1 00:00:04,000 --> 00:00:06,840 Speaker 1: From the Australian. Here's what's on the front. I'm Claire Harvey. 2 00:00:06,920 --> 00:00:14,840 Speaker 1: It's Friday, June seven. Nine Entertainment chairman Peter Costello, the 3 00:00:14,880 --> 00:00:18,000 Speaker 1: former Federal Treasurer, has knocked a journalist to the ground 4 00:00:18,079 --> 00:00:19,120 Speaker 1: at Canberra Airport. 5 00:00:19,600 --> 00:00:22,239 Speaker 2: Mister Cassello, my name is Liam Mendez from The Australian. 6 00:00:22,680 --> 00:00:26,080 Speaker 1: The incident occurred when The Australians reporter Leam Mendes approached 7 00:00:26,120 --> 00:00:29,720 Speaker 1: Costello for comment on the crisis engulfing nine's chief executive 8 00:00:29,800 --> 00:00:35,000 Speaker 1: Mike Sneezebe over sexual harassment allegations against a former senior executive. 9 00:00:35,720 --> 00:00:39,519 Speaker 1: Costello barges towards Mendes and pushes him to the ground. 10 00:00:40,000 --> 00:00:44,160 Speaker 2: Why won't you support mister sneezebe publicly good? So well, 11 00:00:44,200 --> 00:00:50,839 Speaker 2: you've got to answer the questions, mister Castello don't and 12 00:00:50,840 --> 00:00:57,800 Speaker 2: you've just assaulted me. You've just pushed me. It's all 13 00:00:57,800 --> 00:00:59,400 Speaker 2: on camera, mister Cassello. 14 00:01:00,600 --> 00:01:04,440 Speaker 1: Costello has denied the incident was an assault, claiming Mendors 15 00:01:04,480 --> 00:01:05,680 Speaker 1: simply fell over. 16 00:01:06,640 --> 00:01:09,440 Speaker 2: Mister Costello, did you assault a journalist at Canbra Airport? 17 00:01:10,240 --> 00:01:13,520 Speaker 1: When questioned in Parliament House by journalists including the Australians, 18 00:01:13,600 --> 00:01:17,200 Speaker 1: Rhiann and down. Costello told them to be careful not 19 00:01:17,319 --> 00:01:17,880 Speaker 1: to fall. 20 00:01:18,280 --> 00:01:22,440 Speaker 2: Mister Costello, where you consider your position, Get in front 21 00:01:22,600 --> 00:01:23,960 Speaker 2: and I'll come and talk you all out. 22 00:01:24,240 --> 00:01:28,640 Speaker 3: Yeah, there's much ways you'll fall over your coup. When 23 00:01:28,680 --> 00:01:31,200 Speaker 3: I came to a Cambra airport, there was a reporter 24 00:01:31,520 --> 00:01:36,560 Speaker 3: walking backwards with his phone filming. As I walked past him. 25 00:01:36,680 --> 00:01:39,920 Speaker 3: He walked back into an advertising pack card and he 26 00:01:40,000 --> 00:01:43,800 Speaker 3: fell I did not strike him. If he's upset about that, 27 00:01:43,920 --> 00:01:47,000 Speaker 3: I'm sorry, but I did not strike him. And it 28 00:01:47,120 --> 00:01:49,920 Speaker 3: was a public place which I was entitled to walk through. 29 00:01:50,960 --> 00:01:53,600 Speaker 3: And as I said to you, he hit the advertising 30 00:01:53,720 --> 00:01:57,440 Speaker 3: balot he fell over. I'm sorry about that. I wish 31 00:01:57,520 --> 00:02:00,680 Speaker 3: that hadn't have happened. But you know this is I've 32 00:02:00,680 --> 00:02:01,840 Speaker 3: seen it happened a million times. 