 00:06:53,480 Speaker 3: were installed, all this kind of thing. Up until the 94 00:06:53,560 --> 00:06:57,120 Speaker 3: end of World War Two, China's ruled by the Nationalists 95 00:06:57,200 --> 00:07:01,880 Speaker 3: the cormntane. Now, when the Civil war breaks out after 96 00:07:01,920 --> 00:07:04,040 Speaker 3: the end of World War Two in nineteen forty five, 97 00:07:04,800 --> 00:07:08,320 Speaker 3: at that point, Taiwan goes from being a Japanese colony 98 00:07:08,440 --> 00:07:11,040 Speaker 3: to being ruled by the Republic of China. But within 99 00:07:11,120 --> 00:07:16,360 Speaker 3: four years the Communists win the civil war. The Nationalist 100 00:07:16,440 --> 00:07:21,040 Speaker 3: army retreats across the strait to Taiwan, and so for them, 101 00:07:21,080 --> 00:07:24,080 Speaker 3: initially Taiwan is a base where Jiang Kai Chek is 102 00:07:24,080 --> 00:07:27,679 Speaker 3: going to use to reclaim the mainland. For the people 103 00:07:27,720 --> 00:07:31,160 Speaker 3: in Taiwan, their experience was World War II ended and 104 00:07:31,200 --> 00:07:34,680 Speaker 3: they thought, ah, finally we're free of the Japanese, were 105 00:07:34,720 --> 00:07:39,480 Speaker 3: free of our colonial overlord. We can be independent. But 106 00:07:39,600 --> 00:07:42,840 Speaker 3: then in arrives this new force. And originally they were 107 00:07:42,880 --> 00:07:45,880 Speaker 3: welcomed the Nationalists in nineteen forty five, but it wasn't 108 00:07:45,920 --> 00:07:50,880 Speaker 3: long before the Nationalist army was imposing itself free violently 109 00:07:51,040 --> 00:07:55,600 Speaker 3: on the Taiwanese. In came millions, literally millions of kmt 110 00:07:56,000 --> 00:08:01,400 Speaker 3: Cormantang soldiers into Taiwan and then they dominated and ruled 111 00:08:01,440 --> 00:08:06,360 Speaker 3: the society in a very authoritarian way right until the 112 00:08:06,440 --> 00:08:09,960 Speaker 3: late nineteen eighties. So it's really complicated history, but it 113 00:08:10,000 --> 00:08:14,360 Speaker 3: means that for people in Taiwan, even how Japan's seen, 114 00:08:14,720 --> 00:08:17,640 Speaker 3: how the Communist Party is seen, depends so much on 115 00:08:17,760 --> 00:08:21,360 Speaker 3: were you in Taiwan when the nationalist forces came in 116 00:08:21,440 --> 00:08:24,720 Speaker 3: nineteen forty five and then searched in nineteen forty nine, 117 00:08:25,960 --> 00:08:28,160 Speaker 3: or were you one of those who came from the 118 00:08:28,200 --> 00:08:33,480 Speaker 3: mainland and from the Chinese Communist Party perspective, Taiwan is 119 00:08:33,520 --> 00:08:37,800 Speaker 3: this base where their enemies fled, and it's this unfinished 120 00:08:37,840 --> 00:08:42,040 Speaker 3: piece from the Civil War. So there's so much complicated 121 00:08:42,080 --> 00:08:45,360 Speaker 3: history and some very raw emotions still about all this stuff. 122 00:08:46,360 --> 00:08:50,320 Speaker 3: Like Australia and almost every other country, Taiwan has unofficial 123 00:08:50,320 --> 00:08:55,880 Speaker 3: relations with Tokyo. Japan doesn't officially recognize it as an 124 00:08:55,880 --> 00:09:00,440 Speaker 3: independent state. It recognizes Beijing. But there's real, I mean 125 00:09:00,480 --> 00:09:02,319 Speaker 3: they call it people to people links, but in the 126 00:09:02,400 --> 00:09:05,040 Speaker 3: Japanese Taiwan case, it's way more than that. There's I 127 00:09:05,080 --> 00:09:09,400 Speaker 3: mean society to society, political party to political party. Partly 128 00:09:09,480 --> 00:09:12,640 Speaker 3: because the Japanese ruled the place for fifty years. 