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Speaker 1: A warning for listeners that this series contains graphic details,

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Speaker 1: including references to murder and rape, millions of tourists, crowns

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Speaker 1: of commuters, searing heat, and an entire city built on

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Speaker 1: the foundations of some of the world's most iconic ancient ruins.

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Speaker 1: Athens is holiday haven for Europeans and international travelers alike.

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Speaker 1: You could lose yourself in its history and all those

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Speaker 1: people if you want it, and so could anybody looking

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Speaker 1: for you. No cares, no worries, not even about statutes

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Speaker 1: of limitation for some serious crimes. Anyway. For Victoria Police

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Speaker 1: homicide detectives, that was a problem. It had been a

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Speaker 1: problem for years, and if they ever wanted answers for

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Speaker 1: the families of Sue Armstrong and Sue Bartlett, they were

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Speaker 1: going to have to get creative. The bombshell breakthrough in

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Speaker 1: Australia's most infamous cold case would be highly confidential, high stakes,

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Speaker 1: and high time for the.

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Speaker 2: Two sus.

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Speaker 1: My name is Olivia Jenkins and I'm a crime reporter

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Speaker 1: at the Herald's Sun and this is Hunting Justice, a

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Speaker 1: deep dive into one of Australia's most brutal cold cases,

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Speaker 1: the nineteen seventy seven murder of Easy Street housemates Suzanne

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Speaker 1: Armstrong and Susan Bartlett and the man who, according to police,

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Speaker 1: is at the center of the investigation. It had been

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Speaker 1: almost fifty years since Suzanne Armstrong and Susan Bartlett were

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Speaker 1: brutally slain inside their own home, which also meant it

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Speaker 1: had been almost fifty years since investigators had gathered evidence

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Speaker 1: from the crime scene. Police protocols and forensic science have

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Speaker 1: changed a lot in half a century. Today, every single

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Speaker 1: thing is logged, bagged and entered into evidence, but back

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Speaker 1: in the seventies things were vastly different. One of the

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Speaker 1: challenges prosecutors face in modern trials of historical murders. There

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Speaker 1: were so many questions. Had detectives fumbled or contaminated evidence

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Speaker 1: at the Easy Street murdercine urinated there even? Were they

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Speaker 1: wearing gloves bagging exhibits separately or had items all been

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Speaker 1: thrown carelessly into one big bag altogether? Did the knife

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Speaker 1: constable Idols took from Perry krumblus even have any blood

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Speaker 1: on it? How were all these exhibits stored? Were they

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Speaker 1: left out in the open under heat? That's what Perry

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Speaker 1: Karumbluss's high profile defense barrister Dermit Dan wanted to know

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Speaker 1: from witness after witness, officer after officer, as his clients

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Speaker 1: sat in the dock wedged between two guards, all while

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Speaker 1: the sus loved ones watched on. The veteran barrister argued

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Speaker 1: the so called DNA evidence linking an accused double murderer

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Speaker 1: to Victoria's most infamous unsolved crime was flimsy, potentially contaminated.

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Speaker 1: It should be tossed out by a magistrate altogether, Miss

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Speaker 1: Dan argued, but the prosecution insisted. Investigators had the right man,

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Speaker 1: and in September twenty twenty four, they just needed him

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Speaker 1: to fly into their.

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Speaker 3: Trap Atincioni in v.

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Speaker 2: The flight patrol was carried out by a team of

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Speaker 2: four or five state police officers who filtered all the

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Speaker 2: passengers getting off the flight until the subject was identified.

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Speaker 2: We checked all the people who had a match in

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Speaker 2: terms of physical characteristics at impossible age of the individual.

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Speaker 4: In the United subject.

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Speaker 1: That's the head of Rome Fiumachino's airport police, Fernando Spezziali.

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Speaker 1: We've translated his interview from Italian to English, where he

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Speaker 1: first revealed to The Herald's son the moment the latest

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Speaker 1: development in the case began to unfold on his doorstep.

