1 00:00:00,440 --> 00:00:00,640 Speaker 1: Good. 2 00:00:00,680 --> 00:00:02,440 Speaker 2: I tellam, I've been trying to get the show started 3 00:00:02,440 --> 00:00:05,080 Speaker 2: for the last three minutes, but like over there in 4 00:00:05,080 --> 00:00:07,600 Speaker 2: the baseball cap or beret or whatever that is on 5 00:00:07,640 --> 00:00:11,560 Speaker 2: the other side of the world, keeps interrupting halfway through 6 00:00:11,600 --> 00:00:15,120 Speaker 2: me bloody intro. Thank god, you shut up for twelve 7 00:00:15,160 --> 00:00:17,279 Speaker 2: seconds so I could say what I just said, which 8 00:00:17,360 --> 00:00:19,680 Speaker 2: wasn't that impressive anyway, Hello Roberts. 9 00:00:20,680 --> 00:00:22,360 Speaker 1: I've got to say that was a lot of fun 10 00:00:22,400 --> 00:00:22,680 Speaker 1: for me. 11 00:00:22,880 --> 00:00:27,240 Speaker 2: Actually, Ah, when I want you to talk, you have 12 00:00:27,280 --> 00:00:29,840 Speaker 2: these awkward long gaps, and when I don't want you 13 00:00:29,920 --> 00:00:32,680 Speaker 2: to talk, you just keep talking. Hell are you buddy? 14 00:00:32,880 --> 00:00:35,639 Speaker 1: I'm okay. Thank you for asking. That's very kind of you, 15 00:00:35,760 --> 00:00:38,479 Speaker 1: Like does anybody really ask about me anymore? You're the 16 00:00:38,479 --> 00:00:42,760 Speaker 1: first person today, so much appreciated. Secondly, well, I need 17 00:00:42,800 --> 00:00:46,080 Speaker 1: to set things straight. When you ask me something and 18 00:00:46,120 --> 00:00:50,080 Speaker 1: you get a long, awkward silence, you might think, well, 19 00:00:50,120 --> 00:00:52,960 Speaker 1: Bobby Capuci is really awkward, and that would be true. 20 00:00:53,200 --> 00:00:56,600 Speaker 1: But what it also could be that you're observing is 21 00:00:56,640 --> 00:01:00,280 Speaker 1: that the magnitude of your question and the one this 22 00:01:00,520 --> 00:01:03,080 Speaker 1: level of respect and affection that I have for you 23 00:01:03,720 --> 00:01:10,320 Speaker 1: warrant jernalize and think about it. It's the powerful it's 24 00:01:10,360 --> 00:01:11,200 Speaker 1: the power of the pause. 25 00:01:11,280 --> 00:01:15,360 Speaker 2: Mete. You're wrapping your sarcasm in a pseudo compliment and 26 00:01:15,400 --> 00:01:20,440 Speaker 2: nobody's fucking buying it, including me. But you are loved. 27 00:01:21,120 --> 00:01:24,240 Speaker 2: I actually spoke to a lady this morning, this very morning, 28 00:01:25,200 --> 00:01:28,840 Speaker 2: the twenty fourth of July, and she said, when have 29 00:01:28,880 --> 00:01:31,000 Speaker 2: you got Bobby back on the show? I said, well, 30 00:01:31,720 --> 00:01:35,080 Speaker 2: funny you ask, I said, in about five hours from now. 31 00:01:35,160 --> 00:01:39,120 Speaker 2: She goes, I love him. He's my favorite. So shout 32 00:01:39,160 --> 00:01:42,200 Speaker 2: out to all the others that are not that lady's favorite. 33 00:01:43,000 --> 00:01:43,200 Speaker 1: Now. 34 00:01:43,600 --> 00:01:45,840 Speaker 2: I don't even know her name. You know, when you've 35 00:01:45,840 --> 00:01:47,400 Speaker 2: met some I don't know her well, I've met her 36 00:01:47,440 --> 00:01:49,280 Speaker 2: maybe three times, and then you get to a point 37 00:01:49,280 --> 00:01:52,840 Speaker 2: where you're like, fuck, I can't ask because get. 38 00:01:52,720 --> 00:01:55,520 Speaker 1: The name my one fan. You didn't get the name 39 00:01:56,320 --> 00:01:57,440 Speaker 1: hell one person. 40 00:01:58,400 --> 00:02:00,520 Speaker 2: You know what? I just realized I didn't have said 41 00:02:00,520 --> 00:02:03,160 Speaker 2: any of this because she's going to listen to exactly. 42 00:02:02,680 --> 00:02:03,120 Speaker 1: What I just. 43 00:02:03,200 --> 00:02:08,480 Speaker 2: I'm so sorry, lady, but you you are amazing. I'm sorry, 44 00:02:09,200 --> 00:02:12,800 Speaker 2: I just I just fuck. Can we edit this out? Hey? Anyone? 45 00:02:12,960 --> 00:02:16,360 Speaker 2: Melissa tiv anyway, you do know you have more than 46 00:02:16,400 --> 00:02:18,400 Speaker 2: a one fan. You have many fans. 47 00:02:18,520 --> 00:02:20,440 Speaker 1: Do you know when somebody told me about my shirt? 48 00:02:21,040 --> 00:02:22,959 Speaker 1: She wrote in and I don't know how to take this. 49 00:02:23,080 --> 00:02:26,120 Speaker 1: She said, you know, I just love your show because, like, 50 00:02:26,200 --> 00:02:28,880 Speaker 1: I have insomnia and nothing gets me to sleep at night, 51 00:02:29,080 --> 00:02:31,320 Speaker 1: and every night I fall asleep listening to the sound 52 00:02:31,360 --> 00:02:34,359 Speaker 1: of your voice. And I was like, oh, well, wait 53 00:02:34,360 --> 00:02:36,640 Speaker 1: a minute, I'm not really sure how to take that. 54 00:02:37,680 --> 00:02:41,239 Speaker 2: I've been told similar, I've had sorry, I'm having a 55 00:02:41,280 --> 00:02:43,799 Speaker 2: little bit of a drink. Everyone I apologize. I've been 56 00:02:43,840 --> 00:02:47,360 Speaker 2: told yeah, yeah, I'm with you. I don't know, Like 57 00:02:47,440 --> 00:02:50,960 Speaker 2: quite a few people say, I play your podcast when 58 00:02:51,000 --> 00:02:53,359 Speaker 2: I go to sleep. It helps me sleep. I don't 59 00:02:53,360 --> 00:02:55,680 Speaker 2: know whether or not I'm going to take it that 60 00:02:55,760 --> 00:03:02,160 Speaker 2: you and I have trustworthy, calming therapeutic dulcet tones. 61 00:03:03,480 --> 00:03:06,400 Speaker 1: Yeah, that sits better with me than we're more boring 62 00:03:06,400 --> 00:03:09,280 Speaker 1: than a bag of houds. But but we could, we 63 00:03:09,280 --> 00:03:12,520 Speaker 1: could rebrand this. This episode could be like all about 64 00:03:12,520 --> 00:03:15,040 Speaker 1: how to cure and symn there massive it. 65 00:03:15,400 --> 00:03:18,720 Speaker 2: You and I have got to be uncharacteristically efficient today. 66 00:03:19,680 --> 00:03:22,800 Speaker 2: Let's crack on the I have to be out in oh, 67 00:03:22,880 --> 00:03:25,480 Speaker 2: listen to you being irish. I have to be out 68 00:03:25,520 --> 00:03:31,120 Speaker 2: in thirty one minutes from now. You posted today. I 69 00:03:31,120 --> 00:03:33,320 Speaker 2: think it was today. I saw it today anyway, on 70 00:03:33,480 --> 00:03:39,600 Speaker 2: your ig you posted something like overcoming your fear of 71 00:03:39,600 --> 00:03:43,280 Speaker 2: public speaking, and I thought, while we have spoken about 72 00:03:43,320 --> 00:03:45,920 Speaker 2: it in the two thousand shows or so that we've 73 00:03:46,520 --> 00:03:49,280 Speaker 2: had here, and you and I in the hundred or 74 00:03:49,320 --> 00:03:51,680 Speaker 2: so that you and I have done together, I don't 75 00:03:51,680 --> 00:03:53,520 Speaker 2: know how many, by the way, it's probably more than that, 76 00:03:54,400 --> 00:03:56,080 Speaker 2: but we've opened the door a bit. But I thought 77 00:03:56,120 --> 00:04:00,880 Speaker 2: it wouldn't be terrible to do an entire conversation around 78 00:04:01,600 --> 00:04:07,040 Speaker 2: the idea of being more comfortable, more competent, more skilled, 79 00:04:07,640 --> 00:04:10,720 Speaker 2: whatever at doing that thing, and whether or not that's 80 00:04:10,760 --> 00:04:13,560 Speaker 2: you know, talking at your own birthday, having say in 81 00:04:13,600 --> 00:04:16,320 Speaker 2: a few words at your fortieth birthday when you're terrified, 82 00:04:17,279 --> 00:04:20,320 Speaker 2: or speaking in a conference room to a thousand people, 83 00:04:20,400 --> 00:04:25,400 Speaker 2: or anything in between. Yeah, why did you post that? 84 00:04:25,880 --> 00:04:29,400 Speaker 2: And what do you Let's let's start the wheels turning. 