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Speaker 1: Now there's a new curriculum that is being unveiled today

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Speaker 1: and we'll get some details because I've just got the

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Speaker 1: release and skimming through it during the news. Blair Boyer

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Speaker 1: is Education Minister and joins me Now, Minister, good morning,

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Speaker 1: thanks for coming on.

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Speaker 2: Good morning, no worries on magic.

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Speaker 1: What are the changes?

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Speaker 2: So yes, as you said, this is the release of

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Speaker 2: the ninth version of the Australian Curriculum. So for your listeners,

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Speaker 2: for a number of the years now, across Australia we've

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Speaker 2: had a consistent curriculum for reception up all the way

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Speaker 2: up to year ten and then of course each state

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Speaker 2: or territory has its own Leaving Certificate NOWS is called

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Speaker 2: the Safe and that is different. So we have consistency

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Speaker 2: of content, which I think is important, but each state

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Speaker 2: or territory does get a bit of flexibility to do

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Speaker 2: some adaptations, I guess, particularly in terms of what we

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Speaker 2: start with where we put some focus. And today we

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Speaker 2: are releasing our first four subjects for version nine of

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Speaker 2: the Australian Curriculum which will start next year, and that

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Speaker 2: is English, Maths, Languages and Arts. So those curriculum materials

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Speaker 2: will be out for our teaching staff to look at

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Speaker 2: from this week so they can familiarize themselves with that

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Speaker 2: in preparation for starting it next year. The year after

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Speaker 2: we add another four subjects, and then from twenty twenty seven,

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Speaker 2: all states and territories around the country are expected to

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Speaker 2: have the full rollout of the new version of the

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Speaker 2: Australian curriculum.

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Speaker 1: Okay, I noted in the release one of the things

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Speaker 1: you talk about, qualities such as resilience and empathy will

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Speaker 1: be imported into each subject area for the first time.

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Speaker 1: Employeers are increasingly demanding this of graduates. Well, when did

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Speaker 1: resilience fall away? We grew up a resilient lot, I reckon,

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Speaker 1: what the heck's going on? So people are less resilient,

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Speaker 1: less empathetic.

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Speaker 2: Well, certainly with the resilience, that's something that I hear

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Speaker 2: a lot from employers, and I would say with my

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Speaker 2: skills and training portfolio hat on, it's something that I

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Speaker 2: hear almost ad nauseum from training organizations and from employers

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Speaker 2: around wanting those people who are graduating from our education

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Speaker 2: system and then finding employment in the South Australian workforce

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Speaker 2: need to be a bit more resilient around. I guess

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Speaker 2: you know, if you're facing challenges or something difficult, or

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Speaker 2: having a bad day, that you have the personal resilience

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Speaker 2: to stick at it and keep going. And you're right.

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Speaker 2: I think in years gone by that was possibly a

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Speaker 2: bit of a personal trait that was maybe taught more

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Speaker 2: in the household, which I'm probably happy to say on

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Speaker 2: your program from her Matthew might not be as strong

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Speaker 2: a focus always in households Now and increasingly, I think

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Speaker 2: our schools in a range of areas are being asked

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Speaker 2: to step up and do more of that kind of work.

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Speaker 2: And I'll pack in a strong position that the measure

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Speaker 2: of any good education system is how it prepares people

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Speaker 2: for the world that those young people enter when they

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Speaker 2: leave school. And the world that these young people are

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Speaker 2: entering when they leave school now is, for better or worse,

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Speaker 2: very very different to the one that I ended back

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Speaker 2: in nineteen ninety nine when I finished high school. And

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Speaker 2: we've got to make sure that we are giving our

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Speaker 2: kids the skills that the people who are going to

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Speaker 2: employ them need and want.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, but it's like the turn that I see popping

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Speaker 1: up on Facebook every now and then, where years ago

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Speaker 1: it was the parent with the teacher asking the child,

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Speaker 1: why are you your mark so poor? And now the

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Speaker 1: parent is asking the teacher why are his marks so poor?

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Speaker 2: It's exact anecdote, yep, exact anecdote that my father always

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Speaker 2: shared about his forty years in teaching and he finished

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Speaker 2: in twenty twelve and was always auf at the end

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Speaker 2: of his career around what changed between nineteen seventy two

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Speaker 2: and then, And he basically gave the example you just

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Speaker 2: gave around the involvement and kind of buy in he

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Speaker 2: had from parents when he started around their kids learning,

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Speaker 2: and then what change when he finished, which was when

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Speaker 2: he would raise that with parents. Instead of being met

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Speaker 2: with perhaps a bit of an apology and acceptance that

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Speaker 2: there's more that could be done at home, there was

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Speaker 2: normally a criticism level that the teacher for why are

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Speaker 2: you failing my child? So there's definitely been a shift there,

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Speaker 2: But you know, we have to play the cards that

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Speaker 2: we're dealt. The world that these kids are going into

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Speaker 2: is here, things like AI here, whether you like it

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Speaker 2: or not. And if we don't prepare kids to be

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Speaker 2: able to operate in that world, and we have failed them, that.

