WEBVTT - Lorie Argus, CEO - Melbourne Airport 0:00:05.881 --> 0:00:13.561 Apoche Production. Welcome to another episode of Brave Always the 0:00:13.601 --> 0:00:16.961 CEO series. This series we launched into the new world 0:00:17.081 --> 0:00:18.521 of brave leadership. 0:00:18.640 --> 0:00:21.520 Happy people create happy businesses, true. 0:00:21.241 --> 0:00:24.401 Emotionally intelligent leadership. I've picked up Vombit once on our 0:00:24.441 --> 0:00:26.841 about our four flight and everybody thought, well it was 0:00:26.881 --> 0:00:28.601 good enough for him. I can do it now. We 0:00:28.641 --> 0:00:31.801 will be joined by culture and leadership experts and some 0:00:32.040 --> 0:00:35.881 superstar CEOs who will courageously tell us the truth behind 0:00:35.921 --> 0:00:39.681 their brave leadership journeys. Today I'm joined by one of 0:00:39.721 --> 0:00:43.281 my absolute saves, Laurie Argus. Laurie Agus is the CEO 0:00:43.441 --> 0:00:46.041 of Melbourne Airport and took up this role in twenty 0:00:46.120 --> 0:00:49.361 twenty two after seven years as Chief of Aviation and 0:00:49.521 --> 0:00:53.040 Chief of Ground Transport. Laurie started her career in Canada 0:00:53.120 --> 0:00:56.441 before relocating to Australia and joining Virgin Australia. In her 0:00:56.521 --> 0:00:58.961 teen years at the airline, she was appointed Manager of 0:00:59.121 --> 0:01:03.401 International Airport Operations and General Manager of Ground Operations in 0:01:03.521 --> 0:01:06.601 twenty seventeen. Lauri Greg wed with an Executive NBA from 0:01:06.641 --> 0:01:10.361 Bond University. Laurie is an active member of Chief Executive 0:01:10.360 --> 0:01:13.401 Women and of the Australian Institute of Directors and became 0:01:13.481 --> 0:01:17.121 a graduate of AICD in twenty nineteen. Laurie is also 0:01:17.200 --> 0:01:20.600 a non executive director of the Australian Airport Association Airport 0:01:20.681 --> 0:01:24.201 Council International World Governing Board. She's also a wife, a 0:01:24.280 --> 0:01:26.481 mom to two beautiful kids, and just one of those 0:01:26.481 --> 0:01:29.520 people who lights up the room when you walk in. Welcome, Laurie, 0:01:29.560 --> 0:01:30.801 is so great to have you here today. 0:01:31.041 --> 0:01:33.481 Oh thanks, Emma, thanks for such a nice intro. 0:01:33.920 --> 0:01:36.761 Look. I can't start this without noting that Laurie and 0:01:36.801 --> 0:01:39.641 I met back in Virgin Blue days, well over sixteen 0:01:39.681 --> 0:01:41.641 plus years ago, and Laurie, you were one of the 0:01:41.761 --> 0:01:45.121 first female influencers for me in a senior leadership role 0:01:45.161 --> 0:01:46.761 that I looked up to. I'm sure I've told you 0:01:46.840 --> 0:01:49.241 that that is the truth. You have me there. It 0:01:49.361 --> 0:01:51.161 was true even back then. I think you had this 0:01:51.281 --> 0:01:54.281 presence about you, like you were championing the flag for 0:01:54.401 --> 0:01:57.081 women in leadership. Was that always like a goal of 0:01:57.161 --> 0:01:58.801 yours or did you not even know you were doing that? 0:01:59.121 --> 0:02:01.241 I one hundred percent didn't know I was doing that. 0:02:01.401 --> 0:02:02.721 And I'll tell you why I know that. 0:02:02.961 --> 0:02:03.321 I mean, I. 0:02:03.401 --> 0:02:06.801 Remember being alone, I remember being the only female in 0:02:06.841 --> 0:02:09.881 the management ranks at Virgin my boss at the time 0:02:10.001 --> 0:02:12.321 when I was a middle manager, there was ten of 0:02:12.401 --> 0:02:14.481 us and I was the only female. And I remember 0:02:14.601 --> 0:02:17.961 going up against all the other men in the GM job, 0:02:18.761 --> 0:02:21.641 and I had a great executive HR at the time 0:02:21.721 --> 0:02:24.840 who was advocating for diversity, and I'm not sure if 0:02:24.921 --> 0:02:27.641 he wasn't around that I would have got that job, 0:02:27.761 --> 0:02:29.840 because he was pretty passionate about it and he really 0:02:29.921 --> 0:02:33.961 supported me through that recruitment process. But talking about women, 0:02:34.121 --> 0:02:37.081 it was years later when I had somebody tell me 0:02:37.201 --> 0:02:39.641 I was a feminist and I said to him, I said, oh, 0:02:40.121 --> 0:02:42.201 I don't know if I'm a feminist, Like genuinely, I 0:02:42.281 --> 0:02:44.321 answered the question honestly. I said, I don't know if 0:02:44.361 --> 0:02:47.841 I do properly advocate for women or if I'm a feminist. 