1 00:00:05,880 --> 00:00:08,520 Sean Aylmer: Welcome to the Fear & Greed Business Interview. I'm Sean Aylmer. 2 00:00:08,580 --> 00:00:12,059 Sean Aylmer: Apple has revealed how AI will be integrated into its 3 00:00:12,059 --> 00:00:16,079 Sean Aylmer: devices, and investors clearly loved it. The 24 hours after 4 00:00:16,079 --> 00:00:19,020 Sean Aylmer: the tech giant announced its plans for Apple Intelligence, the 5 00:00:19,020 --> 00:00:22,770 Sean Aylmer: share price soared 7%. But there's a lot to unpack 6 00:00:22,950 --> 00:00:25,740 Sean Aylmer: within the announcement itself, from the new features available on 7 00:00:26,309 --> 00:00:30,839 Sean Aylmer: iPhones, to the integration of OpenAI's ChatGPT on new devices. And 8 00:00:30,840 --> 00:00:33,598 Sean Aylmer: there are big questions over security with more data to 9 00:00:33,598 --> 00:00:36,059 Sean Aylmer: be sent to the cloud for processing, instead of being 10 00:00:36,059 --> 00:00:39,120 Sean Aylmer: handled on the device itself. Stephen Fenech is one of 11 00:00:39,120 --> 00:00:44,040 Sean Aylmer: Australia's top technology journalists, and the editor of techguide. com. 12 00:00:44,040 --> 00:00:46,260 Sean Aylmer: au. He's in the US at the moment, where he 13 00:00:46,260 --> 00:00:50,159 Sean Aylmer: was covering Apple's Worldwide Developer Conference. Stephen, welcome back to 14 00:00:50,159 --> 00:00:50,820 Sean Aylmer: Fear & Greed. 15 00:00:51,299 --> 00:00:52,859 Stephen Fenech: Great to be here. Great to see you, Sean. 16 00:00:53,459 --> 00:00:55,320 Sean Aylmer: Now, I've just got to ask before we get into 17 00:00:55,320 --> 00:00:57,630 Sean Aylmer: it, what are these conferences like? You hear so much 18 00:00:57,630 --> 00:01:01,170 Sean Aylmer: about them. Is it just stacks of people in a 19 00:01:01,170 --> 00:01:05,219 Sean Aylmer: big auditorium, and you get the appropriate person up the 20 00:01:05,219 --> 00:01:07,380 Sean Aylmer: front doing a song and dance? Or how's it work? 21 00:01:07,620 --> 00:01:11,789 Stephen Fenech: Yeah, well, it used to be all the developers coming 22 00:01:11,789 --> 00:01:16,140 Stephen Fenech: here to San Jose usually. But during COVID, what Apple 23 00:01:16,140 --> 00:01:19,440 Stephen Fenech: did was they made it a virtual event. So they 24 00:01:19,440 --> 00:01:23,819 Stephen Fenech: basically just played a video and that was the keynote. post- 25 00:01:23,819 --> 00:01:27,660 Stephen Fenech: COVID, they've continued like that, so it's actually still, Tim 26 00:01:27,660 --> 00:01:29,970 Stephen Fenech: Cook gets up on stage for the first few minutes, 27 00:01:30,150 --> 00:01:33,630 Stephen Fenech: then rolls the video, and all the developers are still 28 00:01:33,630 --> 00:01:37,290 Stephen Fenech: watching virtually. They do invite people like myself, the media, 29 00:01:37,290 --> 00:01:39,929 Stephen Fenech: some special guests, and other people to come here to 30 00:01:40,319 --> 00:01:43,469 Stephen Fenech: view it in person. And then to have briefings and 31 00:01:43,500 --> 00:01:47,009 Stephen Fenech: interact, if there's any product, to see the product. But, 32 00:01:47,190 --> 00:01:50,100 Stephen Fenech: yeah, there was still a huge crowd here watching it, 33 00:01:50,160 --> 00:01:54,090 Stephen Fenech: watching the keynote live at Apple's headquarters, their big... At 34 00:01:54,090 --> 00:01:58,590 Stephen Fenech: Apple Park, their massive campus. And, yeah, it was still a 35 00:01:59,040 --> 00:02:00,809 Stephen Fenech: huge buzz in the air. A lot of people were 36 00:02:01,020 --> 00:02:02,700 Stephen Fenech: keen to hear what they were about to announce. 37 00:02:03,360 --> 00:02:05,279 Sean Aylmer: Okay, so let's go through some of those announcements. What 38 00:02:05,279 --> 00:02:07,350 Sean Aylmer: are the big changes coming to iPhones? 