Speaker 1: Appoja Production.
Speaker 2: Welcome back to Poison, the podcast about the allegations about
Speaker 2: a social media influencer who allegedly drugged one of her
Speaker 2: children to gain followers and in turn cash in. As
Speaker 2: always on the podcast, I'm joined by Mickey Fisher, who's
Speaker 2: a social media content creator, a Reiki instructor and a
Speaker 2: mum of three kids.
Speaker 3: Massive day, I've received about a thousand CM.
Speaker 2: We found out about eleven oh six am this morning,
Speaker 2: and I found out from you. I was in a
Speaker 2: meeting and you text with the announcement from police media.
Speaker 2: They basically told everyone or certainly media that there was
Speaker 2: going to be a press conference within the hour, and
Speaker 2: so we were able to drop everything and head to
Speaker 2: that press conference today.
Speaker 4: I was there. You've now seen it online.
Speaker 2: In the room, there's about thirty reporters who all get
Speaker 2: to ask questions of the detective inspector who had been
Speaker 2: running the case. Actually going to play that whole audio
Speaker 2: now from that police inspector who was leading the case
Speaker 2: into these allegations.
Speaker 5: We are good. My name's Paul Dalton.
Speaker 6: I'm a detective inspector in charge of the South Risban
Speaker 6: District Child Protection Investigation Unit.
Speaker 5: Before we start.
Speaker 6: I'll like to advise that the nature of the offense
Speaker 6: and charges discussed may be distressing to.
Speaker 5: Some people here and who later may view their recording.
Speaker 6: I can advise that earlier today, detectives from the Morning
Speaker 6: Side Child Protection Investigation Unit attendant to Logan where they
Speaker 6: arrested a thirty four year old Sunshine Case woman in
Speaker 6: relation to allegedly poisoning a one year old girl who.
Speaker 5: Was known to her.
Speaker 3: So right now you are under arrest for the administration
Speaker 3: of poison. You have the right train silent, you don't
Speaker 3: have to say.
Speaker 1: Anything, and it's running.
Speaker 3: But she's in the best statement unless she was.
Speaker 6: On the fifteenth of October last year, medical staff from
Speaker 6: a hospital in Brisbane South contact the police in relation
Speaker 6: to concerns they had of harm that was being caused
Speaker 6: to a child.
Speaker 5: That was a patient at that hospital.
Speaker 6: Police attended took immediate action to ensure the safety of
Speaker 6: the child, commenced an investigation operation Whiskey Hitch was subch
Speaker 6: only commenced and operated out of the Morning Side CPIU,
Speaker 6: which today resulted in charges being laid against the thirty
Speaker 6: four year old Sunshine Case women for eleven offenses. These
Speaker 6: offenses include five administering poison with the intent to harm,
Speaker 6: three counts of preparation to commit crimes with dangerous things,
Speaker 6: one count of torture, one count of making child exploitation material,
Speaker 6: and one charge of fraud. In relation to these charges,
Speaker 6: police will be alleging that between the sixth of August
Speaker 6: last year and the fifteenth of October, the woman administered
Speaker 6: several prescription and pharmacy medications to the one year year
Speaker 6: old girl without medical approval.
Speaker 5: We were further.
Speaker 6: Alleged but the woman went their links to conceal her
Speaker 6: continued efforts to a minister the unauthorized medicine until the
Speaker 6: offense was detected by medical staff and police while the
Speaker 6: child was being subject to it to immense distress and pain.
Speaker 6: It is alleged the woman filmed and posted footage of
Speaker 6: this of the child. It's also alleged that the content
Speaker 6: produced exploitation material that the child was suffering at the time,
Speaker 6: and this was used to entice monetary donations from unknown followers.
Speaker 6: There are no words to describe just how repulsive offense
Speaker 6: of this nature are. Child protection investigators regularly have to
Speaker 6: deal with investigators investigate offenses against children of very serious
Speaker 6: and distressing ways. There is no excuse for hurting a child,
Speaker 6: particularly one so young that is dependent on adults too
Speaker 6: careful and love for them. CPOU detectors are committed and
Speaker 6: continuing work every day. They do their best to make
Speaker 6: sure that our kids are safe, and I lead a
Speaker 6: lot of them, and I know what they're like. They
Speaker 6: are title us and their endeavors to do that, and
Speaker 6: they are just as entire titus and ruthless when it
Speaker 6: comes to tracking down perpetrators or alleged perpetrators who hurt
Speaker 6: our kids. We'll do everything that we possibly can and
Speaker 6: make sure that these people are held accountable.
