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Speaker 1: Thanks so much for listening to the show. If this

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Speaker 1: is your first time here, here's something you may not

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Speaker 1: know about me.

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Speaker 2: I'm a very curious person. So when I sometimes do things.

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Speaker 1: Which impact me and those around me in a negative way,

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Speaker 1: I try to a stop doing those things and be

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Speaker 1: try to learn as much as I can about which

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Speaker 1: parts of my brain are involved with that, and hopefully

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Speaker 1: you use those parts of my brain to help me

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Speaker 1: figure out something else to do in that situation. Now,

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Speaker 1: my producer Adam asked me to do an episode about

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Speaker 1: some of the books that I've used to learn about

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Speaker 1: the way the brains work and why people do things

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Speaker 1: in certain situations. I've got seven books coming up for

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Speaker 1: you today right after this. Thanks so much for listening

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Speaker 1: to the show. This is better than yesterday, bringing you

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Speaker 1: useful to and useful conversations to make your day today

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Speaker 1: better than yesterday, every episode since seven and thirteen. My

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Speaker 1: name's Oshi Ginsberg. I'm a TV presenter. I'm a best

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Speaker 1: selling author. I'm an award winning documentary maker. I produce

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Speaker 1: live shows. I'm a person who's standing here in very

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Speaker 1: cozy socks, and I'm grateful for your here on the

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Speaker 1: subject of live shows. The next story Club event is

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Speaker 1: happening on the sixth of July in Merrickville. We've already

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Speaker 1: locked in Marley Silver, Merrick Watts, and Phil O'Neil at

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Speaker 1: the time of this recording. Get on story Club Live

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Speaker 1: if you want to get your tickets. This one will

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Speaker 1: absolutely pack out, so do not wait around for that. Look,

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Speaker 1: here are seven books that I consider fundamental if you

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Speaker 1: want to be thinking about thinking. It's by no means

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Speaker 1: an exhaustive list. There's probably many more that I've missed

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Speaker 1: out on. There's certainly many more that I wanted to

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Speaker 1: put on this list, and it won't be the last

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Speaker 1: time I do this. However, if I were to consider

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Speaker 1: which books have really shaped the way that I think

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Speaker 1: about thinking and why people are the way they are

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Speaker 1: are these books have been incredibly influential upon me. So

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Speaker 1: let's go first up, Deep Survival by Lawrence Gonzales. I

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Speaker 1: will read this book easily one time a year, and

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Speaker 1: I've done that for over fifteen years now. This book

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Speaker 1: is an absolute masterclass in understanding why some people survive

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Speaker 1: seemingly impossible situations while others with similar skills, similar equipment,

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Speaker 1: and possibly more skills and more equipment simply don't survive

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Speaker 1: those situations. This book is about what happens to our

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Speaker 1: brains in a survival situation. In this book, Lawrence Gonzalez

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Speaker 1: uses real life incidents. I'm talking terrible accidents, but also

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Speaker 1: miraculous rescues, and using those helps us learn that we

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Speaker 1: can understand a lot more about how people respond in

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Speaker 1: high stakes moments. Gonzales really dives into these gripping and

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Speaker 1: quite terrifying real life survival stories, everything from playing crashes

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Speaker 1: way out in the wilderness to mountaineering accidents, and meticulously

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Speaker 1: dissects the psychological and physiological factors that are at play.

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Speaker 1: Gonzalez explores how our brains react under situations of extreme stress,

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Speaker 1: and in those situations he shows time and again how

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Speaker 1: that extreme stress often leads to predictable errors, but also

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Speaker 1: using those examples, describes how certain mindsets and being prepared

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Speaker 1: in a particular way can dramatically increase our chances of survival.

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Speaker 1: It's less about brute strength, It's more about the mental

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Speaker 1: resilience and the ability to adapt. The main thing that

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Speaker 1: I took from Deep Survival is that when the shit

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Speaker 1: hits the fan, whether it's being caught in a rip

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Speaker 1: or going through a rough patch at work, pay attention

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Speaker 1: to your body signals to your best to slow down.

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Speaker 2: Survival is not about brute force. It's about mindfulness. Also.

