Speaker 1: Bobby Capuccio, Welcome back to you project brother, how are
Speaker 1: you all right?
Speaker 2: And welcome back to the self help and to do it.
Speaker 3: Welcome back to both of these. We hope you well everybody.
Speaker 2: So welcoming environment. I think we're off to a good start.
Speaker 1: Have we started. I think we're both standing at the
Speaker 1: starting line. I can't say we've moved too far forward.
Speaker 1: It's nine oh four as we record on a Thursday
Speaker 1: morning in the thriving metropolis.
Speaker 3: And what is it in San Diego?
Speaker 2: Is it living metropolis of San Diego? It's sixteen five.
Speaker 3: Yeah, just about just five minutes past four.
Speaker 2: This is super early for us in that it is
Speaker 2: it is us.
Speaker 3: It is early for us.
Speaker 1: So one of the things that people don't know about
Speaker 1: you is that you've got a You've got a good
Speaker 1: little well some people don't. You've got a great little
Speaker 1: that sounded condescending. You've got a great ig page called
Speaker 1: the self Help Antidote. So if you don't follow Bobby,
Speaker 1: he's currently at three five, three four, let's see if
Speaker 1: we can boost that up to four thousand followers in
Speaker 1: the next day or three. Have a little bit of
Speaker 1: a listener and a follow but anyway, I want to
Speaker 1: work through some of your thoughts that you share.
Speaker 3: So I'm just going to so here's the protocol for today.
Speaker 3: If you're right with that, I'm.
Speaker 1: Just going to share something that you've said, and I
Speaker 1: want you then to just riff on that for one, two,
Speaker 1: three minutes. And I like this and this will be
Speaker 1: relevant to speakers, want to be speakers, workshop facilitators, anyone
Speaker 1: who gets in front of a group and you said,
Speaker 1: the last thing your audience feels is the first thing
Speaker 1: they remember. So kill the Q and a session at
Speaker 1: the end of your presentations and finish with impact. So
Speaker 1: but I like all of it, but I really like
Speaker 1: the first part. The last thing your audience feels is
Speaker 1: the first thing they remember.
Speaker 3: Where did you learn that? You did that become evident?
Speaker 3: You know?
Speaker 1: Did you just become aware of that by doing that?
Speaker 1: Did someone teach you that and tell us about that concept?
Speaker 2: I think it's a little bit of both. Like we've
Speaker 2: talked about this before, where when you are you are
Speaker 2: working for someone who or they bring you out and
Speaker 2: they don't do presentations themselves. They have a lot of
Speaker 2: ideas about what creates a great presentation and a lot
Speaker 2: of those ideas, unfortunately are false and they don't resonate
Speaker 2: with the audience. The audience isn't going to remember necessarily
Speaker 2: every bullet point or the data that you shared, or
Speaker 2: like this specific reference or scientific study. Not saying that
Speaker 2: all of that stuff is not important because it's it's empowering,
Speaker 2: it's a specific takeaway, but all of that's predicated on
Speaker 2: how did they feel. Like everybody's had the death by
Speaker 2: power point to experience where it's like, oh my goodness,
Speaker 2: all right, slide thirty seven excellent. By the time he
Speaker 2: gets to thirty eight, I'm going to pick my pen
Speaker 2: up off of this table and stab myself in the
Speaker 2: left eye. Versus where you've gone to a twelve hour
Speaker 2: event and you're energized through most of it. Because of
Speaker 2: how you feel and how you feel one it determines
Speaker 2: how likely you are to even implement anything that you're
Speaker 2: sitting through. And it does affect memory and retention and
Speaker 2: all of that good stuff. But at the end of
Speaker 2: the day, people are going to remember, how did I
Speaker 2: feel in that session? Was was I inspired like this?
Speaker 2: This week, I was doing a debrief and one of
Speaker 2: the things that came back in the evals where people like, oh,
Speaker 2: I really love the book references because I want to
Speaker 2: go out and explore some of those books. That's a win.
Speaker 2: Somebody felt something and then as they felt something, they
Speaker 2: heard something that inspired them that they can learn more,
Speaker 2: or they can have more, or they can be more
Speaker 2: as a result of the content being discussed, they're going
Speaker 2: to leave there and go investigator on their own. You
Speaker 2: might have created a lifelong learner in that session. That's
Speaker 2: one of the highest outcomes. So it's not like, oh wow,
Speaker 2: like these three points that I'm bringing in, there's no
Speaker 2: way they're going to get through these three points anywhere else.
Speaker 2: I mean, it's not like we have anything where you
Speaker 2: can go watch seemingly unlimited amount of high quality videos
Speaker 2: being produced and you can access that for free.
Speaker 3: And finally we had that Yeah, you and I should
Speaker 3: shot something.
Speaker 2: It's almost like a TV for you, like a YouTube.
Speaker 2: You know that somebody should do something about that.
Speaker 3: There you go.
Speaker 1: So maybe we should invent the internet as well. Go on,
Speaker 1: I interrupted, kick going Internet.
Speaker 2: That sounds amazing. We need to talk about that. Offul lone.
Speaker 1: Okay, I here, let's let's let's shut this down because
Speaker 1: we've got a lot to get through, but maybe just
Speaker 1: one momentute. I'm thinking, as you're talking, I coach a
Speaker 1: few speakers, and I know you've helped speakers over the
Speaker 1: years and continue to educate and inspire and all of that.