0:02:48.481 --> 0:02:50.161 And she said, well, do you believe in equal pay 0:02:50.240 --> 0:02:52.761 for women? And I said, well, yeah, obviously. And she 0:02:52.841 --> 0:02:54.960 said do you believe in equal opportunities for women? And 0:02:55.001 --> 0:02:57.641 I said yes, of course, and then she said, well, congratulations, 0:02:57.721 --> 0:03:01.041 you're a feminist. So it wasn't until I kind of 0:03:01.121 --> 0:03:03.561 had that conversation with her that I really started digging 0:03:03.641 --> 0:03:07.120 into what it meant to really lift women up and 0:03:07.240 --> 0:03:10.721 advocate for women, and so I'm far better at it nowadays. 0:03:10.921 --> 0:03:12.321 Maybe it was informal. 0:03:12.201 --> 0:03:14.520 Formal Yeah, okay, So I ask you where about that? 0:03:14.800 --> 0:03:17.081 So where your family decided to leave Canada and migrate 0:03:17.161 --> 0:03:19.321 to Australia. There must have been a guess, a huge 0:03:19.401 --> 0:03:22.241 decision for the family and quite a change. How did 0:03:22.321 --> 0:03:23.641 you cope with that? So? How old were you when 0:03:23.680 --> 0:03:24.840 you did move here? Well? 0:03:24.921 --> 0:03:27.521 I came by myself, so, which is a funny story 0:03:27.561 --> 0:03:30.840 in itself, because I was sitting in Edmonton, Alberta. I 0:03:31.001 --> 0:03:34.481 was working at night shift in network operations seven pm 0:03:34.601 --> 0:03:37.841 to seven am. It was minus forty nine in the 0:03:37.921 --> 0:03:39.801 middle of winter, and a. 0:03:40.121 --> 0:03:45.081 Job ad for Brisbane, Australia came across the fax machine. 0:03:45.121 --> 0:03:49.121 I'm like, across the fax machine, I just went, I've 0:03:49.121 --> 0:03:50.761 got to get out of here. I can't live in 0:03:50.841 --> 0:03:53.641 this weather anymore. So I just applied and everyone told me. 0:03:53.721 --> 0:03:55.441 You know, I was twenty six, so everyone was like, 0:03:55.481 --> 0:03:57.321 You're never going to get an airport manager job at 0:03:57.321 --> 0:04:00.041 twenty six across the world. It was one of our 0:04:00.121 --> 0:04:02.720 key stations we were launching Australia, and I'm like, well, 0:04:02.921 --> 0:04:06.201 you know what, I'm just going to try ironically. You know, 0:04:06.521 --> 0:04:08.481 of course women shouldn't always say it was luck that 0:04:08.561 --> 0:04:10.281 they got an opportunity, but I do think in that 0:04:10.441 --> 0:04:12.201 experience it was a little bit of luck and a 0:04:12.241 --> 0:04:15.441 little bit of talent because I was easily movable, and 0:04:15.521 --> 0:04:18.041 I was up against a lot of other really high 0:04:18.121 --> 0:04:21.880 caliber candidates, but they had families and their kids needed schools, 0:04:21.961 --> 0:04:24.321 and they needed visas, and there was all these complications. 0:04:24.401 --> 0:04:26.561 So I think when I said, hey, I can be 0:04:26.641 --> 0:04:28.641 in Australia in four weeks and just stick me in 0:04:28.681 --> 0:04:30.961 a hotel and let's get started, I think that was 0:04:31.041 --> 0:04:34.681 quite attractive to the management. And so I moved and 0:04:34.801 --> 0:04:37.761 I packed up and left my family in Canada. I 0:04:37.880 --> 0:04:40.681 lived at the Seeble in Brisbane for about six months, 0:04:40.721 --> 0:04:43.401 and then I helped start the airline in Australia. So 0:04:43.921 --> 0:04:45.721 one of the scariest times of my life. I never 0:04:45.801 --> 0:04:48.561 went out for months. I didn't have any friends. I 0:04:48.681 --> 0:04:51.001 wasn't brave enough back then to go out to dinner 0:04:51.081 --> 0:04:54.761 by myself or to a movie by myself. I certainly 0:04:54.801 --> 0:04:58.721 do that all the time now, but back then it was, 0:04:58.841 --> 0:05:01.080 you know, I just stayed in my hotel room and worked. 