33 00:02:01,880 --> 00:02:05,200 Speaker 4: There's already speculation that this could put your chairmanship at risk. 34 00:02:05,400 --> 00:02:07,760 Speaker 5: What is your response to Rosa The. 35 00:02:07,760 --> 00:02:10,600 Speaker 3: Journalist said, you assaulted me and you loved and walked away. 36 00:02:12,120 --> 00:02:14,359 Speaker 1: You can watch the video and read what triggered the 37 00:02:14,480 --> 00:02:17,679 Speaker 1: encounter right now at the Australian dot com dot au. 38 00:02:21,160 --> 00:02:24,800 Speaker 1: The fourth episode of the Australian's latest investigative podcast series 39 00:02:24,880 --> 00:02:28,720 Speaker 1: is out today Bronwyn tells the story of missing lennox 40 00:02:28,760 --> 00:02:33,080 Speaker 1: Head mum Bronwyn Winfield, who disappeared from the idyllic surftown 41 00:02:33,400 --> 00:02:38,799 Speaker 1: in the early nineties. Today, Bromwin's creator, The Australian's Headley Thomas, 42 00:02:39,000 --> 00:02:42,560 Speaker 1: joins me with a big revelation in this new episode 43 00:02:42,960 --> 00:03:07,079 Speaker 1: Stay with Us. On May sixteenth, nineteen ninety three, thirty 44 00:03:07,080 --> 00:03:10,519 Speaker 1: one year old Bronwyn Winfield tucked her two little girls 45 00:03:10,560 --> 00:03:13,760 Speaker 1: into bed at the family home in lenox Head on 46 00:03:13,800 --> 00:03:18,440 Speaker 1: the New South Wales North Coast and vanished. Still there 47 00:03:18,480 --> 00:03:21,960 Speaker 1: are no answers, many of our listeners will know. The 48 00:03:22,000 --> 00:03:26,080 Speaker 1: Australian's National Chief correspondent Headley Thomas is trying to change 49 00:03:26,120 --> 00:03:31,079 Speaker 1: that in his new investigative podcast series simply called Bronwyn. 50 00:03:31,639 --> 00:03:34,280 Speaker 1: So far in this series, we've heard about Bronwyn's unhappy 51 00:03:34,280 --> 00:03:37,840 Speaker 1: marriage to John Winfield, who built the lenox Head house 52 00:03:38,120 --> 00:03:43,160 Speaker 1: Bronwyn described as a prison. These are Bromwin's diaries being 53 00:03:43,200 --> 00:03:46,800 Speaker 1: read by a voice actor. When we moved to lenox Head, 54 00:03:46,880 --> 00:03:49,960 Speaker 1: I was even more lonely. The house that was Bill 55 00:03:50,040 --> 00:03:55,560 Speaker 1: became John's castle and my prison. We've heard how Bronwyn 56 00:03:55,760 --> 00:03:59,400 Speaker 1: was seeking a divorce from John and custody of her daughters. 57 00:04:00,080 --> 00:04:03,840 Speaker 1: We've delved into her complex family history and the red herrings. 58 00:04:04,200 --> 00:04:08,440 Speaker 1: The Ment Police didn't conduct a thorough investigation until years 59 00:04:08,560 --> 00:04:12,960 Speaker 1: after Bronwyn had disappeared. We know a coroner recommended John 60 00:04:12,960 --> 00:04:17,160 Speaker 1: Winfield be prosecuted for her murder, and now in episode four, 61 00:04:17,200 --> 00:04:23,719 Speaker 1: we're examining who else knew what and when Headley. Since 62 00:04:23,800 --> 00:04:26,160 Speaker 1: we launched the podcast, one of the things you were 63 00:04:26,240 --> 00:04:28,200 Speaker 1: very keen to ensure that we did was to set 64 00:04:28,240 --> 00:04:31,640 Speaker 1: up a special email address where listeners could contact you. 65 00:04:32,200 --> 00:04:36,160 Speaker 1: That's Bronwyn at the Australian dot com dot au. We 66 00:04:36,279 --> 00:04:38,520 Speaker 1: share access to that mailbox and I can see you 67 00:04:38,560 --> 00:04:41,039 Speaker 1: in the reading and responding to the people who get 68 00:04:41,040 --> 00:04:44,360 Speaker 1: in touch. What's been