WEBVTT - Barnaby’s bombshell: what Joyce is really thinking 

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<v Speaker 1>From The Australian. Here's what's on the front. I'm Claire Harvey.

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<v Speaker 1>It's Friday, November twenty eight, twenty twenty five. The Australian

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<v Speaker 1>Defense Force will have to rely on an aging, vulnerable

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<v Speaker 1>commercial satellite for battlefield communications for up to eight years

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<v Speaker 1>after the acting of a planned seven billion dollar system

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<v Speaker 1>in a cost cutting measure. Experts say the intelsat Is

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<v Speaker 1>twenty two satellite system is no longer fit for purpose

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<v Speaker 1>and risks being jammed in an electronic warfare attack. A

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<v Speaker 1>concerted push by Muslim groups and the Australian Human Rights

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<v Speaker 1>Commission to remove religion as a motivation for terrorist acts

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<v Speaker 1>has angered Jewish bodies and legal experts, who warn the

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<v Speaker 1>move will underline intelligence work while leaving communities exposed to attacks.

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<v Speaker 1>Fifteen Muslim groups have made a submission to a legislative

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<v Speaker 1>review say the current laws marginalize their community. One of

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<v Speaker 1>Australia's best known and most colorful politicians, Barnaby Joyce, is

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<v Speaker 1>quitting the National Party and maybe going to Pauline Hanson's

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<v Speaker 1>One Nation at some time in the future. For now,

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<v Speaker 1>he'll sit on the cross benches as an independent in

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<v Speaker 1>the House of representatives. Sarah Son joins me in a moment.

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<v Speaker 1>Sarah Eison is a senior political journalist in the Australians

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<v Speaker 1>Federal Parliamentary Press Gallery Bureau. Sarah, I can't help myself

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<v Speaker 1>whenever I hear the name Barnaby Joyce. I hear a

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<v Speaker 1>little group of girls seeing Barnaby Joyce in the tune

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<v Speaker 1>of Chattanooga Chu Chu from the Sewan macaulif Skich show

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<v Speaker 1>mad as Hell is Barnaby Joyce. Barnaby is an intriguing

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<v Speaker 1>character in Australian politics, isn't he he is?

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<v Speaker 2>I think you have that, which is what comes to mind.

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<v Speaker 2>What I always have that comes to mind is when

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<v Speaker 2>Barnaby became leader last time, and he's done that a

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<v Speaker 2>few times. I was at the press conference. I was

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<v Speaker 2>a very new journalist in Parliament and I got my

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<v Speaker 2>question and I asked him, you know, Barnaby, you're the

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<v Speaker 2>leader again. How long have you been planning this? And

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<v Speaker 2>of course we've been writing about this for days or weeks,

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<v Speaker 2>about the speculation. And Barnaby looks into my eyes and

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<v Speaker 2>no word of a lie on the record. His real

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<v Speaker 2>comment was, well, Sarah, if I knew this was going

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<v Speaker 2>to happen today, I would have brought my hat. That

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<v Speaker 2>gave me an insight very early on about exactly the

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<v Speaker 2>kind of character of this man, the fact that in

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<v Speaker 2>questions and in so much else in life and politics,

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<v Speaker 2>he does things very differently, and he is a brand

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<v Speaker 2>and a man unto himself.

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<v Speaker 1>I first interviewed Barnaby Joyce when he was a News senator.

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<v Speaker 1>He'd been elected as a Queensland senator actually, and he

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<v Speaker 1>was famously a Queenslander back then, and I was set

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<v Speaker 1>up to interview him, and he'd spoken somewhere about how

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<v Speaker 1>he loves swimming in the surf and that was something

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<v Speaker 1>he did every morning. And I said to him on

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<v Speaker 1>the phone setting up this interview, but you're going to

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<v Speaker 1>have to get in the surf for us, and we're

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<v Speaker 1>going to take some photos of you swimming. And he said, okay,

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<v Speaker 1>but only if you get into so as is the

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<v Speaker 1>life of a Genno, I found myself at some country

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<v Speaker 1>airport buying whatever swimsuit they had in the gift shop,

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<v Speaker 1>so and I had to get into water with Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>The last time I had a very long interview with

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<v Speaker 2>Barnaby Claire was for a really big piece on his

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<v Speaker 2>battle with prostate cancer and the fact he'd gotten his

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<v Speaker 2>prostate removed. And it was a great piece. It was informative,

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<v Speaker 2>it was personal, but still there were certain moments that

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<v Speaker 2>left things to be desired. I asked him how life

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<v Speaker 2>is now, and he kind of gave me this look

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<v Speaker 2>and he said, let's just say some things don't work

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<v Speaker 2>like they used to.