0:05:01.481 --> 0:05:03.401 How did you get through that? Like, I mean, it's 0:05:03.401 --> 0:05:04.761 a big thing to jump at a plan and come 0:05:04.801 --> 0:05:06.081 hit me. You didn't even know what it was like 0:05:06.161 --> 0:05:08.241 working in Australia. Was it was it a different way 0:05:08.281 --> 0:05:09.481 of working? What was it going to be? 0:05:09.721 --> 0:05:09.761 Like? 0:05:10.241 --> 0:05:11.761 Where did you get that confidence from? 0:05:12.320 --> 0:05:15.001 I don't know where it comes from deep within me, 0:05:15.161 --> 0:05:19.921 but I just have this drive to just never give up, 0:05:20.361 --> 0:05:23.320 and I have this kind of resilience and or grit. 0:05:23.561 --> 0:05:25.401 I think I've been working through trying to work out 0:05:25.440 --> 0:05:27.561 what it is. But I think I had kind of 0:05:27.601 --> 0:05:31.681 a pretty bumpy use and I just think it's taught 0:05:31.721 --> 0:05:34.681 me just to push hard. And of course I was terrified. 0:05:34.721 --> 0:05:36.601 I mean I got on the plane. It was the 0:05:36.641 --> 0:05:38.881 middle of winter there, it was the middle of summer here. 0:05:39.201 --> 0:05:41.401 I remember being so hot, and ironically it was only 0:05:41.440 --> 0:05:44.201 April in prison, so it wasn't that bad. And I 0:05:44.320 --> 0:05:46.001 had this moment in the hotel where I went you 0:05:46.081 --> 0:05:48.161 know what. Because the airline hadn't set up yet, I 0:05:48.320 --> 0:05:50.761 was doing all the work remotely, so I was negotiating 0:05:50.801 --> 0:05:53.961 with quantas to do our ground handling remotely. I wasn't 0:05:54.121 --> 0:05:56.681 yet positioned at the airport because we didn't have aircraft here. 0:05:57.481 --> 0:05:58.881 And it was about one or two weeks in that 0:05:58.961 --> 0:06:00.321 I had this moment where I went, you know what, 0:06:00.440 --> 0:06:02.961 I'm completely alone, and even if something happened to me, 0:06:03.841 --> 0:06:06.001 like you know what, my parents probably wouldn't work it 0:06:06.001 --> 0:06:07.761 out until they didn't get an email for me a 0:06:07.841 --> 0:06:10.961 week later. But I must say I had this beautiful 0:06:11.041 --> 0:06:13.921 concierge at the hotel who every day when I'd work, 0:06:13.961 --> 0:06:15.281 he'd come up and he'd be like, what are you 0:06:15.281 --> 0:06:17.041 going to do this weekend, Laurie, And I'm like, well, 0:06:17.081 --> 0:06:19.481 I'm working. And he was the one that pushed me 0:06:19.681 --> 0:06:23.681 literally on my first bus down to the pineapple farm. 0:06:24.281 --> 0:06:26.681 He convinced me to go on some tours. I met 0:06:26.721 --> 0:06:30.121 a few people, like he was quite influential, Like you know, 0:06:30.201 --> 0:06:33.081 there was lots of times of loneliness, but he kind 0:06:33.121 --> 0:06:35.961 of pushed me around. And then you know, six months in, 0:06:36.081 --> 0:06:37.841 once I was starting at the airport, I met lots 0:06:37.841 --> 0:06:40.281 of great people and kind of the rest is history. 0:06:40.481 --> 0:06:42.641 Twenty six is pretty young right to go into a 0:06:42.721 --> 0:06:44.601 leadership role, and then also added to that, you know, 0:06:44.641 --> 0:06:46.681 you ought to be one of the few female leaders there. 0:06:47.081 --> 0:06:50.521 Did you experience any doubt from other people like you're 0:06:50.521 --> 0:06:52.801 coming in, like, hang on, who is this lady? What's 0:06:52.841 --> 0:06:55.481 going on? Can she really do this? Oh? One percent? 