85 00:04:29,440 --> 00:04:31,760 Speaker 2: Where do you start with this with people? Is there 86 00:04:31,800 --> 00:04:32,320 Speaker 2: a start? 87 00:04:33,440 --> 00:04:35,239 Speaker 1: Well? I think I posted it because so many people 88 00:04:35,240 --> 00:04:37,760 Speaker 1: struggle with it. I didn't actually post it. My wife 89 00:04:37,800 --> 00:04:40,719 Speaker 1: Amy posted it. I didn't even know it was up 90 00:04:40,800 --> 00:04:44,120 Speaker 1: until now. But it makes sense, right and when I 91 00:04:44,160 --> 00:04:47,599 Speaker 1: talk about public speaking, I'm not talking about like you 92 00:04:47,640 --> 00:04:49,800 Speaker 1: brought up. I'm not necessarily talking about you're getting on 93 00:04:49,839 --> 00:04:52,480 Speaker 1: stage in front of like hundreds of thousands of people, 94 00:04:52,839 --> 00:04:55,920 Speaker 1: although doing public presentations is definitely part of that. I'm 95 00:04:55,960 --> 00:04:57,800 Speaker 1: talking about someone who gets up to give a toast 96 00:04:57,839 --> 00:05:00,359 Speaker 1: at a wedding, or someone who has to do a 97 00:05:00,400 --> 00:05:03,400 Speaker 1: presentation for the board, or they're a team leader, they're 98 00:05:03,440 --> 00:05:05,120 Speaker 1: a manager, and they got to get up and present 99 00:05:05,200 --> 00:05:09,400 Speaker 1: to their team and they either panic or they which 100 00:05:09,440 --> 00:05:12,080 Speaker 1: means they completely free, or they overthink and they start 101 00:05:12,120 --> 00:05:16,520 Speaker 1: to choke. And this becomes a major stumbling block for people. 102 00:05:17,160 --> 00:05:21,039 Speaker 1: And you know, if you take doctor Albert Ellis came 103 00:05:21,160 --> 00:05:24,640 Speaker 1: up with something that's widely used in cognitive behavior therapy, 104 00:05:24,760 --> 00:05:29,600 Speaker 1: and it's the ABC process. There's ABC D, but basically 105 00:05:30,120 --> 00:05:34,680 Speaker 1: it's that you have an activating event the A and 106 00:05:34,839 --> 00:05:38,800 Speaker 1: this is something that causes you stress. It's associated with adversity, 107 00:05:39,360 --> 00:05:42,320 Speaker 1: Like you're thinking about, I've got to give a presentation, 108 00:05:42,560 --> 00:05:45,200 Speaker 1: you know, tomorrow or in the next hour. Some people 109 00:05:45,279 --> 00:05:47,919 Speaker 1: it could be even next week. And then if you 110 00:05:48,040 --> 00:05:52,320 Speaker 1: jump from A to C, right, the consequence consequence is 111 00:05:52,400 --> 00:05:56,600 Speaker 1: what happens when you're in that situation that is causing 112 00:05:56,640 --> 00:06:01,280 Speaker 1: you to feel a sensation that you're interpreting as an emotion. 113 00:06:01,400 --> 00:06:05,719 Speaker 1: You don't want to feel stress, and it could be well, 114 00:06:05,760 --> 00:06:08,400 Speaker 1: I start to get sweaty pumps, I start to hyperventil 115 00:06:08,480 --> 00:06:10,840 Speaker 1: I start to think about you know, what happens when 116 00:06:10,880 --> 00:06:14,080 Speaker 1: I get up in front of the room and just 117 00:06:14,120 --> 00:06:17,240 Speaker 1: people are tuned out, They're just staring off out into space. 118 00:06:17,720 --> 00:06:20,080 Speaker 1: Oh they hate this. I'm not connecting. I'm not going 119 00:06:20,160 --> 00:06:23,480 Speaker 1: to get that promotion. And when you're in that state 120 00:06:23,680 --> 00:06:28,000 Speaker 1: of stress physiologically, what happens to your frontal lopes. Well, 121 00:06:28,200 --> 00:06:32,360 Speaker 1: you know, they downregulate and performance drops. So even you 122 00:06:32,640 --> 00:06:35,880 Speaker 1: thinking that thought and being fixated on what's going on inside, 123 00:06:35,920 --> 00:06:38,240 Speaker 1: if you rather them what's going on with the people 124 00:06:38,320 --> 00:06:42,080 Speaker 1: in front of you, and being able to assess that accurately, 125 00:06:42,760 --> 00:06:48,200 Speaker 1: you invariably bring down your own level of performance. So 126 00:06:49,040 --> 00:06:51,640 Speaker 1: it's if you take a look at what's in between 127 00:06:51,800 --> 00:06:57,000 Speaker 1: A and C, it's B and B stands for belief. Yeah, 128 00:06:57,000 --> 00:07:04,400 Speaker 1: well that could be it too, but it's whatever you're interpreting, 129 00:07:04,480 --> 00:07:09,279 Speaker 1: whatever you believe about that scenario is going to dictate 130 00:07:10,560 --> 00:07:13,040 Speaker 1: what's going on side of you emotionally and how you're 131 00:07:13,080 --> 00:07:17,680 Speaker 1: responding to what's happening inner world with what you're projecting 132 00:07:17,760 --> 00:07:20,600 Speaker 1: into your outer world. So and this cuts both ways. 133 00:07:20,720 --> 00:07:23,560 Speaker 1: Let's say we take two people, right Jane. Jane gets 134 00:07:23,640 --> 00:07:26,360 Speaker 1: up and she's speaking in front of the board, and 135 00:07:27,080 --> 00:07:29,840 Speaker 1: she notices that somebody in the back of the room 136 00:07:30,240 --> 00:07:32,600 Speaker 1: they just started looking at their phone and now they're 137 00:07:32,640 --> 00:07:35,400 Speaker 1: just texting. And then she took a look at another 138 00:07:35,480 --> 00:07:39,120 Speaker 1: person in the board and they're staring up the ceiling. Instantly, 139 00:07:39,280 --> 00:07:43,760 Speaker 1: Jane starts to interpret that the belief there is, Oh, 140 00:07:43,840 --> 00:07:48,160 Speaker 1: they are so tuned out. I am completely bombing. This 141 00:07:48,200 --> 00:07:51,240 Speaker 1: is why I got passed over last year. They're not 142 00:07:51,320 --> 00:07:55,040 Speaker 1: gonna hand me any more important projects. You know, they're 143 00:07:55,120 --> 00:07:57,560 Speaker 1: downsizing around here. Am I even gonna have it? She's 144 00:07:57,560 --> 00:08:00,400 Speaker 1: thinking about all of this. She's no longer even with 145 00:08:00,480 --> 00:08:03,200 Speaker 1: the group. She's in her head. No matter how good 146 00:08:03,240 --> 00:08:06,080 Speaker 1: her presentation was supposed to be, it's not gonna be 147 00:08:06,120 --> 00:08:09,720 Speaker 1: anywhere near as good. And she's probably gonna not be 148 00:08:09,760 --> 00:08:12,080 Speaker 1: able to wait until she gets out of the room. 149 00:08:12,280 --> 00:08:16,000 Speaker 1: And every time that she presents holding that belief, she's 150 00:08:16,000 --> 00:08:21,119 Speaker 1: gonna create that self fulfilling prophecy. It's not the activating event. 151 00:08:21,720 --> 00:08:27,000 Speaker 1: It's not the consequence physiologically and behaviorally, it's the belief 152 00:08:27,560 --> 00:08:31,080 Speaker 1: about what's happening. I mean, for all, she knows that 153 00:08:31,120 --> 00:08:34,120 Speaker 1: person could have gotten an emergency text message that their 154 00:08:34,200 --> 00:08:37,960 Speaker 1: kid is sick at school. What she's not noticing is 155 00:08:38,240 --> 00:08:40,200 Speaker 1: the members of the board that are close to her 156 00:08:40,320 --> 00:08:43,880 Speaker 1: are nodding their head into agreement. What she's not noticing 157 00:08:44,000 --> 00:08:47,000 Speaker 1: is two people were leaning back in their chair. That 158 00:08:47,040 --> 00:08:49,960 Speaker 1: doesn't mean anything, by the way, it's not disinterest. They 159 00:08:50,000 --> 00:08:52,520 Speaker 1: could be comfortable. But what she didn't notice is they 160 00:08:52,600 --> 00:08:54,880 Speaker 1: went from leaning back in their chair and when she 161 00:08:54,960 --> 00:08:57,840 Speaker 1: made her third point, they both leaned in and they 162 00:08:57,880 --> 00:09:01,640 Speaker 1: were engaged. So she's noticed everything in line with her belief. 