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Speaker 1: But back in Australia, as the delicate Roman snare was

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Speaker 1: about to snap around Perry Crumblas, the families of his

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Speaker 1: alleged victims were none the wiser. To the entire country,

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Speaker 1: the Easy Street murders were known as a terrifying mystery,

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Speaker 1: but not one that was likely to ever be sold,

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Speaker 1: even to generations of crime reporters like Anthony Dowsley. This

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Speaker 1: case has spound such a long time that you know,

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Speaker 1: we have Andrew Rawle, who's at the later end of

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Speaker 1: his career, You're about twenty years older than me, and

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Speaker 1: now I'm coming in covering it. That's three generations reporters

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Speaker 1: just in the one newsroom. Do you think we'd ever

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Speaker 1: get to this point?

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Speaker 3: To be honest, After the articles in twenty seventeen, I

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Speaker 3: actually kind of forgot about it because it didn't seem

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Speaker 3: like that was heading anywhere. There was no indication that

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Speaker 3: they had actually targeted someone. I got no kind of

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Speaker 3: inference from them that there was someone that were really

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Speaker 3: interested in it. Just seemed like they were just doing

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Speaker 3: their due diligence to try and limit the amount of

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Speaker 3: people that they were after.

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Speaker 1: It was slow grinding work, the type that doesn't make

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Speaker 1: the movies, but eventually there was a breakthrough. Over the

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Speaker 1: past few years, the homicide squad had gone back to

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Speaker 1: that list of key suspects to retest their DNA to

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Speaker 1: rule them in or out of the investigation, and on

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Speaker 1: the sixth of January twenty seventeen, they approached Perry Korunbulus

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Speaker 1: for a sample of his DNA and he initially agreed.

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Speaker 1: Police had worked through the list of one hundred and

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Speaker 1: thirty four people, and forty one of them at that

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Speaker 1: point were dead. There was at least one missing sample

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Speaker 1: in their mounting case file on the murders Perry's. According

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Speaker 1: to investigators, the other men on their list of key

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Speaker 1: suspects had been ruled out. All of that was kept

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Speaker 1: out of the spotlight, but the Sue's murders were thrust

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Speaker 1: back into the news just a week later, when the

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Speaker 1: Victoria Police homicide Squad announced a one million dollar reward

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Speaker 1: for information that led to their killer. Sue Armstrong's sister, Gail,

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Speaker 1: led the pola for leeds next to detectives at immediate

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Speaker 1: conference on January fifteenth. It was there that she shared

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Speaker 1: her frustrations over the early investigation, telling reporters that her

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Speaker 1: family wasn't interviewed and they had to make an appointment

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Speaker 1: to speak with police about the case. But back in Dandenong,

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Speaker 1: Perry told his friend Phil Akres that the next time

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Speaker 1: he left for Greece he might not be coming back.

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Speaker 1: His mother was too unwell. By the ninth of May,

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Speaker 1: he was gone, taking his DNA with him. Here's Andrew rule.

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Speaker 4: It would appear that when the police spoke routinely, just

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Speaker 4: another boring day on the job, knocked on a door

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Speaker 4: in you know, Doncaster or Boloine or somewhere, and they

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Speaker 4: get this like Pericles Corumbus, and they say, oh, hello,

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Speaker 4: we're from blah blah blah. You know, can you.

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Speaker 3: Please do this?

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Speaker 4: And he said, apparently he said no problem, yeah, look,

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Speaker 4: you know, I'm just busy. Now whatever, when you want

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Speaker 4: me to next Wednesday, next Friday, whatever, He made an

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Speaker 4: appointment whatever to do the swab and then he vanished.

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Speaker 4: He went to Greece and stayed there, which is fine

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Speaker 4: because these parents hadn't moved there.

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Speaker 1: But Perry's absence didn't deter investigators at that committal you've

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Speaker 1: heard a lot about through this series so far, we

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Speaker 1: learned for the first time exactly how they kept pushing

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Speaker 1: for a breakthrough. Perry had been in Greece for about

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Speaker 1: a year by twenty eighteen, when they approached his brother Tony,

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Speaker 1: who lives in Melbourne's Eastern suburbs, for a sample of

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Speaker 1: his DNA. Remember doctor Dada Hartman's breakdown of what police

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Speaker 1: could do with that sample.