0:06:55.880 --> 0:06:59.481 Because at the time it was at Brisbane Airport, all 0:06:59.561 --> 0:07:02.361 of the station managers were at least fifty plus years 0:07:02.401 --> 0:07:06.080 old old men. I don't think I recall meeting any 0:07:06.401 --> 0:07:09.881 women for quite some time. So the station manager job 0:07:10.161 --> 0:07:13.041 in airports is pretty senior and pretty special, and people 0:07:13.161 --> 0:07:15.241 really aspire to have them because they're great. You get 0:07:15.281 --> 0:07:18.161 to move around the world, you get to experience different countries. 0:07:18.761 --> 0:07:21.481 But that wasn't my background. I had just worked in 0:07:21.561 --> 0:07:24.361 one location my whole kind of career up until that point, 0:07:24.761 --> 0:07:28.401 and I considered myself quite junior. So yeah, lots of 0:07:28.441 --> 0:07:31.921 self doubt and lots of people, particularly you know, no 0:07:32.001 --> 0:07:35.321 offense to Quantus, but particularly Quantus management back then. You know, 0:07:35.401 --> 0:07:38.041 they were all very senior, and so when I was 0:07:38.121 --> 0:07:41.401 kind of coming into a room to negotiate them working 0:07:41.561 --> 0:07:43.961 for me, that was interesting. 0:07:44.361 --> 0:07:45.361 How did you overcome that? 0:07:45.641 --> 0:07:47.841 Well, we were a smaller airline, I mean, we only 0:07:47.921 --> 0:07:50.521 had one daily flight, so we weren't that important to 0:07:50.601 --> 0:07:55.681 Quantus back then. But I always overcome that by just 0:07:55.961 --> 0:08:00.361 being honest and kind and building relationships and connecting with 0:08:00.441 --> 0:08:02.401 people on a human level. I think that's the most 0:08:02.441 --> 0:08:04.881 important thing to do. Like it's not just about the work. 0:08:05.041 --> 0:08:06.401 It's like, who are you and how do I get 0:08:06.441 --> 0:08:08.641 to know you? Let's go for a coffee and you know, 0:08:08.681 --> 0:08:11.761 and these are relationships. I literally have the lovely Henry. 0:08:12.361 --> 0:08:14.521 If he's listening, he was one of the station managers 0:08:14.561 --> 0:08:17.241 back then. He's well retired now, but we still keep 0:08:17.281 --> 0:08:19.921 in touch, Like we actually bump into each other. We 0:08:20.001 --> 0:08:22.161 talk about those days. He was kind of put his 0:08:22.281 --> 0:08:24.281 arms around me to say, hey, guys, you know, let 0:08:24.361 --> 0:08:27.401 her into this club and into this circle. But Emma, 0:08:27.561 --> 0:08:29.601 you will know that that was one of the biggest 0:08:29.641 --> 0:08:31.881 mentors for me at that time. Too, was Brett Godfrey 0:08:32.041 --> 0:08:35.920 because he was launching Virgin and he was also a 0:08:36.041 --> 0:08:39.481 kind of underdog and smaller fish in the pond, you know, 0:08:39.601 --> 0:08:41.721 And he was always really nice and kind to me too, 0:08:41.841 --> 0:08:42.801 so just kept me pushing. 0:08:43.001 --> 0:08:44.481 Brett was one of the first I interviewed on the 0:08:44.561 --> 0:08:47.321 series actually, and I mean, he is an amazing guy 0:08:47.321 --> 0:08:48.961 and it goes to show what he did and the 0:08:49.001 --> 0:08:51.161 opportunity to give people and just how down to earth 0:08:51.201 --> 0:08:53.161 he was about everything. It just allowed us all to 0:08:53.241 --> 0:08:55.681 sort of shine. I guess. So he was one of 0:08:55.721 --> 0:08:58.561 those early mentors for you yeah, one hundred percent. 