163 00:09:01,679 --> 00:09:05,240 Speaker 1: She's dismissing everything that's not in line with her belief. 164 00:09:05,760 --> 00:09:09,920 Speaker 1: So in that video, what we do is we restructure 165 00:09:09,960 --> 00:09:15,240 Speaker 1: the rules so it's impossible to have well, it's not impossible, 166 00:09:15,280 --> 00:09:18,920 Speaker 1: that's ridiculous. It's a lot harder to suffer from performance 167 00:09:18,960 --> 00:09:22,880 Speaker 1: anxiety because what we do with this person, let's say Jane, 168 00:09:23,480 --> 00:09:25,920 Speaker 1: is we ask her, okay, on a scale from one 169 00:09:25,960 --> 00:09:29,160 Speaker 1: to ten, how good of a presenter do you reckon 170 00:09:29,200 --> 00:09:33,080 Speaker 1: you are? And doesn't matter Let's say she's like, I'm five. 171 00:09:33,600 --> 00:09:36,840 Speaker 1: You know, I'm not the worst presenter, but by far 172 00:09:37,000 --> 00:09:41,440 Speaker 1: not the best presenter in my department. I'm sort of mediocre. Well, 173 00:09:41,520 --> 00:09:44,680 Speaker 1: what I would ask Jane is, well, tell me what 174 00:09:44,800 --> 00:09:48,120 Speaker 1: makes a five a five? Why'd you say that? And 175 00:09:48,160 --> 00:09:51,000 Speaker 1: then she's in one of our classes where we're teaching 176 00:09:51,040 --> 00:09:54,440 Speaker 1: public speaking skills. I might ask Jane to get up 177 00:09:54,440 --> 00:09:55,880 Speaker 1: in front of the room and show me a five. 178 00:09:56,640 --> 00:10:01,280 Speaker 1: Show me that five presentation, and then I'll stop her 179 00:10:02,000 --> 00:10:04,640 Speaker 1: a minute or so into it, and I'll say, all right, Jane, 180 00:10:05,080 --> 00:10:08,360 Speaker 1: let's tweak this a little bit. Show me how you 181 00:10:08,440 --> 00:10:11,720 Speaker 1: can do just a little bit worse. Show me a four, 182 00:10:13,280 --> 00:10:15,800 Speaker 1: and then we'll take it to Okay, show me a three. 183 00:10:16,040 --> 00:10:18,160 Speaker 1: We'll go all the way down to one. And the 184 00:10:18,200 --> 00:10:21,719 Speaker 1: reason why this works is if you're having performance anxiety, 185 00:10:21,840 --> 00:10:24,680 Speaker 1: like I'm not really good at this, Well, the rules 186 00:10:24,720 --> 00:10:27,560 Speaker 1: are let's see how bad you can be, And there's 187 00:10:27,640 --> 00:10:30,480 Speaker 1: usually a couple of responses. One, I cannot experience the 188 00:10:30,520 --> 00:10:34,160 Speaker 1: same level of performance anxiety because if I fail, I've 189 00:10:34,200 --> 00:10:39,160 Speaker 1: succeeded according to the rules. Two, I'm getting the person 190 00:10:39,240 --> 00:10:42,880 Speaker 1: to start to play around with range. So if you 191 00:10:43,120 --> 00:10:48,360 Speaker 1: can intentionally make your presentation much much worse within a 192 00:10:48,360 --> 00:10:50,840 Speaker 1: matter of minutes. And by the way, I've never met 193 00:10:50,840 --> 00:10:53,600 Speaker 1: anyone who cannot. And some people are even embarrassed to 194 00:10:53,600 --> 00:10:58,800 Speaker 1: do this, but eventually they get there, their presentation is atrocious. 195 00:10:59,400 --> 00:11:01,480 Speaker 2: Where's they by winning? 196 00:11:02,080 --> 00:11:05,439 Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly, I asked you to do that. So it's 197 00:11:05,440 --> 00:11:08,640 Speaker 1: not like, oh, I'm failing. No, you're doing the assignment properly. 198 00:11:09,320 --> 00:11:12,319 Speaker 1: But the bias becomes if you can make it worse, 199 00:11:12,960 --> 00:11:16,720 Speaker 1: what makes you believe that you're not capable of intentionally 200 00:11:17,280 --> 00:11:20,640 Speaker 1: and expeditiously making it better. And at this point, people 201 00:11:20,640 --> 00:11:23,640 Speaker 1: are laughing. They're having a good time, so they're not 202 00:11:24,160 --> 00:11:28,760 Speaker 1: inwardly as as stressed or feeling so much duress. The 203 00:11:28,800 --> 00:11:31,640 Speaker 1: rest of the audience, the class is laughing, so now 204 00:11:31,800 --> 00:11:34,040 Speaker 1: they're not laughing at you, they're laughing with you. So 205 00:11:34,120 --> 00:11:37,880 Speaker 1: now you have social support and cohesion. And that's like, Okay, Jane, 206 00:11:38,000 --> 00:11:40,199 Speaker 1: take me back to that five again. I want to 207 00:11:40,280 --> 00:11:42,840 Speaker 1: see that five one more time, but this time the 208 00:11:42,880 --> 00:11:46,920 Speaker 1: five is a different representation of the five. She thinks 209 00:11:47,040 --> 00:11:49,680 Speaker 1: she's showing you a five, but the rest of the room, 210 00:11:49,760 --> 00:11:53,520 Speaker 1: and what she realizes soon is the five. Now minutes 211 00:11:53,600 --> 00:11:56,880 Speaker 1: later is much better that it was ten to fifteen 212 00:11:56,920 --> 00:11:59,360 Speaker 1: minutes ago. And then it's like, okay, show me a six, 213 00:12:00,840 --> 00:12:04,319 Speaker 1: let's take it to eight to nine to ten. And 214 00:12:04,600 --> 00:12:10,840 Speaker 1: we're working within range of emotion and expression and energy. 215 00:12:11,240 --> 00:12:16,200 Speaker 1: So we're working on behavioral things that create an intrinsic state. 216 00:12:17,080 --> 00:12:19,760 Speaker 1: And if you can play with locus of control in 217 00:12:19,840 --> 00:12:21,839 Speaker 1: one direction, you can do it another. So there's a 218 00:12:21,920 --> 00:12:25,320 Speaker 1: lot of reasons why that particular exercise that we talked 219 00:12:25,320 --> 00:12:28,760 Speaker 1: about in the video works really really well. 220 00:12:29,600 --> 00:12:34,760 Speaker 2: Mmmm ah, so many things around this. I had a 221 00:12:34,840 --> 00:12:39,200 Speaker 2: lady on in fact, an academic and a medical doctor 222 00:12:39,240 --> 00:12:43,520 Speaker 2: and a researcher and an integrated medicine specialist and maybe 223 00:12:43,640 --> 00:12:47,560 Speaker 2: one of the leading trauma experts in the world. Her 224 00:12:47,600 --> 00:12:50,719 Speaker 2: name is doctor Amy Appajean. Have you heard of her? 225 00:12:51,800 --> 00:12:54,439 Speaker 2: She anyway, she wrote a book called The Biology of Trauma. 226 00:12:54,679 --> 00:12:58,600 Speaker 2: I had her on this morning. Wow, she was so good, dude, 227 00:12:58,640 --> 00:13:03,800 Speaker 2: you shall get her on your show. Amazing. Well, we're 228 00:13:03,840 --> 00:13:06,640 Speaker 2: on your show and my show, so you shall get 229 00:13:06,679 --> 00:13:11,240 Speaker 2: her on our show. The self help antidote great, And 230 00:13:11,280 --> 00:13:15,280 Speaker 2: she was talking about you know, like the I mean, 231 00:13:15,320 --> 00:13:18,160 Speaker 2: it's like so many things. It's not like, oh, you're traumatized. 232 00:13:18,200 --> 00:13:21,080 Speaker 2: All right, here, do this, you won't be anymore. Like 233 00:13:21,160 --> 00:13:25,679 Speaker 2: it's so it's so complicated, it's so contextual, it's so 234 00:13:25,880 --> 00:13:30,320 Speaker 2: variable depending on a range of bloody factors. But she 235 00:13:30,440 --> 00:13:35,480 Speaker 2: did talk on a level about how she didn't say 236 00:13:35,520 --> 00:13:40,200 Speaker 2: these exact words, but we kind of traumatize ourselves based 237 00:13:40,240 --> 00:13:45,200 Speaker 2: on a reaction to a thing, like something happens, and 238 00:13:45,240 --> 00:13:48,560 Speaker 2: then the trauma is our response to the thing that happens. 