39 00:02:07,980 --> 00:02:11,040 Stephen Fenech: Well, the big one is Apple Intelligence, of course. It's 40 00:02:11,040 --> 00:02:15,358 Stephen Fenech: their AI. AI, of course, doesn't stand for artificial intelligence, 41 00:02:15,360 --> 00:02:16,681 Stephen Fenech: they've put their own spin on it, it's A Apple Intelligence. 42 00:02:16,681 --> 00:02:16,682 Sean Aylmer: Of course, of course. 43 00:02:16,682 --> 00:02:22,858 Stephen Fenech: So, yeah, this was expected. This is not a surprise. 44 00:02:22,859 --> 00:02:25,320 Stephen Fenech: I think everyone was a little bit worried that Apple 45 00:02:25,320 --> 00:02:28,860 Stephen Fenech: had... They were trailing a little bit behind companies like 46 00:02:28,860 --> 00:02:34,439 Stephen Fenech: Microsoft, who introduced Copilot almost a year ago. Samsung introduced 47 00:02:34,440 --> 00:02:39,179 Stephen Fenech: the Galaxy S24 in January with Galaxy AI. So Apple's 48 00:02:39,179 --> 00:02:42,930 Stephen Fenech: silence was deafening because no one really knew what was 49 00:02:42,960 --> 00:02:46,560 Stephen Fenech: happening. And it was interesting, in the PC world, there 50 00:02:46,560 --> 00:02:50,760 Stephen Fenech: are a lot of partnerships. So the PC main manufacturers 51 00:02:50,760 --> 00:02:56,070 Stephen Fenech: are partnering with Microsoft and AMD and Qualcomm and Intel, 52 00:02:56,460 --> 00:02:59,189 Stephen Fenech: and they're all talking to each other. You look at 53 00:02:59,190 --> 00:03:04,470 Stephen Fenech: Apple, Apple works with no one, on its own, so a closed shop. They make the hardware, they 54 00:03:04,470 --> 00:03:07,110 Stephen Fenech: make the software, they make the silicon. So there was 55 00:03:07,110 --> 00:03:09,150 Stephen Fenech: none of these conversations going on. It was all happening 56 00:03:09,150 --> 00:03:12,809 Stephen Fenech: internally. And I knew that this is probably their most 57 00:03:12,809 --> 00:03:16,559 Stephen Fenech: important Worldwide Developers Conference for some time, that if they 58 00:03:16,559 --> 00:03:20,820 Stephen Fenech: didn't address AI in a big way, then they'd be 59 00:03:20,820 --> 00:03:25,530 Stephen Fenech: in trouble. But as expected, they responded with the announcement, 60 00:03:25,530 --> 00:03:29,730 Stephen Fenech: which I think is very positive. I think a lot 61 00:03:29,730 --> 00:03:32,849 Stephen Fenech: of customers are going to really appreciate the power of 62 00:03:32,849 --> 00:03:36,299 Stephen Fenech: Apple Intelligence. The one downside I can tell you upfront 63 00:03:36,299 --> 00:03:39,300 Stephen Fenech: is that the fact that on iPhone, for example, you 64 00:03:39,300 --> 00:03:44,190 Stephen Fenech: need to have the very latest iPhone 15 Pro to 65 00:03:44,220 --> 00:03:46,650 Stephen Fenech: be able to use Apple Intelligence on your device. It 66 00:03:46,650 --> 00:03:49,170 Stephen Fenech: needs to have that kind of compute power. So even 67 00:03:49,170 --> 00:03:52,259 Stephen Fenech: if you've got an iPhone 15 or an earlier device, 68 00:03:52,440 --> 00:03:55,710 Stephen Fenech: you're going to miss out. And, of course, the 16, 69 00:03:55,710 --> 00:03:59,250 Stephen Fenech: when that's announced in September and released in September, that 70 00:03:59,250 --> 00:04:03,570 Stephen Fenech: will naturally support it as well. And the M series 71 00:04:03,570 --> 00:04:06,930 Stephen Fenech: of iPads and MacBooks that are going back at least about, 72 00:04:07,020 --> 00:04:09,419 Stephen Fenech: I think three years, will be compatible with it as 73 00:04:09,420 --> 00:04:11,759 Stephen Fenech: well. So I think that's going to be a barrier 74 00:04:11,760 --> 00:04:14,730 Stephen Fenech: to entry for some customers, but yet also could be 75 00:04:15,090 --> 00:04:18,180 Stephen Fenech: a reason to upgrade to the very latest models. 