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Speaker 1: Deep survival is the reason that if you ever sit

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Speaker 1: next to me on a plane, you'll notice that we

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Speaker 1: will always be within five rows of an exit. Right

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Speaker 1: next up, I talk about this next book all the

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Speaker 1: time on this show. It's called The Art of Possibility.

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Speaker 1: It's by Rosamun Stone Xander and Benjamin Xander. So the

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Speaker 1: co writers of this book are a family therapist and

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Speaker 1: a renowned orchestral conductor. And it's a truly unique exploration

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Speaker 1: of how our perspective shapes our reality, using real world

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Speaker 1: stories of managing the unique personalities which come together in

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Speaker 1: a world around youth orchestra, very high stake stuff. This

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Speaker 1: book invites us to shift from a world of scarcity,

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Speaker 1: the idea of what can I get, to one of possibility,

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Speaker 1: what can I contribute? When I went to business school

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Speaker 1: in Amsterdam a while ago, now this book is one

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Speaker 1: of the books which was required reading before I started

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Speaker 1: my core and it fundamentally transformed the way that I

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Speaker 1: deal with adversity. There's a simple tool that I'll share

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Speaker 1: with you right now, which the Xanders offer. And this

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Speaker 1: tool has helped me too many times to count. And

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Speaker 1: that is when everything is falling apart, when things are

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Speaker 1: just really just falling a bit, so you can't imagine

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Speaker 1: how it.

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Speaker 2: Could get any worse.

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Speaker 1: If you throw your hands in the air and gleefully squeal,

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Speaker 1: how fascinating. No matter how bad it feels, immediately you're

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Speaker 1: presented with an opportunity to choose a different possibility as

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Speaker 1: to what happens next. Now, at first it seemed a

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Speaker 1: bit naff, but then it started working, and it's worked

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Speaker 1: too many times to be bunk them. And that's just

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Speaker 1: one of the twelve practices that the Zanders offer in

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Speaker 1: this book, a book which can truly transform personal and professionalize.

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Speaker 1: I don't know about you, but I was somewhat raised

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Speaker 1: in a mindset of scarcity and competition.

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Speaker 2: Well, in this book they offer.

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Speaker 1: An alternative set of abundance and collaboration, seeing possibilities where

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Speaker 1: others see limitations. The big takeaway from the Art of

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Speaker 1: Possibility for me would be that life's not just about

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Speaker 1: getting through the notes on the page. When you're playing

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Speaker 1: right it's about playing those notes and taking what you've

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Speaker 1: been given, but using that stuff to create something new

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Speaker 1: and something wonderful.

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Speaker 2: Next up, it's a book about habit.

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Speaker 1: Long before there was James Clear, there was Charles Dewhig.

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Speaker 1: The Power of Habit was the first book which for

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Speaker 1: me unlocked that the tendency my brain can have for repetition,

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Speaker 1: compulsion and rumination could actually be channeled towards something positive.

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Speaker 1: Doing breaks down habits and the way they work, and

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Speaker 1: doing that was really it was like getting cheat codes

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Speaker 1: for my brain. First up, he talks about the habit

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Speaker 1: loop Q routine reward and then shows how understanding this

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Speaker 1: loop is the keys to not only changing bad habits,

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Speaker 1: but also forming new habits which actually align with your

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Speaker 1: goals and where you want to end up. Now, that's

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Speaker 1: also pretty interesting stuff because he doesn't only cover things

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Speaker 1: like boding your nails or breaking the habit of demolishing

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Speaker 1: a pack of Timtams at three PM. He also goes

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Speaker 1: into how marketers use habits to sell products, like how

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Speaker 1: Procter and Gamble used habit research to turn for Breeze,

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Speaker 1: which had launched and was pretty much a flop. Turning

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Speaker 1: for breeze from that into an all conquering under the

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Speaker 1: sink staple right around the world, and how habits adopted

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Speaker 1: across a whole workforce were used to make a massive workplace,

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Speaker 1: huge foundry like Alcoa much much safer.

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Speaker 2: This book is a look.

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Speaker 1: At how a seemingly small change can make a much

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Speaker 1: larger ripple effect. Habit shape who we are more than

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Speaker 1: we would like to admit. And the biggest thing that

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Speaker 1: I got from this book was that to change habit,

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Speaker 1: you can keep the same cue and the reward, but

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Speaker 1: you swap in a new routine, and that way you're

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Speaker 1: not stuck or led by something that you can't control.