239 00:13:49,160 --> 00:13:52,200 Speaker 2: And somebody else might have the same thing happen and 240 00:13:52,240 --> 00:13:55,400 Speaker 2: out of their control happening in their physical world, the 241 00:13:55,720 --> 00:13:59,959 Speaker 2: thing happens and they are not traumatized. Now this is 242 00:14:00,160 --> 00:14:03,600 Speaker 2: not a criticism or a praise of anyone, but rather 243 00:14:04,880 --> 00:14:11,319 Speaker 2: an awareness. Right, so that being able to, you know, 244 00:14:11,320 --> 00:14:13,400 Speaker 2: knowing that people get on stage who are calm, and 245 00:14:13,440 --> 00:14:15,680 Speaker 2: knowing that people get on stage who are terrified, or 246 00:14:15,720 --> 00:14:17,439 Speaker 2: knowing that people have got to do a talk of 247 00:14:17,520 --> 00:14:22,480 Speaker 2: their best mates fiftieth and they're terrified or they can't wait, 248 00:14:22,560 --> 00:14:25,680 Speaker 2: they're excited. It's not about the fiftieth It's not about 249 00:14:25,720 --> 00:14:29,280 Speaker 2: the situation or circumstance. It's about how you as an 250 00:14:29,320 --> 00:14:33,360 Speaker 2: individual respond to that. It's about the impact based on 251 00:14:33,440 --> 00:14:35,960 Speaker 2: the story you tell or as you say, the belief 252 00:14:36,000 --> 00:14:39,280 Speaker 2: you have. What's my story about the thing I've got 253 00:14:39,280 --> 00:14:43,720 Speaker 2: to do this Saturday night at Bobby's birthday. It's Bobby's birthday. 254 00:14:44,440 --> 00:14:48,760 Speaker 2: Amy asked me to say a few things. Oh my god. Right, 255 00:14:49,200 --> 00:14:51,720 Speaker 2: So it's not about the birthday or the speech. It's 256 00:14:51,760 --> 00:14:54,520 Speaker 2: about my fucking response and my story and then my 257 00:14:54,640 --> 00:14:59,000 Speaker 2: subsequent anxiety and all of these things. I mean what 258 00:14:59,040 --> 00:15:02,200 Speaker 2: you're saying. I but for people who don't have that 259 00:15:02,360 --> 00:15:06,880 Speaker 2: at their disposal or access, where does someone start who's 260 00:15:06,920 --> 00:15:11,280 Speaker 2: listening to this, going, that's cool, Bobby, But I don't 261 00:15:11,360 --> 00:15:13,400 Speaker 2: have that person to walk me through that or talk 262 00:15:13,480 --> 00:15:20,960 Speaker 2: me through that process is, you know, is desensitizing ourselves. 263 00:15:21,040 --> 00:15:23,920 Speaker 2: You know, just exposure therapy good is like well, fuck, 264 00:15:23,960 --> 00:15:26,520 Speaker 2: I'm just gonna I'm going to talk to my phone 265 00:15:26,520 --> 00:15:29,400 Speaker 2: and do a one minute presentation and then watch it 266 00:15:29,520 --> 00:15:31,520 Speaker 2: back and then I'm going to send it to someone. 267 00:15:31,720 --> 00:15:36,400 Speaker 2: Or like, what's like some practical shit that we can 268 00:15:36,480 --> 00:15:40,320 Speaker 2: do that will move the needle in a short ish 269 00:15:40,400 --> 00:15:43,400 Speaker 2: period of time, Like practical, real world stuff that we 270 00:15:43,480 --> 00:15:43,840 Speaker 2: can do. 271 00:15:44,680 --> 00:15:47,120 Speaker 1: And the answer to all that is is yes, But 272 00:15:47,200 --> 00:15:50,680 Speaker 1: to a certain degree, there's got to be a balance 273 00:15:50,760 --> 00:15:55,360 Speaker 1: between support, safety and challenge. If you have a sneak phobia, 274 00:15:55,440 --> 00:15:58,360 Speaker 1: jumping into a snake pit is probably not a good 275 00:15:58,400 --> 00:16:00,920 Speaker 1: form of exposure. You're going to die of a heart 276 00:16:00,920 --> 00:16:04,440 Speaker 1: attack before snake can do anything to you. So look 277 00:16:04,640 --> 00:16:09,760 Speaker 1: for tiny little situations where you can execute. I'll give you. 278 00:16:09,960 --> 00:16:11,800 Speaker 1: I'm going to give you an example out of my 279 00:16:11,920 --> 00:16:17,040 Speaker 1: own life. Something that happened yesterday. So yesterday I had 280 00:16:17,040 --> 00:16:18,680 Speaker 1: to give a presentation. We all did. It was like 281 00:16:18,680 --> 00:16:22,120 Speaker 1: one of those quarterly updates. And when I sat down 282 00:16:22,200 --> 00:16:25,960 Speaker 1: to give a quarterly update on the three strategic initiatives 283 00:16:25,960 --> 00:16:29,160 Speaker 1: that I'm working on in order to accomplish our north 284 00:16:29,200 --> 00:16:33,120 Speaker 1: Star goals, There's there's a couple of people in the room, 285 00:16:33,280 --> 00:16:36,120 Speaker 1: and no matter what I say, they always think it's 286 00:16:36,160 --> 00:16:39,560 Speaker 1: the stupidest thing they have ever heard. And it irritated 287 00:16:39,600 --> 00:16:43,280 Speaker 1: Like there's nothing I could say that will not irritate 288 00:16:43,360 --> 00:16:45,800 Speaker 1: them and make them think that that was the stupidest 289 00:16:45,800 --> 00:16:48,880 Speaker 1: comment in the whole whole meeting. So I'm sitting there 290 00:16:48,920 --> 00:16:51,320 Speaker 1: and I'm like, God, I really don't even want to 291 00:16:51,360 --> 00:16:54,240 Speaker 1: speak right now. I'm just like looking at them like 292 00:16:54,280 --> 00:16:58,280 Speaker 1: this still happens to me, And I'm so nervous because 293 00:16:58,400 --> 00:17:01,760 Speaker 1: these two people and I'm trying so hard to please 294 00:17:01,760 --> 00:17:05,920 Speaker 1: for reasons beyond the show that I'm hitting these buttons 295 00:17:05,920 --> 00:17:08,640 Speaker 1: and all these pop up boxes are appearing all over 296 00:17:08,680 --> 00:17:10,800 Speaker 1: the slide. I don't know how to get them off. 297 00:17:11,480 --> 00:17:15,879 Speaker 1: So and you know, I thought about a teaching from 298 00:17:16,480 --> 00:17:21,280 Speaker 1: Marcus Aurelius, where you know, in Meditations. What's really interesting 299 00:17:21,480 --> 00:17:24,240 Speaker 1: is this is arguably one of the most powerful people 300 00:17:24,240 --> 00:17:26,720 Speaker 1: who have ever lived, could have had anything he wanted, 301 00:17:26,760 --> 00:17:30,320 Speaker 1: faced with temptations, none of us could ever even have them. 302 00:17:30,359 --> 00:17:34,040 Speaker 1: But what he was so preoccupied with was virtue and 303 00:17:34,080 --> 00:17:36,919 Speaker 1: abuse of power. I don't ever want to abuse this power. 304 00:17:36,960 --> 00:17:40,720 Speaker 1: And he never thought anyone would read Meditations. So it's 305 00:17:40,760 --> 00:17:43,400 Speaker 1: brutal honesty. It's a book to himself. And the reason 306 00:17:43,400 --> 00:17:45,800 Speaker 1: why I'm bringing this up is because one of the 307 00:17:45,840 --> 00:17:52,919 Speaker 1: remarkable things was his perspective on greatness, right, because I 308 00:17:53,000 --> 00:17:57,320 Speaker 1: get irritated with the top of greatness people like achieve greatness, 309 00:17:57,520 --> 00:18:00,000 Speaker 1: and I'm going to put it. It's like we're human beings. 310 00:18:00,040 --> 00:18:02,520 Speaker 1: We can get a virus tomorrow, be gone by Saturday. 