the sense that you've got from 69 00:04:44,480 --> 00:04:47,240 Speaker 1: the audience and the people who are motivated to reach 70 00:04:47,279 --> 00:04:47,840 Speaker 1: out to you. 71 00:04:48,480 --> 00:04:51,640 Speaker 5: I get a range of reactions from people who knew 72 00:04:51,640 --> 00:04:54,800 Speaker 5: Bromwan and want to share anecdotes and memories of their 73 00:04:54,839 --> 00:04:59,600 Speaker 5: time with her, People who actually also knew Bromwan's children 74 00:05:00,200 --> 00:05:04,520 Speaker 5: and remembered them as babies and recall how exceptionally close 75 00:05:04,560 --> 00:05:07,960 Speaker 5: and devoted Brommin was to her girls. And also people 76 00:05:08,040 --> 00:05:11,680 Speaker 5: who do know something. Sometimes they don't want to be 77 00:05:11,720 --> 00:05:15,880 Speaker 5: interviewed themselves, but they're making suggestions to me about talking 78 00:05:15,920 --> 00:05:20,039 Speaker 5: to someone they know with information, and that's led to 79 00:05:20,240 --> 00:05:22,680 Speaker 5: a number of new chapters and new interviews that have 80 00:05:22,720 --> 00:05:25,920 Speaker 5: been part of the series even at this early stage. 81 00:05:26,800 --> 00:05:28,719 Speaker 1: One of the people who you've been in touch with 82 00:05:28,880 --> 00:05:33,000 Speaker 1: is John Winfield's former wife. We're calling her D, and 83 00:05:33,160 --> 00:05:36,240 Speaker 1: she's featured in an earlier episode of bromwin What was 84 00:05:36,320 --> 00:05:39,040 Speaker 1: D's account of being married to John Winfield? 85 00:05:39,839 --> 00:05:43,320 Speaker 5: D spoke to me about being a young woman married 86 00:05:43,400 --> 00:05:45,800 Speaker 5: to John, having fallen in love with him and been 87 00:05:46,120 --> 00:05:49,320 Speaker 5: involved with him in a relationship for several years before 88 00:05:49,360 --> 00:05:53,039 Speaker 5: they tied the knot, and then divorcing him after just 89 00:05:53,160 --> 00:05:57,320 Speaker 5: eighteen months of marriage, and D was pretty candid about 90 00:05:57,520 --> 00:06:00,160 Speaker 5: the problem at the heart of the relationship. She said 91 00:06:00,200 --> 00:06:06,400 Speaker 5: that John was very possessive, just always questioning her. When 92 00:06:06,440 --> 00:06:09,279 Speaker 5: they would walk down the street, when they would go 93 00:06:09,400 --> 00:06:12,720 Speaker 5: out somewhere together, she would be perhaps holding his hand, 94 00:06:12,720 --> 00:06:15,880 Speaker 5: they would be having what she thought was a nice outing, 95 00:06:16,040 --> 00:06:20,120 Speaker 5: but then she would be asked, why are you looking 96 00:06:20,160 --> 00:06:23,000 Speaker 5: at him? What do you see in that person? Why 97 00:06:23,000 --> 00:06:26,320 Speaker 5: were you staring at that guy? And she says, I wasn't. 98 00:06:27,120 --> 00:06:29,720 Speaker 5: After a while that became unbearable for her. She didn't 99 00:06:29,720 --> 00:06:33,920 Speaker 5: want to go on with the marriage, and they split up. Interestingly, 100 00:06:34,160 --> 00:06:37,760 Speaker 5: they had moved together to Lennox Head. They lived in 101 00:06:37,800 --> 00:06:41,880 Speaker 5: a caravan for some time in Sandstone Crescent, where they 102 00:06:41,880 --> 00:06:44,400 Speaker 5: had bought a block of land and were building a house. 