76 00:04:18,690 --> 00:04:23,189 Sean Aylmer: Okay. So assuming I have the device that's capable of 77 00:04:23,190 --> 00:04:27,240 Sean Aylmer: using the Apple Intelligence, the AI, what does it mean 78 00:04:27,330 --> 00:04:30,238 Sean Aylmer: for me? How will it change how I use devices? 79 00:04:30,450 --> 00:04:33,659 Stephen Fenech: Well, you've got to remember, if you're an Apple customer, 80 00:04:33,930 --> 00:04:36,510 Stephen Fenech: you're likely to be in the ecosystem. So you might 81 00:04:36,510 --> 00:04:39,029 Stephen Fenech: have an iPhone, you might have an iPad, you might 82 00:04:39,029 --> 00:04:42,389 Stephen Fenech: have a MacBook. And so you're in their ecosystem. So 83 00:04:42,389 --> 00:04:45,240 Stephen Fenech: I think that the advantage that Apple's got over Microsoft 84 00:04:45,240 --> 00:04:47,549 Stephen Fenech: and Samsung and these other companies is they've got a 85 00:04:47,549 --> 00:04:50,940 Stephen Fenech: wider breadth of products that this works on. So Microsoft 86 00:04:50,940 --> 00:04:53,610 Stephen Fenech: have got computers, but they don't have phones. Samsung have 87 00:04:53,610 --> 00:04:57,389 Stephen Fenech: phones but don't have computers. So Apple has the wider 88 00:04:57,389 --> 00:05:00,600 Stephen Fenech: breadth of products. And so, basically, it's going to take 89 00:05:01,080 --> 00:05:03,868 Stephen Fenech: a device that knows already a lot about us to 90 00:05:03,870 --> 00:05:06,959 Stephen Fenech: begin with. All our data is there, all our contacts 91 00:05:06,959 --> 00:05:09,839 Stephen Fenech: are on there. And it's really going to elevate our 92 00:05:09,839 --> 00:05:14,370 Stephen Fenech: efficiency. It's going to elevate our creativity. And just bring 93 00:05:14,370 --> 00:05:18,509 Stephen Fenech: to our fingertips all these tasks and functions that would 94 00:05:18,509 --> 00:05:21,178 Stephen Fenech: normally take a longer time. It'll sort your mailbox. It'll 95 00:05:21,178 --> 00:05:25,950 Stephen Fenech: give you priority notifications. It'll tell you if you're running 96 00:05:25,950 --> 00:05:27,900 Stephen Fenech: late for a meeting. And know that if there's going 97 00:05:27,900 --> 00:05:30,659 Stephen Fenech: to be traffic and book an Uber. And so it's going 98 00:05:30,660 --> 00:05:34,260 Stephen Fenech: to give you all those features. So it really does 99 00:05:34,260 --> 00:05:37,950 Stephen Fenech: elevate the experience through a device, and through a lot 100 00:05:37,950 --> 00:05:41,039 Stephen Fenech: of apps that already know us pretty well. It's really 101 00:05:41,039 --> 00:05:43,409 Stephen Fenech: taking us to the next level. And I think how 102 00:05:43,410 --> 00:05:46,890 Stephen Fenech: Apple has presented it, in comparison to other companies, the 103 00:05:46,890 --> 00:05:49,860 Stephen Fenech: other companies have had a more broader view of AI 104 00:05:49,860 --> 00:05:54,360 Stephen Fenech: and how it's more an efficiency, a business tool. Apple 105 00:05:54,360 --> 00:05:57,779 Stephen Fenech: seemed to have taken a more personal approach. It's contextual, 106 00:05:57,990 --> 00:06:02,219 Stephen Fenech: really operating at the consumer level to assist. If you 107 00:06:02,220 --> 00:06:05,010 Stephen Fenech: want to write an email, rewrite an email, summarize a 108 00:06:05,010 --> 00:06:08,219 Stephen Fenech: document, all those features are there as well. And, of 109 00:06:08,220 --> 00:06:10,589 Stephen Fenech: course, Apple, you did mention in the intro about the 110 00:06:10,589 --> 00:06:15,329 Stephen Fenech: security and the privacy, a big, big pillar of Apple 111 00:06:15,330 --> 00:06:18,930 Stephen Fenech: Intelligence is also that privacy which the company prides itself 112 00:06:18,930 --> 00:06:22,589 Stephen Fenech: on. They've assured customers that privacy will well and truly 113 00:06:22,589 --> 00:06:25,020 Stephen Fenech: be at the heart of Apple Intelligence as well. 114 00:06:25,650 --> 00:06:27,539 Sean Aylmer: Stay with me, Stephen, we'll be back in a minute. 