311 00:18:02,920 --> 00:18:06,160 Speaker 1: So like, what is when you say greatness? What does 312 00:18:06,200 --> 00:18:09,800 Speaker 1: that mean to Marcus Aurelia's greatness was no matter what 313 00:18:09,960 --> 00:18:13,840 Speaker 1: situation you're in, no matter what position or status you're holding, 314 00:18:14,600 --> 00:18:20,520 Speaker 1: always intend to do the greatest good with the resources 315 00:18:20,560 --> 00:18:23,439 Speaker 1: you have from where you are. So for me, it 316 00:18:23,560 --> 00:18:26,880 Speaker 1: was like, Okay, I'm going to say this one thing 317 00:18:27,400 --> 00:18:31,320 Speaker 1: and I'm going to make this one point emphatically. I 318 00:18:31,359 --> 00:18:34,719 Speaker 1: am going to practice right now because this is important 319 00:18:34,720 --> 00:18:38,800 Speaker 1: and it involves other people in their career development, and 320 00:18:39,119 --> 00:18:42,840 Speaker 1: I am going to elevate my level of intensity and 321 00:18:42,880 --> 00:18:45,760 Speaker 1: the emotion that I'm feeling. I am going to project 322 00:18:45,800 --> 00:18:48,240 Speaker 1: that and play with that range, and I'm going to 323 00:18:48,280 --> 00:18:52,240 Speaker 1: make eye contact with people who I know in the 324 00:18:52,400 --> 00:18:55,639 Speaker 1: room are wanting to hear this and they're going to 325 00:18:55,720 --> 00:19:00,760 Speaker 1: resonate with it. So that was just ten seconds practice that, 326 00:19:01,880 --> 00:19:06,160 Speaker 1: and after I went through, I went through an assessment. 327 00:19:06,720 --> 00:19:11,119 Speaker 1: I said, Okay, what did I do particularly well in 328 00:19:11,160 --> 00:19:15,120 Speaker 1: this presentation. It's like, well, first thing is I sat 329 00:19:15,160 --> 00:19:17,320 Speaker 1: down and I gave it right. I could have gotten 330 00:19:17,400 --> 00:19:19,480 Speaker 1: up and walked out of the room. Wouldn't have been 331 00:19:19,480 --> 00:19:21,720 Speaker 1: a very good idea for the room for the meeting 332 00:19:21,720 --> 00:19:24,200 Speaker 1: of my career, but I could have done that. Second 333 00:19:24,280 --> 00:19:29,639 Speaker 1: thing is I identified what part of this is going to 334 00:19:30,520 --> 00:19:35,800 Speaker 1: galvanize and excite people that because it aligns with their 335 00:19:35,800 --> 00:19:41,040 Speaker 1: career aspirations, and I chose to control and focus on 336 00:19:41,160 --> 00:19:45,920 Speaker 1: my delivery in that particular moment. Oh and by the way, 337 00:19:45,960 --> 00:19:48,040 Speaker 1: after the meeting, somebody came up to me and said, oh, 338 00:19:48,080 --> 00:19:51,120 Speaker 1: can I speak to you? I have that aspiration? Can 339 00:19:51,119 --> 00:19:54,400 Speaker 1: you help me get there? Absolutely have my full commitment. 340 00:19:54,800 --> 00:19:59,760 Speaker 1: So that was a success. Second question is if I 341 00:19:59,760 --> 00:20:03,920 Speaker 1: can go back in time and do that meeting all 342 00:20:03,960 --> 00:20:07,560 Speaker 1: over again, what would I have done differently, and not 343 00:20:07,760 --> 00:20:11,080 Speaker 1: just in the presentation inside my own head? Would I 344 00:20:11,080 --> 00:20:15,119 Speaker 1: have changed what I was focusing on? Okay, great, So 345 00:20:15,760 --> 00:20:18,359 Speaker 1: now I learned two things. I learned what I did 346 00:20:18,359 --> 00:20:22,119 Speaker 1: well so I could duplicate that and create on demand. Two. 347 00:20:23,160 --> 00:20:25,560 Speaker 1: I can't control the outcome of that presentation, but I 348 00:20:25,600 --> 00:20:28,760 Speaker 1: can learn from it and leverage that to be more 349 00:20:28,760 --> 00:20:33,159 Speaker 1: effective next time. So when you look at the work 350 00:20:33,200 --> 00:20:36,840 Speaker 1: of doctor Martin Sella and he talks about explanatory style, 351 00:20:37,320 --> 00:20:40,879 Speaker 1: explanatory style is what you say to yourself after an event, 352 00:20:41,240 --> 00:20:44,760 Speaker 1: and there are three elements to a explanatory style that 353 00:20:44,840 --> 00:20:50,080 Speaker 1: are important. It's personal, permanent, and pervasive. So if I 354 00:20:50,200 --> 00:20:52,960 Speaker 1: walked out of that presentation and say, oh god, I 355 00:20:53,119 --> 00:20:58,120 Speaker 1: always drop the ball. I am so stupid. Well, that's permanent. 356 00:20:58,200 --> 00:21:02,160 Speaker 1: Can't fix stupid, can you. It's personal, it's me right, 357 00:21:02,600 --> 00:21:05,480 Speaker 1: and it's pervasive. It's not like, ah, I'm so stupid 358 00:21:05,520 --> 00:21:10,160 Speaker 1: in instances when Nope, I'm just I'm just generally stupid 359 00:21:10,400 --> 00:21:14,960 Speaker 1: in all situations. Like exceeding all things, I want a 360 00:21:15,040 --> 00:21:18,240 Speaker 1: couple of things happen. One, I'm probably not gonna try. Two, 361 00:21:18,440 --> 00:21:23,200 Speaker 1: I can't learn anything from that. So when you have 362 00:21:23,320 --> 00:21:29,560 Speaker 1: that explanatory style, it's dishonest. Whether it's like I'm amazing 363 00:21:29,960 --> 00:21:33,880 Speaker 1: what you're amazing at all times with all things, now, 364 00:21:33,880 --> 00:21:37,240 Speaker 1: that's probably not honest. You want to be balanced between 365 00:21:37,240 --> 00:21:40,880 Speaker 1: a strong internal and external frame of reference. When when 366 00:21:40,880 --> 00:21:43,960 Speaker 1: you implement something like this or that thing that you 367 00:21:44,000 --> 00:21:46,760 Speaker 1: don't want to say in a meeting, you practice saying 368 00:21:46,840 --> 00:21:51,000 Speaker 1: it emphatically or you know what, I'm gonna stand up 369 00:21:51,480 --> 00:21:54,199 Speaker 1: and I'm gonna have fun with the toast because I 370 00:21:54,320 --> 00:21:58,400 Speaker 1: know if I completely stuff this toast up, everyone's gonna 371 00:21:58,480 --> 00:22:01,240 Speaker 1: laugh and that's gonna be great. So I'm gonna lean 372 00:22:01,280 --> 00:22:03,440 Speaker 1: into it. I'm gonna try to fail, I'm gonna I'm 373 00:22:03,440 --> 00:22:06,639 Speaker 1: gonna play but and then after always go through that 374 00:22:06,760 --> 00:22:12,119 Speaker 1: explanatory style and balance internal and external frames. An internal 375 00:22:12,160 --> 00:22:17,000 Speaker 1: frame is where you take responsibility for what you did 376 00:22:17,000 --> 00:22:20,440 Speaker 1: in the moment that produced that outcome, both the good 377 00:22:20,600 --> 00:22:23,879 Speaker 1: and you know the could be better, but also what 378 00:22:24,040 --> 00:22:29,680 Speaker 1: happened externally outside of you, because not everything's in your control. 379 00:22:29,920 --> 00:22:32,120 Speaker 1: You know, was there a time crunch and you didn't 380 00:22:32,160 --> 00:22:34,960 Speaker 1: have time to prepare? That's something that you can learn from. 381 00:22:35,040 --> 00:22:38,520 Speaker 1: Did somebody point to you and go, hey, uh, Craig, oh, 382 00:22:39,119 --> 00:22:41,639 Speaker 1: pop up? And you know, we'd love to love for 383 00:22:41,680 --> 00:22:44,120 Speaker 1: you to say a few words. I need to get 384 00:22:44,119 --> 00:22:47,639 Speaker 1: better at creating on demand in the moment because I 385 00:22:47,640 --> 00:22:49,760 Speaker 1: don't know when these things are going to happen. But 386 00:22:49,840 --> 00:22:53,320 Speaker 1: if you go too far to an external frame of reference, 387 00:22:53,920 --> 00:22:57,040 Speaker 1: that becomes an attribution era where nothing's ever your fault 388 00:22:57,119 --> 00:23:00,880 Speaker 1: or your responsibility. It's all things outside of yourn. If 389 00:23:00,920 --> 00:23:03,640 Speaker 1: you go too far to an internal frame of reference, 390 00:23:04,119 --> 00:23:08,359 Speaker 1: everything's your fault, and you start to go from constructively 391 00:23:08,400 --> 00:23:11,840 Speaker 1: dissecting elements that allow you to progress and get better 392 00:23:11,920 --> 00:23:16,960 Speaker 1: incrementally even though it's uncomfortable, and you start adapting global 393 00:23:17,080 --> 00:23:21,000 Speaker 1: explanatory styles where if you're just dumb or if you 394 00:23:21,160 --> 00:23:23,679 Speaker 1: just suck in front of a room, why would you 