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Speaker 1: Welcome to the mentor. I'm Marke Boris.

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Speaker 2: I remember sitting at the bar going back to the hotel,

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Speaker 2: sitting at the bar with Sean Johnson and his partner,

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Speaker 2: and at a phone call come through from my sister

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Speaker 2: and her been a ragby league founder, had thought she

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Speaker 2: wanted to speak about the game, and I left it.

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Speaker 2: I didn't answer it because I wasn't really in the

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Speaker 2: mood to speak about rugby league at the time, and

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Speaker 2: it was the end of the year and it's enjoying

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Speaker 2: having a sparkling water and a red wine at the bar.

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Speaker 2: And then she ran me back straight away and I

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Speaker 2: knew something was up. I answered the call and I said, hey,

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Speaker 2: what's Hey Mendes, so that's my sister's name.

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Speaker 3: What's what's happened? She's like his dad, and I was like, well,

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Speaker 3: what's happened?

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Speaker 2: And she's like, he's taken his own life, his dad,

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Speaker 2: he's committed suicide.

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Speaker 1: And your biological father, yeah, my.

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Speaker 2: Biological father, who I hadn't spoken until spoken to since

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Speaker 2: I was twenty one I was now thirty at the time,

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Speaker 2: sat there and just broke down in tears, like I

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Speaker 2: don't I didn't even know what I was.

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Speaker 1: It was just like a shock for start.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well you know my dad, My dad was a

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Speaker 2: good guy, but it was just a useless father. And

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Speaker 2: you know, I kind of carried this chip on my

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Speaker 2: shoulder as a young kid, like like you kind of

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Speaker 2: mumba lamas, but you kind of fucked my childhood. Now

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Speaker 2: you know, you're throwing the spanner in the works, and

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Speaker 2: you're fucking fuck with me in my adulthood as well,

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Speaker 2: you know what I mean. So I sat there and

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Speaker 2: I had all this these these thoughts going through my head,

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Speaker 2: and you know, I had I had to break the

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Speaker 2: news to someone else, and I told Sean and I

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Speaker 2: had to go up to my room, and then before

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Speaker 2: I knew it, the whole squad was in my room.

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Speaker 2: David Kobell, included the managers, everyone, and everyone was just

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Speaker 2: there kind.

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Speaker 3: Of helping me out, and and I hopped on.

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Speaker 2: They were the logistics out so I could get back

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Speaker 2: to Christich for the funeral, And so I got back

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Speaker 2: to christ Church. Through this whole next two days of

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Speaker 2: traveling from London to christ Church, so much thoughts were

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Speaker 2: going through my head. I was about to go back

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Speaker 2: home to a family that's part of me that I

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Speaker 2: haven't seen for nearly twenty odd years. And that was

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Speaker 2: a bit of a mind a mine, mind.

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Speaker 3: Fuck within itself.

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Speaker 2: And so anyway, I get myself, me and my sister

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Speaker 2: get at ourself prepared for.

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Speaker 3: The funeral and walking to the funeral, and.

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Speaker 2: Here's my half brother who's basically four or five years

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Speaker 2: younger than me, looks like my twin, and I haven't

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Speaker 2: seen him since I'm seven. So that's my first shock.

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Speaker 2: See obviously, see my dad, and you know, see my

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Speaker 2: aunties who I haven't seen since I was a young kid.

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Speaker 2: And I'm basically four with a room full of strangers.

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Speaker 2: But there's this part, there's there's this still part of

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Speaker 2: me that's in this room. And throughout the day, as

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Speaker 2: I went from the few uneral to my dad's grave site,

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Speaker 2: I actually found out my dad, my grandfather, and my

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Speaker 2: great grandfather had all taken.

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Speaker 3: Their own lives.

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Speaker 1: Wow, and on your dad's side.

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Speaker 3: On my dad's side.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, And the only thing that we share in common

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Speaker 2: is the same middle name, and that's Earl. And as

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Speaker 2: a young kid, I used to hate that middle name.

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Speaker 4: All of you had the same middle name, great grandfather, grandfather, dad,

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Speaker 4: and you and.

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Speaker 2: Me and I found that out during that day. And

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Speaker 2: as a kid, the middle name. I don't know whether

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Speaker 2: it was just to do with the association with my

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Speaker 2: dad because I thought he was useless.

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Speaker 3: As a kid.

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Speaker 2: Like when I was a kid, I hated the middle name.

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Speaker 2: I felt like it gave me bad energy. And whenever

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Speaker 2: someone would ask me, what's your middle name, I would

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Speaker 2: say I don't have one. I'd always go like, I

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Speaker 2: don't have one. And basically that was the turning point

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Speaker 2: in my life. I continue to play rugby league for

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Speaker 2: the next two years, but I felt like my job

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Speaker 2: when I felt my dream was starting to turn into

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Speaker 2: a job. And I believe when you when your dream

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Speaker 2: starts to turn into a job, it's.

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Speaker 3: Time to walk away.

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Speaker 2: That's that's the sport, that's life, that's the universe tapping

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Speaker 2: on your shoulder saying hey, like you need to go

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Speaker 2: find something else and.

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Speaker 1: Tap out, tap out.

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Speaker 2: And you know, when I was a kid, when I'd

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Speaker 2: hang out with my dad, he was real stylish kind

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Speaker 2: of dude, had a great great the way he dressed,

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Speaker 2: did great dress sense. He you know, wore Levi as

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Speaker 2: with the Chuck Taylor's had the leather jacket, the Harley Davison,

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Speaker 2: whereas all my mate's friends they would wear the track

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Speaker 2: the footy tracksuits and stuff like that. So I used

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Speaker 2: to be quite embarrassed by the way my dad dressed,

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Speaker 2: but he was quite hip. So I guess that's where

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Speaker 2: it sort of came into the.

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Speaker 1: Other days, the dreams with the belt exactly.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly exactly, tucked it off the polo, you know

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Speaker 2: that look exactly exactly. And so I'd sort of come

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Speaker 2: to this point in my life where I was about

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Speaker 2: to leave Manly. I've been offered a three year deal

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Speaker 2: to go to Purpen Youong, to play the cat Lands

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Speaker 2: over in the south of France.

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Speaker 3: I was meant to leave on the Friday. On the Wednesday, I.

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Speaker 2: Decided I'd retire. I just felt like I couldn't take

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Speaker 2: over this because I had two years to kind of

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Speaker 2: digest what had gone on, and my form had kind

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Speaker 2: of fallen off the back to the wards, the back

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Speaker 2: end of the year, my back into the career, so

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Speaker 2: I knew it was just time to let go. What

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Speaker 2: year we're doing man twenty seventeen eighteen, so towards the

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Speaker 2: back end of then, and I thought to myself like, listen,

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Speaker 2: there's a great opportunity to go to France and just

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Speaker 2: kind of finish off your career as a working holidays.

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Speaker 1: I think SKD was there, Yeah, he was a few.

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Speaker 3: Of the boys there, piers, he would have been there

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Speaker 3: filling up.

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Speaker 1: So I think there's a few.

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Speaker 3: Kind of boys there.

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Speaker 2: But deep down inside me, there was just something that

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Speaker 2: was holding me back and I felt like taking that with.

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Speaker 3: Me the suicide.

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Speaker 2: Over there to a non speaking English country, trying to

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Speaker 2: get therapy. And then also outside of RGULA League, my

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Speaker 2: hobby was fashion and love sneakers, love clothing, and I

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Speaker 2: saw it. I saw a niche kind of movement in

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Speaker 2: the market where you know, I've lived one dream and

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Speaker 2: once you've lived your dream and you've broken through that

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Speaker 2: like dream atmosphere and you kind of I don't know

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Speaker 2: what it is, but you feel like you can do anything.

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Speaker 2: If you really want to do something, you'll go and

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Speaker 2: do it. And like I said before, like I'd rather

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Speaker 2: found out something I want to do than I don't

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Speaker 2: want to do. So I retired on the Wednesday. On

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Speaker 2: the Monday, I started up earls at the same time

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Speaker 2: parallel with getting a job at SkyTV, so SkyTV is

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Speaker 2: over here at Fox Sports in New Zealand at Sky Sports.

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Speaker 2: So I was gone back every Wednesday and I was

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Speaker 2: doing all the Warriors home games. I was commentary and

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Speaker 2: reporting and started up Earls.

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Speaker 1: But what was it was going to be?

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Speaker 4: Like, Like, I get the brand, I understand with the

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Speaker 4: name camera, but what was your like what skews were

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Speaker 4: you going to be running with?

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Speaker 1: What do you well?

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Speaker 2: I basically, I basically the reason I came to clothing

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Speaker 2: is because that was my passion.

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Speaker 3: The name. I remember.

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Speaker 2: I was up on College Street in Sydney, just by

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Speaker 2: High Park, and I pulled over the side of the

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Speaker 2: road and I was like, I'm going to start this

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Speaker 2: thing called Earl's Collection because basically I didn't have a

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Speaker 2: relationship with my dad, you know, through my adulthood, and

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Speaker 2: I always thought i'd have a I would have an

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Speaker 2: adult conversation with him and let bygones be bygones, build

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Speaker 2: a bridge and we can both move on and just

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Speaker 2: live life, you know what I mean, and find out

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Speaker 2: about his childhood. But for obvious reasons, that didn't get

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Speaker 2: to happen. So I thought I would honor him and

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Speaker 2: take this negative, this really negative cloud of this name

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Speaker 2: and try and turn it into something positive. So I

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Speaker 2: had named it El's Collection, and I was sick of

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Speaker 2: buying other people's clothing. It's beending lots of money on

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Speaker 2: high end clothing. When I felt the quality and basically

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Speaker 2: felt like I could create that myself.

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Speaker 3: So reached out to.

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Speaker 2: A mate who put me in touch with a production

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Speaker 2: company in China, and you know, within six months, I'd

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Speaker 2: launched a forteen piece collection and I was on my

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Speaker 2: journey to start with El's.

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Speaker 4: Collection, to take me through a good forwarding piece collection.

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Speaker 4: So what are we talking about?

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Speaker 5: These?

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Speaker 1: You know strides?

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Speaker 2: We started with teas teas, these basketball shorts which became

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Speaker 2: a craze.

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Speaker 1: And can you describe those?

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Speaker 3: So basketball short?

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Speaker 1: I know what a basket that you're.

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Speaker 2: So basically we had these they called the Earl short,

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Speaker 2: basically just a nice premium bit of polyesamesh with Earl's

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Speaker 2: kind of applicate across the front and would change the

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Speaker 2: colors out. And it got to the point mark where

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Speaker 2: you know, like we're doing like twelve hundred peers in

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Speaker 2: three minutes. I put them up online and they just disappear.