0:08:58.681 --> 0:09:00.961 And I don't even know if he remembers this, but 0:09:01.681 --> 0:09:03.521 you know, he was the one that said to me, 0:09:04.561 --> 0:09:06.481 you know, any time you want to come across at Virgin, 0:09:06.521 --> 0:09:09.721 there'll be an opportunity. And I sadly, and this has 0:09:09.761 --> 0:09:12.081 been brought up recently seeing what everyone at Bonza and 0:09:12.641 --> 0:09:15.321 going through is. You know, I was sadly one of 0:09:15.361 --> 0:09:18.641 those people that when our airline went into administration, I 0:09:18.801 --> 0:09:21.761 was in Brisbane and that's when I've never felt so alone, 0:09:22.281 --> 0:09:24.841 Like I had the administrators lock up the office, take 0:09:24.961 --> 0:09:29.081 my company car. All of my personal belongings were locked up, 0:09:29.201 --> 0:09:32.441 like accessing getting my own things back and kind of 0:09:32.481 --> 0:09:35.281 being here stranded in Australia. And unfortunately it was at 0:09:35.281 --> 0:09:38.001 the same time as ANSET, so you know, they canceled 0:09:38.041 --> 0:09:40.121 my visa. I didn't know what I was going to do. 0:09:40.481 --> 0:09:44.001 I sat on my friend's couch for three months, kind 0:09:44.041 --> 0:09:47.641 of going what happens now. Unfortunately I couldn't work in 0:09:47.761 --> 0:09:50.481 aviation because you know, there was a lot of people 0:09:50.521 --> 0:09:52.361 out of work, a lot of Australians out of work 0:09:52.401 --> 0:09:55.521 and rightly so the government at the time was prioritizing them. 0:09:56.641 --> 0:09:58.561 But Brett was the one that said, if you ever 0:09:58.641 --> 0:10:00.801 work it out, like, if you work out if you're staying, 0:10:01.401 --> 0:10:03.201 you know, let me know. And I think it was 0:10:03.281 --> 0:10:04.601 like a year and a half it took me to 0:10:04.641 --> 0:10:07.401 get my permanent residency, to go through all of that stuff. 0:10:08.201 --> 0:10:11.241 And I called Virgin once I had permanent residency and said, hey, 0:10:11.361 --> 0:10:14.001 would you still consider me? And then that was the 0:10:14.081 --> 0:10:17.881 next ten years. Yeah, So that was amazing to end 0:10:17.961 --> 0:10:20.361 up there where I did after such kind of hardship 0:10:20.441 --> 0:10:21.161 that was pretty specise. 0:10:21.201 --> 0:10:23.641 And does it help you realize now that that impact 0:10:23.681 --> 0:10:25.201 that someone could happen? You're like, you have that for 0:10:25.281 --> 0:10:27.921 people in Albany, import now when you give them a chance? 0:10:28.241 --> 0:10:30.881 Oh one hundred percent. I mean, the thing I worry 0:10:30.881 --> 0:10:33.161 about all the time is my wake. So what is 0:10:33.241 --> 0:10:36.441 the wake that every single thing that I say leaves 0:10:36.681 --> 0:10:40.641 on somebody? Because there's nothing well, I feel like there's 0:10:40.681 --> 0:10:43.521 nothing worse. There's nothing worse than having an interaction with 0:10:43.601 --> 0:10:46.721 somebody that you think is so profound and then you 0:10:46.881 --> 0:10:49.641 meet them five years later or ten years later and 0:10:49.681 --> 0:10:51.001 you talk about it and they're like what are you 0:10:51.081 --> 0:10:51.561 talking about? 0:10:51.601 --> 0:10:53.041 I have no idea what you're talking about. 0:10:53.481 --> 0:10:56.321 And I find that fascinating that people can have such 0:10:56.321 --> 0:11:00.801 an impact on somebody's life with one conversation, and it 0:11:00.921 --> 0:11:03.761 can kind of guide your career or guide your decisions, 0:11:03.881 --> 0:11:06.761 and then they cannot remember it. So I always think 0:11:06.801 --> 0:11:09.401 about that every single thing that I say as a 0:11:09.481 --> 0:11:14.201 CEO is it's important to leave people intact, and I 0:11:14.321 --> 0:11:16.401 just think about the wake of the ripple of what 0:11:16.561 --> 0:11:18.801 I say and the impact that that might have on 0:11:18.961 --> 0:11:21.801 somebody down the track. I think about that a lot. 0:11:21.961 --> 0:11:23.321 Yeah, I love that, and I mean there's something to 0:11:23.401 --> 0:11:25.761 be said for having done those roles at a more 0:11:25.801 --> 0:11:27.921 junior level and moved your way up. There seems to 0:11:27.961 --> 0:11:30.401 be a big consistency, right being in a role. You 0:11:30.481 --> 0:11:31.841 get it, You've been there, you've done it, you know 0:11:31.921 --> 0:11:32.601 what it feels. 