103 00:06:44,560 --> 00:06:47,680 Speaker 5: This is the place that John has always loved. He's 104 00:06:47,760 --> 00:06:50,719 Speaker 5: wanted to live in Lenox and surf there. It's his 105 00:06:50,880 --> 00:06:53,800 Speaker 5: favorite beach break, and he believed that he was going 106 00:06:53,839 --> 00:06:58,200 Speaker 5: to live there with d But after they separated, she 107 00:06:58,320 --> 00:07:00,120 Speaker 5: had to go to court. There was a lot of 108 00:07:00,200 --> 00:07:03,120 Speaker 5: dispute because she said she was a good savior. She 109 00:07:03,160 --> 00:07:06,279 Speaker 5: had her own money. She had put money into the 110 00:07:06,320 --> 00:07:10,640 Speaker 5: relationship and into the property that they had been building together. 111 00:07:11,120 --> 00:07:14,160 Speaker 5: When it came time for them to part, and she 112 00:07:14,240 --> 00:07:16,000 Speaker 5: thought she would be able to leave with what she 113 00:07:16,080 --> 00:07:19,000 Speaker 5: had put in, he didn't want to give her anything, 114 00:07:19,080 --> 00:07:21,560 Speaker 5: and she said that she had to sue him to 115 00:07:21,600 --> 00:07:24,320 Speaker 5: get any money. And that's why when she reflects on 116 00:07:24,440 --> 00:07:30,120 Speaker 5: Bromwin's situation, she thinks about John's attachment to the first 117 00:07:30,160 --> 00:07:33,280 Speaker 5: house that he was building with her, just down the 118 00:07:33,360 --> 00:07:35,640 Speaker 5: road from where he would build a House with Bromwin 119 00:07:35,720 --> 00:07:36,679 Speaker 5: several years later. 120 00:07:40,360 --> 00:07:43,560 Speaker 1: Episode four of Bromwin features a snippet of the nineteen 121 00:07:43,600 --> 00:07:47,520 Speaker 1: eighty nine dark comedy Wore of the Roses. Kathleen Turner 122 00:07:47,560 --> 00:07:51,080 Speaker 1: and Michael Douglas's play a couple whose divorce turns bitter, 123 00:07:51,680 --> 00:07:54,760 Speaker 1: and at the center of the dispute is the marital home. 124 00:07:55,800 --> 00:07:57,119 Speaker 1: I've thought about this a lot. 125 00:07:58,280 --> 00:07:59,680 Speaker 4: I really don't want to be married to you. 126 00:07:59,680 --> 00:07:59,760 Speaker 1: And. 127 00:08:01,760 --> 00:08:03,679 Speaker 4: I may have let you have the house, but now 128 00:08:04,840 --> 00:08:09,520 Speaker 4: you'll never get it. You will never get that house. 129 00:08:11,120 --> 00:08:17,400 Speaker 4: Do you understand that you will never get that house? 130 00:08:18,880 --> 00:08:21,640 Speaker 1: And that's the movie that Murray Nolan brom Win, Winfield's 131 00:08:21,640 --> 00:08:24,480 Speaker 1: next door neighbor, was watching on the night of May sixteenth, 132 00:08:24,560 --> 00:08:27,280 Speaker 1: nineteen ninety three. He remembers that he was watching that 133 00:08:27,320 --> 00:08:30,360 Speaker 1: movie because something interrupted him. It was the sound of 134 00:08:30,400 --> 00:08:34,640 Speaker 1: the Winfields car leaving their driveway next door. Why was 135 00:08:34,679 --> 00:08:35,920 Speaker 1: that unusual for Murray. 