Speaker 2: The first question from a reporter was is there anyone
Speaker 2: else being investigated in this case?
Speaker 5: Now?
Speaker 6: The investigation now has been conducted.
Speaker 2: And the follow up question from that same reporter, so
Speaker 2: the father had no involvement at all.
Speaker 6: As I said before, we've investigated a lot of people
Speaker 6: in relation to this. The idea events that we can
Speaker 6: establish to the satisfaction of the court is the lady.
Speaker 5: We charged can probably go back.
Speaker 6: And I'm very mindful here that I'm whether a young
Speaker 6: child is our victim, I have to respect that child's
Speaker 6: the reason the child was a hospital to start with
Speaker 6: other family members and where that child is now central.
Speaker 6: The child was at a hospital for quite a serious
Speaker 6: metal condition that was being treated on the fifteenth of October.
Speaker 6: Hospital staff had enough information enough concerns to call police.
Speaker 6: Detectives from the CPOU attended that day and their first concern,
Speaker 6: as it is with any child protection investigation, is the
Speaker 6: welfare and the safety of that child. I won't explain
Speaker 6: the process that we use, but the child was immediately
Speaker 6: put into a situation that we were satisfied they were
Speaker 6: in a safe position, and it also extends to siblings
Speaker 6: and other family matters. Since that time, we've been running
Speaker 6: out quite a thorough investigation. It's gone for several months,
Speaker 6: as the timeline indicates, then investigates and involved a lot
Speaker 6: of forensic and medical statements opinion from the experts that
Speaker 6: US police don't understand, and that is sort of explains
Speaker 6: why it's taken to this stage to get to.
Speaker 5: Yes, that's as far as I can take you with that.
Speaker 2: How important was the woman's social media in your investigation
Speaker 2: and the posts that she'd made.
Speaker 6: That look, that's become what we will allege you be
Speaker 6: the motive there essentially, and once again I'll stress this
Speaker 6: is an allegation, but we believe that the person we
Speaker 6: have charged has administered these drugs, this poison to increase
Speaker 6: that person's social media profile and views and thereby obtaining
Speaker 6: a financial benefit.
Speaker 7: Was the child ever actually sick and did she actually
Speaker 7: undergo some of the medical procedures and surgeries that the
Speaker 7: mother claimed in these videos.
Speaker 6: Look, the child was in hospital and being treated for
Speaker 6: quite as three as illness. That's as far as I'll
Speaker 6: go with that. As far as what we will say
Speaker 6: the result of the administering of the poison, all I
Speaker 6: can say it was a medical episode, and the experts
Speaker 6: have described vibe that the child would have been going
Speaker 6: through severe emotional and physical distress.
Speaker 2: And heart In terms of the motive, will you allege
Speaker 2: that it was more important seeing the following than the
Speaker 2: monetary side of it?
Speaker 5: I think one leads to the other. Yeah, I think,
Speaker 5: And look, I'm not a big.
Speaker 6: Up to date on social mere mind is seeing the
Speaker 6: more views you get, the more following it, the more
Speaker 6: opportunity there is.
Speaker 5: To make money.
Speaker 7: How much.
Speaker 6: So we're a less in the days that are between
Speaker 6: the eighth of August and the fifteenth October, and we're
Speaker 6: saying just over sixty thousand dollars.
Speaker 7: And what has happened to that money? Have you been
Speaker 7: able to recover any of it or has it been spent?
Speaker 7: And if so, what on?
Speaker 5: So we've been dealing with gofund ME.
Speaker 6: I understand through my investigators that they are making attempts
Speaker 6: to repay that money to the people through the condness
Speaker 6: of the heart who've donated that money, and we will
Speaker 6: be seeking that money back in restitution should she be
Speaker 6: convicted a later day. Children back in the father's care.