0:11:32.441 --> 0:11:35.961 Like, correct. I think that's what has been game changing 0:11:36.041 --> 0:11:38.201 for my career. And I had somebody say to me 0:11:38.481 --> 0:11:42.201 recently and I hadn't really thought about it, is I 0:11:42.321 --> 0:11:45.921 will talk to my electricians on the airfield exactly the 0:11:46.001 --> 0:11:48.161 same way that I will talk to my board of 0:11:48.241 --> 0:11:51.601 directors in the boardroom. I just try to look at well, 0:11:51.681 --> 0:11:53.921 what's important to the person I'm talking to, and how 0:11:54.001 --> 0:11:56.841 do I tailor my conversations that it's interesting to them 0:11:56.881 --> 0:11:59.081 and that it means something to them. So I think 0:11:59.201 --> 0:12:02.521 just having those experiences, you know, I still go out 0:12:02.521 --> 0:12:04.881 in the operation. I still go jump in the safety cars, 0:12:05.121 --> 0:12:08.001 drive around the airfield, I still walk through the terminals. 0:12:08.121 --> 0:12:10.721 I still help travelers, like you have to just stay 0:12:10.841 --> 0:12:15.161 connected to your operation most importantly. But I think working 0:12:15.241 --> 0:12:16.961 from the ground up, there's a lot to be said 0:12:17.121 --> 0:12:18.881 for that. I mean, you read a lot of success 0:12:18.961 --> 0:12:22.241 stories of CEOs that started in the mail room or 0:12:22.681 --> 0:12:25.321 you know, worked their way through, and I think that 0:12:25.521 --> 0:12:28.761 means something to people because you just didn't get handed everything. 0:12:28.841 --> 0:12:31.921 Absolutely. I think ego, I mean, you have to have 0:12:32.041 --> 0:12:34.001 some of it right in order to get anywhere, especially 0:12:34.081 --> 0:12:36.561 at your level. But how do you temper that? Sometimes? 0:12:36.761 --> 0:12:39.361 Does it sometimes overwhelm you? Like, whoa, look, how far 0:12:39.441 --> 0:12:41.361 I've gotten, the influence I've got I'm sitting at the 0:12:41.401 --> 0:12:43.721 top of the food chain here in the space. I'm meant, 0:12:43.801 --> 0:12:45.441 do you ever have to kind of bring yourself back 0:12:45.521 --> 0:12:47.481 down and you know or not? Really? Oh? 0:12:47.601 --> 0:12:50.321 Look, so my kids bring me back down every day. 0:12:51.521 --> 0:12:55.041 They don't they don't think I'm special. It was funny. Actually, 0:12:55.321 --> 0:12:59.281 my daughter did an economics test recently and she didn't 0:12:59.321 --> 0:13:01.801 get a very good mark. And I get the automatic 0:13:01.881 --> 0:13:04.441 updates from the school when you get marks, and I 0:13:04.561 --> 0:13:06.761 text her said, hey, that wasn't a great mark. And 0:13:06.921 --> 0:13:09.361 she copied and pasted an article out of the Herald 0:13:09.481 --> 0:13:11.721 Sun that related to the airport and she said, well, 0:13:11.761 --> 0:13:14.201 you're not doing a great job on this side. And 0:13:14.281 --> 0:13:20.081 I was like, oh god, so but now, like I guess, 0:13:20.121 --> 0:13:21.961 you do have to have ego. And I often think 0:13:22.001 --> 0:13:24.441 about for me, it's really important to stay ground. Yeah, 0:13:24.761 --> 0:13:26.681 And I always think about, you know, the two most 0:13:26.721 --> 0:13:30.521 important things to me are humanity and humility and caring 0:13:30.641 --> 0:13:33.201 about the people I interact with, the people that work 0:13:33.281 --> 0:13:35.881 for me. And I just think you need to be 0:13:36.041 --> 0:13:39.441 really careful that ego doesn't run away for you, because 0:13:39.481 --> 0:13:43.441 it's even being an internal promotion. People will hold back 0:13:43.521 --> 0:13:45.961 their true feelings when they're talking to a CEO. So 0:13:46.041 --> 0:13:48.481 you've got to create an environment where people are comfortable 0:13:48.561 --> 0:13:50.801 enough to tell you the truth, where you've got people 0:13:50.841 --> 0:13:53.281 that will tell you you're wrong. I have people tell 0:13:53.321 --> 0:13:55.761 me I'm wrong all the time. But I think you know, 0:13:55.841 --> 0:13:58.041 there's lots of case studies in the world where if 0:13:58.121 --> 0:13:59.601 you have a team that works for you that just 0:13:59.641 --> 0:14:01.881 tells you everything that you want to hear and isn't 0:14:01.921 --> 0:14:04.841 going to tell you when there's bad news, those cases 0:14:05.241 --> 0:14:06.361 can end up pretty dangerous. 