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Speaker 1: And how did everyone know about it?

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Speaker 2: Well, just like I guess the first fan, my first

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Speaker 2: customer base and the brand Awinness I got was that

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Speaker 2: rugby league fan. So basically, at the time, the people

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Speaker 2: that followed me through rugby League were going to come on.

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Speaker 1: This journey with me with where they're following you.

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Speaker 3: Although followed me from New Zealand.

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Speaker 1: That's I don't know what what platform Facebook.

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Speaker 2: Instagram, Facebook, you know, Twitter, stuff like that, and then

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Speaker 2: we had no marketing or anything. I knew nothing. I

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Speaker 2: absolutely knew nothing. I knew nothing about clothing. All I

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Speaker 2: knew was I had a good I felt like I

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Speaker 2: had a good eye, and I was going to teach

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Speaker 2: myself how to use Photoshop illustrator and learned to design

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Speaker 2: a fourteen piece collection and put it together shoot it.

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Speaker 2: I shot my first shoot up in China ge Joe.

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Speaker 2: Just randomly happened. I was going up there to check

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Speaker 2: check the factories and then yeah, I just thought, let's

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Speaker 2: just give.

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Speaker 3: This a go.

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Speaker 1: So shorts, T shirts, what else?

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Speaker 2: Switch shirts, hoodies, socks, hats, So start off with that.

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Speaker 2: So just a small range bit of forty.

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Speaker 1: Piece nearly accessories as well.

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Speaker 2: Exactly exactly and.

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Speaker 4: I to stop me, but did you have you must

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Speaker 4: have had a fairly big a reasonable audience from me

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Speaker 4: forty days, so.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, not too bad.

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Speaker 2: I wouldn't say the biggest, the biggest following, but a

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Speaker 2: lot of people knew, like outside of regular league the

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Speaker 2: eighty minutes. I loved clothing I love and I'd always

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Speaker 2: like take photos of fits and that that I put

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Speaker 2: up on my Instagram. And you know, I'm from the

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Speaker 2: era of like living my adulthood.

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Speaker 3: With no social media.

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Speaker 2: Then also this thing coming through with social media and

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Speaker 2: you're getting used to it, you know. I'd go to

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Speaker 2: like Warriors functions and I'll wear a cardigan and Ivan Claire.

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Speaker 2: He would always come up to me with a smile

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Speaker 2: on his face, saying, fuck, what are you wearing there?

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Speaker 4: Mate?

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Speaker 2: That's fucking terrible, do you know what I mean? But

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Speaker 2: I always stuck true to who I was, and that's

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Speaker 2: what he loved about me the most. And we'd go

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Speaker 2: on footy trips and all the boys would hassle me

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Speaker 2: about wearing you know, like Cardigan's tight jeans and all,

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Speaker 2: you know, all the craze, and then they'd get me

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Speaker 2: one on one. They'd be like, hey, Louis, can you

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Speaker 2: take me shopping? My missus ask if I could dress

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Speaker 2: a little bit like you're a little bit more so

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Speaker 2: I'll start to see the boys sort of accept me

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Speaker 2: for who I was. And you know, I just thought

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Speaker 2: to myself, it's just still a fording piece collection. See

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Speaker 2: how it goes. Dropped it and it sold out pretty

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Speaker 2: much within a month.

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Speaker 1: J King to a rising tide.

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Speaker 4: So you rising tider is health nutrition or health span lifespan,

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Speaker 4: which is about nutrition and nutrition is about making sure

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Speaker 4: you have the right balance of everything you need, whether

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Speaker 4: it's what you whether it's through what you eat or

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Speaker 4: what your supplement with what you eat, along with all

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Speaker 4: the other stuff sleep, blah, exercise. But it is a

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Speaker 4: big rising tide in particular in the States and is starting

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Speaker 4: to hit here a bit a little bit less. So

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Speaker 4: this big deal in the US, and everybody wants to

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Speaker 4: live longer.

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Speaker 1: Everybody wants to look.

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Speaker 5: But also for people who I mean, investors are definitely

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Speaker 5: interested invitament companies.

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Speaker 6: They love that.

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Speaker 5: But it is interesting again like for people listening, you

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Speaker 5: can get so defeated by one investor turning you down.

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Speaker 6: It's just like again, just keep going.

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Speaker 1: Would you say, then, Jess.

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Speaker 4: That's critical for entrepreneurs who might be thinking about a

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Speaker 4: journey doesn't have to be invited with whatever they're thinking

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Speaker 4: about that they should always try and find themselves a

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Speaker 4: co founder.

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Speaker 5: I think, I have to say, I think about people

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Speaker 5: who may be doing this by themselves, and I think

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Speaker 5: it's tough. I think, as I said, yes, say, my

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Speaker 5: husband was having just a bit of a hard mental

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Speaker 5: day in terms of managing something literally on the website,

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Speaker 5: and he was defeated by it. And I'm able to

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Speaker 5: say to him, but look how many visitors we had

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Speaker 5: to the website, or like, think of the positives and

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Speaker 5: sort of cheer him up and boost him up. I

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Speaker 5: think having a co founder is incredibly supportive through the

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Speaker 5: hardship of this journey.

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Speaker 6: I mean, as you know, and as you say all

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Speaker 6: the time.

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Speaker 5: On this podcast, this is tough, tough, tough, tough stuff,

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Speaker 5: and so having that sounding board at all times and

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Speaker 5: that emotional support. I mean, the other side of it

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Speaker 5: is being very strict on boundaries. He's my husband, and

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Speaker 5: I do put my marriage first.

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Speaker 6: My mom's a relationship counsel and therapist.

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Speaker 5: I've been brought up in a home where that must

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Speaker 5: come first, and so I'm sort of strict about it,

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Speaker 5: strict boundaries, and it's not easy to have those strict

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Speaker 5: I mean, it's not easy to be strict with that

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Speaker 5: because business is so demanding and it's global and it's

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Speaker 5: an office in la in London and Sydney. I mean

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Speaker 5: the time zones of speaking to people. You speak to

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Speaker 5: people early in the morning and then late at night.

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Speaker 5: But having that companion to pick you up on the

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Speaker 5: hard days is pretty amazing because as we say, like,

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Speaker 5: you've just got to keep going, as my dad would say,

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Speaker 5: you've got to keep boxing.

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Speaker 1: Twenty four seven.

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Speaker 4: It's a tough one, yeah, But I mean, I guess

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Speaker 4: it comes down just to how you structure it out

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Speaker 4: and how you manage it.

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Speaker 1: And you're right if you have the right partner.

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Speaker 6: But I think you're exactly an understanding partner.

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Speaker 5: But I think, and I've heard you say in your podcast,

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Speaker 5: I think I do believe that when you have your

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Speaker 5: own company and you wanted to succeed it is twenty

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Speaker 5: four seven, I think I have. I've seen it with

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Speaker 5: my dad, I sort of saw with my grandmother. I've

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Speaker 5: seen it with sorry people like you. I've seen it

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Speaker 5: with all the If I look at all the successful

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Speaker 5: people in my life or who I've known, I've met,

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Speaker 5: they're at twenty four seven, and so it's sort of

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Speaker 5: like you have to stomach that. You have to stomach

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Speaker 5: that this is going to be a twenty four seven situation.

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Speaker 5: It was hard for me initially to stomach. I think

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Speaker 5: I was very protective of my personal life, of my

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Speaker 5: marriage and let's have boundaries, you know. But then there

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Speaker 5: comes a time where you realize, if we want to succeed,

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Speaker 5: we're going to have to give it out everything.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, it's actually you're talking about disrupt your business. The

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Speaker 4: more disrupting the business into the marketplace, the more you

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Speaker 4: just write the marketplace generally speaking, the more disrupt.

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Speaker 5: Your lifeptions disruption everywhere.

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Speaker 6: I think you're right and be prepared for it.

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Speaker 4: And if you're prepared for it, then there's no surprise.

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Speaker 4: You're okay, yeah, and you'll be fine.

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Speaker 5: There does come a moment in business, don't you think,

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Speaker 5: where you sort of I think the first couple years

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Speaker 5: is tough, and then there comes a moment where you.

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Speaker 6: Realize this is how it has to be.

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Speaker 5: And I think when you come but when you surrender

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Speaker 5: to that and you accept it, it becomes almost easier

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Speaker 5: because I was sort of like rejecting this twenty four seven.

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Speaker 5: This is so demanding, this is so intense, this is crazy,

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Speaker 5: this is hard. But sort of when you come to

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Speaker 5: terms and make peace with it, this is the reality

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Speaker 5: of what it is to build a brand, especially a

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Speaker 5: brand that's going to disrupt an industry. This is the

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Speaker 5: way it has to be, and you come to peace

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Speaker 5: with it, it almost sort of I don't know, relaxes

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Speaker 5: a little bit.

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Speaker 1: Well, I just take the view, not only is it

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Speaker 1: the way it has to be, this way it is.

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Speaker 6: It is.

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Speaker 4: That's the way it is, and if you don't like it,

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Speaker 4: to leave. If you do like it, stay in and

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Speaker 4: talk to me about work life balance and all that shite.

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Speaker 1: There is a rubbish.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, I think with building a brand when it's your own, like,

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Speaker 5: it's different when you're working for when you're building your

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Speaker 5: own brand, go with it. There's no there is no

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Speaker 5: perfect work life balance.

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Speaker 4: Back feel like, you know, they give ship my work

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Speaker 4: life balance and no good And I'm not talking to

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Speaker 4: my kids enough and I'm doing my parents, my brother's sister.

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Speaker 4: Then I just, oh, should I haven't spend for a while,

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Speaker 4: But ago and do a bit exactly.

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Speaker 6: And a couple of breaks like weekends.

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Speaker 5: You know, my husband I would take one break a

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Speaker 5: year over Christmas because we close the office, like taking

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Speaker 5: breaks when we can just to reset our minds. I

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Speaker 5: actually think it sometimes has made me better at my

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Speaker 5: job to take that two week break at the end

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Speaker 5: of the year, just to reset, refresh.

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Speaker 6: But yeah, this is relentless. This is obsessive.

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Speaker 5: This is having a no pad next to your bed

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Speaker 5: every night because you wake up at three in the

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Speaker 5: morning down the ideas. This is going at the same

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Speaker 5: staff member all day, all day until the banner is

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Speaker 5: on the website. This is checking the website fifty times

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Speaker 5: a day until it's perfect because you've seen that the

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Speaker 5: arrow button is falling underneath the wrong line. This is

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Speaker 5: staff problems. This is hr This is relentless. I think

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Speaker 5: I'm a strong girl. I think I'll weather through the

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Speaker 5: storm and I'll do my best to keep going.