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Speaker 5: So we will recover our DNA profile, compare that hopefully

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Speaker 5: to family members to identify that individual. Any other evidence

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Speaker 5: that we can gather from the remains to help us

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Speaker 5: fit build as much from in thick evidence to support

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Speaker 5: that DNA match. And we've had a number of cases

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Speaker 5: where although their dname and be indicative that these people

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Speaker 5: are related, when we've looked at all the other events together,

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Speaker 5: that doesn't hold true.

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Speaker 1: It was a Hail Mary moment for Victoria police. A

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Speaker 1: tissue sample taken from one of Perry's old cars and

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Speaker 1: a DNA sample from Perry's own brother was enough to

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Speaker 1: convince a magistrate to issue a warrant for Perry's arrest

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Speaker 1: from half a world away, but police aware of their

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Speaker 1: alleged fugitives general whereabouts, and sensitive to how quickly an

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Speaker 1: investigation of this magnitude could collapse, kept the breakthrough behind

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Speaker 1: closed doors. Those who knew the sues were still in

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Speaker 1: the dark. To them, the case was as cold as ever.

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Speaker 1: Their friends Warren Tucker and Neville Webster.

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Speaker 6: We're getting a bit older and somewhere a cohort have

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Speaker 6: passed on. So unless this is a resolved we'll go

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Speaker 6: without it ever making results.

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Speaker 7: Yeah, well, theyur vintage will not.

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Speaker 1: Now there a DNA sample in Melbourne, Australia, and their

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Speaker 1: new person of interest in Athens, Greece. To the frustration

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Speaker 1: of police, their hunt for justice had suddenly morphed into

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Speaker 1: an international operation. By late twenty twenty four, sixty five

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Speaker 1: year old Perry Krumblus had been living with his brother

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Speaker 1: Andreas in Athens for several years. So how did the

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Speaker 1: hunt for Perry stretch halfway around the world. He continued

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Speaker 1: to live his quiet life in the Greek capital, away

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Speaker 1: from the occasional news headline about the murders on Easy Street.

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Speaker 1: The only time his name had ever appeared as far

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Speaker 1: as the public records went, was all the way back

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Speaker 1: in the late seventies, when Coroiner Harry Pasco noted that

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Speaker 1: he'd been in possession of a knife. In the days

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Speaker 1: after the murders. No one, not even the Sioux's families,

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Speaker 1: knew his name, but one two hour direct flight was

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Speaker 1: about to change everything. If Victoria police wanted Perry back

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Speaker 1: in Australia, they needed to pick him up somewhere else.

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Speaker 1: In the years leading up to his dramatic arrest, we

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Speaker 1: believe Perry stayed in Greece that entire time, which meant

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Speaker 1: Australian authorities couldn't arrest him there. Australia does have what's

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Speaker 1: called an extradition treaty with Greece. That's when two or

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Speaker 1: more countries mutually agree to hand over a suspected or

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Speaker 1: convicted criminal they find in their country to the country

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Speaker 1: where they allegedly committed a serious crime. But the problem

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Speaker 1: for Australian authorities was Greece's twenty year Statute of Limitations

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Speaker 1: for serious crimes such as murder. That period, which is

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Speaker 1: the maximum time period after an event in which charges

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Speaker 1: can be laid, usually begins from the date of the crime.

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Speaker 1: By the time they'd set their sights on Perry, forty

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Speaker 1: three years had passed since Suzanne Armstrong and Sue Bartlett

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Speaker 1: were murdered and Perry landed right in the middle of

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Speaker 1: a trap, his brother, Andrea says, Perry's other brother in Melbourne,

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Speaker 1: Tony told the media that Perry had been approached by

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Speaker 1: a Greek Australian investor who was interested in buying one

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Speaker 1: of their family's properties in Greece. That business opportunity seemed

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Speaker 1: to require Perry to travel, and so as soon as

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Speaker 1: the flight from Athens touched down in Rome, it set

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Speaker 1: off the biggest development this case had ever seen. The

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Speaker 1: moment Perry bordered that flight from Athens to Rome's Fumachino Airport,

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Speaker 1: it triggered an international interpololo called a red notice. That

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Speaker 1: red notice lets country share information with one another in

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Speaker 1: case a person wanted in one part of the world

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Speaker 1: is tracked down in another, which means when Italian tactical

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Speaker 1: police was searching for Perry on that flight, they had

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Speaker 1: the green light to arrest him. And this is what

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Speaker 1: Perry's brother told reporters from behind the fly screen of

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Speaker 1: the front door at his Balwyn North home.