136 00:08:36,559 --> 00:08:38,920 Speaker 5: Murray had just got out of hospital. He'd taken off 137 00:08:38,960 --> 00:08:43,079 Speaker 5: on a particularly gnarly wave and been dumped and hit 138 00:08:43,120 --> 00:08:47,080 Speaker 5: The reef, broke his back and, as his wife deb 139 00:08:47,120 --> 00:08:51,199 Speaker 5: told me, crushed his spine like a can. He was 140 00:08:51,240 --> 00:08:55,240 Speaker 5: at home at night on the sofa watching the television, 141 00:08:55,840 --> 00:08:59,720 Speaker 5: and he heard the squeaky brakes of the car that 142 00:08:59,800 --> 00:09:03,480 Speaker 5: he knew so well, he said, the distinctive noise of 143 00:09:03,920 --> 00:09:08,320 Speaker 5: the white Ford Falcons brakes as they squeaked as the 144 00:09:08,400 --> 00:09:12,440 Speaker 5: car eased down the sloping driveway always made him realize 145 00:09:12,440 --> 00:09:16,320 Speaker 5: when Bromin or John were leaving the house. But this night, 146 00:09:16,520 --> 00:09:20,559 Speaker 5: when he heard the noise and then he looked outside, 147 00:09:20,920 --> 00:09:24,120 Speaker 5: he could see that the car didn't have the headlights 148 00:09:24,160 --> 00:09:27,880 Speaker 5: on and the engine wasn't turned on either, so the 149 00:09:27,960 --> 00:09:32,400 Speaker 5: car was leaving silently. But as the car went from 150 00:09:32,440 --> 00:09:37,040 Speaker 5: the driveway and onto the bitchmen of the road, it scraped, 151 00:09:37,320 --> 00:09:41,640 Speaker 5: So there was something Murray's surmise, that was heavier than 152 00:09:41,760 --> 00:09:44,880 Speaker 5: usual in the boot of the car, and the boot 153 00:09:45,000 --> 00:09:48,040 Speaker 5: scraped the bitchermen and left a groove in the bitchmen. 154 00:09:48,920 --> 00:09:53,160 Speaker 5: And then the car rolled silently down the hill of 155 00:09:53,240 --> 00:09:56,319 Speaker 5: Sandstone Crescent until it got to the bottom, and the 156 00:09:56,320 --> 00:10:00,720 Speaker 5: car then stopped and the engine was turned the lights 157 00:10:00,760 --> 00:10:05,560 Speaker 5: were turned on, and the car drove away. So it 158 00:10:05,640 --> 00:10:09,600 Speaker 5: was a very unusual way for the car to leave 159 00:10:09,640 --> 00:10:12,440 Speaker 5: the house. Murray hadn't seen that before. 160 00:10:13,280 --> 00:10:15,480 Speaker 1: That was about twenty minutes to eleven pm. On that 161 00:10:15,559 --> 00:10:18,320 Speaker 1: Sunday night. We know that Bromwin was never seen again, 162 00:10:18,920 --> 00:10:21,240 Speaker 1: and one thing we don't know is whether she was 163 00:10:21,280 --> 00:10:24,440 Speaker 1: in that car when it departed. John Winfield has told 164 00:10:24,480 --> 00:10:26,520 Speaker 1: the police that he left the house that night with 165 00:10:26,600 --> 00:10:29,720 Speaker 1: the couple's two young daughters and drove to Sydney after 166 00:10:29,760 --> 00:10:32,120 Speaker 1: he says Bromwin left the house and got into a 167 00:10:32,160 --> 00:10:36,040 Speaker 1: car with someone he didn't know. What have police thought 168 00:10:36,120 --> 00:10:38,679 Speaker 1: over the years about what was going on inside that car? 169 00:10:38,800 --> 00:10:43,000 Speaker 5: Headley Well, The police theory is that Bromwin's body was 170 00:10:43,040 --> 00:10:48,120 Speaker 5: probably in the boot of that vehicle. John emphatically denies that, 171 00:10:48,320 --> 00:10:51,680 Speaker 5: and he says that Bromwin had left about an hour earlier, 172 00:10:52,400 --> 00:10:56,160 Speaker 5: and that was because a car driven by an unknown 173 00:10:56,200 --> 00:11:00,120 Speaker 5: person had pulled up and she'd got