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Speaker 1: You've got to try and.

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Speaker 4: Make sure you sort of detach yourself, and we hear

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Speaker 4: this in the Buddhism all the time about this not

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Speaker 4: attaching yourself to things, whether it's material things or conceptual

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Speaker 4: things as well. So you've got to sort of basically

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Speaker 4: detach yourself from the business you're working in.

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Speaker 7: Yeah, and you do that by grounding yourself in who

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Speaker 7: you are without their business.

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Speaker 1: So your own values, your own values.

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Speaker 7: So what you're kind of and I think that we

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Speaker 7: spent so much time thinking about business values. You write

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Speaker 7: it up on the wall and we have workshops talking

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Speaker 7: about what the values of your business are. Very few

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Speaker 7: of us think about what values I am as a person,

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Speaker 7: and that is way more important than a business value.

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Speaker 1: Give me an example a couple of the value.

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Speaker 4: So we're talking about like in terms of usual virtues,

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Speaker 4: like I'm respectful, I'm generous.

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Speaker 7: Yes, Yeah, there's a bunch of them in the book.

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Speaker 7: I've got the top fifty most common ones. So for

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Speaker 7: me my values Optimism is a huge value of mine.

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Speaker 7: Fairness and equality and community.

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Speaker 3: They're kind of like my values and.

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Speaker 7: So they're not unique to me, but how I order

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Speaker 7: them and how they kind of come to life. And

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Speaker 7: you get most of these values from parents, or from mentors,

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Speaker 7: or from people that you admire.

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Speaker 8: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: So but let's say someone just kicking off, I mean,

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Speaker 4: where does that How does a young person or a

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Speaker 4: person for that matter, evaluate Let's say the fifty virtues,

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Speaker 4: the values or things we stand life stands for. How

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Speaker 4: does someone choose because you can't do a fifties to

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Speaker 4: a lot? I mean, how would you say to someone,

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Speaker 4: go and choose a girl about choosing these things?

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Speaker 7: Because a really simple exercise, which would be think of

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Speaker 7: someone that you really admire, so someone you look up to.

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Speaker 7: It could be someone you know, or it could be

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Speaker 7: someone in the media, or it could be someone a celebrity,

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Speaker 7: and then start listening out what are the qualities in

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Speaker 7: them that you admire, Like, what do you admire.

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Speaker 1: In them outside of materiality?

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Speaker 7: Outside materiality?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, but it could be and that's sort of being famous.

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Speaker 7: Yeah, Like you're looking for the values that make them them,

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Speaker 7: So you know, like what's admiral about it? Yeah, you

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Speaker 7: want to kind of get to the core. It's not

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Speaker 7: about like surface level of they have a nice car. Yeah,

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Speaker 7: this is more about they're really freaking honest.

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Speaker 4: Oh they've got It's also they've got a hot Instagram page.

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Speaker 7: Yeah yeah, Yeah, it's outside of that. We're trying to

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Speaker 7: get to the core. So I call them anchors because

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Speaker 7: I want to differentiate them a little bit from work values.

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Speaker 7: So an anchor suggests it's something that's at the core

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Speaker 7: of somebody, and that is ideally it's someone you know

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Speaker 7: because you can you know it could be your parent,

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Speaker 7: or it could be an uncle, or it could be

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Speaker 7: your boss or something like that. And start listening out

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Speaker 7: what are the values that you admire in them, And

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Speaker 7: then you then start looking at the top fifty most

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Speaker 7: important anchors, and sometimes things jump out at you and

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Speaker 7: that's where when it happens. And then you need to

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Speaker 7: test this out with your partner or a best friend,

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Speaker 7: because you can sometimes say I really value being trustworthy

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Speaker 7: and someone says you're a bloody liar. There's not one

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Speaker 7: of your values. So it's really important to test it

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Speaker 7: out with someone.

445
00:19:24,880 --> 00:19:26,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's pretty cool.

446
00:19:26,240 --> 00:19:31,000
Speaker 4: And so working backwards is sort of a process of

447
00:19:31,280 --> 00:19:33,440
Speaker 4: instead of all of a sudden finding yourself you're sixty

448
00:19:33,440 --> 00:19:34,880
Speaker 4: five and you think, what the fuck have been doing?

449
00:19:34,880 --> 00:19:40,720
Speaker 4: Armal life is giving yourself a fighting chance to not.

450
00:19:40,640 --> 00:19:42,159
Speaker 1: Be in that position when you turn five.

451
00:19:42,200 --> 00:19:44,800
Speaker 4: In other words, recognizing day one, re lease and hopefully

452
00:19:44,840 --> 00:19:47,080
Speaker 4: every day of your life what I'm actually work towards.

453
00:19:47,200 --> 00:19:48,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, what am I doing it?

454
00:19:48,480 --> 00:19:48,720
Speaker 5: Yeah?

455
00:19:48,920 --> 00:19:52,199
Speaker 7: Just read just all I want with this book is

456
00:19:52,240 --> 00:19:55,000
Speaker 7: for people to think perspective then yeah, yeah, just get

457
00:19:55,000 --> 00:19:57,359
Speaker 7: a bit of thought, because sometimes I think I call

458
00:19:57,400 --> 00:19:59,080
Speaker 7: it the default mode, is where you just get on

459
00:19:59,080 --> 00:20:02,960
Speaker 7: this treadmill and it pushes you off at sixty five

460
00:20:03,440 --> 00:20:05,800
Speaker 7: and you get there and you realize, I'm too old

461
00:20:05,840 --> 00:20:08,240
Speaker 7: to do those things I've been dreaming of doing since I.

462
00:20:08,160 --> 00:20:11,400
Speaker 1: Was twenty or I didn't save enough money, didn't.

463
00:20:11,160 --> 00:20:14,760
Speaker 7: Save enough money, didn't look after my health, especially that one,

464
00:20:14,920 --> 00:20:17,400
Speaker 7: especially that one, didn't look after relationships. I've got there

465
00:20:17,400 --> 00:20:19,920
Speaker 7: now and I need to try and repair my relationship

466
00:20:19,960 --> 00:20:20,400
Speaker 7: with my kids.

467
00:20:20,440 --> 00:20:21,080
Speaker 1: Whatever it is.

468
00:20:22,560 --> 00:20:25,720
Speaker 7: All of that happens by default without thinking. You just

469
00:20:25,720 --> 00:20:27,320
Speaker 7: get on this treadmill and you get off, and that

470
00:20:27,520 --> 00:20:30,399
Speaker 7: to me is like you're just just doing and not thinking.

471
00:20:30,560 --> 00:20:32,159
Speaker 7: So all I want is for people to just like

472
00:20:32,520 --> 00:20:35,280
Speaker 7: have a moment to just reassess and look. And for me,

473
00:20:35,400 --> 00:20:38,000
Speaker 7: that moment was I said I left my job after

474
00:20:38,040 --> 00:20:41,560
Speaker 7: fifteen years. COVID happened, which was a huge global experiment,

475
00:20:41,720 --> 00:20:43,840
Speaker 7: and my dad passed away in twenty twenty one at

476
00:20:43,880 --> 00:20:47,000
Speaker 7: twenty twenty two, and that to me was a hugely

477
00:20:47,000 --> 00:20:47,680
Speaker 7: important moment.

478
00:20:47,720 --> 00:20:48,480
Speaker 1: He was my hero.

479
00:20:48,680 --> 00:20:50,200
Speaker 7: All a lot of the qualities that I have now

480
00:20:50,400 --> 00:20:54,239
Speaker 7: I inherited from him, and that made me reconsider just

481
00:20:54,320 --> 00:20:57,080
Speaker 7: am I happy? What are my values? What's important to me?

482
00:20:57,200 --> 00:20:58,600
Speaker 7: And I live in the life I want to live,

483
00:20:58,960 --> 00:21:00,720
Speaker 7: And those three things happen and that's where the germ

484
00:21:00,880 --> 00:21:01,800
Speaker 7: of this book came from.

485
00:21:02,080 --> 00:21:06,560
Speaker 4: And and before I just we close, its running out

486
00:21:06,560 --> 00:21:12,000
Speaker 4: of top. But like you're exit from Junkie Media, which

487
00:21:12,080 --> 00:21:15,840
Speaker 4: was twenty sixteen sixteen, Yeah, so what was it that

488
00:21:16,320 --> 00:21:16,920
Speaker 4: prompted that?

489
00:21:17,840 --> 00:21:20,680
Speaker 7: Yeah, it was It was a couple of things. One,

490
00:21:20,720 --> 00:21:24,320
Speaker 7: it was timing, so we could see that there was

491
00:21:24,359 --> 00:21:25,600
Speaker 7: going to be a peak of a market.

492
00:21:25,800 --> 00:21:28,119
Speaker 1: So it was time, yes, potentially.

493
00:21:27,760 --> 00:21:28,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, it was time.

494
00:21:28,720 --> 00:21:29,480
Speaker 7: That was important.

495
00:21:30,680 --> 00:21:31,480
Speaker 3: Two was.

496
00:21:33,400 --> 00:21:35,879
Speaker 7: Myself and a business partner had worked for ourselves the

497
00:21:35,920 --> 00:21:39,600
Speaker 7: whole time, and I felt like we got to the

498
00:21:39,760 --> 00:21:43,639
Speaker 7: limit of what we could teach ourselves and we wanted

499
00:21:43,640 --> 00:21:45,959
Speaker 7: to learn and be part of a bigger company and

500
00:21:46,040 --> 00:21:49,159
Speaker 7: just get those extra business skills that you get. So

501
00:21:49,640 --> 00:21:52,000
Speaker 7: we decided to take it to market. So we got

502
00:21:52,040 --> 00:21:54,920
Speaker 7: an advisor on board. We took it to market. And

503
00:21:55,800 --> 00:21:58,000
Speaker 7: the process is you start off with this list and

504
00:21:58,040 --> 00:22:00,280
Speaker 7: there was like thirty companies and it's all amazing, and

505
00:22:00,720 --> 00:22:04,200
Speaker 7: slowly the list whittles down and whiddles down down about two. Yeah,

506
00:22:04,320 --> 00:22:06,520
Speaker 7: down to about two, and then we got to two

507
00:22:06,720 --> 00:22:09,520
Speaker 7: and they both put in low ball offers or kind

508
00:22:09,520 --> 00:22:12,520
Speaker 7: of weren't that interested, and we were like, Okay, it's

509
00:22:12,560 --> 00:22:15,480
Speaker 7: not the right time, so we took it off the market.