115 00:06:34,619 --> 00:06:39,060 Sean Aylmer: I'm speaking to tech journalist, Stephen Fenech, editor of techguide. com. 116 00:06:39,870 --> 00:06:44,279 Sean Aylmer: au. I suppose there's a big push, privacy, but also 117 00:06:44,279 --> 00:06:46,589 Sean Aylmer: security, because one of the big changes is the increase 118 00:06:46,589 --> 00:06:48,719 Sean Aylmer: in the amount of data being processed in the cloud, 119 00:06:48,719 --> 00:06:51,839 Sean Aylmer: instead of on the device itself. Is it something we 120 00:06:51,839 --> 00:06:54,600 Sean Aylmer: should be worried about, or we can trust Apple? 121 00:06:54,810 --> 00:06:58,470 Stephen Fenech: Yeah, well, Apple, they've given a gold plated guarantee this 122 00:06:58,470 --> 00:07:01,050 Stephen Fenech: is going to be... Their privacy, they've always been a 123 00:07:01,050 --> 00:07:05,249 Stephen Fenech: company that's been proud of the privacy that their devices 124 00:07:05,250 --> 00:07:09,419 Stephen Fenech: offer. That they really respect customer privacy. It's really something 125 00:07:09,420 --> 00:07:14,550 Stephen Fenech: they've had at the forefront of their mission. And I 126 00:07:14,550 --> 00:07:19,080 Stephen Fenech: think with, I mentioned earlier, the requirements of the device, 127 00:07:19,500 --> 00:07:23,010 Stephen Fenech: the reason for those requirements is so that it can 128 00:07:23,010 --> 00:07:27,450 Stephen Fenech: process a lot of the AI on device. So it's 129 00:07:27,450 --> 00:07:29,910 Stephen Fenech: not going to involve a lot of data going off 130 00:07:29,910 --> 00:07:34,290 Stephen Fenech: your device. For those other examples where it might need 131 00:07:34,290 --> 00:07:36,450 Stephen Fenech: a little bit of help with, they've got a partnership 132 00:07:36,450 --> 00:07:40,620 Stephen Fenech: with ChatGPT. Then, with your permission, it'll send your query 133 00:07:40,620 --> 00:07:45,120 Stephen Fenech: to ChatGPT, to OpenAI. But, again, their assurance is that 134 00:07:45,450 --> 00:07:48,180 Stephen Fenech: that will also be private. They've gone to the length 135 00:07:48,180 --> 00:07:52,800 Stephen Fenech: too of creating a personal secure cloud for their customers 136 00:07:53,130 --> 00:07:57,900 Stephen Fenech: that uses a blockchain type technology to ensure the server 137 00:07:58,230 --> 00:08:02,009 Stephen Fenech: is compatible with Apple's policies, with the data not being 138 00:08:02,009 --> 00:08:07,170 Stephen Fenech: stored, nothing being used, and it all occurring anonymously. None 139 00:08:07,170 --> 00:08:10,590 Stephen Fenech: of the information is used to improve the AI. So 140 00:08:10,590 --> 00:08:14,460 Stephen Fenech: once the query is done, data disappears, and there's no 141 00:08:14,460 --> 00:08:17,820 Stephen Fenech: trace of it. There's nothing stored, nothing used. And that's 142 00:08:17,820 --> 00:08:21,660 Stephen Fenech: what they promise. Even if it does involve OpenAI, that 143 00:08:21,660 --> 00:08:25,830 Stephen Fenech: was part of the deal. So I'm fully expecting Apple 144 00:08:25,830 --> 00:08:29,520 Stephen Fenech: to respect that and to give customers that assurance. 145 00:08:30,060 --> 00:08:34,200 Sean Aylmer: You mentioned OpenAI then. Was it a surprise that they 146 00:08:34,200 --> 00:08:36,510 Sean Aylmer: did a tie- up with that third party? 