129 00:09:15,920 --> 00:09:19,880 Speaker 1: Coming up, how Donald Trump fits in and what Australia 130 00:09:19,960 --> 00:09:37,160 Speaker 1: is supposed to be doing. The Australians published an opinion 131 00:09:37,200 --> 00:09:41,040 Speaker 1: piece by the former Japanese Ambassador to Australia, Shingo Yamagami, 132 00:09:41,080 --> 00:09:44,440 Speaker 1: in which he's very directly accusing Australia of not doing 133 00:09:44,520 --> 00:09:48,600 Speaker 1: enough to support Japan as it tries to assert itself 134 00:09:48,720 --> 00:09:51,880 Speaker 1: against China, particularly over this issue of Taiwan. This is 135 00:09:51,920 --> 00:09:55,720 Speaker 1: all very delicate, and the Chinese regard any kind of 136 00:09:55,800 --> 00:10:00,000 Speaker 1: mention of Taiwan as deeply provocative. What's Japan's kind of 137 00:10:00,280 --> 00:10:04,199 Speaker 1: endgame here? And how could Australia possibly assist without making 138 00:10:04,240 --> 00:10:05,720 Speaker 1: things kind of even more hot? 139 00:10:07,000 --> 00:10:11,160 Speaker 3: Yeah, well, I mean it's a very interesting contribution from 140 00:10:11,200 --> 00:10:13,719 Speaker 3: the former ambassador, and he's right that when he was 141 00:10:13,920 --> 00:10:17,040 Speaker 3: the Japan's ambassador to Australia, I mean, he was really 142 00:10:17,120 --> 00:10:20,880 Speaker 3: unusually vocal in his support for the Morrison government then 143 00:10:20,920 --> 00:10:23,800 Speaker 3: and for Australia as it was being coerced by China. 144 00:10:24,559 --> 00:10:27,160 Speaker 3: So he's saying, I mean, you could say, not unreasonably 145 00:10:27,600 --> 00:10:31,520 Speaker 3: Japan stood up for Australia. Where are you now, Beijing? 146 00:10:31,600 --> 00:10:33,920 Speaker 3: When it gets in these moods when it's being you know, 147 00:10:34,760 --> 00:10:38,840 Speaker 3: waging a campaign of vengeance, you get involved or support 148 00:10:39,160 --> 00:10:41,480 Speaker 3: in some ways that you're peril. Right, you can invite 149 00:10:41,520 --> 00:10:45,200 Speaker 3: that same they sort of extend these economic coercion campaigns 150 00:10:45,200 --> 00:10:47,880 Speaker 3: to others. I mean, I think, what's not helping Australia 151 00:10:47,920 --> 00:10:50,600 Speaker 3: or any other country? And this is the Americans, right, 152 00:10:50,760 --> 00:10:53,600 Speaker 3: Donald Trump, the American President, you know, one of the 153 00:10:53,640 --> 00:10:58,160 Speaker 3: few figures in the international system who's got the power 154 00:10:58,240 --> 00:11:01,560 Speaker 3: behind him to speak clearly to China on this kind 155 00:11:01,640 --> 00:11:05,680 Speaker 3: of thing. He said nothing publicly to support Japan or 156 00:11:05,720 --> 00:11:09,360 Speaker 3: even indicate any kind of support in this dispute. Far 157 00:11:09,440 --> 00:11:12,520 Speaker 3: from it, He's actually spoke decision paying now. Then he 158 00:11:12,600 --> 00:11:17,520 Speaker 3: spoke to Prime Minister Ta Keshi. In his conversation with 159 00:11:18,080 --> 00:11:20,480 Speaker 3: she on the readout after it, he didn't mention at 160 00:11:20,520 --> 00:11:25,320 Speaker 3: all any conversation about Japan or Taiwan. The Chinese then 161 00:11:25,400 --> 00:11:29,680 Speaker 3: released that Taiwan wasn't just in the phone call, it 162 00:11:29,800 --> 00:11:32,320 Speaker 3: was a dominant part of it. Took up almost half 163 00:11:32,360 --> 00:11:36,880 Speaker 3: of their conversation, according to the Chinese. And then after 164 00:11:36,960 --> 00:11:39,520 Speaker 3: the call with the Japanese Prime minister, the Japanese Prime 165 00:11:39,559 --> 00:11:42,320 Speaker 3: Minister came out and said she'd had that call and 166 00:11:42,360 --> 00:11:44,720 Speaker 3: gave a bit of an account of what they spoke about. 167 00:11:44,960 --> 00:11:48,160 Speaker 3: But Trump said almost nothing about it. What is clear 168 00:11:48,679 --> 00:11:53,240 Speaker 3: is there's no statement from the American president so far 169 00:11:53,360 --> 00:11:57,440 Speaker 3: to give the Japanese Prime minister public support. And that's 170 00:11:57,480 --> 00:11:59,760 Speaker 3: the world that you know. The Albanese government and all 171 00:11:59,800 --> 00:12:05,319 Speaker 3: love American allies have to operate with them. 172 00:12:05,320 --> 00:12:11,000 Speaker 1: Will Glasgow is The Australian's North Asia correspondent. You can 173 00:12:11,040 --> 00:12:14,840 Speaker 1: read all his reporting anytime at the Australian dot com 174 00:12:14,880 --> 00:12:15,360 Speaker 1: dot au