510
00:22:15,640 --> 00:22:19,679
Speaker 7: Then about twelve eighteen months later, within the space of

511
00:22:19,720 --> 00:22:23,520
Speaker 7: a week, both of those two and then another one

512
00:22:23,880 --> 00:22:27,240
Speaker 7: all came back to us independently and said, are you still.

513
00:22:27,040 --> 00:22:29,199
Speaker 1: Interested because the market wasn't right at the course of

514
00:22:29,200 --> 00:22:29,679
Speaker 1: the market.

515
00:22:30,440 --> 00:22:32,480
Speaker 4: They can be the right buyers, you can be the

516
00:22:32,560 --> 00:22:34,360
Speaker 4: right asset, but the market's.

517
00:22:34,000 --> 00:22:34,520
Speaker 1: Got to be right.

518
00:22:34,640 --> 00:22:34,880
Speaker 7: Yeah.

519
00:22:35,000 --> 00:22:35,200
Speaker 5: Yeah.

520
00:22:35,359 --> 00:22:37,440
Speaker 7: The three things that the company needs to be aligned,

521
00:22:37,840 --> 00:22:41,040
Speaker 7: the acquirer's company and board needs to be aligned, and

522
00:22:41,080 --> 00:22:41,600
Speaker 7: the market.

523
00:22:41,760 --> 00:22:42,040
Speaker 1: Yeah.

524
00:22:42,040 --> 00:22:44,480
Speaker 7: And we had two of those, but not that third one.

525
00:22:44,520 --> 00:22:47,560
Speaker 4: So that's interesting because you can't force a sile, does

526
00:22:47,600 --> 00:22:50,800
Speaker 4: man Aguja the marketplace determines when people want to buy.

527
00:22:50,960 --> 00:22:51,760
Speaker 1: Yeah.

528
00:22:51,760 --> 00:22:54,040
Speaker 7: And it was the most fascinating lesson when we got

529
00:22:54,080 --> 00:22:55,919
Speaker 7: to call it from the advisor saying, just had a

530
00:22:55,920 --> 00:22:58,520
Speaker 7: call from company X, and then a day or two

531
00:22:58,600 --> 00:23:00,919
Speaker 7: later he's like, you would never leave this, but company

532
00:23:00,920 --> 00:23:04,000
Speaker 7: why is also called And that to us was extraordinary,

533
00:23:04,160 --> 00:23:07,840
Speaker 7: So we then reopened the process just for them. They

534
00:23:07,880 --> 00:23:10,399
Speaker 7: both kind of end up bidding against each other and

535
00:23:10,440 --> 00:23:10,639
Speaker 7: then we.

536
00:23:10,680 --> 00:23:14,840
Speaker 4: Chose one and you went through the usual due diligence

537
00:23:14,880 --> 00:23:16,119
Speaker 4: period what we did.

538
00:23:16,320 --> 00:23:18,639
Speaker 7: And we ended up not going with the company that

539
00:23:18,680 --> 00:23:19,600
Speaker 7: offered the most money.

540
00:23:20,960 --> 00:23:21,719
Speaker 1: And why is that?

541
00:23:22,640 --> 00:23:23,680
Speaker 3: Because we went with a.

542
00:23:23,640 --> 00:23:26,720
Speaker 7: Company that was really aligned with what we wanted. There

543
00:23:26,760 --> 00:23:30,840
Speaker 7: was other factors, especially for what I wanted, staff, an audience,

544
00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:34,680
Speaker 7: staff and audience and also development. I had a three

545
00:23:34,760 --> 00:23:37,760
Speaker 7: year earnout, as my business partner did, and that's three

546
00:23:37,840 --> 00:23:40,000
Speaker 7: years working for someone else, So I wanted it to

547
00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:41,840
Speaker 7: be someone that I wanted to work from and learn from.

548
00:23:41,880 --> 00:23:44,040
Speaker 4: Yeah, and most important part about it that are you're right,

549
00:23:44,200 --> 00:23:46,919
Speaker 4: is giving yourself the best possible chance of actually achieving

550
00:23:46,960 --> 00:23:49,400
Speaker 4: the earn out. And that's got to be someone who

551
00:23:49,480 --> 00:23:51,359
Speaker 4: knows what they're doing. But also, I think equally to

552
00:23:51,480 --> 00:23:54,600
Speaker 4: originally I seemply we're aligned on this one, Timbers.

553
00:23:54,880 --> 00:23:55,560
Speaker 1: I like to learn.

554
00:23:56,240 --> 00:23:58,960
Speaker 4: And bench strength is so important. You know, getting a

555
00:23:58,960 --> 00:24:02,200
Speaker 4: really good bench, like you know your buyer who's got

556
00:24:02,200 --> 00:24:06,520
Speaker 4: bench who has ben strength, They've got a lot of experience,

557
00:24:06,920 --> 00:24:08,879
Speaker 4: and shit, you can you can, you can get you

558
00:24:08,920 --> 00:24:09,560
Speaker 4: can gain from that.

559
00:24:09,720 --> 00:24:11,800
Speaker 7: Yeah, And so an example of that is I left

560
00:24:11,840 --> 00:24:14,600
Speaker 7: the business after four years. My business partner who came

561
00:24:14,920 --> 00:24:18,240
Speaker 7: is still there eight years later in a big, huge role,

562
00:24:18,760 --> 00:24:22,280
Speaker 7: really kind of enjoying and learning new things. So it

563
00:24:22,320 --> 00:24:25,280
Speaker 7: was a really successful acquisition for them in terms of hires.

564
00:24:25,640 --> 00:24:31,080
Speaker 9: In that case, I do think the two words that

565
00:24:31,119 --> 00:24:35,800
Speaker 9: you've just used, which is real courage and willing to

566
00:24:35,920 --> 00:24:38,560
Speaker 9: just back yourself and give something a go, and that

567
00:24:38,680 --> 00:24:40,640
Speaker 9: mindset of like, what's the worst thing.

568
00:24:40,560 --> 00:24:41,800
Speaker 10: That could happen if this doesn't work?

569
00:24:41,840 --> 00:24:44,800
Speaker 9: So if I head up overseas, what's the worst thing

570
00:24:44,840 --> 00:24:46,800
Speaker 9: that can happen, I just come home if it doesn't,

571
00:24:46,840 --> 00:24:48,800
Speaker 9: you know, if it doesn't work out. So that has

572
00:24:48,880 --> 00:24:52,280
Speaker 9: really helped. So the courage, but the curiosity I think,

573
00:24:52,720 --> 00:24:55,280
Speaker 9: I mean, I think people that know me would describe

574
00:24:55,280 --> 00:24:56,639
Speaker 9: me as a real learning person.

575
00:24:56,680 --> 00:24:59,440
Speaker 10: I'm just always wanting to learn. Hence will love podcasts.

576
00:24:59,720 --> 00:25:01,680
Speaker 9: You know, my family are sick of me going oh

577
00:25:01,680 --> 00:25:03,119
Speaker 9: I was listening to this podcast and blah.

578
00:25:03,000 --> 00:25:03,520
Speaker 10: Blah blah blah.

579
00:25:03,520 --> 00:25:05,080
Speaker 11: They're like enough with the podcast.

580
00:25:05,119 --> 00:25:07,080
Speaker 1: They'll be saying to you now because listen to you

581
00:25:07,160 --> 00:25:07,680
Speaker 1: on the podcast.

582
00:25:08,160 --> 00:25:13,000
Speaker 9: They'll be like, oh, mum, really anyway, So the curiosity,

583
00:25:13,080 --> 00:25:16,399
Speaker 9: So I've always been like, just wonder us, what is

584
00:25:16,480 --> 00:25:16,879
Speaker 9: going on?

585
00:25:16,920 --> 00:25:18,720
Speaker 10: Why is that happening? What's that person doing?

586
00:25:18,840 --> 00:25:21,480
Speaker 9: So Interestingly, the reason I got into the whole McKinsey

587
00:25:21,480 --> 00:25:24,440
Speaker 9: and Company was not because it was the dumb thing

588
00:25:24,480 --> 00:25:27,760
Speaker 9: out of an NBA. It was that someone who knew

589
00:25:27,840 --> 00:25:30,240
Speaker 9: I loved solving problems, was like, oh, you should meet

590
00:25:30,320 --> 00:25:32,760
Speaker 9: so and so, and that person happened to work at

591
00:25:32,800 --> 00:25:33,560
Speaker 9: McKinsey and Company.

592
00:25:33,560 --> 00:25:35,359
Speaker 10: And I was like, what is this thing? What is

593
00:25:35,480 --> 00:25:36,560
Speaker 10: management consulting?

594
00:25:36,640 --> 00:25:38,360
Speaker 11: That sounds really interesting?

595
00:25:38,600 --> 00:25:40,800
Speaker 9: Oh you get to solve different problems every three or

596
00:25:40,840 --> 00:25:41,320
Speaker 9: four months.

597
00:25:41,400 --> 00:25:42,359
Speaker 11: Oh, that sounds like me.

598
00:25:43,200 --> 00:25:44,159
Speaker 10: And so it was.

599
00:25:44,240 --> 00:25:45,480
Speaker 11: It was the curiosity.

600
00:25:45,600 --> 00:25:46,440
Speaker 10: So those two things.

601
00:25:46,440 --> 00:25:48,680
Speaker 1: But how do you in that role?

602
00:25:48,760 --> 00:25:51,320
Speaker 4: Though? So when you see someone suggested something to you,

603
00:25:53,200 --> 00:25:55,920
Speaker 4: was that just an acquaintance lucky lucky that is, or

604
00:25:56,080 --> 00:25:57,600
Speaker 4: was it or did you come about making sure that

605
00:25:57,640 --> 00:25:58,439
Speaker 4: you knew people?

606
00:25:59,200 --> 00:26:01,359
Speaker 9: Well I'm about to come on to that actually, because

607
00:26:01,440 --> 00:26:04,440
Speaker 9: I'd say courage and curiosity. But the two other things

608
00:26:04,480 --> 00:26:06,840
Speaker 9: that have really worked for me. One was and I

609
00:26:06,840 --> 00:26:10,359
Speaker 9: think I worked this out later in the game quite

610
00:26:10,359 --> 00:26:14,160
Speaker 9: frankly than I should have, But the importance of connections,

611
00:26:14,760 --> 00:26:18,320
Speaker 9: and that actually meeting people and being curious about their

612
00:26:18,359 --> 00:26:22,720
Speaker 9: lives and what they're doing, and the importance of connections

613
00:26:22,800 --> 00:26:26,280
Speaker 9: and having that as part of your role or having

614
00:26:26,320 --> 00:26:29,119
Speaker 9: that as part of your day job versus just getting

615
00:26:29,160 --> 00:26:30,360
Speaker 9: so focused on your.