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Speaker 1: You're actually working out that you're programmable and if you want,

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Speaker 1: you can program yourself to achieve some pretty magnificent things.

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Speaker 1: But understanding how we can get stuck in a bad

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Speaker 1: habit involves understanding the way that our brains work with reward,

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Speaker 1: and that is where this next book comes in. The

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Speaker 1: Molecule of More by Daniel Lieberman and Michael E. Long

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Speaker 1: is an absolutely mind bending journey into the world of dopamine.

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Speaker 1: This single neurotransmitter which is produced in your brain and

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Speaker 1: my brain and the brains of everybody. We know. It's

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Speaker 1: often associated with pleasure, but that really under sells what

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Speaker 1: dopamine is to us as humans. I would argue that

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Speaker 1: the presence of dopamine and the way that we think

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Speaker 1: is the reason that we as humans have taken over

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Speaker 1: the planet. Dopamine is the molecule of more. It drives

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Speaker 1: our desires, our pursuits, our goals, and our motivation. Think

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Speaker 1: of the difference between liking something and wanting something. Which

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Speaker 1: one's going to drive you to action, Which one is

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Speaker 1: going to make you pick up the phone and call

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Speaker 1: that person you want to go on a date with,

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Speaker 1: which one is going to get you out of bed

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Speaker 1: and get you the gym every day? Which one is

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Speaker 1: going to click that picture and buy that thing. There's

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Speaker 1: a very big difference in what happens in our brain

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Speaker 1: between liking something and wanting something, and it's all about

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Speaker 1: the dopamine. I absolutely loved reading about how dopamine impacts

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Speaker 1: everything from love and addiction to even creativity and our

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Speaker 1: societal aspirations. It also helped me understand a lot more

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Speaker 1: about my own experience with addiction and help me integrate

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Speaker 1: some practices into my life that I guess helped me

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Speaker 1: fall in love in a way with training and training

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Speaker 1: every day changing the way that I think about it

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Speaker 1: so that I don't train because I feel have to

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Speaker 1: and it's a pinnish and h I trained because I

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Speaker 1: want to and I can't wait to do it, and

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Speaker 1: I use techniques or found in this book to help

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Speaker 1: me get to that spot. It's a fascinating look into

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Speaker 1: how our brain chemistry shapes our experiences and our drive

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Speaker 1: to achieve. And that's before you talk about how dopamine

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Speaker 1: influences us as a species. There's a whole section in

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Speaker 1: this book which absolutely blew my mind about one specific

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Speaker 1: gene expression related to the level of dopamine receptors and

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Speaker 1: how that shows up in people and is a significant

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Speaker 1: factor in how we as humans just kept walking from

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Speaker 1: the plains of Africa, across Europe and all the way

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Speaker 1: down to the bottom tip of South America. By measuring

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Speaker 1: the levels of this gene receptor in indigenous populations of

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Speaker 1: these countries, researchers have shown that this particular receptor was

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Speaker 1: blunted to the effect of dopamine so these people for

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Speaker 1: them to get to normal, the feeling of oh yeah,

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Speaker 1: this is an okay amount of excitement and stimulation. They

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Speaker 1: needed to be a lot more novelty. So for people

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Speaker 1: who were going, oh, we've come here and this is

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Speaker 1: a great place to settle down and we'll build our

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Speaker 1: society here, there was a small cohort of every community going, yeah,

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Speaker 1: this is nice, but I don't know what's over that

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Speaker 1: hill over there.

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Speaker 2: They went off trying to find.

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Speaker 1: They went seeking for things that were new and interesting

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Speaker 1: to get them up to that feeling of normalcy. Now,

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Speaker 1: I'm not saying that you and I are going to

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Speaker 1: migrate across the world by foot, but it's been enormously

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Speaker 1: helpful understanding how dopamine affects me, and reading this book

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Speaker 1: really helped me do that. Dopamine is less about immediate pleasure.