in it to 174 00:11:00,360 --> 00:11:03,440 Speaker 5: go away for a break of a few days. John 175 00:11:03,520 --> 00:11:06,640 Speaker 5: doesn't deny that he was driving the white Ford Falcon 176 00:11:06,679 --> 00:11:10,120 Speaker 5: at that time. In fact, he admits that he was 177 00:11:10,240 --> 00:11:13,880 Speaker 5: driving the vehicle because that's around the time he must 178 00:11:13,880 --> 00:11:17,640 Speaker 5: have left the house to go to Sydney. He left 179 00:11:17,640 --> 00:11:20,680 Speaker 5: in a hurry with his two girls at about twenty 180 00:11:20,679 --> 00:11:23,640 Speaker 5: to eleven and he bought fuel at a service station 181 00:11:23,800 --> 00:11:30,720 Speaker 5: in nearby Ballina, at eleven oh six pm. 182 00:11:30,800 --> 00:11:33,520 Speaker 1: Coming up, what it will take for the justice system 183 00:11:33,600 --> 00:11:38,280 Speaker 1: to revisit Bronwin Winfield's case. Subscribers to The Australian here 184 00:11:38,320 --> 00:11:41,640 Speaker 1: knew episodes of Bronwin first. They can also read articles 185 00:11:41,679 --> 00:11:44,120 Speaker 1: written about the case by Headley, as well as our 186 00:11:44,240 --> 00:11:48,240 Speaker 1: National crime correspondent David Murray and senior reporter Matthew Condon. 187 00:11:48,640 --> 00:11:53,560 Speaker 1: Plus subscribers get exclusive access to photos, maps, timelines and more. 188 00:11:54,040 --> 00:11:56,839 Speaker 1: Check us out at the Australian dot com dot a U. 189 00:11:57,400 --> 00:12:15,240 Speaker 1: We'll be back after this break. Bronwyn Winfield loved her 190 00:12:15,320 --> 00:12:19,840 Speaker 1: little girls, Crystal and Lauren. They're now grown women, but 191 00:12:19,880 --> 00:12:23,840 Speaker 1: they've chosen not to be interviewed for Hedley's investigation. There's 192 00:12:23,880 --> 00:12:26,600 Speaker 1: good reason for that. Lauren Winfield is close to her 193 00:12:26,600 --> 00:12:38,079 Speaker 1: father John. For Crystal, it's more complicated. You've spoken to 194 00:12:38,160 --> 00:12:41,520 Speaker 1: Christal in the course of researching and reporting this podcast, Headley, 195 00:12:41,559 --> 00:12:45,760 Speaker 1: but she hasn't been interviewed. We see in the family photos. 196 00:12:45,920 --> 00:12:49,120 Speaker 1: She's a blonde little girl, obviously with a very close 197 00:12:49,200 --> 00:12:53,440 Speaker 1: relationship with her mum, Bromwyn. Why hasn't Cristel wanted to 198 00:12:53,480 --> 00:12:54,880 Speaker 1: talk to you for this podcast? 199 00:12:56,000 --> 00:13:00,480 Speaker 5: Look, I think that question is one very personal to Crystal, 200 00:13:00,600 --> 00:13:05,160 Speaker 5: but from what I've understood in the conversations that We've had, 201 00:13:05,240 --> 00:13:07,920 Speaker 5: as well as conversations I've had with her mother's brother 202 00:13:08,000 --> 00:13:12,160 Speaker 5: and other members of Bromin's side of the family, Crystal 203 00:13:12,280 --> 00:13:17,080 Speaker 5: maintains a connection with her sister, Lauren, who was five 204 00:13:17,200 --> 00:13:21,560 Speaker 5: years old when Bromwyn disappeared. Kristal was only ten. She 205 00:13:21,640 --> 00:13:25,920 Speaker 5: also maintains a connection with her stepfather, John, she calls 206 00:13:26,040 --> 00:13:31,439 Speaker 5: John Dad, and Crystal's own biological father has been deceased 207 00:13:31,480 --> 00:13:35,319 Speaker 5: for some years. There's a strong view on Broman's side 208 00:13:35,360 --> 00:13:38,720 Speaker 5: of the family that Crystal is really torn and while 209 00:13:38,760 --> 00:13:42,120 Speaker 5: she wants answers, she does want to upset her stepfather. 