Speaker 3: But it's such a good.
Speaker 1: Point because when we are, when speakers are or people
Speaker 1: who are going to be in front of a group
Speaker 1: have to present in inverted commas or share two minutes
Speaker 1: introducing someone, or they tend to be so obsessed with
Speaker 1: remembering stuff or their content, or you know, is this
Speaker 1: a good is this accurate, is this good science? Is
Speaker 1: this relevant to this group? And all of those things matter,
Speaker 1: But you might have the best content in terms of
Speaker 1: you know, this is it's all scientifically valid and relevant
Speaker 1: and all of these points are salient and it actually
Speaker 1: is representative of the audience. But if you're not building
Speaker 1: connection and rapport, if you're not touching people emotionally, if
Speaker 1: there's no story, there's no humor, if there's no engagement,
Speaker 1: despite the fact that the content is good, then one
Speaker 1: you're probably not going to get another gig as a speaker,
Speaker 1: not with them anyway, And two people are going to
Speaker 1: walk away from that feeling uninspired despite the great content.
Speaker 2: Absolutely. I mean, if you're a subject matter expert, you're
Speaker 2: diving through that stuff every single day. And I'm not
Speaker 2: saying you don't have a structure, having a structure, knowing
Speaker 2: where you're going to go and an idea of how
Speaker 2: to get there, and being adaptable that it might not
Speaker 2: work out that way based on what's happening in the audience.
Speaker 2: All that stuff is important, but if you're doing that
Speaker 2: stuff every day, it's a matter of letting go and
Speaker 2: connecting with the audience first and foremost. I want to
Speaker 2: answer your question about the Q and A because when
Speaker 2: you take a look at emotional impact, there's two factors,
Speaker 2: two variables. There's primacy and recency, right, Like, what does
Speaker 2: that mean? What did you open with? What did you
Speaker 2: end with?
Speaker 3: Right?
Speaker 2: Right? So those two things set the stage for how
Speaker 2: much they remember and how relevant and engage they are
Speaker 2: emotionally and mentally in every bit within the middle. And
Speaker 2: imagine going to a rock concert and it's like they
Speaker 2: come out, they do this amazing encore and everybody's on
Speaker 2: their feet cheering, and then it's like, Okay, well we're
Speaker 2: gonna do a Q and A. Now any questions, and
Speaker 2: guy in the fifth row is like, whoa, how do
Speaker 2: you keep your hair like so long and wavy? Could
Speaker 2: you tell us about like some hair product recommendation. You've
Speaker 2: just killed the energy. That's That's where I'm walking back
Speaker 2: to the car thinking about, rather than that was an
Speaker 2: amazing finale to that concert. It's the same thing. It's
Speaker 2: not that I'm against answering questions, just where do.
Speaker 3: You do it?
Speaker 1: Do you know what would be even a better a
Speaker 1: bitter story for that is, like I say, they say,
Speaker 1: come out, They do an oncre they plied back in black,
Speaker 1: They ply you shook me all not long, They ply bells,
Speaker 1: they walk off stage and the audience goes nuts, and
Speaker 1: they come back and then they play a brand new
Speaker 1: song that no one's ever heard.
Speaker 3: That's shit, and then they say thanks very much, see
Speaker 3: you later. You know.
Speaker 1: It's like people like everyone was just euphoric and now
Speaker 1: they just walk with through the car park to their
Speaker 1: car with their head in their hands, going what the
Speaker 1: fuck was that?
Speaker 2: Yeah? That's that. That's a beautiful analogy. Actually, all right,
Speaker 2: they want to do that would be because they would
Speaker 2: test that prior.
Speaker 3: Okay, next, So this is all from Bobby's page.
Speaker 1: I've got like quite a bit on this, but I'm
Speaker 1: just going to read the headline, Clarity beats clever how
Speaker 1: to actually reach people? Now, I feel like this is
Speaker 1: in the same ballpark as where we just were, But
Speaker 1: I like that clarity beats clever.
Speaker 2: I feel like I have, like anyone who knows me
Speaker 2: like nos, I probably have no business talking about this.
Speaker 2: That's like me talking about like brevity versus something else.
Speaker 2: So a little bit hypocritical. But just here's a question.
Speaker 2: I'm going to ask your audience who is John Grinder
Speaker 2: or Richard Bandler? And I'm sure a good portion of
Speaker 2: your audience knows exactly who those two gentlemen are, but
Speaker 2: a greater portion of your audience has absolutely no idea
Speaker 2: who they are. Now, have you ever heard the name
Speaker 2: Tony Robbins? H I would be astonished if there's someone
Speaker 2: out there going Tony who? I think? Yeah, does he
Speaker 2: work at the corner shop? No, he's a household name.
Speaker 2: If you wanted to learn about let's say NLP, for example,
Speaker 2: would you go to a Richard Bandler workshop or a
Speaker 2: Tony Robbins workshop? Most people would say Tony Robins. Where
Speaker 2: Richard Bandler and John Grinder are the founders of neurolinguistic programming,
Speaker 2: and they probably understand have a deeper understanding and bandwidth
Speaker 2: about how it's applied than anybody else in the world.
Speaker 2: But Tony Robbins, as intelligent as he is, he captivates
Speaker 2: people as well. So he not only forms, he entertains.