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<v Speaker 1>I think those stories will tell us really the same

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<v Speaker 1>thing that he's very good at wrong footing you, Barnaby Joyce.

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<v Speaker 1>He very much manages to keep his feet by ensuring

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<v Speaker 1>that he's opponent, whether it's a journalist or a political opponent,

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<v Speaker 1>it's never quite sure what he's going to do or

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<v Speaker 1>say next. Of course, in twenty thirteen he transferred to

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<v Speaker 1>the House of Representatives, representing the seat of New England,

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<v Speaker 1>which is of course in New South Wales, and then

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<v Speaker 1>spend a lot of years in and around the leadership

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<v Speaker 1>of the National Party. He's now leaving the NATS and

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<v Speaker 1>becoming an independent.

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<v Speaker 2>So after thirty years with the National Party, I am

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<v Speaker 2>resigning from the party and that really leads me with

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<v Speaker 2>the heavy heart, and I apologize for all the hurt

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<v Speaker 2>that that will cause other people.

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<v Speaker 1>I really do Joyce says he might join One Nation

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<v Speaker 1>in the future. I haven't made that decision yet. I've

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<v Speaker 1>made a decisions too. Well, that's I don't know I've

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<v Speaker 1>made that decision. He'll be one of eleven independents. There are,

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<v Speaker 1>of course, ninety four seats held by the Australian Labor

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<v Speaker 1>Party and forty three by the opposition. What's the point

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<v Speaker 1>of being an independent in that parliament? The government can

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<v Speaker 1>get its legislation through without a single independent vote.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean you could say the same thing about

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<v Speaker 2>if he'd joined One Nation. Obviously he wants to join

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<v Speaker 2>One Nation at the next election on the Senate ticket.

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<v Speaker 2>His option outside of becoming an independent would have been

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<v Speaker 2>to be in One Nation's MP right, and the same

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<v Speaker 2>thing as what you're saying, what's the point would be

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<v Speaker 2>a similar question. And I think the reason he's done

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<v Speaker 2>this is just he's really had enough and regardless of

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<v Speaker 2>the timing and maybe the impact he could have within

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<v Speaker 2>the NATS and the coalition, he's over it and he

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<v Speaker 2>wanted to defect.

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<v Speaker 1>Pauline Hanson has been aggressively courting Barnaby Joyce. What would

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<v Speaker 1>she see in him?

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, he is a firebrand politician. He has a brand,

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<v Speaker 2>and that brand on pretty much every point. Maybe not

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<v Speaker 2>some social policies, but points that matter, particularly climate change.

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<v Speaker 2>Those views of his that he's very loud about, I

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<v Speaker 2>mean they align with herbs. Barnaby is someone that people

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<v Speaker 2>know his name, just like people know who Pauline Hanson is.

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<v Speaker 1>Barnaby I suspect would want to be leader. He's a

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<v Speaker 1>bit of a natural leader. I think he likes to

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<v Speaker 1>be listened to. It's going to be difficult to have

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<v Speaker 1>him in the room but not have him be the boss,

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<v Speaker 1>isn't it.

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<v Speaker 2>I think people think different things about this. You're right,

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<v Speaker 2>Barnaby likes to be the leader, but he is getting on.

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<v Speaker 2>I spoke to Barnaby earlier this year for a big

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<v Speaker 2>interview with The Australian about his battle with prostate cancer

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<v Speaker 2>and how that had really brought things home for him

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<v Speaker 2>when it came to his family and mortality and so on.

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<v Speaker 2>So to say that he will definitely have leadership ambitions,

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<v Speaker 2>I don't think we can be sure of that necessarily. Also,

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<v Speaker 2>One Nation is so different to not just the NATS

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<v Speaker 2>but the Coalition. I feel like he's just going to

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<v Speaker 2>be given such free reign and so much prominence with

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<v Speaker 2>this party, almost a pseudo leader in a way. He'll

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<v Speaker 2>be up all the time. I mean, I think he

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<v Speaker 2>could almost be leader and everything, but name, to be honest.