210 00:13:42,600 --> 00:13:45,800 Speaker 5: She doesn't want to strain the relationship that she has 211 00:13:45,880 --> 00:13:46,480 Speaker 5: with Lauren. 212 00:13:50,600 --> 00:13:54,400 Speaker 1: Bronwyn winfield story bears a striking similarity to that of 213 00:13:54,480 --> 00:13:58,800 Speaker 1: Lynnette Simms, who vanished from Sydney's Northern Beaches in nineteen 214 00:13:58,840 --> 00:14:03,120 Speaker 1: eighty two. Lynn's husband, the former rugby league star Chris Dawson, 215 00:14:03,200 --> 00:14:06,360 Speaker 1: was convicted of her murder in twenty twenty, two, years 216 00:14:06,400 --> 00:14:10,560 Speaker 1: after the coroner, Karl Milvanovitch recommended Dawson be prosecuted for 217 00:14:10,600 --> 00:14:11,080 Speaker 1: the crime. 218 00:14:12,320 --> 00:14:14,840 Speaker 3: Christopher Michael Dawson on the charge to the donor about 219 00:14:14,880 --> 00:14:18,880 Speaker 3: eight January nineteen eighty two at Dayview or elsewhere in 220 00:14:18,920 --> 00:14:23,320 Speaker 3: the state of New South Wales. You did murder Lynette Dawson. 221 00:14:23,960 --> 00:14:26,160 Speaker 5: I find you guilty, mess of doubt. 222 00:14:28,320 --> 00:14:30,880 Speaker 1: Both stories fell through the cracks of a complex and 223 00:14:30,920 --> 00:14:36,480 Speaker 1: opaque criminal justice system. Dawson is now appealing his conviction, 224 00:14:36,640 --> 00:14:41,200 Speaker 1: which came after Headley's twenty eighteen podcast investigation The Teacher's Pet, 225 00:14:41,600 --> 00:14:45,200 Speaker 1: shed fresh light on what had happened four decades ago. 226 00:14:48,880 --> 00:14:51,960 Speaker 1: You always go into these podcast investigations Heady with the 227 00:14:52,040 --> 00:14:56,280 Speaker 1: goal of getting some answers potentially solving a crime. As 228 00:14:56,320 --> 00:14:58,800 Speaker 1: I said, you're getting contacted by people who knew Bromwin 229 00:14:58,960 --> 00:15:02,120 Speaker 1: via that email Addre Bromwin at the Australian dot com 230 00:15:02,160 --> 00:15:06,080 Speaker 1: dot what's needed for this case to progress beyond where 231 00:15:06,080 --> 00:15:09,120 Speaker 1: it is now, which is the DPP in New South 232 00:15:09,120 --> 00:15:12,239 Speaker 1: Wales declining to prosecute John Winfield. 233 00:15:12,920 --> 00:15:17,400 Speaker 5: I think all of these cold cases always require fresh 234 00:15:17,560 --> 00:15:20,800 Speaker 5: sets of eyes to review them, and that goes for 235 00:15:21,160 --> 00:15:24,440 Speaker 5: the office of the DPP as well. There's a lot 236 00:15:24,480 --> 00:15:26,760 Speaker 5: to be critical of the police about in this case 237 00:15:26,840 --> 00:15:30,960 Speaker 5: because for the first five years they really did a 238 00:15:31,200 --> 00:15:34,600 Speaker 5: terrible job and failed to act on a lot of 239 00:15:35,440 --> 00:15:40,440 Speaker 5: red flags suggesting that Bromwin would not have voluntarily just 240 00:15:40,560 --> 00:15:44,520 Speaker 5: abandoned her children, her house, her job, her friends and 241 