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Speaker 1: It's more about the pursuit of novelty and future rewards,

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Speaker 1: and it profoundly influences our drive, our creativity, and this

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Speaker 1: quest for more. The book is fascinating. It really helped

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Speaker 1: me understand everything from how I eat to how I

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Speaker 1: how I shop. It's a brilliant, brilliant book. We do

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Speaker 1: have to take a quick break. I'll be back with

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Speaker 1: three more books, including one written by a person who

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Speaker 1: is part human, part wizard, and is a profound instruction

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Speaker 1: manual that I wish I had when I was a

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Speaker 1: younger man.

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Speaker 2: Thanks so much for being with me today.

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Speaker 1: I'm going through seven books which I think about when

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Speaker 1: I think about thinking. Book number five is Emotional Agility

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Speaker 1: by Susan David, originally from South Africa, now somewhere between

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Speaker 1: being a psychologist at Harvard and living in Melbourne. Susan

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Speaker 1: David has been a guest on this podcast twice now.

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Speaker 1: She's an incredible human being. And Susan David has this

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Speaker 1: line from this book Emotional Agility, which I quote all

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Speaker 1: the time. Uncomfortable feelings are the price of admission to

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Speaker 1: a meaningful life. Susan's concept of emotional agility, It's not

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Speaker 1: about suppressing your emotions or always being positive. It's that

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Speaker 1: it's about acknowledging your thoughts and feelings, even the difficult ones,

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Speaker 1: and then moving through them constructively. She talks about how

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Speaker 1: true resilience comes from being able to face our inner

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Speaker 1: experiences with curiosity and compassion, rather than getting hooked by

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Speaker 1: them or trying to ignore them. I found this book

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Speaker 1: incredibly useful because it provides practical strategies for identifying emotional patterns,

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Speaker 1: stepping back from judgment of ourselves and others, and then

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Speaker 1: aligning our actions with our values even when.

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Speaker 2: We feel uncomfortable. This book isn't about controlling your emotions.

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Speaker 1: Rather, it's about accepting them and then choosing how you

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Speaker 1: respond and allowing you to move forward authentically. And if

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Speaker 1: some of that sounds like familiar territory, you'd be right,

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Speaker 1: because this particular kind of psychology is something that really

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Speaker 1: helped me in the past, and that experience was the

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Speaker 1: inspiration for what was behind book number six, which is

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Speaker 1: so What Now What? By Osha Ginsburg and illustrated by

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Speaker 1: Campbell Walker.

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Speaker 2: Come on, of course, I'm going to plug my own book.

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Speaker 2: What do you reckon? Yeah, I've got a pre sale

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Speaker 2: coming up. We got to make it happen. We're in

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Speaker 2: the pre order phase.

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Speaker 1: Every single copy that I get pre ordered now helps

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Speaker 1: me to launch it in the States. I really want

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Speaker 1: to get it up in America, but I've got to

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Speaker 1: show them that the sales are pumping along here. So

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Speaker 1: if you're in the States, please get onto this. If

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Speaker 1: you order an Amazon there, it will ship over to you.

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Speaker 1: I really really need to get this.

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Speaker 2: Book over there.

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Speaker 1: There was a time not too long ago, even when

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Speaker 1: I was living with life threatening mental anguish. One of

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Speaker 1: the things that really helped me to find a pathway

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Speaker 1: out of that pain was a kind of treatment known

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Speaker 1: as acceptance commitment therapy. Now, once I knew how powerful

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Speaker 1: this set of ideas could be, I really wanted to

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Speaker 1: share what I'd learned in a way that was as

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Speaker 1: accessible as possible, particularly the people who might never ever

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Speaker 1: call up their GP or answer the question are you okay?

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Speaker 2: With Yeah, I'm just tired.

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Speaker 1: I guess you could say that experience. My experience provides

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Speaker 1: the backbone of this book, which is an illustrated dialogue

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Speaker 1: between an arrator frozen by painful thoughts and feelings and

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Speaker 1: a literal helping hand. To make sure that all the

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Speaker 1: psychological concepts, techniques, and ideas were absolutely watertight, so Cam

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Speaker 1: and I worked extensively with an eminent act psychologist both

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Speaker 1: the wording and the visuals to make sure that both

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Speaker 1: of them were compelling, an accurate, and a true representation

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Speaker 1: of the therapeutic process.

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Speaker 2: The fact that I also got to work with.