395 00:23:23,760 --> 00:23:27,520 Speaker 1: ever try to get better? It's not possible for you, 396 00:23:27,600 --> 00:23:32,400 Speaker 1: it's not accessible for you. So it's balancing the explanatory 397 00:23:32,480 --> 00:23:37,560 Speaker 1: style and balancing internal external frames or reference, putting yourself 398 00:23:37,640 --> 00:23:44,000 Speaker 1: in challenging but relatively safe situations where you can practice 399 00:23:44,040 --> 00:23:47,040 Speaker 1: presenting in a way that aligns with the person who 400 00:23:47,119 --> 00:23:48,880 Speaker 1: you want to be and have the impact you want 401 00:23:48,880 --> 00:23:51,159 Speaker 1: to have, and eventually you'll get better and better and 402 00:23:51,160 --> 00:23:52,960 Speaker 1: it won't be like I'm going to say this thing 403 00:23:52,960 --> 00:23:54,960 Speaker 1: in a meeting. Maybe it's I'm going to lead a 404 00:23:55,000 --> 00:23:58,520 Speaker 1: meeting two months from now, or maybe next time my 405 00:23:58,560 --> 00:24:01,640 Speaker 1: company has a conference they send me to represent them 406 00:24:01,800 --> 00:24:04,840 Speaker 1: six months later because and I love what you said 407 00:24:04,840 --> 00:24:07,000 Speaker 1: about you know, and do it in a way where 408 00:24:07,280 --> 00:24:12,880 Speaker 1: it'll feel uncomfortable, but you remove yourself from being overwhelmed 409 00:24:12,920 --> 00:24:15,359 Speaker 1: with anxiety in the moment where oh my goodness, my 410 00:24:15,400 --> 00:24:19,000 Speaker 1: boss watched this and now now they've lost faith in me. 411 00:24:19,480 --> 00:24:22,199 Speaker 1: Record yourself on video and watch it. It's not going 412 00:24:22,240 --> 00:24:24,760 Speaker 1: to be comfortable, but you're not going to fire yourself. 413 00:24:25,320 --> 00:24:27,720 Speaker 1: You know, You're not going to kick yourself out of 414 00:24:27,760 --> 00:24:30,600 Speaker 1: the house unless it's like that bad and then send 415 00:24:30,640 --> 00:24:34,280 Speaker 1: it to someone who's honest with you and supportive at 416 00:24:34,280 --> 00:24:37,119 Speaker 1: the same time, and I'll tell you how they really feel. 417 00:24:37,640 --> 00:24:40,760 Speaker 1: And you know, see, I see. If you get that 418 00:24:40,880 --> 00:24:43,920 Speaker 1: response consistently and work on that daily, like make a 419 00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:47,680 Speaker 1: video every single day to post on social media. Even 420 00:24:47,720 --> 00:24:50,200 Speaker 1: if you don't post it, make a social media video, 421 00:24:50,440 --> 00:24:51,119 Speaker 1: you'll get better. 422 00:24:52,280 --> 00:24:55,080 Speaker 2: Okay, I'm going to ask you some questions, but here's 423 00:24:55,160 --> 00:25:00,560 Speaker 2: my rule. One minute response Max, you're ready, one minute? 424 00:25:00,880 --> 00:25:01,600 Speaker 1: What is the secret? 425 00:25:03,080 --> 00:25:08,480 Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah, yeah, So being a good presenter. Let's talk 426 00:25:08,520 --> 00:25:10,640 Speaker 2: a little bit more. Now, not so much you're talking 427 00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:14,000 Speaker 2: at your mate's birthday, although that can be it. But 428 00:25:14,119 --> 00:25:17,040 Speaker 2: now where maybe we've got to we've got to present 429 00:25:17,080 --> 00:25:18,840 Speaker 2: to the group at work, and it could be five 430 00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:21,320 Speaker 2: minutes or it could be something big. Like you now 431 00:25:21,359 --> 00:25:24,560 Speaker 2: you want to be a corporate speaker, but you're actually presenting, 432 00:25:24,680 --> 00:25:26,639 Speaker 2: let's say, for more than two or three minutes to 433 00:25:26,680 --> 00:25:32,360 Speaker 2: a group. So if you've nailed everything but you can't 434 00:25:32,400 --> 00:25:35,960 Speaker 2: read the room or at least have an insight into 435 00:25:37,400 --> 00:25:39,960 Speaker 2: you're in trouble. So talk to me about reading the room. 436 00:25:40,000 --> 00:25:42,360 Speaker 2: And as you said, we'll get it wrong at times, 437 00:25:42,359 --> 00:25:47,800 Speaker 2: but with for me, one minute on building rapport, creating connection, 438 00:25:48,080 --> 00:25:51,000 Speaker 2: understanding what's going in front of you, and being able 439 00:25:51,040 --> 00:25:55,080 Speaker 2: to adapt to what is happening in the room. 440 00:25:55,680 --> 00:25:58,679 Speaker 1: I believe and the context of this question, that if 441 00:25:58,680 --> 00:26:02,400 Speaker 1: you're having trouble constantly reading the room, you're too inwardly focused. 442 00:26:02,760 --> 00:26:05,159 Speaker 1: You're thinking about your level of performance. You're not with 443 00:26:05,400 --> 00:26:09,760 Speaker 1: the room when you are completely focused on what you 444 00:26:09,880 --> 00:26:14,320 Speaker 1: want to contribute and why, and you are projecting that outward. 445 00:26:14,840 --> 00:26:18,320 Speaker 1: So there's two frames of mind. One is here I am. 446 00:26:19,200 --> 00:26:22,439 Speaker 1: The other is, oh, there you are. If you're in 447 00:26:22,480 --> 00:26:25,199 Speaker 1: the second frame of mind, you will be able to 448 00:26:25,280 --> 00:26:28,440 Speaker 1: read that with the same way. When you first fall 449 00:26:28,480 --> 00:26:31,520 Speaker 1: in love with somebody and you are so into them 450 00:26:31,840 --> 00:26:34,960 Speaker 1: that you start to finish each other's sentences, you almost 451 00:26:35,000 --> 00:26:38,200 Speaker 1: know what they're feeling because you are matching and mirroring 452 00:26:38,240 --> 00:26:42,639 Speaker 1: them subconsciously, and you are sending the same messages to 453 00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:45,320 Speaker 1: your brain that they are sending to theirs. So if 454 00:26:45,359 --> 00:26:48,080 Speaker 1: you're having trouble reading the room, I guarantee you you're 455 00:26:48,119 --> 00:26:50,720 Speaker 1: thinking about how am I coming off? Am I precise? 456 00:26:51,320 --> 00:26:55,119 Speaker 1: Did that bullet the third bullet on the four slide land? 457 00:26:55,520 --> 00:26:55,720 Speaker 2: Oh? 458 00:26:56,560 --> 00:27:00,600 Speaker 1: Did I cite that reference? Accurately. Did I unicate what 459 00:27:00,720 --> 00:27:04,159 Speaker 1: was in the research? You're in your own head because 460 00:27:04,200 --> 00:27:07,080 Speaker 1: all of that stuff, whilst important, is about twenty percent 461 00:27:07,119 --> 00:27:10,320 Speaker 1: of the impact. Eighty percent of the impact is how 462 00:27:10,359 --> 00:27:14,160 Speaker 1: do you make the people in the room feel? Can 463 00:27:14,200 --> 00:27:18,400 Speaker 1: they relate to you? Are you speaking to them? Are 464 00:27:18,440 --> 00:27:22,199 Speaker 1: you emotionally provocative in a good way? And do you 465 00:27:22,320 --> 00:27:27,920 Speaker 1: have a cohesive narrative that allows them to touch upon 466 00:27:28,280 --> 00:27:31,240 Speaker 1: something that is relevant, like a basic human need they 467 00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:34,680 Speaker 1: want to fulfill an aspiration that they want to grow into. 468 00:27:35,200 --> 00:27:37,359 Speaker 1: If you're not doing that stuff, you're gonna have a 469 00:27:37,400 --> 00:27:39,360 Speaker 1: hard time reading the people in front of you. 470 00:27:40,600 --> 00:27:43,760 Speaker 2: All right, It was way longer than sixty seconds, but serious, 471 00:27:45,119 --> 00:27:51,600 Speaker 2: fucking way longer. All right. Content Like, there