00:15:44,640 --> 00:15:49,320 Speaker 5: home to start some new life. That wasn't plausible to 242 00:15:49,440 --> 00:15:52,920 Speaker 5: people who knew Bromwan back then, and it looks much 243 00:15:53,040 --> 00:15:56,080 Speaker 5: less plausible now in the context of a relationship that 244 00:15:56,200 --> 00:15:59,760 Speaker 5: was falling apart at that time. And the police, when 245 00:15:59,760 --> 00:16:02,640 Speaker 5: they came on board, did do a much more thorough 246 00:16:02,760 --> 00:16:06,640 Speaker 5: job with this case and took it to a coronial proceeding, 247 00:16:06,680 --> 00:16:09,120 Speaker 5: and then there was a finding by a coroner, and 248 00:16:09,160 --> 00:16:12,720 Speaker 5: then there was subsequent investigations by police. While all of 249 00:16:12,760 --> 00:16:16,560 Speaker 5: that was going on, the DPP declined to prosecute. But 250 00:16:16,640 --> 00:16:19,480 Speaker 5: what we don't know in all of these sorts of 251 00:16:19,560 --> 00:16:25,040 Speaker 5: considerations is whether the DPP has made its decision correctly, 252 00:16:25,640 --> 00:16:29,200 Speaker 5: whether it's made its decision based on all the information 253 00:16:30,000 --> 00:16:33,920 Speaker 5: and understanding of the case that they could possibly have, 254 00:16:34,640 --> 00:16:38,800 Speaker 5: or whether the decision was made in error. And the 255 00:16:38,840 --> 00:16:43,000 Speaker 5: reason we don't know is because that process is always concealed. 256 00:16:43,240 --> 00:16:47,720 Speaker 5: It's an opaque process. It's not transparent. There isn't any 257 00:16:47,840 --> 00:16:52,600 Speaker 5: way for victims or for police to properly understand why 258 00:16:52,720 --> 00:16:56,480 Speaker 5: apart from the blanket statement of insufficient evidence, these cases 259 00:16:56,520 --> 00:17:01,360 Speaker 5: don't run. Now with the benefit of hindsight looking at 260 00:17:01,520 --> 00:17:04,960 Speaker 5: all of the statements and evidence and new evidence that's 261 00:17:05,200 --> 00:17:08,639 Speaker 5: available that the DPP was probably not aware of at 262 00:17:08,640 --> 00:17:11,800 Speaker 5: the time. It's the kind of case that you think, well, 263 00:17:12,280 --> 00:17:16,000 Speaker 5: is someone considering it again and looking and wondering whether 264 00:17:16,520 --> 00:17:20,720 Speaker 5: this could be another case like Lynn's case involving her husband, 265 00:17:20,800 --> 00:17:23,960 Speaker 5: Chris Dawson, which should have been prosecuted way back in 266 00:17:24,000 --> 00:17:28,080 Speaker 5: the eighties or nineties, and when it was properly considered 267 00:17:28,119 --> 00:17:31,560 Speaker 5: again in twenty twenty two, it led to a prosecution. 268 00:17:44,960 --> 00:17:48,399 Speaker 1: Hilly Thomas is the Australian's National Chief correspondent and the 269 00:17:48,480 --> 00:17:52,320 Speaker 1: creator of the Bronwyn Podcast. Episode four is live for 270 00:17:52,400 --> 00:18:08,560 Speaker 1: subscribers now at bronwynpodcast dot com. That's bronwynpodcast dot com. 271 00:18:08,720 --> 00:18:10,600 Speaker 1: Thanks for joining us on the front this week. Our 272 00:18:10,640 --> 00:18:14,480 Speaker 1: team is Kristen Amier, Joshua Burton, Leott Sammaglue, Jasper League, 273 00:18:14,480 --> 00:18:18,600 Speaker 1: Tiffany Demac, Matthew Condon and me Claire Harvey.