Speaker 2: He not only does that, but he creates an environment
Speaker 2: where you can see greater possibilities for yourself in the future.
Speaker 2: There's a version of you in the seat in that seminar,
Speaker 2: and then you're looking out to a version of you
Speaker 2: three months, six months, a year down the line that
Speaker 2: just energizes you, aligns with your values, and draws you out.
Speaker 2: That's why it's so engaging. So that's the point. You
Speaker 2: don't have to worry about phrasing. Things are articulately or
Speaker 2: with the ultimate amount of eloquence that comes with practice
Speaker 2: and sometimes the things that you say, Like sometimes you
Speaker 2: hear a speaker say something and the way that phrase it,
Speaker 2: it's like, oh my god, that just landed. It's what
Speaker 2: they're saying. It's the sentence structure, it's how they string
Speaker 2: ideas together. It's the tonality, it's the emotion. It's all
Speaker 2: of that, but all of that occurs by a speaker
Speaker 2: who is willing to say something imperfectly yet communicate it
Speaker 2: with clarity, sincerity, and energy. And by energy, I don't
Speaker 2: mean the person's bouncing off the wall. I just mean
Speaker 2: that there is something of them that they are present
Speaker 2: in every utterance and every bridge between who they are
Speaker 2: and where that audience is and where they're going. So
Speaker 2: that if that explains it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it's funny how many people are renowned for something,
Speaker 1: known for something, famous for something that they didn't create.
Speaker 1: You know, you think about like at the moment, there's
Speaker 1: a little there's a little bit of a few row.
Speaker 1: I don't know how big it is. But so Mel
Speaker 1: Robin's the well known whatever she is. I think she
Speaker 1: was originally a lawyer. Now she kind of falls in
Speaker 1: the I guess you would call human performance, self help,
Speaker 1: personal development space.
Speaker 3: Who wrote a.
Speaker 1: Book called let Them Theory. Yeah, it's called let Them Theory.
Speaker 1: I haven't read it, but my understanding is it's like
Speaker 1: people are going to do this to you, da da
Speaker 1: da let them. People are going to say that about you,
Speaker 1: let them but whatever, right, which is not really a
Speaker 1: brand new concept. But there was another lady called Cassie
Speaker 1: Phillips who wrote a poem. Have you heard this, Bobby, Yes.
Speaker 1: So she wrote a poem called let Them. So there's
Speaker 1: this underground kind of disase of people who were going
Speaker 1: because Cassie Phillips wrote this poem. I don't know the
Speaker 1: whole backstory, but she wrote a poem called let Them.
Speaker 1: And then mel Robins wrote a book called Let Them
Speaker 1: Theory and never gave any credit to this person who
Speaker 1: wrote this poem. And it's quite long and it's quite
Speaker 1: a very very similar vibe. Now, maybe she knew about it,
Speaker 1: I would say she did, or maybe.
Speaker 3: Well, I don't know. I don't know.
Speaker 1: But anyway, it's quite funny because so she's written this book.
Speaker 1: By the way, I've not read it, but people tell
Speaker 1: me it's a great book. So it probably is a
Speaker 1: great book. But it's so funny that there are so
Speaker 1: many people who like when you think, also, if I'm
Speaker 1: being honest and we zoom out, you look at human
Speaker 1: behavior and behavioral psychology and self help and personal development
Speaker 1: and all the shit you and I talk about. You know,
Speaker 1: there are new settings and new environments and new challenges.
Speaker 1: But human behavior has essentially been the same forever, like
Speaker 1: the human brain and the human mind. It's not drastically
Speaker 1: different to a thousand years ago or two thousand years
Speaker 1: ago when the Stoics were talking about self awareness and
Speaker 1: know thyself and all this stuff. It's not like, oh,
Speaker 1: you know, all the stuff that we talk about is
Speaker 1: brand new. So it's really been around forever, all of
Speaker 1: this stuff.
Speaker 2: I think that plays into what we were talking about
Speaker 2: where it's the original author, but then who communicates it
Speaker 2: in a way that not only intellectually but emotionally resonates.
Speaker 2: Like if you think about finite games or infinite games,
Speaker 2: who pops into your head, Oh, that's Simon Sinek. But
Speaker 2: actually that book was first written by James cars. If
Speaker 2: you think about Don't Sweat the Small Stuff and It's
Speaker 2: all small Stuff, you think about Richard Carson. But the
Speaker 2: person who originally wrote the book Don't Sweat the Small Stuff, Ps,
Speaker 2: it's all small stuff not a very different title is
Speaker 2: a gentleman who I know very well, who lives not
Speaker 2: too far from me, right, So he wrote that book
Speaker 2: or original So doctor Michael Mantel interesting interesting individually he does.
Speaker 2: He does a lot of speaking, you probably know exactly
Speaker 2: who he is, so you and I'm by far not
Speaker 2: a household name, but I was pretty much a big
Speaker 2: name in the health and fitness industry for a while,
Speaker 2: and there was stuff that you know, I created, and
Speaker 2: I wore the T shirt, the emblem, and I would
Speaker 2: go into health clubs, people oh my god, and they
Speaker 2: would name somebody else that we hired after that was
Speaker 2: more associated with my work than I was. Why because
Speaker 2: clearly the way this individual learned it from me and
Speaker 2: then from us and then taught it resonated with the
Speaker 2: audience to a greater degree than I did as the author.