Speaker 5: All I can say is the kids are safe.
Speaker 8: What were the drugs being administered allegedly improperly?
Speaker 6: There are words I cannot pronounce and and look at
Speaker 6: all seriousness what we now say was in the child's
Speaker 6: system as a matter for the court to determine one
Speaker 6: way or the other. So I won't go down that
Speaker 6: line because I don't want to jeopardize any future court cases. Yeah,
Speaker 6: child's going, the child's going. Well, can you talk about
Speaker 6: how she tried to conceal her behavior? No, that'll be
Speaker 6: part of the matter before the court of the moment.
Speaker 6: So I'm probably crossing to many lines there.
Speaker 5: Yeah, you have.
Speaker 7: You seized any assets that you believe are the proceeds
Speaker 7: of this crime?
Speaker 5: Or will you be seeking to do so? No, we haven't.
Speaker 6: No, we'll be seeking to Basically, those days I explained
Speaker 6: relate to the fraud between I. Was it August and October?
Speaker 6: That's the sixty thousand dollars. That's what we've charged. That's
Speaker 6: what we were alleging has been taken. That's the money
Speaker 6: we'll be seeking back from that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, did you forensically go through her social media accounts?
Speaker 4: Did matter? And those types of companies help me through?
Speaker 6: That's all been done to what extents are and there's
Speaker 6: probably a bit too gritty for me to know, but
Speaker 6: I'm satisfied that the investigators has gone through all of
Speaker 6: her social media counts through our forensic computer experts that
Speaker 6: we do use.
Speaker 7: That's sixty thousand dollars. Did that all end up in
Speaker 7: this woman's hands or did it remain with go fund Me?
Speaker 5: No? No, it's with the woman.
Speaker 1: Yeah, there are five counts. Was there how have we
Speaker 1: decided there were five extences? And was there video or
Speaker 1: photographic evidence?
Speaker 6: Okay, we're probably getting close to that line where I
Speaker 6: can't comment too much. Further, Those five counts of that
Speaker 6: particular administrator relate to a specific drug that was that
Speaker 6: we alleged was in the child's system when we did tests.
Speaker 5: There are more.
Speaker 6: Than five occasions where we believe the child was administer
Speaker 6: that that drug.
Speaker 8: They all pharmaceutical, prescription drugs or were there any creational?
Speaker 6: There was pharmaceutical and there was one one from a
Speaker 6: chemist as well.
Speaker 1: Have you received any advice from medical experts on what
Speaker 1: could have happened to this child had investigators not.
Speaker 3: Stepped in when they do.
Speaker 6: It's been described that gravely hill great, gravely ill with
Speaker 6: the possibility of the child passing away in your time.
Speaker 7: As a police officer, I mean, how cawless is this
Speaker 7: allegedly of course the legs that she went to to
Speaker 7: simply get likes and views.
Speaker 6: Yeah, look, it's you try and put on the words
Speaker 6: to describe this, and with any child abuse matter, it's
Speaker 6: quite difficult. I think it's horrendous on a few different
Speaker 6: levels here. Generally speaking, it's affected a lot of people.
Speaker 6: Not only are we alleging that the child was tortured
Speaker 6: over three month period, now again use Tha's words, suffered,
Speaker 6: se mere emotional and physical distress and harm. Siblings would
Speaker 6: be aware of this. Are the innocent family members that
Speaker 6: be aware of this. This follows on to the good
Speaker 6: people in our community who followed this person, supported this person,
Speaker 6: provided they're harder and cash to do that, which also
Speaker 6: follows on. We've got to understand too, and I think
Speaker 6: is important to note that the hospital staff must be
Speaker 6: extremely distressed and anxious about what happened here, and they've
Speaker 6: done nothing wrong at all. You know, we will be
Speaker 6: alleging that this person has done what she's done in
Speaker 6: defiance of mendical opinion. So it affects a lot of people.
Speaker 6: And I think the worst thing that could happen would
Speaker 6: be if as a society we lose our generous, oussie
Speaker 6: nature where we dig in and help our mates out
Speaker 6: because of one bad incident. Of course, we've got to
Speaker 6: be careful where we're sending our money, what we're doing
Speaker 6: with it. But as I said, I hate to see
Speaker 6: us to see us lose that ausie spirit of helping
Speaker 6: your mate over something that doesn't happen that often.