616
00:26:30,200 --> 00:26:32,399
Speaker 1: Task to get out of.

617
00:26:32,400 --> 00:26:35,560
Speaker 9: The weeds and meet people and just be curious. So

618
00:26:35,600 --> 00:26:38,960
Speaker 9: those connections have ultimately paid dividends. But I didn't do

619
00:26:39,040 --> 00:26:42,600
Speaker 9: that to be deliberate a connection. I'm not a networker,

620
00:26:42,960 --> 00:26:45,320
Speaker 9: and in fact I railed against that for years, which

621
00:26:45,320 --> 00:26:47,920
Speaker 9: is why I didn't do as much of it as possible.

622
00:26:48,280 --> 00:26:50,920
Speaker 9: But when I actually worked out the power of connections

623
00:26:50,960 --> 00:26:54,159
Speaker 9: and helping people and they help you, that for me

624
00:26:54,320 --> 00:26:57,760
Speaker 9: has unlocked so much opportunity. And then the final one,

625
00:26:58,080 --> 00:27:01,040
Speaker 9: which does speak to the young twenty four year old

626
00:27:01,080 --> 00:27:03,560
Speaker 9: and it does speak to the type of leader that.

627
00:27:03,600 --> 00:27:05,960
Speaker 10: I want to be, is care.

628
00:27:06,760 --> 00:27:09,159
Speaker 9: So for me, I really care for people, and I

629
00:27:09,200 --> 00:27:11,720
Speaker 9: think you don't want to get yourself in people leadership

630
00:27:11,800 --> 00:27:14,639
Speaker 9: roles if actually you're just doing it for the title,

631
00:27:14,840 --> 00:27:16,879
Speaker 9: or you're just doing it to earn a bit more money.

632
00:27:17,240 --> 00:27:20,080
Speaker 9: I think you do genuinely have to care for people,

633
00:27:20,720 --> 00:27:25,240
Speaker 9: and I think too many leaders get into leadership or managers,

634
00:27:25,280 --> 00:27:28,399
Speaker 9: I should say, get into leadership positions, and they don't

635
00:27:28,440 --> 00:27:31,600
Speaker 9: have that care and empathy for people, And that's where

636
00:27:31,640 --> 00:27:34,520
Speaker 9: I think it often creates quite toxic workplaces.

637
00:27:34,720 --> 00:27:38,840
Speaker 4: But what would you say to you know, because I

638
00:27:38,840 --> 00:27:43,399
Speaker 4: should rephrase this, A lot of people understand or at

639
00:27:43,480 --> 00:27:46,320
Speaker 4: least they've read about or been told about, this connection piece,

640
00:27:46,440 --> 00:27:49,240
Speaker 4: and they tend to overspend too much time on that

641
00:27:49,640 --> 00:27:51,240
Speaker 4: and not enough time of being in the weeds in

642
00:27:51,280 --> 00:27:53,959
Speaker 4: other words, of building their skill, building up their resume.

643
00:27:54,560 --> 00:27:56,399
Speaker 4: I don't mean in terms of where they worked, but

644
00:27:56,840 --> 00:28:00,440
Speaker 4: the knowledge base. How did you ever get a where

645
00:28:00,480 --> 00:28:02,520
Speaker 4: you felt like you're over balancing one compared to the other.

646
00:28:02,720 --> 00:28:04,720
Speaker 10: Totally, totally and in fact, and I.

647
00:28:04,800 --> 00:28:07,159
Speaker 1: Was wasting time in other words meaning people.

648
00:28:07,520 --> 00:28:09,440
Speaker 10: No, actually I was the opposite.

649
00:28:09,600 --> 00:28:16,199
Speaker 9: So I got overlooked for a role. So this is

650
00:28:16,359 --> 00:28:19,480
Speaker 9: definitely I wouldn't call this is one of those lessons learned.

651
00:28:20,200 --> 00:28:21,720
Speaker 10: I got overlooked for a role.

652
00:28:23,280 --> 00:28:28,199
Speaker 9: And second prize for not getting the role is I

653
00:28:28,320 --> 00:28:30,840
Speaker 9: was fortunate enough to then be sent to a course

654
00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:33,960
Speaker 9: at Harvard, Right, So I did a women and executive

655
00:28:34,040 --> 00:28:38,880
Speaker 9: leadership role at Harvard, and there was this incredible lecturer

656
00:28:38,960 --> 00:28:41,400
Speaker 9: called Francis Frye, and I'll never forget it.

657
00:28:41,760 --> 00:28:44,960
Speaker 10: She said. Look, ultimately, if you really want to succeed.

658
00:28:45,280 --> 00:28:48,200
Speaker 9: Particularly in corporate life, I would say is you have

659
00:28:48,280 --> 00:28:52,480
Speaker 9: to remember three things. Credibility, so being incredibly good at

660
00:28:52,480 --> 00:28:57,720
Speaker 9: your job, executive presence or just presence, and the way

661
00:28:57,760 --> 00:29:03,080
Speaker 9: that you present yourself, and then connections and sponsorship. And

662
00:29:03,360 --> 00:29:06,440
Speaker 9: the problem with many women, so for all the research

663
00:29:06,480 --> 00:29:10,280
Speaker 9: that they've done is that women over index the first one,

664
00:29:10,360 --> 00:29:12,920
Speaker 9: the credibility. So you just get in, you do your job,

665
00:29:13,440 --> 00:29:15,520
Speaker 9: and you just think the rest will take care of itself.

666
00:29:15,520 --> 00:29:17,600
Speaker 9: They'll know that I'm doing a great job, and surely

667
00:29:17,920 --> 00:29:20,280
Speaker 9: you know, then I'll get promoted. And if I looked

668
00:29:20,280 --> 00:29:24,160
Speaker 9: at myself at that point, I was I was so

669
00:29:24,280 --> 00:29:26,400
Speaker 9: focused on the credibility and doing a really good job.

670
00:29:26,400 --> 00:29:28,600
Speaker 9: But I was a young mum, I had two young kids,

671
00:29:28,880 --> 00:29:32,080
Speaker 9: and I did not put any credence on connecting with

672
00:29:32,160 --> 00:29:35,600
Speaker 9: people or networking. And I certainly didn't put any credence

673
00:29:35,640 --> 00:29:39,440
Speaker 9: on executive presence or how I showed up in a room.

674
00:29:39,560 --> 00:29:41,720
Speaker 9: In fact, i'd probably try and take the smallest amount

675
00:29:41,760 --> 00:29:44,600
Speaker 9: of space in the room. And it was just such

676
00:29:44,600 --> 00:29:47,760
Speaker 9: a dawning realization for me of what was going on

677
00:29:47,920 --> 00:29:51,840
Speaker 9: and how I was over indexing, quite frankly, focusing too

678
00:29:51,880 --> 00:29:55,880
Speaker 9: much on that, and that actually the power of really

679
00:29:55,920 --> 00:30:00,640
Speaker 9: strong connections is about building trust. It's about building relationships

680
00:30:00,640 --> 00:30:02,640
Speaker 9: and you never know where that goes, but at the

681
00:30:02,680 --> 00:30:05,959
Speaker 9: heart of most things is trust, right, And so for me,

682
00:30:06,080 --> 00:30:09,760
Speaker 9: that was a real lightbulb moment and it really flipped

683
00:30:10,320 --> 00:30:12,640
Speaker 9: in my mind what was important and how you had

684
00:30:12,640 --> 00:30:15,120
Speaker 9: to get a good balance of all those three things.

685
00:30:15,680 --> 00:30:17,920
Speaker 1: And do you still maintain that totally?

686
00:30:18,160 --> 00:30:18,640
Speaker 11: Totally.

687
00:30:18,760 --> 00:30:19,840
Speaker 10: Yeah.

688
00:30:19,880 --> 00:30:23,120
Speaker 9: The strange thing is I naturally love being with people,

689
00:30:23,200 --> 00:30:27,240
Speaker 9: meeting people, and that has so helped me throughout my career.

690
00:30:27,280 --> 00:30:30,800
Speaker 9: I just hadn't, I think for me, I was so

691
00:30:30,840 --> 00:30:32,880
Speaker 9: busy as a young mum and I just was like

692
00:30:33,000 --> 00:30:36,560
Speaker 9: all about doing a good job. I thought networking and

693
00:30:36,680 --> 00:30:40,320
Speaker 9: meeting people that was just wasting time because I didn't

694
00:30:40,320 --> 00:30:41,120
Speaker 9: have enough time.

695
00:30:41,200 --> 00:30:43,960
Speaker 10: Time was of the essence, and I just did not

696
00:30:44,160 --> 00:30:46,560
Speaker 10: see it as a priority in my job at that time.

697
00:30:46,680 --> 00:30:48,560
Speaker 4: As you still had the kids. So how did you

698
00:30:48,640 --> 00:30:53,040
Speaker 4: then the children? So how did then did you reprioritize

699
00:30:53,080 --> 00:30:56,520
Speaker 4: your time to actually make connections and be in the

700
00:30:56,560 --> 00:31:01,520
Speaker 4: executive Yeah, be a good executive in front of people,

701
00:31:01,520 --> 00:31:03,480
Speaker 4: in other words, not takeing up the smaller space, actually

702
00:31:03,480 --> 00:31:04,600
Speaker 4: occupy your space.

703
00:31:04,960 --> 00:31:05,640
Speaker 1: How did you do that?

704
00:31:06,000 --> 00:31:09,680
Speaker 9: So it's really it's as boring as saying it's about

705
00:31:09,680 --> 00:31:10,600
Speaker 9: calendar management.

706
00:31:11,040 --> 00:31:12,000
Speaker 10: So in any.

707
00:31:11,840 --> 00:31:16,560
Speaker 9: Given week, you know, making sure that you're prioritizing doing

708
00:31:16,600 --> 00:31:19,120
Speaker 9: a good job at what you're doing, but also key

709
00:31:19,120 --> 00:31:21,720
Speaker 9: connections and who you're meeting and what you're doing, and

710
00:31:22,000 --> 00:31:24,680
Speaker 9: really making sure in any given week or any given

711
00:31:24,680 --> 00:31:29,600
Speaker 9: fortnite that you're prioritizing both and you're managing your calendar equivalently.