Speaker 2: It's it's emotional connection.
Speaker 1: I think about all the stuff that I put out
Speaker 1: into the world, not including these conversations, but all the
Speaker 1: the stuff I should on Instagram, which for whatever reason,
Speaker 1: and I'm very grateful, but it's doing great. It's like
Speaker 1: it's at the minute, it's never been busy of six
Speaker 1: and a half million views per thirty.
Speaker 3: Days at the moment and all of that.
Speaker 1: But if I'm being truthful, while everything I write, you
Speaker 1: know comes out of my head, but really these ideas
Speaker 1: and concepts and this advice and these messages are a
Speaker 1: version of them have been shared forever. I'm not inventing
Speaker 1: or redefining or reshaping human behavior, right, It's like I'm
Speaker 1: writing things that are relevant for me in the moment
Speaker 1: or little moments of awareness or discovery that I have.
Speaker 1: Then I'm craigifying it and I'm you know, like I
Speaker 1: wrote this thing the other day about this this concept
Speaker 1: that you know, people will not be happy quite often
Speaker 1: when you succeed. Some people will revel in your your failure,
Speaker 1: your disappointment, your fuck up, your demise. And I'm like,
Speaker 1: what a fucking terrible thing. And there's a word for
Speaker 1: that in German. It's called schadenfreuder, right or shadenfreuder right.
Speaker 1: And it's like, yeah, well, that is an interesting word.
Speaker 1: And this is an interesting thing to think about because
Speaker 1: I talk to people about Hey, listen, some people are
Speaker 1: going to be resentful or jealous or disappointed or whatever
Speaker 1: when you do well. Now, I'm not saying that to
Speaker 1: be negative. I'm saying that to be practical and realistic.
Speaker 2: But then that.
Speaker 1: Concept that I'm talking about, which is relevant for people.
Speaker 1: But by the way, this is not new. This thing
Speaker 1: that I'm talking about of people resenting you or hating you,
Speaker 1: or being jealous of you because you're doing better than them. Oh,
Speaker 1: that's only been around for let's see ever. You know
Speaker 1: this is not a recent occurrence of the human experience.
Speaker 1: But we're just finding new ways to share really old
Speaker 1: ideas and old knowledge.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I think that's intellectually honest. That's why I think
Speaker 2: if you're going to create something that is titled very
Speaker 2: close to somebody else's work, I think you should always
Speaker 2: give credit for so many reasons. One, you clearly are
Speaker 2: not the originator of that idea. You've got it from
Speaker 2: somebody else, and you might teach it better or repackage
Speaker 2: it better, and you know, you might have changed it
Speaker 2: just enough that you know you can get away with it.
Speaker 2: But like, cite the original source, because not only is
Speaker 2: it honest, I think it connects your listener or your
Speaker 2: reader to resources beyond you. Yeah, probably why. Probably why
Speaker 2: I'm not like the head of marketing, but it's there.
Speaker 2: I think as a presenter, I don't know how you
Speaker 2: feel about this. The best thing that can happen again is,
Speaker 2: like we were talking about, I reference something that is
Speaker 2: not directly connected to me, and somebody in the audience
Speaker 2: goes out and reads that and goes, oh, this is amazing,
Speaker 2: and by doing that, takes ownership over their own learning
Speaker 2: experience related to that particular topic. Because they do that,
Speaker 2: they read one book, because they attended the session, they're
Speaker 2: likely to read another. And that's your book you're recommending.
Speaker 2: I mean, of course, but outside of you either way,
Speaker 2: that's beautiful because that has sustainability behind it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you do that better than anyone I know.
Speaker 1: Like, you're always referring to other people's work and books,
Speaker 1: and you're always pointing people in a direction that isn't you?
Speaker 1: And I love that about you, Like, that's great, And
Speaker 1: I think it's funny somebody speaking of books and work
Speaker 1: and whatever, credibility for whatever. Somebody said to me the
Speaker 1: other day they only just discovered that I'd written a
Speaker 1: book called Stop Fucking Around, And they said, oh, I
Speaker 1: see you jumped on the Mark what's his name, the
Speaker 1: guy who wrote Mark Manson?
Speaker 2: Mike Manson.
Speaker 3: Yeah, oh, I see you jumped on the Mark Manson
Speaker 3: bang mag And I go.
Speaker 1: I think I wrote my book six years before he
Speaker 1: wrote his book, so well maybe eight years. Mine was
Speaker 1: twenty ten. I don't know what his was, and it
Speaker 1: doesn't matter because I didn't invent that either.
Speaker 3: You know, it's like, it's so funny when I go, well.
Speaker 1: To be honest, you know, his book is a great book,
Speaker 1: but it's like, it's so funny how people think that, oh, well,
Speaker 1: you did something similar to them, so you must have
Speaker 1: copied them. And I went, no, I wrote that fifteen
Speaker 1: years ago, that book, so probably not. I love another
Speaker 1: one that you've got here. So the quote is purpose
Speaker 1: is antidote. So purpose is antidote. My question is antidote
Speaker 1: to what?
Speaker 3: Like? What is it an antidote too?