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<v Speaker 1>Coming up, wouldn't it have been better to quit politics

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<v Speaker 1>altogether and hand the seat back to the Nats. There's

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<v Speaker 1>a school of thought that if you're a member of

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<v Speaker 1>the House of Representatives, you have won your seat as yourself,

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<v Speaker 1>but also as a representative of your party. He was

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<v Speaker 1>elected as a National's MP. Some might argue that the

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<v Speaker 1>right thing to do if you decide you don't want

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<v Speaker 1>to be in your party anymore is to resign your

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<v Speaker 1>seat and to let a by election happen, give the

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<v Speaker 1>party an opportunity to put someone else in and win

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<v Speaker 1>it back. Why is Barnaby Joyce not doing that.

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<v Speaker 2>Because he wants to stay on in Parliament. I mean,

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<v Speaker 2>obviously he wants to write the next election on the

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<v Speaker 2>Senate ticket of One Nation and just being out of

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<v Speaker 2>the game for all of that time. I don't think

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<v Speaker 2>that's necessarily that smart. The thing is, though, Barnaby also

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<v Speaker 2>views the way that he's gone about all of this

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<v Speaker 2>is actually in pretty good faith. As much as a

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<v Speaker 2>lot of his colleagues disagree. So I mean, we can

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<v Speaker 2>point out a heap of people who defected from their

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<v Speaker 2>party and sat as an independent with no intention of

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<v Speaker 2>giving the seat back. Like you can think of Andrew

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<v Speaker 2>g who was a National as well. You could think

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<v Speaker 2>of maybe David Van or Fatima Payment. That was something

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<v Speaker 2>where they said, oh it doesn't matter, I want this

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<v Speaker 2>place with a party, I want to hold it by myself.

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<v Speaker 2>Barnaby doesn't want to do that. Like, yes, he is

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<v Speaker 2>going to keep sitting in the New England seat for now,

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<v Speaker 2>but his long term plan, which has always been pretty clear,

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<v Speaker 2>is that he would run on the Senate tickt of

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<v Speaker 2>one Nation, essentially handing New England back to the Nationals

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<v Speaker 2>with what he says is a pretty big kitty in

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<v Speaker 2>terms of how much fundraising he does and so on.

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<v Speaker 2>So again, in Barnaby's view, he has done the right thing.

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<v Speaker 1>There's no doubt Barnaby Joyce is talented and articulate and intelligent,

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<v Speaker 1>but he's also accident prone. He tends to attract scandals.

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<v Speaker 1>Do you think the Nats are glad to see the

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<v Speaker 1>back of him?

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<v Speaker 2>Like maybe yes and no, I suppose yes. In terms

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<v Speaker 2>of scandals yes. In terms of the Nats say, no,

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<v Speaker 2>one can tell Barnaby what to do. That's what a

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<v Speaker 2>lot of his colleagues say when it comes to this

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<v Speaker 2>latest affection. They said, we could beg and play with him,

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<v Speaker 2>but if he has decided he's going to go, he's

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<v Speaker 2>going to go.

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<v Speaker 1>No.

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<v Speaker 2>In terms of his fundraising capacity, he is one of

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<v Speaker 2>the top fundraisers of the Nationals outside of Matt Canavan

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<v Speaker 2>and Bridget McKenzie and formerly just Enterprise. He's now with

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<v Speaker 2>the Liberals and no in terms of his brand, if

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<v Speaker 2>you think of the Nationals, he's probably a name that

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<v Speaker 2>comes to mind straight away and that'll all go with

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<v Speaker 2>Barnaby and what that will mean for the party and

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<v Speaker 2>it's resourcing financially and in how much people know about

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<v Speaker 2>the Nats talk about the Nets. That's a question and

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<v Speaker 2>I think it is a loss in some ways to

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<v Speaker 2>the party.

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<v Speaker 1>Sarah Eisen is a senior political reporter with The Australian

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<v Speaker 1>in Canberra. You can check out all our reporting and

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<v Speaker 1>analysis right now at Beaustralian dot com dot au.