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Speaker 1: Simple empathy in subjects so mass will be bills five apples.

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Speaker 1: Sally only has one poor Sally instead of what's the difference.

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Speaker 2: I'm not sure it'll be quite like that. We're still

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Speaker 2: very much pushing hard on the fundamental literacy and unancy stuff.

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Speaker 2: I can tell you that that's why we're leading with

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Speaker 2: English and maths, and we're not moving away from any

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Speaker 2: of that. In fact, we're doubling down on that, things

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Speaker 2: like phonics for literacy. Last year I announced the introduction

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Speaker 2: of a MAS check for grade three and four students,

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Speaker 2: so we do a little bit of a quick assessment

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Speaker 2: to see how they're going, and if, like the phonics check,

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Speaker 2: it identify as the kids aren't keeping up, we put

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Speaker 2: a heap of extra support in straight away so that

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Speaker 2: we aren't working these things out at year nine and

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Speaker 2: year ten when it becomes much much harder to address.

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Speaker 2: The empathy thing is an interesting point, so I was

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Speaker 2: discussing this was Martin Wessell the other day, and his

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Speaker 2: point was there's a real line that can be drawn

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Speaker 2: in the PISA results, which is the international test in

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Speaker 2: OECD nation's fifteen year olds, in which our results have

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Speaker 2: strict year on year for a long time between particularly

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Speaker 2: year nine boys' ability to see other perspectives in the

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Speaker 2: world and how they perform in PISA. There is a

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Speaker 2: real correlation between it. So, you know, it is about

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Speaker 2: making sure that people can see other perspectives, whatever, other

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Speaker 2: ideas and views, and that I think is also goes

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Speaker 2: back to some of the things that employers want in

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Speaker 2: terms of what they referred to as those soft skills communication,

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Speaker 2: how you get along with other people in the workplace,

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Speaker 2: accepting that you're going to be in a workplace where

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Speaker 2: you're not going to be best friends with everybody, and

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Speaker 2: how do you have the resilis to deal with that

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Speaker 2: and keep going. You know, these are the things we

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Speaker 2: have to teach so kids are actually ready for the

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Speaker 2: workforce and can actually thrive in the workforce.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, but these things you describe in another point here

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Speaker 1: you're saying the curriculum needs to be decluttered. Yeah, decluttered.

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Speaker 1: But these things you describe are just clattering it up,

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Speaker 1: aren't they.

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Speaker 2: Oh they're not there. These I mean, these are individual subjects.

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Speaker 2: These are just things that we get to focus on

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Speaker 2: in on the subjects that we are doing. And we

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Speaker 2: aren't removing subjects to declutter it. It is about and

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Speaker 2: this was a national decision that was taken around trying

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Speaker 2: to declutter it is around making sure that all the

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Speaker 2: major concepts are taught, all those important concepts that we

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Speaker 2: would all be probably familiar with the different subjects, but

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Speaker 2: making sure there is capacity in it for a deeper

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Speaker 2: dive and deeper analysis in those areas where we really

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Speaker 2: need to do that. I think there was a real

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Speaker 2: criticism and risk that we were sort of a bit

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Speaker 2: once over lightly in lots of areas, and what we're

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Speaker 2: doing this in our school systems is just sort of

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Speaker 2: hurling heaps of information at kids and some of it

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Speaker 2: would stick and some of it would not, and not

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Speaker 2: doing the work to explain to kids why it's actually

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Speaker 2: important in the real world, to know it, giving them

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Speaker 2: a bit of a passion for it, and then actually

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Speaker 2: understanding how to apply it when they leave school. You know,

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Speaker 2: It's one thing is to have knowledge that you can

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Speaker 2: recite that is important, but you need to be able

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Speaker 2: to understand why it's going to be important when you

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Speaker 2: walk out of high school for the last time, and

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Speaker 2: how you actually get that knowledge and use it when

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Speaker 2: you go to work. That's the important thing.

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Speaker 1: All right. Now, Look, I know what people listening are thinking,

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Speaker 1: and I'd be on this same page as well. All

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Speaker 1: this is well and good, and I'm sure comes from

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Speaker 1: a great place, and I think you personally have been

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Speaker 1: a good so far Minister for Education. But the three are's.