Speaker 2: I think purpose is the antidote to lack of predictability,
Speaker 2: to burnout, to stress. Now I want to be very,
Speaker 2: very careful because when I see burnout, you're talking about
Speaker 2: something that has multiple level levels and variables. So there
Speaker 2: are social, socioeconomic variables related to it. They's psychological, there's
Speaker 2: into chronological like biological. It's not just a matter of wow,
Speaker 2: if you would just double down and have a greater
Speaker 2: sense of purpose, you can get through those sixteen hour
Speaker 2: consecutive days. That is not what I'm saying. What I
Speaker 2: am saying is all things being equal, Purpose psychologically and
Speaker 2: biologically inoculates you to a degree from the deleterious effects
Speaker 2: of stress and lack of predictability. It's a very good thing.
Speaker 2: It's a central component of well being.
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, what is your I don't mean the definition,
Speaker 1: I mean your understanding, Like, don't give me a definition
Speaker 1: that someone wrote. Give me, like your take on purpose.
Speaker 1: I did, ah maybe four days ago. I did a
Speaker 1: podcast on this very thing, and I say at the start,
Speaker 1: I don't know how this works, but I'm just going
Speaker 1: to tell you how it works for me, and I'm
Speaker 1: going to share my thoughts and ideas around it. This
Speaker 1: is definitely not the final word on it, but you know,
Speaker 1: I have yeah, which I'll share maybe after you do.
Speaker 1: But just tell me. Like when you say what your
Speaker 1: understanding of purpose for an individual, what is that equal?
Speaker 2: For me? Purpose is when you exercise something meaningful or
Speaker 2: a core value in a way that impacts people through contribution.
Speaker 2: Like right now, this is my purpose, it's your purpose.
Speaker 2: We both value and are highly engaged by a love
Speaker 2: of learning. And then we come on here and we
Speaker 2: share this stuff. I mean, does it impact everyone as
Speaker 2: a contribution? Like some people are probably like God, these
Speaker 2: guys are idiots, But there's probably another percentage of people like, Oh,
Speaker 2: that's a great idea. I never thought of it that way.
Speaker 2: Oh I can use this, well, that was a contribution.
Speaker 2: So when I exercise something that's personally meaningful to me
Speaker 2: and it contributes to you, I'm living my purpose.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I agree.
Speaker 1: I think also, I think you know purpose, Obviously it's
Speaker 1: different for different people, or it can be. I think
Speaker 1: your purpose over time will maybe change. Like my focus
Speaker 1: or my purpose or my reason when I was twenty
Speaker 1: five is not the same at sixty.
Speaker 3: That's not good or bad.
Speaker 1: That's probably part of the evolution of me, not better,
Speaker 1: not worse, just doing different stuff, focusing on different stuff.
Speaker 3: And I what about though, and then we'll move on
Speaker 3: what about?
Speaker 1: I feel like there's an idea around purpose that you've
Speaker 1: got to somehow discover it under some ethereal mystical spiritual rock,
Speaker 1: and then you get there and this kind of this
Speaker 1: bright light comes out from under it and there it
Speaker 1: is your purpose and you go, oh fuck, it's been
Speaker 1: over here.
Speaker 3: I'm so glad I looked under this rock.
Speaker 1: Now I have my purpose, Like it's some kind of
Speaker 1: transformative aha moment. What are your thoughts on Obviously, that's
Speaker 1: kind of not true for most people. But what are
Speaker 1: your thoughts on identifying it?
Speaker 3: I don't know.
Speaker 1: Do we choose it, do we create it? Do we
Speaker 1: stumble into it? Do we have a moment in time
Speaker 1: where it gets revealed to us?
Speaker 2: The answer to the first question for me is that's
Speaker 2: an insidious misunderstanding, and I think that stops people from
Speaker 2: going out and exploring and doing stuff because it's so
Speaker 2: big and you're like, oh, I don't have it on
Speaker 2: my purpose isn't good enough? Or you know, it's so
Speaker 2: massive the way you're expected to have this ground sense
Speaker 2: of purpose. However that shows up, it's like, I don't
Speaker 2: even think I have one of those, Like when you
Speaker 2: talk to people that like it's almost apologetic, like I
Speaker 2: don't know what my purpose is? Yes, you do, Like,
Speaker 2: what are the things that are meaningful? Like if time
Speaker 2: and money we're no longer an issue for you and
Speaker 2: you can spend your days doing anything you want to do,
Speaker 2: how would you spend your days? What what makes you
Speaker 2: feel most alive and fulfilled? Okay? How can you share
Speaker 2: that with somebody? Yea, in a meaningful way? There you go,
Speaker 2: that's your purpose and you might go out and go,
Speaker 2: oh you and I want this is not my purpose.
Speaker 2: Six months from now, I feel like something else has
Speaker 2: showed up for me. You know, if you're constantly in
Speaker 2: a state of play, you're willing to be there and
Speaker 2: you don't feel this this weight and this burden of
Speaker 2: like you said, this this light coming from the sky,
Speaker 2: you know, Craig, your purpose ordained by you know, is this?
Speaker 2: This is God?
Speaker 3: Here is your purpose? Take notes.
Speaker 2: It's like, why does God always sound like that and
Speaker 2: not like I don't know, like this big imposing like
Speaker 2: why not Morgan Freeman Like it's it's very relaxing, soothing
Speaker 2: type of voice.
Speaker 1: I don't know, I'm just stereotyping what I've been programmed with.