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Speaker 8: Definitely don't think he's capable of doing anything like that,

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Speaker 8: and if it was going to hide too. He wouldn't

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Speaker 8: have stayed here for forty years plus after that, you

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Speaker 8: know what I mean? He would have lived six months,

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Speaker 8: two years, one year whatever.

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Speaker 1: That news sent shock waves around the country. After decades

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Speaker 1: of uncertainty, hundreds of leeds and dozens of suspects, one

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Speaker 1: of Australia's most violent unsolved crimes looked like it may

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Speaker 1: finally be solved. No one had waited longer Forrancers than

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Speaker 1: Sue Armstrong's and Sue Bartlett's family and friends.

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Speaker 4: When we heard about the risky last years of victoriasm

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Speaker 4: broadcast Great Years US or you know, said summons finally

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Speaker 4: called for US.

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Speaker 1: Italian journalist and photographer Eric Massouri worked with The Herald's

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Speaker 1: son every step of the way through Perry's arrest, with

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Speaker 1: me in Melbourne and Eric in Rome. He and I

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Speaker 1: worked closely together while Perry was being held in Italy,

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Speaker 1: leading every development of the task to bring him back

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Speaker 1: to Australia. For Eric to send us developments as quickly

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Speaker 1: as possible. He sent them in his native tongue, which

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Speaker 1: meant I had to brush up on my Italian and fast.

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Speaker 9: I was contacted in the early hours of the morning

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Speaker 9: of Perry's arrest. I started working NonStop on the case.

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Speaker 9: We got in direct contact with the people involved, police,

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Speaker 9: Perry's lawyer judges.

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Speaker 1: Perry was now in custody in one of Rome's most

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Speaker 1: crowded jails, and Victoria police had to wait for local

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Speaker 1: authorities to move the case along, a gamble and one

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Speaker 1: where everyone wanted to know what Now Here's Eric again?

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Speaker 9: Perry was in isolation. Regina Coali is one of the

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Speaker 9: best known prisons in Italy. The cell conditions were standard

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Speaker 9: for a country that respects personal dignity. One of Perry's

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Speaker 9: quest was to be able to speak with his Greek brother.

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Speaker 1: Perry had to appear before an Italian court, and his

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Speaker 1: public defender, Serena Tucci, gave us the first insight into

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Speaker 1: how Perry seemed to be coping with his arrest.

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Speaker 10: During the interrogation, Perry Corumbus availed himself of the right

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Speaker 10: not to answer, so he didn't give us any useful

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Speaker 10: information about what had happened. However, he did proclaim his.

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Speaker 1: Innocence, and so the court decided Victorian homicide detectives would

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Speaker 1: escort Perry back to Melbourne. Serena Tucci told us what

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Speaker 1: Perry was facing.

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Speaker 10: He did proclaim his innocence, and a very important point

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Speaker 10: is that he gave his consent for extradition. This is

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Speaker 10: the central point of the interrogation. His condition seemed good.

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Speaker 10: He asked to speak with his brother, but his condition

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Speaker 10: was good. Extradition procedures are not easy to understand, so

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Speaker 10: I wanted to make sure that he was fully capable

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Speaker 10: of understanding exactly what was happening to him, because the

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Speaker 10: consent is irrevocable.

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Speaker 9: It was an intense day. We arrived at Fromnceno Airport,

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Speaker 9: arrived in a police van. Everything was carried out with

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Speaker 9: great discretion.

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Speaker 1: Dean Thomas, the head of Victoria Police's homicide squad, and

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Speaker 1: other homicide detectives, including Paul Rowe, were in Rome and

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Speaker 1: the operation was underway in front of a plane load

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Speaker 1: of regular passengers. Perry sat wedged between the detectives in

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Speaker 1: an economy seat the entire time, keeping his head down

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Speaker 1: with his headphones on. And in Melbourne on the night

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Speaker 1: of December four, the weight for his plane to land

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Speaker 1: from its layover in Katar was on, and so was

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Speaker 1: the race to catch a glimpse of the man who

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Speaker 1: was now front and center. Of the investigation. Melbourne Airport

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Speaker 1: became the scene of a media circus as we all