0:14:06.441 --> 0:14:08.601 How do you create an environment where people go, you 0:14:08.641 --> 0:14:10.601 know what, it's safe to tell Laurie the truth, even 0:14:10.641 --> 0:14:11.681 though she's not going to like it. 0:14:12.201 --> 0:14:15.081 I realized really early on when I got promoted and 0:14:15.161 --> 0:14:18.321 the kind of walls went up with everyone. I thought 0:14:18.361 --> 0:14:21.081 it was going to be different as an internal promotion 0:14:21.241 --> 0:14:23.521 because I knew everybody. I'd been there for seven years. 0:14:23.761 --> 0:14:27.081 People knew me deeply, I knew them deeply. My first 0:14:27.201 --> 0:14:29.041 kind of one or two interactions with people that I 0:14:29.121 --> 0:14:33.041 knew really well, more junior people in the organization, I 0:14:33.121 --> 0:14:37.081 could see that that nervousness about continuing a conversation with 0:14:37.241 --> 0:14:40.561 me in the new capacity, and that's when I really went, Okay, Wow, 0:14:40.721 --> 0:14:43.721 this is bigger than I thought it was. So I 0:14:43.881 --> 0:14:46.401 just work really hard to make sure people are comfortable, 0:14:46.601 --> 0:14:48.761 to make sure that whoever I'm speaking to, it's not 0:14:48.801 --> 0:14:52.241 about hierarchy, it's not about me having an opinion. I 0:14:52.361 --> 0:14:55.481 read something recently in the boss around. You know, there's 0:14:55.561 --> 0:14:59.041 this CEO that says, it's just an idea. It's like, 0:14:59.161 --> 0:15:02.121 let's workshop an idea, it's not a direction, and I 0:15:02.281 --> 0:15:05.361 kind of take bits and pieces of that too. Example 0:15:05.401 --> 0:15:07.001 I can give is the dirty windows. So I did 0:15:07.041 --> 0:15:08.801 a live. I did one of your lives. So I 0:15:09.001 --> 0:15:11.961 put workplace into the company. I do a workplace live 0:15:12.041 --> 0:15:14.241 every second Friday. I talk to all the team. They 0:15:14.281 --> 0:15:16.721 can ask questions, and you know, I get feedback that 0:15:16.801 --> 0:15:18.801 people love that. I just tell them what's been happening 0:15:18.841 --> 0:15:21.001 for the last couple of weeks. But I did one 0:15:21.041 --> 0:15:23.601 in the boardroom one day. Somebody said, oh, the windows 0:15:23.601 --> 0:15:25.681 are really dirty behind you, and I looked and I 0:15:25.761 --> 0:15:28.161 was like, oh, yeah, they are really dirty. And I 0:15:28.281 --> 0:15:30.161 came in the next day and the windows were spotless. 0:15:30.961 --> 0:15:34.121 And that's when I remembered thinking, I can't even say 0:15:34.201 --> 0:15:36.401 the windows are dirty because somebody's gone out of their 0:15:36.441 --> 0:15:39.521 way and probably out of their maintenance schedule to clean 0:15:39.601 --> 0:15:44.161 those windows because I said they were dirty. So every 0:15:44.201 --> 0:15:45.921 time I kind of think about what I'm saying, I 0:15:46.001 --> 0:15:49.121 think dirty windows don't say something that somebody's going to 0:15:49.241 --> 0:15:52.441 run off because I think CEOs can really create a 0:15:52.481 --> 0:15:56.161 lot of work too for people by just launching bright 0:15:56.241 --> 0:16:00.281 ideas and or saying they want something done and really 0:16:00.401 --> 0:16:03.281 not understanding the impact of what it takes on individuals 0:16:03.361 --> 0:16:03.721 to get that. 0:16:03.801 --> 0:16:06.441 Suff I hear that all the time from companies I 0:16:06.521 --> 0:16:09.681 work with, is just the fact that yeah, they're really