Speaker 2: Being this is the first case that we've seen in Australia.
Speaker 2: Does this open your eyes to this happening with other influence.
Speaker 6: Yeah, possibly, Yeah, as far as it could be happening elsewhere.
Speaker 5: Look, I e could Yeah, the mother did.
Speaker 1: Claim that, uh, the child's after virginity they talk about,
Speaker 1: but was does that appear to be the case or
Speaker 1: will the police allege that the officers were primarily brought
Speaker 1: along life?
Speaker 5: No?
Speaker 6: No, there was no doubt the child wasn't hospital for
Speaker 6: initially for a genuine reason r genuine serious health reason.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 4: What about the social media companies TikTok et cetera.
Speaker 5: Did they have a what disponsibility they have?
Speaker 8: And you know what happens to these posted his material?
Speaker 5: Ah, Look, I can't comment on that.
Speaker 6: People post what they like on on on these on
Speaker 6: these formats all the time. I think a little bit
Speaker 6: of responsibility goes back probably the person that's actually viewing it.
Speaker 6: If you don't like it, just just get rid of it.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Was there any indication that she had munch Housing's white
Speaker 1: proxy or was this purely just the monetary and followers?
Speaker 6: Actually, that has not been raised to us by any
Speaker 6: person during the interview, during the investigation, and certainly we
Speaker 6: found no evidence to suggest that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it would be incoporated with police, and how was
Speaker 1: her response this morning?
Speaker 5: Looked at it, she was copper with police. She went
Speaker 5: with police.
Speaker 6: I mean she was placed on at rest, so she
Speaker 6: had no choice in the matter.
Speaker 7: Was she surprised or what? What was sort of the
Speaker 7: reaction you got when you turned up on the door?
Speaker 4: Oh, I wasn't there.
Speaker 6: I had other detectives go down there with it, and
Speaker 6: no one likes it's knocking on the door.
Speaker 5: One arresting them. But there was no no issues.
Speaker 4: Does she have legal representation?
Speaker 5: I believe she doesn't.
Speaker 4: You in the real.
Speaker 1: Police you say that she disregarded medical advice?
Speaker 6: Would aye alleging that someone advised her not to do
Speaker 6: this because one.
Speaker 5: Knew about it.
Speaker 6: We're alleging that that the hospital has had given her
Speaker 6: and made the offender or wherever treatment plane, anything outside
Speaker 6: that treatment plane, you're not taking it the advice?
Speaker 5: Yeah, what sort of placement to police?
Speaker 3: Hope?
Speaker 4: And what sort of postman will prosecute to seeking president?
Speaker 6: Look, God, there's probably going too far down the line.
Speaker 5: We we got it.
Speaker 6: These are any allegations at this stage. I will say
Speaker 6: that like the offense of two, you can do fourteen
Speaker 6: years for that child exploitation material is twenty years, so
Speaker 6: the consequences can quite be can be quite severe.
Speaker 8: Was this woman allegedly, you know, naive or brazen and
Speaker 8: given this child the wrong medication? Or was she trying
Speaker 8: to make the child appear six to get sympathy and
Speaker 8: likes and stuff like.
Speaker 5: Was she trying to hurt the child? Was saying it
Speaker 5: was an intentional act to gain a benefit the woman.
Speaker 7: Does she remain in custody ahead of that court appearance tomorrow?
Speaker 5: Correct? Yeah, she's in custody now.
Speaker 6: She appear the Brison manustrates court in the morning, and
Speaker 6: we've objected to a bail.
Speaker 4: Yes.
Speaker 3: Things that really stood out to me as quite significant.
Speaker 3: One the fact that he said that the police have
Speaker 3: objected to bail, which means that bail is not an option.
Speaker 3: Is that correct?
Speaker 4: Correct, Well, yes, the police have objected to it.
Speaker 2: However, it's still up to a judge to decide whether
Speaker 2: it's relevant or not. That's the that's the prosecution case,
Speaker 2: but the defense's case might be something else. They might say, well,
Speaker 2: actually she needs she can't, she's not a flight risk, etc.