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Speaker 1: tried to catch a glimpse of the flight QR nine

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Speaker 1: h five as a touchdown on the tarmac. The limited

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Speaker 1: view of the international gates from inside Quantus's domestic terminal

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Speaker 1: did not offer my photographer and I much luck, and

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Speaker 1: Perry was being ushered off the plane as we spoke,

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Speaker 1: so we made the split second decision to race to

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Speaker 1: Victoria Police's headquarters in Melbourne, CBD. It was one in

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Speaker 1: the morning by this point, and surely they couldn't take

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Speaker 1: him anywhere else. That's what we thought, anyway, And about

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Speaker 1: an hour later the sirens sounded and the roller door

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Speaker 1: was open. The detectives were on their way, and we

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Speaker 1: thought they'd have Perry with him, and they did. An

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Speaker 1: unmarked silver police car sped towards the entrance on Latrobe

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Speaker 1: Street where we were waiting, and as it sped into

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Speaker 1: the secure car park, Perry again sat between the detectives,

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Speaker 1: only this time he used his dark color jacket to

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Speaker 1: hide his face from our cameras. The next morning, the

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Speaker 1: updates continued.

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Speaker 7: Mister currum Blase landed back on Australian soil. Just before midnight.

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Speaker 7: He was the first person ushered off the Guitar Airways

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Speaker 7: flight by immigration officers before he was rushed to police headquarters.

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Speaker 1: And so Perry, who had maintained his innocence since his arrest,

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Speaker 1: was sitting in custody inside a Melbourne jail. You may

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Speaker 1: remember in episode three where we broke down what committals

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Speaker 1: are here in Victoria, where evidence from the prosecution and

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Speaker 1: defense is heard by a magistrate who then decides whether

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Speaker 1: an accused person will stand trial. We've brought in a

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Speaker 1: lot of what was aired in those hearings before mat

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Speaker 1: justook Brett's sonnet throughout this series so far, and just

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Speaker 1: over a year after Perry was arrested, the committal meant

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Speaker 1: it was time for the prosecution to put their evidence

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Speaker 1: to the test and for his defense team to do

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Speaker 1: their best to get it tossed out. So over five

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Speaker 1: days inside the Melbourne Magistrate's court, the Sioux's supporters watched

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Speaker 1: every moment they constantly glanced over at Perry, who by

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Speaker 1: this stage sat each day under close watch by two

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Speaker 1: custody officers in a white suit and looked directly ahead

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Speaker 1: almost the entire time. Susanne Armstrong's sister Gail, stared him

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Speaker 1: down every single day as every brutal detail about her

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Speaker 1: sisters and her best friend's horrific murders was aired out

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Speaker 1: in the open. Sue Armstrong in her front bedroom, laying

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Speaker 1: on her back with her night he pulled up over

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Speaker 1: her chest, her legs spread apart, a pool of blood

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Speaker 1: under her head, the possibility she'd been raped, and does

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Speaker 1: of knife wounds. Sue Bartlett lying face down just meters

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Speaker 1: away in the hallway, many of the knife wounds in

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Speaker 1: her back and stomach, blood and seamen in Sue Armstrong's bedroom,

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Speaker 1: blood in the hallway and in the lounge. Prosecutor Zuben

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Speaker 1: men And told the court that their case relied quote

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Speaker 1: almost exclusively on DNA evidence from the crime scene, and

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Speaker 1: they believed that was more likely to be Perry's than

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Speaker 1: anyone else's. Over the next few days, Perry's defense barrister

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Speaker 1: Dan Casey poured over many of those DNA samples, probing

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Speaker 1: first responders and detectives about their handling of the scene,

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Speaker 1: raising concerns about some of the exhibits possibly being contaminated

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Speaker 1: over time and due to police protocols that perhaps weren't

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Speaker 1: astringent in the seventies. The court heard a newspaper in

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Speaker 1: the house dated the day the girls were discovered turned

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Speaker 1: out to belong to a responding officer who had used

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Speaker 1: it for shade, and that knife for Officer Ron Iddles

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Speaker 1: seized from Perry days after the murders. Could it even

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Speaker 1: be the murder weapon? The court heard it had been

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Speaker 1: tested for blood multiple times throughout the investigation and no

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Speaker 1: blood was found on its blade or sheath, Mister Dan said,

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Speaker 1: and forensic technicians confirmed this. The court also heard testing

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Speaker 1: of the knife to see if it fit as the

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Speaker 1: murder weapon was quote inconclusive. That long list of witnesses,

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Speaker 1: those who were still alive, retold their version of events

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Speaker 1: as best they could. Barry Woodard, his brother Henry, Alona Stevens,

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Speaker 1: and Janet Powell former detectives, forensic biologists and first responders.