147 00:08:36,990 --> 00:08:40,169 Stephen Fenech: No, not at all. I think that OpenAI is probably 148 00:08:40,170 --> 00:08:44,730 Stephen Fenech: the go- to platform at the moment. And Microsoft is 149 00:08:44,730 --> 00:08:47,400 Stephen Fenech: a massive investor, so they're a leader in the field. 150 00:08:48,000 --> 00:08:50,189 Stephen Fenech: But I think you've got to remember though, Apple Intelligence 151 00:08:51,120 --> 00:08:53,338 Stephen Fenech: does a fair bit of the heavy lifting to begin with. 152 00:08:53,610 --> 00:08:56,699 Stephen Fenech: So they do have their own that's going to do 153 00:08:56,700 --> 00:08:59,670 Stephen Fenech: most of the work. But they wanted to have OpenAI 154 00:08:59,670 --> 00:09:03,000 Stephen Fenech: as a backup source, and for maybe customers would prefer 155 00:09:03,000 --> 00:09:06,328 Stephen Fenech: to use OpenAI, a lot of them maybe have paid accounts with 156 00:09:06,330 --> 00:09:09,090 Stephen Fenech: ChatGPT. So Apple is not going to stand in their 157 00:09:09,090 --> 00:09:12,509 Stephen Fenech: way. It's like they've got Google on the iPhone, you 158 00:09:12,509 --> 00:09:15,599 Stephen Fenech: can do a Google search. So in this instance, if 159 00:09:15,599 --> 00:09:21,059 Stephen Fenech: a customer would prefer, or require, a greater inquiry that 160 00:09:21,059 --> 00:09:25,078 Stephen Fenech: would only be answered through ChatGPT, then they've got that 161 00:09:25,080 --> 00:09:25,770 Stephen Fenech: option as well. 162 00:09:26,610 --> 00:09:28,830 Sean Aylmer: We also have a date now for the arrival of 163 00:09:28,830 --> 00:09:31,679 Sean Aylmer: Vision Pro virtual reality headsets in Australia, Stephen. 164 00:09:32,009 --> 00:09:34,260 Stephen Fenech: That's right, yeah. Well, they're going to land in Australia. 165 00:09:34,260 --> 00:09:37,679 Stephen Fenech: July the 12th is the launch date. And you can pre- 166 00:09:37,679 --> 00:09:42,570 Stephen Fenech: order from June the 28th at 10:00 PM. So 10: 00 167 00:09:42,570 --> 00:09:45,990 Stephen Fenech: PM, if you're jumping on, you can order. And, look, 168 00:09:45,990 --> 00:09:47,730 Stephen Fenech: I'll tell you up front, it's going to cost you $ 6, 169 00:09:47,730 --> 00:09:51,660 Stephen Fenech: 000 to begin with. It's starting at $ 5, 999. So 170 00:09:53,490 --> 00:09:57,300 Stephen Fenech: it's not a cheap product. It's quite an investment. It's 171 00:09:57,300 --> 00:09:59,850 Stephen Fenech: relative to the price it was in the US. If 172 00:09:59,850 --> 00:10:02,610 Stephen Fenech: you do the conversion, I think it's 3, 600 US 173 00:10:02,610 --> 00:10:05,549 Stephen Fenech: dollars plus tax. So you do the math there, do 174 00:10:05,550 --> 00:10:08,009 Stephen Fenech: the conversion, it's roughly about the same price as it 175 00:10:08,009 --> 00:10:12,540 Stephen Fenech: would be in the US. It has, early on, had 176 00:10:12,540 --> 00:10:16,350 Stephen Fenech: a huge response here in the US. There was a 177 00:10:16,350 --> 00:10:19,230 Stephen Fenech: lot of talk about people returning them in the... Apple 178 00:10:19,230 --> 00:10:23,669 Stephen Fenech: have a 14- day return, no questions asked period. I 179 00:10:23,670 --> 00:10:27,509 Stephen Fenech: think that Apple says that there were no greater return 180 00:10:27,509 --> 00:10:29,940 Stephen Fenech: volumes of the Vision Pro as there would be on 181 00:10:29,940 --> 00:10:33,540 Stephen Fenech: an iPhone. They were on record saying that. The media 182 00:10:33,540 --> 00:10:35,040 Stephen Fenech: made a big deal about the fact that there were 183 00:10:35,040 --> 00:10:38,220 Stephen Fenech: a lot of customers returning the Vision Pro before that 14- 184 00:10:38,220 --> 00:10:41,400 