712
00:31:30,040 --> 00:31:32,720
Speaker 9: So my equivalent now is certainly making sure that I

713
00:31:32,760 --> 00:31:35,400
Speaker 9: do connect sort of industry wide and a whole bunch

714
00:31:35,440 --> 00:31:38,160
Speaker 9: of our key stakeholders, whether that be government, whether that

715
00:31:38,240 --> 00:31:42,200
Speaker 9: be unions, whether that be big employers, but also making

716
00:31:42,200 --> 00:31:44,520
Speaker 9: sure in my diary is lots of time for meeting

717
00:31:45,240 --> 00:31:47,200
Speaker 9: amazing talent in our organization.

718
00:31:48,520 --> 00:31:50,040
Speaker 10: I could fill my diary.

719
00:31:49,840 --> 00:31:52,680
Speaker 9: Up just by doing my job, you know, the sort

720
00:31:52,720 --> 00:31:55,760
Speaker 9: of what's going on in all of that side of things.

721
00:31:55,760 --> 00:32:00,560
Speaker 9: But you have to manage your calendar accordingly and realizing

722
00:32:00,560 --> 00:32:01,560
Speaker 9: that that's a priority.

723
00:32:01,640 --> 00:32:02,640
Speaker 10: They were the two things.

724
00:32:02,800 --> 00:32:03,600
Speaker 1: So that's interesting.

725
00:32:03,600 --> 00:32:05,560
Speaker 4: It's sort of like what's interesting about that too many

726
00:32:05,600 --> 00:32:07,880
Speaker 4: ways as you're talking, is that a where super is

727
00:32:07,920 --> 00:32:13,040
Speaker 4: about managing its portfolio, which is diverse for you, It's

728
00:32:13,080 --> 00:32:16,720
Speaker 4: about managing your portfolio. So it's like a portfolio management

729
00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:21,240
Speaker 4: process totally. This is my portfolio. It's external stakeholders, internal

730
00:32:21,320 --> 00:32:26,280
Speaker 4: stakeholders as staff, it's markets and you know, and you

731
00:32:26,280 --> 00:32:28,240
Speaker 4: can fill in all the sub categories in each.

732
00:32:28,080 --> 00:32:31,160
Speaker 1: One of those. That's my portfolio. So I've got to

733
00:32:31,200 --> 00:32:31,720
Speaker 1: manage this.

734
00:32:32,240 --> 00:32:36,920
Speaker 4: Sometimes it's backfilling because you might be under managing something,

735
00:32:38,160 --> 00:32:40,120
Speaker 4: putting enough time because you had to do something over here,

736
00:32:40,200 --> 00:32:43,320
Speaker 4: something going on over here, dragged you in, pulled you in.

737
00:32:43,640 --> 00:32:48,000
Speaker 4: But sometimes it's back feeling something. But each week, so

738
00:32:48,120 --> 00:32:50,760
Speaker 4: is your approach you called a diary management or color

739
00:32:50,760 --> 00:32:53,080
Speaker 4: and of management, which is sort of underplaying it a

740
00:32:53,080 --> 00:32:57,120
Speaker 4: little bit, I think, being humble, but you really are

741
00:32:57,480 --> 00:33:00,600
Speaker 4: running a portfolio of things that you need to attend.

742
00:33:01,000 --> 00:33:03,800
Speaker 9: Yeah, And I think for me, what I certainly do

743
00:33:04,000 --> 00:33:06,120
Speaker 9: and I do like a quarterly check in, but I

744
00:33:06,160 --> 00:33:08,240
Speaker 9: do a major thing at the beginning.

745
00:33:07,920 --> 00:33:08,400
Speaker 10: Of every year.

746
00:33:08,440 --> 00:33:10,880
Speaker 9: I go, right at the end of the day, what

747
00:33:10,960 --> 00:33:14,240
Speaker 9: do I really want to achieve this year? And both

748
00:33:14,640 --> 00:33:18,600
Speaker 9: personally and professionally, but on the professional side, in the

749
00:33:18,680 --> 00:33:21,080
Speaker 9: role of a CEO, what are the five.

750
00:33:20,960 --> 00:33:22,440
Speaker 10: Most important things I got to do?

751
00:33:22,880 --> 00:33:25,000
Speaker 9: And so I write them down, I put them right

752
00:33:25,040 --> 00:33:29,200
Speaker 9: in front of me, and I just come back really

753
00:33:29,240 --> 00:33:32,080
Speaker 9: regularly to check in that that's where my time and

754
00:33:32,160 --> 00:33:35,760
Speaker 9: attention is focused, because it's so easy to go off

755
00:33:35,760 --> 00:33:38,400
Speaker 9: to one thing that it's urgent or in fact.

756
00:33:38,240 --> 00:33:40,360
Speaker 10: It's just interesting to you.

757
00:33:40,360 --> 00:33:43,000
Speaker 9: You know, both things happen, and so for me, it's

758
00:33:43,040 --> 00:33:45,640
Speaker 9: always coming back to what's the most important elements of

759
00:33:45,640 --> 00:33:47,720
Speaker 9: my role and where can I have the most impact

760
00:33:47,720 --> 00:33:49,800
Speaker 9: for the team and for our members importantly.

761
00:33:53,160 --> 00:33:54,960
Speaker 8: You know, one of the big issues for founders is

762
00:33:55,000 --> 00:33:57,880
Speaker 8: that there's no one point of place or one point

763
00:33:57,920 --> 00:33:59,640
Speaker 8: of truth if you like, for all of these sort

764
00:33:59,680 --> 00:34:02,200
Speaker 8: of question and so it is a lot of figuring out.

765
00:34:02,320 --> 00:34:04,560
Speaker 8: So there's a reason that Steve jobs just for that

766
00:34:04,640 --> 00:34:06,800
Speaker 8: black skivy every day because you just didn't want to

767
00:34:06,840 --> 00:34:09,360
Speaker 8: make any more decisions because there's so many that you

768
00:34:09,400 --> 00:34:10,840
Speaker 8: have to make, and this is one of them. ESOPs

769
00:34:10,880 --> 00:34:12,840
Speaker 8: is one, and you know, how are you going to

770
00:34:12,840 --> 00:34:13,400
Speaker 8: structure it?

771
00:34:13,440 --> 00:34:14,000
Speaker 11: Earnings?

772
00:34:14,239 --> 00:34:16,319
Speaker 8: You know, if they stay a certain period of time,

773
00:34:16,360 --> 00:34:19,400
Speaker 8: and then that's which is we would recommend you know,

774
00:34:19,400 --> 00:34:20,960
Speaker 8: you just don't want to be getting equity out at

775
00:34:21,000 --> 00:34:22,600
Speaker 8: the beginning because you want to see the people going

776
00:34:22,640 --> 00:34:24,879
Speaker 8: to stay because startups are hard, and so you want

777
00:34:24,880 --> 00:34:26,000
Speaker 8: to make sure that people are in it for a

778
00:34:26,000 --> 00:34:26,759
Speaker 8: long period of time.

779
00:34:26,840 --> 00:34:28,560
Speaker 11: So it's sort of how do you structure that in

780
00:34:28,600 --> 00:34:29,040
Speaker 11: a way that.

781
00:34:29,400 --> 00:34:31,840
Speaker 8: Serves you as the founder and actually gives them what

782
00:34:31,920 --> 00:34:34,560
Speaker 8: they need to be incentivized and to actually, you know,

783
00:34:34,719 --> 00:34:36,480
Speaker 8: stay for the right reasons.

784
00:34:36,680 --> 00:34:37,960
Speaker 1: And that brings me to the thing.

785
00:34:38,600 --> 00:34:40,960
Speaker 4: The very one of the most portant things that I know,

786
00:34:41,040 --> 00:34:44,280
Speaker 4: I think exists in these environments is and it applies

787
00:34:44,320 --> 00:34:46,560
Speaker 4: to an easel, applies to when a VC might be

788
00:34:46,560 --> 00:34:47,640
Speaker 4: coming in evaluation.

789
00:34:47,880 --> 00:34:49,480
Speaker 1: So it's all very well to say to.

790
00:34:49,440 --> 00:34:53,360
Speaker 4: Someone, look, you're I want two under grands one hundred

791
00:34:53,320 --> 00:34:55,240
Speaker 4: grads worth of work out of you the next two months,

792
00:34:55,280 --> 00:34:55,920
Speaker 4: but I can't.

793
00:34:55,680 --> 00:34:56,879
Speaker 1: Pup for to pay you. So I'm going to give

794
00:34:56,880 --> 00:34:57,840
Speaker 1: you options.

795
00:34:58,120 --> 00:35:00,279
Speaker 4: And let's assume we've got the right tax structure and

796
00:35:00,680 --> 00:35:03,440
Speaker 4: it's all in place, and that individual says, yeah, I

797
00:35:03,520 --> 00:35:05,560
Speaker 4: like one hundred thousand of options. I've got another job,

798
00:35:05,600 --> 00:35:06,839
Speaker 4: so I'm going to do this stuff at night. It's

799
00:35:06,840 --> 00:35:08,719
Speaker 4: an extra one hundred grand, and I believe what you're doing,

800
00:35:08,800 --> 00:35:10,960
Speaker 4: so I think there could be some upside. So I'll

801
00:35:10,960 --> 00:35:13,520
Speaker 4: take the options for one hundred grand and assuming the

802
00:35:13,520 --> 00:35:17,520
Speaker 4: structures right, But then you've got to say, okay, I'm

803
00:35:17,520 --> 00:35:19,400
Speaker 4: going to give you a hundred grands worth of options,

804
00:35:19,520 --> 00:35:21,640
Speaker 4: which one hundred grands worth of shares effectively if you

805
00:35:21,680 --> 00:35:24,800
Speaker 4: excise the option, which is ten percent of my company.

806
00:35:25,360 --> 00:35:27,640
Speaker 4: And the dude says, well, hang on a minute, ten

807
00:35:27,680 --> 00:35:31,319
Speaker 4: percent of pre money, So that means the companies worth

808
00:35:31,400 --> 00:35:35,839
Speaker 4: let's say, mean bucks, And the dude says, well, or

809
00:35:35,920 --> 00:35:36,920
Speaker 4: how's it worth million dollars?

810
00:35:37,000 --> 00:35:40,239
Speaker 1: You haven't got a sale yet? How do you work out?

811
00:35:41,680 --> 00:35:42,799
Speaker 1: How do you work the shit out?

812
00:35:42,800 --> 00:35:42,880
Speaker 3: Like?

813
00:35:43,560 --> 00:35:44,279
Speaker 1: How do you say?