are some 472 00:27:51,640 --> 00:27:53,919 Speaker 2: people who their contents of five out of ten, but 473 00:27:53,960 --> 00:27:58,280 Speaker 2: they're fucking amazing on stage, right, You know that they 474 00:27:58,920 --> 00:28:01,360 Speaker 2: know a bit about seven things, but beyond that, it's 475 00:28:01,359 --> 00:28:04,040 Speaker 2: pretty skinny. And I think when I was young and 476 00:28:04,080 --> 00:28:06,800 Speaker 2: I presented that was me. It's like I knew quite 477 00:28:06,840 --> 00:28:11,359 Speaker 2: a bit about a small area and then but because 478 00:28:11,400 --> 00:28:13,359 Speaker 2: I could get away with a bit of charisma and 479 00:28:13,480 --> 00:28:16,280 Speaker 2: charm and bullshit and storytelling, I got away with it. 480 00:28:16,680 --> 00:28:19,160 Speaker 2: But it caught up with me because I literally when 481 00:28:19,160 --> 00:28:22,040 Speaker 2: I was about thirty, I recognized I need to know 482 00:28:22,119 --> 00:28:25,760 Speaker 2: more stuff. I don't know enough stuff, right, so tell 483 00:28:25,760 --> 00:28:31,480 Speaker 2: me about let's put preparation and content just I don't 484 00:28:31,520 --> 00:28:33,960 Speaker 2: know what you want to say about that, but off 485 00:28:34,040 --> 00:28:34,199 Speaker 2: you go. 486 00:28:36,480 --> 00:28:40,080 Speaker 1: I feel like when it comes to quote unquote charisma, magnetism, 487 00:28:40,160 --> 00:28:42,080 Speaker 1: whatever you want to call it. When it comes to 488 00:28:43,000 --> 00:28:47,320 Speaker 1: true expertise, the ability to similate information and form distinctions 489 00:28:47,800 --> 00:28:52,760 Speaker 1: from that information that's relevant to other people, it's mutually reinforcing. 490 00:28:52,760 --> 00:28:54,800 Speaker 1: The more prepared you are and the more you know, 491 00:28:55,560 --> 00:28:59,120 Speaker 1: the more dynamic and confident you're going to be on stage. Right. 492 00:28:59,320 --> 00:29:02,920 Speaker 1: So I think preparation is something that you do twenty 493 00:29:03,080 --> 00:29:05,280 Speaker 1: four hours a day, not seven days a week. I mean, 494 00:29:05,360 --> 00:29:08,360 Speaker 1: take a day off, but it's something you do every 495 00:29:08,680 --> 00:29:12,440 Speaker 1: single day. If you are cramming for a presentation, that 496 00:29:12,640 --> 00:29:16,320 Speaker 1: presentation is gonna be pretty contrived. I think most of 497 00:29:16,360 --> 00:29:19,560 Speaker 1: the preparation that you do it's a matter of proximity. 498 00:29:19,880 --> 00:29:22,920 Speaker 1: The closer you get to the presentation. I'm talking about 499 00:29:22,920 --> 00:29:26,080 Speaker 1: like a day and hours before. The more preparation should 500 00:29:26,120 --> 00:29:28,800 Speaker 1: have to do with mindset and what's going on with 501 00:29:28,880 --> 00:29:33,160 Speaker 1: you emotionally in presence. The further you get from that presentation, 502 00:29:33,600 --> 00:29:36,320 Speaker 1: the more it should be about the content. You need 503 00:29:36,400 --> 00:29:40,960 Speaker 1: to know three to five levels deeper in your subject 504 00:29:41,040 --> 00:29:46,720 Speaker 1: matter expertise than your audience. Otherwise you're gonna come across 505 00:29:46,720 --> 00:29:50,440 Speaker 1: as counterfeit. You're gonna be anxious and for good reason. 506 00:29:50,920 --> 00:29:56,960 Speaker 1: And there's a level there's a level of dishonesty because 507 00:29:57,000 --> 00:30:00,360 Speaker 1: you're presenting yourself as a subject matter expert. So the 508 00:30:00,400 --> 00:30:06,200 Speaker 1: short answer is prepare around content like research, all of 509 00:30:06,240 --> 00:30:10,520 Speaker 1: those things. Subject matter expertise further away. The closer you get, 510 00:30:10,560 --> 00:30:13,440 Speaker 1: the more you shift that towards stage presence. 511 00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:19,920 Speaker 2: Bob Ittt good answer. By the way, Okay, how many 512 00:30:19,960 --> 00:30:24,000 Speaker 2: seconds adapt adaptability you get up it's not going the 513 00:30:24,000 --> 00:30:27,480 Speaker 2: way you want. You realize, Oh fuck, I'm gonna have 514 00:30:27,480 --> 00:30:31,920 Speaker 2: to change direction or slightly change my approach, or it's 515 00:30:31,960 --> 00:30:34,960 Speaker 2: not going the way you thought it was. The ability 516 00:30:35,000 --> 00:30:37,640 Speaker 2: to be flexible and adaptable in real time. 517 00:30:38,840 --> 00:30:42,240 Speaker 1: Oh to fall back to my last response, if if 518 00:30:42,320 --> 00:30:46,840 Speaker 1: you are constantly preparing around your subject matter expertise, and 519 00:30:46,880 --> 00:30:49,760 Speaker 1: then you're in the right frame of mind, the right mindset, 520 00:30:49,840 --> 00:30:52,120 Speaker 1: you're not nervous about Oh my god, am I going 521 00:30:52,160 --> 00:30:55,000 Speaker 1: to bomb if I if I shift gears, are they 522 00:30:55,120 --> 00:30:57,239 Speaker 1: going to notice? You'll be able to do that much 523 00:30:57,320 --> 00:30:59,280 Speaker 1: more readily. Can I tell a quick story? I know 524 00:30:59,320 --> 00:31:01,920 Speaker 1: we only have fifth sixty seconds. 525 00:31:01,560 --> 00:31:06,200 Speaker 2: But quick story, just at everyone. 526 00:31:06,440 --> 00:31:08,440 Speaker 1: There was a debate I had, and this is going 527 00:31:08,520 --> 00:31:10,680 Speaker 1: back over two decades ago, with this guy that I 528 00:31:10,720 --> 00:31:12,640 Speaker 1: worked with, and he was a professor, and he was 529 00:31:13,000 --> 00:31:16,240 Speaker 1: like one of those PowerPoint kings, right, and I was like, 530 00:31:16,280 --> 00:31:18,400 Speaker 1: you have to present from the PowerPoint and you have 531 00:31:18,480 --> 00:31:23,080 Speaker 1: to have clearly defined, structured slides. I'm like, dude, you're 532 00:31:23,080 --> 00:31:25,920 Speaker 1: a subject matter expert. Come in and know the ten 533 00:31:26,000 --> 00:31:29,040 Speaker 1: points that you want to hit, know your examples, no 534 00:31:29,480 --> 00:31:31,120 Speaker 1: how to, but you got to be able to take 535 00:31:31,160 --> 00:31:34,760 Speaker 1: information and questions from the room and change course and 536 00:31:34,800 --> 00:31:38,520 Speaker 1: then bring it back. That's teaching. And we just constantly 537 00:31:38,520 --> 00:31:42,160 Speaker 1: butted heads on this. So one day he goes to 538 00:31:42,160 --> 00:31:46,800 Speaker 1: give his presentation and the projector's not working and the 539 00:31:46,840 --> 00:31:50,480 Speaker 1: slides were not delivered, so he doesn't have any slides 540 00:31:50,760 --> 00:31:53,600 Speaker 1: and neither does anyone in the room. Well let's just 541 00:31:53,640 --> 00:31:58,400 Speaker 1: say that was a horrible day for him because they 542 00:31:58,440 --> 00:32:01,000 Speaker 1: had to pull him out of there. He could think 543 00:32:01,040 --> 00:32:04,360 Speaker 1: about this, This guy was a professor, then went into 544 00:32:04,440 --> 00:32:08,160 Speaker 1: a commercial enterprise. Standing in front of room decades of 545 00:32:08,200 --> 00:32:13,680 Speaker 1: experience could not present. Yeah, that's what that's what happens. 