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Speaker 1: There's no word of this, and that's what people out

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Speaker 1: there want to hear. I know, the writing, reading, arithmetic.

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Speaker 1: If we focus on that, well, problems solved surely, and

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Speaker 1: all these things we've discussed this morning.

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Speaker 2: I can reassure you and all your listeners that as

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Speaker 2: absolutely still all about the free arts, and that's why

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Speaker 2: we are leading with English and maths. We are absolutely

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Speaker 2: still doing those fundamentals more than ever. I'm I do

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Speaker 2: not support and will not support, and neither with Martin Wessell,

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Speaker 2: the Chief Executive, any reduction in that. And I would

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Speaker 2: point to the phonics check around literacy which was introduced

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Speaker 2: in twenty seventeen, and then the mass check of the

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Speaker 2: same kind of nature that we introduced last year is

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Speaker 2: all about fundamental literacy and numerosy stuff, the good old

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Speaker 2: fashioned stuff that there's no doubt about that, and then

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Speaker 2: putting support behind those kids that those checks identify are struggling.

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Speaker 2: So I can tell you there is the Three Arts

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Speaker 2: all the way through this. We aren't. You know, this

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Speaker 2: is not an ideological battle, it's not cultural war stuff.

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Speaker 2: But we need to also make sure that we put

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Speaker 2: those other bits into the education system which support those

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Speaker 2: kids who might be disengaged from school or not going

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Speaker 2: to school, to get them back at school, because it's

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Speaker 2: one thing to do that the three ares, and I

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Speaker 2: support that, Matthew. It's no good if kids aren't at

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Speaker 2: school not learning anything at all. So you know, the

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Speaker 2: reason I've got Arts and Languages is one of the

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Speaker 2: four that we're leading with is that is to make

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Speaker 2: sure that there is a bit of I guess an

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Speaker 2: opportunity for creative outlet for kids. For a lot of kids,

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Speaker 2: art and languages are something they love at school. So

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Speaker 2: having that as well as our sort of hardcore literacy

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Speaker 2: and numeracy stuff is going to be good to actually

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Speaker 2: make sure kids want to be at school and come

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Speaker 2: to school and learn all that important stuff, including the

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Speaker 2: three Arts. And I can tell you, as a son

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Speaker 2: of an English teacher and history teacher, I'm a big

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Speaker 2: believer in that fundamental literacy and nunancy stuff. And we

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Speaker 2: are back and away from it one bit.

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Speaker 1: It makes you wonder, then, how we've left sight of

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Speaker 1: that along the way.

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Speaker 2: The problem is, and I know people's frustration with this,

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Speaker 2: so I truly do understand it. And the thing that

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Speaker 2: has changed though, Matthew, particularly since then, the twenty or

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Speaker 2: five years since I left school, is the state of

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Speaker 2: young people, particularly the young people's mental health and well being,

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Speaker 2: is in just far worse shape than it was then,

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Speaker 2: even including primary school. You know.

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Speaker 1: There, that doesn't it Social media technology is whole, the

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Speaker 1: online earthly.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, it's kids. They've heard of this. This is

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Speaker 2: the as the anxious generation, and they are and I

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Speaker 2: see it in my own kids who are in two

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Speaker 2: of them are in grade three and one grade four.

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Speaker 2: You know, the stuff they pick up on social media,

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Speaker 2: the things that they start focusing on social media. And

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Speaker 2: I think about now, we've always had bullying and harassment

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Speaker 2: in school, and sadly there will always be some of it.

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Speaker 2: But you know, assuming you had at you know, a

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Speaker 2: safe home and a loving family, you used to be

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Speaker 2: able to escape that after school. Now, if you're being

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Speaker 2: bullied through TikTok or snapchat or Instagram or Facebook, it

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Speaker 2: is at you twenty four hours a day, there is

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Speaker 2: no escaping it, and that is driving kids' mental health down.

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Speaker 2: And I always come back to this point, it's kind

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Speaker 2: of nuts of us to think that in a world

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Speaker 2: where the mental health and well being of the kids

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Speaker 2: taking tests like that plan and the workforce teaching them

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Speaker 2: is worse than it has been, that our results are

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Speaker 2: also going to miraculously go up at the same time.

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Speaker 2: So I approach the well being stuff very much as

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Speaker 2: it's well being for academic success. Our road to improving

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Speaker 2: that plan and piece of results is through also investing

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Speaker 2: in the well being of kids and our workforce. So

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Speaker 2: they're actually in a good place when they sit down

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Speaker 2: to do a NAP PLAN test and PISA test to

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Speaker 2: do well. But we are keeping that focus on the

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Speaker 2: fundamental literacy and numeracy stuff at the same time, all.