Speaker 5: Etc.
Speaker 4: Etc.
Speaker 2: So really that's going to be decided tomorrow. In what
Speaker 2: is in her first mention, which is before the matches's court.
Speaker 2: As we heard, there's eleven charges in all. Let's just
Speaker 2: recap those now you've got them in front of you.
Speaker 3: So we've got five counts of administering poison with intent
Speaker 3: to harm, three counts of preparation to commit crimes with
Speaker 3: dangerous things, one count of torture, one count of child
Speaker 3: exploitation material, and one count of fraud.
Speaker 4: The torture, for me, was the most shocking charge. It's
Speaker 4: just that word.
Speaker 3: I think it's also interesting to talk about the dates
Speaker 3: within the parameters that all of this is. They're basically
Speaker 3: working within the sixth of August last year, twenty twenty
Speaker 3: four to the fifteenth of October twenty four, which is
Speaker 3: the day that police were called and notified by the hospital.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and that's sort of not very long.
Speaker 2: No, it's a really short amount of time that they
Speaker 2: they're investigating or they have investigated. So I was in
Speaker 2: that press conference, I got to ask a couple of questions.
Speaker 2: One of my core questions was how much of a
Speaker 2: role did looking into her social media posts play in
Speaker 2: the investigation? And I think the inspector heard my question,
Speaker 2: but maybe took it in a different way. What I
Speaker 2: was trying to say.
Speaker 4: Was was it actually.
Speaker 2: Helpful for them to just have a catalog of what
Speaker 2: she'd already said? And so a lot of the time
Speaker 2: when this stuff happens, it might be a he said,
Speaker 2: she said type thing where you need other witnesses to
Speaker 2: come forward to say No. She definitely told me that
Speaker 2: in this case, it's not that. Because she posted a
Speaker 2: on social media everyone to see, it would be really
Speaker 2: interesting to see how the dad is feeling today because
Speaker 2: that was explicit. A reporter asked was the father a
Speaker 2: person of interest and the answer from the detective was no, Yes.
Speaker 3: That to me was very interesting that it's like that
Speaker 3: was just completely dismissed.
Speaker 2: This is the Queensland Police body camera footage that's been
Speaker 2: shared with us. It shows two female detectives attending the
Speaker 2: house that this woman was staying at, Nie Logan, so
Speaker 2: the opposite end to where she lived.
Speaker 4: Right now.
Speaker 2: You can see them knock on the door and she
Speaker 2: comes to the door. It's clear that she wasn't expecting
Speaker 2: them because she's dressed in her pajamas and carrying.
Speaker 4: A pink water bottle. As she sits down. The police
Speaker 4: go through the charges.
Speaker 2: Now, in the video that's been shared, there's a lot
Speaker 2: of muted audio that means they've silenced the audio.
Speaker 4: They've done that because the police officers are obviously.
Speaker 2: Talking about the young girl and naming her and talking
Speaker 2: about information that right now shouldn't be shared given the
Speaker 2: nature of the young child we're talking about.
Speaker 4: And then you hear them read the charges to her.
Speaker 3: So right now you are under arrest for the administration
Speaker 3: of poison child. You have the right train silent. You
Speaker 3: don't have to say anything, answer any but she's in
Speaker 3: a police statement unless.
Speaker 4: She wish to do so.
Speaker 2: She grabs her face in her hands and then she's
Speaker 2: led to an awaiting plane clothes police car and taken
Speaker 2: into custody and most likely is at Brisbane Watchhouse. Her
Speaker 2: face is blurred in the vision and by rights because
Speaker 2: these are allegations still, but what you can see is
Speaker 2: her hands go to her head as if she's obviously
Speaker 2: really upset about what's happening and the fact that she's
Speaker 2: been arrested.
Speaker 3: It's interesting that the Queensland Police even released that footage,
Speaker 3: especially so quickly. Do you think that that is is
Speaker 3: that normal procedure because I had a few people going,
Speaker 3: that's really fascinating that that was even released to the public.
Speaker 4: Listen.