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Speaker 1: Mister Dan probed them all too. Where were they on

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Speaker 1: January tenth, nineteen seventy seven, the night the sues were

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Speaker 1: believed to have been murdered? How did police preserve the

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Speaker 1: crime scene? How did they walk through or store evidence

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Speaker 1: to ensure a proper chain of custody. Did officers weggl

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Speaker 1: us how many people walked into the crime scene after

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Speaker 1: the women's bodies were discovered, or could one of them

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Speaker 1: instead be the real killer not his client Perry, like

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Speaker 1: the prosecution were alleging. After five days inside a stuffy,

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Speaker 1: full courtroom, Perry just meets away from the families of

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Speaker 1: the women police say he killed. Magistrate's Sonnet had decided

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Speaker 1: Perry's charge of carnal knowledge, though which would be known

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Speaker 1: as rape today, was thrown out. Magistrate's Sonnet struck it

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Speaker 1: out because he found there wasn't enough evidence to hold

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Speaker 1: up that conviction because detectives had told the committal Sue

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Speaker 1: Armstrong appeared to have been raped after she was killed

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Speaker 1: and not before. The Sue's loved ones sat stoic in

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Speaker 1: the front row of the courtroom as Perry twice said

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Speaker 1: he pleaded not guilty to each count of murder before

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Speaker 1: he was led away. Sue Armstrong's sister Gail quickly left

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Speaker 1: the court with a friend and homicide detective Paul Rowe,

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Speaker 1: the informant for this case, and one of the officers

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Speaker 1: that escorted Perry back to Melbourne. Not wanting to comment publicly,

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Speaker 1: on this next stage of the case. Garumblus remains in

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Speaker 1: custody at the Melbourne Assessment Prison and is due to

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Speaker 1: appear at the Supreme Court soon for an administrative hearing.

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Speaker 1: For fifty years, the horrors unleashed on Susanne Armstrong and

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Speaker 1: Susan Bartlett have plagued their families to the public. They

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Speaker 1: became a cautionary tale, a statistic, the women at the

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Speaker 1: center of a forgotten and then remembered and then forgotten

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Speaker 1: again crime. For decades, their friends, students, and their neighbors

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Speaker 1: have been tormented by memories of two women who brought

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Speaker 1: their lives so much joy when their own were taken

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Speaker 1: so violently. I've come to know so much about Sue

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Speaker 1: Armstrong and Sue Bartlett through death, but through hours of interviews,

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Speaker 1: countless phone calls, road trips, photographs and cups of It's

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Speaker 1: been a privilege to help paint a picture of how

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Speaker 1: they lived and everything that made them who they were,

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Speaker 1: long before there was ever a hunt for justice, and

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Speaker 1: the hunt isn't over yet. This show is hosted, researched,

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Speaker 1: and written by me Olivia Jenkins. It was produced, edited

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Speaker 1: and written by John ty Burton. Our video producer is

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Speaker 1: Daniel Coates. Our graphic designers are Kirko Dwyer and Sean Lee.

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Speaker 1: Jeordie Atkinson is our executive producer. You can find all

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Speaker 1: of our coverage of this case at Huntingjustice dot com

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Speaker 1: dot a U. You can also find every article, video

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Speaker 1: and episode of this series as well as the crime

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00:23:46,920 --> 00:23:50,080
Speaker 1: stories Melbourne cares about most by joining our Facebook group

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00:23:50,240 --> 00:23:54,119
Speaker 1: Harold's Son Crime and Courts. If you have questions, feedback

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Speaker 1: or something you think we should know, get in touch

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Speaker 1: with us anytime. Our email address is Harold's Son Crime

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Speaker 1: at News dot com dot AU, or you can contact

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Speaker 1: me securely. Those details are in the show notes