814
00:35:44,360 --> 00:35:48,200
Speaker 4: I mean, how do you what proxies do you use?

815
00:35:49,360 --> 00:35:52,000
Speaker 4: Like you haven't got a sale? You're talking to somebody

816
00:35:52,040 --> 00:35:55,200
Speaker 4: who you want to come into. It could be a CMO,

817
00:35:55,320 --> 00:35:56,920
Speaker 4: it could be a see if I could be anyone

818
00:35:56,920 --> 00:35:59,719
Speaker 4: with any expertise that you don't have, could be a

819
00:35:59,719 --> 00:36:02,760
Speaker 4: develop and you can't afford to pay them because it's

820
00:36:02,760 --> 00:36:05,000
Speaker 4: hard to raise money. The moments you said so, you

821
00:36:05,120 --> 00:36:07,360
Speaker 4: decided to go to another track. So you don't stall,

822
00:36:07,680 --> 00:36:10,440
Speaker 4: I'm going to give you equity and then you're happy

823
00:36:10,440 --> 00:36:14,359
Speaker 4: to give them ten percent because you feel comfortable at

824
00:36:14,360 --> 00:36:18,359
Speaker 4: ten percent is not too much equity that I can't

825
00:36:18,360 --> 00:36:20,840
Speaker 4: control the business anymore. Now I still got ninety percent.

826
00:36:21,600 --> 00:36:23,640
Speaker 4: But the individual who you're offering it is going to

827
00:36:23,640 --> 00:36:25,080
Speaker 4: see it. But how do I know that one hundred

828
00:36:25,120 --> 00:36:26,880
Speaker 4: grand is worth ten percent?

829
00:36:27,120 --> 00:36:27,720
Speaker 11: You just don't.

830
00:36:28,160 --> 00:36:29,320
Speaker 1: You've got to convince them.

831
00:36:29,200 --> 00:36:29,960
Speaker 11: Somehow, have to give it.

832
00:36:30,000 --> 00:36:32,319
Speaker 8: That's another we'll put that to the next lily. Add

833
00:36:32,320 --> 00:36:34,279
Speaker 8: that to the ongoing list of things that founders have

834
00:36:34,320 --> 00:36:34,480
Speaker 8: to do.

835
00:36:34,560 --> 00:36:37,600
Speaker 11: That's right. Valuations at that stage, early stage.

836
00:36:37,520 --> 00:36:39,760
Speaker 8: You know, you're right, how do you value a business

837
00:36:39,760 --> 00:36:41,720
Speaker 8: that hasn't really done anything yet?

838
00:36:41,840 --> 00:36:42,960
Speaker 11: So we do look for proxy.

839
00:36:43,040 --> 00:36:45,279
Speaker 8: So we're looking, you know, in the US and other

840
00:36:45,400 --> 00:36:47,319
Speaker 8: markets to see what you know, try and get as

841
00:36:47,360 --> 00:36:48,080
Speaker 8: much information as.

842
00:36:48,080 --> 00:36:50,120
Speaker 11: We have when we do those early stage valuations.

843
00:36:50,560 --> 00:36:54,520
Speaker 1: But it is a bit yeah, you know, figure out

844
00:36:54,560 --> 00:36:54,759
Speaker 1: the air.

845
00:36:54,960 --> 00:36:56,400
Speaker 11: Yeah, absolutely, But at least.

846
00:36:56,360 --> 00:36:59,920
Speaker 4: I mean, one of the advantages you may not like

847
00:37:00,000 --> 00:37:02,520
Speaker 4: make me saying this, but of having KPMG sitting in

848
00:37:02,560 --> 00:37:05,000
Speaker 4: there is that someone's going to say at least they

849
00:37:05,120 --> 00:37:11,799
Speaker 4: they KPMG gave us some corporate experience in terms of

850
00:37:12,200 --> 00:37:15,160
Speaker 4: perhaps producing the valuation or at least being aware of

851
00:37:15,200 --> 00:37:18,239
Speaker 4: the valuation. Like if I'm an investor, I need to

852
00:37:18,320 --> 00:37:23,680
Speaker 4: know that someone else has done a sanitory check on

853
00:37:23,719 --> 00:37:26,880
Speaker 4: this thing, or a reasonable list check at least. Yeah,

854
00:37:27,040 --> 00:37:28,600
Speaker 4: but I know you don't endorse evaluation.

855
00:37:28,680 --> 00:37:29,560
Speaker 11: But no, no, that's fine.

856
00:37:29,560 --> 00:37:32,279
Speaker 8: I mean, even if that's the call the case, the

857
00:37:32,400 --> 00:37:35,120
Speaker 8: investor can still go no, yeah, yeah, I don't believe it.

858
00:37:35,120 --> 00:37:38,719
Speaker 11: So in this environment, it's so well they will. Yeah,

859
00:37:38,800 --> 00:37:39,760
Speaker 11: certainly this environment.

860
00:37:39,760 --> 00:37:41,800
Speaker 8: I mean, the valuations are certainly down across the board,

861
00:37:41,800 --> 00:37:44,240
Speaker 8: but I mean it is so subjective at that stage

862
00:37:44,239 --> 00:37:46,240
Speaker 8: that it becomes I mean, then another thing you need.

863
00:37:46,120 --> 00:37:48,879
Speaker 11: To be good at as a founder's negotiation. So you've

864
00:37:48,880 --> 00:37:49,920
Speaker 11: got to negotiate through that.

865
00:37:50,160 --> 00:37:52,239
Speaker 8: So you know, that's and that's where you've probably got

866
00:37:52,239 --> 00:37:54,279
Speaker 8: to create tension in the deal by having a number

867
00:37:54,320 --> 00:37:56,440
Speaker 8: of investors that want you and how do you how

868
00:37:56,480 --> 00:37:58,560
Speaker 8: do you work through that and get yourself the best

869
00:37:58,560 --> 00:38:00,960
Speaker 8: deal without sacrificing too much, Because it comes down to

870
00:38:01,400 --> 00:38:03,200
Speaker 8: if you don't get the money, well then maybe the

871
00:38:03,200 --> 00:38:04,040
Speaker 8: company falls over.

872
00:38:04,480 --> 00:38:05,840
Speaker 11: But if you give it to such.

873
00:38:05,640 --> 00:38:09,680
Speaker 8: A low valuation, then that's very hard pill to swallow.

874
00:38:09,800 --> 00:38:11,800
Speaker 8: There is no point because you already have less and

875
00:38:11,880 --> 00:38:13,920
Speaker 8: less equity as time goes on, and so you'll end

876
00:38:14,000 --> 00:38:14,880
Speaker 8: up with nothing.

877
00:38:14,880 --> 00:38:15,560
Speaker 11: And we've seen that.

878
00:38:15,600 --> 00:38:18,319
Speaker 8: We've got some founders we try to work with now

879
00:38:18,360 --> 00:38:20,560
Speaker 8: that have come to us because they've got so little equity.

880
00:38:20,600 --> 00:38:22,960
Speaker 8: And these are these are experienced founders. To be honest,

881
00:38:23,000 --> 00:38:25,200
Speaker 8: we just don't quite know how it's happened because they've

882
00:38:25,200 --> 00:38:28,600
Speaker 8: all got very experienced vcs on the cap table and

883
00:38:28,680 --> 00:38:31,760
Speaker 8: they're looking at they've got under ten percent, and so they're.

884
00:38:31,520 --> 00:38:33,120
Speaker 1: Going they're working for everybody else.

885
00:38:33,360 --> 00:38:35,200
Speaker 8: Well, now, the thing is they've said to the vs

886
00:38:35,280 --> 00:38:38,120
Speaker 8: we're walking away, and so we're trying to Rea.

887
00:38:38,440 --> 00:38:39,880
Speaker 11: We're trying to work out how to fix it.

888
00:38:39,960 --> 00:38:42,839
Speaker 8: Because so that's the problem with if you take it,

889
00:38:43,000 --> 00:38:45,520
Speaker 8: if the evaluation is too low from the beginning, you've

890
00:38:45,520 --> 00:38:47,359
Speaker 8: got to know that you just go to you know,

891
00:38:48,040 --> 00:38:49,880
Speaker 8: you sort of go to have less and less equities

892
00:38:49,880 --> 00:38:51,880
Speaker 8: time goes on as you take more capital, so you've

893
00:38:51,880 --> 00:38:52,120
Speaker 8: got it.

894
00:38:52,160 --> 00:38:52,839
Speaker 11: That's another thing.

895
00:38:52,920 --> 00:38:55,480
Speaker 8: How do you think through that as someone who most

896
00:38:55,520 --> 00:38:58,439
Speaker 8: of these people have no experience in this. So these

897
00:38:58,480 --> 00:39:00,920
Speaker 8: are the technicians a lot of the time, yeah they are,

898
00:39:00,960 --> 00:39:03,400
Speaker 8: but even that, like I'm from a commercial background. I

899
00:39:03,400 --> 00:39:05,520
Speaker 8: haven't had to negotiate. You know, before I did startups,

900
00:39:05,520 --> 00:39:09,000
Speaker 8: I wasn't negotiating equity. No one talks to you about that,

901
00:39:09,160 --> 00:39:11,719
Speaker 8: and certainly it's more common now. But you know, the

902
00:39:11,719 --> 00:39:14,640
Speaker 8: startup ecosystem in Australia, if you think, really is sort

903
00:39:14,640 --> 00:39:16,280
Speaker 8: of kicked off in twenty ten eleven.

904
00:39:16,719 --> 00:39:18,880
Speaker 11: I had startups before that. They weren't even called startups.

905
00:39:18,920 --> 00:39:20,880
Speaker 11: Think they're just called crappy businesses.

906
00:39:20,400 --> 00:39:23,480
Speaker 8: That no one wanted to work for, and equity was

907
00:39:23,800 --> 00:39:25,520
Speaker 8: No one was talking about those sort of things then.

908
00:39:25,560 --> 00:39:27,920
Speaker 11: So at least it's being talked about. But it's still

909
00:39:28,280 --> 00:39:30,919
Speaker 11: hugely confusing, I think, and hard as hard.

910
00:39:30,960 --> 00:39:36,240
Speaker 4: It's really hard because you've got a retreat in terms

911
00:39:36,239 --> 00:39:39,239
Speaker 4: of investors. You've got to retreat in terms of those

912
00:39:39,239 --> 00:39:41,120
Speaker 4: people want to put money with the vcs in the

913
00:39:41,120 --> 00:39:43,120
Speaker 4: first place, which means the vc has got less money

914
00:39:43,160 --> 00:39:45,839
Speaker 4: to invest. The vc' has got more pressure on them

915
00:39:46,080 --> 00:39:49,480
Speaker 4: than ever before to get a return because they just

916
00:39:49,560 --> 00:39:51,520
Speaker 4: don't have money flowing into them like they did during

917
00:39:51,520 --> 00:39:54,719
Speaker 4: the COVID period. During the COVID period, everything was overinflated.