vibrant, 0:16:09.761 --> 0:16:11.681 you know, chatty ceo, but they're just they're often just 0:16:11.761 --> 0:16:13.721 throwing at ideas and then they walk at that meeting 0:16:13.841 --> 0:16:16.721 and we're all left to go reschedule our plans and 0:16:16.761 --> 0:16:18.921 work out suits. I think that's a great insight. I 0:16:19.001 --> 0:16:21.241 haven't heard another CEO say of the fourign here, so 0:16:21.321 --> 0:16:23.881 thank you for that, Laurie. I remember when you fell 0:16:23.961 --> 0:16:26.361 pregnant with your signup virgin okay, And I bring this 0:16:26.521 --> 0:16:28.721 up because I remember thinking at the time because, as 0:16:28.761 --> 0:16:31.401 you said, you were one of the few gms who 0:16:31.441 --> 0:16:33.881 were a female actually, and in all honesty, I can't 0:16:33.881 --> 0:16:39.361 actually remember another female GM taking Matt leaf, right, And 0:16:39.401 --> 0:16:42.641 I remember at the time just thinking to theirself, oh, like, 0:16:43.561 --> 0:16:45.561 how do you do that? Like, I mean, now it 0:16:45.601 --> 0:16:47.441 doesn't seem like a big deal at all, right, Like 0:16:47.561 --> 0:16:49.601 you can take Matt leave, you still get a promotion 0:16:49.681 --> 0:16:51.361 when you're a matt leave like you know. But at 0:16:51.401 --> 0:16:54.721 the time, I remember it just being vivid in my head, going, oh, like, 0:16:54.801 --> 0:16:56.881 how's that going to affect your career? What's going to happen? 0:16:57.401 --> 0:16:59.201 What was that process like for you? And did you 0:16:59.281 --> 0:17:01.881 feel pressure to sort of come back early or even 0:17:02.481 --> 0:17:04.201 own the fact that you'd fallen pregnant and this is 0:17:04.201 --> 0:17:04.920 going to happen or. 0:17:06.121 --> 0:17:10.360 This is dangerous territory? Okay, because it didn't work out right, 0:17:10.481 --> 0:17:13.521 if I'm honest, I ended up leaving virgin when my 0:17:13.640 --> 0:17:16.721 son was three weeks old. But I'll tell you about 0:17:16.761 --> 0:17:20.080 pressure because I was a GM and because there was 0:17:20.160 --> 0:17:23.960 no example, and I was surprised to have fallen pregnant 0:17:24.001 --> 0:17:26.801 because I was forty and so you know, of course, 0:17:26.880 --> 0:17:29.441 my husband and I were hopeful, but we were realistic 0:17:29.600 --> 0:17:33.080 that mathematically the likelihood of falling pregnant at that age 0:17:33.201 --> 0:17:36.161 is less likely, not so much anymore, it seems, though. 0:17:36.561 --> 0:17:39.160 So I was terrified when I got pregnant because number one, 0:17:39.160 --> 0:17:41.401 I didn't think i'd actually get pregnant, and then number two, 0:17:42.001 --> 0:17:44.561 there was no example in the organization on how to 0:17:44.640 --> 0:17:47.961 deal with it at all, and the concept of having 0:17:48.041 --> 0:17:51.680 somebody so senior step out for Matt Leeve was just 0:17:51.921 --> 0:17:56.801 foreign to everyone, and so it took me. If my 0:17:57.160 --> 0:17:59.801 old boss ever listens to this, he'll laugh because it 0:17:59.921 --> 0:18:03.561 took me five months to tell my boss I was pregnant. 0:18:03.961 --> 0:18:04.920 That's how scared I was. 0:18:05.041 --> 0:18:05.241 Wow. 0:18:05.321 --> 0:18:08.360 And every day I'd go in and my husband was like, Okay, 0:18:08.640 --> 0:18:10.521 you have to tell him, and I said, yeah, I know. 0:18:10.961 --> 0:18:12.481 And so every day I'd come home and he'd go, 0:18:12.561 --> 0:18:13.880 did you tell him? And I said, no, my chi 0:18:13.921 --> 0:18:17.120 can know. So when I did finally tell him, he 0:18:17.321 --> 0:18:19.481 laughed and said, yeah, no kidding, because you could see 0:18:19.521 --> 0:18:21.360 that I was pregnant by that point, right, I mean, 0:18:21.521 --> 0:18:23.721 Win and Freddie could probably see that I was pregnant 0:18:23.761 --> 0:18:26.801 by at that point. We had a great supportive HR 0:18:27.360 --> 0:18:31.241