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Speaker 1: Right, And these changes kick in from next year.

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Speaker 2: They do first four subjects for next year, another four

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Speaker 2: subjects a year after and from twenty twenty seven the

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Speaker 2: whole Australian curriculum and that content, you know, I reiterate

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Speaker 2: that content is consistent across every state and territory, which

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Speaker 2: is good because I think we move away from the

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Speaker 2: cultural all stuff around what are we teaching what are

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Speaker 2: we not teaching? That all gets rolled out everywhere from

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Speaker 2: twenty twenty seven.

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Speaker 1: And history, okay, the importance that your dad a history teacher.

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Speaker 1: Should we get back to the fundamentals of what history

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Speaker 1: used to be like or do we worry about the

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Speaker 1: social the culture wars that you mentioned.

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Speaker 2: Well, No, I don't think we do. I mean, I know,

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Speaker 2: for instance, I think it's the upen history still has

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Speaker 2: a very strong focus on World War two history and

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Speaker 2: things like that, So we do still do all that.

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Speaker 2: But you know, I think what we know when we

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Speaker 2: talk about the kind of decluttering, it's around, because it's

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Speaker 2: a bit of a clumsy word, it's around the ability

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Speaker 2: to make sure that instead of kind of doing once

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Speaker 2: over lightly on a whole range of things, that there's

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Speaker 2: the room in there for teachers to have a real

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Speaker 2: deep dive into things like World War two history, you know,

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Speaker 2: so instead of having a really kind of superficial knowledge

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Speaker 2: of things, you can do a more in depth investigation

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Speaker 2: and learning of some of those things, and all those

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Speaker 2: things that I think I learned about at that high

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Speaker 2: school that I loved in history, that stuff is all

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Speaker 2: still there.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, last question not related to that so much, but

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Speaker 1: about school terms. And as you'd know that the previous

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Speaker 1: government moved years even into high school, so we match

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Speaker 1: up with what's going on around the country. Can we

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Speaker 1: look at matching up school terms around the country, because

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Speaker 1: you know, you get people here who's who want to

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Speaker 1: catch up with family interstate, and of course the dates

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Speaker 1: don't match up during school terms, and you think, well,

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Speaker 1: why the heck not, that's such a simple thing.

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Speaker 2: Surely to do it gets raises me a lot, and

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Speaker 2: I understand people's frustration gather around.

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Speaker 1: It's a good example too, obviously.

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Speaker 2: Yes, indeed, yes, And it hasn't been on the national

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Speaker 2: agenda yet. It would be a tough one to do

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Speaker 2: because you know, all those states and territories have got

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Speaker 2: their own kind of big event or event season. I

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Speaker 2: guess that they want to make sure they can cater

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Speaker 2: for all. But I certainly understand the frustration. It was

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Speaker 2: almost reminds you of the argument between narrow gauge and

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Speaker 2: standard cage with railways. Doesn't know, people can't understand about

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Speaker 2: how exactly we can't be consistent with that stuff. So yeah, listen,

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Speaker 2: I'm aware of it. I think other state ministers would

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Speaker 2: say the same thing, but then probably all not be

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Speaker 2: necessarily willing to compromise when it comes to shifting something.

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Speaker 2: And my concern with that, I've got to say is

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Speaker 2: I don't want to be beholden to what Victoria and

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Speaker 2: New South Wales dictate is the right time for school holidays,

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Speaker 2: because it'll be my fear. But I do understand. You know,

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Speaker 2: I've been in the same boat. My family ran trying

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Speaker 2: to catch up with family interstate and they don't have

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Speaker 2: school holidays at the same time, and you can't do it.

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Speaker 1: It's rubbish.

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Speaker 2: I know.

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Speaker 1: We all we all fell into line with Tasmania over

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Speaker 1: daylight savings and going for six months at a time,

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Speaker 1: So surely we can do it with school holidays, even

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Speaker 1: if we all compromise a week and they move a

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Speaker 1: week back and we move a week forward and then bang,

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Speaker 1: at least there's a week in there. But anyway, but.

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Speaker 2: If their crosses over, you know, I understand people with

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Speaker 2: frustration with that. They wonder why we have a consistent

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Speaker 2: We can have consistent national curriculum exactly, can't have it

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Speaker 2: for other things.

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Speaker 1: That's what the questions.

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Speaker 2: Good on you, Blair boy, Thank you jeez, thanks Matthew.

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Speaker 1: Education Minister. Changes to the curriculum from next year.