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Speaker 1: One of my heroes, the great artist Campbell Walker also

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Speaker 1: known as Truth This really meant that the message I

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Speaker 1: was hoping to convey to kind of an entirely different layer,

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Speaker 1: another layer of depth, of humor and of meaning, and

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Speaker 1: between the two of us were able to make some

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Speaker 1: pretty complex topics far easier to digest. So please there's

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Speaker 1: a link in the show notes to get a copy

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Speaker 1: for you, get a copy for your friend, get a

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Speaker 1: copy just in case you'll find the link in the

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Speaker 1: show notes.

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Speaker 2: Okay.

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Speaker 1: Book number six plug over Finally the book that I

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Speaker 1: wish existed when I was playing music and jumping on stage.

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Speaker 1: But I'm so grateful that exists now that I'm writing

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Speaker 1: and performing so much and really putting myself out there

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Speaker 1: and doing things like this podcast, my upcoming live show,

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Speaker 1: comedy shows, really bold ideas like.

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Speaker 2: The live show that I'm trying to do for this tour.

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Speaker 2: This book to it now what it.

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Speaker 1: Involves live motion capture and three D animation, and not

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Speaker 1: many people are expecting what that's going to look like,

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Speaker 1: and I'm terrified of it. But reading this book has

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Speaker 1: really helped me have the confidence to just boldly charge forward.

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Speaker 1: The seventh book today is The Creative Act, A Way

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Speaker 1: of Being by Rick ruben If you're involved in any

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Speaker 1: kind of creative pursuit or even just curious about the

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Speaker 1: creative process, this book is an absolute must read for you.

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Speaker 1: Rick Rubin is part guru and part wizard. He is

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Speaker 1: a legendary music producer who changed the world with his

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Speaker 1: work that turned great albums into incredible albums for bands

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Speaker 1: like The Beastie Boys, El Cool, J, Slayer, The Red

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Speaker 1: Chili Pepper, Jay Z, Johnny Cash. Not to mention, Sue

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Speaker 1: mix a Lot, Baby Got Back YEP. Rick Rubin co

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Speaker 1: produced Baby Got Back.

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Speaker 2: Thank You, Rick. But Rick is about so much more

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Speaker 2: than that. This book is exceptional.

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Speaker 1: In this book, he really distills just decades of experience

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Speaker 1: into a very clearly written, simply written, but a profound

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Speaker 1: meditation on creativity itself. It's not a how to guide.

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Speaker 1: There's no step by step instructions. It's more an exploration

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Speaker 1: of the principles, mindsets, and practices that foster creativity. He

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Speaker 1: talks about the importance of listening, of observation, of detachment,

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Speaker 1: surrendering to the creative flow. It's about understanding that creativity

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Speaker 1: isn't just about producing something, but about a way of

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Speaker 1: being in a way of connecting with the world around you.

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Speaker 1: If you've ever had the thought, the limiting thought of well,

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Speaker 1: I'm not that creative, then this book is for you,

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Speaker 1: because this book really challenges us to see that creativity

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Speaker 1: is not a specialized skill practiced by a select and

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Speaker 1: elite few, but creativity is a fundamental aspect of human existence,

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Speaker 1: a way of being that enriches our lives and offers

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Speaker 1: a path to a deeper connection with ourselves, with others, and.

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Speaker 2: With the world around us.

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Speaker 1: I look forward to your thoughts. Maybe if there's some

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Speaker 1: books that I've missed, I'd love to get your ideas

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Speaker 1: on that. Thank you so much for joining me on

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Speaker 1: this episode. I can't wait to hear what you think.

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Speaker 1: We're back here on Wednesday. My guest that I'm thrilled

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Speaker 1: to welcome is Chris Ryan. She has a brand new

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Speaker 1: live show which is playing in Melbourne this weekend. I

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Speaker 1: put a link in the show notes for that. Thanks

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Speaker 1: so much for listening. Thanks so much for Addam Bunch

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Speaker 1: for cutting this episode. Enjoy the show. If you liked it,

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Speaker 1: please tell someone like it, follow it, find us on YouTube, finance,

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Speaker 1: on Instagram, find us where around. Okay, I'll see it

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Speaker 1: Wednesday