546 00:32:14,320 --> 00:32:17,600 Speaker 2: That's not uncommon. Thank you for sharing that story. It's 547 00:32:17,640 --> 00:32:21,960 Speaker 2: like people don't get that. It's there's a difference. Well, 548 00:32:22,640 --> 00:32:25,680 Speaker 2: I don't know if you've had this, but and obviously 549 00:32:25,720 --> 00:32:27,320 Speaker 2: I'm not going to say who, but I've had at 550 00:32:27,360 --> 00:32:31,160 Speaker 2: least five people over the eight years, maybe closer to ten, people, 551 00:32:32,760 --> 00:32:36,520 Speaker 2: most of whom were well known. One I'll tell you 552 00:32:36,560 --> 00:32:42,320 Speaker 2: when we finish here, like extremely well known. And the 553 00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:53,400 Speaker 2: conversation was so bad. This particular person was so uninspiring, disinterested. 554 00:32:54,600 --> 00:32:58,040 Speaker 2: I'm like, oh my god. And I was excited to 555 00:32:58,080 --> 00:33:00,560 Speaker 2: have this person. And it was also a bit of 556 00:33:00,600 --> 00:33:04,120 Speaker 2: a feather in the typ cap to get this person 557 00:33:04,160 --> 00:33:07,680 Speaker 2: and go, hey, guess who's on and Melissa and I 558 00:33:07,760 --> 00:33:11,040 Speaker 2: waxed and waned over. I'm like, we listened to it, right, 559 00:33:11,560 --> 00:33:15,440 Speaker 2: I can't. This is terrible. People will hate this. Yeah, 560 00:33:15,480 --> 00:33:18,600 Speaker 2: So it's funny you said that because I wrote down 561 00:33:19,000 --> 00:33:22,800 Speaker 2: my last point was death by PowerPoint was So it's 562 00:33:22,880 --> 00:33:26,680 Speaker 2: hilarious that you do that. It's like the antithesis of connection. 563 00:33:26,760 --> 00:33:32,960 Speaker 2: And rapport and you know, instinctiveness and intuition in real time. 564 00:33:33,200 --> 00:33:35,600 Speaker 1: Well, it's a secret cow. I mean, anybody listening to 565 00:33:35,680 --> 00:33:37,760 Speaker 1: us right now, I think about the best conference you've 566 00:33:37,760 --> 00:33:40,720 Speaker 1: ever attended, and who was an inspiring keynote speaker. Eight 567 00:33:40,760 --> 00:33:42,760 Speaker 1: out of ten times they did interview is a PowerPoint. 568 00:33:42,760 --> 00:33:44,600 Speaker 1: If they used the power point, it was to show 569 00:33:44,640 --> 00:33:49,560 Speaker 1: you something that's visually represented or a video that's very distinct. 570 00:33:49,600 --> 00:33:51,760 Speaker 1: I mean, I think you can do that through spoken word. 571 00:33:51,840 --> 00:33:53,880 Speaker 1: I think there's a lot of advantages to doing it. 572 00:33:54,160 --> 00:33:57,080 Speaker 1: But I'm not against power point. But power point is 573 00:33:57,120 --> 00:34:01,360 Speaker 1: so overused and depended upon, especially when you work in 574 00:34:01,360 --> 00:34:05,920 Speaker 1: industries where they consider not having a detailed slide by 575 00:34:05,960 --> 00:34:10,040 Speaker 1: slide PowerPoint to be unprofessional. I think the inability to 576 00:34:10,080 --> 00:34:12,200 Speaker 1: get in front of a room and teach them something 577 00:34:12,239 --> 00:34:16,120 Speaker 1: and take them on a journey somewhere without a like 578 00:34:16,239 --> 00:34:19,160 Speaker 1: pink by numbers, bullet by bullet approach to doing so, 579 00:34:19,719 --> 00:34:23,960 Speaker 1: I believe that's somewhat unprofessional. But it's kind of kind 580 00:34:24,000 --> 00:34:24,239 Speaker 1: of hot. 581 00:34:25,160 --> 00:34:28,040 Speaker 2: My last one. Then we're going to wrap it up. 582 00:34:29,120 --> 00:34:32,360 Speaker 2: So you're doing a conference and you're doing it too. 583 00:34:33,560 --> 00:34:36,480 Speaker 2: It doesn't matter what the industry is you're talking about, basically, 584 00:34:37,120 --> 00:34:38,759 Speaker 2: how to be the best version of you, how to 585 00:34:38,760 --> 00:34:43,280 Speaker 2: optimize you mentally, emotionally, physically. You know how to self managed, 586 00:34:43,320 --> 00:34:45,960 Speaker 2: self regulate and be the best version of you. Very broad, 587 00:34:46,080 --> 00:34:48,680 Speaker 2: very general, but you could do that with your eyes closed. 588 00:34:49,800 --> 00:34:53,960 Speaker 2: Thousand people. I get up, I read your bio. I 589 00:34:54,000 --> 00:34:58,560 Speaker 2: tell the room you're fucking amazing. You get up. What 590 00:34:58,560 --> 00:35:01,279 Speaker 2: do you do in the first minute, Like, what is 591 00:35:01,320 --> 00:35:04,759 Speaker 2: the first minute about? What's your intention? What's your focus? 592 00:35:05,239 --> 00:35:07,719 Speaker 2: What's your objective in the first minute. 593 00:35:10,840 --> 00:35:13,319 Speaker 1: I think the first minute in the last minute are 594 00:35:13,680 --> 00:35:18,440 Speaker 1: rather important because primacy and recency is the gateway and 595 00:35:18,480 --> 00:35:21,840 Speaker 1: the framing for all the content in the middle. I 596 00:35:22,040 --> 00:35:27,440 Speaker 1: usually start with a provocative question that touches upon the 597 00:35:27,560 --> 00:35:29,880 Speaker 1: interests or something that I know is going to be 598 00:35:29,960 --> 00:35:32,359 Speaker 1: very important to the people sitting in the audience based 599 00:35:32,400 --> 00:35:35,080 Speaker 1: on the subject matter, or I open with a story. 600 00:35:36,200 --> 00:35:39,600 Speaker 1: What I don't open with because I think that's equally 601 00:35:39,640 --> 00:35:43,480 Speaker 1: important is well today, our goal for this session is 602 00:35:43,920 --> 00:35:48,120 Speaker 1: our objectives are again like PowerPoint based, not saying I'm 603 00:35:48,120 --> 00:35:50,680 Speaker 1: not going to get there, but I'm going to captivate 604 00:35:50,680 --> 00:35:53,520 Speaker 1: the room with the story. So the first thing I 605 00:35:53,600 --> 00:35:57,440 Speaker 1: open with if it's not a question. If it's not 606 00:35:57,560 --> 00:36:01,759 Speaker 1: an antidote, it'll most likely be a story for me. 607 00:36:02,000 --> 00:36:05,480 Speaker 1: And I'm not saying that works for everybody. Then once 608 00:36:05,520 --> 00:36:09,359 Speaker 1: you do that, you capture attention and they're with you. Ben, 609 00:36:09,440 --> 00:36:12,840 Speaker 1: you can go over, Okay, here's our objectives for today. 610 00:36:13,360 --> 00:36:15,640 Speaker 1: And then it's connected to the story you just told. 611 00:36:17,800 --> 00:36:19,799 Speaker 2: You know what you don't do. You don't walk up 612 00:36:19,840 --> 00:36:22,480 Speaker 2: there and go, hey, how is everyone? 613 00:36:22,960 --> 00:36:25,640 Speaker 1: Oh my goodness, Hey all right. 614 00:36:25,520 --> 00:36:29,560 Speaker 2: How we all doing? Oh my god, stop Brian, stop 615 00:36:29,800 --> 00:36:31,200 Speaker 2: fucking stop. 616 00:36:33,280 --> 00:36:33,840 Speaker 1: Ryan again. 617 00:36:34,280 --> 00:36:40,160 Speaker 2: How are you enjoying it so far? Sush shush, hi mite. 618 00:36:40,600 --> 00:36:42,719 Speaker 2: How do people connect with you? Find you, follow you, 619 00:36:42,840 --> 00:36:45,680 Speaker 2: listen to you tell the world? 620 00:36:46,719 --> 00:36:50,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, please find me on Robert Capuccio dot com the 621 00:36:50,120 --> 00:36:54,279 Speaker 1: self help antidote, which is the one half of this show. 622 00:36:54,320 --> 00:36:58,360 Speaker 1: You're listening to dot com self help antidote dot com 623 00:36:58,400 --> 00:37:00,800 Speaker 1: not self help antidote one half the show. You're listening 624 00:37:00,800 --> 00:37:03,240 Speaker 1: to dot com. That would just be absurdly long, wouldn't it. 625 00:37:03,280 --> 00:37:04,160 Speaker 1: And I'm on LinkedIn. 626 00:37:06,880 --> 00:37:13,040 Speaker 2: No, you're not o c D at all. Thanks buddy. 627 00:37:13,080 --> 00:37:16,319 Speaker 2: We'll say goodbye fare but as always, appreciate you. See 628 00:37:16,360 --> 00:37:16,879 Speaker 2: you next time. 629 00:37:17,280 --> 00:37:18,120 Speaker 1: Thank you. Everybody,