918
00:39:55,400 --> 00:39:58,480
Speaker 4: It just was so I saw I saw one. I

919
00:39:58,520 --> 00:40:03,320
Speaker 4: won't mention names, but I saw one. They just literally

920
00:40:04,560 --> 00:40:08,320
Speaker 4: an idea, had some pretty good individuals behind it, like

921
00:40:08,600 --> 00:40:12,600
Speaker 4: experienced people who had been in and or experience larger

922
00:40:12,600 --> 00:40:18,200
Speaker 4: and much larger outcomes. But they raised ten million dollars.

923
00:40:19,560 --> 00:40:20,200
Speaker 1: Quite quickly.

924
00:40:21,640 --> 00:40:24,160
Speaker 4: And this is during the right beginning COVID, sort of

925
00:40:24,200 --> 00:40:26,160
Speaker 4: during the beginning, the first part of COVID. They raised

926
00:40:26,160 --> 00:40:30,600
Speaker 4: ten million dollars offer quite a big valuation, but that

927
00:40:30,680 --> 00:40:32,640
Speaker 4: had nothing, They had no sale, they didn't even have

928
00:40:32,680 --> 00:40:36,560
Speaker 4: it produced. And then what happens is these individuals tell

929
00:40:36,600 --> 00:40:39,719
Speaker 4: the marketplace, they tell everybody a look, they feel obliged

930
00:40:39,760 --> 00:40:40,480
Speaker 4: to announce it.

931
00:40:41,120 --> 00:40:42,520
Speaker 1: Perhaps they want to announce it.

932
00:40:42,880 --> 00:40:46,520
Speaker 4: Perhaps investors wanted to announce two during a hot period

933
00:40:46,920 --> 00:40:49,080
Speaker 4: because the investors want it to be announce so that

934
00:40:49,120 --> 00:40:52,799
Speaker 4: they can go and raise money themselves into the fund.

935
00:40:53,200 --> 00:40:55,919
Speaker 4: And then other people are watching this and they go, oh,

936
00:40:56,239 --> 00:40:59,040
Speaker 4: hang on, they raised ten mili off this valuation.

937
00:40:59,800 --> 00:41:00,960
Speaker 1: They were like, super.

938
00:41:00,840 --> 00:41:04,600
Speaker 4: Early stage, I can do the same. Well, why can't

939
00:41:04,600 --> 00:41:05,200
Speaker 4: I do the same?

940
00:41:05,840 --> 00:41:07,239
Speaker 8: I think I know the deal you're talking about, and

941
00:41:07,280 --> 00:41:08,960
Speaker 8: you can't do the same because those found those founders

942
00:41:08,960 --> 00:41:11,239
Speaker 8: of that company have had a big they're quite if

943
00:41:11,280 --> 00:41:11,600
Speaker 8: it's the.

944
00:41:11,520 --> 00:41:13,080
Speaker 11: Same one super experience.

945
00:41:13,160 --> 00:41:15,640
Speaker 8: But then it comes down that's a really good example

946
00:41:15,680 --> 00:41:17,400
Speaker 8: because then you won't be able to do the same

947
00:41:17,440 --> 00:41:19,440
Speaker 8: unless you've had the same experience as those founders, So

948
00:41:19,760 --> 00:41:20,160
Speaker 8: we know that.

949
00:41:20,160 --> 00:41:21,640
Speaker 1: They probably woudn't do the same today anyway.

950
00:41:21,960 --> 00:41:24,160
Speaker 8: Yeah, and we and look, we know second time founders

951
00:41:24,160 --> 00:41:28,360
Speaker 8: get funded for obvious reasons more easily than first time founders,

952
00:41:28,400 --> 00:41:31,160
Speaker 8: So you know, I wouldn't I think in that equation

953
00:41:31,160 --> 00:41:32,960
Speaker 8: when you look at the valuation, we're always going to

954
00:41:32,960 --> 00:41:35,319
Speaker 8: look at the experience of the founders and things like that.

955
00:41:35,360 --> 00:41:38,040
Speaker 11: It's going to if they've got this interesting, I'll bump

956
00:41:38,040 --> 00:41:39,920
Speaker 11: the valuation up for sure, Which.

957
00:41:39,800 --> 00:41:41,719
Speaker 8: Is why that if it is the same one those

958
00:41:41,760 --> 00:41:44,439
Speaker 8: people were able to raise on, they raised so much

959
00:41:44,440 --> 00:41:46,800
Speaker 8: money on such a high valuation because of the experience

960
00:41:46,840 --> 00:41:49,600
Speaker 8: of that team. Came down to and it was a

961
00:41:49,600 --> 00:41:51,600
Speaker 8: problem that they had experience when they were growing their

962
00:41:51,680 --> 00:41:55,360
Speaker 8: last company, so they had some pretty solid evidence around

963
00:41:55,360 --> 00:41:56,920
Speaker 8: the problem and they feel they.

964
00:41:56,880 --> 00:41:58,160
Speaker 11: Could build a solution to it.

965
00:41:58,600 --> 00:42:01,440
Speaker 8: So I suppose the investor went experienced team, we all

966
00:42:01,480 --> 00:42:03,799
Speaker 8: know the problem is a real problem. I think we've

967
00:42:03,840 --> 00:42:05,839
Speaker 8: given their experience they can probably build the solution. We'll

968
00:42:05,840 --> 00:42:06,920
Speaker 8: give them the ten million.

969
00:42:06,840 --> 00:42:07,560
Speaker 11: And see how they go.

970
00:42:08,719 --> 00:42:12,040
Speaker 8: And but of faith, it's a big leap of faith.

971
00:42:12,200 --> 00:42:14,680
Speaker 8: And again I wonder if that would happen today.

972
00:42:14,880 --> 00:42:15,279
Speaker 11: I don't know.

973
00:42:15,960 --> 00:42:19,200
Speaker 1: My feeling is a probably be a lot tougher.

974
00:42:19,520 --> 00:42:20,319
Speaker 11: It would be a lot tougher.

975
00:42:20,320 --> 00:42:22,479
Speaker 8: And also, you know, you've had to read the paper

976
00:42:22,520 --> 00:42:25,200
Speaker 8: today and the vcs are under scrutiny as well.

977
00:42:25,360 --> 00:42:29,319
Speaker 11: You know, you've got one couple of years ago.

978
00:42:29,360 --> 00:42:31,080
Speaker 8: You look, I'm an investor in a few of the funds,

979
00:42:31,080 --> 00:42:33,359
Speaker 8: and I was like, great, the evaluations were all up.

980
00:42:33,760 --> 00:42:34,680
Speaker 11: It all looks great.

981
00:42:35,040 --> 00:42:36,360
Speaker 8: And now I'm looking at it, going, what have you

982
00:42:36,360 --> 00:42:39,480
Speaker 8: been investing in? These companies look terrible? So I wasn't

983
00:42:39,480 --> 00:42:41,480
Speaker 8: really looking that closely when it was all high. But

984
00:42:41,560 --> 00:42:43,760
Speaker 8: now I'm like, I like that one or that way.

985
00:42:43,800 --> 00:42:45,680
Speaker 8: So there is more scrutiny on them too, so I

986
00:42:45,680 --> 00:42:47,880
Speaker 8: think they're going to be a bit more careful. And

987
00:42:47,960 --> 00:42:51,040
Speaker 8: also there was a bit of i'd say they copped

988
00:42:51,040 --> 00:42:54,880
Speaker 8: a bit of flack around the way they're investing before

989
00:42:55,000 --> 00:42:57,440
Speaker 8: the sort of market dropped, so it was a bit

990
00:42:57,480 --> 00:42:59,480
Speaker 8: of a free for all. We saw companies, you know,

991
00:42:59,600 --> 00:43:02,160
Speaker 8: being off at term sheets within twenty four hours. At times,

992
00:43:02,280 --> 00:43:04,120
Speaker 8: there was very little due diligence like we used to

993
00:43:04,120 --> 00:43:06,880
Speaker 8: do due diligence for some of the vcs on finances

994
00:43:06,920 --> 00:43:09,800
Speaker 8: for the companies, we haven't done due diligence for two years,

995
00:43:10,400 --> 00:43:13,600
Speaker 8: not one not one piece. So, as you know, so

996
00:43:13,640 --> 00:43:15,920
Speaker 8: I think there's that's sort of been interesting. So I

997
00:43:15,920 --> 00:43:17,279
Speaker 8: think the vcs are probably going to be a bit

998
00:43:17,320 --> 00:43:19,080
Speaker 8: more careful, a little bit more risk averse at the

999
00:43:19,080 --> 00:43:19,719
Speaker 8: moment as well.

1000
00:43:19,880 --> 00:43:24,040
Speaker 4: So would you suggest to early early stage, early stage

1001
00:43:24,120 --> 00:43:27,719
Speaker 4: entrepreneurs that they perhaps try to hunt down a.

1002
00:43:27,719 --> 00:43:31,000
Speaker 1: Few wells for themselves. Yeah, as opposed to going to

1003
00:43:31,000 --> 00:43:31,560
Speaker 1: the vcs.

1004
00:43:31,640 --> 00:43:33,000
Speaker 11: Look, I think if you can get to hein and

1005
00:43:33,040 --> 00:43:33,720
Speaker 11: it works great.

1006
00:43:34,760 --> 00:43:38,319
Speaker 8: And also the big increases family officers, So seeing the

1007
00:43:38,400 --> 00:43:41,239
Speaker 8: family officers are certainly playing in this space. Definitely in

1008
00:43:41,239 --> 00:43:44,520
Speaker 8: the climate, tech, impact, is sustainability, all of that, that

1009
00:43:44,680 --> 00:43:45,880
Speaker 8: space is very popular.

1010
00:43:46,080 --> 00:43:47,040
Speaker 11: They sort of like it.

1011
00:43:47,719 --> 00:43:49,279
Speaker 8: I'd say, if you're going for your fun, if you're

1012
00:43:49,280 --> 00:43:51,960
Speaker 8: looking for funds, look for ones you know they'll they'll

1013
00:43:52,000 --> 00:43:53,920
Speaker 8: specify on their website the amounts.

1014
00:43:54,080 --> 00:43:56,280
Speaker 11: You know you've got to get. An early stage investor