Speaker 1: But I think also, you know, maybe we grew up
Speaker 1: some of us anyway, thinking that our purpose, not all
Speaker 1: of us, but some of us is going to be
Speaker 1: this like significant, profound thing. Yeah, you know, maybe it's
Speaker 1: just living your values, being a good person, doing no
Speaker 1: harm and helping others when that's an option the end,
Speaker 1: like maybe donate.
Speaker 3: The cure cancer or build the space shuttle.
Speaker 2: Well, it's it's all significant because what you're talking about
Speaker 2: is more people in society getting into touch with what
Speaker 2: it is that fulfills them and gives them a sense
Speaker 2: of well being and sharing it with other people. And
Speaker 2: I like a lot of times when you have individuals
Speaker 2: like you talked about like should in fraut if I'm
Speaker 2: probably even pronouncing that correctly my Germans a bit rough,
Speaker 2: you know, Like, imagine what it's like to be that person,
Speaker 2: not the person who's suffering through misfortune, but the person
Speaker 2: who's delighting in it. Like if they were completely wrapped
Speaker 2: up in sharing things that are mutually rewarding and uplifting,
Speaker 2: would that really be the state they're in. I don't know.
Speaker 2: Maybe the person that's going through misfortune deserves it because
Speaker 2: they're a horrible human and they've done something really bad
Speaker 2: to the person who's like reveling in it, But more
Speaker 2: likely than not, it has nothing to do with that.
Speaker 2: It's like this deep seated sense of misery. I think
Speaker 2: people understanding and acting on a sense of purpose is
Speaker 2: highly not just for the individual and the community, but
Speaker 2: for society as a whole. If you're passionate about food
Speaker 2: and you open up a tiny little restaurant, guess what, Yeah,
Speaker 2: the world needs cancer research, and the world also needs
Speaker 2: like these little tiny bistros on the corner that people
Speaker 2: go to with their family and escapism and it makes
Speaker 2: their life better.
Speaker 1: All right, Next one, I'm with you, Next one, moving on.
Speaker 1: I don't know if this is a question or a statement,
Speaker 1: but it's got a question mark at the end of it,
Speaker 1: and the post is good enough. The post is fake
Speaker 1: it until you feel it. Question mark? Is that a recommendation?
Speaker 1: Is that an exploratory?
Speaker 2: Is?
Speaker 3: What is that?
Speaker 2: Did I write that?
Speaker 3: You wrote that? You wrote that? You wrote that?
Speaker 1: On February nineteen, Robert Joseph Capuccio. I'll tell you what
Speaker 1: you and then you started by. When I first got
Speaker 1: into sales, I was told that a fake'sker than a
Speaker 1: sincere frown. Maybe this will start you off or worse.
Speaker 1: We've all heard be positive, just smile because after all,
Speaker 1: any painful emotion is negative. So I think you're maybe questioning,
Speaker 1: questioning that idea fake it till you feel it.
Speaker 3: Yeah. I don't think it was a recommendation, right.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because I was like, wow, God, did I write that? Yeah?
Speaker 2: I feel like it's if I if I remember correctly,
Speaker 2: or maybe that Okay.
Speaker 1: Let me let me give you a tiny bit more
Speaker 1: right for forcing a greenline change of mood or anyone
Speaker 1: else's for that matter. A real smile activates both Wow,
Speaker 1: zygo comedicus? Is that that zygomedicus?
Speaker 2: Zygomedicus major parslateraalis, Yeah, just that muscle firing sequence. So
Speaker 2: I mean, I think what I was getting at is,
Speaker 2: you know, just you don't have to feel a certain
Speaker 2: way to engage in behaviors. Yes, if I feel a
Speaker 2: certain way, that does support the engagement in certain patterns
Speaker 2: of thought and behaviors, but it's mutually reinforcing. Engaging in
Speaker 2: a pattern of behavior will elicit those feelings eventually, So
Speaker 2: just get into action, Like, oh, I would love to
Speaker 2: do more public speaking, but I'm scared. Like, if you've
Speaker 2: not done public speaking and you're not scared, you're delusional.
Speaker 2: Do not get on stage like speak afraid, be afraid,
Speaker 2: step out on stage and do it, do a shit
Speaker 2: job as a matter of fact, if you need to,
Speaker 2: and then do it again and again and keep like
Speaker 2: reviewing what went well. Well. I showed up to the
Speaker 2: right place, I was on the right stage. Excellent number Two.
Speaker 2: I stepped out on the stage. Three I communicated like,
Speaker 2: there's good, You're gonna build a body of evidence, because
Speaker 2: think about it. If you're feeling anyway about something that
Speaker 2: is going to happen in the future, whether that's a
Speaker 2: year from now, an hour from now, or two minutes
Speaker 2: from now, it's because you're making a prediction. What feeds
Speaker 2: those predictions is interpretations of past experiences. Accurate interpretations, probably not,
Speaker 2: but interpretations. So when you engage in the behaviors that's
Speaker 2: required to do something right, like going to the gym
Speaker 2: is required to get fit, you start to build a
Speaker 2: body of evidence to support competence that you can in
Speaker 2: fact do it. And competence and confidence are intimately interwoven
Speaker 2: with one another. I think confidence without the desire to
Speaker 2: build competence is overrated, and this research show it's it's
Speaker 2: highly destructive as well. So I think that's what I
Speaker 2: was getting at. It's like, now, don't put on a
Speaker 2: fake smile, engage in things and the behaviors that are
Speaker 2: smile worthy and you'll feel that emotion.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I think I spent a lot of my time not
Speaker 1: fighting it till I might it. But but you know,
Speaker 1: doing that thing, lacking confidence, lacking skill, lacking you know,
Speaker 1: knowledge and awareness, but doing what you suggest which is
Speaker 1: going Essentially, I can't get good at this without doing it,
Speaker 1: so so I'm just going to lean in and go,
Speaker 1: you know, start scared, start in it, start shit.