Speaker 2: I think it's a very big public interest case. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and in the interest of child protection, it makes sense
Speaker 2: for the police to release the fact that they have
Speaker 2: charged this woman with these allegations and they're proceeding given
Speaker 2: their evidence and the investigations. So I think, you know,
Speaker 2: it's unusual, but this whole thing is unusual, right. It's
Speaker 2: not something we're saying in Australias. Certainly not something I've
Speaker 2: heard about in Australia at this level.
Speaker 3: And that was one of the questions you asked as well.
Speaker 3: I'm pretty sure that was you who asked about whether
Speaker 3: or not there's been anything similar.
Speaker 2: And yeah, I think again, I think the detective I
Speaker 2: might not have framed the question right. But the question
Speaker 2: what I was trying to ask is is this now
Speaker 2: an area of concern for police in future because we
Speaker 2: know there are a whole bunch of social media influences
Speaker 2: that use their children in posts.
Speaker 4: And earn money out of that.
Speaker 2: Now, we're not saying that all of those people have
Speaker 2: nefarious thoughts and what the reasons they're using children, But again,
Speaker 2: it goes back to that whole piece of should kids
Speaker 2: be in social media posts of influencers based on the
Speaker 2: fact that they don't have they're not giving permission about it.
Speaker 3: That's actually so true because one of the most serious charges,
Speaker 3: and I think the one that has the longest prison sentence,
Speaker 3: is the child exploitation materials and that is in reference
Speaker 3: to the woman filming this child in distress and vulnerable situations.
Speaker 3: That's not unusual to anything that we would see online.
Speaker 3: That content in itself, regardless of how the child got
Speaker 3: that way. That's that's exploitive we see everywhere. So then
Speaker 3: really that does open up that conversation of going, well,
Speaker 3: is should this be policed or not police?
Speaker 8: Should this?
Speaker 3: Should this be something that we're really taking very seriously
Speaker 3: across the board.
Speaker 2: And what I thought was really interesting from the detective
Speaker 2: who admitted himself that he wasn't a social media expert,
Speaker 2: but he did say, obviously the onus is on the
Speaker 2: person posting it, but the onus is on the people
Speaker 2: watching it. And so if you're uncomfortable with seeing to
Speaker 2: children being exploited on social media, the best way you
Speaker 2: can stop it is to stop following that person.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's so true.
Speaker 2: So what happens now day, Well, she's going to appear
Speaker 2: in the Brisbane Magistrate Court tomorrow morning. Right now, we
Speaker 2: don't know what time that is, but we have put
Speaker 2: forward calls to Brisbane courts and this is what's called
Speaker 2: a first mention, and nothing really happens in a first mention.
Speaker 2: It's primarily procedural, and what's most likely to happen is
Speaker 2: the charges are going to be read out to the accused.
Speaker 2: The accused then can indicate whether they plead guilty or
Speaker 2: they plead not guilty. If they plead guilty, the court
Speaker 2: proceeds to sentencing or adjourns the matter for a sentencing hearing,
Speaker 2: and then if they plead not guilty, the case is
Speaker 2: adjourned for a trial date to be set or for
Speaker 2: further proceedings. So tomorrow's Magistrate's court appearance won't be the end.
Speaker 2: There is a chance tomorrow the judge will issue a
Speaker 2: suppression order or could issue a suppression order, which means
Speaker 2: in that case we might be required to stop the
Speaker 2: podcast for a period of time. But we will follow
Speaker 2: the direction of the courts because, as we said from
Speaker 2: the outset, the last thing we want to do is
Speaker 2: hinder an investigation or an ongoing court matter the moment,
Speaker 2: we know more Tomorrow we'll bring you another episode as
Speaker 2: soon as we can, as long as, of course, it
Speaker 2: doesn't harm the case anyway. Thanks for listening to this
Speaker 2: episode and supporting this story. Independent storytelling that shapes the
Speaker 2: world is what pod shape really cares about. Right now,
Speaker 2: there's thousands of people listening to this show and our
Speaker 2: other True Crimes, and they're completely engaged. More than ten
Speaker 2: million Australians listen to podcasts each week. If you've ever
Speaker 2: thought about advertising your business in a podcast, there's a
Speaker 2: link to reach out in the show notes, or head
Speaker 2: to podshape dot com to book a free call.