Stephen Fenech: day period. But, look, I've tried it a couple of times, 185 00:10:41,400 --> 00:10:45,269 Stephen Fenech: and you really have to experience this for yourself. But 186 00:10:46,469 --> 00:10:49,559 Stephen Fenech: I've tried a lot of headsets, and this is, without 187 00:10:49,559 --> 00:10:53,400 Stephen Fenech: a doubt, the highest quality, and nothing less. It's what 188 00:10:53,400 --> 00:10:56,820 Stephen Fenech: you'd expect from Apple. Just an amazing quality experience that, 189 00:10:57,210 --> 00:11:02,490 Stephen Fenech: interestingly, was announced at last year's Developers Conference. Appropriately announced 190 00:11:02,490 --> 00:11:05,820 Stephen Fenech: at that time because they need developers to get behind 191 00:11:05,820 --> 00:11:09,480 Stephen Fenech: it to create apps for the platform. And there's already 192 00:11:09,480 --> 00:11:13,560 Stephen Fenech: more than 2, 000 apps available for Vision Pro. And 193 00:11:14,130 --> 00:11:17,670 Stephen Fenech: they've even announced Vision OS 2. So we're already up 194 00:11:17,670 --> 00:11:22,319 Stephen Fenech: to the second version that allows customers to have a 195 00:11:22,320 --> 00:11:25,800 Stephen Fenech: virtual monitor so they can still use their Mac, but their 196 00:11:25,800 --> 00:11:29,280 Stephen Fenech: monitor is in the headset. It's obviously great for gaming, 197 00:11:29,550 --> 00:11:32,760 Stephen Fenech: viewing content, and all these other apps that you can 198 00:11:32,760 --> 00:11:37,650 Stephen Fenech: use. They call it spatial computing. And I've got to say, 199 00:11:37,650 --> 00:11:39,480 Stephen Fenech: the first time you put them on, you're going to think, " Wow, 200 00:11:39,480 --> 00:11:42,839 Stephen Fenech: this is amazing." But I think it still needs to 201 00:11:42,840 --> 00:11:48,150 Stephen Fenech: have that killer application to really sell it. But the 202 00:11:48,150 --> 00:11:50,520 Stephen Fenech: downside, of course, is that the barrier to entry for 203 00:11:50,520 --> 00:11:52,950 Stephen Fenech: a lot of people is just the price. Not many 204 00:11:52,950 --> 00:11:55,170 Stephen Fenech: people are going to be able to afford this, unfortunately. 205 00:11:55,170 --> 00:11:57,629 Stephen Fenech: So we'll see how it goes in the Australian market. 206 00:11:57,630 --> 00:11:59,220 Stephen Fenech: I think it'll be a bit of a slow burn 207 00:11:59,458 --> 00:12:01,470 Stephen Fenech: in Australia, as it was here in the US. There 208 00:12:02,250 --> 00:12:04,800 Stephen Fenech: was initial flurry, but then it slowed right down, and 209 00:12:05,010 --> 00:12:10,440 Stephen Fenech: it's a steady sale without breaking any records. But, yeah, 210 00:12:10,559 --> 00:12:12,539 Stephen Fenech: I'm not sure how Australians are going to take that 211 00:12:12,540 --> 00:12:15,958 Stephen Fenech: one, whether they're going to shell out $ 6, 000. You'd 212 00:12:15,960 --> 00:12:18,239 Stephen Fenech: have to be a huge Apple fan to invest. But, 213 00:12:18,690 --> 00:12:20,069 Stephen Fenech: look, it is a great experience though. 214 00:12:20,760 --> 00:12:22,500 Sean Aylmer: Stephen, thank you for talking to Fear & Greed. 215 00:12:22,800 --> 00:12:23,578 Stephen Fenech: Pleasure. Thanks, Sean. 216 00:12:24,179 --> 00:12:27,390 Sean Aylmer: That was tech journalist, Stephen Fenech, editor of techguide. com. 217 00:12:28,200 --> 00:12:30,629 Sean Aylmer: au. This is the Fear & Greed Business Interview. Join us 218 00:12:30,630 --> 00:12:32,909 Sean Aylmer: every morning for the full episode of Fear & Greed, daily 219 00:12:32,910 --> 00:12:35,488 Sean Aylmer: business news for people who make their own decisions. I'm 220 00:12:35,490 --> 00:12:37,078 Sean Aylmer: Sean Aylmer. Enjoy your day.