Speaker 2: You know what helps? I always use performing arts as
Speaker 2: an example because I think there's a lot of relevance
Speaker 2: and correlations like method acting, Like what is it that
Speaker 2: you want? Because if you think about it, you've always been,
Speaker 2: to a degree a method actor. Like before you got
Speaker 2: your university degree, you were not the type of person
Speaker 2: that was capable of.
Speaker 3: Earning that degree.
Speaker 2: You behaved into that. You did certain things that developed
Speaker 2: you into the type of person that was awarded like
Speaker 2: that credential. So what is it that you really want
Speaker 2: to do? You want to be a better leader? Okay, great,
Speaker 2: you just got cast in a role in a major
Speaker 2: motion picture of one of the greatest leaders in the world.
Speaker 2: What is that like day to day? Like as you're preparing,
Speaker 2: what does that leader do? Like, what did the behaviors?
Speaker 2: What are the rituals you will start to move into
Speaker 2: that position.
Speaker 1: Yes, yes, that's so interesting you say that because it's
Speaker 1: also very insightful. I mean, I am If you knew
Speaker 1: me when I was at school, if you knew me
Speaker 1: when I was in my twenties and you know, building
Speaker 1: gyms and doing all the stuff I was doing and
Speaker 1: being a you know whatever, I was right, you would
Speaker 1: not have gone, this is the guy that's going to
Speaker 1: go and have this academic career and end up doing
Speaker 1: it whatever. You know, you wouldn't have And it's both.
Speaker 1: You know, when I did my my undergrad degree, when
Speaker 1: I did my excise science degree, I felt like a fraud.
Speaker 1: For the best part of a year. I felt like
Speaker 1: I shouldn't be there. I felt like everyone else was
Speaker 1: an academic I wasn't. The same thing happened when I
Speaker 1: started my doctorate. Yeah, and I know it's so interesting,
Speaker 1: but eventually, you know, you go, well, I feel awkward
Speaker 1: or I feel whatever, even undeserving.
Speaker 3: You know, I remember when I started it.
Speaker 1: I don't even know if I should say this, but
Speaker 1: when I was at Monash, I had the opportunity, well
Speaker 1: I'm still at Monash to Uni.
Speaker 2: I had the.
Speaker 3: Opportunity to apply for a scholarship.
Speaker 1: And I'm like, I go, no, no, I don't give
Speaker 1: the scholarship to a twenty three year old with no
Speaker 1: do you know. I'm like, I definitely do not deserve to.
Speaker 1: I don't know if I would have got it or not,
Speaker 1: but I you know, so I just chose not to
Speaker 1: because I've felt like completely and in hindsight, the right decision,
Speaker 1: you know, I'm sure, But all right, let's move on.
Speaker 1: We've got two more to go. I reckon. So I
Speaker 1: like this. I want you to unpack this. You wrote
Speaker 1: this February five, and it's I think it's a quote
Speaker 1: from Travis Bradbury and Jane Graves from Emotional Intelligence two
Speaker 1: point zero.
Speaker 3: And you said, the weaker the.
Speaker 1: Connection you have with someone, the harder it is to
Speaker 1: get your point across. If you want people to listen,
Speaker 1: you have to practice relationship management. That's yeah, I haven't
Speaker 1: thought about it that way. I think about building connection
Speaker 1: and rapport with people a lot, but I wouldn't have well,
Speaker 1: I think it's true. I wouldn't have worded that that way.
Speaker 1: I would have gone about it from another direction. But
Speaker 1: unpack that for us.
Speaker 2: So much of it is right there within the quote.
Speaker 2: I think it was Michael Lambert who did this meta
Speaker 2: analysis trying to find what drives outcomes in therapy and coaching.
Speaker 2: This doesn't just applyed therapy and coach. I'm just referencing
Speaker 2: this and you found that thirty to fifty percent of
Speaker 2: the variance of all outcomes are depending upon not the
Speaker 2: tape of therapy or the model of coaching, but the
Speaker 2: relationship between client coach patient therapist. You know, if you
Speaker 2: take a look at who are the most effective managers
Speaker 2: and leaders, it's people who like their team, understands and
Speaker 2: know uncertain terms. The majority of them anyway, this person
Speaker 2: cares about me. So relationship is It's about listening, It's
Speaker 2: about wanting to serve. It's about noticing attributes in another person.
Speaker 2: I think it's about it's about having people feel seen
Speaker 2: so that they can be truly heard. You know, we
Speaker 2: use the word rapport constantly and talking about referencing other people.
Speaker 2: One of the best definitions I have ever heard of,
Speaker 2: one of the most impactful definitions from me personally, is
Speaker 2: from Joseph O'Connor and Ian McDermott with they said that
Speaker 2: rapport is a relationship of positive responsiveness with myself, me
Speaker 2: and another person or group of people. And what's interesting,
Speaker 2: it's not just oh, I really like this person. It's
Speaker 2: not about likability. It's about we are in response to
Speaker 2: one another. It's that person that goes here's a great example.
Speaker 2: I was on the phone with a team leader at
Speaker 2: a school site, and this is earlier in the day,
Speaker 2: and I'm working with a group that there was a
Speaker 2: lot of contention within the faculty, and over the past
Speaker 2: year are our meetings that we do every single month
Speaker 2: has really worked out because at first it was hard.
Speaker 2: People were saying very tough things to say to one
Speaker 2: another and it wasn't just hard to say. It was
Speaker 2: hard for other people to hear, and it was harsh,
Speaker 2: but there was enough safety that someone stepped out, and
Speaker 2: over time those conversations have become more fluid and people
Speaker 2: give feedback and it's like there's a dynamic and they're
Speaker 2: coming up with ideas and strategies on how to get
Speaker 2: better within the team so they can impact people in
Speaker 2: the school and the students. That's responsiveness, like I couldn't
Speaker 2: come up with this without you, and we couldn't arrive
Speaker 2: where we're at right now without everybody else in the
Speaker 2: room that's weighing in on this. That's rapport. That's relationship
Speaker 2: of positive responsiveness, where the whole is greater than the
Speaker 2: sum of its parts.
Speaker 3: That thing I love it.
Speaker 1: I love it all right? One last one, This is
Speaker 1: only a bit a bit you wrote here. Set yourself
Speaker 1: up to win intention and small environmental shifts can create
Speaker 1: big changes in your life. So I want to skip
Speaker 1: out the intention part. When you say environmental shifts, are
Speaker 1: you talking about where you work, the that you work in,
Speaker 1: are you talking about the people that you work around? Like,
Speaker 1: I know, for me, this is the way I understood it,
Speaker 1: which probably isn't the way you meant it. But for me,
Speaker 1: the environment in which I work has a big impact
Speaker 1: on how much I enjoy work, how creative I am,
Speaker 1: how creative my output, my productivity, my efficiency, my ability
Speaker 1: to focus my energy, Like I really optimize my energy
Speaker 1: because I work in a space by myself, which is
Speaker 1: a very comfortable, nice space with a beautiful view. And
Speaker 1: if I want to step out of the comfort and
Speaker 1: the nice into the mayhem, I can.
Speaker 3: But yeah, so for me, environment really impacts the quality of.
Speaker 1: Well everything in my life. But you know, with work
Speaker 1: and with study and research makes a big impact. What
Speaker 1: are your thoughts on all of that? Is that where
Speaker 1: you were going or was it somewhere else?
Speaker 2: No? Yeah, I agree with that first time in it's
Speaker 2: it's hard not to agree with that. I think when
Speaker 2: it comes to work satisfaction, things we talk about like burnout,
Speaker 2: the people you work around are extraordinarily influential. What I'm
Speaker 2: talking about is people always try to start off, or
Speaker 2: you're told to start off with these huge changes.
Speaker 3: You either do it or you don't do it right.
Speaker 2: I think that Yoda came up with that first, and
Speaker 2: just reference Yoda. But what we forget is the small shifts.
Speaker 2: So if you come home and you know that you
Speaker 2: need to do some work or you want to you
Speaker 2: want to invest time in studying and learning something that
Speaker 2: really helps your career. But every time you get home,
Speaker 2: you find yourself sitting in front of the couch because
Speaker 2: it's it's it's you know, you have the triggers, you
Speaker 2: have the sofa, you've got the TV. Your conditioned to
Speaker 2: just sit down there without even thinking about it. Just
Speaker 2: small environmental shifts can make a massive difference. Maybe just
Speaker 2: like stop off at a park like before you get home,
Speaker 2: or maybe like a coffee shop, or maybe if you're
Speaker 2: constantly in a certain environment and you're eating certain foods
Speaker 2: that you said, well, i'd rather a cutback on that
Speaker 2: rather than white knuckling it and disciplining and will powering
Speaker 2: your way to success. Not saying anything is innately wrong
Speaker 2: with that. Maybe try a different place where those triggers
Speaker 2: are not present. So when we talk about behavior change,
Speaker 2: you can't separate that from habit formation, and habit formation
Speaker 2: for better or for war starts with a queue or
Speaker 2: a trigger, and those are environmental in nature. So if
Speaker 2: you change your environment in a very small, not scary,
Speaker 2: but challenging and significant way, you can start to support
Speaker 2: the behaviors that can compound over time, supporting greater shifts
Speaker 2: and greater types of forward momentum. If you will.
Speaker 3: Love it, love it. That's what I was talking about anyway. Yeah,
Speaker 3: well all of that makes sense anyway.
Speaker 1: So your listeners know where to find you and follow you,
Speaker 1: but mine might not, So why don't you tell them?
Speaker 2: Okay, Well, there's Robert Capuccio dot com. There's the selfop
Speaker 2: antidote dot com. There's LinkedIn. Yes, I do have an
Speaker 2: Instagram page. It's mediocre at best, but yeah, check it out.
Speaker 1: It's definitely not mediocre. There's a lot of good stuff
Speaker 1: on there. All right, mate, You're terrific. Enjoy your Wednesday
Speaker 1: night over there. I'll enjoy my Thursday morning over here,
Speaker 1: and we will reconnect in about one hundred and sixty
Speaker 1: eight hours from now.
Speaker 2: Good day, Craig, Good day Listeners,